highaltitude.log.20150713

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[07:59] <LunarWork> morning
[08:01] <chimpusmaximus> Morning
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[08:04] <LunarWork> 27 hrs to go to Pluto
[08:05] <chimpusmaximus> Not long
[08:06] <SpacenearUS> New position from 03DL7AD-12 after 03a day silence - 12http://tracker.habhub.org/#!qm=All&q=DL7AD-12
[08:06] <LunarWork> yea
[08:06] <LunarWork> this is history live
[08:07] <chimpusmaximus> Bit disappointed neither of my kids at school have even mentioned it being mentioned at school.
[08:08] <LunarWork> oh
[08:09] <chimpusmaximus> Probably does not help its near the end of term and not long since finished exams.
[08:11] <LunarWork> yea
[08:12] <LunarWork> brb reducing data
[08:24] <Vaizki> not to put a damper on the event or anything, there is very little value in watching events like these "live" .. :)
[08:25] <Vaizki> of course there is a feeling of human achievement, global community, our destiny in space etc.. but the real data will roll out much later
[08:27] <Vaizki> (and yes I know the hype is very important for funding in the U.S.)
[08:27] Nick change: fl_0 -> fl_0|afk
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[08:36] <edmoore> yes pictures matter
[08:37] <edmoore> even if they're not that sciencey
[08:37] <edmoore> i've observed this several times at work, whereby we gather real,ly high quality data
[08:37] <edmoore> but this is lost on the less technical customers until i turn them into a really colouyrful visulaisation
[08:37] <edmoore> then they get excited
[08:37] <edmoore> even better, videos
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[08:46] <ibanezmatt13> when you have buffers being manipulated by ISRs and various functions, must it be volatile?
[08:48] <infaddict> ibanezmatt13: any variable modified inside ISR must be declared as volatile
[08:49] <ibanezmatt13> now then, perhaps that is the issue I'm having :)
[08:49] <ibanezmatt13> A modified version to run on PC for debugging works fine
[08:49] <ibanezmatt13> But when USART ISR fires on chip, totally freezes
[08:49] <ibanezmatt13> but the buffers aren't volatile, so they must need to be. I'll try it thanks
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[08:53] <Vaizki> if you want to pastebin code or something, can take a quick peek :)
[08:54] <ibanezmatt13> sure
[08:54] <Vaizki> so many gotchas in ISRs etc
[08:54] <ibanezmatt13> http://pastie.org/10289454
[08:54] <ibanezmatt13> At the mo, I understand, the way I'm doing it is not greatly efficient, and is loosing data
[08:54] <ibanezmatt13> But just wanna get something going
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[08:55] <ibanezmatt13> I'm not sure if the ISR is too long, but tried to keep it as small as I could for this method
[08:55] <Vaizki> it's not too long
[08:56] <ibanezmatt13> So if no data is being received, it toggles the LED and transmits "timeout..." down the UART, which works
[08:56] <ibanezmatt13> when I introduce some data to the UART, it freezes and does nothing from that point until i reset
[08:56] <ibanezmatt13> I think it might be the volatile thing with the buffers
[08:58] <Vaizki> you don't cli() anywhere btw
[08:58] <Vaizki> so you are modifying those registers with interrupts enabled
[08:59] <Vaizki> so what happens when you run that on the avr?
[08:59] <ibanezmatt13> ok so initially I have no data going in to the UART deliberately, and so the LED toggles every 3 seconds, and it tx's "timeout..." over the UART which is great
[09:00] <ibanezmatt13> So then I plug the RX line of the chip into the TX of another I have programmed to send NMEA example strings at 1Hz
[09:00] <ibanezmatt13> Then the LED freezes in its current state, which is fine, but nothing at all comes out of serial
[09:00] <ibanezmatt13> if I remove the data input, it doesn't go back to toggling LED, which it should
[09:01] <ibanezmatt13> Just about to try the volatile thing now
[09:02] <Vaizki> you can toggle a GPIO pin in the ISR no problem.. for example every time it's called. so you know it's getting there
[09:02] <ibanezmatt13> yeah I've tried that and the USART_RX ISR definitely fires, but not as it should
[09:03] <Vaizki> maybe you want to start main() with a cli();
[09:03] <ibanezmatt13> hm, I didn't think about using cli()
[09:04] <ibanezmatt13> didn't think you were supposed to keep disabling then renabling
[09:04] <ibanezmatt13> I'll try it
[09:05] <Vaizki> no I mean in the start, disable them before you set up the usart and timer registers, then sei() like you do now
[09:05] <ibanezmatt13> ahh I see
[09:05] <Vaizki> what do you mean the ISR doesn't fire "as it should"?
[09:05] <ibanezmatt13> right, let's see what comes over the serial now...
[09:05] Nick change: fl_0 -> fl_0|afk
[09:06] <ibanezmatt13> I just touched the RX port wire and the LED has now frozen
[09:07] <ibanezmatt13> nah, getting nothing
[09:08] <ibanezmatt13> I suppose I don't know if it's firing like it should or not. I expected the LED to flash for longer, but the packets are fast so that means nothing
[09:10] <mfa298> If you've got another LED you can connect up, it might be worth having one thats always flashing at 1Hz or so, that way you can tell if the code is still running in some form.
[09:10] <Geoff-G8DHE_> won't you need to clear the irq flag before returning from the ISR ?
[09:10] <ibanezmatt13> yeah I could try that mfa298
[09:11] <ibanezmatt13> I think that might be done automatically Geoff-G8DHE_, I read somewhere but should check
[09:12] <mfa298> I think reading the URD register clears the interrupt as well
[09:12] <ibanezmatt13> Yeah
[09:12] <mfa298> or even UDR
[09:12] <Geoff-G8DHE_> Ugh so at any point after that you could have another IRQ come in ?
[09:13] <Vaizki> I think gcc generates ISR prologue and epilogue code automatically
[09:13] <ibanezmatt13> I'm not sure Geoff-G8DHE_
[09:13] <ibanezmatt13> so I've reset the chip and the LED is toggling to indicate timeout, yet it's receiving data at 1Hz... (confirmed by Salae)
[09:13] <mfa298> I had some issues in my code a while back, and the always blinking LED is a useful tool to see if the code it running or has crashed (it had crashed in my case)
[09:14] <ibanezmatt13> I'll try that mfa298, would be useful to see if it has actually crashed or just hung somwhere
[09:15] <ibanezmatt13> could shove PORTB ^= (1 << DEBUG_PIN); in the timer interrupt there. WOn't be 1Hz but should be ok
[09:15] <ibanezmatt13> well, for another pin :)
[09:16] <mfa298> another option might be having the LED toggled in the Timer ISR and then change the speed at which the timer fires depending on current state,
[09:17] <mfa298> although I wonder if LED toggle in ISR might act differently to toggling in the main() function is things do break
[09:18] <ibanezmatt13> hm not sure, I can try it
[09:24] <ibanezmatt13> think I may have just blown the chip up :P
[09:27] <ibanezmatt13> oh dear, Vaizki, the LED that toggles in the timer interrupt stops too when a byte is received...
[09:27] <daveake> We told you to be careful in ISRs :p
[09:28] <ibanezmatt13> I know :)
[09:28] <daveake> No, you won't have killed it with code
[09:30] <ibanezmatt13> I'm not sure daveake, now even after reset the LED doesn't toggle at all...
[09:31] <daveake> Just program with something simpler that just flashes the LED
[09:34] <ibanezmatt13> programmer's not happy now... the joys. I'll come back later when I get something working again :P
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[10:16] <SpacenearUS> New position from 03OM3BC-11 after 0315 hours silence - 12http://tracker.habhub.org/#!qm=All&q=OM3BC-11
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[10:43] Nick change: Wiktor -> WiKtOr
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[11:15] <SpacenearUS> New vehicle on the map: 03F5MVO-11 - 12http://tracker.habhub.org/#!qm=All&q=F5MVO-11
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[11:19] <F5MVO> Hello
[11:20] <F5MVO> It's ok today on tracker.habhub.org
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[11:51] Nick change: fl_0 -> fl_0|afk
[11:51] Nick change: fl_0|afk -> fl_0
[11:54] <SpacenearUS> New vehicle on the map: 03F1UFX_chase - 12http://tracker.habhub.org/#!qm=All&q=F1UFX_chase
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[12:25] <NSPACE1> floater question
[12:30] <gonzo_> just ask
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[12:55] <SpacenearUS> New vehicle on the map: 03pb0ahx_chase - 12http://tracker.habhub.org/#!qm=All&q=pb0ahx_chase
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[13:28] <KT5TK> Crazy: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_hYC-ukmlU0
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[13:53] <infaddict> KT5TK: crazy. wouldnt like to have been strolling around the fields when a chair and gun landed on me
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[14:02] <_charlie> lolwut
[14:03] <_charlie> cool, but if he just kept popping balloons so he gradually descended that would've been cooler :D
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[14:05] <infaddict> yep _charlie thats what I though the was gonna do
[14:05] <infaddict> unless he accidentally shot the attaching rope. i wouldve aimed for the outer balloons for this reason, and to minimise burst damage.
[14:06] <_charlie> yeah
[14:07] <_charlie> need to try one on a HAB - have a servo connected to the trigger or something ;)
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[14:19] <SpacenearUS> New vehicle on the map: 03MONDO-3 - 12http://tracker.habhub.org/#!qm=All&q=MONDO-3
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[14:59] <SpacenearUS> New vehicle on the map: 03F5APQ_chase - 12http://tracker.habhub.org/#!qm=All&q=F5APQ_chase
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[15:50] <Lunar_Lander> hello again
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[15:59] <garymortimer> Mondo is off
[15:59] <_charlie> :(
[15:59] <garymortimer> oh maybe not
[16:00] <NSPACE1> howzit Gary when you doing your next launch...
[16:00] <NSPACE1> i am chasing my tail at work.
[16:01] <NSPACE1> finished the tracker and nothing to do...
[16:02] <garymortimer> Well I'm waiting for there to a less wet probable ending to the flight so once this cold front is through I guess Pravin
[16:03] <NSPACE1> he he.. will catch that one. we should consider a nice remote high site i=with comms for remote tracking seeing how we have so litlle trackeing guys available.
[16:05] <garymortimer> Yeah we should, I guess we should try and target an area for consistent landings and put it there
[16:06] <garymortimer> sort of the Ladysmith, Harrismith Estcourt triangle
[16:07] <NSPACE1> the wind will play havoc now, so no luck for a consistent landing site. The strong south easter and then the northerly on a daily basis will create some issues. last week the high altitude winds were good for a local floater.
[16:07] <garymortimer> Yeah was too busy at work but will keep an eye out
[16:08] <NSPACE1> I want to do some tests with a small solar cell and a 3.6v rechargeable battery to see what can be done.. i would like to chase what PS46 has done...
[16:09] <_charlie> ^this
[16:09] <_charlie> I'm wondering about just removing the battery altogether and accepting silence at night
[16:10] <garymortimer> has that been done?
[16:10] <_charlie> no idea
[16:11] <craag> not intentionally afaik
[16:11] <_charlie> Just have to make sure nothing glitches up during dawn/dusk when it would be turning on and off
[16:11] <craag> some of the B-* batteries degraded so much they were effectively like that
[16:11] <garymortimer> did PS 46 get very close to the equator this time??
[16:11] <NSPACE1> yeah but the chance of not getting a reboot from the micro may be a strong concern. Maybe just keep the telemetry at longer intervals and then have a battery cutoff voltage that will silence the TX during low power conditions..
[16:12] <_charlie> yeah but then you are still carrying battery weight
[16:13] <NSPACE1> I chatted to Andy Nugen about his load on PS46, the totals with solar and battery was just 30grams?
[16:13] <_charlie> 30g D:
[16:13] <_charlie> thats massive wow
[16:14] <garymortimer> 46 has been flying for ages now, that in itself is an achievement
[16:14] <edmoore> how long?
[16:14] <_charlie> absolutely really very impreeive
[16:14] <edmoore> p.s. come to the concert, anyone thinking of
[16:14] <edmoore> concert? golly fingers have a mind of their own
[16:14] <edmoore> conference
[16:15] <garymortimer> would love to, bit of a comute
[16:15] <_charlie> like nearly 2 months now I think
[16:15] <_charlie> I wish I could, alas I can not :(
[16:15] <NSPACE1> The micro and radio gear ( a 3rd overtone crystal circuit the size on a thumbnail) can be a small part of it. PS 46 is over South America now doing another trip. Man that one was amazing.
[16:16] <garymortimer> Is it its 3rd time round with lots of hanging about a bit near the equator
[16:16] <_charlie> I have some boards ready to be made, but cannot get access to the reflow oven :(
[16:16] <NSPACE1> my oops the payload was 11g.
[16:17] <edmoore> _charlie: why not?
[16:17] <NSPACE1> the balloon 36 Qualatex foil balloon filled with Hydrogen.
[16:17] <_charlie> 11g sounds about right :D
[16:18] <_charlie> edmoore, I have only heard that uni has a reflow oven. Have been meaning to ask a technician about it, but they are never in when I get time to look for them.
[16:18] <edmoore> buy an argos toaster oven for £20
[16:18] <fsphil> they go ding. worth it
[16:18] <NSPACE1> i was thinking of my pico payload which is at 35g :-( some serous work here for now,.
[16:19] <garymortimer> I have a few 36's if you want to fly that payload Pravin
[16:19] <_charlie> I am tempted to buy my own, but I live in halls and we arent allowed to draw more than 1000W in our rooms :/
[16:19] <edmoore> what crapola
[16:20] <edmoore> i'd never have coped with that kind of restriction
[16:20] <NSPACE1> let em trim it further and i definately will take you up on that offer. PS dont forget about our high a_____ one as well.
[16:20] <fsphil> aah
[16:20] <fsphil> that's annoying
[16:20] <mattbrejza> sounds like some dodgy wiring
[16:20] <edmoore> yes
[16:20] <_charlie> Tell me about it, halls dont cook food in the holiday for us, and the pantries only have a microwave
[16:20] <mattbrejza> do they have the entire floor of a block of flats on one 30A ring main?
[16:21] <_charlie> Well it's a renovated stately home kind of place, so none of the utilities make sense
[16:21] <mattbrejza> persumably they dont actually measure your power usage, just use it at 'offpeak' times to prevent tripping anything
[16:22] <_charlie> There was a major water leak outside my room a few months ago, during which plumbers 'found' some pipes they didnt know existed
[16:22] <_charlie> One pipe was even just cut open ended
[16:23] <mattbrejza> sounds like your halls have 'character'
[16:23] <_charlie> i have no idea how they enforce the rule, but power did keep tripping during last semester
[16:23] <_charlie> 'character' is really awesome and cool
[16:23] <garymortimer> I won't forget Pravin and we must talk some more Dave Mc Cash has a suitable setup... Anyhoo I must make supper and listen to the Archers Omnibus! Laters all
[16:23] <_charlie> Until 'character' has been around for a couple of months :P
[16:23] <mattbrejza> persumably they check rooms every now and again and if you have a kettle then theyll blame you for tripping it
[16:23] <fsphil> UPS is handy for buildings with Character
[16:23] <_charlie> cya gary
[16:24] <_charlie> yeah, rooms are cleaned once a fortnight for us, so I presume they use that as a chance to look around
[16:24] <_charlie> Hence why I hide my canister of Helium under a massive pile of clothes in my cupboard XD
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[16:25] <_charlie> Before I got to move it into my lab
[16:25] <mattbrejza> i hope its not a big one (for your own safety)
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[16:27] <_charlie> was only like 75cm tall
[16:27] <_charlie> not too heavy
[16:27] <_charlie> But yeah, it's in a lab now
[16:28] <ike> <NSPACE1>The micro and radio gear ( a 3rd overtone crystal circuit the size on a thumbnail) can be a small part of it. PS 46 is over South America now doing another trip. Man that one was amazing. - can you show me link to this transmiter
[16:30] <mattbrejza> its probably something like this http://www.tradeofic.com/Circuit/3709-OVERTONE_CRYSTAL_OSCILLATOR.html
[16:31] <mattbrejza> then just attach a long bit of wire to the end and pull the crystal
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[16:33] <ike> yes you can make really small transmiter this way
[16:33] <_charlie> yeah
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[16:34] <ike> this looks small to http://www.ebay.com/itm/Smallest-SIM800L-GPRS-GSM-Module-Micro-Card-Board-Port-Onboard-Antenna-/281745579131?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_3&hash=item4199585c7b
[16:34] <_charlie> I've seen someone using rasp pi outputs to Tx with
[16:34] <arjunnaha> Does anyone have any experience launching from Cotsworld/Big Hills?
[16:34] <ike> but IDK if it's locked to chinise mobile networks ot it can work around the globe
[16:34] <edmoore> ike: gsm is probably a non-starter
[16:35] <edmoore> arjunnaha: vaguely, and infaddict does
[16:35] <edmoore> what's the qurestion?
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[16:37] <_charlie> bbs, need to go get sanwhich for dinner :/
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[16:55] <day> this is frickn awesome :O https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:Iris.ogg
[16:55] <day> front mounted camera of an IRIS-T air to air missle
[16:58] <_charlie> awesome
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[18:51] <Geoff-G8DHE_> !flights
[18:51] <SpacenearUS> 03Geoff-G8DHE_: Current flights: 03SP3OSJ 144.7MHz RTTY 100bd 450/7n2 10(b234)
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[19:53] <SpacenearUS> New vehicle on the map: 03TUX_chase - 12http://tracker.habhub.org/#!qm=All&q=TUX_chase
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[21:03] <SpacenearUS> New position from 03PS-46 after 0311 hours silence - 12http://tracker.habhub.org/#!qm=All&q=PS-46
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[21:24] <amell> cant wait for tomorrow morning. Pluto time
[21:24] <fsphil> hah
[21:25] <fsphil> we've waited YEARS. these next few days are awful
[21:25] <LazyLeopard> ...though it'll be a day or two more before we get to see any of it.
[21:25] <amell> will be a 600 pixels across image taken at 3.17am tomorrow. however long it takes to download.
[21:25] <amell> NH is sending that 600 pixel image over first thing.
[21:25] <fsphil> I think they've already downloaded the last data before the flyby silence
[21:26] <fsphil> stealth mode. sneaking up on the dwarf planet
[21:26] <amell> theres one more image due from lorri, that 600pix one. then silence.
[21:26] <amell> 1am wednesday is when it starts sending data again
[21:26] <fsphil> aaaages
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[21:27] <amell> dont mind waiting for the detailed images, just want to see this 600x600 image tomorrow am.
[21:28] <amell> saw that the DSN downloads are at 999 bytes/sec.
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[21:28] <fsphil> very specific
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[21:28] <fsphil> they should've pushed it for 1000 :)
[21:29] <amell> 6 minutes to download a 360k image
[21:29] <fsphil> that's very fast considering how far it is
[21:29] <fsphil> these early images seem to be jpegs. it's like the ultimate SSDV :)
[21:30] <amell> just checked, DSN isnt listening to NH which is surprising. more interested in voyager 1
[21:31] <mattbrejza> i thought the dsn says 2.1kbit/s down
[21:31] <mattbrejza> it was listening eariler today though
[21:31] <amell> seems to vary a bit.
[21:31] <mattbrejza> i wonder if that figure includes channel coding or not
[21:32] <amell> when i checked, NH was quieter than vgr1 at 4 x 10^-24 kW
[21:32] <fsphil> anyone with a big dish fancy trying to detect the carrier? :)
[21:32] <mattbrejza> thats -150dBm or so
[21:32] <mattbrejza> after the dish
[21:32] <fsphil> where's pjm when you need him
[21:33] <mattbrejza> voyager 2 was being recieved by a smaller dish though, might have more luck with that
[21:33] <amell> vgr1 currently 8x10^-23 kW
[21:34] <fsphil> -150dBm is insane
[21:34] <amell> 159b/s at 8.42Ghz
[21:34] <SpeedEvil> mattbrejza: They have two 1000b/s transmitters
[21:34] <SpeedEvil> mattbrejza: It was realised after launch that these are redundant normally, but because they have RHCP and LHCP coupling to the dish, you can run them at teh same time
[21:35] <mattbrejza> yea i read that :)
[21:35] <mattbrejza> but is that 1000b/s the over the air symbol rate * M, or the throughput after all the encoding/decoding?
[21:35] <amell> i dont understand that. MMS4 is currently downlinked at 2.5Mb/s - power received is 4x10^-55 kW
[21:36] <mattbrejza> i think its broken
[21:36] <mattbrejza> somewhat
[21:36] <amell> yeah, doesnt make sense
[21:37] <mattbrejza> tahts -480dBm
[21:37] <mattbrejza> thermal noise floor at 300K is -208dBJ for comparison
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[23:26] <amell> madrid DSN is setting up for NH right now.
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[00:00] --- Tue Jul 14 2015