highaltitude.log.20151230

[00:00] <mattbrejza> ah 600V to -600V, makes more sense now
[00:06] <Vaizki> tbh I only bought it because I got it for about 100 euros.. new in box
[00:07] <Vaizki> it's got the wrong bells and whistles but at least should be a good trade item later for something I need :)
[00:11] <Vaizki> http://imgur.com/ViUmSDO
[00:12] <Vaizki> this is not the probe you're looking for...
[00:13] <Vaizki> square wave test signal is just a bit off with a random probe...
[00:14] <mattbrejza> AC coupled?
[00:15] <Vaizki> nope.. DC.. you can see it on the bottom menu
[00:20] <mattbrejza> weird, thats exactly the signal youd expect with AC coupling
[00:21] <Vaizki> yea with the low frequencies getting cut off the voltage would droop at the edges
[00:21] <Vaizki> but it works just fine with the probe that came with it...
[00:25] <Lunar_Lander> good night
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[00:48] <Laurenceb_> why is this a thing
[00:48] <Laurenceb_> with cheap china production, spending more than £5 for a jacket is overkill
[00:52] <adamgreig> lol
[00:53] <adamgreig> if your jacket is stuffed full of goose down you probably don't want to imagine the cheap chinese producton version
[00:55] <Laurenceb_> interesting link fsphil
[00:55] <Laurenceb_> Unlike Daedalus, which used a closed-cycle fusion engine, Longshot would use a long-lived nuclear fission reactor
[00:55] <Laurenceb_> tl;dr : they just changed the medication at the lunatic asylum
[00:57] <Vaizki> Ack 3am. Time to sleep.
[01:04] <Darkside> hrm
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[01:22] <Laurenceb_> genius http://www.alternatewars.com/BBOW/Space/RL-10B-2_Cutaway.jpg
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[05:53] <SpacenearUS> New vehicle on the map: 03HORUS - 12http://tracker.habhub.org/#!qm=All&q=HORUS
[05:59] <Darkside> er
[05:59] <Darkside> whoops
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[08:55] <SpacenearUS> New position from 03DL0CRE-11 after 032 days silence - 12http://tracker.habhub.org/#!qm=All&q=DL0CRE-11
[08:55] <SpacenearUS> New vehicle on the map: 03DL2YED_chase - 12http://tracker.habhub.org/#!qm=All&q=DL2YED_chase
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[09:21] <SpacenearUS> New vehicle on the map: 03CALLSIGN123_chase - 12http://tracker.habhub.org/#!qm=All&q=CALLSIGN123_chase
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[09:48] <SpacenearUS> New position from 03DC2EH-6 after 032 days silence - 12http://tracker.habhub.org/#!qm=All&q=DC2EH-6
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[11:39] <SpacenearUS> New position from 03SP6NVB-11 after 035 days silence - 12http://tracker.habhub.org/#!qm=All&q=SP6NVB-11
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[13:04] <Darkside> Laurenceb: your conversation about projct orion and longshot made me remember an old book i had: https://imgur.com/a/wMMjJ
[13:04] <Darkside> Laurenceb: very odd book, no publish date, and it confused me a lot when I was a kid reading it. I thought it was from the future :-)
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[13:48] <realborg> Darkside, 1955, 2055 or 2155? https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2fautyLuuvo
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[14:06] <SpeedEvil> Dusty fusion rocketry is sort-of in the same class
[14:06] <SpeedEvil> ^fission
[14:06] <SpeedEvil> you can get to several times c
[14:07] <SpeedEvil> err
[14:07] <SpeedEvil> several percent of
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[14:27] <Babs> hello everyone - is leobodnar on/does anyone know whether he was transmitting continuously with his pico balloons or just intermittently ie once every couple of hours to save batteries?
[14:29] <craag> Hi Babs
[14:29] <craag> It was just intermittently
[14:30] <Babs> hey craag - happy christmas n'all
[14:30] <craag> every 5 or 10 minutes iirc, and also dependent on battery/solar state
[14:30] <craag> happy christmas to you! :)
[14:30] <Babs> ok cool - thanks
[14:31] <Babs> i've got my boards all ready for populating and was just messing around with code
[14:31] <craag> oh sweet, got pics?
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[14:35] <Babs> i'm away from them at the moment but have the ones along the stencils https://www.flickr.com/photos/91049302@N00/22691807712/in/album-72157652458202834/
[14:35] <Babs> https://www.flickr.com/photos/91049302@N00/22082574474/in/album-72157652458202834/
[14:36] <Babs> the second one is the board for the eclipse pointy HAB
[14:37] <Babs> i need to populate it and launch it for a test flight, probably under latex as it can support 3 batteries on the underside
[14:37] <chris_99> Babs, that seems to want me to login to flickr
[14:37] <UpuWork> yup
[14:37] <Babs> the first one is a solar powered board
[14:37] <craag> I'm getting 404
[14:37] <eroomde> 404
[14:38] <SpeedEvil> https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fission-fragment_rocket#Dusty_Plasma Darkside
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[14:41] <Babs_> sorry, it was on my autoupload flickr album (which if any of you don't have is brilliant. automatically uploads all of your iphone photos to a private folder to back them up - they installed it a few months ago)
[14:41] <Babs_> https://www.flickr.com/photos/91049302@N00/23438890593/in/dateposted-public/
[14:41] <Babs_> https://www.flickr.com/photos/91049302@N00/23769996630/in/dateposted-public/
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[14:42] <craag> lotsa tabs
[14:42] <Babs_> and then chrome crashed, hence the radio silence for a mo
[14:42] <Babs_> tab tastic
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[14:42] <Babs_> i shamefully nicked Upu's break off tab idea
[14:43] <Babs_> but then extended it to the batteries
[14:44] <Babs_> the lipo charging circuit I had has a mahusive capacitor that i don't know whether was overkill or not
[14:45] <craag> I like your passives layout
[14:45] <Babs_> https://www.adafruit.com/products/390 - used this circuit
[14:45] <Babs_> craag - thanks
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[14:45] <Babs_> caraag - edit: what is a passives layout?
[14:46] <Babs_> *craag
[14:46] <craag> all the caps lined up on the back :)
[14:46] <craag> caps/resistors/inductors = passives
[14:46] <Babs_> ahh ok
[14:46] <Babs_> i had to spend a whole holiday having each 1-3pm in the dark whilst the baby slept
[14:47] <Babs_> enforced time meant i could basically arrange and rearrange everything with effectively unlimited time to do it
[14:47] <eroomde> you're all sharing a room?
[14:47] <craag> hehe sounds ideal :)
[14:48] <Babs_> suite eroomde, suite
[14:59] <Babs_> transmitting every 2 hours. People just leave their radios on to track when they're away from their computers?
[15:00] <craag> Yes they did, and leo used RSID, which transmits a little sequence that dlfldigi will retune to to follow drift
[15:01] <Babs_> the sequence itself retunes the radio of anyone listening to it?
[15:01] <craag> yep (as long as it's in the dlfldigi audio band
[15:01] <craag> )
[15:01] <fsphil> was a nice trick
[15:02] <craag> FYI to make the rsid, he got fldigi to play it, and then directly copied the tones. The specs on the coding are hard to find apparently.
[15:05] <Babs_> i have been reading a cryptography book over Christmas and some of the enigma cryptographers used the day key settings to transmit a new message key for each message
[15:06] <Babs_> strikes me as something similar, although leo was using it to increase the chances of decipherment, whereas the germans used it to decrease it
[15:06] <Babs_> those bletchley park dudes were smart
[15:07] <realborg> alan turing was smart
[15:08] <realborg> unfortunately the british have a strange concept of loyalty and gratitude
[15:08] <Vaizki> not as simple as that...
[15:08] <Babs_> hey, it only took 60 or so years for us to say sorry.
[15:09] <Babs_> which is ironic, given that in Britain at least every second word uttered is sorry
[15:09] <richardeoin> encoding rsid is fine btw, feel free to pinch this https://github.com/bristol-seds/pico-tracker/blob/master/firmware/src/rsid.c#L77
[15:09] <Babs_> its all the lateral thinking they did which was fantastic
[15:09] <richardeoin> although I think I just took it from the dl-fldigi source
[15:09] <craag> oh nice richardeoin
[15:10] <Babs_> what is the general steps richardeoin?
[15:10] <Babs_> *are
[15:12] <richardeoin> the best description I found was this page http://www.w1hkj.com/RSID_description.html
[15:12] <richardeoin> under "Description of RSID"
[15:13] <Babs_> cool thanks
[15:13] <Babs_> might do it on the second launch
[15:13] <richardeoin> you start with 3 sets of 4 bits
[15:13] <Babs_> for stage one my workaround will be "use lots of polystyrene"
[15:13] <richardeoin> 4 bits - aka a nibble
[15:14] <richardeoin> and then that set of 4 bits corresponds to one of the 16 rows of the rsid_squares matrix
[15:15] <richardeoin> (each row is orthogonal)
[15:15] <realborg> what would aliens from Vega be called? :)
[15:16] <richardeoin> and then xor it in some way - that code describes the exact proceedure
[15:17] <craag> Are you thinking of trying for a float flight Babs_ ?
[15:18] <richardeoin> the only problem is there's a finite number of modes recognised by dl-fldigi
[15:18] <richardeoin> I was thinking of trying 2kHz wide contestia but there's no rsid code defined for it
[15:20] <richardeoin> craag: iirc Babs_ had a float flight a few months ago, correct me if I'm wrong
[15:20] <richardeoin> about 5km with a qualatex?
[15:24] <craag> Oh yes
[15:24] <craag> forgot about that, sorry!
[15:24] <craag> A good test for a shiny new tracker ;)
[15:31] <Babs_> craag - i did a couple in the summer, one went to prague on an AA battery, but was transmitting once a minute and so lasted only c.20 hours
[15:32] <Babs_> they were on foils, but it might be fun to do one with a latex one
[15:32] <Babs_> for latex float i presume its just making free lift as small as possible then hoping for no pop?
[15:33] <craag> Launch in the late afternoon/evening to maximise time before uv at altitude
[15:33] <Babs_> how long do the balloons last under uv exposure?
[15:36] <realborg> probably get it vacuum coated with aluminum or silver?
[15:37] <Babs_> given the solar one will only weigh c.30g its probably just easier to launch it under 1 or 2 foils
[15:38] <Babs_> i'm quite keen on making my own but it sits in the list of things where finding the time is the rate determining step in it all
[15:42] <Babs_> ooooo - foil outer (cube, basically anything easy to make) with max 1.5m width in all directions - doesn't need to be air tight, just v. strong. maybe tape reinforcement.
[15:43] <Babs_> latex inner. contained within the foil.
[15:43] <Babs_> it might be possible do this inbetween baby naps.
[15:44] <Babs_> i might found a radical HAB offshoot. HAB incorporating baby contraints.
[15:44] <Babs_> *constraints
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[15:47] <SpeedEvil> Babs_: http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/NEW-AIR-SWIMMERS-R-C-REMOTE-CONTROL-FLYING-INFLATABLE-CLOWN-FISH-/121756641792?hash=item1c5942ea00:g:DMUAAOSwk5FUyA73
[15:48] <Babs_> I visited that company with work once
[15:49] <Babs_> the prospect of flying a shark at 5000m is intriguing, but i think the likelihood of the balloon surviving any higher than 5000mm is approximately zero
[15:49] <SpeedEvil> Also.
[15:50] <SpeedEvil> In the UK, I am slightly sure that you may require an airship licence to fly one of those.
[15:50] <russss> do you have a license for that shark, sir
[15:50] <SpeedEvil> And the mooring requirements are interesting.
[15:51] <Babs_> that would give davidmiller nightmares
[15:52] <Babs_> i think the thin foil outer with strengthening tapes has potential
[15:52] <SpeedEvil> for what?
[15:52] <russss> I think it still comes under "small unmanned aircraft"
[15:52] <Babs_> would be heavy but still better than the 36 inch qualtex for getting float height without UV degradation or need for CAA permission
[15:55] Nick change: lz1dev_ -> lz1dev
[15:56] <SpeedEvil> russss: I was looking at 'small unmanned aircraft means ... other than a balloon', and 'classification of aircraft' -> power -> lighter than air -> airship
[15:56] <russss> oh
[15:57] <russss> hmm, I'm not sure an airship classifies as a balloon though
[15:58] <russss> although they don't specifically define "balloon", just to make it more amusing
[15:58] <russss> I think balloon and airship are mutually exclusive categories
[15:59] <russss> hence if it's classified as an airship then it's not a balloon and hence it can be a small unmanned aircraft
[15:59] <SpacenearUS> New vehicle on the map: 03SP5NVX - 12http://tracker.habhub.org/#!qm=All&q=SP5NVX
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[16:00] <SpeedEvil> russss: controllable balloon for more amusement
[16:03] <SpeedEvil> I think we can all agree that the ANO is poorly drafted, and doesn't define lots of things that could do with definition
[16:06] <russss> I'm not discounting the fact that "balloon" is probably defined somewhere else in legislation
[16:07] <russss> I think a "controllable balloon" is one which has controllable lift, i.e. a hot air balloon
[16:07] <SpeedEvil> russss: The problem is unless it's defined specifically in the legislation regarding the ANO, it's not directly relevant. You can't read across unless it specifically says so, or if it's subordinate legislation.
[16:08] <SpeedEvil> yes, but it very much doesn't say that, and is open to interpretation.
[16:09] <russss> true
[16:11] <SpeedEvil> You obviously want to - if you can - be in 'small balloon', 'kite weighing less than 2kg' or 'parachute including a parascending parachute' (not air or ground towed) as those are teh least regulated categories
[16:11] <SpeedEvil> (article 253)
[16:11] <SpeedEvil> if you're in 'small unmanned aircraft' - then you're hit with the regulations around those
[16:11] <SpeedEvil> Lack of definition of kite is annoying
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[17:55] <Lunar_Lander> hello
[17:56] <SpeedEvil> hey
[17:58] <Lunar_Lander> how's life?
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[18:27] <SpeedEvil> Stalled.
[18:31] <SA6BSS-Mike> ps-57 is calling in on wspr, still going :)
[18:33] <bertrik> launched december 12?
[18:33] <JerJer> Just saying Hi (73 de n8twj) - I just started researching HAB. A few friends and myself (could kinda call us a club, but not official) are looking to launch our first balloon this summer
[18:34] <JerJer> SA6BSS-Mike: did PS-57 just fly over the US and now down by south america or is it going north toward the US?
[18:35] <JerJer> oh - the green line is station heard?
[18:37] <SA6BSS-Mike> its running around the globe on the south hemisphere, just passed SA
[18:37] <lz1dev> .whereis ps-57
[18:37] <SpacenearUS> 03lz1dev: 03PS-57 was over 03South Atlantic Ocean 10(-22.784,-21.491) at 039349 meters about 0311 hours ago
[18:38] <SA6BSS-Mike> jep, the green line is to the stationes that heard the last tx
[18:38] <JerJer> very cool stuff (it is all new to me :)
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[18:40] <SA6BSS-Mike> bertrik: PS-57 was released at 19:15 12 Dec 2015 UTC
[18:40] <JerJer> we have built our own SDR radio for HF&first fab run should be arriving any day& my next project is a small HAB
[18:40] <bertrik> SA6BSS-Mike: impressive!
[18:40] <SA6BSS-Mike> it will call in any moment now, abolutle within the 45min or so
[18:41] <SA6BSS-Mike> bertrik: yes, verry!
[18:43] <JerJer> does anyone have a mac installer for latest version of wspr-x ?
[18:44] <JerJer> i'm not motivated for a compiling session
[18:44] <SA6BSS-Mike> http://physics.princeton.edu/pulsar/k1jt/wsjtx.html
[18:45] <JerJer> nice - i was on a different site
[18:45] <JerJer> oh - the homepage links haven't been updated
[18:47] <JerJer> ugh - unable to create shared memory segment (googling)
[18:47] <JerJer> ahh RTFM
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[19:23] <SpacenearUS> New position from 03PS-57 after 0312 hours silence - 12http://tracker.habhub.org/#!qm=All&q=PS-57
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[20:16] <SM0ULC-Reb> jerjer: http://sourceforge.net/projects/wsjt/
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[20:33] Nick change: lz1dev_ -> lz1dev
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[21:41] <Ian_> Next Summer!
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[21:48] <Laurenceb_> china Falcon 9
[21:48] <Laurenceb_> http://i2.wp.com/www.universetoday.com/wp-content/uploads/2015/01/0326fb05bbf649b9b0fde0c81630d058.jpg
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[22:23] <Babs_> ping eroomde
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[22:26] <eroomde> Babs_: pong
[22:27] <Babs_> hi mate - you made some superpressure balloons BITD right?
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[22:29] <Babs_> outside of the "don't bother, they are an inordinate faff" what material and sealing method did you use?
[22:31] <eroomde> only zero pressure
[22:31] <eroomde> (open bottomed)
[22:31] <Babs_> ahh ok
[22:31] <eroomde> we used uhmwpe and a continuous welder (a pair of heated wheels you fed the seam between)
[22:32] <Laurenceb_> you are probably thinking of Leo
[22:32] <Laurenceb_> he used large PTFE bits at 180C
[22:33] <Babs_> did you make the continuous welder? the only thing i can see that does the job is this kind of thing https://www.protectivepackaging.net/crimper-sealer
[22:33] <Babs_> hey laurenceb_
[22:33] <Laurenceb_> aiui only Leo has made custom envelopes, and he used a soldering iron
[22:33] <Babs_> soldering iron. punchy.
[22:34] <Babs_> i made a v large (well, it seemed when i was 12) hot air balloon once from a load of gores. i need to make the adult leap to some kind of foil/plastic
[22:35] <Laurenceb_> yeah its hard to find the right material
[22:35] <Babs_> plus not set fire to my mom in the process (no joke, meths, a 12 year old and naked flames and a mother in tights do not mix well)
[22:37] <Hiena> Hey guys, some interesting balloon related new: Yesterday a dosen of small balloon landed in Csakbereny's (Hungary) kindergarden. To the balloons had small child drawings attached. On the balloons Ostrava was printed. The local mayor investigated and found, the balloons was "love balloons" released by the Ostrava's primary school students in a christmass waiting celebration.
[22:38] <Hiena> This is a 400 km flight for an uprepared and uncalculated cluster...
[22:40] <Hiena> Ostrava is in the Czech Republic.
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[22:43] <eroomde> Babs_: china
[22:43] <Babs_> ?
[22:43] <eroomde> the bearing assembly advised us to 'adopt butter regularly'
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[00:00] --- Thu Dec 31 2015