highaltitude.log.20190405

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[01:47] <SpacenearUS> New vehicle on the map: 03default_chase - 12https://tracker.habhub.org/#!qm=All&q=default_chase
[01:48] <SpacenearUS> New vehicle on the map: 03True - 12https://tracker.habhub.org/#!qm=All&q=True
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[02:18] <SpacenearUS> New vehicle on the map: 03masaChase_chase - 12https://tracker.habhub.org/#!qm=All&q=masaChase_chase
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[04:47] <SpacenearUS> New position from 03U3B-25 after 0314 hours silence - 12https://tracker.habhub.org/#!qm=All&q=U3B-25
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[08:16] <SpacenearUS> New vehicle on the map: 03SITS-6 - 12https://tracker.habhub.org/#!qm=All&q=SITS-6
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[08:57] <SpacenearUS> New vehicle on the map: 03masa01_chase - 12https://tracker.habhub.org/#!qm=All&q=masa01_chase
[09:14] <SpacenearUS> New vehicle on the map: 03ex2 - 12https://tracker.habhub.org/#!qm=All&q=ex2
[09:18] <SpacenearUS> New vehicle on the map: 03SP3KPH - 12https://tracker.habhub.org/#!qm=All&q=SP3KPH
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[10:06] <SpacenearUS> New vehicle on the map: 03SP3KPH-9 - 12https://tracker.habhub.org/#!qm=All&q=SP3KPH-9
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[10:13] <SpacenearUS> New vehicle on the map: 03SP3KPH-12 - 12https://tracker.habhub.org/#!qm=All&q=SP3KPH-12
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[10:29] <SpacenearUS> New position from 03U3S31 after 0314 hours silence - 12https://tracker.habhub.org/#!qm=All&q=U3S31
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[11:24] <SpacenearUS> New position from 03ICSPACE8 after 0312 hours silence - 12https://tracker.habhub.org/#!qm=All&q=ICSPACE8
[11:26] <SpacenearUS> New position from 03ICSPACE9 after 0312 hours silence - 12https://tracker.habhub.org/#!qm=All&q=ICSPACE9
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[11:43] <SpacenearUS> New vehicle on the map: 03N0CALL_chase - 12https://tracker.habhub.org/#!qm=All&q=N0CALL_chase
[11:57] <SpacenearUS> New vehicle on the map: 03tracher4 - 12https://tracker.habhub.org/#!qm=All&q=tracher4
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[12:13] <SpacenearUS> New vehicle on the map: 03SP8GPB-15 - 12https://tracker.habhub.org/#!qm=All&q=SP8GPB-15
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[12:32] <Bozzy> !flights
[12:32] <SpacenearUS> 03Bozzy: Current flights: 03ICSPACE8 10(cd6d), 03ICSPACE9 10(f3d6)
[12:33] <SpacenearUS> New vehicle on the map: 03SP3KSS_chase - 12https://tracker.habhub.org/#!qm=All&q=SP3KSS_chase
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[12:49] <SpacenearUS> New position from 03IK2MMR-12 after 03a day silence - 12https://tracker.habhub.org/#!qm=All&q=IK2MMR-12
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[12:53] <Ian_> GPS week number rollover at midnight zulu tonight :) If your satnavs are older, look to mfr's website for updates or report on vulnerable models.
[12:54] <Ian_> Right channel.
[12:54] <PE2BZ> Ian_ has Left the Wrong channel and is now in the Right channel
[12:55] <Ian_> All so confusing eh?
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[12:55] <PE2BZ> Yes indeed ;-)
[12:56] <PE2BZ> Almost as confusing as colour labelling your antenna cables and not writing down which one was which antenna
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[13:01] <Ian_> Is that a confession, and is it really that good for your soul. Some things you just need to keep secret, otherwise your XYL will remind you at every inconvenient opportunity for the rest of your born natural.
[13:10] <PE2BZ> Yes it is, and pleeeeaaase don´t tell her :-)
[13:20] <SpacenearUS> New vehicle on the map: 03ON8CF-9_chase - 12https://tracker.habhub.org/#!qm=All&q=ON8CF-9_chase
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[13:53] <Medad> Launch of pico balloons from London delayed by 1h. Launch closer to 4pm UK time
[13:54] <Medad> Trackers prepared now but need to fill balloons
[13:54] <Medad> this is for ICSPACE8 and ICSPACE9
[13:55] <PE2BZ> tnx update !
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[14:17] <Timur_> hello
[14:17] <Timur_> it is me again
[14:18] <Timur_> we have couple of questions, hope you'll advice something)
[14:19] <PE2BZ> Welcome back :-)
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[14:19] <Timur_> what cameras should we use to take pictures on our HAB? we need to connect 2 cameras to stm32
[14:20] <PE2BZ> What type of interface for the camera on stm32 ?
[14:24] <Timur_> we want to send commands to our camera using digital pins with the help of transistor
[14:25] <chris_99> will the camera use SPI/... though?
[14:25] <PE2BZ> Do you want to transmit the camera images or ¨just recover¨ and save from the SD card ?
[14:26] <Timur_> i mean we want to use a normal camera, not like arducam. so we can insert sd card in the camera and just tell it to take a photo
[14:27] <PE2BZ> Fixed focus camera ? Or do you intend to zoom in / zoom out ?
[14:27] <Timur_> so it will not use stm32 to transfer the picture from camera to sd card
[14:27] <PE2BZ> clear :-)
[14:27] <Timur_> fixed focus i think
[14:28] <PE2BZ> Is the STM32 prescribed ? I would fly 2 PI´s with Pi camera....
[14:29] <PE2BZ> Action cam clones in their correspondig case could be an option ?
[14:30] <Timur_> well, it is not prescripted but we already have it, so i think we'll stick with stm
[14:30] <chris_99> sorry misunderstood what you meant. what stm32 are you using out of interest?
[14:31] <daveake> If there's no need to get at the photos during flight, just use an action cam
[14:32] <Timur_> what action cams do you suggest?
[14:34] <Bozzy> Has ICSPACE launched yet?
[14:35] <PE2BZ> it´s delayed for one hour, filling now
[14:35] <Bozzy> Cool, thanks
[14:35] <PE2BZ> launch close to 4 pm UK time
[14:36] <Timur_> we are using STM32F407VGT6
[14:36] <PE2BZ> Timur_, you need to adapt the action cam clone to accept external input for making a photo
[14:36] <PE2BZ> It´s not default on most camera´s
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[14:37] <hyde00001> Timur_ have you seen this: https://www.st.com/content/ccc/resource/training/technical/product_training/group0/90/5a/91/24/1a/14/4b/40/STM32F7_Peripheral_DCMI/files/STM32F7_Peripheral_DCMI.pdf/_jcr_content/translations/en.STM32F7_Peripheral_DCMI.pdf
[14:37] <PE2BZ> https://www.amazon.co.uk/Action-Camera-1080p-Waterproof-Sports/dp/B01535HSUG
[14:37] <PE2BZ> Not expensive, quite nice image quality
[14:38] <hyde00001> HD sports cam £11.80... what is the world coming too...
[14:38] <PE2BZ> daveake, would you know if this one works on a normal Pi (Pi zero) https://www.antratek.nl/13-2mp-mipi-camera-module?gclid=CjwKCAjw-ZvlBRBbEiwANw9UWkTsnxb5jRs69jjcoM5PF94nw0oVqHomvVLHysG-Vb4Cc0SWzc3fGxoCnYcQAvD_BwE
[14:39] <hyde00001> The SD card will be more expensive...
[14:39] <Timur_> i would love to hear all the suggetions on action cameras and simple cameras like arducam if you think that it will work on HAB
[14:39] <daveake> I like the Gitup Git2 as a cheap but good and reliable action cam
[14:39] <Timur_> i'll chek the links thanks
[14:39] <PE2BZ> hyde00001, not exactly, the offer is 32 GB for extra 6 UK pound actually :-)
[14:40] <hyde00001> I would recommend using a an action camera - interfacing cameras to micro-controllers isn't trivial unless you know what you re doing.
[14:40] <daveake> PE2BZ: Only the original Omni and the current Sony sensors will work on the Pi
[14:40] <PE2BZ> thanks
[14:40] <hyde00001> £5.20!
[14:42] <SpacenearUS> New vehicle on the map: 03SILTS1 - 12https://tracker.habhub.org/#!qm=All&q=SILTS1
[14:42] <hyde00001> upvote Gitup... SJCAM SJ2000 unreliable at altitude...
[14:43] <Timur_> we have some experiense interfacing cameras to micro controllers so we'll appreciate all the suggetions on these type of cameras too)
[14:43] <Timur_> thanks
[14:43] <hyde00001> (at least mine is...)
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[14:46] <hyde00001> FWIW, don't put the action cam in its underwater case - it just fogs up as the pressure changes.
[14:51] <Medad> really sorry for the delay, ICSPACE8 will launch in 30 min
[14:51] <Medad> then ICSPACE9 in around 10 min after that. We have prefilled both balloons in our workshop and will release them one after the other
[14:52] <Medad> Thank you for your patience
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[15:21] <SpacenearUS> New position from 03KD0VJI-4 after 032 days silence - 12https://tracker.habhub.org/#!qm=All&q=KD0VJI-4
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[15:27] <Medad> ok getting ready to launch ICSPACE8
[15:28] <Bozzy> Is it still predicted to sail North?
[15:28] <Medad> yes
[15:28] <Bozzy> OK, will try to track if it comes up here
[15:32] <PE2BZ> Patience ? ;-)
[15:32] <Medad> 434.601 MHz.
[15:32] <Medad> going to release in 1 min
[15:35] <Medad> icpsace8 launched!
[15:35] <PE2BZ> Yeahhh !
[15:41] <Medad> very slow rise though
[15:41] <Medad> but it is going!
[15:41] <Bozzy> What altitude are you expecting?
[15:42] <PE2BZ> If the tcxo works out OK the radio over here could follow it through the night.
[15:43] <PE2BZ> the predictor image in ukhas groups goes for 8000 m
[15:43] <PE2BZ> If I recall right
[15:43] <Medad> yes
[15:44] Last message repeated 1 time(s).
[15:44] <Medad> 674m altitude now
[15:44] <Medad> going very well
[15:44] <Medad> GPS works nicely
[15:45] <PE2BZ> I need 3000 m more altitude so I have to be patient....
[15:47] <Medad> ok that is nice
[15:50] <PE2BZ> Did you use plastic spray for the coating ?
[15:50] <SpacenearUS> New vehicle on the map: 03SSTAR0286 - 12https://tracker.habhub.org/#!qm=All&q=SSTAR0286
[15:53] <Bozzy> See hun, how can that be tracked from Greece?
[15:54] <PE2BZ> websdr from UK
[15:54] <Bozzy> habhub I mean
[15:54] <PE2BZ> Might be the suws websdr ?
[15:57] <Bozzy> ICSPACE9 going up soon?
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[16:04] <Medad> ICSPACE9 will go up after a few minutes
[16:04] <Medad> PE2BZ we used acrylic conformal coating by MG chemicals
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[16:05] <Medad> ICSPACE8 is doing quite well. I think we will soon prepare ICSPACE9
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[16:14] <Medad> Ok we will launch ICSPACE9 very soon. Testing everything
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[16:17] <Medad> Everything is working on ICSPACE9. Getting ready to launch
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[16:18] <Medad> 434.251MHZ for ICSPACE9
[16:19] <SpacenearUS> New vehicle on the map: 03WB0URW-5 - 12https://tracker.habhub.org/#!qm=All&q=WB0URW-5
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[16:20] <Robert_mja> Is ICPACE8 with your self-tuned GPS antenna?
[16:25] <Robert_mja> maybe a nice idea for the next flight with 2 balloons at a time is to link the send start time to the gps time. Then both balloons can send alternately on the same frequency :-) More easy to follow both balloons.
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[16:26] <Medad> ICSPACE9 launched!!
[16:26] <Medad> ICSPACE9 is the one with the guitar wire antenna
[16:27] <Medad> ICSPACE8 has a off the shelf ceremic patch antenna
[16:27] <Medad> for GPS
[16:27] <Robert_mja> Ok, nice experiment!
[16:30] <Medad> Still we can see that our guitar wire antenna is really struggling
[16:30] <SpacenearUS> New vehicle on the map: 03default_chase - 12https://tracker.habhub.org/#!qm=All&q=default_chase
[16:30] <Medad> takes maybe 10 s for a fix
[16:31] <Medad> instead of 3s with ceramic patch antenna
[16:44] <Bozzy> Just starting to see a signal here from ICSPACE8
[16:44] <Medad> nice!
[16:44] <Medad> ICSPACE9 is doing nicely as well
[16:45] <Medad> Anybody seeing significant frequency drift on ICSPACE8 or 9?
[16:45] <PE2BZ> I might need to have to wait till tomorrow....
[16:47] <Bozzy> Yay, just got a green
[16:51] <Medad> lovely!
[16:52] <PE2BZ> On the Farnham web sdr there is no trace of drift for nr 8
[16:53] <PE2BZ> same for nr 9, looks nice on frequency both
[16:59] <Medad> wonderful
[16:59] <Medad> Lovely day for a lovely flight
[17:00] <Medad> Very slow flight today for us. All our last flights have been during some storm or hurricane
[17:10] <Bozzy> Bad altiture reading for a while?
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[17:16] <Medad> yes there are some errors. Next time I will use the validity flag on given by the ublox gps
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[17:19] <SpacenearUS> New vehicle on the map: 03masaChase_chase - 12https://tracker.habhub.org/#!qm=All&q=masaChase_chase
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[17:40] <PE2BZ> ICSPACE8 has reached floating state
[17:40] <PE2BZ> which gives this http://predict.habhub.org/#!/uuid=49e503bb7d217223c733c5d6c9aa5626046ad0b7
[17:40] <PE2BZ> sort of
[17:42] <Bozzy> Getting a lot of drift from 9 in dl-digi, AFC struggles with it
[17:42] <Bozzy> It's like the transmitter is cooling and heating
[17:45] <Bozzy> With every transmission?
[17:47] <Robert_mja> Or this, I yhink: http://predict.habhub.org/#!/uuid=bfdc60bdfdeec6b93cc90a5328d33dd6269047e2
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[17:57] <Medad> [17:42] <Bozzy>
[17:57] <Medad> Interesting Bozzy. we did see the drift on 9 but AFC could handle it
[17:58] <Medad> Now we will tune in again. Back indoors. It is too cold outside
[17:58] <Bozzy> The issue for me is the AFC dropping back to the lower frequency on new transmission
[17:59] <Bozzy> Not dropping back quick enough I mean
[17:59] <Bozzy> ICSPACE8 does the same but not as bad
[18:02] <PE2BZ> Robert_mja, your burst altitude appears to be over optimistic :-)
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[18:04] <Robert_mja> With the accent rate set it will not come to that hight ;-)
[18:06] <Robert_mja> Medad, how did you fill the balloons so accurately, they float at almost exactly the same height!
[18:09] <PE2BZ> Robert_mja, then I take this approach :-) http://predict.habhub.org/#!/uuid=26494aea69618600ccf0714159a855eb3fe06cae
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[18:28] <Medad> Robert_mja the float altitude for the second one was expected to be much higher, targeting 9000m
[18:29] <Medad> weight was 16.8g with a net lift of 5g
[18:29] <Medad> for the earlier ICSPACE8, weight of tracker was 21g with a much heavier ceramic patch antenna with a net lift of 3g
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[18:30] <garymortimer> salut
[18:31] <garymortimer> whose idea was it have ICSPACE transmit every two minutes or so? Whats the deal with that?
[18:32] <Robert_mja> Ok! I have to leave now, will look later how it's going... Balloon is going in the wrong direction to receive something for me ;-)
[18:33] <garymortimer> Is it for battery life??
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[19:04] <Medad> <garymortimer> yes it is for battery life
[19:05] <Medad> we want it to transmit as long as possible
[19:05] <Medad> is there significant drift on Icspace9?
[19:07] <Bozzy> Still tracking 8 here, the drift is a lot less now for some reason, not checked 9
[19:11] <SA6BSS-Mike> Medad: how did you seal the balloons?
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[19:13] <Medad> Thanks for the information
[19:14] <Bozzy> Is 8 dropping or altitude measurement issues again?
[19:15] <SA6BSS-Mike> looks like both is dropping
[19:15] <SA6BSS-Mike> looking at https://www.accuweather.com/en/world/satellite it seems to be clouds in the area
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[19:18] <Bozzy> I am guessing incorrect readings as 8 has a very strong signal here
[19:19] <SA6BSS-Mike> what call are you on the map?
[19:19] <Bozzy> Bozzy, I am in York
[19:19] <SA6BSS-Mike> yeah, I see
[19:20] <SA6BSS-Mike> im quite sure the readings are correct, are you refering to having a strong signal just at outer bluer ring ?
[19:21] <SA6BSS-Mike> then remeber the lower the balloon is the shorter the los and therefore alot stronger signal even at 5°
[19:22] <Bozzy> Yes, but having said that, just checked the waterfall, the signal has gone down now
[19:22] <SA6BSS-Mike> oki
[19:23] <Bozzy> Earlier, 8 dropped by 8000ft then went straight back up again going by readings
[19:23] <SIbot> In real units: 8000 ft = 2438 m
[19:25] <SA6BSS-Mike> its the clouds, then it drys out a lower altitude and rises again, but at night no sun to dry it so it falls allt eh way dowb
[19:25] <SA6BSS-Mike> n
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[19:40] <Bozzy> Your right, it has dropped, signal faded to zero here
[19:43] <SA6BSS-Mike> it usuly have a realy strong signal, and then just in 10min almost dissapear
[19:43] <SA6BSS-Mike> and as tge drop and gain in altitude are quite linear its a sign of the gps working as it should
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[19:53] <Medad> I am back. The drop does not look like gps errors. It is indeed falling. I thought it might decend around 2000m after nightfall and stablise but it seems to have come a bit too low.
[19:53] <Medad> Interesting explaination SA6BSS-Mike
[19:54] <Medad> is it raining near the balloons?
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[19:57] <Bozzy> Telford weather says not
[19:58] <SA6BSS-Mike> Medad: it is cloudy https://www.accuweather.com/en/world/satellite
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[19:59] <Medad> ok. I guess the clouds are wet
[20:00] <Bozzy> Getting very low now
[20:02] <Medad> yes. sad
[20:03] <SA6BSS-Mike> Medad: how did you seal the balloons?
[20:04] <Medad> impulse sealer over the valve
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[20:05] <SA6BSS-Mike> Medad: try fastdrying suplerglue on at least one of the paylods next time
[20:05] <Medad> hmm. interesting
[20:10] <Bozzy> No updates since 8 mins, not good :-(
[20:11] <Bozzy> Same with 9?
[20:12] <Medad> it seems to have disappeared from radar some time ago
[20:12] <Bozzy> Leak maybe on both?
[20:13] <Medad> there is a chance of a leak. this is the first time we heat sealed them
[20:13] <SA6BSS-Mike> looking at the altitude curve it sugests leak as there was no time in float before it started decending
[20:14] <Medad> yes. Maybe the heat sealer just put holes around the valve
[20:15] <Bozzy> So looks maybe as both got a leak at around 19,000 ft ?
[20:15] <SIbot> In real units: 19,000 ft = 5791 m
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[20:17] <Medad> ICSPACE9 did not get off to a good start. We expected it to reach 9000m from our past launch experience. However, the take off was very very sluggish and only reached around 6000m. Maybe at 6000m it expanded to its full volume and just started leaking after that
[20:18] <Medad> I will send a picture of the seal
[20:23] <Medad> http://www.union.ic.ac.uk/guilds/icseds/wp-content/uploads/2019/04/20190405_154401.jpg
[20:23] <Medad> http://www.union.ic.ac.uk/guilds/icseds/wp-content/uploads/2019/04/20190405_154615.jpg
[20:23] <Medad> These are 2 pictures of the seal made with the impulse sealer
[20:24] <SA6BSS-Mike> the seal looks good but there is a self seal of a different material inside that nozzle
[20:24] <Medad> yes that is true
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[20:24] <Medad> we did not remove that.
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[20:26] <Medad> Tomasz Brol at UKHAS conference 2018 recommended removing the self sealing valve before heat sealing
[20:26] <SA6BSS-Mike> ok, that makes sence
[20:26] <SA6BSS-Mike> or glue it :)
[20:27] <Medad> His view was the self sealing valve leaks helium. I don't know if glue can form an air tight seal
[20:28] <SA6BSS-Mike> it does, I have tried it several times and now it works
[20:29] <SA6BSS-Mike> but you will probably save 1-2 gram removing the seal
[20:29] <Medad> what glue do you use?
[20:29] <Medad> and did you also use heat sealing?
[20:30] <Medad> with the glue?
[20:31] <SA6BSS-Mike> never heat seald anything I have flown, always use glue, not importent what you use, just clear fastdrying, any type is good, tried 5-6 differnt ones , all have worked
[20:31] <Medad> any brand you recommend?
[20:32] <Medad> how do you precisely measure the free lift and adjust it without a self sealing balloon?
[20:33] <SA6BSS-Mike> im using a Sealing clip like this https://www.ikea.com/ca/en/catalog/products/10339171/
[20:34] <Medad> Then when you want to add a little more helium/hydrogen, do you remove the clip? does the gas then all leak out?
[20:35] <SA6BSS-Mike> no, ofc not, its just a tiny fraction in the ballon at the top, nothing gets in or out
[20:35] <SA6BSS-Mike> it is a bit trycky the first time but you get it
[20:38] <SA6BSS-Mike> so i, Im of for a moment,
[20:41] <Medad> Thanks for the info Mikael
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[21:20] <SpacenearUS> New position from 03IK2MMR-12 after 038 hours silence - 12https://tracker.habhub.org/#!qm=All&q=IK2MMR-12
[21:22] <SA6BSS-Mike> Medad: chears, looking forward to your nexr
[21:22] <SA6BSS-Mike> next launch
[21:26] <Medad> may I know the exact brand of the glue you used to seal the balloons? It will be easier for us to get it. Is it super glue? stick glue? something like this? https://www.amazon.co.uk/UHU-38106-All-Purpose-Adhesive/dp/B0031RG2GA
[21:27] <Medad> Balloons are really addictive. such excitement
[21:28] <Medad> Balloons are really big people's lego
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[21:48] <SpacenearUS> New position from 03SQ9MOA-12 after 034 days silence - 12https://tracker.habhub.org/#!qm=All&q=SQ9MOA-12
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[22:08] <Ian_> Medad superglue is another name for cyanoacrylate https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cyanoacrylate
[22:09] <Ian_> PoundLand, anywhere with a healthy turnover. Model aircraft makers used to keep it in the refrigerator to keep it fresh.
[22:11] <Ian_> £1 should get you anywhere from 5 to 10 small single use tubes, with oodles of the stuff; more than enough to get your fingers temporarily stuck together. :)
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[22:16] <SA6BSS-Mike> Ian_: yes, correct, I have used this 4 pack for just a 1£ https://www.biltema.se/bygg/kemikalier/lim/superlim-2000035422 its not realy critical, I asume its about the same compund in all of the glues avalible
[22:16] <SA6BSS-Mike> fast drying that is
[22:19] <Ian_> Pretty much so I imagine. It's also very convenient in the smaller tubes, so less waste, but still enough left over after most small jobs that wicked minds will look for other applications. I did lay a thumb knuckle open with the edge of a Surform tool a few years ago - who would have thought that edge was serrated? - I filled the wound with cyanoacrylate, stung like hell, but closed it ... until I bent the thumb :)
[22:20] <SA6BSS-Mike> lol
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[00:00] --- Sat Apr 6 2019