highaltitude.log.20150216

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[00:28] <lz1dev> http://i.imgur.com/mLnDkKd.png
[00:28] <lz1dev> iridum has some pretty good coverage
[00:38] <adamgreig> lol wow
[00:39] <adamgreig> that's cool
[00:44] <lz1dev> when they say constellation, they are not kidding
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[01:00] <superhigh> Hi
[01:00] <lz1dev> hi superhigh
[01:00] <superhigh> What's happening? Anyone got a live flight on the go?
[01:01] <lz1dev> !flights
[01:01] <SpacenearUS> 03lz1dev: Current flights: 03B-64 434.500 Contestia 64/1000 10(3afe)
[01:01] <lz1dev> answer is no
[01:02] <superhigh> Yeah I thought I saw a UK one earlier but guess it's not exactly prime time!
[01:04] <superhigh> !flights
[01:04] <SpacenearUS> 03superhigh: Current flights: 03B-64 434.500 Contestia 64/1000 10(3afe)
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[08:48] <tweetBot1> @MX5AKA: New article by @daveake M0RPI - High Altitude Ballooning, From The Ground Up (and back again) http://t.co/DzOXHVdk2K #ukhas #hamradio #hamr
[08:54] <edmoore> this implies there are other tweetbots
[08:54] <edmoore> may the heavens have mercy
[08:55] <daveake> hah
[08:56] <fsphil> there are many copies
[08:56] <fsphil> and they have a plan
[08:56] <daveake> Can they tweet?
[08:57] <edmoore> this is a good summary daveake
[08:57] <edmoore> nice
[08:57] <daveake> cheers
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[08:57] <daveake> sulkingbot
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[08:57] <daveake> bot wars
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[09:19] <tweetBot> @horizonqmgs: @ProjectHeT Head over to #UKHAS and read everything. Research other projects. Beg/borrow a regulator for filling the balloon.
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[09:35] Nick change: day- -> day
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[10:32] <Vaizki> very very nice writeup for us newbies, daveake
[10:33] <infaddict> can u relink pls Vaizki
[10:34] <Vaizki> http://www.daveakerman.com/?p=1732
[10:34] <infaddict> thx
[10:34] <Vaizki> there are channel logs you know
[10:34] <Vaizki> :)
[10:37] <infaddict> really?
[10:37] <infaddict> ;)
[10:37] <daveake> http://habhub.org/zeusbot/
[10:37] <infaddict> agree, very good article
[10:38] <daveake> Very much needed. A lot of work but it'll save me answering many emails individually.
[10:38] <Darkside> heh
[10:38] <Darkside> nice
[10:39] <Darkside> we did somethign similar for our local amateur raido magazine a few years back
[10:40] <jededu> ping upu
[10:40] <daveake> Problem is, when you start you don't know what it is that you don't know, and there's really no single place to go to find out
[10:40] <craag> unknown unknowns
[10:40] <daveake> I know
[10:40] <infaddict> lol just typed same thing craag
[10:40] <Vaizki> dave's easy mode ballooning
[10:41] <Darkside> craag: donald rumsfeld
[10:41] <infaddict> i'm trying not to take too much on in one go. not even thinking about balloon/parachute yet.
[10:41] <daveake> No, don't
[10:42] <daveake> A fair proportion of emails I get are "what balloon do I need?"
[10:42] <Vaizki> think lifting bodies cruising lazily into orbit instead
[10:42] <Babs_> the balloon is a critical component of habbing
[10:42] <daveake> The answer is "how the hell do I know?"
[10:42] <daveake> For my launches I often don't decide the balloon size till launch day
[10:42] <infaddict> yer but until i know weight of my paylooad choosing a balloon/parachute is impossible right
[10:42] <daveake> It's pretty much the last thing
[10:42] <infaddict> so should be well down my list
[10:42] <daveake> well down
[10:43] <Babs_> daveake the fact that you have a choice of balloons is impressive in itself
[10:43] <infaddict> so dave other than payload weight, what influencing your choice? weather?
[10:43] <daveake> Well it helps a lot when trying to avoid motorways etc
[10:43] <daveake> Tho that last flight I successfull missed all the large forests but hit a tree anyway
[10:43] <infaddict> oosh a motorway landing wouldnt be pretty
[10:44] <daveake> OK, in my case I choose to get a good flight path, but then I have 1 of each size from 350g to 2000g so that's ok for me
[10:45] <daveake> For anyone doing 1 flight you need to buy the balloon a few days before launch, or earlier
[10:45] <daveake> So you can't adjust the flight by changing the balloon, just by changing the amount of gas
[10:45] <infaddict> right i see. so helium amount can alter flight path a certain degree i guess (ascent/descent rate)
[10:45] <daveake> not much on descent either
[10:45] <infaddict> ah right
[10:45] <daveake> helium has gone by then!
[10:45] <infaddict> true, so parachute size controls that
[10:45] <infaddict> with payload weight
[10:46] <daveake> For descent you can use a different parachute, but as above you're only going to have the one
[10:46] <Babs_> people always make the mistake of not taking their JCB along for recover. Its the last thing on the checklist and most people forget it, yet it can be totally critical for recovery https://www.flickr.com/photos/91049302@N00/7329355502/in/set-72157629918448066
[10:46] <daveake> beasides which, the descent speed doesn't change the flight path anywhere near as much as the ascent rate does
[10:46] <infaddict> mmm my payload is going to be fairly light i think. electronics are very light, just my 2 cameras and 4 AA's that are the hefty things.
[10:47] <daveake> beasides wtf
[10:47] <daveake> Every chase should include a JCB :)
[10:47] <infaddict> thats if i ever get my GPS into flight mode haha ;-)
[10:48] <jededu> Anybody have any spare inductors COILCRAFT_MSS5131 footprint 2.5uH Mouser sent chip inductors
[10:51] <UpuWork> hi jededu
[10:53] <jededu> Hi upu that was the question
[10:53] <UpuWork> err
[10:54] <jededu> Does anybody else stock coilcraft
[10:54] <UpuWork> LPS4018
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[10:54] <UpuWork> I have
[10:54] <SpacenearUS> New vehicle on the map: 03default_chase - 12http://tracker.habhub.org/#!qm=All&q=default_chase
[10:55] <jededu> What value
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[10:55] <Vaizki> default_chase sounds like a bank gone bad
[10:56] <SpacenearUS> New vehicle on the map: 03home_chase - 12http://tracker.habhub.org/#!qm=All&q=home_chase
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[11:01] <UpuWork> what value do you need ?
[11:01] <jededu> 2.5uh
[11:01] <UpuWork> 2.2 or 3.3
[11:01] <UpuWork> they don't do a 2.5
[11:02] <jededu> 3.3
[11:02] <UpuWork> how many ?>
[11:02] <jededu> 10
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[11:02] <UpuWork> don't have that many I only get them in 10's :)
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[11:02] <UpuWork> if you want 1 or 2 no probs
[11:02] <jededu> 3
[11:02] <UpuWork> heh
[11:02] <jededu> 2
[11:02] <UpuWork> lol
[11:02] <UpuWork> let me go check 1 sec
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[11:03] <UpuWork> its your lucky day
[11:04] <UpuWork> Be 7 in the post
[11:04] <edmoore> upu to the rescue
[11:04] <edmoore> oo
[11:04] <Vaizki> IS THERE ANYTHING UPU CANNOT DO?
[11:04] <UpuWork> sigh :/
[11:04] <Vaizki> sorry :)
[11:04] <jededu> Cool upu thx :)
[11:06] <edmoore> upu can't sound southern
[11:06] <edmoore> but he can look after his customers
[11:08] <jededu> He does :)
[11:12] <UpuWork> a skill I shall never require edmoore
[11:12] <edmoore> looking after your customers?
[11:12] <edmoore> also have you met andrew back yet? he is more northern than you
[11:13] <UpuWork> @9600 ?
[11:13] <edmoore> yes
[11:13] <edmoore> i like the name Project Helium Tears
[11:13] <UpuWork> follow him on Twitter
[11:13] <UpuWork> yes is that him ?
[11:13] <edmoore> no
[11:13] <UpuWork> ok
[11:13] <edmoore> those guys are essex
[11:15] <Darkside> right, playthrough of moonlight sonata done
[11:15] <Darkside> only part 1 ofc
[11:15] <Darkside> need to learn part 2
[11:15] <Darkside> part 3 is waaaaaay beyond me
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[11:24] <edmoore> part 3 is just arpeggios Darkside
[11:24] <edmoore> practice slowly
[11:24] <edmoore> it fits under your hands really nicely
[11:24] <edmoore> beethoven is not rachmaninoff
[11:28] <Darkside> humm
[11:29] <Darkside> i dont currently have the technical skill for it
[11:29] <Darkside> been playing a lot of more minimalistic stuff
[11:29] <Darkside> ludovico einaudi
[11:29] <Darkside> philip glass
[11:29] <Darkside> etc
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[11:36] <SpacenearUS> New position from 03EDUPIC_Alt1 after 034 days silence - 12http://tracker.habhub.org/#!qm=All&q=EDUPIC_Alt1
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[11:38] <burko> Anyone tried the funcube dongle pro for tracking? Tried on the weekend and is useless
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[11:39] <craag> pro or pro plus?
[11:40] <Maxell> burko: I think the antenna-setup is more important.
[11:41] <Maxell> Any details about the antenna being used?
[11:41] <infaddict> what antenna did you use and did you have a amp/filter?
[11:41] <burko> Just pro. Tried a basic whip first then a home made 1\4 with ground plane
[11:41] <daveake> Either model should work very well
[11:42] <cm13g09> morning craag
[11:42] <burko> It seems deaf, cant pick up the ATIS from the airport. My basic scanner can do that with ease
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[11:43] <craag> mornin cm13g09
[11:43] <fsphil> the Pro needs a filter
[11:44] <fsphil> mine was deaf unless I added a 70cm filter (habamp)
[11:44] <fsphil> the pro+ doesn't have that issue
[11:45] <cm13g09> craag: See my PM
[11:45] <fsphil> as it has the filters built-in
[11:46] <burko> Yeah i have been researching all night and that seems to be the common solution. Is there anywhere in Australia that sells habamp?
[11:50] <Vaizki> if not, just get a filter separately?
[11:52] <burko> Yeah i have been looking for a simple inline one, cant seem to find that either
[11:52] <fsphil> before I got the habamp I used a VHF/HF diplexer
[11:52] <Darkside> burko: no
[11:52] <Darkside> burko: only upu's store sells the habamp
[11:52] <fsphil> the strongest signals in my case where broadcast FM on 100mhz and tetra on 400mhz
[11:53] <fsphil> sorry, VHF/UHF diplexer
[11:53] <Darkside> and yes, theFCD pro isn't brilliant
[11:53] <Darkside> sure, i've used it for HAB, but yes, it had a habamp in front :-)
[11:53] <Darkside> the first habamp in fact :-)
[11:55] <daveake> I ran up my Airspy a few days ago, and compared with an FCD Pro (not plus) with 2 trackers running. The FCD showed lots of fake signals due to the 2 signals combining; the Airspy was pretty much clean
[11:55] <burko> Hmmmm, might have to just drop the cash on a habamp. Anyone tried the newer SDRs on ebay, 820t based? Would these work without habamp?
[11:55] <Darkside> i'd make it clear you are talking about a funcube dongle pro, not pro plus on your blog post
[11:55] <Darkside> burko: they will all 'work' without a habamp
[11:56] <Darkside> it all depends what performance you're after
[11:56] <burko> I define work as actual practical use in tracking
[11:57] <Darkside> then sure
[11:57] <Darkside> tracking balloons where? :-)
[11:57] <Darkside> <-- australian btw
[11:57] <daveake> you kept that quiet :p
[11:57] <burko> The airspy does look promising. Planning to launch my own pico in australia yes
[11:58] <Darkside> mmk
[11:58] <Darkside> pico in australia means <50g
[11:58] <Darkside> wlel
[11:58] <Darkside> well*
[11:58] <Darkside> let's just say the legislation is a little bit vague
[11:58] <Darkside> but its generally taken to mean payload weight <50g
[11:58] <burko> Yeah, not much to play with
[11:58] <Darkside> doesnt really say if it includes the balloon weight..
[11:59] <Darkside> IMO it doesn't, but i'm not a lawyer >_>
[11:59] <Darkside> yes, VK3YT is the local pico wizard
[11:59] <burko> The common interpretation seems to be 50g payload + balloon
[11:59] <fsphil> that's a good thing
[11:59] <cm13g09> Darkside: the usual IANAL situation applies, right?
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[11:59] <Darkside> burko: depends who you speak to i guess :-)
[12:00] <daveake> Well the balloon has lift, so the weight is negative, right? :p
[12:00] <Darkside> haha
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[12:00] <fsphil> even a lawyer probably wouldn't give you a straight answer
[12:00] <Darkside> soooo yeah
[12:00] <daveake> s/even/espcially/
[12:00] <Darkside> keep your payload as light as possible
[12:00] <burko> VK3YT seems to be having great success. Although not big on sharing
[12:00] <Darkside> yep
[12:01] <Darkside> though you'll find thats the case for many HAB projects
[12:01] <Darkside> most will not give out a complete design
[12:01] <Darkside> particularly for a pico
[12:01] <Darkside> the challenge for a pico balloon flight is to build something that works well, runs for ages, and is light
[12:02] <Darkside> it's not like you're strapping a tracker onto a camera and launching that.. on a pico th eonly thing you're launching is the tracker itself
[12:02] <burko> Happy to develop my own from scratch, just getting a decent ground station seems to be costly
[12:02] <Darkside> also dont forget wiht a pico its going to float out of range of your ground station pretty quickly
[12:02] <Darkside> (if float is what you're going for)
[12:03] <burko> Yeah thats why i wanted a good receiver
[12:03] <Darkside> well
[12:03] <Darkside> its only going to help so much
[12:03] <Darkside> once it goes over the horizon, there isn't much you can do
[12:04] <burko> Horizionnis pretty big at 7000m
[12:04] <Darkside> not as big as at 35km :-)
[12:04] <fsphil> doesn't take long to float too far
[12:04] <Darkside> but yes, it doesnt take long for it to float out of range at 7km alt
[12:04] <fsphil> my first float was out of range within a few hours
[12:04] <fsphil> and that was at about 34km
[12:05] <burko> Trure. I am just not willing to go through the approval process for the large one
[12:05] <Darkside> ehh its not that hard
[12:05] <Darkside> they seem to be getting better at it
[12:05] <Darkside> well, the last group i did a launch with seemed to get approval really easily
[12:05] <Darkside> nfi now
[12:05] <Darkside> nfi how*
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[12:06] <burko> Hmmm, see how i go. Start small :)
[12:06] <Darkside> well this is the thing
[12:06] <Darkside> in HAB its easier to start big :-)
[12:06] <Darkside> wel, with tracker payloads anyway
[12:06] <daveake> yup
[12:07] <Darkside> also helps if you have a lot of SMD PCB design/construction experience
[12:07] <Darkside> because a pico payload generally means an all-SMD design
[12:07] <Darkside> burko: i'm with project horus btw
[12:07] <Darkside> well, whats left of project horus, hah
[12:08] <burko> True. I am thinking an amateur radio license might be handy for tracking transmitters too. I am an electrical engineer so the design is no drama
[12:08] <Darkside> yes
[12:08] <Darkside> go for your standard or full call
[12:08] <Darkside> not hard to do the extra bit of RF study if you're an elec eng
[12:08] <Vaizki> I also have an airspy, I don't know about FCD as I'm very new to this but it's clearly more sensitive than my R820T2 dvb-t dongle
[12:09] <Darkside> well, not so much RF study, but more theamateur radio specific stuff
[12:09] <Darkside> Vaizki: the airspy has a very different tuner IC
[12:09] <burko> Ah i watched Horus in the early days and loved it! Its what really started my interest in HAB
[12:09] <Darkside> burko: but yes, amateur raido licence recommended
[12:10] <Darkside> means you can use the APRS network
[12:10] <Darkside> which means you can keep tracking once it goes over the horizon :-)
[12:10] <Vaizki> frequency agile APRS with geofencing ;)
[12:10] <Darkside> heh
[12:11] <burko> Yeah i watched PS-34 on the weekend and it seems most of it was received by aprs
[12:11] <Darkside> sure, if you intend to float outside australia
[12:11] <Darkside> burko: yep
[12:11] <Darkside> APRS isnt *that* hard to generate, even in a pico payload
[12:11] <Darkside> theres a few different methods of generating the FSK-on-FM signal
[12:11] <Darkside> of varying 'niceness'
[12:11] <Darkside> simple one is just to varactor modulate a PLL
[12:12] <Darkside> not so nice ones involve nasty tricks with data modems ICs
[12:12] <Darkside> anyway, definitely worth getting an amateur licence
[12:12] <Darkside> and definitely worth me going to bed right now
[12:13] <Darkside> burko: what state BTw?
[12:13] <burko> Ah, seems i am going to be going off in many tangents launching this balloon ;) for now though i must sleep.
[12:14] <burko> NSW, just outside canberra
[12:14] <Darkside> cool
[12:14] <Vaizki> I was just checking APRS 145MHz stuff dvb-t dongle vs airspy.. I get about 15dB better signal with airspy
[12:14] <Darkside> i think theres a good amateur radio club in canberra
[12:14] <Darkside> CRARC
[12:15] <Darkside> Vaizki: is that 'absolute' levels or SNR
[12:15] <Darkside> Vaizki: because the 'absolute' levels on whatever software you're using are likely not going to be comparable between devices
[12:15] <burko> Im out of here. Thanks for the chat and info
[12:16] <Darkside> gnight
[12:17] <Vaizki> Darkside, SNR on sdrsharp
[12:17] <Darkside> mmk
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[12:17] <SpacenearUS> New position from 03HYDEST001 after 0314 hours silence - 12http://tracker.habhub.org/#!qm=All&q=HYDEST001
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[12:21] <Vaizki> I have no idea how the absolute dB levels work on sdrsharp
[12:22] <Vaizki> I'm always looking at SNR, nothing else really matters
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[12:49] <infaddict> any recommendations for a GSM module to wire up to my arduino mini pro? ideally 3.3v but could power separately if required. lots of different options on google so wondering if anybody has recommendations.
[12:51] <eroomde> telit modules
[12:51] <eroomde> i have not looked up if they fit your voltage criteria
[12:51] <infaddict> cheers eroomde will look those up
[12:52] <eroomde> hmm sparkfun don't sell them anymore
[12:52] <eroomde> https://www.sparkfun.com/products/9533
[12:52] <infaddict> are they just the chips or a breakout board?
[12:52] <eroomde> they sell a breakout board for it too
[12:53] <eroomde> this is a telit on a very vintage flight computer https://www.flickr.com/photos/eroomde/2501001535/
[12:53] <infaddict> ok, as i'm using a mini pro anything i do has to be wired/soldered myself
[12:54] <infaddict> yep thats the kinda thing i am after. connect battery (or vcc & gnd), plus pins for tx/dx and an antenna
[12:55] <infaddict> the sparkfun items look good, but they are $120 for the GSM and breakout board. was hoping to get something in UK/Euro a bit cheaper.
[12:55] <eroomde> well that breakout board would be the thing, probably
[12:55] <eroomde> sure
[12:55] <eroomde> http://uk.farnell.com/webapp/wcs/stores/servlet/Search?st=gsm+module&catalogId=15001&categoryId=700000005572&langId=44&storeId=10151
[12:55] <eroomde> or an old nokia
[12:56] <eroomde> probably the cheapest way
[12:56] <infaddict> am i right to think I want GPRS?
[12:57] <eroomde> don't know
[12:57] <UpuWork> I would suggest not to bother with GSM
[12:57] <eroomde> don't think so?
[12:57] <infaddict> mmm been looking on ebay for old nokias and sony ericcson or motorolla but no luck yet
[12:57] <UpuWork> or just get one of the cheap dx.com ones
[12:57] <eroomde> oh dx.com
[12:57] <eroomde> i forgot about them
[12:57] <eroomde> i might just order some shit from there now
[12:57] <UpuWork> lol
[12:57] <infaddict> hey upu. was just as a backup for radio. i know they tend to only work half the time anyway.
[12:58] <UpuWork> infaddict make your own tracker. I'll lend you one of mine
[12:58] <eroomde> he is UpuWork
[12:58] <eroomde> you're behind the curve
[12:58] <eroomde> it's cool
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[12:58] <infaddict> ok a stand alone unit to just pop in the payload? or does it interface with flight tracker?
[12:59] <UpuWork> just a standalone one. Clip in a battery, screw on an antenna. Job done.
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[12:59] <infaddict> ok cool thx i've seen them around. so they have GPS and GSM in one, with a sim card too.
[13:00] <eroomde> oh but sending custom text messages is fun
[13:00] <infaddict> lol
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[13:18] <SpeedEvil> being careful that some ofthe stadnalone ones are just GSM positioning, not GPS
[13:18] <SpeedEvil> these are evenworse
[13:22] <infaddict> yep depends on how i want to implement. standalone GSM (e.g. to send a SMS) is fine as my flight computer will tell it to send a text with lat/long from my gps unit. more to wire up, more to code but part of the fun.
[13:22] <infaddict> or as Upuwork said, a standalone unit does same job
[13:27] <craag> I think UpuWork meant he'd lend you a rtty tracker.
[13:27] <craag> Probably one of his plug'n'pavas
[13:28] <craag> As a backup to yours
[13:29] <craag> In terms of GSM Tracker - I've used the TK102B. Genuine ones are about $50, anything cheaper tends to be a clone, which aren't as reliable (I've had it just stop sending for no reason). Genuine one worked well on a terrestrial mission.
[13:30] <infaddict> ok thx craag will look them up. even if i dont use on my first flight, there's always room to improve later on!
[13:30] <daveake> I think you might be thinking of when I suggested a separate GSM tracker as a backup rather than add it to your radio tracker, thus inflicting SoftwareSerial on your code
[13:31] <infaddict> ok i thought Upuwork was offering that very thing, but probably mistaken
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[13:36] <daveake> No, if he offered something it would be a spare radio tracker
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[13:36] <infaddict> ah right my misunderstanding then
[13:36] <daveake> and that's the best backup
[13:36] <infaddict> wouldnt that duplicate my own rtty tho
[13:36] <daveake> Yes but yours might not work :/
[13:36] <infaddict> and yield 2 sligthly different positions
[13:37] <daveake> yes but each would be a different payload ID
[13:37] <infaddict> ah right
[13:37] <daveake> So the map shows 2 balloons at the same place (ish)
[13:37] <infaddict> ok understand thx dave
[13:37] <infaddict> that sounds far too safe ;-)
[13:37] <daveake> A GSM backup would be better if a) you were in a country with few/no other trackers, and b) you hadn't a clue how to track
[13:37] <daveake> e.g. that Swedish flight
[13:38] <daveake> Though both GSM trackers failed anyway
[13:38] <infaddict> b) is currently true. hoping to work on that before my launch tho!
[13:38] <daveake> yeah just fix that :)
[13:38] <daveake> I've flown in another country, where I was the only person tracking, and I didn't feel the need for a GSM tracker
[13:38] <infaddict> got a yagi and magmount waiting to be tested but blinking dongle not arrived from HK yet
[13:41] <jededu> I think my cutdown will be ok :) https://vid.me/nH8r
[13:41] <daveake> lol
[13:42] <daveake> turn the power down a tad :)
[13:42] <jededu> Yes :)
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[13:42] <infaddict> nice!
[13:42] <infaddict> if nothing else you'll see a burning payload like a flare!
[13:42] <jededu> lol
[13:42] <daveake> Nope
[13:42] <daveake> Not enough O2
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[13:51] <Vaizki> have you guys used SDR Console v2?
[13:52] <Vaizki> seems like a nice bit of software but it keeps giving me this "Please wait" dialog box after about half an hour of playing around, then stops responsing and writes to disk like crazy
[13:52] <Vaizki> I'm assuming it has crashed and writes out a dump or something
[13:52] <eroomde> jededu, blimey
[13:52] <eroomde> that'll learn it
[13:52] <jededu> lol
[13:53] <eroomde> i just shoot for a surface heat plus of about 100kW/m^2
[13:53] <eroomde> which is certainly not at the glowing yellow stage
[13:53] <eroomde> heat flux*
[13:54] <UpuWork> backup radio tracker infaddict
[13:55] <infaddict> cheers u
[13:55] <infaddict> UpuWork
[13:56] <UpuWork> https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/63720513/Images/PCB%20Pictures/buzz.jpg
[13:57] <jededu> infaddict I have 2 of upu's backup trackers well worth it
[13:58] <Vaizki> UpuWork, that has a SMA connector sticking out the bottom?
[13:58] <UpuWork> yes
[13:59] <daveake> That design flew last week
[13:59] <daveake> and was still working (in the tree) 24 hours later
[13:59] <UpuWork> I don't have a pic of it with the antenna on
[14:00] <Vaizki> so 24+ hours with single lithium AA cell?
[14:00] <UpuWork> yeah probably 48
[14:00] <UpuWork> but its a 3.3V design
[14:00] <UpuWork> the 1.8V version of that could do way over that
[14:00] <mattbrejza> 1.8V version being a resistor change?
[14:00] <Vaizki> tx every 20 secs?
[14:00] <UpuWork> no radio
[14:01] <Vaizki> and M8C
[14:01] <mattbrejza> oh also thats the fixed tps
[14:01] <UpuWork> yes
[14:01] <UpuWork> Original had an RFM22B on it
[14:01] <UpuWork> which ran at 1.8V
[14:01] <mattbrejza> is there a lora one on its way?
[14:02] <Vaizki> what is the boost converter?
[14:02] <UpuWork> well
[14:02] <UpuWork> if you flip that over
[14:02] <UpuWork> there are lora pads
[14:02] <mattbrejza> ah right
[14:02] <UpuWork> TPS61201
[14:03] <UpuWork> though it probably won't work
[14:03] <UpuWork> we did another one with a 1K on the MISO line which does actually program
[14:03] <mattbrejza> or CS pulled high?
[14:04] <UpuWork> one of them I can't remember
[14:04] <UpuWork> daveake has them
[14:04] <UpuWork> they work though
[14:04] <Geoff-G8DHE-M> Any sort of date yet for a LoRa flight I wonder ?
[14:04] <UpuWork> not yet
[14:05] <Geoff-G8DHE-M> Frustrating ;-) Can't check out the gateway
[14:06] <daveake> Feb 28th
[14:06] <Geoff-G8DHE-M> OOh right I'll make sure the day stays clear!
[14:07] <daveake> You might want to do the same for March 20th too :)
[14:07] <daveake> 8am launch
[14:08] <Geoff-G8DHE-M> Done, perhaps an early morning call for that then ;-)
[14:08] <UpuWork> time will not move
[14:08] <daveake> Not a day for ISH
[14:09] <Geoff-G8DHE-M> Trouble is with that chip you can't even see the RSSI move withiut a genuine signal :-(
[14:09] <Geoff-G8DHE-M> without
[14:12] <pc1pcl> msg daveake Just noticed your Blogpost has "Most balloons will need less than 3.6m/s which is a BOC T cylinder", probably 3.6m^3 was meant?
[14:14] <eroomde> dimensional analysis for the win
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[14:26] <daveake> pc1pcl yeah craag spotted that one too :)
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[14:31] <daveake> fixed now, plus a few others
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[14:34] <pc1pcl> daveake: Got one more: "About 6 days prior to launch, start checking the wind predictions (see below) and the wind predictions (www.wunderground.com is good for this)." 2x wind predictions, second one probably should be something like '(general) weather predictions'?
[14:34] <daveake> ah dammit I saw that one earlier
[14:34] <daveake> fixed
[14:37] <pc1pcl> ah ok, I was thinking one would want to keep in mind if it was going to be a 'nice day with clear skies', overcast or even heavy sleet coming down to base the go/nogo on. but makes sense this way too.
[14:38] <daveake> those are secondary
[14:38] <daveake> they won't stop a launch
[14:38] <daveake> well not if you really want to launch :)
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[14:39] <pc1pcl> Another thing, which may be by design though, is that many links aren't clickable, just show up in the running text. e.g in the sections on receiving station and uploading.
[14:41] <daveake> laziness
[14:43] <pc1pcl> more or less a feature rather than a bug then ;)
[14:48] <Vaizki> so no love for sdr console here?
[14:49] <Geoff-G8DHE-M> Oh yes only one I use
[14:49] <Geoff-G8DHE-M> SDR# is OK but not really a good UI
[14:49] <Vaizki> I just started looking at it but it keeps hanging with a tiny Please Wait window.. and seems to be dumping gigabyts of stuff to disk
[14:50] <Geoff-G8DHE-M> Not normal at all
[14:50] <Vaizki> so it looks like it crashes
[14:50] <Vaizki> it will work ok for 20-30 minutes it seems
[14:50] <Geoff-G8DHE-M> have you only just installed it ?
[14:50] <Vaizki> yes
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[14:50] <Vaizki> fresh off the magic dropbox link on the site
[14:51] <Geoff-G8DHE-M> Try a reset Tools|Reset
[14:51] <Vaizki> ok will try
[14:52] <Geoff-G8DHE-M> It does have a memory leak for me but only after a bout a week or so of running
[14:52] <Geoff-G8DHE-M> What radio/dongle are you using it with ?
[14:53] <Vaizki> airspy
[14:53] <Geoff-G8DHE-M> OK well me to
[14:53] <Geoff-G8DHE-M> + a couple of dongles on other aerials
[14:53] <Vaizki> build 1990?
[14:54] <Geoff-G8DHE-M> you do need a good USB port which can handle the bandwidth unless you decimate in Airspy
[14:54] <Geoff-G8DHE-M> Yup 1990 is current Beta
[14:54] <Vaizki> well I have not had any drops when testing with the tools
[14:56] <SpacenearUS> New vehicle on the map: 03VORTEX4 - 12http://tracker.habhub.org/#!qm=All&q=VORTEX4
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[14:57] <infaddict> well after many hours debugging I've finally solved the uBlox I2C NAV5/airborne mode problem
[14:57] <Geoff-G8DHE-M> ?
[14:57] <infaddict> and it was related to buffers in I2C so thanks to all who suggested that line of enquiry
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[14:57] <infaddict> behind the scenes, I2C has a 32 char buffer limit
[14:57] <infaddict> hardcoded in twi.h
[14:58] <Geoff-G8DHE-M> Ugh
[14:58] <infaddict> even if you request more data, you can't get more
[14:58] <daveake> wut
[14:58] <infaddict> but the crux of issue is on the send()
[14:58] <infaddict> the send buffer is also 32 bytes max!!
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[14:58] <infaddict> a NAV5 message is 44
[14:58] <infaddict> hence it truncates
[14:58] <infaddict> i have modified my code to detect > 32 bytes and split into chunks
[14:58] <infaddict> hey presto!!
[14:59] <infaddict> lots of code I've seen on the net is therefore not working properly and NOT setting flight mode
[15:00] <Vaizki> infaddict: sorry I didn't get to debugging it, I would have caught that with the LA.. :P
[15:01] <Vaizki> Geoff-G8DHE: running airspy_rx -r NUL -t 0 again and a rock solid 10.00 MSPS
[15:01] <infaddict> i guess this is one good reason for checking for an ACK rather than fire and forget
[15:01] <infaddict> no worries Vaizki
[15:02] <Geoff-G8DHE-M> Thats good several people expect it to work with old machines with stressed USB ports already!
[15:02] <infaddict> i can stop dreaming of i2c and bytes and focus on flight computer!
[15:02] <daveake> infaddict So were you using write with a >32 byte buffer?
[15:02] <infaddict> writing single bytes Dave
[15:02] <infaddict> but behind the scenes it buffers them up
[15:02] <infaddict> >32 are simply ignored!!
[15:02] <infaddict> without any error code
[15:02] <Vaizki> Geoff-G8DHE: I have a quad-core haswell at 3.2GHz running nothing but this...
[15:02] <daveake> I send 1 at a time and it works, as in it does enter flight mode
[15:02] <infaddict> hum are you sure? my testing proves that isnt working for me.
[15:03] <daveake> I flew one last week
[15:03] <Vaizki> daveake: 1 character at a time?
[15:03] <infaddict> ok but how do you know it was in flight mode? could it have not been?
[15:03] <daveake> for (i=0; i<Length; i++)
[15:03] <daveake> {
[15:03] <daveake> Wire.write(Message[i]);
[15:03] <daveake> }
[15:03] <infaddict> yep that was my exact code originally
[15:03] <daveake> The default mode caps out at 12km
[15:03] <infaddict> problem is if you look at the write function in wire.cpp, it stops after BUFFER_SIZE
[15:03] <infaddict> and BUFFER_SIZE is 32
[15:03] <infaddict> unless you have diff version perhaps
[15:03] <infaddict> with a higher limit
[15:04] <daveake> 1 sec
[15:04] <Vaizki> so what pulls it out of the buffer and writes it out, a timer?
[15:05] <daveake> No it would have to be endTransmission
[15:05] <infaddict> yep endTransmission causes it to actually be sent
[15:05] <infaddict> and i2c behind the scenes does use timers for syncing i think
[15:05] <Vaizki> byte: write() will return the number of bytes written
[15:06] <Vaizki> maybe check return values more often? :)
[15:06] <daveake> oh wait, the tracker I flew was serial GPS not i2c
[15:07] <daveake> yeah just checked the tracker settings it compiled with, and it's serial
[15:07] <daveake> well well
[15:08] <infaddict> ah that explains it!
[15:08] <daveake> I don't think there are any timers involved
[15:09] <infaddict> its a 100Khz serial behind the scenes
[15:09] <infaddict> again that rate is hardcoded by twi
[15:09] <Vaizki> arduino never ceases to amaze me
[15:11] <Vaizki> the Wire class I found doesn't even have a write() method
[15:11] <infaddict> the old version is send()
[15:11] <infaddict> wont compile in latest ver tho
[15:11] <infaddict> sadly i've learned fat too much are wire in the last 2 days
[15:11] <infaddict> *far
[15:12] <infaddict> really glad this is solved tho. can actually focus on flight computer now instead of this thing!
[15:12] <Vaizki> oh ok send has a void return type
[15:12] <infaddict> yep
[15:12] <daveake> So if you do write(some buffer, len), does it copy that lot to its own buffer, up to the 32-byte limit?
[15:12] <daveake> or does it use the buffer directly, and thus avcoid this 32-byte limit?
[15:13] <infaddict> nope
[15:13] <infaddict> that overload is just a wrapper to write(buffer)
[15:13] <Vaizki> no it copies to an internal statically allocated buffer
[15:13] <daveake> wow how shit
[15:13] <infaddict> indeed
[15:13] <daveake> OK, rewrite coming up
[15:13] <infaddict> also Dave, in the requestFrom... putting 80 is uselss
[15:13] <Vaizki> yea you should be able to give it a pointer to your own buffer
[15:13] <infaddict> its capped at 32
[15:13] <infaddict> changes it to 32 without telling you
[15:14] <daveake> There's no need for its own tx buffer at all
[15:14] <infaddict> nope. there is a user created library with 0 buffers i read about.
[15:14] <infaddict> recooni2h
[15:14] <infaddict> gonna see what theyve done
[15:14] <infaddict> but for now my code if fixed at least
[15:14] <daveake> so what are you doing now?
[15:15] <Vaizki> drinking beer probably
[15:15] <infaddict> haha!! nearly...
[15:15] <daveake> *in your code* now :p
[15:16] <infaddict> i am keeping my message as a single unsigned char array... which in this example contains 44 bytes... then in the send function i check if the passed length is > BUFFER_SIZE...
[15:16] <infaddict> and if so I send only chunks of 32 at a time
[15:16] <daveake> ah ok
[15:16] <infaddict> you still need the message intact as single array for ACK check
[15:16] <infaddict> other approach is to split message down into 2 arrays
[15:16] <daveake> so it's begin ... send(<=32) .. end .. begin .. remainder... end ?
[15:16] <infaddict> yep
[15:17] <infaddict> just testing it now with various messages to prove it
[15:17] <daveake> I'm semi-surprised that the ublox is happy with that
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[15:17] <infaddict> yer i mailed them this morning as i had proved serial=ok and I2C=not ok with same message
[15:18] <infaddict> however its the arduino library intepretation thats really causing the issue
[15:18] <daveake> Too late now but a Salae logic would have spotted the 32-byte thing in 5 minutes
[15:18] <eroomde> looking at the source of arduinos would have done in less
[15:18] <eroomde> i have, many times
[15:18] <eroomde> which is why i stay the hell away from them
[15:19] <infaddict> yep. anyway i've learned a lot and hopefully helped others who might hit same thing in future.
[15:19] <eroomde> hacked together crud for the use case where it's just about ok for very simple things
[15:19] <infaddict> thx to all who offered advice and things ot check
[15:20] <Vaizki> daveake: 17:00 Vaizki: infaddict: sorry I didn't get to debugging it, I would have caught that with the LA.. :P
[15:21] <daveake> :)
[15:21] <Vaizki> I was going to pull out the saleae yesterday :)
[15:21] <infaddict> sry i know nothing of Salae. what would this have spotted and how?
[15:21] <eroomde> it's a logic analyser
[15:21] <eroomde> you tap into signal lines on your pcb and it records their levels
[15:22] <Vaizki> you would sample the i2c signals into memory and it would decode the traffic for yoy
[15:22] <eroomde> it can then display the trace on your screen and do software decoding of the digital signals
[15:22] <eroomde> it's a useful widget
[15:22] <Vaizki> https://www.saleae.com/Content/Images/Logic16/Software.jpg
[15:22] <eroomde> saleae is a brand that makes hobby-friendly ones
[15:22] <Vaizki> looks like that
[15:23] <Vaizki> there are very cheap ebay ones also but the software is not as good as with saleae
[15:23] <eroomde> that's not to dismiss them as just for hobbysists, they're decent and i value mine, but they're not for debugging large high speed digital busses or nuthin, but then the price is right
[15:23] <infaddict> right so on the SDA and SCL i wouldve been able to see the >32 bytes being not transmitted
[15:23] <eroomde> yes
[15:23] <Vaizki> yep
[15:24] <infaddict> sounds v useful. how does it interface to your hardware?
[15:24] <Vaizki> it basically just detects 0/1 transitions on 8-16 lines (depending on model), then streams over USB to computer memory
[15:24] <eroomde> (but always better to not trust someone else's library from arduinoland first)
[15:24] <Vaizki> after capture, the software analyzes
[15:24] <eroomde> infaddict, little clippy probes
[15:25] <eroomde> like an oscilloscope
[15:25] <infaddict> cool sounds like a nice gadget to have.
[15:26] <eroomde> it is
[15:26] <eroomde> i'd get a scope first if it's a toss-up on the money
[15:26] <Vaizki> they are very high impedance inputs so they don't pull the signal up or down or really sink any current
[15:27] <Vaizki> so they have minimal impact on your circuit.. just like with a scoe
[15:27] <Vaizki> scope
[15:27] <eroomde> hahahahahaha
[15:27] <Vaizki> no? :)
[15:27] <Vaizki> they don't kill my circuits!
[15:27] <eroomde> only if you work with low speed, low impedance signals
[15:27] <Vaizki> sure, that's me
[15:28] <eroomde> scope probes wreak havoc on a significant proportion of my stuff
[15:29] <Vaizki> infaddict: the saleaes are not cheap and as said an oscilloscope (especially a digital storage oscilloscope or DSO) is a more all-rounder in the toolbox when the budget is not unlimited
[15:30] <eroomde> a tiny bit of extra capacitative load on one half of a high impedance, high speed balanced signal can really screw the common-mode rejection ratio and ruin the measurement outputs
[15:30] <eroomde> just as a forinstance
[15:30] <infaddict> Yer looking at $200 for basic 8 channel Saleae. Double for pro version.
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[15:31] <eroomde> infaddict, if getting one thig, grab the rigol 1054Z scope
[15:31] <infaddict> i thought scopes were usually more than that
[15:31] <eroomde> thing*
[15:31] <eroomde> they're a bit more
[15:31] <infaddict> ah right £229 for 1054z
[15:31] <Vaizki> what's the Z in rigol? I just know the E?
[15:31] <eroomde> but it's like getting a pncil sharpener for £5 or an entire pencil case for £10
[15:31] <infaddict> ;-)
[15:31] <eroomde> and you can do some decoding with the rigol anyway
[15:31] <eroomde> Vaizki, new model
[15:32] <eroomde> 4ch, 50mhz/ch
[15:32] <Vaizki> ooo
[15:32] <Vaizki> still hackable?
[15:32] <Vaizki> 4 channels at that price is pretty sweet
[15:32] <eroomde> yes
[15:32] <eroomde> it's amazing for the price
[15:33] <eroomde> no-brainer if you're looking for a scope for around that money
[15:33] <eroomde> there's nothing close
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[15:33] <Vaizki> indeed.. the old one was around same price with 2 channels?
[15:33] <infaddict> mmm if and when i get more into this stuff i will keep that in mind thanks. bookmarked.
[15:34] <eroomde> scopes are eyes
[15:34] <eroomde> into the world of electrons
[15:34] <eroomde> get it before your yaesu for sure :)
[15:34] <eroomde> Vaizki, there's a nice primer on scope probes in jim william's AN47 app-note
[15:34] <Vaizki> at first it feels like flying an alien spaceship made for someone with 7 tentacles 2 opposable thumbs per hand
[15:35] <eroomde> probes for different kinds of measurements
[15:35] <Vaizki> operating a scope I mean
[15:35] <eroomde> that whole app note is worth working through at some point in your life as an electronics hobbyist generally
[15:35] <Vaizki> especially these new ones with a bucketload of features
[15:35] <Vaizki> eroomde: ok thanks will do
[15:36] <eroomde> all of his app notes are great tbh
[15:37] <eroomde> a sort of personal hero of mine
[15:37] <eroomde> keeps me enjoying electronics despite it not really being What I Do
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[16:03] <Steffanx> Im not very active here, so i probably missed it, but leo bodnar is no longer launching his B-xx balloons?
[16:06] <craag> He's been busy with real-life work unfortunately
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[16:26] Nick change: stryx`_ -> stryx`
[16:29] <Vaizki> damn that new rigol scope is out of stock EVERYWHERE
[16:33] <pc1pcl> yeah ws looking for it earlier, but just goes to show that it looks like a great deal.
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[16:39] <Vaizki> yea well I already have an old gw instek scope so no panic
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[16:57] <Babs_> *looks up* i totally knew it was about buffers
[16:58] <Babs_> the fact that i didn't even know that there were two different types of buffers doesn't take any gloss off it for me
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[17:03] <Ian_> I do know that just burning a non-Uno-standard boot loader for an Atmega328p-pu took me down a fairly steep learning path that I hadn't anticipated at the outset.
[17:04] <Babs_> i get what everyone says that arduino is good out of the box, but modifying its underlying structure is necessary and a bit of a pain after a few months messing around with it
[17:04] <Babs_> but normally someone else has done it and its ubiquity means that it is generally documented somewhere
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[17:05] <Babs_> but as a way of getting me back to where i was with basic some years ago it has been great
[17:06] <Ian_> Basically it's strength is also it's weakness. It promises limited simplicity as you wade in and before you get caught up in the rip-tide which needs you to be a very strong swimmer indeed.
[17:06] <Babs_> wise words
[17:07] <Babs_> i also have a sense of nostalgia for the fact that you are always running out of memory etc. and having to use creative ways to make use of limited resources
[17:07] <Babs_> its the dragon, apple II and zx81 all over again
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[17:08] <Babs_> makes you think about the problem not just about the solution
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[17:10] <eroomde> it makes me think about how i want to go on holiday instead of fighting this guff
[17:10] <eroomde> which infact I am at the end of the week
[17:10] <eroomde> so ner
[17:10] Nick change: number10_ -> number10
[17:11] <Babs_> eroomde - when i was your age i drove across the states taking in as many movie sets as i could. you should totally do it.
[17:11] <Babs_> if you are into movies
[17:11] <eroomde> i have done coast-to-coast in the states, but mostly by rail, with a bit of car
[17:12] <eroomde> i was actually going to do cal-florida via all the rocket sites soon
[17:12] <eroomde> maybe with arko
[17:12] <Babs_> we did this one off war games. it would totally be your thing. http://www.nps.gov/mimi/index.htm
[17:15] <eroomde> i do like tourist centres in random places
[17:15] <eroomde> suspect interest might be more anthropological tho
[17:15] <eroomde> like soviet architecture in berlin
[17:15] <eroomde> that's the bit i liked most about being there
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[17:17] <Vaizki> so I ordered the rigol... sigh.. damn expensive being on the channel here
[17:17] <Babs_> once you have your cal-flor route sorted, map this site over the top of it http://www.roadsideamerica.com/
[17:18] <eroomde> Vaizki, good shout
[17:18] <tramvai> Hello everyone. I would like to ask a question regarding adding programs to startup. My goal is to add XAMPP to the startup routine, but it needs administration privileges. How would I go about doing it?
[17:18] <eroomde> Babs_, awesome
[17:18] <eroomde> thanks
[17:18] <Babs_> its totally revelatory to do a journey and find out you are only 5 miles away from the worlds largest toxic pit, or the worlds 3rd largest free standing coastal monolith. breaks up the journey.
[17:19] <eroomde> tramvai, wrong channel?
[17:19] <tramvai> Yes it is, crap.
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[17:19] <tramvai> Sorry. :(
[17:21] <Vaizki> eroomde: they're heavily backordered but I'm tired of my GW Instek.. even though it cost me only 60 euros it's got really crappy memory and it weighs a ton
[17:24] <Vaizki> 125k points of memory vs 12M on the rigol :O
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[18:30] <SpacenearUS> New position from 03PS-34 after 03a day silence - 12http://tracker.habhub.org/#!qm=All&q=PS-34
[18:30] <SpacenearUS> New position from 03VK3YT-11 after 03a day silence - 12http://tracker.habhub.org/#!qm=All&q=VK3YT-11
[18:31] <mclane_> Hello upu, I would have a question regarding an old tracker design of you
[18:32] <mclane_> pAVA v7
[18:32] <mclane_> there you are using a step-up converter from TI (TPS61201)
[18:33] <mclane_> which I would like to reuse
[18:33] <mclane_> do you remembe which kind of choke you have used for that?
[18:33] <mclane_> and where I can find eagle footprints for it?
[18:34] <mclane_> (I looked in your ava lob but could not find anything fitting)
[18:34] <mclane_> (ava lib)
[18:35] <craag> adp1607 is an alternative part btw
[18:36] <mclane_> what is the advantage?
[18:36] <mclane_> "nicer" package?
[18:36] <mclane_> (I don't like QFN)
[18:37] <craag> Not sure about the package - I believe it can handle more current.
[18:37] <craag> I've seen a couple of designs recently using it.
[18:39] <mclane_> I just looked to it - qfn also
[18:40] <mclane_> minimum input voltage is 0.8 V instead of 0.3 V - which is of course not really relevant
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[18:44] <Upu> mclane_ Coilcraft LPS418
[18:44] <Upu> LPS4018
[18:44] <Upu> ava.lbr -> Inductor -> LPS4018
[18:45] <Upu> only issue with adp1607 is the 3.6V max input voltage
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[18:46] <craag> Yes, 1 cell only
[18:46] <Zeusking19> Good evening all
[18:46] <Upu> you coulde use 2
[18:46] <Upu> hi Zeusking19
[18:52] <mclane_> upu: I cannot find it in https://github.com/Upuaut/Eagle-Libraries
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[18:53] <Upu> https://www.dropbox.com/s/qytveix714ocw11/Ava.lbr?dl=0
[18:53] <Upu> grab that
[18:54] <Upu> hmm
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[18:54] <Upu> 404 part not found
[18:54] <Upu> 1 sec
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[18:56] <Upu> https://www.dropbox.com/s/lrp3k4q3jpjamzl/StevesCoilCraft.lbr?dl=0
[18:56] <Upu> I probably need to bring that into my library
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[18:57] <mclane_> perfect thanks!
[19:06] <Zeusking19> Alright - so, I'm a complete newbie to HAB, have been interested for a long time and I started looking into it seriously today, but I have a concern - I live right outside Heathrow Airport (spelthorne borough) and I am worried I'll be denied by the CAA due to my location. Is there any general ideas as to what may happen or would there be someone to contact to find out?
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[19:09] <mbales_> i would suggest launching from somwhere not in restricted air space
[19:10] <craag> Yes you may need to travel a bit to find a launch site.
[19:10] <craag> I live in Southampton and so we have to travel out to the New Forest to get away from the airport.
[19:11] <craag> Even then, the NOTAM restricts us that the balloon cannot go south or west from the launch site.
[19:11] <craag> But it works :)
[19:11] <craag> *south or east
[19:11] <mbales_> who enforces that?
[19:12] <craag> enforces?
[19:12] <mbales_> as it seems very difficult to tell a balloon where not to go
[19:12] <craag> We just have to watch ground winds.
[19:12] <Vaizki> don't launch if the winds are that way
[19:13] <craag> If it goes that way at 30km, doesn't really matter.
[19:13] <craag> It's the wind taking it straight back into the air corridor that they're worried about.
[19:13] <mbales_> i see, that makes more sense
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[19:15] <craag> They don't check/enforce afaik - but if anything happened then we'd be fully (criminally?) liable.
[19:15] <Zeusking19> Alright, thank you guys :)
[19:16] <craag> Zeusking19: If you can't find anywhere
[19:16] <craag> You could chat nicely to the Cambridge Spaceflight Guys (CUSF)
[19:17] <craag> Who have a site in cambridge, that they can launch from, and may be able to let you launch from too. (they legally have to be present)
[19:17] <daveake> Plus, nosey people like me might check your notam and mention the transgression in a PM :p
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[19:17] <Zeusking19> :P
[19:17] <Zeusking19> When you say about moving away from the airport, how far are we talking here? Just plotting out in my head how feasible it will be
[19:18] <edmoore> might have to be tens of miles
[19:18] <edmoore> depends on direction
[19:18] <edmoore> find a relative in the home counties
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[19:19] <Zeusking19> My family does not really extend very far, the only relative further away is in Poole
[19:20] <Zeusking19> That probably won't work if the wind gusts south due to the guaruntee of it landing in water
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[19:20] <edmoore> you'll have to make use of the flight path predictor
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[19:21] <Zeusking19> Alright.
[19:22] <Vaizki> well you have to drive a hundred miles anyway to find the payload.. so what's another 50 to the launch site..
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[19:23] <Vaizki> I for example can't launch near where I live, I probably have to drive at least 150km to a launch site
[19:23] <Zeusking19> From my current position, the landing is roughly 72 miles away
[19:23] <Vaizki> otherwise I will risk it being in the sea or in Russia
[19:24] <Zeusking19> So I see your point there
[19:24] <daveake> Zeusking19 It can vary from nothing to 100's of miles
[19:24] <daveake> in pretty much any direction
[19:24] <Zeusking19> daveake, I understand that. Wind is an unpredictable thing :P
[19:24] <Vaizki> not at all
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[19:24] <Vaizki> just predicting it more than 1 hour in advance is :)
[19:25] <Vaizki> at least here in Finland, your results may vary out there
[19:25] <Zeusking19> Hm, alright - is this something to think about now? Or later once there actually is a balloon to take measurements etc off?
[19:26] <Vaizki> well there are "prevailing winds" and I guess you should plan a launch site according to them
[19:26] <Zeusking19> Alright, so it is something to plan closer to the time.
[19:26] <Vaizki> and be ready to postpone or abort if the wind is not in your favor
[19:27] <Lunar_Lander> hello
[19:27] <Zeusking19> Hi Lunar_Lander
[19:27] <Vaizki> .. and then there's those who land on the moon, where there is no wind
[19:27] <Vaizki> (that's cheating)
[19:27] <Zeusking19> cheating? :P
[19:27] <Zeusking19> I would expect a postpone/abort is common in HAB though
[19:27] <Zeusking19> Given Air Traffic, Wind, etc
[19:28] <Vaizki> I wouldn't know, I'm a launch virgin
[19:28] <Vaizki> I only launch in my sleep
[19:28] <edmoore> air traffic doesn't cause aborts
[19:28] <Vaizki> *coat*
[19:28] <edmoore> you get a notam or you don't
[19:28] <Zeusking19> Not necessarily aborts, but smaller waits in the tens of minutes
[19:28] <edmoore> not really
[19:29] <Zeusking19> Eh, fair enough.
[19:29] <daveake> In some cases you need to call atc and they may request a delay
[19:29] <daveake> For my current and previous sites I haven't had to
[19:29] <Zeusking19> Okay.
[19:29] <Zeusking19> Good to know all of this
[19:30] <daveake> But I know Steve does call atc and last time I was there they said "launch in next 5 minutes or wait for 20"
[19:30] <daveake> So we launched
[19:30] <Vaizki> dave, you wrote this all up so you could link it :)
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[19:31] <daveake> He already read it :)
[19:31] <Vaizki> ah
[19:31] <Zeusking19> Would that be the article published yesterday at http://www.daveakerman.com/ by any chance? (judging from daveake's username, yes)
[19:31] <Vaizki> I'm having it engraved on my shaving mirror
[19:31] <Vaizki> Zeusking19: definite maybe
[19:32] <daveake> yup, guilty
[19:32] <Zeusking19> I'll put it out there now - it is very helpful.
[19:32] <Vaizki> easy way to learn seems to be just to idle here and when you have a stupid though, say it out loud and watch what happens
[19:32] <Vaizki> working great for me
[19:32] <daveake> :)
[19:33] <Vaizki> thought
[19:33] <Zeusking19> No thought is stupid, if it's part of learning then it is good to think, right? :P
[19:33] <edmoore> depends on whether you like BASIC or not, really
[19:34] <Vaizki> well the bit where I thought about a timer released smoke bomb.. that WAS stupid.
[19:35] <Vaizki> oh well, I ordered some 3.3v arduino pros from ebay for trialling my tracker design and got 5V ones..
[19:36] <Vaizki> and I don't have any 8MHz crystals or caps to breadboard a 328 now.. so.. how about an ARM tracker? :)
[19:37] <Zeusking19> daveake, not sure if you are aware but in your latest article under "Balloons and Parachutes", your hyperlink on "Random Engineering" links to "http://www.daveakerman.com/%C2%A0http://habitat.habhub.org/genpayload/"
[19:37] <daveake> tsk another error :/
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[19:38] <daveake> It was a subtle trick to stop Steve from selling out of balloons before I put in my next order
[19:39] <Zeusking19> :)
[19:39] <Vaizki> hmm was it so you can run a 328p without a xtal?
[19:39] <Vaizki> or is my memory failing me at the early age of 41?
[19:39] <qyx_> yes
[19:40] <qyx_> it should be confgured for internal RC osc by default
[19:40] <Vaizki> ah so just a fuses config?
[19:41] <qyx_> yes
[19:41] <qyx_> although it is a long time i used avrs
[19:41] <Vaizki> or you mean by default as in as shipped by atmel?
[19:41] <qyx_> there were 4 fuse bits to select osc and another one (on some avr chips) to select div8 divider
[19:41] <qyx_> yep, from atmel
[19:41] <Vaizki> not sure where those 328p came from that are in my parts bins.. they might have whatever config
[19:44] <Vaizki> but thanks for confirming the internal oscillator to me, I want to run at 8MHz and 3.3V anyway so..
[19:46] <Jartza> 'allo
[19:46] <edmoore> hallo Jartza
[19:47] <edmoore> Vaizki, i don't know this off the top of my head and usually i would therefore shuttup, but vaguely from mem the internal osc has quite a tempco
[19:47] <Jartza> made a video of tagsu-effects :D https://www.dropbox.com/s/4b790lf8b0htih4/1424115654.mp4
[19:47] <edmoore> so if using for, say, uart comms with a ublox on a flight, you might want to check the baud rates don't drift too much
[19:47] <Vaizki> edmoore: yes I remember that too, I just want to have something breadboarded to develop the software
[19:48] <Vaizki> I am not going to fly an atmega without a xtal :)
[19:48] <db_g6gzh> Vaizki: fuse settings for that config are on https://www.ukhas.net/wiki/guides:arduino_design
[19:48] <Jartza> Vaizki: you need any attinys?
[19:48] <Jartza> in dip-packages :)
[19:48] <Vaizki> I have some I think
[19:48] <Vaizki> but they are lacking in pins for this
[19:48] <Jartza> yeah, these are tiny84 and tiny85s
[19:49] <Vaizki> I need i2c + serial + 2-3 gpio
[19:49] <Jartza> tiny84 is 14 pin
[19:49] <Jartza> not "real" i2c though, which sucks a bit
[19:49] <Vaizki> ah right, well I have some 85's only
[19:49] <Vaizki> but I have a bucket of 328p
[19:49] <Jartza> I only have 10 of those
[19:49] <Vaizki> 10 is a bucket
[19:49] <Jartza> haven't done anything with them yet
[19:50] <Jartza> small buckets you have in espoo :)
[19:50] <Jartza> I just got some attiny841 samples though
[19:50] <Jartza> they seem like nice for tiny series
[19:50] <Jartza> 2*uart, spi and i2c _slave_
[19:50] <Jartza> I really don't understand the last one
[19:51] <Vaizki> why not? it's a coprocessor :)
[19:51] <Jartza> but other than that, nice part.. except I need to patch and compile my avr-gcc myself
[19:51] <Jartza> well, i2c master is also easy to bigbang, though. slave is a bit more complicated
[19:51] <Jartza> bitbang, even
[19:52] <Vaizki> 814 doesn't come in DIP, right?
[19:52] <Jartza> 841. nope. soic
[19:52] <Jartza> but I have also "bucket" of soic-dip-adapters
[19:53] <Vaizki> I have all the bits needed for a tracker, now just need to put the proto together
[19:54] <Vaizki> been sick & lazy.. maybe I should just do it..
[19:59] <Vaizki> time to go forage for parts
[20:04] <Jartza> I'm getting rid of most of my TH-parts :)
[20:04] <Jartza> leaving only those needed for breadboarding
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[20:06] <Vaizki> well you do this for a living, I dabble ;)
[20:06] <Vaizki> gimme a couple of year
[20:08] <Jartza> umm, I do electronics for hobby :)
[20:08] <Jartza> and code for living
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[20:14] <JezGB> Hello!
[20:14] <mfa298> Hi JezGB
[20:14] <JezGB> Hi mfa298!
[20:14] <JezGB> I hope I'm in the right place...
[20:15] <JezGB> I just created a payload document on habitat and I'd like to get it approved...
[20:15] <adamgreig> #habhub is the place to ask
[20:16] <JezGB> Ah - ok. Sorry!
[20:16] <mfa298> payload docs don't need approval, flight docs do (but you want a tested payload doc first)
[20:16] <JezGB> Sorry - meant flight doc
[20:16] <JezGB> New to this... (you can probably tell!)
[20:18] <daveake> Does the payload doc work? i.e. have you had your balloon showing on the map yet?
[20:18] <SpacenearUS> New vehicle on the map: 03EDUPIC14 - 12http://tracker.habhub.org/#!qm=All&q=EDUPIC14
[20:18] <JezGB> Hi Dave - no, we haven't done that yet. I just created the payload doc and flight doc...
[20:19] <daveake> OK well get the payload on the map first
[20:19] <JezGB> I'll try... ;-)
[20:19] <daveake> If the payload doc is wrong and you have to replace it, the flight doc will be useless
[20:19] <daveake> so no point getting that approved yet
[20:20] <JezGB> Good point...
[20:20] <daveake> next question - when is the flight?
[20:20] <JezGB> Next Sunday, weather permitting.
[20:21] <daveake> ok
[20:21] <daveake> personally I'd wait for a day or 2, to see what the predictions are looking like
[20:21] <daveake> You've done the CAA thing?
[20:21] <JezGB> Hah hah - yes, they're not looking brilliant at the moment are they?!?
[20:21] <daveake> dunno not looked!
[20:21] <JezGB> Yes, we're expecting the paperwork any day. We have verbal approval
[20:22] <daveake> ok cool
[20:22] <JezGB> Terrible...
[20:22] <Upu> thats not approval :)
[20:22] <Upu> unless you have it on paper
[20:22] <JezGB> As I said, we're expecting that any day. We won't be launching without it...
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[20:23] <jededu> Ready to go :) http://i.imgur.com/T8BrSnX.jpg
[20:23] <Upu> where from again ?
[20:23] <JezGB> Malvern Wells
[20:23] <JezGB> (UK)
[20:23] <Upu> yup thats close to Dave
[20:24] <Upu> That tracker looks like it wants a cuddle jededu
[20:24] <JezGB> We're actually from near Basingstoke - Malvern is our chosen launch location (probably best not ask why!) ;-)
[20:24] <adamgreig> aww nice work jededu
[20:24] <jededu> Its cute :) im going to try for the weekend
[20:25] <Upu> test the payload and then we can approve the doc, also post it on the mailing list and you'll get lots of listeners especially on a Sat
[20:25] <JezGB> Ok, thanks!
[20:25] <daveake> Your own tracker JezGB ?
[20:26] <JezGB> Yes - Arduino based
[20:26] <daveake> cool
[20:26] <Upu> got some pics ?
[20:27] <JezGB> Erm - sort of... It's not quite packaged yet, but we've been posting video blogs on YouTube - Team Auguste...
[20:27] <JezGB> It looks a complete mess. But it will look nicer, honest!
[20:27] <Upu> oh wait
[20:27] <Upu> this is the one you were walking round the field with it on a plank ?
[20:28] <JezGB> Ah. You've seen them then...
[20:28] <JezGB> Yes. That's us.
[20:28] <Upu> I saw one of them yes :)
[20:28] <Upu> which GPS is it you have ?
[20:28] <JezGB> We're kind of new to this,,,
[20:28] <JezGB> The AdaFruit module
[20:28] <Upu> recent purchase ?
[20:28] <JezGB> A month or two since.
[20:28] <Upu> ok
[20:28] <JezGB> Why do you ask?
[20:28] <Upu> some of them don't support alitude over 27km
[20:29] <Upu> newer ones should do
[20:29] <JezGB> Yes, I'd read that - that's why we went AdaFruit.
[20:29] <JezGB> For a minute I thought you were going to say the recent ones didn't work @ altitude!
[20:29] <Upu> well they probably do
[20:30] <Upu> but adafruit are a little wishy washy about saying they do
[20:30] <JezGB> I guess we;ll find out...
[20:30] <Upu> don't think they've need tested
[20:30] <JezGB> Yes, noticed that.
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[20:30] <Upu> send that : mySerial.println($PMTK604*6D);
[20:30] <Upu> if you get back :
[20:30] <Upu> $PMTK705,AXN_2.10_3339_2012060701,5153,,1.0*03
[20:30] <Upu> note 5153
[20:30] <Upu> don't fly it
[20:30] <Upu> come speak to me about a ublox
[20:31] <Upu> what radio module do you have ?
[20:31] <JezGB> Radiometrix NTX2
[20:31] <JezGB> I'll try the string later... Thanks!
[20:31] <Upu> NTX2 or NTX2B ?
[20:32] <JezGB> NTX2
[20:32] <Upu> ok Farnell ?
[20:32] <JezGB> No
[20:32] <Upu> I need to work on my advertising :)
[20:32] <edmoore> the guy on a bbc2 thing right now i helped launch a hab
[20:32] <edmoore> i was about to switch off as it looked aweful
[20:32] <Upu> NTX2 is more than fine
[20:32] <edmoore> gosh this program looks ropey
[20:33] <JezGB> Cool - good to know!
[20:33] <Upu> been a while since an original NTX2 went up, it will drift a little
[20:33] <Upu> as the temp changes
[20:33] <edmoore> it looks like a hackerspace
[20:33] <Upu> Drop in TCXO replacement http://ava.upuaut.net/store/index.php?route=product/product&path=71_63&product_id=92
[20:33] <JezGB> Yeah - we noticed that when we stuck it in the freezer... ;-)
[20:33] <Upu> that won't drift
[20:34] <JezGB> I think we'll do that for the proper launch - I think it's a bit late for next weekend.
[20:34] <Upu> and is frequency agile so you get it away from the 075 band or not upset some HAM's if you use 650 (top tip : don't care)
[20:34] <Upu> sure
[20:34] <Upu> anyway post on the mailing list
[20:34] <JezGB> Oh dear - we're using 650...
[20:34] <Upu> haha
[20:34] <daveake> excellent
[20:35] <Upu> :)
[20:35] <Upu> seriously don't worry about it I'm just pulling your leg you have every right to use that frequency
[20:36] <JezGB> Erm, at the risk of finding out something I'd rather not know... Why would .650 upset HAMs?
[20:36] <JezGB> ;-)
[20:37] <daveake> because it's a repeater frequency
[20:37] <daveake> and you might stop one ham from hearing about the health issues of another
[20:37] <JezGB> ;-)
[20:37] <Upu> HAMs believe they have priority over that frequency when they don't
[20:37] <daveake> though I think that's what HF is for
[20:37] <edmoore> still not sure it's actually intefered with a repeater yet
[20:38] <Upu> both you as an ISM user and they as licensed HAM's are secondary users
[20:38] <Upu> however as edmoore points out
[20:38] <daveake> There was one where the repeater interfered with someone trying to rx a hab
[20:38] <Upu> and excuse the technical term but its a load of bollocks anyway
[20:38] <JezGB> Ok... Perhaps we'll change the frequency for our "real" launch as well as the module type...
[20:38] <Upu> transmit away sir I shall be listening
[20:38] <JezGB> ;-)
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[20:39] <Upu> there is nothing wrong with the NTX2 you have
[20:39] <Upu> its about time the trackers had some real tracking to do
[20:39] <JezGB> :-)
[20:39] <JezGB> Ok - apologies for the newb question, but is there a guide to testing the payload doc?
[20:39] <Upu> sure
[20:39] <Upu> make it
[20:39] <daveake> had to laugh this morning - someone added "path=WIDE1-1,WIDE2-1" to the config for a PITS APRS board
[20:39] <Upu> transmit and decode using dl-fldigi
[20:40] <Upu> and it should automatically upload
[20:40] <Upu> if you get it right
[20:40] <Upu> SpacenearUS will pop a message up here with a handly link
[20:40] <daveake> good job that the s/w doesn't use a configurable path
[20:40] <Upu> are you transmitting now ?
[20:40] <JezGB> I thought that might be the way, but it seemed too simple! ;-)
[20:41] <JezGB> No, not transmitting
[20:41] <Upu> ok
[20:41] <Upu> well go transmit
[20:41] <JezGB> Ok - I'll give it a go! Thanks for your help - much appreciated!
[20:42] <Upu> whats the call sign ?
[20:42] <JezGB> AUGUSTE1
[20:42] <Upu> ok let us know when you're transmitting
[20:42] <Upu> I can watch the logsd
[20:43] <JezGB> Will do
[20:43] <edmoore> this is hilarious
[20:43] <edmoore> bbc2
[20:43] <Flerb> I was wondering, how do people integrate the arduino directly into their projects? I mean come to think of it the arduino is kinda just a breakout board for the atmega328p
[20:44] <edmoore> Flerb, you've hit the nail on the head
[20:44] <edmoore> it's just a cheap avr microcontroller
[20:44] <edmoore> so same as any other microcontroller
[20:44] <Upu> Flerb Arduino is a development platform and a boot loader for the AVR's
[20:44] <Upu> you don't need Arduino to program an Arduino board
[20:44] <Zeusking19> *cough* avrdude
[20:44] <Upu> yeah that
[20:45] <Flerb> so people might use whatever they useto program it
[20:45] <Flerb> like assembler
[20:45] <Flerb> if they wanted to
[20:45] <Upu> personally I use the Arduino "suite" to program my boards via an ISCP programmer which zaps the boot loader
[20:45] <edmoore> yes
[20:45] <Upu> yup
[20:45] <Flerb> So all the arduino people did was make something easier to access for noobs
[20:45] <edmoore> assembly would be fine
[20:45] <edmoore> yes
[20:45] <edmoore> that's all it is
[20:46] <edmoore> a breakout board and a very stripped-down and well packaged development environment and toolchain
[20:46] <Flerb> mhm
[20:46] <Flerb> I was actually thinking of building a small FM receiver with one of these chips https://www.sparkfun.com/datasheets/BreakoutBoards/Si4702-03-C19-1.pdf
[20:47] <Flerb> It's the antenna bit that gets complicated though
[20:47] <Upu> you mean the filter ?
[20:48] <Flerb> With all due respect, huh?
[20:48] <Upu> "antenna bit"
[20:48] <mfa298> daveake: I've had repeater users interfere with my trying to receive hab's on .650 (either the pompey repeater or one oop norf at alyesbury)
[20:48] <Flerb> Upu: the antenna.
[20:49] <Upu> whats complex about a bit of wire ?
[20:49] <Flerb> Just the whole matching bit.
[20:49] <Upu> what frequency are you transmitting on ?
[20:49] <daveake> Ah was you I was thinking of, I think :)
[20:49] <Flerb> Upu: receiving
[20:49] <Flerb> FM
[20:49] <Flerb> broadcast
[20:50] <Flerb> they made a pretty complicated document on it http://www.silabs.com/Support%20Documents/TechnicalDocs/AN383.pdf
[20:50] <Upu> so 88 -> 107 Mhz ?
[20:50] <Upu> get one of those telescopic antennas
[20:51] <Upu> extend it 66cms -> 81cms
[20:51] <Upu> but commercial stations are so strong you could pick them up on a random piece of wire
[20:51] <Flerb> OK. says to use an AC coupling capacitor, tuning inductor and ESD diode
[20:52] <Flerb> all of which confusles me.
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[20:58] <Zeusking19> Just reading the conversation above fascinates me - this should be something interesting to learn :)
[20:58] <Flerb> Also, I was just looking at the ATmega328 datasheet, and is there much reason not to use a lower clock speed as to save power
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[20:59] <Flerb> says it uses 0.2mA at 1mhz and 1.8v
[21:00] <mfa298> Flerb: depends on what speed your application needs and what voltage other parts need. If you can do 1MHz @1.8v then go for it
[21:01] <mfa298> although that need you to not use arduino libraries, and may restrict certain things.
[21:01] <mfa298> e.g. serial at 9600 at 1MHz may not work (from memory) as you end up near the speed tolerance
[21:02] <edmoore> you can certainly do a basic tracker with a 1mhz clock
[21:02] <Upu> thje AVR isn't the issue really
[21:02] <edmoore> if baud rate is tough then get the nearest correct xtal value
[21:02] <qyx_> it depends on the application, sometimes it may be feasible to run fullspeed for very short periods of time and sleep the rest
[21:02] <Upu> no compared to the GPS and the radio
[21:03] <Upu> The PAVA trackers ran at 4Mhz
[21:03] <Upu> Err 2Mhz
[21:03] <Flerb> I would imagine for this project it'd only need to have the controller fully on when switching channels
[21:03] <Upu> because I was using 16Mhz crystals and using the DIV/8 fuse
[21:03] <Flerb> because the chip will work on its own once programmed
[21:05] <Zeusking19> Just a curious question, HYDEST001 (on the habhub tracker) seems to be bobbing up and down at an altitude of 61-80m, has a path so I'm not exactly sure if it's a test, so my question: when would a HAB ever do that? if so, why?
[21:06] <Upu> it will be being tested and GPS has that sort of jitter in its altitude readings
[21:06] <Upu> so it may be just sat on a table and do that
[21:07] <Zeusking19> Ah, right, so even though a path is on the tracker that is false?
[21:07] <Flerb> I should possibly do some research on knobs
[21:07] <edmoore> i know the pub that it seems to be next to
[21:07] <edmoore> Zeusking19, that's a predicted path
[21:07] <Upu> !track HYDEST001
[21:07] <SpacenearUS> 03Upu: Here you go - 12http://tracker.habhub.org/#!qm=All&q=HYDEST001
[21:07] <Flerb> I mean one could use a potentiometer
[21:07] <Zeusking19> Ah, right, sorry, new to this :P
[21:07] <Upu> oh not
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[21:07] <Upu> no
[21:07] <Zeusking19> Anyway, I should be off. Night all
[21:07] <Upu> thats the prediction if it suddently took off right now
[21:07] <Upu> nps night zeusbot
[21:08] <Flerb> wait no you can only go to a maximum with a potentiometer
[21:08] <edmoore> i don't think zeusbot sleeps upu
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[21:08] <Upu> hah
[21:08] <Upu> that guy needs a better nick
[21:08] <Flerb> Or would one use a rotary encoder?
[21:08] <edmoore> either flerb
[21:08] <edmoore> depends what the knob is doing
[21:09] <Flerb> well. I think the knob would need to be a stepped type one that could continuously rotate to change frequency or channel
[21:10] <Flerb> sort of like the kind you find in a car
[21:10] <edmoore> yep
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[21:11] <Flerb> edmoore: does a rotary encoder continuously rotate?
[21:11] <edmoore> often
[21:11] <edmoore> e.g. optical ones
[21:12] <Flerb> so a knob can just spin round and round whereas a potentiometer normally goes between two fixed points
[21:12] <edmoore> yep
[21:12] <Flerb> well a rotary encoder
[21:13] <Flerb> It'd be nice to get a rather big rotary encoder.
[21:13] <Flerb> Or do the knobs get mounted on them
[21:19] <Flerb> ooh heck
[21:19] <Flerb> I just thought
[21:20] <Flerb> QFN
[21:20] <Flerb> probably hella difficult to solder
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[21:27] <Flerb> QFN parts in eagle, will I have to draw up the QFN footprint, despite the fact that it's already in adafruit's library?
[21:27] <Flerb> (this chip doesn't have eagle libraries
[21:29] <qyx_> no, you can reuse footprints from other libraries
[21:30] <qyx_> just find your qfn part in the main eagle window and then drag&drop it to your library window
[21:31] <qyx_> and if you make the pads a bit longer, you can easily solder the qfn by hand
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[21:32] <qyx_> just make ~1mm via underneath so you can solder the pad too (from the bottom)
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[21:34] <Flerb> Is there a way to automagically put pin names on the soldermask?
[21:35] <JezGB> Sorry chaps - I haven't forgotten you - I'm just having a bit of bother getting my receiver to work. Worked fine yesterday - output is riddled with errors today. Working on it...
[21:36] <zyp> qfn can be quite a piece of shit to work with even when reflowing, I don't think I'd want to try mounting one without even being able to reflow it
[21:36] <craag> JezGB: Are you overloading the receiver?
[21:37] <qyx_> zyp: actually i like qfn more than qfp when hand soldering
[21:37] <JezGB> Don't _think_ so... As I said, worked just fine last night...
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[21:37] <Upu> no problems JezGB
[21:38] <Upu> this is the part you don't have to rush
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[21:39] <JezGB> Thanks Upu! *F* annoying though...
[21:40] <Upu> whats happening ?
[21:41] <JezGB> Random character errors
[21:41] <lz1dev> 
[21:42] <Upu> alt + prtn screen it -> http://imgur.com CTRL+V and send us the resulting link
[21:42] <Flerb> those random character errors...
[21:42] <Flerb> g
[21:42] <Flerb> !
[21:43] <lz1dev> sometimes irc make strange noises
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[21:52] <JezGB> http://imgur.com/7TRAW4W
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[21:54] <craag> the rtty doesn't look very clean there. What power supply are you using for the tracker?
[21:54] <daveake> +1
[21:54] <daveake> Also narrow down that filter width
[21:54] <daveake> Check the "auto" box next to the filter width bar
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[21:54] <JezGB> At the moment it's running off the PC, but a battery doesn't help
[21:55] <daveake> also knock the audio shift down in dl-fldigi by 20Hz or so till the red cursor lines are right in the middle of the yellow signal lines
[21:55] <Geoff-G8DHE> Also turn the Squelch off, even with the slider down.
[21:56] <Geoff-G8DHE> Umm hangon the audio level diamond is BLACK not enougth singal
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[21:57] <craag> That's plenty enough signal really, it's just so strong that there's no background noise.
[21:57] <craag> so the total audio power is low.
[22:00] <JezGB> No difference. I don't get it. It worked perfectly last night - same setup, same everything.
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[22:00] <craag> are you using an sdr?
[22:00] <Flerb> If I were to power the ATmega328p with 3.3v would it's io only be 3.3v?
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[22:00] <craag> Flerb: yes
[22:00] <JezGB> Yes
[22:01] <craag> JezGB: Try closing the sdr application and re-opening it?
[22:01] <craag> Somethings causing some visible distortion to the signal
[22:01] <craag> (it's not hardware/audio problem, not a code problem)
[22:01] <craag> (it's a hardware/audio problem, not a code problem)
[22:04] <JezGB> Hi craag - yes, tried that already! Just tried again - no difference...
[22:05] <craag> :/
[22:06] <craag> The batteries you tried - not depleted?
[22:06] <JezGB> Couldn't have put it better myself... ;-)
[22:06] <Geoff-G8DHE> Never seen the audio level overload diamond Black when seeing a signal before, very odd ?
[22:07] <craag> Geoff-G8DHE: It looks at the total audio power - so gets confused when it's *that* strong
[22:07] <craag> as there's no, or very little background noise
[22:07] <Geoff-G8DHE> OK never spotted hat before myself ..
[22:08] <craag> very rarely seen unless you're testing a payload right next to you :)
[22:08] <Geoff-G8DHE> I test with a 5w signal next to it!
[22:08] <craag> JezGB: Could you try moving the payload to another room, just to see if it is overloading the receiver?
[22:10] <JezGB> I'll give it a go... (But I was using it like this all afternoon yesterday!!)
[22:13] <Upu> are you using virtual audio cable ?
[22:13] <JezGB> Yes Upu
[22:14] <Upu> How many virtual cables did you make when you set it up ?
[22:14] <Upu> I've got this issue where the rtty looks crap so I just switch to another audio cable
[22:14] <Upu> and it cleans up
[22:14] <Upu> and/or reboot
[22:14] <JezGB> Erm, just one I think.
[22:14] <Upu> usually you don't get any decode at all
[22:15] <Upu> but try reboot
[22:15] <Geoff-G8DHE> Can you hear the audio yourself on a speaker ?
[22:15] <JezGB> I guess that's the last resort... ;-)
[22:15] <Geoff-G8DHE> run the MME repeater in VAC so you can put channel 1 to standard output
[22:16] <Geoff-G8DHE> as well as fldigi
[22:16] <JezGB> Yes, I can hear the audio on speaker as well
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[22:17] <Geoff-G8DHE> any odd noises or clicks ?
[22:17] <craag> Upu: sounds like you need to clean the contacts on those virtual audio cables
[22:17] <JezGB> No - sounds just like it did when it worked!
[22:18] <JezGB> Anyway - I'll try again tomorrow - unfortunately I have some things to do tonight and have to be up early tomorrow. Thanks for your help guys! Really appreciated - and sorry to be a nuisance...
[22:18] <craag> Do let us know when you manage to fix it!
[22:18] <craag> Would be useful to know how...
[22:19] <JezGB> Will do!
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[23:31] <Geoff-G8-> ##
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[00:00] --- Tue Feb 17 2015