highaltitude.log.20190329

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[05:23] <SpacenearUS> New position from 03KD0VJI-4 after 0313 hours silence - 12https://tracker.habhub.org/#!qm=All&q=KD0VJI-4
[07:05] <SpacenearUS> New position from 03BSS19 after 0317 hours silence - 12https://tracker.habhub.org/#!qm=All&q=BSS19
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[08:27] <trickv_> Does anyone have experience launching cheap flights using party balloons? I'm looking to do a cheap and cheerful launch in New Zealand tomorrow with a small 100g payload and a "90 party balloon" and wondering what kind of burst diameter a cheap balloon like this might be likely to yield.
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[08:32] <SA6BSS-Mike> trickv_: we ping Ben he might have an idéa PE2BZ
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[08:43] <M6BQV> Quite looking forwards to VLTHAB launch this morning - may be the first launch I can RX and help track
[08:45] <fsphil> where's it launching from?
[08:46] <M6BQV> Aylesbury
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[08:49] <M6BQV> If it get's high enough I should get it - I've not had a chance to confirm my station is working
[08:51] <fsphil> !flights
[08:51] <SpacenearUS> 03fsphil: Current flights: 03PICO-32 144.251 MHz CTSTIA32/1000 10(33b0), 03Pico-Bello-again 10(99f6), 03JHN Launch 10(5ce3), 03Vanguard Learning Trust Launch 2 10(f235)
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[09:12] <FuzzyLemon> Thanks! Any help tracking would be much appreciated!
[09:14] <FuzzyLemon> We are aiming to launch at 10
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[09:25] <M6BQV> @FuzzyLemon Best of Luck
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[09:35] <SpacenearUS> New position from 03E1 after 0310 hours silence - 12https://tracker.habhub.org/#!qm=All&q=E1
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[09:42] <SpacenearUS> New vehicle on the map: 03JHNBALLOONV3 - 12https://tracker.habhub.org/#!qm=All&q=JHNBALLOONV3
[09:42] <SpacenearUS> New vehicle on the map: 03VLTHAB - 12https://tracker.habhub.org/#!qm=All&q=VLTHAB
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[09:50] <SpacenearUS> New position from 03PEPER-1 after 03a day silence - 12https://tracker.habhub.org/#!qm=All&q=PEPER-1
[10:08] <M6BQV> VLTHAB is away! Good luck
[10:09] <M6BQV> Maybe not!
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[10:17] <M6BQV> FuzzyLemon, had a spot of trouble?
[10:22] <FuzzyLemon> Just making last minute camera adjustments
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[10:22] <FuzzyLemon> Launch will be more like 11
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[10:25] <M6BQV> No rush
[10:26] <Bozzy> !flights
[10:26] <SpacenearUS> 03Bozzy: Current flights: 03PICO-32 144.251 MHz CTSTIA32/1000 10(33b0), 03Pico-Bello-again 10(99f6), 03JHN Launch 10(5ce3), 03Vanguard Learning Trust Launch 2 10(f235)
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[10:48] <FuzzyLemon> ok finally starting to fill the balloon now
[10:58] <SpacenearUS> New vehicle on the map: 03hatTrick - 12https://tracker.habhub.org/#!qm=All&q=hatTrick
[10:58] <SpacenearUS> New position from 03PICO-WL after 032 days silence - 12https://tracker.habhub.org/#!qm=All&q=PICO-WL
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[11:22] <FuzzyLemon> VLTHAB is up
[11:23] <FuzzyLemon> but we have lost RTTY and Lora signals here :(
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[11:23] <M6BQV> Nothing here I'm afraid
[11:25] <FuzzyLemon> Still getting a weird single sideband on rtty
[11:25] <FuzzyLemon> nothing on lora
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[11:31] <Bozzy> Cracking signal here from JHN
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[11:32] <g8fjg> VLTHAB i just see single carrier on 434.500 in the right direction..
[11:34] <FuzzyLemon_> yep that's what we have too
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[11:35] <FuzzyLemon_> any ideas why that might have happened?
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[12:01] <SpacenearUS> New position from 03E3 after 0312 days silence - 12https://tracker.habhub.org/#!qm=All&q=E3
[12:01] <M6BQV> Do you think I should hear a high balloon with a whip on the top of the car?
[12:01] <M6BQV> Located Near Gatwick Airport - south of London
[12:04] <SpacenearUS> New vehicle on the map: 03X7 - 12https://tracker.habhub.org/#!qm=All&q=X7
[12:09] <SpacenearUS> New vehicle on the map: 03MotoG5_Chase - 12https://tracker.habhub.org/#!qm=All&q=MotoG5_Chase
[12:10] <PE2BZ> trickv_, with 90 cm party balloons I take the 110 cm burst diameter from the calculator (Hwoyee 30 gram). 100 gram payload likely to burst at 13 km altitude, 30 gram payload burst at 17 km altitude both on 2.5 m/s ascend
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[12:27] <hyde00001> M6BQV - yes you should be able to hear JHN like that, though is falling now so the window of opportunity is closing
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[12:32] <M6BQV> Hmmm, couldnt read it at all during the whole flight - must have something setup wrong - I'm using an SDR that I normally use as an RX only iGate for APRS - should work if I just change frequency
[12:33] <hyde00001> yes in principle, I'm listening on a "real radio" and can hear it fine. do you have the sdr software set up for USB
[12:33] <hyde00001> im in Oxford - similar distance to payload...
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[12:34] <M6BQV> Yes, USB clear LOS to the North of me. Strange - may build a moxon rectangle for future passes
[12:34] <M6BQV> *flights
[12:35] <hyde00001> habamp might be the answer... https://store.uputronics.com/index.php?route=product/product&path=59&product_id=53
[12:36] <hyde00001> that said I'm really struggling with dl-fldigi today - its like the waterfall is "stuck" anyone got any suggestions? (Mac OSX just updated...) (dl-fldigi 3.21)
[12:37] <M6BQV> Yeah could be beneficial - I heard absolutely nothing though. Waterfall was just static except for some 433 device lower down the band
[12:37] <M6BQV> Had 2500hz band width
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[12:40] <hyde00001> Although there isn't a calendar entry look like Steve Randall (X7) might be planning on launching from Elsworth, so you might be able to have another go...
[12:42] <PE2BZ> hyde00001, the waterfall is stuck ? The signal appears but you cannot tune ?
[12:42] <M6BQV> I've got to drive up to London now - station back to APRS - I'll have another go soon. Exciting stuff but wish I could de-code. Got my own PITS built in some polystyrene - just waiting on an SD card in the post to start configuring it
[12:43] <hyde00001> PE2BZ - no. waterfall is black no movement at all. I know sound is getting to computer via USB sound card but dl-fldigi doesn't seem to be listening or its on a tea break
[12:44] <PE2BZ> Values for min and max waterfall are not set to the same value ?
[12:46] <hyde00001> https://imgur.com/a/GfEounu
[12:46] <hyde00001> ooh ill look for that...
[12:48] <hyde00001> In DL client settings, frequency tracking min 1000 max 2000
[12:48] <hyde00001> is that what you meant?
[12:48] <PE2BZ> no, the -20 and +70 are set allright
[12:50] <hyde00001> been ages since i've been listening to rtty...become more of LoRa person...
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[13:04] <PE2BZ> hyde00001, it appears the mac also has privacy settings to enable fldigi to use the audio sources ?
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[13:04] <PE2BZ> https://groups.io/g/linuxham/topic/mac_o_s_10_14_mojave_and/27388506?p=,,,20,0,0,0::recentpostdate%2Fsticky,,,20,2,0,27388506
[13:06] <hyde00001> mmmm looking at link and my setting...
[13:08] <hyde00001> wow genius seem to do the trick at least I have a moving waterfall now...
[13:08] <hyde00001> not sure I would have ever found that setting
[13:09] <PE2BZ> :-)
[13:10] <PE2BZ> I´m on 434.337 atm :-0
[13:10] <hyde00001> FWIW in case anyone is looking at log later - on most recent Mac OSX had to enable microphone for dl-fldigi within Security & Privacy tab of System Preferences
[13:11] <hyde00001> tuning now, but poor antenna so need the blue circle to come a bit closer....
[13:12] <PE2BZ> Take your time, so does my payload :-)
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[13:20] <hyde00001> hint of something on 434.337
[13:20] <hyde00001> https://i.imgur.com/Pp3Vcfq.png
[13:20] <hyde00001> oops probably should have been a link not a straight image...
[13:21] <PE2BZ> Only 1 trace ? Where´s my other half ?
[13:21] <hyde00001> doesn't really look or sound like RTTY yet...
[13:21] <hyde00001> quite
[13:21] <PE2BZ> turn of the SQL first
[13:23] <PE2BZ> Frequency for X7 anyone ?
[13:23] <hyde00001> ±sql didn't really help
[13:24] <PE2BZ> tx is a number of rtty strings followed by CW callsign and locator
[13:24] <G8KNN> X7 on 434.052 150 baud 7n1
[13:25] <PE2BZ> tnx
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[13:30] <hyde00001> X7 :-)
[13:31] <PE2BZ> You abandoned me ? :-P
[13:32] <hyde00001> i'm looking at that blue line...
[13:32] <hyde00001> once it reaches oxford i'm back in...
[13:32] <PE2BZ> accepted ;-)
[13:32] <hyde00001> odd that i could only see "one half" any ideas?
[13:33] <hyde00001> getting nearer
[13:33] <PE2BZ> That could have been 20 seconds CW or did it take more as 20 seconds ?
[13:33] <hyde00001> no listened for quite a while
[13:33] <PE2BZ> Hoping for this http://predict.habhub.org/#!/uuid=3ee0e1fa81026f52a7ba7fcbfbddfe9000f5e2a5
[13:34] <hyde00001> come on PICO-WL come west to the UK and help us celebrate Still-In-EU-Day
[13:35] <dschadlich> Hi, I am looking to launch a balloon with a payload transmitting WSPR on 20m. I am expecting my flight to take me across the Atlantic. I was wondering what type of regulations I need to be aware of when my balloon travels over other countries?
[13:37] <PE2BZ> hyde00001, green for X& over here :-) You can do it !
[13:37] <PE2BZ> dschadlich, I would say only the regulations for airborne frequency use in certain area´s
[13:39] <hyde00001> one tone centred on 434.337.3
[13:40] <hyde00001> in the words of spinal tap - where
[13:40] <hyde00001> is my other sausage
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[13:44] <hyde00001> maybe this should be the year I get an actual antenna for home rather than using a magnetic whip stuck to an old biscuit tin balanced on a window sill
[13:44] <Robert_mja> What does the errocode bit mean in the pico-bello telemetry?
[13:50] <hyde00001> sorry PE2BZ, ditched you again for my other HAB...
[13:54] <PE2BZ> Robert_mja, 0 is good :-)
[13:54] <PE2BZ> I have to ask YO3ICT
[13:56] <hyde00001> PE2BZ, blue line in Oxford, but still only one tone... need to upgrade my biscuit tine setup...
[13:56] <PE2BZ> with only 540 hz shift you should not miss half the signal....
[13:59] <hyde00001> plenty of room to see it, I guess my setup sub-optimal
[14:02] <hyde00001> putting "my" tone at either 1000 or 2000 on the waterfall doesn't help...
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[14:07] <hyde00001> my other "girlfriend" has two tones... :-(
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[14:14] <hyde00001> anyone know the E3 LoRa settings?
[14:14] <daveake> I might :)
[14:14] <daveake> Not flying today
[14:14] <PE2BZ> E3, not E1 ;-)
[14:15] <daveake> Same answer
[14:15] <PE2BZ> E3 thinks different ?
[14:15] <PE2BZ> Hello, I am at 19.690 m altitude close to X7 :-)
[14:16] <daveake> Oh, sneaky Steve is flying my tracker :)
[14:16] <hyde00001> E3 look like its on same flight as X7... Dave are you doing something clever with telem??
[14:16] <hyde00001> aaaah simpler answer...
[14:16] <daveake> E7 is an in-flight repeater for E1/E2, when I get round to launching them
[14:16] <daveake> E3 ^
[14:17] <SpacenearUS> New vehicle on the map: 03G8KHW_Tab2_chase - 12https://tracker.habhub.org/#!qm=All&q=G8KHW_Tab2_chase
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[14:17] <daveake> So yeah it'll be 434.450MHz mode 7
[14:17] <daveake> Assuming Steve hasn't changed it
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[14:24] <hyde00001> isn't happening for me on 434.450/7 but I'm having that sort of day :-(
[14:24] <hyde00001> ooh tell a lie
[14:25] <hyde00001> yes 434.450/7 is fine if i turn the PITS transmitting on 434.436 on my bench off....
[14:26] <PE2BZ> sigh ;-)
[14:27] <PE2BZ> Been there, done that :-)
[14:32] <hyde00001> PE2BZ not helping me with your flight though...
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[14:33] <PE2BZ> That´s a bit pitty, but no worries. If it gets to the right altitude and does not burst it will reverse and travel back to the Netherlands and Germany
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[14:53] <Robert_mja> I hope that will happen soon :-) Signal is to weak now to decode here, "Veluwe" between my antenna and the balloon I think.
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[14:59] <PE2BZ> If it floats at around 12 km it will take some time to turn..... Time will tell ;-)
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[15:23] <hyde00001> Looks like a convenient landing for E3/X7
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[15:39] <hyde00001> This: https://twitter.com/i/events/1111513330575765505
[15:51] <PE2BZ> PICO-WL did burst :-(
[15:54] <hyde00001> Booo
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[16:01] Action: PE2BZ rows his boat gently down the stream
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[16:37] <hyde00001> PE2BZ - sort of interesting news - my one tone has gone suggesting that it was dependent on PICO-WL
[16:39] <hyde00001> Shame I never got to hear it properly... In other news, looks like my "other girlfriend" was recovered
[16:48] <hyde00001> G8KHW - forget something?
[17:02] <SpacenearUS> New vehicle on the map: 03W1DMA-11 - 12https://tracker.habhub.org/#!qm=All&q=W1DMA-11
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[17:04] <SpacenearUS> New vehicle on the map: 03OK7DMT-1 - 12https://tracker.habhub.org/#!qm=All&q=OK7DMT-1
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[17:04] <cm13g09> .... https://www.bbc.co.uk/newsround/47744431
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[17:47] <SpacenearUS> New position from 03U3B-25 after 0314 hours silence - 12https://tracker.habhub.org/#!qm=All&q=U3B-25
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[18:25] <SpacenearUS> New vehicle on the map: 03KK6UUQ-3 - 12https://tracker.habhub.org/#!qm=All&q=KK6UUQ-3
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[19:12] <garc> hello to everyone
[19:13] <PE2BZ> Good morning afternoon evening
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[19:15] <garc> i have to ask a question i have 2 meteorological balloons
[19:16] <garc> the 1st is not guaranteed is not a well known company for meteorological balloons
[19:17] <garc> i am thinking of putting the good one in to the other in order to make it much more durable
[19:17] <garc> is it a good idea?
[19:20] <garc> any thoughts?
[19:22] <daveake> More durable in what way? It would help a little with potential damage on the ground, but anything sharp will pierce both anyway
[19:22] <daveake> You'll need more gas
[19:22] <daveake> So no, I don't think it's a good idea.
[19:24] <garc> I mean before the helium floating to fill the one balloon in to the other in order to gain more altitude...
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[19:27] <garc> i think that following this way we will gain a bit more altitude
[19:27] <garc> am I right?
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[19:29] <daveake> You won't gain more altitude, no.
[19:29] <daveake> When the last balloon bursts determines the max altitude
[19:30] <daveake> And that's determined by the balloon and amount of gas
[19:34] <garc> I cann't understand the reason I will use the same amount of gas because the one balloon will be inside of the other! We will not have 2 separate balloons we would have to meteorological balloons in to one one balloon inside the another
[19:35] <garc> so we will have one more layer in the main balloon
[19:37] <PE2BZ> Why would that bring you more altitude ? the amount of gas is the same and the weight is more....
[19:37] <SA6BSS-Mike> but the burst diamater of the first balloon will stil be the same, and you ad extra weight as a second balloon
[19:40] <garc> yes I undertand but there are from a different company!
[19:41] <SA6BSS-Mike> try, if you already have the balloon why not try
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[19:43] <garc> yes but If I use only the one I will be able to make and a 2nd flight....
[19:44] <garc> If I use both of them one inside another we may have a more durable flight
[19:45] <garc> and I believe that because the one is Hwoyee and the other one is a balloon named cloudbuster ballooon from pionneer line!
[19:45] <PE2BZ> What is the part you don´t trust about the ¨cheap brand¨ ?
[19:46] <garc> the 2nd one is not refering the burst diameter!
[19:46] <garc> it's from a greek store here in my town
[19:46] <PE2BZ> SA6BSS-Mike, the reset chips are in, might put the RS41 on the roof tomorrow with 6 x 52 x 52 panels and the chip.
[19:46] <PE2BZ> what did it cost ?
[19:46] <PE2BZ> @ garc
[19:47] <garc> the greek one?
[19:47] <PE2BZ> yes
[19:47] <garc> 35 euros
[19:48] <PE2BZ> For one piece ? What size did you order ?
[19:49] <garc> the only size that he was having in the store was 5,5 ft with a recommended helium lift of 2,2 lbs and a maximum helium lift of 4,6 lbs
[19:49] <SIbot> In real units: 5,5 ft = 17 m
[19:49] <SIbot> In real units: 2,2 lbs = 10.0 kg
[19:49] <PE2BZ> Did you put it on a scale to tell the weight ?
[19:51] <garc> of course! I used a kitchen weighter to weight the greek balloon to find how heavy was...
[19:51] <garc> the greek one is 340grams
[19:51] <PE2BZ> Why does SIbot say that 5,5 ft = 17 meter ?
[19:51] <SIbot> In real units: 5,5 ft = 17 m
[19:52] <PE2BZ> 1 ft
[19:52] <SIbot> In real units: 1 ft = 0.30 m
[19:52] <PE2BZ> so 5 ft
[19:52] <SIbot> In real units: 5 ft = 1.52 m
[19:52] <PE2BZ> so 5.5 ft
[19:52] <SIbot> In real units: 5 ft = 1.52 m
[19:52] <PE2BZ> so 5,5 ft
[19:52] <SIbot> In real units: 5,5 ft = 17 m
[19:52] <dbrooke> it's ignoring the ',' so 55ft
[19:52] <SIbot> In real units: 55 ft = 17 m
[19:52] <PE2BZ> thanks, could have taken me a while to reach that point ;-)
[19:52] <PE2BZ> 17 m
[19:53] <dbrooke> not the smartest parser it seems ...
[19:53] <PE2BZ> garc why would you pay 35 Euro for a balloon with 1m50 diameter ?
[19:53] <dbrooke> it did the same for 2,2 lbs which is how I spotted the bug
[19:53] <SIbot> In real units: 2,2 lbs = 10.0 kg
[19:53] <SA6BSS-Mike> PE2BZ: ok, had mine out with large cells today but it was so heavy winds that it had tripped the quite robust wood structure and smashed the cells ... next tryout sunday morning as it looks like it gona be sunny then
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[19:54] <PE2BZ> SA6BSS-Mike, sorry to hear about all the smashed work :-( We have sun tomorrow and birthday on sunday so no radio time that day
[19:55] <PE2BZ> http://www.randomengineering.co.uk/Random_Aerospace/Balloons.html
[19:55] <garc> yes i know I bought from there the other one
[19:55] <PE2BZ> They sell all types of balloons including instructions for calculating the filling and so on
[19:56] <garc> i just wanted it right now and I couldn't wait ...
[19:56] <garc> the funny thing is that that greek store
[19:57] <PE2BZ> The best option would be to threat the Greek one as 300 gram Hwoyee and attach a payload that does not need recovery. For the experimental balloons we fly (90 cm and 100 cm latex) we estimate the burst diameter with air pressure, a thin rope around the balloon and ear and eye protection.
[19:57] <garc> made us a gift of a helium filled pioneer balloon
[19:57] <PE2BZ> That´s nice !
[19:58] <PE2BZ> But for a balloon which advertises itself as ¨float 8 days¨ why would you want it to burst ?
[19:59] <garc> no the balloon was filled with helium the same day for a well known greek race in athens!
[20:00] <garc> the sponsor said that after the race he will let the balloon go and it was a pitty so he gave it to us to made a hab with it! :)
[20:00] <garc> here is the video of this flight
[20:00] <garc> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rTD4tLmGSOE
[20:00] <PE2BZ> Ahh. You never get that HE out of the balloon inside another balloon you know that ?
[20:01] <PE2BZ> So you have to put 5 kg on your weighing scale, attacht the balloon and see how many of that 5 kg it lifts
[20:01] <garc> what do you mean?
[20:01] <PE2BZ> With which of the two lines above ?
[20:03] <garc> the first one
[20:03] <PE2BZ> the first line: you cannot re-use the HE from the Greek balloon to fill another balloon. You have to less pressure inside the balloon. So if it´s filled allready you only have one choice that is to let it fly.
[20:03] <garc> yess!!!
[20:04] <garc> I think that I confused you
[20:04] <garc> in that day we didn't transport the helium of the balloon in to another
[20:05] <garc> I just said that the sponsor gave us a free greek meteorological balloon filled with helium
[20:06] <garc> so we only tied it in to the parachute and let it go
[20:06] <garc> the flight was for about an hour
[20:07] <garc> but the sky is getting darker and darker
[20:07] <garc> the gps said that the maximum altitude was 9500 meters approximately
[20:07] <PE2BZ> That was the flight from the youtube movie :-)
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[20:08] <garc> but for my team it seams much more than 9500 meters! we have made 7 hab flights at the moment
[20:08] <PE2BZ> GPS inside the camera ?
[20:08] <garc> yes inside our payload!
[20:09] <PE2BZ> I ment to ask if the GPS was part of the camera or a type which has been proven to be reliable in flight mode. But given the fact that you have done 7 HAB flights I assume you checked that ?
[20:09] <garc> in this specific flight the system said that maximum alt was 9500 meters but it doesn't like! it seems much more than 9500...
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[20:10] <garc> no we splitted our systems
[20:11] <garc> we used an action camera
[20:11] <garc> and a mobile phone in to waterproof case
[20:12] <PE2BZ> Now one more time, which type of GPS did you use ?
[20:12] <garc> in the other flights we had also aprs system attached but in that flight we did't included in
[20:13] <garc> we are using 3 apps of tracking
[20:14] <garc> we use the traditional google find my device
[20:14] <garc> and one of the best applications that I have ever found
[20:14] <garc> called gpslogger!
[20:15] <garc> with this up you can do a variety of things!
[20:15] <PE2BZ> I am sorry but that´s not the info I am looking for. Did you rely on the GPS receive in a smartphone to tell you the maximum altitude ?
[20:15] <daveake> ping craag ... I think Sibot needs new batteries ... "In real units: 2,2 lbs = 10.0 kg"
[20:15] <SIbot> In real units: 2,2 lbs = 10.0 kg
[20:15] <garc> such as receive mails with altitude latitude longitude battery of the phone etc!!!
[20:16] <garc> that was a big mistake! we didn't include aprs system on this flight!
[20:16] <garc> but! this phone has a great gps!
[20:17] <garc> its the well known nokia 2
[20:17] <garc> it has also 4700 (i think?) mah battery
[20:18] <PE2BZ> I won´t say that is has not. But did you ever, ever hear about GPS limits, flight mode, pedestrian mode and so on? Did you ever check if that GPS set / chip / model supports altitudes above 10 km ?
[20:18] <PE2BZ> I am leaving the computer and watch a movie with the XYL btw. Will be back tomorrow.
[20:18] <garc> add me here my friend
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[20:23] <garc> https://www.facebook.com/Thegarcproject/
[20:24] <garc> :)
[20:25] <garc> so you believe that is much more than 9500 meters?
[20:29] <garc> @PE2BZ ?
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[20:47] <SpacenearUS> New vehicle on the map: 03ON8CF-9_chase - 12https://tracker.habhub.org/#!qm=All&q=ON8CF-9_chase
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[21:30] <happysat> nice clear skies we got good 4 hunting :p http://happysat.nl/Meteor/2019-3-29-20-13-19-849_68.infra-red.jpg
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[22:16] <SpacenearUS> New vehicle on the map: 03PC4L_chase - 12https://tracker.habhub.org/#!qm=All&q=PC4L_chase
[22:25] <Ian_> PE2ZB you will be too distracted to enjoy the film now, but good luck anyhow, it should have a more productive outcome and a more predictable ending :)
[22:26] <Ian_> Best tracking application ever . . . the Admins will be upset/disappointed about comments like that, given all their hard work.
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[22:29] <Ian_> SA6BSS-Mike [19:41] do I detect a diminishing will to live in there somewhere :)
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[00:00] --- Sat Mar 30 2019