[00:05] <Lunar_Lander> good night
[00:08] Lunar_Lander (~kevin@p54889619.dip0.t-ipconnect.de) left irc: Quit: Leaving
[00:14] heathkid (~heathkid@unaffiliated/heathkid) left irc: Read error: Network is unreachable
[00:15] heathkid (~heathkid@unaffiliated/heathkid) joined #highaltitude.
[00:39] Hoogvlieger (~Hoogvlieg@ip41-37-211-87.adsl2.static.versatel.nl) joined #highaltitude.
[01:14] Hoogvlieger (~Hoogvlieg@ip41-37-211-87.adsl2.static.versatel.nl) left irc: Quit: Leaving
[01:28] DL7AD1 (~sven@p4FD429F1.dip0.t-ipconnect.de) joined #highaltitude.
[01:29] DL7AD (~sven@p4FD4198E.dip0.t-ipconnect.de) left irc: Ping timeout: 246 seconds
[01:33] StudentJack (519e1d37@gateway/web/freenode/ip. joined #highaltitude.
[01:46] MarkIreland (~MarkIrela@host86-167-101-237.range86-167.btcentralplus.com) joined #highaltitude.
[01:51] MarkIreland (~MarkIrela@host86-167-101-237.range86-167.btcentralplus.com) left irc: Ping timeout: 276 seconds
[01:55] <StudentJack> Hi-I am working on a HAB project for my studies and I researching tracking of the ballon. I am looking into using my Arduino with a Habduino sheild. I am trying to find a relatively cheap dongle (around £20-£30) that will work with a mac and be able to receive UHF since I am in the UK.If you guys have any recommendations I would be very thankful!
[01:56] <adamgreig> the cheap option is the rtl-sdr dongles really
[01:56] <adamgreig> none are great but most will work alrightish
[01:57] <StudentJack> Will they work well enough to find the payload when it lands and to have a good estimate of how high the ballon went?
[01:58] <adamgreig> it depends.. if you're nearby, yes, if you're still at the launch site, definitely not
[01:58] <adamgreig> knowing how high they went... they'll probably work fine when the balloon is at altitude, yep
[01:58] <adamgreig> for £35 or so you can buy a pre-amp http://ava.upuaut.net/store/index.php?route=product/product&path=72_80&product_id=136 that will help a fair deal
[02:08] <StudentJack> Thanks! I will read up about those. I am still a bit confused as to how the radio signal gets turned into coordinates though. I understand the transmission, receiving it with the dongle and then the decoding but how does the decoded information translate to where the payload is? Also do you think a pre-amp necessary If I only plan on using it once or twice?
[02:08] <adamgreig> the payload on the balloon (e.g. the habduino+arduino or whatever) has a GPS receiver
[02:08] <adamgreig> the GPS receiver lets it know where it is
[02:08] <adamgreig> then it transmits that information over the radio
[02:28] Laurenceb_ (~Laurence@host86-179-250-250.range86-179.btcentralplus.com) left irc: Ping timeout: 256 seconds
[02:28] Lemml (~andreas@p3E9C3CBB.dip0.t-ipconnect.de) left irc: Ping timeout: 276 seconds
[02:29] <StudentJack> thanks for the help
[02:30] StudentJack (519e1d37@gateway/web/freenode/ip. left irc: Quit: Page closed
[02:47] MarkIreland (~MarkIrela@host86-167-101-237.range86-167.btcentralplus.com) joined #highaltitude.
[02:52] MarkIreland (~MarkIrela@host86-167-101-237.range86-167.btcentralplus.com) left irc: Ping timeout: 256 seconds
[03:48] MarkIreland (~MarkIrela@host86-167-101-237.range86-167.btcentralplus.com) joined #highaltitude.
[03:53] MarkIreland (~MarkIrela@host86-167-101-237.range86-167.btcentralplus.com) left irc: Ping timeout: 255 seconds
[04:26] LazyL_M0LEP (~irc-clien@ joined #highaltitude.
[04:28] <SpacenearUS> New vehicle on the map: 03norma_chase - 12http://tracker.habhub.org/#!qm=All&q=norma_chase
[05:06] Ian_ (4d66af83@gateway/web/freenode/ip. left #highaltitude.
[05:06] Ian_ (4d66af83@gateway/web/freenode/ip. joined #highaltitude.
[05:11] YO9GJX (~YO9GJX@ left irc: Remote host closed the connection
[05:58] <DoYouKnow> Does anyone here know of a flight simulator that partners with a real Flight Management System manufacturer to make a realistic flight simulator?
[06:17] DoYouKnow (sid90491@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-bhpxknzancfezkuk) left irc: Changing host
[06:17] DoYouKnow (sid90491@unaffiliated/doyouknow) joined #highaltitude.
[06:17] DoYouKnow (sid90491@unaffiliated/doyouknow) left irc: Changing host
[06:17] DoYouKnow (sid90491@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-bhpxknzancfezkuk) joined #highaltitude.
[06:27] fl_0 (foo@unaffiliated/fl-0/x-7355575) left irc: Ping timeout: 260 seconds
[06:32] fl_0 (foo@unaffiliated/fl-0/x-7355575) joined #highaltitude.
[06:53] richardeoin (~richard@cpc87181-aztw31-2-0-cust20.18-1.cable.virginm.net) left irc: Ping timeout: 265 seconds
[07:20] wrea (~quassel@2604:180:1:8ca::bae2) left irc: Quit: No Ping reply in 180 seconds.
[07:21] wrea (~quassel@2604:180:1:8ca::bae2) joined #highaltitude.
[07:30] ipdove (~ipdove@interclub.plus.com) joined #highaltitude.
[07:51] Flutterb1t (~flutterba@unaffiliated/day) joined #highaltitude.
[07:54] Flutterbat (~flutterba@unaffiliated/day) left irc: Ping timeout: 255 seconds
[07:54] Nick change: Flutterb1t -> Flutterbat
[07:56] DL1SGP (~felix64@dhcp11.signon4.dk.beevpn.com) left irc: Ping timeout: 260 seconds
[07:57] DL1SGP (~felix64@dhcp13.signon4.dk.beevpn.com) joined #highaltitude.
[07:59] number10 (d42c14ce@gateway/web/freenode/ip. joined #highaltitude.
[08:03] es5nhc (~tarmo@108-40-71-217.sta.estpak.ee) joined #highaltitude.
[08:04] gonzo__nb (~gonzo@host-92-6-244-28.as43234.net) left irc: Remote host closed the connection
[08:09] michal_f_wrk (~michal_f@84-10-62-166.static.chello.pl) joined #highaltitude.
[08:11] Strykar (~wakkawakk@ joined #highaltitude.
[08:26] Strykar (~wakkawakk@ left irc: Read error: Connection reset by peer
[09:50] ibanezmatt13 (~ibanezmat@nat-0-185.soton.ac.uk) joined #highaltitude.
[09:55] MarkIreland (~MarkIrela@host86-167-101-237.range86-167.btcentralplus.com) joined #highaltitude.
[09:59] MarkIreland (~MarkIrela@host86-167-101-237.range86-167.btcentralplus.com) left irc: Ping timeout: 260 seconds
[10:03] fl_0 (foo@unaffiliated/fl-0/x-7355575) left irc: Ping timeout: 260 seconds
[10:08] fl_0 (foo@unaffiliated/fl-0/x-7355575) joined #highaltitude.
[10:34] <SM0ULC-Reb> DoYouKnow: FSX?
[10:59] SushiKenBrown (~quassel@cmr-208-124-174-194.cr.net.cable.rogers.com) left irc: Ping timeout: 240 seconds
[10:59] SushiKenBrown (~quassel@cmr-208-124-174-194.cr.net.cable.rogers.com) joined #highaltitude.
[11:05] ibanezmatt13 (~ibanezmat@nat-0-185.soton.ac.uk) left irc: Quit: Leaving
[11:18] richardeoin (~richard@cpc87181-aztw31-2-0-cust20.18-1.cable.virginm.net) joined #highaltitude.
[11:46] <SpacenearUS> New position from 03VE2WMG-11 after 038 days silence - 12http://tracker.habhub.org/#!qm=All&q=VE2WMG-11
[11:51] chris_99 (~chris_99@unaffiliated/chris-99/x-3062929) joined #highaltitude.
[11:52] <kokey> what's good brands for 18650 li-ion cells?
[11:56] MarkIreland (~MarkIrela@host86-167-101-237.range86-167.btcentralplus.com) joined #highaltitude.
[12:00] chris_99 (~chris_99@unaffiliated/chris-99/x-3062929) left irc: Ping timeout: 250 seconds
[12:01] MarkIreland (~MarkIrela@host86-167-101-237.range86-167.btcentralplus.com) left irc: Ping timeout: 240 seconds
[12:11] chris_99 (~chris_99@unaffiliated/chris-99/x-3062929) joined #highaltitude.
[12:13] chris_99 (~chris_99@unaffiliated/chris-99/x-3062929) left irc: Client Quit
[12:29] <Vaizki> kokey, I know this is a typical irc-answer but what do you want 18650 cells for?
[12:30] <kokey> Vaizki: for an esp8266
[12:31] <Vaizki> are you flying them on a balloon?
[12:32] <kokey> yup, will launch one every 30 seconds so they can relay each other
[12:32] <kokey> just joking, won't be flying it at all
[12:32] <Vaizki> :D
[12:32] <Vaizki> you almost had me there!
[12:33] <Vaizki> 18650 li-ion is ok for -20 or so, below that the capacity plummets.. that's why I asked
[12:33] <Vaizki> if you want quality 18650 I would say panasonic
[12:34] <kokey> I bought some, what I think, are fake ultrafire batteries
[12:34] <kokey> will teach me for being a cheapskate
[12:34] <Vaizki> eeeep
[12:34] <mattbrejza> they might live up to their name at least
[12:34] <Vaizki> don't buy batteries with 'fire' in the name
[12:35] <kokey> well I think these ultrafires are safer to use
[12:35] <kokey> because they don't have much in it that can explode: http://i.imgur.com/duMlI.jpg
[12:35] <Vaizki> haha
[12:35] <craag> lol
[12:35] <kokey> need to fetch my saw from upstairs to check if mine are like that
[12:36] <Vaizki> that's like a 200mA cell
[12:37] <kokey> some are a bit 'better' http://www.rzbiker.com/20120527_184518.jpg
[12:38] <Vaizki> that's a 10440 :)
[12:38] kim27 (~kim27@unaffiliated/kim27) joined #highaltitude.
[12:39] chris_99 (~chris_99@unaffiliated/chris-99/x-3062929) joined #highaltitude.
[12:41] <kokey> so the esp8266 usually needs around 800mA and the ultrafire I had was performing a _lot_ worse than 4xAA 1200mah from maplin
[12:42] <Vaizki> a lipo charger that tells you how many mAh were put in is handy...
[12:42] <kokey> I was using a tp4056 with protection thingie
[12:43] <kokey> it was weird how quickly it charged the battery
[12:43] <kokey> and I was surprised how light the cells were
[12:43] chris_99 (~chris_99@unaffiliated/chris-99/x-3062929) left irc: Client Quit
[12:43] <Vaizki> yea that's a dead giveaway if they are too light
[12:44] <Vaizki> so you are solar charging them?
[12:44] <kokey> usb charging
[12:44] <Vaizki> oh wait sorry tp4056 wrong chip
[12:45] <kokey> you can solar charge with a tp4056 I think
[12:45] <kokey> but solar charging in Dublin, would do better with a wind turbine
[12:45] <Vaizki> you're talking to a guy from Finland
[12:45] <Vaizki> the sun just set
[12:46] <kokey> I suppose it doesn't even rise much over the horizon in the first place
[12:47] <craag> here in the uk we just need hydroelectric powered esp8266s
[12:47] <Vaizki> piezo power from raidrops
[12:47] <AndyEsser> craag: couple new resevoirs in the North
[12:48] <kokey> yeah who needs rooftop solar when you can have rooftop hydro
[12:52] <SpacenearUS> New vehicle on the map: 03VA2RMG-11 - 12http://tracker.habhub.org/#!qm=All&q=VA2RMG-11
[12:55] <gonzo_> static charge collection
[12:56] <gonzo_> useful figures (not verified). a 4ft head down a 4" pipe will give abou 1kw
[12:56] <gonzo_> go on sibot, do it!
[12:58] MarkIreland (~MarkIrela@host86-167-101-237.range86-167.btcentralplus.com) joined #highaltitude.
[12:58] <gonzo_> though a paddle type impeller is easier to make and leff probe to debris
[12:58] <gonzo_> less prob
[13:00] chris_99 (~chris_99@unaffiliated/chris-99/x-3062929) joined #highaltitude.
[13:01] <Vaizki> 1kW sounds like a lot for a 4" pipe? :O
[13:02] MarkIreland (~MarkIrela@host86-167-101-237.range86-167.btcentralplus.com) left irc: Ping timeout: 246 seconds
[13:36] <gonzo_> what that those figures lack is the flow rate, which I assume will be pressure dependent
[13:36] <gonzo_> unless it's just gravity fed
[13:40] <Vaizki> well hydrostatic pressure fed..? kinda?
[13:42] <gonzo_> that should be given by the 4ft
[13:44] <gonzo_> a quick online calc session...... 1m straight drop in a 10cm 0.1m^3/sec
[13:44] <gonzo_> that does not look good
[13:45] <gonzo_> you would need 1mtr diam to be getting anywhere near the flow req
[13:45] <gonzo_> so that must have a higher static head than 4ft
[13:46] <gonzo_> (I;ll get m' coat)
[13:58] Laurenceb_ (~Laurence@host86-179-250-250.range86-179.btcentralplus.com) joined #highaltitude.
[13:58] MarkIreland (~MarkIrela@host86-167-101-237.range86-167.btcentralplus.com) joined #highaltitude.
[14:03] MarkIreland (~MarkIrela@host86-167-101-237.range86-167.btcentralplus.com) left irc: Ping timeout: 264 seconds
[14:24] BrainDamage (~BrainDama@unaffiliated/braindamage) left irc: Disconnected by services
[14:24] BrainDamage1 (~BrainDama@ joined #highaltitude.
[14:24] BrainDamage (~BrainDama@unaffiliated/braindamage) joined #highaltitude.
[14:26] BrainDamage1 (~BrainDama@ left irc: Client Quit
[14:26] BrainDamage (~BrainDama@unaffiliated/braindamage) left irc: Disconnected by services
[14:26] BrainDamage1 (~BrainDama@ joined #highaltitude.
[14:27] Strykar (wakkawakka@2604:8800:100:8277:d4c2:6d74:3556:e4e5) joined #highaltitude.
[14:27] BrainDamage (~BrainDama@unaffiliated/braindamage) joined #highaltitude.
[14:30] fl_0 (foo@unaffiliated/fl-0/x-7355575) left irc: Ping timeout: 260 seconds
[14:35] fl_0 (foo@unaffiliated/fl-0/x-7355575) joined #highaltitude.
[14:40] BrainDamage1 (~BrainDama@ left irc: Remote host closed the connection
[14:41] BrainDamage (~BrainDama@unaffiliated/braindamage) left irc: Disconnected by services
[14:41] BrainDamage1 (~BrainDama@ joined #highaltitude.
[14:42] BrainDamage (~BrainDama@unaffiliated/braindamage) joined #highaltitude.
[14:42] BrainDamage1 (~BrainDama@ left irc: Client Quit
[14:43] BrainDamage (~BrainDama@unaffiliated/braindamage) left irc: Disconnected by services
[14:43] BrainDamage1 (~BrainDama@ joined #highaltitude.
[14:44] BrainDamage (~BrainDama@unaffiliated/braindamage) joined #highaltitude.
[14:44] BrainDamage1 (~BrainDama@ left irc: Remote host closed the connection
[14:46] BrainDamage1 (~BrainDama@ joined #highaltitude.
[14:46] BrainDamage (~BrainDama@unaffiliated/braindamage) left irc: Disconnected by services
[14:46] BrainDamage (~BrainDama@unaffiliated/braindamage) joined #highaltitude.
[14:48] BrainDamage1 (~BrainDama@ left irc: Client Quit
[14:58] Strykar (wakkawakka@2604:8800:100:8277:d4c2:6d74:3556:e4e5) left irc: Read error: Connection timed out
[14:59] Strykar (wakkawakka@2604:8800:100:8277:d4c2:6d74:3556:e4e5) joined #highaltitude.
[15:17] Strykar_ (wakkawakka@2604:8800:100:8277:d4c2:6d74:3556:e4e5) joined #highaltitude.
[15:46] {^TIBS01^} (~tibs01@5751bf79.skybroadband.com) left irc: Read error: Connection reset by peer
[16:08] TIBS01 (~tibs01@5751bf79.skybroadband.com) joined #highaltitude.
[16:14] ibanezmatt13 (~ibanezmat@nat-0-180.soton.ac.uk) joined #highaltitude.
[16:17] blocky (blocky@S0106bcd1656536a8.vc.shawcable.net) joined #highaltitude.
[16:21] ibanezmatt13 (~ibanezmat@nat-0-180.soton.ac.uk) left irc: Quit: Leaving
[16:26] cjdavies (~cj@cjdavies.org) left irc: Ping timeout: 276 seconds
[16:29] LazyL_M0LEP (~irc-clien@ left irc: Ping timeout: 260 seconds
[16:32] cjdavies (~cj@cjdavies.org) joined #highaltitude.
[16:33] Nick change: cjdavies -> Guest53230
[16:34] Strykar (wakkawakka@2604:8800:100:8277:d4c2:6d74:3556:e4e5) left irc: Ping timeout: 240 seconds
[16:35] Strykar_ (wakkawakka@2604:8800:100:8277:d4c2:6d74:3556:e4e5) left irc: Ping timeout: 260 seconds
[16:40] ipdove (~ipdove@interclub.plus.com) left irc: Quit: Nettalk6 - www.ntalk.de
[16:43] LazyL_M0LEP (~irc-clien@ joined #highaltitude.
[16:47] Lunar_Lander (~kevin@p548889AF.dip0.t-ipconnect.de) joined #highaltitude.
[16:48] <Lunar_Lander> evening
[16:49] <blocky> i am thinking about creating a small wireless accelerometer to go in a model rocket, does anyone know what frequencies i can use in canada? i was thinking maybe 950mhz
[16:49] <blocky> err 915, in the ism band
[16:51] <SpeedEvil> Do you have a ham licence?
[16:51] <blocky> no, but i could probably get one if that makes a difference
[16:52] <fab4space> lol
[16:52] <SpeedEvil> It may give additional options, I don't know how it works in canada
[16:52] <blocky> also this is going to be very low range, low altitude to start with, ie under 100m (at least for now)
[16:52] <SpeedEvil> for 100m, it can probably be quite simple indeed
[16:53] <AndyEsser> wifi with cantenna
[16:53] <blocky> AndyEsser how light can a wifi module be though?
[16:53] <AndyEsser> blocky: honestly - don't take my advice - however 100m over conventional wifi is doable
[16:54] <SpeedEvil> esp8266 in principle would work fine
[16:54] <AndyEsser> I don't know about component size and weight for off-the-shelf wifi solutions
[16:54] <fab4space> use an ESP12F
[16:54] <fab4space> it has good range
[16:54] <SpeedEvil> Plus - it has plenty of RAM to store accel, for later download if momentary interruptions happen
[16:54] <fab4space> http://tronixlabs.com/news/new-product-esp8266-esp12f-wifi-board-with-full-io-and-pcb-antenna-tronixlabs-australia/
[16:54] <fab4space> 2$ on aliexpress
[16:55] <fab4space> SPI/I2C/UART
[16:55] <blocky> cool, didn't know about that
[16:55] <blocky> thanks
[16:55] <blocky> need to go to work now unfortunately, back later\
[16:56] IUBAM (9c3803e6@gateway/web/freenode/ip. left irc: Quit: Page closed
[16:58] <SpacenearUS> New position from 03DM3FB after 03a day silence - 12http://tracker.habhub.org/#!qm=All&q=DM3FB
[16:58] IUBAM (9c3803e6@gateway/web/freenode/ip. joined #highaltitude.
[17:02] gonzo_nb (~gonzo@host-92-6-244-28.as43234.net) joined #highaltitude.
[17:13] <eroomde> my fingers have totally forgotten gnuplot
[17:15] <SpeedEvil> :/
[17:22] SgtStroopwafel (~Chuck@s5597aba6.adsl.online.nl) left irc: Quit: Fuck, SgtStroopwafel is down!
[17:28] MarkIreland (~MarkIrela@host86-167-101-237.range86-167.btcentralplus.com) joined #highaltitude.
[17:36] LazyL_M0LEP_ (~irc-clien@ joined #highaltitude.
[17:37] <eroomde> accidently hitting auto on your scope after setting everything up very carefully for a delicate capture :/
[17:38] LazyL_M0LEP (~irc-clien@ left irc: Ping timeout: 260 seconds
[17:44] <LazyL_M0LEP_> ...and having it decide it doesn't know where the pole is and needs to re-align itself?
[17:45] Nick change: LazyL_M0LEP_ -> LazyLeopard
[17:53] jcoxon (~jcoxon@ joined #highaltitude.
[17:57] MarkIreland (~MarkIrela@host86-167-101-237.range86-167.btcentralplus.com) left irc: Quit: Leaving...
[18:18] YO9GJX (~YO9GJX@ joined #highaltitude.
[18:25] IUBAM (9c3803e6@gateway/web/freenode/ip. left irc: Quit: Page closed
[18:29] <SpacenearUS> New vehicle on the map: 03DL1MX_chase - 12http://tracker.habhub.org/#!qm=All&q=DL1MX_chase
[18:34] Nick change: Guest53230 -> cjdavies
[18:34] cjdavies (cj@cjdavies.org) left #highaltitude.
[18:37] <eroomde> was there someone on this channel who said they worked for GEMS?
[18:38] <adamgreig> no one's said GEMS on this channel in at least a couple years
[18:38] <Laurenceb_> Girls Educational & Mentoring Services
[18:38] <adamgreig> just you asking about 4-20mA sensors
[18:39] <eroomde> adamgreig: it could easily have been more than 2 years ago
[18:40] <adamgreig> indeed
[18:40] <adamgreig> M0CJM_Neil in 2013
[18:40] <adamgreig> http://habhub.org/zeusbot/logs_highlighted/highaltitude.log.20130711.html#L1392
[18:41] <eroomde> thanks
[18:41] <eroomde> oh well, guess he's not around anymore
[18:42] <eroomde> i have puzzling gems sensor issues
[18:44] <eroomde> all of these are 4-20mA sensors all manifolded together, responding to a presure step. units are bar and seconds https://www.dropbox.com/s/2pqr831mmvn2t63/Screenshot%202016-01-04%2018.43.22.png?dl=0
[18:44] <eroomde> there is all sorts of fucky
[18:44] <adamgreig> curious
[18:45] <Ian_> Still a family friendly channel in 2016?
[18:45] <Lunar_Lander> I hope so
[18:45] <Lunar_Lander> please consider this family friendly drawing https://drive.google.com/file/d/0B1lke6hPHKJDTksyRmhxSjRPcXM/view
[18:48] <eroomde> have you considered a career in medecine Lunar_Lander?
[18:48] <Lunar_Lander> not really, why?
[18:48] <AndyEsser> Lunar_Lander: the handwriting
[18:48] <Laurenceb_> eroomde: what does your test setup looklike?
[18:48] <Lunar_Lander> oh
[18:48] <AndyEsser> I suspect he's making a joke about how doctor's have terrible handwriting
[18:48] <Lunar_Lander> xD
[18:48] <AndyEsser> also, evening all
[18:49] <Lunar_Lander> hi
[18:49] <Laurenceb_> also is the time axis seconds?
[18:50] <eroomde> literally look at the line that contains the link
[18:51] <Laurenceb_> doh
[18:52] <Laurenceb_> heh looks like my strain gauge amplifier when it was misbehaving
[18:52] <Laurenceb_> is there any interfacing tronics?
[18:52] <eroomde> yes, mine
[18:52] <eroomde> it's fine
[18:52] <Laurenceb_> so same on all channels?
[18:53] <eroomde> that's not under suspicion
[18:53] <eroomde> it's the sensors
[18:53] <Laurenceb_> perplexing
[18:53] <eroomde> i've literally hooked them up directly to my scope and lab psu and got the same shapes
[18:54] <Laurenceb_> I'm guessing the short period oscillation is the characteristic period of the plumbing?
[18:54] <eroomde> yes
[18:54] <Laurenceb_> ok that much makes sense then :P
[18:54] <eroomde> the blue line is, i think, basically trustworthy
[18:55] <Laurenceb_> yeah
[18:55] <eroomde> it's a sensor i pulled from an experiment that i never had any cause to doubt
[18:55] <Laurenceb_> eeek
[18:55] <Laurenceb_> oh
[18:55] <Laurenceb_> so the others havent been used in experiments?
[18:55] <eroomde> the other two are the ones that seem faulty
[18:55] <Laurenceb_> ok
[18:55] <eroomde> no they haven't
[18:55] <eroomde> this degree of wierd was obvious straight away
[18:56] <Laurenceb_> are the sensors just bridges ?
[18:57] <eroomde> have tried a number of different value's dropper resistors within the compliance voltage range of the sensors
[18:57] <eroomde> the sensors are 4-20mA
[18:57] <eroomde> which i said in the message where i posted the link
[18:57] <Laurenceb_> what does that mean?
[18:57] <eroomde> (again)
[18:57] <eroomde> look don't worry Laurenceb_
[18:57] <eroomde> i'll call the rep tomorrow
[18:57] <eroomde> suspect they're faulty
[18:57] <Laurenceb_> bridge sensors driven with 20mA ?
[18:58] <Laurenceb_> its interesting that the is a time constant :D
[18:58] <Laurenceb_> I used tons of pressure sensors, but never seen similar to this
[18:58] <Laurenceb_> *use
[18:58] <eroomde> well you've coincidently managed to completely avoid normal industrial process control, then
[18:59] <Laurenceb_> yes
[18:59] <eroomde> which accounts for probably 99% of all pressure sensors
[18:59] <eroomde> https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Current_loop#Process-control_use
[18:59] <Laurenceb_> oh that stuff
[18:59] <Laurenceb_> I see now
[18:59] drowe67 (~drowe67@zedm.net) joined #highaltitude.
[19:00] <eroomde> so, it's weird
[19:00] <Laurenceb_> yeah I build OEM stuff
[19:00] <eroomde> but it does mean there is active stuff on the sensor itself
[19:00] <eroomde> which i suspect is the cause
[19:01] <eroomde> greetings drowe67
[19:02] <drowe67> eroomde: hi there!
[19:02] <eroomde> i will grab an expensive nice bridge sensor tomorrow and treat that as a better truth. it just is slightly faff as i have to add a second data aquisition box in (one set up with bridge excitation)
[19:03] <AndyEsser> exciting!
[19:03] <Laurenceb_> yeah, surely active stuff, very hard to see how you could get a time delay mechanically
[19:04] <eroomde> indeed. just annoying if they are having QA issues as these are otherwise good jellybean sensors
[19:05] jcoxon (~jcoxon@ left irc: Quit: Leaving
[19:16] <SA6BSS-Mike> fnaf
[19:20] DL1SGP (~felix64@dhcp13.signon4.dk.beevpn.com) left irc: Ping timeout: 245 seconds
[19:22] DL1SGP (~felix64@dhcp13.signon4.dk.beevpn.com) joined #highaltitude.
[19:27] bertrik (~quassel@rockbox/developer/bertrik) joined #highaltitude.
[19:28] LazyLeopard (~irc-clien@ left irc: Quit: Leaving
[19:34] bradfirj (~bradfirj@2a03:b0c0:1:d0::c9:c001) left irc: Ping timeout: 255 seconds
[19:57] <Oddstr13> any recommendations when it comes to PCB manufacturers?
[19:57] <Oddstr13> for small runs / prototypes
[19:57] <fsphil> dirtypcb seem popular
[20:03] bradfirj (~bradfirj@2a03:b0c0:1:d0::c9:c001) joined #highaltitude.
[20:05] mclane_ (~quassel@p5498DFBD.dip0.t-ipconnect.de) joined #highaltitude.
[20:33] Hiena (~boreger@ joined #highaltitude.
[20:35] mikestir (~quassel@cpc76842-brmb9-2-0-cust742.1-3.cable.virginm.net) joined #highaltitude.
[20:42] <Hiena> Hey, eroomde! We talked about a dirt cheap listening station. Well, i found a way. At the local trift store i could buy old TV tuner cards for 2 EUR. The Leadtek cards was equipped with phillips tuners and has easily accessible pins. These tuners programmed through the I2C and the chips well documented. The video out from the tuner is a simple AM demodulated and gain adjusted.
[20:46] <Geoff-G8DHE> Hiena, are you talking about listening to HAB trackers as most use some sort of FM rather than AM ?
[20:49] <Hiena> Nope. The classic analog TV-s has AM for the video and FM for the audio. The most "modern" digital tuners is a single block units usually with +5V, +12V supply, I2C for controlling and demodulated composite video and analog audio out.
[20:50] <Geoff-G8DHE> I know, and the FM is on a 6MHz (varies with country) sub-carrier, but that wont decode HAB telemetry.
[20:51] <Hiena> Why?
[20:51] <Geoff-G8DHE> Because they filter the 6MHz sub-carrier out then decode that, the HAB telemetry is not on a sun-carrier but the main carrier.
[20:52] <Geoff-G8DHE> which is only AM decoded and won't give you any useful output.
[20:52] es5nhc (~tarmo@108-40-71-217.sta.estpak.ee) left irc: Remote host closed the connection
[20:53] <Hiena> But i don't want to use the FM audio demodulator, i want to use AM video demodulator.
[20:53] <Geoff-G8DHE> yes but the HAB telemetry is generaly uses frequency modulation not apmplitude modulation.
[20:56] <Hiena> Well, that case i could use the FM section, and add or subtract the sub-carrier frequency and adjust the PLL section to that frequency.
[20:56] <Geoff-G8DHE> I think you need to understand the modulation methods a little more fully!
[20:57] <mikestir> HAB telemetry is super narrow bandwidth. The reason it works so well is entirely due to the narrow bandwidth of the receiver
[20:58] <mikestir> the FM on a TV demodulator is nowhere near narrow enough
[20:58] <Hiena> mikestir: That just one filter change in the tuner.
[20:59] <chris_99> you know you could get an rtlsdr for a fiver?
[20:59] <mikestir> ^^^this
[20:59] <SA6BSS-Mike> +2
[20:59] jcoxon (~jcoxon@ joined #highaltitude.
[20:59] <Geoff-G8DHE> Nope, its not the flitering itself its the sensitivity of the decoder to changes in frequency.
[21:00] <Geoff-G8DHE> plus there is no carrier when using FSK for any AM to be visible either so the output if anything will only be a constant voltage.
[21:01] <Hiena> chris_99: And where is te fun? Also eroomde linked me some hundred pound "affordable" station.
[21:01] <mikestir> you could probably use a BFO to get some of the way to a useful receiver, but you'd still need to post-process the video output using SDR techniques, so you might as well just use an rtlsdr
[21:02] <mikestir> if you want to build something as an exercise then find a TV tuner where you can get at the (usually) 45 MHz IF and then feed that into a homebrew direct-conversion receiver
[21:04] <Hiena> Geoff-G8DHE: The decoder sensitivity usually adjustable by external resistors. The no carrier would be a trickier question.
[21:07] <Geoff-G8DHE> It doesn't work as simply as that I'm afraid! The older TV receivers are designed for Amplitude Modulation, they won't be able to recover the Frequency Modulation that is used. There is a technique of adding in A Beat Freqency Oscillator (BFO) to resolve changes in frequency but you will have a very poor receiver resulating, and still you will need to alter the bandwidth of all the filters to reduce the noise level its not a single flite
[21:11] <SpacenearUS> New vehicle on the map: 03PS-59 - 12http://tracker.habhub.org/#!qm=All&q=PS-59
[21:12] <Hiena> I see... Is there a spec. for the used HAB telemetry systems?
[21:12] <mikestir> the common one is called RTTY
[21:13] <Geoff-G8DHE> Yes see the Wiki pages its simple RTTY using FSK, or one or the more modern coding systems like Contestia etc.
[21:14] <Geoff-G8DHE> " 300 baud 200Hz FSK "
[21:15] <Geoff-G8DHE> https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Frequency-shift_keying
[21:25] Strykar (wakkawakka@2604:8800:100:8277:14f3:a957:dd7b:120b) joined #highaltitude.
[21:30] <fsphil> the rtlsdr receivers are definitly the best for the price range
[21:30] <fsphil> the next one up is maybe 10 times the price
[21:31] <fsphil> or 20 times. just checking the price of the airspy
[21:31] <chris_99> i've just been looking at the tcxo mod you can do, which looks interesting
[21:34] <Vaizki> as an owner of 3 rtl-sdr dongles, airspy and sdrplay.. but basically very little ham-type experience beyond communication receivers .. airspy is such a joy to use
[21:34] <Vaizki> of course I have an interest in what's up in the air far beyond a specific hab tracker signa
[21:35] <Vaizki> signal.. so that skews my opinion considerably
[21:35] <chris_99> the airspy looks really nice
[21:35] <fsphil> you can even receive TV with it. kinda, http://i.imgur.com/3FTddA5.png
[21:36] <chris_99> heh neat
[21:36] <chris_99> is that analog tv?
[21:36] <fsphil> yeah
[21:37] <fsphil> hackrf transmitting in another room
[21:37] <chris_99> nice!
[21:37] <chris_99> could you transmit digital with hackrf (i've no idea the bandwidth you need)
[21:37] <fsphil> yeah
[21:37] <fsphil> dvb-t needs about 8mhz
[21:37] <Vaizki> sdrplay is a tough one for me.. It does work and it's ok and all but just somehow feels like a "previous generation" product to me
[21:37] <fsphil> you could probably receive dvb-t with the airspy fine
[21:38] <Vaizki> well yes but why
[21:38] <fsphil> indeed
[21:38] <chris_99> i'm planning on trying to capture my keyboard emissions tommorow with my rtlsdr if i can
[21:39] <Vaizki> umm..
[21:40] <Vaizki> what does your keyboard emit at frequencies that the rtl-sdr can receive?
[21:41] <fsphil> you need to register on the sdrplay website before you can download drivers. seems a bit annoying
[21:41] <Vaizki> yes I don't know what's up with that
[21:41] <chris_99> Vaizki, http://lasec.epfl.ch/keyboard/
[21:43] <Vaizki> chris_99: ok so without watching the videos, what frequency are they listening in on?
[21:43] <Vaizki> rtl-sdr starts at about 25MHz
[21:43] <chris_99> around 100MHz
[21:44] <fsphil> my mouse makes some pretty odd signals in the 144mhz band
[21:44] <fsphil> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OtOUxxuOsGQ
[21:44] <chris_99> haha
[21:44] <chris_99> interesting
[21:45] <Vaizki> hehe well your mouse is how far from the antenna? :)
[21:45] <fsphil> hah, in this case about 2 metres :)
[21:54] fiasco (5472d0ed@gateway/web/freenode/ip. joined #highaltitude.
[21:58] mclane_ (~quassel@p5498DFBD.dip0.t-ipconnect.de) left irc: Remote host closed the connection
[22:01] <Vaizki> hurray for the weather, only -22 forecasted for thursday!
[22:01] <Vaizki> (last night the forecast was -28 for thursday)
[22:01] <Vaizki> in Finland we have to enjoy the little things :D
[22:12] xfce (~xfce@cpe-85-10-26-137.dynamic.amis.net) joined #highaltitude.
[22:12] Nick change: xfce -> Guest28290
[22:15] fiasco (5472d0ed@gateway/web/freenode/ip. left irc: Quit: Page closed
[22:19] jcoxon (~jcoxon@ left irc: Quit: Leaving
[22:23] <fsphil> nice
[22:23] <fsphil> just wet here
[22:24] <Lunar_Lander> snowy here
[22:24] <fsphil> some roads where flooded
[22:24] <michal_f> it was just -17 here, and my car had trouble starting
[22:24] <Lunar_Lander> -3
[22:24] <fsphil> here at the moment is apparently a toasty 6 degrees C
[22:26] Hiena (~boreger@ left irc: Quit: Konversation terminated!
[22:48] <Vaizki> plus side from -20 is that I can thermal cam around the house and see where we're losing heat
[22:49] <fsphil> nice
[22:49] <fsphil> looking forward to them becoming cheap enough to get just for playing about wit
[22:49] <fsphil> h
[22:50] <mikestir> I did that the other week to see if there were any voids in the cavity insulation. The thermalite blocks are actually good enough insulation that you can see the mortar courses through the plaster
[22:50] <mikestir> that's pretty cool
[22:50] <Vaizki> not to be condescending or anything but we take insulation, energy efficiency and power consumption quite seriously here :)
[22:50] <Vaizki> sometimes even a bit too seriously...
[22:50] <mikestir> I guess you have to with those kinds of thermal gradients :)
[22:51] <Vaizki> fsphil: I got me a Flir E4 and hacked it to E8 and beyond..
[22:52] <Vaizki> a great learning tool also to find out what generates heat for example in your house circuit breaker panel...
[22:53] <gonzo_nb> getting heat there world ring alarm bells
[22:53] <mikestir> the MCBs get pretty warm
[22:53] <Vaizki> I'm not talking heat as in hot to the touch
[22:54] <Vaizki> this thing is accurate to 0.1 degrees
[22:55] <Vaizki> I did find loose contacts in there just by heat
[22:55] <Vaizki> a bit of tightening and things cooled down
[22:56] <mikestir> Vaizki: do you know what sensor that one has?
[22:56] <gonzo_nb> fun toy to play with
[22:56] <Vaizki> it's a 320x240 lepton sensor
[22:56] <mikestir> nope
[22:56] <mikestir> there isn't a 320x240 lepton
[22:57] <mikestir> there's a 160x120 but it's not generally available (although of course flir make it)
[22:57] <gonzo_nb> I have seen scanning mirrors on bolometer type sensors. Not sure what the sensor was though, to be quick enough to respond
[22:57] <Vaizki> ok.. well it's an E4 cam but has the same sensor as E8, software hacked to enable the resolution and disable the artificial noise gen
[22:58] <gonzo_nb> and not sure what the lens would be. I saw it being tested with a pinhole
[22:58] <Vaizki> yes, they actually add noise via software to cripple the low end
[22:58] <Vaizki> quite a lot of noise..
[22:58] <mikestir> lenses have to be something like germanium or silicon (or a pinhole)
[22:58] <gonzo_nb> sounds like they did to old jvc vcr's
[22:59] <mikestir> Vaizki: reason I'm asking about the sensor is afaik the cheapest 320x240 sensor they do is more expensive than the whole E4
[23:00] <Vaizki> yes well I'm not going to tear it down so I would rely on google
[23:01] <Vaizki> basically E4 - E8 have the same sensor, just different SW
[23:01] <mikestir> mike (electric stuff) did a teardown I think. I'll have a look
[23:01] <Vaizki> yes he did a REAL teardown
[23:03] <mikestir> has anyone flown a lepton yet?
[23:03] Guest28290 (~xfce@cpe-85-10-26-137.dynamic.amis.net) left irc: Ping timeout: 276 seconds
[23:04] <fsphil> more of a tearapart
[23:06] <Vaizki> FLIR Astra Z3 suggested in the tearAPART
[23:07] <Vaizki> probably a codename
[23:07] <mikestir> interesting it runs on windows ce when the flir one is linux
[23:07] <Vaizki> yes mine is CE
[23:07] <Vaizki> was a bit shocked by that..
[23:07] <SpeedEvil> the lepton is nice in that it's simple SPI
[23:09] <mikestir> Vaizki: does the hack unlock it to 30fps as well?
[23:10] <Vaizki> you mean for video? not sure..
[23:10] <mikestir> yeah. that might be locked in the sensor since it's a US export limit rather than a marketing one
[23:12] <Vaizki> lots of other things like high speed ADCs are us export limited but in specific applications they are still allowed
[23:12] <Vaizki> I can check the apparent fps..
[23:13] <SpeedEvil> Accellerometers are limited - but in ways you would not care about if you can recalibrate tehm
[23:13] <SpeedEvil> - the primary limitation is on baseline drift over a year
[23:14] <Vaizki> the live display on my hacked E4 seems more like 10fps than 30fps
[23:14] <Vaizki> clearly visible update rate .. to the naked eye
[23:15] <mikestir> sounds about right. the export limit is something like 8.8fps
[23:16] <Vaizki> scientifically proven that I have a hot ass, my chair is glowing...
[23:26] <Vaizki> https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/367935/FLIR0042.jpg
[23:26] <Vaizki> seems like my balcony door needs some attention...
[23:26] <Vaizki> yes it's closed, but still leaking cold air like crazy
[23:26] <Lunar_Lander> ohhhh
[23:27] <SpeedEvil> Vaizki: duct tape
[23:27] <Lunar_Lander> good night :)
[23:29] Lunar_Lander (~kevin@p548889AF.dip0.t-ipconnect.de) left irc: Quit: Leaving
[23:31] <fsphil> -3.6. oochy
[23:32] <Vaizki> well it's -18.3 outside..
[23:32] <Vaizki> best time to break out the flir! :)
[23:32] <gonzo_nb> looks a fun toy
[23:33] <fsphil> some day
[23:33] <Vaizki> I should go outdoors with it really
[23:33] mikestir (~quassel@cpc76842-brmb9-2-0-cust742.1-3.cable.virginm.net) left irc: Ping timeout: 246 seconds
[23:33] <fsphil> for now I'll have to be happy with a fridge thermometer
[23:33] <Vaizki> see if I can spot the superheated steam pipes that deliver heating to houses
[23:37] gonzo_nb (~gonzo@host-92-6-244-28.as43234.net) left irc: Remote host closed the connection
[23:51] <Oddstr13> I was considering the flir breakout that sfe carries on the cyber monday sale
[23:52] <Oddstr13> was however a bit too expensive to buy without any application planned for it :P
[23:52] <Vaizki> yea at least this ready made camera can be loaned out to friends and be rewarded with bottles of fine :)
[23:52] <Vaizki> wine
[23:53] <Oddstr13> what camera is it?
[23:53] <Oddstr13> havn't read all the backlogs yet :P
[23:53] <Vaizki> flir E4 hacked to E8 level + some addl feature
[23:55] <Oddstr13> oh, the E4 is a camera
[23:55] bertrik (~quassel@rockbox/developer/bertrik) left irc: Remote host closed the connection
[23:55] <Oddstr13> thought that was the sensor chip itself from the reading I've done
[23:55] <Vaizki> E4, E6 and E8 are camera models in the range
[23:56] <Vaizki> E8 costs like 6x the price of E4 here.. but it was a 2min hack to make the E4 better than the E8
[23:56] <Oddstr13> that sucks.
[23:57] <Vaizki> yes and no
[23:58] <Oddstr13> well, it's awesome that you could do that with the E4, but it sucks that they clearly over-charge for the E8
[23:58] <Oddstr13> cause I'm sure they're not selling the E4 with a loss
[23:58] <Vaizki> well being in r&d myself that's a strong statement..
[23:58] <Vaizki> they have to recover more than unit manufacturing cost
[23:59] <Oddstr13> true
[23:59] <Oddstr13> but wouldn't it be better to sell way more of a better unit?
[00:00] --- Tue Jan 5 2016