highaltitude.log.20191117

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[06:08] <SpacenearUS> New vehicle on the map: 03LZ1CWT_chase - 12https://tracker.habhub.org/#!qm=All&q=LZ1CWT_chase
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[07:54] <VE6AZX> ugh - I tried another zero pressure balloon and it didn't really work that well.
[07:54] <VE6AZX> anyone else tried making zero pressure balloons?
[07:55] <VE6AZX> VE6AZX-11 in aprs.fi if you're wondering what happened.
[07:55] <SIbot> In real units: 11 in = 27.94 cm
[07:56] <SA6BSS-Mike> what was the goal of the flight?
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[07:57] <SA6BSS-Mike> what happned to the radio during that 3h silence?, did it freeze and stoped tx ?
[07:59] <VE6AZX> I think so
[07:59] <VE6AZX> I was trying to float for a few hours
[07:59] <VE6AZX> it was outside exposed to the cold
[08:00] <VE6AZX> atmega328p making aprs tones with GPS + lithium energizer 3v CR123 battery + RFM98W lora transmitter
[08:00] <VE6AZX> two things bother me - the fact that my tracker obviously didn't work well, and the fact that it somehow came to the ground early. These things are supposed to stay up for a day give or take
[08:01] <VE6AZX> it was a bag made of .31 mil poly sheeting which was tuck-taped into a cylinder, tied at the top, and with a 1 inch opening at the bottom for pressure release.
[08:01] <SIbot> In real units: 1 in = 2.54 cm
[08:03] <SA6BSS-Mike> did you recover the payload so you could see the envelope and maby draw some conlusion of how it looked?
[08:04] <VE6AZX> unfortunately no.
[08:05] <VE6AZX> it went kind of far away and the gas to get it back would cost 4x what it cost to make
[08:05] <VE6AZX> though... the information would have been valuable.
[08:07] <VE6AZX> I actually phoned raven aerostar a while ago. got a nice person who didn't mind talking with me - they said their professional zero pressure balloons are basically made the same way, but with heat sealing.
[08:07] <VE6AZX> I've tried that as well, but heat sealing actually admits the possibility of more leaks than tape.
[08:07] <SA6BSS-Mike> I have no experince of zero p balloons but i spontanieusly think 1" hole at the bottom sounding a bit to large to me, but I guess you have read up on this
[08:08] <SIbot> In real units: 1 in = 2.54 cm
[08:08] <VE6AZX> That's what I've been wondering.
[08:08] <VE6AZX> unfortunately that information doesn't seem to be readily available.
[08:08] <VE6AZX> have you ever heard of amateurs doing zero-pressure experiments with success?
[08:10] <SA6BSS-Mike> cant say I have and I been on the channel for quite some time
[08:11] <SA6BSS-Mike> if you are after floating a payload at gigh alt many uses and underinflated latex balloon
[08:11] <SA6BSS-Mike> what altitude are you looking at?
[08:12] <VE6AZX> ultimately want to get to 30 km. Right now I'll settle for any stable float around 10 km or so.
[08:12] <VE6AZX> thanks for the answers, by the way. I appreciate it.
[08:13] <VE6AZX> I've wondered about the latex balloons underinflated. You use a very light payload on those, yes?
[08:13] <SpeedEvil> yes
[08:13] <VE6AZX> I had a rather light one on my test zero pressure.
[08:13] <SA6BSS-Mike> 30km float for 12-15h is doable with an latex, if you want to float at 10km a superpresude ballon is gona work well with 1.5$ balloons from china
[08:14] <VE6AZX> does the latex balloon have to be big?
[08:14] <VE6AZX> or can I under-inflate something like a 600g?
[08:14] <SA6BSS-Mike> if your payload is light you could brobably get realy high on one of the smalles latex b
[08:15] <SA6BSS-Mike> thee is a calculator avalible for this
[08:15] <SA6BSS-Mike> http://habhub.org/calc/
[08:15] <VE6AZX> I've noticed that it suggests possible floaters for some configurations, yes.
[08:16] <VE6AZX> a bit of background as to why I was looking at zero pressure's at all - at work (uni) we're trying to send up a kilogram or so of science instruments on a latex balloon and float at around 30 km or so for a few hours.
[08:16] <VE6AZX> been trying to use a remote controlled valve to do this
[08:16] <VE6AZX> but it's been a real pain
[08:17] <VE6AZX> caused me to wonder if making a zero pressure, which should naturally vent at altitude, would be easier.
[08:17] <VE6AZX> but I guess the answer is probably no, at least how I'm building them.
[08:17] <SA6BSS-Mike> rr :)
[08:17] <SA6BSS-Mike> there was some US group that floated latex for a couple of days, lets google....
[08:18] <VE6AZX> I'll look.
[08:18] <VE6AZX> sorry if I missed that.
[08:18] <VE6AZX> there was the stanford group that did "ValBal"
[08:18] <VE6AZX> but they float rather low compared to where we need to wind up
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[08:20] <VE6AZX> I had wondered if putting on a crazy amount of weight compared to the other successful floaters causes a lot of stress on the latex membrane
[08:20] <VE6AZX> we did actually manage to float a 600g with a 500g payload at 20 km for an hour or so
[08:20] <VE6AZX> but it burst.
[08:21] <SA6BSS-Mike> ahh, yes it was the valbal I was thinking of
[08:22] <VE6AZX> they were indeed successful, but we've got to go to around 30 km, not 20, for our X-ray spectrometer to work.
[08:22] <SA6BSS-Mike> rr
[08:24] <SA6BSS-Mike> and you probably want your intrument back so no uncontrolled float?
[08:25] <SA6BSS-Mike> gona need some sort of cutdown arangement as well
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[08:49] <OZ1SKY_Brian> tjena mike
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[09:08] <YO3ICT> Yesterday we did the first PITS flight in Romania. Payload recovered successfully and the servo cutdown worked as advertised. Unfortunately, the Lora reception was very poor. The TX power was default. What is the config command to increase the output power?
[09:09] <Darkside> sounds like you should be getting your antenna setups more than increasing the output power...
[09:09] <Darkside> checking*
[09:10] <YO3ICT> Not really. It was the trusty dual band mag mount on the chase car, that worked so well for many RTTY flights. We only got one complete image on the downlink by using the 3 el yagi.
[09:10] <SA6BSS-Mike> OZ1SKY_Brian: halloj!!
[09:10] <Darkside> sounds like an antenna issue on the payload then?
[09:11] <Darkside> upping the power only gets you a few db. if your antenna is out of tune or something that could be lots more loss
[09:11] <Darkside> got someone with a nanoVNA or something?
[09:11] <YO3ICT> Maybe, with some big attenuation due to heavy fog on the ground. But other RTTY flights used 20-25mW, it is the first time I flew with only 10mW.
[09:12] <YO3ICT> Antennas perfect tuned, checked with my analyzer.
[09:12] <Darkside> thats only 3db difference...
[09:12] <Darkside> what speed mode were you using on the lora payload?
[09:12] <YO3ICT> Yes, 3db double the payload.
[09:12] <YO3ICT> Mode 1
[09:12] <Darkside> also remember that the lora RX isnt as high spec as what you are probably using for your RTTY reception
[09:13] <Darkside> but go talk to daveake
[09:13] <Darkside> he would know more, i only run loRa in super slow modes for my cutdown paload - i use wenet for imagery
[09:13] <YO3ICT> Still 10mW?
[09:13] <Darkside> lora i only run 10mw, yes
[09:14] <Darkside> wenet... not so much. more like 50mW
[09:14] <Darkside> but that is running at 115kbit/s
[09:14] <Darkside> so the extra juice is warranted
[09:14] <YO3ICT> So there were about 3000 image packets IIRC, something like a third we're not received.
[09:15] <YO3ICT> And right after cutdown we had no downlink decode at all. Looks to me more like a Freq drift error, but the gateway AFC should take care of that, doesn't it?
[09:15] <Darkside> should do
[09:16] <YO3ICT> Payload antenna was monopole, figured out that the RPi ground plane *might* be enough.
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[09:16] <YO3ICT> So, what was the power config setting?
[09:16] <Darkside> no idea, i dont use dave's code
[09:16] <YO3ICT> Ok
[09:17] <YO3ICT> Do you flew wenet with monopole antenna or ground plane?
[09:17] <Darkside> uh monopole with radials
[09:17] <YO3ICT> ok
[09:17] <Darkside> driven element, and 4 radials
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[09:48] <SpacenearUS> New position from 03W9WWI-11 after 0321 hours silence - 12https://tracker.habhub.org/#!qm=All&q=W9WWI-11
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[11:37] Nick change: Stephie -> Stephanie
[11:39] Nick change: Stephanie -> Stephie
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[11:53] <SA6BSS-Mike> anyone looked at the data comming out of the rs41 gps , would it be possible to cut out the gps portion of the sonde to use on other trackers? https://imgur.com/tFg9on1
[11:53] <SA6BSS-Mike> tried hook the tx pin up to one of my boards but it does not sync the time (wspr)
[11:53] <SA6BSS-Mike> or location
[11:54] <SA6BSS-Mike> the sonde tx correct data as I decode it at the same time with rtty/dlflgi
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[12:17] <dbrooke> I don't know about all the firmwares but at least the RS41HUP code uses ublox binary format, so if you were expecting NMEA that might explain it
[12:20] <dbrooke> and that part seems to be originally from SQ5RWU - https://github.com/darksidelemm/RS41HUP/blob/master/ublox.c
[12:26] <YO3ICT> Arduiniana TinyGPS++ library used on my WSPR trackers is extracting the NMEA data. I just send commands to the GPS in the ubx format but I receive in NMEA.
[12:26] <YO3ICT> By commands, I mean : flight mode, high-performance mode, software reset.
[12:27] <YO3ICT> So I guess it is possible to cut the GPS section and wire the UART directly to whatever you want. I am not sure though that the ublox format is compatible between MAX7/8 and the RS41 Ublox chip.
[12:28] <Darkside> should be mostly compatible
[12:28] <Darkside> i dont think most of the basic stuff has changed much between the ublox 6 series (or is it a 5-series?) and the newer stuff
[12:29] <Darkside> tbh given the price of ublox modules from ebay i dont think its worth fucking around cutting up a 4-layer board to get the gps off
[12:29] <YO3ICT> Probably some additional commands must be sent, regarding the antenna circuitry and the LNA
[12:29] <Darkside> dont think so
[12:29] <Darkside> i think thats just powered on by default
[12:29] <YO3ICT> Can be, yes.
[12:30] <Darkside> i think the problem is more going to be the fact the code is using ublox binary
[12:30] <Darkside> but given its a 4 layer board, cutting it up around the gps area is asking for trouble
[12:30] <Darkside> you probably spent more money in fuel to go recover the RS41 than it would cost to buy a ublox module off ebay :P
[12:31] <YO3ICT> For sure.
[12:32] <dbrooke> Darkside: as an aside while you're here, since I enabled chasemapper as a service on my auto_rx Pi it seems to consume memory https://stuff.dbrooke.me.uk/sp-6pXLHe.png
[12:33] <Darkside> ahh i bet i know what that is
[12:33] <Darkside> you have a gps attached/
[12:33] <Darkside> ?
[12:33] <dbrooke> remote gpsd
[12:33] <Darkside> yep
[12:33] <Darkside> it'll be the geometry object which is storing gps positions
[12:34] <Darkside> i should probably make that have an option to only keep a backlog
[12:34] <Darkside> i mean, a certain backlog of positions
[12:34] <Darkside> not all of them :P
[12:34] <dbrooke> right
[12:34] <dbrooke> I mean, an actual chase wouldn't last a month 8-)
[12:34] <Darkside> https://github.com/projecthorus/chasemapper/blob/master/chasemapper/geometry.py#L15
[12:35] <Darkside> this class
[12:35] <Darkside> would be an easy fix
[12:36] <Darkside> if len(self.track_history)>max_len: self.track_history = self.track_history[-1*max_len:]
[12:36] <Darkside> or siilar
[12:36] <Darkside> similar*
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[12:43] Action: dbrooke reads up on python lists
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[12:55] <dbrooke> looks like .pop(0) will remove the first element
[12:59] <SpacenearUS> New vehicle on the map: 03LZ4NY-6_chase - 12https://tracker.habhub.org/#!qm=All&q=LZ4NY-6_chase
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[13:05] <SpacenearUS> New position from 03NU6XB-11 after 0315 hours silence - 12https://tracker.habhub.org/#!qm=All&q=NU6XB-11
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[13:38] <SpacenearUS> New position from 03WB0URW-6 after 0317 hours silence - 12https://tracker.habhub.org/#!qm=All&q=WB0URW-6
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[15:53] <SpacenearUS> New position from 03N2NXZ/AM after 033 days silence - 12https://tracker.habhub.org/#!qm=All&q=N2NXZ%2FAM
[16:09] <SpacenearUS> New vehicle on the map: 03N2NXZ-11 - 12https://tracker.habhub.org/#!qm=All&q=N2NXZ-11
[16:10] <SA6BSS-Mike> n2nxz just launched a OM3BC tracker soing aprs as well as rtty on 144.600
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[17:01] <SpacenearUS> New vehicle on the map: 03Zw123_chase - 12https://tracker.habhub.org/#!qm=All&q=Zw123_chase
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[18:07] <SpacenearUS> New vehicle on the map: 03KJ7JPY-11 - 12https://tracker.habhub.org/#!qm=All&q=KJ7JPY-11
[18:09] <Turjakas> Hello. I've seen some old logs where people have discussed using Si4032 UHF TX chip in a tracker. Did anyone manage to actually use it to produce proper FSK for modes like WSPR? In my tests, I can only adjust the frequency in ~312Hz steps... and in direct asynchronous mode (when driving TX via PWM using the SPI MOSI pin), it produces the carrier tone and lots of high-frequency artifacts...
[18:09] <Turjakas> I've got a bunch of Vaisala RS41 radiosondes that I would like to recycle and extend, so that's why I'm using that particular chip
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[19:02] <molo> !hysplit
[19:02] <SpacenearUS> 03molo: HYSPLIT available for: 03ICT3, K6RPT-11, WB8MSJ-2
[19:03] <molo> !hysplit NU6XB-11
[19:03] <SpacenearUS> 03molo: No HYSPLIT for that callsign
[19:03] <molo> is there a way to generate a hysplit for NU6XB-11 ?
[19:10] <SA6BSS-Mike> ask in #habhub channel
[19:13] <molo> thanks
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[19:29] <SpacenearUS> New position from 03ICT3 after 032 days silence - 12https://tracker.habhub.org/#!qm=All&q=ICT3
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[21:45] <M0KVI_> OK this should hopefully work now I've identified
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[23:58] <SpacenearUS> New vehicle on the map: 03VK5ST-9_chase - 12https://tracker.habhub.org/#!qm=All&q=VK5ST-9_chase
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[00:00] --- Mon Nov 18 2019