highaltitude.log.20150221

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[02:03] Action: SpacenearUS is going for a nap.
[02:03] Action: SpacenearUS is back!
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[07:34] <SpacenearUS> New vehicle on the map: 03OHUP - 12http://tracker.habhub.org/#!qm=All&q=OHUP
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[08:07] <Guest49440> i have a question regarding order of raspberry pi GPS module
[08:09] <daveake> Upu is the man but go ahead and ask anyway
[08:11] <Guest49440> ok thanks
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[08:37] <Reb-SM0ULC> oh, venus inbound to spain
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[08:38] <SpacenearUS> New position from 03ATSAT-4 after 033 days silence - 12http://tracker.habhub.org/#!qm=All&q=ATSAT-4
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[09:07] <Reb-SM0ULC> ohup released
[09:07] <SpacenearUS> New vehicle on the map: 03OHUP_chase - 12http://tracker.habhub.org/#!qm=All&q=OHUP_chase
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[09:08] Action: Reb-SM0ULC suggests detecting of balloons passing 1000m for launch.
[09:21] <mclane_> hopefully no wet landing?!
[09:21] <Reb-SM0ULC> mm, any ohup people around? burst altiude? sea is close...
[09:23] <lz1dev> !whereis ohup
[09:23] <SpacenearUS> 03lz1dev: 03OHUP is over 03Huesca, Spain 10(41.60263,-0.15284) at 035674 meters
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[09:38] <Vaizki> Uh Oh Up that really is seabound
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[09:51] <SpacenearUS> New vehicle on the map: 03VEGA-I - 12http://tracker.habhub.org/#!qm=All&q=VEGA-I
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[10:05] <Mark_B> Good morning
[10:05] <Upu> morning
[10:06] <Mark_B> Hi, is it OK if I do a functional check of my tracker for the next 30 minutes?
[10:06] <Mark_B> I'd like to try out the chase car app too
[10:06] <adamgreig> yes
[10:06] <adamgreig> we encourage people to in fact
[10:06] <Upu> not a problem at all
[10:06] <Mark_B> Hi Adam. Thanks
[10:07] <Mark_B> Upu, ta
[10:10] <Mark_B> OK, I'm transmitting and getting the 'uploaded .... successfully' on fldigi
[10:11] <adamgreig> now check out spacenear.us
[10:11] <Mark_B> I've updated the payload config doc for MM3
[10:11] <Upu> MM3 ?
[10:11] <Upu> yeah you need a payload doc
[10:11] <Upu> [2015-02-21 10:11:44,666] DEBUG habitat.parser MainThread: No configuration doc for 'MM3' found
[10:12] <Mark_B> Checking parser logtail but it showing 'no config doc fo MM3 found'
[10:12] <Mark_B> Ah, OK.
[10:13] <Mark_B> I'll look at what I did with the payload doc. Thanks
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[10:17] <Mark_B> Doh! I didn't change the callsign in the callsign editor
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[10:19] <SpacenearUS> New vehicle on the map: 03MM3 - 12http://tracker.habhub.org/#!qm=All&q=MM3
[10:22] <infaddict> Morning. Anybody had issues with iOS app not tracking chase car? I've set the chase callsign and enabled tracking but it simply does nothing.
[10:22] <infaddict> Also checked security permissions and app has access to location services
[10:23] <Vaizki> There is an iOS app?
[10:24] <SpacenearUS> New vehicle on the map: 03MM3test_chase - 12http://tracker.habhub.org/#!qm=All&q=MM3test_chase
[10:24] <infaddict> yep
[10:24] <infaddict> i use it a lot for predictions and flights whilst out and about
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[10:25] <infaddict> Mark_B: cleary isn't having my chase car issues. Are you using the iOS app Mark?
[10:27] <Vaizki> What's the name of the app?
[10:28] <infaddict> habhub
[10:32] <Vaizki> Ah not available in Finland for some reason
[10:34] <Vaizki> Ok got it by changing to uk store
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[10:38] <Vaizki> Let me try chase
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[10:40] <Vaizki> Not working here either
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[10:40] <infaddict> mmm so my question is how are others getting chase car onto map?
[10:43] <Vaizki> Habhub web app?
[10:43] <Vaizki> The iOS app doesn't seem to get any location data from the phone
[10:43] <Vaizki> It doesn't even ask for permission
[10:44] <Vaizki> And if I give permission from settings and restart app, still nothing
[10:45] <Vaizki> Also there is no little arrow in location settings to indicate it has used location services
[10:45] <infaddict> yep i think its broken and possibly others are not using it
[10:46] <infaddict> but if others are using web app how is their position being fed to it?
[10:46] <infaddict> ideally a mobile phone with GPS would do that all
[10:46] <Vaizki> JavaScript can access location
[10:47] <Vaizki> Just try it, it will ask for permission to use location
[10:47] <infaddict> yep but location based on internet IP i am guessing and not GPS
[10:48] <adamgreig> it's based on GPS
[10:48] <adamgreig> it wouldn't need to ask for permission to use internet IP location
[10:48] <infaddict> how if my computer doesnt have one
[10:48] <Vaizki> If you have gps it will use it
[10:48] <adamgreig> then it tries using available wifi networks or anything else it can use to locate your computer
[10:48] <adamgreig> your browser does all this
[10:48] <infaddict> exactly
[10:49] <infaddict> most computers dont have gps. lot of phones do.
[10:49] <Vaizki> If you have gps in your phone it will use it
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[10:49] <adamgreig> right, but most people wanting chase car functionaltiy are using phones...
[10:49] <adamgreig> and if you want to use your laptop just plug a gps in
[10:49] <Vaizki> I don't see the problem
[10:50] <infaddict> i am tracking with a laptop, so wondered how to get chase car on map. i tried iOS app and nothing. so how do i do it? which website?
[10:50] <adamgreig> http://tracker.habhub.org
[10:50] <adamgreig> with a laptop you can use dl-fldigi
[10:51] <adamgreig> assuming you have a gps on the laptop (e.g. a usb one)
[10:51] <adamgreig> iOS app should work but I've never used it and it's not written by us
[10:51] <infaddict> nope i dont - this is my issue. i have an iphone with GPS.
[10:51] <infaddict> and a macbook without GPS
[10:51] <adamgreig> then go to that website
[10:51] <adamgreig> and grant it permission to use your location
[10:51] <Vaizki> With your phone
[10:51] <infaddict> on iphone or macbook?
[10:51] <adamgreig> iphone
[10:51] <adamgreig> obviously if your macbook doesn't have a gps you can't exactly send gps positions from it
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[10:54] <SpacenearUS> New vehicle on the map: 03INFCU_CHASE_chase - 12http://tracker.habhub.org/#!qm=All&q=INFCU_CHASE_chase
[10:54] <infaddict> great it works thanks guys
[10:54] <infaddict> i had been to the site on macbook and the iOS app but never to the site on my phone (which then shows additional car icon)
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[10:58] <Mark_B> Func check carried out, satis :)
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[11:02] <Mark_B> Winds / NOTAM etc permitting I'm hoping to launch next Saturday (28th), I will put up a notice on the mailing list when details are more certain
[11:04] <craag> :) Good luck!
[11:04] <alxwntr> Hi all, could I please ask a question about antennas?
[11:04] <alxwntr> (or antennae, if you;re that way inclined...)
[11:04] <craag> Just ask
[11:05] <alxwntr> thanks
[11:05] <Mark_B> Thanks craag
[11:05] <alxwntr> I have got my electronics working nicely
[11:05] <alxwntr> and I need to make myself a yagi for tracking
[11:06] <alxwntr> I have seen a few sites with instructions - does anyone have any recommendations for the best method?
[11:06] <craag> Just to check - are you planning to use another antenna as well - eg a magmount?
[11:06] <alxwntr> well, I thought I'd need a yagi, but if I need another one, then yes
[11:06] <alxwntr> what would that be for?
[11:07] <craag> So when you're chasing in the car
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[11:07] <craag> You don't want to have to point the yagi the whole time
[11:07] <alxwntr> oh of course
[11:07] <alxwntr> sure - I have a little magmount
[11:07] <alxwntr> don't know if the gain would be enough
[11:08] <craag> But the yagi is useful when the magmount falls short, like if it's landed and you can't get enough signal to decode it, you can at least direction-find it.
[11:08] <alxwntr> it's from a dongle I got - about 100mm long
[11:08] <craag> err
[11:08] <craag> no
[11:08] <craag> A 434MHz magmount is suitable
[11:08] <alxwntr> do you mean a big one to stick on the roof
[11:08] <craag> eg. http://cpc.farnell.com/watson/wsm-270/wsm-270-mini-mag-antenna/dp/IT44456
[11:08] <craag> yeah
[11:09] <alxwntr> ah ok
[11:09] <alxwntr> thanks
[11:09] <alxwntr> well, I guess I will be getting one of those
[11:09] <alxwntr> but I would still need a yagi for finding the thing after it lands, right?
[11:09] <craag> wrt your original questions - as long as you get the driven element the right length (where the coax connects), any guide/calculator for the rest of the dimensions will work.
[11:10] <craag> Don't bother with a balun, just connect inner of the coax to one side, outer to the other.
[11:10] <craag> It is suggested to, yes.
[11:10] <alxwntr> ok
[11:10] <craag> Not essential most of the time - but when it is, you can be a bit stuck without it..
[11:10] <alxwntr> it also looked quite fun, building one
[11:10] <craag> yeah :)
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[11:11] <craag> I've been to a few ham radio microwave meetups where they set up a calibrated test range and people show off their yagi designs.
[11:11] <alxwntr> could you recommend any guides that have details of how it all works? The ones I saw just had lengths
[11:12] <alxwntr> and I'd quite like to know what I'm doing
[11:12] <craag> Quite cool to see the results some people get from bits of wood and wire
[11:12] <alxwntr> oh nice
[11:12] <craag> Well it's a boom with bits of metal in it
[11:12] <alxwntr> I'm going to a talk that Stuart is giving about HAB tracking at a HAM group, so I'll ask them
[11:13] <craag> The lengths of the metal, and spacing just has to be roughly right.
[11:13] <craag> I've built ones with threaded rod and pvc pipe for the boom.
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[11:13] <alxwntr> classy :)
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[11:14] <alxwntr> in terms of cabling and connectors, any special considerations?
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[11:14] <infaddict> http://widerimage.co.uk/docs/Mountain_Yagi_434_4Element.pdf
[11:14] <alxwntr> I've heard people say the wrong connectors can ruin the signal, etc
[11:14] <craag> Don't use pl259/so239
[11:15] <craag> ideally SMA or BNC
[11:15] <alxwntr> ok
[11:15] <craag> A short length of rg58 will be fine.
[11:15] <alxwntr> and ordinary co-ax cable?
[11:15] <craag> yep - as long as it's not stupidly long.
[11:15] <alxwntr> is that the cable, rg58?
[11:15] <alxwntr> ok thanks
[11:15] <craag> rg58 is a common 50 ohm coax cable.
[11:16] <alxwntr> great
[11:16] <craag> usually the cheapest
[11:16] <craag> ham guys will tend to have drums of it :)
[11:16] <alxwntr> it's just going to be a metre or so - from the antenna to my Yupiteru
[11:17] <alxwntr> ah - good call. I wouldn't want to buy a whole drum
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[11:18] <Reb-SM0ULC> ohup when silent?
[11:18] <Reb-SM0ULC> ohup whent silent?
[11:19] <craag> infaddict: That guide looks a bit off to me - folded dipoles require a closely spaced director to lower the impedance in my experience - doubt it matters much for reception though :)
[11:20] <infaddict> not sure craag thats what i was directed to from here a few weeks ago when starting out with Yagi's. In the end I bought a kit from Germany which I'm currently assembling.
[11:21] <alxwntr> ooh - got a link for that?
[11:21] <infaddict> like you said tho, in my internet searches i've seen them made from tons of cheap materials
[11:21] <infaddict> sure 1 min
[11:21] <alxwntr> cheers
[11:22] <infaddict> This is the shop: http://shop.nuxcom.de/
[11:22] <infaddict> let me get the one i went for in the end...
[11:23] <craag> alxwntr: fyi you can buy short lengths of rg58 online - but ask nicely at your ham club and someone might give you a couple of meters :)
[11:23] <alxwntr> I'd seen that guide before, but I just don't have any way of telling if it's any good so I thought I'd ask on here
[11:23] <infaddict> yer i got 10 metres off ebay quite cheap
[11:23] <infaddict> here;s the 50ohm 70cm yagi kits: https://shop.nuxcom.de/index.php?cPath=7_80_77&MODsid=f6353bede95d7985f4765e0ac8cde6f1
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[11:24] <infaddict> i went for a 7 element 0.98m boom but they do a shorter 0.61m too
[11:24] <infaddict> fyi you still need to cut and drill things to assemble these
[11:24] <alxwntr> sure
[11:24] <alxwntr> thanks a lot
[11:24] <infaddict> watch for postage costs on top, was a fair bit as I am UK (Euro much cheaper)
[11:25] <alxwntr> there are loads of guides out there, you see, and I have no idea what to go for
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[11:25] <alxwntr> how many elements, for example
[11:25] <alxwntr> is more better?
[11:25] <infaddict> well you get to a point where you are no longer mobile
[11:25] <infaddict> if you intend to use for mobile tracking
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[11:26] <infaddict> these kits are also mounted on masts or in lofts and can be many many metres long
[11:26] <alxwntr> I see. Is portability the only concern?
[11:27] <alxwntr> i.e. more = better?
[11:27] <craag> More elements makes it more focused.
[11:27] <alxwntr> great
[11:27] <infaddict> well there's the impedance and wavelength of course
[11:27] <alxwntr> thanks
[11:27] <infaddict> but that link shows 433Mhz 70cm stuff
[11:27] <infaddict> and you want 50ohm
[11:27] <infaddict> the precise length and positioning of the various elements are very important to good reception
[11:28] <Vaizki> 70cm as in wavelength, not boom length
[11:28] <infaddict> yep
[11:28] <alxwntr> right
[11:28] <craag> Although everyone disagrees massively on the *correct* precise length/spacing
[11:28] <infaddict> i went for 0.98m boom, possibly a bit too long for mobile stuff but fits in the car
[11:28] <craag> So I don't think it matters too much :)
[11:28] <infaddict> and i plan to mount to my camera tripod for tracking practice at home
[11:28] <infaddict> currently building a tripod mount out of some spare parts
[11:29] <Vaizki> Yagi design is a black art, don't deviate from plans
[11:29] <alxwntr> heh ok
[11:29] <infaddict> theres a great youtube vid on antennas - lemme find it
[11:29] <alxwntr> great - cheers
[11:30] <alxwntr> Vaizki - feels weird, right? I know it is a black art, but it feels like it should be more straightforward
[11:30] <infaddict> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lslHtCUSfN4
[11:30] <alxwntr> as in, the result of a bunch of simple calculations
[11:30] <infaddict> really good watch
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[11:31] <infaddict> explains what the elements do and show effect visually on a light bulb
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[11:31] <alxwntr> that's great
[11:32] <alxwntr> knackered audio sync is rather disconcerting...
[11:32] <infaddict> There is always an element of give/take in this stuff. I am sure I haven't cut my elements precisely to microns. but i am close to within 1-2mm so hoping thats enough.
[11:33] <infaddict> also not sure if its same one craag linked earlier but I went for this mag mount for car chase: http://cpc.farnell.com/watson/wsm-270/wsm-270-mini-mag-antenna/dp/IT44456
[11:34] <alxwntr> Yup - that's the one :)
[11:35] <infaddict> i had to buy several diff type of connectors to ensure i can get from receiver thru my amplifier to both magmount and yagi
[11:35] <infaddict> always useful to have them lying around tho
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[11:42] <infaddict> woop my new DMM has arrived ;-)
[11:44] <infaddict> went for a ExTech EX300
[11:49] <alxwntr> nice
[11:50] <infaddict> its certainly a step up from my cheapo one i've been using.
[11:50] <alxwntr> by the way, for making the elements, it's easy to get small gauge Al tube at a model shop - is tube ok, or would I have to use bar?
[11:51] <craag> infaddict: the one that was reviewed on eevblog?
[11:51] <infaddict> tube is ok, not sure on required diameter tho.
[11:51] <infaddict> yes craag
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[11:52] <infaddict> the only downside i've spotted so far is i do like being able to clip on crocodile clips to the probe tips, but they are protected with plastic other than a small point
[11:52] <craag> nice :) I've been looking at that... my current multimeter has done nearly 10 years, but one by one the functions are dying.
[11:53] <infaddict> aha turns out ExTech sell push on croc clips
[11:53] <craag> :)
[11:53] <infaddict> its probably more than i need craag but came recommended and i'm the kinda person who likes to buy decent quality if at all
[11:53] <craag> yep good call
[11:54] <infaddict> my old one wasnt doing inline current very well at all (and i had no idea of its draw)
[11:55] <craag> I shorted out an SLA through the 10A setting on mine. It doesn't do current any more :)
[11:55] <infaddict> oops. simple things like auto range make me happy.
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[11:57] <mfa298> craag: if the dmm was half decent there should just be a fuse to replace for that
[11:59] <craag> mfa298: The 10A setting isn't fused, and has continuity - I think it might have overvolted the ADC
[12:01] <mfa298> ouch
[12:02] <mfa298> I'm sure I've seen multimeters with fuses for 10A - although that might have been an old avo or similar
[12:02] <infaddict> my new one has 10A fused
[12:03] <infaddict> with a warning to only load it for 30 seconds max
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[12:05] <craag> This one is a cheap unbranded one, has a stiff wire shunt resistor straight from the 10A terminal to the Common terminal.
[12:05] <infaddict> yep my old was the same. tbh i rarely use 10A.
[12:05] <infaddict> and rarely use AC too
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[12:43] <Vaizki> I have an Agilent one with all kinds of weird functions
[12:45] <Vaizki> They were on massive discount here when they were introduced and it has Bluetooth data logging also
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[12:50] <Vaizki> But damn that ex300 is cheap
[12:51] <Vaizki> Under 40 quid??
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[12:53] <Vaizki> Freq & duty cycle too
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[12:53] <infaddict> yep, mines a 330 actually
[12:53] <infaddict> yer it has NCV AC sensor
[12:53] <infaddict> frequency and duty
[12:53] <Vaizki> Check your baud rate & pwm ;)
[12:54] <infaddict> yer £38 on amazon uk
[12:54] <infaddict> exactly!
[12:54] <infaddict> so hopefully i can use this without my radio receiver (still not arrived)
[12:54] <infaddict> never done that so will be intersting
[12:54] <Vaizki> What radio did you get? Dongle?
[12:55] <infaddict> yer ordered 2 cheap SDR dongles off ebay. sadly didnt spot they were in Hong Kong till I'd ordered. 3 weeks later still nothing.
[12:55] <infaddict> same chipset and others who have had good results
[12:55] <infaddict> plan to open it up and replace connection with SMA
[12:56] <infaddict> i have the HabAmp to use with it
[12:56] <infaddict> if it ends up not working i might consider the Funcube pro
[12:58] <infaddict> so for frequency measurement, where do i connect test leads to? the PWM pin and ground?
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[13:05] <mfa298> infaddict: if it comes with an mcx connector it may be easier to make a pigtail adapter with the antenna and cable that comes with it
[13:06] <mfa298> if its a normal (belling Lee) connector then change it to a sma
[13:06] <infaddict> hey mfa298 - u talking about the dongle?
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[13:07] <mfa298> yes
[13:07] <infaddict> http://i.ebayimg.com/00/s/MTAwMVgxMDAx/z/kBQAAOSweA9Txjoe/$_57.JPG
[13:07] <infaddict> thats the crappy antenna it comes with
[13:07] <mfa298> a lot come with the small mcx connectors which aren't as awful as the belling lee
[13:07] <infaddict> can't quite see what that is
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[13:08] <mfa298> looks like an mcx connector
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[13:08] <mfa298> you can see it on the end of the coax
[13:08] <mfa298> !wiki rf_connectors
[13:08] <SpacenearUS> 03mfa298: Wiki page 03rf_connectors (guides) - 12http://ukhas.org.uk/guides:rf_connectors
[13:08] <infaddict> yep under the coax but visible.
[13:09] <infaddict> so i could snip off the antenna and wire to another type of connector
[13:10] <mfa298> what I did with one of thoes is cut the coax and put a suitable connector. so it becomes and mcx to sma or mcx to bnc adapter
[13:10] <infaddict> was hoping to box this dongle and hamamp into an enclosure with ports for USB and antenna (ideally SMA)
[13:10] <mfa298> probably a lot easier than trying to open the case and change the mcx to something else
[13:10] <infaddict> true, thx
[13:11] <mfa298> depending on where you're using this setup you really want the habamp as close to the antenna as possible.
[13:12] <Zeusking19> In regards to the SDR antennas above, sadly I was looking at the exact same ones - I also noticed majority were based in Hong Kong
[13:12] <Zeusking19> Guess I'll have to keep looking
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[13:12] <mfa298> cosycave used to have them in the uk, and there are some uk sellers but they tend to cost more.
[13:15] <infaddict> yep i chose cheapest (around £5) but of course will wait 4 weeks for arrival
[13:15] <infaddict> i couldve paid £10-£12 for UK
[13:15] <infaddict> wish i had now, just didnt spot it in my haste
[13:15] <Zeusking19> infaddict: Even the £10-12 ones, they say the item is located in Slough, UK yet the seller is in Hong Kong
[13:16] <infaddict> tbh Zeusking19 the delay is good because it means i have had time to plan all my other parts, and start programming.
[13:16] <infaddict> so now i have my circuit fully breadboarded and code 99% written
[13:16] <infaddict> i can begin GPS testing, temperature testing, voltage testing etc without the SDR
[13:17] <Zeusking19> Would you guys recommend a preamp?
[13:17] <infaddict> for SDR dongles i believe its mandatory
[13:17] <infaddict> most people get rubbish results without one
[13:17] <craag> It helps a lot
[13:17] <craag> I have chased and recovered without one :)
[13:18] <craag> did need the yagi to get the extra signal strength once it'd landed though.
[13:18] <Zeusking19> alright, any particular one in particular from habsupplies? I am kinda looking to have to pay the least due to limited funds
[13:19] <infaddict> habsupplies do the HamAmp which is amp/filter in one, for 433Mhz
[13:19] <infaddict> http://ava.upuaut.net/store/index.php?route=product/product&path=72_73&product_id=83
[13:19] <craag> Well you can either get it boxed or unboxed iirc
[13:19] <infaddict> there is boxed version or hyperlink to switch to naked version
[13:19] <infaddict> the amp needs power
[13:19] <Zeusking19> And also, surely the smaller connector on the dongle won't fit the SMA on the amp?
[13:20] <infaddict> we were just discussing that
[13:20] <Zeusking19> Ah, I see now
[13:20] <infaddict> you need to either make a pigtail by snipping the antenna that came with dongle
[13:20] <infaddict> or open up the dongle and fit a SMA
[13:20] <infaddict> i am planning to do something similar to this guy : http://www.stratodean.co.uk/2013/01/the-receiver-and-antenna.html
[13:20] <infaddict> but use a better enclosure lol
[13:21] <infaddict> so he put dongle and hamamp into one box, with habamp powered via USB 5V header
[13:21] <Zeusking19> hm
[13:22] <infaddict> habamp can also draw power up the coax
[13:22] <mfa298> amp/filter with SDR depends on the SDR. With the cheap rtl ones then the amp/filter helps a lot. With the more expensive ones (like the FCD Pro+) you may not need it as it's more sensitive and has the filtering built in.
[13:23] <infaddict> indeed mfa298, the FCD Pro+ is a whole different ball game.
[13:23] <Zeusking19> The main issue for me is cost, to be honest
[13:23] <infaddict> i have never used either, so my comments are purely based on what I have read
[13:23] <Zeusking19> if I have to muck around a bit to get something effective I don't mind
[13:23] <infaddict> Its £28 for the naked habamp. you can of course try tracking without it first.
[13:24] <infaddict> see what results you get
[13:24] <infaddict> esp over distance
[13:24] <Zeusking19> Yes
[13:24] <mfa298> infaddict: the point is that the cheap rtl dongle and FCD Pro+ are all SDR dongles (as is the airspy and various others)
[13:24] <infaddict> sure agree, so my comments on amp were aimed at cheap dongles
[13:24] <SpacenearUS> New vehicle on the map: 03O2HERO-1 - 12http://tracker.habhub.org/#!qm=All&q=O2HERO-1
[13:25] <infaddict> Airspy does look very nice
[13:25] <Zeusking19> Would I be best getting something like this without having the possibility of damaging anything? http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/SMA-female-jack-to-MCX-male-plug-straight-adapter-RF-Coaxial-connector-Convertor-/261478845784
[13:26] <mfa298> Zeusking19: that should work, does the same thing as the pigtail connector I was talking about earlier
[13:26] <Zeusking19> alright
[13:27] <infaddict> yep. not sure if you need MCx male or female tho. i presume the dongle is female? so u need male?
[13:27] <Zeusking19> Looks like it, looking at the antenna
[13:27] <infaddict> which is what you linked to, so fine
[13:28] <Zeusking19> although.
[13:28] <Zeusking19> hm
[13:28] <Zeusking19> If I bought an MCX male to SMA female cable, and did that from dongle -> preamp
[13:28] <mfa298> with the pigtail option you get to do mcx male to sma mail and use that to connect to the habamp - although you'll probably need to buy suitable connectors and tools (most tend to be crimp rather than solder)
[13:29] <Zeusking19> hm
[13:30] <infaddict> for magmount heres my intended route: USB Dongle (SMA F) -> (SMA M) lead (SMA M) -> (SMA F) HabAmp (SMA F) -> (SMA-M) Convertor (BNC F) -> (BMC M) Mag Mount Antenna
[13:30] <infaddict> For Yagi: USB Dongle (SMA F) -> (SMA M) lead (SMA M) -> (SMA F) HabAmp (SMA F) -> (SMA-M) Convertor (N-Type M) -> (N-Type F) Yagi
[13:30] <infaddict> i had to write all this down to make sense of the connections
[13:30] <Zeusking19> Hold on, is the USB dongle female/male?
[13:30] <infaddict> thats what i asked earlier - not sure till mine arrives
[13:31] <infaddict> looks female tho from pics as end of coax looks like a male
[13:31] <Geoff-G8DHE_> Female
[13:31] <infaddict> i wouldnt buy any connectors until you've decided on exactly what you are connecting to what
[13:32] <infaddict> esp with limited budget
[13:32] <infaddict> thx Geoff-G8DHE_
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[13:32] <gonzo_> be careful of the annoying reverse SMAs used for wlan. They have the same outer bodies, but they have swapped the gender of the inner pin
[13:33] <infaddict> yep reverse polarity ones?
[13:33] <infaddict> dont buy any connections labelled RP or reverse polarity or Wifi
[13:33] <gonzo_> easy to get mixed uo with other SMAs and results in a confuciong open circuit in the chain, or a broken pin
[13:33] <infaddict> whoever invented them should be shot at dawn
[13:33] <infaddict> ;-)
[13:33] <gonzo_> good. Best not having any. Naughty nasty things
[13:34] <gonzo_> it was a misguided attempt to stop people using non approved kit with wlan stuff
[13:34] <mfa298> infaddict: where possible having cables with the correct ends rather than converters may be wise (less weight and strain on the connectors and potentially less losses in the signal)
[13:35] <infaddict> agreed. i will likely snip off ends and connect what i want rather than a ton of convertors.
[13:35] <gonzo_> loss is less of an issue after the preamp. But the strain issue os still a good point
[13:36] <infaddict> yep the least i am carrying around and least to break or strain the better
[13:36] <infaddict> ideally if i could make everything SMA i'd be happy
[13:36] <infaddict> dont own any crimping tools yet tho
[13:37] <gonzo_> you can get clamp type SMAs for thinner cables, like rg174. Though calmp ones are rare for bigger coax
[13:37] <Zeusking19> Just wondering, on the HABAmp, is that female or male SMA?
[13:37] <mfa298> generally equipment has female connectors and cables have male connectors (but not always)
[13:38] <infaddict> yep the habamp enclosure appears to have female connections
[13:38] <infaddict> http://www.l-com.com/images/Common-RF-Coax-Connectors.png
[13:39] <infaddict> ignore the confusing right hand side RP pics
[13:40] <Zeusking19> annoyingly there seems to be no such thing as an SMA male -> MCX male
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[13:43] <mfa298> you mean like http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/like/220952713713
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[13:43] <Zeusking19> pretty much
[13:44] <Zeusking19> I still have doubts as to whether the dongle is female/male
[13:44] <mfa298> should be female connector on the dongle (all the ones I have are)
[13:44] <gonzo_> that last sentence just sounds wrong!
[13:45] <Zeusking19> alright..
[13:45] <gonzo_> (escuse my purile humour. My inner dialogue runs like a carry-on film script)
[13:45] <Zeusking19> One like this would be suitable for Dongle -> HABAmp, yes? : http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/MCX-male-to-SMA-male-pigtail-for-SDR-Dongle-to-up-converter-RTL2832-HD-SDR-/121559210120?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_3&hash=item1c4d7e5888
[13:46] <Zeusking19> wait a sec
[13:46] <Zeusking19> That's the same steve that sells the balloons if I am not mistaken
[13:46] <Zeusking19> lol, ignore me
[13:47] <Geoff-G8DHE-M> Your mistaken
[13:47] <Zeusking19> yeah, ignore me
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[13:49] <Zeusking19> Alright, just saved down some links
[13:49] <Zeusking19> I'll probably have to salvage a USB cable to power the HABAmp
[13:50] <Zeusking19> assuming that it'll run on 5V that is
[13:50] <Geoff-G8DHE-M> It will, you just move the jumpers around inside
[13:51] <Zeusking19> alright
[13:51] <Zeusking19> :)
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[13:51] <Zeusking19> that's good, because I think I have a basic tracking kit done
[13:53] <Zeusking19> damn, just the tracking kit alone is going out of budget
[13:53] <Zeusking19> urgh
[13:53] <Zeusking19> great, wonderful
[13:54] <Zeusking19> I can't even afford the equipment
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[13:59] <craag> Zeusking19: Don't get the habamp for now if it's going to blow your budget
[13:59] <craag> It's a worthwhile enhancement - but not completely essential
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[14:00] <Zeusking19> craag: I realised, with the NTX2 from farnell (the non-freq agile), I will be able to fit it in my budget
[14:00] <Zeusking19> Are there any major disadvantages to the NTX2 compared to the NTX2B?
[14:00] <craag> Yes, the -B has a temperature compensated crystal
[14:01] <craag> so it's frequency doesn't drift around when cooled down
[14:01] <craag> How much is the one from farnell?
[14:01] <Zeusking19> £16, but reason I bring it up is because I have leftover budget from one of farnell's design challenges
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[14:02] <craag> Hmm
[14:02] <Zeusking19> In the end it will be cheaper for me, and I can always upgrade to the NTX2B at a later date
[14:02] <craag> Can you get any of the other bits from farnell instead, eg arduino?
[14:02] <craag> Ok.
[14:02] <Zeusking19> I already have the arduino on order from Farnell
[14:02] <craag> Fair enough :)
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[14:02] <Zeusking19> My budget I have is fine for the tracking equipment
[14:02] <craag> NTX2 will perform exactly the same on the ground
[14:03] <Zeusking19> Yes - and hopefully before my first launch I'll knock it up to an NTX2B
[14:03] <craag> Good plan :)
[14:03] <infaddict> what radio tx are u using then Zeusking19
[14:03] <Zeusking19> A test module and a flight module, if you get my drift
[14:03] <craag> yep
[14:03] <craag> just make sure to test the flight module too!!!!
[14:03] <craag> development module and flight module might be more accurate
[14:03] <Zeusking19> Yes, of course, it would be stupid not to test it :P
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[14:08] <Zeusking19> infaddict: I'll have to use a standard NTX2 and upgrade to an NTX2B later.
[14:08] <Zeusking19> Thanks for the help guys
[14:08] <Zeusking19> I really appreciate it :)
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[14:20] <craag> No problem Zeusking19. Which country are you in btw?
[14:20] <Zeusking19> That would be the UK :)
[14:21] <craag> Cool. Me too.
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[14:25] <infaddict> me three
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[15:27] <Upu> ping Babs_ where do you purchase those SMB bearings from ?
[15:27] <Babs_> from smb bearings
[15:27] <Upu> oh do you just mail them ?
[15:29] <Babs_> ring the lady up, she is a bit snotty but they arrive the day afterwards
[15:29] <Upu> lol
[15:29] <Babs_> the mail/fulfilment is expensive, so over order
[15:29] <Upu> ta
[15:29] <Upu> define expensive ?
[15:30] <Babs_> and don't go for the ultra thin plastic ones even if you are tempted (i.e. the 3mm thick ones), they are a bit fragile
[15:30] <Babs_> at 3mm go metal, at 5mm then the plastic ones are fine
[15:30] <Upu> going for a 22 mm OD with a 10mm shaft
[15:32] <Babs_> 10mm is quite a lot
[15:32] <Upu> going to be quite a bit of weight and force
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[15:32] <Babs_> and use hollow carbn fibre tube to run it on and it will keep the weight down
[15:33] <Babs_> sounds cool
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[15:37] <Laurenceb_> Babs_: this is for your camera rig?
[15:37] <Babs_> like if you are ordering a few bearings, it will basically come to 25 quid
[15:37] <Babs_> for upus laurenceb
[15:37] <Laurenceb_> sounds exciting
[15:37] <Laurenceb_> ok
[15:38] <Laurenceb_> for eclipse?
[15:38] <Upu> yeah
[15:38] <Upu> whether we get it working in time is another matter
[15:38] <Babs_> i set myself a timeline of 4 years and am struggling
[15:38] <Laurenceb_> heh
[15:38] <Babs_> upu is putting it together in 3 months
[15:39] <Laurenceb_> is the conference for this year being organised yet?
[15:39] <Babs_> i expect daveake and he to do a we go to the moon JFK speech as a motivator
[15:39] <Laurenceb_> im guessing the plan is for Greenwich?
[15:40] <Laurenceb_> are there photos of your system Babs_ ?
[15:40] <Laurenceb_> have you decided on a camera yet?
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[16:10] <Laurenceb_> this is looking very very cool
[16:10] <Laurenceb_> http://koti.kapsi.fi/jpa/stuff/pix/sigrok_etm2.png
[16:11] <Laurenceb_> http://koti.kapsi.fi/jpa/stuff/pix/sigrok_etm3.png
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[16:16] <Laurenceb_> ETM with simultaneous logic capture on saleae clone
[16:28] <Zeusking19> Upu, out of curiousity, how much does shipping cost from habsupplies?
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[16:49] <Babs_> laurenceb - https://www.flickr.com/photos/91049302@N00/15381431277/in/set-72157636929911016
[16:50] <Babs_> was going to use an EOSM with a pancake lens
[16:51] <Babs_> https://www.flickr.com/photos/91049302@N00/14038645584/in/set-72157636929911016 reaction wheels - the camera set up hangs below the this bit
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[17:04] <alxwntr> Pretty impressive project Babs...
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[17:05] <alxwntr> Is it all aimed at taking super-steady photos?
[17:05] <SpeedEvil> Babs_: moa?
[17:06] <SpeedEvil> Is this sort-of steady, or 'I can take 10 second exposures blur-free'
[17:06] <Upu> Zeusking19 depends where you are
[17:06] <Zeusking19> South East UK
[17:06] <Upu> £4.30 or something
[17:07] <Zeusking19> alright :)
[17:07] <Zeusking19> Just thought I'd check ahead of time
[17:08] <Babs_> speedevil - i have an alexmos board to run it, so it should be that steady
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[17:41] <SpacenearUS> New vehicle on the map: 03Gabro01 - 12http://tracker.habhub.org/#!qm=All&q=Gabro01
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[17:49] <SpacenearUS> New vehicle on the map: 03N4XWC-1 - 12http://tracker.habhub.org/#!qm=All&q=N4XWC-1
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[17:58] <SpacenearUS> New vehicle on the map: 03KJ4TDM-1 - 12http://tracker.habhub.org/#!qm=All&q=KJ4TDM-1
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[18:03] <Lunar_Lander> evening
[18:05] <infaddict> evening Lunar_Lander
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[18:12] <infaddict> anybody in the UK recommend mobile internet dongle/company? i can hotspot to my iPhone but was thinking of a backup.
[18:14] <craag> '3' is best I've found
[18:14] <craag> I've got an E353 that I load up with 1 month when I need it.
[18:16] <infaddict> ok thx craag will take a look
[18:16] <craag> The E353 has an external antenna socket that I hook up with a magmount 3g for chases.
[18:22] <infaddict> craag: how much data do you top up for a launch and tracking?
[18:24] <Zeusking19> In regards to '3', we just ended a contract with them and all hell broke loose, they failed to cancel the contract for 2 months after they said they would, billed us £50 in unpaid fees, among calling us every day for two weeks straight
[18:24] <craag> I often stream, so 1G works out.
[18:24] <craag> Yeah don't go with a contract
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[18:25] <craag> I pay for a month at a time/
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[18:26] <craag> I have heard horror stories before about their contracts, but their coverage is one of the best in rural areas, as they use the o2 network as well.
[18:26] <Zeusking19> If you need coverage, Tesco piggybacks on O2 as well
[18:26] <Zeusking19> Anyways, I have an Arduino and an NTX2 (for development, not the actual flight) on order from Farnell, Arduino will hopefully be here either tomorrow/monday, NTX2 sometime next week
[18:26] <craag> :)
[18:27] <infaddict> yer rural coverage is clearly important for us
[18:28] <Zeusking19> Then sometime next week I'll be ordering a HABAmp and a ublox
[18:29] <Zeusking19> I think once I have what I need for tracking I'll probably start tracking some flights, however I don't think there'll be many in range of my area given my location near Heathrow
[18:29] <infaddict> i am yet to track but i've been told you can pick up ballons from a fair way out with a Yagi
[18:30] <Zeusking19> hm
[18:30] <craag> Once the balloons are up >30km, they'll cover nearly all of te UK
[18:30] <infaddict> yep
[18:30] <Zeusking19> Alright then :)
[18:30] <Zeusking19> It's very exciting, all of this HAB stuff - glad I actually took the time to read about it
[18:30] <infaddict> thats why i am building a little yagi mount for camera tripod
[18:30] <infaddict> to track other flights from home
[18:30] <infaddict> as practice
[18:30] <craag> You can compare your receiver setup against the websdr
[18:31] <craag> http://websdr.suws.org.uk/
[18:31] <craag> It normally picks them up quite well, uses habamp+rtlsdr.
[18:31] <R34lB0rg> hope my rtlsdr will arrive soon
[18:32] <Zeusking19> I'll have to order an rtlsdr at some point, it's definitely in my plans though as something I'll need
[18:32] <Zeusking19> That said, Insulation - any good places to find that?
[18:33] <infaddict> for payload?
[18:33] <Zeusking19> Yep
[18:34] <infaddict> i bought a polysterene box (like a small fish box) and plan to fill any empty voids with more cut poly foam or similar (or even loose poly stuff)
[18:34] <craag> These boxes work well if your kit isn't too big: http://www.hobbycraft.co.uk/hobbycraft-polystyrene-box-with-flat-lid/591590-1000
[18:34] <craag> And then I usually pack with bubble-wrap
[18:35] <Zeusking19> I think my equipment will easily fit in one of those boxes
[18:35] <infaddict> yep v similar to mine
[18:35] <infaddict> tbh even with 2 cameras, batteries and my board i will tons of air gaps to fill
[18:37] <craag> With some patience (and mess), you can pack with solid foam: http://www.norb.co.uk/data/uploads/WP_20140306_09_08_00_Pro.jpg
[18:38] <infaddict> yer id like to aim for something like that
[18:38] <R34lB0rg> Zeusking19, a rtl-sdr costs ~10$ on ebay
[18:38] <Zeusking19> I know - I've already found one that I'll order later ;)
[18:38] <R34lB0rg> 10$ and you can start tracking others flights
[18:40] <Zeusking19> I know this sounds really stupid but - I'm actually really scared of losing my flight when it comes to that
[18:40] <Zeusking19> I don't know why I'm worried about that now
[18:41] <craag> So think of all the things that could go wrong, and prepare for them as best you can :)
[18:41] <infaddict> haha me too, ive invested a lot of time and a fair bit of $ into it, but hey thats part of the excitement.
[18:41] <infaddict> as craag says test test and test again
[18:41] <craag> You do have to be prepared for the possibility
[18:41] <craag> But - if things are done right - it's quite rare nowadays
[18:41] <infaddict> run data thru your tracker from other flights, such as crossing meridian, negative heights etc
[18:41] <infaddict> see the wiki for that
[18:42] <infaddict> use the freezer
[18:42] <infaddict> fling your payload down the stairs
[18:42] <infaddict> etc
[18:42] <Zeusking19> When you say "use the freezer", do you literally mean stuffing my payload in a freezer for an hour?
[18:42] <infaddict> yes or longer
[18:42] <infaddict> it should still function
[18:42] <Zeusking19> Because 1. that sounds fun and 2. good idea
[18:43] <Zeusking19> :)
[18:43] <infaddict> deep freeze setting if you have it
[18:43] <infaddict> its gonnad experience -50 up there
[18:43] <Zeusking19> Main issue is having a freezer big enough :P
[18:43] <infaddict> your battery performance will drop and you need to ensure everything works
[18:43] <infaddict> equally practice tracking your payload. get someone to drive off with it and you find it etc.
[18:44] <Zeusking19> That would work if I was old enough to drive, so in effect I'll end up being a human GPS in that case
[18:44] <Zeusking19> (as we should, tracking and driving is probably dangerous and not advised :P)
[18:44] <infaddict> haha true, get someone to help if you can. or even just in a big field with a mate at the other side.
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[18:45] <Zeusking19> Nearby we have a fairly large outdoor complex, too big to be considered a park to be honest
[18:45] <Zeusking19> Quite a few high locations etc
[18:46] <Zeusking19> Afternoon activity, track the payload :P
[18:46] <infaddict> !wiki how to lose your flight
[18:46] <SpacenearUS> 03infaddict: Wiki page 03how_to_lose_your_flight - 12http://ukhas.org.uk/guides:how_to_lose_your_flight
[18:46] <SpacenearUS> 03infaddict: Wiki page 03projects:canadawest:progress - 12http://ukhas.org.uk/projects:canadawest:progress?s[]=lose&amp;s[]=flight
[18:46] <infaddict> check that top link
[18:47] <Zeusking19> Heh, this'll get confusing easily
[18:48] <Zeusking19> "Don't test that it reports the altitude correctly above 32,768"
[18:48] <infaddict> its a list of what NOT to do haha
[18:48] <Zeusking19> And out of curiousity - how on earth do you even test that without actually sending the payload up?
[18:48] <infaddict> written in a slightly sarcastic tone
[18:48] <infaddict> by feeding in test data to your program
[18:48] <infaddict> so instead of reading GPS, read a file of data
[18:48] <infaddict> again the wiki explains this - lemme find it
[18:48] <infaddict> !wiki coding errors
[18:48] <SpacenearUS> 03infaddict: Wiki page 03common_coding_errors_payload_testing - 12http://ukhas.org.uk/guides:common_coding_errors_payload_testing
[18:49] <Zeusking19> I have skimmed the wiki but pretty soon I'm gonna have to start reading it in-depth once it comes to actually developing my payload
[18:49] <infaddict> at bottom of that page is section about testing payload
[18:49] <infaddict> with simulated flight
[18:49] <infaddict> e.g. crossing meridian
[18:49] <Zeusking19> alright, thanks!
[18:49] <infaddict> np afk for a while
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[19:15] <Zeusking19> With a polystyrene box (http://www.hobbycraft.co.uk/hobbycraft-polystyrene-box-with-flat-lid/591590-1000 for example) how would you recommend fixing down the equipment inside so it won't move?
[19:22] <daveake> hot melt
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[19:23] <R34lB0rg> epoxy
[19:26] <Geoff-G8DHE> !wiki glue
[19:26] <SpacenearUS> 03Geoff-G8DHE: No results for your query
[19:27] <Geoff-G8DHE> !wiki constrution materials
[19:27] <SpacenearUS> 03Geoff-G8DHE: No results for your query
[19:27] <Geoff-G8DHE> !wiki Construction Materials
[19:27] <SpacenearUS> 03Geoff-G8DHE: No results for your query
[19:27] <Geoff-G8DHE> search for Glue on wiki!
[19:27] <SpacenearUS> New vehicle on the map: 03KF5PGW-3 - 12http://tracker.habhub.org/#!qm=All&q=KF5PGW-3
[19:28] <Geoff-G8DHE> http://ukhas.org.uk/guides:materials?s%5B%5D=glue
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[19:32] <Zeusking19> Great, thanks
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[19:55] <Zeusking19> Should be ordering my rtlsdr tomorrow
[19:55] <Zeusking19> :)
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[21:13] <Laurenceb_> http://www.mers.byu.edu/long/theses/msthesis_edwards.pdf
[21:13] <Laurenceb_> this would be fun on a balloon
[21:14] <Zeusking19> *cough* saw the word Radar and immediately chucked because of inside joke
[21:14] <Zeusking19> Guest97165: ah-hem
[21:15] <qyx_> Laurenceb_: the same thing came to my mind when you pasted that 6GHz radar last time
[21:15] <Laurenceb_> holy shit
[21:15] <Laurenceb_> page 105
[21:15] <Laurenceb_> truly epic
[21:15] <Guest97165> what
[21:17] <qyx_> huh, thats actually quite cool
[21:25] <Laurenceb_> p107 too
[21:34] <SpeedEvil> Looks very interesting
[21:34] <SpeedEvil> 25W is a lot.
[21:34] <SpeedEvil> But it's not _that_ much
[21:35] <Laurenceb_> you have more integration time on a balloon
[21:35] <Laurenceb_> and you could reduce the pixel size
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[21:35] <Laurenceb_> i want to know how choice of wavelength effects it
[21:36] <Laurenceb_> how a 434mhz one would compare
[21:39] <qyx_> behind-the-corner HF radar!
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[21:56] <Laurenceb_> http://people.seas.harvard.edu/~jones/es151/prop_models/slide17.gif
[21:57] <SpeedEvil> That's what - 3m?
[21:57] <Laurenceb_> maybe
[21:58] <Jartza> evening
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[22:04] <Lunar_Lander> hi Jartza
[22:09] <Jartza> hello Lunar_Lander :)
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[22:13] <Vaizki> evening peeps
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[22:24] <Jartza> them too
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[22:35] <Lunar_Lander> hello Vaizki
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[22:47] <NormanOK> hello everyone
[22:50] <Upu> Evening NormanOK
[22:51] <NormanOK> Good evening! I have a couple of questions and I'd appreciate any help :)
[22:51] <Upu> shoot
[22:52] <SpacenearUS> New position from 03ATSAT-4 after 039 hours silence - 12http://tracker.habhub.org/#!qm=All&q=ATSAT-4
[22:52] <NormanOK> I often see balloons transmitting both aprs and some other digital mode at two different frequencies. Do you know what kind of transmitter people use for that?
[22:52] <Upu> usually 2 seperate ones
[22:52] <Upu> 434Mhz can be Radiometrix MTX2/NTX2B, RFM22B custom SI4460 etc
[22:53] <Upu> 144Mhz can be Radiometrix HX1 + custom
[22:53] <Upu> sometimes with the B balloons the SI4460 does both but only @ 10mW
[22:53] <NormanOK> I'm in the states and I don't know if I can buy any Radiometrix transmitters from here.
[22:53] <Upu> you can I ship to the states http://ava.upuaut.net/store
[22:54] <Upu> I have an agreement with the US distributor (Lemos) that I can ship to amateur users
[22:54] <Upu> http://ava.upuaut.net/store/index.php?route=product/category&path=71_63
[22:54] <Upu> specifically
[22:54] <NormanOK> I am almost ready to launch my first balloon. I have a OOK transmitter at 434 Mhz. I simply send morse code. I can track it myself but I don't know if anyone would be interested in tracking that later.
[22:54] <NormanOK> oh thanks for the link.
[22:55] <Upu> where abouts are you in the states ?
[22:55] <NormanOK> Oklahoma
[22:55] <Upu> Well if you get as far as Alabama the grandaddy of all our hobby resides there
[22:56] <Upu> If I was you in the states
[22:56] <Upu> I'd run both APRS and 434Mhz
[22:56] <NormanOK> yes that's what I'd like to do, but I wasn't clear about the transmitter to use.
[22:56] <NormanOK> how about SI4464?
[22:57] <Upu> there are lots of options but the Radiometrix modules are well proven
[22:57] <NormanOK> are those chips easy to use?
[22:57] <Upu> yes that can do it but you'll need to make your own circuit
[22:57] <Upu> not really
[22:58] <Upu> At the risk of sounding like I'm advertising I make the Habduino (www.habduino.org) which does both at the same time
[22:58] <Upu> its open source
[22:58] <Upu> so you grab the schematics
[22:58] <NormanOK> wow, that looks great!
[22:59] <NormanOK> I'll look into that. is there a smaller version with arduino pro mini?
[23:01] <Upu> nope but you have the schematics :)
[23:02] <NormanOK> thanks :)
[23:02] <Upu> I am designing a compact APRS transmitter designed for balloon use
[23:03] <NormanOK> for pico balloons?
[23:03] <Upu> probably not pico
[23:03] <Upu> needs 2 AA's
[23:03] <Upu> the down side of the HX1 is it needs 5V
[23:03] <Upu> stepping up from single cell to 5V isn't really viable
[23:04] <Upu> http://i.imgur.com/8iMhqkB.png
[23:04] <Upu> board top right
[23:05] <Upu> http://i.imgur.com/SzKWDDu.png
[23:05] <NormanOK> HX1 is 300mW right? do you need that much power? I read people do amazing stuff with only 10 mW.
[23:05] <Upu> easier with the ground plane filled in
[23:05] <Upu> yes it is
[23:05] <Upu> sure your american ?
[23:05] <Upu> normally you want POWER! :)
[23:05] <Upu> 10mW does work
[23:06] <NormanOK> haha :)
[23:06] <Upu> but I'd say it was a little marginal
[23:06] <Upu> However for balloon use 100mW would be gine
[23:06] <Upu> fine
[23:06] <NormanOK> I'm not from the US originally, you got me.
[23:06] <NormanOK> moved here couple of years ago
[23:06] <Upu> so yes a SI4464 would probably cut the mustard
[23:06] <Upu> where are you from originally ?
[23:06] <NormanOK> Turkey
[23:06] <Upu> oh cool
[23:07] <Upu> the slightly larger board is a Dojri 500mW
[23:07] <Upu> or 1W but I've soldered it to 500mW
[23:08] <Upu> trying a few things
[23:08] <Upu> end game will be a SI4464 based board
[23:08] <Upu> but that means making the radio bit myself
[23:09] <NormanOK> your boards look great. I'm nowhere near that level. I haven't even designed a pcb by myself, but learning.
[23:09] <Upu> but yes if you want to go Pico you need to be < 30g weight
[23:09] <Upu> well ask away on here
[23:09] <Upu> lots of expertise and advice
[23:09] <NormanOK> my payload is going to be about that much I think. maybe 35g
[23:10] <NormanOK> the heaviest component is the gps antenna. I don't know why it's that heavy.
[23:10] <NormanOK> it's about 13g
[23:10] <qyx_> remove it
[23:10] <daveake> 1/4 wave piece of wire should work well enough
[23:10] <Upu> yeah http://ava.upuaut.net/store/index.php?route=product/product&path=59_65&product_id=55
[23:10] <qyx_> yep
[23:10] <Upu> or a piece of wire
[23:11] <qyx_> i got gps signal indoors on 45mm piece of wire
[23:11] <daveake> ditto
[23:11] <NormanOK> yeah? I should get a connector for it probably, or just soldier a piece of wire bypassing the connector.
[23:11] <Upu> which GPS ?
[23:12] <NormanOK> ublox 6M
[23:12] <NormanOK> got it from ebay for $13
[23:12] <Upu> just rip off whatever rubbish is on there as stick a wire on there
[23:12] <Upu> Use this stuff : http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Ernie-Ball-Custom-Gauge-Guitar-Single-Strings-Electric-or-Acoustic-Pack-6-13-/360959212478?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_3&hash=item540ad87bbe
[23:13] <NormanOK> ok :)
[23:14] <NormanOK> that should cut down the total weight by almost a half :)
[23:14] <Upu> https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/63720513/Images/GPS%20Comparison/IMG_2110.JPG
[23:14] <Upu> 45mm from the ground plane
[23:14] <NormanOK> I wanted to attach a solar cell to it. I thought I was buying a 5V one, turned out to be .5V
[23:15] <Upu> start simple
[23:15] <Upu> use primary cells first
[23:16] <NormanOK> to decode the transmission gqrx + fldigi did not work very well
[23:17] <NormanOK> the OOK msg I transmit doesn't translate to a nice morse code sound in gqrx and fldigi can't decode it.
[23:18] <NormanOK> on top of it, the frequency shifts really fast, with a slight temperature change which happens right away when I key it, so instead of a straight line in waterfall I get a curve :)
[23:19] <qyx_> did you use that $1 transmitter from ebay?
[23:19] <NormanOK> $4 from sparkfun :)
[23:19] <qyx_> https://cdn.sparkfun.com//assets/parts/5/1/0/3/10534-01a.jpg
[23:19] <qyx_> this
[23:19] <NormanOK> yep
[23:20] <qyx_> they do that, probably not much suitable for this purpose
[23:20] <NormanOK> I've written a short code in gnu radio to fix that problem, so it gives a nice beep beep sound which is easily decoded by fldigi.
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[23:21] <NormanOK> trying to be really cheap :)
[23:23] <NormanOK> ok one more question :)
[23:24] <NormanOK> I've tried to calculate the floating altitude based on a balloon's maximum lift.
[23:26] <NormanOK> if the maximum lift is M and payload is m, I got ~6km for m/M=0.5 and ~16km for m/M=0.1.
[23:26] <NormanOK> do you think that sounds right based on your experience?
[23:27] <daveake> We have no experience :-). Leo is your man but he seems to be on gardening leave
[23:29] <NormanOK> his balloons were pretty amazing. I wonder if he stopped after B-66? I don't see any updates on his webpage.
[23:30] <bertrik> no experience here, but I don't remember seeing a lot of floaters > 10 km
[23:31] <NormanOK> there is one right now on the tracker, VENUS1-3.
[23:31] <NormanOK> at 18.5 km
[23:32] <bertrik> oh, nice
[23:36] <NormanOK> if my calculation is right, venus' payload should weigh ~8% of the balloon's maximum lift. so for a ~15g payload about ~190g lift.
[23:37] <Lunar_Lander> good night
[23:38] <NormanOK> good night
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[23:39] <NormanOK> thanks for your help. I'll be back with more questions :)
[23:39] <NormanOK> good night!
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[23:46] <Flerb> I was wondering - what does normal AVR code look like?
[23:46] <Flerb> As in the C code.
[23:46] <Flerb> I mean in the arduino language you use like digitalWrite and things
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[23:47] <mattbrejza> digitalWrite -> PORTD |= (1<<4)
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[23:57] <Flerb> mattbrejza: i don't get that. what's the 1<<4 bit about?
[23:58] <Flerb> that's bit-shifting right?
[23:58] <bertrik> yes
[00:00] --- Sun Feb 22 2015