highaltitude.log.20151004

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[00:33] <SpacenearUS> New vehicle on the map: 03CALLSIGN123_chase - 12http://tracker.habhub.org/#!qm=All&q=CALLSIGN123_chase
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[03:20] <jarod> http://tracker.habhub.org/#!mt=roadmap&mz=18&qm=1_day&mc=52.66485,6.72408&f=NLDPH01
[03:20] <jarod> it landed on the road? :O
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[06:02] <SpacenearUS> New vehicle on the map: 03EAGLE1 - 12http://tracker.habhub.org/#!qm=All&q=EAGLE1
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[06:09] <Bill_R> Good morning! Just wanted to ask for approval for flight document 'Glebe House School'... how do I do this?
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[06:59] <daveake> Bill_R If you /join #habhub and post the flight document ID there, someone will (possibly way in the future as it's early) approve it for you
[07:13] <Bill_R> Thanks very much Dave
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[07:29] <SM0ULC> morrn
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[07:41] <DL1SGP> good morning folks
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[08:10] <ntx2> Hello: looking for some help with decoding using dl-fl-digi
[08:11] <ntx2> I can hear the data coming in via gqrx but I do not see the waterfall in dl-fl-digi
[08:11] <ntx2> what might be the cause?
[08:11] <ntx2> in the past, I have been able to decode without any problems but suddenly something has occured which has made the waterfall disappear and dl-fl-digi does not decode anything
[08:12] <ntx2> I do not remember changing any dl-fl-digi settings
[08:14] <fsphil> check in pavucontrol that dl-fldigi is still recording from the sound cards output, not input
[08:16] <ntx2> checked...it says dl-fl-digi capture from Built in analog stereo
[08:16] Nick change: fl_0 -> fl_0|afk
[08:16] <ntx2> in the recording tab
[08:17] <fsphil> it needs to be "Monitor of ..."
[08:19] <ntx2> holycow
[08:19] <ntx2> that was it
[08:20] <ntx2> thank you
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[08:25] <PE2BZ> !flights
[08:25] <SpacenearUS> 03PE2BZ: Current flights: 03SP9UOB pico 20 - 144.250MHz DOMEX16 10(dc08)
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[08:36] <DL7AD> good morning
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[08:46] <SpacenearUS> New vehicle on the map: 03CALLSIGN123_chase - 12http://tracker.habhub.org/#!qm=All&q=CALLSIGN123_chase
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[08:52] <fsphil> this CALLSIGN123 person loves to travel
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[10:38] <tweetBot> @daveake: LORA3 recovered #ukhas http://t.co/bTbB5epidj
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[11:14] <G8FJG> Hi all. sitting at kitchen table with brand new RasPi and lora board ...loaded wheezy..loaded all the steps on Dave's page...all seems to work Except!
[11:15] <G8FJG> When I get to load sudo ./gateway I get nothing
[11:18] <G8FJG> no small blue screen.....Ideas ?....I know its difficult to diagnose remote ...but just some ideas ...Its been 30 years since I used Unix, and I was just a monkey then
[11:18] <G8FJG> I feel like the monkey now
[11:19] <G8FJG> ps using the Raspi and wifi to get access to WWW , that was a Triumph!!
[11:19] <craag> G8FJG: So you're logged in with putty?
[11:19] <G8FJG> Putty?
[11:20] <craag> err
[11:20] <craag> are you working directly on the pi (with a screen)?
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[11:20] <G8FJG> remember I'm just a monkey typing
[11:20] <craag> or logged in over the network
[11:20] <G8FJG> yes using the Pi
[11:20] <craag> (I forget you can plug a screen in sometimes lol)
[11:20] <craag> ok
[11:21] <craag> when you type 'sudo ./gateway' does it give you another prompt?
[11:21] <craag> as if the command has finished?
[11:21] <G8FJG> I'll have a look think its an error message , hang on
[11:22] <craag> ok, tell me the gist of it
[11:22] <G8FJG> sudo: ./gateway: command not found
[11:22] <craag> what folder path are you in?
[11:23] <G8FJG> hang on foe the monkey to type
[11:23] <G8FJG> r
[11:23] <craag> np :)
[11:25] <craag> 'pwd' will give you the path you're in
[11:25] <Geoff-G8DHE-Lap> why the colon ? after sudo ?
[11:25] <craag> colon?
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[11:25] <Geoff-G8DHE-Lap> Oh just realised its the response nit his command
[11:26] <craag> yeah, it's saying it can't find gateway in the current folder
[11:26] <Geoff-G8DHE-Lap> but there is a : after sudo itself never spotted that myself
[11:27] <G8FJG> still monkeying around. might be a problem higher up the tree
[11:27] <craag> G8FJG: I think you're in the wrong folder
[11:28] <G8FJG> pi@G8FJG ~/lora-gateway $ make gcc -c gateway.c gateway.c:3:23: fatal error: curl/curl.h: No such file or directory compilation terminated. makefile:5: recipe for target 'gateway.o' failed make: *** [gateway.o] Error 1
[11:28] <craag> ok so you need to install libcurl-dev
[11:28] <craag> 'sudo apt-get install libcurl-dev' maybe?
[11:29] <G8FJG> I think / thought I'd done that
[11:29] <G8FJG> libcurl-dev when well
[11:29] <G8FJG> when= went
[11:32] <craag> ok, can you link me to the guide you followed?
[11:32] <G8FJG> after installing libcurl4 , it installed ok , just reported that 2 of the urls were 404
[11:32] <G8FJG> http://www.daveakerman.com/?p=1719
[11:32] <craag> ok
[11:33] <craag> try 'make' again?
[11:34] <G8FJG> tried "make" in lora-gateway $ got...pi@G8FJG ~/lora-gateway $ make gcc -c gateway.c gateway.c:3:23: fatal error: curl/curl.h: No such file or directory compilation terminated. makefile:5: recipe for target 'gateway.o' failed make: *** [gateway.o] Error 1
[11:37] <G8FJG> I've got the lora-gateway folder containing the gateway txt folder , that I can personalise
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[11:44] <SM0ULC> try a make clean also
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[12:06] <G8FJG> Thanks for all the help ...working a treat ..ice pack on balding? head..
[12:06] <mfa298> G8FJG might be worth an 'sudo apt-get update' before installing the packages. It could be the package metadata is out of date
[12:07] <craag> mfa298: that was exactly it ;)
[12:08] <G8FJG> mfa298 right on the money!!
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[12:14] <tweetBot> @daveake: LORA1 missing presumed eaten by aliens. Or sheep. No signal and not at landing position n. #ukhas
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[13:27] <Lunar_Lander> hello
[13:27] <Lunar_Lander> just had a fascinating read
[13:27] <Lunar_Lander> http://www.bbc.com/future/story/20150824-how-a-nazi-rocket-could-have-put-a-briton-in-space
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[13:29] <MikeUoN> great article, yeah
[13:29] <MikeUoN> kind of sad too
[13:29] <Lunar_Lander> yeah
[13:29] <Lunar_Lander> it would have been a bold plan, but one that was feasible
[13:30] <MikeUoN> alas...
[13:31] <MikeUoN> And then of course, there's the whole Black Arrow 'thing'...
[13:32] <Lunar_Lander> yeah
[13:32] <Lunar_Lander> a quite weak rocket that was scrapped after it fulfilled its job
[13:32] <MikeUoN> ONly country to develop a satellite launch capability and then give it up...
[13:32] <Lunar_Lander> yeah
[13:33] <Lunar_Lander> and the Europa I&II story
[13:33] <MikeUoN> I think I read somewhere taht they got the message to cancel shortly before a launch. But they went ahead with it anyway, just to prove it would work...
[13:33] <MikeUoN> Not heard that one, I think
[13:34] <Lunar_Lander> the first attempt at an european rocket
[13:34] <Lunar_Lander> the british Blue Streak coupled to a french second stage and german third stage
[13:34] <MikeUoN> :(
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[13:35] <Lunar_Lander> one problem was that the manuals were in the supplying countries language so that the people at Woomera had a hard time on preperation
[13:35] <Lunar_Lander> at least so I read
[13:35] <MikeUoN> d'oh, yeah that would make things harder
[13:35] <Lunar_Lander> yea
[13:35] <MikeUoN> Now it's up to Reaction Engines and skylon... ;)
[13:35] <Lunar_Lander> :)
[13:36] <Lunar_Lander> https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Europa_%28rocket%29
[13:37] <MikeUoN> thanks!
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[13:38] <michal_f> hi
[13:38] <michal_f> any recomendations for a magmount car antenna, for 70cm ?
[13:40] <Lunar_Lander> you are welcome
[13:40] <michal_f> :]
[13:41] <michal_f> Can anyone, please, recommend a magmout car antenna, for 70cm ?
[13:41] <michal_f> was that better ?;]
[13:41] <Lunar_Lander> ah sorry, I was replying to someone else
[13:41] <michal_f> hehe, ok
[13:41] <Lunar_Lander> :)
[13:42] <michal_f> but now you have to tell us, what antenna you have
[13:42] <Lunar_Lander> MikeUoN, the claim that F8 reached orbit is not correct as far as I know (under Project History)
[13:42] <Lunar_Lander> I got a 70cm yagi
[13:42] <Lunar_Lander> one made of alumium
[13:42] <Lunar_Lander> aluminum
[13:42] <Lunar_Lander> :)
[13:42] <Lunar_Lander> no car antenna unfortunately :(
[13:45] <MikeUoN> i dont have a car so... :/
[13:45] <MikeUoN> which was F8
[13:46] <MikeUoN> I was thinking of Prospero, which worked in orbit for like 2 years I think
[13:47] <Lunar_Lander> yea
[13:47] <Lunar_Lander> Europa I F8, from the chart in the wikipedia article
[13:47] <MikeUoN> ooh sorry, i was on a different wavelength lol
[13:51] <Lunar_Lander> no problem :)
[13:55] <Lunar_Lander> the european program was quite important, because due to the failures, the Symphonie 1 and 2 satellites were launched by Delta, but the Americans said, the satellites may only be used experimentally and not commericially
[13:55] <Lunar_Lander> Ariane then was a step to independence
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[13:57] <MikeUoN> nice
[13:59] <Lunar_Lander> yea
[14:01] <SpacenearUS> New vehicle on the map: 03Ary-mobile_chase - 12http://tracker.habhub.org/#!qm=All&q=Ary-mobile_chase
[14:04] <SpacenearUS> New position from 03K6RPT-11 after 032 days silence - 12http://tracker.habhub.org/#!qm=All&q=K6RPT-11
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[14:10] <michal_f> !flights
[14:10] <SpacenearUS> 03michal_f: Current flights: 03SP9UOB pico 20 - 144.250MHz DOMEX16 10(dc08)
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[14:28] <SpacenearUS> New vehicle on the map: 03N5YML-7 - 12http://tracker.habhub.org/#!qm=All&q=N5YML-7
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[14:32] <arjunnaha> Just a quick question, with the AirProducts large tank, is one able to carry it in a car?
[14:32] <arjunnaha> Or will I be better off with delivery?
[14:33] <daveake> Large being which ?
[14:33] <daveake> N30 ?
[14:33] <tweetBot> @daveake: Went out to find 3 balloons; came back with many more ... #UKHAS http://t.co/DTv88O9Uf7
[14:33] <arjunnaha> Dunno, but http://balloonhelium.co.uk/products/product/6094
[14:33] <arjunnaha> Large being Balloon Helium large
[14:33] <daveake> That's a BOC T
[14:34] <daveake> Yes fine in a car
[14:34] <arjunnaha> Ah, mfa28 said he received an AirProducts tank...
[14:34] <daveake> They do both
[14:35] <daveake> These are air products http://www.click4balloons.co.uk/helium-gas-499-c.asp
[14:35] <daveake> Note they look very different
[14:36] <arjunnaha> I'll have to see what they give me!
[14:46] <SpacenearUS> New vehicle on the map: 03horizon 3_chase - 12http://tracker.habhub.org/#!qm=All&q=horizon%203_chase
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[15:03] <SpacenearUS> New vehicle on the map: 03KF6RFX-3 - 12http://tracker.habhub.org/#!qm=All&q=KF6RFX-3
[15:03] <SpacenearUS> New vehicle on the map: 03KF6RFX-11 - 12http://tracker.habhub.org/#!qm=All&q=KF6RFX-11
[15:17] <sburg> I'm going to assume -3 and -11 are the same balloon
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[15:27] <Lunar_Lander> btw
[15:28] <Lunar_Lander> I guess I never showed the flight report for F1
[15:28] <Lunar_Lander> or does someone remember that I did?
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[15:32] <Lunar_Lander> well
[15:32] <Lunar_Lander> here it is https://myshare.uni-osnabrueck.de/f/1dafb2db3f/
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[15:34] <G8fjg> just testing raspi now in shack ......for wifi connectivity
[15:37] <sburg> nope, they're different. one down, one still going
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[15:49] Nick change: Jartza_ -> Jartza
[15:51] <MikeUoN> thanks Lunar_Lander , having a read now
[15:51] <Lunar_Lander> you're welcome :)
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[16:07] <SpacenearUS> New vehicle on the map: 03CALLSIGN123_chase - 12http://tracker.habhub.org/#!qm=All&q=CALLSIGN123_chase
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[16:18] <MikeUoN> what would happen if someone accidently put something in space?
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[16:20] <MikeUoN> Like, "oh no, the thing I mean to go to 90km went to 101km"
[16:21] <craag> by what transport?
[16:21] <MikeUoN> rockoon
[16:22] <craag> heh I wonder what insurance quote you'd get for 15s in space
[16:22] <MikeUoN> lol indeed
[16:23] <MikeUoN> my understanding is that if you want to put something above 100km your into outerspace treaty and UK space agency 'waters'
[16:24] <craag> and if it's uk registered you need insurance :)
[16:25] <craag> hence why the uk's latest funcube cubesats are owned on paper by the dutch :P
[16:25] <MikeUoN> but what if you thought it would only get to 90km, but it just crept over 100km?
[16:25] <MikeUoN> lol :P
[16:25] <craag> If it's unforeseeable, then I think they'd let you off
[16:26] <craag> But if you know ahead of time that there's a chance, you'd get done :P
[16:26] <MikeUoN> fair enough :P
[16:26] <craag> and by discussing it on a publicly logged channel, you're firmly in the second category ;)
[16:26] <MikeUoN> indeed so.
[16:26] <MikeUoN> xD
[16:27] <SpacenearUS> New vehicle on the map: 03KC9PON-11 - 12http://tracker.habhub.org/#!qm=All&q=KC9PON-11
[16:27] <MikeUoN> If you dont hear from me in the next week, you'll know the men in black came for me...
[16:27] <craag> you're doing a rockoon in the next week??
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[16:29] <MikeUoN> i wish :P
[16:29] <MikeUoN> was purely hypothetical
[16:29] <craag> heh
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[16:32] Nick change: [1]michal_f -> michal_f
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[16:48] <DL7AD> good evening :)
[16:49] <MikeUoN> hi :)
[16:49] <MikeUoN> how are you doing?
[16:50] <DL7AD> MikeUoN: hi.yeah fine. just came from the maker faire in berlin
[16:50] <MikeUoN> oh cool! how was it?
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[16:51] <DL7AD> we did ssdv there today and yesterday
[16:51] <MikeUoN> do/see/get any cool stuff?
[16:51] <MikeUoN> neat
[16:51] <DL7AD> pick&place machines for ¬5000
[16:51] <MikeUoN> :O
[16:51] <MikeUoN> one more order of magnitude to come down and I might start considering one :P
[16:52] <DL7AD> me 2! :D
[16:52] <DL7AD> have a look for www.smallsmt.biz
[16:53] <MikeUoN> cor blimey
[16:53] <MikeUoN> that looks beautiful
[16:54] <Lunar_Lander> hi DL7AD
[16:54] <DL7AD> http://ssdv.habhub.org/images/2015-10-04--12-19-21-DL4MDW-3909.jpeg?u=46
[16:55] <DL7AD> the green car is our Funkwagen (engl. radio car)
[16:55] <DL7AD> hi Lunar_Lander
[16:56] <craag> funkwagen is a far better word :D
[16:56] <MikeUoN> super toll!
[16:56] <Lunar_Lander> :D
[16:57] <DL7AD> Lunar_Lander: did you get my lettter?
[16:57] <Lunar_Lander> yea thanks :)
[16:57] <Lunar_Lander> sorry that I didn't mention it earlier
[16:58] <DL7AD> finally https://drive.google.com/file/d/0BwzVllHCGu5FWGlnQTI2dlhCbU0/view?usp=sharing
[17:02] <MikeUoN> LOL
[17:03] Nick change: fl_0|afk -> fl_0
[17:05] <MikeUoN> is taht a train station in the background
[17:05] <DL7AD> yep
[17:06] <DL7AD> actually there are 2 train stations
[17:06] <DL7AD> MikeUoN: Ostbahnhof (Eastern station) and Postbahnhof (Mail/Parcel station). but Postbahnhof is not active anymore
[17:06] <MikeUoN> cool, thanks
[17:07] <DL7AD> at that's were the maker faire took place
[17:07] <MikeUoN> the roofs are pretty cool
[17:14] <Laurenceb__> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=001IXnp0ogc
[17:15] <arjunnaha> How accurate is the Southampton Uni ASTRA compared to the CUSF?
[17:16] <craag> they're about equal I think - easier to use the cusf one though
[17:17] <arjunnaha> The ASTRA has more variable inputs, so mentally feels better but who knows?!
[17:18] <craag> each model some bits better than the other I think
[17:18] <craag> I'm ex-southampton uni and I use cusf :P
[17:19] <chris_99> Laurenceb__, which motors have you used out of interest, i just got a simulator for engines, i've been playing with, and it looks like the ones that take the rocket to 150km, are probably extremely expensive?
[17:19] <arjunnaha> lol
[17:19] <Laurenceb__> chris_99: currently planning on Cesaroni Pro29 1 grain
[17:19] <Laurenceb__> Classic propellant
[17:20] <Laurenceb__> in custom CF casing
[17:20] <chris_99> Cool, what kind of apogee are you expecting with that?
[17:22] <Laurenceb__> 160km or so
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[17:25] <chris_99> awh it doesn't seem to have any of those motors in the database
[17:26] <Laurenceb__> lol its a custom "motor"
[17:26] <Laurenceb__> what software are you playing with?
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[17:27] <chris_99> oh i tell a lie, it does actually, just the search function is poor heh, OpenRocket
[17:28] <Laurenceb__> ah yeah OpenRocket
[17:28] <Laurenceb__> I dont trust it
[17:28] <Laurenceb__> well - basic drag etc seems to work, but spin stabilisation behaves strangely
[17:28] <Laurenceb__> I dont think they ever tested it with spin stabilised rockets
[17:29] <chris_99> ah, interesting, it does also mention that the calculations are iffy around mach 1 iirc
[17:29] <Laurenceb__> thats taken as given
[17:29] <chris_99> why is that though?
[17:29] <Laurenceb__> shock waves are complex
[17:30] <chris_99> ah
[17:30] <Laurenceb__> if you want something that can beat 100km in openrocket, try the aerotech single use motors
[17:30] <Laurenceb__> I decided not to use those for a rockoon as they have asymmetric grain and are a pita to ignite
[17:31] <chris_99> heh, a pain in what way?
[17:32] <Laurenceb__> well it seems they rarely ignite on the ground under ideal conditions...
[17:33] <chris_99> ah, what kind of igniters do you use, is it something like nichrome+..?
[17:34] <Laurenceb__> the stock Cesaroni igniters, i.e. MJG J-Tek igniters
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[17:35] <Laurenceb__> but Cesaroni motors have a pressed black powder liner inside the APCP propellant
[17:35] <Laurenceb__> they solve the problem the pro way
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[17:36] <chris_99> interesting
[17:39] <chris_99> i've got something similar to http://www.aeroconsystems.com/motors/Screamer_folder/screamer.htm but the gas always seems to leak out the top as far as i can tell
[17:41] <Laurenceb__> Total Impulse - 11 NS approx.
[17:41] <Laurenceb__> thats aweful
[17:41] <chris_99> yeah it's a lot lower than the ones you're dealing with heh
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[17:44] <MikeUoN> Awesome video.
[17:45] <MikeUoN> What is the rough mass of the entire rocket you will send up (roughly).
[17:46] <Laurenceb__> 50grams
[17:48] <MikeUoN> nice
[17:52] <Maxell> michal_f: for chasing?
[17:52] <Maxell> whoops scrollbuffer
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[19:41] <arjunnaha> Silly question, but what is the Hz shift?
[19:42] <craag> arjunnaha: frequency distance between the two rtty lines
[19:42] <craag> ie the amount it 'shifts' from one to the other
[19:43] <arjunnaha> Is there a way to 'measure' it?
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[19:43] <mclane_> 0's and 1's are represented by 2 different frequencies separated by the shift
[19:43] <mclane_> you can see it on the waterfall in dl-fldigi
[19:44] <craag> the waterfall in dl-fldigi has frequency divisions marked along the top
[19:44] <arjunnaha> Ah, thanks
[19:44] <craag> you're looking for the difference between the two lines
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[19:45] <arjunnaha> Got it!
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[19:47] <Laurenceb__> chris_99: if you are interested in off the shelf motors, there may be a way to beat 100km
[19:47] <Laurenceb__> these things http://www.modelrockets.co.uk/shop/klima-model-rocket-motors/d3-six-pack-18mm-rocket-glidercar-motor-p-3310.html
[19:48] <chris_99> cheers, i'll have a look
[19:49] <Laurenceb__> they have higher ISP than Estes
[19:49] <Laurenceb__> http://www.neu.raketenmodellbau-klima.de/Download_Dateien/Motorflyer_DINA4.pdf
[19:49] <Laurenceb__> but youd need a CW tracker about 2.5gram mass to fit on the top
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[19:52] <chris_99> do you use any simulator out of interest, can you recomend something, i can plug data into, to get a better feel for different motors?
[19:52] <Laurenceb__> just random matlab code
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[19:53] <chris_99> aha
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[19:57] <Lunar_Lander> hm
[19:57] <Lunar_Lander> nasaspaceflight discusses going to Phobos in 2033 and Mars in 2039
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[20:09] <fsphil> cool
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[20:12] <Lunar_Lander> yea
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[20:14] <Laurenceb__> hopefully I can find the CE documentation for Klima rocket motors
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[20:15] <Babs_> Evening everyone - with the mtx2 http://www.radiometrix.com/files/additional/mtx2.pdf , i'm supplying it at 3v3, but can i toggle the txd /activitate the en high from an atmega328 running on 1.8v logic?
[20:16] <Upu> probably
[20:16] <Upu> try it ?
[20:16] <Upu> or just use a transistory switch thing
[20:16] <Babs_> Hey anthony
[20:17] <Babs_> i've got it set up on a pcb in eagle
[20:17] <Upu> best to try it
[20:17] <Babs_> so its a one way try i guess if i get it printed
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[20:18] <Babs_> it says "TXD DC coupled input for 3V CMOS logic. Rin=47k& " which i didn't think looked promising
[20:18] <Upu> that will work
[20:18] <fsphil> you just get let range on the shift
[20:18] <Upu> EN not sure will need testing
[20:19] <Babs_> but the toggle on rxd should? (it shoud be possible to hotwire the en i guess)
[20:19] <Babs_> if the en didn't work on 1.8
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[20:20] <fsphil> rxd is an analogue input
[20:20] <Babs_> hey fsphil. so, the worst is that i don't get the full range?
[20:20] <fsphil> yeah
[20:21] <fsphil> 0-3v is the max shift, (25khz? can't remember now)
[20:21] <Babs_> are there implications for that further down the road or does fl-digi etc. correct for that
[20:21] <fsphil> rtty normally uses a very tiny voltage shift
[20:21] <fsphil> so you'll be fine
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[20:22] <fsphil> but yea, EN I've no idea on
[20:22] <Babs_> ok great, or presumably just don't a 0 ohm resistor through it (or at least a lower one than the 330 ohm one i used when i did it on 3v3)
[20:22] <Babs_> the en is easy to bridge i guess
[20:23] <fsphil> how are you driving it? uart or pwm?
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[20:23] <Babs_> as the mtx2 is one of the few through hole components on it
[20:23] <Babs_> pwm
[20:23] <fsphil> ah then you just need to adjust that
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[20:24] <Babs_> adjust the what?
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[20:24] <fsphil> you can imagine the pwm as an analogue output
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[20:25] <fsphil> the same settings on 3.3v would work on 1.8v with a smaller variation between 0 and 1
[20:26] <fsphil> adjust the duty*
[20:26] <Babs_> thats in the code right?
[20:26] <Babs_> will find it
[20:27] <fsphil> yeah. not sure how you're donig it
[20:27] <fsphil> arduino probably has its own function
[20:28] <Babs_> ok cool thanks. finished my solar powered tracker thingy
[20:28] <Babs_> http://imgur.com/Swul7Mh
[20:28] <craag> Looking neat Babs_ !
[20:29] <Babs_> its teeny tiny
[20:29] <Babs_> unless you are sven, in which case its like an oil tanker
[20:29] <Babs_> thanks craag
[20:29] <fsphil> lol
[20:30] <craag> I'd suggest putting a ground polygon on the top around the ublox antenna
[20:30] <craag> rather than those 2 little tracks + vias
[20:30] <Babs_> ground on the top layer?
[20:31] <Babs_> i thought i had to keep the ground plane away from the antenna?
[20:32] <craag> yes..
[20:32] <Babs_> my wife: "why has it got a little p3nis on the top of it"?
[20:32] <Lunar_Lander> :D
[20:32] <craag> the ground plane on the bottom might be a bit close
[20:32] <craag> haha
[20:32] <mattbrejza> lol getting your monies worth when it comes to routing it out
[20:33] <Babs_> so i do a ground plane on the top, bring the ground plane on the bottom down a bit and then via the two together?
[20:33] <craag> That's what I'd do, yes
[20:33] <mattbrejza> if you want those programming things to snap off id suggest adding some little holes along the break line to make it easier
[20:33] <Babs_> ok cool thanks.
[20:34] <Babs_> mattbrejza - i don't have the skills to do it without it generating errors
[20:34] <Babs_> just dremeled it off the last time
[20:34] <mattbrejza> what errors does it give?
[20:35] <mattbrejza> you might just need to reduce the drill-dimension distance in the drc settings
[20:35] <Babs_> clearance
[20:35] <Babs_> clearance errors
[20:36] <mattbrejza> you can just ignore errors though
[20:36] <mattbrejza> the board house wont care if you have a hole in the middle of a trace
[20:36] <mattbrejza> or perhaps use vias if you want to be error free
[20:36] <Babs_> that gives me the fear. I expect if they come back and don't work the next time i load eagle up there will be a pop up saying
[20:36] <Babs_> "told you so"
[20:38] <Upu> the man on the routing machine at the fab will be sticking his milling bit in Babs dolls
[20:38] <Babs_> its symmetrical (almost) - thats enough for me
[20:39] <Babs_> you can make pretty rapid progress with it though. its my 3rd board - the first one looked like it was drawn by a 2 year old with a copper felt tip pen
[20:40] <Upu> better than mine then
[20:41] <mattbrejza> hmm i wouldnt mind doing a hand drawn board
[20:41] <mattbrejza> next medium compelxity board i might place everything, print it out, draw tracks, scan into eagle
[20:42] <Babs_> you haven't seen how many revisions its gone through upu....
[20:42] <Upu> lol so been there :)
[20:47] <MikeUoN> neat board!
[20:47] <MikeUoN> What microcontroller are you using, Babs_
[20:48] <Babs_> atmega328 - just the basic one everyone uses
[20:48] <MikeUoN> cool
[20:48] <Babs_> i do need to get back to stabilotron-II though. Nothing is going to delay that eclipse.
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[20:50] <adamgreig> mattbrejza: I wouldn't scan back into eagle :p
[20:50] <adamgreig> must be better ways to get gerbers
[20:50] <adamgreig> hand drawn boards are fun
[20:50] <adamgreig> riiight up until you make a single mistake...
[20:51] <mattbrejza> yea i guess you wont easily be able to work out if everything is connected correctly
[20:52] <adamgreig> lol, no DRC
[21:05] <MikeUoN> that would be a cool app for google glass for something, suddenly *caution tracks closer than xmm* :P
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[21:07] <zyp> I made a few hand drawn boards as a kid
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[21:10] <MikeUoN> dont know if anyone has seen these yet - 8400 Apollo images just released by nasa https://www.flickr.com/photos/projectapolloarchive/albums
[21:11] <russss> they are 99.9% already released
[21:12] <MikeUoN> ah well :P
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[21:17] <ntx2> !flights
[21:17] <SpacenearUS> 03ntx2: Current flights: 03SP9UOB pico 20 - 144.250MHz DOMEX16 10(dc08)
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[22:03] <cjdavies> Anybody here have experience in aerial structure from motion?
[22:03] <cjdavies> looking for first pointers for a friend
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[22:25] <Geoff-G8DHE> cjdavies, Not sure I understand what your asking - aerial structure from motion ?
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[22:32] <cjdavies> Geoff-G8DHE: flying an ultralight aircraft over a large geographic area, taking photographs downwards at set intervals, then running the photos through VisualSFM (or other) to produce a 3D map of the area
[22:34] <Geoff-G8DHE> Ah you don't mean a radio aerial then! Which is what we would normally expect on this channel ;-)
[22:35] <Geoff-G8DHE> Not sure I have heard of anybody doing the above on this channel, although it has a close relationship to producing 360VR shots in which I play!
[22:36] <cjdavies> Yes sorry for not being more specific; it's just when this guy asked me about it, this channel came to mind as somewhere that somebody might have a crossover interest :)
[22:37] <cjdavies> What do you mean by 360 VR, equirectangular panoramas I assume?
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[22:38] <Geoff-G8DHE> Yes see http://www.sphericalvisions.com
[22:41] <cjdavies> Nice, I spent 2 months on North Uist shooting sphericals :)
[22:41] <Geoff-G8DHE> There good fun aren't they, rather spoilt now with Googles lower quality offerings :-(
[22:45] <cjdavies> Though, hand a Google Cardboard to somebody at a museum & watch their jaw drop!
[22:46] <Geoff-G8DHE> Yes the first time most people are rather suprised ;-) I do agree!
[22:48] <cjdavies> Can I ask if you've ever exhibited your stuff 'offline'? Next year I'm going to need to do a physical exhibition involving them, but I am still pondering the best way to do so.
[22:49] <Geoff-G8DHE> I did some down in Plymouth during an event a few years ago projecting into an inflated dome "tent", not sure if the info is still online let me dig
[22:51] <cjdavies> Yeah I've come across the dome idea, but we probably aren't going to have the budget - it's a 3 month slot in a small museum so hiring even an 8ft high dome will probably be out of the question
[22:51] <SIbot> In real units: 8 ft = 2.44 m
[22:52] <cjdavies> snarky bot :p
[22:53] <Geoff-G8DHE> :) No searching the bookmarks doesn't come up with any given it was back in 2010
[22:54] <cjdavies> I chatted with a guy in Granada on Thursday who had done a lot of inflatable dome work, it seems perfect if your budget allows for it
[22:55] <Geoff-G8DHE> There have been some attempts to use large "golfballs" that you put your head inside from underneath, but never seen how they were doing the projection, nor the effects on users!
[22:55] <cjdavies> Atm we're thinking along the lines of having several stations with a computer & HMD each, but that makes it a largely singular experience nor suitable for a group in a museum
[22:56] <cjdavies> Mirroring the HMD display to a large flat projector might be an idea, but I'm not really sure
[22:56] <Geoff-G8DHE> The only other route is VR goggles then
[22:56] <cjdavies> Yeah, that's what I mean by HMD
[22:56] <Geoff-G8DHE> OK wasn't sure
[22:57] <Geoff-G8DHE> They don't suit all however, only tried a couple of times myself and find them rather claustrophobic and disorienting to be honest!
[22:59] <cjdavies> Yup, we've used them a bunch of times in outreach & while there are plenty that love them (especially young children) there are plenty that can't stand them
[23:00] <cjdavies> So relying upon them as the focal point of an exhibit would be a bad idea
[23:01] <Geoff-G8DHE> Have you met Aldo Hoeben or seen any of his works ?
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[23:02] <Geoff-G8DHE> He has used projections of spherical mirrors in the past to good effect http://fieldofview.com
[23:02] <Geoff-G8DHE> c/of/on/
[23:03] <cjdavies> I don't think so, but I've only been into spherical things for a few months (though VR for longer)
[23:04] <Geoff-G8DHE> Another method is to project from the inside of a spherical tent and the watch from the outside.
[23:05] <cjdavies> hm, now that's one I hadn't thought of
[23:05] <Geoff-G8DHE> Also this http://fieldofview.com/projects/panamorphosis-table
[23:06] <cjdavies> oh, now that is interesting
[23:06] <Geoff-G8DHE> Ah yes this was the one, he mapped the result of projecting of th sphere into any arbitary room http://fieldofview.com/projects/trajectum-lumen
[23:07] <Geoff-G8DHE> accounting for colour and the uneven walls etc it ran for a couple of years as I recall
[23:07] <cjdavies> ah, so a bit like projection mapping but to ignore the architecture rather than accentuate it
[23:07] <Geoff-G8DHE> thats it!
[23:07] <cjdavies> I'd never even considered such a thing, but it's rather inspired
[23:07] <cjdavies> the space I have to work with is almost completely white, which makes projection based approaches hopefully quite workable
[23:08] <cjdavies> I'll see if I can find the picture I took while I was there
[23:08] <Geoff-G8DHE> That does help a lot!
[23:08] Nick change: fl_0 -> fl_0|afk
[23:10] <cjdavies> https://goo.gl/photos/AgZ5DaeL4Uau23Cr8
[23:10] <cjdavies> that should be a public link
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[23:11] <Geoff-G8DHE> Yes that should be viable, maybe build a cube inside and project onto the six surfaces from the outside using a simple cubic projection ?
[23:12] <cjdavies> ah, yes!
[23:12] <cjdavies> I've done projection onto... I'm not sure what it's called
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[23:12] <cjdavies> in a nightclub venue, essentially large metal frames with a stretch diffuse white material inside
[23:12] <Geoff-G8DHE> That way you could get a few people inside without having to be too large or ventilation problems
[23:12] <cjdavies> we could build a cube out of that & project the four sides
[23:12] <cjdavies> a CAVE essentially
[23:13] <Geoff-G8DHE> yes that should work fine
[23:13] <cjdavies> this has been an unexpectedly useful chat, considering I came to ask a question for a friend on a completely unrelated topic :)
[23:14] <Geoff-G8DHE> Its suprising what you come across ;-)
[23:15] <cjdavies> IRC is a wonderful place that that
[23:15] <cjdavies> I mean, I originally ended up here ~3 years ago because somebody told me it was a good place to get info on a particular GPS module
[23:17] <Geoff-G8DHE> Ah just found some of the stuff it wa the ICCI festival http://www.plymouth.gov.uk/icci_360_festival.pdf
[23:18] <cjdavies> ah, so that was a multi projection dome rather than a single fisheye lensed or spherical mirroed projector
[23:18] <Geoff-G8DHE> Yes quite high res for the time
[23:19] <cjdavies> that's one of the things I was talking to this guy in Granada about - he generally uses the 270 degree approach with a spherical mirror on a single projector, but taht means he's limited to the resolution of a single high end DLP
[23:19] <cjdavies> so content choice/production has to be done intelligently
[23:20] <Geoff-G8DHE> I put up several of Sheffield Park through the seasons set to mussic of course
[23:20] <Geoff-G8DHE> which was quite fun organising! http://www.sphericalvisions.com/default.php?sp
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[23:21] <cjdavies> maybe if I keep at it for another decade my spherical portfolio will be a fraction of yours :)
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[23:23] <Geoff-G8DHE> Ha ha you need to look up Wille Kaemena and Don Bains efforts now there is volume and quality!
[23:24] <Geoff-G8DHE> Anyway must head off as need to be up reasonably early tomorrow! AFK
[23:24] <cjdavies> thanks for all your input tonight :)
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[00:00] --- Mon Oct 5 2015