highaltitude.log.20150112

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[09:21] <Boelle_dk> Anyone interested in 2 GPS breakouts with Quad-V antenna and from Hab Supplies + 1 Habamp (434 Mhz) ?
[09:23] <qyx_> you trashed your project?
[09:23] <qyx_> it was some ship iirc, wasn't it?
[09:26] <Boelle_dk> ship? no... emm
[09:26] <Boelle_dk> yes i had a project going....
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[09:27] <Boelle_dk> automatic tracker.... so i could just sit home and have a setup in a remote field but with good location
[09:27] <Boelle_dk> i actually was close to having a pan tilt thing going, but it was underpowered for an 8 element yagi
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[09:28] <Boelle_dk> then i started to look at what it would cost to get a decent powered one made and it was to much
[09:28] <Boelle_dk> if then i compared it to the amount of flights over denmark it made no sense
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[09:29] <Boelle_dk> so practically everything have never seen outdoors....
[09:29] <Boelle_dk> and i have only soldered on connectors to get a gps signal
[09:30] <Boelle_dk> i have carefully desoldered everything and cleaned up the boards.... they are like new except for some solder in the holes of the breakouts
[09:31] <Boelle_dk> did not have the right tools to get it all out... but new headers can be soldered in, i will even include some... also included are the battery holders for the coin cell battery
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[09:31] <Boelle_dk> also there are 6 sma connectors.
[09:37] <Boelle_dk> all i'm after is to be able to get one of the pi add-on boards... want to build an NTP server instead... could have used one of the breakouts for that but also have an active antenna and dont want the pi totally up in the window
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[09:48] <LunarWork> helo
[09:48] <LunarWork> +l
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[09:57] <edmoore> helol?
[09:59] <Boelle_dk> ello
[09:59] <fsphil> yo
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[10:07] <storm_> Morning
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[10:30] <Boelle_dk> Anyone interested in 2 GPS breakouts with Quad-V antenna and from Hab Supplies + 1 Habamp (434 Mhz) ? can also throw in a RTL2832U based dongle with adapters
[10:31] <Boelle_dk> nothing of it is hardly what you can call used.... they are simply surplus after i finally ditched the idea of an automatic tracker/listner station... want to build an NTP server instead and for that i need the pi addon board as i will be using an active antenna so i can place the server away from the windows
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[10:59] <fsphil> not sure repeating it here will get you any interest, especially this time of the day
[10:59] <fsphil> try the mailing list
[11:03] <Boelle_dk> mail list? never knew there was one
[11:03] <fsphil> !wiki mailing list
[11:03] <SpacenearUS> 03fsphil: Wiki page 03mailing_list (ukhas) - 12http://ukhas.org.uk/ukhas:mailing_list
[11:04] <Boelle_dk> thank you :-)
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[11:04] <lz1dev> ^ root@
[11:04] <lz1dev> :(
[11:05] <craag> could be in a dedicated irc vm :)
[11:05] <lz1dev> dedicated
[11:05] <lz1dev> irc
[11:05] <lz1dev> vm
[11:05] <craag> probably not
[11:06] <craag> :P
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[11:20] <day> ur just bad users. A pro like him can handle being root permanently
[11:21] <lz1dev> 2privileged4me
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[11:34] Action: Oddstr13 goes to set his identd to say he is root
[11:36] <lz1dev> real man run as root
[11:36] <lz1dev> with sshd allowing root logic
[11:36] <lz1dev> login*
[11:36] <fsphil> rename root to something cryptic, and create a normal user root
[11:36] <lz1dev> and max 6char pass
[11:37] <Oddstr13> lz1dev: are you a real man? and if so, what's the ip of your box? ;)
[11:37] <lz1dev> 1.3.3.7
[11:38] <craag> 127.0.0.1
[11:38] <Oddstr13> nice, that one must've cost you a fortune
[11:38] <fsphil> real men use ipv6
[11:38] <lz1dev> ::1
[11:38] <Oddstr13> no place is like ::1 :3
[11:38] <fsphil> I tried to remember my ipv6 prefix and failed
[11:38] <Oddstr13> fsphil: ip -6 addr :P
[11:38] <fsphil> that's cheating :p
[11:39] <Oddstr13> unless you've got dead:beef::, I don't really consider that cheating :P
[11:39] <craag> 2001:470:1f09:527:dead:ac1d:d0d0
[11:39] <fsphil> 2001:8b0:34:
[11:39] <fsphil> how could I forget that
[11:39] <Oddstr13> easy! :P
[11:39] <lz1dev> a the good ol' 8b0:34
[11:40] <craag> :dead:beef:c0ff:ee is our router :)
[11:40] <fsphil> 2001: was a good year
[11:40] <Oddstr13> I don't really have IPv6 set up anywhere at the moment
[11:40] <lz1dev> you are holding the internet back
[11:41] <fsphil> I've found it handy
[11:41] <Oddstr13> should totaly set it up on my vps
[11:41] <fsphil> not having to deal with nat is brilliant (sorry nats`)
[11:41] <Oddstr13> I had IPv6 tunnel to my home connection back when I played around with IRC shells and such
[11:41] <mattbrejza> do many home isps give ipv6 addresses yet?
[11:42] <fsphil> don't think so
[11:42] <fsphil> my isp is probably one of the few exceptions
[11:42] <mattbrejza> i have one at uni, not sure that counts though
[11:42] <Oddstr13> mattbrejza: not sure if any does that in Norway, maybe one or two?
[11:42] <mattbrejza> lol dont ask me
[11:43] <mattbrejza> you do have free 4G wifi on trains though
[11:43] <mattbrejza> that was nice
[11:43] <fsphil> entanet do it
[11:43] <Oddstr13> I asked my old ISP once, and I was told off becouse I'm not a buisness
[11:43] <fsphil> they're fairly big
[11:43] <Oddstr13> mattbrejza: some of the trains do I think, yes
[11:43] <Oddstr13> honestly I don't really travel any
[11:44] <fsphil> my car has good 3G wifi :)
[11:44] <db_g6gzh> 2001:8b0:3d7 here (well, at home), same ISP as fsphil 8-)
[11:44] <fsphil> yay
[11:44] <mattbrejza> 2001:630: ftw
[11:44] Action: Oddstr13 goes to log in to HE
[11:44] <craag> my car has good 3G wifi with ipv6 :)
[11:45] <fsphil> hah
[11:45] <fsphil> one up'ed
[11:45] <db_g6gzh> mine too 8-)
[11:45] <cm13g09> mattbrejza: 3rd block of that's going to be d0, from memory ;)
[11:45] <mattbrejza> lol yea
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[11:45] <fsphil> which 3G provider is doing ipv6?
[11:46] <db_g6gzh> though I have to tunnel the IPv6 to the car as the 3G doesn't do it
[11:46] <craag> none afaik - openwrt+sixxs :)
[11:46] <fsphil> we had an order done over the 3 network that used IPv6 a while back
[11:46] <db_g6gzh> fsphil: I tunnel a /64 from my /48
[11:46] <fsphil> ah
[11:47] <db_g6gzh> but I'm using a data SIM from the ISP too
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[11:49] <db_g6gzh> HE or sixxs should be able to tunnel to any 3G I'd have thought
[11:49] <fsphil> there are five orders in our system that where made over ipv6. two are me testing
[11:49] <fsphil> that's more than the last time I looked
[11:49] <Oddstr13> I have a currently unused tunnel on HE from back in june 2009
[11:50] <Oddstr13> let's set that one up here.
[11:51] <craag> db_g6gzh: Yeah that's what I use - although I'm using ayiya so there's a fair bit of packet overhead
[11:51] <craag> Haven't tried proto41 yet
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[11:53] <mattbrejza> fsphil: do you sell anything interesting?
[11:53] <mattbrejza> if so i might ++ that :P
[11:53] <fsphil> nah, doors
[11:53] <db_g6gzh> I suppose they might block proto 41 in the 3G network
[11:53] <mattbrejza> oh lol
[11:53] <fsphil> non-techincal customer base :)
[11:53] <mattbrejza> i already have doors im afraid
[11:53] <fsphil> so if I see them using something, I know it's made it
[11:54] <fsphil> only three ipv6 orders in ~5 years
[11:54] <fsphil> it's not made it yet
[11:54] <db_g6gzh> Ooh, according to my home firewall about 75% of my traffic is IPv6
[11:54] <db_g6gzh> that's more than I expected
[11:54] <fsphil> a fair bit of our email comes in over ipv6 oddly
[11:54] <Oddstr13> db_g6gzh: stop torrenting D:
[11:54] <Oddstr13> xD
[11:55] <db_g6gzh> it'll be all the googley things I suppose
[11:55] <fsphil> yea suspect so
[11:55] <Oddstr13> fsphil: is that really so odd?
[11:55] <Oddstr13> most of it is from central rellay servers I would think
[11:55] <Oddstr13> like gmail and hotmail
[11:55] <fsphil> suppose not
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[12:00] <Oddstr13> anyone able to ping solvang.openshell.no?
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[12:03] <Oddstr13> I guess not. That means the ISP router is blocking ping requests >.<
[12:04] <db_g6gzh> no, traceroute goes as far as 93.89.122.168.ip.vitnett.no which is the correct IP but continues after that so maybe ICMP blocked somewhere
[12:04] <Oddstr13> why can't it just forward that along with the DMZ or whatever mechanism it's using :/
[12:05] <Oddstr13> db_g6gzh: could you put that traceroute on http://oddstr13.openshell.no/paste/ ?
[12:08] <db_g6gzh> from my vps - http://oddstr13.openshell.no/paste/VLO49I7H/
[12:08] <Oddstr13> ...that's weird
[12:08] <db_g6gzh> same from home once it reaches telenor
[12:09] <Oddstr13> heh, I guess vitnett is getting their net thru telenor now then
[12:10] <Oddstr13> before it was thru broadnet
[12:10] <db_g6gzh> I assume the ICMP time exceeded never makes it back from the last one and so it keeps going
[12:11] <db_g6gzh> anyway, got to go now ...
[12:11] <Oddstr13> I guess it actually is forwarded, but never rewritten by the nat, or some strange stuff like that
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[12:12] <Oddstr13> man, I should really just rip out that wifi router and plug the modem straight into my gw
[12:13] <Oddstr13> just need to find the settings for the network stuff, as it is static ip afaik
[12:14] <Oddstr13> o well, no HE tunnel for me for now
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[12:31] <SpacenearUS> New position from 03PS-30 after 0321 hours silence - 12http://habhub.org/t/#!qm=All&q=PS-30
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[13:48] <alxwntr> hello folks
[13:49] <alxwntr> apologies for the basic question, but I need to ask about the uBlox 7q
[13:49] <alxwntr> the guide on the ukhas wiki seems to be for the 6q
[13:49] <alxwntr> althoughh it's listed as 6/7/8
[13:50] <alxwntr> on the datasheet for the 7q there is nothing about 'flight mode'
[13:50] <alxwntr> do I still need to set it to flight mode like the 6q?
[13:50] <adamgreig> yes
[13:50] <adamgreig> in the exact same way
[13:50] <adamgreig> it's in the same message
[13:50] <alxwntr> ok cool
[13:50] <adamgreig> the datasheet for the 7q does mention it, you may be looking at the wrong datasheet or searching for the wrong thing
[13:51] <adamgreig> the instructions for the 6 will work on your 7 though
[13:51] <alxwntr> oh right - definitely nothing in this sheet (oddly)
[13:51] <alxwntr> thanks
[13:53] <adamgreig> there are like three datasheets (at least) relevant to the ublox 7q
[13:53] <adamgreig> you want the one that describes the NAV message
[13:53] <alxwntr> ha
[13:53] <alxwntr> helpful...
[13:54] <alxwntr> right - I'll have a search
[13:54] <adamgreig> or NAV5 perhaps I mean
[13:55] <adamgreig> UBX-CFG-NAV5 message
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[13:55] <adamgreig> change dynamic mode to airborne :P
[13:56] <alxwntr> ah got it
[13:56] <alxwntr> it's the protocol spec not the datasheet
[13:57] <alxwntr> cheers
[13:57] <alxwntr> airbourne <2g, I'm assuming
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[13:57] <Upu> 1g should be fine
[13:58] <alxwntr> ok thanks
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[14:01] <Boelle_dk> Q... any ras pi experts that can tell me if my boot sequence looks on? ie the rc2.d folder i renamed the files so they load in order and not on top of each other
[14:01] <craag> what's wrong with the default?
[14:01] <Boelle_dk> my goal is to get network interface up as fast i can and then NTP deamon last just before login prompt
[14:02] <craag> why out of interest?
[14:02] <Boelle_dk> heheeh... i do some data logging and it its dependtant on the time.. ie at reboot i want interface up and then time set before logging starts
[14:03] <Boelle_dk> http://pastebin.com/MZtTYbjk
[14:03] <Boelle_dk> is how it looks now
[14:03] <craag> You could use an RTC?
[14:03] <Boelle_dk> if it does not happen in order it will start out with year 1970 and the data is screwed
[14:04] <Boelle_dk> yep, but i dont have one... my plan is to also run an NTP server on the pi....
[14:04] <adamgreig> alxwntr: I set it to airborne <4g and still have problems, but my things are going at >10g ;)
[14:04] <adamgreig> they are not balloons :p
[14:04] <Boelle_dk> so i might get an RTC with the GPS addon board
[14:05] <Boelle_dk> but do my sequence look total bonkers or should it be ok?
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[14:05] <craag> no idea tbh
[14:06] <craag> If you're running a gps time server, they do best left on for long periods.
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[14:06] <craag> (Not that you'd really notice at an NTP level I suspect)
[14:08] <Boelle_dk> my plan is to let it run as close to 24/7 i can.
[14:08] <Boelle_dk> powerouts etc might slow down that plan
[14:08] <craag> Most reliable way to get the time set correctly before starting your application I reckon would be to poll ntpd, and check that it's synced, before starting your logging
[14:08] <craag> Otherwise everything is just a race
[14:08] <Boelle_dk> but i do have some ups batterys on the table so maybe wire the pi to those and then a charger on via a timer...
[14:09] <craag> And if your dhcp misses a beat on the interface init, you'll be wrong.
[14:09] <Boelle_dk> yeah... you have a point there....
[14:09] <Boelle_dk> that is why i tried to rename things so network comes first and ntp last....
[14:09] <craag> still a race
[14:10] <Boelle_dk> but i agree... it should wait until network is up
[14:10] <Boelle_dk> and retry until its up
[14:10] <craag> let everything do as normal
[14:10] <craag> just look at ntp
[14:10] <craag> wait for it to sync, (offset < 100ms or so)
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[14:11] <Oddstr13> while year == 1970 do sleep(1) end
[14:11] <fsphil> there is a commant to wait for ntp
[14:11] <fsphil> cunningly called ntp-wait
[14:11] <craag> fsphil: Wow
[14:11] <craag> How did I not know about this
[14:11] <Boelle_dk> me wow too
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[14:11] <Boelle_dk> but me also a big noop
[14:12] <craag> (I have a script that polls ntp for sync status :P)
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[14:13] <craag> Boelle_dk: So that is the answer, just run that before your logging :)
[14:13] <craag> It'll hang until the time is set
[14:13] <Boelle_dk> yep...
[14:13] <Boelle_dk> me on a google hunt for how to set it
[14:14] <craag> you run it, when it exits, the time is set.
[14:14] <craag> So crudely you can do:
[14:14] <craag> ntp-wait; run-bo-logging;
[14:15] <craag> and run-bo-logging won't run until ntp has synced
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[14:15] <Boelle_dk> ok... i just ahve to check if the command is there as standard....
[14:15] Action: craag afk
[14:16] <fsphil> could probably sneak it in somewhere in the init scripts, before the login prompt appears
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[14:17] <Boelle_dk> that was my idea.... ie after ntp but before logging starts
[14:22] <fsphil> the pi init scripts call ntpdate iirc
[14:22] <fsphil> so the date should be set even before ntp starts
[14:23] <fsphil> but that script will still wait until it's properly synced
[14:26] <fsphil> maybe not, don't see it on mine here
[14:29] <Boelle_dk> i will try and thinker with it during the evening... right now i just found out my locales fails... ie perl: warning: Setting locale failed
[14:29] <Boelle_dk> i must have removed something
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[14:37] <Boelle_dk> doh... did remove one package to much.... locales ....dooooh
[14:37] <Boelle_dk> *slap in face*
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[14:45] <storm_> @fsphil: I just saw that you launched a project named STORM in 2013, that is it for my unique naming idea... ;D
[14:48] <eroomde> you could always kill him
[14:48] <eroomde> it can be... aranged
[14:48] <eroomde> how about tempest
[14:48] <eroomde> maelstrom
[14:48] <eroomde> blitz
[14:49] <eroomde> arange, arrange. muscle memory ruined by numpy
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[14:52] <storm_> @eroomde: I like malestrom, STORM was for "Stratospheric observations and radiation monitoring" so we will have to come up with a new science description
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[14:53] <fsphil> storm_: you're quite welcome to it :)
[14:54] <fsphil> I make up a new name each time
[14:54] <fsphil> the whole -1 -2 -3 number scheme was too boring
[14:54] <eroomde> marvellous adventure launching envelopes (for) stratospheric radiation obsevration and monitoring
[14:55] <Oddstr13> that.
[14:55] <fsphil> hehe
[14:55] <mfa298> reading some of the scrollback I'm pretty sure more recent rasbian distros have a fake clock script that saves time to a file before reboot so checking for 1970 might not work.
[14:55] <craag> malestrom/maelstrom?
[14:56] <craag> mfa298: Yep - it doesn't.
[14:56] <mfa298> also if you really care about time it can take a while for ntp to be synced properly (clocks could be 0.5s out for 30+ minutes after a reboot)
[14:56] <craag> ntp-wait is the golden ticket though.
[14:56] <fsphil> ntp-wait needs a --good-enough option
[14:57] <storm_> @eroomde: lol, I might acutally use that
[14:57] <LunarWork> talk to you later! :)
[14:57] <eroomde> btw the @ is unecessary in irc
[14:57] <eroomde> most clinets just pick up your nick anyway
[14:58] <fsphil> HAWK - high altitude weather ... komputer?
[14:58] <eroomde> clients even
[14:58] <eroomde> craag, yes your spelling is correct and mine isn't
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[14:59] <craag> Marvellous Adventure, Envelopes a'Launching, for Stratospheric ..
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[14:59] <eroomde> marvelous adventurous envelope launching studying t' radiation oopt' mesosphere
[15:00] <eroomde> it'll only work if you're from the north
[15:00] <Upu> that the Yorkshire version ?
[15:00] <craag> lol
[15:00] <daveake> aye oop an' away
[15:03] <storm_> noob question: does the habhub expect every telemetry packet to be the same length? I want to transmit the individual event informations from the radiation detector and as you can guess the number of events is not deterministic
[15:04] <Upu> no
[15:04] <Upu> variable is fine as long as the document describes them and the checksum matches
[15:04] <storm_> ok thx
[15:05] <storm_> final three PCBs to arrive next week, than the coding for the flight model can begin :)
[15:06] <eroomde> great
[15:07] <eroomde> what radiation detection mechanism are you using?
[15:07] <Boelle_dk> fsphil... have googled for how to use ntp-wait at boot and all i could find was a man page... not an example for how to use it on the pi at boot time
[15:07] <Boelle_dk> could you point me in the right directtion?
[15:07] <Oddstr13> Boelle_dk: welcome to linux!
[15:08] <qyx_> what are you expecting to find?
[15:08] <Boelle_dk> :-P
[15:08] <storm_> @eroomde: PIN-diode array
[15:08] <storm_> it is a RD3024 module from Teviso
[15:08] <Oddstr13> Boelle_dk: just run ntp-wait beofore starting the logging part of your script
[15:08] <storm_> with us-pulse width digitisation
[15:09] <Haxxa> As a kid I don't have access to latex balloons and bottles of hydrogen etc. - how far could a normal helium ballon (alminion or rubber) with an mcu and camera get
[15:09] <eroomde> storm_, is it looking at some medium that emaits light on a collision?
[15:09] <eroomde> Haxxa, look at PS-30 on habhub
[15:09] <eroomde> it's a qualatex 36" off the shelf party balloon
[15:09] <eroomde> alumised mylar
[15:09] <storm_> nope it is just radiation soft (in contrast to what you usually want to use) so that the diodes break through when an ionising particle passes through them
[15:09] <eroomde> hopefully that's good enough for you
[15:10] <eroomde> storm_, ok I see
[15:10] <eroomde> so they're not PIN-type photodiodes but just normal pin diodes?
[15:10] <Boelle_dk> Oddstr13: just run..... yeah got that part..... its the how part i miss
[15:10] <Oddstr13> Boelle_dk: how do you start your logging script, and in what language is it written?
[15:10] <storm_> eroomde, yup
[15:11] <eroomde> ok i getcha
[15:11] <eroomde> cool
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[15:12] <Boelle_dk> Oddstr13: the logging stuff is emoncms from openenergymonitor.org.... it is started via a file in /etc/rc2.d/
[15:12] <storm_> they are somewhat sensitive to electromagnetic radiation, but I believe to be able to handle it by shielding and controlling my rf transmissions (especially from the gsm module)
[15:12] <Boelle_dk> but i want to have ntp wait in place even before i start to install that
[15:12] <Boelle_dk> i dont want it mixed in with the logging itself
[15:12] <eroomde> is this a UK launch storm_ ?
[15:12] <storm_> no Germany
[15:13] <storm_> some time during the summer
[15:13] <Oddstr13> Boelle_dk: I would've just started the script from a crontab, but that's me
[15:14] <Oddstr13> @reboot screen -dmS cruorserv ~/Code/start-cruorserv.sh
[15:14] <Boelle_dk> the logging is a complete package installed via apt-get
[15:15] <Boelle_dk> but oh well.... maybe try and ask in #linux....
[15:15] <Oddstr13> well, modify the init script then
[15:15] <eroomde> storm_, and are you hoping to launch into a storm?
[15:15] <Oddstr13> not sure how it would like having ntp-wait in there
[15:15] <storm_> oh my god, no :D
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[15:16] <eroomde> i've never launched into a storm but it remains on the list of things i'd quite like to do at some point
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[15:16] <storm_> well certainly not a good idea for my first ever launch...
[15:17] <eroomde> no definitely not
[15:17] <storm_> the hardware is quite valuable, so I would like to recover it in one piece
[15:17] <Oddstr13> I would think it could return some pretty interesting telemetry
[15:17] <eroomde> you definitely want to be comfortable handling balloons and not bieng struck by lightning before trying such a thing
[15:17] <Oddstr13> eroomde: well, that's a *thunder*storm :P
[15:18] <Oddstr13> I don't wana be outside in such weather here.
[15:18] <Oddstr13> In fact, I don't really wana be in this location during thunderstorms.
[15:18] <eroomde> sure, i'd want to fly right into the cell
[15:19] <Oddstr13> eroomde: lightning struck less than 100m from the house early last summer
[15:19] <Oddstr13> my ear wasn't quite so happy with that.
[15:20] <eroomde> we get storms near work quite often
[15:20] <eroomde> on the edge of a valley that they move along
[15:20] <eroomde> a lot of the buildings have very heavy lightning conductors around them
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[15:20] <eroomde> on each corner and with copper bars running around the edge like guttering
[15:21] <eroomde> as many of the buildings contain (or used to contain) things that didn't react well to being struck by lightning
[15:21] <Oddstr13> stuff goes boom?
[15:21] <eroomde> yep
[15:21] <Oddstr13> BOOOM!
[15:21] <eroomde> all our test bays have big conductors too
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[15:22] <Oddstr13> Well, I live on a farm in the middle of nowhere
[15:23] <eroomde> those masts are all conductors http://www.spacefoto.co.uk/wp-content/uploads/2011/11/rocket_test.jpg
[15:23] <number10> rocket triggered lightening looks fun
[15:23] <Oddstr13> ..I'm a bit hesitant to puting up antennas cause them thunderstorms
[15:23] <eroomde> and the bays are externally and internally lined with copper straps
[15:23] <storm_> afk
[15:23] <eroomde> you can see them on the top inside edge beneath the water pipe
[15:24] <eroomde> afk
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[17:17] <x-f> http://spaceflightnow.com/2015/01/11/photos-spacexs-rocket-landing-platform-back-in-port/
[17:18] <x-f> not much was recovered :/
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[17:36] <Geoff-G8DHE-Tab> pong Babs
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[18:39] <Lunar_Lander> evening
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[19:54] <mbales__> Woo, my APRS board managed to hit the local igate, one more round of protorypes and itll be flown
[19:59] <jcoxon> congratulations!
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[20:04] <Reb-SM0ULC> mbales__: :)
[20:05] <jcoxon> its not the easist thing to do
[20:05] Action: jcoxon spent a long time working on a aprs board to relay via ISS
[20:05] <jcoxon> with the aim to fly it on a balloon
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[20:37] <manstallion> piinthesky board issues?
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[20:38] <craag> ?
[20:38] <craag> you're having issues?
[20:38] <Upu> hi manstallion
[20:39] <Upu> whats the problem ?
[20:41] <manstallion> With the board connected to a VDU I'm getting pictures being taken every few seconds but no GPS lock?
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[20:42] <Upu> is the GPS antenna screwed in and in a window / outside ?
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[20:43] <manstallion> Yeah screwed into the closest connection to the battery clip and hanging out of the window?
[20:43] <Upu> yes that should do it
[20:43] <Upu> how long has it been on ?
[20:45] <manstallion> Had it runnng for a few hrs before xmas - just picking it up again - I'll leave it on again and catch up over the next few days if still an issue
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[20:45] <Upu> well it shouldn't take days
[20:45] <Upu> 5 mins max but it does depend on the sky view
[20:45] <Upu> the antenna is an active patch so ensure its magnet side down
[20:45] <Upu> and has a clear view of the sky
[20:46] <Upu> and is away from any thing that can interfere like the camers etc
[20:46] <manstallion> Will do - thanks
[20:46] <Upu> check the SMA connector is securely in place too
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[20:50] <daveake> I was about to ask about power ....
[20:50] <daveake> .... if it's a model B and a chinese crappo USB PSU then that might affect the GPS
[20:52] <Upu> oh yes power it from batteries
[20:52] <mbales__> UPU, what was teh site you sell from again?
[20:52] <craag> You guys really have picked a challenging product to sell
[20:53] <craag> / support
[20:53] <Upu> http://ava.upuaut.net/store
[20:53] <Upu> yeah thats why Dave is doing the support :)
[20:54] <mbales__> awesome, thanks
[20:54] <daveake> ha!
[20:54] <mbales__> nearly time for some more gps modules / hx1's
[20:54] <daveake> support and angrymails, that's me
[20:54] <craag> lol
[20:55] <craag> well you asked for it with all that pi fame ;)
[20:55] <Upu> cheers mbales__ :)
[20:55] <daveake> That was just the 2nd time in 35 years of dealing with customers that I've turned into MrAngry
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[20:56] <craag> yeah that was understandable
[20:56] <craag> s/understandable/deserved/
[20:56] <daveake> Stupid is OK, ignoring my advice isn't :)
[20:56] <daveake> well the combination isn't
[20:57] <mfa298> if someone did an angrymails game that could be very popular with support people. Maybe fire bad emails at end users.
[20:57] <mbales__> time to dig into the datasheet to see if the M* is all that different from the 7
[20:57] <mbales__> of wait, says right there it is
[20:57] <lz1dev_> ps-30 seems scared of entering south africa :(
[20:58] <daveake> ebola
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[20:58] Nick change: day- -> day
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[21:00] <mbales__> finally got a round to a real world battery test. WIth the current setup a 9V will run it for about 6 hours, sent out for a new board thatll let me off AAs and should last way longer
[21:00] <craag> mbales__: What's this for?
[21:02] <mbales__> its a very tiny APRS board (being stateside and all) about the footprint of a AA battery
[21:02] <craag> oh nice!
[21:03] <craag> si406x?
[21:03] <mbales__> goal is to fly for cheap on smaller balloons with less helium. As weel as to include everything you need on one board (temp/pressure/humidity sensors and on the next version a camera)
[21:04] <mbales__> hx1 for now, im working on my own radio module for future versions
[21:04] <Upu> desolder the case from the HX1
[21:04] <Upu> saves a few g
[21:04] <mbales__> i was wondering about that
[21:04] <mbales__> good to know its doable without breaking things
[21:05] <Upu> I'll do it for you prior to shipping if you want
[21:05] <mbales__> nice! ill have to keep that in mind
[21:05] <mattbrejza> use lead free solder
[21:05] <mattbrejza> its lighter
[21:05] <mattbrejza> (i assume)
[21:05] <mbales__> haha
[21:05] <mbales__> may well be but thats a bit more extreme than im looking to do
[21:05] <Upu> I tried that on the pava
[21:06] <Upu> it didn't make any difference :)
[21:06] <mbales__> maybe thinener substrate than FR4
[21:06] <mbales__> excellent, did you do it with a hot air iron?\
[21:06] <Upu> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Zh2dYZHYrDw&ab_channel=AnthonyStirk
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[21:06] <Upu> thats a decased HX1
[21:07] <mbales__> very cool, i also wanted to look under the hood a bit and see how theyre doing things
[21:08] <Upu> you don't really need 300mW for airborne
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[21:08] <Upu> as Leo demostrated
[21:08] <mbales__> yeah, ive sent up a beacon that was transmitting ~25mw on 2 meter and heard it no problem the whole way up
[21:09] Action: mfa298 wonders how many US hams mis-read the 300mW as 300MW :p
[21:09] <arko> murican powered
[21:09] <mbales__> thats a hell of a transmitter
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[21:12] <Laurenceb_> wut http://hackaday.com/2015/01/12/fail-of-the-week-cat6-coax/
[21:13] <mbales__> i was just looking at that
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[21:15] <lz1dev_> cat6 is not a good coax
[21:15] <mbales__> i cant imagine shielded cat 6 is cheaper than coax
[21:15] <lz1dev_> who could've known
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[21:16] <mfa298> that sounds similar to something I came across at work the other week. USB over some old twisted pair "Computer cable" (probably serial or something similarly old)
[21:17] <mfa298> I don't think the data lines were even on the same pair
[21:17] <mfa298> oddly it didn't work (as I suspected when I saw it)
[21:18] <mbales__> depeding how long the run was it could work, ive made USB cables out of much worse but they were short
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[21:18] <mfa298> there were some interesting solder jobs in it as well
[21:18] <mfa298> and it was a few meters and various joints.
[21:19] <mbales__> yeah that wont work terrible well, anythign over about 5 meters requires a repeater or something similar
[21:19] <mbales__> i have done a USB / ethernet converter and run a USB connection several hundred feet
[21:19] <mfa298> it was probably around 5m total length and into a Pi so not the best of USB host devices either
[21:19] <mbales__> which i believe is about 20kg in metric measurements
[21:20] <Upu> this american is funny. He can stay
[21:20] <mbales__> haha, hooray
[21:20] <mbales__> on that note, so i can tell who is who can all the UK folks queue up?
[21:21] <mbales__> thats an old favorite of mine
[21:21] <Upu> bah dum :)
[21:21] <lz1dev_> this reminded me of a hack i found in bathroom
[21:21] <lz1dev_> http://i.imgur.com/hNG1RAt.jpg
[21:21] Action: mfa298 quickly joins the queue so he's at the front
[21:22] <mbales__> wow, thats quite the exhaust fan
[21:25] JelmerD (~JelmerD@2a01:7c8:aab3:389:5054:ff:fec2:1821) got lost in the net-split.
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[21:25] <Myself> If it works.
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[21:26] <mbales__> ill have to dig up a picture of the access control system at the local hackerspace, its quite the wire bundle
[21:28] <mbales__> and it even mostly works
[21:29] <mfa298> lol, this dodgy mess was also for access control :), moved things around and it now works and much less cabling needed.
[21:29] <Myself> haha, which space is that?
[21:29] <Myself> also, -->#hackerspaces
[21:30] <mbales__> Santa Barbara hackerspace the worlds greatest hackerspace in Santa Barbara
[21:30] <Myself> har
[21:31] <arko> mbales__: doing a launch soon?
[21:32] <mbales__> we plan on doing the global balloon challenge, trying for max altitude. Before that Ill probably do a launch to test this board, likely in february at some point
[21:32] <Upu> oo up against me and Dave
[21:33] <daveake> yeah give up now :)
[21:33] <arko> mbales__: cool let me know if you need someone rxing
[21:33] <arko> i got lots of gear, could listen and help out
[21:33] <arko> just need a heads up
[21:33] <mbales__> will do! you have any flights coming up? Id like to send a few of these around for others to test
[21:33] <arko> i do not
[21:34] <arko> i'm on temporary leaving from habs
[21:34] <mbales__> haha, oh i assure you i have no plans of winning so no need to worry about that
[21:34] <arko> finishing up degree
[21:34] <mbales__> ah sounds about right, thatll eat up some time
[21:34] <arko> http://arkorobotics.com/cubex.html
[21:34] <arko> had that flight a while back
[21:34] <arko> http://wiki.032.la/habex2
[21:35] <arko> lots of fun
[21:35] <mbales__> very cool, I like the design
[21:35] <arko> had a friend drive up a mountain in SB to rx the cubex image data
[21:36] <mbales__> what transmitter are you using on that baord?
[21:37] <arko> si4464 i think
[21:37] <arko> http://hackaday.io/project/270-cubex
[21:37] <arko> i just knocked off the upu/leo design
[21:37] <Upu> https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/63720513/Images/PAVA9/Scan035.jpg
[21:38] <arko> ^ booya
[21:41] <Laurenceb_> http://www.pervices.com/products-crimson/
[21:41] <Laurenceb_> drool
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[21:45] <mbales__> nice!
[21:45] <mbales__> i like the breakaway programmer
[21:54] <mbales__> Upu, whats your height record?
[21:54] <Upu> err I'm ...
[21:54] <mbales__> not looking for trade secrets, just want to know what i have to beat, haha
[21:54] <Upu> 6th in the world
[21:54] <mbales__> wow
[21:54] <Upu> 142181 feet
[21:54] <theRealSIbot> In real units: 142181 ft = 43.3 km
[21:54] <mbales__> wow
[21:55] <mbales__> thats a big number
[21:55] <Upu> Dave did 143172feet
[21:55] <theRealSIbot> In real units: 143172 ft = 43.6 km
[21:55] <mbales__> haha
[21:55] <mbales__> i like the bot
[21:55] <Upu> :)
[21:55] <mbales__> i havent broken 110,000 feet yet, ive got some work to do
[21:55] <theRealSIbot> In real units: 110,000 ft = 33.5 km
[21:55] <Upu> no real secret
[21:55] <Upu> use a light payload
[21:55] <Upu> large balloon
[21:56] <Upu> and hydrogen
[21:56] <mattbrejza> 2012 vintage 1600g balloons
[21:56] <Upu> and low ascent rate
[21:56] <Upu> yes that too
[21:56] <Upu> if you have one
[21:56] <mfa298> mbales__: admiting to that might mean you have to hand back your US citezenship, I'm not sure they allow metric over there :p
[21:56] <Upu> you've won
[21:56] <Upu> amusingly (to me) my payload was so light it didn't register on Arhab's imperial units
[21:56] <mbales__> ah, good to know i was thinking along those lines
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[21:57] <mbales__> :( but that only leaves me 3 other countries to go to that dont use SI
[21:57] <Upu> you and North Korea isn't it ?
[21:57] <mattbrejza> na north korea isnt that backward
[21:57] <Upu> http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/a/ab/Metric_system_adoption_map.svg/2000px-Metric_system_adoption_map.svg.png
[21:57] <mbales__> i thought myanmar / burma did too
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[21:58] <mbales__> unless you count using stone as a measurement
[21:58] <jededu> Smallest/lightest one yet :) http://gerblook.org/pcb/i778Go5riaE3hkSKDq9p35#front
[21:58] <mbales__> whats the dimensions on that?
[21:59] <Upu> DL7AD link your payload pls :)
[21:59] <mfa298> come to the UK we have a great hab conference and like to confuse people with our random mix of imperial and metric
[21:59] <mbales__> haha
[21:59] <Upu> yeah
[21:59] <mbales__> hooray
[21:59] <Upu> basically if I drink - imperial
[21:59] <Upu> if I speed - imperial
[21:59] <Upu> if I go sideways - imperial
[21:59] <Upu> if I go up - metrix
[21:59] <Upu> metric
[21:59] <Upu> if I buy meat - metric
[22:00] <mfa298> I buy petrol in metric but measure distance and fuel using in miles and mpg
[22:00] <mattbrejza> routing pcbs?
[22:00] <Upu> if I weigh myself - imperial
[22:00] <Upu> metric mattbrejza
[22:00] <mattbrejza> im imperial
[22:00] <mattbrejza> but metric weight
[22:00] <mattbrejza> and imperial height
[22:00] <mbales__> 6 ft sounds way better than ~2 meters
[22:00] <theRealSIbot> In real units: 6 ft = 1.83 m
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[22:02] <mfa298> and buying milk is either metric or imperial depending on which shop you go to.
[22:02] <mbales__> thats painfully complicated
[22:02] <mfa298> although randomly 2L of milk usually costs more than 4 pints (2.2L)
[22:03] <mbales__> i prefer: all science = metric, everything else imperial, especially temperature
[22:03] <qyx_> temperature is not scientific enough?
[22:03] <Reb-SM0ULC> mfa298: i guess imperial pints?
[22:03] <mattbrejza> also british pints are larger than american pints
[22:03] <mbales__> degrees celcius is not precise enough for my likeing
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[22:03] <mbales__> liking
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[22:04] <mfa298> Reb-SM0ULC: British Pint of course. Especially if it's Beer :)
[22:04] <mbales__> too many decimals
[22:05] <Reb-SM0ULC> 1 us pint ~= 0.83267418463 imperial pints, mm, great
[22:05] <Reb-SM0ULC> (liquid volume..)
[22:05] <RikusW> lz1dev_: no ebola around here I know of
[22:05] <mbales__> oh and for programming the FFF system
[22:06] <mbales__> firkin, furlong, fortnight
[22:06] <mbales__> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/FFF_system
[22:06] <mfa298> I'll stick to my British Pint and tasty may it be!
[22:07] <jededu> 60mm x 16mm
[22:07] <lz1dev_> RikusW: yeh thats not a problem since it's not airborne :)
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[22:08] Action: RikusW is South African
[22:08] <mbales__> youve got me beat on the width
[22:08] <craag> jededu: What step up are you using?
[22:08] <lz1dev_> RikusW: nice to meet you south africa
[22:09] <jededu> tps61016
[22:09] <craag> cheers
[22:09] <mbales__> RikusW, i believe my boss is from zinkwazi
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[22:10] <RikusW> I heard something about Google and wifi internet on balloons ?
[22:10] <mbales__> project loon: http://www.google.com/loon/
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[22:13] <RikusW> Interesting that they want to use LTE
[22:14] <RikusW> Is such a project feasible ?..
[22:14] <mbales__> theyve done some test flights, i know that much
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[22:15] <mfa298> they've done quite a lot of test flights.
[22:15] <RikusW> I will be more than happy if it works :)
[22:15] Action: RikusW only got gprs at present...
[22:15] <craag> afaik they have LTE working to OTS handsets on the ground
[22:15] <mfa298> it's a pretty big payload as well so more things possible than the hobbyist can do
[22:15] <craag> ~2Mbps throughput to the handsets
[22:15] <lz1dev_> mfa298: i think the biggest problem is that it moves around
[22:16] <lz1dev_> unless they plan to release hunderds of the things
[22:16] <craag> They already have :)
[22:16] <mbales__> if i remember right the idea was to create a mesh network of the things eventually
[22:16] <mfa298> lz1dev_: I think that's the general idea.
[22:16] <craag> You guys should have been at the conf this year
[22:16] <craag> (2014)
[22:17] <lz1dev_> its 2015 craag
[22:17] <mfa298> plus they control the height so can choose what winds the loon is in
[22:17] <craag> what
[22:17] <craag> noooo
[22:18] <lz1dev_> don't worry, you stop mistyping the year after the first month
[22:18] <mfa298> I think someone suggested that at least one loon balloon has flown for >100 days and I think they were launching several a week (and it's still in a testing phase)
[22:18] <lz1dev_> :)
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[22:27] <Reb-SM0ULC> "capability to launch up to 20 Project Loon balloons every day"
[22:27] <Reb-SM0ULC> as of november
[22:31] <edmoore> that's a good chunk of gas
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[22:34] <RikusW> what type of gas is normally used ? He is quite expensive afaik
[22:34] <RikusW> H can go boom...
[22:34] <daveake> He
[22:35] <RikusW> Is there any reason not to use H on unmanned balloons ?
[22:35] <edmoore> not really
[22:35] <edmoore> for giant ones, there might be range safety issues?
[22:35] <edmoore> probably not for fundamental reasons but more just for beaurocratic reasons
[22:36] <edmoore> but i'd certainly just use H for habbing
[22:36] <RikusW> red tape again...
[22:37] <RikusW> habbing ?
[22:38] <daveake> High Altitude Ballooning
[22:38] <edmoore> high altitude ballooning
[22:38] <RikusW> ah
[22:39] <mfa298> snap (can I win if I didn't say the matching sentence ?)
[22:39] <edmoore> ''.join(word[0].toupper() for word in mylastmessage)
[22:39] <mfa298> as loon can control their balloons they can potentially bring them in for recovery so less wasteful of gas
[22:39] <edmoore> then snap
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[22:41] <lz1dev_> edmoore: that code won't work
[22:41] <edmoore> yes i know
[22:41] <edmoore> i just thought about it
[22:41] <edmoore> total bs
[22:41] <Myself> Meteorlogical balloons have long switched over to hydrogen.
[22:42] <michemto> Hey, anyone knows who is the author of ukhas logo=
[22:43] <edmoore> ' '.join(word[0].upper()+word[1:] for word in "high altitude ballooning".split(' '))
[22:43] <edmoore> however
[22:43] <edmoore> apparently from googling you can just do "high altitude ballooning".title()
[22:44] <edmoore> and yes
[22:44] <edmoore> works for me
[22:44] <edmoore> heh
[22:44] <edmoore> learnt something
[22:44] <lz1dev_> TIL :P
[22:45] <lz1dev_> michemto: i would guess danielsaul
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[22:47] <edmoore> also i think i just gave the default arguement to split in the generator above
[22:47] <edmoore> so probs redundant
[22:47] <edmoore> unlike a spell chacker
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[23:11] <Scott85> is this price a mistake? http://www.amazon.co.uk/gp/product/B007YQZUEE
[23:11] <Scott85> I paid £15 for one a few weeks back
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[23:12] <daveake> There are many clones for less, but that seems a good price for a Sparkfun model
[23:12] <daveake> btw better to get the 3V3/8MHz model
[23:13] <Scott85> yeah, but I've already built all my kit for 5v :(
[23:14] <Scott85> got the hab supplies parts
[23:15] <daveake> Shame. 3V3 means you don't have to mess around with / pay for level converters
[23:16] <Lunar_Lander> good night!
[23:16] <Scott85> well I see this one has input of 7v-9v which is perfect for what I already have
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[23:16] <Scott85> 6*1.5v AA Energizer Lithium
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[23:16] <Scott85> apparently the level converter on the mini is more efficient than the uno?
[23:17] <daveake> Another advantage for the 3V3 model - 4 AAAs is enough
[23:17] <daveake> All linear regulators are basically the same efficiency
[23:17] <daveake> Difference is that the good ones have a low drop-out voltage
[23:18] <daveake> Meaning that they'll maintain output voltage for longer as the battery discharges
[23:18] <Scott85> ah right, so not the 1.2v difference?
[23:18] <Scott85> makes sense
[23:18] <daveake> 0.2V more like
[23:19] <daveake> I've run a tracker on 3V going in to the regulator on an Arduini mini pro (3V3 model)
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[23:19] <daveake> and 3V on 4 lithiums is pretty much the end of their life
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[23:20] <Scott85> wow, that's good
[23:21] <Scott85> I still don't understand how they make these Li batteries 1.5v?
[23:22] <Scott85> I've had rc cars and helicopters and the Li batteries are always in multiples of 3.7v
[23:22] <daveake> Different chemistry
[23:22] <craag> It's a different chemistry from Li+/LiPo
[23:22] <daveake> These are lithium-iron disulfide
[23:22] <craag> The haven't got many characteristics in common tbh
[23:23] <Scott85> oh ok
[23:23] <daveake> They're about 1.83V when fresh, but quickly drop
[23:23] <Scott85> yes, I also picked up that the voltage was over 1.7 each when I started
[23:24] <Scott85> looking forward to eventually get this balloon off the ground :)
[23:25] <Scott85> had everything working great on proto, arduino uno as tracker, then when I soldered it all together it was unstable, would just freeze after a couple of hours
[23:27] <Scott85> so putting another one together with a pro mini instead, I just wrecked the one I ordered last week though, soldered the header on skew and then tried to straighten it afterwards, it didn't go well :(
[23:28] <daveake> oops
[23:28] <daveake> Best to solder 1 pin, then melt/adjust if it's not straight, then do the other pins
[23:29] <Scott85> that's a good idea, I'll do that for the next one
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[23:30] <Scott85> I've just ordered 3, so lots of room for mistakes
[23:30] <Scott85> good night all
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[23:36] <mfa298> for larger headers (e.g. the Pi 26/40 pin header) I tend to do one corner first then melt that solder again whilst straightening it out, then do the opposite corner, check it, then do all the rest of the pins
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[23:47] <mbales__> i like to put the pins into a breadboard, put your board on top and solder that way, nice straight pins everytime
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[23:48] <daveake> finally, a use for breadboard :)
[23:49] <mbales__> theyre great for designing circuits that only work on breadboards
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[23:50] <mbales__> i cant count how many times something works great on a breadboard but refuses to work on a pcb
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[23:54] <mfa298> that probably means it's working due to magic wowo rather than any sort of electronic design / principles
[23:55] <mbales__> haha
[00:00] --- Tue Jan 13 2015