highaltitude.log.20140601

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[00:21] <Laurenceb_> aadamson: are you W7QO-6?
[00:21] <aadamson> that'd be me
[00:21] <Laurenceb_> ah nice flight
[00:22] <Laurenceb_> via aprs?
[00:22] <Laurenceb_> altitude is a bit noisy
[00:23] <aadamson> yeah two issues...I knew that I had a problem with where the solar controller was located in relationship to the gps
[00:23] <aadamson> it somehow interferes with it so I don't get a very good gps lock at times, but bigger issue is *RAIN*
[00:24] <aadamson> I've flown through one batch and an in or about to be in another now
[00:24] <aadamson> :(
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[00:25] <Laurenceb_> oh
[00:25] <Laurenceb_> i thought it was too early for sunset
[00:25] <Laurenceb_> looking at the altitude
[00:25] <aadamson> its just sunset now
[00:25] <aadamson> but it's a very turbulent sky at the moment
[00:25] <aadamson> especially where the balloon is.
[00:26] <aadamson> it has been locked in at 21k feet until the first batch of rain actually was following a thunderstorm
[00:27] <lz1dev> its not that bad, only moving at 13mph
[00:28] <Laurenceb_> needs to be lighter and higher
[00:29] <aadamson> yeah 25grams was more than I wanted, but it was due to a bunch of variables that I'll correct, I knew I was going to be a bit heavy
[00:29] <Laurenceb_> does the temperature only go to zero?
[00:29] <aadamson> but a 6km target what what I wanted
[00:29] <aadamson> duh, that's a programmer error
[00:29] <Laurenceb_> heh
[00:30] <aadamson> don't cast a float to uint16_t when you really want int16_t
[00:30] <aadamson> duh
[00:30] <Laurenceb_> what are the other telemetry fields
[00:30] <aadamson> hang on, I'll give you the decoder ring
[00:30] <Laurenceb_> "S2L"
[00:31] <Laurenceb_> and battery is fully charged now?
[00:31] <aadamson> http://bcas.tv/paste/results/UZSE2s30.html
[00:31] <aadamson> so I didn't have the right resistor for the VD on the batt side, 4.138 is max ADC range
[00:31] <Laurenceb_> ah
[00:32] <aadamson> I needed a 51k and a 48.7k, but instead it's 2 47k's with a 2.05 vref
[00:32] <Laurenceb_> ah
[00:32] <aadamson> it's the *little things* :)
[00:32] <Laurenceb_> heh
[00:32] <Laurenceb_> very nice for a first attempt
[00:32] <aadamson> but sheesh from where I started... I'm happy! :)
[00:33] <aadamson> much to LeoBodnar help and poking :)
[00:33] <Laurenceb_> how often does it transmit?
[00:33] <aadamson> 2 times every 2 minutes
[00:33] <aadamson> until dark then 1 time every 4 minutes
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[00:33] <Laurenceb_> ah, pretty much same as Leo
[00:33] <aadamson> it's got a little tiny < 5gram 200mah battery
[00:34] <Laurenceb_> whats the current consumption at night?
[00:34] <aadamson> uh, that's a little complicated to answer do you have access to excel?
[00:34] <Laurenceb_> yes
[00:34] <Laurenceb_> lol
[00:34] <aadamson> https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/6730484/mah%20calculator.xlsx
[00:35] <aadamson> top section is solar/lipo - left day - right night
[00:35] <aadamson> bottom left is TPS61200 on AA and bottom right is LTC3526L on AA - amazing the number there actually
[00:35] <aadamson> those are all *from the battery* numbers so on the input side of the buck or boost
[00:36] <Laurenceb_> wait
[00:36] <Laurenceb_> 6.2 days on AA?
[00:36] <aadamson> yeah
[00:36] <Laurenceb_> wow
[00:36] <aadamson> remember I go to *STOP* mode so I'm sub 1mA probably closer to 400uA
[00:36] <aadamson> the gps in shutdown draws 300uA
[00:36] <Laurenceb_> nice
[00:37] <Laurenceb_> so you boot up the tcxo each tranmit time?
[00:37] <aadamson> and with this scheme, I'm 90 seconds stop, 30 seconds on, and I shutdown the gps prior to the last beacon
[00:37] <aadamson> I do
[00:37] <Laurenceb_> interesting, aiui Leo keeps it running
[00:37] <aadamson> it's a DPLL (TI CDCEL913
[00:37] <aadamson> )
[00:37] <Laurenceb_> i guess APRS can handle a bit of frequency mismatch
[00:38] <aadamson> yeah
[00:38] <Laurenceb_> Leo was after unattended SSB operation
[00:38] <aadamson> but the dpll is up in nano seconds I believe, I'd have to look again
[00:38] <aadamson> and I use is as a vcxo
[00:38] Nick change: heathkid|2 -> heathkid
[00:38] <aadamson> it's 2.5mA of current if I just shutdown the output but leave the DPLL in regular mode
[00:38] <aadamson> I wanted that back and found no unwanted side effects so I shut it down to 40uA
[00:39] <Laurenceb_> interesting
[00:39] <aadamson> so far the radio has been awesome on 10mW
[00:39] <Laurenceb_> are you doing 434mhz?
[00:40] <aadamson> no all 144.390 (actually geofencing is running in fact the next pass of ISS is too low but the one followoing I should switch to it's freq and try to beacon through it :)
[00:40] Action: Laurenceb_ zzz - its nearly 2am here :-S
[00:40] <Laurenceb_> ok
[00:40] <Laurenceb_> cya
[00:40] <aadamson> cya! night and thanks for the comments
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[00:54] <lz1dev> aadamson: how long do you expect the balloon to fly?
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[01:16] <aadamson> lz1dev, i have no idea :)
[01:17] <aadamson> looks like it switched to night mode ok...
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[02:16] <SpeedEvil> Is there an actual upper limit to UK balloon launches - if the CAA approves it?
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[05:17] <saadzmirza> Hi. saadzmirza here.
[05:17] <saadzmirza> Anyone here?
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[05:29] <saadzmirza> 1) Has anyone tried hacking a radiosonde to transmit on amateur frequencies? How would one go about decoding the signal?
[05:31] <saadzmirza> 2) We're launching our Marathon to the Sky balloon soon. The habhub calculator says the neck lift should be 800g for a 3.5m/sec ascent with the 250g payload(actually lighter), but our balloon supplier is saying it should be 300g. Who's right?
[05:31] <Darkside> saadzmirza: to 1), yes
[05:31] <Darkside> i did sa fair bit of work on the vaisala sondes
[05:31] <Darkside> but you can't push them any higher than 420MHz
[05:32] <saadzmirza> But did it work?
[05:32] <saadzmirza> Oh.
[05:32] <Darkside> we got thm running at 420.050MHz, but at much reduced power
[05:32] <Darkside> so the short answer is "no"
[05:32] <saadzmirza> What about using a different transmitter?
[05:32] <Darkside> they are pretty intgratd devics
[05:32] <Darkside> would be a larg amount of work to use a diffrent transmitter module, or modify the existing one
[05:33] <saadzmirza> Ok. What about question 2, it's more pressing.
[05:33] <Darkside> what size balloon?
[05:34] <saadzmirza> Totex TA4000
[05:34] <Darkside> er
[05:34] <saadzmirza> Burst diameter 1506cm.
[05:34] <Darkside> whats the weight of that
[05:34] <saadzmirza> 4000gm
[05:34] <Darkside> WAT
[05:34] <Darkside> thats ridiculously huge
[05:34] <saadzmirza> Yeah altitude record
[05:34] <saadzmirza> hopefully
[05:34] <Darkside> we don't have any information on those balloons
[05:34] <saadzmirza> I do.
[05:34] <Darkside> as in, the calc doesnt support them
[05:35] <Darkside> also we've found the larger balloons more often float than go to high altitudes
[05:35] <saadzmirza> Oh yeah. I modified the burst diameter, and heck, I guess we'll overfill slightly.
[05:35] <saadzmirza> How can we avoid the float and get to the higer altitudes?
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[05:35] <Darkside> heh
[05:35] <Darkside> i'd like to know that too
[05:36] <saadzmirza> Ok. Maybe a higher ascent rate?
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[05:36] <Darkside> its a very very fine line between altitude and float
[05:36] <Darkside> last time i went <40km, we usd a 1600g hwoyee
[05:37] <saadzmirza> Do you mean >40KM?
[05:37] <saadzmirza> And I've heard that many times.
[05:37] <Darkside> yes, sorry
[05:37] <Darkside> 1600g hwoyees are magic balloons
[05:38] <saadzmirza> Hm. Are you sure you're not all representaties of Hwoyee or something?
[05:38] <Darkside> lol
[05:39] <Darkside> they're cheaper
[05:39] <saadzmirza> Anyway the $120 price seems much more palatable than the $850 for the TA4000 we paid. It's too late now
[05:39] <Darkside> and getting totex's out of the states is expnsiv
[05:39] <saadzmirza> i know read the previous message
[05:39] <saadzmirza> We're in New York.
[05:39] <Darkside> mmk
[05:40] <saadzmirza> Speaking of being in New York, it's nearly 2am here. I think I'll call it a night.
[05:40] <saadzmirza> About the neck lift issue - we're filling up a milk jug, tieing it, and when it reaches the magic number, it should have equilibrium, and we'll tie the payload and launch.
[05:41] <saadzmirza> Kaymont says the milk jug should weigh 300g, while the calculator says 800g. Who's right?
[05:42] <Darkside> dunno.
[05:43] <saadzmirza> Well, that's disappointing. What's the next course of action.
[05:43] <saadzmirza> *?
[05:44] <Darkside> use a smaller balloon?
[05:46] <saadzmirza> Ok. If I put the magic Hwoyee 1600 in the calculator, the predictor says 656g of neck lift.
[05:46] <Darkside> sorry, not much help with balloons of that size
[05:46] <saadzmirza> Ok, heh. I have a feeling Kaymont is wrong, and the predictor is right.
[05:50] <saadzmirza> According to the calculator, if we could have a Hwyoee 1600 with a burst diameter of 200m (call me crazy), you could reach above the Karman Line with a balloon. This is impossible with latex. Maybe some magic spider silk serum compound?
[05:50] <saadzmirza> Or a nano elastic mesh?
[05:54] <saadzmirza> Darkside , on this page BASE offers an explanation to your theory.
[05:54] <saadzmirza> https://groups.yahoo.com/neo/groups/GPSL/conversations/topics/11343
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[06:09] <Spectre> Morning
[06:11] <Spectre> Anyone in the know who started B-54? (username in IRC)
[06:12] <LeoBodnar> me
[06:13] <Spectre> Morning Leo. Great flight so far.
[06:14] <Spectre> Is it possible to get a list of components you used on the project? (modules, balloon)
[06:17] <LeoBodnar> morning
[06:18] <LeoBodnar> balloon is custom made but similar to Qualatex 36" foil one
[06:19] <LeoBodnar> and the module is similar to Upu PAVA 9 one I think he has schematic and code online
[06:21] <Spectre> Ok. Just one balloon or a bunch?
[06:21] <malgar> LeoBodnar: how much costs a launch like B-54 not conidering the work you put in? just the hardware..
[06:21] <malgar> *considering
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[06:27] <LeoBodnar> about £20 at a guess
[06:28] <LeoBodnar> maybe £25
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[06:30] <Spectre> LeoBodnar: you ment this page: http://ava.upuaut.net/?p=675 ?
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[06:40] <KT5TK> Pretty cool revival of W7QO-6
[06:42] <KT5TK> Back to 3000m and beaconing steady. The rain drops may have dried off.
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[07:01] <Rebounder> morrn
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[08:19] <Spectre> @LeoBodnar: Where can I buy the pAVA R9?
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[08:30] <Upu> heh
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[08:32] <Upu> you can't Spectre
[08:32] <Upu> its not for sale
[08:32] <Spectre> Oh ok
[08:33] <Spectre> Looks realy professionell
[08:33] <Upu> thanks
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[08:43] <Spectre> So the pAVA plus battery, maybe extra Antenna is all that is needed?
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[09:07] <DL7AD> are there any predictions vor b-54?
[09:08] <mfa298> Spectre: most people design their own payloads (often but not always using the AVR / Arduino chips)
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[09:10] <LeoBodnar> let's wait for aadamson releasing his design details and all copy that. It says "open hardware"
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[09:28] <mikestir> LeoBodnar: Did you ever fly a payload running Olivia?
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[09:31] <LeoBodnar> not yet but I can
[09:32] <LeoBodnar> it has a much wider character set and longert block size so it will be slower for the same symbol rate
[09:33] <mikestir> hmmm. Reason I ask is that I sent my mrs out in the car with my tracker running DominoEX16, and even though I could hear it fairly well several miles away, it was absolutely rubbish at decoding
[09:33] <mikestir> I assume it was just not tolerant at all of multipath and doppler
[09:34] <mikestir> so I guess it may not be the best choice for a potentially spinning payload
[09:34] <LeoBodnar> DomEX does not have any error correction so one missing symbol and the whole sentence is trashed
[09:35] <mikestir> I know, but I'm talking about going between perfect decodes and nothing legible at all. I reckon I could tell when she was stopped at traffic lights
[09:35] <LeoBodnar> Olivia would do much better but anything with interleaved encoding that has 2-3 seconds long block should do OK
[09:36] <LeoBodnar> if you have Domex working next logical step is THOR
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[09:41] <LeoBodnar> Olivia is a bit brain twisted if you do it from scratch mostly due to Hadamard code stage. But i think dl-fldigi has the source code in C
[09:42] <mikestir> yeah a lot of these modes seem quite poorly documented, so the fldigi source code is quite helpful
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[09:53] <mikestir> the doppler is actually quite audible
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[10:12] <Herman-PB0AHX> GA all
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[10:20] <g8fjg_ron> any details for Icarus?
[10:21] <jonsowman> g8fjg_ron: it'll be a test, ignore it
[10:22] <g8fjg_ron> thanks looked a bit strange!!!
[10:23] <jonsowman> we should really change the calltest to TESTING_IGNORE_ME for that .wav
[10:23] <jonsowman> sorry for the confusion
[10:23] <jonsowman> *callsign
[10:32] <mikestir> maybe there should be a convention that testing payloads have their callsign prefixed with an exclamation mark or something
[10:33] <daveake> Well, it's "testing" if there's no flight doc
[10:33] <daveake> There was talk of having a testing clone of SNUS
[10:33] <daveake> That was 2 conferences ago so I suspect nothing's happening on that front :p
[10:33] <chrisstubbs> That would be a good idea, or even an extra tab that displays all flights and have the main tab only display ones with active docs
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[10:34] <daveake> Plus Leo probably needs his own page :)
[10:35] <chrisstubbs> If we had a pound for every flight leo did...
[10:35] <craag> spacenearus needs a rewrite before any new functionality is added
[10:35] <craag> And there's talk of a habitat rewrite as well
[10:36] <craag> so it's probably in the works, but deep dependencies
[10:37] <chrisstubbs> Yes, I can imagine the guys that wrote it has quite a lot of time to devote to it if it was a uni project
[10:38] <craag> It would be best to have a map directly querying habitat
[10:38] <craag> This would make it very easy to filter by active flights
[10:39] <craag> But the current habitat is a bit slow to query
[10:39] <Upu> talking of conferences : http://ukhas.org.uk/general:ukhasconference2014
[10:39] <Upu> Tickets for sale now
[10:39] <Upu> buy some pls
[10:39] <craag> I wrote a version of habmap that queried it directly, and it took about a good 8 seconds to load all the data
[10:40] <Upu> I think there is some work being done on the whole system soon
[10:40] <Upu> there are 2 new servers sat waiting in the wings
[10:40] <craag> :D
[10:40] <Upu> with enough ram to load the whole NOAA dataset into RAM
[10:40] <Upu> GFS even
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[10:41] <craag> cos we really need faster predictions right :P
[10:42] <Upu> haha
[10:46] <craag> A lot of capability just waiting for use though.. reporting of soft bit decisions and confidences could get some cool results from server-side processing
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[10:50] <SpeedEvil> Just streaming audio even.
[10:50] <SpeedEvil> Rather than actually doing demodulating
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[11:01] <LeoBodnar> just remember a year ago XD [11:41] <craag> cos we really need faster predictions right :P
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[11:03] <PE0SAT> Can somebody help me with some details on Icarus, freq and mode
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[11:03] <jonsowman> PE0SAT: it's just testing, ignore it
[11:04] <PE0SAT> jonsowman: Thanks
[11:05] <Upu> I removed it
[11:06] <jonsowman> thanks Upu
[11:07] Nick change: kuldeepdhaka__ -> kuldeepdhaka
[11:07] <amell> :)
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[11:07] <amell> btw, who pays for the habitat/snus servers?
[11:09] <amell> mikestir: Thats an absolutely brilliant idea, sending the mrs out in the car with a tracker. i must try that to get some peace.
[11:10] <craag> You can even know exactly when she's coming back!
[11:10] <amell> yes, a win win all around
[11:11] <Upu> me amell
[11:11] <amell> oh, ok.
[11:12] <amell> horus reappeared. its going to get busy with the Gs taking off this afternoon
[11:14] <amell> dual transmissions should be interesting. hope dlfldigi copes with reporting two balloons at once.
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[11:24] <ike> LZ1NY-1 did you buy some balloons?
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[11:26] <vk5joe> andy is ps-8 down
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[11:34] <mikestir> amell: she left the kids behind, so peace I did not get!
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[11:37] <Spectre> Sup with icarus? Showing with parachute.
[11:38] <chrisstubbs> Spectre, its a test audio clip someone has decoded
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[11:39] <Spectre> Ok
[11:39] <LeoBodnar> trolloon
[11:39] <Spectre> :)
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[11:40] <Spectre> Looks like your B-54 will fly a lil longer.
[11:41] <LeoBodnar> hopefully
[11:42] <Spectre> Is the solar charging the batteries?
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[11:46] <malgar> I have a problem with the cut down hot wire. I'm using the mosfet irf540n driven by arduino. I know that the thresold voltage is not the best for arduino but I tried it on a breadboard and the wire cut the cord perfectly many times. Now I solder it on the stripboard but it seems that the thresold voltage is not enough anymore. I get very low current and voltage and the wire is almost cold
[11:46] <malgar> suggestions?
[11:47] <SpeedEvil> Is the arguino on the same power supply?
[11:47] <SpeedEvil> There is a right solution - a gate driver to drive the gate to 10V or so.
[11:48] <SpeedEvil> And there is 'stick a 1.5V coin cell in series with the gate.'
[11:48] <mattbrejza> looks like that mosfet should be fine of 5V but not 3.3V
[11:48] <SpeedEvil> It's not.
[11:48] <malgar> it is a 9V battery.. I changed it but voltage is the same
[11:48] <daveake> Yeah but it's the voltage at the gate that matters
[11:48] <SpeedEvil> The Rds(on) figure is specified at 10V Vgs.
[11:48] <mattbrejza> Datasheet suggests youll get 10A with 4.5Vgs
[11:48] <mattbrejza> Fig1
[11:49] <SpeedEvil> If you look in detail at the graphs, it's likely you need about 7V to swithc 10A 'reliably'
[11:49] <SpeedEvil> yeah - the fun problem is:
[11:49] <malgar> yes! and as I said before.. on the breadboard it worked perfectly
[11:49] <SpeedEvil> What is the Vgs(th) of the part measured for that graph.
[11:49] <SpeedEvil> malgar: Is this the same part?
[11:49] <LeoBodnar> Take logic level MOSFET
[11:49] <malgar> SpeedEvil: what do you mean?
[11:49] <SpeedEvil> The Vgs(th) of the FET may vary over a 2V range.
[11:49] <daveake> If it's on the edge of working, it won't take much to stop it working
[11:49] <LeoBodnar> they have Vgsth 1-2v
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[11:50] <Laurenceb_> did W7QO-6 land overnight>
[11:50] <malgar> LeoBodnar: yes.. I know.. but we will launch on thursady and time is very short.. In the next days we will search a logic level mosfet
[11:50] <SpeedEvil> malgar: Vgs(th) is the voltage at which a FET starts to turn on. In the case of the IRF part above - it's specified as 2.0-4V.
[11:51] <malgar> Spectre: isn't the output from arduino 5V?
[11:51] <malgar> it should be fine
[11:51] <SpeedEvil> malgar: That is - for any specific part, the voltage/current graph commonly shown on the datasheet might be offset by +-1V - assuming that it is using an 'average' figure of 3V.
[11:51] <LeoBodnar> I also have bad news for Vgs)th)
[11:51] <SpeedEvil> The threshold voltage rises as it gets cold.
[11:51] <daveake> It does
[11:51] <daveake> I've used IRLB8721PBF which works
[11:51] <LeoBodnar> its tempco is negative
[11:52] <SpeedEvil> If it's marginal on the ground, it won't work at all at -20C. A 1.5V battery in series with the gate may make it reliable.
[11:52] <SpeedEvil> Or a single transistor amplifier to take it to 9V
[11:52] <LeoBodnar> ooh, shit design
[11:52] <mattbrejza> you could always pull the gate high to 9V and have the pin go low or hi-z
[11:52] <malgar> :D this is not a problem because we will use it to cut the cord at ground. The reason is that our area is covered by forest with high trees
[11:52] <daveake> yup. lots of ways to make this work
[11:52] <SpeedEvil> malgar: Err - no.
[11:52] <LeoBodnar> *inline battery
[11:53] <mattbrejza> although not the best idea for a cutdown (my one)
[11:53] <malgar> and we will cute the parachute-payload cord
[11:53] <SpeedEvil> malgar: The chip may either explode, or stop working if you do that.
[11:53] <SpeedEvil> malgar: you can't pull the voltage on a pin outside the supply rails
[11:53] <malgar> SpeedEvil: I don't take the power from arduino
[11:53] <malgar> but from a 9V battery
[11:53] <LeoBodnar> do you have any BJT transistors malgar ?
[11:53] <malgar> LeoBodnar: I don't think so
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[11:54] <malgar> LeoBodnar: do you have a specific one to suggest me?
[11:54] <SpeedEvil> malgar: The easy way is a 10K resistor to the base of an NPN transistor from the GPIO, ground the emitter of the NPN, and then connect the collector to a 10K to 9V. Then the collector goes to the gate of the FET
[11:54] <LeoBodnar> make a BJT transistor control gate voltage from 0V to 9V
[11:54] <LeoBodnar> almost anything should work
[11:55] <LeoBodnar> something like this http://www.neufeld.newton.ks.us/files/electronics/mosfet-motor/MOSFET-motor-driver.png
[11:55] <mattbrejza> is there a local electronics place that might sell mosfets?
[11:55] <mattbrejza> if so the easiset way would be to buy a level logic one
[11:56] <malgar> mattbrejza: yes, but the last time I went there I ask about a logic level mosfet and they said that I have to give them the exact model because they don't know what it is
[11:56] <mattbrejza> well do they have a list so that you could have a look through?
[11:57] <mattbrejza> if not do something with a bjt
[11:57] <mattbrejza> although that one leo posted will be risky for a cutdown, but you can always attach the wire after everything is powered up
[11:57] <malgar> mattbrejza: on tuesday I'll go there to check better. Maybe I can go there with a big list of compatible mosfet
[11:58] <LeoBodnar> http://uk.farnell.com/infineon/ipp039n04l-g/mosfet-n-ch-80a-40v-pg-to220-3/dp/1775618
[11:58] <LeoBodnar> http://uk.farnell.com/stmicroelectronics/stp60nf03l/mosfet-n-logic-to-220/dp/9803254
[11:58] <malgar> mattbrejza: the cutdown is to get the payload free from the parachute if it goes on a tree
[11:58] <LeoBodnar> http://uk.farnell.com/jsp/search/browse.jsp?N=204245+731+502+110158844+110169484+110158845+110180972+110199684+110175628&No=0&getResults=true&appliedparametrics=true&locale=en_UK&divisionLocale=en_UK&catalogId=&skipManufacturer=false&skipParametricAttributeId=&prevNValues=204245+731+502+110158844+110169484+110158845+110180972+110199684&mm=1002572||,1001803||,1002090||,&filtersHidden=false&appliedHidden=false&autoApply=false&ori
[11:59] <mikestir> pull the bjt base up and make sure the firmware sets the output high before it sets the pin to an output
[11:59] <Laurenceb_> try maplin
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[12:00] <LeoBodnar> these all have Vgsth <=1.5V
[12:00] <malgar> LeoBodnar: thank you
[12:01] <mattbrejza> if it comes to the day before the launch you can bodge fix with a single resistor but its not ideal
[12:02] <LeoBodnar> there'll be other things to bodge fix it day before
[12:02] <LeoBodnar> do it properly
[12:02] <malgar> fortunately this cut down is not critical.. it is just a safety feature to get the payload free if it goes on a tree
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[12:06] <malgar> anyway.. I still don't understand why it worked on the breadboard
[12:06] <malgar> I tried it many times.. always working
[12:06] <craag> malgar: same battery?
[12:07] <mattbrejza> same device?
[12:07] <malgar> not the same battery.. but the same model and same voltage
[12:08] <malgar> same device.. wait.. I changed the gpio but they should are all the same
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[12:08] <craag> And using a 3.3v arduino both times?
[12:08] <malgar> noo arduino uno
[12:08] <malgar> 5v
[12:08] <malgar> in both times
[12:08] <craag> hmm puzzling
[12:09] <malgar> I used the A2 pin as gate for the mosfet
[12:09] <craag> definitely got the right gpio? (checked the voltage on the gate of the mosfet)?
[12:09] <malgar> and on the breadboard was pin 7
[12:09] <malgar> now I chek the voltage
[12:10] <LeoBodnar> is your wire connected to drain or source?
[12:11] <malgar> just measured the voltage at the gate: 5.05 V
[12:11] <Laurenceb_> http://i.imgur.com/xOaiJhP.jpg
[12:12] <malgar> LeoBodnar: 5V->WIRE->drain; source->GND
[12:12] <malgar> ops
[12:12] <malgar> LeoBodnar: 9V->WIRE->drain; source->GND
[12:12] <craag> can you check the voltage at drain and source?
[12:13] <LeoBodnar> perhaps your source voltage gets lifted above GND
[12:14] <LeoBodnar> because of voltage drop
[12:15] <malgar> craag: when wire is connected.. 0.5-0.7 V, when is not connected 7V
[12:15] <craag> Ok, so you have got ~6V across the wire
[12:15] <craag> Sounds like a wire issue rather than a MOSFET one
[12:16] <craag> What's the battery voltage when it's switched on?
[12:16] <malgar> craag: no wait.. this measurement is between 9V and drain
[12:16] <craag> err ok
[12:16] <craag> can you measure the voltage at drain and source with respect to ground, when it's switched on?
[12:17] <malgar> with hot wire connected?
[12:17] <craag> yeah
[12:17] <craag> or the not-so-hot wire ;)
[12:17] <malgar> :D
[12:18] <malgar> I want to be careful to manage it.. I would like to avoid a sudden burn :P
[12:19] <craag> Yep, try connecting the voltmeter, then switch the circuit on, glance at the voltage and then switch it off.
[12:20] <malgar> 6.3 when it's off, 5.2 when it's on
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[12:20] <craag> ok, and on the source?
[12:20] <malgar> battery is 7.99 V now
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[12:20] <craag> (should be 0V always)
[12:21] <craag> but as Leo said, it might not be
[12:21] <malgar> between source and GN?
[12:21] <malgar> gnd
[12:21] <craag> yeah
[12:21] <craag> just to make sure there's no voltage drop there
[12:22] <malgar> well.. source is conncected to ground with a drop of stain.. so it has to be 0
[12:22] <malgar> measured: 0V
[12:23] <craag> Ok, not a clue then. Could be a dead MOSFET.
[12:23] <craag> Would be good to replace it with a lower threshold one anyway.
[12:23] <malgar> uh.. arduino light gets lower when battery is connected (I use the same battery in parallel
[12:24] <malgar> wait.. *when pin is high
[12:24] <craag> Always have your cut-down on a separate battery to the arduino
[12:24] <craag> But it sounds like you might have some flat batteries which wouldn't be helping at all
[12:24] <craag> If the LED dims, then that means the arduino hasn't got 5V
[12:25] <craag> So it'll be driving the MOSFET with less than 5V.
[12:25] <malgar> I have the lithium ultimate But I use them just for the flight
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[12:26] <craag> Ok, do you separate batteries for the cutdown MOSFET and for the arduino?
[12:26] <aadamson> OMG, I have phoenix it appears ... I figured for how quickly it came down rain (and maybe ice related) that it had an envelop problem... appears it just needed to take a break...
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[12:26] <aadamson> no will it survive the morning heat cycle...
[12:26] <aadamson> now
[12:27] <malgar> It was not in my plans.. but I'll do for sure now
[12:27] <G0WXI> Hi, I'm just in the final prep stages for launching flights G-04 and G-05, is anyone around to approve my flights please? - thanks Graeme
[12:27] <craag> malgar: Yep, last thing you want is it rebooting your arduino when it pulls all that current!
[12:28] <malgar> craag: yes.. but as I said, it is not so critical beacuse it will be activated when the flight will be over
[12:28] <craag> ping Upu - flight doc approval
[12:28] <craag> G0WXI: Got the doc ids?
[12:28] <malgar> anyway I'll do that
[12:29] <jonsowman> i can do it if he's not around craag
[12:29] <craag> malgar: Good practice though! (And you might still need the tracking signal to find it)
[12:29] <malgar> right
[12:30] <craag> cheers jon - for graeme G0WXI
[12:30] <jonsowman> got the IDs?
[12:30] <jonsowman> actually it's ok, G-04 and G-05 right G0WXI?
[12:30] <malgar> unfortunately tomorrow here shops are closed due national holyday
[12:30] <jonsowman> docs end in b8c and 15f respectively?
[12:31] <G0WXI> 69523e115a14b2c241fd32c3a8762b8c 2014-06-01T14:00:00+01:00 Yes, is this the ID for G-04?
[12:31] <jonsowman> correct
[12:31] <malgar> I can't buy it before tuesday and we will launch thursday :\
[12:31] <jonsowman> G0WXI: you want both 04 _and_ 05 approved?
[12:31] <G0WXI> yes please, both are going up at the same time
[12:31] <craag> malgar: cutting it fine! It does sound like your immediate problem is a dead battery.
[12:32] <mattbrejza> are you powering the cutdown and tracker from the same battery?
[12:32] <jonsowman> G0WXI: craag: OK, all done for you. good luck!
[12:32] <craag> mattbrejza: He was
[12:32] <malgar> mattbrejza: yes but I will change it
[12:32] <mattbrejza> ok
[12:32] <G0WXI> Excellent, many thanks
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[13:09] <G8APZ> amell are you calibrated today?
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[13:13] <G6SUQ_Graham> Ooh, G04
[13:13] <Neil_M0CJM> Afternoon all
[13:13] <Steve_G0TDJ> Hi Guys
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[13:13] <G6SUQ_Graham> ... and if that prediction is correct it will land near me
[13:14] <Neil_M0CJM> Hi Steve_G0TDJ
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[13:14] <Steve_G0TDJ> Hi Neil
[13:15] <G6SUQ_Graham> I think the altitude is a little wrong - 439m - Je think not!
[13:15] <G8APZ> what the heck? I should be receiving by now... just occasional crud on the freq.
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[13:15] <G6SUQ_Graham> #ooh, I take that back, it's launched!
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[13:17] <jonsowman> good lord I hope that prediction is wrong
[13:17] <G8APZ> I don't like this fast telemetry
[13:17] <craag> jonsowman: I think it's a foil pico
[13:17] <jonsowman> phew
[13:18] <Steve_G0TDJ> "I'm planning a simultaneous launch today of 2 pico flights" - Graeme
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[13:20] <G6SUQ_Graham> maybe a second pico, maybe both on the same balloon?
[13:21] <G8APZ> It's decoding as NO GPS SIGNAL
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[13:22] <G8APZ> NO GPS SIGNAL - Sats in view = 0 - Batt volts = 3.042V
[13:22] <G0WXI> That's not gone to plan, G-05 has no GPS lock :(, I very much doubt it will recover.
[13:23] <Steve_G0TDJ> Damn. I was particularly interested in G-05 because of the Tx chip
[13:24] <G8APZ> the telem on 434.125 is decoding OK, but on 510 its the NO GPS message
[13:24] <Steve_G0TDJ> What are they on the dial please G8APZ?
[13:24] <G0WXI> Sod's law during testing it has worked everytime, the ADF7012 is a great chip.
[13:25] <G0WXI> G-04 is Txing on .510, but with no GPS lock to time sync it's Tx G-05 is trashing G-04
[13:26] <Steve_G0TDJ> OK Cheers
[13:26] <G8APZ> 125 and 510
[13:27] <Steve_G0TDJ> Listening for '04
[13:27] <G8APZ> G-04 telem is on those two freqs, but G-05 is warbling away 1kHz away!
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[13:28] <G8APZ> g-05 is on 511.7
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[13:28] <G8APZ> G-05 has no GPS lock so effectively useless
[13:29] <Spectre> Anyone of you ever tried the ultimate GPS module by Adafruit?
[13:29] <Steve_G0TDJ> I can see traces of G-05 on the waterfall but not decoding anyway
[13:30] <Neil_M0CJM> nowt here
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[13:30] <mfa298> Spectre: I think a few people have mistakenly used them and then been annoyed when they cut out before the balloon bursts
[13:30] <G8APZ> the fast RTTY and no lead in tone means squelch is useless and screen fills with crap between packets!
[13:31] <Steve_G0TDJ> Yep, G-04 too but not strong enough to decode yet.
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[13:33] <Spectre> So most used unit is u-blox?
[13:33] <G8APZ> On 125 you get two messages. first a very short transmission with a header ** G-04 ** and then a break before the telemetry packet
[13:33] <G6SUQ_Graham> sigs just becoming audible in the mush
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[13:33] <G8APZ> with such short packets, it's hard to keep them in tune
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[13:34] <mfa298> Spectre: most people use the uBlox modules as they are well tested in hab conditions and can be set to work at higher altitudes. most other gps modules cut out at 12/18/27 km
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[13:35] <G8APZ> This is hard.... no lead in tone, and the packet comes in out of the expected passband... Aargh
[13:35] <G6SUQ_Graham> are *all* arduino's suitable for HAB, or are there ones to avoid?
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[13:35] <Spectre> mfa298: Ok. The MAX7 Series from u-blox Looks good.
[13:36] <mfa298> you can even get them on the hab supplies store and with useful breakouts if you don't want to solder that small
[13:37] <mfa298> modules http://ava.upuaut.net/store/index.php?route=product/category&path=59_64
[13:37] <mfa298> breakouts http://ava.upuaut.net/store/index.php?route=product/category&path=59_60
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[13:42] <DutchMillbt> Hi all what's ICARUS frequency?
[13:42] <daveake> It's a test
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[13:43] <DutchMillbt> a simulation?
[13:43] <daveake> There's a wav file recording of icarus on the wiki
[13:44] <Upu> need to redo that with one that comes up as NOTREAL
[13:44] <DutchMillbt> oke roger ;-)
[13:44] <daveake> and a surprising number of people decode and upload it
[13:44] <daveake> and a slightly lower number of people think it's a real flight :p
[13:44] <Laurenceb_> http://i.ytimg.com/vi/iZdw-9tCuEY/0.jpg
[13:44] <G6SUQ_Graham> and some people go chase it!
[13:46] <Laurenceb_> did W7QO-6 land overnight?
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[13:51] <Upu> I'm confused
[13:51] <Upu> doesn't take much
[13:51] <Upu> what's with these G payloads
[13:51] <Upu> what frequency are they transmitting on?
[13:51] <craag> 434.507.69 here
[13:51] <craag> but intermittent
[13:52] <Upu> no gps signal ?
[13:52] <craag> meant to be TDMA with the other one
[13:52] <craag> But the other one doesn't have lock
[13:52] <Upu> ah
[13:52] <Upu> whats on 434.125 ?
[13:53] <craag> Erm more intermittent telemetry it looks like
[13:53] <craag> not sure why
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[13:56] <Upu> its also G-04
[13:56] <craag> I've got G-04 on 434.507
[13:56] <Upu> $$G-04,182,13:56400,52.214268,0.173651,3096,6,2.997,1.100,91,1*8BAA
[13:56] <Upu> from 434.125
[13:56] <craag> So TDMA and Frequency Diversity?
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[13:57] <mfa298> I think the email was suggesting there was some channel hopping as well for those with qrm issues on one freq
[13:57] <Upu> ok uploading on both frequencies
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[13:57] <craag> Ah ok, makes sense I guess.
[13:57] <Upu> interesting idea
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[13:58] <craag> Usually people put different trackers on different freqs, but this way you make sure you get data from both trackers.
[13:59] <craag> Good signal! 300 baud working well here
[13:59] <G8APZ> pity there is no preamble lead in .....
[13:59] <Upu> its stable
[13:59] <Upu> so turn AFC off
[14:00] <G8APZ> a sudden packet and the AFC can't always follow any drift
[14:00] <craag> Yeah, AFC off, filter at 325hz
[14:00] <craag> I haven't touched it in a good few minutes and it's getting 100%
[14:01] <craag> or was, til I poked it :P
[14:01] <G8APZ> it was drifting earlier hence use of AFC
[14:01] <Martin_G4FUI> My experience with discontinuous transmissions is that they are tricky to decode, especially at the beginning of the string - if a series of, say NULs were sent at the beginning, would this make telemetry strings more decodable, or would there be other unwanted side-effects?
[14:02] <G8APZ> a lead in tone is desirable....
[14:02] <G8APZ> idle I think it's called
[14:03] <G8APZ> if nothing else it would allow me to use squelch rather than having random noise clutter in between packets!
[14:03] <G0WXI> There's a few return characters to help get sync, having squelch enabled will kill it though
[14:04] <mattbrejza> you probably want a few 0-1-0 transistions to get teh afc on target
[14:04] <mattbrejza> i assume thats what the problem is
[14:05] <G8APZ> frequency hopping interesting though!
[14:05] <Martin_G4FUI> I have vague recollections from teleprinter days of something which used to be called "idle reversals" - proabably some kind of trick for degaussing polarised relays or some such Black Magic!
[14:05] <craag> there's no reason to have squelch on tbh
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[14:07] <G0WXI> G-05 is alive :)
[14:07] <G8APZ> craag true, but screen clutters up between packets... I prefer to see a few of them before they disappear!
[14:07] <G8APZ> oooh!
[14:08] <g8fjg_ron> G05 working
[14:08] <Upu> whys it not on the map ?
[14:08] <Martin_G4FUI> Is this an attempted float, btw?
[14:09] <G8APZ> I'm decoding G-05 on 511.7
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[14:09] <Steve_G0TDJ> G-05 is no longer sending continuously. Does that mean it's got Sat lock?
[14:09] <Martin_G4FUI> Anyone posted ths lauch on Twitter?
[14:09] <Upu> [2014-06-01 14:08:55,922] DEBUG habitat.parser MainThread: Exception in UKHAS main parse: ValueError: Incorrect number of fields (got 8, expect 7)
[14:10] <Martin_G4FUI> launch
[14:10] <Steve_G0TDJ> Martin_G4FUI: I did
[14:10] <G8APZ> it appears to have locked
[14:10] <Upu> yes Steve but looks like payload doc is wrong
[14:10] <Steve_G0TDJ> Ah!
[14:10] <Steve_G0TDJ> Can it be fixed?
[14:10] <Martin_G4FUI> Ok Steve_G0TDJ ta ...
[14:10] <Upu> someone can I'm sure just not me :)
[14:11] PD1LDO (c26da205@gateway/web/freenode/ip.194.109.162.5) joined #highaltitude.
[14:11] <G8APZ> I see Leo's B-54 is east of Madrid
[14:11] <PD1LDO> can anyone tell me the freq of G04?
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[14:12] <Steve_G0TDJ> PD1LDO: I have G-04 sigs on 434.124.47 for 1500 center
[14:12] <Upu> its also on 434.509
[14:12] <G8APZ> Upu you are doing well at the outer edge of the circle
[14:13] <Upu> My antenna is 300 meters tall
[14:13] <Upu> https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/63720513/Images/HAM/Rotator/IMG_0796.JPG
[14:13] <G8APZ> Upu agl I presume?
[14:13] <Upu> yes :)
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[14:14] <PD1LDO> Steve_G0TDJ: RTTY300?
[14:15] <Steve_G0TDJ> Roger 7n1
[14:15] <G8APZ> G-04 not covering much ground... winds must be very light
[14:16] <PD1LDO> thnks already setup software so it is ready to receive when we are able to ;)
[14:19] <PE2G> PD1LDO: What's yr QTH?
[14:19] <Upu> G-05 on the map
[14:20] <Steve_G0TDJ> Coolio
[14:20] <Steve_G0TDJ> Getting the occasional partial I think it's below my horizon
[14:21] <PD1LDO> PE2G: near Herman
[14:21] <PD1LDO> Pijnacker
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[14:26] <G0WXI> Just for info, now G-05 has lock, G-04 will Tx on 00,15,30,45 secs, alternating between .510 and .125, after each sentence Tx it will Tx on the alt freq just the call sign. G-05 does the same Tx pattern but at 07,22,37,52 secs
[14:28] <Steve_G0TDJ> So close: $$$$G-05,q0,14z28:36,5214>938,0.006452,4834V,3,010,*F61;E.......
[14:30] <g8fjg_ron> got them both decoding on 2 sets of dl-fldigi
[14:35] <PD1LDO> it has to climb a bit more for me te come into the footprint
[14:36] <G0WXI> G-05 breaks 5km :) I must be getting the weight down
[14:36] <Neil_M0CJM> does help if you open the bandwidth filter up to like 350 :-)
[14:36] <G8APZ> Bugger! G-05 lost lock
[14:37] <G8APZ> back again but alternating
[14:37] <G8APZ> Sats in view 38???
[14:38] <G8APZ> Sats in view 34.... something is up Houston!!
[14:38] <Neil_M0CJM> wow 2 instances of fldigi open and decoding them both at same time
[14:40] <G8APZ> G-05 packets decoding with wrong lat/long whilst no GPS lock
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[14:45] <malgar> I need a suggestion: When there isn't GPS signal, do I stop sending rtty strings or I transmit the last valid one, or a string with something like -9999.999 ?
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[14:51] <G8APZ> Malgar it depends if there is useful info in the packet... the lat/lon needs to be valid I guess, even though it is wrong...but there needs to be some way of indicating "Untrustworthy""
[14:51] <Thomascatt> what is the secret to decoding 04 and 05?
[14:51] <craag> malgar: I tend to send the last known good time/lat/lon/alt but with satellites=0
[14:52] <malgar> ok
[14:52] <G6SUQ_Graham> so, are there 2 or 3 ballons flying?
[14:53] <G8APZ> Thomascatt tune to one of the frequencies... at the moment G-04 is on 434.125
[14:54] <G8APZ> then use FL digi and select the flight... auto configure then set the op mode/rtty/custom filter bandwidth to about 350
[14:54] <Thomascatt> 125 is very weak
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[14:55] <G8APZ> Thomascatt where are you?
[14:55] <Thomascatt> I assume RTTYR?
[14:55] <Thomascatt> South Coast
[14:56] <Thomascatt> got : $$$$$G 05,!98,14:55:50,252.w38297,-2960.300049,010614,15,2.948,1*D144
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[14:57] <Thomascatt> looks like not stroing enough!!
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[14:57] <Lunar_Lander> hello
[14:57] <G8APZ> Thomascatt you are almost decoding OK!
[14:57] <Thomascatt> many thanks I ll sit on the frequency
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[15:01] <G8APZ> G6SUQ_Graham I think it is one flight with two trackers.... G0WXI will know
[15:01] <G8APZ> G-05 gone into a carrier probably resetting?
[15:01] <G8APZ> G-05 back
[15:03] <G0WXI> G-05, random reset, sentence Id back to 0
[15:03] <G8APZ> Thomascatt are you on the HAB map under a different name? I mean is your FL digi online?
[15:03] <G8APZ> G0WXI any idea what the problem is Graham?
[15:05] <G0WXI> Not sure my code isn't clever enough to do an intentional reset
[15:06] <G0WXI> I'm wondering if a lack of harmonic filtering on the ADF7012 output is causing the blocking of the GPS
[15:06] <G8APZ> Oh! maybe the volts to the GPS or the processor are intermittent and caused a reset?
[15:06] <Thomascatt> G8APZ not sue abt your question but no the map does not show me been like this lately
[15:07] <G0WXI> wouldn't suprise me with my soldering
[15:09] <G8APZ> Thomascatt have you set up the operator location and name in configuration section?
[15:09] <Thomascatt> thought I had Ill take another look...
[15:09] <G8APZ> G0WXI do you use pb/sn/ag solder?
[15:10] <G0WXI> all easy solder pb
[15:10] <G8APZ> Thomascatt check in DLClient tab that online is ticked
[15:10] <Thomascatt> bear with me...
[15:11] <G8APZ> G0WXI I use 0.5mm with 2% silver - eutectic... easy to get small clean joints
[15:13] <Thomascatt> ill shut machine down to cold...
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[15:14] <G0WXI> G8APZ, I will have to look that up
[15:14] <G8APZ> G0WXI I don't use that lead free muck!
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[15:17] <craag> Lead-free isn't that bad, just less forgiving.
[15:18] <craag> I do use leaded at home for the convenience of it.
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[15:19] <tbbelg> Hello
[15:20] <tbbelg> I'm from Belgium. I would try my telemetry but don't see my balloon on spacenear.us
[15:21] number10 (519a0c5e@gateway/web/freenode/ip.81.154.12.94) joined #highaltitude.
[15:21] <craag> Hey tbbelg
[15:21] Thomascatt (5207d160@gateway/web/freenode/ip.82.7.209.96) joined #highaltitude.
[15:21] <tbbelg> dl-fldigit : upload ok
[15:21] <craag> So you've got your own balloon transmitting rtty?
[15:21] <craag> ok
[15:21] <Thomascatt> is ant windwows wonderfull !
[15:21] <craag> Have you made a payload doc?
[15:22] <tbbelg> yes
[15:22] <Thomascatt> and if by magic it decodes and im on the ,map with gratefull thanks
[15:22] <aadamson> not sure of country restrictions, but if talking solder paste, my favorite is kester easy profile 256, it is lead solder, but it just makes a nice DIY board
[15:22] <amell> freq for G4/5
[15:22] <amell> ?
[15:22] <aadamson> and I just use a toaster oven and arduino reflow controller
[15:23] <craag> tbbelg: What's your payload callsign?
[15:23] <tbbelg> behialex-1
[15:23] <craag> tbbelg: Can you try uploading now?
[15:24] <tbbelg> it upload every minutes +-
[15:24] <aadamson> Laurenceb_, yes, it got in a thunderstorm and rain (actually was in it for a while, tracking either just behind or just north, couldn't escape) and finally landed around 11pm EDT - I went to bed
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[15:24] <tbbelg> just a minute i verify
[15:25] <aadamson> Laurenceb_, figuring it had an envelop problem, when my wife looked this morning and told me it was at 21k feet... it spent 2:45 on the ground, in a tree, bush, on a rooftop, who knows... but has been at 21-24k ever since..
[15:25] <tbbelg> gps signal had gone,i will reset it
[15:25] <craag> tbbelg: Gotcha, you're uploading, but no gps lock.
[15:25] <craag> ok
[15:25] <lz1dev> "latitude": 0.0,
[15:25] <lz1dev> "longitude": 0.0,
[15:25] <mattbrejza> 21000 ft
[15:25] <SIbot> In real units: 21000 ft = 6 km
[15:25] <mattbrejza> ah
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[15:27] <tbbelg> it's back :-)
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[15:28] <craag> tbbelg: You've got 'invalid_always' set up in your payload doc
[15:29] <tbbelg> what does it mean ?
[15:29] <amell> NO GPS SIG - Sats in View = 0 - Batt Volts = 2.926V
[15:29] <amell> got it
[15:29] <craag> You need to tell habitat how it can know when it's got gps lock
[15:29] <amell> is this expected? :)
[15:30] <G8APZ> amell go to 125 and try the G-04 transmitter
[15:30] <G8APZ> G-05 is out of GPS lock
[15:30] <craag> tbbelg: So you are sending number of satellites?
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[15:30] <tbbelg> yes
[15:31] <G8APZ> amell there are two transmissions ... one is a few kHz above the other... G-04 on 125 and G-05 is on 510
[15:31] <amell> i have strong local interference on 125
[15:31] <craag> tbbelg: You can use that to tell habitat when you have a lock
[15:31] <amell> not tracked it down yet, i think its some shitty ISM device in the house
[15:31] <craag> tbbelg: For example, search for CRACKLE in the payload docs
[15:31] <tbbelg> thank you craag. I will search for it
[15:31] <G8APZ> amell it is 350 baud so comes in fits and starts!
[15:31] <Upu_M0UPU> thats the idea of this launch amell so you can rx on another frequency
[15:31] <G8APZ> G- 05 is resetting with carrier right now
[15:31] <craag> tbbelg: There's a filter in the telemetry string config, that looks for 4-12 satellites.
[15:32] <G8APZ> G-05 back online at 510
[15:32] <G8APZ> I'm sure there is a RTTY "BEL" code at the start!!
[15:33] <amell> blimey this is hard to tune
[15:34] <Thomascatt> it is hard work! and it drifts but its all part of the fun!!!
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[15:34] <G8APZ> Thomascatt turn off the AFC and squelch
[15:35] <Thomascatt> Done though the idea was to leave AFC on!
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[15:36] <G8APZ> the AFC hunts when no signal.... and when the sig comes back it isn't in the right place!
[15:36] <Thomascatt> Ah OK thats sounds good its off sxo hopefully will stay put manty thanks!
[15:37] <G8APZ> Thomascatt that's good for this type of monitoring... other flights with continual and drifty signals best done with AFC on!
[15:38] <Thomascatt> OK Many thanks Ill get the idea one day!!
[15:38] <G8APZ> I still don't see you on the map though
[15:39] <G8APZ> unless it is with a different id
[15:39] <Thomascatt> as G4MYS !!
[15:39] <amell> i see it but not decoding - lot of noise
[15:39] <G8APZ> ah OK!!
[15:39] <G8APZ> Southampton area
[15:40] <Thomascatt> I had noted if I use G4MYS the comments go on the internet! thus with an nick name my comment are well hidden!
[15:40] <G8APZ> amell for calibration purposes, the sigs are on 125 and 510
[15:40] <tbbelg> craag : i add "number of sat".
[15:41] <amell> going back to 5 - 4 has too much local interference.
[15:41] <G8APZ> Thomascatt OK... don't have to watch your .--. and --.-
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[15:43] <Thomascatt> G8APZ i was surprised when I feed my call in the comments made here all come up!
[15:44] <Thomascatt> one does not want ones mates laughing!!
[15:44] <G8APZ> Right!
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[15:44] <delphinus> what frequency are G04/5 on?
[15:45] <dutch_duc> 434,125 et 434,510 (USB)
[15:45] <Laurenceb_> W7QO-6 needs a dropped probe to fly into fort knox
[15:45] <delphinus> thanks
[15:45] <G8APZ> plus another transmission one or two kHz HF
[15:46] <dutch_duc> somebody knows for Icarus qrg ?
[15:46] <jonsowman> dutch_duc: it's testing, ignore it
[15:46] <G8APZ> G-04 looks to be flying very close to me on the predicted path
[15:46] <Upu_M0UPU> its been removed just refresh dutch_duc
[15:46] <amell> downloading 3.17Gb of data from my rocket flight this morning
[15:47] <G8APZ> G0WXI there is a small discrepancy in the height between 04 and 05 - interesting
[15:47] <amell> it would have been a lot less if i hadnt had trouble finding it in the cornfield. Passed my Level 1 UKRA certification today :)
[15:48] <G8APZ> is that foundation?
[15:48] <dutch_duc> thanks to jonsowman and Upu_M0UPU
[15:49] <G8APZ> G3XHY co-ords are wrong in FLdigi - off the Norfolk coast!
[15:50] <Thomascatt> The United Kingdom Rocketry Association (UKRA) promotes and represents high power, medium power and model rocketry in the
[15:50] <G8APZ> G-05 lost GPS again
[15:51] <Thomascatt> sounds interesting!!!
[15:51] <Upu_M0UPU> its back G8APZ
[15:51] <G8APZ> G-05 back
[15:51] <PE0SAT> G8APZ: Yep it is back
[15:51] <Thomascatt> which UKRA is ment?
[15:52] <PE0SAT> signals are ok, but dl-fldigi finds it difficult to decode
[15:54] <tbbelg> I don't see 'CRACKLE' in payload doc. Where can I find information about it ?
[15:54] <PE0SAT> Who is on 434.510, I have B-05 on 434.511.6
[15:55] <Upu_M0UPU> G-04
[15:55] <PE0SAT> Upu_M0UPU: Thanks
[15:55] <Upu_M0UPU> G-04 is switching between 434.510 and 434.12 something
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[16:10] <G8APZ> G0WXI Interesting that G-05 telemetry when it says no GPS is sending believable lat/long with extra characters.... 2 in front of lat and 296 in front of lon
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[16:15] <tbbelg> I don't see how to tell habitat that is a lock
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[16:16] Nick change: [1]Geoff-G8DHE-M -> Geoff-G8DHE-M
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[16:26] <G0WXI> G8APZ G-05 is a smaller module than G-04, so just a little less weight, so expect the float to be higher
[16:28] <G8APZ> g0wxi still reporting no GPS. Can you see what I mean about the lat/lon it sends?
[16:29] <G8APZ> Ah... resetting
[16:30] <G0WXI> G8APZ yes well spotted, I'm wondering if I don't clear my arrays correctly and they get loaded with cr*p when GPS is lost
[16:31] <G0WXI> I don't know what is causing the reset either, I don't know if soem sort of watchdog is getting triggered?
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[16:34] <G8APZ> g0wxi maybe the GPS is falsely being reported as lost? Could it be as a result of the crap?
[16:36] <G0WXI> G8APZ seems it could be reading the GPS data fields somehow out of sync, reporting high no. of sats in view etc.
[16:36] <tbbelg> craag : sorry don't see how to fix it :-(
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[16:39] <G8APZ> g0wxi I hope you have a listing of the code that flew on G-05!
[16:40] <daveake> G0WXI I suspect that, as your GPS parsing is out of sync, you might have a memory overflow and that's causing the resets
[16:40] <Geoff-G8DHE-M> Ah I am getting a G-04 just above G-05 as well as down on 434.125 ??
[16:40] <Geoff-G8DHE-M> Its almost like an image ??
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[16:42] <Geoff-G8DHE-M> In fact I can see both down on 434.126 and .127 as well as both up on 434.511 and 512 ??
[16:43] <Geoff-G8DHE-M> this is on a dongle so no image likely to be causing the problem either ...
[16:43] <mikestir> I thought that was the idea? They both transmit on two frequencies alternately
[16:44] <Geoff-G8DHE-M> Oh I see! I thought one was down on 125 and the other 0n 510.
[16:44] <Geoff-G8DHE-M> trnasmitting alterntively.
[16:45] <Geoff-G8DHE-M> I'm only popping in from time to time probably missed that fact!
[16:45] <G8APZ> No - each transmits on both freq with one of them a bout 1kHz higher
[16:46] <G8APZ> ie G-05 is 1kHz higher on both freqs
[16:46] <Geoff-G8DHE-M> yup with it now.
[16:47] <G8APZ> FLdigi reports 51km away... that isn't right!
[16:47] <Lunar_Lander> hi daveake, recently I found a spacenear screenshot you posted the day of my flight which shows my balloon being first received, and in the chat you asked yourself if I would sign it for you
[16:48] <Lunar_Lander> would you still be interested?
[16:48] <lz1dev> i'd sign it
[16:48] <lz1dev> :p
[16:48] <daveake> That seems such a long time ago :)
[16:49] <daveake> It's OK no need :)
[16:49] <Lunar_Lander> :)
[16:50] <G8APZ> It is 22km from here to G-05 and FLdigi says 51km!
[16:51] <G8APZ> OBO 110 X
[16:51] <G8APZ> no GPS again!
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[16:58] <gonzo_> something flying?
[16:59] <G8APZ> yes.. G-04 and G-05 on 510 and 125
[16:59] <G0WXI> G8APZ daveake yes, I always keep a branch of the code for each flight, a bit more testing, thanks for the pointer dave re memory overflow, I'll have a look into this
[16:59] <G8APZ> each on both qrgs but 05 1 kHz or so higher than 04
[17:00] <G8APZ> gonzo and 05 out of GPS lock atm
[17:01] <G8APZ> g0wxi 05 still believable lat long if you strip the leading digits
[17:01] <jonsowman> sprintf -> snprintf -> be happy
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[17:01] <G8APZ> it is odd that it keeps parroting "NO GPS" though.... continually!
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[17:04] <malgar> finally listeners are increasing in Italy
[17:05] <malgar> we wrote some articles on blogs and HAM forums
[17:12] <gonzo_> I'll have a look ta
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[17:23] <LeoBodnar> W7QO-6 seem to have gone to 21km
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[17:44] <G8APZ> I don't think that G-05 is going to reset this time :-(
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[18:13] <G8APZ> g0wxi still no reset on G-05 - will be eating soon, so will leave rig monitoring just in case! Maybe a forced reset every 100 telemetry blocks is needed!
[18:13] <jededu> We have the NOTAM for Wednesdays launch :)
[18:13] <jonsowman> I think fixing the actual bug is probably a better idea
[18:14] <jonsowman> call me conventional etc
[18:14] <G8APZ> yes, I agree, if it can be found!
[18:14] <jonsowman> oh I'm sure it can
[18:14] <G8APZ> trouble is that there may be some blocking of sat rx
[18:14] <G8APZ> which makes a non existent bug very hard to find!
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[18:15] <jonsowman> true, some bugs require a fair amount of ingenuity to hunt them down
[18:15] <G0WXI> G8APZ, might just get lucky again on this flight, but yes jonsnowman need to understand the root cause, as G8APZ spotted lat and long seem to be OK if the strange prefix removed, so perhaps GPS may be OK
[18:16] <jonsowman> there's a lot of helpful people on here if you're struggling :)
[18:16] <malgar> jededu: from where?
[18:16] <G8APZ> peer review of code maybe!
[18:16] <jonsowman> certainly can't hurt
[18:17] <G8APZ> years ago, boss at work used to offer a pint for finding bugs in code that was allegedly clean!
[18:17] <DL7AD> good evening
[18:17] <G8APZ> Pint per bug!
[18:17] <G8APZ> Hello
[18:17] <G6SUQ_Graham> G8APZ: I used to offer a choccy-bar to our QA team!
[18:18] <G8APZ> G6SUQ_Graham any incentive will do!!
[18:19] <jededu> malgar just posting it for approval its nr kidderminister
[18:19] <G0WXI> I'll have a go to see what I can find, but I'm not a proffessional programmer so peer review would be interesting for me entertaining for others
[18:19] <Herman-PB0AHX> G4 and G5 in auto config ??
[18:19] <G8APZ> yes
[18:19] <Herman-PB0AHX> ok tnx
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[18:21] <G8APZ> G0WXI start recruiting then!! I'm ex mainframe assembler, Cobol, Visual Basic and 4GL , plus PHP so not a lot of use to you
[18:21] <jonsowman> G0WXI: consider pushing your code to github or the like so that other people can view it easily
[18:21] <G6SUQ_Graham> mainframe ASM, coool, we are not worthy!
[18:22] <G8APZ> G6SUQ_Graham It was ICL PLAN on 1900 range
[18:22] <G6SUQ_Graham> George?
[18:22] <G8APZ> 1903T and yes, George 2
[18:23] <Herman-PB0AHX> wat do i rong in autoconfig it wil not writing here signaal s9+
[18:23] <G8APZ> all of 192k memory!!
[18:23] <G6SUQ_Graham> I was a 'one month' Op on a ICL1900 series before going on a COBOL course
[18:23] <mfa298> best thing to do it treat peer review as being a learning exercise. I'm sure if you wanted people to explain why things are bugs they will do.
[18:24] <G8APZ> after autoconfig, go to Op mode/RTTY/Custom and widen the rx filter bandwidth to about 350
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[18:24] <G6SUQ_Graham> mfa298: yes, that's the way to do it, and also a chance for the prog to explain what they were trying to achieve, in case someone has better ideas
[18:25] <G8APZ> G6SUQ_Graham assuming the code is documented!
[18:25] <mfa298> and always be prepared for several different suggestions of how to do something, there's often no one correct solution.
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[18:25] <Herman-PB0AHX> G8APZ: yes red line now
[18:26] <G8APZ> that's a start!
[18:26] <LeoBodnar> G8APZ did you do any IBM360/370 asm?
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[18:27] <G6SUQ_Graham> I did a little 370 asm
[18:27] <G8APZ> LeoBodnar no, but I did work on IBM machines in the 90s with a 4GL - from Software AG - Natural
[18:28] <legionelmelenas> Hi, I'm new, I'm next to the balloon b-54, I'm looking at 435,500 and 434,500 and do not get anything, the balloon is in flight?
[18:28] <LeoBodnar> Did it have anything to do with Capita?
[18:28] <G8APZ> LeoBodnar no... various investment banks
[18:29] <LeoBodnar> i see
[18:29] <Herman-PB0AHX> $$$$$G-05,480,18:29:35,21,045<,-296.9238:8.p1814Lq9,2.8X0,1*e4B8
[18:30] <G6SUQ_Graham> legionelmelenas: B54 does not transmit continuous ... every 5 minutes or so
[18:30] <LeoBodnar> what mode do you use legionelmelenas ?
[18:30] <G8APZ> but pips on freq every 3 seconds or so
[18:30] <LeoBodnar> it should be 434.500MHz USB
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[18:30] <LeoBodnar> hunt about +- few kHz
[18:30] <legionelmelenas> I'm reviewing the spectrum with a FUNcube pro dongle
[18:31] <legionelmelenas> and a rtl-sdr
[18:32] <Herman-PB0AHX> verry close $D$$$G-05,488,18:31:S5,251.054184,-2960.931q52010714,21,2.871L1+0024
[18:32] <LeoBodnar> you should see 3 second pips and every few miutes a 250Hz wide transmission for about 30-50 seconds
[18:33] <legionelmelenas> leobodnar thanks, according to the map I have the balloon at 30km
[18:34] <legionelmelenas> Any website with information?
[18:34] <G8APZ> select from auto config and then tick RxID
[18:35] <Herman-PB0AHX> NO GPs SIF - Sats n View = 24 - Ba|t Vo|ts < 2.<35V
[18:35] <G8APZ> that's G-05 - look down 1kHz or so for G-04
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[18:36] <Willdude123_> Hi
[18:36] <LeoBodnar> legionelmelenas: http://leobodnar.com/balloons/
[18:36] <G8APZ> G-05 currently has a problem with GPS
[18:37] <legionelmelenas> thanks leobodnar
[18:38] <malgar> LeoBodnar: are there innovative ideas you are working for new launches?
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[18:40] <LeoBodnar> just battling with envelope building atm
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[18:42] <Herman-PB0AHX> yesss green lines now from g05
[18:48] <DL7AD> what happened to G-05?
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[18:58] <malgar> I don't find the page showing the frequencies of the current flights
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[19:02] <g8fjg_ron> G-05 reset
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[19:04] <aadamson> nice flight LeoBodnar!
[19:04] <aadamson> for B-54 that is
[19:04] <aadamson> did you create some kind of script to *back populate* aprs data to snus data?
[19:04] <aadamson> or live populate it from aprs as the came may be
[19:05] <aadamson> case.. ^
[19:06] <mattbrejza> i *believe* there is a script to copy *live* data from aprs.fi to snus
[19:06] <mattbrejza> but *also* leo has a script to copy the log data across
[19:06] <aadamson> mattbrejza, there is, but usually it works like W7QO-6, and you don't get all the telemetry
[19:07] <aadamson> I knew the later, but am seeing the RX being APRS so figured he musta put something together to convert from aprs to actual telem data
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[19:07] <mattbrejza> must be a different script then
[19:08] <aadamson> ya, easy enough to do thinking about it... take the feed from aprs-si, convert the telem back to ascii and send in a payload description to the habhub format
[19:09] <LeoBodnar> you don't have to copy *everything*
[19:09] <aadamson> nice job however!
[19:10] <LeoBodnar> thank you aadamson
[19:10] <aadamson> makes using snus much nicer for mixed mode
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[19:11] <aadamson> shared lot o thanks for you today :)... I wouldn't be at 25hr - 2:45 where it was living on some rooftop with yours and everyone elses (upu, mikestir, yada, yada, yada) - THANKS ALL
[19:12] <LeoBodnar> G-04 and G-05 sound like a nice mesh network
[19:12] <aadamson> is that what they are doing? very cool
[19:12] <LeoBodnar> no but yes
[19:13] <aadamson> hehe...
[19:16] <aadamson> LeoBodnar, are you just doing *round* envelope design, would there be any advantage to oval or blimp type?
[19:19] Nick change: LeoBodnar -> SpaceBaron
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[19:23] <arko> who's W7QO-6?
[19:23] <aadamson> me - aadamson
[19:23] <arko> o snap
[19:32] Nick change: Upu_M0UPU -> Upu
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[19:32] Nick change: SpaceBaron -> LeoBodnar
[19:33] <SpeedEvil> aadamson: he's doing round, AIUI.
[19:34] <aadamson> AIUI?
[19:34] <SpeedEvil> aadamson: If you do oval, you get - with flat disks - lots more stress.
[19:34] <SpeedEvil> As I understand it
[19:34] <aadamson> ah
[19:34] <SpeedEvil> Round means you need to cut two gores only, in a simple shape, and it's optimally stressed.
[19:35] <SpeedEvil> To make a blimp shape, you need something more complex, for example, a cylinder with two endcaps, or ...
[19:35] <aadamson> yeah I was thinking *hot dog* on it's end shaped, but yea I understand that... if you had a *sleeve* you might could do the hotdog shapped
[19:35] <SpeedEvil> But for a balloon, there is little point.
[19:35] <SpeedEvil> Remember the limit at 2m.
[19:36] <aadamson> sheesh, just reading the new... I just don't get our decisions some times... trade 5 bad guys for 1 guy who left to join the other side...
[19:36] <aadamson> I don't think I'd like to be one of our military just now, that just put a 5:1 ratio on each head :(
[19:38] <majemoi> Please, what are frequencies and transmition modes for G-04 and G-05?
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[19:41] <Upu> 434.508/434.510
[19:41] <Upu> RTTY 300
[19:41] <Upu> also on 434.125 intermittant
[19:41] <Upu> 7N2
[19:42] <majemoi> :Upu: many thanks, is there a period transmission?
[19:43] <Upu> about every 30seconds
[19:43] <majemoi> Upu: Thak you very much.
[19:48] <Upu> your balloon doing well aadamson
[19:48] <Upu> is it doing any 70cms stuff ?
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[19:54] <aadamson> Thanks Anthony, no, I need to deal with the LPF to do that and I built all my boards for 144mhz at the moment, when I spin the board, I'll fix that... I have to do that to fix the power board placement - what causing the poor gps performance, and correct some blue wires
[19:55] <aadamson> Upu, https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/6730484/2014-05-29%2017.55.54.jpg - what is flying minus the black pvc heatshrink
[19:55] <arko> aadamson: what balloon are you flying?
[19:55] <Upu> yeah saw it on GPSL
[19:55] <Upu> congrats on getting in the air
[19:55] <aadamson> the pv/lipo power board I mounted underneath hoping that would solve the proximity issue, but it didn't
[19:55] <Upu> its what Leo would have wanted
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[19:56] <arko> lol
[19:56] <aadamson> arko, the leo special - 36" qualatex
[19:56] <aadamson> took me forever to find some *for a descent price*
[19:56] <arko> um
[19:56] <arko> its like $3
[19:56] <aadamson> yeah, but I couldn't find any round locally so I bought 10 for about 2 and change each
[19:57] <aadamson> you'd think in Atlanta I could find some but NO.... :(
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[19:58] <aadamson> next time I'll do some thing differently to save some weight... it's amazing how heavy hot glue is :)
[19:59] <aadamson> and I didn't think to get some pvc heatshrink so I had to run to uline to get some *bottle cap* shrinks and used 4 of them.... duh
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[19:59] <DL7AD> good evening!
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[20:00] <JWP> Hi, where can i find the frequency's for g-05 and g-04? trying to track them...
[20:00] <Upu> 20:41] <Upu> 434.508/434.510
[20:00] <Upu> [20:41] <Upu> RTTY 300
[20:00] <Upu> [20:41] <Upu> also on 434.125 intermittant
[20:00] <Upu> [20:41] <Upu> 7N2
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[20:02] <Upu> I put it int he info box
[20:03] <JWP> Oke, thanks...
[20:05] <Thomascatt> 05 seems to have just had a bit of a fit
[20:05] <Upu> GPS has been on and off all flight
[20:05] <Thomascatt> yes!
[20:05] <Upu> ping nigelvh can we remove your payloads ?
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[20:06] Nick change: [1]Geoff-G8DHE-M -> Geoff-G8DHE-M
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[20:12] <amell> nice corridor of receivers on the map for B54 transit between france and spain :)
[20:14] <amell> and I see Horus has made a reappearance
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[20:21] <nigelvh> Upu: Yeah.
[20:22] <nigelvh> Hope they were as interesting to watch across the pond as your guys' are.
[20:22] <Upu> ta
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[20:23] <nigelvh> I just find it the most humorous how different in size/weight it seems the flights tend to be.
[20:23] <nigelvh> We're *always* up around 6-7 payloads totalling ~10 pounds. And you guys are in a race to the bottom.
[20:24] <nigelvh> One of these days I'm going to read that one of you guys has hacked the uBlox into running arbitrary code and replaced the microcontroller.
[20:25] <Upu> :)
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[20:25] <craag> All we really need is a ublox with a CC430 jammed onto the silicon :)
[20:25] <Upu> if its any concelation its a constant source of amusement from this side of the pond too
[20:26] <nigelvh> Haha
[20:26] <nigelvh> Though, it doesn't lead us to break any altitude records.
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[20:26] <Upu> you had them for a while
[20:26] <Upu> I think that ship has sailed
[20:26] <nigelvh> Hahaha, yeah
[20:27] <Upu> Team Mexico
[20:27] <Upu> ftw
[20:27] <craag> lol
[20:29] <tbbelg> hello craag
[20:30] <craag> hey tbbelg, hows it going?
[20:30] <nigelvh> One of these days I'd really like to try a floater, but I haven't gotten to it yet.
[20:30] <tbbelg> I modify the parsing to add 'number of sat' but same error
[20:30] <craag> tbbelg: Ok, give me a couple of minutes and then I'll take a look :)
[20:31] <tbbelg> i didn't found 'CRACKLE' in doc
[20:31] <tbbelg> thanks
[20:31] <tbbelg> i have not satellite now, but it upload
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[20:35] Nick change: MichaelC3 -> MichaelC
[20:37] <Thomascatt> Knighty night
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[20:37] <I22452swl> k
[20:37] <G8APZ> GN Thomascatt
[20:37] <I22452swl> 73
[20:38] <tbbelg> sorry craag, could't fix satellite for the moment
[20:38] <craag> hey tbbelg, just looking at your payload doc
[20:39] <G8APZ> oh bum... G-05 lost GPS again!
[20:39] <craag> So you removed the invalid_always filter?
[20:39] <tbbelg> i tried differents things lol
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[20:40] <craag> tbbelg: Ok, let me try something, see if it works.
[20:40] <tbbelg> ok
[20:43] <craag> tbbelg: Now waiting for a sentence with a gps lock...
[20:44] <tbbelg> ok i try to lock gps
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[20:45] <tbbelg> if i put electronic outside, cause low temp, i can't best receive with dl-fldigit
[20:46] <craag> Ok tbbelg, take a look at what I've done on the latest payload doc
[20:46] <tbbelg> ok
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[20:47] <craag> I've put in a filter, that tells it to look for certain values of 'satellites' to indicate a lock
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[20:49] <craag> That's the way I set it up with my payloads, so should work for yours - worth a test as soon as the weather is better though!
[20:49] <tbbelg> ok craag, thank you very much
[20:50] <tbbelg> i try a fix next minutes to test :-)
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[20:51] <cambazz> where do we get aviation weather data, like wind?
[20:52] <SpeedEvil> A NASA server
[20:52] <cambazz> is it public?
[20:53] <craag> *NOAA server
[20:53] <craag> yep it's public
[20:53] <mfa298> cambazz: Its public but a huge dataset (if you want all of it)
[20:53] <craag> They publish a 180-hour forecast model every 6 hours
[20:53] <mfa298> something like 17GB 4 times a day of you want it all and want to stay current
[20:54] <craag> You can query from it exactly what you want
[20:54] <craag> But it's a bit slow to understand :/
[20:54] <cambazz> ok well i dont need that much data, i just need to know about wind where i live. but, i also dont know about the `wind thing`
[20:54] <cambazz> can i know what wind is at what altidude
[20:54] <mfa298> you might be able to get some of whats local to you although that wasn't working too well a while ago
[20:54] <cambazz> and where does the wind occur. like is there a wind at 10000 meters?
[20:55] <cambazz> or 20000
[20:55] <cambazz> i guess at some altitude since the pressure is 0 there is no wind?
[20:56] <mfa298> the noaa dataset gives winds at various altitudes
[20:57] <craag> cambazz: That would be about 100km
[20:57] <craag> Up at 40km there's still wind
[20:57] <craag> Is this for HAB flight prediction, or another reason?
[20:58] <cambazz> craag: ok but after 30km there is very little air pressure
[20:58] <LeoBodnar> define "wind"
[20:58] <cambazz> yes it is for hab flight prediction.
[20:58] <craag> LeoBodnar: moving air particles :)
[20:58] <craag> cambazz: Have you seen the CUSF predictor?
[20:58] <LeoBodnar> "air particles"?
[20:58] <cambazz> LeoBodnar: well, i dont know anything about the `wind` is should learn about this wind
[20:58] <cambazz> well no, it sure has many details
[20:59] <craag> http://predict.habhub.org/
[20:59] <cambazz> craag: no, i will look now
[20:59] <craag> Uses the before-mentioned NOAA dataset
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[21:00] <cambazz> well are there any tests
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[21:00] <G8APZ> G-05 rebooting
[21:00] <cambazz> with this predictor of real flights
[21:00] <craag> cambazz: Many
[21:00] <craag> It's what nearly all of us use
[21:00] <craag> And it also does the live prediction on spacenear.us/tracker
[21:00] <mfa298> there is another predictor (using the same data) but it's not nearly as configurable
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[21:01] <cambazz> how do i select a place in this landing predictor?
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[21:02] <cambazz> ok i foudn it
[21:02] <LeoBodnar> what is GFSG maximum altitude? i think i tried to do a prediction for somebody last year and it did not work above 20-something km
[21:02] <tbbelg> craag : fix lock ok but error remains : "_fix_invalid": true,
[21:02] <LeoBodnar> or was it 30-ish km?
[21:03] <cambazz> who ever did this cusf predictor, many thanks.
[21:03] <craag> cambazz: CUSF - Cambridge University SpaceFlight
[21:03] <cambazz> real nice work. i thought that i could do something like this with that data, and its already made
[21:03] <craag> They're working on a version 2 as well I think
[21:04] <craag> tbbelg: Ok, looking now...
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[21:06] <cambazz> all this is based on prediction right?
[21:06] <mfa298> cambazz: there's also an hourly version e.g. http://predict.habhub.org/hourly/cambridge/ but you'll need to talk to someone in #habhub to get one setup for your location
[21:07] <craag> tbbelg: Looks like I missed it in the logtail - do you have the output?
[21:07] <cambazz> ok nice.
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[21:08] <G8APZ> doesn't look like G-05 has many trackers... I'm still on it but don't know how long I can hold it!
[21:08] <tbbelg> "battery": 3.94
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[21:08] <tbbelg> oups i can't copy/paste here
[21:09] <LeoBodnar> oh 3.94v on G-05?
[21:09] <craag> tbbelg: http://pastebin.com/
[21:09] <G8APZ> 2.67v I think
[21:09] <cambazz> ok another question: these guys who did the fpv flight, at what altitude an autopilot can steer the craft? (considering it is small, made out of foam)
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[21:11] <mfa298> cambazz: depending on your location the rules for guided flights get quite strict (In the UK the range is limited to being in visible range and I think under a certain altitude)
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[21:12] <G8APZ> I'm losing G-05 now... decodes only partial
[21:12] <G8APZ> green, but getting iffy
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[21:12] <cambazz> ok i will porobably do this in the midle of a salt lake that is like a desert. luckily there is a salt lake - and i will just go there.
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[21:13] <G8APZ> I see F0ERP picked up G-05 now, so should have it for some time
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[21:15] <G8APZ> maybe it was G-04 he's tracking!
[21:15] <cambazz> so by the way, any recomendations on tracking antenna designs?
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[21:15] <G8APZ> G-05 passed over coast
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[21:17] <craag> tbbelg: You still there?
[21:18] <tbbelg> yes
[21:18] <craag> did you have the logtail output?
[21:18] <tbbelg> i try to lock sat
[21:18] <craag> ah ok
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[21:18] <tbbelg> because i lost the log :)(
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[21:19] <craag> ah oops :P
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[21:20] <craag> I'll be back in a couple of minutes, if you do get it, pause the logtail so you can send it to me
[21:21] <tbbelg> ok
[21:23] <cambazz> is there any flight location data recorded from the baloon publicly avail?
[21:24] <mfa298> all the flights using spacenear.us have their data on http://habitat.habhub.org/ept/
[21:24] <craag> cambazz: http://habitat.habhub.org/ept/
[21:24] <craag> agh beaten ;)
[21:24] <craag> Yeah hundreds of flights on there
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[21:24] <mfa298> but not everyone uses that system (although pretty much most of Europe does)
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[21:29] <cambazz> ok so i got a yagi, i got a nice celestron tripod. (also an equtarial mount, but just the base part is nice. can i get away with manual positioning of the antenna.
[21:29] <craag> Well how long is your yagi?
[21:29] <craag> (how many element?)
[21:30] <cambazz> well i did not count it, but a friend has 433mhz - and i will borrow it. it is long.
[21:30] <cambazz> does that give the angle?
[21:31] <craag> If it's less than 6 foot long then yes, you can manually point it.
[21:31] <craag> To be honest you won't need a yagi
[21:31] <craag> I've tracked my own flights with a 1/4 wave.
[21:31] <cambazz> you mean a wire?
[21:32] <cambazz> do you hang it vertically or horizontally
[21:32] <craag> Got 200km with a wire dipole stuck to my window :)
[21:32] <craag> vertically
[21:32] <craag> 1/4 wave with groundplane vertical on the payload
[21:32] <craag> (upside down)
[21:32] <cambazz> can you show me photos?
[21:32] <cambazz> i dont also know what a wire dipole is
[21:33] <craag> https://www.philcrump.co.uk/images/e/e2/Testing_Battery_CRAAG1.jpg
[21:33] <craag> ^^ Yellow wire is 1/4 wave radiator
[21:33] <craag> The 4 wires are a ground plane
[21:34] <craag> Then for tracking from the car, I use a magmount ham radio antenna for 434MHz
[21:35] <craag> It's only about 30cm long, and omnidirectional as well, so no need to point it.
[21:35] <cambazz> ok i see. and these are not directional at all right?
[21:35] <craag> correct
[21:35] <craag> Where are you btw?
[21:35] <cambazz> istanbul
[21:35] <cambazz> but i will probably go in the middle of the country, where there is a salt lake
[21:35] <craag> Ah ok! You might not have many listeners, so still good to have the yagi as a backup
[21:36] <cambazz> what is the directionality of the yagi
[21:36] <craag> I'll estimate it'd be about 20 degree beamwidth
[21:36] <craag> So will pick up well when pointed within 20 degrees
[21:37] <craag> But you can move it around by hand until the signal is loud :)
[21:37] <craag> What receiver are you planning to use?
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[21:38] <cambazz> rtl sdr with habamp
[21:38] <cambazz> i cant afford a real ham receiver.
[21:38] <craag> Ok, yeah I've chased with rtlsdr with and without habamp
[21:39] <craag> habamp improves it no-end
[21:39] <craag> *a lot
[21:40] <craag> Something like this is good for mounting on the car: http://www.eham.net/reviews/detail/4078
[21:40] <LeoBodnar> cambazz, oh Istanbul!
[21:40] <cambazz> wht do you mean by no-end? you mean it improves it?
[21:40] <craag> cambazz: I mean it improves it a lot :)
[21:40] <LeoBodnar> have we communicated via email?
[21:40] <craag> Sorry, obscure saying
[21:41] <tbbelg> craag : i will try toworrow. Very thanks for helping me :-)
[21:42] <craag> tbbelg: Ok no worries - ping me an email at phildcrump@gmail.com if you have more questions
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[21:42] <cambazz> LeoBodhar: well no :) i started like 3 months ago, and i will run a series of high altitude experiments. i do electronics and software.
[21:42] <tbbelg> ok. Good night
[21:43] <LeoBodnar> i have some contacts from Turkish hams/hab guys
[21:43] <cambazz> nice.
[21:43] <cambazz> are you an amateur or some foundation member?
[21:43] <LeoBodnar> maybe you can get in touch with them and build at team
[21:44] <LeoBodnar> i am M0XER
[21:44] <cambazz> yes would be nice
[21:44] <LeoBodnar> PM
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[21:47] <LeoBodnar> you guys have very strong APRS and VHF network in Turkey
[21:49] Nick change: RaptorJesus -> And
[21:50] <cambazz> nice to know
[21:50] Nick change: And -> RaptorJesus
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[21:52] <arko> now you need to convince your neighbors to setup stations too :P
[21:52] <mfa298> you'll need an Amateur radio license (assuming you're not yet licensed) to use APRS (or at least have someone in your group that's licensed) and you'll need to check it's allowed airborne. but it's potentially worth looking into as there's a ready made receiving network.
[21:53] <G8APZ> almost 9 hours with sigs from G-05 but now only partials still sounds OK though
[21:56] <joekul> Hi there! Where can I find the freqs/modes/etc of the balloons currently tracked?
[21:57] <G8APZ> which ones?
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[21:58] <joekul> I am seeing G-04/5 currently predicted passing not far from Switzerland
[21:59] <joekul> I a RTL-SDR beginner.
[21:59] <mfa298> joekul: there's details on spacenear.us/tracker
[21:59] <mfa298> and more info in some of the recent posts on http://groups.google.com/group/ukhas
[22:00] <cambazz> ok i got a sdr and in istanbul can i just put a node in this scanner thing?
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[22:00] <G8APZ> joekul G-04 and G-05 tx on two frequencies.... 434.510 and 434.125 each one slightly apart by 1 or 2kHz
[22:00] <G8APZ> mode RTTY but you get that in FLdigi software
[22:02] <G8APZ> G-04 and G-05 are travelling slowly. It will be some time before they are withing range of Switzerland
[22:02] <joekul> okay. Thanks. I cannot see that info in the mobile version of spacenear.us and the full version crashes my android Chrome browser
[22:04] <G8APZ> I have the information from an email
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[22:06] <SA6BSS> try this version http://habmap.philcrump.co.uk/
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[22:08] <G8APZ> Since launch at 14:00 these flights have been within radio range of launch site until just recently. Remarkable!
[22:10] <joekul> I thought that one of the habitat.habhub.org pages did list the current flights crews/modes.
[22:10] <joekul> SA6BBS: philcrump's works on my tablet! Thanks!
[22:11] <craag> :D
[22:12] <joekul> interesting autocorrect: freqs -> crews, especially about weather balloons :)
[22:14] <G8APZ> craag = Philcrump :-)
[22:23] <joekul> Any recommendations for an Android IRC client (Nexus 10 tablet)?
[22:24] <mfa298> andchat seemed ok the few times I've used it. (or get into using linux and do ssh/mosh + screen/tmux + irssi)
[22:27] <lz1dev> i wish more peopled used tmux
[22:27] <joekul> I'll try andchat first, thanks!
[22:28] <G8APZ> 73 and goodnight all.... cannot decode either G-04 and G-05 now... only hearing, not decoding ----
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[22:28] <g8fjg_ron> 73
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[22:31] <Laurenceb_> do G-04 and G-05 talk to each other?
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[22:35] <g8fjg_ron> I dont think so , when g05 working properly gps timers make sure they dont tx at the same time
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[22:52] <it9ewl> hello
[22:54] <SpeedEvil> hello
[22:56] <it9ewl> the trajectory of a ball is predictable?
[22:58] <lz1dev> yeah
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[22:58] <lz1dev> but I think you mean a ballon?
[23:00] <DL7AD> lz1dev: you are too slow :P
[23:01] <Laurenceb_> lol hes left
[23:01] <Laurenceb_> that was very informative
[23:01] <lz1dev> guess, he needed a yeah
[23:01] <lz1dev> vOv
[23:02] <lz1dev> research=complete
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[23:03] <DL7AD> ah damn.... missed the iss
[23:04] <lz1dev> DL7AD: you are too slow :p
[23:05] <DL7AD> :D
[23:05] <DL7AD> lz1dev: i want to find out what the minimum power is you will need to reach the iss
[23:06] <Laurenceb_> maybe he was writing a PhD thesis
[23:07] <lz1dev> not sure if putting a single line from IRC would count as a reference
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[23:29] Nick change: [1]Geoff-G8DHE-M -> Geoff-G8DHE-M
[23:42] <cnelson> might as well discuss this here
[23:42] <cnelson> tryign to hit .de from california would be fun
[23:43] <Laurenceb_> W7QO-6 is heading down too fast
[23:44] <arko> cnelson: yeah
[23:44] <arko> http://habitat.habhub.org/mobile-tracker/
[23:44] <arko> cnelson: ^ check W7QO flying in the us
[23:44] <arko> he did a day launch
[23:45] <arko> for some reason the night launches tend to work better
[23:45] <arko> im not sure if its the way the balloon is streched over night or being heated at a higher altitude has something to do with it
[23:45] <lz1dev> open the telemetry graph
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[23:51] <arko> cnelson: http://ukhas.org.uk/projects:microballoons:data
[23:51] <cnelson> arko: inteesting
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[23:52] <lz1dev> if it continues to go like that, it might hit the ground during the night
[23:52] <arko> yeah, i'd believe that, his did last night
[23:53] <lz1dev> still going down
[23:53] <lz1dev> maybe something punctured the balloon
[23:53] <lz1dev> think it went down to like 700m
[23:54] <arko> my best guess is that during the day you get a greater heat transfer at the lower altitudes as you rise, so by the time you reach your target float altitude you balloon has over streched
[23:54] <arko> so at night when the pressure decreases you lose a lot more altitude
[23:54] <arko> hmm
[23:54] <arko> but thats not a very solid train of thought :)
[23:55] <arko> gotta model it
[23:55] <arko> im sure Leo knows
[23:55] <Lunar_Lander> good night!
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[23:57] <arko> maybe this weekend i'll give it a shot, meanwhile im stuck in bounded diff eq hell :/
[23:58] <aadamson> it's right in the middle of another thunderstorm... I can't catch a break it seems
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[23:58] <arko> well that explains that
[23:58] <aadamson> with only 1.5g of free lift it doesn't take too much water to make it go down
[23:59] <arko> what was your ascent rate at launch?
[23:59] <aadamson> the area it's in is wide open however, so we can hope it does another phoenix
[23:59] <aadamson> arko, I plotted it over time and I was approx .7m/s
[23:59] <arko> ah
[00:00] --- Mon Jun 2 2014