highaltitude.log.20150130

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[06:49] <Vaizki> Ian_: actually... cold pork shoulder bbq midnight snack..
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[07:17] <jededu> EDUPIC cancelled for today will try again tomorrow
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[08:00] <infaddict> Morning
[08:01] <infaddict> Pretty heavy payload right here! http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-us-canada-31052066
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[08:04] <infaddict> Its Friday which means another noob question. What type of wire (size/material etc) for general payload use such as running from board to external temp sensor? Same q for payload antenna wire.
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[08:08] <UpuWork> doesn't matter really
[08:08] <UpuWork> antennas try not to be too spikey
[08:08] <UpuWork> just run it inside straws for support
[08:10] <infaddict> Ok thx Upu. I'm a bit worried at how long the antenna spikes need to be, i was hoping my payload would be considerably smaller.
[08:10] <UpuWork> 164mm
[08:10] <UpuWork> can't argue with physics
[08:10] <infaddict> ha yep
[08:10] <UpuWork> well
[08:10] <infaddict> i'd rather find
[08:10] <infaddict> it
[08:10] <UpuWork> smaller antennas are availble
[08:11] <infaddict> and for general wiring from micro/pcb to sensors etc, what guage or type usually
[08:11] <UpuWork> really don't worry about it
[08:11] <infaddict> this really is my first project so sry if its stupid
[08:11] <UpuWork> wide enough for the electrons to flow
[08:12] <mfa298> Note: 164mm is the length for a 434MHz transmitter, other frequencies may be available (although probably not in the UK)
[08:12] <infaddict> i dont have it lying around so will be buying it, hence want to buy all round stuff i can use a lot
[08:12] <UpuWork> got any old IDE cables lying about from computers ?
[08:12] <Geoff-G8DHE-M> Square wire is expensive
[08:12] <UpuWork> cat 5 cable ?
[08:13] <UpuWork> speaker cable ?
[08:13] <UpuWork> anything
[08:13] <UpuWork> speaker cable may be too thick
[08:13] <infaddict> i have a draw full of usb/hdmi/network cables and other audio stuff
[08:13] <SA6BSS-Mike> cat5 is great to cut up
[08:13] <UpuWork> stuff like this is nice http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/LAPP-KABEL-0050009-WIRE-SILICONE-ORANGE-1MM-QTY-PER-1M-/221408182255?pt=UK_BOI_Electrical_Components_Supplies_ET&hash=item338cf4bfef
[08:13] <UpuWork> very flexible
[08:14] <UpuWork> insulation doesn't pull back too much when you apply your 2500w Weller Solder cannon
[08:14] <infaddict> great thx for advice guys!
[08:14] <Geoff-G8DHE-M> If you have a BT depot near you have a word with a technician for some hook-up wire!
[08:14] <Geoff-G8DHE-M> Internal cable is nicely colour coded
[08:14] <UpuWork> break in to your local BT Exchange loads of wire in there
[08:14] <UpuWork> p.s above was a joke
[08:14] <infaddict> Geoff, my grandfather worked as a technician for 40 years for BT so I'm sure he will still have some contacts lol
[08:15] <Geoff-G8DHE-M> a 1 metre length of 400pair is brilliant
[08:15] <mfa298> for flexible wire between boards and components stranded wire is likely to be best.
[08:15] <UpuWork> Old printer parallel cable
[08:15] <UpuWork> lots of wire inside that
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[08:15] <infaddict> so upcycle seems to be the trend here ;-)
[08:15] <mfa298> on PCB's I've recently been using old punchdown wire from telephony kit (having been pulling loads of it out from work)
[08:16] <UpuWork> OT http://i.imgur.com/p9lZerR.jpg
[08:16] <mfa298> UpuWork: lol :)
[08:16] <Geoff-G8DHE-M> :)
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[08:32] <fsphil> don't use cat5 cable for an antenna
[08:32] <fsphil> it'll break if you look at it
[08:34] <SA6BSS-Mike> the cat cable I have is multistranded, dont break easy
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[08:36] <fsphil> best kind
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[08:40] <SA6BSS-Mike> to many payloads lost their antenna, there is allways a good to put an extra adhesive tape holding on to the radiating element
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[09:01] <SpacenearUS> New position from 03K6RPT-12 after 0315 hours silence - 12http://tracker.habhub.org/#!qm=All&q=K6RPT-12
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[09:39] <SpacenearUS> New position from 03li4m0 after 038 days silence - 12http://tracker.habhub.org/#!qm=All&q=li4m0
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[10:34] <SpacenearUS> New vehicle on the map: 03ZURG - 12http://tracker.habhub.org/#!qm=All&q=ZURG
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[10:53] <Vaizki> hmmh PS-32 should be in sight of Argentina today.. or already..
[10:53] <lz1dev> !ping ps-32
[10:53] <SpacenearUS> 03lz1dev: Last contact with 03PS-32 was 03a day ago
[10:54] <Vaizki> yea or it could of course be down. no trackers in tierra del fuego :)
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[11:23] <HF_ATL> morning
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[11:39] <michemto> Hey guys! I need some information about radios...
[11:40] <jonsowman> go ahead
[11:40] <lz1dev> michemto: just ask your question
[11:40] <michemto> I'm using PITS for my GPS data transmission
[11:41] <michemto> And I need something to get this data down here
[11:41] <michemto> Is alinco DJ-X11E a good choice?
[11:43] <SpacenearUS> New vehicle on the map: 03BUZZ - 12http://tracker.habhub.org/#!qm=All&q=BUZZ
[11:51] <pc1pcl> michemto: it might work, although from the pictures it looks like an fm walkie (without talkie), it looks likeit will do all mode reception
[11:51] <adamgreig> but like, you should probably just get an SDR like the funcube or an rtl-sdr dongle
[11:51] <michemto> http://www.tehnoturg.ee/dj-x11e-skanner-0-05-1299-99995mhz-am-fm-wfm-ssb-cw-1800mah-aku-liion-laadija-patareikarp-alinco.html
[11:52] <pc1pcl> yeah, at 400 euro for this receiver, you're probably better off with a SDR dongle.
[11:53] <daveake> And even if you did want to spend that much on a scanner, the ICOM IC-R20 is a nicer model
[11:53] <pc1pcl> as still probably would need to buy an antenna, magmount etc, and interface it with computer
[11:53] <pc1pcl> so, if you had one lying around anyway, no reason not to use it, but if you need to buy it new, I'd say, don't
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[11:56] <michemto> IC-R20 adds 100¬ instantly :)
[11:56] <michemto> But someone told that better use scanner than SDR dongle
[11:56] <michemto> So is dongle working as good as scanner
[11:57] <daveake> My view is that when you're chasing a payload, a scanner is better; when you're at home a good SDR (FCD, Airspy etc) is better
[11:57] <michemto> Anyone knows, where I can find PITS Prebuilt SD Card Image
[11:57] <michemto> http://www.pi-in-the-sky.com/index.php?id=prebuilt-sd-card-image
[11:57] <daveake> Those SDRs are definitely more sensitive
[11:57] <gonzo___> a scanner with ssb is probably similar performance to a cheap dongle with habamp. But the scanner is far simpler to set up and use
[11:57] <michemto> Ill be using this only for chasing my payload
[11:57] <daveake> Build the image yourself from the instructions
[11:57] <SpacenearUS> New vehicle on the map: 03Monster_chase - 12http://tracker.habhub.org/#!qm=All&q=Monster_chase
[11:58] <michemto> Ill probably go for scanner if budget allows.
[11:58] <daveake> I'm going to remove that link; it was only there for the terminally lazy, and that's not you is it? :)
[11:58] <gonzo___> the FCD pro+ is probbaly better than a cheap scanner or cheap dongle
[11:58] <daveake> It is
[11:59] <daveake> I prefer a scanner in the car, as you can just grab it and take it with you
[11:59] <michemto> Its not me :D
[11:59] <daveake> We had a terminally lazy user recently and his flight didn't go well
[11:59] <gonzo___> an RTFM fail?
[12:00] <pc1pcl> since the SDR dongles are almost 'free' compared to price of a scanner, I'd definately start with a cheap dongle, then decide based on the results and how it handles in e.g. a car if you need to upgrade, and if that upgrade will be a scanner/hamtranceiver or a funcube dongle..
[12:00] <daveake> A CBA fail
[12:00] <michemto> Hehehe, what happened
[12:00] <daveake> Thought that he could leave tracking to others
[12:00] <michemto> WELL! :D
[12:00] <michemto> Where can I find best price for funcube in UK - actually shipping to Estonia is needed but...
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[12:05] <infaddict> i'm starting with a cheap SDR dongle + HabAmp. Total cost £30. will see how it performs. agree its not as portable as scanner, as have to carry laptop + dongle + amp + antenna around.
[12:05] <infaddict> esp in bad weather it wont be usable
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[12:06] <daveake> It's hard to argue with the cost; cheap enough to get as well as a scanner or transceiver
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[12:08] <gonzo___> In my recoveries, ok not that many, I have had the laptop in the car anyway, as it was doing the dl-fldigi decoding.
[12:09] <infaddict> yer. ive done 0 so new to this, but would you then need to leave the car into a field (for example) and still carry the kit?
[12:09] <gonzo___> and I have always managed to drive around for a good enough signal, to start getting telemetry. Then just a case of using a handheld gps (phone) to home in on the given coords.
[12:09] <infaddict> ok so trust the co-ords once landed and use GPS
[12:10] <daveake> Well, once on foot you probably have a position anyway. At that point you don't need to decode anymore*, but a scanner is handy just to df as you walk along
[12:10] <daveake> * Unless it landed on an active golf course and is still moving :p
[12:10] <gonzo___> if the payload is giving you live coors, I'd say trust them
[12:11] <craag> if the gps has a valid fix, it's often not more than 5 meters out.
[12:11] <daveake> Also, if you have a decent Android phone or tablet, you can decode on that with a handheld scanner
[12:11] <infaddict> i thought in general yagi's are a bit big and bulky to use in car, so surely you're out on foot using them anyway?
[12:11] <gonzo___> or someone has seen it and it's moving around in a farmers van
[12:11] <daveake> s/farmers van/golf trolley/
[12:11] <daveake> happens
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[12:12] <LunarWork> hello
[12:12] <gonzo___> if you can get close enough, then you can use your body as a screen and get a pretty rough directional fix
[12:12] <craag> yep that works well
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[12:12] <gonzo___> you had a golf incident then dave?
[12:12] <craag> also for working out if you need to look on ground, or in the tree above you :)
[12:12] <daveake> During a competition :p
[12:13] <gonzo___> the last fix should give that though, compared to the handheld one
[12:13] <daveake> http://www.daveakerman.com/?p=1658
[12:13] <gonzo___> hehe nice
[12:13] <daveake> We were allowed out on the course
[12:13] <daveake> and the payload came back towards us :/
[12:13] <daveake> It was still taking photos
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[12:14] <infaddict> haha class
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[12:20] <mfa298> in the flight of gonzo___'s that I recovered I had a laptop for which the battery died just as I got to the launch site. Luckily it was a large muddy field so laptop wasn't needed after that point. If it was walking around a wood I'd probably prefer just a radio (maybe netbook in a rucksack as backup) but using a laptop as the radio would be a pain in that scenario
[12:21] <Vaizki> I see michemto was from estonia.. well I'd probably see his launches very well
[12:21] <Vaizki> something to practise tracking on before I launch my own ;)
[12:23] <Vaizki> hmm that scanner he linked - dj-x11 - has i/q output directly
[12:23] <seventeen> There is not much to go wrong on an RFM98 is there? SPI is dead, but loopback is working.
[12:26] <seventeen> I was going to take it off the Pi and try bit banging it.
[12:26] <daveake> Should work just fine with SPI on the PI
[12:27] <seventeen> "should" : may be a problem in the Pi.
[12:27] <daveake> I shall rephrase
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[12:27] <daveake> I've used the rfm98 on a Pi loads of times
[12:27] <Vaizki> daveake, what's that tablet you have sdr on?
[12:28] <daveake> I don't.
[12:28] <seventeen> I am sure UpuWork tested the board.
[12:28] <UpuWork> I did
[12:28] <daveake> Well check the DIO0/5/CE pin allocations are correct
[12:29] <seventeen> CE ?
[12:29] <daveake> Those are a bit fluid atm :/
[12:29] <daveake> Chip Enable
[12:29] <daveake> CE0 or CE1 on the Pi
[12:29] <high-flyer> hi guys, im following this really useful tutorial (http://ukhas.org.uk/guides:linkingarduinotontx2) and it says that for DominoEx to work you need a resistor. I know the author uses this (https://www.tindie.com/products/gerrysweeney/seven-decade-programmable-resistor-1r-9999999r-1-500mw-gerrysweeneycom/) but is there anything smaller which I can use? Many thanks
[12:29] <Vaizki> daveake, I meant this setup? http://www.daveakerman.com/wp-content/uploads/2014/09/IMG_0654.jpg
[12:29] <daveake> Yeah no SDR
[12:29] <UpuWork> hey high-flyer I only used that to select the correct value
[12:30] <UpuWork> once you have the right value you can use a fixed resistor
[12:30] <daveake> Just using mattbrejza's app and the microphone
[12:30] <Vaizki> ah ok, what's running on the android?
[12:30] <daveake> Sadly that tablet doesn't have a mic/line in
[12:30] <seventeen> Didn`t know you could change CE. I am trying to read back frequency on "both" chips, just getting zeros.
[12:30] <daveake> But it works amazingly well via the actual microphone
[12:31] <daveake> Pi has 2 CE pins and you just use channel 0 or 1 in your i2c code
[12:31] <high-flyer> ok thanks, can i buy a fixed resistor straightaway or do i need to find that value myself?
[12:31] <seventeen> daveake: your code. looks pretty foolproof
[12:31] <UpuWork> probably need to find it
[12:31] <daveake> I like simple
[12:32] <fsphil> there's always an advanced fool
[12:33] <UpuWork> HI!
[12:33] <daveake> I work on the basis that if I don't simplify things down to my level then nothing will ever work
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[12:35] <seventeen> I`ll get back to you. dave, upu.
[12:35] <UpuWork> Get back to Dave I'm clueless tbh :)
[12:35] <daveake> :)
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[12:54] <Reb-SM0U1C> hello all
[12:55] <LunarWork> hej
[12:57] <amell> <burps politely>
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[12:59] <PE0SAT> .c
[12:59] Nick change: day- -> day
[12:59] <Reb-SM0U1C> no edupic today?
[13:00] <SA6BSS-Mike> nop, maybe tomorrow
[13:04] Nick change: superkuh_ -> superkuh
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[14:22] <SpacenearUS> New position from 03LORA1 after 033 days silence - 12http://tracker.habhub.org/#!qm=All&q=LORA1
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[14:54] <infaddict> so i understand the basics of Yagi antennas (watched some youtube vids etc), but can anybody explain in simple terms what this part of the device is doing? http://www.dl5up.de/Grafik/DK7ZB/PIC00957.JPG
[14:54] <infaddict> i.e. the wrapped cabling
[14:57] <craag> It's a 'balun'. It converts the unbalanced (signal,ground) from the coax into balanced (signal+, signal-) which is what you ideally want for feeding a dipole (the driven element)
[14:57] <craag> However the type of construction pictured doesn't works so well over 300 MHz or so
[14:57] <craag> And the advantage in reception is negligible
[14:57] <craag> So if you're just building a receive yagi for 434MHz, ignore it.
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[15:00] <Ian_> More specifically, the type of balun illustrated is used to choke off currents that might otherwise flow down the outer braid of the feeder, making one of the sides of the driven element electrically longer - a real PITA
[15:01] <craag> Yeah the idea is that it's an inductor, which blocks high frequency RF on the outer braid.
[15:01] <Ian_> Baluns of a different type can also be used to impedence match. As craag says, not required for reception.
[15:01] <infaddict> interesting, thx guys. My yagi is specifically for 434Mhz.
[15:01] <infaddict> for receiving
[15:02] <Ian_> Yagis tend to be for narrow bands of frequencies
[15:02] <craag> Then just connect the coax straight to the elements :)
[15:02] <infaddict> i bought a kit (cos I'm lazy) and the parts are included, so is it worth fitting it?
[15:02] <craag> Erm is the balun rated for 434MHz?
[15:02] <infaddict> its a 432Mhz 50ohm kit so it should be close
[15:02] <craag> If so, then no reason not to as you've got one ready made.
[15:03] <craag> Ah yeah, go ahead then :)
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[15:03] <craag> We were assuming you weren't lazy ;)
[15:03] <infaddict> ok cool, it does help knowing what its there for tho so thx
[15:03] <infaddict> lol
[15:03] <infaddict> i still like to know how things work even if lazy
[15:03] <craag> good to hear :)
[15:04] <Ian_> In a coax, at RF there is effectively three potential currents that could be flowing - on the outer surface of the core, on the inside of the braid and on the outside of the braid.
[15:05] <Ian_> This is due to the skin effect, where RF currents flow on the surface of conductors and not so much, if at all, in the centre.
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[15:05] <Ian_> Not something that needs to concern you at the moment however.
[15:07] <infaddict> Cheers craag and Ian
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[15:35] <Laurenceb> has anyone here got airspy working?
[15:35] <Laurenceb> I've been struggling for two days now, no luck :-/
[15:35] <daveake> Yes, but on Windows
[15:35] <Laurenceb> :-/
[15:35] <Laurenceb> yeah I'm trying on ubuntu
[15:36] <Laurenceb> I now have a dedicated laptop with latest ubuntu
[15:36] <daveake> I had to install the Zadig driver as it wasn't seen otherwise
[15:36] <Laurenceb> but I'm still stuck
[15:36] <Laurenceb> interesting
[15:36] <Laurenceb> the usb is an utter disaster
[15:36] <Laurenceb> how could anyone fail so badly
[15:37] <Laurenceb> it seems to be literally broken on anything accept the developers machine
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[15:37] <Laurenceb> *except
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[15:39] <Laurenceb> guess I should try a dedicated windows laptop instead
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[15:48] <Vaizki> Airspy works for me on Windows and Mac
[15:48] <Vaizki> Zero fuss with it and no drivers were needed
[15:48] <Laurenceb> odd
[15:49] <Laurenceb> what software do you use?
[15:49] <Vaizki> Sdr# on Win, gqrx on mac
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[15:50] <Laurenceb> wtf
[15:50] <Vaizki> Gqrx sucks though compared to sdr#
[15:50] <Laurenceb> which version of gqrx?
[15:50] <Laurenceb> today I've been trying to install gqrx
[15:50] <Laurenceb> no luck so far
[15:50] <Vaizki> Latest in macports
[15:51] <Laurenceb> ok
[15:51] <Laurenceb> http://pastie.org/9874078
[15:51] <Laurenceb> im stuck and out of ideas
[15:51] <Laurenceb> anything welcome as a suggestion :P
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[15:52] <Vaizki> I'm on a phone stopped in a car rest area :)
[15:53] <Laurenceb> heh
[15:53] <LunarWork> bye :)
[15:53] <Vaizki> So maybe later...
[15:54] <Vaizki> I wish sdr# ran on OS X or Linux
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[15:56] <craag> Laurenceb: Are you installing from the ppa?
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[15:57] <craag> Ah looks like you are.
[15:57] <pc1pcl> built-in source types: file osmosdr fcd rtl rtl_tcp uhd hackrf bladerf rfspace
[15:57] <pc1pcl> I suppose you'd want 'Airspy' to appear in that list?
[15:58] <craag> I've got a simple ppa install of it and it has airspy in the list
[15:58] <craag> gr-osmosdr v0.1.x-xxx-xunknown (0.1.5git) gnuradio 3.7.5
[15:58] <craag> built-in source types: file osmosdr fcd rtl rtl_tcp uhd miri hackrf bladerf rfspace airspy
[16:01] <pc1pcl> yup, running Debian Jessie and my 3.7.5 version is also listing airspy, seems Laurenceb has version 3.7.2.1; maybe 3.7.5 can be gotten somewhere?
[16:02] <craag> add-apt-repository ppa:gqrx/snapshots
[16:03] <craag> apt-get update && apt-get install gqrx
[16:03] <craag> is all I remember doing
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[16:17] <Laurenceb> yeah I have that, fixed it now with --force-overwrite
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[16:46] <Phil__> Hi Folks. I am new to ballooning. I would like to link up with someone locally that would be happy to steer me in the right direction. How can I do this?
[16:46] <Laurenceb> has anyone got any suggestions as to why git pull would return 403 unless i use sudo git pull?
[16:47] <stilldavid> which keys are associated with the github account?
[16:47] <stilldavid> and are you pulling via ssh or http?
[16:47] <fsphil> Phil__: where is local?
[16:48] <Phil__> South Lincolnshire - between Grantham and Stamford
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[16:49] <Laurenceb> still david: im just trying to clone ChibiOS
[16:49] <Laurenceb> so I cloned it some time ago
[16:49] <lz1dev> perhaps the repo doesnt exist anymre
[16:49] <Laurenceb> now im trying to pull inside the clone directory
[16:49] <lz1dev> ?
[16:49] <Laurenceb> no i get this error with all git commands
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[16:49] <Laurenceb> I broke something
[16:49] <adamgreig> Laurenceb: lol what have you done
[16:50] <Laurenceb> sudo works fine
[16:50] <adamgreig> try like
[16:50] <stilldavid> can you `cat .git/config`
[16:50] <adamgreig> cd ..
[16:50] <lz1dev> wat
[16:50] <adamgreig> sudo chown laurence:laurence -R gitrepo/
[16:50] <adamgreig> fill in your own actual username and git repo folder
[16:50] <adamgreig> though tbh
[16:50] <adamgreig> 403 isn'tthis
[16:50] <lz1dev> idd :D
[16:50] <adamgreig> it's probably like, only root has your ssh key
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[16:50] <stilldavid> ^
[16:50] <adamgreig> but like... if you're pulling chibios...
[16:50] <adamgreig> it's a public repo
[16:50] <Laurenceb> yeah i already own everything
[16:50] <stilldavid> hmm.
[16:50] <adamgreig> unless you're pulling your own copy of it
[16:51] <adamgreig> could you: git remote -v
[16:51] <Laurenceb> no its public
[16:51] <adamgreig> lol
[16:51] <Laurenceb> I get this for all git stuff
[16:51] <Laurenceb> wget works ok
[16:51] <adamgreig> public but yours?
[16:51] <adamgreig> what are you doing haha
[16:51] <adamgreig> ok
[16:51] <Laurenceb> no, just public
[16:51] <adamgreig> could you pastie.org an example session
[16:51] <Laurenceb> git clone <anything>
[16:51] <Laurenceb> k
[16:52] <lz1dev> but why would it work with sudo
[16:52] <lz1dev> thats very strange
[16:52] <Laurenceb> git pull
[16:52] <Laurenceb> error: The requested URL returned error: 403 while accessing https://github.com/mabl/ChibiOS/info/refs
[16:52] <adamgreig> try git clone tho
[16:52] <adamgreig> (to somewhere else)
[16:52] <adamgreig> i suspect you have some kind of auth configured somewhere
[16:52] <adamgreig> in a way that is bad
[16:52] <Laurenceb> same error
[16:53] <lz1dev> $ curl -I https://github.com/mabl/ChibiOS/info/refs
[16:53] <lz1dev> HTTP/1.1 404 Not Found
[16:53] <Laurenceb> its like proxy is wrong
[16:53] <Laurenceb> yet wget works
[16:53] <adamgreig> do you have a proxy?
[16:53] <Laurenceb> no
[16:53] <adamgreig> maybe git isn't using the proxy
[16:53] <adamgreig> lol
[16:54] <lz1dev> old version of git maybe?
[16:54] <adamgreig> cd /tmp; git clone https://github.com/mabl/ChibiOS
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[16:55] <Laurenceb> error: The requested URL returned error: 403 while accessing https://github.com/mabl/ChibiOS/info/refs
[16:55] <adamgreig> check out your ~/.gitconfig
[16:55] <adamgreig> for anything about github auth, https, usernames, etc
[16:56] <Phil__> fsphil: Any ideas?
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[16:56] <Laurenceb> i have a token in there
[16:56] <adamgreig> get rid of that
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[16:57] <fsphil> Phil__: sorry, not in the area. not sure who here might be
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[16:58] <pc1pcl> Phil__: but I suppose you have more or less the right approach; could try again in a few hours to see if someone 'local' is in?
[16:58] <Laurenceb> too late ive used sudo on it :P
[16:58] <Phil__> fsphil: OK - I'll try posting in the mailing list and see if I can get anything there. Thanks anyway.
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[16:59] <chrisstubbs> Phil, if not, you can learn pretty much everything you need to online
[17:00] <chrisstubbs> ^ Phil__
[17:01] <lz1dev> Laurenceb: also probably a good idea to check if git is up to date
[17:01] <Laurenceb> ok
[17:01] <Laurenceb> its not lol
[17:01] <lz1dev> anything below 1.7 is probably not a good idea
[17:01] <Phil__> chrisstubbs: I've been browsing the UKHAS website, so I've got a good idea where I'm going. Just wanted to chat with someone to get some reassurance.
[17:02] <chrisstubbs> Well fire away with any questions you have in the meantime
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[19:27] <Lunar_Lander> hello again
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[19:48] <Flerb> helloo
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[20:07] <Spike__> HI there anyone out there that give me some advice on which NTX2B I should buy?
[20:08] <Upu> there is only 2 really
[20:08] <Upu> the stock Radiometrix one
[20:08] <Upu> and the HAB Supplies one
[20:08] <Upu> how do you mean ?
[20:08] <Spike__> Well there is a frequency to choose and an frequency agile one
[20:09] <Upu> ok disclaimer I am HAB Supplies :)
[20:09] <Upu> the frequency agile one
[20:09] <Upu> then you can choose
[20:09] <Upu> its the same price as the non frequency agile one
[20:09] <Upu> and works just like a fixed one but I pick more sensible frequencies
[20:11] <Spike__> Sounds good, but what still is a bit unclear to me, but I am a newbe in this field, Isn't there a specific frequency used for the habhub
[20:11] <Upu> nope you just tell habitat what the frequency you're on
[20:11] <Upu> I'll just allocate you a random one unless you specify but I generally say above 434.150 and below 434.550
[20:11] <Upu> less interference
[20:12] <Spike__> Where does the interference come from
[20:12] <Upu> belwo 434.150 household stuff, weather stations baby monitors car keys etc
[20:12] <Upu> its the license exempt band
[20:12] <Upu> losts of crap on there
[20:12] <Upu> above 550 you get angry radio amateurs
[20:13] <Upu> and other stuff that is perfectly entitiled to use the frequency
[20:13] <Spike__> Clear!
[20:13] <Spike__> Maybe you can help with another question as well
[20:14] <Upu> certainly
[20:14] <Spike__> I intend to use a raspberry pi for my balloon
[20:14] <Vaizki> so between .150 and .550 is not license exempt?
[20:14] <Upu> it is
[20:14] <Spike__> but isn't there some code available that I can use to transmit my GPS data over the radio or do I need to write my own script
[20:14] <Upu> just quieter
[20:14] <Upu> there is quite a bit of code around but I would try do it yourself
[20:14] <Vaizki> ok was wondering
[20:15] <Upu> have you bought the radio yet ?
[20:15] <Spike__> no I did not yet
[20:15] <Spike__> but intend to do so
[20:15] <Upu> ok prviate message
[20:15] <Vaizki> ah that reminds me I have to order them from you Upu
[20:16] <Upu> super :)
[20:16] <Spike__> Never mind
[20:17] <Vaizki> don't worry I won't buy them all
[20:17] <Spike__> Although it does not sound that hard to get the radio transmitting the data I was wondered a bit that I did not find a complete description of the solution
[20:17] <Spike__> to build the radio end-to-end
[20:18] <Spike__> Although the its a licence exempt band is it usual that people also transmit some images during the flight (in low res of course)
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[20:19] <florolf> hi
[20:22] <Vaizki> Spike__: SSDV is used for images and it is "on top" of RTTY just like the tracking messages .. so yes it can be done on 434MHz
[20:23] <mfa298> Spike__: people have sent low res images from a Raspberry Pi over the license exampt band using something known as ssdv (not sstv)
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[20:24] <mfa298> and as Upu said above writing your own code is well worth it as you then know what it does. That way there's half a chance you can fix it (or at least work out what's wrong) when you're at the launch site and it's not working.
[20:24] <mfa298> and with a raspberry Pi with Python it's not hard to do something that works - Just start off with something really simple and add to it a bit at a time.
[20:24] <Spike__> yeah right it also half the fun
[20:26] <Spike__> but as most things are quiet well documented it seemed a bit akward that I could not find any information on this part
[20:26] <Vaizki> which part?
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[20:26] <mfa298> and don't be afraid to ask when you get stuck. Most people here are friendly and will try and help if you're stuck with something, they're just not going to do all the work for you.
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[20:28] <Spike__> sounds as a warm welcome thanks
[20:28] <Spike__> for now I know enough and will order my NTX2B
[20:28] <Spike__> I'll get back as soon as I am stuck
[20:28] <Spike__> Thnx so far
[20:28] <mfa298> you'll probably want a gps module at the same time.
[20:29] <Spike__> I already bought one and have it up and running
[20:29] <mfa298> the ones Hab Supplies (Upu) sells are known to work at altitude (a lot stop working at <=18km) and they come on a useful breakout board
[20:30] <Spike__> Thnx I checked on that
[20:30] <Spike__> The only other unkown thing to me is how to build a 360 degree camera on my raspberry pi
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[20:31] <Spike__> but I think I'll test that once I've had my first succesful flight
[20:32] <mfa298> that's harder, you can only have one camera on the Pi sensibly, although you might be able to find a lense to give you that with a single camera
[20:33] <mfa298> depending on what the gps module you've got is and how it's connected you might need to look at how you're getting data from it.
[20:33] <daveake> The wide-angle adapter lenses are pretty rubbish
[20:33] <mfa298> i.e. if it's on the uart you'll end up sharing the uart with the gps and ntx2b
[20:35] <Spike__> you're right, the only proper solution I've considered so far is to use two controller boards at the same time
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[20:36] <jededu> I tested somthing similar to this recently suprised how good it was http://www.digitaltrends.com/photography/create-awesome-360-degree-videos-dslr-gopro-eye-mirror-accessory/
[20:39] <Upu> sorry back now
[20:39] <Upu> ah missed him
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[20:43] <desraino> hi anthony are u there?
[20:44] <desraino> i want ask u something again
[20:44] <Upu> I'm here
[20:45] <Upu> ah hi from GSBC forum :)
[20:47] <desraino> first, my english so bad
[20:47] <Upu> not a problem
[20:47] <Upu> whats your native language ?
[20:47] <desraino> and second, iam new in here
[20:47] <Upu> welcome :)
[20:47] <desraino> indonesian but i tried
[20:48] <Upu> ok yes you best speak in English :) We don't have any Indonesians before you :)
[20:48] <Upu> you don't have much land to land on there
[20:49] <desraino> what if i made my system without ukhas protocol?
[20:50] <desraino> oh what time is now on there
[20:50] <Upu> well I am not an organiser so they will need to advise
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[20:50] <Upu> I will mail them and get them to respond to your post
[20:52] <Upu> ok I asked the organisers to respond to you on the forum desraino
[20:52] <desraino> my team hve made a tracker with offline system monitoring and realtime, its just need visual basic studio, yagi and the radio
[20:52] <Upu> what are you using to transmit ?
[20:52] <desraino> oh thank you anthony
[20:52] <Upu> radio ?
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[20:53] <desraino> ah sorry i meant gps
[20:54] <desraino> gps to yagi and the vb process
[20:54] <Upu> but how are you transmitting the location from the balloon ?
[20:55] <desraino> using 3dr radio telemetry
[20:55] <desraino> 433mhz
[20:57] <Upu> ok
[20:57] <daveake> hmm
[20:57] <daveake> You might want to try doing some range tests, and see what settings get the best range
[20:58] <daveake> Hint: The 250kbps setting isn't going to work
[20:59] <Upu> whats the lowest rate it goes too ?
[21:00] <desraino> what rate?
[21:01] <Vaizki> I don't think it goes below 2000 baud
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[21:03] <Upu> the transmission rate of that radio desraino may be too fast for reliable communcations with the ballon
[21:04] <Upu> you may find it drops out very quickly and we don't want you to loose your balloon
[21:04] <desraino> ah thus conversation getting interesting
[21:04] <Upu> can you get some one to climb a hill with the radio 20km away and see if you can recieve it ?
[21:05] <desraino> but i have to breakfast early, its 4:04AM
[21:05] <Upu> of cource
[21:05] <Upu> course
[21:05] <Upu> come back when you have eaten :)
[21:05] <Vaizki> it's probably not going to work for 20km
[21:05] <desraino> ok then
[21:07] <Vaizki> well maybe with yagi yes it would work to 20+ km hmm.. we tried those on a drone once and they're fine for that
[21:11] <jededu> We had 7km range once with a higain antenna
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[21:14] <Vaizki> patch antenna?
[21:16] <Lunar_Lander> well
[21:16] <Lunar_Lander> http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/0521809266/ref=as_li_tl?ie=UTF8&camp=1789&creative=390957&creativeASIN=0521809266&linkCode=as2&tag=ee04-20&linkId=YMKR5G7S4GXPTRJ7
[21:16] <Lunar_Lander> (unrelated, but I am stunned)
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[21:18] <Upu> I have that book
[21:18] <Upu> 2nd Edition
[21:18] <Lunar_Lander> me too and the 1st also
[21:18] <arko> that's the real holy bible
[21:18] <arko> let there be V=IR
[21:18] <arko> and there was V=IR
[21:19] <Upu> desraino David from GSBC is going to respond to your question on the forum
[21:20] <jededu> I think it was a small dipole
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[21:38] <SpacenearUS> New vehicle on the map: 03DIPERK1 - 12http://tracker.habhub.org/#!qm=All&q=DIPERK1
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[21:48] <infaddict> evening
[21:51] <infaddict> looking for advice on payload box material. guessing some sort of rigid insulating foam but do people buy sheet and assemble?
[21:52] <Upu> UK ?
[21:52] <jededu> http://randomsolutions.co.uk/Random_Aerospace/Stuff.html
[21:52] <Upu> Hindleys Styrofoam
[21:52] <Upu> as well
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[21:52] <jededu> HaHa
[21:53] <infaddict> yep UK thx Upu
[21:53] <infaddict> aha payload boxes!
[21:53] <Upu> http://www.hindleys.com/index.php/materials/plastics-foam/sheet/styrofoam-high-density-polystyrene-foam.html
[21:54] <Upu> thats great stuff as you can make it any size you want
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[21:55] <infaddict> cool. and is the foam/poly enough or do I need to add extra insulation (e.g. foil)
[21:55] <Upu> nah
[21:55] <Upu> its fine
[21:55] <Upu> just don't leave gaping holes
[21:56] <Vaizki> umm not sure if you want to faraday cage your box
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[21:56] <infaddict> great. biggest hole will be for camera lense. just bagged a £15 ebay canon camera.
[21:56] <Upu> I'd show you a pic
[21:56] <Upu> if I could remember what my picasa URL was
[21:57] <infaddict> Vaizki, what does that mean?
[21:58] <Upu> serious google + can just **** off
[21:59] <Upu> https://plus.google.com/u/0/photos/118244444241111963790/albums/5721284963524937009
[21:59] <arko> damn i love the hot pink color
[21:59] <Vaizki> infaddict: a faraday cage is a... cage.. of conducting material which will not allow radiowaves in or out
[22:00] <infaddict> ah ok, so how will my radio TX out?
[22:00] <infaddict> via antenna i presume
[22:00] <Upu> yes
[22:00] <infaddict> so what are advantages of that?
[22:00] <Upu> of what ? having an antenna ? You can recieve your payload.
[22:00] <infaddict> sry of a faraday cage
[22:00] <Vaizki> I was trying to say it might NOT be an advantage
[22:00] <Vaizki> to foil the box
[22:01] <infaddict> ah ok, i get you
[22:01] <infaddict> sry i misread your original post Vaizki
[22:01] <infaddict> i read it as advice to do a faraday cage lol
[22:02] <Vaizki> if you have a camera running in the box I'm pretty sure you will have all the heat you need in there
[22:02] <daveake> I've seen a payload that someone made with foil-backed polystyrene foam sheet
[22:02] <daveake> Made him remove the foil :)
[22:02] <infaddict> Upu I see you made some sort of lense connection between camera and payload box
[22:03] <Vaizki> looks like wide angle adapter with home made heater?
[22:03] <Upu> note the camera is in its own compartment
[22:03] <infaddict> yep
[22:03] <Upu> yeah
[22:03] <Upu> didn't work
[22:03] <Upu> don't do it
[22:03] <infaddict> ha
[22:03] <Vaizki> thx for trying it!
[22:03] <infaddict> why didnt it work?
[22:03] <Upu> steamed up
[22:03] <Upu> even with the heater
[22:03] <Upu> it was a UV filter
[22:04] <infaddict> ok so some moisture/dew between lense and filter maybe
[22:04] <infaddict> is it best to just expose camera lense to open air then?
[22:04] <daveake> yes
[22:04] <Vaizki> unless your ebay camera went swimming
[22:04] <zyp> trapping room temp air means trapping moisture
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[22:04] <daveake> buy another one
[22:05] <daveake> Absolutely no point flying a camera if you're going to make it steam up
[22:05] <Upu> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HcbykWjsQrI&ab_channel=AnthonyStirk
[22:05] <Vaizki> that's the one found on a danish beach?
[22:06] <Upu> nope thats the one a boat recovered
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[22:06] <Upu> that was my first flight
[22:06] <Vaizki> you were running video all the time?
[22:06] <infaddict> i'm undecided between photo vs video. was originally planning regular photo taking but video would also be great
[22:06] <Upu> where I did everything wrong :)
[22:06] <Upu> yes
[22:06] <Upu> do both infaddict
[22:07] <infaddict> mmm wonder if the canon hack allows both. i have no comms between camera and by board in my design.
[22:07] <Upu> yes you can switch between video and stills
[22:07] <Vaizki> use 2 cameras
[22:07] <infaddict> or get 2 cameras but weight issues
[22:07] <daveake> On some models you can switch video <-> stills
[22:07] <daveake> But just use 2 cameras
[22:07] <daveake> Easier to balance the payload that way
[22:08] <Vaizki> how long was the flight if you got a powershot doing video the whole time?
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[22:11] <Upu> it was a cheap chinese camera
[22:11] <Upu> that locked out the GPS
[22:11] <Upu> running from external batteries
[22:11] <Upu> ther A560 ran for 9 hours
[22:11] <Upu> took 4000 pics
[22:11] <Upu> loads of it going dark at sea
[22:12] <Vaizki> hehe
[22:13] <Vaizki> so the camera was not shielded and jammed your gps?
[22:13] <Upu> yup
[22:13] <Vaizki> but not on the ground?
[22:13] <Upu> and my code had a padding error
[22:13] <Upu> and I didn't put enough gas in
[22:13] <Upu> and I joined up with an idiot
[22:13] <Upu> but all in all a good flight
[22:14] <Vaizki> what did the padding error do?
[22:14] <jededu> Has anybody used sundancesolar.com for small panels?
[22:14] <Upu> turned coordinates like 0.001 to 0.1
[22:14] <Upu> which is significant
[22:14] <Upu> :)
[22:14] <Vaizki> ahaha
[22:14] <Vaizki> sorry
[22:14] <daveake> And after flying the jammer on an idiot's flight, you gave it another outing on someone else's ... :p
[22:14] <Vaizki> just realized you're basically on the 0 meridian
[22:14] <Upu> yeah funny story
[22:15] <Vaizki> you'd notice THAT here
[22:15] <Upu> so I didn't realise at the time it was the camera
[22:15] <Upu> so we flew it on Daves payload
[22:15] <Upu> and locked that out :)
[22:15] <daveake> I was blaming my code :/
[22:15] <infaddict> Is that camera specific or more general issue?
[22:15] <Upu> cheap chinese key ring cameras
[22:15] <Upu> make very effective GPS jammers
[22:16] <infaddict> lol
[22:16] <daveake> If it's cheap esp chinese you're running a serious risk of jamming the gps
[22:16] <Upu> and the effect is not apparent on the ground
[22:16] <Upu> be warned
[22:16] <Vaizki> infaddict: maybe you can wrap the camera in foil ;)
[22:16] <infaddict> ha good idea!
[22:17] <Upu> http://ukhas.org.uk/_media/guides:paddingerrors2.jpg?cache=
[22:17] <Upu> this is what it looks like when your code sucks
[22:17] <Vaizki> nice
[22:17] <Upu> (not my flight)
[22:17] <infaddict> either your payload was moving like something of FLight Of The Navigator...
[22:17] <Upu> http://ukhas.org.uk/guides:common_coding_errors_payload_testing?s[]=common&s[]=coding
[22:17] <Upu> pls read
[22:17] <Upu> afk for a few
[22:17] <Vaizki> yea so when it would wander from 0.09 to 0.10 it would jump from 0.9 to 0.1
[22:18] <infaddict> yep thx Upu already bookmarked that when I first found the wiki
[22:19] <infaddict> so to minimise moisture i'm guessing you pack the payload empty space with more foam. acts as protection too.
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[22:29] <Vaizki> infaddict: when you go up the air is getting cold & dry
[22:29] <infaddict> yer but relative outside to inside
[22:29] <infaddict> warm air inside, cold outside = bad right?
[22:29] <Vaizki> so yes the air trapped in the box must shed its moisture when it cools
[22:30] <infaddict> yer so the camera hole is probably enough for that
[22:30] <Vaizki> and I don't really know but I suspect it will condense on the box inside
[22:31] <SpacenearUS> New position from 03PI_SKY_LORA after 03a day silence - 12http://tracker.habhub.org/#!qm=All&q=PI_SKY_LORA
[22:31] <Vaizki> upu goes afk but allows us to track him
[22:31] <Vaizki> how nice
[22:32] <Upu> thats not me
[22:32] <Vaizki> oh ok :)
[22:32] <Upu> I'm up north
[22:33] <Geoff-G8DHE_> But it went from you to Dave to Barnstaple!
[22:33] <Vaizki> so the LoRa stuff.. you can only track that with a LoRa hardware receiver right?
[22:33] <daveake> yup
[22:33] <mattbrejza> as it stands
[22:33] <Vaizki> can't decode in software on a pc from audio
[22:34] <daveake> <Upu> thats not me
[22:34] <daveake> nor me :)
[22:34] <Vaizki> yet.. yes I know everything is possible with cpu etc
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[22:34] <mattbrejza> if anyone wants to write a soft version go nuts: https://www.google.com/patents/EP2278724A1?cl=en
[22:34] <Vaizki> so why LoRa in HAB? as a backup tracker radio?
[22:34] <Vaizki> or just for ssdv etc?
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[22:35] <Upu> its very fast for the power
[22:35] <Upu> as it uses all the bandwidth
[22:35] <Upu> all of it
[22:35] <mattbrejza> because you can use a reciever that looks like https://drive.google.com/open?id=0B3Urttk8BK7kellWMkpHUFEwV00&authuser=0
[22:35] <mattbrejza> and you dont need a laptop
[22:35] <daveake> Indeedy
[22:36] <daveake> Makes it so simple even MrBalloon's "friend" could do it
[22:36] <Vaizki> you could build a similar sandwich for rtty reception?
[22:36] <mattbrejza> well...
[22:36] <Vaizki> or am I missing something...
[22:36] <mattbrejza> lots of fsk reciever ICs do eist
[22:36] <Upu> or this http://i.imgur.com/H3A42wI.jpg
[22:37] <mattbrejza> its just they dont tend to work well with small bandwidths
[22:37] <mattbrejza> although some of the SI ones that might not be true anymore
[22:37] <daveake> or this http://www.daveakerman.com/?p=1682 (joins party)
[22:37] <Upu> :)
[22:38] <Vaizki> right, so it's about the level of integration offered
[22:38] <Vaizki> similar to xbee & friends but better range
[22:38] <mattbrejza> tested that antenna yet upu?
[22:39] <Upu> nope
[22:39] <Upu> just got a 434Mhz module on there
[22:39] <Upu> will test the rest of the board first
[22:40] <Vaizki> so can you use the lora module flexibly to send low-rate gps updates and high rate ssdv etc alternatively?
[22:40] <daveake> s/will test/will send to Dave to write the code and test/
[22:40] <Upu> ---/\ this
[22:40] <daveake> :)
[22:42] <Vaizki> daveake: what's the back bar there? gps antenna?
[22:42] <Upu> oled
[22:42] <Upu> display
[22:42] <Upu> GPS antenna is top left
[22:42] <daveake> On mine, there's no GPS shown - it was added later
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[22:43] <Vaizki> I see a max7q?
[22:43] <daveake> The LCD tells you where you are, where the payload is, and the distance/direction to get there
[22:43] <Upu> yeah I had some old ones
[22:43] <Upu> above that
[22:43] <Upu> Taoglas antenna
[22:44] <Vaizki> who makes your pcbs btw?
[22:44] <Upu> Hackvana
[22:44] <Upu> #hackvana on freenode
[22:47] <Vaizki> ok.. and what is the other radio board? looks like BT?
[22:48] <Vaizki> on upu's board
[22:48] <Upu> yes blue tooth
[22:48] <Vaizki> just a serial converter?
[22:48] <Upu> no its so it can send data to phone
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[22:49] <Vaizki> yea but you talk 3.3v ttl serial to it?
[22:49] <Vaizki> and uses serial port profile in BT?
[22:50] <Upu> yes
[22:50] <Upu> basically its li-ion/li-po pass through charger
[22:50] <Upu> regulator
[22:50] <Upu> then an AVR with a radio, BT , OLED and GPS on it
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[22:53] <Vaizki> so spi for lora, serial for bt, i2c for gps and oled is also spi? you're not giving the 328p time to rest there
[22:53] <Flerb> I realised with the ds18s20 temperature sensor, I wired it slightly badly. I hadn't realised it can take power from the serial line.
[22:53] <Flerb> I don't really get how that works
[22:54] <Vaizki> it's explained in the datasheet and app notes :)
[22:54] <Upu> OLED is actually done in s/w
[22:54] <Upu> but yes to all
[22:54] <Flerb> I forgot about pullups then I found out the arduino has one built in
[22:54] <Vaizki> Flerb: don't use parasitic power if you don't have to
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[22:54] <Upu> +1
[22:55] <Vaizki> that's all you need to know! :)
[22:55] <Flerb> Vaizki: I'm not sure if wiring the vcc straight to 3v3 was the right thing though
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[22:55] <Vaizki> why not?
[22:55] <Vaizki> you just need a pullup on the data pin
[22:56] <Flerb> And the uno has internal ones.
[22:56] <Flerb> So I think I'm covered
[22:56] <Vaizki> well I'd still put a 4.7k on the outside
[22:56] <Flerb> I'm not sure how the comic sans on the board will come out
[22:56] <Flerb> I did it as an import bitmap.
[22:56] <Flerb> I just wanted to make the board easy for dyslexic kids to read.
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[22:57] <Vaizki> upu, how strong is the pullup on the 328p?
[22:58] <Upu> I use external on the DS18B20
[22:58] <Upu> never done it without
[22:58] <Flerb> hmm
[22:58] <Vaizki> yea I do too
[22:58] <Flerb> 20k allegedly
[22:58] <Flerb> I guess I'll just tie onto the pin
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[22:59] <Flerb> If I solder the other two in, keep the data one, then solder a resistor in series with it and its pad
[22:59] <Flerb> A guy on youtube did it with the internal one
[22:59] <Vaizki> one-wire is pretty robust especially if your "cable run" is 2cm on a PCB
[22:59] <Vaizki> and you only have one sensor on the bus
[22:59] <Flerb> He actually managed to connect three up. I'll use an external to be safe I think
[23:00] <Vaizki> so it should work fine but I always put in the 4.7k anyway :)
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[23:03] <Flerb> Upu: have you used them on flights?
[23:03] <Upu> all the time
[23:04] <Flerb> Ah OK. Do you use the transistor package ones or the probes?
[23:04] <Upu> SMD
[23:04] <Vaizki> hehe
[23:04] <Upu> on the PITS and Habduino
[23:04] <Flerb> ah
[23:05] <Flerb> Doesn't the smd have more pins not connected than connected?
[23:05] <Upu> yep
[23:05] <Vaizki> just use the TO-92 if you want temp in the box
[23:05] <Darkside> the rest would be for heat conduction i would expect
[23:05] <Upu> SOIC8
[23:06] <Flerb> I will probably make a version of this board with SMD components at some point
[23:06] <Flerb> just need to get a toaster oven and rip it apart and stuff
[23:06] <Lunar_Lander> good night :)
[23:06] <Darkside> or hand solder
[23:06] <Upu> night Lunar
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[23:08] <Flerb> Darkside: hand-soldering surface mount? I'm scared
[23:09] <mattbrejza> they dont bite ;)
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[23:11] <Upu> SMD is easier than through hole
[23:11] <Upu> as long as you have good tweezers and a decent iron
[23:12] <mattbrejza> i wouldnt say its easer than through hole really
[23:12] <Upu> I hate doing through hole stuff now
[23:12] <Upu> mind you
[23:13] <Upu> I just finished a reel of 0603 100nf caps today
[23:13] <Upu> 5000
[23:13] <Upu> assume 1% went "ping" in the tweezers
[23:13] <mattbrejza> if you have stencils for everything then doing lots of SMD is certianly quicker
[23:13] <Upu> yep
[23:14] <mattbrejza> 1% is good going
[23:14] <mattbrejza> so thats about £2 of caps? :P
[23:14] <Upu> good tweezers make a difference
[23:14] <Upu> heck no
[23:14] <Upu> reels of 100nf are £6
[23:14] <mattbrejza> i got one for £2 iirc
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[23:15] <Upu> cheap
[23:16] <Vaizki> £6 for 5000 caps?
[23:16] <Upu> yeah something like that
[23:16] <mattbrejza> not if you use these to decouple http://uk.farnell.com/avx/gx02yd104kat2-500/cap-rf-x5r-0-1uf-16v-0402/dp/2094036 ;)
[23:16] <Flerb> Upu: don't you have a fake chinese oven?
[23:16] <Upu> haha
[23:17] <Upu> its not fake
[23:17] <Upu> its 100% chinese
[23:17] <mattbrejza> they are supposed to be completely flat upto many GHz, so very low ESL
[23:18] <Upu> http://uk.farnell.com/multicomp/mc0603b104k250ct/cap-mlcc-x7r-100nf-25v-0603-reel/dp/2310560
[23:18] <Flerb> Upu: who is it made by? (silly question, underpaid overworked workers obviously)
[23:19] <Flerb> In terms of manufacturer
[23:19] <Upu> The noname shinglonglinglong rubber remould factory
[23:19] <Upu> T962A
[23:20] <Flerb> Any good?
[23:20] <Upu> its ok
[23:20] <Flerb> How much did you pay?
[23:20] <Upu> absolutely stinks
[23:20] <Upu> http://www.instructables.com/id/T962A-SMD-Reflow-Oven-FixHack/step1/Why-So-Smelly/
[23:20] <Flerb> well this is an unfortunate name http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/ELECTROLUBE-EROC500ML-CLEANER-REFLOW-OVEN-500ML-/181209705749
[23:21] <Upu> right I'm off to bed night all
[23:22] <Flerb> night.
[23:22] <Vaizki> aaaand time to sleep
[23:22] <Flerb> think i'll stick with toaster surgery
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[23:23] <Vaizki> Flerb: you can upgrade to http://www.amazon.com/Passion-Natural-Water-Based-Lubricant-Gallon/dp/B005MR3IVO
[23:23] <arko> and great... my amazon suggestion list is messed up now
[23:23] <Vaizki> :D
[23:23] <Vaizki> oops
[23:23] <Vaizki> you didn't guess from the url?
[23:25] <Vaizki> but as evidenced by recent internet address referrals, I really need sleep. now.
[23:25] <Flerb> What was this about? https://groups.google.com/forum/#!topic/ukhas/D0e1atlyLQs
[23:25] <Flerb> 23/17
[23:25] <Flerb> 1.35294117647
[23:26] <Flerb> multiply by ten
[23:26] <Flerb> 13.35294117647
[23:26] <Flerb> subtract ten
[23:26] <Flerb> 3.35294117647
[23:27] <Flerb> round to nearest whole number
[23:27] <Flerb> 3
[23:27] <Flerb> 3 sides of a triangle
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[23:27] <Flerb> ed and upu = illuminati confirmed
[23:29] <Flerb> xoring the two we get 110
[23:30] <Flerb> 110 in binary = 6
[23:31] Action: chrisstubbs has been busy https://farm9.staticflickr.com/8567/16218485270_6e8629875d_o.jpg
[23:32] <arko> :)
[23:32] <Flerb> chrisstubbs: did you use eagleup or something for that
[23:32] <Flerb> R11 is missing, I think
[23:33] <chrisstubbs> Yeah the board was eagleup
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[23:33] <chrisstubbs> nah its in bodge position between R10 and C8
[23:34] <chrisstubbs> Had the boards made before I spotted that cock up ;)
[23:36] Action: mattbrejza has been busy looking to see if i can get a replacement part for our gas oven
[23:37] <mattbrejza> (the answer appears to be no if anyone actually cared)
[23:38] <Flerb> https://www.edx.org/course/electronic-interfaces-bridging-physical-uc-berkeleyx-ee40lx
[23:38] <Flerb> ^ that looked moderately interesting
[23:38] <Flerb> chrisstubbs: interesting - I could never get it to render the actual components
[23:38] <chrisstubbs> Yeah I added 90% of them manually
[23:39] <chrisstubbs> it got the 0603 components and thats it
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[23:45] <Flerb> chrisstubbs: if you're interested - this is an arduino shield i just designed (eagleup model)
[23:45] <Flerb> http://puu.sh/ffNXl/8f666c05ca.jpg
[23:46] <chrisstubbs> Is that comic sans?
[23:46] <Flerb> yes, yes it is.
[23:47] <Flerb> chrisstubbs: I wanted my board to be easily usable by dyslexic kids
[23:47] <chrisstubbs> Think thats the first PCB with comic sans I have ever seen
[23:47] <chrisstubbs> Can I unsee it? ;)
[23:47] <chrisstubbs> Yeah so if you want to stick components on you can grab them from the sketchup warehouse thing
[23:47] <Flerb> ah ok
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[23:47] <chrisstubbs> eyeball them to scale and put them in place
[23:48] <chrisstubbs> does the job for instructions etc
[23:48] <Flerb> I just thought, I could have probably figured out a way to get the red and green leds on a single pin
[23:48] <Flerb> like just red when low, green when high
[23:49] <Flerb> See I thought it was supposed to come with component models
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[23:49] <Flerb> chrisstubbs: howdo I resize?
[23:50] <Flerb> Haven't used sketchup before
[23:50] <chrisstubbs> eagleup comes with a small selection, you can somehow add more but I imagine its a big job
[23:50] <chrisstubbs> tools>scale
[23:51] <Flerb> This will take some getting used to
[23:52] <Flerb> chrisstubbs: if I want to make it parallel with the edge, can I?
[23:55] <chrisstubbs> You can kinda with the edge/corner/face snaps on the move tool
[23:56] <chrisstubbs> but you'd be better off learning it via youtube or something rather than IRC
[23:57] <Flerb> one down http://puu.sh/ffPOJ/d672163b5c.jpg
[00:00] --- Sat Jan 31 2015