highaltitude.log.20150427

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[00:24] <SpacenearUS> New vehicle on the map: 03KC9LIG-11 - 12http://tracker.habhub.org/#!qm=All&q=KC9LIG-11
[00:25] <SpacenearUS> New vehicle on the map: 03KC9LHW-11 - 12http://tracker.habhub.org/#!qm=All&q=KC9LHW-11
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[05:21] <SA6BSS> ha, an Ireland station just picked up ps-43, thats some distance :)
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[06:07] <Reb-SM3ULC> SA6BSS: impressive :)
[06:08] <Reb-SM3ULC> SA6BSS: How's the hunt going?
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[06:56] <LunarWork> hello
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[07:27] <arjunnaha> Saw a car yesterday with the red PI5KY C...is that you daveake?
[07:27] <arjunnaha> *reg
[07:28] <daveake> nah, mins is RP11 SKY
[07:28] <daveake> mine
[07:28] <arjunnaha> Ah, okay
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[07:31] <Upu> lol
[07:31] <daveake> stalker
[07:32] <Geoff-G8DHE-M> :)
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[08:07] <sq5kvs> Hi !
[08:08] <fsphil> morning
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[08:09] <sq5kvs> Ou f..
[08:09] <sq5kvs> I forgot about flight yesterday :)
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[08:48] <SpacenearUS> New vehicle on the map: 03fasterpussycat_chase - 12http://tracker.habhub.org/#!qm=All&q=fasterpussycat_chase
[08:49] <sq5kvs> :)
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[10:52] <sq5kvs> nothing....
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[11:26] <alxwntr> Hello all
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[11:27] <alxwntr> Does anyone know about possible differences with I2C between the Arduino Uno and Mega 2560?
[11:27] <alxwntr> I migrated to the Maga 2560 because I was running out of SRAM
[11:27] <alxwntr> the SD buffer really nailed it
[11:28] <alxwntr> but I'm having no joy getting it to work
[11:28] <alxwntr> the Uno worked without any external pull-ups
[11:28] <alxwntr> but the Mega refuses to play with or without
[11:29] <alxwntr> I'm connecting to a Hab Supplies uBlox breakout board
[11:29] <LunarWork> the pins are different
[11:29] <alxwntr> yep - got it on the right ones
[11:29] <alxwntr> 20 and 21
[11:29] <alxwntr> A4 and A5 on the Uno
[11:29] <SpeedEvil> Sure you've connected both supply voltages, checked the idle state of the I2C bus, decoupling, ...
[11:30] <alxwntr> well, the first thing should be fine - the module is running from the +5V pin
[11:30] <alxwntr> as with the Uno
[11:30] <alxwntr> the 2nd and 3rd I don't know
[11:30] <alxwntr> how do I check the idle state?
[11:32] <SpeedEvil> voltmeter
[11:32] <alxwntr> Oh I see
[11:32] <alxwntr> well, both pins are pulled to +5V
[11:32] <mattbrejza> SD card, 5V, ...
[11:33] <SpeedEvil> SD cards can't take 5V
[11:33] <SpeedEvil> (safely)
[11:33] <alxwntr> yeah - I've got a board for that
[11:33] <alxwntr> it works fine
[11:33] <alxwntr> writes and reads nicely
[11:34] <alxwntr> but now it's not even on the breadboard
[11:34] <alxwntr> I wanted to isolate the I2C issue first
[11:35] <alxwntr> I guess I just wondered if anyone knew of anything I had to do differently when changing the board
[11:35] <mattbrejza> dont suppose you have any test equipment (eg logic analyser)
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[11:36] <alxwntr> I wish I did - it would come in very handy
[11:36] <alxwntr> the weirdest thing is, I noticed a few successes
[11:36] <alxwntr> the odd packet would get through and respond
[11:36] <alxwntr> quite rare
[11:37] <alxwntr> but I canh't work out why it would do that
[11:38] <alxwntr> if I print out the bytes I get from the the port, I mostly get 255s
[11:38] <alxwntr> but not always
[11:38] <alxwntr> there are other numbers in there too
[11:39] <alxwntr> but no B5,62 sync characters
[11:39] <alxwntr> god it's frustrating
[11:40] <alxwntr> it would almost be better if I was getting absolutely nothing...
[11:41] <alxwntr> ah well, I guess I'll go back to poking it with sticks. :)
[11:42] <daveake> The 255 means "no data available"
[11:42] <alxwntr> yeah, 0xFF, right?
[11:43] <daveake> I'm just following your mixed bases :)
[11:43] <alxwntr> which would imply it is talking a bit
[11:43] <alxwntr> oh course, sorry :)
[11:44] <daveake> Bin the 255's and send the rest to a spare serial port for debugging
[11:44] <alxwntr> ok
[11:44] <alxwntr> will do
[11:44] <alxwntr> perhaps I'll get something sensible that way
[11:44] <alxwntr> thanks - I'll try that now
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[11:52] <sq5kvs> err-mode , at least
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[12:03] <Herman_> !flights
[12:03] <SpacenearUS> 03Herman_: Current flights: 03APJ09 10(a030), 03June Sky BAC Flight 10(c957)
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[12:12] <alxwntr> Well, now that I've got rid of the 0xFFs, it looks like it's this:
[12:13] <alxwntr> 244750524D432C2C562C2C2C2C2C2C2C2C2C2C4E2A3533DA
[12:13] <alxwntr> repeated over and over
[12:13] <alxwntr> which is weird
[12:13] <alxwntr> I'm expecting B5 62 on the front of everything it sends
[12:13] <alxwntr> but I never get it
[12:14] <alxwntr> and it sends that in response to the string that sets the IO to UBX and to the one that sets its mode to airbourne 1g
[12:21] <SpacenearUS> New position from 03WA2MJM-11 after 033 days silence - 12http://tracker.habhub.org/#!qm=All&q=WA2MJM-11
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[12:33] <adamgreig> alxwntr: that sounds frustrating
[12:33] <adamgreig> could you take a photograph of your setup?
[12:33] <adamgreig> there might be something obviously amiss
[12:34] <alxwntr> Sure! Will do. Thanks Adam.
[12:34] <alxwntr> 2 secs
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[12:40] <alxwntr> ok. Well.
[12:40] <alxwntr> Adam, thanks for suggesting that
[12:40] <adamgreig> what did you discover? :P
[12:41] <alxwntr> I just straightened the wires a little so you would be able to see what was going on properly
[12:41] <alxwntr> and whadya know?
[12:41] <adamgreig> haha
[12:41] <adamgreig> excellent
[12:41] <alxwntr> it started working
[12:41] <adamgreig> you eventually learn that wires into the female headers on arduinos are never very reliable
[12:41] <alxwntr> must have been a loose connexion or something
[12:41] <alxwntr> yeah, absolutely
[12:41] <adamgreig> I'm glad to hear it's working!
[12:42] <alxwntr> perhaps I'll tin them so they're a tighter fit
[12:42] <adamgreig> ideally consider soldering them to some male pins that push into the female headers
[12:42] <alxwntr> yeah, thanks a lot - sorry to bother with what was such a silly problem
[12:42] <alxwntr> oh - good plan
[12:42] <eroomde> get proper connectors for stuff
[12:42] <eroomde> especially flight hardware
[12:43] <alxwntr> definitely - planning to get a proper pcb printed so I can make a shield
[12:43] <eroomde> there should be no solidcore wire anywhere on anything you're intending to fly, and no connectors that don't have a positive locking engagement
[12:43] <eroomde> cool
[12:43] <alxwntr> no solid core? fatigue breakages?
[12:43] <eroomde> yes
[12:43] <alxwntr> ok
[12:43] <alxwntr> thanks
[12:44] <adamgreig> what about all my hardline RF though eroomde :(
[12:44] <eroomde> that's true for electrical installations in general
[12:44] <eroomde> unless it's solidly mounted to something secure
[12:44] <alxwntr> right
[12:44] <eroomde> hardline rf is rather different to solidcore wire, mechanically
[12:44] <eroomde> and obviously you use things like twin-and-earth solidcore in mains installations
[12:44] <eroomde> but they're never going to be flexed
[12:45] <adamgreig> I got some really weird semi-rigid coax patch N cables at the ham rally
[12:45] <adamgreig> I think they're thin solid core coax
[12:45] <alxwntr> oh nice - I was looking for some of that for the payload antenna
[12:46] <adamgreig> I'd probably use normal coax for the antenna
[12:46] <alxwntr> is it 50Ohm?
[12:46] <adamgreig> I hope so :P
[12:46] <alxwntr> heh
[12:46] <alxwntr> I just though it would be easier to make the solid core co-ax straight
[12:47] <alxwntr> the tutorial on making a payload antenna on the wiki is nice
[12:47] <alxwntr> so if the core is the active element, presumably it wants to be nice and straight
[12:47] Action: SpacenearUS is going for a nap.
[12:47] <eroomde> yes but don't use solidcore for that
[12:47] <adamgreig> right - but for example, sticking flexible wire down a straw would do it
[12:47] Action: SpacenearUS is back!
[12:48] <alxwntr> ah ok
[12:48] <alxwntr> thanks
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[13:12] <diegoesep> hello all
[13:12] <diegoesep> daveake, Upu UpuWork , how do we stack the PI In the SKy Board to the RPI ? and how do we stack the Lora add on board on top of the PITS?
[13:13] <daveake> stacking connectors
[13:13] <diegoesep> which model is it daveake ?
[13:13] <daveake> dunno that's h/w and I only do the s/w :)
[13:13] <diegoesep> lol
[13:13] <diegoesep> :)
[13:14] <daveake> You need a connector with extended pins
[13:14] <daveake> Put that on the Pi
[13:14] <daveake> then PITS+ on top
[13:14] <daveake> then a regular-length-pin connector
[13:14] <daveake> then the lora board
[13:15] <diegoesep> ok, it is not clear for me what is precisely the "connector with extended pins" and "regular-length-pin connector" :)
[13:15] <diegoesep> on your page http://www.daveakerman.com/?p=1706 I can see the boards
[13:15] <diegoesep> but not the connectors
[13:16] <daveake> do a google image search for "raspberry pi stacking connector"
[13:16] <diegoesep> ok , this one :
[13:16] <diegoesep> http://www.google.fr/imgres?imgurl=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.adafruit.com%2Fimages%2F1200x900%2F1112-00.jpg&imgrefurl=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.adafruit.com%2Fproducts%2F1112&h=900&w=1200&tbnid=ziKl-9jZaIHagM%3A&zoom=1&docid=dlGtu2YMQK38SM&ei=tjY-Vem9Ds34aN_xgNgN&tbm=isch&client=ubuntu&iact=rc&uact=3&dur=213&page=1&start=0&ndsp=32&ved=0CCEQrQMwAA
[13:17] Nick change: fl_0|afk -> fl_0
[13:17] <diegoesep> with 2x20 instead of 2x13?
[13:17] <UpuWork> oh hey diegoesep
[13:18] <UpuWork> I've not put them onsale yet as no one stacked it apart from Dave and I
[13:18] <UpuWork> I'll post you some out tommorrow
[13:18] <UpuWork> how many do you need ?
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[13:19] <daveake> One point to note ... you can only use one lora module this way (the one labelled CE0)
[13:19] <daveake> As the CE1 channel is used by the ADC
[13:19] <diegoesep> I have not yet ordered the PITS board UpuWork sorry , I 'm just looking if I can use it for my next HAB launch
[13:19] <daveake> Next batch of boards the ADC is replaced by an i2c model
[13:19] <UpuWork> ah ok mention it when you order
[13:20] <diegoesep> in fact daveake and UpuWork , I'm checking if we can setup a radio extension compatible with French regulations for HAB
[13:20] <diegoesep> based on anylink dp1276 lora modules at 144.650Mhz
[13:21] <diegoesep> it is using a TXC0 and I've got very good results with my first ground based tests
[13:21] <diegoesep> also we can use the 50mw output instead of 10mw
[13:22] <UpuWork> French laws are just as restrictive as UK I think
[13:23] <diegoesep> there is no limit on the EIRP as I know for airborne
[13:23] <diegoesep> but the limit is that we can only use 144.650 Mhz with 20khz bandwith
[13:23] <diegoesep> most of the flights used APRS (with 0.5, 1,2 or 10watts)
[13:24] <diegoesep> but I want to use LORA and FSK for my next flights
[13:24] <eroomde> why not use an amateur radio frequency diegoesep ?
[13:24] <daveake> Hmmm jealous ... https://community.balloonchallenge.org/uploads/default/319/a0baa654ba9b75a8.jpg
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[13:24] <UpuWork> thats impressive
[13:24] <diegoesep> eroomde, we are not allowed to use the 144.800Mhz frequency for APRS in france for the balloons
[13:25] <eroomde> sure
[13:26] <eroomde> but can you use any other amateur radio frequencies (my question)?
[13:26] <diegoesep> eroomde, no only the 144.650 freq is allowed
[13:27] <eroomde> oh well
[13:28] <diegoesep> I'm not even sure if I can use LoRa modulation on the amateur radio frequency...
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[13:28] <SpacenearUS> New vehicle on the map: 03STREEK - 12http://tracker.habhub.org/#!qm=All&q=STREEK
[13:29] <eroomde> you could not bother with LoRa
[13:30] <craag_philcrump> legally you can use lora modulation on amateur radio frequencies
[13:30] <craag_philcrump> It's no different to d-star voice encoding for example
[13:30] <diegoesep> that's a good news for me craag_philcrump :)
[13:31] <diegoesep> maybe one day it will be possible to demodulate lora with a SDR based software
[13:31] <craag_philcrump> Some people might complain - but as long as you make availible what modulation settings you're using, so someone else with a module, *could* decode it if they wanted to - then you're fine.
[13:31] <craag_philcrump> Oh and stay within the maximum channel bandwidth for the given band.
[13:32] <diegoesep> I plan to use SF12, 20Khz for the telemtry
[13:32] <diegoesep> and SF6,20Khz for the SSDV
[13:32] <craag_philcrump> Great :)
[13:32] <diegoesep> with the same frequency since there are orthogonals
[13:34] <diegoesep> daveake, UpuWork eroomde craag_philcrump : this is the LORA/FSK tracker that I've built for my next HAB project: http://oi57.tinypic.com/zmy242.jpg
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[13:35] <mattbrejza> i would consider SF11 over SF12 though
[13:35] <craag_philcrump> nice
[13:35] <diegoesep> and I plan to use a RPI PITS for SSDV
[13:35] <craag_philcrump> Yeah +1 for matt's suggestion
[13:36] <diegoesep> I 've a telemetry packet every 10 seconds with SF12
[13:36] <mattbrejza> slower ones are more prone to errors due to drift during the transmission
[13:36] <diegoesep> this module is based on a TCXO
[13:36] Nick change: Crashbone|Away -> Crashbone
[13:36] <craag_philcrump> Just noticed you're in france - I'm aware that d-star isn't legal over there? However I think that's because of the internet-linking side of it, rather than the proprietary codec stuff.
[13:36] <mattbrejza> oh right
[13:36] <mattbrejza> well SF11 was fine for us if you wanted something faster
[13:37] <diegoesep> I've got better results for the ground range with SF12 on this module and no CRC or drift issue
[13:37] <UpuWork> diegoesep use imgur pls :)
[13:37] <UpuWork> tinypic spends 5 mins loading ads
[13:37] <diegoesep> oh sorry UpuWork ok :)
[13:37] <fsphil> and sometimes never sends the intended image anyway
[13:39] <diegoesep> so my plan is to setup a set of LoRa gateways in south of France like what you have done in the UK
[13:39] <diegoesep> with the 144.650Mhz frequency
[13:40] <diegoesep> and I am exploring possibilities to create a RPI PITS addon board that will be based on these Anylink LoRA module at 144.650
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[13:41] <diegoesep> so this board can both be used in the tracker/ssdv using PITS, or on the PI Lora Gateway using daveake software
[13:41] Nick change: Crashbone -> Crashbone|Away
[13:41] <diegoesep> and maybe you can sell this board on your site UpuWork ? :)
[13:42] <diegoesep> I've set up a prototype with a RPI B+ with daveake lora-gateway and it is working fine both for telemetry and ssdv
[13:42] <UpuWork> I'll put the stacking headers on the site tommorrow or wednesday
[13:47] <diegoesep> this is the new LoRa tracker I've built (imgur this time): http://i.imgur.com/wr5iv4D.jpg
[13:48] <diegoesep> with this module , even the 7.8Lhz SF12 LORA modulation is stable with the TCXO
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[14:32] Nick change: fl_0 -> fl_0|afk
[14:32] <LunarWork> be back later
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[15:12] <SpacenearUS> New position from 03JACKAL2 after 032 days silence - 12http://tracker.habhub.org/#!qm=All&q=JACKAL2
[15:18] <SpacenearUS> New vehicle on the map: 03K0HK-11 - 12http://tracker.habhub.org/#!qm=All&q=K0HK-11
[15:24] Nick change: craag_philcrump -> craag
[15:24] <bradfirj> :sigh: OSHPark didn't drill my drills correctly :(
[15:25] <Ian_> Please elaborate?
[15:26] <Ian_> What was the nature of the errors?
[15:26] <bradfirj> User error it seems, I just went back to my Gerbers, and it was in fact me who dun goofed, not the fab
[15:26] <bradfirj> :doublesigh:
[15:26] <eroomde> i drilled a drill in boards gone by // when precision was high // and tolerance worth giving
[15:26] <bradfirj> It's even worse when it's your own fault isn't it?
[15:28] <mattbrejza> pic?
[15:28] <Ian_> It happens, and if it happened to you, then it could just as easily happen to others.
[15:28] <mattbrejza> did you use gerbv or whatever the cool online one is?
[15:29] <mattbrejza> (dirtypcbs renders your gerbers for you after submission which is nice)
[15:29] <Ian_> Lots of people are now hoping to learn something and avoid the same pitfall - believe me.
[15:29] <bradfirj> Yeah hold on, I'll upload a pic
[15:29] <bradfirj> My issue was the 5V barrel jack that is a stock part in KiCAD uses the drill layer for the slot hits
[15:30] <bradfirj> So the drill gerber shows the slots cut correctly, in GerbView, but when uploaded to OSH (and I didn't catch this) they're downsized to a single circular drill hit of the width of the slot
[15:31] <bradfirj> As at OSHPark they reccomend you should use large Vias instead of slots
[15:31] <bradfirj> I'll know for next time!
[15:31] <eroomde> large vias instead of slots??
[15:31] <eroomde> but vias aren't slots
[15:31] <eroomde> i'm confused
[15:32] <eroomde> if you need a slot you need a slot
[15:32] <Ian_> Whew, and I thought it was just me.
[15:32] <eroomde> who the hell has ever heard of 'isolation vias' on a board with mains and low voltage
[15:33] <eroomde> 'oh hey spark, don't bother trying to jump across my air gap, why don't i just conduct you to the other side for free through all my copper plating!! my pleasure!!'
[15:33] <eroomde> never heard such bullshit in all my life
[15:34] <bradfirj> eroomde: That would be my reaction too
[15:34] <bradfirj> tbh my reaction is "is it on the drill layer? Please drill it"
[15:34] <bradfirj> But I accept this is a hobbyist level thing and the fab probably don't have time to deal with it
[15:34] <bradfirj> http://cdn.freshdesk.com/data/helpdesk/attachments/production/4007680178/original/replacing-plated-slots.png?1414565255
[15:34] <bradfirj> for reference, this is what I mean
[15:35] <craag> It's explained on here: http://support.oshpark.com/support/solutions/articles/134889-internal-cutouts-and-slots
[15:35] <craag> They still do slots
[15:35] <craag> Jsut not very small ones
[15:35] <craag> Have to be 2.54mm+
[15:36] <adamgreig> jeez
[15:36] <bradfirj> So in my case
[15:36] <adamgreig> dirtypcbs.com are cheaper and will do slots down to 0.8mm wide
[15:36] <bradfirj> drill layer:
[15:36] <bradfirj> http://i.imgur.com/FwLl0G6.png
[15:36] <bradfirj> http://i.imgur.com/GPsEbGJ.jpg
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[15:36] <bradfirj> board from fab
[15:37] <mattbrejza> oh its just three holes
[15:37] <eroomde> tedious
[15:37] <mattbrejza> dremel to the rescue
[15:37] <adamgreig> oh that's very annoying
[15:37] <adamgreig> yea
[15:37] <bradfirj> So I get a lesson in RTFM
[15:37] <adamgreig> dirty won't do plated slots
[15:37] <adamgreig> I don't think OSHPark do either
[15:37] <bradfirj> gonna stick to SMD barrel jacks in future
[15:37] <bradfirj> less to screw up
[15:37] <adamgreig> heh
[15:38] <eroomde> i wouldn't fly jacks
[15:38] <bradfirj> I just have a bag of through hole ones I'm never going to use
[15:38] <bradfirj> eroomde: It's not for a payload it's a testbed for a rotator
[15:38] <eroomde> fine then
[15:38] <adamgreig> eroomde: these sealed ones I have are screw-on too
[15:38] <adamgreig> so they lock quite nicely really
[15:38] <adamgreig> quite enjoying them as small and cheaper alternatives to the mad large/expensive 2pin circ conns
[15:40] <eroomde> you'll never get that bayonetty click of olive-drab satisfaction though
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[15:40] <adamgreig> i know ;(
[15:40] <adamgreig> (they do actually have a quite nice positive click as they mate though)
[15:40] <adamgreig> (but it's not as nice)
[15:40] <bradfirj> Someone enlighten me what these circular connectors our?
[15:40] <bradfirj> are*
[15:40] <bradfirj> oh god that typo
[15:40] <bradfirj> I'm sorry
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[15:41] <bradfirj> bayonetty click of olive-drab satisfaction sounds intriguing
[15:41] <adamgreig> search for amphenol 62gb
[15:41] <adamgreig> but they're any nice circular milspec connector
[15:42] <bradfirj> ooh those
[15:42] <bradfirj> yes I've used those
[15:42] <bradfirj> http://wecc.co.uk/Old/images/ecmclock.jpg
[15:42] <bradfirj> they're present on those
[15:42] <bradfirj> I use those a lot
[15:43] <eroomde> i use them for pretty-much everything
[15:43] <eroomde> as a good default
[15:46] <adamgreig> do you tend to use them for power input?
[15:46] <eroomde> for some stuff yes
[15:46] <eroomde> it really depends what it is
[15:46] <eroomde> a few of our products have them for power
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[15:50] <eroomde> i use the 14-12 insert/shell arragement a fair bit
[15:50] <eroomde> http://img-europe.electrocomponents.com/largeimages/R4422117-01.jpg
[15:50] <eroomde> 4 high current power pins + 8 signals
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[15:50] <adamgreig> that's nice
[15:50] <arko> beauty
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[17:14] <daveake> lnr has a low snr
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[17:15] <edmoore> let's hope it stops
[17:16] <Laurenceb__> https://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_embedded&v=CMtVbsTpRXU
[17:18] <edmoore> this looks like a terrible idea
[17:18] <edmoore> oh yes
[17:18] <edmoore> it was a terrible idea
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[17:22] <Hiena> SpaceX Thales Mission Mon Apr, 27 2015 11:55 PM CEST ? Tue Apr, 28 2015 2:00 AM CEST
[17:22] <Laurenceb__> https://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_embedded&v=zdOgBMcl4TA
[17:26] <edmoore> that must be annoying
[17:27] <Lunar_Lander> oh
[17:28] <Lunar_Lander> so the silo pusher motor worked but then the rocket didn't fire?
[17:28] <mattbrejza> 'The S-300 is regarded as one of the most potent anti-aircraft missile systems currently fielded'
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[17:29] <fsphil> that went well
[17:31] <edmoore> Lunar_Lander, i think so yes
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[19:25] <SpacenearUS> New vehicle on the map: 03DL9UL_chase - 12http://tracker.habhub.org/#!qm=All&q=DL9UL_chase
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[19:54] <SpacenearUS> New position from 03K6RPT-11 after 033 days silence - 12http://tracker.habhub.org/#!qm=All&q=K6RPT-11
[19:55] <alxwntr> Hiya!
[19:55] <alxwntr> Which package would people recommend for drawing up schematics?
[19:56] <alxwntr> things are getting complicated and I want to keep track of it
[19:57] <alxwntr> (it would be good if it also produced pcb files for when I come to order it)
[19:58] <adamgreig> kicad
[19:58] <nigelvh> alxwntr: There are a number of programs that do PCB/schematics.
[19:58] <nigelvh> Some people like kicad, I use Eagle, etc, etc
[19:58] <alxwntr> I've seen various names,just wondered if there was one that was the most recommended
[19:59] <adamgreig> i recommend kicad strongly in preference to eagle
[19:59] <adamgreig> eagle is probably a bit more widely used by hobbyists atm
[19:59] <adamgreig> in srs bsns you use expensive commercial packages
[19:59] <alxwntr> ok - I've seen lots of people using Eagle
[19:59] <alxwntr> but kicad is better?
[19:59] <adamgreig> yes, sparkfun put out a number of reasonable eagle tutorials like six or seven years back and that seems to have prompted a lot of hobbyists to take it up
[19:59] <adamgreig> in my opinion kicad is much better yes :p
[20:00] <alxwntr> good enough for me - got to start somewhere :)
[20:00] <alxwntr> cheers
[20:00] <adamgreig> (I used eagle for years, had an eagle pro licence, swapped to kicad for one thing and haven't looked back)
[20:00] <adamgreig> are you on linux or windows or mac or what?
[20:00] <adamgreig> at the moment CERN are putting a lot of work into making kicad much easier to use, and the latest versions are really a lot better than older ones you might find installers for lying around
[20:01] <alxwntr> I run Linux Mint on my laptop, but that's quite a new thing
[20:01] <alxwntr> still getting used to it
[20:01] <adamgreig> ok
[20:01] <alxwntr> Win7 on the pc
[20:01] <adamgreig> idk about linux mint really
[20:01] <adamgreig> on ubuntu there's a PPA so it's very very easy
[20:01] <adamgreig> on windows looks like http://www2.futureware.at/~nickoe/ is the way to go
[20:01] <adamgreig> well
[20:01] <alxwntr> it's a Ubuntu/debian branch
[20:01] <adamgreig> http://www.kicad-pcb.org/display/KICAD/Installing+KiCad#InstallingKiCad-Windows
[20:01] <adamgreig> links you to ^^ which has a .exe you can install
[20:01] <adamgreig> ah ok
[20:02] <adamgreig> well in that case you can probably use the ubuntu PPA on that too, https://code.launchpad.net/~js-reynaud/+archive/ubuntu/ppa-kicad
[20:02] <adamgreig> in fact that kicad installing page ^^^ has references for mint and windows
[20:02] <adamgreig> so I guess just go with that :P
[20:02] <alxwntr> ah great - that's ideal
[20:02] <alxwntr> :)
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[20:07] <noahlaferriere> hello
[20:08] Nick change: noahlaferriere -> nova
[20:08] Nick change: nova -> Nova2
[20:08] <Nova2> is anyone on>
[20:09] <chrisstubbs> Hi Nova2
[20:09] <Nova2> hi chrisstubbs
[20:09] <Nova2> do u know anything about weather ballooning
[20:10] <chrisstubbs> Little bit ;) You are in the right place
[20:10] <Nova2> lol i hope so
[20:11] <Nova2> i need a method of streaming live video
[20:11] <Nova2> people seem to do it relatively easy, but im not sure how especially with weight limitations
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[20:12] <chrisstubbs> So we often use SSDV to stream digital images back over the radio during flight
[20:13] <chrisstubbs> It is somewhat live, but low res and only one frame every couple of minutes
[20:13] <chrisstubbs> https://ukhas.org.uk/guides:ssdv - quite easy to do with a raspberry pi
[20:14] <Nova2> would i need to use a ham radio to pick up the signal?
[20:14] <chrisstubbs> Ham radio or an SDR dongle
[20:14] <Nova2> and i have extensive knowledge with rpi so i decided to try this :P
[20:15] <Nova2> is there any packet loss with ssdv
[20:16] <chrisstubbs> With our distributed listener platform once the balloon gets up to a reasonable altitude it is very good
[20:16] <chrisstubbs> eg: http://chris-stubbs.co.uk/wp/wp-content/uploads/2014/09/SSDV-Live-Images.jpg
[20:16] <Nova2> oh lord& that resolution lol. I was planning on not driving all around to recover it and the data but it looks like it will come to that
[20:17] <SpeedEvil> yeah. In principle there is no reason why you can't do significantly better fairly easily.
[20:17] <SpeedEvil> But significantly better is perhaps 3* the size in each direction.
[20:17] <chrisstubbs> the bigger the photo the longer it takes to send, up to you
[20:17] <Nova2> mhm
[20:17] <SpeedEvil> (10* the bandwidth)
[20:18] <Nova2> how far do the balloons travel when they get up to around 30 km
[20:18] <SpeedEvil> GEtting to the capabilities of modern cameras over >>30km links while staying legal is problematic
[20:18] <SpeedEvil> Nova2: It depends - a quick up-down may be ~100km
[20:18] <Nova2> legality can kiss my ass
[20:18] <SpeedEvil> A slow trip may take days
[20:18] <chrisstubbs> Depends on the wind, check out http://habhub.org/
[20:18] <Nova2> damn.....
[20:19] <Nova2> no way in hell im going 100km for this lol
[20:19] <SpeedEvil> Nova2: wherea re you?
[20:19] <Nova2> USA
[20:19] <Nova2> FAA is a royal bitch
[20:20] <daveake> 100km is far ????
[20:20] <Nova2> yes?
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[20:20] <adamgreig> you live in the USA, 100km is like a commute, right? :P
[20:20] <Reb-SM3ULC> just wait when there's no wind then ;)
[20:20] <daveake> If you have anything more powerful than a pushbike, it's nothing
[20:20] <Nova2> how come i would get around 50 bits per second on this yet NASA can stream at like gigabit
[20:21] <Nova2> exaggeration
[20:21] <daveake> Not far for a pushbike tbj
[20:21] christopherlee (~christoph@host86-178-85-68.range86-178.btcentralplus.com) left irc:
[20:21] <daveake> We have 10mW
[20:21] <daveake> NASA don't
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[20:21] <daveake> We have Yagis
[20:21] <Nova2> Daveake: i need to be abe to ride my scooter there
[20:21] <daveake> NASA have dishes
[20:21] <Nova2> i mean speed
[20:21] <Nova2> not range
[20:22] <daveake> 100km is a distance not a speed
[20:22] <Nova2> yes.
[20:22] <Nova2> im talking about download speed
[20:22] <daveake> So "going 100km" refers to a distance
[20:22] <Nova2> 50 bits per second
[20:22] <daveake> yes I answered that one
[20:23] <Reb-SM3ULC> Nova2: try microvwave link, high power, high bandwidth
[20:23] <daveake> Anyway in the USA you can use more power
[20:23] <daveake> Get a radio ham license
[20:23] <daveake> And buy a car
[20:24] <Nova2> daveake: lol i have a car.
[20:24] <Reb-SM3ULC> Nova2: you can probably use something in the 2.4 ghz-band, in the US you are ok with 1W, pretty ok power
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[20:25] <Nova2> and i dont need a ham license. no need when they cant track it if im using it briefly
[20:25] <daveake> I see
[20:25] <Geoff-G8DHE> http://tinyurl.com/ppanauj
[20:26] <Nova2> lmao
[20:26] <daveake> Try not to upload your position to the web then
[20:26] Action: daveake checks diary to see if it's half term already
[20:26] <adamgreig> or to transmit your position on tbe GPS signal...
[20:26] <adamgreig> you'd be surprised how readily picked up a radio signal from 30km is :P
[20:27] <adamgreig> and other hams just fall over themselves to report people making the most minor infringements, lol
[20:27] <adamgreig> it's even part of the ham radio test
[20:27] <daveake> :)
[20:27] <Nova2> daveake: its not like theyre going to track a 16 yr old kid for pressing a button on his fancy walkie talkie
[20:27] <adamgreig> You discover a friend making illegal transmissions. Should you... a) offer to help b) rat them out to the FCC
[20:27] Nick change: fl_0|afk -> fl_0
[20:28] <Nova2> C. look the other way
[20:28] <daveake> Well you're clearly full of answers
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[20:30] <LuckyLuke> hi all. I'm playing with ntx2b and raspi, and wanted to try to reprogram it to different frequency
[20:30] <LuckyLuke> there's one thing however that stops me. how do I send serial data to ENable pin while its already connected to TDX ?
[20:30] <LuckyLuke> can I connect it to both TDX and EN?
[20:30] <daveake> Youdon't connect EN to Vcc
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[20:30] <LuckyLuke> and also enable some GPIO to EN ?
[20:31] <daveake> You connect it to a pin that can Tx serial
[20:31] <daveake> which might be done in s/w or h/w
[20:31] <LuckyLuke> raspi has one serial Tx pin. can I connect it to both EN and TXD ?
[20:31] <daveake> Yes with a trick
[20:31] <daveake> Have a look at the Pi In The Sky board schematic on github
[20:32] <daveake> Pi Tx connects to EN through a resistor
[20:32] <Nova2> stilldavid: nice website if ur on somewhere :P
[20:32] <daveake> and EN also connects directly to a GPIO pin
[20:33] <daveake> So set the GPIO to an output, and pull it high, for normal operation
[20:33] <daveake> Or set to open-circuit so that EN sees the Tx data
[20:33] scrapit85 (~scrapit85@206.93.199.146.dyn.plus.net) joined #highaltitude.
[20:33] <LuckyLuke> so I suspected...
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[20:34] <LuckyLuke> can't find that schematics, just code
[20:36] <daveake> www.pi-in-the-sky.com has the link, which is https://github.com/piinthesky
[20:36] <daveake> and there you will find repositories for the s/w and h/w
[20:36] <LuckyLuke> oh, thanks
[20:37] <Nova2> does pi in the sky go above 30k feet?
[20:37] <Nova2> oh nvm
[20:39] <daveake> You would need a license to use it in the USA
[20:40] <Nova2> for the radio?
[20:41] <Nova2> and why are there 2 antenna jacks
[20:41] <daveake> yes for the radio
[20:41] <daveake> 2 antennae - radio downlink, GPS receiver
[20:43] <Nova2> i thought downlink is what your recieve on
[20:43] <Nova2> receive*
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[20:44] <Reb-SM3ULC> Nova2: it's the downlink output
[20:44] <Nova2> wouldnt it technically be an uplink since it broadcasts>
[20:44] <Nova2> ya ik im a radio newb
[20:44] <LuckyLuke> daveake: setting GPIO pin to opec-circuit... is this how you do this in SetNTX2BFrequency() function ?
[20:44] <LuckyLuke> pinMode (NTX2B_ENABLE, INPUT);
[20:44] <LuckyLuke> pullUpDnControl(NTX2B_ENABLE, PUD_OFF);
[20:45] <daveake> LuckyLuke Yes
[20:45] <Geoff-G8DHE> It links DOWN from the balloon to you on the ground, unless your planning on going up yourself?
[20:45] <Reb-SM3ULC> Nova2: uplink, to object, downlink from object to ground
[20:45] Action: chrisstubbs seconds the recommendation for going up yourself
[20:46] <daveake> Oh god
[20:46] <daveake> I had one like that
[20:46] <LuckyLuke> so I still havew one question(for now) - how do I write to serial port so it emits reversed logic (swap Lo and HI) ? This is what NTX2b expects according to datasheet ...
[20:46] <Nova2> ill get like 20 bloons
[20:46] <daveake> Italian policeman who wanted to emulate Felix Baumgartner
[20:46] <daveake> using 100 weather balloons
[20:46] <Nova2> lmao
[20:46] <Nova2> i gtg
[20:46] <mikestir> 100? was he a fatty?
[20:46] <daveake> I told him he was a nutter
[20:47] <Nova2> thx for the help kinda :)
[20:47] <Nova2> ill be back to riddle you with more questions later
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[20:47] <Geoff-G8DHE> Some just don't seem to be able to help themselves ....
[20:47] <LuckyLuke> :)
[20:48] christopherlee (~christoph@host86-178-85-68.range86-178.btcentralplus.com) joined #highaltitude.
[20:48] <Geoff-G8DHE> Should we suggest he contacts arko ?
[20:48] <Geoff-G8DHE> no can't be that cruel!
[20:49] <daveake> Just email the Pittsburgh radio ham club
[20:49] <arko> oy! my payloads are 12g or less now :)
[20:49] <daveake> tell them a schoolkid wants to Tx illegally
[20:49] <Geoff-G8DHE> :)
[20:49] <arko> daveake: lol
[20:52] <christopherlee> daveake: Have you ever thought about geo tagging the photos the pi takes?
[20:53] <daveake> yeah someone suggested that a couple of days ago
[20:53] <daveake> Will do it soon probably
[20:53] <Reb-SM3ULC> maybe me.. :) but i was think height etc, but general geotag is a good idea
[20:54] <christopherlee> ok, was going to have a go myself but may be a challenge to far for my skills.
[20:54] <diegoesep> it will be nice to extend ssdv to support it maybe?
[20:54] <diegoesep> or directly in the EXIF of the JPEG?
[20:54] <mikestir> could do with a magnetometer so you can get an indication of which way the camera is pointing as well
[20:54] <christopherlee> very true
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[20:55] <Geoff-G8DHE> 3-axis then you can get the full direction its pointing
[20:55] <Geoff-G8DHE> makes creating sphericals much easier!
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[20:55] <chrisstubbs> daveake, am I right in thinking the pressure is in hPa/mBar on the PITS with BMP180?
[20:56] <daveake> It would just be in the jpeg; there's no spare space in the SSDV header
[20:57] <Geoff-G8DHE> http://360.g8dhe.net/cameraattitude/cameraattitude.htm
[20:57] <christopherlee> My understanding was i could get the data from the GPS thread and pass over to the snapper thread like the altitude is already done
[20:57] <daveake> Yeah I've got magnetometer code and that would be easy to add
[20:58] <christopherlee> then pipe into raspistill as its supported. only pain would be to convert to correct format?
[20:58] <Lunar_Lander> good night :)
[20:58] <daveake> Well the issue there is that there's effectively a random period between creating the take_pic file and taking the photo itself
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[20:59] <daveake> but aside from that error, yes it would work
[21:00] <LuckyLuke> daveake: I'm looking at tPITS schematics but can't see EN pin connected to TXD pin anywhere. Am I missing smth?
[21:00] <LuckyLuke> I tried to wire it on breadboard but it wont work
[21:01] <daveake> The circuit is as I described
[21:01] <daveake> Sorry I don't have Eagle on this netbook so I can point out where it is
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[21:02] <daveake> and breadboard never works anyway
[21:02] <LuckyLuke> even for bbench testing ?
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[21:03] <daveake> Well, if you want to add a variable amount of resistance, capacitance and inductance to each part of your circuit, be my guest :)
[21:03] <daveake> but we get a lot of "my circuit don't work" pleas for help here
[21:04] <LuckyLuke> i get it
[21:04] <daveake> where the fault is a bad connection on a breadboard
[21:04] <LuckyLuke> however the question was for a schematics which seems to miss that connection :)
[21:04] <LuckyLuke> I'll do some more experiments
[21:04] <daveake> They don't
[21:05] <daveake> Pi Tx goes through the usual potential divider circuit to NTX2/MTX2 data pin
[21:05] <daveake> Spare GPIO goes to enable pin
[21:05] <daveake> and a resistor connects Pi Tx to enable
[21:06] <LuckyLuke> which is missing from a PDF file - but I don't want to argue. I might be missing smth. very obvious as a newcomer
[21:07] <SpacenearUS> New vehicle on the map: 03zxx_chase - 12http://tracker.habhub.org/#!qm=All&q=zxx_chase
[21:08] <daveake> It's there
[21:08] <daveake> Look at GPIO17
[21:09] <LuckyLuke> GPIO17 is not a serial port, right ?
[21:09] <daveake> No it's a GPIO pin
[21:10] <LuckyLuke> 8-tx is serial and on schematics it goes only to ntx2b data, not to EN
[21:11] <daveake> 31<daveake>30 Look at GPIO17
[21:11] <daveake> Look at the connections it has
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[21:15] <mikestir> LuckyLuke: it's connected via the named net "UBX_RXD" and the 10k resistor R5
[21:16] <daveake> Not exactly the way I'd draw it :)
[21:16] <daveake> But then I use pen and paper not Eagle
[21:17] <LuckyLuke> ah ok, now I see it. it's somewhat an explicit connection. at least for a gyu like me who sees a schematics like this for a first time
[21:18] <mikestir> do you still do your PCBs using tape as well daveake? :)
[21:18] <daveake> No I get Upu to do it all :)
[21:18] <mikestir> yeah too many named interconnects on that schematic for something aimed at beginners imho
[21:19] <daveake> Yeah it took me a while to confirm the cct was as per my spec :)
[21:19] <Upu> lol
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[21:26] <stilldavid> oh, yeah. In case anyone wants to see some photos over the rocky mountains: https://stilldavid.com/stories/weather-balloon-rocky-mountains/
[21:26] <SpacenearUS> New vehicle on the map: 03KD0TRE_chase - 12http://tracker.habhub.org/#!qm=All&q=KD0TRE_chase
[21:26] <arko> seriously some nice work stilldavid :)
[21:26] <stilldavid> thanks arko :)
[21:26] <stilldavid> I was only a _little _nervous about landing on top of a mountain...
[21:26] <stilldavid> next time: better and more working cameras :)
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[21:28] <edmoore> these are great stilldavid
[21:28] <edmoore> what cam on the payload?
[21:28] <stilldavid> most of those are a gopro hd hero
[21:29] <edmoore> watching game of thrones so can't read txt
[21:29] <arko> lol
[21:29] <edmoore> does it have a still mode or something?
[21:29] <edmoore> or does it just record with no compression?
[21:29] <stilldavid> yeah, every 10s
[21:29] <edmoore> nice
[21:29] <stilldavid> I have a couple more 1200g balloons, I just wanted to get this one up for GSBC and while there was a lot of snow on the peaks
[21:30] <christopherlee> How did the g9 photos turn out?
[21:30] <edmoore> they're superb
[21:30] <edmoore> making all that lens distortion work for you :)
[21:30] <stilldavid> edmoore: I wish it wasn't _so_ pronounced!
[21:31] <stilldavid> christopherlee: great aside from being out of focus
[21:31] <stilldavid> I used an intervalometer script for CHDK, which was good, but it was set to focus once then hold focus
[21:31] <stilldavid> but for some reason, just before release, it focused on my pants when I was holding it. doesn't do so well at infinity
[21:32] <stilldavid> eg: full frame crop: https://stilldavid.com/stories/photos/balloon-rockies/longs/s2000/longs1.jpg
[21:32] <stilldavid> a bit soft
[21:32] <edmoore> (trousers)
[21:32] <christopherlee> Bit of a pain, my plan is for a sony rx100 mkii. Have constrcuted a remote shutter which will focus each time first.
[21:33] <arko> WOW
[21:33] <arko> nice one
[21:33] <christopherlee> Bit more interesting that flat old norfolk....
[21:33] <stilldavid> good call, christopherlee . Mine was a bit old and I was worried about battery life
[21:34] <stilldavid> and didn't have a 7.4V rail on the payload to solder into it
[21:34] <stilldavid> Totally going to 3d print a battery shell and get some copper tape for the next launch.
[21:34] <edmoore> great accompanying photos
[21:35] <christopherlee> 3d printed a battery for tk102 tracker before, the sony actualy has a dummy battery available.
[21:35] <edmoore> did the batts pop out or something?
[21:35] <christopherlee> gopro shots have come out great.
[21:35] <stilldavid> on the 2nd gopro, I have _no_ idea. It took about 15 shots, then just died. last shot is of the ground just before release.
[21:35] <stilldavid> battery was fully charged on recovery.
[21:36] <christopherlee> sd card error?
[21:37] <stilldavid> ¯\_(Ä)_/¯
[21:37] <stilldavid> it was an old SD card, I hadn't thought of that.
[21:37] <christopherlee> my greatest concern with the hero4 black...
[21:37] <christopherlee> believe it normaly still shows error on lcd if thats the case
[21:38] <stilldavid> which is great... at altitude with nobody to see it.
[21:38] <stilldavid> in space, nobody can see your errors...
[21:38] <christopherlee> :-)
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[22:12] <SpacenearUS> New vehicle on the map: 03KD0TRE-11 - 12http://tracker.habhub.org/#!qm=All&q=KD0TRE-11
[22:12] Nick change: fl_0 -> fl_0|afk
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[00:00] --- Tue Apr 28 2015