highaltitude.log.20180324

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[00:32] <SpacenearUS> New vehicle on the map: 03RS_N0320162 - 12https://tracker.habhub.org/#!qm=All&q=RS_N0320162
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[01:28] <ulfr^> hm
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[05:13] Nick change: day__ -> day
[05:34] <SpacenearUS> New vehicle on the map: 03U3S23 - 12https://tracker.habhub.org/#!qm=All&q=U3S23
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[07:27] <SpacenearUS> New vehicle on the map: 03TI2CVJ - 12https://tracker.habhub.org/#!qm=All&q=TI2CVJ
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[10:12] <SpacenearUS> New vehicle on the map: 03BALTS3 - 12https://tracker.habhub.org/#!qm=All&q=BALTS3
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[10:42] <SpacenearUS> New vehicle on the map: 03Pauls_chase - 12https://tracker.habhub.org/#!qm=All&q=Pauls_chase
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[10:58] <SpacenearUS> New vehicle on the map: 03Didzis_chase - 12https://tracker.habhub.org/#!qm=All&q=Didzis_chase
[11:12] <SpacenearUS> New vehicle on the map: 03CALLSIGN123_chase - 12https://tracker.habhub.org/#!qm=All&q=CALLSIGN123_chase
[11:15] <SpacenearUS> New vehicle on the map: 03Didzis1_chase - 12https://tracker.habhub.org/#!qm=All&q=Didzis1_chase
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[11:17] <SpacenearUS> New vehicle on the map: 03Didza_komanda_chase - 12https://tracker.habhub.org/#!qm=All&q=Didza_komanda_chase
[11:19] <SpacenearUS> New vehicle on the map: 03RS_N3650672 - 12https://tracker.habhub.org/#!qm=All&q=RS_N3650672
[11:24] <SpacenearUS> New position from 03IV3SRD-11 after 032 days silence - 12https://tracker.habhub.org/#!qm=All&q=IV3SRD-11
[11:26] <SpacenearUS> New vehicle on the map: 03RS_N2440704 - 12https://tracker.habhub.org/#!qm=All&q=RS_N2440704
[11:37] <SpacenearUS> New vehicle on the map: 03RS_N1253412 - 12https://tracker.habhub.org/#!qm=All&q=RS_N1253412
[11:41] <Darkside> oh good i see G1BLO has upgraded his auto_rx instance
[11:46] <SpacenearUS> New vehicle on the map: 03KG5FRM-1 - 12https://tracker.habhub.org/#!qm=All&q=KG5FRM-1
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[12:02] <SpacenearUS> New position from 03HMS2 after 0311 days silence - 12https://tracker.habhub.org/#!qm=All&q=HMS2
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[12:04] <SpacenearUS> New vehicle on the map: 03RS_N1253417 - 12https://tracker.habhub.org/#!qm=All&q=RS_N1253417
[12:05] <SpacenearUS> New vehicle on the map: 03YL3CAAH_chase - 12https://tracker.habhub.org/#!qm=All&q=YL3CAAH_chase
[12:48] <SpacenearUS> New vehicle on the map: 03FOOL2 - 12https://tracker.habhub.org/#!qm=All&q=FOOL2
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[13:00] <torntrousers> Hey guys. I'm testing some antenna's with my 434Mhz lora tracker.
[13:00] <torntrousers> I've one of these: https://www.moonraker.eu/antennas/ham-amateur-radio-antennas/zl7-70-70cm-7-element-special-yagi-antenna\
[13:00] <torntrousers> One of these: http://feiyuxin.manufacturer.globalsources.com/si/6008834522560/pdtl/RFID-antenna/1155832368/2.5dBi-433MHz-magnetic-antenna.htm
[13:01] <torntrousers> And just a 16cm piece of wire.
[13:01] <torntrousers> With the tracker out in the garden the Yagi gets an RSSI of about -75, the little magnetic one an RSSI of -77 and just the piece of wire an RSSI of -76
[13:01] <torntrousers> I thought the fancy yagi would be a bit better. Does that sound expected?
[13:01] <SpacenearUS> New position from 03U3B-14 after 0312 hours silence - 12https://tracker.habhub.org/#!qm=All&q=U3B-14
[13:01] <PE2BZ> Nice antennas! especially the piece of wire ;-)
[13:02] <PE2BZ> Is you lora tracker wired with SMA connectors ?
[13:03] <torntrousers> the tracker out in the garden? no. that just has a 16.5cm piece of wire soldered onto the sx1278 antenna output
[13:04] <PE2BZ> Ok, that´s allright. But on the receiver part ?
[13:04] <torntrousers> the reciever does have an sma connector, its this - https://raw.githubusercontent.com/HarringayMakerSpace/HabitatLoraGateway/master/doc/WemosRFM98.jpg
[13:06] <PE2BZ> And the cable to the receiver has what type of connector ? Perhaps the connector is reverse SMA at the cable side ?
[13:06] <torntrousers> so with the reciever and the piece of wire its directly in the sma socket, the other two antenna's have a metre or 2 of shielded cable
[13:07] <PE2BZ> Yes, and at the end of the (2) shielded cables you do have an SMA connector which goes to the receiver ?
[13:07] <torntrousers> yep. it looks like a regular male connector
[13:08] <PE2BZ> Can you paste a photo of those ? with imgur for example ?
[13:09] <torntrousers> it looks like this - http://www.wellshow.com/wp-content/uploads/2010/01/sma-connector-plug.jpg thats not the actual one i have but it looks the same to me
[13:09] <PE2BZ> That looks allright.
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[13:16] <PE2BZ> And the rssi is -75 when the tracker is transmitting and -120 or something when the tracker is not transmitting ?
[13:19] <PE2BZ> Mine is -60 with the 7 element yagi and -88 with 16 cm wire with the tracker 6 meter away out of the window
[13:20] <torntrousers> my receiver code doesn't show the rssi when not transmitting. perhaps I should i add that?
[13:20] <torntrousers> my tracker is something like 25 metre's away through some walls
[13:21] <torntrousers> I'll go to about 6 metres away...
[13:21] <PE2BZ> 25 metre´s is allright, no problem
[13:22] <PE2BZ> If you disable the tracker, the receives just shows no RSSI ?
[13:22] <torntrousers> about 6 metres away through a window the piece of wire gets rssi of -55
[13:23] <PE2BZ> Just to make shure that the actual signal of the tracker is displayed. Over here one build a scanner for radio sondes on 403 MHz using the rssi on that frequency band. And the 434 MHz band has a lot of signals
[13:23] <torntrousers> yes, i only get the rssi from the received packet - https://github.com/HarringayMakerSpace/HabitatLoraGateway/blob/master/HabitatLoraGateway.ino#L125
[13:26] <PE2BZ> That way I also would have expected a better value for the Yagi
[13:27] <torntrousers> the yagi gets an rssi of -55 here too. so the piece of wire wins, though the yagi is via a couple of metres of cheapo shielded cable
[13:27] <PE2BZ> you wired the yagi cable yourself I assume ?
[13:28] <PE2BZ> No short circuit with shield wires ?
[13:30] <torntrousers> actually the reciever does show an rssi when not recieving of -100, i wasn't totally sure what that meant - https://github.com/HarringayMakerSpace/HabitatLoraGateway/blob/master/HabitatLoraGateway.ino#L252
[13:30] <torntrousers> i did wire it myself. so i suppose it could have not done it well
[13:31] <torntrousers> but if there was short i wouldn't be getting anything?
[13:32] <PE2BZ> As proven, on this distance even a wire works ;-)
[13:32] <PE2BZ> Does the moonraker provide a balloon for impedance, or does it have an antenna connector ?
[13:32] <PE2BZ> That´s not clear on the image for me
[13:34] <torntrousers> i'll take a photo ...
[13:34] <SpacenearUS> New vehicle on the map: 03LU7AA-11 - 12https://tracker.habhub.org/#!qm=All&q=LU7AA-11
[13:36] <torntrousers> https://photos.app.goo.gl/l4mMcf9llYHkh2bt1
[13:37] <torntrousers> so it has the adjustable capacitor thing i can screw in and out. I've fiddle with that a bit
[13:39] <PE2BZ> Does it have a wirind diagram ?
[13:39] <torntrousers> no
[13:40] <PE2BZ> the top of the capacitor is attached to the top bolt ?
[13:41] <torntrousers> yes, the bottom of the capacitor is not connected to anything (the picture isn't from the best angle so it looks a bit like it might be)
[13:42] <PE2BZ> and the shield of the outgoing cable is connected to the bottom screw ?
[13:43] <torntrousers> yep
[13:46] <PE2BZ> the adjustable capacitor won´t do much for receiving. So that´s not the issue. Do you have an ohm meter ?
[13:50] <torntrousers> yes
[13:51] <PE2BZ> I excpect to measure no short circuit on the ground and pin on the sma male. is that correct ?
[13:53] <torntrousers> just a sec while i try ...
[13:55] <torntrousers> yes, looks good
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[13:56] <PE2BZ> and centre goes to core and shield to shield ?
[13:57] <torntrousers> not clear what you mean?
[13:58] <PE2BZ> The center pin of the SMA should have zero ohm to the wire on the screw terminal you mounted at the capacitor
[13:59] <PE2BZ> and the shield of the SMA should have zero ohm to the screw where you mounted the shield cable
[14:00] <torntrousers> about 2.6 ohms for each according to the meter
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[14:01] <PE2BZ> That´s also ok.
[14:01] <torntrousers> ok just shorting the meters probes together shows 2.2
[14:01] <PE2BZ> Do you happen to have an (SDR) receiver on which you can test the antenna ?
[14:02] <torntrousers> no
[14:06] <PE2BZ> Are you able to set the power on the tracker to 1 mW (assuming it´s on 10 mW now) and check if the results improve ?
[14:08] <torntrousers> i think so, will have to check the api's...
[14:08] <PE2BZ> Or place the tracker in a metal bin (trashcan or something) just to have lower signal
[14:08] Action: PE2BZ is not suggesting to throw away the tracker ;-)
[14:09] <torntrousers> i can set the power with this: https://github.com/sandeepmistry/arduino-LoRa/blob/master/API.md#radio-parameters
[14:09] <torntrousers> so could set it to 2. Not sure what that means in mW?
[14:09] <PE2BZ> Is it at default (17) now ?
[14:10] <torntrousers> perhpas I shouldn't answer that?
[14:10] <PE2BZ> 50 mW is much to high for local testing. I am not lecturing ;-)
[14:10] <torntrousers> I'll go set it to 2...
[14:10] <PE2BZ> https://www.rapidtables.com/electric/dBm.html
[14:11] <PE2BZ> 2 dBm is 1.5 mW that would be better for testing
[14:11] <PE2BZ> afk to get a drink. brb
[14:12] <torntrousers> actually it was set to 7. I've set it to 2 now
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[14:15] <torntrousers> so with that my simple 16cm piece of wire directly in the receiver female sma socket gets an rssi of -79
[14:15] Nick change: BrainDamage_ -> BrainDamage
[14:16] <PE2BZ> -76 to -79 with 3 dBm less power :-) makes sense
[14:16] <torntrousers> and the yagi -78
[14:17] <PE2BZ> to be shure.... the yagi points to the tracker AND the antenna (wire) of the tracker has the same polarisation as the yagi ? botch horizontal, or vertical ?
[14:18] <torntrousers> the wire is vertical which matches the one on the tracker.
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[14:19] <PE2BZ> So the yagi should also be vertical, dipoles up / down and the first element (director) pointing towards your tracker
[14:19] <torntrousers> the yagi i think is vertical, and if i change it to horozontal the rssi goes to about -82
[14:23] <PE2BZ> and changing the direction away from the tracker lowers the RSSI (higher - value) ?
[14:30] <torntrousers> hmm, so pointing about 90 degrees away doesn't seem to change the rssi much, but at about 45 degrees to the tracker it goes down to -71. Thats a bit odd?
[14:32] <torntrousers> maybe I need to be things out doors
[14:44] <PE2BZ> ¨down to -71¨ is a stronger signal. The - value gives a below noise value, so -71 is about 7 dB stronger as -78
[14:45] <torntrousers> so thats good right? So the yagi is about -8 better than the bit of wire
[14:46] <PE2BZ> Now we´re talking :-)
[14:46] <PE2BZ> +8 dB better
[14:47] <PE2BZ> and the 45 degrees could be reflections. HR++ windows do keep a lot signal outdoors
[14:47] <PE2BZ> or outwindows ;-)
[14:47] <torntrousers> ok. thanks for all the guidance
[14:49] <PE2BZ> my pleasure, np
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[15:36] <SpacenearUS> New vehicle on the map: 03KG_chase - 12https://tracker.habhub.org/#!qm=All&q=KG_chase
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[16:16] <SpacenearUS> New vehicle on the map: 03DC2EH-11 - 12https://tracker.habhub.org/#!qm=All&q=DC2EH-11
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[16:43] <Ian_> PE2BZ The capacitor on a ZL Special antenna is for impedance matching. Often it is just an open coax stub which is trimmed for best match and then rolled up and popped under the cover.
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[17:01] <PE2BZ> Thanks for the info Ian. But that assumes the capacitor in parallel to the dipole connections, in parallel with the antenna wire ?
[17:15] <SpacenearUS> New vehicle on the map: 03RS_M5033289 - 12https://tracker.habhub.org/#!qm=All&q=RS_M5033289
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[17:21] <SpacenearUS> New vehicle on the map: 03KG7YQB-12 - 12https://tracker.habhub.org/#!qm=All&q=KG7YQB-12
[17:27] <SpacenearUS> New vehicle on the map: 03pumelele_chase - 12https://tracker.habhub.org/#!qm=All&q=pumelele_chase
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[18:04] <SpacenearUS> New position from 03SA6BSS-9 after 0318 hours silence - 12https://tracker.habhub.org/#!qm=All&q=SA6BSS-9
[18:10] <SpacenearUS> New vehicle on the map: 03RS_M50332x9 - 12https://tracker.habhub.org/#!qm=All&q=RS_M50332x9
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[18:35] <SpacenearUS> New position from 03BSS13 after 0320 hours silence - 12https://tracker.habhub.org/#!qm=All&q=BSS13
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[18:46] <mfa298> reading up, shouldn't a ZL Special show a dead short between the feed point, I thought it was a pair of looped dipoles
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[19:08] <PE2BZ> mfa298 the core of the shielded cable was wired to the ¨center¨ of the capacitor. There was no wiring diagram thorntrousers said. I also expect the 2 dipoles to be wired parallel with the 300 ohm wire between them but I did not know if the 50 ohm coax had to be wired parallel to the 2 dipoles.
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[20:38] <DoYouKnow> anyone know of a google-earth like channel?
[20:38] <DoYouKnow> for discussion of imagery analysis?
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[21:04] <SpacenearUS> New vehicle on the map: 03Dan_chase - 12https://tracker.habhub.org/#!qm=All&q=Dan_chase
[21:14] <SpacenearUS> New position from 03HIRFW-6 after 0313 hours silence - 12https://tracker.habhub.org/#!qm=All&q=HIRFW-6
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[21:39] <Ian_> j #kml
[21:42] <Ian_> On a ZL, both the driven element and the reflector are driven and the coupling between them is crossed. Also a capacitor, beehive or short coaxial line is used for matching.
[21:43] <Ian_> Both driven and reflector are folded elements. That's how they achieve the boom length reduction over conventional yagi antennas.
[21:55] <Laurenceb_> !whereis HIRFW-6
[21:55] <SpacenearUS> 03Laurenceb_: 03HIRFW-6 was over 03Russia 10(50.43941,149.54548) at 0312443 meters about 0311 minutes ago
[21:55] <Laurenceb_> Russian hackers
[21:55] <Laurenceb_> over 18 months in the air
[22:13] kc2uez (~SKA0ut@static-74-42-252-20.br1.glvv.ny.frontiernet.net) left irc: Ping timeout: 256 seconds
[22:15] <Ian_> Seems like no perceptible loss of altitude.
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[22:51] <gabriel> ?help
[22:51] <gabriel> is anyone online?
[22:51] <bertrik> hi
[22:52] <gabriel> is there any regulations on launching a rocket off of a HAB
[22:52] <gabriel> *are
[22:53] <bertrik> sorry, I don't know, I'm usually just passively listening/reading this channel, I don't launch HABs myself
[22:54] <daveake> Yes. You'll need to speak to your national aviation authority. Good luck you;ll need it.
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[23:00] <gabrielh> helo
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[23:17] <SpacenearUS> New vehicle on the map: 03RS_N1033649 - 12https://tracker.habhub.org/#!qm=All&q=RS_N1033649
[23:18] <SpacenearUS> New vehicle on the map: 03RS_N0750654 - 12https://tracker.habhub.org/#!qm=All&q=RS_N0750654
[23:21] <SpacenearUS> New vehicle on the map: 03RS_N2420701 - 12https://tracker.habhub.org/#!qm=All&q=RS_N2420701
[23:30] <SpacenearUS> New vehicle on the map: 03RS_N2010235 - 12https://tracker.habhub.org/#!qm=All&q=RS_N2010235
[23:30] <SpacenearUS> New vehicle on the map: 03RS_N2450536 - 12https://tracker.habhub.org/#!qm=All&q=RS_N2450536
[23:31] <SpacenearUS> New vehicle on the map: 03RS_N1143567 - 12https://tracker.habhub.org/#!qm=All&q=RS_N1143567
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[23:45] <SpacenearUS> New vehicle on the map: 03RS_N0320289 - 12https://tracker.habhub.org/#!qm=All&q=RS_N0320289
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[00:00] --- Sun Mar 25 2018