highaltitude.log.20141114

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[04:18] <SpacenearUS> New position from 03B-64 after 036 hours silence - 12http://habhub.org/mt/?focus=B-64
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[05:00] <lz1dev> !whereis b-64
[05:00] <SpacenearUS> 03lz1dev: 03B-64 is over 03Y1ld1zeli, Sivas Province, Turkey 10(40.06819,36.6559) at 0312782 meters
[05:10] <Myself> it's spending its time in turkey... what's the ground speed lately?
[05:13] <Myself> hmm, 12m/s is 43 km/hr
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[05:43] <Rebounder> that was slow
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[07:01] <SpacenearUS> New vehicle on the map: 03CALLSIGN123_chase - 12http://habhub.org/mt/?focus=CALLSIGN123_chase
[07:03] <SpacenearUS> New position from 03EDUPIC8 after 0312 hours silence - 12http://habhub.org/mt/?focus=EDUPIC8
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[10:25] <countrylad> Hello, this is my first time using IRC and also my first time looking into HAB so please excuse my basic understanding. I am on here because my young son has a theme of "flight" this term at school and I thought it would be amazing if I could tie in with this and do a basic HAB launch with him and his friends. I would be very grateful for any advice anyone can give me as to where to start. We are based in the UK on the Bedfor
[10:25] <countrylad> Thanks in advance.
[10:25] <UpuWork> hi countrylad
[10:25] <UpuWork> you're in the right place
[10:26] <UpuWork> Best place to start is http://www.ukhas.org.uk/general:beginners_guide_to_high_altitude_ballooning
[10:27] <UpuWork> do you think you can make it across to Ross on Wye for about 10:30 on Sunday morning ?
[10:27] <UpuWork> You can come see a launch and have a chat
[10:28] Action: daveake wakes up
[10:28] <daveake> np btw :)
[10:28] <Geoff-G8DHE-M> Morning all
[10:29] <UpuWork> morning Geoff
[10:29] <Geoff-G8DHE-M> don't blind me till I've had a second cup of coffee please!
[10:30] <amell> lol
[10:30] <amell> youre launching this sunday? I thought it was a bit windy&. goes and looks
[10:31] <amell> oh yeah, its not too bad isnt it. surprised after todays weather
[10:32] <UpuWork> yeah will be launching many things
[10:32] <amell> and getting many things back hopefully.
[10:32] <UpuWork> Pits superleggera http://i.imgur.com/PwV42QX.jpg
[10:33] <amell> ??? what is that daughterboard in the middle?
[10:33] <WillDWork> i like the stand-offs
[10:33] <craag> pico-ish :)
[10:33] <UpuWork> super light ones :)
[10:33] <UpuWork> its an MTX2 with its case off
[10:33] <craag> amell: Stripped MTX2
[10:33] <Geoff-G8DHE-M> LED's even
[10:33] <UpuWork> 1.2g saved
[10:33] <amell> im confused. is that a pi or not?
[10:33] <UpuWork> A+ under there yes
[10:33] <amell> are they a lot smaller?
[10:33] <Geoff-G8DHE-M> powered by a PP3 ?
[10:33] <UpuWork> 4 x AA in a holder
[10:34] <UpuWork> in theory we could do 2 x AA for about 6 hours
[10:34] <UpuWork> Shuts off @ 2.7V in put
[10:34] <countrylad> great, thanks upuwork, may be a struggle for this Sunday but I will certainly see if it is possible. Thank you very much for the invite.
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[10:34] <amell> oh wow. i hadnt seen the A+ missed that one.
[10:34] <UpuWork> no problems countrylad, if nothing else pop on here on Sunday morning
[10:34] <UpuWork> there will be lots going on
[10:35] <amell> A+ looks ideal for hab.
[10:35] <UpuWork> yeah it only uses 91mA via that regulator too
[10:35] <daveake> "only" :)
[10:35] Action: daveake awaits ed's input :)
[10:35] <UpuWork> well thats sod all compared to a B :)
[10:35] <daveake> true
[10:35] <daveake> less chance of an inferno
[10:35] <amell> am sure you can get it down more with some careful cutting...
[10:36] <UpuWork> we (Dave) still needs to implement GPS power saving
[10:36] <amell> The audio circuit incorporates a dedicated low-noise power supply. - do you need this?
[10:36] <WillDWork> nice looking 'HAT'
[10:36] <daveake> Not been much point before
[10:36] <UpuWork> fab didn't mitre the edges WillDWork
[10:36] <UpuWork> Already been told off by Eben
[10:36] <daveake> :)
[10:37] <WillDWork> not quite to standard - v2.1 required
[10:37] <UpuWork> Well its not a HAT
[10:37] <amell> £14 for an A+ - damn
[10:37] <UpuWork> as it doesn't have EEPROM and we are planning on stacking
[10:37] <UpuWork> and HAT spec doesn't support stacked boards
[10:37] <UpuWork> physically its HAT spec though
[10:38] <amell> are you launching a picam at all?
[10:38] <UpuWork> yeah it will have camera on it if we launch
[10:38] <UpuWork> be rude not too
[10:38] <amell> indeed
[10:38] <daveake> 3 Pi cams in total
[10:38] <edmoore> i have no input
[10:38] <edmoore> play your games
[10:38] <UpuWork> lol
[10:38] <daveake> :)
[10:39] <amell> can you get power consumption down further by removing or cutting components?
[10:39] <UpuWork> http://imgur.com/AYfazFz,zmA8MeF after and before
[10:39] <WillDWork> what's getting stacked on top? future plans?
[10:39] <UpuWork> HX1
[10:39] <UpuWork> Lora
[10:40] Action: amell wonders how heavy the 40 pin GPIO is.
[10:40] <fsphil> seems Philae may have moved a bit
[10:40] <daveake> not very
[10:40] <UpuWork> ooo linky fsphil ?
[10:40] <amell> fsphil: to more sunlight?
[10:40] <daveake> I removed most of the pins from a model A for one flight
[10:40] <jcoxon> fsphil, they are saying it might be more the orbiter has changed its orbit
[10:40] <fsphil> yea just saw that
[10:40] <fsphil> ah well
[10:41] <amell> oh, they are going to start drilling...
[10:41] <daveake> they might as well
[10:41] <amell> need a hammer drill to ping it out of the cave.
[10:42] <fsphil> surprised 2 hours of sunlight a day isn't enough to do something with the lander
[10:42] <daveake> yeah
[10:42] <Geoff-G8DHE-M> It takes quite a bit to keep it warm
[10:42] <edmoore> probably needs a baseline to keep the thermal system going
[10:42] <daveake> ko
[10:42] <daveake> ok
[10:42] <jcoxon> basically we are proving that the film armageddon would work
[10:42] <amell> it will get closer to earth and gets warmer, wonder if it is able to wake up when conditions suit.
[10:42] <jcoxon> and bruce willis is the hero that we've always suspected
[10:42] <UpuWork> we had to prove that ?
[10:42] <Geoff-G8DHE-M> the MUPUS electronics were at -140 they had to warm to-48 before starting
[10:43] <amell> they should have called leobodnar in to design the electronics.
[10:43] <fsphil> to be fair, this was built over 10 years ago
[10:43] <daveake> If it comes to "landing, then taking off, then landing again but not sure where before running out of power", didn't edupic already do that?
[10:44] <amell> yes, it was designed in 1999. scary.
[10:44] <edmoore> leo doesn't quite have the thermal issues that phillae has
[10:44] <Geoff-G8DHE-M> and that is using known products as well so 5 year old designs before starting
[10:44] <fsphil> "On the other hand, here at #esoc people are sure it's not a change in @ESA_Rosetta orbit that's altered the signal" -- chris lintott
[10:45] <amell> fsphil: is that twitter?
[10:45] <fsphil> yea
[10:45] <fsphil> so it must be true
[10:45] <Geoff-G8DHE-M> reddit and twitter
[10:45] <Geoff-G8DHE-M> http://www.reddit.com/live/tw0cnch7nxjx/
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[10:45] <amell> its hard to find the stuff about comets because of some stupid womans huge butt.
[10:46] <DL7AD> !hysplit B-64
[10:46] <SpacenearUS> 03DL7AD: HYSPLIT for 03B-64 - 12http://spacenear.us/tracker/hysplit_cache/141114-04_18097_B64.gif
[10:48] <amell> The lander can hibernate and may likely still work several monthes from now, even if under limited power. thats promising.
[10:49] <edmoore> suspect her bottom has a higher escape velocity than 67p at least
[10:50] <Oddstr13> http://puu.sh/cQfGK/02ecba3be9.png What is the signal to the right there? Left one is JT65 I'm tuned to 28.076 MHz
[10:50] <Geoff-G8DHE-M> very narrow shift
[10:52] <edmoore> littlechefs
[10:52] <edmoore> it's how they communicate
[10:52] <qyx_> whats wrong with her?
[10:52] <Oddstr13> Geoff-G8DHE-M: Indeed
[10:52] <amell> this is the penetrator https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7Hj5SG-99HE - id hoped it would make the lander jump away
[10:53] <UpuWork> oyxgen thief qyx_
[10:53] <gonzo_> chocolate/pie thief
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[10:56] <diegoesep> article on hackaday.com about my RPI OLED screen in stratosphere:
[10:56] <diegoesep> http://hackaday.com/2014/11/14/throwing-pis-into-the-stratosphere/
[10:57] <qyx_> ok, actually i might be confused
[10:57] <edmoore> i do wish they'd just go under
[10:58] <qyx_> you meant elakdawalla or whatever?
[10:58] <diegoesep> daveake, they talk about your flights too:
[10:58] <diegoesep> Dave] hasn’t stopped launching balloons, either, testing new trackers and radio modules, as well as his most recent build that sent a Superman action figure to the skies—all recorded in glorious HD.
[10:58] <diegoesep> Check out both [Dave] and [Fabrice's] blogs for loads of pictures documenting the latest in High Altitude Ballooning, and stay with us after the jump for a quick video of [Fabrice's] OLED in action.
[10:59] <edmoore> it's almost like you needn't have posted the link
[10:59] <daveake> hah
[11:00] <Oddstr13> Geoff-G8DHE-M: seems to follow the same timeslots as JT65
[11:02] <Oddstr13> http://puu.sh/cQgaC/73d0f70e1b.png
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[11:04] <Oddstr13> http://puu.sh/cQgeF/099c225310.wav
[11:08] <edmoore> this is the cpu on philae if anyone is interested http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/RTX2010
[11:09] <amell> certainly interested.
[11:09] <amell> wondered if theres a radiation hardened ARM
[11:09] <edmoore> 80s cpu
[11:10] <amell> ARM is 80s too :)
[11:11] <qyx_> forth, seriously
[11:20] <edmoore> the 80s cpu comment wasn't wrt to arm
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[11:20] <edmoore> i don't know about rad hard arms amell
[11:22] <edmoore> i can find a document from 2010 saying arm themselves are investigating hardening against single event upsets
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[11:31] Nick change: day- -> day
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[11:47] <LeoBodnar> with the silicon the size of dinner plate ARM can hardly compete against a lowly 8051 or suchlike
[11:47] <LeoBodnar> in the event of radiation exposure
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[13:04] <zjztgj> Are there simple models or to estimate the temperature elevation inside the balloon caused by sun radiation?
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[13:08] <countrylad> Thanks again to upuword for the warm welcome this morning (to recap I have never done this before but my young son has a theme of "flight" this term at school). After doing lots of reading this morning I think the best approach will be to make something very simple to begin with (both for my sake and the children!)
[13:09] <fsphil> always a good plan
[13:09] <craag> simple is good
[13:10] <fsphil> it's tradition for the first flight to be simple and work well
[13:10] <Geoff-G8DHE-M> It might be worth getting one of the cheap and simple RTL-SDR dongles and to track some flights
[13:10] <fsphil> and the second flight to have everything and not work :)
[13:11] <craag> I'd really recommend taking them up on their offer of observing the launch this weekend
[13:11] <countrylad> I was thinking something along the lines of a payload with as much off-the-shelf parts as possible (and ideally already in my garage). I have a small GPS over GPRS tacker and a SPOT satellite tracker in the garage (some where) and was wondering what you thought of something simple based on these and a camera.
[13:12] <craag> They've both got a lot of hab experience and will be trying out some new toys
[13:12] <jcoxon> countrylad, i'd honestly go with radio if you can
[13:12] <jcoxon> and use gsm/gprs or spot as a backup
[13:13] <craag> You'd get to see how much better radio tracking is too ;)
[13:14] <mattbrejza> countrylad: where are you based? there might be some launches near you at some point
[13:14] <countrylad> I really want to go, a small issue is that I promised my daughter I would be at her dance performance thing on Sunday morning. Priorities...?
[13:15] <craag> ah yes, valid excuse then!
[13:15] <countrylad> We are on the Bedfordshire/Cambridgeshire border
[13:15] <craag> There'll be more launches
[13:17] <countrylad> I read about radio trackers, but to be very honest, my lack of understanding worries me. They don't seem to be the sorts of thing I could just pop in easily with little knowledge. (or are they?) At the moment the thought of sending up a baloon into near space is worrying enough.
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[13:18] <fsphil> they're not as bad as they first appear
[13:19] <Geoff-G8DHE-M> do you have any electronics experience ?
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[13:34] <countrylad> sorry for the delay, no Geoff-G8DHE-M, no electronic experience.
[13:36] <countrylad> My other two questions were about the launch site/permissions and helium. I had assumed I would need to apply for CAA permission but saw there are two sites in Cambridgeshire with permanent authorisation. Are these easy to gain access to?
[13:37] <craag> One is run by Steve (randomaerospace.co.uk), the other by CUSF (cambridge uni spaceflight)
[13:38] <craag> Ask nicely and they may be able to help you out :)
[13:38] <countrylad> Regard to helium, is it simple to obtain? There is a BOC "shop" not too far from us which I thought may be the obvious route.
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[13:38] <craag> (they legally need to be present at the launch, so needs to slot into their schedule)
[13:39] <craag> I get the helium from balloonhelium.co.uk
[13:39] <craag> then collect at my local depot
[13:39] <craag> (They buy it bulk from BOC and resell it - through the BOC depot)
[13:40] <craag> The volume of their cylinders is on here: http://balloonhelium.co.uk/main/pricing
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[13:40] <craag> gtg
[13:41] <countrylad> thank you!
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[13:55] <Laurenceb> B-64 reaches Armenia
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[14:28] <SpacenearUS> New position from 03CALLSIGN123_chase after 037 hours silence - 12http://habhub.org/mt/?focus=CALLSIGN123_chase
[14:32] _Paradigm (~Pieter@2001:980:e088:1:6ded:ac48:7b25:b602) joined #highaltitude.
[14:32] <_Paradigm> Hi everyone!
[14:33] <SpeedEvil> hi
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[14:53] <_Paradigm> Is anyone here having any experience with an arduino Uno + ntx2b + ublox neo 6m combo? RTTY works fine with the ntx2b, but when I plug the gps in as well, the ntx2b starts shifting and warbling..
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[14:59] <UpuWork> software serial ?
[15:00] <_Paradigm> I use softwareserial for the gps, yes
[15:00] <_Paradigm> could that be a problem?
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[15:19] <mattbrejza> b-64 has added armenia and azerbaijan to its visited list today
[15:21] <SpeedEvil> and anotehr country yesterday
[15:21] <mattbrejza> it had already been over greece?
[15:21] <UpuWork> yes _Paradigm
[15:22] <UpuWork> it messes with the timing
[15:22] <SpeedEvil> err - sorry
[15:22] <SpeedEvil> I was thinking turkey
[15:22] <SpeedEvil> but it went over last lap
[15:23] <SpeedEvil> I think it's also the first actual datapoint from inside Iran - possibly this trip
[15:24] <SpeedEvil> (I'm not counting great circle extrapolations)
[15:24] <mattbrejza> give it a couple of hours
[15:27] <SpeedEvil> Do we count these as countries?http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nakhchivan_Autonomous_Republic
[15:27] <SpeedEvil> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nakhchivan_Autonomous_Republic
[15:28] <mattbrejza> i think so yea
[15:29] <mattbrejza> or rather, that counts as azerbaijan
[15:32] <adamgreig> oh my god that map http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Enclave_and_exclave
[15:32] <adamgreig> E1 is a counter-counter-enclave
[15:33] <adamgreig> an enclave of E inside a counter-enclave of A which is itself an exclave inside E which is an enclave of A
[15:33] <adamgreig> wtf
[15:33] <mattbrejza> https://www.google.co.uk/maps/@51.4332271,4.9209341,13z?hl=en
[15:34] <adamgreig> oh that's amazing
[15:34] <SpeedEvil> yeah - that's fun
[15:34] <SpeedEvil> Seen that before
[15:35] <adamgreig> i love those things
[15:35] <adamgreig> http://dividedcities.com/ and "the city and the city" by china mieville
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[16:02] <Lunar_Lander> hello
[16:05] number10 (5689d5b6@gateway/web/freenode/ip.86.137.213.182) joined #highaltitude.
[16:06] <Lunar_Lander> comet operations continue with drilling
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[16:06] <Lunar_Lander> hope it works
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[17:18] Nick change: MaXimaN_ -> MaXimaN_M6XIM
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[17:40] <fsphil> evening
[17:40] <Lunar_Lander> hello
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[17:42] <mattbrejza> !whereis b-64
[17:42] <SpacenearUS> 03mattbrejza: 03B-64 was over 03Qubadli, Azerbaijan 10(39.2239,46.6335) at 0312686 meters about 0331 minutes ago
[17:43] <Lunar_Lander> how is everyone?
[17:43] <LeoBodnar> cosmic, Del
[17:44] <ulfr> We're all matter.
[17:44] <ulfr> That's what we all are...
[17:44] Action: ulfr matters around
[17:44] <Lunar_Lander> true
[17:44] <fsphil> matter is just trapped energy
[17:45] <ulfr> Poor energy. :/
[17:45] <SpacenearUS> New position from 03EDUPIC8 after 0311 hours silence - 12http://habhub.org/mt/?focus=EDUPIC8
[17:45] <fsphil> it'll escape eventually
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[18:15] <SpacenearUS> New vehicle on the map: 03SP5NVX - 12http://habhub.org/mt/?focus=SP5NVX
[18:21] <SpacenearUS> New position from 03PI_SKY_PLUS after 033 days silence - 12http://habhub.org/mt/?focus=PI_SKY_PLUS
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[20:31] <mikestir> shhh
[20:44] <lz1dev> !aprs info hb-b-64
[20:44] <SpacenearUS> 03lz1dev: Cannot locate the callsign.
[20:48] <lz1dev> !aprs add m0xer-4 ---------------------------------------------------------
[20:48] <SpacenearUS> 03lz1dev: Added 03m0xer-4 as 10(---------------------------------------------------------) to APRS Importer
[20:48] <lz1dev> crap its actually out of range
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[20:50] <lz1dev> !aprs remove m0xer-4
[20:50] <SpacenearUS> 03lz1dev: Removed 03m0xer-4 from APRS Importer
[20:51] <lz1dev> !aprs add G1RRR-9 --------------------------------------------------------------
[20:51] <SpacenearUS> 03lz1dev: Added 03G1RRR-9 as 10(--------------------------------------------------------------) to APRS Importer
[20:51] <lz1dev> !aprs ping G1RRR-9
[20:51] <SpacenearUS> 03lz1dev: Last contact with 03G1RRR-9 was 0321 hours ago
[20:51] <Laurenceb__> https://pbs.twimg.com/media/B2agO52IYAAV1pY.jpg
[20:52] <SpacenearUS> New vehicle on the map: 03-------------------------------------------------------------- - 12http://habhub.org/mt/?focus=--------------------------------------------------------------
[20:52] <lz1dev> best name
[20:53] <daveake> ------------------------------------------------------------------------haha-------------------------------
[20:53] <lz1dev> http://find-you.com/cgi-bin/msg.cgi?call=KJ4ERJ-HB
[20:54] <lz1dev> it actually checks the length
[20:54] <Lunar_Lander> xD
[20:55] <lz1dev> splits it into two messages :D
[20:55] <SpacenearUS> New vehicle on the map: 03PI_SKY_PLUS - 12http://habhub.org/mt/?focus=PI_SKY_PLUS
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[20:55] <lz1dev> !aprs remove g1rrr-9
[20:55] <SpacenearUS> 03lz1dev: Removed 03g1rrr-9 from APRS Importer
[20:55] <lz1dev> ^ best callsign
[20:59] <Myself> I need to get some new equipment behind the W1RLS repeater, it's dormant at the moment...
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[20:59] <Myself> W1RLS = Wireless = even better :P
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[21:17] <Laurenceb__> has anyone here ever pushed to github from a machine they are ssh ing into?
[21:17] <Laurenceb__> im getting publickey errors
[21:18] <qyx_> use ssh agent and -A param
[21:19] <Laurenceb__> hmm
[21:19] <Laurenceb__> what is ssh agent?
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[21:19] <qyx_> you run ssh agent on your local computer, add your keypair to it
[21:20] <qyx_> then you ssh to your server as usually with -A parameter
[21:20] <Laurenceb__> right
[21:20] <Laurenceb__> how do i get my keypair to my local computer?
[21:20] <qyx_> and if you try to connect to another ssh server from this session, it will authenticate using ssh-agent and key on your local compter
[21:20] <qyx_> huh
[21:20] <qyx_> i assumed that you are already using it
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[21:21] <Laurenceb__> i just ssh <remote machine>
[21:21] <Laurenceb__> then git push
[21:21] <qyx_> and how do you connect to github?
[21:21] <Laurenceb__> and it fails
[21:21] <Laurenceb__> ssh
[21:21] <qyx_> when it doesnt fail
[21:21] <Laurenceb__> but thats all configured on the remote machine
[21:21] <Laurenceb__> iirc its set up to use ssh
[21:22] <qyx_> has it worked yet?
[21:22] <Laurenceb__> it works fine on the remote machine when i am logged in normally
[21:22] <Laurenceb__> git push and it pushes
[21:22] <qyx_> same user?
[21:22] <Laurenceb__> yes
[21:22] <qyx_> whould be no problem then
[21:23] <qyx_> your keys should be in ~/.ssh/id_rsa
[21:23] <qyx_> and available in both situations (local and remote)
[21:23] <qyx_> *would=should
[21:23] <Laurenceb__> so i can just scp them over?
[21:23] <mclane_> someone available who has worked already with the new raspi a+?
[21:24] <qyx_> you don't need to scp them to your local pc if they already are on the remote machine
[21:24] <Laurenceb__> ok
[21:24] <mclane_> can it be run on battery power directly?
[21:24] <qyx_> also, you shouldn't move your private key, it is called private for that reason
[21:24] <qyx_> you should generate new keypair instead and add do github
[21:25] <Laurenceb__> hmm
[21:25] <Laurenceb__> i already have
[21:25] <qyx_> yes, but huh
[21:25] <Laurenceb__> i can push from the local machine
[21:25] <qyx_> just check if your keys are available on the machine you use to push
[21:25] <qyx_> in the mentioned location
[21:25] <Laurenceb__> yes they are
[21:26] <qyx_> then i don't know wheres the problem
[21:26] <Laurenceb__> :-/
[21:26] <qyx_> try ssh-ing to github
[21:26] <Laurenceb__> ill pastebin it
[21:27] <Laurenceb__> http://pastie.org/9719895
[21:28] <qyx_> run with debug3, it will say which key fails
[21:28] <qyx_> also, where are we, we are being offtopic
[21:31] <qyx_> like this https://pastee.org/pb7zn
[21:33] <Laurenceb__> https://pastee.org/xcwc6
[21:36] <qyx_> ah, different name
[21:36] <qyx_> use the -i param
[21:37] <qyx_> ssh -vvv -T git@github.com -i .ssh/gituhb
[21:38] <Laurenceb__> ah that worked
[21:38] <Laurenceb__> lol typo
[21:38] <qyx_> that too
[21:39] <Laurenceb__> oh
[21:39] <Laurenceb__> i see how
[21:39] <Laurenceb__> http://stackoverflow.com/questions/7927750/specify-an-ssh-key-for-git-push-without-using-ssh-config
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[21:40] <Laurenceb__> "Even if the user and host are the same, they can still be distinguished in ~/.ssh/config."
[21:41] <qyx_> didn't know that, nice
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[21:41] <Laurenceb__> so i need to add a "default" host or something
[21:41] <Laurenceb__> ill read the docs
[21:41] <Laurenceb__> thanks for the help
[21:42] <Laurenceb__> atm its localhost only
[21:43] <fsphil> http://blogs.esa.int/rosetta/2014/11/14/philaes-first-touchdown-seen-by-rosetta/
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[21:49] <mikestir> fsphil: do you know when they are expecting to re-establish comms? I thought it was supposed to be around 2100 UTC?
[21:49] <fsphil> next 1-3 hours
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[21:50] <mikestir> hope the drilling worked
[21:50] <fsphil> yea
[21:51] <mikestir> or more importantly that the analysis worked and there's enough power left to transfer the results
[21:52] <fsphil> it would be a nice end
[21:54] <Laurenceb__> but we have to discuss shirtgate instead
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[21:55] <fsphil> I tought the new suffix was *shock
[21:55] <fsphil> ShirtShock
[21:56] <Laurenceb__> http://i.dailymail.co.uk/i/pix/2014/11/14/1415980737706_Image_galleryImage_Matt_Taylor_Rosetta_Proje.JPG
[21:56] <Laurenceb__> lol trollface
[21:57] <Laurenceb__> guy on the right obviously suggested he wore the shirt :D
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[21:58] <lz1dev> http://www.reddit.com/live/tw0cnch7nxjx/updates/5160d342-6c45-11e4-b53e-12313d14849a
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[21:59] <lz1dev> fingers crossed
[21:59] <edmoore> http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/science-environment-30053204
[21:59] <edmoore> poor sap
[22:00] <lz1dev> that shirt is epic tho
[22:00] <arko> that really sucks :/
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[22:01] <arko> people seem to want to go out of their way to get offended
[22:01] <fsphil> how dare you
[22:01] <arko> :O
[22:01] <Laurenceb__> i was being sarcastic when i said to discuss shirtgate....
[22:02] <arko> obligatory: ... limiting factor with this fast sddv is ...
[22:02] <arko> erp
[22:02] <arko> stupid paste bin
[22:02] <arko> obligatory: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BAnGYfnFz9I
[22:03] <DL7AD> evening
[22:03] Nick change: DL7AD -> AF5LI
[22:04] <arko> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fHMoDt3nSHs
[22:04] <arko> thats what i meant
[22:04] <arko> derp
[22:04] <Lunar_Lander> hello everyone
[22:04] <AF5LI> hi Lunar_Lander
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[22:07] <SpacenearUS> New vehicle on the map: 03HORUS - 12http://habhub.org/mt/?focus=HORUS
[22:08] <Lunar_Lander> how's life AF5LI?
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[22:38] <pnephos2> Hi. Do you know what pin should I use to connect an antenna to the NTX2B transmitter?
[22:39] <daveake> the antenna pin ?
[22:40] <pnephos2> yes
[22:41] Babs_ (5eaf0925@gateway/web/freenode/ip.94.175.9.37) joined #highaltitude.
[22:43] <qyx_> The antenna pin.
[22:44] <Upu> http://www.radiometrix.com/files/additional/ntx2bnrx2b_0.pdf Pin 2 RF Out
[22:44] <daveake> Also connect the ground plane to the 2 pins either side (1,3)
[22:45] <mikestir> http://blogs.esa.int/rosetta/2014/11/15/philae-still-talking/
[22:46] <fsphil> "The command has been sent. Landing gear is moving and the rotation will begin in a few minutes"
[22:46] <fsphil> exciting stuff
[22:48] <lz1dev> http://i.imgur.com/fcQqVqI.jpg
[22:48] <lz1dev> anyone can decypher the timestamps? :D
[22:48] <mikestir> space wireshark
[22:48] <mikestir> year, day number, utc time in ms
[22:54] <Babs_> philae schmilae, they didn't have to cope with ublox changing the NAV-PVT protocol between the Max-7 and the Max-8
[22:54] <Babs_> another night wasted
[22:55] <mikestir> they should have got LeoBodnar to design the secondary power system as well
[22:56] <Babs_> http://blogs.esa.int/rosetta/2014/11/14/philaes-first-touchdown-seen-by-rosetta/
[22:56] <Babs_> amazing, with 10m of where it was calculated to land
[22:56] <Babs_> *within
[22:57] <Geoff-G8DHE_> That must be a wierd gravity field to work with as well!
[22:58] <Babs_> I presume they must approximate it with lots of small bodies and just add them together
[22:58] <Babs_> but the varying density must be tricky to work with
[23:01] <Geoff-G8DHE_> rotated 35 degrees ...
[23:02] <Lunar_Lander> https://twitter.com/Philae2014/status/533393729156308992
[23:02] <Lunar_Lander> yea
[23:02] <fsphil> Good News Everyone!
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[23:03] <Geoff-G8DHE_> but has the power changed .... ?
[23:04] <fsphil> battery is "good"
[23:04] <SpeedEvil> 'Philae's planned mission is expected to come to an end when batteries are exhausted sometime on Saturday; future contacts are possible if the illumination conditions change as the comet orbits closer to the Sun, enabling solar power to flow again.
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[23:12] <mikestir> if the pass started at 2229h and it's currently 2312, and it takes 29 minutes for the command to get there and 29 minutes for the telem to get back - how do they know?
[23:12] <mikestir> or did they upload the command earlier?
[23:13] <Geoff-G8DHE_> The commands will have already been uploaded
[23:13] <Geoff-G8DHE_> waiting for the link to open
[23:14] <Geoff-G8DHE_> the window is only 1:30 to 3:30 at best I gather
[23:15] <fsphil> "Stefan Ulamec: We have energy, we got data. We got all the housekeeping data including all the COSAC data. No idea what's in there"
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[23:15] <mikestir> it's a brilliant result
[23:16] <mikestir> if the rotation gets the secondary batteries up too then christmas will have come early
[23:16] <Rebounder> :)
[23:17] <x-f> they said they had about 80% of planned science data before this evening, then all should be very good indeed
[23:17] <fsphil> these people deserve a day or two off after this :)
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[23:18] <Rebounder> nah
[23:19] <Rebounder> build a new one.. ;)
[23:19] <amell> sundays launch weather still looks good
[23:19] <mikestir> for another comet probe?
[23:20] <amell> ooh. philae was due to report in about now. checking...
[23:20] <mikestir> all good
[23:20] <amell> phew. any info on remaining power?
[23:20] <Geoff-G8DHE_> they have lifted and turned 35 degrees waiting reports on solar panels a
[23:20] <mikestir> http://blogs.esa.int/rosetta/2014/11/15/philae-still-talking/
[23:20] <fsphil> wonder if it's any flatter
[23:20] <fsphil> it was sitting at a scary angle before
[23:21] <mikestir> and they believe they got a full telemetry download including the COSAC results amell
[23:21] <Geoff-G8DHE_> as one pointed out not with the amount of gravity (it only weighs 2 grams!)
[23:21] <amell> fsphil: was it? last i heard they didnt know what the exact orientation was
[23:21] <Geoff-G8DHE_> also which direction is gravity operating in
[23:21] <amell> what an unusual concept :)
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[23:22] <Geoff-G8DHE_> they don't actually know the masses of the two sections only the overall mass
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[23:23] <mikestir> they're on the small section as well aren't they? so gravity is almost certainly not "down"
[23:23] <amell> yeah, it could actually be clinging to a cliff face by gravity& if you could define it as a cliff face...
[23:24] <amell> any new pictures? cant see any yet
[23:24] <Geoff-G8DHE_> nope
[23:25] <Geoff-G8DHE_> not sure they want to waste the power
[23:25] <Geoff-G8DHE_> or the bandwidth, theywant the measurments from the science packages
[23:26] <fsphil> it's sitting on the top, both lobes are below it
[23:26] <Geoff-G8DHE_> have you seen the first bounce images ? http://blogs.esa.int/rosetta/2014/11/14/philaes-first-touchdown-seen-by-rosetta/
[23:26] <fsphil> gravity is definitly 'down' for it
[23:27] <amell> Geoff: cool pic
[23:27] <mikestir> fsphil: I guess that's probably by design
[23:27] <amell> unbelievable accuracy on the first landing.
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[23:28] <amell> did the harpoons actually fire after all? i understand there was some doubt on that
[23:29] <Geoff-G8DHE_> apparently not
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[23:29] <mikestir> so after all xkcd said, harpoons don't work on comets :(
[23:29] <daveake> I guess the whales are hiding
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[23:29] <Geoff-G8DHE_> Oh not good https://twitter.com/Philae_Ptolemy/status/533400432622993408/photo/1
[23:29] <fsphil> well we don't know if harpoons work on comets
[23:29] <fsphil> they didn't try
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[23:30] <amell> we did establish that comets are a lot harder than we thought.
[23:30] <fsphil> also very cool
[23:31] <SpeedEvil> An hour to shed 4% of voltage - when we know it's near the end of the charge
[23:31] <SpeedEvil> so it's likely near the cliff
[23:31] <SpeedEvil> not good
[23:31] <SpeedEvil> amell: softer
[23:32] <SpeedEvil> if they were harder, the harpoons would have triggered
[23:32] <qyx_> hm, what happens if it falls of the cliff?
[23:32] <fsphil> it goes silent
[23:32] <amell> Speedevil: i read harder, thats why it bounced. springiness in the landing feet
[23:32] <SpeedEvil> hmm
[23:32] <amell> if it was soft, impact would have been absorbed
[23:32] <SpeedEvil> I understoodthe issue to be it was so soft that the accelleration was low enough not to trigger the harpoons
[23:33] <amell> oh? thats new to me.
[23:33] <SpeedEvil> Ihaveb't been following it closely as ESA video fucks up for me
[23:33] <x-f> but they did detect the touchdown, flywheel was switched off
[23:34] <fsphil> urg, last picture on twitter shows the battery voltage dropping fast
[23:34] <x-f> previously it was said that Philae has to land on at least two feet for the harpoons to fire, maybe that was it
[23:34] <fsphil> https://pbs.twimg.com/media/B2cGPAtIYAASDMO.jpg:large
[23:34] <Geoff-G8DHE_> then as the bounced it turned as the flywheels slowed
[23:34] <SpeedEvil> 4%/hour at the end of battery life isn't good
[23:35] <Geoff-G8DHE_> but there is a slight uplift at the end, but might just be a lower load rather than power going in
[23:35] <mikestir> near real-time graphs of the battery voltage on a man-made robot half a billion km away - for some reason my mrs doesn't appreciate how cool that is
[23:35] <SpeedEvil> yeah
[23:35] <fsphil> haha
[23:36] <malgar> :D
[23:36] <mikestir> Geoff-G8DHE_: that dip would be around about when the pass started I think, so maybe just increased load as it uplinked to rosetta?
[23:36] <Geoff-G8DHE_> not sure if thats cet or utc
[23:36] <x-f> speed of light makes the biggest delay here..
[23:37] <mikestir> these are proper scientists we're talking about - it's bound to be utc
[23:37] <SpeedEvil> Unless there was an epoch fail.
[23:38] <Geoff-G8DHE_> Nah its off one of the laptops, time would be in cet
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[23:38] <Geoff-G8DHE_> we really don't know
[23:39] <amell> this 35 degree swivel - how much extra light do they think it will give?
[23:39] <fsphil> might've made things worse
[23:39] <Geoff-G8DHE_> no comments have been made, they don't know the orientation at all so yes could get worse
[23:39] <SpeedEvil> https://twitter.com/Philae2014/status/533403430489178112/photo/1 oops
[23:39] <amell> 35 degrees implies its been calculated.
[23:40] <SpeedEvil> Battery, meet mr cliff.
[23:40] <fsphil> plop
[23:40] <daveake> cliff says congratulations
[23:40] <fsphil> I think they got images afterwards
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[23:41] <amell> do they need to hibernate it so it can wake up when solar power is sufficient?
[23:41] <x-f> it'll do it automatically
[23:41] <fsphil> I think it can do that already
[23:41] <amell> great. so fingers crossed it will wake again in a month or two.
[23:41] <fsphil> so even when it falls silent tonight, it could be back soon
[23:42] <SpeedEvil> Everyone get out there now, and point your laser pointers at it
[23:42] <daveake> And of course it has a repeater right next door
[23:42] <qyx_> will they probe rosetta periodically for new data?
[23:42] <amell> i guess rosetta will pass it automatically if anything comes
[23:42] <qyx_> or how do DNS allocations work
[23:42] <fsphil> rosetta has a dedicated receiver for the lander
[23:42] <qyx_> DSN
[23:43] <mikestir> rosetta is still going to be doing its own science so I suppose they'll be in fairly regular contact anyway?
[23:43] <Rebounder> !flight horus
[23:43] <SpacenearUS> 03Rebounder: Flight 10(c274): 03PicoHorus-N+1 10(1 payload) - Launch date 03Today at 21:30 from 03South Australia, Australia 10(-35.1217,138.8503)
[23:43] <amell> It can proudly die now, drill in hand, iced and hoping for providence like Han Solo. lol
[23:43] <x-f> i'm pretty sure ESA has much more pictures from Philae that they're not releasing to the public yet, but they might know to which side to turn by examing the shadows
[23:44] <amell> should have put a plutonium power source on philae
[23:44] <SpeedEvil> the horizon is pretty obvious from the panorama published
[23:44] <Rebounder> cool with the flight in uruguay, the first?
[23:45] <amell> i guess that would be too heavy. cant wait for new horizons to send us pics of pluto surface next year.
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[23:45] <x-f> amell, on today's Google+ they explained that RTG wasn't possible because of not having enough experience and for political reasons :|
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[23:46] <fsphil> Ceres before that too
[23:46] <amell> New horizons has 11kg of Pu238 on board. The entire US only creates 1kg of Pu238 per year.
[23:46] <amell> so i can see how specialised that energy source is
[23:46] <Lunar_Lander> goos night!
[23:46] <arko> well good thing it's headed to Pluto
[23:47] <amell> yeah. i recall that there were concerns about launching it. a launch fail would cause some serious clean up issues.
[23:47] <fsphil> oops... "In November 2007, during its second flyby, the Rosetta spacecraft was mistaken for a near-Earth asteroid and given the designation 2007 VN84"
[23:47] <Lunar_Lander> XD
[23:47] <arko> fsphil: lol
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[23:50] <amell> 20V is drop out - get ready to wave goodbye
[23:50] <Geoff-G8DHE_> "On board Philae, system voltage has fallen very close to 21.5V; below that, the battery won't last much longer. At this time, there is insufficient sunlight to provide power."
[23:51] <arko> Daisy....
[23:51] Last message repeated 1 time(s).
[23:51] <arko> Answer me won't you do....
[23:51] <fsphil> What are you doing Dave
[23:51] <daveake> <innocent>
[23:52] <Geoff-G8DHE_> Like this twitter Now Philae down to sleep
[23:52] <Geoff-G8DHE_> We pray a sunbeam soon to sweep
[23:52] <Geoff-G8DHE_> And if the hibernation break
[23:52] <Geoff-G8DHE_> We have more science yet to make
[23:52] <daveake> Rosetta are you better
[23:52] <daveake> are you well
[23:52] <daveake> well
[23:52] Last message repeated 1 time(s).
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[23:52] <arko> haha
[23:52] <daveake> Still downloading
[23:53] <daveake> This is like watching a hab slowly die
[23:53] <amell> actually, its probably already died. were just listening to the signals as they come in.
[23:53] <Geoff-G8DHE_> its gone
[23:53] <fsphil> echos in the dark
[23:53] <SpeedEvil> daveake: trees are less likely
[23:53] <daveake> yes
[23:53] <daveake> true
[23:53] <Geoff-G8DHE_> its back
[23:54] <daveake> OK so who's going to go and recover this one?
[23:54] <amell> its like listening to the dead.
[23:54] <amell> daveake: ill take a rain check on this one.
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[23:54] <Geoff-G8DHE_> watches for _chase vehicle on snus
[23:54] <x-f> it'll be closer in a few months
[23:54] <amell> bruce willis can go get it.
[23:55] <x-f> Armageddon was lies :(
[23:55] <fsphil> I think we should send michael bay
[23:55] <fsphil> win win for everyone
[23:55] <amell> nah, need daveake and his tree stick
[23:55] <Babs_> fsphilae
[23:56] Nick change: fsphil -> fsphilae
[23:56] <fsphilae> why yes, I am a bit sleepy
[23:56] <daveake> I don't do space or the M5
[23:56] <fsphilae> heh, they're still downloading images
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[23:56] <amell> oh apparently they have a new image
[23:57] <Babs_> "He achieved his target landing in Douglas, Isle of Man only to bounce and land in Liverpool. At that point the solar panels got nicked and we lost contact"
[23:57] <amell> 28kbps is painfully slow.
[23:57] <fsphilae> haha
[23:57] <fsphilae> SLOW?
[23:57] <daveake> cough
[23:57] <fsphilae> you youngin's
[23:57] <SpeedEvil> My first modem was 1200/75
[23:57] <fsphilae> I'll have you know .. [buffering]
[23:57] <fsphilae> .. that that's quite fast ....
[23:57] <SpeedEvil> (actually, it was 2400, but prestel diddn't do that)
[23:58] <amell> naff, my first modem was a telebit trailblazer
[23:58] <Babs_> firefox is on ITV4 too. What a night.
[23:58] <fsphilae> we've had adsl here for 10 yaers now
[23:58] <mikestir> does anyone know if the philae link is store and forward or just a bent pipe? I assume the former, so the downlink would continue even after the battery dies?
[23:58] <fsphilae> before that it was 128kbit/s isdn
[23:58] <fsphilae> bent pipe
[23:59] <arko> hahaha
[23:59] <arko> fsphilae
[23:59] <Geoff-G8DHE_> Wow mine was 300baud acoustic copluer to phone!
[23:59] <mikestir> oh right. having a fast uplink to rosetta would seem like an obvious improvement
[23:59] <arko> i wish we could watch live data
[00:00] --- Sat Nov 15 2014