highaltitude.log.20151116

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[00:09] <Lupus_sat> According to Geiger counter: radiation decrease up to ~2 km and increase after that up to ~20 km (maximum of muon generation height). Intensity ratio 20 km / 0 m above sea level of Geiger counter ~ 20 times.
[00:09] <Lupus_sat> ou can use scintillation detectors based on NaI(Tl), CsI etc., but you will measure energy of low-energy electrons and gammas, that produced during scattering of cosmic rays with detector.
[00:09] <Lupus_sat> You can't to measure energy spectrum of cosmic rays -- it's necessary detector with weight of about few tons for that. :-)
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[00:12] <Lupus_sat> PIN diodes as sensitive media for radiation counter have less sensitivity than Geiger counter due to small volume .
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[00:26] <mattbrejza> you can measure the energy of the incident particle on a scintillator by the intensity of the flash though?
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[00:30] <Lunar_Lander> yea
[00:30] <Lunar_Lander> also you can have a proportional counter by lowering the voltage on the GM tube
[00:30] <Lunar_Lander> so that not every strike causes an avalance and thus a count
[00:41] <Lunar_Lander> good ngiht
[00:41] <Lunar_Lander> night
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[01:23] <Laurenceb_> http://imgur.com/a/DHdkj
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[11:48] <LunarWork> hello
[11:49] <craag> morning
[11:50] <LunarWork> how's life?
[11:51] <craag> pretty goo thanks, you?
[11:51] <craag> *good even
[11:52] <daveake> is that the daemon for goo ?
[11:52] <craag> heh
[11:53] <LunarWork> :D goo is the new gnu
[11:53] <LunarWork> I'm fine too thanks
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[11:54] <LunarWork> excited about the MTX2, also ordered another minIMU3 and a BME280 pressure-temperature-humidity sensor
[11:54] <LunarWork> (last one to try out what it can do)
[11:57] Nick change: murb_ -> murb
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[12:09] <fl_0> re
[12:09] <fl_0> where can I find documentation about the ukhas flight docs?
[12:10] <fl_0> i was looking at the wiki but couldn't find any hint
[12:11] <fl_0> a found it
[12:11] <fl_0> sftn
[12:16] <fsphil> ah, it's available: http://www.itead.cc/spyverter.html
[12:16] <fsphil> for all you HF fans
[12:31] <daveake> All the way down to DC
[12:31] Nick change: kokey_ -> kokey
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[12:49] <SpacenearUS> New vehicle on the map: 03SQ6OMN-11 - 12http://tracker.habhub.org/#!qm=All&q=SQ6OMN-11
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[12:51] <Laurenceb_> sup
[12:53] <Laurenceb_> http://imgur.com/a/DHdkj
[12:53] <Laurenceb_> mini tracker ready to go
[12:54] <mattbrejza> sort out your silk labels first though... ;)
[12:54] <Laurenceb_> heh
[12:55] <Laurenceb_> I'm much happier with the xtal placement now
[12:55] <Laurenceb_> just wondering about EMI problems with the GMR sensor
[12:55] <mattbrejza> size: 40mil and ratio 14% comes out fine
[12:55] <Laurenceb_> its going to get a strong E field at the top side
[12:55] <Laurenceb_> with which pcb place?
[12:55] <mattbrejza> dirtypcbs
[12:56] <Laurenceb_> ah
[12:56] <mattbrejza> size 32 is probably fine too (ive certainly put that through pcbpool)
[12:57] <Laurenceb_> ok, I was going to use seeedstudio
[12:58] <mattbrejza> https://drive.google.com/file/d/1sP_3sj-TVsLFedsxd0yKPfKGzacXqfb-rA/view has size 40 14% labels
[12:58] <Laurenceb_> thats pretty decent
[12:58] <Laurenceb_> how accurate are the vias, and what diameter?
[12:58] <mattbrejza> 15mil drill
[12:58] <mattbrejza> diameter is auto...
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[12:59] <mattbrejza> so whatever eagle defaults to
[12:59] <Laurenceb_> ah ok
[12:59] <Laurenceb_> whats minimum via with dirtypcbs?
[12:59] <mattbrejza> 12 perhaps
[13:00] <Laurenceb_> ok
[13:01] <Laurenceb_> the adaptor for mounting this into the nose is going to be "fun"
[13:01] <Laurenceb_> I'm going to go with a quarter turn screw fitting nosecone
[13:02] <chris_99> how hard will the tracking part be, will you need many trackers?
[13:03] <Laurenceb_> it'll need two trackers
[13:03] <Laurenceb_> as in ground stations
[13:03] <chris_99> only two?
[13:04] <Laurenceb_> yes
[13:04] <Laurenceb_> and they will both need GPS disciplined oscillators
[13:04] <Laurenceb_> Leo has built a few already
[13:04] <chris_99> cool, whats the method you use for tracking?
[13:05] <Laurenceb_> PLL onto the carrier then calculate the difference in integrated phase between the two ground stations
[13:06] <Laurenceb_> then you fit a trajectory to that
[13:06] <Laurenceb_> this was done back in the 50s
[13:06] <chris_99> is this called trilateration/triangulation/... though, or something else entirely?
[13:06] <Laurenceb_> in fact its how they tracked Sputnik
[13:07] <chris_99> cool
[13:07] <Laurenceb_> something else, if there were more ground stations trilateration might be feasible
[13:07] <Laurenceb_> but its not necessary to track a rockoon
[13:07] <Laurenceb_> you can fit 6 parameters describing a parabola to it
[13:09] <Laurenceb_> with three ground stations and a baro sensor you could track picoballoons this way
[13:10] <chris_99> isn't it sort of some form of triangle that is is formed between the two ground stations and the rocket?
[13:10] <Laurenceb_> I guess it is, yeah
[13:10] <chris_99> so could you not call it triangulation or..?
[13:11] <Laurenceb_> its a form of triangulation I guess
[13:11] <adamgreig> more like trilateration I would have thought?
[13:11] <Laurenceb_> yes
[13:12] <Laurenceb_> its be interesting to try this with picoballoons
[13:12] <Laurenceb_> not sure what it would achieve tho - GPS is nice and light and low power now
[13:12] <adamgreig> cost
[13:13] <Laurenceb_> ah good point
[13:13] <Laurenceb_> GPS modules are pricey compared to CW tracker
[13:16] <Laurenceb_> well its easy to try :P
[13:16] <Laurenceb_> http://www.leobodnar.com/shop/index.php?main_page=product_info&products_id=234
[13:17] <Laurenceb_> should plug straight into an airspy
[13:26] <fab4space> this gps module is 6$ and works at more than 18km altitude http://navspark.mybigcommerce.com/navspark-mini-uart-to-usb-adapter/
[13:26] <fab4space> and this one prodives raw output :
[13:26] <fab4space> http://navspark.mybigcommerce.com/ns-raw-carrier-phase-raw-measurement-output-gps-receiver/
[13:26] <fab4space> for RTK
[13:34] <SpacenearUS> New position from 03WB8ELK-4 after 037 hours silence - 12http://tracker.habhub.org/#!qm=All&q=WB8ELK-4
[13:35] <Laurenceb_> ah skytraq
[13:36] <adamgreig> a cw tracker is always going to be cheaper than a gps based one
[13:36] <adamgreig> because the gps one requires a radio to downlink the position
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[13:37] <chris_99> and wouldn't you have to use an SDR one, too, due to the acceleration/velocity limits
[13:37] <adamgreig> well on a rocket maybe, but even for balloons a cw tracker'l remain cheaper
[13:37] <chris_99> mmm
[13:37] <adamgreig> you need more receivers with a balloon as you can't just fit a trajectory in quite the same way
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[14:54] <SpacenearUS> New vehicle on the map: 03CHANGEME - 12http://tracker.habhub.org/#!qm=All&q=CHANGEME
[14:55] <daveake> tsk, UpuWork :)
[14:55] <UpuWork> yolo
[14:56] <jonsowman> lol
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[15:14] <SpacenearUS> New vehicle on the map: 03BUGGERALL - 12http://tracker.habhub.org/#!qm=All&q=BUGGERALL
[15:15] <SpacenearUS> New vehicle on the map: 03INSERTNAMEHERE - 12http://tracker.habhub.org/#!qm=All&q=INSERTNAMEHERE
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[15:17] <UpuWork> eh ?
[15:18] <SpacenearUS> New vehicle on the map: 03IMSTUCKPLSHELP - 12http://tracker.habhub.org/#!qm=All&q=IMSTUCKPLSHELP
[15:18] <UpuWork> you're not funny
[15:18] <SpacenearUS> New vehicle on the map: 03OKIGONOWSADFACE - 12http://tracker.habhub.org/#!qm=All&q=OKIGONOWSADFACE
[15:21] <mattbrejza> !whereis OKIGONOWSADFACE
[15:21] <SpacenearUS> 03mattbrejza: I haven't got a clue
[16:01] <fsphil> gotta wonder about those Bradford residents
[16:01] <SpacenearUS> New vehicle on the map: 03K9MQ-11 - 12http://tracker.habhub.org/#!qm=All&q=K9MQ-11
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[16:15] <SpacenearUS> New position from 03F4HHV after 036 days silence - 12http://tracker.habhub.org/#!qm=All&q=F4HHV
[16:25] <tweetBot1> @petejbell: Just heard my @pitsproject is on the way! Simultaneously excited & traumatised by how much extra learning this means I'll have to do! #ukhas
[16:25] <eroomde> the pits means you don't have to do the learning
[16:25] <eroomde> if only he could hear.
[16:25] <adamgreig> shouting into an abyss
[16:26] <tweetBot1> @petejbell: Bedtime reading #ukhas @pitsproject //CC @robjones_cowley https://t.co/P41YjuiRfl
[16:33] <eroomde> the stratosphere needs more blinking LEDs, for sure
[16:35] <kokey> I'm thinking of putting together a pico
[16:36] <kokey> what gps and radio makes sense for this nowadays?
[16:36] <adamgreig> depends how xtreme you wanna go
[16:36] <adamgreig> probably a ublox max-m8q and then the radio is fairly up for debate... the lora module? the mtx2? something more custom?
[16:36] <kokey> I'm in Dublin, so if I can cross the UK I'm happy
[16:36] <adamgreig> if you're happy designing your own RF parts of PCBs and working out their inane registers and stuff, one of the silabs ezradiopro modules is probably not a bad shout either
[16:37] <adamgreig> if you want a 'radio module' i think the mtx2 is probably a good option
[16:38] <kokey> ok got a ublox, I think max6, going before, and an rfm22b
[16:38] <adamgreig> the max 7 and 8 are not very different to the 6
[16:38] <adamgreig> the rfm22b seems a poor choice for this sort of thing for various reasons but you might consider its newer brethren like the rfm95 (98?) or 69 or something
[16:39] <kokey> cool, I remember something about it spitting out a bit of garbage not long after boot
[16:39] <kokey> how much is an mtx2 nowadays?
[16:40] <kokey> ah, the Upu site is still going
[16:40] <daveake> yeah 69 replaces the 22b
[16:41] <fsphil> you shouldn't have too much trouble getting to the uk from dublin. infact it might be easier than landing in ireland, with the current winds
[16:42] <kokey> looks like the rfm69 is a hell lot cheaper than the mtx2
[16:46] <kokey> I was very happy with the arduino pro mini, is that still good?
[16:46] <adamgreig> it works
[16:48] <kokey> should be a breeze to work with again after the esp8266
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[16:58] <SpacenearUS> New vehicle on the map: 03ASTROPI - 12http://tracker.habhub.org/#!qm=All&q=ASTROPI
[16:58] <fsphil> I do like the avr
[16:58] <fsphil> easier to develop for than the arm stuff
[16:59] <adamgreig> hmm
[16:59] <adamgreig> much harder to debug though
[16:59] <adamgreig> of course, you need to less often ;)
[17:02] <eroomde> yes
[17:02] <eroomde> it's nice just not having to spend ages figuring out peripherals
[17:02] <eroomde> also they can be debugged!
[17:03] <adamgreig> sure in principle they can be :P
[17:03] <adamgreig> I saw a dragon once...
[17:04] <mattbrejza> i actually have two dragons now...
[17:04] <mattbrejza> just a few years too late
[17:04] <mattbrejza> still havnt worked out why they have so much stuff on them
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[17:11] <Laurenceb_> heh
[17:12] <Laurenceb_> anyone know a rule of thumb for calculating crystal drive level?
[17:12] <adamgreig> lol ugh
[17:12] <adamgreig> every time I try to work that out I regret it
[17:12] <Laurenceb_> rms_voltage/(2*pi*load_cap*frequency)*motional_resistance ?
[17:12] <adamgreig> sounds about right
[17:13] <Laurenceb_> ok :P
[17:13] <Laurenceb_> s/ / / *
[17:14] <adamgreig> that's not how regexes work
[17:15] <Laurenceb_> I know lol
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[17:15] Nick change: Russell -> Guest30467
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[17:18] <Guest30467> Is there any way to increase the allowed connections per IP address. I have around 400 students attempting to track our balloon, but since they all share a small set of public IP addresses, most are getting the "too many connections from your IP address" error message
[17:18] <adamgreig> interesting
[17:18] <adamgreig> on what website?
[17:18] <adamgreig> tracker.habhub.org or the IRC?
[17:18] <adamgreig> or dl-fldigi?
[17:18] <Guest30467> tracker.habhub.org
[17:19] <Guest30467> our specific URL is http://tracker.habhub.org/#!mt=roadmap&mz=8&qm=1_day&mc=41.47607,-85.59411&f=K9MQ-11
[17:19] <adamgreig> paging lz1dev DanielRichman
[17:20] <eroomde> that's a lot of students
[17:20] <Guest30467> Well, they all have chomebooks.
[17:20] <Guest30467> it's probably more than 400.
[17:22] <adamgreig> is there anything else on the error message?
[17:22] <adamgreig> any chance of a screenshot or something?
[17:24] <adamgreig> not sure where your error is coming from exactly
[17:24] <RealBorg> Guest30467, setting up a proy is not an option?
[17:24] <Guest30467> hang on. I'm havign someone send me a screen shot
[17:25] <adamgreig> I don't _think_ we limit connections per IP address on our end
[17:25] <adamgreig> it might be a google maps thing
[17:25] <RealBorg> aptitude install tinyproy
[17:25] <adamgreig> or we might be doing that inadvertently
[17:25] <adamgreig> RealBorg: suspect given they're running 400 chromebooks there will be all sorts of things going on
[17:25] <Guest30467> yeah. you're correct. it is a Google maps error.
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[17:25] <adamgreig> and not likely easily remedied by installing some random proxy app from apt
[17:25] <adamgreig> ok
[17:26] <Guest30467> Is there a way to upload a graphic file in this IRC client?
[17:26] <adamgreig> there's probably not a huge amount we can do about google maps errors but perhaps try swapping the tile source
[17:26] <adamgreig> not really - try imgur.com
[17:26] <adamgreig> where it says "Map" on the top right, if you change to "OSM", does it work any better?
[17:27] <RealBorg> adamgreig, they need to set up a proy server to avoid fetching 400 times
[17:27] <adamgreig> RealBorg: I'm aware of the concept, but that's not really useful advice to give right now
[17:28] <Guest30467> http://archive.hobart.k12.in.us/errorscreen.jpg
[17:28] <adamgreig> oh huh
[17:28] <adamgreig> that is from aprs.fi rather than tracker.habhub.org
[17:28] <chrisstubbs> Guest30467, http://habmap.philcrump.co.uk/ is an alternative
[17:29] <Guest30467> not sure about the OSM. It's not happening to me. I'm the tech guy. So I'm relaying your questions to someone else.
[17:29] <adamgreig> you should be able to use tracker.habhub.org and click OSM on the top right to fix the google maps issue
[17:29] <adamgreig> aprs.fi is a separate system run by other people, which I can't help with
[17:30] <Guest30467> we do have a proxy server. which is why everyone is coming from the same IP address.
[17:32] <Guest30467> I'm assuming that each connection through the proxy server has a different cookie, so the site would keep track of each of the 400 connections through the proxy server separetly
[17:33] <Guest30467> yeah. I just notioced that. I am going to have to talk to them to find out why/how they are on that site...
[17:33] <Guest30467> bye.
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[17:58] Nick change: clopez_ -> clopez
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[18:03] <lz1dev> ping adamgreig
[18:04] <adamgreig> ahoy lz1dev
[18:05] <adamgreig> looks like it was a google maps issue and nothing to do with us
[18:05] <adamgreig> and probably on aprs.fi and not even tracker
[18:05] <adamgreig> so no worries :P
[18:05] <lz1dev> yeah, we cant be us
[18:05] <lz1dev> it*
[18:05] <lz1dev> 5 people on analyics atm
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[18:06] <adamgreig> lol
[18:06] <lz1dev> 30 session at around 5
[18:06] <lz1dev> its not us :)
[18:06] <lz1dev> aprs.fi has some pretty wierd limits
[18:08] <lz1dev> what are cache cdns
[18:13] <adamgreig> like cloudflare i think
[18:14] <eroomde> we put a redis server in the space just under the roof
[18:14] <eroomde> cache in the attic
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[18:17] <lz1dev>  _ 
[18:18] <eroomde> https://twitter.com/Pinboard/status/666311222690648064
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[18:28] <kc2pit> How long has Navspark been giving away those Minis?
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[19:09] <SpacenearUS> New vehicle on the map: 03CRAAG4 - 12http://tracker.habhub.org/#!qm=All&q=CRAAG4
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[20:07] <Lunar_Lander> evening
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[22:05] <BeaverOne> https://www.flickr.com/photos/100852237@N06/albums/72157660091977635 -- My Autonomous Parafoil Flight Controller as of today
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[23:20] <SpacenearUS> New vehicle on the map: 03DL4MDW-11 - 12http://tracker.habhub.org/#!qm=All&q=DL4MDW-11
[23:29] Laurenceb_ (~Laurence@host86-146-188-51.range86-146.btcentralplus.com) left irc: Ping timeout: 244 seconds
[23:37] cross_ (~cross@spitfire.i.gajendra.net) left irc: Remote host closed the connection
[23:38] <BeaverOne> anyone interested in some free Receivers and Transmitter Modules? http://i.imgur.com/xrpnwis.jpg
[23:42] Laurenceb_ (~Laurence@host86-179-248-178.range86-179.btcentralplus.com) joined #highaltitude.
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[23:45] niftylettuce (uid2733@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-sphzwiqttixklxdi) joined #highaltitude.
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[00:00] --- Tue Nov 17 2015