highaltitude.log.20160927

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[00:36] <Ian_> Idle question: If I take the HCSD card from my RPi3 (Raspian Wheezy), which boots to a console login, should I expect it to be a happy bunny on a Pi Zero or should I just be cutting a brand new card?
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[05:19] <SpacenearUS> New position from 03K6RPT-11 after 0314 hours silence - 12https://tracker.habhub.org/#!qm=All&q=K6RPT-11
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[05:35] <SpacenearUS> New position from 03S-18 after 039 hours silence - 12https://tracker.habhub.org/#!qm=All&q=S-18
[05:55] <SpacenearUS> New position from 03KD2EAT-11 after 0313 hours silence - 12https://tracker.habhub.org/#!qm=All&q=KD2EAT-11
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[06:43] <mfa298> Ian_: it ought to work although are you sure it's wheezy. the standard images for the pi3 are Jessie (newer than wheezy)
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[06:46] <Ian_> mfa298 it's the standard one as downloaded by NOOBS lite, so it may well be Jessie, rather than Wheezy. A yesterday download.
[06:47] <Ian_> And, no I wasn't sitting up all night waiting on a reply :) I do have a small raft of LoRa config questions though . . . ?QRV
[06:48] <mfa298> best bet is to try it, although if downloaded yesterday it should be fine
[06:49] <Ian_> Without the LoRa board, it ran convincingly . . . with Dave's Gateway software.
[06:49] <AndyEsser> morning
[06:49] <Ian_> is it that late already? GM OM
[06:53] <Ian_> As far as my memory serves me (E&OE) the idea is to edit gateway.txt, but given is gateway.txt.old and gateway-sample.txt so the dev is still rolling. I took the sample and made a copy of that to edit convincingly, but I have a few questions about which I would like clarification
[06:54] <Ian_> EnableDev=N, lowopt_0=0, power_0=255, #SMSFolder=./, UplinkTime_0=2, UplinkCycle_0=60
[06:55] <Ian_> That's the set of variables that I am going to ask about.
[06:55] <Ian_> The device is to be RX only.
[06:55] <Ian_> I need to guarantee no TX
[06:56] <Ian_> 1). UplinkTime and UplinkCycle commented out as developmental tx facility not required ?
[06:56] <daveake> It won't Tx without external intervention anyway
[06:56] <Ian_> 2). power_0=255 commented out or set to 0 ?
[06:56] <daveake> But yes comment those out so it listens all the time
[06:57] <Ian_> 3). lowopt_0=0 what is the purpose of this please ?
[06:57] <daveake> All you need, in the channel-specific sections, are the frequency and mode settings
[06:58] <daveake> turns off optimisation of slow packets
[06:58] <Ian_> OK, can I be nosey though?
[06:58] <Ian_> 4). EnableDev=N what does this unlock if it is Y (RTFC?)
[06:58] <daveake> whatever I'm playing with at the time
[06:58] <Ian_> 5/5). #SMSFolder=./ patently an uplink message folder ?
[06:59] <daveake> yes
[06:59] <SpacenearUS> New position from 03HB9FDK-11 after 0316 hours silence - 12https://tracker.habhub.org/#!qm=All&q=HB9FDK-11
[07:01] <Ian_> Sounds good Dave, thank you. It's all getting a step closer. Now I just have to find some 50R terminating resistors and the bag of various adaptors that I amassed long enough ago to have been able to successfully misplace them!
[07:02] <Ian_> The resistors for when I don't have an antenna handy during my playing.
[07:03] <daveake> What, in case it Txs? It's 10mW.
[07:04] <Ian_> Yes, really. I have them and don't know how delicate they are to no load transmissions - The NTX2B I know are safe.
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[07:47] <gonzo_> I missed the scooby flight yesterday
[07:48] <gonzo_> did they land clear of those pylons?
[07:54] <mfa298> I'm not sure we saw much from him during/after the flight here
[07:55] <mfa298> and I'm not sure his posts abotu the flight got approved (he says he did email the list)
[07:56] <gonzo_> it was a very hab-ish time. Though they did mention waiting for a break in the rain
[07:56] <gonzo_> and for Wales, that would be about june
[07:57] <fsphil> 2018
[07:58] <gonzo_> that soon?
[07:58] <gonzo_> well, wet air coming in off the sea, over hills. It;s only going to end one way
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[08:01] <Vaizki> green & lush?
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[08:04] <gonzo_> and wet
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[08:06] <AndyEsser> flying lesson yesterday, coming into land
[08:06] <AndyEsser> "Caution, start of runway wet, middle wet, end of runway wet"
[08:06] <daveake> I have to remind people that I don't live in Wales.
[08:06] <AndyEsser> Ok, I get it... it's Wet
[08:06] <AndyEsser> it's WAles, of course it's wet
[08:07] <fsphil> wet wet wet?
[08:07] <AndyEsser> indeed
[08:07] <daveake> We do see a lot of Welsh weather but it mostly at a distance :-)
[08:08] <AndyEsser> suddenly becomes clear blue skies and warm when it hits the border?
[08:10] <Vaizki> I thought that's how the border was drawn.. on a weather map
[08:17] <daveake> Makes sense :-)
[08:20] <gonzo_> I had someone at the weekend asking about shropshire... That's in wales isn't it.
[08:20] <gonzo_> And they were from b'ham!
[08:21] <daveake> Say no more
[08:21] <fsphil> sure that's practically wales anyway
[08:21] <gonzo_> it's on the other side of the wet line
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[08:39] <abu> hi all
[08:41] <mfa298> hi abu
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[08:57] <abu> hi all, apologies, I have a terrible internet connection!
[08:58] <abu> could someone tell me, when using filling scales to fill the balloon with helium, do I have to fill untill the neck lift value is reached?
[08:59] <edmoore> yes
[08:59] <edmoore> though perhaps account for the weight of the fill tube
[08:59] <abu> ah ok, thanks
[08:59] <edmoore> when you say filling scales i presume you mean something like fish/luggage scales which you could use upside down?
[08:59] <abu> yes, thats what I'll be using
[08:59] <edmoore> gotcha
[09:00] <edmoore> note that if it's windy then the balloon's drag will produce an additional force on the scales
[09:00] <edmoore> so do you best to try and move it with the wind while measuring
[09:00] <abu> I'm using a hwoyee 1600 with 1.5kg payload, it works out a neck lift of 2.708kg, does that sound about right?
[09:00] <edmoore> yep
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[09:02] <abu> excellent, thanks for the advice
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[09:13] <fsphil> nice and beefy payload
[09:17] <edmoore> like in the days of yore
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[10:48] <Vaizki> 1.5kg? so are there landing beers in the box?
[10:51] <SpacenearUS> New position from 03ZERO after 034 days silence - 12https://tracker.habhub.org/#!qm=All&q=ZERO
[11:00] <SpacenearUS> New position from 03HIRFW-6 after 0315 hours silence - 12https://tracker.habhub.org/#!qm=All&q=HIRFW-6
[11:05] <SpacenearUS> New position from 03IV3SRD-11 after 039 hours silence - 12https://tracker.habhub.org/#!qm=All&q=IV3SRD-11
[11:10] <SpacenearUS> New position from 03KF5KMP-5 after 036 days silence - 12https://tracker.habhub.org/#!qm=All&q=KF5KMP-5
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[11:15] <SpacenearUS> New vehicle on the map: 03EPOPKW_chase - 12https://tracker.habhub.org/#!qm=All&q=EPOPKW_chase
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[11:23] <pb0ahx> !flights
[11:23] <SpacenearUS> 03pb0ahx: There are no flights currently :(
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[11:40] <SpacenearUS> New position from 03VE2WMG-11 after 0317 hours silence - 12https://tracker.habhub.org/#!qm=All&q=VE2WMG-11
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[11:50] <SpacenearUS> New vehicle on the map: 03KF5KMP-4 - 12https://tracker.habhub.org/#!qm=All&q=KF5KMP-4
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[12:55] <fsphil> kicad users, do you draw mounting holes in the pcb outline or make a component and place a few of them instead?
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[12:58] <adamgreig> fsphil: make a component
[12:58] <adamgreig> might i suggest agg-kicad and its M3-MOUNT and M3-HOLE parts
[12:58] <adamgreig> https://github.com/adamgreig/agg-kicad/blob/master/agg.pretty/M3_MOUNT.kicad_mod
[12:58] <fsphil> you may :) thanks
[12:58] <adamgreig> https://github.com/adamgreig/agg-kicad/blob/master/agg.pretty/M3_HOLE.kicad_mod
[12:58] <fsphil> what's the difference?
[12:59] <adamgreig> the hole is literally just a hole, the mount has a no-mask circle with smaller holes in it, which works very well if you use a locking washer and also looks cool
[12:59] <AndyEsser> one's a hole, and one's a mount - obv
[12:59] <adamgreig> photos incoming
[12:59] <adamgreig> https://www.flickr.com/photos/randomskk/14915186042
[12:59] <adamgreig> mount ^
[12:59] <fsphil> ah, surround the hole with vias?
[12:59] <adamgreig> the hole you can probably imagine
[12:59] <fsphil> noice
[13:00] <fsphil> yeah that does look good
[13:00] <adamgreig> or for an example that's not gunked with solder paste, https://www.flickr.com/photos/randomskk/19113969893
[13:00] Action: AndyEsser steals link
[13:00] <adamgreig> so it serves two good purposes
[13:00] <adamgreig> 1) it really does lock well onto locking washers (the ones with little teeth), which is nice in high-vibration things?
[13:01] <adamgreig> but more importantly, 2) it stops you being tempted to route tracks inside the area occupied by the washer and screw head
[13:01] <fsphil> yeah that be bad
[13:01] <adamgreig> which is otherwise irrisistable with the normal holes
[13:03] <adamgreig> but yea, submodule https://github.com/adamgreig/agg-kicad :P
[13:03] <fsphil> the mask doesn't line up with the silk in that last board. pesky pcb fabs
[13:03] <adamgreig> ikr
[13:03] Nick change: Steffann -> Steffanx
[13:08] <edmoore> the little teeth are next to useless for high vibration things
[13:08] <edmoore> possibly even worse that having northing
[13:08] <edmoore> nothing*
[13:08] <adamgreig> wondered when you'd come by :P
[13:08] <edmoore> threadlocker is a very much better answer to the problem
[13:09] <edmoore> well i work with high vibration things, have to know this stuff
[13:10] <edmoore> there are a series of excellent papers and videos on vibration-proofing mechanical fasteners and it's quite eye-opening to see how long toothy or spring washers don't last
[13:10] <edmoore> tho it depends a bit of the axis of vibration
[13:10] <fsphil> I think I remember a video on that
[13:13] <fsphil> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_ne19-3vkJg
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[13:28] <SpacenearUS> New position from 03HIRFW-5 after 03a day silence - 12https://tracker.habhub.org/#!qm=All&q=HIRFW-5
[13:46] <SpacenearUS> New vehicle on the map: 03N1YIP-11 - 12https://tracker.habhub.org/#!qm=All&q=N1YIP-11
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[14:50] <Laurenceb__> ooh a vibration discussion
[14:50] Action: Laurenceb__ has been looking at similar issues on vehicles
[14:51] <Laurenceb__> mainly vibration isolating fixings for medical stuff in ambulances
[14:51] <Geoff-G8DHE-M> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=W4s2UwKm7dc
[14:51] <Laurenceb__> it turns out its very easy to make the problem worse rather than better with illconsidered use of "dampers"
[14:53] <gonzo_> bit of system dynamics there
[14:55] <Laurenceb__> yeah you need to stick the system onto a vibrating table to be sure you are actually helping
[14:55] <Laurenceb__> some of the off the shelf systems we tried made things up to 10dB worse O_o
[14:59] <AndyEsser> night all
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[15:07] <abu> hi all
[15:08] <abu> Could someone help me with the issue of insurance? do i need any if i'm launching a HAB?
[15:09] <Geoff-G8DHE-M> Depends is it a personal launch or a school/company launch ?
[15:09] <abu> its a school launch
[15:10] <Geoff-G8DHE-M> No direct experience but isn't covered in the normal risk asesment submission you complete for a school activity ?
[15:11] <abu> Possibly, thanks, I'll look in to it.
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[15:46] <SpacenearUS> New position from 03HB9FDK-11 after 036 hours silence - 12https://tracker.habhub.org/#!qm=All&q=HB9FDK-11
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[18:21] <x-f> http://www.spacex.com/Mars - 10 minutes
[18:21] <adamgreig> prepatory video: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0qo78R_yYFA
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[18:22] <Laurenceb__> 14000 tonnes
[18:22] <Laurenceb__> crazy
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[18:33] <mattbrejza> that rocket has 4x the thrust of the saturn V, and two needed for mars?
[18:34] <Laurenceb__> yeah, must have large payload
[18:34] <Laurenceb__> I had assumed it would go direct to mars with <100tonnes of payload
[18:35] <mattbrejza> it had a cluster of ~20 engines that they just tested?
[18:35] <Laurenceb__> aiui 42 engines
[18:35] <Laurenceb__> yeah
[18:35] <Laurenceb__> also no animation of earth re-entry
[18:35] <mattbrejza> i thought hte graphic said 127MN, and i thought the engine they fired was 7MN
[18:35] <Laurenceb__> that is a very hard part they bypassed
[18:36] <Laurenceb__> no it was less
[18:36] <Laurenceb__> also the getting back from mars part...
[18:37] <Laurenceb__> nasa has done a lot of work on methane/oxygen generation using solar power and zeolites to harvest from the atmosphere, but they would have to have that part demonstrated
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[18:39] <Laurenceb__> "we will go to mars when we have fixed the projector"
[18:40] <adamgreig> Laurenceb__: for the people on mars?
[18:40] <adamgreig> or for the booster?
[18:40] <mattbrejza> oh the F-1 is 7MN
[18:40] <adamgreig> doesn't look like the people on mars need to come home, it terraforms in a handful of days
[18:40] <adamgreig> shame the livestream isn't starting
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[18:40] <Laurenceb__> lul adamgreig
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[18:40] <Laurenceb__> magic terraforming solves all the problems
[18:40] <craag> "Waiting for everyone to reach their seats and get settled. Starting in 5 to 10."
[18:40] <craag> 2 minutes ago @elonmusk
[18:43] <lz1dev> spacex fm
[18:47] <staylo> Waiting for the five-minute theremin solo
[18:49] <staylo> Must be some very distant seats, or some very unsettling music
[18:51] <craag> hmm https://twitter.com/AusYouthAero/status/780839545138929664
[18:53] <adamgreig> "People still filing in. Expect a start maybe in the next 10 minutes. Also, no wifi at all here" 1m ago
[18:54] <Vaizki> shocking, no widi
[18:54] <Vaizki> wifi even.. how will they manage
[18:54] <Vaizki> I'm sure Mars has wifi though, right?
[18:54] <staylo> Plenty of midi though
[18:58] <Laurenceb__> starting
[18:58] <Laurenceb__> maybe...
[19:00] <fsphil> they're going to run out of stars at this rate
[19:00] <adamgreig> it looped over just as you said that :P
[19:00] <fsphil> noo, time travel
[19:00] <fsphil> I hear an audience
[19:00] <fsphil> ahh, this brings me back to every ESA web stream ever
[19:00] <Vaizki> ze frenz
[19:01] <Vaizki> slooooow and booooooring
[19:01] <AndyEsser> I'm going to assume that you're all tuned in :P
[19:02] <Vaizki> no I just talk to myself pretending I'm Elon Musk at the same time
[19:02] <AndyEsser> :P
[19:02] <fsphil> psssh, pluto
[19:02] <Vaizki> this is like 4th grade
[19:03] <fsphil> I dunno, venus is really nice to look at through a telescope
[19:05] <AndyEsser> The population at the bottom is amusing :)
[19:06] <Vaizki> nobody laughed :(
[19:06] <Vaizki> he said "we can warm it up"
[19:06] <Vaizki> is he talking terraforming?
[19:06] <fsphil> *hand wave science*
[19:06] <AndyEsser> he's a proponent of melting the ice caps to release CO2
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[19:14] <staylo> Green wins.
[19:16] <Vaizki> yes I would also put a HUGE window on the front of a space ship
[19:17] <Vaizki> .. which is just one of the reasons why I don't design space ships
[19:18] <AndyEsser> :P
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[19:20] <Vaizki> aaaand terraforming
[19:20] <fsphil> on the surface of mars it's awfuly like the ship from the Martian
[19:20] <AndyEsser> got no sense of scale from that video
[19:20] <AndyEsser> seen it twice now
[19:20] <AndyEsser> still no idea
[19:20] <adamgreig> 112m tall booster that's 11m diameter or so
[19:20] <adamgreig> 112m whole stack height, sorry
[19:20] <adamgreig> 18m spaceship diameter or something
[19:21] <AndyEsser> ta
[19:21] <Vaizki> I have not seen The Martian
[19:22] <AndyEsser> IT's a good film
[19:22] <AndyEsser> and a good book
[19:22] <AndyEsser> I'd recommend
[19:22] <Vaizki> read the book yes
[19:22] <fsphil> I've seen the film but not read the book :)
[19:22] <fsphil> never get time to read a book
[19:23] <x-f> the book is way better than the film, the film was good though
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[19:34] <fsphil> did he just say venus has a lower gravity well than earth?
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[19:35] <AndyEsser> he did correct himself after didn't he?
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[19:36] <fsphil> said it would be a little more difficult
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[19:36] <adamgreig> venus is 80% earth mass?
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[19:36] <fsphil> 91% according to random google result
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[19:36] <fsphil> I thought it was closer than that
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[19:40] <fsphil> nice
[19:41] <AndyEsser> REALLY FUN
[19:41] <AndyEsser> :P
[19:42] <fsphil> he's really selling it eh :)
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[19:50] <Laurenceb__> water mining
[19:50] <Laurenceb__> doing it wrong
[19:54] <fsphil> most of the time would be getting through security
[19:56] <Laurenceb__> nasa have done water extraction from simulated atmosphere
[19:56] <Laurenceb__> using zeolites
[19:56] <Laurenceb__> seems much simpler
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[20:00] <AndyEsser> fook me....
[20:01] Nick change: pb1dft__ -> pb1dft
[20:01] <fsphil> professor X will be pleased
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[20:01] <fsphil> maybe not with the steps though
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[20:07] <Vaizki> haha
[20:07] <fsphil> lol
[20:07] <fsphil> what a load of crap
[20:07] <Vaizki> he forgot to say he's a vegan
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[20:08] <AndyEsser> I missed that, what was crap?
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[20:08] <Vaizki> tl;dr - audience question, dude went to burning man and toilets were full of shit. is mars going to be full of shit too?
[20:08] <AndyEsser> lol
[20:09] <Laurenceb__> wow the tank
[20:10] <Vaizki> what the..
[20:10] <fsphil> the audience are weird today
[20:10] <AndyEsser> very weird
[20:10] <Vaizki> I wonder if anyone has an offensive shirt
[20:10] <adamgreig> lol of pretty awful audience qs lol
[20:11] <fsphil> Jeff Bezos's mates
[20:14] <Laurenceb__> lol Vaizki
[20:14] <Laurenceb__> lol burning man wtf
[20:14] <Laurenceb__> go home stoner
[20:15] <fsphil> you're a bit behind
[20:15] <Laurenceb__> yeah 5 min delay as busy
[20:15] <Laurenceb__> wow this guy
[20:15] <fsphil> yeah that guy was nutes
[20:15] <fsphil> -e
[20:15] <fsphil> there's a few other odd ones coming up too
[20:15] <Laurenceb__> oh dear
[20:15] <fsphil> not quite that bad though
[20:15] <Laurenceb__> inb4 emdrive
[20:16] <fsphil> heh, not emdrive but improbability drive
[20:16] <adamgreig> oh my god
[20:16] <adamgreig> the audience
[20:16] <Laurenceb__> like a load of stoners
[20:17] <fsphil> this is the worst Q+A in a long time
[20:17] <AndyEsser> not what I imagine he'd be answering questions about
[20:17] <Laurenceb__> inb4 "dude, weed lmao"
[20:17] <AndyEsser> Outer Space Education Alliance...
[20:18] <Laurenceb__> inspires the shit out of us
[20:18] <adamgreig> keep up Laurenceb__ :P
[20:18] <Laurenceb__> hehe
[20:18] <fsphil> lol
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[20:22] <Vaizki> ok this is getting downright waste-of-timeish
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[20:23] <AndyEsser> He's doing well to keep his composure
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[20:23] <Laurenceb__> im 5 minutes slow
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[20:23] <Laurenceb__> inb4 "hi elon I want your babies"
[20:23] <Laurenceb__> it's like they invited nasaspaceflight.com ... oh wait they did
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[20:24] <Vaizki> ffs
[20:24] <fsphil> wopw
[20:24] <fsphil> -p
[20:24] <Laurenceb__> improbability drive...
[20:24] <fsphil> local idiot
[20:24] <AndyEsser> once again... keep up Laurenceb__
[20:24] <fsphil> at least he was honest
[20:24] <AndyEsser> :P
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[20:24] <Laurenceb__> I'm facepalming 5 minutes late
[20:24] <Laurenceb__> this just gets worse
[20:24] <AndyEsser> just skip ahead and save some brain cells
[20:25] <adamgreig> just stop at the audience qs
[20:25] <Vaizki> haha outer space education alliance strikes again!
[20:25] <fsphil> outer space education aliliance again
[20:25] <fsphil> they're worse than the empire
[20:25] <AndyEsser> ASK THE SODDING QUESTION ALREADY
[20:25] <Vaizki> or klingons
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[20:25] <fsphil> expecting some interest from the United Federation of Planets next
[20:25] <Vaizki> the purpose of the question is to get her alliance noticed
[20:25] <Vaizki> not to get an answer
[20:26] <AndyEsser> fsphil: HA!
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[20:27] <AndyEsser> TAKE THE MIC AWAY FROM HER
[20:27] <Vaizki> :D
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[20:29] <fsphil> +1 for heart of gold
[20:29] <AndyEsser> +1
[20:30] <AndyEsser> The HoG :)
[20:30] <fsphil> PIGS IN SPACE
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[20:31] <Vaizki> finally pigs can fly with minimal thrust
[20:31] <Vaizki> I have a startup!
[20:31] <AndyEsser> omg
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[20:33] <Laurenceb__> wow I was accurate
[20:33] <Laurenceb__> someone wanted to kiss him
[20:33] <Laurenceb__> beyond parody
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[20:33] <Laurenceb__> but elon you said we gunna go to mars
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[20:33] <AndyEsser> wait until you get to the 30 ton electric bus
[20:33] <Laurenceb__> expecting interstellar weed farm at this rate
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[20:34] <fsphil> abort, abort!
[20:34] <adamgreig> haha
[20:34] <fsphil> I think he seen who was about to ask the last question
[20:35] <fsphil> that was AWFUL
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[20:35] <AndyEsser> He's going to be fuming
[20:35] <x-f> that wasn't a nominal Q+A session
[20:35] <fsphil> yes I can imagine a few choice words being spoken right now
[20:35] <AndyEsser> yea
[20:35] <AndyEsser> anyway
[20:35] <AndyEsser> bed time
[20:35] <AndyEsser> night all
[20:35] <fsphil> nite
[20:35] <Laurenceb__> he needs a dragon to escape from the conference
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[20:36] <fsphil> well that was a waste of time. should've just waited for the summary
[20:36] <kc2pit> Heart of Gold is cool and all, but I was hoping for more Culture ship names since JRTI and OCISLY got me to start reading the books.
[20:37] <fsphil> which is basically "elon has crazy ideas, might actually do some of them"
[20:37] <kc2pit> And I want to see the Only Slightly Bent land and relaunch.
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[20:47] <Laurenceb__> apparently the Q&A never happened
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[20:51] <SpacenearUS> New position from 03N4XWC-1 after 034 days silence - 12https://tracker.habhub.org/#!qm=All&q=N4XWC-1
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[21:45] <chris______> Thank you to everyone who listened in to my flight yesterday
[21:46] <chris______> It went really well though it was rather dark when I made the recovery... thankfully it was dry though
[21:48] <chris______> Special thanks to G8KNN who kicked things off
[21:48] <chris______> He also recorded the last locations as the payload skimmed a high voltage pylon....phew
[21:49] <chris______> So thanks again.
[21:52] <SpacenearUS> New position from 03S-17 after 032 days silence - 12https://tracker.habhub.org/#!qm=All&q=S-17
[21:54] <chris______> Good luck with S-17!
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[23:08] <SpacenearUS> New position from 03IV3SRD-11 after 038 hours silence - 12https://tracker.habhub.org/#!qm=All&q=IV3SRD-11
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[23:50] <michal_f_off> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UNfeQg6L_BY :]
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[00:00] --- Wed Sep 28 2016