highaltitude.log.20190923

[00:06] <SpacenearUS> New vehicle on the map: 03NT6T-11 - 12https://tracker.habhub.org/#!qm=All&q=NT6T-11
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[01:47] <SpacenearUS> New vehicle on the map: 03KD2KPZ-12 - 12https://tracker.habhub.org/#!qm=All&q=KD2KPZ-12
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[05:40] <SpacenearUS> New position from 03ICT3 after 0319 hours silence - 12https://tracker.habhub.org/#!qm=All&q=ICT3
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[09:41] <michal_f> help! I connected an SMA splitter just after my diamond x-50. One output goes to HAB-preamp, other output is just a coax. (both coaxes are about 10m length)
[09:41] <michal_f> the problem is that connecting the non-amp coax give big noise: https://i.paste.pics/f85839f8b601ef8ed550d589d05bc0c2.png
[09:41] <michal_f> any ideas ?
[09:42] <michal_f> it's enought to unscrew coax from splitter for this blob of noise to disappear
[09:47] <daveake> By "non-amp coax" I think you mean "aerial" :)
[09:47] <daveake> But that's huge
[09:50] <daveake> Does the non-amp coax connect to something? Why are you using an unmatched splitter?
[09:53] <michal_f> the free coax is terminated with just a bnc connector
[09:53] <michal_f> and no - I just use cheap chinese splitter
[09:53] <michal_f> didn't know I need a matched splitter - where can I get one :)
[09:54] <daveake> If you watch ebay for a while, sometimes the Minicircuits splitters come up at a good price. Those are very nice.
[09:54] <michal_f> thanks !
[09:54] <daveake> This kind of thing
[09:54] <daveake> https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Mini-Circuits-15542-ZFRSC-42-2-Way-Connectorized-Power-Splitter-Loc-A05-09/233282783475?epid=1038679278&hash=item3650bcc8f3:g:Aj8AAOSwT5RdJGBI
[09:55] <daveake> They have different ranges (that one is up to 4.2GHz so better than we need)
[09:55] <daveake> I've paid less than £10 for them
[09:55] <daveake> Small, solid, SMA, work very well. What's not to like? :)
[09:56] <michal_f> great daveake
[09:57] <michal_f> anyway - why a simple splitter won't work ?
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[10:07] <michal_f> preamp is powered by biasT, I wonder if it hsa anything to do with the effect
[10:10] <Darkside> that looks like oscillation
[10:10] <Darkside> well, maybe
[10:10] <Darkside> definitely not good, whatever it is
[10:19] <daveake> Well, cut the power and see what happens
[10:32] <michal_f> afair it's still there if I cut power, just very weak....
[10:32] <michal_f> mast is up - i'll take it down again when I get proper splitter
[10:35] <russss> daveake: $60 list price though! Are they usually that cheap on ebay?
[10:36] <daveake> I've not bought any for a long time, but I remember having to wait till some cheap ones came up.
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[11:10] <PE2BZ> michal_f, are you 100% sure you do not feed the output from the preamp back to the input by any means ?
[11:12] <michal_f> not sure, but it looks ok to me
[11:12] <michal_f> but i'm an RF noob :/
[11:13] <PE2BZ> It looks like the main passband of the preamp which is very strong with power to the preamp and still there but much weaker without power which makes me think there is some feedback from the output to the input somehow.
[11:16] <michal_f> https://i.imgur.com/N4LYHmp.jpg
[11:16] <michal_f> this is "schematics"
[11:17] <PE2BZ> What quality is the cable <michal_f> the free coax is terminated with just a bnc connector ? Did you check it for shorts ?
[11:17] <Darkside> the fact there is a open circuit at the end isnt going to help things
[11:17] <Darkside> that length of coax is going to result in reflects and who knows what else
[11:18] <Darkside> do you get teh same result with the preamp directly connected to the antenna, without the splitter?
[11:18] <michal_f> coax is h155 (but not an original belden). there's just a BNC at the end, not terminated with any load. there are no shorts
[11:19] <michal_f> without the spliter all is fine. even with splitter in-line, but the other coax unconnected is fine
[11:19] <Darkside> then its an issue with the amp and the mismatch input impedance
[11:19] <Darkside> get a proper RF splitter
[11:19] <michal_f> thank you guys
[11:19] <michal_f> should I get somekind of 50 Ohm terminator for the unused BNC end ?
[11:20] <PE2BZ> Can you try to terminate the BNC connector wiht 50 Ohm ( 47 or 68 ohm resistor, or connect it to a radio)
[11:20] <michal_f> I think I had it connected to other radio and the problem was visible - not sure now, and not that much important.
[11:20] <michal_f> I will certainly get a proper splitter
[11:21] <PE2BZ> Not wirewound resistor, which acts as a coil which we do not want.
[11:22] <Darkside> PE2BZ: i suspect the issue is that he's presenting a bad impedance at the input to the amplifier
[11:23] <michal_f> anyway, these are my masts ! https://drive.google.com/file/d/1FFsLMfduYpdolbEnMGLiFGWlpoQlDRsy/view?usp=sharing
[11:23] <michal_f> :]
[11:23] <dbrooke> if you're planning to use the additional coax for the same band as the amp then you'd be better off splitting after the amp, if you want it for VHF then I'd suggest a duplexer eather than a splitter
[11:24] <michal_f> no, I wan't the oter coax for 2m - so a duplexer then ?
[11:25] <dbrooke> yes
[11:26] <Darkside> you are not planning on transmitting through this antenna are you?
[11:27] <michal_f> no, just RX
[11:32] <SpacenearUS> New position from 03KB0MC-5 after 0313 hours silence - 12https://tracker.habhub.org/#!qm=All&q=KB0MC-5
[11:35] <PE2BZ> Darkside, that could be the problem, however an open input at the T-splitter should / would act the same as the open end of the BNC connector if the coax is properly wired. If the shield has no connection all kind of things could happen when attaching that wire antenna indeed. But for myself for RX I also use splitters with the right impedance. Mini circuits, or PCB wiht 3 SMA connectors and 4 resistors of 100 ohm (2 to make 50 ohm)
[11:35] <PE2BZ> with shortest wires.
[11:38] <michal_f> hmm I could try with home made splitter before I spend $$ on minicircuit
[11:38] <Darkside> uh
[11:38] <Darkside> so using a resistive splitter means you are putting loss in front of your preamp
[11:38] <michal_f> not a good ideA ?
[11:38] <Darkside> which means noise figure will be degraded
[11:39] <Darkside> splitter after preamp is OK, so long as you dont lose too much signal
[11:39] <PE2BZ> That way the only good option is the duplexer, he needs the other output for 144 MHz so cannot split after the preamp
[11:40] <Darkside> yes a duplexer would be a better option then
[11:40] <Darkside> shoudl have less loss on
[11:40] <Darkside> less loss than a splitter i mean
[11:43] <michal_f> ? smth like this: https://www.ebay.com/itm/Diplexer-2m-70cm-for-Ham-Radio-Transceiver/183958767790?hash=item2ad4cc08ae:g:gjwAAOSw5WZalsqp
[11:45] <PE2BZ> Looks good to me, small size, mine is in a metal box 8 * 8 8 4 cm (can handle 200 W TX)
[11:46] <Darkside> the chip inductors means it will have more loss than somethign with nice big inductors
[11:51] <PE2BZ> LIke https://www.ebay.com/itm/Diplexer-2m-70cm-50W-N-or-SO239-connectors/183944338395?hash=item2ad3efdbdb:g:mesAAOSwrlpdKKvw
[11:51] <Darkside> yes
[11:52] <PE2BZ> from the same seller, you could ask him about the insertion loss for 2 m and 70 cm for the SMD type. With this one you will add another 3 adapters from N to SMA or BNC.
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[11:54] <michal_f> http://janielectronics.com/index.php?route=product/product&path=33&product_id=126 this is his e-shop
[11:54] <michal_f> there's some plot but unreadable. I'll ask
[12:11] <PE2BZ> Any type of splitter from 1 to 2 will divide the signal in 2, giving eacht output about 3 dB less signal. (3 dB is half the power) so any value below about 2 dB in the pass through band would be good certainly for receiving only.
[12:18] <dbrooke> the plot on the ebay page zooms a bit better, though the scaling isn't great for insertion loss, but still looks < 1dB at 435 and 145 so should be OK
[12:33] <SpacenearUS> New position from 03KA6TVU-12 after 036 days silence - 12https://tracker.habhub.org/#!qm=All&q=KA6TVU-12
[12:43] <michal_f> I have a response from jani electronics: "0.2dB 2m 0.3dB 70cm"
[12:48] <michal_f> ok. ordered one :)
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[12:55] <PE2BZ> Nice figures :-)
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[13:37] <SpacenearUS> New position from 03W2GRK-11 after 0315 hours silence - 12https://tracker.habhub.org/#!qm=All&q=W2GRK-11
[14:11] Nick change: Kryczek_ -> Kryczek
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[15:21] <SpacenearUS> New vehicle on the map: 03OAQ-PIS - 12https://tracker.habhub.org/#!qm=All&q=OAQ-PIS
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[18:15] <SpacenearUS> New vehicle on the map: 03TORY_chase - 12https://tracker.habhub.org/#!qm=All&q=TORY_chase
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[19:12] <SpacenearUS> New position from 03LU1ESY-13 after 0318 hours silence - 12https://tracker.habhub.org/#!qm=All&q=LU1ESY-13
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[20:54] <SpacenearUS> New vehicle on the map: 03KD2KPZ-12 - 12https://tracker.habhub.org/#!qm=All&q=KD2KPZ-12
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[00:00] --- Tue Sep 24 2019