highaltitude.log.20161116

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[00:39] <SpacenearUS> New vehicle on the map: 03F4GDL-11 - 12https://tracker.habhub.org/#!qm=All&q=F4GDL-11
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[03:17] <SpacenearUS> New vehicle on the map: 03ZL1AB - 12https://tracker.habhub.org/#!qm=All&q=ZL1AB
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[08:03] <SpacenearUS> New vehicle on the map: 03OO2 - 12https://tracker.habhub.org/#!qm=All&q=OO2
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[08:16] <SpacenearUS> New vehicle on the map: 03OO3 - 12https://tracker.habhub.org/#!qm=All&q=OO3
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[08:20] <SpacenearUS> New vehicle on the map: 03OO4 - 12https://tracker.habhub.org/#!qm=All&q=OO4
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[08:23] <SpacenearUS> New vehicle on the map: 03OO5 - 12https://tracker.habhub.org/#!qm=All&q=OO5
[08:29] <arjunnaha> Considering my absolute disaster of a DIY 1/4 wave ground plane on my payload, any there any alternatives for transmitting 434MHz RTTY
[08:29] <Upu> get better at making the 1/4 wave :)
[08:30] <arjunnaha> I suppose that's an option 🙃
[08:31] <SpacenearUS> New position from 03S-20 after 0311 hours silence - 12https://tracker.habhub.org/#!qm=All&q=S-20
[08:33] <mfa298> In terms of things to make that's probably the easiest one to build
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[08:34] <arjunnaha> Just have to perfect my cutting and soldering (and remembering to straighten the centre wire!)
[08:35] <mfa298> in terms of building it, cut the elements long and then trim as needed once built.
[08:35] <mfa298> and for straightening just choose the right wire.
[08:36] <arjunnaha> I used the pigtail from Uputronics and some solid core wire
[08:36] <arjunnaha> I've heard about people using guitar wire
[08:40] <SpacenearUS> New vehicle on the map: 039910708919_chase - 12https://tracker.habhub.org/#!qm=All&q=9910708919_chase
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[08:42] <SpacenearUS> New vehicle on the map: 03OO0 - 12https://tracker.habhub.org/#!qm=All&q=OO0
[08:42] <SpacenearUS> New vehicle on the map: 03OO1 - 12https://tracker.habhub.org/#!qm=All&q=OO1
[08:42] <SpacenearUS> New vehicle on the map: 03OO6 - 12https://tracker.habhub.org/#!qm=All&q=OO6
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[08:50] <SpacenearUS> New position from 03HIRFW-6 after 0314 hours silence - 12https://tracker.habhub.org/#!qm=All&q=HIRFW-6
[09:10] <daveake> arjunnaha: Steve Randall did a good video on how to make these
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[09:50] <jakeio> Hey, can anyone explain to me how the three LoRa registers for frequency work?
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[10:07] <M0RJX> Hey Upu have you seen this paste ROHS and only 138C I'm going to give it a go http://uk.farnell.com/chip-quik/smdltlfp/solder-paste-sn-bi-ag-138deg-c/dp/2510617?ost=2510617&selectedCategoryId=&categoryNameResp=All%2BCategories&searchView=table&iscrfnonsku=false
[10:08] Action: SpeedEvil looks at his indium, gallium, and tin.
[10:08] Action: SpeedEvil is awaiting bismuth
[10:09] <M0RJX> Lol
[10:09] <M0RJX> You collecting metals
[10:09] <M0RJX> Gallium is fun
[10:09] <M0RJX> if a litle messy
[10:10] <SpeedEvil> I want to play with high vacuum seals
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[10:11] <Upu> hey Rob thats for removing stuff I think
[10:11] <SpeedEvil> yeah
[10:16] <M0RJX> Upu, I think you can solder with it provided that you dont want it to work in high temps ie above 120C :-)
[10:16] <M0RJX> I'll give it a go for 14 quid and see what happens. IBM used to use this stuff for their mainframes but it's not in fassion due to the additional cost
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[10:18] <Upu> I think you can use it to remove components as it stays molten for longer. What are you trying to use that for anyway ?
[10:20] <M0RJX> To have a play with low melt soldering. I saw this been used ot make boards placing them on a flood light and it seemed to work well.
[10:20] <M0RJX> Basically having a play :-)
[10:20] <Upu> lol
[10:20] <Upu> ok well its not meant for that :)
[10:21] <M0RJX> Like many things in life...
[10:21] <M0RJX> I'm sure the wife said that too ;-)
[10:21] <Upu> 7 payloads transmitting on same frequency https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SdPcgibEfQM
[10:23] <M0RJX> Upu, cool is that or office
[10:23] <M0RJX> your
[10:23] <M0RJX> I've working on 1000 on the smae frequency ATM
[10:23] <M0RJX> i'm
[10:23] <M0RJX> Canty type today
[10:23] <M0RJX> see^
[10:25] <Upu> yep itis
[10:25] <Upu> well not enough seconds in a minute for 1000 at 1 sec per TX :)
[10:26] <M0RJX> Indeed it's proving probamatic.
[10:27] <M0RJX> Looing at one update every 5 mins ideally
[10:30] <mfa298> flood light soldering sounds like the slightly less edible version of roadies bacon (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dvh7makS4qc)
[10:32] <lz1dev> thats one way to do it i guess
[10:33] <M0RJX> Upu, I linked to the wrong paste http://uk.farnell.com/chip-quik/smdltlfp60t4/solder-paste-sn-bi-ag-138deg-c/dp/2529023
[10:33] <Upu> yeah still wondering why ? :)
[10:34] <M0RJX> Well you said you had issues with 217C paste in your oven and I thought this would be worth a shot
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[10:48] <Upu> Yeah it set the PCB's on fire
[10:49] <Upu> trying to find the image
[10:49] <M0RJX> nasty i'be not had any issues with the modded oven yet
[10:49] <russss> ?!
[10:49] <russss> are you sure the oven temp is right?
[10:49] <Upu> its Chinese russss
[10:49] <russss> heh
[10:49] <Upu> actual temp +/- 100'C
[10:49] <M0RJX> lol
[10:49] <M0RJX> so true
[10:50] <russss> we have a T962A at London Hackspace and it works pretty well
[10:50] <russss> although allegedly it somehow got left running with the heater on
[10:50] <M0RJX> have you upgraded the firmware?
[10:50] <russss> not yet, it's on my list whenever I can be bothered
[10:51] <M0RJX> I've been working on this atm
[10:51] <M0RJX> https://www.theicarusproject.co.uk/index.php?route=product/product&path=59&product_id=52
[10:52] <Upu> hmm thats really annoying me now can't find the pic
[10:52] <russss> ah nice
[10:52] <M0RJX> Upu, I'm sure you can remeber the smell
[10:52] <Upu> https://usercontent.irccloud-cdn.com/file/4peLHhCB/xBJoyFq.jpg
[10:52] <Upu> found this though
[10:52] <M0RJX> :-)
[10:55] <Upu> http://i.imgur.com/KUAJWHy.jpg
[10:56] <Upu> that took a while
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[11:04] <Upu> yes M0RJX everyone still has cancer
[11:08] <M0RJX> Ooh PCBway has just arrivee
[11:08] <M0RJX> http://imgur.com/a/mOsnm
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[11:10] <KG7WPQ> Hi guys anybody at the keyboard?
[11:10] <KG7WPQ> CQ CQ any station..
[11:10] <M0RJX> ?
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[11:10] <M0RJX> Yep
[11:10] <KG7WPQ> Alright cool
[11:10] <AndyEsser> no
[11:10] <KG7WPQ> sometimes I come in here and it's just static
[11:10] <M0RJX> Really
[11:11] <KG7WPQ> Well, it is 3am so I wouldn't have been surprised
[11:11] <KG7WPQ> anyway, is anybody familiar with the Dorji DRA818V transceiver module?
[11:11] <M0RJX> peaks are 18:00 - 00:00 GMT
[11:11] <KG7WPQ> I want to use one to build an APRS decoder
[11:12] <M0RJX> I'm not
[11:12] <KG7WPQ> Are you familiar at all with using an Arduino to decode APRS?
[11:13] <KG7WPQ> I've sent off emails to a couple of people developing similar stuff but lack of replies has me feeling a bit impatient lol
[11:13] <KG7WPQ> And google is just leading me to "Look what this guy built! No information, just pictures of the final project"
[11:14] <KG7WPQ> My plan anyway, is to build an APRS decoder, it will receive APRS transmissions, decode them and print the decoded strings to a display..
[11:15] <M0RJX> Upu, has an APRS transmitter not sure about RX
[11:15] <KG7WPQ> Building on that further, I want to get to a point where the program can look at the string and evaluate it, looking first for it's own callsign, and if it sees that, identify any commands that might be in the message
[11:16] <KG7WPQ> To go further with that idea, I want to eventually be able to control a small robot from my home station
[11:16] <M0RJX> Sounds great
[11:16] <KG7WPQ> Sounds complicated lol
[11:17] <daveake> Pi + SDR + RTL_FM + Direwolf will get you the decoded strings
[11:17] <KG7WPQ> this is similar to the "MAREA" project being driven by some ARRL members. I emailed those guys and they gave me some info
[11:17] <KG7WPQ> Yeah, problem is the Pi is big, inefficient and more than I need.
[11:17] <mfa298> KG7WPQ: I think SP9UOB has a few bits on his site about decoding aprs with a microcontroller (pic)
[11:17] <mfa298> http://sp9uob.verox.pl/dstnc.html
[11:17] <daveake> I suspect an Arduino is less than you need
[11:18] <KG7WPQ> Nah the ATMega328 has already proven it's worth on-orbit
[11:18] <KG7WPQ> It is still more than I need
[11:19] <KG7WPQ> I just have to figure out how to make it all work, and I already understand there's not going to be any hand-holding with getting this going on my own lol
[11:24] <KG7WPQ> I guess what I'm really looking for here is somebody who is interested in working on this project with me, unfortunately everybody I've contacted that's already done this is either too busy with other things, doesn't ever respond, or doesn't understand english, unfortunately
[11:24] <KG7WPQ> Sometimes I feel like I'm trying to work the rarest of all possible DX on the wrong sideband
[11:26] <daveake> I'm confused. There's an easy solution here which is Pi, existing software plus some frankly trivial code to do some work on the resulting messages.
[11:27] <daveake> If you don't have the skills to do it all on a PIC/AVR, and aren't willing to learn, then the Pi option is an obvious one
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[11:30] <KG7WPQ> You're making some assumptions about what I know
[11:31] <mfa298> and if you did it on a Pi Zero you've got something thats not that big (or look at some of the many other SBCs out there)
[11:31] <KG7WPQ> I have worked extensively with the raspberry pi and the ATMega / ATTiny
[11:32] <daveake> My assumption is based on you asking for help on how, and help on doing it with you
[11:32] <KG7WPQ> My main reason for choosing specifically the ATMega328 is that I'm already familiar with it, I know I can run it at 3.3 volts without an xtal and I don't have to use somebody else's pre-made board
[11:33] <KG7WPQ> Also I have probably 25 ATMega328's in my parts bins
[11:33] <daveake> Why is the voltage a factor ?
[11:34] <KG7WPQ> Because when you start hanging things from balloons weight is a factor and you can't always bring an arsenal of batteries with you
[11:34] <daveake> p.s. pi zero runs happily at 3.3V
[11:34] <KG7WPQ> I'm sure it does
[11:34] <daveake> erm, doubly confused ... thought this was for a robot
[11:34] <KG7WPQ> right now it is
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[11:35] <KG7WPQ> but if I want to make things lightweight and efficient for later versions of the project, I might as well start out there right?
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[11:35] <daveake> granted for a hab weight is a factor, but a pi zero is pretty light
[11:35] <KG7WPQ> Stop trying to sell me a Pi zero lol
[11:35] <KG7WPQ> not happening
[11:35] <KG7WPQ> I don't need a PC
[11:36] <daveake> It's not a ... oh, CBA
[11:37] <SpacenearUS> New position from 03IV3SRD-11 after 0310 hours silence - 12https://tracker.habhub.org/#!qm=All&q=IV3SRD-11
[11:37] <jakeio> !whereis UBSEDS18
[11:37] <SpacenearUS> 03jakeio: 03UBSEDS18 was over 03North Pacific Ocean 10(41.81333,148.52486) at 0312244 meters about 036 days ago
[11:38] <craag> When I looked around previously, there wasn't much decent FOSS aprs decode code for microcontrollers
[11:38] <craag> everyone who's written some seems to have done it to sell a project with it
[11:39] <craag> On a little low-power linux system however - plenty of choice ;)
[11:39] <KG7WPQ> Anyway, the Pi simply has too much crap I don't need to try and support. I don't need USB or HDMI or audio, and definitely don't need an operating system. It's all stuff that is not needed
[11:40] <KG7WPQ> I've built functional robots with both the pi and arduino and a few other things, they all work fine, in fact much the same. I'm just aiming to strip away all of the non essential stuff
[11:41] <SpeedEvil> Stripping away the non-essential stuff if it comes at the cost of more dev time is usually a loss.
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[11:42] <KG7WPQ> So is buying crap you don't need :)
[11:42] <SpeedEvil> sure
[11:42] <SpeedEvil> But if buying stuff you don't need gets you the stuff you do need cheaper and easier than a 'pure' solution, ...
[11:43] <mfa298> the impression I've got is that the majority of people using an avr for aprs are only using it to transmit. My suspicion is that getting a good receiver/decoder on an avr may be challenging for the various dsp.
[11:44] <M0RJX> KG7WPQ, sounds like you know it already so show us what you end up with it will be great to see your implementation.
[11:44] <mfa298> if you could do some of the processing in dedicated hardware first that might help, but then your cost may be greater than other solutions that have already been suggested
[11:44] <mattbrejza> you can get the analogue demodulator as a single IC, then its 'jsut' a case of decoding the bit stream
[11:45] <mattbrejza> id have thought the analogue demodulation could be done on the AVR itself, but thats somewhat more work
[11:45] <M0RJX> Personally witha Pi Zero you could have it sone in an afternnon and get on with something else. daveake has suggested a very quick and easy solution ^
[11:45] <M0RJX> I'm off to do some work
[11:46] <craag> adam's stm32 code for decoding rtty that was demoed at UKHAS conf a few years ago could be a good start
[11:46] <KG7WPQ> The radio module I'm going to be working with does demodulation, You just connect uart to the controller
[11:46] <mattbrejza> craag: that was my code ;)
[11:46] <daveake> ha
[11:46] <craag> oh yeah :P
[11:47] <KG7WPQ> http://www.weirdlab.fr/wp-content/uploads/2016/01/DRA818V_Trackuino.PNG
[11:47] <KG7WPQ> Still waiting for an email back from the guy that published this. You can see from the URL he's in France.. Communication has been very slow
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[11:48] <mattbrejza> that schematic is tx only though?
[11:48] <KG7WPQ> This is why I'm turning away from off the shelf solutions and electing instead to just use the ATMega328 by itself rather than an Arduino or some other thing
[11:49] <KG7WPQ> And yeah, when I have something to show, it's going to be published so anybody can use it
[11:49] <KG7WPQ> I've found a lot of projects like this that only give you access to a hex file, no actual code
[11:49] <KG7WPQ> that doesn't help anybody
[11:50] <gonzo_> given the state of some people's code, in some cases, possibly for the best!
[11:51] <mfa298> quick google of the datasheet seems to suggest the uart on that is only for configuration. I don't see any mention of afsk decode
[11:51] <mattbrejza> you might want a MX614 or TCM3105 IC for demodulation
[11:51] <SpacenearUS> New vehicle on the map: 03VE2WMG-11 - 12https://tracker.habhub.org/#!qm=All&q=VE2WMG-11
[11:52] <KG7WPQ> There's no demodulation IC in that schematic though and that guy's project works just fine
[11:53] <mattbrejza> its also TX only
[11:54] <KG7WPQ> ..ah crap
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[11:54] <mfa298> it's feeding audio from the avr into the mic in pin on the trx
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[11:54] <KG7WPQ> Yeah you're right i see that
[11:55] <KG7WPQ> well, guess that's the wrong direction then
[11:55] <KG7WPQ> and that page was the best info I've found so far
[11:57] <KG7WPQ> Alright, im gonna go now..
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[11:57] <edmoore> the schematic is so horribly layed out that I'd be suspicious of anything else they had to say
[11:58] <mattbrejza> looks like a mspaint job too
[11:58] <russss> schematic snob
[11:58] <mfa298> the page that links to it (http://www.weirdlab.fr/?p=906) does describe it as a quick and dirty schematic
[11:58] <gonzo_> given enough uplink power, it should be possible to do a zero crossing detect and demod that way
[12:00] <gonzo_> but with a 122bd rate and the bell 303 tones..... Hmmm
[12:00] <gonzo_> 1200db
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[12:00] <mattbrejza> im not quite sure what the FET on the GPS EN is for
[12:01] <Upu> https://usercontent.irccloud-cdn.com/file/rQEXkNfU/2015-04-13%2010.29.26.jpg
[12:01] <Upu> keep meaning to put that on sale
[12:01] <Upu> been ready for a year just keep getting stuck at the instruction manual
[12:01] <Upu> afk
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[12:12] <edmoore> space-grade hot-melt glue?
[12:13] <russss> isn't that kapton tape?
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[12:15] <edmoore> attaching the 3d printed bit of plastic to the battery holder
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[12:54] <Upu> thats the stuff Ed
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[12:54] <Upu> that was a prototype
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[13:02] Nick change: fl__0 -> fl_0
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[13:14] <Ian_> arjunnaha Upu Here you go with a basic batch of Ernie Ball #13 1/4 wave ground plane antennas (guitar strings)
[13:14] <Ian_> https://www.amazon.co.uk/CUSTOM-1013-P01013-013-strings/dp/B00J6PXVPG/ref=sr_1_3?ie=UTF8&qid=1479299783&sr=8-3&keywords=ernie+ball+13
[13:15] <Ian_> Each string will produce enough material for radiator and four radials.
[13:15] <SpacenearUS> New vehicle on the map: 03X5532133 - 12https://tracker.habhub.org/#!qm=All&q=X5532133
[13:19] <SpacenearUS> New vehicle on the map: 03OO7 - 12https://tracker.habhub.org/#!qm=All&q=OO7
[13:19] <Ian_> KG7WPQ seemed intent on pushing his vision of the world and appeared to give up when it all vapourised. Like most of the APRS devices alluded to he gave the impression of being a tx only model. Probably gone away to find out what a Pi Zero really is.
[13:24] <mfa298> what he wants to do may well be possible, but I think it probably needs a fair bit of effort and possible some external components
[13:25] <mfa298> and probably enough expertise to realise it may not be a small + quick bit of code to write
[13:27] <Ian_> It was more the resistance to the possible idea of a Pi solution which intrigued me.
[13:28] <SpacenearUS> New vehicle on the map: 03OO8 - 12https://tracker.habhub.org/#!qm=All&q=OO8
[13:31] <mfa298> if you want low power there is a strong benfit in moving from the Pi to a microcontroller, but there might be something better than an AVR.
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[13:37] <SpacenearUS> New vehicle on the map: 03OO9 - 12https://tracker.habhub.org/#!qm=All&q=OO9
[13:42] <gonzo_> given the callsign, weight should not be a problem. There would be lots of power from that car battery
[13:48] <gonzo_> that schematic from the french guy, has an optocoupler in an odd place?
[13:48] <gonzo_> also the symbol for it showa a gas discharge device instead of a photodiode
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[13:51] <cm13g09> yay.... hand soldering 0402
[13:51] <cm13g09> that's gonna be fun
[13:51] <gonzo_> and the drive to that optocoupler doesn't have a current limit and is driven from an i/o
[13:52] <mattbrejza> whats even the point of it
[13:52] <gonzo_> I refuse to loom at the code though, as I have to work on french stuff every day
[13:53] <gonzo_> look
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[13:59] <SA6BSS-Mike> if anyone looking for an easy aprs tx, https://hamprojects.wordpress.com/2015/06/29/vhf-beacon-and-aprs-tracker-english-version/
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[14:01] <SpacenearUS> New vehicle on the map: 03SR0FLY - 12https://tracker.habhub.org/#!qm=All&q=SR0FLY
[14:02] <SA6BSS-Mike> and ofc tyhis one http://www.om3bc.com/docs/payload/payload_en.html
[14:03] <SA6BSS-Mike> last one I did a pcb for in eagle but never tried it
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[15:09] <russss> spacex just filed for frequencies for...this https://usercontent.irccloud-cdn.com/file/8RUjyIXK/
[15:11] <AndyEsser> russss: interesting
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[15:21] <Geoff_G8DHE> https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/SpaceX_satellite_constellation
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[15:32] <gonzo_> what freqs were apllied for?
[15:32] <AndyEsser> all of them
[15:32] Last message repeated 1 time(s).
[15:32] <russss> a significant chunk of Ka and Ku band
[15:34] <russss> https://usercontent.irccloud-cdn.com/file/qu355N0t/
[15:34] <gonzo_> hey would need huge bandwidth for the downlinking and intersat comms
[15:34] <russss> I'd link the PDF but the link is too long for IRC because the FCC's website is crap
[15:35] <edmoore> bitlizzle
[15:35] <gonzo_> though in some ways, they could do away with some of the main groundstation (company, not users) requirement ifor traffic between their users
[15:36] <russss> it's linked from this tweet https://twitter.com/brianweeden/status/798895891541323776
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[15:36] <AndyEsser> russss: goo.gl?
[15:37] <russss> gonzo_: I'd take a wild guess they're going to try and use optical for inter-satellite comms
[15:37] <gonzo_> if they can get the sats following on the same orbits (whicu sounds like the plan) that could be doable
[15:37] <Geoff_G8DHE> thats what it says
[15:38] <russss> Geoff_G8DHE: so it does. I missed that.
[15:38] <russss> that doc is not super interesting, it has a ton of specs about beam steering and emissions, and some stuff about debris mitigation
[15:39] <edmoore> with 4000 they could just run cat-5 between adjacent sats
[15:39] <russss> haha
[15:39] <AndyEsser> come now
[15:39] <AndyEsser> cat-6 at least
[15:39] <edmoore> evidence of living in a 'post-truth' world is that google has a lot of recipes for 'pasta carbonara' on its front page that involve cream and/or peas
[15:39] <russss> edmoore: I'm imagining someone in a spacesuit trying to crimp cables now
[15:39] <gonzo_> and dangle some eth down to earth, you just catch one and plug in
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[15:40] <gonzo_> may have to run a bit
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[15:42] <Geoff_G8DHE> Makes sense for Mars, not sure its that sensible for Earth a lot of bandwidth to take up!
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[18:02] <AndyEsser> hmm
[18:03] <AndyEsser> now to work on Business Plan: "I want to build rocket engines in Bangor. Thank you"
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[18:51] <PE2BZ> !track ubseds18
[18:51] <SpacenearUS> 03PE2BZ: Here you go - 12https://tracker.habhub.org/#!qm=All&q=ubseds18
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[19:44] <SpacenearUS> New position from 03UBSEDS18 after 037 days silence - 12https://tracker.habhub.org/#!qm=All&q=UBSEDS18
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[19:49] <SA6BSS-Mike> ha, speaking of the *Devil :)
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[20:27] <Geoff_G8DHE> Think its on its 6th orbit so far ?
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[20:55] <SA6BSS-Mike> jepp, looks like it
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[21:15] <SpacenearUS> New position from 03IK8SUT-11 after 0319 hours silence - 12https://tracker.habhub.org/#!qm=All&q=IK8SUT-11
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[22:30] <SpacenearUS> New vehicle on the map: 03HB9TSS-11 - 12https://tracker.habhub.org/#!qm=All&q=HB9TSS-11
[22:44] <SpacenearUS> New vehicle on the map: 03SpaceN_chase - 12https://tracker.habhub.org/#!qm=All&q=SpaceN_chase
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[23:05] <SpacenearUS> New position from 03IV3SRD-11 after 039 hours silence - 12https://tracker.habhub.org/#!qm=All&q=IV3SRD-11
[23:07] <SpacenearUS> New vehicle on the map: 03SPACE2 - 12https://tracker.habhub.org/#!qm=All&q=SPACE2
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[00:00] --- Thu Nov 17 2016