highaltitude.log.20161005

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[03:09] <SpacenearUS> New position from 03NM5SS-11 after 039 hours silence - 12https://tracker.habhub.org/#!qm=All&q=NM5SS-11
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[07:58] Action: AndyEsser waves
[07:59] <fsphil> that hertz
[07:59] Action: gonzo_ tels him to put it away
[08:00] <gonzo_> _l
[08:00] <gonzo_> +l
[08:00] <gonzo_> a bad typing day again
[08:05] <mfa298> some of these puns seem to go in cycles
[08:06] <AndyEsser> So much it hertz
[08:06] <AndyEsser> well now I feel stupid...
[08:06] <AndyEsser> hadn't even seen fsphil's message...
[08:11] <daveake> It's a sign
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[08:14] <fsphil> negative
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[08:29] <jakeio> Hello, my A-Level Computing project is to create a software suit that allows 2-way communications with airborne payloads. It will use two LoRa radios in parallel to maintain 100% duty cycle transmit/receive. Can I ask what people think of this, and if they have any suggestions for features. This is all for my 'research and analysis'.
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[08:34] <Geoff-G8DHE-M> Will the receiver front end work happily when your transmitting (in the same band ?) next too it ?
[08:36] <jakeio> I wasn't necessarily going to use the same band, as many people have one 434MHz LoRa and one 868MHz LoRa on one Pi I thought I might use one of those for transmission and another for receiving. Should be less interference that way shouldn't there?
[08:36] <mfa298> some analysis of ir2030 might be useful to demonstrate you've looked at what's allowed (or not)
[08:37] <Geoff-G8DHE-M> Possibly, the front ends have little to no filtering so can still be swamped by other large signals.
[08:38] <Geoff-G8DHE-M> You might want to investigate Circulators, but they are normally failry heavy objects.
[08:40] <jakeio> mfa298, I've commented on the main bands suitable for LoRa, aren't these the 434.04-434.79 and the two 868ish ones, one with the 500mW limit but duty cycle limit of 10% or "techniques to mitigate interference" and the other being the 5mW one we usually use? Geoff-G8DHE-M would you suggest it would be better to use just one transceiver to prevent this? Slightly reducing responsiveness in favour of robustness?
[08:40] <SpacenearUS> New position from 03HIRFW-6 after 0313 hours silence - 12https://tracker.habhub.org/#!qm=All&q=HIRFW-6
[08:41] <Geoff-G8DHE-M> It certainly makes for a simpler and lightweight system. Unless you really need the bandwidth/time then its a lot simpler.
[08:42] <gonzo_> if you are planning those for flight, double check the power limits for airborne kit
[08:43] <Geoff-G8DHE-M> remember 434 and 868 are harmonicaly related so there is always going to be greater residual signals from one band to the other.
[08:45] <mfa298> jakeio: I'm thinking partly for the write up, it's always good to demonstrate you've looked into the details.
[08:46] <mfa298> if you don't need 100% duty cycle on uplink then the higher power 868 option could be good for ground to balloon.
[08:47] <jakeio> Thanks. I'll probably do a table comparing both methods and then decide on the one radio one! And mfa298 thanks, I shall include this in my write up!
[08:47] <Geoff-G8DHE-M> You might also want to read up and comment on intermodulation and mixing products of radio signals as its these that normally limit such systems.
[08:48] <mfa298> A Level computing sounds a lot more interesting than when I did it.
[08:49] <jakeio> OK, will do! Thanks again. Does anyone have any suggested features, what would you find it useful to be able to make an airborne payload do? I've already got suggested things like diagnostic, downloading images manually, etc.
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[08:50] <Geoff-G8DHE-M> Many airborne systems are designed to have a repeating function, to link other ground based systems together.
[08:51] <jakeio> Like some of the UKHASNET stuff?
[08:51] <Geoff-G8DHE-M> Yes that would be an example, anything airborne sees a much greater range, but at the same time can see many wanted/unwanted signals.
[08:52] <mfa298> the other function an uplink is often used for is to trigger a cutdown
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[08:53] <Geoff-G8DHE-M> Another idea is Band scanning for occupancy and use of radio bands.
[08:53] <jakeio> By cutdown do you mean dropping something while airborne? Like what daveake tried a few days ago?
[08:54] <Geoff-G8DHE-M> That sort of thing yes, either itself or extra items
[08:54] <mfa298> originally cutdown tended to mean cutting the balloon away for the payload decended on it's parachute
[08:55] <mfa298> but there are cases of having two payloads that seperate as well
[08:55] <jakeio> OK, that would be interesting. Incorporating some remote servo-control.
[08:55] <Geoff-G8DHE-M> think of temperature & pressure sensors dropped in a line and then results repeated back from the still flying section.
[08:56] <jakeio> Ah, that could be interesting, e.g. transmitting from remote, hard to access areas, disaster areas, etc.
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[11:00] <torntrousers> Hello. I'm looking for some help with how to send payload telemetry to habitat.
[11:00] <torntrousers> I've got to doing an HTTP PUT with some JSON and it replies:
[11:00] <torntrousers> {"error":"unhandled exception","reason":"ForbiddenError: doc.receivers must exist and have one receiver"}
[11:00] <torntrousers> I don't know what doc.receivers is. Any hints?
[11:01] Action: AndyEsser despises errors with incorrect HTTP statuses
[11:01] <AndyEsser> doc.receivers is a list of stations that received the sentence I believe
[11:01] <AndyEsser> if you look at tracker.habitat.org you'll see the callsigns of stations that received the latest sentence
[11:02] <AndyEsser> I believe, don't quote me on it
[11:02] <AndyEsser> adamgreig might be a good person to poke about it
[11:02] <AndyEsser> and possibly best to ask in #habhub
[11:02] <lz1dev> torntrousers: http://habitat.habhub.org/jse/#schemas/payload_telemetry.json
[11:03] <SpacenearUS> New position from 03IV3SRD-11 after 039 hours silence - 12https://tracker.habhub.org/#!qm=All&q=IV3SRD-11
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[11:05] <torntrousers> ok thanks, i didnt know about #habhub, will go there
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[11:39] <SpacenearUS> New vehicle on the map: 03test1 - 12https://tracker.habhub.org/#!qm=All&q=test1
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[12:04] <SpacenearUS> New position from 03NM5SS-6 after 037 days silence - 12https://tracker.habhub.org/#!qm=All&q=NM5SS-6
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[12:05] <SpacenearUS> New vehicle on the map: 03KG5BFY-6 - 12https://tracker.habhub.org/#!qm=All&q=KG5BFY-6
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[12:52] <SpacenearUS> New vehicle on the map: 03CHANGEME - 12https://tracker.habhub.org/#!qm=All&q=CHANGEME
[12:57] <torntrousers> Hello again. Wondering how to test a payload transmitter and i noticed on the habhub tracker map that there is a LORA receiver about 20Kms away from me
[12:57] <torntrousers> G8FJG_3Pi
[12:58] <torntrousers> I had a look at the elevations between us, scroll down the page a bit here - https://www.doogal.co.uk/RouteElevation.php?url=GPX/0aefca34-9707-466d-b499-aa45154b3365.gpx - and its almost line of site but a small hill a bit in the way. Do you think from that there's any chance G8FJG_3Pi might pick up my payload transmissions from the ground?
[12:58] <AndyEsser> possible if there's a duct
[12:58] <Geoff-G8DHE-M> You'll only find out by trying!
[12:59] <torntrousers> How would i get hold of G8FJG_3Pi to see if they'd try?
[12:59] <AndyEsser> mailing list?
[13:00] <Geoff-G8DHE-M> He pops up on here on a regular basis as g8fjg??????
[13:00] <fsphil> he's in the channel from time to time too
[13:00] <fsphil> Ron_G8FJG
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[13:02] <bobsaget> Hello, is there a script available that will scrape the wspr website and add balloons here that are only in WSPR rx areas?
[13:03] <Geoff-G8DHE-M> lz1dev, would be the guy for that!
[13:03] <bobsaget> by here I mean the tracker at habhub
[13:03] <bobsaget> ahh ok
[13:03] <Geoff-G8DHE-M> check in #habhub as well
[13:03] <bobsaget> OK
[13:04] <lz1dev> i don't have a thing for that
[13:04] <lz1dev> maybe becasue the wspr site is pretty bad
[13:04] <lz1dev> ¯\_(Ä)_/¯
[13:04] <bobsaget> bummer, I seem to remember andy the australian had a way
[13:05] <bobsaget> i think he was using modified wsjtx programs running on various stations around the world though
[13:05] <lz1dev> they had a thing :)
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[13:14] <SpacenearUS> New position from 03DO7EN-11 after 0310 days silence - 12https://tracker.habhub.org/#!qm=All&q=DO7EN-11
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[14:21] <SpacenearUS> New position from 03KD0HIP-7 after 033 days silence - 12https://tracker.habhub.org/#!qm=All&q=KD0HIP-7
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[14:51] <SpacenearUS> New vehicle on the map: 03KB1KVR - 12https://tracker.habhub.org/#!qm=All&q=KB1KVR
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[14:54] <russss> Blue Origin in-flight launch escape system test in ~6mins https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bqUIX3Z4r3k
[14:57] <fsphil> oblig usa flag
[14:57] <fsphil> are they required to put them on?
[14:57] <russss> I think they're also obliged to chant "USA USA" whenever something goes well
[14:57] <fsphil> mmm
[14:58] <fsphil> that is an odd looking rocket
[14:58] <russss> 5th flight of the same vehicle
[14:58] <russss> though it's not expected to survive this one
[14:58] <russss> shortest hold ever
[15:00] <fsphil> "Chat is disabled for this live stream"
[15:00] <fsphil> smart
[15:00] <fsphil> aw, hold
[15:00] <russss> not sure why you'd ever enable it tbh
[15:00] <russss> I assume this is a built-in hold
[15:01] <russss> but it's difficult to tell
[15:01] <fsphil> yeah. they should just have a longer countdown :)
[15:01] <fsphil> I'm going home in 5 minutes, after a hold of 55 minutes
[15:01] <russss> heh
[15:01] <adamgreig> how are they destroying the booster, do we know?
[15:01] <fsphil> firing the crew escape bits
[15:02] <adamgreig> yea but are they triggering a booster bad time and seeing if the crew bit detects that and escapes?
[15:02] <adamgreig> or just escaping from a nominal flight
[15:02] <russss> the latter
[15:02] <adamgreig> aw
[15:02] <fsphil> ah. from the sounds of the chat it sounds like the rocket *might* survive
[15:02] <adamgreig> fair
[15:02] <russss> they're going to fire the launch escape, then they expect the booster will go out of envelope and will cut thrust and crash to the ground
[15:02] <russss> but it might survive, maybe
[15:02] <adamgreig> does the booster have parachutes, or is it powered landing only?
[15:02] <russss> powered only I think
[15:02] <fsphil> I bet they've programmed it to handle this
[15:03] <adamgreig> wish the hold was a countdown instead
[15:03] <russss> I'm not sure this is a built-in hold
[15:03] <adamgreig> usually those are countdowns eh
[15:03] <russss> T-1:13 is a weird time for a hold
[15:03] <fsphil> the presenters are in full sales mode
[15:04] <adamgreig> that too :P
[15:04] <adamgreig> GA in the exclusion zone perhaps lol
[15:04] <fsphil> oh, weird noise
[15:04] <adamgreig> there goes the lox
[15:04] <adamgreig> pressure vent i guess
[15:04] <Laurenceb_> how long until launch?
[15:04] <russss> yeah I'd guess that means they'll have to recycle
[15:04] <adamgreig> 1:13 + hold
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[15:04] <Laurenceb_> thats one minute?
[15:05] <adamgreig> yea, but we're 5 minutes into an unplanned? hold
[15:05] <russss> yeah but I think something is not right
[15:05] <Laurenceb_> hmm
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[15:05] <Laurenceb_> yeah doesnt sound good
[15:05] <russss> well, it didn't explode
[15:05] <Laurenceb_> I think in this case its meant to?
[15:05] <Laurenceb_> lol
[15:05] <fsphil> hah
[15:05] <fsphil> success!
[15:05] <fsphil> oh wait
[15:06] <fsphil> oh they're still doing the sales pitch
[15:06] <russss> it didn't explode before it was meant to
[15:06] <russss> sales pitch for the windows.
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[15:06] <adamgreig> wish they'd get on with it, i have to run in a minute lol
[15:07] <fsphil> can't hear what that quiet voice is saying
[15:08] <fsphil> heard "control ..."
[15:08] <Laurenceb_> its all a secret plot
[15:08] <Laurenceb_> to hypnotise the viewers
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[15:09] Nick change: andycamb1 -> andycamb
[15:09] <fsphil> "copy that thanks ..." meh, speak louder
[15:09] <russss> "have you tried turning it off and on again"
[15:10] <russss> I think I heard "ready for recycle"
[15:10] <adamgreig> at least the sales pitch has stopped
[15:11] <fsphil> pump is off
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[15:13] <fsphil> ah, made me jump
[15:13] <russss> me too
[15:13] <fsphil> heard some chat with flight, couldn't make it out
[15:13] <russss> I think this has slightly exceeded my definition of a "brief hold"
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[15:15] <fsphil> my bet is on scrub
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[15:15] <adamgreig> wish they'd put the mission control loop on the audio properly
[15:15] <fsphil> yeah
[15:15] <fsphil> ".... is complete"
[15:16] <adamgreig> rather than what I assume is it going off in a speaker in the same room as the sales team
[15:16] <russss> presumably we're hearing it through a speaker on the pad
[15:16] <russss> ...so the rocket can hear what's going on?
[15:16] <adamgreig> haha or the pad?
[15:16] <adamgreig> I feel like you don't need a speaker on the pad
[15:16] <Laurenceb_> I just see "the streamer stopped streaming" ?
[15:16] <adamgreig> but I guess it would have to have a PA system
[15:16] <fsphil> aww I think they muted the stream
[15:16] <russss> I can literally hear crickets
[15:16] <fsphil> from the control room
[15:16] <adamgreig> the poor crickets won't know what's hit them
[15:18] <fsphil> can still hear voices. or that could just be me
[15:18] <russss> perhaps they switched to a mic further away
[15:20] <russss> it looks like the lox vent valve got closed
[15:21] <russss> ah yes
[15:21] <russss> T-15
[15:21] <fsphil> oh no scrub, cool
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[15:26] <Laurenceb_> time to reload stream
[15:27] <Laurenceb_> hope it works
[15:29] <Laurenceb_> umbilical looks neat
[15:30] <adamgreig> the booster is going to try and proceed to space? lol
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[15:30] Nick change: andycamb1 -> andycamb
[15:30] <fsphil> you'd think it would sense the emergency and cut thrust
[15:30] <russss> presumably it would do, if there was actually an emergency
[15:30] <fsphil> I'm tired of admiring this rocket. hurry up and break it
[15:31] <russss> good noises
[15:31] <adamgreig> wonder why they had to hold in the first place
[15:32] <russss> actually sounds like something has a worn bearing, heh
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[15:32] <fsphil> 4 times in space, it's feeling a bit depressed
[15:34] <adamgreig> oh my god
[15:34] <russss> those fins didn't seem to move particularly smoothly...
[15:34] <fsphil> hold
[15:35] <adamgreig> yay
[15:35] <russss> bzz. bzz. bzz.
[15:35] <russss> this thing makes some interesting noises
[15:36] <Laurenceb_> sounds like venting to me
[15:36] <adamgreig> brief flash of more exciting UI
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[15:36] <adamgreig> oh yay at last
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[15:37] <fsphil> that looks unfriendly
[15:37] <adamgreig> spinning all over the place
[15:38] <adamgreig> guess that's what the seatbelts are for lol
[15:38] <russss> yeah I don't know if you'd get out of that with your retinas attached
[15:38] <fsphil> hah, booster still going
[15:38] <adamgreig> alive though perhaps
[15:38] <fsphil> yes, you'd survive but not without injury
[15:38] <fsphil> feet
[15:39] <adamgreig> nice mains
[15:39] <fsphil> sweet
[15:39] <adamgreig> "a bit sporty", nice
[15:41] <fsphil> nicely done
[15:41] <fsphil> dunno about "safe ride"
[15:42] <fsphil> did they mention an altitude for the booster?
[15:42] <russss> 200kft+
[15:43] <Vaizki> almost spaceish
[15:43] <fsphil> 60km, over half way there
[15:43] <fsphil> should get a sonic boom
[15:43] <fsphil> love it!
[15:44] <russss> that is a terrifying thing
[15:44] <fsphil> lol
[15:44] <fsphil> I'd love to see it in person
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[16:04] <arjunnaha> Quick question, I'm looking at my payload data with regards to the external temperature. I've found NASA's temperature/altitude model and chucked it all into Excel. My temp vs the predicted temp is vastly different, am I missing the trick somewhere?
[16:06] <Geoff-G8DHE-M> How accurate was the GPS altitude data and the temperature sensor ?
[16:09] <arjunnaha> It was the PITS board Ublox and an DS18B20 temp sensor
[16:11] <Geoff-G8DHE-M> The GPS altitude will depend on how many sats and there locations for any accuracy, there are normally parameters to give you accuracy in the data. Was there a calibration for DS18B20 no idea how accurate they are at -ve temperatures ?
[16:12] <fsphil> the temperature of the DS18B20 might not match the air temperature very well
[16:12] <fsphil> especially higher up where it's thinner
[16:12] <arjunnaha> I think the DS18B20 was pre-calibrated, but the GPS altitude didn't look very accurate
[16:18] <Geoff-G8DHE-M> Can you not run a claibration of the sensor now even, just to see how accurate it might be?
[16:19] <Geoff-G8DHE-M> How far out was it anyway,are you talking a few degrees or 10's of degrees out and over what range, were guessing otherwise.
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[16:23] <arjunnaha> It was 10 of degrees out - http://pastebin.com/X8jtkCbk
[16:23] <SpacenearUS> New vehicle on the map: 03KG5BFY-8 - 12https://tracker.habhub.org/#!qm=All&q=KG5BFY-8
[16:24] <arjunnaha> With the columns at: TEMP, ALT, PREDICTED TEMP, DIFFERENCE
[16:25] <Geoff-G8DHE-M> Ah the first temp is 31.4 degrees C ? Which country are you in ?
[16:27] <arjunnaha> A very sunny day in the UK
[16:28] <Geoff-G8DHE-M> Was the sensor shielded from the sun, or was its black surface absorning direct sunlight ?
[16:28] <Geoff-G8DHE-M> also where was the sensor mounted ?
[16:30] <arjunnaha> The sensor was encased in metal like this: https://www.amazon.co.uk/Arduino-Raspberry-Waterproof-Digital-Thermal/dp/B00WW6V342/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1475685036&sr=8-1&keywords=ds18b20+temperature+sensor
[16:31] <Geoff-G8DHE-M> But sticking out in the direct sunlight ?
[16:31] <arjunnaha> Yes, out of the payload
[16:31] <Geoff-G8DHE-M> To measure air temperature it needs to be shielded from direct sunlight which will heat the surface up.
[16:32] <Geoff-G8DHE-M> you just want air flowing over the surface and shielded from direct sunlight.
[16:32] <arjunnaha> Ah, that would help
[16:32] <arjunnaha> I'll try and remember that for my next launch!
[16:33] <Geoff-G8DHE-M> some form of double screen is best with just the air being able to flow thru.
[16:33] <Vaizki> https://store.vaisala.com/eu/productresources/large1/HMS82.jpg
[16:33] <Vaizki> wink wink
[16:33] <arjunnaha> haha
[16:36] <Geoff-G8DHE-M> The first layer will get heated and radiate IR, the second layer blocks the IR, both layers need to let air flow however!
[16:37] <SpacenearUS> New vehicle on the map: 03NM5SS-5 - 12https://tracker.habhub.org/#!qm=All&q=NM5SS-5
[16:38] <Geoff-G8DHE-M> at low air pressure the DS18B20 being an active device also outputs heat with no air to remove the heat it suffers self heating as well.
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[16:40] <SpacenearUS> New vehicle on the map: 03KG5BFY-5 - 12https://tracker.habhub.org/#!qm=All&q=KG5BFY-5
[16:40] <SpeedEvil> Convection falls off sharply with pressure
[16:40] <SpeedEvil> conduction not so much
[16:40] <SpeedEvil> (if at all really)
[16:40] <arjunnaha> ah, our next launch will be a proper data collecting payload, so I will look into all of this next time
[16:40] <SpeedEvil> If you have even small airflow, as fast as convection normally or not much faster, it's good
[16:42] <SpacenearUS> New position from 03WIDE2-1 after 03a day silence - 12https://tracker.habhub.org/#!qm=All&q=WIDE2-1
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[17:09] <lz1dev> lul
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[17:31] <xer0rex_> Hello I am new here. How do I get into High altitude ballooning?
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[17:33] <SpeedEvil> Where do you live?
[17:33] <xer0rex_> Southampton
[17:33] <xer0rex_> UK
[17:33] <SpeedEvil> LEgality varies from 'meh, do whatever you want' to 'You will go to jail'
[17:33] <SpeedEvil> ah
[17:33] <SpeedEvil> then it's pretty managable.
[17:34] <xer0rex_> Phew, good to know
[17:34] <SpeedEvil> Fo small balloons (will not exeed 2m in diamter at any point in flight) the regulations are fairly minimal.
[17:34] <SpeedEvil> For larger ones, you need to apply for permission and can only sensibly launch from away from airports and ...
[17:34] <SpeedEvil> what are you hoping to do?
[17:35] <xer0rex_> I am looking into getting into it as a hobby. I want to learn the specifications of it. I am a member of the Spceflight society at the University of Southampton
[17:36] <xer0rex_> I am not sure what I can/want to send as the payload
[17:36] <Bencls> camera
[17:36] <SpeedEvil> cheese
[17:37] <xer0rex_> Yes, that for sure (the camera)
[17:37] <Bencls> CD Drive (to catch aliens)
[17:37] <bertrik> plush toys are popular apparently
[17:37] <Bencls> Radio Tracking beacon is popular among those who want to recover their payloads
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[17:39] <xer0rex_> I am into amature radio, but dont know a lot about PCB design (looking to get into it). I have been messing about with KiKAD a bit, but never built my own PCB
[17:39] <xer0rex_> So dont know where to go on that end either
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[17:39] <Bencls> Copper coated board, permanent marker and ferric chloride
[17:39] <Bencls> And a drill
[17:40] <Bencls> But you don't necessarily need your own PCB
[17:40] <Bencls> You could just use veroboard
[17:41] <Bencls> https://ukhas.org.uk/frontpage:projects <-- Reading about what other people have done is a good place to start
[17:41] <xer0rex_> I could, but arnt they a bit flaky?
[17:41] <Bencls> What, varoboard?
[17:42] <xer0rex_> Yeah
[17:42] <Bencls> nah, The stuff works quite well.
[17:43] <xer0rex_> Ah okay. How long will it take me to set up a launch? Can I start working on it and do it in a month or so?
[17:44] <Bencls> Yes, although you will need to apply for launching permission nowish
[17:44] <xer0rex_> Ah right
[17:44] <Bencls> http://stratosvision.com/docs/CAALaunchForm.doc
[17:44] <Bencls> https://ukhas.org.uk/general:restrictions_legality
[17:45] <xer0rex_> https://ukhas.org.uk/general:restrictions_legality
[17:45] <xer0rex_> Sorr was trying to copy it
[17:48] Nick change: pd3t -> pb1dft
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[17:50] <Ian_> Vero Board . . . Hmmm. CPC Farnell strip board E003 or E005. Both are gold flashed, so better than Veroboard. The former is SRBP FR2(?) and the latter FR4 fibreglass substrate
[17:51] <Geoff-G8DHE-M> Trying to do it in a couple of months is also a bit hopeful!
[17:51] <Bencls> I meant Vero board in the same way people call vacuum cleaners hovers
[17:52] <Geoff-G8DHE-M> If you need speed then one of the kit starters might be a better idea Pi In The Sky (PITS)
[17:52] <Geoff-G8DHE-M> or Habduino
[17:52] <Ian_> Accepted. I was just pointing out that there are improvements to the basic product. The problem with VB is that the copper oxidises before and after the project is made
[17:53] <Geoff-G8DHE-M> http://www.pi-in-the-sky.com/
[17:53] <Bencls> yes, I noticed that with my generic brand strip board, Had to clean it with iron wool every time before soldering (don't do that).
[17:53] <Geoff-G8DHE-M> http://www.habduino.org/
[17:53] <mfa298> the one to stay away from is breadboard. Anything with soldered joints is probably secure enough for most flights
[17:53] Action: mfa298 wonders if anyones done a wirewrap payload yet
[17:54] <Geoff-G8DHE-M> xer0rex_, Have you founbd the Wiki yet ?
[17:55] <Bencls> Wire wrap is old school, does anyone actually do that anymore?
[17:55] <Geoff-G8DHE-M> https://ukhas.org.uk/start
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[17:57] <ALMA-3> hi, yesterday I got the ALMA-3 flight approved with the unmodified ALMA-2 payload doc
[17:57] <ALMA-3> But I wonder if that is right. I want to update the call-sign to ALMA-3 of course
[17:58] <ALMA-3> Does that mean a new payload doc or is that only about the format?
[17:58] <Geoff-G8DHE-M> The payload doc has the callsign in it
[17:58] <ALMA-3> ok good to know
[17:58] <ALMA-3> The flight doc has it as well, hence my confusion
[17:58] <mfa298> Bencls: i doubt many do, I think I did see something that suggested it can be a better joint than solder if done well, but probably a slow method.
[17:58] <Geoff-G8DHE-M> just use the old payload doc and copy it and modify callsign, then include in a new Flight doc and send some test messages thru the system before asking for approval
[17:59] <ALMA-3> I will do. What is the approval channel again?
[17:59] <Geoff-G8DHE-M> #habhub
[17:59] <ALMA-3> thanks 1e+06
[17:59] <Geoff-G8DHE-M> Flight doc only asks for callsign AS INFO
[17:59] <Ian_> I suppose wire wrap might succumb to the wide temperature variations of a HAB flight
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[18:16] <xer0rex_> Geoff-G8DHE-M: Sorry I was walking home, will have a look at it now
[18:17] <xer0rex_> Yup found it!
[18:17] <cm13g09> mfa298: Ping (Urg)
[18:21] Nick change: ensign -> rexnsh
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[19:29] <SpacenearUS> New vehicle on the map: 03ALMA-3 - 12https://tracker.habhub.org/#!qm=All&q=ALMA-3
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[20:01] <DutchMillbt> ALMA-3?
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[20:20] <SpacenearUS> New position from 03KF5KMP-4 after 032 days silence - 12https://tracker.habhub.org/#!qm=All&q=KF5KMP-4
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[20:29] Nick change: pb1dft__ -> PD3T
[20:29] <SpacenearUS> New vehicle on the map: 03DK0PT - 12https://tracker.habhub.org/#!qm=All&q=DK0PT
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[21:15] <SpacenearUS> New position from 03X0 after 032 days silence - 12https://tracker.habhub.org/#!qm=All&q=X0
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[22:14] <SpacenearUS> New position from 03KG5BFY-6 after 038 hours silence - 12https://tracker.habhub.org/#!qm=All&q=KG5BFY-6
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[23:06] <SpacenearUS> New position from 03IV3SRD-11 after 0310 hours silence - 12https://tracker.habhub.org/#!qm=All&q=IV3SRD-11
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[00:00] --- Thu Oct 6 2016