highaltitude.log.20151126

[00:18] luteijn (~luteijn@5ED1420C.cm-7-2b.dynamic.ziggo.nl) left irc: Ping timeout: 264 seconds
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[07:25] heathkid|2 (~heathkid@unaffiliated/heathkid) joined #highaltitude.
[07:26] zzqa_ (~A@c-76-27-48-44.hsd1.ut.comcast.net) joined #highaltitude.
[07:27] gonzo___ (~gonzo_@host-92-6-244-28.as43234.net) joined #highaltitude.
[07:27] jevin_ (~jevin@72.12.217.220) joined #highaltitude.
[07:27] Strykar_ (~wakkawakk@122.170.160.74) joined #highaltitude.
[07:27] ipdove (~ipdove@interclub.plus.com) joined #highaltitude.
[07:27] SushiKenBrown (~quassel@cmr-208-124-174-194.cr.net.cable.rogers.com) joined #highaltitude.
[07:27] skagmo_ (skagmo@cassarossa.samfundet.no) joined #highaltitude.
[07:27] Geoff-G8DHE-Lap (~Geoff-G8D@geoffg8dhe.plus.com) joined #highaltitude.
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[07:28] nigelvh_ (~nigel@50.35.11.45) joined #highaltitude.
[07:28] Upu- (~UpuWork@smtp.nevis.co.uk) joined #highaltitude.
[07:28] UpuWork (~UpuWork@smtp.nevis.co.uk) left irc: Disconnected by services
[07:28] natrium43 (~alexei@tigerc.at) joined #highaltitude.
[07:28] heathkid (~heathkid@unaffiliated/heathkid) left irc: Disconnected by services
[07:28] Nick change: heathkid|2 -> heathkid
[07:28] hehuj (~Copyright@f523.ip15.netikka.fi) joined #highaltitude.
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[07:28] Nick change: nigelvh_ -> Guest76632
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[07:28] PI4GV (~PI4GV@217.23.14.205) left irc: Ping timeout: 265 seconds
[07:28] Nick change: PI4GV_ -> PI4GV
[07:28] tweetBot1 (~nodebot@philcrump.co.uk) joined #highaltitude.
[07:29] ir2ivps6_ (~ir2ivps6@f9.a2.559e.ip4.static.sl-reverse.com) joined #highaltitude.
[07:29] Helios-Reaper (~helios@2001:630:d0:f111:e07a:b1fa:68a1:80eb) joined #highaltitude.
[07:29] SpacenearUS1 (~a-bot@kraken.habhub.org) joined #highaltitude.
[07:29] Sirius-B1 (~BeB@172-34-149-5.dyn.cable.fcom.ch) joined #highaltitude.
[07:29] cfloare (~cfloare@crystal.itim-cj.ro) joined #highaltitude.
[07:30] Jartza (jartza@heinola.org) joined #highaltitude.
[07:30] sumie-dh (sumie-dh@nat.brmlab.cz) joined #highaltitude.
[07:30] andyvk5_ (~andyvk5@zedm.net) joined #highaltitude.
[07:30] geheimni1` (~geheimnis@23.226.237.192) joined #highaltitude.
[07:31] lz1dev_ (~rgp@unaffiliated/lz1dev) joined #highaltitude.
[07:31] Upui (~Upu@ubn.upuaut.net) joined #highaltitude.
[07:31] Upu (~Upu@ubn.upuaut.net) left irc: Disconnected by services
[07:31] DanielRichman (~daniel@unaffiliated/danielrichman) joined #highaltitude.
[07:31] Nick change: Upui -> Upu
[07:31] arko_ (~Arko@vanderse.xxx) joined #highaltitude.
[07:31] BitEvil (~quassel@tor/regular/SpeedEvil) joined #highaltitude.
[07:31] luteijn_ (~luteijn@5ED1420C.cm-7-2b.dynamic.ziggo.nl) joined #highaltitude.
[07:31] NLincs_ (~NLincs@36.8.189.80.dyn.plus.net) joined #highaltitude.
[07:31] wrea_ (~quassel@2604:180:1:8ca::bae2) joined #highaltitude.
[07:31] comzeradd_ (~sid286@2620:101:8016:74::4:11e) joined #highaltitude.
[07:31] SgtStroopwafel_ (~Chuck@85.151.171.166) joined #highaltitude.
[07:32] GargantuaSauce_ (~sauce@blk-224-177-97.eastlink.ca) joined #highaltitude.
[07:33] <SpacenearUS1> New vehicle on the map: 03car_chase - 12http://tracker.habhub.org/#!qm=All&q=car_chase
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[07:35] BrainDamage (~BrainDama@unaffiliated/braindamage) got netsplit.
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[07:35] qyx (~qyx@krtkoorg.ynet.sk) got netsplit.
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[07:35] guido____ (uid129580@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-jyjaqbaflbmvkwuf) got netsplit.
[07:35] SgtStroopwafel (~Chuck@s5597aba6.adsl.online.nl) got netsplit.
[07:36] Chimpusmaximus (sid119166@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-mivblefgmpiczrag) got netsplit.
[07:36] DanielRi1hman (~daniel@unaffiliated/danielrichman) got netsplit.
[07:36] bradfirj (~bradfirj@2a03:b0c0:1:d0::c9:c001) got netsplit.
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[07:36] Geek_Juice (~Bryanstei@shellium.org) joined #highaltitude.
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[07:36] mattltm (mattltm@viking.pengimo.com) returned to #highaltitude.
[07:36] tweetBot (~nodebot@philcrump.co.uk) got netsplit.
[07:36] JDat (JDat@89.248.91.5) got netsplit.
[07:36] Sirius-BE (~BeB@172-34-149-5.dyn.cable.fcom.ch) got netsplit.
[07:36] jonsowman (~jonsowman@kryten.hexoc.com) got netsplit.
[07:36] GargantuaSauce (~sauce@blk-224-177-97.eastlink.ca) got netsplit.
[07:36] arko (~Arko@vanderse.xxx) got netsplit.
[07:36] berndj (~berndj@azna.co.za) got netsplit.
[07:36] Nick change: arko_ -> arko
[07:36] Possible future nick collision: arko
[07:36] fergusnoble_ (fergusnobl@repl.esden.net) joined #highaltitude.
[07:36] M0NSA (~helios@2001:630:d0:f111:e07a:b1fa:68a1:80eb) got netsplit.
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[07:36] JelmerD (~JelmerD@2a01:7c8:aab3:389:5054:ff:fec2:1821) got netsplit.
[07:36] gonzo__ (~gonzo_@host-92-6-244-28.as43234.net) got netsplit.
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[07:38] Nick change: Guest76632 -> nigelvh1
[07:38] JDat` (JDat@89.248.91.5) left irc:
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[07:38] Nick change: nigelvh1 -> nigelvh__
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[07:40] daveake (~daveake@daveake.plus.com) got netsplit.
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[07:40] ir2ivps6 (~ir2ivps6@f9.a2.559e.ip4.static.sl-reverse.com) got netsplit.
[07:40] NLincs (~NLincs@36.8.189.80.dyn.plus.net) got netsplit.
[07:40] Darkside (~darkside@zedm.net) got netsplit.
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[07:40] Tiger^ (tygrys@moo.pl) got netsplit.
[07:40] benoxley (~benoxley@66.172.10.141) got netsplit.
[07:40] geheimnis` (~geheimnis@23.226.237.192) got netsplit.
[07:40] andyvk5 (~andyvk5@zedm.net) got netsplit.
[07:40] englishman (~englishma@alcohol.dtfuhf.com) got netsplit.
[07:40] Triskel (triskel@ircaddict.org) got netsplit.
[07:40] Sync (~foobar@sync-hv.de) got netsplit.
[07:40] staylo (~staylo@vm3999.vps.tagadab.com) got netsplit.
[07:40] Nick change: daveake_ -> daveake
[07:40] Possible future nick collision: daveake
[07:40] Nick change: geheimni1` -> geheimnis`
[07:40] Possible future nick collision: geheimnis`
[07:40] Nick change: yashi___ -> yashi
[07:40] Lemml (~andreas@p4FEEAB39.dip0.t-ipconnect.de) got netsplit.
[07:40] lilafisch (~lilafisch@irc.xtort.eu) got netsplit.
[07:40] clopez (~tau@neutrino.es) got netsplit.
[07:40] fl_0 (foo@unaffiliated/fl-0/x-7355575) got netsplit.
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[07:40] skagmo (skagmo@cassarossa.samfundet.no) got netsplit.
[07:40] Helios_Reaper (~helios@2001:630:d0:f111:e07a:b1fa:68a1:80eb) got netsplit.
[07:40] zyp (zyp@zyp.no) got netsplit.
[07:40] arjunnaha (sid119604@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-ehsivrgnptfslpuw) got netsplit.
[07:40] adamgreig (adam@druid.randomskk.net) got netsplit.
[07:40] Elwell (~elwell@freenode/staff-emeritus/elwell) got netsplit.
[07:40] nigelvh (~nigel@50.35.11.45) got netsplit.
[07:40] Copyright (~Copyright@f523.ip15.netikka.fi) got netsplit.
[07:40] russss (sid30@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-jgwylxjeffqtjgwa) got netsplit.
[07:40] murb (~murb@an.der.schoenen.blauen.danu.be) got netsplit.
[07:40] Bryanstein (~Bryanstei@shellium/admin/bryanstein) got netsplit.
[07:40] cfloare_ (~cfloare@crystal.itim-cj.ro) got netsplit.
[07:40] DoYouKnow (sid90491@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-zaecxxzhwqztinhb) got netsplit.
[07:40] fergusnoble (fergusnobl@repl.esden.net) got netsplit.
[07:41] dbrooke (~db@gresley.dbrooke.me.uk) got netsplit.
[07:41] natrium42 (~alexei@tigerc.at) got netsplit.
[07:41] comzeradd (~sid286@2620:101:8016:74::4:11e) got netsplit.
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[07:41] Zokol (~Zokol@ns319387.ip-91-121-73.eu) got netsplit.
[07:41] Nick change: Geek_Juice -> Bryanstein
[07:41] Possible future nick collision: Bryanstein
[07:41] Nick change: fergusnoble_ -> fergusnoble
[07:41] Possible future nick collision: fergusnoble
[07:41] Nick change: arjunnaha_ -> arjunnaha
[07:41] Possible future nick collision: arjunnaha
[07:41] Nick change: comzeradd_ -> comzeradd
[07:41] Possible future nick collision: comzeradd
[07:41] Bryanstein (~Bryanstei@shellium.org) left irc: Changing host
[07:41] Bryanstein (~Bryanstei@shellium/admin/bryanstein) joined #highaltitude.
[07:41] cjdavies (~cj@cjdavies.org) joined #highaltitude.
[07:42] stryx` (~stryx@unaffiliated/stryx/x-3871776) joined #highaltitude.
[07:42] Nick change: cjdavies -> Guest9468
[07:42] Stry (~wakkawakk@122.170.160.74) got netsplit.
[07:42] SpacenearUS (~a-bot@kraken.habhub.org) got netsplit.
[07:42] lz1dev (~rgp@unaffiliated/lz1dev) got netsplit.
[07:42] SushiKenBrown_ (~quassel@cmr-208-124-174-194.cr.net.cable.rogers.com) got netsplit.
[07:42] Aleks (~Aleks@unaffiliated/aleks) got netsplit.
[07:42] Nick change: SpacenearUS1 -> SpacenearUS
[07:42] Possible future nick collision: SpacenearUS
[07:42] Nick change: Aleks_ -> Aleks
[07:42] Possible future nick collision: Aleks
[07:42] Aleks (~Aleks@znc.ie.mk) left irc: Changing host
[07:42] Aleks (~Aleks@unaffiliated/aleks) joined #highaltitude.
[07:42] murb (~murb@an.der.schoenen.blauen.danu.be) returned to #highaltitude.
[07:43] adamgreig (adam@druid.randomskk.net) returned to #highaltitude.
[07:44] Tiger^ (~tygrys@moo.pl) joined #highaltitude.
[07:44] Elwell (~elwell@freenode/staff-emeritus/elwell) returned to #highaltitude.
[07:45] jonsowman (~jonsowman@kryten.hexoc.com) returned to #highaltitude.
[07:46] qyx (~qyx@krtkoorg.ynet.sk) got lost in the net-split.
[07:46] erxeto (~paco@frog.onna.be) got lost in the net-split.
[07:46] BrainDamage (~BrainDama@unaffiliated/braindamage) got lost in the net-split.
[07:46] SgtStroopwafel (~Chuck@s5597aba6.adsl.online.nl) got lost in the net-split.
[07:46] guido____ (uid129580@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-jyjaqbaflbmvkwuf) got lost in the net-split.
[07:46] Chimpusmaximus (sid119166@gateway/web/irccloud.com/session) joined #highaltitude.
[07:47] GargantuaSauce (~sauce@blk-224-177-97.eastlink.ca) got lost in the net-split.
[07:47] bradfirj (~bradfirj@2a03:b0c0:1:d0::c9:c001) got lost in the net-split.
[07:47] DanielRi1hman (~daniel@unaffiliated/danielrichman) got lost in the net-split.
[07:47] berndj (~berndj@azna.co.za) got lost in the net-split.
[07:47] Sirius-BE (~BeB@172-34-149-5.dyn.cable.fcom.ch) got lost in the net-split.
[07:47] gonzo__ (~gonzo_@host-92-6-244-28.as43234.net) got lost in the net-split.
[07:47] JelmerD (~JelmerD@2a01:7c8:aab3:389:5054:ff:fec2:1821) got lost in the net-split.
[07:47] JDat (JDat@89.248.91.5) got lost in the net-split.
[07:47] luteijn (~luteijn@5ED1420C.cm-7-2b.dynamic.ziggo.nl) got lost in the net-split.
[07:47] tweetBot (~nodebot@philcrump.co.uk) got lost in the net-split.
[07:47] M0NSA (~helios@2001:630:d0:f111:e07a:b1fa:68a1:80eb) got lost in the net-split.
[07:47] guido____ (uid129580@gateway/web/irccloud.com/session) joined #highaltitude.
[07:49] BitEvil_ (~quassel@tor/regular/SpeedEvil) joined #highaltitude.
[07:49] BrainDamage (~BrainDama@unaffiliated/braindamage) joined #highaltitude.
[07:51] Triskel (triskel@ircaddict.org) got lost in the net-split.
[07:51] Sync (~foobar@sync-hv.de) got lost in the net-split.
[07:51] staylo (~staylo@vm3999.vps.tagadab.com) got lost in the net-split.
[07:51] DoYouKnow (sid90491@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-zaecxxzhwqztinhb) got lost in the net-split.
[07:51] cfloare_ (~cfloare@crystal.itim-cj.ro) got lost in the net-split.
[07:51] englishman (~englishma@alcohol.dtfuhf.com) got lost in the net-split.
[07:51] russss (sid30@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-jgwylxjeffqtjgwa) got lost in the net-split.
[07:51] Copyright (~Copyright@f523.ip15.netikka.fi) got lost in the net-split.
[07:51] andyvk5 (~andyvk5@zedm.net) got lost in the net-split.
[07:51] benoxley (~benoxley@66.172.10.141) got lost in the net-split.
[07:51] nigelvh (~nigel@50.35.11.45) got lost in the net-split.
[07:51] sumie-dh_ (sumie-dh@nat.brmlab.cz) got lost in the net-split.
[07:51] zyp (zyp@zyp.no) got lost in the net-split.
[07:51] Helios_Reaper (~helios@2001:630:d0:f111:e07a:b1fa:68a1:80eb) got lost in the net-split.
[07:51] skagmo (skagmo@cassarossa.samfundet.no) got lost in the net-split.
[07:51] cjdavies_ (~cj@cjdavies.org) got lost in the net-split.
[07:51] Darkside (~darkside@zedm.net) got lost in the net-split.
[07:51] NLincs (~NLincs@36.8.189.80.dyn.plus.net) got lost in the net-split.
[07:51] fl_0 (foo@unaffiliated/fl-0/x-7355575) got lost in the net-split.
[07:51] ir2ivps6 (~ir2ivps6@f9.a2.559e.ip4.static.sl-reverse.com) got lost in the net-split.
[07:51] SpeedEvil (~quassel@tor/regular/SpeedEvil) got lost in the net-split.
[07:51] kim27 (~kim27@unaffiliated/kim27) got lost in the net-split.
[07:51] jevin (~jevin@72.12.217.220) got lost in the net-split.
[07:51] clopez (~tau@neutrino.es) got lost in the net-split.
[07:51] lilafisch (~lilafisch@irc.xtort.eu) got lost in the net-split.
[07:51] Lemml (~andreas@p4FEEAB39.dip0.t-ipconnect.de) got lost in the net-split.
[07:51] dustinm` (~dustinm@2607:5300:100:200::160d) joined #highaltitude.
[07:52] dbrooke (~db@gresley.dbrooke.me.uk) got lost in the net-split.
[07:52] natrium42 (~alexei@tigerc.at) got lost in the net-split.
[07:52] wrea (~quassel@2604:180:1:8ca::bae2) got lost in the net-split.
[07:52] Zokol (~Zokol@ns319387.ip-91-121-73.eu) got lost in the net-split.
[07:52] goopypanther (~goopypant@goopypanther.org) joined #highaltitude.
[07:53] SushiKenBrown_ (~quassel@cmr-208-124-174-194.cr.net.cable.rogers.com) got lost in the net-split.
[07:53] lz1dev (~rgp@unaffiliated/lz1dev) got lost in the net-split.
[07:53] Stry (~wakkawakk@122.170.160.74) got lost in the net-split.
[07:53] Geoff-G8DHE-Tab (~Geoff-G8D@geoffg8dhe.plus.com) joined #highaltitude.
[07:53] cgfbee (~bot@oc1.itim-cj.ro) joined #highaltitude.
[07:53] fl_0 (foo@unaffiliated/fl-0/x-7355575) joined #highaltitude.
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[07:55] <SpacenearUS> New vehicle on the map: 03CALLSIGN123_chase - 12http://tracker.habhub.org/#!qm=All&q=CALLSIGN123_chase
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[08:25] <fsphil> lovely, https://www.raspberrypi.org/blog/raspberry-pi-zero/
[08:25] <eroomde> there is also a raspbian zero-day
[08:25] <eroomde> (it generales non-random ssh keys)
[08:26] <fsphil> well timed
[08:28] <fsphil> lacks the CSI camera interface
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[08:36] <eroomde> fsphil: no star tracker 4 u
[08:36] <eroomde> have you come across sinclair interplaneatry?
[08:36] <eroomde> looks like a really beautiful cottage industry
[08:36] <eroomde> one smart guy, with links to a local uni, making niche-but-very-good things for nanosats
[08:36] <eroomde> star trackers, reaction wheels etc
[08:37] <fsphil> not heard of them. I like their "Peaceful Use Policy"
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[08:38] <fsphil> ah they made that tracker on skysat
[08:39] <eroomde> yeah
[08:39] <fsphil> sexy, http://i.imgur.com/nNXQE6o.jpg
[08:39] <eroomde> http://www.sinclairinterplanetary.com/news/superstrypifailure
[08:39] <eroomde> ouch
[08:39] <eroomde> isn't it!
[08:39] <eroomde> i've read some papers on his wheels
[08:40] <eroomde> they're very nice
[08:40] <eroomde> otsof thought gone into pole arrangements and bearings and so on
[08:40] <eroomde> i'd love to do a wear-free reaction wheel with magnetic bearings
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[08:41] <fsphil> hubble could use a few of those
[08:43] <fsphil> "The primary focus is on low-cost, rapid-schedule programs..."
[08:43] <fsphil> definitly a Sinclair :)
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[08:45] <eroomde> that's the market to be in though
[08:45] <eroomde> where you can run rings around some big defense company
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[08:54] <SpacenearUS> New vehicle on the map: 03norma_chase - 12http://tracker.habhub.org/#!qm=All&q=norma_chase
[08:57] <eroomde> see ^
[08:57] <eroomde> it's the end of days
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[09:19] <fsphil> some interesting papers on that site
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[11:27] <Sirius-B1> Is Pi in the sky compatible with the new Pi Zero?
[11:27] <craag> https://twitter.com/pitsproject/status/669827553776050176
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[11:31] <lz1dev_> https://www.pi-supply.com/giveaways/black-piday-giveaway/?lucky=976
[11:31] <lz1dev_> :>
[11:31] <Sirius-B1> tnx :-)
[11:31] Nick change: lz1dev_ -> lz1dev
[11:37] <dbrooke> Pi Zero doesn't have the camera connector, so less reason to use PITS rather than another tracker solution
[11:38] <chris_99> yeah i noticed that :(
[11:39] <SpacenearUS> New position from 03SP6NVB-11 after 03a day silence - 12http://tracker.habhub.org/#!qm=All&q=SP6NVB-11
[11:45] <Sirius-B1> yeah, but I still love it ;-)
[11:46] Nick change: Sirius-B1 -> Sirius-Bern
[11:52] <dbrooke> fair enough 8-) but for me the camera would be the reason to choose PITS
[11:53] <fsphil> yeah without a camera there's no point in having 512MB RAM and 1GHz CPU
[11:53] <fsphil> unless it's doing SDR stuffs
[11:54] <fsphil> which the Pi is fairly poor at anyway
[11:54] <mattbrejza> could have done with wifi or something like that
[11:55] <craag> I'd like to see usb on the gpio header
[11:55] <SpeedEvil> I'd rather have CSI/DSI and actual opened both of those
[11:55] <craag> then someone could put a usb wifi chipset on a mini hat
[11:55] <Upu> hey Sirius
[11:55] <russss> I'm working on SDR with the Pi2, it's not too bad with the multiple cores
[11:56] <Upu> we only got the PiZero this morning like everyone else so we haven't even looked at it with PITS yet #notspecial
[11:56] <craag> SpeedEvil: I think rpis hands are tied on that :/
[11:57] <craag> dealing with camera manufacturers is not much fun when it comes to getting information, even as a direct customer
[11:58] <eroomde> it's only the pi1 cpu right?
[11:58] <craag> slightly clocked-up pi1 yes
[11:58] <craag> 700MHz -> 1ghz
[11:58] <russss> yeah
[11:58] <craag> but still single core
[11:58] <eroomde> at least the pi2 has NEON
[11:58] <eroomde> and other things
[11:58] <craag> and armv6
[11:58] <eroomde> wonder who it's for
[11:59] <Upu> Well at "£5" (I've not seen it at this price its £11 from Farnell) anyone really you can bring out all manner of bullshit marketing terms at this point
[11:59] <SpeedEvil> craag: there are some open-source devices with DSI'/CSI displays
[11:59] <Upu> "physical computing"
[11:59] <Upu> "internet of things"
[12:00] <SpeedEvil> Upu: you can buy it at 4 quid + postage of 2.50
[12:00] <SpeedEvil> (or >1 to kill the postage)
[12:00] <Upu> interesting
[12:00] <Upu> but yeah I can think of a few things where it will be handy
[12:00] <Upu> but yes USB to the damn header
[12:00] <eroomde> i wonder who it's for
[12:00] <craag> SpeedEvil: Yeah. broadcom too though.
[12:00] <Upu> nerds everywhere eroomde
[12:01] <Upu> or is that not your question
[12:01] <mattbrejza> for all those IoT applications.. http://blog.atmel.com/2015/11/25/8-bit-turkey-anyone/
[12:02] <eroomde> that probably is among the more useful of the things of the internet
[12:02] <dbrooke> how does the 'I' work with no built-in network? 8-)
[12:02] <Upu> well Lora addon board anyone ?
[12:02] <eroomde> well exactly
[12:02] <chris_99> haha mattbrejza
[12:02] <craag> PPP over serial :D
[12:02] <Upu> heh
[12:03] <mattbrejza> since when did buzzwords have to be used correctly?
[12:03] <eroomde> broadcom + lora
[12:03] <eroomde> next stop, the .Net gadgeteer
[12:03] <eroomde> in the high point of hab
[12:03] <craag> lol
[12:03] <SpeedEvil> https://www.kickstarter.com/projects/1598272670/chip-the-worlds-first-9-computer - also I got notification for today
[12:03] <SpeedEvil> saying 'real soon now'
[12:04] <SpeedEvil> https://www.kickstarter.com/projects/1598272670/chip-the-worlds-first-9-computer/posts/1425613
[12:04] <eroomde> he is my prediction, which will turn out to not be true like everything else that would be good but won't happen
[12:04] <eroomde> in 2017, everyone will say 'this is stupid' and the pendulum will swing back towards using microcontrollers more efficiently
[12:05] <SpeedEvil> yeah
[12:05] <Upu> well at the moment you use a Pi because of the camera
[12:05] <Upu> and for nothing else really
[12:05] <Upu> and this has no camera
[12:05] <SpeedEvil> In 5 years, lightbulbs will be running linux
[12:05] <Upu> so...
[12:05] <eroomde> and even then, ssdv was first done in ukhas on an 8-bit avr
[12:05] <Upu> SpeedEvil LIFX
[12:05] <Upu> they already are
[12:06] <Upu> I think
[12:06] <SpeedEvil> Upu: I mean the cheap ones
[12:06] <Upu> ah rgr
[12:06] <eroomde> can it talk top a touch screen?
[12:06] <mattbrejza> even the new entry level arduino is a dual core thing with something made by intel :/
[12:06] <Upu> err
[12:06] <Upu> no
[12:06] <Upu> only via USB ?
[12:06] <eroomde> cos i can see the idea behind a sort of pyQT->some i/o control panel
[12:06] <eroomde> maybe
[12:07] <Upu> there is an unsoldered header on the bottom
[12:07] <Upu> not sure what its for
[12:07] <dbrooke> it also lacks the built-in display connector
[12:07] <eroomde> tho i'd still probably go for knobs and switches, but i know i'm not in the mainstream there
[12:07] <dbrooke> so HDMI/USB would be needed for touch screen
[12:07] <SpeedEvil> dbrooke: Or DSI
[12:07] <Upu> it has HDMI
[12:07] <Upu> and USB
[12:08] <SpeedEvil> dbrooke: DSI is a _much_ better match for 2.5" displays or so
[12:08] <dbrooke> SpeedEvil: isn't that missing though?
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[12:08] <eroomde> i'd be quite excited if openBSD got ported to the pi, but i think it won't so long as there's closed blobs
[12:08] <SpeedEvil> Otherwise you need a HDMI-whatever interface
[12:08] <SpeedEvil> dbrooke: yes
[12:08] <eroomde> but i've had such a happy time with openBSD, and the pi is nice for embedding into stuff
[12:09] <Hix> greetings eroomde, long time no speak. What was the company you used for the rapid ENG PCBs in the UK?
[12:09] <mattbrejza> pcbpool
[12:09] <eroomde> (irish/german)
[12:09] <eroomde> what mattbrejza said
[12:09] <eroomde> and also, yo!
[12:09] <eroomde> so they're enig as standard, nice and fast, and come with a free lasercut stainless stencil
[12:09] <dbrooke> anyway, I use plenty of Pis but stripping down to this level seems to move it into territory where a microcontroller suits better
[12:09] <Hix> Cool thanks :)
[12:10] <eroomde> dbrooke: i agree
[12:10] <Upu> however dbrooke if you can get it for £5 its damn cheap
[12:10] <SpeedEvil> dbrooke: 170mA@5V idle
[12:10] <eroomde> i'll sell you my old pentium 3 for £5 iuw
[12:10] <dbrooke> Upu: yes, but still need a use. I'm sure there are plenty but not quite for me.
[12:10] <SpeedEvil> eroomde: And it will use that in power in 2 weeks
[12:11] <chris_99> heh
[12:11] <eroomde> more importantly everyone, there is a pretty hefty bug in raspbian, which you might want to patch
[12:11] <Upu> well I may sketch up a Lora board for it later
[12:11] <Upu> and put it out there
[12:11] <eroomde> it, by default, doesn't use a proper random number generator to make its ssh keys
[12:12] <eroomde> https://www.raspberrypi.org/forums/viewtopic.php?f=66&t=126892
[12:13] <chris_99> heh a binary patch
[12:14] <eroomde> rightly shouted at
[12:15] <Upu> well
[12:15] <Upu> given all my Pi's have the default username and password
[12:26] <dbrooke> some of my older ones do, latterly I've taken to installing a minimal OS image and then setting up a standard configuration using saltstack
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[12:37] <fsphil> an open source boot loader for the pi would be nice
[12:39] <fsphil> there is a broadcom person working on the gpu driver, not sure about the boot thing
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[12:50] Nick change: GargantuaSauce_ -> GargantuaSauce
[13:22] <Chimpusmaximus> Upu: would be interested in Lora board for it
[13:22] <fab4space> me too Upu :p
[13:25] <fsphil> the current one will probably work. three times bigger than it though :)
[13:25] <fsphil> just put an avr on there though. forget the pi
[13:26] <craag> or stm32
[13:26] <craag> or picaxe
[13:26] <fsphil> oh yes
[13:26] <fsphil> stm32 uart is very simple
[13:26] <fsphil> that's 50% of the payload done already
[13:26] <fsphil> if using ntx2* anyway
[13:26] <Upu> if any has the mechanical drawings for the Pi Zero I'd be interested
[13:26] <Chimpusmaximus> Yeah existing one i would think would work, just very large.
[13:26] <chris_99> i found a camera that seems to have code for the stm32
[13:27] <craag> chris_99: what interface?
[13:27] <chris_99> sec
[13:27] <chris_99> http://www.aliexpress.com/item/V2640-Camera-Module-2-Megapixel-UXGA-1622X1200-Camera-Board-JPEG-output-development-Board-Kit/32423672571.html?ws_ab_test=searchweb201556_7_71_72_73_74_75,searchweb201527_4,searchweb201560_9
[13:27] <craag> (btw my day job is cameras+jpeg+stm32)
[13:27] <chris_99> cool
[13:27] <fsphil> I've been using an ov camera with an stm32 recently
[13:27] <fsphil> super duper 160x120 images
[13:28] <craag> ov2640 isn't bad
[13:28] <craag> and works ok on the dcmi interface
[13:28] <fsphil> ov9655 is what i have, and it's fairly poor
[13:28] <chris_99> is there a better camera i could look at craag
[13:28] <chris_99> poor in what way?
[13:28] <fsphil> though all cameras would be fairly poor at 160x120
[13:28] <fsphil> it's not great in low light levels
[13:28] <chris_99> ah
[13:28] <craag> yeah ov2640 doesn't like low light either
[13:28] <fsphil> testing it indoors and it had trouble with normal lighting
[13:29] <craag> but it does have 800x600 res
[13:29] Nick change: yashi -> flutterbat
[13:29] <chris_99> it says 1622X1200 is that interpolated then
[13:29] <fsphil> the 9655 has 1280x960 I think
[13:29] <craag> and does come out with nice pics in daylight
[13:29] <fsphil> yeah low light levels is not a big issue for normal hab flights
[13:31] <craag> chris_99: ah no it is uxga native
[13:31] <craag> I jsut didn't have enough ram for more than 800x600 at the time ;)
[13:31] <chris_99> ah
[13:31] <fsphil> I'm not a fan of the OV's lack of documentation either
[13:31] <fsphil> random settings to obscure registers
[13:31] <craag> OV2640 is the last omnivision with available documentation
[13:31] <craag> and it got cloned
[13:32] <craag> so omnivision put everything behind nda after that
[13:32] <chris_99> ah
[13:32] <craag> even with nda... you get barely anything.
[13:32] <chris_99> heh, weird
[13:33] <fsphil> the doc I got for the 9655 just lists a lot of them as "reserved"
[13:33] <craag> We're using a newer one and haven't got access to any of what the registers actually do.
[13:33] <fsphil> which actually seem to be important
[13:33] <craag> just 'scripts' for certain modes, with long lists of 'reg','value'
[13:33] <fsphil> yeah
[13:33] <fsphil> no fun
[13:35] <craag> but yeah I'd recommend the ov2640+stm32 chris_99
[13:35] <craag> there's a fair bit of example code around too
[13:35] <mattbrejza> do you have an image from the ov?
[13:36] <fsphil> a lot of it is poor :)
[13:36] <craag> fsphil: naturally - but is something to start from
[13:36] <chris_99> craag, ta, yeah i found some code for the stm i think
[13:36] <fsphil> indeed
[13:37] <fsphil> I need to figure out how to use the USB port. get images to the computer a lot quicker than serial
[13:39] <chris_99> i believe libopencm3 now supports the stm32f429 with usb, i need to try that on my dev boards
[13:39] <fab4space> craag, chris_99, fsphil , I ordered a alcam oem : http://www.geeky-gadgets.com/alcam-oem-arduino-serial-camera-module-offers-time-lapse-and-stop-motion-05-12-2014/
[13:40] <fab4space> which is a stm32+ov3640
[13:40] <fab4space> but unfortunately the firmware is closed
[13:40] <Chimpusmaximus> Upu: all i can find https://usercontent.irccloud-cdn.com/file/APnV2vbZ/Screen%20Shot%202015-11-26%20at%2013.39.41.png
[13:40] <chris_99> ah yeah i think you mentioned this before, that would be a killer fab4space
[13:40] <fab4space> so all the hardware is ready with this board :)
[13:41] <Upu> ah perfect
[13:41] <Upu> where did that come from
[13:41] <fab4space> I just need to plug a lora or mtx2 chip on top of it and then we have a good tracker + ssdv hardware
[13:42] <Chimpusmaximus> grabbed from a youtube video on a 3d printed case, https://youtu.be/YxBamwc6s7U
[13:42] <fsphil> craag: does your camera do jpeg encoding?
[13:42] <fsphil> some of the OVs do
[13:42] <craag> fsphil: ov2640 does, the one I'm using now does not.
[13:42] <craag> msot of the newer ones don't
[13:42] <fsphil> though I believe the stm32f4*'s are fast enough to do it real time
[13:43] <craag> as interfaces are fast, and SoC's can do the encoding
[13:43] <mattbrejza> and hopefully fast enough to also write to sd card seeing as theyre lacking on ram
[13:43] <SpeedEvil> I have a sketch (in the non-arduino sense) of that
[13:43] <fsphil> by DMA'ing in to two 16-line long buffers
[13:43] <fsphil> encoding the first while the second fills
[13:44] <SpeedEvil> I took a parallel camera, and then connected a RAM such that I could simply stream from the camera into the RAM
[13:44] <craag> I haven't tried software encoding, but it did look possible.
[13:44] <SpeedEvil> Using a 'page' of RAM and auto-increment, so on every clock, the camera wrote to the RAM.
[13:44] <SpeedEvil> At teh end of a line, I simply flipped to the next line.
[13:45] <SpeedEvil> This required very little real-time CPU. Then do JPEG at leisure, and write to SD
[13:45] <SpeedEvil> this was as you'd normally otherwise be required to encode the JPEG in ~1/30th sec
[13:45] <fsphil> I'm not familiar enough with the STM's DMA stuff yet
[13:46] <SpeedEvil> No DMA at all, pure bit-banging
[13:46] <SpeedEvil> The camera data pins connected to the RAM
[13:47] <fsphil> wouldn't it be easier to just use dma?
[13:47] <SpeedEvil> That would need lots more pins.
[13:47] <SpeedEvil> I was using (IIRC) a 36 QFN
[13:47] <fsphil> ah
[13:48] <SpeedEvil> With all pins doing double or more duty
[13:48] <fsphil> sounds horrible :)
[13:48] <SpeedEvil> Or beautiful.
[13:48] <fsphil> hah
[13:48] <eroomde> you can get openbsd on beaglebone black
[13:48] <eroomde> i didn't know that
[13:48] <fsphil> oh there's an arm port?
[13:49] <eroomde> yes
[13:49] <eroomde> http://www.openbsd.org/armv7.html
[13:50] <fsphil> nice. a little arm board with 4 ethernet ports and openbsd would be really handy
[13:52] <eroomde> yes
[13:52] <fsphil> my soekris needs replacing eventually
[13:55] <RealBorg> cool, I found a uk guy in my countries ATC
[13:55] <eroomde> air traffic control?
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[14:01] <Laurenceb> hmm cameras
[14:02] <Laurenceb> so am I still best using a GoPro if I want 240fps VGA?
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[14:07] <SpeedEvil> 10 keychain cameras.
[14:07] <adamgreig> haha
[14:07] <SpeedEvil> Turned on and allowed to drift
[14:15] <eroomde> I've just read a paper by someone with the best name ever
[14:15] <eroomde> Prof. Lancelot Hogben FRS
[14:16] Lemml (andreas@p4FEEAB39.dip0.t-ipconnect.de) joined #highaltitude.
[14:19] <SpeedEvil> :)
[14:26] <fsphil> from Hogwarts
[14:29] Ben_ (86972e4c@gateway/web/freenode/ip.134.151.46.76) joined #highaltitude.
[14:29] <Ben_> anyone around?
[14:30] <number10> yep
[14:30] <Ben_> got a couple of questions about the requirements needed to get permission for flight
[14:31] <number10> ok
[14:31] <Ben_> is a paracute 100% required?
[14:31] <number10> I think there is a fair bit on the wiki
[14:32] <Ben_> i admit that sounds like a stupid question
[14:32] <Upu> yes Ben_
[14:32] <Upu> Most NOTAMS indicate "equipment to decent by parachute"
[14:32] <Ben_> A group at my uni were thinking about trying to glide the payload down
[14:32] <Ben_> right
[14:32] <Upu> UK ?
[14:32] <Ben_> ye
[14:32] <Upu> how heavy is your payload ?
[14:32] <Ben_> no more than 3kg
[14:32] <Ben_> ideally
[14:33] <Upu> should have emptied my mouth before typing that
[14:33] <number10> thats heavy
[14:33] <Upu> so 3kg and you are asking if you should use a parachute ?
[14:33] <Ben_> <3kg is pretty easy for a glider model
[14:34] <Upu> Generally we advise keeping it below 1kg
[14:34] <Ben_> I mean, the fuselage isn't heavy
[14:34] <Ben_> its polystyrene
[14:34] <Upu> 3kg is heavy and can be a handful at launch
[14:34] <Ben_> assuming we stick to 1kg
[14:34] <daveake> you'd need to apwak to the CAA in any case
[14:34] <eroomde> Ben_: dona parachute first
[14:34] <Upu> you need a parachute whatever you launch I guess
[14:34] <eroomde> then if you want a glider, talk to the CAA about getting an exemption
[14:35] <Ben_> right
[14:35] <eroomde> you won't be able to *just* launch a glider legally with the law as it stands
[14:35] <Ben_> I know you can apply for permissions based on a UAS provided the craft is under 10kg
[14:35] <Ben_> i'm expecting a lot of hoops to jump through if they'll let us at all
[14:36] <Ben_> something we could consider would be parachute descent to ~1km and glide down after that
[14:36] <Ben_> we wanted to demonstrate landing site selection
[14:38] <eroomde> sure, it's all technically possible and to be encouraged, just so long as you get all the paperwork ducks in a row as you realise
[14:38] <Upu> http://imgur.com/XcGdKNn
[14:38] <Upu> not the most complex board
[14:39] <Ben_> yeah honestly I'm expecting the paperwork to be the most difficult bit ._.
[14:39] <Ben_> I'll see if I can find a contact at the CAA and get some advice from them
[14:40] <Chimpusmaximus> Upu: you say that but would have taken me days or weeks, something i must master next year
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[14:40] <eroomde> so are you going to fly zeros Upu?
[14:40] <Upu> I'll tidy it up
[14:40] Action: Upu shrugs
[14:40] <Upu> no camera :)
[14:41] <eroomde> has someone got a bbc microbit yet primed and ready for all the blog whoring?
[14:41] <Upu> haha
[14:41] <daveake> Yes I mentioned this when I saw a prototype in August :/
[14:41] <Ben_> what do you guys tend to use in terms of thermal regulation? We were looking at those electronic handwarmer things, not sure how suitable they are in terms of power draw
[14:41] <eroomde> Ben_: nothing
[14:41] <eroomde> it's normally unecessary
[14:41] <mattbrejza> tbh just fly a green board which is the same shape then when its realised photoshop on the microbit and you are the blog winner
[14:41] <daveake> There might be a zero with camera pins brought out, sometime
[14:42] <mattbrejza> *released
[14:42] <daveake> hah
[14:42] <Chimpusmaximus> Lots of hot cameras
[14:42] <Ben_> huh, i'd've thought the temperature would screw with your batteries
[14:42] <eroomde> Ben_: if using servos, you might want to consider the grease in the gearbox
[14:42] <Upu> use the right batteries
[14:42] <Upu> L92 lithiums
[14:42] <eroomde> Ben_: not for the chemistry we normally use (lithium primary cells from energizer)
[14:42] <eroomde> it's fine
[14:42] <Ben_> yeah we were going to clear otu the grease and use metal gears over the nylon ones
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[14:42] <Upu> Sorry L92 http://data.energizer.com/PDFs/l91.pdf
[14:42] <eroomde> i'd put *some* grease in just incase
[14:42] <eroomde> but just low temperature stuff
[14:42] <eroomde> L91 Upu
[14:43] <Ben_> ye
[14:43] <Chimpusmaximus> My servo seems to have had issues on last flight but was last minute addition.
[14:43] <Upu> and you can have the opposite issue, no air to so stuff gets hot
[14:43] <Upu> yeah my typing
[14:43] <Ben_> worth wrapping the electronics in anything or are they generalyl fine just in the fuselage then?
[14:43] <eroomde> they'll likely be fine in the fuselage
[14:43] <eroomde> especially if it's made of something insulative like polystyrene
[14:43] <michal_f> this new PI has lower power consumption ?
[14:44] <Upu> not sure michal_f
[14:44] <daveake> no, same as A+
[14:44] <Upu> same as a A+ possibly
[14:44] <Ben_> 80-160mA
[14:44] <michal_f> thanks
[14:44] <Ben_> not sure how that compares to the A+
[14:44] <Ben_> i know its half what the 2 draws
[14:45] <daveake> https://pbs.twimg.com/media/CUuhVvlXAAARZ3S.jpg:large
[14:45] <Ben_> ok well i can scratch thermal stuff off my list at least
[14:46] <mattbrejza> theyre beginning to rivial the arduino for number of different varients
[14:46] <eroomde> Ben_: i suspect the trick to making this work will be to scratch off as much as is practically possible that adds faff and complexity
[14:46] <eroomde> i'd get a PCB built up SAP - with representative sensors and datalogging, and radio, and fly it a couple of times
[14:46] <Laurenceb> glider guidance on the other hand...
[14:46] <Ben_> Yep. We're looking at using as much CotS stuff as we can (PitS, Ardupilot) as they can be tested individually beforehand and it's not difficult to test as a whole before the flight
[14:47] <Ben_> glider guidance is the easy part in my experience
[14:47] <eroomde> i wouldn't do it like that
[14:47] <Laurenceb> I dunno how well that would handle it
[14:47] <Ben_> done it with quadrotors
[14:47] <Laurenceb> you can hit bands of really bad turbulence
[14:47] <eroomde> what foil section are you going for? do you plan to fly the whole way down?
[14:47] <Laurenceb> small stuff picks up more of the turbulence too
[14:47] <Ben_> We're either looking at full glider descent or chute to 0.5-2km and glide after that
[14:48] <Ben_> i imagine the turbulance is worse in the winter
[14:48] <eroomde> the latter is probably a great deal easier but the former would be much more useful
[14:48] <Ben_> we need to hit a balance - CAA permission is an issue the more of the profile we glide
[14:48] <Laurenceb> this is a conventional glider?
[14:48] <Laurenceb> i.e. fixed wing?
[14:48] <Ben_> let me find an example picture, 2s
[14:49] <eroomde> CAA permission + range of reynolds number you require it to work in
[14:49] <Ben_> current design is not unalike this: http://hobbyking.com/hobbyking/store/__82600__HobbyKing_8482_SkyRay_Flying_Wing_FPV_Model_1213mm_EPO_PNP_.html
[14:49] <Ben_> but that is absolutely subejct to change
[14:50] <eroomde> so that's pretty squarely aimed at low altitude flight
[14:50] <Laurenceb> I guess it could glide quite a long way from 2km
[14:50] <Laurenceb> but you'd struggle to do return to launch site
[14:50] <Ben_> honestly I don't know how well the flight profiles of this sort of thing changes at high alt. Might even consider powered flight after 2km
[14:51] <Ben_> we aren't aiming for return to launch site, merely landing zone selection
[14:51] <Ben_> ie avoid someone's back garden
[14:51] <Upu> UAV
[14:51] <Upu> technically not permitted again
[14:51] <Ben_> yeah there's a lot of hoops for that too
[14:51] <Ben_> under 10kg you can do it afaik though
[14:51] <Ben_> with permission ofc
[14:51] <Ben_> any mor eand you need to straight up register it
[14:52] <Ben_> I believe it counts as a UAV whether or not its powered though
[14:53] <eroomde> for flights in less dense atmospheres there's a few things you can about really - one if the aerofoil as discussed, but there are other things like the rudder/elevator size (or fuselage length) wanting to increase with the square root of the reduction in density
[14:53] <eroomde> for a given stability margin
[14:53] <eroomde> more simply, a given low-level airframe will because a lot twitchier at high altitudes
[14:54] <Ben_> right. want to hit a balance between altitude stability and simplicity of the airframe - none of our team are aerospace students
[14:54] <eroomde> i'd throw in some dihedral if i was building one too just to give a bit more static margin
[14:54] <eroomde> hah welcome to my world
[14:54] <eroomde> i see value in what you've described - buy a foamy cheap frame and put an ardupilot in and see what happens, then iterate
[14:54] <eroomde> what students are you?
[14:55] <Ben_> mostly electronics/comp sci with a couple of mech
[14:55] <eroomde> if you're doing COTS electronics and COTS airframe, where do you do the engineering bit?
[14:55] <Ben_> i'm electronic eng and comp sci myself
[14:56] <Ben_> the airframe won't be entirely CotS, we'll probably end up building our own fuselage and attaching wings as we go, we'd have to modify the ardupilot to enable our landing zone algorithms and we intend to write our own tracking software
[14:57] <eroomde> tracking software for a ground station?
[14:57] <Ben_> mhm
[14:57] <Ben_> were looking into transmitting chosen LZ to the craft or having the craft choose from a predefined selection along the general area of the flight path
[14:58] <Ben_> ofc this changes if we only fly below 2km
[14:58] <Ben_> but yes - iterating on systems we can test individually is very much theaim
[14:58] <Ben_> but yes - iterating on systems we can test individually is very much the aim
[14:58] <eroomde> cool
[14:58] <eroomde> well, good luck
[14:59] <Ben_> thanks
[14:59] <eroomde> i'm not that familiar with the ardupilot, but i imagine you'd want the facility to log all your accels, gyro, GPS and pressure info at a fairly high rate
[14:59] <eroomde> which will really help with ground sim and tuning the controller
[14:59] <Ben_> we seem to have got some attention from the IET so might be able to get them to giv eus some funding
[14:59] <Laurenceb> this sounds like a lot of trouble
[14:59] <Ben_> yeah, i think ardupilot offers something simiilar
[14:59] <Laurenceb> I tried a rogallo wing a few years ago
[14:59] <Ben_> i've logged telemetry from flights before
[14:59] <eroomde> given the simplicity of the electronics hardware requirement, i'd seriously consider a DIY pcb
[15:00] <Laurenceb> went with simple custom hardware
[15:00] <eroomde> Laurenceb: no it doesn't
[15:00] <Laurenceb> C of G shift
[15:00] <eroomde> there's nothing inherently unsound about a fixed wing
[15:00] <Laurenceb> I meant ardupilot
[15:00] <Ben_> why would your CoG shift?
[15:00] <Laurenceb> have you seen the ardupilot codebase....
[15:00] <eroomde> ah yes
[15:00] <Ben_> there are other alternatives to ardupilot
[15:00] <eroomde> i sort of agree with that
[15:00] <Laurenceb> Ben_: easiest way to steer a rogallo
[15:01] <Ben_> i've used crius before now which worked well
[15:01] <eroomde> a few PID loops are not hard to implement, i wonder why all the ardupilot fuss
[15:01] <Laurenceb> https://ukhas.org.uk/_media/projects:ukhas_glider_project:pict7924.jpg?w=750&tok=e9b4e0
[15:01] <eroomde> well, i can see why if you want to fly planes and don't know any electronics or somftware
[15:01] <Laurenceb> or something along those lines
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[15:01] <Ben_> i mean,i have 15 yrs experience in RC models and more recentnly autopilots
[15:01] <eroomde> Ben_: I think Laurenceb was refering to shifting the CoG to steer the rogallo
[15:01] <Laurenceb> there are probably infinite little tweaked rogallo design variants
[15:01] <Ben_> so i'm going with what i know
[15:02] <Ben_> ah, hadn't realised that was how you steered it
[15:02] <Ben_> did that workwell or
[15:02] <Laurenceb> worked perfect in ground tests
[15:02] <eroomde> however, the CoG and CoP will move around with density/altitude if you fly all the way back from up high
[15:02] <eroomde> which might upset things without some planning
[15:02] <Ben_> mm
[15:03] <Laurenceb> that design in the photo didnt, you can't stick a motor on like that
[15:03] <eroomde> unless you have a lot of static margin in your control/airframe, i think something relatively primitive like the ardupilot might struggle
[15:03] <Laurenceb> eroomde: CoP seemed very stable in descent from 12km
[15:03] <eroomde> but i can't back that up quantitatively, so take it for what it's worth (a hunch)
[15:03] <Laurenceb> there was no significant shift in trim
[15:03] <Ben_> i mean if we only glide down from a managable altitude then we don't mind, it's more a proof of concept
[15:03] <Laurenceb> or glide ratio, it was around 4 the whole way
[15:04] <Ben_> want to demonstrate controlled recovery at a defined location
[15:04] <Ben_> I agree random turbulance at high alt could mess wiht it
[15:05] <Laurenceb> it messed with my rogallo a lot
[15:05] <Laurenceb> it was flipped upside down multiple times and shunted sideways
[15:05] <Laurenceb> it saw every crazy attitude changer you could think of
[15:05] <Ben_> I mean provided the pilot could restabilise it wouldn't be that much of an issue for us
[15:06] <Ben_> testing woul dbe required to see what its recovery is like
[15:06] <Laurenceb> I'd worry that ardupilot would give up the ghost
[15:06] <daveake> No, it's been done
[15:06] <Ben_> in my experience its been pretty reliable given semidecent gps
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[15:06] <Ben_> i don't know what expereince you have wiith it
[15:07] <Ben_> or similar
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[15:07] <daveake> Andrew Tridgell sould be the person to ask about Ardupilot at high alt
[15:07] <daveake> w
[15:07] <Laurenceb> yeah but if you hit a band of heavy turbulence with fixed wing
[15:07] <Ben_> I'll make a note of his name
[15:07] <Laurenceb> its not trivial to recover from
[15:08] <eroomde> samba?
[15:08] <Laurenceb> he managed with ardupilot yeah, but might have been lucky
[15:08] <daveake> same
[15:08] <Ben_> I'll do some research into the altitudes you can expect the large turbulance/jetstreams
[15:08] <Ben_> may tune the descent profile / launch date to avoid the most of it
[15:09] <eroomde> Ben_: 10-15km depending on time of year
[15:09] <eroomde> there's your research done :)
[15:09] <Ben_> switching to a glide profile between 7 and 2 km would be relatively risk-free then
[15:09] <Ben_> i say relatively..
[15:09] <eroomde> well, jetstream anyway. turbulance generally could be anywhere
[15:09] <Ben_> granted but its at certian altitudes you realyl get wrecked by it
[15:10] <Laurenceb> i saw some at ~4.5km
[15:10] <Ben_> provided still conditions near ground level its generally alright higher up iirc
[15:10] <Laurenceb> not always :P
[15:10] <Ben_> granted
[15:10] <eroomde> i am pretty convinced that with a well designed (stable) airframe you could just rudder-inly control it back in
[15:10] <eroomde> only*
[15:10] <Ben_> i'd want to experiment with whichever pilot we run with and see hwo it reacts beore we launch proper anyway
[15:11] <Ben_> maybe, not flying-wing profile then?
[15:12] <Laurenceb> I'd agree with eroomde
[15:12] <Laurenceb> but my aero skillz werent up to it, so I went with rogallo
[15:12] <Ben_> my recent experience is entireily with multirotors :/ we ruled out replacing a parachute with a deployable quad
[15:12] <Laurenceb> that was stable and always recovered from turbulence, so it proves the concept in principle
[15:12] <Ben_> though that woul dmake an interesting project
[15:13] <Laurenceb> I tried with a RTF glider before that, and it went into an unstable tumble/spiral after hitting turbulence
[15:14] <Ben_> yeah. will go to the coast/peak district with it and see hwo it handles varying wind conditions before committing ot a certain profile
[15:14] <Ben_> the lower we get the more it'll be able to deal with it id've thought
[15:14] <eroomde> Ben_: no, not flying wing
[15:14] <eroomde> they're actually just making life harder for yourself
[15:15] <eroomde> they're manouverable and fun to fly, but about the least stable way of making an aeroplane
[15:16] <Laurenceb> I went with rogallo as its documented and known to have good stability when trimmed correctly
[15:16] <Laurenceb> but it was still a load of work to get something I was happy with, about 10 prototypes
[15:16] <Ben_> right. was looking at flying wing originally as it's probably the easiest to build quickly
[15:17] <eroomde> but if you're buying OTS it makes no diff anyway
[15:17] <Ben_> in terms of price/complexity/safety it does
[15:17] <Ben_> won't be getting airframe entirely ots
[15:19] <Ben_> i don't know how comfortable we'd be flying a fairly large chunk of wood or something
[15:19] <Ben_> and polystyrene gives way to strength
[15:19] <eroomde> i don't understand what you're saying
[15:20] <Ben_> which bit
[15:20] <eroomde> why does flying wood come into it
[15:20] <Laurenceb> my powered rogallo in the photo was a complete failure btw, so dont try it
[15:20] <eroomde> and when does polystyrene give way to strength - at a roundabout if strength is approaching from the right?
[15:20] <Ben_> a flying wing is pretty easy to build out of polystyrene, but a regular glider is made out of wood, as polystyrene ain't strong enough for those wing shapes
[15:20] <Laurenceb> you need to mount the wing on a joint if you have a motor and prop, or CoP/CoG alignment is screwed up
[15:20] <Laurenceb> http://1.bp.blogspot.com/_bCr9ad8EFic/S2rNmgHOhYI/AAAAAAAABuw/3SqW3qj6N7k/s400/rogallo_11_cr_small.jpg
[15:21] <eroomde> (what i'm facetiously saying is please be accurate with your engineering language, as it makes everything much easier)
[15:22] <eroomde> surely a flying wing, for a given L/D and so on, has the same wing loading as a glider?
[15:22] <eroomde> it's just a question of how you choose to arrange the control surfaces
[15:22] <eroomde> there's nothing inherent in it
[15:22] <Ben_> most gliders i've seen have very thin and long wing profiles
[15:23] <eroomde> sure but they're shooting for extremely large glide ratios and very low drag
[15:23] <Laurenceb> also the rogallo in that photo is wrong
[15:23] <Ben_> reiterating that i'm not an expert in this but emulating 99% of glider models i've looked at seems difficult wiht polystyrene
[15:23] <eroomde> that's not an inherent property of 'glider' that's just hobby markets
[15:23] <Laurenceb> you need ~115 degree apex andgle and tighter fabric
[15:23] <Laurenceb> I'll shut up about rogallos now
[15:23] <eroomde> if you're comparing like-with-like specifications generated by some mission profile requirement, that doesn't really come into it
[15:24] <Laurenceb> I do wonder about a rogallo style design with a rigid aerofoil on top
[15:24] <eroomde> what i'm saying is, if you have some given spec like a 1kg thing with a 4:1 glide ratio and 20mph sea level airspeed, that materials choices are similar for both
[15:24] <eroomde> brb
[15:24] <Ben_> right
[15:25] <Ben_> i will definitely do extensive research into the stability of these
[15:25] <Ben_> my loft at home is full of old models at aboutu the right scale so I might bust them out
[15:25] <Laurenceb> well if you need 4:1 glide and 20mph sea level airspeed, rogallo is for you
[15:25] <Ben_> how much of a pain in the ass is writing an autopilot fo rone of those?
[15:26] <Laurenceb> I dont know
[15:27] <Laurenceb> maybe they have de-spaghettied their code
[15:27] <Laurenceb> last time I looked I gave up
[15:27] <Laurenceb> but that was a couple of years ago
[15:27] <Ben_> fair
[15:27] <Ben_> I mean i've got a proven flying wing on ardupilot right now
[15:27] <Ben_> which was why we were sticking to what we knew
[15:28] <Ben_> not at 12km up, granted
[15:28] <Ben_> but it will do circles around my fielid
[15:29] <Ben_> the thinking was we come up with logic to define the flight profile through the RPi and all we need to do is point the autopilot at our LZ
[15:29] <Ben_> the latter is really not that difficult
[15:30] <Laurenceb> prob worth launching it then
[15:30] <Laurenceb> just to see what happens
[15:30] <Ben_> yeah
[15:31] <Ben_> I mean we can test the landing algorithms without a balloon launch
[15:31] <Ben_> we've got a little module we can slot on the back with a small brushless motor on
[15:31] <Ben_> the thing goes like the clappers
[15:34] <Ben_> I'm going ot double check the CAA guidelines and see if our classification actually changes if we put a motor on it
[15:35] <Ben_> the thing should be able to deal with more wind if it has power
[15:36] <eroomde> sorry, had to go an watch a rocket engine firing
[15:37] <Ben_> ..
[15:37] <Ben_> fair
[15:37] <Upu> tough life :)
[15:37] <eroomde> Ben_: that's probably a good idea
[15:38] <eroomde> powered flight to some altitude in a field (in line of sight and whatever else) and then see if it can glide itself back accurately
[15:38] <Ben_> that's the plan
[15:38] <Ben_> idea is if it can handle itself in LOS distances then there shouldn't be a huge amount to worry about on descent
[15:38] <Ben_> depending on descent profile anyway
[15:42] <Ben_> i just found out the price of a helium tank
[15:42] <Ben_> ouch
[15:42] <Ben_> forgot it was silly money atm
[15:42] <eroomde> how much for how much?
[15:42] <eroomde> also you can use hydrogen
[15:43] <Ben_> ~£110 for 3.5m^3 i'm looking at rn
[15:43] <Ben_> not sure on pricing for hydrogen
[15:43] <eroomde> rn?
[15:43] <Ben_> right now
[15:43] <Ben_> sorry
[15:43] <eroomde> that's pricey
[15:44] <eroomde> about 2x what i would have thought
[15:44] <daveake> £115 will get you 5.4 m^3 http://www.click4balloons.co.uk/helium-canister-hire-uk-local-collection-871-c.asp
[15:45] <eroomde> Ben_: you mentioned this is a uni project?
[15:45] <Ben_> this is a uni project ye
[15:45] <eroomde> find the Uni gas person
[15:45] <eroomde> BOC gave us He for free all through uni
[15:45] <Chimpusmaximus> http://balloonhelium.co.uk/main/pricing is similar price to Daves
[15:45] <eroomde> for our balloon projects
[15:46] <eroomde> they had someone embedded in the engineering department
[15:46] <Ben_> might be worth enquiring
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[15:46] <eroomde> they also supplied regulators and so on
[15:46] <Ben_> we're at a relatively small uni so I'm not gonna hold my breath
[15:46] <eroomde> where are you, geographically?
[15:46] <Ben_> I'm at Aston
[15:47] <Ben_> so middle of Birmingham
[15:47] <eroomde> ah
[15:47] <eroomde> presume you can find a launch site a bit further out :)
[15:47] <Ben_> yeah we'll find somewhere
[15:49] <eroomde> away from birmingham airport and halfpenny green airfield
[15:49] <Ben_> i'tll be nowhere near the surrounding area yeah
[15:49] <Laurenceb> heh
[15:49] <eroomde> the latter of which once amusingly decided to go upmarket and call itself Wolverhampton Business Airfield, and would agressively correct any pilot who radiod to halfpenny green
[15:49] <eroomde> but thankfully they gave up with that silliness
[15:49] <Ben_> xD i used to go there every few weeks
[15:49] <Ben_> backwhen i was young
[15:50] <Ben_> just to go watch what was going on
[15:51] <Ben_> anywho i'm gonna go brave my commute out of brum then I'm back to looking for placements so...
[15:51] <Ben_> thank you for the advice, it's bene helpful
[15:52] <eroomde> np, good luck with the caa stuff
[15:52] <eroomde> you'll be the first to properly tackle it in ukhas that i know of
[15:53] <eroomde> so will be interesting
[15:53] <Ben_> maybe
[15:53] <Ben_> looking at a career in automated flight systms to it should be worth it
[15:53] <Ben_> a'ight, probably talk soon
[15:53] <eroomde> ttfn
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[16:55] <adamgreig> hey Upu/daveake, what connector is on the pits boards?
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[17:02] <daveake> gpio? power?
[17:02] <daveake> (not that I know either way! Upu does the physicval bits)
[17:03] <adamgreig> the gpio one i think
[17:03] <adamgreig> the one with loads of contacts that does weird stacking :P
[17:03] <daveake> yeah gpio
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[17:55] <Upu> adamgreig its a Samtec part, I'll dig details out later
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[19:12] <SM0ULC-Reb> Really cool with the rasp zero :)
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[19:27] <adamgreig> Upu: found it, Samtec SSW-120-01-T-D
[19:27] <Upu> uh sorry
[19:27] <adamgreig> dug it out of the github repo for pits in the end
[19:27] <Upu> forgot
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[19:27] <Upu> lol sorry
[19:27] <adamgreig> no worries, wasn't waiting or anything, just a bit curious
[19:28] <adamgreig> suddenly remembered pits was open source and it was probably in the github somewhere, grepped for samtec :P
[19:28] <Upu> REF-182665-01 2x20 pos. with PCB alignment peg option
[19:28] <Upu> REF-182683-02 2x20 SIF 4.93mm length PCB tails
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[19:28] <Upu> Toby.co.uk order codes
[19:28] <Guest32318> http://imgur.com/gallery/RUd7wPp - photography on point.
[19:28] <adamgreig> so you solder them through-hole on the bottom and the pins are just long enough to stack?
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[19:29] <Upu> no they solder on the top
[19:29] <Upu> they are a bit odd as the holes in the PCB aren't plated
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[19:29] <Upu> reflow well though
[19:29] <adamgreig> oh huh
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[19:29] <adamgreig> maybe they are not SSW-120-01-T-D then
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[19:29] <adamgreig> i'll check the toby codes
[19:29] <Upu> stick those parts in Toby
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[19:31] <adamgreig> are they surface mount in any sense? do you just stick paste on the pads and they solder onto the legs going through the holes?
[19:31] <Upu> they are surface mount
[19:31] <Upu> I just use the alignment peg version as it makes stick the headers on easier
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[19:32] <Upu> hard to describe really
[19:32] <Upu> and I don't have a pits here to take pics
[19:32] <adamgreig> oh i got them
[19:32] <adamgreig> the -683 one is quite different and i was looking at that
[19:32] <adamgreig> the -665 is more clearly surface mount
[19:32] <adamgreig> cheers
[19:33] <Upu> nps
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[19:36] <Ben-AstroSoc> https://www.caa.co.uk/application.aspx?catid=33&pagetype=65&appid=11&mode=form&id=4409 is this the CAA's balloon permission form or am I barking up the wrong tree? Can't find a whole lot of info regarding unmanned balloons
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[19:37] <daveake> See that word "captive"
[19:37] <daveake> Is yours captive?
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[19:38] <Ben-AstroSoc> ie tethered?
[19:38] <daveake> Correct form is linked to on this page: https://ukhas.org.uk/guides:faq
[19:38] <daveake> captive = tethered
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[19:38] <Ben-AstroSoc> cheers
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[19:41] <Ben-AstroSoc> I'm going to email the CAA once the design/descent profile is more concrete I think
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[19:53] <SpacenearUS> New position from 03F4HHV after 034 days silence - 12http://tracker.habhub.org/#!qm=All&q=F4HHV
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[19:55] <mclane_> I just saw the new Pi zero
[19:55] <mclane_> cool but no cam interface:-((
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[19:56] <fsphil> aye
[19:57] <fsphil> bit of a flaw
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[19:57] <mclane_> nevertheless, I will buy one once available here
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[19:58] <daveake> There may or may not be a future Pi zero with cam interface
[19:58] <daveake> Unlike the other Pi models they don't guarantee to keep the interfaces the same when the revise the board
[19:59] <mclane_> dave, can you lobby for a cam interface??
[19:59] <daveake> I did that in August when I had a pre-production model in my hand :/
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[20:00] <Lunar_Lander> hello
[20:00] <Lunar_Lander> what in the world happened?
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[20:00] <fsphil> and that ever absent second uart :)
[20:00] <daveake> Yeah I've done that a few times
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[20:01] <mclane_> would be great to have a pi zero with cam interface for our 100g balloon experiments
[20:01] <fsphil> picopi
[20:01] <mclane_> (still no regulations available in Germany for normal weather balloons)
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[20:02] <mclane_> would be happy to create a tracker board for such a configuration
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[20:05] <mclane_> otherwise I have to continue with my current design: tracker with stm32 + dorji 1278 + bosch BME280 + linksprite jpg cam
[20:06] <mclane_> target weight 30 g
[20:06] <Lunar_Lander> yea
[20:06] <Lunar_Lander> pi zero + cam = pi 0.5
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[20:43] <Upu> http://imgur.com/pZcS2jr / http://imgur.com/1YB3HcN it fits but probably not going to make it
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[20:43] <Upu> and yes I know I've not via stiched it
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[20:57] <habby> UPU: Earlier, someone was talking about the correct CAA permissions form. Is the captive form the wrong one for sending to Near Space?
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[20:58] <Upu> it is the wrong one
[20:58] <habby> Wigan have a Captive approval...!?
[20:58] <Upu> [19:38] <daveake> Correct form is linked to on this page: https://ukhas.org.uk/guides:faq
[20:58] <Upu> oh dear
[20:58] <Upu> habby = pete ?
[20:59] <habby> Yup that's what I saw when I looked just now...
[20:59] <habby> yes, me.
[20:59] <Upu> stop changing your name :)
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[20:59] <Upu> http://www.hindleys.com/
[20:59] <habby> Will do!
[21:00] <daveake> Quite a few people have not understood the word "captive"
[21:00] <Upu> http://www.hindleys.com/index.php/materials/plastics-foam/sheet/styrofoam-high-density-polystyrene-foam.html
[21:00] <Upu> http://www.barenco.co.uk/ for the connectors
[21:00] <Upu> http://www.hamradio.co.uk/ for the coax
[21:00] <daveake> For thinner sheet try http://modelshop.co.uk/
[21:01] <Upu> captive probably explains why it was so generous :)
[21:01] <habby> Antenna for the car?
[21:02] <habby> I wonder is they know!!? And I wonder if I should tell them!?
[21:02] <habby> *if
[21:02] <Upu> I would tell them
[21:02] <Upu> http://www.hamradio.co.uk/aerials-antenna-manufacturers-diamond-antennas/diamond/diamond-mr-77-pd-2566.php
[21:02] <Upu> the S version
[21:02] <daveake> If they think it's captive then you won't have the correct permission
[21:02] <Upu> http://airspy.com/ for the base radio
[21:02] <daveake> which means no fly
[21:03] <Upu> You can get the Airspy's from pjm here http://airspy.co.uk/
[21:03] <Upu> right now I've spent all your money I'm going to drink your wine cheers :)
[21:04] <habby> daveake: not me, it's a colleague in Wigan who has sent me his CAA exemption/permission and application
[21:04] <Lunar_Lander> eurowine xD
[21:04] <habby> Do you think I could post it on here for people to check? Or is that a no-no?
[21:04] <Upu> err no it has personal info on it
[21:04] <Upu> scan it and mail it to me ?
[21:04] <habby> UPU: That one meets my 3 rules for wine:
[21:04] <habby> 1) Red
[21:04] <habby> 2) At least 14%
[21:05] <habby> 3) From South America (cos what they don;t know about narcotics aint worth knowing!)
[21:05] <Upu> don't get eroomde going on wine :)
[21:05] <Upu> This is Chilean :)
[21:06] <Lunar_Lander> I got wine to run LTspiceIV
[21:06] <Upu> no Lunar_Lander wrong wine :)
[21:06] <habby> UPU: Therefore meets rule 3 ;)
[21:06] <Lunar_Lander> xD
[21:06] <Upu> Oh derp yes
[21:06] <Upu> I failed Geography
[21:07] <Upu> I read that as South African
[21:07] <Lunar_Lander> please consider briefly this HF PCB http://gerblook.org/pcb/42VCRsoXZioEp4nSZ3LVhP
[21:07] <Lunar_Lander> :D
[21:07] <Lunar_Lander> (not a final version)
[21:07] <Upu> I suspect
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[21:07] <Upu> you won't be able top screw an antenna on with the SMA in that cut out
[21:08] <Lunar_Lander> yea
[21:08] <Lunar_Lander> I thought of one of those sideways connectors like you also have on the shop
[21:08] <habby> UPU: You have mail
[21:08] <Upu> change the polygon on under the GPS uncheck thermals
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[21:09] <Lunar_Lander> OK
[21:09] <Upu> and the GPS is in an odd position
[21:09] <Upu> antenna
[21:09] <Lunar_Lander> craag already said the chip antenna is not good
[21:09] <Lunar_Lander> yea
[21:09] <Upu> it may work
[21:09] <Lunar_Lander> he suggested an external antenna
[21:09] <Upu> but probably won't
[21:09] <Lunar_Lander> yea
[21:10] <Upu> that looks like a correct NOTAM
[21:10] <Lunar_Lander> do you just need a SMA connector on the board to be able to use an external antenna or does it need accessoires?
[21:10] <Upu> though the original application is the wrong one
[21:11] <habby> That would explain why they ignored it for so long, maybe!?
[21:11] <Upu> I suspect when they have filled in the captive bit and put max height as 90000 feet CAA twigged it wasn't very captive
[21:11] <Upu> daveake you got mail
[21:11] <Upu> have a look but yeah I think the NOTAM is correecty
[21:11] <Upu> correct
[21:12] <Upu> brb dog looks like it needs a pee
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[21:13] <daveake> yeah that looks fine
[21:13] <daveake> Different to usual as it has no flight date, but instead the 72-hour thing
[21:14] <daveake> I've heard of others using the captive form for HAB and still getting the right permission; obviously depends on the application email/letter stating it's actually a HAB
[21:15] <daveake> or, as you say, putting "90,000 feet" as the height should do it :)
[21:16] <Lunar_Lander> jm
[21:16] <Lunar_Lander> 90000 ft
[21:16] <Lunar_Lander> hm
[21:16] <Lunar_Lander> bot gone
[21:17] <craag> :(
[21:17] <Lunar_Lander> hi craag
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[21:18] <Upu> yay
[21:18] <Upu> 90000 feet
[21:18] <SIbot1> In real units: 90000 ft = 27.4 km
[21:18] <craag> looks like someone else grabbed the nick in the meantime :/
[21:19] <Upu> registered ?
[21:19] <craag> nope. effort.
[21:19] <craag> :P
[21:19] <Upu> lol
[21:19] <Upu>  /nick SubtleHint2AmericansBot
[21:19] <craag> heh
[21:20] <Lunar_Lander> XD!
[21:20] <Lunar_Lander> 14.27 psi
[21:20] <Lunar_Lander> hm
[21:20] <Lunar_Lander> 420 foot-candles
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[21:26] <mclane_> Lunar_Lander: chip antenna normally works fine if there is no metal around
[21:26] <habby> UPU: What was the connector type for the antenna you gave me? PL259? Is the coax cable RG213 (which is what gonzo advised me to get on here.
[21:27] <Upu> yeah its PL259 at the Watson end
[21:27] <Upu> if you do get an Airspy
[21:28] <Lunar_Lander> yea
[21:28] <Upu> and if you can get the coax inside in a fairly shot coax run
[21:28] <Upu> I'll get you a Habamp to go with it
[21:28] <Oddstr13> so, can any of you predict the outcome of running this python code, without actually running it? https://oddstr13.openshell.no/paste/Vld5Eiu7/
[21:28] <Lunar_Lander> disclaimer: upu and dave rock!
[21:28] <Lunar_Lander> :P
[21:29] Action: Upu pats Lunar_Lander
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[21:30] <Lunar_Lander> :)
[21:31] <Upu> I like this MagPi magazine it reminds me of Input
[21:31] <Upu> pages of code for you to type in
[21:31] <Lunar_Lander> yea
[21:32] <Oddstr13> Upu: time to get a OCR going :P
[21:32] <Lunar_Lander> speaking of that I still wanted to read that recent issue about getting started on pi
[21:32] <Upu> sadly that didn't exist back in 1986
[21:32] <habby> Oddstr13: 0-5 0-4 0-3 etc
[21:32] <Oddstr13> habby: indeed. let's just say I was scratching my head for a while.
[21:33] <habby> Oddstr13, the '10' threw me for a sec!
[21:33] <Oddstr13> ;)
[21:34] <Oddstr13> https://oddstr13.openshell.no/paste/Vld6yKyZ/
[21:48] <habby> UPU: I don't think I can justify £170 for an Airspy on the budget I've got. Might have to leave that for next year's project...
[21:48] <Upu> no probs
[21:48] <Upu> you can use a £10 dongle from cozycave
[21:49] <Upu> performance isn't as good though
[21:49] <habby> Will the amp help?
[21:49] <daveake> yes lots
[21:49] <habby> Hmmmm....
[21:49] <habby> Well, that is probably doable then
[21:50] <habby> This one...? https://www.cosycave.co.uk/index.php?id_product=84&controller=product
[21:53] <Upu> yeah that will work
[21:53] <habby> out of stock...
[21:54] <habby> This: https://www.cosycave.co.uk/index.php?id_product=83&controller=product (older version)
[21:57] <Lunar_Lander> I also got a product question
[21:57] <Lunar_Lander> http://ava.upuaut.net/store/index.php?route=product/product&product_id=119 how much does this weigh?
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[21:57] <daveake> Get one with an SMA adapter
[21:58] <daveake> About 30g I think Lunar_Lander
[21:58] <Lunar_Lander> ah
[21:58] <Lunar_Lander> that sounds fair
[21:58] <Lunar_Lander> thanks
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[22:36] <habby> UPU: Yagi?: http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Portable-base-yagi-antenna-pmr-446MHZ-or-435Mhz-70cm-6-ele-high-gain-folded-/291618422595?hash=item43e5cfff43:g:qGMAAOSwWnFV8AGB
[22:36] <habby> UPU: Or http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Portable-base-yagi-antenna-pmr-446MHZ-or-435Mhz-70cm-6-ele-high-gain-gamma-/291623855731?hash=item43e622e673:g:yfMAAOSwv-NWVFcD
[22:37] <habby> I know it's 435MHz, but is that close enough?
[22:37] <Upu> yes
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[22:38] <habby> What's the difference between 6 ele high gain folded and 6 ele high gain gamma?
[22:38] <Upu> one of the elements is folded
[22:38] <Upu> no idea what difference it makes to performance
[22:40] <SA6BSS-Mike> a little cheaper http://www.ebay.de/itm/Original-ABY7LB-Vormast-Richtantenne-fur-350-500-MHz-70cm-Band-9dBi-Gewinn-/161895993016?hash=item25b1c0ceb8:g:F1IAAOSweW5U~r9g
[22:40] <Upu> sounds too cheap
[22:40] <SA6BSS-Mike> using that one for mobile I baught 3 of the in a pckadge
[22:40] <SA6BSS-Mike> they do work quite good
[22:41] <SA6BSS-Mike> even when I?m tracking wx sondes at 403Mhz
[22:41] <SA6BSS-Mike> the limit is that if you want to tx
[22:41] <SA6BSS-Mike> its max 15W
[22:43] <SA6BSS-Mike> the two linked in the begining handle 200W
[22:43] <SA6BSS-Mike> some more info on the antenna http://www.ov-f28.de/Carant/Carant-Yagi.htm
[22:44] <SA6BSS-Mike> going to bed , gn
[22:44] <habby> Thanks
[22:45] <mfa298> In a dipole I think the folded version has a slightly higher bandwidth, but also a higher impedance. Not sure how much that will still hold try in the Yagi version
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[23:28] <SpacenearUS> New position from 03SP6NVB-11 after 0310 hours silence - 12http://tracker.habhub.org/#!qm=All&q=SP6NVB-11
[23:28] <SpacenearUS> New vehicle on the map: 03SP6NVB-12 - 12http://tracker.habhub.org/#!qm=All&q=SP6NVB-12
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[23:34] <SpacenearUS> New vehicle on the map: 03SP6NVB-12 - 12http://tracker.habhub.org/#!qm=All&q=SP6NVB-12
[23:36] Last message repeated 1 time(s).
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[23:42] <SpacenearUS> New vehicle on the map: 03SP6NVB-12 - 12http://tracker.habhub.org/#!qm=All&q=SP6NVB-12
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[23:50] <SpacenearUS> New vehicle on the map: 03SP6NVB-12 - 12http://tracker.habhub.org/#!qm=All&q=SP6NVB-12
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[00:00] --- Fri Nov 27 2015