highaltitude.log.20140915

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[00:07] <craag_philcrump> cm13g09: No, was hoping someone else would take it up tbh!
[00:08] <craag_philcrump> There was a couple of people who weighed in with features - but just added more bugs.
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[00:10] <craag_philcrump> Reading scrollback - yes I did get a bit of abuse about it by an enraged imperial-units-fan
[00:12] <lz1dev> craag_philcrump: i made some modifications
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[00:12] <craag_philcrump> :)
[00:12] <craag_philcrump> gn!
[00:13] <lz1dev> 5 yards/fortnight
[00:13] <SIbot> In real units: 5 yards/fortnight = 2.286 meter/week
[00:13] <lz1dev> ez
[00:13] <SpeedEvil> http://www.astr.ua.edu/keel/telescopes/mcdonald.html - making a 107" telescope 106" with firearms
[00:13] <SIbot> In real units: 106inch = 2717.8 mm
[00:13] <SIbot> In real units: 106inch = 2692.4 mm
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[00:13] <lz1dev> ez
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[00:13] <lz1dev> and wrong :\
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[04:19] <SpacenearUS> New vehicle on the map: 03sp7wna_chase - 12http://habhub.org/mt/?focus=sp7wna_chase
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[07:31] <fsphil> SIbot! wb :)
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[07:54] <SA6BSS|2> anyone got predictions for EDUPIC2 if it comes back to life
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[08:31] <pd3jag> morge all
[08:32] <sp2ipt> hi
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[08:47] <pd3jag> is there some action today??
[08:51] <Geoff-G8DHE-Lap> http://habitat.habhub.org/calendar/
[09:06] <RocketBoy> !flights
[09:06] <SpacenearUS> 03RocketBoy: Current flights: 03B-64 434.500 Contestia 64/1000 10(3afe), 03B-66 434.500 Contestia 64/1000 10(705b), 03EDUPIC1 Flightmode Test 10(df55), 03SP HAM's tech workshop launch  10(4de8)
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[09:30] <amell> dont think theres any action. its teeing it down with rain in cambridgeshire
[09:31] <fsphil> sunshine and happyness here
[09:31] <fsphil> well the first bit anyway
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[10:17] <SpeedEvil> http://www.esa.int/spaceinvideos/esalive
[10:17] <SpeedEvil> comet lander mission landing discussion
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[10:42] <SpacenearUS> New vehicle on the map: 03STS-13 - 12http://habhub.org/mt/?focus=STS-13
[10:42] <SIbot> In real units: 03ST = NaN kg
[10:42] <x-f> toolighttomeasure kg
[10:42] <mfa298> Oh noes, the bots are talking to each other,
[10:42] <SIbot> In real units: th = NaN mm
[10:43] <fsphil> uh-oh
[10:43] <x-f> so it has come to this
[10:43] <fsphil> the
[10:43] <fsphil> , the
[10:43] <SIbot> In real units: th = NaN mm
[10:43] <fsphil> ooh
[10:43] <fsphil> 5 th
[10:43] <SIbot> In real units: 5 th = NaN mm
[10:43] <fsphil> what's th?
[10:43] <fsphil> 5000000 th
[10:43] <SIbot> In real units: 5000000 th = NaN mm
[10:45] <mfa298> this bot, it seeme'th broken
[10:45] <mfa298> awww, that didn't trigger it.
[10:45] <SIbot> In real units: th = NaN mm
[10:45] <fsphil> comma space th
[10:45] <x-f> craag_philcrump, your robochild seems a bit sick today
[10:45] <mfa298> or it's just being slow (or my internet is)
[10:46] <fsphil> nah your second line triggered it
[10:46] <fsphil> , that's all folks
[10:46] <SIbot> In real units: th = NaN mm
[10:46] <mfa298> x-f I think it's someone else now running it (possibly lz1dev )
[10:46] <mfa298> this is going to get annoying
[10:47] <mfa298> so it needs more than just a space in the line
[10:48] <fsphil> ,th
[10:48] <SIbot> In real units: th = NaN mm
[10:48] <fsphil> ,mm
[10:48] <x-f> ,st
[10:48] <SIbot> In real units: st = NaN kg
[10:48] <fsphil> ,miles
[10:48] <SIbot> In real units: miles = 1.609344 kilometer
[10:48] <fsphil> it thinks the comma is a number
[10:48] <fsphil> 6th of december
[10:48] <SIbot> In real units: 6th = NaN mm
[10:49] <mfa298> sounds like [0-9,\.]\w?[<unit>]
[10:49] <fsphil> th shouldn't be there though
[10:49] <mfa298> needs a better regex
[10:49] <fsphil> , splots
[10:49] <fsphil> , ar
[10:50] <fsphil> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Thomson_%28unit%29
[10:50] <fsphil> pretty niche
[10:50] <mfa298> or thou
[10:50] <mfa298> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Thousandth_of_an_inch
[10:50] <fsphil> 150000 th
[10:50] <SIbot> In real units: 150000 th = NaN mm
[10:50] <fsphil> 10000000000000000000 th
[10:50] <SIbot> In real units: 10000000000000000000 th = NaN mm
[10:50] <fsphil> whatever it is, it ain't working
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[10:55] <x-f> on a different subject, am i right thinking that Ublox "stationary" navmode does more integration than "airborne <5g" mode, therefore the latter might be more suitable to detect GPS signal fluctuations through the ionosphere?
[10:55] <SIbot> In real units: th = NaN mm
[10:55] <x-f> or that's just crazy talk
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[11:37] <gonzo_> stop trying to break it!
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[11:37] <gonzo_> wonder if it knows the more esoteric units?
[11:37] <gonzo_> 1 grain
[11:37] <SIbot> In real units: 1 grain = 0.06479891 gram
[11:38] <gonzo_> Impressed!
[11:38] <gonzo_> 1 furlong
[11:38] <SIbot> In real units: 1 furlong = 201.168 meters
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[11:38] <gonzo_> 4e-1 ironing boards per square fortnight
[11:38] <SpikeUK> 1 curie
[11:39] <gonzo_> it's sulking now
[11:39] <SpikeUK> 1 Curie
[11:39] <SpikeUK> Wants a vindaloo maybe?
[11:40] <gonzo_> those curries are rated in Rotgens anyway
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[11:41] <SpikeUK> 1 microcurie
[11:41] <SIbot> In real units: 1 mi = 1.609344 kilometer
[11:42] <SpikeUK> Erm
[11:43] <SpikeUK> 1 roentgen
[11:43] <fsphil> miles
[11:43] <fsphil> ignoring everything after mi
[11:43] <SpikeUK> Looks that way - dead clever though
[11:43] <fsphil> yep some adjustments to the regex and that'll be great
[11:44] <SpikeUK> so 25 millimeter
[11:44] <SIbot> In real units: 25 mi = 40.2336 kilometer
[11:44] <SpikeUK> Boom
[11:45] <Ian___> Sibot not allowed to calculate distances near Mars/
[11:46] <craag_philcrump> x-f: Yep, lz1dev has broken it :P
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[11:46] <x-f> heh
[11:47] <craag_philcrump> He's hosting it now
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[12:08] <mikestir-work> no sign of edupic2? I did have a tune around first thing this morning but nothing heard
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[12:58] <Sn0w> hello
[12:59] <Sn0w> I'm trying to figure out if AP510 APRS Tracker VHF with GPS/Bluetooth/Thermometer/TF Card Support APRSdroid can be used for HAB projects in the UK
[12:59] <mfa298> in short no.
[13:00] <Sn0w> ok. thanks. any other easy-to-use alternative?
[13:00] <mfa298> APRS (at least to be useful) works on 144.800 in the UK which requires an amateur radio license. That license striclty forbids use airborne
[13:00] <SIbot> In real units: 144.800 in = 3677.92 mm
[13:00] Action: mfa298 slaps Sibot
[13:00] <fsphil> ok dare I say it, but that's annoying (sorry SiBot!)
[13:01] <fsphil> (I still love you really)
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[13:01] <mfa298> Sn0w: to answer most of the questions have a read of the ukhas.org.uk wiki - there's lots of good information there
[13:03] <Sn0w> i have. using dl-fldigi looks a bit intimidating to me
[13:04] <Sn0w> was looking for a kit/simple method
[13:04] <fsphil> it's a lot to take in at first yea
[13:04] <mfa298> dl-fldigi is used on the receiving side with a suitable radio / SDR dongle and you can get lots of practice with other peoples flights
[13:05] <mfa298> if you want an easy job of making the hardware look at the Habduino or Pi in the Sky board (I think both are on the hab supplies store)
[13:05] <Sn0w> ok. i'll have a look there. read that the dongle is not very reliable
[13:06] <mfa298> if you go that route you can get the benefit of lots of people in the UK helping to track your flight as well.
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[13:07] <mfa298> the rtl dongles are perfectly fine for testing. For tracking your own flight you might want to get (or borrow) something a bit better. But people have chased their own balloons with the rtlsdr dongles.
[13:07] <mfa298> depending on where you are in the UK there may well be others locally you can help out
[13:08] <chimpusmaximus> I use a SDR dongle and managed to track our own and other peoples ok. I do use a LNA which makes a big difference.
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[13:08] <DL7AD_mobile> G'afternoon
[13:08] <Sn0w> ok. so it's back to reading for me...
[13:09] <Sn0w> lots of info to absorb
[13:09] <Sn0w> thank you all for your help
[13:09] <mfa298> if you're unsure about anything in the wiki do ask questions
[13:09] <mfa298> and hanging around here can be enlightening
[13:09] <Sn0w> cheers.
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[13:15] <cm13g09> mfa298: ping
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[13:15] <mfa298> cm13g09: pong
[13:15] <mightymik> i'm in the wrong business ... MS officially buys Mojang for 2.5 Billion dollars
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[13:27] <Piet0r> Halyballs
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[13:46] <Darkside> how have peopl foud the Pawan balloons?
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[13:48] <Geoff-G8DHE> Normally found with just remments wrapped around the payload string ;-)
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[13:49] <Darkside> ?
[13:49] <Darkside> they dont burst cleanly?
[13:49] <Darkside> or ar you having a jok
[13:49] <Darkside> joke*
[13:49] <Geoff-G8DHE> No just joking
[13:49] <Darkside> mmk
[13:50] <SpeedEvil> Though it's sort-of-relevant, some people have had problems with balloons not bursting properly and the whole balloon coming down tangled with the chute, not remnants
[13:51] <daveake> Not used one yet, but Hwoyees vary from "neck and a bit" to "blimey that must be the whole thing"
[13:51] <Darkside> yeah
[13:51] <Darkside> we're using 2 pawans this weekend
[13:51] <daveake> Flown 2 2000g H's the last few days
[13:51] <Darkside> ~2.6kg payload, 7ft chute
[13:51] <SIbot> In real units: 7ft = 2.1336 meter
[13:51] <Darkside> though i think the 7 ft is the arc length
[13:51] <SIbot> In real units: 7 ft = 2.1336 meter
[13:51] <daveake> Got neck on the first and 1.1kg of latex on the second
[13:52] <mfa298> woohoo: SIbot actually managed to do the right thing, that must be a first for today.
[13:52] <SIbot> In real units: th = NaN mm
[13:53] <Darkside> lol
[13:53] <Darkside> wtf
[13:53] <Darkside> thin
[13:53] <Darkside> thing
[13:53] <Darkside> nup
[13:54] <mfa298> it seems to have a very broken regex. , seems to count as a number
[13:54] <mfa298> and th is aparently a unit it wants to try and convert
[13:56] <Darkside> 5 th
[13:56] <SIbot> In real units: 5 th = NaN mm
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[13:56] <Darkside> 1000000 th
[13:56] <SIbot> In real units: 1000000 th = NaN mm
[13:56] <x-f> 3 ly
[13:56] <Darkside> intersting unit
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[13:59] <x-f> light year isn't SI unit, SIbot, you missed that
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[14:02] <craag_philcrump> 12 ft
[14:02] <theRealSIbot> In real units: 12 ft = 3.66 m
[14:02] <SIbot> In real units: 12 ft = 3.6576 meter
[14:02] Last message repeated 1 time(s).
[14:02] <theRealSIbot> In real units: 12 ft = 3.66 m
[14:02] Last message repeated 1 time(s).
[14:02] <SIbot> In real units: 12 ft = 3.6576 meter
[14:02] Last message repeated 1 time(s).
[14:02] <theRealSIbot> In real units: 12 ft = 3.66 m
[14:02] Last message repeated 1 time(s).
[14:02] <SIbot> In real units: 12 ft = 3.6576 meter
[14:02] Last message repeated 1 time(s).
[14:02] <theRealSIbot> In real units: 12 ft = 3.66 m
[14:02] Last message repeated 1 time(s).
[14:02] <SIbot> In real units: 12 ft = 3.6576 meter
[14:02] Last message repeated 1 time(s).
[14:02] <theRealSIbot> In real units: 12 ft = 3.66 m
[14:02] Last message repeated 1 time(s).
[14:02] <SIbot> In real units: 12 ft = 3.6576 meter
[14:02] theRealSIbot (~nodebot@li184-238.members.linode.com) left irc: Remote host closed the connection
[14:02] <SIbot> In real units: 12 ft = 3.6576 meter
[14:02] <craag_philcrump> lol oop
[14:03] <craag_philcrump> s
[14:03] <Darkside> uh oh
[14:03] <Darkside> bot wars :P
[14:03] <jonsowman> haha
[14:04] <jonsowman> also
[14:04] <jonsowman> the fact it says 'meter' is kinda ironic
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[14:21] <Maxell> jonsowman: "meters" would be better?
[14:23] <x-f> "metres" i guess
[14:23] <Maxell> In Dutch: 0 meter, 1 meter, 2 meter
[14:23] <Maxell> win \o/
[14:24] <SpacenearUS> New position from 03EDUPIC2 after 0317 hours silence - 12http://habhub.org/mt/?focus=EDUPIC2
[14:25] <Maxell> wot
[14:25] <jonsowman> Maxell: mm, metres
[14:26] <Maxell> mm == millimeter
[14:26] <jonsowman> lol no, mm as in "hmmm"
[14:26] <jonsowman> meter should be metre
[14:26] <jonsowman> (in British English)
[14:26] <edusupport> Can somone clear EDUPIC2 from the map please
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[14:27] <daveake> done
[14:28] SIbot (~nodebot@5ec31737.skybroadband.com) joined #highaltitude.
[14:29] <costyn> whos flying LORA1?
[14:29] <costyn> oh wait that was yesterday
[14:30] <daveake> do keep up :)
[14:31] <costyn> sorry, weekends are usually full-time family oriented unfortunately
[14:31] <costyn> as happens when you have small kids
[14:32] <mfa298> I think we might have had a demonstration of why it's suggested in the IRC spec that things like bots should use NOTICE instead of PRIVMSG
[14:33] <daveake> :)
[14:33] <craag_philcrump> Heh
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[14:34] <daveake> grumpybot
[14:34] <craag_philcrump> woo
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[14:34] <craag_philcrump> realBot time
[14:34] <craag_philcrump> ah no
[14:34] <craag_philcrump> he's back :(
[14:34] <daveake> never seen a bot rage quit before :)
[14:34] <lz1dev> 5 ly
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[14:35] <lz1dev> 5 ly
[14:35] SIbot (~nodebot@5ec31737.skybroadband.com) left irc: Read error: Connection reset by peer
[14:35] <lz1dev> welp
[14:35] <mfa298> it might be preferable if bot testing didn't occur in the channel where we might want to talk about something vaguely on topic
[14:35] <fsphil> aww I missed Robot Wars
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[14:35] <lz1dev> 5ly
[14:35] <SIbot> In real units: 5ly = 4.7303652e+16 metres
[14:35] <craag_philcrump> I seem to recall that the github version defaulted to a test channel :P
[14:36] <fsphil> IRCbots, stand by
[14:36] <SIbot> In real units: st = kg
[14:36] <lz1dev> there ya go
[14:36] <costyn> haha
[14:36] <fsphil> 3, 2, 1, ACTIVATE!
[14:36] <craag_philcrump> , st
[14:36] <SIbot> In real units: st = kg
[14:36] <costyn> still needs work
[14:36] <craag_philcrump> just a little ;)
[14:37] <daveake> SIBot beginning to inch towards madness
[14:37] Action: daveake waits for implosion
[14:38] <gonzo_> it is mor holy than thou
[14:38] <costyn> daveake: still got miles to go till completion
[14:39] <fsphil> how long is a piece of string
[14:39] <fsphil> (not a realy question bots)
[14:39] <fsphil> -y
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[14:39] <costyn> fsphil: that was the first BBC Horizon episode I saw.. was hooked after :)
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[14:40] <fsphil> must have been an old one
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[14:40] <fsphil> the recent episodes are a bit naff
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[14:40] <costyn> fsphil: 2009
[14:40] <fsphil> oh fairly recent
[14:41] <fsphil> the last one I saw they kept repeating things, and showing pointless shots of people staring at things
[14:42] <costyn> haha
[14:42] <fsphil> and lots of closeups for dramatic effect
[14:42] <fsphil> but very little actual content
[14:42] <SpeedEvil> fsphil: To be fair - pointless shots of people staring at things has always been a large part of the repotoire.
[14:42] <costyn> yea some of them are silly pieces of fluff
[14:42] <fsphil> I must have just caught a bad one
[14:42] <costyn> fsphil: maybe they had to dumb it down
[14:42] <fsphil> SpeedEvil: true. Brian Cox is bad for it
[14:43] <fsphil> except he does it on mountains
[14:43] <SpeedEvil> I would actually really love to be able to watch random episodes from 1985 (say) of tomorrows world and Horizon
[14:43] <SpeedEvil> To see if they were actualy that good - or my current dissatisfaction with science programs is because I know _way_ too much about everything.
[14:43] <costyn> SpeedEvil: hehehehe
[14:43] <fsphil> that would be a neat experiment
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[14:44] <costyn> I suspect you'd be cringing then at the things they said which ahve turned out to be plain wrong or different
[14:44] <SpeedEvil> costyn: well - no.
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[14:44] <SpeedEvil> costyn: I mean - you can consider it in terms of knowledge at teh time pretty easily
[14:45] <SpeedEvil> There is a big difference between skimming over something showing the oooh factor, and trying to explain to the deepest level your audience can reasonably understand
[14:46] <costyn> I guess so
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[14:49] <SpeedEvil> But - could I accurately tell that when I was 12.
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[15:07] <mattbrejza> anyone used one of these on a tracker: http://uk.farnell.com/analog-devices/adp1607acpzn-r7/boost-0-8-3-3v-2mhz-1-8-3-3v-6lfcsp/dp/2254940
[15:07] <mattbrejza> they seem pretty nice and small
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[15:18] <SpacenearUS> New vehicle on the map: 03EDUPIC2 - 12http://habhub.org/mt/?focus=EDUPIC2
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[15:25] <craag_philcrump> EDUPIC2 is up
[15:25] <craag_philcrump> 434.650 from Birmingham
[15:28] <fsphil> relaunch?
[15:28] <costyn> that's a pretty late launch... or are they going for sunset pics?
[15:29] <craag_philcrump> I think it's a foil judging by the ascent rate
[15:29] <fsphil> could be the same balloon
[15:29] <craag_philcrump> I missed the first flight - what was that?
[15:30] <fsphil> it was a 100g, filled to float
[15:30] <fsphil> the cold got it in the end, radio and gps died
[15:30] <fsphil> ah see in #habhub, it's a new launch
[15:31] <craag_philcrump> ah, same callsign, I see
[15:32] <fsphil> there was some hope the old one would reappear when it warmed up
[15:33] <craag_philcrump> Launched yesterday and died overnight?
[15:33] <mfa298> I think the last one had been so weak there wasn't much chance of it being heard unless it was very close to someone
[15:35] <costyn> sooo... that multi-predictor for consequtive days, there's no public one set up right? only if you fix it yourself?
[15:36] <mfa298> you can get hourly's setup you just need to find the right person in #habhub
[15:36] <costyn> mfa298: nah... just curious/playing around, not doing anything serious.
[15:36] <craag_philcrump> Take an offering - it pleases the deities
[15:37] <lz1dev> !hysplit run sts-13
[15:37] <SpacenearUS> 03lz1dev: Your job has been added to the queue. Check in a few minutes
[15:37] <costyn> mfa298: http://www.facebook.com/l.php?u=http%3A%2F%2Fpredict.habhub.org%2F%23!%2Fuuid%3D74f3200f84d5729779e301726c6c300ac0f190f6&h=oAQG-tmas
[15:37] <costyn> aargh
[15:37] <costyn> lets try that again http://predict.habhub.org/#!/uuid=74f3200f84d5729779e301726c6c300ac0f190f6
[15:37] <craag_philcrump> hehe looks fun
[15:38] <mfa298> the #habhub guys can setup something like http://predict.habhub.org/hourly/oldgore/ fairly easily these days and it's much less pain than trying to set it up yourself
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[15:38] <craag_philcrump> Perfect candidate for an hourly - go ask
[15:39] <costyn> prediction for the 19th has it landing on that venezuelan peninsula, but it looks pretty desolate there
[15:39] <costyn> craag_philcrump: nah
[15:40] <costyn> Now if I'd had an oceangoing boat, I might consider launching it into the sea and going to retrieve it
[15:40] <costyn> although 100KM+ in a boat is nothing to sneeze at I guess
[15:41] <costyn> certainly not on the way back going aginst the wind and waves
[15:41] <craag_philcrump> and finding it in the sea doesn't have great success rate
[15:42] <costyn> heheh
[15:42] <costyn> no there's that
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[15:42] <mfa298> on the plus side, the chance of getting it stuck up a tree are pretty slim
[15:42] <costyn> hehhe
[15:44] <tweetBot> @AMSAT_UK: @emfcamp plan to release videos of #EMFcamp presentations but still lots of work to do #amsat #hamradio #hamr #ukhas http://t.co/l7rFQVf9Cp
[15:44] <edusupport> I think EDUPIC2 has hit a cold patch
[15:45] <edusupport> Its leveling out now
[15:45] <fsphil> 100g or a foil balloon?
[15:46] <edusupport> 100g
[15:47] <Geoff-G8DHE> http://360.g8dhe.net/HAB_Flights/2014_Flights/EDUPIC2_20140915/EDUPIC2_201409151546.jpg
[15:47] <fsphil> coming down
[15:47] <edusupport> Looks like it
[15:47] <edusupport> I know its not a leak
[15:48] <fsphil> is it cloudy where you are?
[15:48] <fsphil> the clouds might have chilled it
[15:56] <Geoff-G8DHE> Is the temperature functional ?
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[16:07] <chrisstubbs> edusupport, better go for a drive with the helium canister for a top up!
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[16:39] <amell> oh, did edupic2 land again? :(
[16:39] <MaXimaN_> Not yet, but it's heading downwards
[16:40] <amell> puzzled as snus says its on the ground.
[16:40] <amell> Time: 2014-09-15 15:52:46 last report. edusupport gone to recover?
[16:40] <amell> appears to be almost walking distance.
[16:42] <MaXimaN_> Ah yes, I didn't notice the timestamp
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[16:43] <amell> should be recoverable unless some scrote has run off with it, or if its on the train line
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[16:49] <Radim_OM2AMR> STS-13 QRG is 437.6943 MHz, its still floating. Heads to Croatia according to HYSPLIT.
[16:49] <SIbot> In real units: 13 QR = kg
[16:49] <SpeedEvil> ...
[16:50] <Radim_OM2AMR> ok, SIbot QRkg :-)
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[17:42] <Lunar_Lander> evening
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[18:16] <mikestir> edupic2 in a tree?
[18:18] <SA6BSS|2> got an update anyway, maybe recovery team on sight
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[18:25] <SA6BSS|2> yeap, thats a tree for sure
[18:25] <TomasThomas> Hello. I've just filled the flight documents for my launch tomorrow. The name is 'TT7 launch 1' and it will take place in Roznov pod Radhostem, Czech Republic in the morning around 8:00 BST. Can anyone add it to the tracker page, plesase?
[18:25] <SIbot> In real units: 1foot = 0.3048 metre
[18:26] <MaXimaN_> Better than a busy road or train line :)
[18:27] <lz1dev> TomasThomas: go to #habhub and give the flight doc id there :)
[18:28] Nick change: SA6BSS|2 -> SA6BSS
[18:28] Nick change: SA6BSS -> SA6BSS-Mike
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[18:32] <TomasThomas> lz1dev: do you mean add a new topic to the UKHAS google group?
[18:32] <lz1dev> no its another channel
[18:32] <lz1dev> type: /join #habhub
[18:32] <TomasThomas> oh, ok thank you
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[18:46] <edusupport> EDUPIC2 recovered
[18:46] <mikestir> launching again?
[18:46] <edusupport> Envelope failiure
[18:47] <edusupport> I have run out need to get some foils
[18:48] <edusupport> Thats 2 out of 5 100g with faults
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[18:49] <edusupport> http://imgur.com/IPRs60k,6egcT5m#0 there are 2 images
[18:49] <craag_philcrump> They are difficult to float
[18:50] <craag_philcrump> err that's a foil?
[18:50] <mikestir> wow how did that not end up stuck in a tree
[18:50] <edusupport> I know but 2 with holes in I spotted the first one
[18:50] <edusupport> No pawan 100g
[18:50] <craag_philcrump> oh ok
[18:50] <craag_philcrump> looks a bit weird
[18:51] <craag_philcrump> may just be potato-cam syndrome ;)
[18:51] <edusupport> No gas
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[18:52] <edusupport> Is there a better small latex available
[18:53] <daveake> Are you sure those holes didn't happen after landing?
[18:53] <daveake> Steve has the Hwoyee 100's in now
[18:55] <edusupport> No the one I spotted while filling at home was exactly the same when I launched it it climbed at a decent rate it wasnt under filled
[18:56] <fsphil> HAB landing on the moon: http://www.lroc.asu.edu/ckeditor_assets/pictures/138/content_sept11_blink.gif
[18:57] <craag_philcrump> fsphil: must be the americans
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[18:58] <bertrik> but, the moon has no trees!
[18:58] <qyx_> this fact doesn't meen that recovery would be easier
[18:58] <edusupport> Ordered some Hwoyee's
[18:59] <daveake> Yeah, not the easiest place to recover. No 3G for a start.
[18:59] <craag_philcrump> not sure even dave's nagivation systems would work too well
[19:00] <craag_philcrump> *navigation
[19:00] <qyx_> *mean
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[19:04] <daveake> Oh, I often have a nagivation system in the car with me ...
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[19:25] <SpacenearUS> New vehicle on the map: 03ECC1 - 12http://habhub.org/mt/?focus=ECC1
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[20:05] <maxmed> Hi, do many people remove the pins from the NTX2B and solder their wires/antenna (coax cable) directly to the circuit board?
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[20:08] <fsphil> I've never heard of anyone doing that
[20:09] <craag_philcrump> I tend to do that when I've run out of heatshrink
[20:09] <craag_philcrump> No real reason to though
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[20:10] <maxmed> So people normally just solder the wires onto the pins and cover with heat shrink? I thought soldering to the board would be less fragile/prone to bending or snapping
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[20:12] <mfa298> I cut the legs off one ntx2 once. But that was to make it easier to remove from some stripboard
[20:12] <Lunar_Lander> evening craag
[20:13] <fsphil> there should be strain relief on the antenna anyway
[20:13] <craag_philcrump> maxmed: That was my thinking as well, but I'm not sure it makes much difference
[20:13] <craag_philcrump> you should secure the antenna well enough that bending/breaking it shouldn't be an issue
[20:13] <craag_philcrump> Remember the Ed test
[20:13] <fsphil> or on landing it doesn't transfer force into the PCB
[20:13] <craag_philcrump> (throw it down the stairs, if anything breaks, it wasn't secure enough)
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[20:16] <maxmed> Ok, I'll solder the wires to the pins. When soldering the coax cable to the pins do you separate the inner and outer wire and solder each to the corresponding pin?
[20:17] <craag_philcrump> Good evening Lunar_Lander
[20:17] <Lunar_Lander> maxmed, you mean the inner wire and the mesh around it?
[20:18] <maxmed> Yes
[20:18] <mfa298> maxmed: when I did mine (although the coax went into the stripboard) I seperated the braid into two parts and soldered to the two ground pins and the center to the ant pin
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[20:20] <maxmed> Are the pins on the NTX2 just soldered on (so they will fall off if heated) or are they mechanically fixed somehow?
[20:24] <craag_philcrump> They are mechanically fixed iirc
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[20:28] <maxmed> Are there any more compact antennas than a 1/4 wave ground plane antenna?
[20:28] <myself> "gain" starts to be a misnomer, but yes..
[20:29] <craag_philcrump> People have used commercial stubby antennas
[20:29] <craag_philcrump> But generally only on backup trackers
[20:30] <bertrik> I think I've seen J-pole antennas here, not sure if they qualify as more compact
[20:30] <Lunar_Lander> the pins on my ntx2 once broke off
[20:30] <maxmed> I noticed some of the super compact trackers at the ukhas conference only had tiny wire little antennas?
[20:31] <Lunar_Lander> but that was due to mechanical overloading and thermal stress
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[20:31] <myself> You can curl things up so the electrical length is the same, but the area (there's a radio term for this which slips my mind right now) is smaller.
[20:31] <myself> So efficiency suffers, but they're nice and small.
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[20:32] <Maxmed> Sorry Internet crashed, did I miss anything?
[20:33] <craag_philcrump> Maxmed: The little wire antennas were gps antennas
[20:33] <craag_philcrump> They didn't have the 70cm TX antennas fitted
[20:33] <myself> oh, I'll repeat what I said
[20:33] <myself> You can curl things up so the electrical length is the same, but the area (there's a radio term for this which slips my mind right now) is smaller. So the efficiency suffers, but they're nice and small.
[20:33] <craag_philcrump> afaik nearly all small trackers have flown with a 1/4 ave
[20:33] <craag_philcrump> antenna aperture
[20:34] <myself> look up "loading coil" for how short antennas can be made not-completely-awful. It placates the transmitter, but doesn't help the actual aperture. (thanks!)
[20:34] <Maxmed> Ahh ok, I'm surprised they didn't use chips scale antennas
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[20:35] <myself> have you looked at the gain figures on those? chipscale stuff is usually well into the negative dBi..
[20:35] <craag_philcrump> Maxmed: The 1/4 wave might be a bit better than the chip antenna when there's no interference around
[20:35] <myself> especially for longer wavelengths. Besides, how tiny a sky are you trying to fly this thing in; why does it need to be small?
[20:35] <craag_philcrump> and they can guarantee it's in free-space (not getting detuned by metal around it, something that the chip antenna is designed to cope with)
[20:36] <myself> flying on a balloon is pretty much the best-case scenario for free-space assumptions in antenna modeling, yeah :) everything works almost like the book said it would! :)
[20:37] <Maxmed> I meant use a chip scale for the gps. I'm struggling to find a lightweight secure way of supporting a 1/4 wave antenna a it's so big and I'm thinking of having a very small payload container
[20:37] <craag_philcrump> yep, as long as it isn't stuffed into a box next to a hunk of metal with little rf oscillators all over it (camera)
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[20:38] <myself> let the whip dangle, gravity is your support.
[20:38] <craag_philcrump> I usually secure the radials, so they don't droop, and let the radiating element dangle
[20:39] <myself> Anyone using metal foil tape on their balloon envelope as antenna elements during ascent?
[20:39] <craag_philcrump> Latex expands, so I gues you're thinking of a foil balloon?
[20:40] <myself> Perhaps, or not thinking at all, which is more likely.
[20:40] <myself> It just popped into my head and I figured I'd throw it out there.
[20:40] <Maxmed> Are the radials necessary or will a 'whip' antenna work?
[20:40] <craag_philcrump> Yeah I think Leo experimented with a larger antenna using a wire up to the top of the foil
[20:40] <craag_philcrump> Didn't seem to help much
[20:41] <craag_philcrump> Maxmed: Radials are best
[20:41] <craag_philcrump> The antenna system is one of the critical bits :)
[20:42] <craag_philcrump> Protip: You can use guitar wire for the radials - it's stiff enough to hold itself up, you can still bend it in to shape, and it solders well
[20:42] <Maxmed> Ok, I'll stick with the ground plane anttenna, I was very pleased with the range last time, it's just a bit hard to mount.
[20:44] <craag_philcrump> Yeah it is
[20:44] <craag_philcrump> Have a look at Dave's blog for how he does it, and stratodean as well.
[20:45] <Maxmed> Which Dave? Do you have a link to the blog?
[20:46] <myself> support wire = counterpoise, dangler = active element, use gravity for everything :)
[20:47] <craag_philcrump> http://www.daveakerman.com/
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[20:50] <craag_philcrump> Maxmed: More blogs with pics: http://www.norb.co.uk/
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[21:00] <lilafisch> wing oto #santa
[21:00] <lilafisch> sry
[21:00] <myself> SIbot: 0.0001 lb in sane units please :)
[21:00] <SIbot> In real units: 0.0001 lb = 4.5359237e-05 kg
[21:00] <cm13g09> SIbot: thats NOT sane!
[21:00] <myself> right?
[21:00] <myself> a hundred micrpounds!
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[21:01] <Lunar_Lander> craag thanks for the idea with the guitar wire
[21:02] <craag_philcrump> Lunar_Lander: This is what I got: http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Ernie-Ball-Custom-Gauge-Guitar-Single-Strings-Electric-or-Acoustic-Pack-6-13-/360959212478
[21:04] <Lunar_Lander> cool thanks
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[21:30] <Ian___> Ernie Ball must be having a fit, what with increased demand for #13 strings. Is that string failing somehow . . . ? Not realising that every packet is an antenna potentially destined for the North Sea or perpetual orbiting of subspace.
[21:33] <myself> aliens set down on earth in the year 4,281 after humanity has long since wiped itself out, and one of Leo's balloons is still circling, but finally its envelope gives out, and the payload descends and clonks an alien explorer on the head
[21:34] <myself> they see the vicious sharpness of the string and conclude it must be a weapon, and analyze its composition..
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[21:51] <Lunar_Lander> myself, :)
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[22:31] <kf7fer> trying to use a microSD library on a 32u4 is like trying to put 25lbs of sh*t in a 20lb bag....
[22:31] <SIbot> In real units: 20lb = 9.0718474 kg
[22:31] <kf7fer> but what about 25lbs SIbot?
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[22:32] Action: kf7fer disappointed in SIbot
[22:33] <kf7fer> bye bye bootloader? I need to start using the STM32 or something; after all, I'm a 'merican! We need POWER!
[22:36] <kf7fer> C:\Program Files (x86)\Arduino\hardware\arduino\cores\arduino\Tone.cpp:210:12: warning: #warning this may not be correct
[22:36] <kf7fer> is that like a double negative?
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[22:48] <aadamson> kf7fer, appears sibot prefers single unit, not multple unit(s) :)
[22:55] <mattbrejza> lbs = mass x time, whatever that is
[23:06] <kf7fer> far more mass than time I'm afraid
[23:06] <kf7fer> almost always too much mass. At least in my world
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[23:40] <kf7fer> I must have a lousy GPS fix... my altitude went from 85... to -53... to 225. -53? I never saw anything like that before
[23:40] <kf7fer> then 104. No wonder the rent is cheap here
[23:41] <Ian___> I was wondering if you had noticed the furniture shifting about at all . . .
[23:43] <kf7fer> just means my "is the payload stationary?" routine has gotten much more complicated
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