highaltitude.log.20151228

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[02:47] <Laurenceb_> https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/1/1b/NB-36H_producing_contrails_in_flight.jpg
[02:47] <Laurenceb_> dat tail
[02:49] <SpeedEvil> http://theaviationist.com/2014/06/26/no-nosewheel-landing-av8/
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[04:18] <SpacenearUS> New vehicle on the map: 03VK5ARG-1 - 12http://tracker.habhub.org/#!qm=All&q=VK5ARG-1
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[07:57] <SpacenearUS> New vehicle on the map: 03CALLSIGN123_chase - 12http://tracker.habhub.org/#!qm=All&q=CALLSIGN123_chase
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[08:22] <mclane_> ping upu - good morning Anthony
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[08:38] <Upu> hey mclane_
[08:38] <lz1dev> https://www.pi-supply.com/giveaways/boxing-day-raspberry-pi-giveaway/?lucky=18817
[08:38] <lz1dev> another raffle :)
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[08:57] <mclane_> Hi upu - do you still sell ublox gps chips?
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[09:20] <Upu> yes mclane_
[09:20] <mclane_> I need 2 of the M8Q
[09:21] <Upu> http://ava.upuaut.net/store/index.php?route=product/product&path=59_64&product_id=123 CAM-M8Q
[09:21] <Upu> http://ava.upuaut.net/store/index.php?route=product/product&path=59_64&product_id=107 MAX-M8Q
[09:21] <Upu> http://ava.upuaut.net/store/index.php?route=product/product&path=59_64&product_id=108 MAX-M8C
[09:21] <Upu> you have to click the links direct
[09:22] <eroomde> the internet version of having them inside your jacket liner
[09:22] <Upu> lol
[09:22] <Upu> pain tbh
[09:23] <eroomde> standalone ublox is it mate? might be able to 'elp ya there
[09:23] <eroomde> http://static.tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pub/images/f_6611.jpg
[09:23] <Upu> haha
[09:25] <Upu> in fairness they never told me I couldn't sell then only that I was to stop advertising I sell them
[09:27] <mclane_> Upu: order is out
[09:27] <eroomde> yeah - tiresome but a workaround at least
[09:31] <Upu> got it cheers mclane_
[09:31] <Upu> not sure how I'm going to deal with it when I move shop software
[09:32] <eroomde> to what are you moving?
[09:33] <Upu> I'm rebranding and getting new shop software in there
[09:33] <Upu> the former for "commericial reasons" the latter because the opencart I'm on is rather broken underneth
[09:34] <mclane_> but I hope you will continue to sell those ublox parts? - I coud not find them elswhere for a reasonable price
[09:34] <eroomde> john scott-scott died yesterday
[09:34] <Upu> yes
[09:35] <eroomde> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZfPpauFbnIA
[09:36] <Upu> had he retired ?
[09:38] <eroomde> yes
[09:38] <Upu> not like Alan then :)
[09:38] <eroomde> he's quite a bit older
[09:38] <eroomde> was
[09:40] <number10> its a shame that they never continued that programme
[09:41] <eroomde> it is!
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[09:41] <eroomde> by the standards of 2015 it's be a great little launcher
[09:41] <eroomde> it'd*
[09:41] <eroomde> let alone the 70s
[09:42] <eroomde> you could do Very Little to buy a significant chucnk more payload to leo too
[09:42] <number10> did some of the technology ever get used in the European space programme
[09:42] <eroomde> swap the avionics out for modern stuff, use some slightly more modern, lighter materials for the tanks
[09:43] <eroomde> number10: yes
[09:43] <eroomde> well sort of
[09:44] <eroomde> it was blue streak - british ballistic missile - that could sucked into Europa
[09:44] <eroomde> but we then gave up with that programme too
[09:44] <eroomde> the french took it all and we now have arianespace
[09:46] <eroomde> i personally think something blackarrow class today would sell quite well and be doable on a smaller budget, but i think you'd need first stage reusability
[09:46] <number10> the current uk funding is quite small I guess
[09:47] <eroomde> yes
[09:47] <eroomde> but the market for being able to put up a constellation of cubesats is, if not there now, nearly there
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[09:48] <eroomde> so something that could put a few hundred kg into LEO, with multiple relights of the upper stage, could be an attractive thing, i think
[09:50] <eroomde> without doing a proper business case i couldn't say, but i feel like if falcon 1 were built now there would be more of a market for it
[09:51] <eroomde> i know that there exist entire launchers being purchased just for cubesats now - which is really quite remarkable
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[09:54] <eroomde> good morning jcoxon
[09:54] <jcoxon> morning
[09:55] <Darkside_> https://i.imgur.com/bzeKvuZ.jpg
[09:56] <number10> looks like you are ready to go Darkside_
[09:57] <eroomde> what's the cylinder?
[09:57] <Darkside_> caviy filter
[09:57] <Darkside_> cavity*
[09:57] <Darkside_> centered on 431.650MHz, about 2MHz wide
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[09:58] <Darkside_> its so i dont wipe out the lora receiver when i transmit on my 2/70 rig
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[10:37] <SpacenearUS> New position from 03DC2EH-6 after 0321 hours silence - 12http://tracker.habhub.org/#!qm=All&q=DC2EH-6
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[10:38] <Vaizki> umm why would you transmit on 2m/70cm while chasing?
[10:39] <eroomde> to talk to people?
[10:39] <Vaizki> well yes but that was 1989, now we have gsm :)
[10:39] <Darkside> err
[10:40] <Darkside> we usually have multiple chase cars
[10:40] <Darkside> and comms via a repeater is usually easier than making a phone call while driving
[10:40] <Vaizki> nice setup on the dog "screen"
[10:40] <Vaizki> and everyone is ham licensed?
[10:40] <Darkside> in our group? yes
[10:40] <Darkside> last hunt we used 160m mobile for our primary car-car comms
[10:41] <Darkside> just for shits n giggles
[10:41] <Vaizki> ok then
[10:41] <Vaizki> 160m.. oh well :)
[10:41] <Darkside> awesom fun and to use
[10:41] <Darkside> band*
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[10:41] <Darkside> does slightly better coverage than 2m simplex
[10:42] <Darkside> and you get away from all the pesky foundation calls :P
[10:53] <SpacenearUS> New vehicle on the map: 03DL2YED_chase - 12http://tracker.habhub.org/#!qm=All&q=DL2YED_chase
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[10:56] <mfa298> other benefits radio can have is being more legal for the driver to use in some places, and its a group medium, rather than having to make lots of phone calls
[10:57] <Darkside> yeah
[10:57] <Darkside> on our chase cars its usually the driver that handles the outside-car comms
[10:57] <Darkside> well, via radio anyway
[10:58] <Darkside> i usually use IRC as an alternate comms channel :P
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[11:33] <fl_0> x-f: ping
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[12:00] <SpacenearUS> New vehicle on the map: 03DC2EH-11 - 12http://tracker.habhub.org/#!qm=All&q=DC2EH-11
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[12:11] <SpacenearUS> New position from 03DL0CRE-11 after 033 days silence - 12http://tracker.habhub.org/#!qm=All&q=DL0CRE-11
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[13:41] <x-f> fl_0, pong
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[13:43] <fl_0> x-f: are you the author of the grpahical dashboard
[13:43] <fl_0> ?
[13:43] <fl_0> i was handed the link from a while ago
[13:43] <x-f> yes
[13:44] <fl_0> x-f.lv/dev/habitat-graphs/payload/DL0CRE-11
[13:44] <fl_0> that one
[13:44] <x-f> yes, what's up with it?
[13:45] <fl_0> i was interested in how that was set up
[13:45] <fl_0> we will have a HAB mission in Feb 2016
[13:45] <fl_0> and flying with a pressure sensor
[13:45] <fl_0> that is shown in the graphs
[13:45] <fl_0> but not on the dashboard
[13:45] <fl_0> is there a reason for this?
[13:47] <x-f> yes, i didn't think it would be necessary :) i'll add it this evening (ISH)
[13:47] <fl_0> is the interface to the habhub public?
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[13:48] <x-f> you can grab the data from Habitat's "export payload telemetry" tool
[13:48] <fl_0> ah okay
[13:53] <adamgreig> fl_0: the interface is public incidentally, http://habitat.readthedocs.org
[13:53] <adamgreig> but yea the http://habitat.habhub.org/ept tool is also an api of sorts
[13:54] <fl_0> i was thinking about setting an own dashboard up
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[15:40] <cm13g09> craag: ping
[15:41] <cm13g09> or indeed anyone here..... any idea what Farnell's Christmas/New Year opening hours are?
[15:41] <cm13g09> UK, that is
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[16:05] <Miek> cm13g09: they're listed on the right on uk.farnell.com
[16:09] Action: cm13g09 may be blind!
[16:10] <cm13g09> nope...
[16:10] <cm13g09> not seeing it
[16:11] <cm13g09> Miek: Are they running a normal operation tomorrow?
[16:11] <cm13g09> I seem to have ended up with some beta homepage that I must've opted into
[16:12] <Miek> ah right, it's open 9:00 till 16:00 tomorrow and the next day, closed today
[16:12] <cm13g09> Miek: ta, much appreciated
[16:12] <Miek> http://pastebin.com/UXkZpvdi
[16:13] <cm13g09> I guess they'll manhandle that order out the door tomorrow then
[16:13] <cm13g09> and since UPS will be back to normal service on Wednesday as well
[16:14] <cm13g09> I guess I'll get that one turn up at the office while I'm doing stock take
[16:14] <cm13g09> happy days!
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[18:24] <cm13g09> Miek: So... that's just smart from Farnell....
[18:25] <cm13g09> I place a UK order
[18:25] <cm13g09> but there's stock in Belgium
[18:25] <cm13g09> Belgium, for whatever reason, are working today
[18:25] <cm13g09> so they've shipped it!
[18:26] <eroomde> partly why we don't work this week
[18:26] <eroomde> if farnell are closed and our customer is closed, what on earth is the point?
[18:27] <cm13g09> eroomde: well yeah
[18:27] <cm13g09> I'm just stunned that their systems did something logical!
[18:32] <SpacenearUS> New vehicle on the map: 03PYSY - 12http://tracker.habhub.org/#!qm=All&q=PYSY
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[19:08] <SpacenearUS> New vehicle on the map: 03KF7RHV-11 - 12http://tracker.habhub.org/#!qm=All&q=KF7RHV-11
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[19:18] <Laurenceb_> Falcon 9 sim now has a gui
[19:18] <Laurenceb_> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=b8vzt1PLG5U
[19:18] <Laurenceb_> as I thought - without entry burn stage 1 will hammer straight through the atmosphere
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[19:31] <SpeedEvil> So it does have a terminal velocity of ~80m/s or whatever
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[19:31] <SpeedEvil> but - that doesn't matter as that only applies with lots more braking room than it's gor
[19:31] <SpeedEvil> t
[19:42] <SpeedEvil> Interesting ^
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[19:44] <SA6BSS-Mike|2> ps-57 called in 45min ago on wspr , it was verry low on last telemetry so nice its still going
[19:45] <fsphil> it could tx from the ground
[19:45] <fsphil> that happened one of bills flights once
[19:45] <SA6BSS-Mike|2> well not from the ocean anyway :)
[19:46] <Laurenceb_> I wonder if its losing gas or has hit bad weather
[19:46] <fsphil> heh, maybe not
[19:46] <Laurenceb_> we need some sort of sensor to answer this question
[19:46] <Laurenceb_> dunno what tho...
[19:46] <SA6BSS-Mike|2> its bad wether or cloudy anyway
[19:46] <Laurenceb_> it wouldnt be immediately obviously even looking at it
[19:47] <SA6BSS-Mike|2> it reached a all time high altitude yesterday so no gas leak
[19:47] <Laurenceb_> nope that suggests just the opposite
[19:47] <SpeedEvil> It would be nice to see Q / atmospheric decel / thrust decel broken out seperately
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[19:49] <Laurenceb_> <SA6BSS-Mike|2> float altitude isnt a linear function of amount of gas
[19:49] <Laurenceb_> it depends on envelope elasticity and stuff
[19:50] <Laurenceb_> anomalous high altitude during day and low during night suggests gas loss
[19:50] <SA6BSS-Mike|2> so if the envelope is streatshed out over time it could go higher?
[19:51] <Laurenceb_> that too
[19:51] <Laurenceb_> its very complex
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[19:51] <Laurenceb_> if the envelope was transparent maybe an LED and photodiode facing upwards could detect ice / dew on the envelope
[19:51] <SA6BSS-Mike|2> is there "more atmosphere" at the eqautor then on the poles that have have a play in this to?
[19:51] <Laurenceb_> yes
[19:52] <SA6BSS-Mike|2> ok
[19:52] <Laurenceb_> I did write some code for processing B-64 data
[19:52] <Laurenceb_> using hysplit and lab calibration + extrapolation to low temperature using published studies
[19:52] <Laurenceb_> only managed to put an upper bound on gas leakage
[19:53] <Laurenceb_> but that was enough for >20 years flight time
[19:53] <Laurenceb_> so with the right material and >12km float, UV damage kills it first
[19:53] <SA6BSS-Mike|2> I remeber reading some of your discusions , you calculated at the curent gas leak of b-64 it would be airborne for some 12 years
[19:53] <SpacenearUS> New position from 03PS-57 after 0311 hours silence - 12http://tracker.habhub.org/#!qm=All&q=PS-57
[19:54] <SA6BSS-Mike|2> there we go :)
[19:54] <SA6BSS-Mike|2> 9383m nice alt
[19:55] <Laurenceb_> SA6BSS-Mike|2> yes I later revised that to 20 years with better data
[19:56] <SA6BSS-Mike|2> ah ok
[19:56] Nick change: SA6BSS-Mike|2 -> SA6BSS-Mike
[19:56] <Laurenceb_> there was probably some detectable gas loss, but it was right down in the noise
[19:57] <Laurenceb_> I dont know if PS-57 uses a heat sealed inflation valve
[19:57] <Laurenceb_> aiui nobody has flown for more than 10 days with a completely unmodified party balloon as the valves leak
[20:00] <Laurenceb_> Leo got bored of it as the problem was pretty much solved apart from Lithium-Sulphur batteries
[20:00] <SA6BSS-Mike> that might be something to try next time I fly - heatsealing
[20:01] <Laurenceb_> and making those practical is hardly a diy project
[20:01] <Laurenceb_> also if you did manage to crack it, youd sell them for $billions rather than make picoballoons :D
[20:01] <SA6BSS-Mike> Yeah, to bad, I come in to habing quite late when he was up in his mid B-30 th
[20:02] <Laurenceb_> tbh I think Leo enjoys pain
[20:02] <SA6BSS-Mike> :)
[20:02] <Laurenceb_> he seemed to launch about 10 of each version
[20:02] <Laurenceb_> and launch stuff that he was 90% sure would fail just to be sure
[20:03] <Laurenceb_> but after 64 attempts super long duration pico is a solved problem
[20:03] <SA6BSS-Mike> and from his experimentation we learned alot about pico ballons, netted latex and cutom envelops.
[20:04] <Laurenceb_> I'd still like to look at UV damage
[20:04] <SA6BSS-Mike> custom ballons is something I like to try
[20:04] <Laurenceb_> that would require a few years flight time, but could be practical with solar only and HF
[20:04] <SA6BSS-Mike> and probably will
[20:04] <Laurenceb_> Leo never flew HF
[20:05] <Laurenceb_> I suspect you could get 10 year flight times with the UV treatment process using on CR-39 glasses
[20:06] <SA6BSS-Mike> Im more interested geatting a couple of days float at +11k km
[20:06] <Laurenceb_> the world record is just short of 3 years
[20:06] <SA6BSS-Mike> if that is sucsessfull maby a hf
[20:06] <Laurenceb_> but that was with untreated mylar, you could do so much better now
[20:07] <Laurenceb_> if you just want 11km, I'd try party balloon with pre stretch and aluminium stripped off
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[20:08] <SA6BSS-Mike> custom is anyway something I like to try i the future
[20:08] <Laurenceb_> it'd be interesting to see how long a party balloon can fly
[20:09] <SA6BSS-Mike> hard to find the right winds to keep it in range of receivers formore then a coiple of days
[20:09] <Laurenceb_> Leo started using custom envelopes before trying anything else
[20:09] <Lunar_Lander> Leo is a superstar, among Upu, Dave, Steve and Ed and others
[20:09] <Laurenceb_> heh
[20:10] <SA6BSS-Mike> he is :)
[20:11] <Laurenceb_> party balloon with heat sealed vent, alu removed, pre stretch and H2 should fly at ~11.5km
[20:11] <Laurenceb_> thats almost high enough to avoid the weather
[20:12] <Laurenceb_> something else that hasnt been investigated very well is how much pre stretch enables superpressure to be increased
[20:14] <SA6BSS-Mike> Have a few paryballoons left and will pre strech them before flight, but that probably not until March or so
[20:14] <Lunar_Lander> sounds interesting
[20:15] <Lunar_Lander> I heard of a superpressure science balloon called atmosat
[20:15] <Lunar_Lander> that one was manned
[20:15] <Lunar_Lander> a three shell system of mylar inside and aluminized mylar outside and kevlar in the middle
[20:17] <Laurenceb_> the problem with aluminized mylar is that the aluminium cracks
[20:17] <Lunar_Lander> http://www.tandfonline.com/doi/pdf/10.1080/00022470.1977.10470451
[20:17] <Lunar_Lander> yea
[20:18] <Laurenceb_> so it behaves live a perfect black body
[20:18] <Laurenceb_> https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Black_body#/media/File:Black-body_realization.png
[20:18] <Laurenceb_> interesting link, thanks
[20:19] <Lunar_Lander> you're welcome
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[21:39] Nick change: Steffann -> Steffanx
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[21:46] <fl_0> x-f: pressure sensor seen
[21:46] <fl_0> thank you very much :)
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[21:59] <eroomde> maybe of interest here - a documentary about an atlantic-crossing drone
[21:59] <eroomde> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=D0PODlNjSaA&feature=youtu.be
[21:59] <craag> cm13g09: latent pong
[22:00] <eroomde> that sounds like a really shit game
[22:00] <craag> hah
[22:07] <cm13g09> eroomde: LOL
[22:07] <cm13g09> So... I guess today isn't a bank holiday in Belgium
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[22:18] <michal_f> !flights
[22:18] <SpacenearUS> 03michal_f: Current flights: 03Horus LoRa Cutdown Test #1 10(cf5a)
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[22:33] <eroomde> i thought i was being clever ordering a martini with lillet, turns out that's what the Vesper is in casino royale
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[22:38] <Lunar_Lander> water is cool
[22:38] <Lunar_Lander> (that is why I landed my HAB in a river)
[22:38] <Lunar_Lander> (satire!)
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[22:49] <Darkside> RocketBoy: heyy
[22:50] <RocketBoy> hhi - hows it going down south - been up to anything new HAB wise?
[22:58] <RocketBoy> Darkside: Just dropped you an email
[22:58] <Darkside> driving to do a launch now :D
[22:58] <Darkside> oh cheers RocketBoy
[22:59] <Darkside> i'm realising now i should have added some parchutes to that order :P
[22:59] <Darkside> oh well
[23:00] <RocketBoy> Yeah there is no real way round the extra postage to Aus
[23:00] <Darkside> yeah its fine
[23:01] <RocketBoy> well good luck with the launch - the December Wx has been poor here (bit of an understatement for poor northen folk) - bet its a bit better there
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[23:20] <SpacenearUS> New position from 03HORUSLORA after 03a day silence - 12http://tracker.habhub.org/#!qm=All&q=HORUSLORA
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[23:57] <SpacenearUS> New vehicle on the map: 03VK5ARG-1 - 12http://tracker.habhub.org/#!qm=All&q=VK5ARG-1
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[00:00] --- Tue Dec 29 2015