highaltitude.log.20151005

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[05:53] <SpacenearUS> New vehicle on the map: 03VE6GLW_chase - 12http://tracker.habhub.org/#!qm=All&q=VE6GLW_chase
[06:08] Nick change: fl_0|afk -> fl_0
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[08:59] <pb0ahx> good morning all
[09:00] Nick change: pb0ahx -> Herman-PB0AHX
[09:07] <infaddict> morning Herman-PB0AHX
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[12:54] <SpacenearUS> New position from 03K6RPT-11 after 0313 hours silence - 12http://tracker.habhub.org/#!qm=All&q=K6RPT-11
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[13:12] <M0XIN> Did ForestHAB get launched? Down already?
[13:14] <gonzo_> next monday I think it is
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[13:18] <M0XIN> Ohhhh my bad
[13:18] <M0XIN> So it is
[13:34] <gonzo_> I did exactly the same this morning
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[13:39] <tweetBot> @daveake: Blog post re the LoRa airborne mesh network http://t.co/YcayIhQ8Gy #UKHAS
[13:40] <SpacenearUS> New vehicle on the map: 03KD0HIP-7 - 12http://tracker.habhub.org/#!qm=All&q=KD0HIP-7
[13:49] <eroomde> appeal: does anyone have a casio fx-992s scientific calculator that they would sell me
[13:49] <eroomde> it must be specifically that model
[13:51] <chris_99> theres one on fleabay by the looks of it
[13:52] <chris_99> oh i tell a lie, the silly person has listed it as casio fx-992s but it's not that model
[13:53] <eroomde> i'd like it to be in reasonable nick
[13:53] <tweetBot> @AmsatUK: LoRa Airborne Mesh Network #amsat #hamradio #hamr https://t.co/CK4bTMNzto
[13:54] <SpacenearUS> New position from 03KD5GOM-11 after 032 days silence - 12http://tracker.habhub.org/#!qm=All&q=KD5GOM-11
[13:54] <chimpusmaximus> Can find new for about £36
[13:55] <eroomde> hence me askingnhere
[13:56] <SpacenearUS> New position from 03KB1KVR after 032 days silence - 12http://tracker.habhub.org/#!qm=All&q=KB1KVR
[13:58] <michal_f> just read that blog post of Dave...
[13:58] <michal_f> recovery with a drone comes to mind...
[13:58] <michal_f> drone retransmitting a landed payload
[14:02] <chimpusmaximus> Going to be limited in height but certainly something i have considered. I actually tested a pi with ir camera attached to quad to see what results i could get.
[14:04] <michal_f> and what did you get ?
[14:04] <Maxell> daveake: "Heres an SDR screenshot showing packets being transmitted every 2 seconds; the packets occupy a bit less than 1 second so there is slightly more than 1 second between packets:" screenshot does not work
[14:04] <Maxell> Links back to some gmail attachment?
[14:04] <michal_f> I confirm
[14:05] <chimpusmaximus> Some interesting results i have not had time to work out... Could certainly pick up differences in colour in fields etc.
[14:07] <daveake> OK I'll fix that later
[14:07] <Maxell> tnx
[14:07] <daveake> Meanwhile I have an appointment with LORA2 :-)
[14:07] <Maxell> nice :)
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[14:18] <daveake> Spoke to a friendly guy at the company; hopefully we'll be able to get the thing off the roof
[14:20] <infaddict> nice
[14:21] <SpacenearUS> New vehicle on the map: 03W5LCY-7 - 12http://tracker.habhub.org/#!qm=All&q=W5LCY-7
[14:29] <Ian_> Nice writeup Daveake, Good hunting with Lora2 and good luck with someone phoning you re Lora1 - shame about the proprietry format, but it does offer an inexpensive airborne and groundstation solution.
[14:29] <Ian_> Lora that is :-)
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[14:34] <Ian_> Entertaining thoughts of a 5 or 7 element 70cm ZL special with integral Lora on the blunt end.
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[14:38] <craag> yeah just duct tape matt's bt lora rx to the handle :)
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[14:44] <eroomde> There is a pellet company, near us in buckingham
[14:44] Nick change: fl_0 -> fl_0|afk
[14:44] <eroomde> and yet they did not choose to call themselves Buckingham Pallets
[14:45] <eroomde> i do not understand how such an gaping opportunity could go unmissed
[14:48] <jonsowman> :)
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[14:58] <gonzo_> companied house shows a ltd co (dissolved) with that name
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[15:12] <Ian_> Handle? I was thinking of it maybe being somewhere up a mast. OK on the Gaffa tape though!
[15:13] <craag> hehe could do
[15:15] <Ian_> Don't accept RF losses when you can stick the DC and data up the mast instead.
[15:16] <Ian_> And down of course
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[15:17] <Ian_> craag - I've lost track, is jcoxon's final exam this Friday or last?
[15:18] <eroomde> 9th
[15:18] <eroomde> then it's his birthday on the 10th
[15:18] <Ian_> Fine, many thanks - Well, that's exceptionally good timing!
[15:27] <Laurenceb> final exam
[15:27] <Laurenceb> wait what
[15:28] <Laurenceb> uni seems as long ago as when i was in reception class :P
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[15:29] <Ian_> Oh, and congrats on your first day in your new job Laurencab. Hopefully a less demanding and more informed crowd than the last lost?
[15:29] <Laurenceb> thanks Ian
[15:29] <Laurenceb> new job is same as old job
[15:30] <Laurenceb> but we used the random startup generator
[15:30] <Ian_> Oh no, not the same people to make your life such fun eh?
[15:30] <Laurenceb> talking of which, I think I found a bug
[15:30] <Laurenceb> http://tiffzhang.com/startup/?s=474176931859
[15:31] <Laurenceb> the army is an actual thing
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[15:31] <Laurenceb> bbl
[15:32] <Ian_> We had one once!
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[15:42] Nick change: fl_0|afk -> fl_0
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[15:45] <arjunnaha> Is it possible for landing less that 1km away from launch?! http://predict.habhub.org/#!/uuid=1de079ad0474f20f7de797432b36471524e4069c
[15:45] <adamgreig> that's nothing
[15:45] <adamgreig> some predictions come in less than 200m from launch
[15:46] <adamgreig> by the time you actually launch it's usually changed though
[15:47] <fsphil> I had a prediction showing a launch from my house landing in the car park of where I work
[15:47] <arjunnaha> Waiting game until then...
[15:47] <chris_99> haha
[15:49] <chimpusmaximus> But always check just be fore launch.. paid the price and never seen again.
[15:49] <arjunnaha> I'm checking like every 5 mins 😂
[15:50] <craag> it'll only change once every 6 hours :P
[15:50] <chris_99> is there some data on how accurate the predictor is, compared to real launches out of interest?
[15:50] <adamgreig> it only updates every 6 hours ;)
[15:50] <adamgreig> aw craag beat me to it
[15:50] <craag> ;)
[15:50] <adamgreig> chris_99: basically no
[15:50] <adamgreig> it's "quite good" but "only as good as your ability to fill a balloon and weigh payloads" and "within tolerance of the balloon manufacturer"
[15:50] <arjunnaha> Lol
[15:50] <adamgreig> there is extensive data
[15:50] <adamgreig> there's no analysis
[15:50] <SpeedEvil> adamgreig: Is there?
[15:51] <SpeedEvil> adamgreig: there is extensive recorded tracks.
[15:51] <SpeedEvil> adamgreig: Are there actually recorded predictions though
[15:51] <adamgreig> yes
[15:51] <SpeedEvil> yay
[15:51] <adamgreig> well-
[15:51] <adamgreig> "yes"
[15:51] <adamgreig> effectively
[15:51] <SpeedEvil> SMOP then.
[15:51] <adamgreig> but without analysis it's essentially useless
[15:51] <adamgreig> quite
[15:52] <adamgreig> programming and mathematics, anyway
[15:53] <SpeedEvil> I guess what you'd want would be something like 'what would the prediction at launch time be for an ascent with the measured rate, and burst at, followed by fall be compared to the ground track
[15:53] <adamgreig> yes
[15:53] <adamgreig> ideally also "prediction a day before launch time" and so on
[15:53] <adamgreig> and then questions like "what is the distribution of distances from the final landing site vs predicted" and "how sensitive is it to errors in ascent rate and burst altitude"
[15:54] <craag> know any stats students?
[15:54] <adamgreig> I do a _lot_ of stats :p
[15:55] <eroomde> thats a programming job
[15:55] <eroomde> not a hard styats problem
[15:55] <adamgreig> it's mostly a programming job
[15:55] <adamgreig> I think you want to be quite aware of stats issues before tackling it
[15:55] <adamgreig> but it's standard fare
[15:57] <craag> fair enough
[15:57] <michal_f> http://cgmemes.blogspot.com/2015/06/it-quantum-mechanics.html :]
[15:57] <adamgreig> most of the problem is just boring data munging anyway, which is why it's not been done yet
[15:58] <craag> yeah, that was the bit that sounded like my experience of stats cw..
[15:58] <adamgreig> and also lack of any pressing need beyond occasional curiosity
[15:58] <eroomde> how long is historical pred data kept?
[15:58] <eroomde> i mean gfs data rather than cached predictions
[16:02] Nick change: michal_f -> michal_f_AFK
[16:03] <adamgreig> well
[16:03] <adamgreig> from noaa, not all that long
[16:03] <adamgreig> we have a separate compacted archive of the entire UK area going back well over a year now
[16:04] <SpacenearUS> New vehicle on the map: 03UON1 - 12http://tracker.habhub.org/#!qm=All&q=UON1
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[16:08] <UoNMike> Sorry guys, I didnt intend for Fldigi to upload straight away. :P
[16:09] <adamgreig> no problem
[16:09] <adamgreig> it's good to test it
[16:09] <UoNMike> For sure, I'll go for a little walk now.
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[16:37] <tweetBot> @daveake: LORA2 recovered #ukhas http://t.co/aZFtHEq0Gu
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[16:44] <UoNMike> meh that'll do...
[16:44] <UoNMike> nice daveake
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[16:55] <daveake> Well that was easy :)
[16:56] <daveake> Payload on a roof, probably too high for poles, but line/chute/latex dangling down to head height
[17:04] <Ian_> Well done and yet another good reason for a long train.
[17:08] <UoNMike> lol
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[17:30] <UoNMike> What company does LBG refer to in the bottom table here? https://ukhas.org.uk/guides:balloon_data
[17:30] <UoNMike> I've tried searching but alas no result.
[17:31] Nick change: fl_0 -> fl_0|afk
[17:32] Nick change: fl_0|afk -> fl_0
[17:34] <daveake> No idea. IME Click4 Balloons are the cheapest, followed by Balloon Helium
[17:34] <SpacenearUS> New vehicle on the map: 03CALLSIGN123_chase - 12http://tracker.habhub.org/#!qm=All&q=CALLSIGN123_chase
[17:35] <SpacenearUS> New vehicle on the map: 03UB4YBF_chase - 12http://tracker.habhub.org/#!qm=All&q=UB4YBF_chase
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[17:48] <UoNMike> THanks daveake
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[19:20] <SpacenearUS> New vehicle on the map: 03FORESTHAB - 12http://tracker.habhub.org/#!qm=All&q=FORESTHAB
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[19:33] <SpacenearUS> New vehicle on the map: 03BGS2 - 12http://tracker.habhub.org/#!qm=All&q=BGS2
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[19:50] <SpacenearUS> New position from 03BGS1 after 034 days silence - 12http://tracker.habhub.org/#!qm=All&q=BGS1
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[19:57] <arjunnaha> Upu, my PITS board is suddenly not transmitting even though the green light is flashing and can see the RTTY ssh sentences
[19:57] <Upu> sure its not transmitting ?
[19:57] <Upu> nothing on the SDR ?
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[19:57] <arjunnaha> Nothing at all, strange it was working like 10 mins ago
[19:58] <arjunnaha> Rebooted and bam! No radio
[19:58] <Upu> Make sure the board is seated correctly. Did you change the frequency ? Tune up to 434.650 to see if its there
[19:59] <arjunnaha> Board is on my desk, freq is same (434.250) and nothing on 434.650
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[19:59] <Upu> check its seated correctly give it a good push on the header
[20:00] <arjunnaha> nothing yet ;(
[20:00] <Upu> how are you powering the board ?
[20:00] <arjunnaha> Battery, let me change quickly
[20:02] <arjunnaha> I've changed, let's see
[20:02] <Upu> where are you launching from ?
[20:02] <arjunnaha> School
[20:03] <Upu> yeah I Know but where is that :)
[20:03] <arjunnaha> The Forest School in Wokingham ;-)
[20:03] <arjunnaha> Not any signal yet after green light
[20:03] <Upu> thats bloody odd
[20:04] <Upu> tune up and down on the SDR
[20:04] <arjunnaha> I mean it was working fine like 10 mins ago
[20:04] <Geoff-G8DHE-m> Have you tuned across the whole band?
[20:05] <arjunnaha> Found something, let me load up dl-flidigi
[20:05] <arjunnaha> *fldigi
[20:05] <arjunnaha> Boom. Done
[20:05] <arjunnaha> The freq is now at 434.644 even though settings are at 434.250
[20:05] <Upu> hmm
[20:06] <Upu> that means for some reason it hasn't switched frequency
[20:06] <Upu> is your PITS software bang up to date ?
[20:06] <Upu> that was a bug daveake fixed a while back
[20:06] <arjunnaha> Installed it a few weeks ago
[20:06] <Geoff-G8DHE-m> That's close to 434.650 only 6khz low!
[20:06] <arjunnaha> Like when we had that massive troubleshooting session
[20:07] <Upu> ping daveake
[20:07] <arjunnaha> Is that freq drift?
[20:07] <daveake> pong
[20:07] <daveake> reboot it
[20:07] <Upu> read back
[20:07] <daveake> have done
[20:07] <daveake> reboot it
[20:07] <Upu> rgr
[20:07] <Upu> :)
[20:07] <arjunnaha> Doing so now Captain Akerman
[20:07] <arjunnaha> ;-)
[20:09] <arjunnaha> Still at 4343.644
[20:09] <arjunnaha> *434.250
[20:09] <arjunnaha> *434.644
[20:09] <arjunnaha> Blast
[20:09] <daveake> OK what have you changed ?
[20:09] <arjunnaha> I haven't touch the config file since install
[20:10] <daveake> OK but what have you changed?
[20:10] <arjunnaha> Nothin'
[20:10] <daveake> (c) every customer ever
[20:10] <arjunnaha> lol
[20:11] <daveake> OK, try power off then on again
[20:11] <arjunnaha> Sound like Microsoft Tech Support
[20:11] <arjunnaha> Right, one sec
[20:11] <Upu> haha
[20:11] <fsphil> no, tech support in general
[20:11] <Upu> how to make friends and influence people :)
[20:11] <arjunnaha> Have you tried turning it on and off?
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[20:12] <fsphil> no no no
[20:12] <fsphil> off and on
[20:12] <fsphil> you're fired
[20:12] <arjunnaha> Bam
[20:12] <arjunnaha> Still at bloody 434.644
[20:12] <Upu> got a spare SD card ?
[20:13] <arjunnaha> Might do, it's a pretty decent one in now though
[20:13] <arjunnaha> Its like a sandisk extreme pro
[20:13] <Upu> I'd remove it
[20:13] <Upu> put it to one side you can still fly that
[20:13] <Upu> quickly make a new one and install PITS
[20:13] <Upu> leave everything as it is default and see if it works
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[20:14] <Lunar_Lander> I could show something in the meantime if interesting for the people here
[20:14] <Upu> intermission with Lunar
[20:14] <Upu> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9hmDZz5pDOQ
[20:14] <Lunar_Lander> F2 taking shape with sensor tubes attached to payload box https://drive.google.com/file/d/0B1lke6hPHKJDYndicTRQd2xjRUU/view?usp=sharing
[20:15] <Upu> click that
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[20:15] <Geoff-G8DHE-m> Oh icecreams
[20:15] <Upu> and away you go Lunar_Lander
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[20:15] <Lunar_Lander> :D nice
[20:15] <daveake> arjunnaha Is this Pi networked?
[20:15] <daveake> If so, unplug the network and reboot
[20:16] <arjunnaha> No, had a wireless adapter but took that out yesterday
[20:16] <daveake> ok fine
[20:16] <arjunnaha> Thank you 1gb/s internet
[20:16] <mclane_> Lunar_Lander: what is in the tubes?
[20:17] <Upu> don't loose that other SD because if there is a genuine issue we'd like to look at it
[20:17] <Lunar_Lander> each has a small piece of protoboard with a ds18b20 and a hih-5031 and hih-6121
[20:21] <arjunnaha> Computer says no
[20:21] <arjunnaha> 4gb card comes up as 3.9gb and can't flash it
[20:24] <arjunnaha> Found another card
[20:26] <mclane_> Lunar_Lander: try Bosch BME280: T, p and rel. humidity in a tiny package with I2c or SPI interface
[20:28] <Lunar_Lander> yea
[20:28] <Lunar_Lander> the new one
[20:28] <mclane_> http://www.pirnay.com/cache/4/d4c161d79d5a674a7a44d5a6fd772760.jpg
[20:29] <mclane_> works fine
[20:29] <Upu> yeah I used that on a recent data logger
[20:29] <Upu> where did you get it from mclane_ ?
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[20:29] <mclane_> mouser
[20:30] <mclane_> http://www.mouser.de/ProductDetail/Bosch-Sensortec/BME280/?qs=sGAEpiMZZMsF1ODjcwEocB0teEbUEBlMe2ty%252bXJvNLw%3d
[20:31] <mclane_> soldering was a little bit tricky
[20:32] <mclane_> still needs to be flown - if job & weather is permitting it
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[20:33] <Upu> ta
[20:35] <Lunar_Lander> thanks mclane_ :)
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[20:38] <michal_f> do you think that switching from 300baud to 50 baud after landing is a good idea? helps in recovery ?
[20:40] <Upu> will certainly help if the signal is weak
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[20:45] <Lunar_Lander> oh he left
[20:45] <Lunar_Lander> well the pressure measurement is a bit redundant so to speak
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[20:54] <michal_f> Do you have any preferences for a chasecar roof antenna ?
[20:55] <michal_f> 5/8L 1/2L ? anything ?
[20:55] <michal_f> this will be connected to upu's preamp
[20:55] <Upu> Diamond MR-77S
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[20:56] <michal_f> thanks, that was my choice too :)
[20:56] <Geoff-G8DHE> I use a Comet SBB-4 works fine for me.
[20:57] <michal_f> there's also a 73s that's half the price... from specs iit seems to differ only in ouput power. and looks a little different
[20:57] <Lunar_Lander> Upu, were you satisfied with the bme280?
[20:57] <Upu> not used it yet
[20:57] <Upu> its on an unfinsihed untested design
[20:58] <Lunar_Lander> ah
[20:59] <Lunar_Lander> a prototype
[21:00] <Lunar_Lander> like this one https://drive.google.com/file/d/0B1lke6hPHKJDS2VWUzFLVUc5SWM/view?usp=sharing
[21:00] <Upu> that chip antenna will never work there Lunar_Lander
[21:01] <Lunar_Lander> the breakout on the breadboard?
[21:01] <Upu> yep
[21:01] <Lunar_Lander> that's not connected and used
[21:01] <Upu> http://imgur.com/MKqpv4M
[21:01] <Lunar_Lander> that verboard thing is a heating that my colleague Eugen built
[21:01] <Lunar_Lander> nice :)
[21:02] <Lunar_Lander> so that on the pic is not a tracker
[21:02] <Lunar_Lander> :)
[21:02] <Lunar_Lander> on my pic
[21:03] <Upu> tub of ice
[21:05] <Lunar_Lander> yea
[21:06] <Lunar_Lander> that was to test the thresholds of the heating, the idea was that the ds18b20 on the leads activates the heating (kanthal in that small box) when below 0°C and when either of the ds18b20 on the board go above 30°C, it turns off
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[21:14] <Lunar_Lander> I still think that thing is too complicated
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[21:16] <arjunnaha_> ping daveake
[21:17] <daveake> pong
[21:17] <arjunnaha_> I have done a fresh install on a new SD card but it is still broadcasting at 434.644 instead of 434.250
[21:18] <daveake> And this is the same Pi that worked earlier ?
[21:18] <arjunnaha_> Yes
[21:18] <daveake> nothing at all vageuly relevant has changed?
[21:19] <arjunnaha_> No, but I can try a different pi
[21:19] <daveake> ok
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[21:23] <tweetBot> @MalbikEndar: Apollo 13 re-entry revival by #ukhas https://t.co/7ybwb6W3r6
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[21:27] <Lunar_Lander> too complicated devices are bad
[21:29] <UoNMike> you spelled awesome wrong ;)
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[21:30] <Lunar_Lander> :D
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[21:31] <arjunnaha_> different pi, same freq
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[21:32] <arjunnaha_> daveake
[21:32] <daveake> kill the tracker program, run it manually, send me the startup log
[21:35] <arjunnaha_> http://pastebin.com/Dc3vQdgK
[21:36] <daveake> Looks fine
[21:36] <daveake> It is on a network, though you told me earlier it wasn't
[21:37] <arjunnaha_> It is now, because I had to setup the fresh install via ssh
[21:38] <daveake> ok
[21:38] <daveake> And you're 100% sure it's txing on 434.444 and not 434.250 ?
[21:39] <arjunnaha_> I'm 100% it's on 434.644
[21:40] <daveake> ok and it's transmitting data normally ?
[21:41] <arjunnaha_> Yes
[21:41] <daveake> OK I conclude a buggered MTX2 or the connection to it (enable pin)
[21:41] <daveake> Have a chat with Upu
[21:42] <arjunnaha_> ping Upu
[21:42] <Upu> its probably safe to fly albeit on 434.644
[21:42] <Upu> but once you've flown it can I get it back to test ?
[21:42] <arjunnaha_> Still a bit of an issue though, might drift.
[21:42] <arjunnaha_> I'm scared
[21:43] <Upu> no it won't it has the same frequency stability
[21:43] <daveake> NO won't drift
[21:43] <daveake> This is a fail to setup the mtx2
[21:43] <Upu> all thats happening is the MTX2 isn't getting the command to switch frequency
[21:43] <Upu> so its on its default
[21:43] <arjunnaha_> I need like a £1200, I'm sure kind of yes
[21:44] <Upu> Look with any of this there is a risk the electronics may fail
[21:44] <Upu> if you're not happy to launch it understand, cancel and post it back to me and i'll have a look at it.
[21:44] <Upu> however I'm fairly confident it will be fine
[21:45] <arjunnaha_> What's your returns policy?
[21:45] <Upu> post it back I'll fix it :)
[21:45] <Upu> if I can't fix it you'll get a new one
[21:45] <arjunnaha_> How quickly can that be done ;-)
[21:45] <Upu> I try do them in a day
[21:46] <Upu> when are you launching ?
[21:46] <arjunnaha_> Monday 12th
[21:46] <arjunnaha_> October
[21:46] <Upu> send it back special delivery tommorrow
[21:46] <Upu> I'll get it Wed
[21:46] <Upu> you should have it back by Thurs
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[21:47] <Upu> right I need to bed I've been up since 4am
[21:47] <Upu> night all
[21:47] <daveake> nn
[21:47] <arjunnaha_> Right, I'll do that then ;-)
[21:47] <arjunnaha_> lol
[21:47] <UoNMike> night
[21:47] <arjunnaha_> nn
[21:48] <arjunnaha_> Shall I return it to BD16 1PE?
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[21:55] <Lunar_Lander> night UoNMike
[21:55] <UoNMike> Night LL :) have a good one
[21:55] <Lunar_Lander> thanks you too :)
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[22:12] <michal_f> daveake: what was your lowest weight for a raspiTracker ?
[22:14] Nick change: fl_0 -> fl_0|afk
[22:16] <daveake> pits weights here http://www.pi-in-the-sky.com/index.php?id=support-faq
[22:17] <daveake> This one was lighter but I don't recall how much http://www.daveakerman.com/?p=1321
[22:23] <michal_f> I was pleased with my bare tracker weight until I started to add enclosure, chute and other stuff... nows its 450g
[22:23] <daveake> I think the total for the bear +capsule was less than that
[22:23] <michal_f> I guess I'll choose hwoyee 1200 for this
[22:38] <michal_f> according to calculator, 100g less weight gives just extra ~500 meters altitude. not much difference
[22:38] <michal_f> unless you're to break some record
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[00:00] --- Tue Oct 6 2015