highaltitude.log.20150302

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[00:05] <SpacenearUS> New vehicle on the map: 03KC5SFU-5 - 12http://tracker.habhub.org/#!qm=All&q=KC5SFU-5
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[00:53] <homojn> hi
[00:55] <craag> o/
[00:55] <homojn> How goes it?
[00:57] <craag> Good ta
[00:57] <craag> you?
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[01:00] <craag> bedtime, gn!
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[01:02] <homojn> Alright thanks
[01:02] <homojn> :(
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[02:30] <homojn> hello
[02:30] <homojn> What times does this chat usuually get active?
[02:35] <SpeedEvil> It's quiet typically from about 2 hours ago, till 10 hours from now
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[02:50] Nick change: Strykar_ -> Strykar
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[03:10] <homojn> cool
[03:10] <homojn> cheers
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[04:32] <heathkid> bla bla bla
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[08:12] <Maxell> heathkid: roger
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[09:16] <infaddict> Morning all. Question on PCB mounting/routing for NTX2B. I'm unsure whether to go horiz/vertical and also on Eagle schematic there is a hashed out red area. Is that a restricted area for planes/paths?
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[09:16] <infaddict> Finally, should I isloate the RF paths (signal and ground) from the rest of the stuff on the board?
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[09:18] <Maxell> infaddict: afaik RF ground can and will be 0 volts/gnd
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[09:18] <infaddict> ok so the RF gnd can go on normal gnd plane with other gnd then
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[09:19] <infaddict> so wonder if the rf tx signal needs its own polygon to keep it away from other stuff
[09:19] <Upu> hey infaddict
[09:20] <infaddict> Morning Upu
[09:20] <Maxell> infaddict: I think the NTX2B has his RF ground connected to the same 0 volts rail yes.
[09:20] <Upu> its just a bit where the crystal was on the original NTX2B's
[09:20] <infaddict> aha
[09:20] <infaddict> cool so can be ignored on my version
[09:20] <Upu> you can get (but wouldn't recommend it) 0603 comps under the original
[09:20] <Upu> newer one is lower so just stay out of the underside entirely
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[09:20] <Upu> won't cause any issues you can route under there
[09:21] <infaddict> ok so i can route anything under ntx2b without any worry?
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[09:21] <Upu> yep just keep the RF section clean
[09:21] <Upu> if you are making your own board I would use the MTX2 actually
[09:21] <Upu> smaller
[09:21] <Upu> same circuit
[09:21] <Upu> (its just an NTX2B cut in half internally)
[09:22] <infaddict> right, that was my other q. bear in mind this is my first ever board. yer i wasnt originally gonna go PCB for 1st flight but thinking i will now. but own NTX2B so gonna use that on V1 anyway.
[09:22] <infaddict> by "RF section clean" do you mean avoid gnd plan and other signals on the RF lines?
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[09:24] <Upu> route RF out to the antenna
[09:24] <Upu> surround it with ground plane
[09:24] <Upu> you're making coax cable but on a PCB
[09:25] <infaddict> great. and that ground plane can be my normal ground plane where every other gnd is going right?
[09:25] <Upu> yes
[09:25] <infaddict> perfect, easier than i thought
[09:25] <Upu> surround the track with GND via's
[09:26] <Upu> no corners, 90's etc in either the GPS or radio RF track
[09:26] <Upu> http://i.imgur.com/eOFEIHx.png
[09:27] <Upu> kepe it short and simple
[09:27] <infaddict> interesting, never seen use of vias like that
[09:28] <infaddict> yes simple is good. i plan to put my SMA connector very close to radio.
[09:28] <infaddict> i'm thinking of mounting SMA on bottom of board pointing downwards, which is where antenna needs to be
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[09:50] <ProSpectre> anyone of you receiving HRPT from wx satellites?
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[10:13] <SpacenearUS> New vehicle on the map: 03M0UPU-Chase - 12http://tracker.habhub.org/#!qm=All&q=M0UPU-Chase
[10:14] <infaddict> You launching Upu?
[10:14] <daveake> He may be thin but he's still too heavy to launch
[10:15] <infaddict> ;-)
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[10:16] <SpeedEvil> daveake: that sounds like a bet.
[10:16] <daveake> "We're going to need considerably bigger balloons"
[10:20] <Maxell> That PS-36 balloon is also doing a nice .au trip :P http://tracker.habhub.org/#!mt=roadmap&mz=4&qm=All&f=PS-36&q=PS-36
[10:21] <infaddict> I told a relative about my plan to launch a balloon to near space and they actually did think I would be on it! ;-)
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[10:23] <Maxell> Heh, his -9 vechicle is his chase car. Nice importing work there... http://aprs.fi/#!call=a%2FM0UPU-9
[10:23] <infaddict> daveake: as predicted i am already sick of the Arduino crappy IDE and development environment. what options do i have for standalone C++ IDE to be able to load binaries onto Arduino (or any micro)?
[10:25] <craag> avrdude is your friend :)
[10:25] <craag> (and what the arduino IDE uses behind the scenes)
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[10:26] <infaddict> thx craag will take a look. so is avrdude a IDE or a way to load stuff onto micros?
[10:27] <Darkside> the second
[10:27] <craag> it's a simple binary for loading hex files onto AVRs
[10:27] <craag> eg. avrdude -c avrispmkII -P usb -B 5 -p m328 -C /etc/avrdude.conf
[10:28] <craag> (that's what I use on ubuntu)
[10:28] <craag> avrispmkII = programmer I'm using
[10:28] <craag> usb = port it's plugged into
[10:28] <craag> m328 = avr part (atmega328)
[10:29] <craag> then append: -U flash:w:main.hex:i
[10:29] <craag> to flash the compiled main.hex
[10:29] <craag> (sorry for dump, gtg)
[10:29] <infaddict> hehe np. so what do you use to write code and compile/build to main.hex?
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[10:55] <dbrooke> infaddict: I use the CLI, so an editor (vim in my case) and (the debian package in my case) of https://github.com/sudar/Arduino-Makefile
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[11:57] <fsphil> infaddict: vim to write, make/gcc to build
[11:59] <infaddict> thx dbrooke and fsphil. so is vim a proper ide rather than advanced text editor? so it can lookup definitions, api's, auto complete etc
[11:59] <fsphil> just a text editor
[11:59] <fsphil> pretty good one
[12:02] <infaddict> ok ta
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[12:09] <dbrooke> To get context aware navigation/search I use cscope http://cscope.sourceforge.net/cscope_vim_tutorial.html
[12:16] <R34lB0rg> i've bricked my arduino / ardupilot so that avrdude does not recognize it anymore (timeout)
[12:18] <fsphil> are you programming through an ISP header or serial?
[12:20] <R34lB0rg> trough ttyACM0 / atmega32 / stk500v2
[12:20] <R34lB0rg> well, i guess i'm not getting through to the stk500v2
[12:21] <fsphil> sounds like ISP
[12:22] <fsphil> I've had that fail if I set the fuses wrong. or can also be another device on the SPI bus like an SD card
[12:22] <fsphil> they can stop the programmer working
[12:23] <R34lB0rg> procedure to brick it was simple: git clone ardupilot; make ; make update
[12:23] <fsphil> check the makefile didn't change the fuses
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[12:31] <R34lB0rg> make upload only did "/usr/bin/avrdude -c wiring -p atmega2560 -P /dev/ttyACM0 -b115200 -U flash:w:/tmp/ArduCopter.build/ArduCopter.hex:i"
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[12:55] <LunarWork> hello
[12:56] <SpeedEvil> he
[12:56] <Geoff-G8DHE-Lap> llo
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[13:04] <Maxell> infaddict: you could give "ino" a try. http://inotool.org/
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[16:31] <adamgreig> hey Laurenceb what was that non-contact thermo thing you had
[16:31] <adamgreig> does farnell sell them
[16:33] <SpeedEvil> adamgreig: Do you mean the tmp007 tmp006 TI thermal infrared sensor?
[16:33] <adamgreig> yes
[16:33] <SpeedEvil> nad yes
[16:33] <adamgreig> thanks
[16:33] <adamgreig> perfect
[16:34] <adamgreig> hmm farnell only have the tmp007 on eval board?
[16:34] <SpeedEvil> TI does samples reasonably
[16:36] <SpeedEvil> http://www.ti.com/lsds/ti/analog/sensors/overview.page
[16:38] <adamgreig> how... directional... is it
[16:38] <SpeedEvil> not
[16:38] <SpeedEvil> you need a lens if you want to make it directional
[16:38] <adamgreig> a lens eh
[16:39] <adamgreig> http://www.melexis.com/Infrared-Thermometer-Sensors/Infrared-Thermometer-Sensors/MLX90621-823.aspx
[16:39] <SpeedEvil> http://www.3dlens.com/shop/proddetail.php?prod=5088
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[16:40] <SpeedEvil> And yes, those are considerably more expensie
[16:41] <adamgreig> shame
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[16:43] Nick change: KingJ_ -> KingJ
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[17:28] <alxwntr> Hiya, a question about conserving memory on the Arduino:
[17:29] <SpeedEvil> Don't use the arduino stack
[17:29] <alxwntr> if I want to store the arrays of UBX commands to send to a gps
[17:29] <alxwntr> it takes up a fair bit
[17:29] <alxwntr> I saw some code that stores them in a .h file
[17:29] <alxwntr> is this much more efficient?
[17:30] <alxwntr> I would have to learn how to write them properly, but if it saves a lot of space it might be worth it
[17:30] <alxwntr> *looks up stack
[17:31] <mattbrejza> put them in the eeprom
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[17:31] <mattbrejza> the arrays will take up flash and ram on the avr
[17:31] <Vaizki> _F()
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[17:33] <alxwntr> oh that's what that does...
[17:33] <alxwntr> I was wondering
[17:33] <alxwntr> right
[17:33] <alxwntr> and the eeprom is a separate bit of memory that the arduino has?
[17:33] <mattbrejza> yea
[17:34] <alxwntr> so if I store something as
[17:34] <alxwntr> const unsigned char { F(stuff) }
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[17:34] <mattbrejza> the avr cant access flash like ram, so it has to copy all const arrays into the ram on startup (so they use ram even though they never change)
[17:34] <alxwntr> can I then just use it in the code as I would any other variable?
[17:35] <alxwntr> ok
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[17:35] <mattbrejza> http://www.avrfreaks.net/forum/tut-c-using-eeprom-memory-avr-gcc?page=all
[17:35] <adamgreig> they're not huge arrays though, like tens of bytes at most
[17:35] <adamgreig> I'd just stick them in flash space and whatever
[17:36] <mattbrejza> the flight mode one is 44 bytes
[17:36] <mattbrejza> and the nmea off ones are 16 each
[17:37] <alxwntr> ok, probably not big enough to worry about
[17:37] <mattbrejza> so what is your ram usage?
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[17:38] <alxwntr> bit early to say just yet
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[17:38] <alxwntr> I'm getting things to work atm
[17:39] <qyx_> what
[17:39] <qyx_> there is a thing called progmem
[17:39] <adamgreig> mattbrejza: but the nmea off ones are all nearly identical, no need to store them all
[17:39] <qyx_> i don't know if it is on arduino though
[17:39] <adamgreig> maybe optimise memory usage after getting it working
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[17:39] <qyx_> but it allows you to put things in the flash (just like const char array)
[17:39] <mattbrejza> adamgreig: the checksum is different, so you can but it gets a bit annoying
[17:40] <mattbrejza> space-effort tradeoff
[17:40] <Vaizki> Or just turn off all nmea output with one command
[17:41] <adamgreig> pft
[17:41] <Vaizki> If you just use ubx
[17:41] <adamgreig> hmm can you do that though?
[17:41] <Vaizki> Yes
[17:41] <adamgreig> mattbrejza: https://github.com/adamgreig/m2-electronics/blob/master/m2r/firmware/ublox.c structs and a checksum computing algorithm ;)
[17:41] <adamgreig> Vaizki: what's the command for that?
[17:41] <Vaizki> CFG-PRT
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[17:42] <Vaizki> I think. I'm in a taxi queue in Barcelona
[17:42] <Vaizki> 45min queue
[17:42] <adamgreig> ah yes
[17:42] <adamgreig> I think you're right
[17:42] <adamgreig> wonder why I didn't just do that
[17:43] <adamgreig> certainly it has a bit mask that enables outNmea and outUbx
[17:43] <mattbrejza> because someone wrote the longer way on the wiki and everyones been copying it since? :P
[17:43] <Vaizki> I know I'm right, I use it. :)
[17:43] <adamgreig> I wasn't copying it, I was on a plane for 8 hours with no internet and some datasheets :P
[17:43] <mattbrejza> also if you use ucentre to generate the config strings you might miss the 'faster' way
[17:44] <adamgreig> yea I guess it stemmed from using ucenter ages back to do this
[17:44] <adamgreig> neat
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[17:47] <Vaizki> I have a Mac and never used ucenter.. Helps ;)
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[17:49] <mattbrejza> ucentre does graph all the sat data nicely though
[17:50] <Vaizki> I'm sure I'll try it some day... Very new to Ublox
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[17:59] <Vaizki> ok that was bad, 65 minutes in taxi queue
[17:59] <Vaizki> trade shows suck
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[18:04] <adamgreig> Vaizki: at MWC?
[18:05] <Vaizki> yup
[18:05] <Vaizki> 16th year in a row
[18:05] <adamgreig> wow
[18:05] <adamgreig> I was up all night trying to get a demo working for a booth there :P
[18:06] <Vaizki> which one if it's not a secret?
[18:06] <alxwntr> Sorry!
[18:06] <adamgreig> not exactly a secret but see privmsg
[18:06] <alxwntr> just had to take a really important wedding-related call
[18:07] <alxwntr> :)
[18:07] <alxwntr> thanks for the advice/info
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[18:28] <michemto> Hey!
[18:29] <michemto> could anyone give me approximate number how many balloons have been up there
[18:29] <arko> over 9000
[18:30] <adamgreig> i just wanna count all the balloons. but i can't, can't count every balloon
[18:31] <arko> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qfPTC7-wCL8
[18:33] <alxwntr> classic!
[18:35] <arko> i think it would be difficult to get a count of how many habs have been launched
[18:36] <mattbrejza> how do you count all the balloons let do by little kids...
[18:36] <adamgreig> doubt they get very high :P
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[18:36] <mattbrejza> didnt leo get one that flaoted at ~2km?
[18:36] <alxwntr> mattbrejza: those tutes you posted are excellent
[18:36] <alxwntr> thanks
[18:36] <mattbrejza> thank google ;)
[18:37] <alxwntr> :)
[18:38] <alxwntr> michemto: is what you're trying to do count only the serious balloon projects?
[18:38] <alxwntr> like these ones:
[18:38] <alxwntr> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZJIDWUQ_rNs
[18:38] <alxwntr> scary...
[18:43] <michemto> hehe :D
[18:43] <michemto> damn, bad topic
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[19:10] <michemto> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZyB8a3T95Vc
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[00:00] --- Tue Mar 3 2015