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[01:59] <SpacenearUS> New vehicle on the map: 03D-7 - 12http://tracker.habhub.org/#!qm=All&q=D-7
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[02:35] <Ian_> Vaizki, wondering about the bps/shift combination.. most RTTY demodulators seem to support only a few fixed bps/shift combos? why is that?
[02:35] <Ian_> Answer: like resistors and things there are preferred values. Back in the day circuits for demods tended to be fixed tuned and interoperation demended a set of standards
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[02:37] <Ian_> these evolved, which is why 50 baud RTTY had shifts of 850Hz and narrow of 425Hz later becoming 170Hz as tx and rx equipment became more frequency stable
[02:39] <Ian_> Other services chose different baud rates and shifts to meet their needs. Largely developed in isolation. US RTTY often used 45.45 baud, known as Allied Interpolaltion speed. Obviously couldn't hack 50 baud, similarly with 60Hz AC mains frequency :)
[02:39] <Ian_> afk bedtime
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[02:46] <HAB> Hi everyone, we are tracking our weather balloon with call sign VK4NRL-11, is anyone following?
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[06:30] <SpacenearUS> New vehicle on the map: 03DC2EH-11 - 12http://tracker.habhub.org/#!qm=All&q=DC2EH-11
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[08:03] <Vaizki> so which shift should I choose for maximum interoperability with rtty decoders? i know dl-fldigi can handle anything from 100-3k Hz, i tried a lot of resistor values and it caught them all
[08:06] <jcoxon> Vaizki, people often go for a 425hz shift
[08:06] <Vaizki> i was thinking (you can correct me) that a small shift is good because you can set a narrow filter. but a wider shift is good because the software can probably track drift, doppler what not easier. i see values around 400-450 in some examples, so is that an optimum rabge?
[08:06] <Vaizki> ok sounds reasonable
[08:06] <jcoxon> partially its traditional but also it suits teh filters etc
[08:06] <jcoxon> as you said
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[08:08] <Vaizki> well thats settled then, traditional sounds good
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[08:22] <SpacenearUS> New position from 03E29AJP-11 after 0321 hours silence - 12http://tracker.habhub.org/#!qm=All&q=E29AJP-11
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[08:47] <tweetBot1> @jamescoxon: New article post http://t.co/k49miyHDsh - Developing a remote UKHASnet node, soon to be installed on the Redsand forts #ukhasnet #ukhas
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[09:16] <SpacenearUS> New vehicle on the map: 03LUTEIJN - 12http://tracker.habhub.org/#!qm=All&q=LUTEIJN
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[09:19] <Maxell> !payload LUTEIJN
[09:19] <SpacenearUS> 03Maxell: Payload 03PWSwag Mark-II 10(0e6a) 03$$LUTEIJN - 03434.1759 MHz USB 03RTTY 50/350Hz ASCII-7 none 1
[09:19] <Maxell> :)
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[09:29] <pc1pcl> hopefulyl that is still in testing mode..
[09:31] <jcoxon> pc1pcl, yeah that looks like a ublox that is still looking for a lock
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[09:33] <pc1pcl> !dial LUTEIJN
[09:33] <SpacenearUS> 03pc1pcl: Latest dials for 03PWSwag Mark-II 10(0e6a): none
[09:35] <SpacenearUS> New vehicle on the map: 03E29AJP-1 - 12http://tracker.habhub.org/#!qm=All&q=E29AJP-1
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[10:12] <PE2BZ> !payload luteijn
[10:12] <SpacenearUS> 03PE2BZ: Payload 03PWSwag Mark-II 10(0e6a) 03$$LUTEIJN - 03434.1759 MHz USB 03RTTY 50/350Hz ASCII-7 none 1
[10:13] <pc1pcl> looks like it has a more sane location now,
[10:14] Tjalling_PE1RQM (~chatzilla@d5c523f5.ftth.concepts.nl) joined #highaltitude.
[10:14] <Maxell> mogguh Tjalling_PE1RQM
[10:15] <Maxell> Request map clearing?
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[10:17] <DutchMillbt> Good morning ...weak rtty @434.154 LUTEIJN?
[10:18] <Maxell> DutchMillbt: all I see is a single carrier :)
[10:19] <Maxell> ISM QRM now :(
[10:19] <pc1pcl> I think I heard some week signals there earlier this morning already before they were supposedly up and at it.
[10:20] <Maxell> S5 QRM on 434.154 now
[10:21] <Tjalling_PE1RQM> Mogguh Maxell
[10:21] <Tjalling_PE1RQM> And dutchmill
[10:21] <Tjalling_PE1RQM> And PCL, whow a lot of dutchies here
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[10:21] <DutchMillbt> Hi Maxell..
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[10:23] <Tjalling_PE1RQM> They said it should transmit at 434.1759
[10:23] <DutchMillbt> mmm... is LUTEIJN trying to draw the Mockingjay on the map?
[10:24] <Maxell> jarod: wakker worden, there will be a HAB soon, we think :)
[10:24] <Tjalling_PE1RQM> For me, that's one of the few frequencies with QRM :( So I hope it will drift a bit
[10:24] <PE2BZ> We all hope it will drift a bit ;-)
[10:24] <Maxell> yeah Tjalling_PE1RQM, same here. A few qrm carriers on .175
[10:25] <Maxell> why did they went for .175 then? :(
[10:25] <Tjalling_PE1RQM> Don't know :(
[10:26] <Tjalling_PE1RQM> Let's see what the frequency will be
[10:27] <DutchMillbt> .175 clean here
[10:27] <Maxell> oh nice
[10:27] <DutchMillbt> just a few blips now and then
[10:28] <PE2BZ> Someone in NFM calling Test Test ?
[10:28] <Maxell> test test :)
[10:28] <Maxell> PE2BZ: was usb .176
[10:28] <DutchMillbt> ... ha ha and a 9++ FM carrier hi
[10:29] <Maxell> yeah
[10:29] <Maxell> 2 watts
[10:29] <Tjalling_PE1RQM> Didn't hear him :)
[10:29] <PE2BZ> Maxell Listening at 3 receivers at once. Didn't know which speaker it was from ;-)
[10:29] <Maxell> to check if revspace dongle's offset was correct
[10:29] <Maxell> and already warmed up :)
[10:29] <pc1pcl> might clear out ISM users that dynamically change channels..
[10:30] <PE2BZ> rtty @ 434.199
[10:30] <Maxell> Like that?
[10:30] <Maxell> YES!!!
[10:30] <DutchMillbt> @434.184 also
[10:31] <Maxell> 7n1
[10:31] <pc1pcl> 434$$LUTEIJN,275,10:31:06,5227.66595,00437.76652,0*DA3F
[10:31] <Tjalling_PE1RQM> Thats strong
[10:31] <PE2BZ> I receive Luiteijn @ websdr@work on 434.199
[10:31] <Maxell> wow
[10:31] <Maxell> harmonics
[10:31] <Maxell> damn
[10:32] <DutchMillbt> well 434.200 is the one
[10:32] <Maxell> yeah
[10:32] <Maxell> harmonics on both seides
[10:33] <PE2G> No gps altitude
[10:33] <Maxell> R.I.P. PWSwag mk II
[10:33] <Tjalling_PE1RQM> This is sad...!
[10:34] <Maxell> Tjalling_PE1RQM: Loool
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[10:35] <_Paradigm> Hi everyone
[10:35] <_Paradigm> We had some technical difficulties just yet
[10:35] <pc1pcl> Hi _Paradigm
[10:35] <Tjalling_PE1RQM> I hope it will get a fix. The last time, these students have lost their payload in the Northsea
[10:35] <_Paradigm> Yea that was us lol
[10:35] <Tjalling_PE1RQM> Hi para
[10:35] <Tjalling_PE1RQM> Oooh, I hope this one will be allright then
[10:35] <Maxell> Also, how did they get these "sideband"/harmonics?? http://i.sigio.nl/300f36f31705ad5baa0fdf44c2e9400d.png
[10:35] <_Paradigm> It seems that the GPS has lost fix
[10:36] <_Paradigm> Is there another way to estimate the balloon's position?
[10:37] <pc1pcl> directional antennas, triangulate it out..
[10:37] <Geoff-G8DHE-M> !dial LUTEIJN
[10:37] <SpacenearUS> 03Geoff-G8DHE-M: Latest dials for 03PWSwag Mark-II 10(0e6a): 03434.175 MHz, 434.20062 MHz
[10:37] <Maxell> jarod: yo, it's up in the air @ 434.200 MHz USB. You will be able to shoot it down from Zaandam :)
[10:37] <Tjalling_PE1RQM> I think that will be hard. With a directional antenna, you cannot be exact enough
[10:38] <Maxell> Tjalling_PE1RQM: yeah you can when it's on the ground
[10:38] <Maxell> But it requires the last few packets so you know in about 300 meters where it is. :P
[10:38] <Tjalling_PE1RQM> You have to be there in the neighborhood already then.
[10:38] <Maxell> Not just, "somethere east in the Netherlands"
[10:38] <mclane_> no gps lock?
[10:38] <Maxell> mclane_: ac
[10:38] <Maxell> k
[10:39] <_Paradigm> Last prediction said it would land in Belgium
[10:39] <Maxell> u srs
[10:39] <Maxell> lol
[10:40] <mclane_> gps frozen --> again a 808 keycam?
[10:40] <Maxell> pc1pcl: DutchMillbt: want to go sunday recovery?? :)
[10:40] <Maxell> Get ready to pack :P
[10:45] <DutchMillbt> Hi Maxell nope... no gps and CUSF predictor says Malmedy ;-)
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[10:47] <Tjalling_PE1RQM> Wait, the GPS is doing strange thing right now
[10:47] <_Paradigm> Looks like it wants to go visit India
[10:47] <Tjalling_PE1RQM> Maybe it will get a fix
[10:47] <pc1pcl> which may or may not mean good news ;)
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[10:47] <Tjalling_PE1RQM> It's not dead at least
[10:48] <Tjalling_PE1RQM> It travels much faster around the globe than Leo's balloons :)
[10:48] Action: Geoff-G8DHE-M Switches off aerial tracker!
[10:49] <_Paradigm> The antenna might have come loose, we had a rough launch because of the wind
[10:50] <_Paradigm> gps antenna
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[10:53] <DutchMillbt> PE1RQM can you do a bearing ( azimuth)?
[10:54] <Maxell> DutchMillbt: "towards belgium" :P
[10:54] <Tjalling_PE1RQM> No, sorry, just omni here
[10:54] <Tjalling_PE1RQM> I have a yagi in my shed, but towards Belgium there will be obstacles
[10:55] <DutchMillbt> someone else
[10:55] <DutchMillbt> a bearing?
[10:55] <Maxell> G6GZH also decoding!
[10:56] <Maxell> DutchMillbt: nope, omni on the roof
[10:56] <pc1pcl> Got my yagi down becasue of the highwinds and it wasn't rotatable anyway, might try and get it in some sort of working condition.
[10:56] <PE2G> Bearing ~250 deg from JO32HI
[10:57] <_Paradigm> We are on our way to the hague right now
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[11:00] <DutchMillbt> Thankz PE2G ,, JO21CX 100 deg
[11:00] <ChrisMostert> It seems our GPS has lost lock. Hoping for it to send some sensible coördinates soon...
[11:02] <pc1pcl> hmm reception on a clotheshanger moxon work in progress project that is just lying on some bvxes in my garage, so probably pretty near Ypenburg.
[11:06] <_Paradigm> Well this adds some extra challenge to it..
[11:08] <DutchMillbt> The position (rough calculation) near Dordrecht
[11:09] <DutchMillbt> ...we need the doppler guy
[11:09] <Geoff-G8DHE-M> In range here now South Coast UK
[11:09] <_Paradigm> Who's the doppler guy? :p
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[11:10] PE2BZ (3e2d69ba@gateway/web/freenode/ip. joined #highaltitude.
[11:10] <DutchMillbt> PA3BNX
[11:11] <SpacenearUS> New vehicle on the map: 03OHUP - 12http://tracker.habhub.org/#!qm=All&q=OHUP
[11:12] <det_> yet not in range here 70 km east of Hanover
[11:12] <PE2G> jijdaar has a bearing of ~230 deg from De Bilt
[11:13] <det_> I must leave nw.. RX stays on.. Good Luck de DJ3AK
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[11:14] <PE2G> Alt may be ~10 km, given a 5m/s ascent
[11:15] <PE2BZ> PE2BZ gokt op 180 graden vanaf Naaldwijk. Zou hij al zuid van Naaldwijk kunnen zitten ?
[11:16] <DutchMillbt> PE2BZ heb je een rotor?
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[11:16] <PE2BZ> Ja, ik heb een rotor. Alleen het "dooie punt" op 180 graden. Dus moeilijk bepalen of het 170 of 190 graden is.
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[11:17] <det_> RTTY nw audible here at -0.4 degreese elevation (guessed).. alt must beu between 10km and 15km
[11:19] <SpacenearUS> New vehicle on the map: 03PD1ODE-9_chase - 12http://tracker.habhub.org/#!qm=All&q=PD1ODE-9_chase
[11:21] <DutchMillbt> Based on the PE2BZ heading (180) and Jijdaar (230) Bruinisse area
[11:22] <det_> green decode nw in JO52GJ. sigs still increasing
[11:22] <DutchMillbt> Geoff-G8DHE-M can you give u a direction?
[11:23] <Geoff-G8DHE-M> 75 from IO90TT
[11:23] <DutchMillbt> oke thankz
[11:24] <det_> 245 deg from JO52GJ
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[11:24] <SpacenearUS> New vehicle on the map: 03PD1ODE/P_chase - 12http://tracker.habhub.org/#!qm=All&q=PD1ODE%2FP_chase
[11:24] <PE2BZ> PE2BZ nu 190 graden vanuit JO21CX. And I also notice now the upper and lower sideband mirrors in the RTTY signal.
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[11:31] <Maxell> PE2BZ: like these? http://i.sigio.nl/300f36f31705ad5baa0fdf44c2e9400d.png
[11:31] <Tjalling_PE1RQM> I see them too
[11:32] <PE2BZ> Maxell : Indeed, the same spacing.
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[11:33] <PE2BZ> I notice on the waterfall on fldigi that the drift of the harmonics is about twice the drift of the main carrier.
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[11:37] <PE2BZ> Away for lunch now. will check signal and direction after lunch.
[11:37] jijdaar (9117fea1@gateway/web/freenode/ip. joined #highaltitude.
[11:38] <DutchMillbt> Calculated position = Terneuzen area
[11:39] <Geoff-G8DHE-M> Its now 80° from IO90TT
[11:40] <DutchMillbt> thx Geoff
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[11:41] <_Paradigm> Thank you very much for all your effort guys!
[11:42] <DutchMillbt> PE2G can you give me a heading..PE2BZ qrt for lunch
[11:43] <DutchMillbt> Position NL/BE border near Zelzate
[11:44] <PE2G> DutchMillbt: ~230 from JO32HI
[11:44] <DutchMillbt> roger that
[11:46] <Maxell> nice DutchMillbt
[11:46] <Maxell> good work
[11:47] <Maxell> need to automate that w/ some sort of "backwards habrotate"
[11:47] <PE1ANS_> +/- 175 from JO11wo = Colijnsplaat
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[11:48] <Geoff-G8DHE-M> its now 85° from IO90TT
[11:48] <DutchMillbt> Position -> NE Gent in BE
[11:49] <_Paradigm> Signals still going strong?
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[11:50] <pc1pcl> transmitter side of the payload seems fine.
[11:50] <Geoff-G8DHE-M> Solid here 25db s/n
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[12:01] <Geoff-G8DHE-M> Do we know size of balloon and expected burst height ?
[12:01] <DutchMillbt> Geoff can you give me a update for your heading?
[12:01] <Geoff-G8DHE-M> One second
[12:02] <_Paradigm> Expected burst altitude is 30km, it's an 800g Hwoyee
[12:03] <Geoff-G8DHE-M> 87° IO90TT
[12:03] <DutchMillbt> qsl
[12:03] <PE1ANS_> 145* JO11wo
[12:04] <DutchMillbt> thankz PE1ANS
[12:05] <Geoff-G8DHE-M> So could be coming up on burst time roughly 1:40 to climb to that height
[12:06] benadski (~benadski@53509EBD.cm-6-1c.dynamic.ziggo.nl) joined #highaltitude.
[12:06] <storm_home> is their any information on the position, the habhub data is all over the place?
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[12:06] <Maxell> storm_home: Position -> NE Gent in BE
[12:06] <Maxell> Based on rotating antennas.
[12:07] <Maxell> No GPS lock makes tracking it down much harder :)
[12:07] <storm_home> indeed ;)
[12:08] <DutchMillbt> Based on the PE1ANS and G8DHE position is Brussel area ?
[12:12] <storm_home> any info on the current frequency? trying to get a lock, based near aachen (aix la chapelle)
[12:13] <PE2G> storm_home: 434.200 MHz
[12:13] <PD5TON> RX 434.199,42
[12:13] <storm_home> thx
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[12:19] <Maxell> joi
[12:19] <Maxell> duurt lang
[12:19] <Maxell> Solid 23 dB s/n in the Hague... $$LUTEIJN,793,12:19:11,6729.23766,-00000000000006729.23766,24*7B3A
[12:20] <DutchMillbt> Hi Geoff-G8DHE can you give me a update for the heading and signal
[12:22] <Geoff-G8DHE-M> 89° from IO90TT
[12:22] <DutchMillbt> thkz
[12:23] <Geoff-G8DHE-M> s/n 24db and about -90dBm
[12:23] <PE1ANS_> 21 Db s/n 150* JO11wo
[12:23] <DutchMillbt> thnkz PE1ANS
[12:25] <DutchMillbt> calculated position ->Wavre area
[12:25] <PD3ADN_Arno> Dan zou die dus ergens ter hoogte van Brussel zitten
[12:26] <PE2BZ> PE2BS 170 degrees from JO21CX
[12:26] <DutchMillbt> Yes
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[12:30] <DutchMillbt> It's heading to Charleroi as CUSF predicted
[12:32] <DutchMillbt> I'm out for lunch back in 30 min
[12:32] <PE2G> DutchMillbt: Do you still have link to that prediction?
[12:32] <Maxell> At least not towards the North Sea :D
[12:32] <chrismosterd> It's something :p
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[12:33] <DutchMillbt> Nope.. PE2G didn't save that
[12:33] <PE2G> OK, smakelijk
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[12:34] <PE2G> Burst?
[12:34] <DutchMillbt> Je kan www.acscdg.com gebruiken voor het bepalen van de positie..
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[12:37] Nick change: Lenovo_ -> SpeedEvi1
[12:38] <SpacenearUS> New position from 03K6RPT-12 after 0314 hours silence - 12http://tracker.habhub.org/#!qm=All&q=K6RPT-12
[12:40] <Geoff-G8DHE-M> 90° from IO90TT -88dBm and 25dBm S/N
[12:44] <Maxell> PD3ADN_Arno: still solid 23 dB s/n ratio hereh
[12:44] <Maxell> floating? :)
[12:45] <Maxell> PE2G: burst? Still strong signal here
[12:45] <PE2G> No burst indeed
[12:47] <Maxell> :P
[12:47] <Maxell> PE2G: You are 4 packets ahead of me :P
[12:47] <Maxell> Stop doing that everytime :P
[12:47] <PE2G> :)
[12:48] <pc1pcl> lock?
[12:48] <chrismosterd> gps fix? location changed
[12:48] <Maxell> wow yes
[12:48] <pc1pcl> seems like a valid location
[12:48] <Maxell> alaitude also
[12:48] <Maxell> it's coming down
[12:48] <Maxell> shit shit
[12:48] <Maxell> do we want to chase?
[12:48] <Maxell> 11767 meters
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[12:49] <Geoff-G8DHE-M> yup looking a lot weaker here and fluttery
[12:49] <_Paradigm> shiiit nice
[12:49] <Maxell> Two hours drive
[12:49] <_Paradigm> Let's do this!
[12:49] <Maxell> GOGOGOGOG
[12:50] <chrismosterd> First one to get there wins a prize :)
[12:50] <PD3ADN_Arno> I lost the signal... only 4 dB or less in Loosduinen
[12:50] <Geoff-G8DHE-M> looks like it wasn't it flight mode for the GPS prrhaps ?
[12:50] <pc1pcl> still signal in ypenburg.
[12:50] <chrismosterd> hope the signal keeps up
[12:51] <pc1pcl> chrismosterd: _Paradigm do you guys have signal yourselves?
[12:51] <storm_home> telemetry graph and payload selection on the tracker are broken for me, anyone else has this problem, all just white...
[12:51] <_Paradigm> pc1pcl: No we are in Dordrecht at the moment
[12:52] <_Paradigm> We do not have the equipment for such long range tracking
[12:52] <chrismosterd> Does it not show up on the waterfall?
[12:55] <_Paradigm> No not at all
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[12:55] <Tjalling_PE1RQM> I don't hope that it lands in the middle of the city Charleroi
[12:56] <Maxell> _Paradigm: you are not going for the recovery?
[12:56] <_Paradigm> We are, on the way now
[12:56] <Maxell> NICE!
[12:56] <Maxell> Have fun!
[12:56] <_Paradigm> Thanks!
[12:56] <Ian_> Good hunting
[12:56] <Tjalling_PE1RQM> Good hunting guys
[12:56] <Maxell> transmitter failing?
[12:57] <Tjalling_PE1RQM> still receiving
[12:57] <Maxell> oh might be strong signal making RX's agc go funky
[12:58] <Maxell> heh
[12:58] <Maxell> My HAB tracker modem on android did somthing weird:
[12:58] <Maxell> "$$LUTEIJN,959,12:55:47,5040.52749,00434.96478,7394*F5EC","F5APQ,PE2BZ@work,FBTL,PD5TON,PE2BZ,PD1ODE,PE1ANS,PE2G,PC1PCL"
[12:58] <Maxell> "$$LUTEIJN,959,12:55:47,5040.52749,00434.96478,7394*F5eC",PD1ODE/P
[12:59] <pc1pcl> lower case e :)
[12:59] <Maxell> mattbrejza: you made the app right? Habitat does not care about case right?
[13:03] <PD3ADN_Arno> Signal now here completely lost
[13:04] <RocketBoy> yeah what has happened is that somone recived a string with bit 5 corrupted - so it appeared as e rather than E - but still passed the habitat CRC check - which is case insensotive
[13:04] <db_g6gzh> it's only a single bit error from E to e
[13:04] <RocketBoy> happens quite a lot
[13:05] <PE2G> I'm losing it at -0.3 deg elevation, 250 km
[13:06] <Maxell> RocketBoy: hmm yeah ok seems fine with me
[13:06] <Maxell> PE2G: still 0,3 degrees elevation left
[13:06] <Maxell> also getting lots of reds
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[13:07] <pc1pcl> dipping behind horizon here I think
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[13:08] <Maxell> pc1pcl: does the FT-817 has the same 6 din pin for audio out?
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[13:08] <pc1pcl> ja, zelfde cat enn ACC pluggen achterop
[13:08] <Maxell> Time to make ft-817 <--> smart phone cable for the android app
[13:08] <pc1pcl> also has a headset audio out
[13:09] <pc1pcl> so that's probably easier to make
[13:09] <Ian_> Any Ham contacts in S Charleroi that can assist in the short term?
[13:09] <Maxell> pc1pcl: ah, yeah. De Savornin Lohmanpad portable :)
[13:10] <Maxell> With the FT897 not that easy
[13:10] <pc1pcl> Going to see if I can hear anything outside, but doubt it.. ON5LT just came on the map, at least they are in the right country.
[13:10] <Maxell> nah outside not going to work man
[13:10] <Maxell> it's 0.2 here
[13:10] <Maxell> at 13 meters ASL
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[13:11] <Maxell> I also need to drill some piece of metal for the long mobile antenna
[13:11] <Maxell> and lijmklem that to the bench over there
[13:12] <Ian_> ON5LT has the ball
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[13:12] <Maxell> woot
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[13:17] <Reb-SM0ULC> looks like it will land in an urban area
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[13:22] <Ian_> Looks like there is a handy Snack Sherrif nearby. Should be down, hopefully S of Chaussee de Chatelet, would that flat roof be a problem? Safe from casual passers by
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[13:24] <Ian_> Thanks for the excitement Guys, will be back later to follow the recovery. Snack Sherrif contact details - maybe a customer has said they saw a balloon - ring the man - check the menu :)
[13:24] <Ian_> https://www.google.co.uk/?gws_rd=ssl#q=snack+sherif+charleroi+opening+hours
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[13:30] <Ian_> Lateral thinking.
[13:31] <_Paradigm> we will probably arrive in Charleroi at 4 p.m.
[13:32] <Ian_> Any point in ringing the Snack Sherrif for any word of a possible sighting or would that increase the risk?
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[13:35] <Ian_> Sunset in Charleroi today 17.47
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[14:00] <alxwntr> Hiya, does anyone have any recommendations for enclosures for the payload?
[14:00] <alxwntr> I was thinking of one of those expanded polystyrene boxes that fishmongers use for transportng frozen fish (stinky)
[14:00] <alxwntr> but I thought I'd check if anyone had found anything ideal
[14:01] <SpeedEvi1> May be a leeeetle too large.
[14:01] <alxwntr> yeah, I thought perhaps
[14:01] <alxwntr> maybe they have small ones
[14:01] <SpeedEvi1> http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Polystyrene-Foam-Mug-Cup-Packaging-Mailer-Mailing-Boxes-60-100-120-200-260-300-/131137458342?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_3&var=&hash=item1e8866d0a6
[14:02] <alxwntr> Ah, winner!
[14:02] <alxwntr> cheers
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[14:17] Nick change: SpeedEvi1 -> SpeedEvil
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[14:27] <Ian_> alxwntr at that price you would need your bumps read. Think of a 50mm or 75mm sheet of polystyrene, cut and glue or laminate yourself a box. It does't need to cost the earth.
[14:28] <Ian_> Look to recycle packaging material where possible. Not that it's ecological, it's better than that, .. . it's free :)
[14:28] <RocketBoy> http://randomaerospace.com/Random_Aerospace/Stuff.html
[14:28] <SpeedEvil> Ian_, yes - but that's 60 of them
[14:28] <RocketBoy> shameless pug
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[14:29] <SpeedEvil> That seems reasonable.
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[14:31] <Ian_> Gotta feed the vested interest, for sure RocketBoy. We have to appreciate our suppliers.
[14:32] <Ian_> 60? That would be a potential Armada ;)
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[14:37] <alxwntr> Yeah - I wouldn't buy 60. I'm actually thinking I'll check at the local computer shop to see if they have packaging from components that they're going to chuck out
[14:37] <alxwntr> Seems like a good way to reuse stuff
[14:37] <pc1pcl> maybe a polyst. ball form a craft shop?
[14:37] <alxwntr> a ball?
[14:38] <alxwntr> you mean hollow out the middle?
[14:38] <pc1pcl> I think there are hollow ones about the size of a child's head
[14:38] <alxwntr> oh cool
[14:38] <alxwntr> there's a HobbyCraft around here that I'll check out
[14:39] <RocketBoy> glued polystyrene sheet is a good way of making a box - use glue gun (low heat setting) epoxy, Por Glue or even PVA if your prepared to wait
[14:39] <pc1pcl> used some to make 'bombs' with party gifts inside for my son's birthday a few years ago.
[14:39] <alxwntr> heh
[14:39] <alxwntr> cute
[14:40] <pc1pcl> http://www.craftmill.co.uk/polystyrene-styrofoam-plastic-balls/large-hollow-polystyrene-balls/polystyrene-balls-styrofoam-balls-in-2-hollow-halves
[14:40] <pc1pcl> something like that.
[14:40] <alxwntr> just seen that link Rocketboy - thanks
[14:41] <alxwntr> oh that's nice pc1pc1
[14:41] <alxwntr> might paint it black and stick a coomedy cartoon fuse in the top
[14:42] <pc1pcl> that particular shop just had a picture, not sure if they are particulary cheap or expensive there, but check out craft shop to see what they have.
[14:42] <alxwntr> might give someone a shock when it lands on their greenhouse
[14:42] <alxwntr> sure - will do
[14:42] <RocketBoy> the stuff made from small polystyrene balls has a tendancy to bubble up - XPS (Extruded Ploystyrene foam) is best for making bpxes
[14:42] <RocketBoy> boxes
[14:42] <pc1pcl> painitng them black was the hardest part, as I didn't have any paint handy that wouldn't disollve the foam..
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[14:42] <alxwntr> Acrylic is the way to go
[14:43] <alxwntr> I remember that from my model-making days
[14:43] <alxwntr> everything else seems to eat it
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[14:43] <alxwntr> do people use polystyrene because of insulation?
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[14:43] <RocketBoy> yep - and impact protection
[14:44] <alxwntr> as in, wouldn't a plastic box be just as good
[14:44] <alxwntr> oh, of course
[14:44] <alxwntr> I guess it's pretty light too
[14:44] <RocketBoy> yep
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[14:45] <_Paradigm> We will reach Charleroi in about 30 min now :D
[14:46] <RocketBoy> difficult to think of nything cheaper and better
[14:47] <Vaizki> it also floats very very well
[14:48] <RocketBoy> yeah - I got a payload back after 2 weeks of floating in the north sea
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[14:49] <Maxell> _Paradigm: woot :D
[14:49] <alxwntr> no way!
[14:50] <alxwntr> did it just float into shore?
[14:50] <alxwntr> someone pick it up and call you?
[14:50] <RocketBoy> yep - by luck just 10Km up the cst from where I live
[14:50] <alxwntr> ha
[14:50] <alxwntr> lucky
[14:50] <RocketBoy> they rang and I went and picked it up
[14:51] <RocketBoy> I use laminated if found signes - keeps the water out
[14:51] <Vaizki> I am considering 3d printing a sign :)
[14:52] <Vaizki> Thin ABS
[14:52] <Vaizki> Cut out lettera
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[14:53] <RocketBoy> sweet
[14:53] <Maxell> Vaizki: or cut the polystyrene :)
[14:54] <alxwntr> do you use a RepRap or something?
[14:54] <Vaizki> Well we have a 3D printer and glow in the dark plastic
[14:54] <alxwntr> too cool
[14:54] <Vaizki> Cube from 3DS
[14:55] <Vaizki> They were dumping them at 400eur
[14:55] <alxwntr> the printers?!
[14:55] <Vaizki> Or a retailer was
[14:55] <Vaizki> Yes
[14:55] <alxwntr> pff
[14:55] <alxwntr> nice find
[14:56] <alxwntr> Their website lists them for £839.
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[15:00] Action: storm_home is considering 3D printing a mold for his payload box, and then using bottled isolation foam
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[15:03] <Vaizki> it was an older generation
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[15:08] <RocketBoy> ere it is: https://www.flickr.com/photos/16828840@N07/sets/72157650698879021/ (not so sure about the laminated signs now)
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[15:10] <RocketBoy> a testament to polystyrene, gel gun glue and duct tape
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[15:47] <SpacenearUS> New vehicle on the map: 03KD4BFP-8 - 12http://tracker.habhub.org/#!qm=All&q=KD4BFP-8
[15:50] <Ian_> Paradigm, any joy on the LUTEIJN (English pronunciation approximates to LUTIEN ?) chase front. Where are you now?
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[15:52] <Geoff-G8DHE> There following the course it took so may be a while getting to the landing spot ... ;-)
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[15:55] <Ian_> We need very cheap mobile data sos that we can get in on the action with the chase team . . .
[15:55] <Maxell> Ian_: _Paradigm not here :(
[15:55] <Maxell> Ian_: they have roaming data
[15:56] <Ian_> Oh, forgot to look in the right index of users present. Hope it's going well though.
[15:56] <Maxell> "15:45:49 < _Paradigm> We will reach Charleroi in about 30 min now :D" I think
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[15:58] <Ian_> I guess that Charleroi is a substantial bit of realestate to navigate. Looks easy on a satellite or map view, but is somewhat more complex at ground level.
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[15:59] <pc1pcl> Ian_: Dutch and English vowels don't really match too well, luteijn has an 'u' more or less as in 'mute' and 'eij' more or less as the 'i' in 'time'.
[16:01] <Ian_> Ah, so more like LUTINE.
[16:03] <pc1pcl> yeah, although I guess depends on accent of the speaker too.
[16:04] <SpacenearUS> New vehicle on the map: 03default_chase - 12http://tracker.habhub.org/#!qm=All&q=default_chase
[16:05] <Ian_> Yes. pclpcl are you located in the Nederlands?
[16:05] <SpacenearUS> New vehicle on the map: 03bld_chase - 12http://tracker.habhub.org/#!qm=All&q=bld_chase
[16:06] <pc1pcl> Yes I am, The Hague.
[16:06] <Geoff-G8DHE> So are we going to ring the Lutine Bell when a balloon goes down ?
[16:06] <Ian_> The track of LUTEIJN held true on the descent although it was shortening fairly quickly. My uneducated guess would be just behind the Snack Sherif
[16:07] <Ian_> You can ring it when it's found for sure. I don't suppose Lloyds is too interested in HAB payloads. They must take enough of a beating on a bad satellite launch day
[16:08] <Geoff-G8DHE> :)
[16:09] <Ian_> I think the best outcome today would be that the Guys drop into Snack Sherif and enquire if anyone has seen a parachute and the girl asks if they want it with frits and mayonaise or tartare sauce
[16:09] <pc1pcl> actually the name of the bell may well be related closely to 'luteijn', as it is from a French ship named after a kind of fairy-tale creature
[16:10] <Ian_> fairy-tale creature, that probably describes Lloyds of London pretty closely.
[16:11] <pc1pcl> Not 100% sure what the orignal name was that got corrupted into 'luteijn' when it moved north from france, but could have been 'lutin/lutine'.
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[16:11] <Lunar_Lander> evening
[16:12] <pc1pcl> http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/7/7f/Lutin_by_godo.jpg/220px-Lutin_by_godo.jpg
[16:16] <Ian_> looks a bit like my dad lol
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[16:19] <Ian_> I wonder if the gold and silver bullion from HMS Lutine was salvaged. Lloyds paid out £1,000,000 when it sank off the Dutch coast in 1799
[16:20] <Ian_> It just goes to show that HAB expands the mind in unexpected ways.
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[16:25] <pc1pcl> from what I read just now, only part of it was recovered.
[16:26] <pc1pcl> english wikipedia mentions 80% remains to be salvaged...
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[16:30] <Ian_> That was a £ million in 1799, I wonder what the worth is at today's gold and silver prices. Surprised that it hasn't been a major project in recent decades. I guess that lots of permits would be required to even think about it.
[16:31] <Ian_> bbl, got to lift plywood onto a roof . . . lots of huffing and puffing from this end :)
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[17:10] <lz1dev> http://www.raspberrypi.org/forums/viewtopic.php?f=28&t=99042
[17:10] <lz1dev> lol
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[17:13] <Lunar_Lander> xD
[17:13] <fsphil> we already knew it can't run flash
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[17:14] <lz1dev> http://www.nrc.gov/reading-rm/doc-collections/gen-comm/info-notices/1997/in97082.html
[17:14] <lz1dev> lol
[17:14] <fsphil> ooch
[17:15] <lz1dev> http://www.epri.com/abstracts/Pages/ProductAbstract.aspx?ProductId=000000000001018702
[17:21] <SpacenearUS> New position from 03PROJECT1 after 033 days silence - 12http://tracker.habhub.org/#!qm=All&q=PROJECT1
[17:21] <SpacenearUS> New vehicle on the map: 03M0RPI_chase - 12http://tracker.habhub.org/#!qm=All&q=M0RPI_chase
[17:25] <daveake> chase car still works then
[17:25] <daveake> this'll be its first outing of '15
[17:25] <fsphil> do all your windows updates now
[17:26] <daveake> haha good point :)
[17:27] <fsphil> how's the prediction?
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[17:33] <daveake> Not bad http://predict.habhub.org/hourly/oldgore/
[17:34] <daveake> Most predictions have been better and it may well change back at the next update
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[17:36] <daveake> Ground wind prediction for 11am is zero
[17:36] <daveake> I like zero
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[18:49] <infaddic_> evening guys. i have another question on PWM if anybody can help.
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[18:50] <Vaizki> who taught you to ask if you can ask? :)=
[18:51] <infaddic_> Ha! I've seen several examples of PWM examples using analogwrite and values such as 100 for low and 110 for high. In this example, the 10 difference leads to a shift value e.g. 425hz...
[18:51] <infaddic_> but then I've seen other examples using digitalwrite with value 1 high and 0 low...
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[18:51] <infaddic_> is this digital example not controlling the shift and simply doing the largest shift?
[18:52] <Vaizki> digitalwrite just toggles between GND and VCC
[18:52] <Vaizki> do you know how PWM works? :)
[18:52] <infaddic_> yep so 0 and 3V on the NTXB for example
[18:52] <craag> the digitalwrite examples require a voltage divider to lower the shift value
[18:52] <craag> PWM doesn't need the voltage divider
[18:53] <pc1pcl> if no extra circuitry behind it to modify that, it would do a large shift though.
[18:53] <Vaizki> pwm = pulse width modulation, meaning the arduino actually sends out VCC and GND in alternating pulses
[18:53] <infaddic_> Yes Vaizki i've read 10+ articles on PWM and made detailed notes. my question was specifically on the digital thingy.
[18:53] <Vaizki> ok
[18:53] <infaddic_> thx craag, the divider is probably what I have missed (the article didnt mention it)
[18:53] <Vaizki> anyway, if you use digitalwrite, you're going to get a fixed shift as you said
[18:54] <infaddic_> ok thx that makes a lot more sense now
[18:55] <Vaizki> but you need to bias your voltage between VCC and GND preferable (with 2 resistors) to create a 0.5 x VCC base voltage, then use a resistor on the digital output of the arduino to bump that up to 0.5 x VCC + shift voltage
[18:55] <Vaizki> there was an old revision of the ntx2b arduino page on the wiki that had some values
[18:55] <Vaizki> gimme 10 sec
[18:55] <infaddic_> ok thx, on upu's code sample i cant see any resistors in his board
[18:56] <Vaizki> http://ukhas.org.uk/guides:linkingarduinotontx2?rev=1399496254
[18:56] <Vaizki> yes, but look at this older version before he went PWM :)
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[18:56] <infaddic_> ah that version has, but current version doesnt mention them?!
[18:56] <Vaizki> because his example uses PWM now
[18:56] <infaddic_> ok so you dont need resistors for PWM right?
[18:57] <infaddic_> i think i get what you were saying, if u wanted to use digital and get better voltage control u would use resistors?
[18:57] <Vaizki> right, the rapid cycle between on-off (gnd-vcc) and the duty cycle set with the analogwrite() value 0-255 (255 = 100%), it approximates a voltage of lower than Vcc
[18:58] <Vaizki> yes if you just slam a HIGH or LOW to NTX2B, you get a far too large shif
[18:58] <Vaizki> shift
[18:58] <Vaizki> I know, I tried it yesterday :)
[18:58] <infaddic_> yep understand. so wonder where the science in choosing 100-110 lies. i know the 10 gap approximates a voltage difference, but why pick 100?
[18:58] <Vaizki> dl-fldigi can only handle max 3kHz of shift and it was way past 5k without any resistors
[18:59] <pc1pcl> also, TX pin expects max 3V so might need resistor if you're going to go over that.
[19:00] <Vaizki> yes, well in the old revision I linked, the bias voltage is 0.5 x Vxx = 1.65V or so
[19:00] <pc1pcl> data sheet has some values for this , based on the TXD input having 100K to ground, so , 10k for 3.3V needed in series
[19:00] <Vaizki> and with the arduino pin set high, it goes up a bit but not even to 2V
[19:01] <infaddic_> ok thx guys, afk for a bit but back later ;-)
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[19:01] <Vaizki> oh he's so gonna fry it :)
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[19:01] <Vaizki> and I also wonder why do people sign off from IRC.. you miss half the info :)
[19:02] <pc1pcl> luckily there's logs..
[19:02] <pc1pcl> anyway I think he had a 3.3v arduino so probably not going to blow it up too much.
[19:02] <Vaizki> yea I have a pro mini as well I'm testing with
[19:06] <Ian_> I'm with Vaizki on that one, logs are only for when something goes wrong. I renew my session each night for convenience and catch up several times a day. from the last high water mark.
[19:07] <pc1pcl> absolute maximum ratings say you can put up to 16V on the TXD and Vcc pins so it is rather robust.
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[19:10] <DutchMillbt> Hi all did they recover LUTEIJN?
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[19:13] <pc1pcl> DutchMillbt: heard nothing new on that
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[19:20] <Vaizki> umm what's up with LUTEIJN's track :O
[19:20] <Vaizki> dodgy gps?
[19:21] <pc1pcl> yeah, only the last bit over Belgium was done with a good lock, the rest is bogus ;)
[19:22] <Ian_> It eventually came good on the descent. There was conjecture that the GPS may not have gone into flight mode, but that was speculation. Also thoughts initially that the antenna may have been bashed during a windy launch.
[19:23] <Vaizki> so they didn't check that they're receiving a valid position before releasing?
[19:23] <pc1pcl> another option I can think of was that the camera that might have been jamming the GPS might have finally run out of its own battery.
[19:24] <pc1pcl> it did have what seems like a valid lock for the launch too for some time.
[19:24] <Ian_> Success from failure then? Any word from the chase team?
[19:25] <pc1pcl> afaik last update was that they were near Charleroi, but that was around 15.00 BST / 16.00 local time.
[19:25] <Vaizki> bummer dropping it into a city
[19:26] <pc1pcl> I think it went on a little further south than they expected.
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[19:33] <Vaizki> landing in a place like that, SMS backup would have been nice..
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[19:52] <infaddict> checks logs ;-)
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[19:54] <Vaizki> just wondering, why DO you sign off in between?
[19:55] <infaddict> i dont intentionally. i shut the lid on my macbook and it goes to sleep.
[19:55] <infaddict> even when lid is open and it goes to sleep IRC logs me off
[19:55] <Vaizki> ah ok
[19:56] <infaddict> i'm on battery at the moment so probably sleeping a bit quicker than it should
[19:56] BrainDamage (~BrainDama@gateway/tor-sasl/braindamage) got netsplit.
[19:57] <Vaizki> I run a ZNC irc proxy in an always-on server, allows me to have multiple connections to the proxy but operate under one nick from all of them
[19:57] <Vaizki> also it stores the backlog of all channels and sends it to my client on connect
[19:57] <Vaizki> some clients like hexchat which I use on windows, support that backlog spam so it looks like I never left
[19:58] <Vaizki> on clients which don't support it especially, I get extra timestamps added to beginning of each line of the backlog
[19:58] <infaddict> so anyway, just when i think i've fully understood the basics of PWM another stupid question enters my brain ;-)
[19:58] <Vaizki> anyway, I recommend znc if you use irc a) a lot b) drom different devices
[19:59] <infaddict> right i do switch between my iMac, macbook, iphone and also a windows work machine
[19:59] <Vaizki> I have multiple stupid answers loaded
[19:59] <infaddict> i'll check it out thx
[19:59] <infaddict> and fall foul of my nick stil being registered on another machine
[20:00] <Vaizki> just checked, I have 7 active IRC clients connected to ZNC right now :)
[20:01] <Vaizki> home windows, home imac, work windows, work mac mini, mbp, ipad and a self made logging/alerting script
[20:01] <Vaizki> so, pwm is screwing your brain?
[20:01] <infaddict> so the duty cycle is controlled by how long you are high vs low. in most examples i've seen the timing between sending bits is constant. e.g. 20ms. so is that therefore 50% duty cycle?
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[20:03] <Vaizki> no no.. it's a similar concept but PWM operates at high frequencies to simulate a voltage below Vcc
[20:04] <infaddict> yep but if you are only sending a bit on a regulated time (e.g. every 20ms) the line is high or low every 20ms right?
[20:04] <Vaizki> frequencies so fast that the ntx2b won't react to them, if there's any internal capacitance I guess
[20:04] <edmoore> thought experiment time
[20:04] <Vaizki> no, you are sending 2 different duty cycles of PWM
[20:04] <edmoore> let's lay some foundations first
[20:04] <infaddict> ah right!
[20:05] <edmoore> oh maybe enlightenment happened just before the foundations
[20:05] <Vaizki> not sure what the PWM freq on arduinos actually is but 1kHz comes to mind
[20:05] <infaddict> lol so taking the classic graphs: http://arduino.cc/en/uploads/Tutorial/pwm.gif
[20:06] <Vaizki> so not too high a rate
[20:06] <Vaizki> led dimmers also work via PWM
[20:06] <infaddict> yep its just under 1kHz on some pins
[20:06] <infaddict> so on that graph above voltage is the vertical axis and time is horizontal
[20:06] <Vaizki> I would just go with fixed width and 3 extra resistors
[20:07] BrainDamage (~BrainDama@gateway/tor-sasl/braindamage) got lost in the net-split.
[20:07] <Vaizki> the signal to ntx2b will be very clean that way
[20:07] <infaddict> so when code does an analogwrite(100) and then (100) which axis is changing? vert or horiz?
[20:07] <Vaizki> fixed shift
[20:07] <infaddict> (110) sry
[20:07] <infaddict> 100 and 110
[20:07] <infaddict> i'd like to understand how that graph shape alters
[20:07] <edmoore> the ratio of on vs off time
[20:07] <Vaizki> the ratio of 1 vs 0 changes
[20:08] <edmoore> the total time of a complete on-off cycle is constant
[20:08] <infaddict> ok great thx. so i stupidly thought it was controlling the vert voltage. which it isnt.
[20:08] <edmoore> but the time within that cycle that it is on vs when it is off changes
[20:08] <Vaizki> which is 1ms in case of 1kHz pwm
[20:08] <edmoore> infaddict, no you can't do that with digital, but the point about using pwm and a filter is tha you get the same effect
[20:08] <Vaizki> infaddict, if it was controlling the vert voltage it would be a true DAC
[20:09] <infaddict> ok so we are simulating a average voltage by flipping 0 to 5v (or 0 to 3.3)
[20:09] <edmoore> do you see how pwm and a filter can do the same thing as a dac? if not i can explain it in another way
[20:09] <edmoore> infaddict, yes precisely
[20:09] <infaddict> and the longer we are high/on the higher that resultant voltage would be?
[20:09] <edmoore> and then we have a filter to smooth out the square waves into just a constant level
[20:10] <Vaizki> well we don't but I guess the ntx2b has
[20:10] <edmoore> the ntx2 has one on the vco anyway (so it ignores higher frequency stuff)
[20:11] <infaddict> ok so if i understand it correctly, the analogwrite value is influencing how long we are high vs low and therefore impacting voltage.
[20:11] <edmoore> precisely
[20:12] <edmoore> we call this quantity (on vs off time) the 'duty cycle'
[20:12] <infaddict> so next question is on the timing of those high vs low bit sends. i know that relates to intended baud.
[20:12] <edmoore> so a dutcy cycle of 90% would be 90% on, 10% off
[20:12] <infaddict> so 50 baud is tx every 20ms...
[20:12] <infaddict> so that is totally unrelated to the duty cycle?
[20:12] <edmoore> but it doesn't give you any information about how long one of those cycles is
[20:12] <Vaizki> infaddict, yes totally unrelated
[20:12] <edmoore> and those cycles need to be very fast relative to the bandwidth of the signal you're trying to encode
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[20:13] <edmoore> let's forget about radio for a second and pretend we're instead using a light bulb to send data
[20:13] <edmoore> and the lightbulb brightness is what encodes the bits
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[20:13] <infaddict> ok
[20:13] <edmoore> so we don;t want the light fully on or fully off, we just want it from say 30% on to 50% on for each bit
[20:14] <edmoore> so how can we make the bulb glow at 50% brightness with just a switch
[20:14] <Vaizki> just like we can make movies from still frames
[20:14] <edmoore> well, we can switch it on and off say 1s on and 1s off
[20:14] <edmoore> but you would see it come on the go off at 0.5Hz that way
[20:15] <edmoore> so lets increase the frequency to say 0.2s on 0.2s off
[20:15] <edmoore> well at that speed you still might see the fillament heating up (glowing) and cooling down when off
[20:15] <edmoore> so let's say crank the switching frequency right up to the point that the filament can't possible noticably heat up or cool down within a switching cycle
[20:16] <edmoore> say 1ms on the 1ms off
[20:16] <edmoore> it definitely doesn;t have time to go from 'cool' to 'hot' and then back to cool within that 2ms cycle
[20:16] <infaddict> yep i think i understand this part (which is analogy to the delay time or interrupt time). but so far this doesnt include the value such as 100 or 110 right?
[20:16] <edmoore> sure but bear with
[20:16] <infaddict> so by doing something very fast on/off you can simulate in the middle
[20:17] <infaddict> np ;-) just checking i am inline
[20:17] <edmoore> so what we've established here is that 2ms is a good cycle time (1ms on + 1ms off = 2ms) because it's very fast relative to the dynamics of the light bulb
[20:17] <edmoore> or in other words 500Hz
[20:17] <edmoore> 1s/0.002s (to be super thorough)
[20:18] <edmoore> so we can say this system has 500Hz PWM
[20:18] <edmoore> *now* we address duty cycle
[20:18] <edmoore> if we want 30% brightness we want it to be on for 0.6ms and off to 1.4ms within this 2ms cycle we just established
[20:19] <edmoore> if we want 80% brightness we go on for 1.6ms, off for 0.4ms
[20:19] <edmoore> but still the time for a complete cycle is 2ms
[20:20] <Vaizki> and to expand on baud, it means basically the amount of transitions your signal has per second. at 50 baud the signal changes (well CAN change) every 20ms. because RTTY only encodes one bit per signal changes, it's 1 bit per 1 baud --> baudrate = bits per second. but that one 20ms period of space or mark is actualy 20 x 1ms cycles of PWM (assuming 1kHz PWM) but it's too fast for the NTX2B to "see".
[20:20] <Vaizki> sorry to barge in, I wrote that some time ago but need the input buffer for another channel :)
[20:20] <edmoore> no exactly right
[20:20] <edmoore> so say you do 20ms per symbol, that would actually be 10 pwm cycles (assuming 500Hz pwm) or 20 cycles assuming 1kHz pwm
[20:21] <infaddict> ok thats where i was getting it wrong then... because i imagined a cycle to be the time between bit sends (e.g. 20ms)
[20:21] <edmoore> what you need regardless is the pwm frequency to be much higher than the baud rate
[20:21] <edmoore> so that even within a single symbol (bit period) you still get what looks like a smooth voltage
[20:21] <edmoore> even though the underlying process is still pwm
[20:22] <infaddict> ok so its actually cycling many 1's or 0's between your 20ms timing
[20:22] <edmoore> yes
[20:22] <Vaizki> tbh, I think pwm-ing the shift for ntx2b at <1kHz pwm sounds like pushing it
[20:22] <edmoore> abstract the two concepts
[20:22] <edmoore> use pwm to make a DAC
[20:22] <infaddict> but not tx'ing that fast?
[20:22] <edmoore> black box that as 'dac'
[20:22] <Vaizki> I will do it with bias voltage and resistors :)
[20:22] <edmoore> then using the dac black box to generate voltages for your rtty
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[20:23] <infaddict> anyway back to your lightbulb analogy... where does that fit with sending 100 or 110 to the pin?
[20:24] <edmoore> ah, so those commands are setting the duty cycle, i assume
[20:24] <infaddict> in your example the bulb was 100% on or off with timing doing all the work
[20:24] <infaddict> in the code examples i've seen (i can paste urls here), the timing is fixed by the baud (e.g. 20ms) and they use analogwrite with 100 and 110 to do the shift
[20:25] <Vaizki> but in addition to the pwm rate which has to be high enough to become invisible to the receiving component (ntx2b), there's also the issue of accuracy. atmega 328p has 8 bits for that, allowin 0-255 for the analogWrite().. at 3.3V that means 0.013V per step. you cannot achieve more granular changes than that
[20:25] <edmoore> sure, so 'analogwrite' is actually the pwm black box
[20:25] <edmoore> the 'analog pin' is actually implemented with pwm
[20:26] <Vaizki> infaddict, I think it's done for 5V arduino and one step is 0.0196V
[20:26] <Vaizki> so 100->110 raises "voltage" by 0.2V
[20:26] <infaddict> yep and the mention of voltage is what confused me with the vertial axis on the duty cycle graph!
[20:26] <infaddict> as that is 0-3.3V
[20:27] <Vaizki> well with 3.3V Vcc your steps are smaller, so your shift will be smaller than in the example
[20:27] <edmoore> so if you abstract away the pwm implementation into a black box called 'analogwrite' you can just say 'i want a voltage of '110'' and the analogwrite function will calculate what dutycycle you need to achieve that
[20:27] <Vaizki> and the voltage will be Vcc*110/255
[20:28] <infaddict> yep maybe i dont really need to understand how it actually works under the hood. i know how to set the timing for baud. and i can mess on a test different values in the analogwrite to achieve desired shift.
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[20:29] <Vaizki> well if your shift is 10 in the example with 5V, it's going to be 5/3.3*10 with 3.3V :)
[20:29] <Vaizki> so 100->115
[20:30] <infaddict> yep agreed. i still dont understand why the author picked 100 to start with. and not 50 or 60 or 70.
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[20:30] <edmoore> oh random
[20:30] <edmoore> it can be whatever you want
[20:30] <Vaizki> 100 is a nice number close to the middle of the 1-255 range
[20:30] <infaddict> why is the middle important?
[20:30] <edmoore> it isn;t in this application
[20:31] <edmoore> in general it is as it gives you the most room symmetrically on either side
[20:31] <Vaizki> I think it's because this emulates the vboltage bias in the previous implementatio
[20:31] <edmoore> but that is not useful to us here as we only ever want a known small shift
[20:31] <edmoore> Vaizki, that's all arbitrary
[20:31] <Vaizki> which was a symmetric voltage divider that put the base voltage (space) at 0.5 * Vcc
[20:31] <edmoore> don;t worry about it
[20:31] <edmoore> pick something
[20:31] <Vaizki> I know
[20:31] <edmoore> stay away from the limits of your rails
[20:32] <Vaizki> I'm not saying it matters, just where that came from :)
[20:33] <Vaizki> and get your shift to 425Hz .. it also doesn't matter but is customary I hear :)
[20:33] <edmoore> indeed
[20:33] <edmoore> well it doesn;t matter
[20:33] <edmoore> sorry, it *does* matter
[20:34] <edmoore> but small bananas within sensible ranges for a few hundred hz
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[20:35] <infaddict> ok thx again guys, been really helpful. i'm still in theory mode sadly until more of my parts arrive. otherwise would try all of this and probably learn quicker!
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[20:36] <Vaizki> I would stay between 200-1000 myself, you want a clear shift but not too large
[20:36] <edmoore> btw in the lamp example, the filament is doing the filtering
[20:36] <edmoore> as it can;t respond instantly
[20:36] <edmoore> in the ntx2, there's a low pass filter on the input to cut off the higher frequencies
[20:36] <Vaizki> if the shift is very large, you have to use a very wide filter on receiver side, which will vacuum in noise and other transmissions
[20:36] <edmoore> so you want the owm freq to be above that
[20:37] <_Paradigm_> We went all the way to Charleroi - couldn't locate the payload.. it had landed in the middle of an urban area.
[20:38] <infaddict> did u get a decent fix? sry i missed the chat after the fix issues.
[20:38] <Vaizki> are you sure it didn't make it over the city center?
[20:38] <Vaizki> warm houses, rising air currents etc
[20:38] <_Paradigm_> Yes fortunately the gps gave some sensible coords just before it got down
[20:39] <Vaizki> I have no experience with HAB but urban areas kill star gazing with those thermals
[20:39] <Vaizki> so it might have floated a bit longer than predicted by the tracker?
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[20:39] <_Paradigm_> We drove around for about 3 hours trying to get a signal
[20:39] <_Paradigm_> I think we covered the area pretty well
[20:40] <_Paradigm_> Perhaps the computer didn't survive the crash
[20:40] <Vaizki> bummer.. what antenna?
[20:40] <Vaizki> 12.4m/s coming down.. well that might be bit of a jolt
[20:41] <infaddict> mmm pretty fast
[20:41] <Vaizki> note to self: tape around batteries
[20:41] <edmoore> infaddict, and instructive experiment when your bits arrive
[20:41] <edmoore> connect radio, receiver etc up
[20:42] <edmoore> and increase the pwm frequency from say 1hz to 5kHz
[20:42] <edmoore> and you should see on the waterfall the pwm switching coming through at low frequencies but then as the pwm frequency increases to above the input filter freq you should jsut see a single halfway tone emerge
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[20:43] <infaddict> ok so starting wide and narrowing?
[20:43] <Vaizki> no.. :)
[20:44] <Vaizki> he's talking about PWM rate, but not sure if you want to mess with that
[20:44] <_Paradigm_> Vaizki: had to look it up, but it's a Diamond Slim Gainer AZ510
[20:44] <edmoore> it's more to understand pwm
[20:44] <Vaizki> in atmega it's controlled by a divider
[20:44] <Vaizki> so you get 1kHz, 500Hz, 250Hz etc
[20:44] <infaddict> u mean the prescaler?
[20:44] <Vaizki> yea
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[20:44] <Vaizki> or something like that, for the timer that runs pwm
[20:44] <Vaizki> don't mess with it ;)
[20:45] <infaddict> surely you have to set the prescaler in order to set the interrupt timing of the baud you want?
[20:45] <Vaizki> but if you run at 8MHz, your pwm is probably going to be only 500Hz
[20:45] <_Paradigm_> In my experience, increasing the pwm speed definitely gave better results
[20:45] <infaddict> yep my arduino is 8Mhz
[20:45] <edmoore> infaddict, i think you're really confusing two very very logically and functionally separate concepts
[20:45] <edmoore> one
[20:45] <edmoore> pwm
[20:46] <Vaizki> I would do voltage divider. the pwm is just an extra complication.
[20:46] <edmoore> two
[20:46] <edmoore> baud rates
[20:46] <edmoore> this conversation has zero to do with interrupt timings of baud rates
[20:47] <Vaizki> _Paradigm_, ok so a 1 meter +5.5dBi whip
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[20:47] <_Paradigm_> Vaizki: sounds about right, I am not an expert at all in this area :)
[20:48] <Vaizki> sounds like a pretty good mobile antenna
[20:48] <Vaizki> but in a city, your payload is low, your antenna is low and buildings in between
[20:49] <craag> _Paradigm_: Did you have contact details in the payload?
[20:49] <_Paradigm_> Fortunately we did put our phone numbers on there, and a message in Dutch, English and French
[20:50] <_Paradigm_> Let's hope someone finds it
[20:50] <Vaizki> did you promise a reward? :)
[20:50] <_Paradigm_> In their backyard or something
[20:50] <craag> That's one advantage of an accidental urban landing :)
[20:50] <_Paradigm_> No I didn't think of that Vaizki.. good point
[20:51] <Ian_> Did you visit the Snack Sherif and enquire if any of their customers had mentioned seeing a parachute?
[20:51] <_Paradigm_> I think in this particular situation, having a gprs module on board would increase the finding chance hugely
[20:53] <_Paradigm_> Ian_ yes we did, we also got help from a very nice elderly couple in an appartment at the 7th floor, to search the area for a signal
[20:54] <Vaizki> oh nice
[20:54] <_Paradigm_> I think we would have found it, if it was still sending out rtty
[20:56] <Vaizki> unless it went for way longer..
[20:56] <_Paradigm_> Well it was a fun day, full of cliffhangers and twists
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[20:57] <Vaizki> btw, I'm not sure if I'm crap at configuring dl-fldigi or what but the waterfall seems to be very very noisy in it
[20:57] <_Paradigm_> Vaizki: I don't think it came further than 1 km from the predicted landing spot
[20:57] <Reb-SM0ULC> _Paradigm_: sri for a bit out of date, what was the payload?
[20:58] <Vaizki> is there any way to clean up the waterfall in dl-fldigi?
[20:58] <_Paradigm_> Reb-SM0ULC: Do you mean the name?
[20:59] <Reb-SM0ULC> _Paradigm_: no, just wondered if you lost a lot of stuff.. :/
[21:00] <_Paradigm_> Reb-SM0ULC: Not too much, no GoPro or anything, on board there was a cheap Canon Powershot and a flight computer
[21:00] <Reb-SM0ULC> _Paradigm_: well, hope someone finds it tomorrow then
[21:01] <infaddict> yep hope it shows up
[21:03] <_Paradigm_> Yea we hope so too :)
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[21:07] <Ian_> Paradigm, I was hoping that the Snack Sherif was going to say, Yes, a customer brought it in, would you like that frites and tartare sauce, or Mayonaise :) Fingers crossed for a telephone recovery.
[21:08] <Ian_> Did it get the throw down the stairs integrity test pre-flight?
[21:09] <_Paradigm_> Ian_ nah because we wouldn't be able to fix it anyway.. time issues
[21:09] <Ian_> It's good that strangers turn out to be very helpful, a reassuring note on humanity.
[21:09] <Ian_> Time is always the enemy I guess.
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[21:11] <_Paradigm_> Yea these projects should be done only when there is no time pressure
[21:11] <Ian_> While you were travelling we had an interesting talk about the package name, connection to the Lutine Bell at Lloyds of London and missing bullion from 1799. So we weren't idle in your absence :)
[21:11] <_Paradigm_> Otherwise the risk increases enormously
[21:11] <_Paradigm_> Hahah lol, I'll read it when I'm home
[21:12] <_Paradigm_> Still on the road
[21:12] <edmoore> there was a photo of a chap launching a hab among the national portrait gallery photographic prize 2014 exhibition
[21:12] <edmoore> i saw it earlier today
[21:12] <edmoore> he had fuller face and upper body cover increase the hydrogen went off
[21:13] <Geoff-G8DHE-Tab> Vakzki, when testing close to the Tx it can look bad due to overloading of the frontend
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[21:14] <Vaizki> yea I took the FE gain down completely.. maybe it's just that
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[21:15] <Vaizki> http://i.imgur.com/q2nHiol.png
[21:15] <Vaizki> looks like that now
[21:15] <Vaizki> SDR# in the background
[21:15] <Geoff-G8DHE-Tab> Did you use aerials either end? If so try without, or put the Tx in a box
[21:16] <Vaizki> no aerial on the ntx2b
[21:16] <Geoff-G8DHE-Tab> A lot cleaner then some we have seen!
[21:16] <Vaizki> the receiver is an Airspy with a big ass discone on my roof
[21:17] <Vaizki> yea I got it cleaned up by taking down the airspy gain settings
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[21:17] <Geoff-G8DHE-Tab> Ah the Airspy will help, but no aerial required if Tx is close!
[21:18] <Vaizki> at least there's the roof between the tx and antenna :)
[21:18] <Vaizki> tin roof at that
[21:18] <Geoff-G8DHE-Tab> :)
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[21:20] <Vaizki> before you wonder why I get that garbage in my decode, it's because the ntx2b is not always transmitting
[21:20] <Vaizki> I was testing fldigi, how much of a lead in does it require to relock onto the "carrier"
[21:22] <Ian_> Ah, yes, the rx agc will try to find a signal down to the noise floor. Re fldigi question, fast AGC on your rx then less than a second of stable carrier
[21:22] <Ian_> Does anyone use slow agc on a receiver?
[21:22] <Vaizki> yea in that pic it's a 3sec carrier
[21:23] <Vaizki> hey I didn't know what AGC *IS* yesterday
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[21:24] <Ian_> Not a problem as long as you are happy with 3 secs. Obviously learning fast although I suspect it's not the technology that stumped you.
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[21:24] <Vaizki> I didn't even know there as a setting for AGC in fldigi but found it now :)
[21:25] <Vaizki> was
[21:25] <Ian_> Confession, neither did I. I was thinking about a communications receiver . . . :)
[21:27] <Geoff-G8DHE-Tab> Leave it on fast, there can be a lot of flutter on HAB signals from slow to fast
[21:27] <Vaizki> well since I'm using an SDR, I'm just sending a 3kHz chunk of spectrum out to fldigi as audio
[21:27] <Vaizki> so the AGC has to happen on the fldigi side?
[21:27] <Ian_> A click from a thermostat when using slow agc and a few seconds of data are wiped out. At least with a fast AGC the recovery is prompt.
[21:27] <Geoff-G8DHE-Tab> and a slow setting can leave you missing lead in characters!
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[21:31] <Vaizki> I'm probably not going to put pauses in the transmission in the real app
[21:31] <Vaizki> but these bits and the whole "stack" of communications is a bit fascinating
[21:33] <Geoff-G8DHE-Tab> Its a complete hobby in its own right of course ;-)
[21:34] <Vaizki> what I'm not a 100% getting is that the NTX2B is a FM transmitter, yet I'm receiving them with a SSB AM demodulator
[21:34] <Vaizki> and it magically works :)
[21:34] <Geoff-G8DHE-Tab> Let alone adding computers, cameras, Hydrogen gas and big condoms
[21:35] <Geoff-G8DHE-Tab> Your not really generating FM your switching between two freqs
[21:37] <Vaizki> yea I'm not sure any more where I read that it's a FM transmitter
[21:38] <Geoff-G8DHE-Tab> FSK<>FM
[21:38] <jcoxon> Vaizki, it is a FM transmitter but not in the way you are using it
[21:38] <Ian_> You could FM the NTX2B, but it probably wouldn't serve our purpose very well
[21:38] <Geoff-G8DHE-Tab> Its sold as being a FM capable Tx but not the way we use it really.
[21:38] <Vaizki> ok so that makes a bit more sense
[21:39] <Ian_> Ours is "binary FM" :)
[21:39] <Vaizki> because the signals don't look like FM at all :)
[21:39] <Ian_> A spot of two tone, now you see it now you don't!
[21:40] <Geoff-G8DHE-Tab> You could use two separate Tx and use took on the two of them for FSK
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[21:41] <Geoff-G8DHE-Tab> OOK not took!
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[21:41] <Ian_> Thought for a moment that you were using a northern accent Geoff
[21:41] <Ian_> t'OOK
[21:42] <Geoff-G8DHE-Tab> I'm on the tablet with dreaded correction!
[21:42] <Vaizki> maybe I will file this FM vs FSK stuff for later reading :)
[21:42] <Vaizki> for now I'm happy with the fact that it works
[21:43] <Geoff-G8DHE-Tab> :)
[21:44] <Vaizki> ook ook said the librarian
[21:45] <Vaizki> next up on bits to get to know.. ublox..
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[22:02] <_Paradigm> Home sweet home
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[22:12] <Vaizki> hmm I wonder what this ublox is outputting on serial in default config
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[22:13] <Upu> NMEA @ 9600
[22:13] <Vaizki> yea that's what I'm trying but I see garbafe
[22:14] <Vaizki> I did try 4800 first for old times sake
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[22:14] <Vaizki> ah now I have output
[22:15] <Vaizki> wonder what I screwed up earlier.. thx upu
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[22:40] <Babs_> upu -are you still on?
[22:42] <daveake> he's not
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[22:44] <Vaizki> not even upu's super ublox module can get a fix inside the house.. and I can't drag this breadboarded thing outside either :)
[22:46] <Geoff-G8DHE> Wow! Google Earth have turned on dynamic 3d modelling for lots of Urban areas now!
[22:47] <Vaizki> yea they're giving the pro stuff for free I guess
[22:48] <Geoff-G8DHE> Not sure that was turned on in the Pro version when I last used a Pro version a few onths back!
[22:49] <Geoff-G8DHE> this isn't just the 3d models, this is dynamic modelling of your local urban streets
[22:51] <Babs_> hey daveake - you can almost certainly answer the question
[22:51] <daveake> ok ...
[22:51] <Babs_> why do upu's ublox breakout boards have an en
[22:51] <Vaizki> oh actually the ublox has one satellite
[22:51] <Babs_> is it purely power saving ?
[22:52] <Vaizki> it's getting UTC time correctly at least
[22:52] <Babs_> or is there another mystic reason why i might want to switch it off
[22:52] <daveake> Didn't know that they did :)
[22:52] <Vaizki> mine doesn't
[22:52] <Babs_> just trying to work out whether i need one on my tracker too, or whether it just overcomplicates it incorporating a mosfet etc
[22:52] <Vaizki> which one do you have?
[22:52] <Babs_> m8
[22:53] <daveake> I know that people have had trouble with ubloxes if they lose lock in power saving mode
[22:53] <daveake> so it might be to powercycle it to reset
[22:53] <Vaizki> http://ava.upuaut.net/store/index.php?route=product/product&path=59_60&product_id=68
[22:53] <daveake> or yes could be power saving
[22:53] <Vaizki> this one?
[22:54] <Babs_> this one http://ava.upuaut.net/store/index.php?route=product/product&path=59_64&product_id=107
[22:55] <Babs_> i'll incorporate a mosfet but incorporate something that just enables me to bypass it in case the mosfet gives me trouble
[22:55] <Babs_> thanks both
[22:55] <Vaizki> why do you need a mosfet?
[22:56] <Vaizki> isn't that what EN is for, to turn it on?
[22:56] <Babs_> as far as I know, en doesn't feature on the chip Vaizki
[22:57] <Ian_> Would you use an Enable pin to effectively disconnect the Ublox whilst programming the MCU in situ?
[22:57] <Babs_> ah hah - yes Ian_ , i knew i was using it for something
[22:58] <Vaizki> hmmh, or maybe it's connected to the ANT_ON of the chip
[22:58] <Vaizki> to enable an external LNA
[22:58] <Ian_> There always has to be a simple answer - Occam's Gillete, or some such
[22:58] <Babs_> i breadboarded it up but already had the code in there so didn't spot it https://www.flickr.com/photos/91049302@N00/16291336667/
[22:58] <arko> http://new.livestream.com/spacex/events/3783845
[22:58] <Ian_> Another good answer there
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[22:59] <Babs_> should be able to get the mosfet working, if not i can always incorporate a switch for it and just turn it off when i am programming
[22:59] <Babs_> there will be a way
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[22:59] <Babs_> are you in the top of that thing arko?
[23:00] <Vaizki> To use the module you will need to pull the EN line high (just attach it to the 5V line).
[23:01] <Vaizki> says one of upu's pages..
[23:01] <Vaizki> so seems like having it down shuts the whole thing
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[23:02] <amell> spacex launch is soon isnt it
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[23:02] <Laurenceb_> 7 min
[23:02] <craag> http://new.livestream.com/spacex/events/3783845
[23:03] <craag> (ta arko)
[23:03] <arko> cheers
[23:03] <arko> Babs_: with my cowboy hat
[23:03] <qyx_> annoying that they still use flash to stream live content
[23:03] <qyx_> this works with vlc rtsp://212-133.livestream.com:8080/livestreamiphone/142499_129958_c5bac6cf_1_198@5981
[23:03] <amell> hope theres a livestream from the barge, there wasnt one last time
[23:03] <Babs_> sorry Vaizki - I've already got it working with the breakout board, now breadboarding out the whole tracker using the bare chip https://www.flickr.com/photos/91049302@N00/16291488597/
[23:04] <Babs_> so the caps, mosfets etc. are all external
[23:04] <Babs_> arko - there is a UK dude who was competing for the x prize who was planning to do exactly that
[23:05] <arko> lol
[23:05] <Babs_> http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/sci/tech/821489.stm
[23:05] <amell> babs_: bennett? dont make me laugh
[23:06] <arko> haha crazy kids
[23:06] <Babs_> he conducted a test on morecambe sands, which is out equivalent of cape canaveral
[23:06] <amell> yeah its bennett. no chanc ein hell
[23:06] <Laurenceb_> starchaser
[23:06] <Babs_> launch pad 39b there http://theculturevulture.co.uk/blog/wp-content/uploads/2012/09/IMG_0223-500x333.jpg
[23:07] <Laurenceb_> they still seem to exist...
[23:07] <amell> laurenceb_: they launched earlier this week
[23:07] <Laurenceb_> but havent done anything for years
[23:07] <Laurenceb_> starchaser?!
[23:07] <Laurenceb_> wtf
[23:08] <qyx_> argh
[23:08] <Laurenceb_> no go
[23:08] <amell> laurenceb_: http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-31126820
[23:08] <amell> comedy
[23:08] <adamgreig> we are not going to space today :(
[23:09] <amell> was it the radar?
[23:09] <Geoff-G8DHE> Tracking was said
[23:09] <amell> yeah, range radar fubar
[23:09] <Babs_> has anyone ever incorporated an SD card reader in one of their trackers and if so is the chip on the middle of this really necessary? http://www.adafruit.com/product/254
[23:09] <amell> whens the next window?
[23:10] <amell> Payload was destined for L1, so would be instantaneous window
[23:10] <Geoff-G8DHE> The chip is just a hex buffer
[23:11] <Geoff-G8DHE> normally used for level conversion
[23:11] <adamgreig> Babs_: it's needed if your micro is at 5V
[23:11] <adamgreig> if your system is 3v3 then you're OK
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[23:11] <Vaizki> it guards DI, CLK and CS
[23:11] <zyp> amell, I'd guess every ~24 hours then
[23:11] <Vaizki> babs, it guards DI, CLK and CS against overvoltage
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[23:12] <Babs__> if i am supplying 3v3 is it necessary then?
[23:12] <adamgreig> is your microcontroller logic 3v3?
[23:12] <Geoff-G8DHE> Are all your I/O at 3.3v
[23:12] <amell> laurenceb_: did you watch yet another quality sparrowchaser launch?
[23:12] <Laurenceb_> heh yeah
[23:12] <Laurenceb_> lulz
[23:12] <Laurenceb_> was it a custom motor?
[23:12] <Babs__> hi both - yes, powering it off 3v3 now which suggests that i can go straight to the sd card
[23:13] <Babs__> just didn't know whether it was doing something else in terms of cleaning up the signal to it
[23:13] <amell> nobody is sure what he was using. he claimed the cold (-4) affected the motor
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[23:13] <Geoff-G8DHE> Are those card lock mechanism's robust enough for HAB work ?
[23:13] <amell> which, frankly, is bullshit
[23:14] <Babs__> basically , i want to put my SD card on my tracker board from scratch, rather than plugging the adafruit unit straight in which i am currently doing on my breadboard
[23:14] <amell> just as well he didnt launch as he didnt have airspace clearance.
[23:14] <Geoff-G8DHE> Mine failed on a RPi on its third insertion last week :-(
[23:15] <amell> 1elonmusk
[23:15] <amell> 1Air Force tracking radar went down. Launch postponed to same time tomorrow.
[23:15] <amell> 12https://twitter.com/newhorizons2015/status/564563146770108416
[23:15] <amell> so. see you tomorrow guys
[23:15] <daveake> not a good day for tracking
[23:16] <Vaizki> yea g'nite
[23:16] <amell> daveake: lost something? :)
[23:16] <daveake> as if
[23:17] <amell> wonder if they will bring the barge back into port or not. long time to hold station
[23:18] <amell> 23.07 tomorrow
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[23:21] <amell> if this is going to lagrange point L1, I am wondering why the launch time is different tomorrow
[23:23] <amell> I bet it is moon gravity that changes it.
[23:25] <SpacenearUS> New position from 03KG7IXX-11 after 034 days silence - 12http://tracker.habhub.org/#!qm=All&q=KG7IXX-11
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[00:00] --- Mon Feb 9 2015