highaltitude.log.20150301

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[06:13] <SpacenearUS> New position from 03PS-36 after 038 hours silence - 12http://tracker.habhub.org/#!qm=All&q=PS-36
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[08:52] <ProSpectre> morning HABies
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[09:28] <ProSpectre> Can the Funcube DOngle be used to receive weather data from NOOA sats?
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[09:42] <ProSpectre> found it. works.
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[10:00] <AdamDynamic> I'm sure I read on the CUSF website a while back that they help HABers by allowing people to use their CAA exemption - does anyone know if they are still doing this (or ever did this, if I'm mis-remembering?)
[10:01] <AdamDynamic> Their twitter feed seems to have gone dead, are they still an active society?
[10:09] <Geoff-G8DHE-Lap> I do believe they do drop them an email is prbably best.
[10:16] <AdamDynamic> Email sounds like a good idea
[10:16] <AdamDynamic> I thought that someone from the society might have been on here and thought I'd try my luck :)
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[10:26] <infaddict> Using macports for the first time and installing latest Gqrx. Been going an hour now installing dependancies!
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[11:49] <SpacenearUS> New vehicle on the map: 03HB9FUF-4 - 12http://tracker.habhub.org/#!qm=All&q=HB9FUF-4
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[12:15] <domojn> hello
[12:17] <fsphil> afternoon
[12:18] <domojn> Lovely afternoon, isn't it
[12:18] <fsphil> indeed. having a nice lazy one so far
[12:19] <domojn> lol
[12:20] <domojn> Is this chan UK only?
[12:21] <fsphil> not at all
[12:23] <infaddic_> finally got Gqrx working with latest version on mac. Sadly it involves a full X-Code and Macports installation then a full source download (including all deps) of Gqrx.
[12:24] <fsphil> I'm surprised there isn't a pre-compiled binary
[12:25] <infaddic_> Indeed me too. Only ones I could find are well out of date.
[12:25] <infaddic_> But I can now create one!
[12:25] <infaddic_> On my list to do and if someone has anywhere to host it I will share it here
[12:25] <infaddic_> I've also figured out (after much trial and error) how to zoom in on the frequency spectrum graph...
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[12:26] <infaddic_> So you cursor has to be on the horizontal frequency line and change to a "hand" cursor.... then you press 2 fingers on trackpad (only press not click) and move both fingers left or right
[12:26] <infaddic_> So NOT the usual pinch to zoom
[12:26] <infaddic_> and like nothing else I've come across
[12:27] <infaddic_> the latest version of Gqrx also detects soundflower on OSX so can now easily route audio to fldigi
[12:27] <domojn> What freqs do you guys use?
[12:27] <fsphil> yea on linux it's hover over the frequency line and use the mouse wheel
[12:27] <fsphil> so it's probably emulating that with the two finger thing
[12:27] <fsphil> mac mice are so odd
[12:28] <fsphil> domojn: in the UK it's mostly the 434mhz ISM band
[12:28] <infaddic_> yep agreed, for users with less accesibility there really should be keyboard equivalents or a more intuitive way like a slider control
[12:28] <domojn> lpd, lol
[12:28] <infaddic_> but its open source so that can easily be added
[12:28] <domojn> I bet that must be a pain in the backside using 433
[12:29] <fsphil> yea, my laptop has no version of a mouse wheel so it's a bit ackward
[12:29] <infaddic_> exactly
[12:29] <infaddic_> so now i just need my antenna joining bits and bobs to arrive to make it all hang together
[12:30] <fsphil> 433.9 would be annoying because of all the other devices
[12:30] <domojn> Have you tried using pg up/ down, or the Home and End keys?
[12:30] <fsphil> but away from that it's fine
[12:30] <infaddic_> a mac keyboard has none of those things (well my macbook anyway)
[12:30] <fsphil> flights are routinely tracked from 500km away
[12:30] <domojn> 433 is a horrible band, terrible qrm
[12:31] <fsphil> depends on the area
[12:31] <fsphil> it's pretty much silent here apart from 433.9
[12:32] <fsphil> between 434.100 and 434.500 is fine
[12:32] <domojn> http://store.apple.com/us/question/answers/product/MC184T/B/is-there-a-keyboard-short-cut-for-page-updown-with-the-wireless-keyboard/Q72FCDUUUC29J4H42
[12:32] <fsphil> yea mac keyboards are as odd as their keyboards
[12:32] <fsphil> er, as their mice*
[12:33] <fsphil> lovely screens though
[12:34] <infaddic_> indeed. but if your badging something as an OSX application at least make it work with OSX gestures and devices.
[12:35] <fsphil> must see if gqrx runs on the Pi2 .. anyone tried?
[12:37] <domojn> Apple try way too hard to be different
[12:38] <domojn> What do the transmitters transmit exactly?
[12:39] <domojn> And what modes?
[12:40] <fsphil> on 434mhz it's typically rtty
[12:40] <fsphil> but other modes have been used. dominoex, thor and contestia
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[13:09] <paul_> I don't know if anybody will find this interesting but I pushed up a first commit of a script which stitches together really wideband radioscans using rtl_power
[13:09] <paul_> https://github.com/corpr8/widebandradioscan
[13:10] <paul_> currently configured to go from 50Mhz-350Mhz
[13:10] <paul_> outputs a webpage with an image which is approx 55K pixels wide.
[13:13] <paul_> and tested on R PI 2.
[13:14] <fsphil> got an example?
[13:14] <paul_> Yeah hang on 2 secs
[13:15] <SpeedEvil> http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/SCIAKY-Electron-Beam-Welder-EBW-Model-VX-3-68x68x84-NEW-CNC-Control-REFURBISHED-/251486125761?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item3a8dbdbec1
[13:15] <SpeedEvil> vacuum test chamber anyone?
[13:16] <paul_> ok so I have to re-run the script as the previous was set to listen for only 1 min and it has ludicrously small amount of data: http://gravitywell.no-ip.org/web/SurveySweep-2015-03-01-12-31-29/
[13:16] <paul_> set it running will post new url once finished (approx 30 mins)
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[13:59] <paul_> Updated wideband scan (5minutes data across 5-350Mhz): http://gravitywell.no-ip.org/web/SurveySweep-2015-03-01-13-15-33/
[14:00] <paul_> sorry, 50Mhz - 350Mhz
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[14:25] <SpacenearUS> New vehicle on the map: 03VE2WMG-11 - 12http://tracker.habhub.org/#!qm=All&q=VE2WMG-11
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[14:33] <alxwntr> Hello everyone
[14:34] <alxwntr> I'm trying to learn how to communicate with my uBlox7 over I2C
[14:34] <alxwntr> and I'm making lots of progress
[14:34] <alxwntr> but I have encountered an issue with sending data
[14:34] <adamgreig> what seems to be the issue
[14:35] <alxwntr> when I write end.Transmission(), it returns a 2
[14:35] <fsphil> paul_: that's quite neat
[14:35] <alxwntr> which is apparently "received NACK on transmit of address"
[14:36] <adamgreig> paul_: nice, what software did you use?
[14:36] <alxwntr> not sure why - it's a very simple routine to send one command as a start so I can get my head around it
[14:36] <adamgreig> alxwntr: do you have an oscilloscope or logic analyser or anything like that?
[14:36] <alxwntr> unfortunately not, sorry
[14:36] <adamgreig> and could you put the code up?
[14:36] <alxwntr> what would that result normally mean?
[14:36] <alxwntr> oh sure
[14:36] <adamgreig> I've done i2c to a ublox before but never on arduino
[14:36] <adamgreig> (which I assume you're using)
[14:37] <adamgreig> (from the function name only)
[14:37] <adamgreig> paul_: what SDR are you using that does 50MHz wide?
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[14:38] <alxwntr> http://pastebin.com/9i8qBa0E
[14:39] <alxwntr> I based it on the functions in the wiki for transmission over serial
[14:39] <alxwntr> and altered it after infaddict helped me loads
[14:39] <alxwntr> should be quite simple
[14:40] <alxwntr> hope I haven't done anything stupid with the hardware
[14:40] <adamgreig> and the error occurs where?
[14:40] <adamgreig> do you have pull-up resistors on SDA and SCL?
[14:40] <alxwntr> no - I thought it wasn't needed for just one thing
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[14:41] <alxwntr> I have +5V (also to EN), GND, SDA->A4, SCL->A5
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[14:42] <adamgreig> you require pullups always with i2c
[14:42] <alxwntr> oh!
[14:42] <adamgreig> often people use the internal pullup resistors in the AVR
[14:42] <adamgreig> (and come to think of it.. perhaps the ublox also has internal pullups)
[14:42] <adamgreig> they need to exist somewhere
[14:43] <adamgreig> so if you check the ublox hardware integration manual (which definitely is a must-read)...
[14:43] <adamgreig> in 1.6.3 is the description of the I2C interface and indeed it says "Pins SDA1 and SCL2 have internal 13k pull-ups"
[14:44] <adamgreig> so perhaps that is fine
[14:44] <adamgreig> where does the error happen?
[14:44] <alxwntr> ln 58
[14:45] <alxwntr> I guess that's when I try to send the queued data
[14:45] <alxwntr> it returns 2, which I read as an error as it wasn't 0: success
[14:46] <adamgreig> but wire.endTransmission() returns 0 on line 41?
[14:46] <adamgreig> most of the time?
[14:46] <adamgreig> oh, nevermind, that presumably doesn't get called at all?
[14:46] <alxwntr> 41 isn't called - the array isn't big enough
[14:46] <alxwntr> yep
[14:47] <adamgreig> as a quick check, try removing the serial.print part, it could be messing up the i2c timing
[14:47] <alxwntr> ah
[14:47] <alxwntr> how would I know it's worked?
[14:47] <alxwntr> or you mean just at that point?
[14:47] <adamgreig> just the one on l50 that's between wire.start and wire.end
[14:48] <alxwntr> ok
[14:48] <alxwntr> will do
[14:49] <alxwntr> hmm, no dice
[14:49] <alxwntr> same result
[14:49] <adamgreig> ok
[14:50] <adamgreig> this level of debugging gets a bit harder so there are a few other things worth checking...
[14:50] <adamgreig> you say you have 5V powering the ublox
[14:50] <adamgreig> is that with a voltage regulator and level conversion..
[14:50] <alxwntr> yes
[14:50] <adamgreig> or 5V directly into the ublox?
[14:50] <alxwntr> sorry
[14:50] <alxwntr> 5V straight from Arduino 5V into uBlox
[14:51] <Geoff-G8DHE-Lap> Infaddict and Vaizki werepalying with I2C on the ublox recently and solved several issues.
[14:51] <Geoff-G8DHE-Lap> were playing *
[14:52] <adamgreig> so if you check the datasheet for the ublox you'll see (4.1, abs max ratings) that the maximum vcc is 3.6V
[14:52] <adamgreig> 5V is fairly over-spec, and 5V for the SCA/SCL lines is also over spec
[14:52] <alxwntr> oh shit
[14:52] <adamgreig> would somewhat expect it to work anyway so it's probably not your actual problem
[14:52] <adamgreig> but it's no good either and probably not doing the ublox any favours
[14:52] <alxwntr> that's a really stupid mistake
[14:53] <alxwntr> sorry
[14:53] <adamgreig> there was some chat about this sort of thing in the channel a while back, but the gist is you need a 3v3 power supply (such as the one on the arduino) and use pullups that just go to 3v3 instead of 5v
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[14:53] <adamgreig> well - if you're using the ublox's internal pullups, that's easy because they go to its vcc
[14:53] <adamgreig> so if you just connect the ublox's EN and VCC to the arduino's 3v3 you should be ok
[14:54] <alxwntr> So nothing special required for the other two pins?
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[14:54] <alxwntr> oh hang on
[14:54] <alxwntr> the VCC pin on my ublox (max7-q)
[14:54] <alxwntr> says 5V
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[14:54] <alxwntr> so actually, perhaps I wasn't so stupid
[14:55] <alxwntr> phew
[14:56] <adamgreig> where does it say that?
[14:56] <adamgreig> is your ublox mounted on a PCB that includes a voltage regulator or something?
[14:56] <alxwntr> it's the habsupplies breakout
[14:56] <alxwntr> 5v sritten by the pn
[14:58] <alxwntr> sorry, should have said that
[14:59] <infaddict> i connect 3.3V to ublox VCC and EN as per adamgreig
[14:59] <adamgreig> yea, if you have a 5v regulator on the PCB then that's fine
[14:59] <alxwntr> http://ava.upuaut.net/store/index.php?route=product/product&path=59_60&product_id=68
[15:00] <alxwntr> just like that one
[15:00] <alxwntr> but with the ublox max7
[15:00] <alxwntr> so, looks like there is a regulator
[15:01] <infaddict> are you using a pre built PCB or building one yourself
[15:01] <alxwntr> pre-fab
[15:01] <alxwntr> you mean the ublox?
[15:01] <infaddict> no i mean what are you connecting it to
[15:01] <infaddict> like where is your power coming from
[15:02] <alxwntr> I've got it all on a breadboard
[15:02] <alxwntr> ooh sorry - arduino
[15:02] <alxwntr> uno r3
[15:02] <infaddict> ok so the uno has a regulator on it to take in your raw power and output a clean 5V
[15:02] <infaddict> you need that clean 5V to feed into ublox board on both VCC and EN
[15:03] <alxwntr> ok - I think that's what I've done
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[15:04] <adamgreig> yea it sounds like you've got that part. it starts being a bit harder to debug without extra tools now though ;)
[15:04] <alxwntr> are you thinking that the problem is probably with the hardware rather than the code~?
[15:04] <adamgreig> perhaps a much more minimal arduino test case would be useful
[15:05] <alxwntr> bit difficult to know how much less I could do - I'm only sending one command and waiting for a response
[15:06] <alxwntr> any ideas?
[15:06] <infaddict> so u r getting a 2 back on endTransmission?
[15:06] <adamgreig> something like... const uint8_t d[8] = { 0xB5, 0x62, 0x01, 0x03, 0x00, 0x00, 0x04, 0x0D }; void setup() { wire.beginTransmission(0x42); wire.write(d, 8); int result = wire.endTransmission(); Serial.begin(9600); Serial.println(result); }
[15:06] <Geoff-G8DHE-Lap> infaddict didn't you find a 32byte limit in the write.h ?
[15:06] <infaddict> correct i've already told alxwntr about that
[15:07] <Geoff-G8DHE-Lap> Sah ok
[15:07] <infaddict> but always good to mention it again ;-)
[15:07] <infaddict> Why the ,8 in the wire.write
[15:07] <infaddict> wire.write should just take the char
[15:07] <infaddict> like wire.write(d)
[15:08] <adamgreig> uhm... d is an array
[15:08] <adamgreig> wire.write(d) will transmit the very first element, 0xB5
[15:08] <adamgreig> but not all of it
[15:08] <adamgreig> hence the ,8
[15:08] <infaddict> ok i havent seen d declared so didnt know that
[15:08] <adamgreig> it's declared right there
[15:08] <adamgreig> same line
[15:08] <infaddict> ah sry yer
[15:09] <infaddict> well i loop through the message and xmit one at time
[15:09] <infaddict> and get no such error
[15:09] <infaddict> and i dont have pullups
[15:09] <adamgreig> perhaps you could share your exact code with alxwntr then
[15:09] <adamgreig> (the ublox has internal 13k pullups to vcc)
[15:09] <alxwntr> he has (very kindly)
[15:09] <infaddict> already shared it
[15:09] <adamgreig> the exact same code works for infaddict and not for alxwntr?
[15:10] <alxwntr> and it's more-or-less the exact same structure for these simple functions
[15:10] <infaddict> nope my code doesnt look like his
[15:10] <adamgreig> perhaps try the exact same first
[15:10] <alxwntr> ok
[15:10] <adamgreig> or at least the most minimal mods to make it work
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[15:10] <adamgreig> if that's still not working you can safely assume it's a hardware problem
[15:10] <alxwntr> ok
[15:10] Nick change: Steffanx -> Guest57226
[15:10] <alxwntr> I'll try that
[15:10] Nick change: Guest57226 -> Steffann
[15:11] <alxwntr> thanks for the help everyone
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[15:11] <infaddict> and you have the correct arduino pins connected to SCA and SDL
[15:11] <infaddict> ?
[15:11] <alxwntr> A4 and A5
[15:11] <paul_> adamgreig: using at rtl2838 stick and rtl_power
[15:11] <alxwntr> I have +5V (also to EN), GND, SDA->A4, SCL->A5
[15:11] <adamgreig> paul_: wow, I didn't know the rtl-sdr could capture 50MHz chunks?
[15:12] <adamgreig> oh, is the software sweeping inside each 50MHz bit?
[15:12] <alxwntr> (on the gps breakout that is)
[15:12] <paul_> adamgreig: Yup!
[15:12] <paul_> and on a Pi 2
[15:12] <paul_> :)
[15:12] <adamgreig> is the software itself doing a quick sweep?
[15:12] <paul_> the dongle is using 1Khz buckets
[15:13] <paul_> yes it's iterating over rtl_power at different frequencies...
[15:13] <adamgreig> inside each 50MHz bit?
[15:13] <db_g6gzh> alxwntr: does your breakout board have the IIC level shifter fitted? "We can fit an additional level conversion chip to level convert SCL/SDA on request (additional charge) but by default SCL/SDA are NOT connected."
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[15:14] <paul_> nope each 50Mhz bit is an rtl_power sweep at 10khz resolution (sorry not 1 khz)
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[15:14] <adamgreig> oh, right, but it's not seeing all 50MHz simultaneously?
[15:14] <paul_> nope thats just too much data
[15:14] <paul_> but you can
[15:14] <alxwntr> db_g6gzh: oh goodness, you may have got it
[15:14] <paul_> at lower resolution
[15:14] <adamgreig> so it's sampling 10kHz of spectrum and then swapping to the next 10kHz and so on per 50MHz, for 5 minutes, and then you repeat that for many 50MHz windows
[15:14] <infaddict> alxwntr: A4 and A5 should work. note there are also dedicated SDA and SDL pins
[15:14] <adamgreig> can you definitely?
[15:15] <infaddict> alxwntr: but only laballed on rear of UNO
[15:15] <adamgreig> like, no matter what resolution to do all 50MHz simultaneously is I think well beyond what the rtl-sdr can do
[15:15] <paul_> nope - it does lots of 10Khz simultaneours
[15:15] <adamgreig> @_@ huh
[15:15] <alxwntr> I wasn;t planning on using I2C initially, but infaddict suggested it would be a good idea and I hadn't realised I must have missed this
[15:15] <adamgreig> alxwntr: hah, that could well be your problem :P
[15:15] <db_g6gzh> alxwntr: on the page you linked there is an empty space to the left of the serial level shifter
[15:15] <adamgreig> but I don't understand why Upu would offer i2c level conversion
[15:16] <adamgreig> it's an open drain, the pullups are internal, you don't need it at all
[15:16] <adamgreig> oi Upu why do you put level conversion on your i2c :P
[15:16] <adamgreig> but yea, if the pins are not connected you'll have a bad day
[15:16] <alxwntr> you see the picture on that page - is the blank space buttom left where this would go?
[15:17] <alxwntr> i.e., if I get a level convertor, could I fit one here?
[15:17] <adamgreig> you can probably just bypass the level converter with some well thought out wires but it does look like that's the spot
[15:17] <alxwntr> to allow me to use this I2C business (wich seems quite good...)
[15:17] <alxwntr> what does that do in the circuit?
[15:18] <alxwntr> the level convertor I mean
[15:18] <infaddict> yer so the clue is in this sentence on Upus page:
[15:18] <infaddict> We can fit an additional level conversion chip to level convert SCL/SDA on request (additional charge) but by default SCL/SDA are NOT connected.
[15:18] <db_g6gzh> I'm not so familiar with the arduino I/O, maybe it always pulls up to its own Vcc ?
[15:19] <adamgreig> it can optionally but doesn't always
[15:19] <db_g6gzh> OK
[15:19] <infaddict> so alxwntr if your gps breakout board doe not have the level conversion chip then i2c wont work
[15:19] <adamgreig> haha having said that
[15:19] <db_g6gzh> ...
[15:19] <adamgreig> it looks like in recentish arduino software, wire.beginTransmission does actually enable the internal pullups for you...
[15:20] <adamgreig> so for the microchip they are optional, but the library turns them on...
[15:20] <adamgreig> you can disable it still but it's a bit gross
[15:20] <db_g6gzh> I guess Upu is playing safe with the level shifter then
[15:20] <adamgreig> yea, sounds like it
[15:20] <adamgreig> sigh, arduinos
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[15:22] <db_g6gzh> so alxwntr you need the level shifter on the breakout to convert the ublox 3V3 to the arduino 5V on SDA and SCL
[15:22] <alxwntr> ah I see - so the uBlox works on 3V3 logic and the arduino on 5V, is that is?
[15:22] <alxwntr> *it
[15:23] <infaddict> your arduino, yes
[15:23] <alxwntr> ok
[15:23] <infaddict> my mini pro is 3.3v
[15:23] <db_g6gzh> yes, Uno anyway
[15:23] <alxwntr> I guess I'll send Upu an email and ask him how I can fit the level convertor
[15:24] <adamgreig> (though just to be stubborn I will note you can quite happily do this without a level converter because i2c is a somewhat neat protocol that can avoid the issue altogether)
[15:24] <adamgreig> (just, alas, the arduino wire library turns on pullups in the arduino that make it 5v instead of 3v3)
[15:24] <alxwntr> right
[15:25] <alxwntr> ah well, I don;t mind doing a bit of bodging to get it to work
[15:25] <db_g6gzh> assuming 3V3 gives the arduino input enough margin to read reliably
[15:26] <alxwntr> it's all new to me, so I can think of all these issues for the next project
[15:28] <alxwntr> looks like direct 3v3 I2C connexion is not recommended for the Uno:
[15:28] <alxwntr> http://playground.arduino.cc/Main/I2CBi-directionalLevelShifter
[15:28] <alxwntr> "Usually works" isn't really good enough, eh?
[15:29] <SpacenearUS> New vehicle on the map: 03sp9uob - 12http://tracker.habhub.org/#!qm=All&q=sp9uob
[15:31] <db_g6gzh> that says it needs at least 3V6 to guarantee reading a high, talk to Upu about the level shifter then at least you know you can trust the hardware
[15:31] <alxwntr> Will do
[15:31] <alxwntr> cheers
[15:33] <db_g6gzh> 3V5 I meant to type but same applies
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[15:50] <SpacenearUS> New vehicle on the map: 03Gabro01 - 12http://tracker.habhub.org/#!qm=All&q=Gabro01
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[16:30] <SpacenearUS> New vehicle on the map: 03sp9uob-l - 12http://tracker.habhub.org/#!qm=All&q=sp9uob-l
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[16:59] <Ian_> alxwntr Bss138 FET may be the answer http://diydrones.com/forum/topics/ppm-input-logic-level
[16:59] <Ian_> Not sure if this is the part that Upu would optionally fit (they are veeery small)
[17:00] Action: Ian_ looks for packets of bits - cheap as chips but a pain waiting for the banana boat arriving.
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[17:06] <infaddict> Dunno if anybody is interested but I've made a basic Eagle part for the Habsupplied M8C pico breakout. Feel free to use it and share it if its useful to you. https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/47752976/Eagle%20Libs/HAB-BO-M8PICO.lbr
[17:19] <SpacenearUS> New position from 03HYDEST001 after 0313 days silence - 12http://tracker.habhub.org/#!qm=All&q=HYDEST001
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[17:29] <Upu> ping alxwntr
[17:30] <Upu> does the board you purchased have a unpopulated set of pads on it ?
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[17:39] <Lunar_Lander> hello
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[17:46] <Vaizki> hullo
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[17:59] <Ian_> Hi Upu do you use BSS138 for that application?
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[18:13] <infaddict> looking to invest in a crimping tool and associated parts for coax work. do i need to look for specific sizing for SMA type work?
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[18:14] <Vaizki> why do you want to crimp your own coax?
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[18:15] <infaddict> why do you think? to connect coax to connectors
[18:15] <Vaizki> I just get ready made cables whenever I can..
[18:17] <Vaizki> I have made coax cables in the past but I suck at it. so I buy ready made or ask a friend to make them..
[18:17] <Jartza> evening
[18:17] <Vaizki> oh look a friend
[18:19] <Jartza> :)
[18:20] <Jartza> I used to hsve this special tool for stripping coax cable
[18:20] <Jartza> and crimpers
[18:20] <Vaizki> I still have them somewhere from old coax ethernet days
[18:21] <Jartza> but I also prefer to buy ready made cables
[18:21] <Vaizki> infaddict, do you have a specific reason why a ready-made cable wouldn't work?
[18:21] <Jartza> yeah, 10base-T, that's the time :)
[18:21] <Vaizki> long run or tight spaces?
[18:22] <mfa298> infaddict: my experience of crimping coax connectors is that the tools are sized as much for the cable as the type of connector
[18:22] <infaddict> Vaizki: i just want flexibility of precise lengths and possibility of mixture of connector types
[18:23] <Vaizki> well I would say a not-perfect connector on a coax is worth a whole lot of extra length in terms of signal loss
[18:23] <infaddict> thats why i want the correct tool as per original q
[18:24] <Vaizki> well then it depends on the connectors and cable you are usin
[18:26] <infaddict> 7mm coax like RG mini-8
[18:26] <infaddict> to SMA for starters
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[18:37] <Vaizki> http://www.amphenolconnex.com/132231.html
[18:37] <Vaizki> for example
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[18:38] <Vaizki> amphenol of course has their own tools which are hideously expensive but you can do quality brass connectors with any decent ratchet crimper
[18:38] <mfa298> good crimp tools cost a small fortune and probably work best with the designated connectors
[18:39] <mfa298> the cheaper crimp tools will do ok with standard types of cable and connectors (I've got a £20 from ebay that does ok with most of what I want)
[18:39] <cambazz> so here is my shoot at hab: http://pasteboard.co/1uaorw98.jpg <- it is not nearly as complete, but I can at least start wriing the software
[18:39] <Vaizki> yea rg58/rg8x is not very exotic
[18:40] <cambazz> and ideas for a micro lightweight sdcard shield
[18:40] <mfa298> I've had issues with mcx connectors on rg174 (the pin is too small for the crimp tool) and some 75R stuff
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[18:40] <Vaizki> most of my short cables are just ready made FME ones with adapters on both ends
[18:41] <Vaizki> FME is nice because the female connector is very small in diameter
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[18:41] <Vaizki> so when it's on the cable, you don't need a big hole to run it
[18:42] <cambazz> I found one on tindie, https://www.tindie.com/products/bot_thoughts/eezee-microsd-breakout-4/ but it is out of stock
[18:48] <infaddict> ok thx guys
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[18:49] <infaddict> cambazz: i'm using this one without issue: https://www.sparkfun.com/products/544
[18:49] <infaddict> looks v similar to that one you quote
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[18:52] <cambazz> infaddict: here is what i am trying to figure out: the sparkfun one has no chip inside, just a connector, where the other ones has some chips inside. i wonder if they do anything else than voltage regulation and stuff
[18:54] <infaddict> looks like a level shifter
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[18:57] <infaddict> i believe microSD is 2.7 to 3.6V. so that board you quote can accept 5V and will be shifting it downwards hence the chip.
[18:57] <infaddict> also note it depends which pins of SD spec you need. some breakouts don't wire all of them, just enough to read/write data.
[19:04] <cambazz> infaddict: i need to just read write and my board is already 3.3V
[19:04] <infaddict> ok in that case i would look for a native 3.3V breakout board
[19:05] <infaddict> or one that accepts 3.3V. that one you pasted does judging by texts.
[19:05] <cambazz> like the SF one?
[19:05] <infaddict> yes but that one you quote also appears to accept both 3.3V and 5V
[19:05] <cambazz> well it is extra weight for me. the sf board works directly with 3.3v right
[19:06] <infaddict> yes
[19:06] <infaddict> i am powering it with 3.3V from arduino mini pro
[19:12] <cambazz> i am doing this run with a moteino mega, but next time, i am hoping to get a msp430F5529 board. I think the msp430 boards have amazing analog capacity, and more suitable for harsh environments.
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[19:14] <Vaizki> they have nice mixed signal stuff yes but what do you need from that side?
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[19:15] <cambazz> Vaizki: I have been using them with energia, and i think overall they are more suitable for hab. especially the power system. and measuring more accurately.\
[19:16] <cambazz> they have the FR board which has FR ram and it is ultra low power. you can still program those with energia, arduino like language\
[19:17] <Vaizki> some may consider that as a benefit... :)
[19:17] <Vaizki> I have done MSP430 stuff years ago but never used energia
[19:17] <Vaizki> and FRAM parts didn't exist then
[19:18] <cambazz> Vaizki: i have built a robot and rf transmission system with them, and results were amazing
[19:19] <Upu> hey Ian_
[19:19] <Upu> I think I used it for turning GPS modules on and off
[19:19] <Vaizki> well I don't doubt that, just don't see what kind of ADC stuff etc you'd want for HAB where the MSP430 would be beneficial
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[19:20] <Ian_> Thanks for that. I have some and was thinking that I could provide FOC if they were needed . . . Even have a stamp ready.
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[19:21] <Ian_> Thought you maybe used them for level shifting as well.
[19:21] <Upu> might have done in the past
[19:21] <Ian_> Thanks again.
[19:22] <Vaizki> I think the power consumption of MSP430 parts is also very nice but not so sure if it matters at all when I'm running a NTX2B and Ublox at full steam anyway, sinking 60mA into those
[19:22] <Vaizki> or let's say 50mA
[19:23] <cambazz> hey is anyone using a moteino? whose are 3.3V boards right? I have 3.3V to Vin, and it would only give 2.8V on the 3.3V output
[19:23] <cambazz> so how do we use them at 3.3V
[19:24] <Vaizki> bypass the regulator?
[19:24] <cambazz> Vaizki: you have a point. Today I realized that too. (the fact that I got parts that sink current)
[19:24] <cambazz> Vaizki: so connect 3.3V to a 3.3V source? that would bypass regulator right?
[19:24] <infaddict> Vaizki: i did look at power saving modes of ublox but decided against it as even at full draw i still get 20+ hours battery life
[19:24] <infaddict> but more than possible to put it to sleep and wake it etc
[19:24] <Vaizki> cambazz: I'm not sure I'd have to check schematics
[19:24] <Vaizki> but now I'm late for dinner&
[19:25] <Vaizki> infaddict: yea not worth it for up & down hab
[19:25] <Ian_> Everything stops for tea :)
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[19:25] <Flerb_> This chip is so small it's getting clearance errors in eagle... weird
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[19:27] <Ian_> What chip would that be?
[19:28] <Flerb_> Ian_: the NRF24L01+
[19:28] <Flerb_> Catchy name don't you think?
[19:28] <zyp> Flerb_, fix your design rules
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[19:30] <Flerb_> zyp: was using the default
[19:30] <Flerb_> nothing wrong when using my manufacturer's
[19:31] <zyp> what's the poing in running DRC before you've even set the rules to something appropriate? defaults are usually not
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[19:43] <cambazz> both moteino s has a mcp1703CB as regulator, and i will bypass this?
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[19:48] <AdamDynamic> I'm doing some freezer tests on my GoPro Hero 2 and it seems to be dying after about 55-60 mins
[19:48] <AdamDynamic> Anyone any tips on extending the life?
[19:48] <Upu> well generally they keep themselves warn
[19:48] <Upu> warm
[19:49] <AdamDynamic> Yeah that's what I thought
[19:49] <Upu> don't forget as you go up there is less air
[19:49] <TT7> Hello gentlemen, could somebody point me to an example of solar lipo charging circuit useful in a HAB? in 99% of cases I come across voltage step down cases that use big panels. I intend to use 2-4 0.5V cells
[19:49] <Upu> which actually means heat doesn't conduct away as quickly
[19:49] <Upu> however yes can be an issue
[19:50] <Upu> what model of GoPro is it ?
[19:50] <Upu> TT7 there are quite a few out there generally you do panels -> lipo charger -> buck -> 1.8V or whatever
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[19:51] <AdamDynamic> It's a GoPro Hero2
[19:51] <AdamDynamic> I was looking at the 'extended battery packs' for them
[19:51] <Upu> yes use those
[19:51] <Upu> they generally do ok
[19:51] <AdamDynamic> Not sure if that would help though - I don't think the battery necessarily ran out of charge, it just died in the cold?
[19:52] <Upu> hte Hero3's have issues
[19:52] <AdamDynamic> The price being one of them :)
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[19:53] <Flerb_> for some reason eagle has no built in 0402 inductor
[19:53] <daveake> Hero3 + backpac battery = 3 hours 15 min run time
[19:53] <Flerb_> sparkfun has one but it's symbol is huge for some reason
[19:54] <cambazz> and recomendations for a power management circuitry? currently I got https://www.pololu.com/product/2122
[19:54] <AdamDynamic> Is that 3hrs 15 mins in a freezer? Or just in 'normal use'?
[19:54] <daveake> in flight
[19:54] <AdamDynamic> Hmm, I wonder why Hero2 is getting nothing like that then?
[19:55] <AdamDynamic> I'm running a test at 'room temperature' to see how long it takes to die - determine whether the battery is on the way out
[19:55] <TT7> Upu do you have any tips about which ICs to use? or rather to what extant it is necessary for it to have MPPT
[19:55] <AdamDynamic> I'll see how it goes and look at a backpack in the meantime
[19:55] <AdamDynamic> Thanks all!
[19:57] <daveake> hero2 + backpac is similar time
[19:57] <daveake> I don't think the freezer is a good test
[19:57] <AdamDynamic> How so?
[19:58] <daveake> Because in flight the camera is in contact with insulation and thin air
[19:58] <daveake> not ice and relatively thick air
[19:58] <AdamDynamic> Ah I see
[19:59] <AdamDynamic> Is there any approach to test for these types of conditions at sea level?
[19:59] <Upu> I know the SVP1400 or something works well
[19:59] <Upu> SPV ?
[19:59] <Upu> afk top gear
[19:59] <daveake> ditto
[20:00] <daveake> Top Gear has the answer to gopro lifetime
[20:00] <daveake> More POWWWWER
[20:00] <AdamDynamic> Good approach. I shall try int.
[20:00] <AdamDynamic> *it
[20:00] <AdamDynamic> Thanks again :)
[20:01] <Lunar_Lander> :D
[20:01] <TT7> Upu thanks, I'll look into it
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[20:08] <Flerb_> Anyone know what these X symbols mean? http://puu.sh/giexW/0c643e76bf.png#
[20:08] <Flerb_> (on an sma edge mount)
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[20:09] <zyp> unrouted net
[20:09] <qyx_> yep, when the unrouted parts overlap on multiple layers
[20:09] <qyx_> in this case it is unconnected ground on both sides
[20:09] <zyp> you probably have pads both on top and bottom of each other, that are not connected to each other yet but should be
[20:09] <cambazz> Upu: what is a spv1400
[20:10] <zyp> you get the same symbol when you have traces running on top and bottom to a via, then remove the via
[20:10] <Upu> http://www.st.com/web/en/catalog/sense_power/FM142/CL1810/SC1517/PF251161
[20:12] <Flerb_> so really on this four of the connectors need to be connected to the ground plane
[20:12] <Flerb_> shouldn't ratsnest just open them up to the ground plane?
[20:12] <cambazz> ok btw, how do we measure low currents? my regular amp meter would not do it. (it is like a fluke like)
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[20:16] <qyx_> Flerb_: you have to tell it somehow the shield should be on the GND net
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[20:19] <Flerb_> qyx_: ah
[20:19] <Flerb_> i have sorted it
[20:19] <Flerb_> should I keep the rf traces as short as I can?
[20:23] <Babs_> those big foil balloons - how much can they lift?
[20:23] <Babs_> i realise there was probably a grammatically more correct way to phrase that question
[20:23] <Upu> about 60g max
[20:24] <Upu> but if you actually want it to stay up <25
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[20:25] <cambazz> any methods to measure idle current, like i dont know what they call it "quiscent" current?
[20:25] <Babs_> thanks upu
[20:26] <Flerb_> http://imgur.com/a4YFgAV
[20:26] <Babs_> got my board laid out and connected up btw
[20:26] <Upu> happy to have a scan
[20:27] <Babs_> i don't want no laughing
[20:28] <Upu> can't promise that
[20:29] <Flerb_> Babs_: you want laughing then?
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[20:37] <infaddict> hey guys anybody have eagle part for ntx2b? i have a version but the pin holes look far too small
[20:37] <infaddict> i can create my own but thought id ask here
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[20:38] <Upu> in my ava.lbr library infaddict
[20:40] <infaddict> thx i have that. presume hole size is correct? look like 0.4mm or smaller on my screen
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[20:40] <infaddict> i'm now expert of course, they are smaller than any other part i am using so thought i'd ask
[20:40] <infaddict> *no
[20:51] <Ian_> Freudian slip. Soon to be expert . .. ?
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[20:58] <infaddict> haha lol just a typo
[20:59] <cambazz> any ideas about running arduinos at 3.3V and 16mhz. i am reading its problematic.
[20:59] <SpeedEvil> It's not an arduino.
[21:00] <SpeedEvil> It's a atmel processor.
[21:00] <SpeedEvil> Go and download the actual datasheet, and read it
[21:01] <cambazz> SpeedEvil: I have moteinos, both the R4 and mega, and they seem to work at 3.3V and they got 16mhz xtals, so they are working.
[21:02] <cambazz> i am looking into if they are really working or not.
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[21:02] <SpeedEvil> So read the datasheet. See if it's in spec.
[21:03] <cambazz> they have very little specs. but they might have used a variant of atmega1284
[21:03] <KC9SGV> Why does my station not show up on the map ? It showed up yesterday...
[21:03] <KC9SGV> Chicago
[21:03] <craag> cambazz: If you read the datasheet, I believe it says that performance is not guaranteed for 3.3V/16MHz - so it may work now - but may not work 5 degrees colder, with moer gpios connected, with your hand over it, etc.
[21:04] <cambazz> craag: thats what i have been suspecting.
[21:04] <craag> Read the ID off the chip and check the datasheet though.
[21:04] <SpeedEvil> Read the datasheet - of the actual processor - not the arduino
[21:05] <cambazz> SpeedEvil: yes yes, thanks.
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[21:06] <Jartza> this is what atmega328p says https://www.dropbox.com/s/ppmgogyajysqarq/Screenshot_2015-03-01-23-04-58.png?dl=0
[21:07] <KC9SGV> Getting some weird decodes in Chicago...Looks like telemetery, but from WHOM...?
[21:07] <Jartza> so it seems, not supported, but it still might work
[21:07] <KC9SGV> Using WSJT-X
[21:07] <Jartza> but if you have different chip.. well, check the datasheet :)
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[21:09] <KC9SGV> All the European listening stations show up, but none from USA. I know my station is up...I am sitting right next to it...
[21:10] <KC9SGV> Very weird...
[21:12] <Upu> hey KC9SGV
[21:13] <Upu> sometimes takes a few
[21:13] <KC9SGV> Please fix this issue
[21:13] <Upu> you're on the map
[21:13] <Upu> near Chicago
[21:13] <KC9SGV> Really ....?
[21:13] <Upu> the site caches
[21:13] <Upu> so it may not appear immediately
[21:14] <KC9SGV> Oh, but I have been up for hours today
[21:14] <Upu> http://i.imgur.com/MNlbiB5.png
[21:14] <Upu> possible local browser issue ?
[21:14] <Upu> Clear cache ?
[21:16] <KC9SGV> Yep, tnx will try everything
[21:16] <Upu> nps
[21:17] <KC9SGV> Stiil does not explain the weird telemetry-like decodes that I get here. is that normal../
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[21:20] <Upu> you mean from random back ground nosie KC9SGV ?
[21:21] <KC9SGV> Is there any way of decoding telemetry dumps manually...?
[21:21] <Upu> not sure what you mean ?
[21:22] <KC9SGV> Well, what does 0OTHNT8H63CY/ mean...?
[21:22] <KC9SGV> Or is this normal corrupted data///
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[21:22] <Upu> if this is just from the background noise with no discernable signal its just random data and can be ignored
[21:23] <Upu> grab the example from the wiki so you can try a decoding a real signal
[21:23] <KC9SGV> Ok tnx will do that..good suggestion.
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[21:27] <Vaizki> and regarding atmega at 16MHz and 3.3V.. yes it's been known to work but why risk it. the jeenode for example is a device that has been built for years on 16MHz crystal even though it's 3.3V, but I'm sure they don't test it to -40 or lower
[21:27] <Upu> out of spec
[21:27] <Upu> needs to be 8Mhz
[21:27] <Vaizki> yup, I run 8MHz
[21:27] <Upu> and 4Mhz or less for 1.8V
[21:27] <Upu> just set DIV/8 fuse
[21:28] <Upu> will run it at 2Mhz with a 16Mhz crystal
[21:28] <Vaizki> hmm
[21:28] <Upu> more than enough for habby stuff and will probably use a new nano amps less power
[21:28] <Upu> amps !=power ofc but you know what I mean
[21:28] <Upu> thank god Ed isn't here
[21:28] <Vaizki> hehe
[21:29] <Vaizki> amps are like watts frozen in time
[21:29] <cambazz> :)
[21:29] <Vaizki> or maybe watts having an out of body experience
[21:29] <cambazz> Vaizki: for example this 3.3V problems is an excellent reason to use msp430F5529
[21:29] <Vaizki> what problem?
[21:29] <Vaizki> there is no problem
[21:31] <zyp> if you're picking a new architecture now, I'd strongly advise picking cortex-m over msp430
[21:32] <cambazz> well, ok maybe no problem, but the msp430 works at 25mhz at 3.3V
[21:32] <Vaizki> well I also have STM32 cortex m3 and cortex m0
[21:32] <cambazz> zyp: I am using both msp430's and cortex-m, but cortex-m needs lots of power.
[21:32] <Vaizki> which kick the living daylights out of atmega and msp430 in the mips game
[21:32] <daveake> How many of those 25 do you actually need?
[21:33] <Vaizki> 0.2
[21:33] <zyp> cambazz, I think stm32l beats msp430 pretty well on power/performance
[21:33] <cambazz> I am looking at this: http://www.ti.com/ww/en/launchpad/launchpads-msp430-msp-exp430fr5969.html#tabs
[21:33] <daveake> yes I know the answer :)
[21:33] <zyp> in other words, power per work done
[21:33] <cambazz> the good thing about this is that it has a ultra low power measurement / debugging hardware, so at 13bucks, you can use it as a ULP amp meter
[21:34] <zyp> using a cortex-m doesn't imply that you need to have it busywaiting at 200 MHz
[21:34] <Vaizki> I have 50mA of radio & gps running, I'm not going to sweat microampereres on the MCU
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[21:35] <zyp> Laurenceb_, didn't you do an actual power comparison between msp430 and stm32 once?
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[21:56] <amell> why is habbing so quiet lately? :( mailing list is dead as a dodo
[21:56] <Upu> its called "winter" amell
[21:57] <Upu> its the cold stuff outside
[21:57] <amell> yeah, but thought there would be some floaters at least!
[21:57] <Upu> been too nasty to launch them I suspecxt
[21:57] <Upu> and only really jed doing them atm
[21:57] <SpeedEvil> Leo got busy
[21:57] <SpeedEvil> :)
[21:57] <Upu> its been gale force winds up here
[21:58] <Upu> Leo won the game SpeedEvil and retired :)
[21:58] <amell> yeah here too. everyone was stood around at elsworth today talking about launching rockets but not doing it
[21:58] <Upu> its not the right weather
[21:58] <amell> most of them disappeared to the pub at noon
[21:58] <Upu> it will start to settle
[21:58] <SpeedEvil> Talk to the russians.
[21:58] <SpeedEvil> They launch in snow and hail.
[21:58] <Upu> but atm if you launch from the UK you're likely to end in the sea
[21:59] <qyx_> anyone knows if leo is alive?
[21:59] <SpeedEvil> yes.
[21:59] <qyx_> or why does he stopped floating?
[21:59] <Upu> yeah he's alive
[21:59] <Upu> moved on to other things
[21:59] <Upu> work etc
[21:59] <SpeedEvil> he's reportedly fine, he's just busy with life
[21:59] <qyx_> nah
[22:00] <qyx_> so no nsa abduction happened
[22:00] <qyx_> thankfully.. someone should continue with the b-series though
[22:00] <amell> hourly for elsworth is funny. a launch on monday will reach the hague in 2.69 hours. lol
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[22:19] <Geoff-G8DHE> Don't tell UKIP thatthey will have a Payload ready in no time ... mind you they won't get payed if its delieverd!
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[23:14] Nick change: db_g6gzh -> dbrooke
[23:26] <Lunar_Lander> good night
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[00:00] --- Mon Mar 2 2015