highaltitude.log.20151018

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[00:39] <Laurenceb_> http://www.mate.tue.nl/mate/pdfs/11635.pdf
[00:39] <Laurenceb_> figure 2.6 is amazing
[00:39] <Laurenceb_> - strength of wood fibre testing
[00:57] <Laurenceb_> some of it is very impressive
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[11:40] <SpacenearUS> New vehicle on the map: 03HB9HFJ-11 - 12http://tracker.habhub.org/#!qm=All&q=HB9HFJ-11
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[11:54] <SpacenearUS> New vehicle on the map: 03SP6VWX-9_chase - 12http://tracker.habhub.org/#!qm=All&q=SP6VWX-9_chase
[11:55] <SpacenearUS> New vehicle on the map: 03F1JRN-9 - 12http://tracker.habhub.org/#!qm=All&q=F1JRN-9
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[12:15] <PE2BZ> !flights
[12:15] <SpacenearUS> 03PE2BZ: Current flights: 03Project Horus + LaunchBox October 2015 10(e937)
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[12:34] Nick change: pb0ahx -> Herman-PB0AHX
[12:35] <Herman-PB0AHX> !flights
[12:35] <SpacenearUS> 03Herman-PB0AHX: Current flights: 03Project Horus + LaunchBox October 2015 10(e937)
[12:35] <Herman-PB0AHX> !dial e937
[12:35] <SpacenearUS> 03Herman-PB0AHX: Latest dials for 03VK5ARG-1 10(e937): none
[12:36] <Upu> Australia Herman
[12:36] <Herman-PB0AHX> yes i see
[12:37] <Herman-PB0AHX> it is time for new projekt here
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[17:15] <SpacenearUS> New vehicle on the map: 03KE0EWJ - 12http://tracker.habhub.org/#!qm=All&q=KE0EWJ
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[17:42] <Lunar_Lander> hello
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[17:54] <SpacenearUS> New vehicle on the map: 03??????????_chase - 12http://tracker.habhub.org/#!qm=All&q=%3F%3F%3F%3F%3F%3F%3F%3F%3F%3F_chase
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[18:57] <SpacenearUS> New vehicle on the map: 03sabrina133_chase - 12http://tracker.habhub.org/#!qm=All&q=sabrina133_chase
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[19:12] <LeedsMSC> Hi, can anyone see me?
[19:13] <chris_99> yup
[19:13] <Laurenceb_> no you are on the internet
[19:13] <Lunar_Lander> please state your request
[19:13] <Lunar_Lander> this was a message from the automated UKHAS IRC chat response system
[19:15] <Laurenceb_> heh
[19:15] <LeedsMSC> Hi Chris, I'm doing a masters at Leeds about Geographical information systems. Currently researching into high altitude balloons for emergency imagery after natural disasters. Would you be able to direct me to any sources on payload weights and expected 'air time' once the balloons are in the sky?
[19:16] gb73d (~gb73d@81-178-182-123.dsl.pipex.com) left irc:
[19:17] <adamgreig> hmm i know a masters student who did exactly this actually
[19:17] <adamgreig> or very similar, mapping for communities in rural india where you otherwise don't have great maps, but the same sort of idea
[19:17] <chris_99> that sounds really interesting
[19:17] <adamgreig> maybe 1kg payload weight, you might get two hours in the air, in a normal sort of configuration
[19:17] <adamgreig> obviously this scales quite extremely, some balloons stay airborne for months or years, and they can weigh from tens of grams to hundreds of kilos
[19:18] <adamgreig> typically you'll want to recover the balloon to get the camera with the photos, so usually the idea would be to launch a balloon, normal 2hr flight, recover it, look at photos
[19:18] <LeedsMSC> adamgreig - Did your friend publish any work on his project? Would be very interesting to read if so.
[19:19] <chris_99> Does anyone know if anyones ever used a TX3H on a flight out of interest?
[19:19] <adamgreig> not afaik
[19:19] <adamgreig> think it was not part of his formal masters project
[19:20] <adamgreig> LeedsMSC: last I heard he was planning on sendingi the photos to a couple academics and write a paper
[19:21] <adamgreig> but I haven't heard much since (he has graduated)
[19:21] <adamgreig> want his email address?
[19:22] <LeedsMSC> That would be great if you could PM that adamgreig
[19:24] <adamgreig> have done
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[19:26] <LeedsMSC> Thanks again. An other general question if you will allow me: I know its a bit of a fuzzy term; but how good is survivability of the cameras? Do only the memory cards survive or are they slowed adequately enough to be reusable. In theory the project is for disposable cameras in high stress scenarios but recoverable equipment is always a plus.
[19:28] <adamgreig> they should survive just fine
[19:28] <adamgreig> the payloads have parachutes
[19:30] <adamgreig> you don't want this stuff falling out of the sky that fast!
[19:30] <LeedsMSC> Ok awesome, wasn't sure if the speed would be reduced enough keep the actual camera fully intact. Thanks for the great info, very much appreciated.
[19:31] <craag> We tend to aim for 5 m/s descent at sea level
[19:33] <Geoff-G8DHE> bear in mind that for mapping the images are only useful upto the first cloud layer!
[19:36] <RealBorg> has anyone tried using two balloons yet?
[19:36] <RealBorg> one to burst at altitude and the other to slow the descent
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[19:38] <LeedsMSC> For direct imagery that's very true Geoff, but if money allows (and perhaps now survivability is better than expected) Synthetic Aperture Radar can penetrate clouds for topographic modelling
[19:38] <LeedsMSC> Sometime I will have to look further into myself :)
[19:38] <Geoff-G8DHE> Think your mass is gooing to go up for that however!
[19:39] <Geoff-G8DHE> also power demands, power is mass!!
[19:40] <LeedsMSC> something* True, and the power for the non-passive instruments might actually be the killer factor. Good point.
[19:43] <craag> It's all about budgeting
[19:43] <craag> power and mass
[19:43] <craag> and cost!
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[19:54] <Lunar_Lander> hi craag
[19:54] <Laurenceb_> yeah, synthetic aperture on a HAB would be amazing
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[19:55] <adamgreig> would need to get the swinging a bit more under control for useful results i'd think
[19:56] <Geoff-G8DHE> stablised payload = Mass, Aerials = Mass, storage of results would also need something more than Flash memory = Mass
[19:56] <adamgreig> what would you imagine it uses if not flash memory?
[19:56] <Geoff-G8DHE> Can we borrow a Google balloon ?
[19:56] <Geoff-G8DHE> Not sure adamgreig, but the data rate will be significant!
[19:57] <adamgreig> yea but it's definitely still going to be flash memory
[19:57] <adamgreig> and tbh needn't be all that significant for SAR
[19:57] <adamgreig> depends on what exactly you do but you can get a lot from basically just audio data as your storage medium..
[19:57] <Geoff-G8DHE> depends how much you process in real time ..
[19:58] <adamgreig> even if you process nothing in real time
[19:59] <Geoff-G8DHE> What would you think the total data might be for a 2 hour flight then , I would have thought many GB maybe a TB ?
[19:59] <adamgreig> just do a frequency swept chirp or dc radar with mixing at the receiver and your output signal is DC to some kHz
[19:59] <adamgreig> record that as a wav file and you can write to a 32gb sd card all day long
[19:59] <adamgreig> maybe a couple hundred megabytes?
[20:00] <Geoff-G8DHE> be interesting to do the sum's but not for me tonight!
[20:01] <adamgreig> say 16bit pcm at 48khz
[20:01] <adamgreig> yea, like 700MB for two hours of raw data
[20:01] <adamgreig> storage is not likely to be the challenging part here
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[20:12] <Laurenceb_> hmm payload swinging
[20:13] <Laurenceb_> wonder how an IMU would help
[20:14] <adamgreig> if you knew the swinging pretty exactly you could cancel it out to some extent
[20:14] <adamgreig> it's small compared to the signal and large compared to the wavelength
[20:15] <adamgreig> to be honest you might be able to use the ground return to characterise the swinging and use that to fix the rest of it
[20:15] <Laurenceb_> yeah I'm a bit confused
[20:15] <Laurenceb_> needs some modelling to see how much of an issue it would be
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[20:23] <LeedsMSC> Guys, thanks very much for all your interesting points again. Was nice talking with you all. Bye for now!
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[21:09] <SpacenearUS> New vehicle on the map: 03KG5JFN-11 - 12http://tracker.habhub.org/#!qm=All&q=KG5JFN-11
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[21:12] <arko> SP9UOB: http://www.planetary.org/blogs/guest-blogs/2015/1016-the-success-of-european-rover-challenge.html
[21:22] <SpeedEvil> http://www.banggood.com/Eachine-H8-Mini-Headless-Mode-2_4G-4CH-6-Axis-RC-Quadcopter-RTF-p-975808.html
[21:22] <SpeedEvil> I suspect this will not work.
[21:22] <SpeedEvil> But one pound quadcopters.
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[21:24] <Geoff-G8DHE> waiting for one of these at the moment http://www.banggood.com/GM300-Digital-Laser-Point-Infrared-Thermometer-Temperature-Meter-Gun-p-85756.html
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[21:37] <SpeedEvil> I recommend against those, they have a 'high' drain on the 9V cell
[21:37] <SpeedEvil> IIRC it dies in a couple of months
[21:38] <SpeedEvil> http://www.dx.com/p/benetech-gm320-1-2-lcd-infrared-temperature-tester-thermometer-orange-black-2-x-aaa-228801#.VXC_IfFVGRs is great
[21:38] <SpeedEvil> ~0.5mA 'on' taking measuremtnes (laser and light off)
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[00:00] --- Mon Oct 19 2015