highaltitude.log.20150706

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[06:37] <SpacenearUS> New position from 03F5KAV-11 after 0311 hours silence - 12http://tracker.habhub.org/#!qm=All&q=F5KAV-11
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[09:27] <Laurenceb> https://i.imgur.com/2XcEPvw.jpg
[09:28] <infaddic_> tidy shack ;-)
[09:29] <fsphil> lol
[09:29] <fsphil> "Hmmm... where did I put my keys..."
[09:29] <chimpusmaximus> Hey who got a photo of my office.
[09:40] <SpacenearUS> New vehicle on the map: 03WB2LJK-10 - 12http://tracker.habhub.org/#!qm=All&q=WB2LJK-10
[09:40] <SpacenearUS> New vehicle on the map: 03WB2LJK-11 - 12http://tracker.habhub.org/#!qm=All&q=WB2LJK-11
[09:41] <eroomde> it sort of foesn't look disorganized though
[09:41] <eroomde> i mean you can see floor space
[09:41] <eroomde> it just looks the the organization is extremely... fluid
[09:42] <eroomde> also that's definitely a toupé
[09:42] <lz1dev> i think he likes planes
[09:44] <lz1dev> and remotes
[09:44] <tweetBot> @G7IGB: School plans 2am balloon launch: Students at Queen Mary's Grammar School, Walsall... http://t.co/Hx1dN41yA8 #hamradio #ukhas
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[10:35] <SpacenearUS> New vehicle on the map: 03WB2LJK-11 - 12http://tracker.habhub.org/#!qm=All&q=WB2LJK-11
[10:37] <eroomde> i needz him
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[12:21] <F5MVO> Hello, how i can to retransmit a weather balloon on habhub tracker ?
[12:25] <F5MVO> it's quiet
[12:26] <infaddic_> hi F5MVO. do u have a payload/flight that you want to show on the tracker?
[12:27] <F5MVO> no, it's just for retransmitt weather ballon like Hertsmonceux
[12:28] <UpuWork> I think fsphil did it once?
[12:30] <F5MVO> like this : http://tracker.habhub.org/#!mt=roadmap&mz=10&qm=1_day&f=F5KAV-11
[12:30] <fsphil> I wrote a program that tailed the sondemonitor logs and pushed the position as a UKHAS-style string
[12:30] <F5MVO> it's the Idar weather balloon
[12:30] <fsphil> but it was very unreliable
[12:30] <Darkside> i've got a reaosnable sondemonitor to APRS script
[12:31] <Darkside> https://github.com/darksidelemm/sondemonitorAPRS
[12:32] <Darkside> uses the live kml output from sondemonitor
[12:32] <infaddic_> yer looks like F5KAV-11 is using APRS
[12:32] <F5MVO> thanks all, i look at, i know SM2APRS
[12:33] <Darkside> i didn't know about it, so i wrote my own :P
[12:34] <infaddic_> hey UpuWork, did the tracker get back to you safe?
[12:34] <UpuWork> yes thanks infaddic_
[12:34] Nick change: infaddic_ -> infaddict
[12:34] <UpuWork> sorry was going to mention it then forgot
[12:34] <infaddict> np just checking
[12:34] <infaddict> thx again for the loan
[12:35] <UpuWork> nps
[12:35] <Darkside> ok sleep time for me..
[12:35] <Darkside> gnight all
[12:35] <infaddict> gnight
[12:38] <UpuWork> afternoon
[12:38] <Geoff-G8DHE-Lap> Hi infaddict, should have some time tonight so will drop you a link onc I've got the images processed!
[12:38] <infaddict> hey Geoff-G8DHE-Lap, ah great thanks a lot. no hurry.
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[12:43] <michal_f> hi
[12:45] <michal_f> what's better suited for baloon tracking? diamond x-50 or x-300 ?
[12:46] <adamgreig> x-50
[12:46] <adamgreig> less gain
[12:46] <adamgreig> (balloons are often at significant elevation and high-gain colinears have a narrower radiation pattern)
[12:47] <michal_f> i suspected that, thanks for confirming that
[12:48] <F5MVO> it's run only under Linux ?
[12:48] <Reb-SM3ULC> adamgreig: but if they are close (high angle) there will be higher power?
[12:49] <adamgreig> well yes sure
[12:49] <adamgreig> at 50bd if you have line of sight you'll probably be fine with either antenna
[12:49] <adamgreig> but if I was going to pick one or the other for HABs it'd definitely be the x-50
[12:49] <adamgreig> (and in fact that's the one I own)
[12:50] <F5MVO> fsphil: it's run under Linux only ?
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[12:50] <fsphil> F5MVO: yea
[12:51] <adamgreig> the x-50 is also smaller and cheaper, so..
[12:55] <Reb-SM3ULC> adamgreig: yes, also the x50 is a bit more mobile if you want...
[12:59] <michal_f> thanks !
[13:02] Nick change: fl_0 -> fl_0|afk
[13:03] <fsphil> I took my x50 down recently due to a house move, it had been up for about 5 or 6 years and is still in good condition
[13:05] <Reb-SM3ULC> I think oz1sky has a X510 and he is very happy with the quality.
[13:12] <infaddict> mmm i've been looking at a x50 too. seems possible to mount it to a mobile tripod if required.
[13:12] <infaddict> i might be moving to a penthouse apartment where it'd be good to erect this on roof terrace.
[13:18] <michal_f> ok, I ordered x50n :)
[13:19] <fsphil> I've still to get mine up at the new place
[13:19] <fsphil> I can run better cable this time perhaps
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[13:56] <Vaizki> x50n here too, I don't know much about antennas but seems good for the price
[13:57] <Vaizki> and it's quite light weight, the ground plane sticks are sturdy so should be semi portable.
[13:57] <thasti> http://aprs.fi/#!call=a%2FDK3SB-7&timerange=3600&tail=3600
[13:58] <thasti> sry, wc
[13:59] <Vaizki> I actually clamped the X50n to a telescoping tree pruner shaft :)
[13:59] <infaddict> thx Vaizki - i'm worried the lease of most appointments might not allow fixed antenna installation and associated cabling
[14:00] <Vaizki> sorry, not a subject of her majesty so no idea what an appointment is in terms of housing? :)
[14:05] <Vaizki> are you leasing a house or flat?
[14:06] <infaddict> likely an apartment
[14:06] <infaddict> so in a block of other apartments
[14:07] <infaddict> looking for top floor but not confirmed
[14:07] <infaddict> they have a shared lease type agreement and not sure on rules of erecting antenna yet
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[14:12] <Vaizki> you have a wife right? :)
[14:13] <Vaizki> if not, you could use copper tape on a window directly to make a 70cm band antenna
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[14:14] <SA6BSS-Mike> I had the x50 and changed it for a x300 does not notice any difference, most inportent is to get the antenna up up high over p.co.uk] has joined #highaltitude
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[14:14] <SA6BSS-Mike> [11:27:24] <Laurenceb> https://i.imgur.com/2XcE
[14:15] <SA6BSS-Mike> damn VIRC
[14:15] <chris_99> heh
[14:15] <SA6BSS-Mike> I had the x50 and changed it for a x300 does not notice any difference, most inportent is to get the antenna up up high over closeby obstcales
[14:18] <gonzo__> higher gains can help the snr for higher bandwidth signals
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[14:19] <gonzo__> 50bd I found fine to the LoS, but 300bd it lost decode before LoS
[14:24] <infaddict> right thanks guys
[14:25] <infaddict> any recommendation on good coax to run from the x50
[14:26] <Vaizki> also for hidden antennas, maybe a j-pole like http://www.kcb.co.uk/shop2/contents/en-uk/p1572.html
[14:26] <Vaizki> infaddict, how long is your run?
[14:26] <infaddict> i dont know that yet
[14:27] <fsphil> westflex cable was recommended on here before
[14:27] <fsphil> westflex 103
[14:27] <fsphil> more expensive than most though
[14:28] <gonzo__> it's lower loss, but needs special connectors, doe to the non std inner core diam
[14:28] <infaddict> interesting
[14:28] <fsphil> yea the plugs are expensive
[14:28] <gonzo__> for a rx only antenna, put a habamp up near the antenna and bring it down on whatever coax you want. (I even use CT100 sat TV coax for that)
[14:29] <gonzo__> or bring an antenna lead into the loft on RG213 or similar, and put a habamp there
[14:29] <fsphil> yea I don't like putting electronics up on the mast
[14:30] <Vaizki> I think Aircell 7 also needs special connectors but they are not too expensive
[14:30] <gonzo__> lofts make nice equipment enclosures!
[14:30] <gonzo__> as do sheds.... My LNAs/PAs ate in my shed
[14:30] <gonzo__> arew
[14:31] <fsphil> as long as the spiders don't get them
[14:31] <gonzo__> Is there an IP rating field for spiders??
[14:31] <Vaizki> that's the X
[14:32] <Vaizki> means spiderproof
[14:32] <gonzo__> nope X only has 4 legs
[14:32] <fsphil> IPXX
[14:32] <gonzo__> that's two 4 legged things. Or one 8 leg that had been cut in half)
[14:32] <gonzo__> called eric?
[14:34] Nick change: fl_0|afk -> fl_0
[14:40] <mfa298> unless it's a stupidly long run RG213 is probably good enough although westflex is even lower loss - but more pain to work with (I've got both but mostly use the 213 but that's generally setting up temporary stations)
[14:49] <UpuWork> I have Westflex
[14:49] <UpuWork> and its a bitch to work with
[14:49] <UpuWork> so much copper in it
[14:53] <mfa298> considering I bought mine almost 10 years ago I consider it a good investment due to the copper content.
[14:53] <mfa298> probably worth more now than it was when I got it :)
[14:53] <UpuWork> lol
[14:53] <gonzo__> westflex I think has a foil screen, not good for flexing
[14:53] <UpuWork> well I was told not to use it on the rotator
[14:53] <UpuWork> which I ignored
[14:54] <UpuWork> and its been totally fine for 3 years now
[14:54] <gonzo__> or use LDF450 if you want foam dielectric coax!
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[14:58] <Vaizki> how about ecoflex 10?
[14:59] <Vaizki> ecoflex 10 plus on 433MHz.. 8.9dB/100m attenuation
[15:00] <Vaizki> compared to 15.8 for RG 213
[15:01] <Vaizki> but if you have a habamp, I don't easily see a need for more than 10 meters of good coax?
[15:02] <gonzo__> any loss between the antenna and first gain stage is added directly to your system noise figure
[15:02] <gonzo__> the easiest way is to get the LNA up near the antenna
[15:03] <Vaizki> yea that's what I mean, probably no more than 10m between antenna and habamp
[15:03] <gonzo__> with a high ish gain LNA, you can pretty much ignore the cable loss aftyer it
[15:04] <gonzo__> that was why I mentioned lofts, as they are usually close to the antenna
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[15:04] <gonzo__> warm, dry and you can get access to the kit
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[15:07] <Vaizki> also if you are not a fan of making cables and have tight places to run through, maybe look at something like premade aircell 5 with FME connectors
[15:08] <gonzo__> or buy a bigger sds drill bit
[15:08] <Vaizki> the connector is barely bigger than the cable
[15:08] <Vaizki> or that :)
[15:08] Nick change: KT5TK1 -> KT5TK
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[16:03] <infaddict> http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/technology-33409305
[16:08] <eroomde> interesting infaddict
[16:08] <eroomde> i could use that
[16:09] <Laurenceb> but its gopro...
[16:09] <Laurenceb> wonder what percentage of the time it boots sucessfully
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[16:13] <infaddict> ha Laurenceb. i'll be interested to see the price point
[16:14] <infaddict> its small and light they say
[16:14] <eroomde> £330
[16:14] <eroomde> (in article)
[16:17] <infaddict> ah right, missed that somehow
[16:17] <infaddict> that not too far off the top end one anyway
[16:23] <infaddict> still too expensive for my needs. Will look at alternatives including those suggested on this channel. A lot only do 2hrs recording tho (usually battery limit) so need to find one with 3hrs ideally.
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[16:24] <adamgreig> or just replace the battery
[16:24] <adamgreig> or supplant it
[16:24] <adamgreig> I guess i really mean supplement but I like the idea of supplanting a battery
[16:24] <infaddict> yep looking at that option too adamgreig
[16:24] <infaddict> haha
[16:24] Nick change: fl_0 -> fl_0|afk
[16:25] <infaddict> thinking of 1 main camera doing 3hrs and trying a low end HD mini cam for down/up views
[16:25] <infaddict> for the up/down i'm not that bothered on capturing entire flight, just the launch and burst
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[16:44] <Vaizki> http://techcrunch.com/2015/07/06/gopro-reinvents-its-action-camera-with-the-hero4-session/#.w09ixe:3L47
[16:45] <Vaizki> a better treatise on the new go pro
[16:45] <Vaizki> "The Session detects its mounting orientation and automatically rotates the video." would suggest they use a square sensor and crop based on orientation
[16:46] <Vaizki> or maybe it's just upside down capable :(
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[19:07] <dokument> Is anyone familiar with the FAA regulations on dropping a glider from a weather balloon (from ~100k ft for this question)?
[19:12] <SpeedEvil> Where are you?
[19:12] <SpeedEvil> Err - nvm
[19:12] <SpeedEvil> I don't know FAA regs
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[19:13] <SpacenearUS> New position from 03WMSI_HAB after 033 days silence - 12http://tracker.habhub.org/#!qm=All&q=WMSI_HAB
[19:13] <dokument> SpeedEvil: What country are you in? Do you know anything about this where you are? I'd love to hear
[19:15] <SpeedEvil> Well - in the UK - dropping anything other than a parachute would require special approval
[19:16] <dokument> Yeah I keep hearing people say (and write) that you can not drop a glider but I can not find that anywhere in the regulations. Just wanting to make sure that I haven't missed something
[19:16] <SpeedEvil> dokument: If you're in the USA, it's irrelevant
[19:17] <SpeedEvil> In the UK, the limits are set by the classes of things that are exempt from normal rules.
[19:17] <dokument> no i understand that you are not referencing US laws
[19:18] <SpeedEvil> Parachutes and small balloons and kites are all exempt specifically from all the regs.
[19:18] <SpeedEvil> If you launch a controllable glider, that is clearly not a parachute, and requires someone to be within 70m of it maintaining unaided visual control
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[19:19] <dokument> unless it is fully autonomous (not controlled), in the US at least
[19:20] <SpeedEvil> There is no provision whatsoever in the 'RC' exemption for autonomous things.
[19:20] <SpeedEvil> you then have to go up to the UAV regulations - which you really, really don't want to do
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[19:20] <Vaizki> maybe you could say it's not flying but falling with style
[19:21] <dokument> Vaizki: seriously
[19:21] <Vaizki> buzz lightyear is my hero, don't mock him
[19:22] <dokument> SpeedEvil: Why not? also UAV != Autonomous (depending on how they word it at least)
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[19:22] <dokument> Vaizki: I meant seriously as I agree with you
[19:22] <SpeedEvil> dokument: Because the regulations require significant approval work and fees around your UAV
[19:22] <Vaizki> you must be american
[19:23] <dokument> Source? I have seen nothing that indicates that
[19:24] <dokument> By the way, I appreciate all of your help and input
[19:24] <SpeedEvil> dokument: This is UK only.
[19:24] <dokument> Vaizki: indeed
[19:24] <SpeedEvil> Go and look at the ANO
[19:27] <Geoff-G8DHE_> infaddic, here we go http://360.g8dhe.net/HAB_Flights/2015_Flights/Caer_Urfa_20150628/
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[20:48] <dokument> SpeedEvil: in the UK do you have similar payload size restrictions (2 payloads, each 2.75kg)
[20:49] <SpeedEvil> Payload and balloon need to be entirely at all times within a 2m sphere - or it requires approval
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[21:08] <day> has anyone ever given these 2bucks 433Mhz transmitters from ebay a try? How do they compare to radiometrix hardware?
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[21:12] <Geoff-G8DHE_> Useless, they drift at a horrendous rate of knots! Tried one a while ago for a different project total waste of time.
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[21:19] <gonzo__> do they have analogue keying lines?
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[21:21] <Geoff-G8DHE_> I seem to recall that they did see here they look similar http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/433mhz-RF-Transmitter-and-Receiver-pair-wireless-arduino-hobby-ASK-OOK-UK-A302-/151420294681?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_3&hash=item23415a5619
[21:24] <Geoff-G8DHE_> they are a little super-regenerative Rx and so sensitive to placement and all sorts of gotcha they went in the bin.
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[21:32] <gonzo__> super regen ones are noce, the mush that comes out of the RX is more powerful than the tx
[21:32] <gonzo__> (we used to use cheapo kids 27meg walkie talkes from the market, as jammers
[21:33] <gonzo__> would last for days on a 6V lantern batt borrowed off the roadmen
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