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[07:42] <DL1SGP1> ping Upu UpuWork: that was a nice reply by the Prof :)
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[07:57] <UpuWork> indeed
[07:59] <Darkside> ?
[07:59] <Darkside> oh
[07:59] <Darkside> that email
[07:59] <UpuWork> anyway all sorted I think
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[07:59] <UpuWork> no one harmed
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[08:08] <fsphil> and lessons learned
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[08:10] <DL1SGP1> yeah :) let's hope they really ask for some tutoring for future projects, would be kinda sweet
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[09:30] <LeoBodnar> morning *
[09:31] <Darkside> evening LeoBodnar
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[10:21] <DL1SGP1> hi LeoBodnar
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[10:24] <jededu> I am thinking of building a pico transmitter so that we can do some test flights with the students I understand the technicalities of it but its the hardware thats the problem is there anything on the market we could use bare boards ect
[10:25] <craag> jededu: Building one out of ots boards is quite easy
[10:25] <dave-oop-north> You can make a pretty lightweight tracker with an Arduino Mini Pro, RFM22B and UBlox breakout with the chip antenna
[10:26] <craag> eg https://www.philcrump.co.uk/CRAAG1
[10:26] <jededu> https://www.philcrump.co.uk/CRAAG1
[10:26] <jededu> sorry too quick
[10:26] <dave-oop-north> and http://www.daveakerman.com/?p=310 :)
[10:26] <craag> (which is based on dave-oop-north 's RFM22+Pro Mini+ublox tutorial
[10:26] <dave-oop-north> haha
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[10:27] <jededu> is that transmitter 10mw
[10:27] <DL1SGP1> :)
[10:27] <fsphil> I'm not a fan of the rfm22b
[10:27] <fsphil> use it with caution :)
[10:27] <craag> jededu: It can be when you set it to be.
[10:28] <jededu> cool looks like what i need thanks
[10:28] <jededu> fsphil why are you not a fan
[10:29] <fsphil> they've a bad habit of resetting when they get cold
[10:29] <dave-oop-north> The rfm22b has an over-zealous low-voltage reset
[10:29] <jededu> ahh
[10:29] <fsphil> but careful programming can get around that
[10:29] <craag> For an up-down flight though, they're not too bad.
[10:29] <craag> Just insulate them well :)
[10:30] <gonzo_> out of interest, how does the efficiency of a stup up reg from 2xaaa compare with a linear LDO from 3xaaa
[10:30] <dave-oop-north> what I and a few others do is poll a register each sentence (one that was changed during initialisation), then reset the rfm if the register has reset
[10:30] <jededu> thats all we want to to up and down
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[10:31] <jededu> I need to understand the programming a bit more but once I get into it :)
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[10:33] <gonzo_> do most here use switching regs?
[10:33] <craag> gonzo_: Yes, most switching regs are around 85-90% efficient.
[10:34] <craag> You can then calculate what the linear one should be
[10:34] <gonzo_> interesting, I could not get that sort of efficiency
[10:34] <gonzo_> 80% max
[10:35] <craag> Admittedly I'm yet to try one on my own PCB, have always used breakout boards.
[10:36] <gonzo_> initially I was using a 5V vcc, so switching was the way to go. Butwhen I moved into the 19th century and went to 3v3, it seemed simpler to use a linear reg. Given the efficiencies I was getting (or not)
[10:37] <gonzo_> looking at the discharge curve for the lithuims dry batts, they look to hold a steady V for most of the life, there looks to be little to scavenge from them then the voltage goes over the cliff
[10:40] <jededu> How good are the GPS chip antennas over the sarantel
[10:41] <LeoBodnar> take it out [10:29] <dave-oop-north> The rfm22b has an over-zealous low-voltage reset
[10:43] <LeoBodnar> best efficiency switching regs are those with low switching frequency and big inductors
[10:43] <LeoBodnar> which is what you don't want on a HAB
[10:45] <dave-oop-north> I've tried a couple of ebay switcher modules. For 3V3 200mA o/p one ran at 70% the other 80%
[10:46] <dave-oop-north> I agree with gonzo once the discharge curve starts curving downwards you've got little left
[10:46] <jededu> Somone on here mentioned this one any good?
[10:46] <jededu> http://www.technobotsonline.com/pololu-step-down-3.3v-600ma-voltage-regulator-d24v6f3.html
[10:47] <jededu> I have just bought a couple for the Pi project
[10:49] <dave-oop-north> "The input voltage, VIN, should be at least a few volts above VOUT"
[10:49] <dave-oop-north> You might want to find out what they really mean
[10:49] <dave-oop-north> e.g. measure it
[10:50] <jededu> I saw that
[10:50] <dave-oop-north> "a few" is probably 2-3
[10:51] <jededu> I want to use li-polys what do you think only because i have an abundance ot them
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[10:55] <gonzo_> the wisdome says that lipo are not good at low temp
[10:55] <gonzo_> solid lithiem is better
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[11:01] <Darkside> jededu: Energizer Lithium AAs
[11:01] <SpeedEvil> For 'big' payloads - dissipating a watt or three - li-po are just fine
[11:01] <SpeedEvil> As the batteries will stay quite warm with the heat from the electronics.
[11:01] <jededu> Energiser 300 mAh :)
[11:01] <jededu> 3000
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[11:03] <jededu> I shall save them for the big one then :)
[11:04] <dave-oop-north> They'll probably be OK in a well heated Pi payload :)
[11:04] <dave-oop-north> ok I'm slow :)
[11:04] <gonzo_> you beat me to that dave
[11:04] <dave-oop-north> :)
[11:07] <jededu> I diddnt realise you could get an AA in 3000 mAh i think thats the way to go my Li-Polys at that rating are way heavier
[11:08] <gonzo_> I was using the max756 for my switchers, 2xaaa, but was not getting the efficiencies. So figured that the cost saving and simplicity of an ldo was worth the extra aaa
[11:08] <SpeedEvil> jededu: remember they are 1.5V though
[11:09] <gonzo_> the energiser lithiem are the HAB man's friend
[11:09] <SpeedEvil> So it's not - quite as good.
[11:09] <gonzo_> and they are a fraction of the weight of the equiv alc
[11:10] <SpeedEvil> Still - >300Wh/kg is damn good
[11:15] <jededu> Yes so if i use 4 for 6v (this is for the pi) looking at the specs is 58 grammes 7.2 3000 mAh li-poly 340 grammes although i would heve to add the carrier no brainer
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[11:20] <jededu> Not cheap though
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[11:31] <gonzo_> 5xAA energiser woudl be lighter?
[11:31] <SpeedEvil> Considerably
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[11:45] <Chetic_> ultimate lithium <3
[11:45] Nick change: Chetic_ -> Chetic
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[11:53] <Geoff-G8DHE> OT Oh nice https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0eGiQzf6nac&feature=youtube_gdata_player
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[13:14] <BalloonYOLO_> Tying to fill in a payload config form for Habitat, but need a telemetry string to paste in. Does anyone have a string from a normal HABduino board?
[13:15] <UpuWork> Habduino already has a document
[13:15] <UpuWork> so start from that
[13:15] <BalloonYOLO_> Nice
[13:15] <BalloonYOLO_> Where can that be found?
[13:16] <UpuWork> just amend the baud rate as it appears to have been set to 100
[13:16] <UpuWork> http://habitat.habhub.org/genpayload/
[13:16] <UpuWork> start from existing
[13:16] <UpuWork> search -> Habduino
[13:16] <UpuWork> click the bottom one
[13:16] <UpuWork> I fixed the 100 baud thing
[13:16] <eroomde> ben?
[13:17] <UpuWork> Change the name etc
[13:17] <BalloonYOLO_> Ed!
[13:17] <UpuWork> and call sign
[13:17] <UpuWork> lol
[13:17] <eroomde> see, you get access to free consulting as i'm on my death bed
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[13:18] <adamgreig> lol eroomde
[13:18] <adamgreig> :(
[13:19] <eroomde> well irc passes the time
[13:19] <eroomde> iplayer
[13:19] <eroomde> radio
[13:19] <eroomde> punctuates the gap between loo visits
[13:23] <K5KXF> eroomde how are you today?
[13:23] <BalloonYOLO_> Beenusing this for a while but no ones been able to solve why we cant get the bands on our waterfall - speaking of waterfalls, hope you feel better soon!
[13:23] <eroomde> K5KXF: food poisening
[13:24] <K5KXF> Wow that sucks!
[13:24] <eroomde> https://www.dropbox.com/s/6yud4jm1ltj6h7t/2014-02-16%2015.33.40.jpg
[13:24] <fsphil> or the opposite
[13:24] <eroomde> this was yesterday
[13:24] <K5KXF> sorry to hear it will pass soon I hope (monroe)
[13:24] <eroomde> when all my troubles seemed so far away
[13:25] <fsphil> uh oh, he's getting musical
[13:25] <eroomde> it took vengeance from about 1am until now
[13:25] <K5KXF> lol you still have a fever? deliorus :)
[13:25] <eroomde> my friend said 'i hope it passes quickly'
[13:25] <fsphil> hah
[13:25] <eroomde> i wasn't sure if that was a diarrhea joke
[13:25] <K5KXF> lol
[13:26] <eroomde> no fever
[13:26] <eroomde> thankfully
[13:26] <eroomde> just duble ended violence
[13:26] <fsphil> guy in the office here injured his arm, it's in a sling. I'm not sure he appreciates my arm puns
[13:26] <K5KXF> yuck only experienced that once in my life
[13:26] <eroomde> i get it not that infrequently, usually from taramasalata roulette
[13:27] <K5KXF> ate 2 boxes of chocolate covered cherries
[13:28] <K5KXF> get well soon!
[13:28] <eroomde> willdo thanks
[13:28] <eroomde> i have a bday lunch tomorrow somehwere nice
[13:28] <eroomde> so i want to be back in the game for that
[13:29] <number10> what did you have muscells oystersa and prawns?
[13:30] <eroomde> and scallops
[13:30] <eroomde> half a crab
[13:30] <eroomde> smoked mackerel
[13:30] <eroomde> crab cakes
[13:30] <eroomde> shrimps
[13:30] <K5KXF> Prob the crab they have a posin sack in them
[13:30] <eroomde> smoked salmon
[13:30] <eroomde> well, i've had crab before plenty
[13:30] <eroomde> and not killed myself
[13:31] <K5KXF> if not removed you get sick
[13:31] <K5KXF> it's a tiny green pouch sometimes it gets missed during cleaning
[13:31] <number10> always worries my when eating shellfish that others prepare
[13:32] <number10> I got a refund on mussels from waitrose once, after having washed them mkre than 8 would not close
[13:33] <number10> more
[13:33] <eroomde> wow
[13:33] <eroomde> yeah that sounds dodgy
[13:33] <number10> I think its not worth the risk - I know someone who couldnt touch them again after FP
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[13:34] <number10> I think I'll hold off for a while going to that place eroomde
[13:34] <eroomde> lol
[13:34] <eroomde> it was delicious though
[13:35] <number10> :)
[13:35] <adamgreig> anyone else in your party feeling delicate?
[13:35] <gonzo_> got to enjoy it all the 2nd time around!
[13:36] <number10> I went to the hive beach cafe - the whole crap turns up with a stone - for you to break the claws...
[13:36] <number10> they do later turn up with nut crackers
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[13:38] <eroomde> no reply from 2 of them
[13:38] <eroomde> other 2 seem ok
[13:38] <adamgreig> ominous :P
[13:39] <eroomde> yep
[13:43] <Willdude123> So I sent my FOI request for amateur callsigns to ofcom
[13:43] <Willdude123> https://www.whatdotheyknow.com/user/william_dover/requests
[13:43] <DL1SGP1> I hope you are feeling better soon eroomde
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[13:50] <SpeedEvil> http://www.twitch.tv/twitchplayspokemon - perhaps the least productive use of the internet yet?
[13:51] <mattbrejza> twitch in general or the pokemon thing?
[13:51] <SpeedEvil> The pokemon thing
[13:51] <mattbrejza> oh theyre out of that dark cave now
[13:52] <mattbrejza> not sure how theyll manage the safari zone
[13:52] <fsphil> badly
[13:52] <fsphil> neat idea
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[14:15] <BalloonYOLO_> Using an ezcap dongle and cant get the 2 bands to show up on the waterfall, the receiver is working though - as we can tune in to radio stations on gqrx..
[14:16] <gonzo_> have a look around 433.920MHz. You shoudl see a lot of muck there from wireless devices
[14:16] <gonzo_> that's a good test that the rx is working near the HAB band
[14:16] <craag> Well only on a decent antenna
[14:17] <BalloonYOLO_> Not much action..
[14:17] <gonzo_> it also test that
[14:17] <craag> BalloonYOLO_: What TX are you using?
[14:17] <gonzo_> I use it as a sanity check
[14:18] <craag> ie. What are you using as a transmitter?
[14:18] <BalloonYOLO_> TX?
[14:18] <craag> ntx2?
[14:19] <BalloonYOLO_> How can I check?
[14:19] <craag> BalloonYOLO_: What's your setup that you're testing?
[14:20] <BalloonYOLO_> Habduino
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[14:20] <craag> ah ok :0
[14:20] <craag> :)
[14:20] <craag> So you've set a frequency in the code?
[14:20] <BalloonYOLO_> Yep
[14:20] <Laurenceb> what happened to G-01?
[14:20] <BalloonYOLO_> 434.679
[14:20] <fsphil> stopped transmitting Laurenceb
[14:20] <DL1SGP1> Laurenceb: battery died
[14:20] <Laurenceb> ah
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[14:21] <craag> BalloonYOLO_: Ok, and you've got the ezcap centered somewhere slightly off frequency?
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[14:21] <craag> So the noise in the middle isn't over 434.679
[14:22] <BalloonYOLO_> centering on 434.000
[14:23] <craag> BalloonYOLO_: Ok cool
[14:23] <craag> So habduino is powered up, but no signals around 434.679?
[14:24] <craag> A screenshot of the sdr receiver window may help
[14:25] <BalloonYOLO_> Not seeing any defined bands, just the odd bit of mess. Habduino is powered up and has found GPS position (flashing green)
[14:25] <craag> Ok, can I get that screenshot to take a look?
[14:25] <BalloonYOLO_> yeah ok
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[14:29] <BalloonYOLO_> Screen shot on the way..
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[14:30] <balloonyolo> https://www.dropbox.com/s/u3rkvha805b0e8j/Screen%20shot%202014-02-17%20at%2014.26.08.png
[14:31] <BalloonYOLO_> ^screenshot @craag
[14:31] <mattbrejza> is the sdr program in USB?
[14:31] <craag> Ok nothing there. The SDR receiver software would be more useful
[14:32] <craag> (the one where you're setting the center freq)
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[14:32] <craag> Also what antennas have got attached to the habduino/ezcap
[14:32] <craag> ?
[14:37] <BalloonYOLO_> about a 70cm extendable antenna on the dongle
[14:37] <BalloonYOLO_> and quarter wavelength antenna on the habduino
[14:38] <craag> Ok, could be overload then tbh, should be easy to tell from the sdr software screenshot.
[14:39] <BalloonYOLO_> Ok, on the way.. thanks for your help
[14:39] <balloonyolo> https://www.dropbox.com/s/xdcmxr1bmhla2ti/Screen%20shot%202014-02-17%20at%2014.39.25.png
[14:40] <craag> Well there's definitely a signal there
[14:40] <BalloonYOLO_> yeah
[14:40] <craag> But you're in FM mode
[14:40] <craag> You need to be in SSB (USB)
[14:40] <BalloonYOLO_> ok changed that
[14:41] <craag> Zoom in a bit to get the signal in the much smaller passband
[14:41] <fsphil> also in dl-fldigi, you're in DOMEX16 mode
[14:41] <craag> And it should then appear in dl-fldigi
[14:41] <fsphil> you'll need to be in RTTY
[14:41] <BalloonYOLO_> What domex mode should we be in?
[14:42] <BalloonYOLO_> ok
[14:42] <BalloonYOLO_> done
[14:45] <craag> Erm have you set up audio routing from gqrx to dl-fldigi
[14:45] <craag> ?
[14:45] <craag> Only that dl-fldigi waterfall looks very microphone-like
[14:46] <BalloonYOLO_> how do we set audion routing?
[14:46] <BalloonYOLO_> audio
[14:46] <craag> in osx, I have no idea.
[14:46] <craag> sorry
[14:47] <x-f> BalloonYOLO_, http://cycling74.com/soundflower-landing-page/
[14:49] <BalloonYOLO_> Thanks guys
[14:49] <x-f> better link - http://cycling74.com/products/soundflower/
[14:49] <BalloonYOLO_> were picking up some bands of dl-fldigi but need to zoom in on them, anyone know how?
[14:50] <BalloonYOLO_> *on dl-fldigi
[14:51] <craag> As if in change the gap between the red lines you mean?
[14:51] <BalloonYOLO_> yeah
[14:51] <craag> Right-click on 'RTTY' in the bottom left
[14:51] <craag> A window will pop up
[14:51] <BalloonYOLO_> yes
[14:52] <craag> Select 'Custom Shift' from the Carrier shift dropdown in top left
[14:52] <craag> Then use the value box below it to adjust
[14:52] <BalloonYOLO_> thanks!
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[14:54] <BalloonYOLO_> its all very small in the waterfall, anyone know how to zoom in so we can better match up the red lines on the bands?
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[14:54] <craag> Erm the most you can zoom out should be enough
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[14:55] <craag> Could i trouble you for another screenshot?
[14:56] <craag> A comprehensive video tutorial of this could be a very good thing
[14:56] <BalloonYOLO_> agreed
[14:56] <Geoff-G8DHE> Does seem like a repeat of last night !
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[14:59] <BalloonYOLO_> Lost our bands some how..
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[15:32] <jededu> cragg just looking at the page link you sent me earlier (your pico page) were flying at 10mw
[15:33] <jededu> craag sorry
[15:34] <craag> hello
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[15:36] <craag> Yes 10mW ouput as per legal limit if that was the question?
[15:39] <jededu> Just wondered if your code on github was already ser to 10mw, I was trawling through it and found the ref to TX power it just seems to be set to 11db I may be completly wrong though still learning
[15:39] <craag> Ah yes
[15:39] <craag> You can't actually set the rfm22 to 10dBm
[15:40] <jededu> Getting there
[15:40] <craag> 1dB over, after non-ideal antenna losses, is nothing to worry about.
[15:42] <jededu> What threw me was the note //Tx power to max thats why I started searching for settings
[15:44] <craag> Oh in the RFM22.cpp lib
[15:44] <craag> Yeah I didn't touch that
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[15:56] <Laurenceb> http://www.st.com/st-web-ui/static/active/en/fragment/product_related/rpn_information/board_photo/nucleo-F1.jpg
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[16:40] <aadamson> http://mbed.org/platforms/ST-Nucleo-F103RB/
[16:40] <aadamson> and here
[16:40] <aadamson> http://mbed.org/platforms/ST-Nucleo-F401RE/
[16:40] <aadamson> for specifics
[16:41] <kd2eat> What's the deal with those processors? Lower power consumption than AVR?
[16:41] <aadamson> 32bit
[16:41] <aadamson> vs. 16
[16:41] <aadamson> and 4x - 10x the speed
[16:42] <craag> AVRs are 8bit
[16:42] <aadamson> *and* can do lower power consumption
[16:42] <craag> ARM Cortex Mx ftw
[16:42] <aadamson> craag, thanks slip of the fingers
[16:42] <craag> Got a desk full of freescale M0+ atm
[16:42] <kd2eat> Ahh, but aside from that, no redeeming features. ;-p
[16:42] <aadamson> indeed avrs' are 8bit
[16:43] <aadamson> craag, yea I've got a desk full of M4+'s
[16:43] <aadamson> altho M0+ is cool
[16:43] <aadamson> what processor?
[16:43] <craag> nice
[16:43] <craag> KL25
[16:43] <aadamson> booo hissss freescale :)
[16:43] <craag> Doing sensor node prototypes, no need for power, need for lack of it infact.
[16:44] <aadamson> I know some really like the teensy 3.1 and I think its a fs, not a m0, but still
[16:45] <aadamson> oh and not a low power variant, just a Fs
[16:45] <craag> Their dev boards are nice
[16:45] <craag> And the research group here uses them, so I get easy support :)
[16:46] <aadamson> I'm tinkering with a L1 at the moment, just because I actually want something a little faster than the L0
[16:46] <aadamson> yeah, that makes it nice
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[16:46] <craag> I'm hoping to find something that justifies something more than an M0 at some point.
[16:48] <craag> Need something with some meaty maths, rather than just embedded control!
[16:48] <fsphil> double trouble
[16:48] <aadamson> much more fun - https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/6730484/DSCN2349.JPG
[16:48] <fsphil> the stm32f0 dev boards are stupidly cheap
[16:48] <aadamson> https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/6730484/DSCN2370.JPG
[16:49] <aadamson> F103 the first f405 the second
[16:49] <aadamson> :)
[16:49] <craag> fsphil: How much are they approx?
[16:49] <fsphil> £6
[16:49] <craag> ok, the freescale boards are 8
[16:49] <fsphil> that's not bad
[16:49] <aadamson> *
[16:49] <aadamson> *.86
[16:49] <aadamson> 8.86 from digikey
[16:49] <aadamson> all of the discoverys are cheap
[16:50] <fsphil> the freescale one is cute
[16:50] <fsphil> every board should have rounded corners
[16:50] <aadamson> looks like a beaglebone :)
[16:51] <craag> aadamson: Those boards look great.
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[16:51] <craag> I like the way 'ARM' is printed on the chip as well
[16:51] <craag> Don't get that with freescale :P
[16:51] <fsphil> they are indeed sweet boards
[16:51] <fsphil> nice colour
[16:51] <aadamson> yeah stupid 3 axis gimbal controllers, we just decided to do a 405 version as it was drop in mostly
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[16:52] <aadamson> ah just oshpark standard stuff and a stencil and tweezers and a toaster oven :)
[16:52] <fsphil> good soldering on them
[16:52] <craag> Yeah!
[16:52] <fsphil> it's very tidy
[16:52] <craag> reflow?
[16:52] <aadamson> yeah
[16:52] <craag> very neat
[16:52] <aadamson> I use a simple 1500w toaster oven and one of these...
[16:53] <fsphil> my reflowed stuff didn't look as good
[16:53] <fsphil> although I had no stencil
[16:53] <aadamson> http://www.rocketscream.com/shop/reflow-oven-controller-shield-arduino-compatible
[16:53] <aadamson> and you can get cheap stencils from oshstencil.com
[16:53] <aadamson> I've built probaby 20 of those controllers before a commercial company picked it up and then send us development boards now
[16:54] <aadamson> it's all open source, hardware and software
[16:54] <craag> aadamson: I was hoping for a nice ARM-controlled oven, but no, arduino :(
[16:54] <aadamson> hehe... yeah, it was the *early days* :)
[16:54] <aadamson> and it does it's job
[16:54] <craag> yeah
[16:54] <aadamson> I'm going to splurge and get one of those T962A's that upu likes so much I think tho
[16:54] <craag> All my stuff at work is avr based
[16:55] <craag> Throwing myself into the arm side with uni so I can try to bring things forward
[16:55] <fsphil> I still like avr for its simplicity
[16:55] <aadamson> https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/6730484/DSCN2416.JPG - I did those with a stencil and oven as well
[16:55] <fsphil> and good pre-packaged support in linux distros
[16:56] <aadamson> isn't the same true for arm now?
[16:56] <fsphil> nearly
[16:56] <eroomde> it's much better
[16:56] <eroomde> but openocd can still bring people to murder
[16:56] <aadamson> the launchpad (keil-arm maintained) gcc compiler is available, and so are the dfu tools
[16:56] <fsphil> my distro of choice is lacking a bit, but it's definitly improving
[16:56] <aadamson> I kinda like openocd, but I only use it on windows
[16:56] <aadamson> with an stlinkv2 and it I can do just about anything
[16:56] <aadamson> *another cheap* st tool btw
[16:57] <eroomde> trying to find the right incantations for a conig file can be annoying
[16:57] <eroomde> you just end up finding someone elses
[16:57] <aadamson> I did this board if anyone is interested... I haven't got any yet
[16:57] <eroomde> which i don't find satisfying
[16:57] <aadamson> https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/6730484/cortex-conn.png
[16:57] <craag> Afternoon eroomde
[16:57] <fsphil> I've not had to directly deal with openocd yet
[16:57] <eroomde> hi
[16:58] <aadamson> it takes the 20 pin connector on an stlinkv2 and gives you either a 10pin micro connector or the 6 pin discovery connector
[16:58] <craag> Thanks for the advice on that soldering iron the other weekend
[16:58] <eroomde> aadamson: are you in the US?
[16:58] <eroomde> np
[16:58] <aadamson> for debugging
[16:58] <aadamson> yeah
[16:58] <eroomde> ah
[16:58] <aadamson> what config are you needing?
[16:58] <aadamson> you're talking about the link script?
[16:58] <eroomde> the shrouded polarised 5x10 cortex headers seem to only be avaible there
[16:58] <eroomde> for jtag
[16:59] <eroomde> can only find the unboxed ones in the uk
[16:59] <eroomde> tis annoying
[16:59] <aadamson> I use eclipse for everything (and command line makefiles), but I build for the F1, F3, F4, etc
[16:59] <eroomde> i do everything with vim
[16:59] <eroomde> on linux
[17:00] <fsphil> vim and make
[17:01] <aadamson> well for linux, all the launchpad toolchain is there, and dfu tools are pretty much available.
[17:01] <aadamson> This makefile, while not a cmake type file, is pretty good tool, and it will build for both a bootloader or none
[17:01] <aadamson> non
[17:02] <aadamson> https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/6730484/Makefile
[17:03] <aadamson> just needs a linker script for the right locating for the bootloader if you use one. (we do on the F1 as st broke the dfu greatly on that processor - only available via uart1... duh)
[17:03] <Laurenceb> eroomde: tagconnect ftw
[17:04] <eroomde> i'm happy not openocd and olimex jtag is all working
[17:04] <eroomde> also have those blackmagic probes at work
[17:06] <aadamson> well, I've got to run... pulling my hair out with diptrace... I can't for the life of me figure out how to make a thermal pad that is on the ground net, and a groundplane also on the ground net, lose it's ratlines once I connect the 2 with a static via - also on the ground net... dang stuff!
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[17:09] Nick change: number10_ -> number10
[17:24] Nick change: The_Doctor -> Adran
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[17:36] <adwiens_KC0WYS> $10 mbed boards announced today: http://mbed.org/blog/entry/STMicroelectronics-mbed-enabled-Nucleo/
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[17:43] <adwiens_KC0WYS> ah just scrolled up-- you guys were already talking about them :P
[17:44] <eroomde> this channel is like that
[17:45] <K5KXF_> fsphill online?
[17:46] <eroomde> it's between 5pm and 6pm here so he might be commuting
[17:46] <K5KXF_> roger that thanks
[17:47] <K5KXF_> I working on NBTV and wanted to ask some questions
[17:47] <K5KXF_> he has something going there with an RPi
[17:54] <Laurenceb> http://i.4cdn.org/v/src/1392648100479.jpg
[17:55] <eroomde> code doesn't write itself, Laurenceb
[17:56] <K5KXF_> wow what is that?
[17:56] Hix (~Hix@ left irc: Remote host closed the connection
[17:56] <Laurenceb> stereotypical irc lurkers lair
[17:56] <eroomde> ukhas mission control
[17:57] <K5KXF_> thanks for posting I feel much better now
[17:57] <K5KXF_> :)
[17:57] Action: adwiens_KC0WYS is thoroughly disgusted
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[17:57] <K5KXF_> I thought I was bad
[17:57] <K5KXF_> lol
[18:00] <gonzo_nb> there is a nbtv club in the uk. poss some info on their site
[18:02] <K5KXF_> thanks gonzo yeah I found a forum and I've asked for help there
[18:02] <Laurenceb> http://www.documentingreality.com/forum/attachments/f2/438775d1364598831-horrendous-computer-set-ups-00.jpg
[18:03] <K5KXF_> ok that's enough of that! lol
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[18:18] <adwiens_KC0WYS> http://karlmac.com/wp-content/uploads/2011/11/59Vt6.gif
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[18:33] <fsphil> evening K5KXF. afk atm, back later
[18:35] <K5KXF> copy
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[19:59] <jededu> Has anybody successfully monitored the battery voltage on a RasPi during a flight
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[20:00] <mfa298> jededu: I think you'll need to add on an adc as there isn't one on the pi (or at least not one broken out on the gpio headers)
[20:01] <mclane> its going to happen once my tracker is ready ;-)
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[20:01] <daveake> MCP3002 is a popular choice
[20:01] <mclane> yea
[20:02] <jededu> I have a pi board with a 3002 and a 4802 just working how its wired
[20:03] <mclane> what do you do with the D/A converter?
[20:05] <jededu> Nothing yet I found a post about voltage measurement on the pi and reliased I had a D/A board
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[20:06] <jededu> The kids use it to vary the output voltage to motors ect
[20:06] <eroomde> dac to drive a motor
[20:06] <eroomde> ouch
[20:06] <eroomde> that's all kinds of bad
[20:07] <jededu> not direct
[20:07] <eroomde> phew ;)
[20:07] <jededu> lol
[20:07] <LeoBodnar> well use DAC to make SAR ADC
[20:09] <eroomde> that'd work
[20:09] <jededu> Ill try
[20:09] <jededu> Need to understand it first lol
[20:09] <eroomde> it's super easy
[20:09] <eroomde> let's play a game
[20:10] <eroomde> i'm thinking of a number between 0 and 255
[20:10] <eroomde> you have to guess it
[20:10] <eroomde> all i'll do is answer if your guess is above or below (or right)
[20:10] <eroomde> ok your move
[20:10] <jededu> 127
[20:10] <eroomde> lower
[20:11] <jededu> 0
[20:11] <eroomde> higher
[20:11] <jededu> this could take forever
[20:11] <eroomde> no
[20:11] <jededu> 150
[20:11] <eroomde> you can definitely always do it in 8 guesses
[20:11] <eroomde> always
[20:11] <jededu> 100
[20:12] <craag> (tip: divide the possible range by 2 each time)
[20:12] <eroomde> the trick is to always divide your space into two
[20:12] <eroomde> so your first guess of 127 was good
[20:12] <eroomde> so now you know it's 0-127 as i said lower
[20:12] <eroomde> so now a good guess would be 63
[20:12] <SpeedEvil> Being careful you don't have off-by-one errors meaning you miss bits of the search space
[20:12] <eroomde> as that's half of 127
[20:12] <jededu> 63.5
[20:12] <eroomde> sure but stay integer for now
[20:13] <eroomde> as that's how these things work
[20:13] <eroomde> 63
[20:13] <eroomde> lower
[20:13] <jededu> 31
[20:13] <eroomde> higher
[20:13] <mclane> 48
[20:13] <eroomde> lower
[20:13] <eroomde> but, you get the idea
[20:13] <jededu> yes
[20:13] <eroomde> you can home in
[20:13] <fsphil> my first PIC project after the blinking LED was measuring the voltage using binary search
[20:13] <eroomde> that technique is called successive approximation
[20:14] <mclane> called successive approximation?
[20:14] <fsphil> hmm.. I thought it was called binary search
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[20:14] <eroomde> so, you need a bit of electronics that takes two signals in, and compars them and outputs a 1 or a 0 depending on whther the test input is higher or lower voltage than the control input
[20:14] <jededu> ok
[20:14] <craag> fsphil: It kinda is in a compsci environment, not in an adc.
[20:14] <eroomde> that device is called a comparator
[20:15] <fsphil> ok
[20:15] <eroomde> so you use the dac to generate the 'guess' signal
[20:15] <eroomde> and the comparator compares it to the battery voltage (or whatever)
[20:15] <eroomde> and tells you if it's higher or lower
[20:15] <eroomde> so then you can just do that successive approximation algorithm to home in on the level
[20:15] <jededu> makes sense
[20:16] <eroomde> many adcs use exactly this technique
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[20:27] <jededu> This is what im playing with http://www.primarypi.co.uk/images/da.JPG
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[20:40] <K5KXF> ping fsphil
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[20:47] <fsphil> pong K5KXF
[20:48] <K5KXF> Hey make any progress with the NBTV set-up?
[20:49] <K5KXF> I've gotten on an NBTV forum looking for info
[20:50] <fsphil> I've not worked on it this week, was busy preparing other launches
[20:50] <fsphil> I've got a Pi wired up here to a radio so I'll be on it again shortly
[20:51] <K5KXF> Yeah I figured it was a side project your working on
[20:51] <K5KXF> So you wrote some software for the transmit side on the Pi?
[20:51] <fsphil> yea
[20:52] <K5KXF> Is it using much processing power do you know?
[20:52] <fsphil> it just plays the signal through the audio jack
[20:52] <K5KXF> and that goes to the transmitter right?
[20:52] <fsphil> yea, wired straight into the ntx2 atm - however to do it properly I'll need to hack the Pi, remove the DC block filter
[20:53] <K5KXF> yeah roger that
[20:53] <fsphil> the audio PWM can be output on one of the GPIO pins but I seem to be having issues with that
[20:53] <K5KXF> I wonder if the quality of the output is very good?
[20:53] <fsphil> well it's as good as 48x40 greyscale video can be I guess :)
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[20:54] <K5KXF> yeah that quality is fine
[20:54] <fsphil> I'll take a video clip later
[20:54] <fsphil> it's better than the video I had before
[20:54] <K5KXF> cool
[20:54] <K5KXF> I have a Pi
[20:55] <K5KXF> I guess Upu sells the modules
[20:55] <Upu> which ones ?
[20:56] <K5KXF> the transmitter module
[20:56] <Upu> NTX2B ?
[20:56] <K5KXF> yeah that one
[20:57] <Upu> I do
[20:57] <K5KXF> What's the max output power on them?
[20:57] <Upu> 10mW
[20:57] <Upu> more than enough :)
[20:57] <K5KXF> ok good for testimg
[20:57] <Upu> and launching
[20:58] <Upu> possibly
[20:58] <Upu> I defer to fsphil
[20:58] <K5KXF> Well our range will be 150 miles
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[20:58] <K5KXF> or better if we can make it work
[20:58] <Upu> FM ?
[20:59] <K5KXF> yeah FM
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[20:59] <K5KXF> I'm thinking 5 watts
[20:59] <Upu> some extra juice wouldn't go amiss
[21:00] <K5KXF> QFH antenna
[21:00] <K5KXF> 15db helical on the ground
[21:00] <K5KXF> But all for nothing if I cant make it work
[21:01] <K5KXF> lol
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[21:01] <fsphil> with a good antenna on the ground it should be possible
[21:01] <fsphil> I've not done a range test on this with 10mw yet
[21:01] <K5KXF> It will be quite interesting to try it
[21:02] <K5KXF> I think you picked a perfect res/fps combo
[21:03] <fsphil> well it divides nicely into the sound card samplerate
[21:04] <K5KXF> I can get 70 miles with 1.5 watts 900 mhz
[21:04] <K5KXF> but it's at the limits there
[21:05] <K5KXF> lower freq and narrow bandwith should push it out there a bit farther
[21:09] <K5KXF> I'm still collecting information I'll ask more specific questions soon as I learn enough to ask the right ones
[21:10] <K5KXF> I'm a terriable programer
[21:10] <K5KXF> open book type
[21:10] <K5KXF> lol
[21:13] <K5KXF> I was just wondering about processing power and the quality of the output today
[21:14] <fsphil> encoding the video (assuming it's presented in the correct resolution) is easy
[21:14] <fsphil> CPU-wise
[21:14] <fsphil> the Pi is a bit slow at scaling it down if the source video has a higher resolution
[21:14] <K5KXF> ahh what's the input res your using?
[21:16] <K5KXF> 640x480?
[21:18] <fsphil> 320x240
[21:19] <K5KXF> ok yeah I can find a camer that can do that natively
[21:21] <K5KXF> thanks for the info fsphil
[21:22] <K5KXF> I gotta go back to work but I'll be around
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[21:23] <kd2eat> So, I'm having a problem on several boards with my UBLOX MAX7 chip.
[21:24] <kd2eat> The symptom is that I get data from the chip, but apparently never lock onto satellites.
[21:24] <kd2eat> I installed debugging and I'm seeing that the GPGSV stanzas "flap". I sometimes see as many as 21 satellites... then the next poll, I see one or two.
[21:24] <kd2eat> The GPS never manages to lock on.
[21:25] <kd2eat> I'm using a chip antenna on my boards. They have continuity to the pin on the UBLOX and are installed in the correct orientation. I'm struggling for ideas.
[21:25] <kd2eat> I'm going to try installing the passives I need to run an external antenna tonight. Other thoughts would be welcomed.
[21:26] <kd2eat> This is on a clone of KT4TK's Pecan Pico 4.
[21:27] <kd2eat> (KT5TK's)
[21:32] <mfa298> If it's seeing 21 satellites that sounds wrong.
[21:33] <fsphil> I have a KT5TK board and it never locks while the radio is transmitting
[21:33] <fsphil> the two antennas are too close
[21:33] <kd2eat> Hmm. Interesting.
[21:33] <fsphil> worth testing
[21:33] <kd2eat> I've dialed down my transmissions to 16 seconds for testing. I wonder if I should crank it back up for a few minutes.
[21:33] <fsphil> or even less
[21:33] <fsphil> he's used it with aprs without any problems, but those packets are very short - probably less than a second
[21:34] <kd2eat> Here's an example:
[21:34] <kd2eat> $GPGSV,6,1,22,01,,,18,02,,,19,03,,,19,04,,,18*7A
[21:34] <kd2eat> $GPGSV,6,2,22,07,,,12,08,,,17,09,,,14,12,,,14*7D
[21:34] <kd2eat> $GPGSV,6,3,22,13,,,12,14,,,12,15,,,25,16,,,19*77
[21:34] <kd2eat> $GPGSV,6,4,22,17,,,16,18,,,13,19,,,22,20,,,16*7C
[21:34] <kd2eat> $GPGSV,6,5,22,21,,,11,22,,,17,23,,,11,24,,,24*7E
[21:34] <kd2eat> $GPGSV,6,6,22,25,,,13,26,,,15*7C
[21:34] <kd2eat> (I added some risers exposing I2C pins, and I'm echoing the serial data out to an I2C arduino slave)
[21:35] <fsphil> sneaky
[21:35] <kd2eat> printf == my favorite debugger
[21:36] <kd2eat> I tried increasing the timeout once before, but it wouldn't hurt to try it again. I've puttered on three different boards with multiple code revisions. I could have had something else broken at the time. lol
[21:36] <mfa298> according to wikipedia there's only 31 gps satellites in orbit so seeing 22 of them seems unlikely.
[21:36] <fsphil> if you can get data directly try turning the radio off completely
[21:37] <Laurenceb_> http://2.bp.blogspot.com/-Nve-jMg1kOc/UJdXjKpb9EI/AAAAAAAAC6w/b7sXqBxKQoE/s400/1351753404Atomic_Attack_no.5_195301_pg00a.jpg
[21:37] <kd2eat> mfa298: I agree.. but it's what the GPS is telling me. Dunno what that might mean.
[21:38] <kd2eat> fsphil: I think what i might do is set the retransmit to like 5 minutes and see if the GPGSV data looks stable. If it stops flapping, I'll have my smoking gun.
[21:38] <mfa298> looks like it's not filled in the elevation or azimuth for any of them so I wonder if that's just noise that it happens to be decoding as gps sats.
[21:38] <mfa298> or a slightly more intellegent gps jammer nearby
[21:39] <cm13g09> mfa298: ping
[21:40] <kd2eat> mfa298: Good thought. Perhaps it's just receiving some kind of burst of noise that's being misinterpreted?
[21:40] <mfa298> cm13g09: pong
[21:40] <SpeedEvil> It doesn't fill in alt/az - as it doesn't know position so it can't work it out
[21:41] <mfa298> SpeedEvil: that would make sense.
[21:41] <SpeedEvil> If the date/time/position is very screwed up - it can not lock in some cases
[21:41] <kd2eat> Oh, so until we have a coordinate worked out, those fields would be blank?
[21:41] <SpeedEvil> yes
[21:43] <kd2eat> OK. I'm starting to think that fsphil's observation makes the most sense. I'm transmitting every 16 second or so. If I'm "jamming" the GPS that frequently, maybe it's tossing out it's brains and starting over, but never making progress?
[21:43] <kd2eat> The data sure does seem to show the GPGSV data resetting fairly regularly.
[21:43] <kd2eat> I don't have timestamps.
[21:45] <kd2eat> I was actually suspicious it might be the "go to sleep" code for the AVR resetting something that caused a GPS reset. I commented all that out, but it didn't change the behavior.
[21:48] <kd2eat> fsphil: How did you discover that your board wouldn't lock while transmitting? Did you have to scale back the transmits or something?
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[21:53] <aadamson> kd2eat, you removed the 4 RX components on the si side didn't you?
[21:54] <aadamson> the passives on the rx side of the si need to be removed or else it locks up... not sure if that means the si or the whole board. Second and I found this out the hard way
[21:55] <aadamson> *make* sure you put a piece of coax on the board and run that to a dummy load. *can't remember how Thomas' board works*, but without radials, there is no ground plane and the RF will get back into the board.
[21:55] <aadamson> unless you can shut off the TX and verify that it's not an RF issue, I'd bet your gps shutdown is RF related
[21:56] <kd2eat> OK. I've disabled the RX components by removing a cap and inductor, so it's isolated from the TX side. I didn't totally remove all the components however.
[21:57] <kd2eat> I've been running with a small SMA rubber ducky antenna.
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[22:01] <fsphil> kd2eat: someone else noticed the same thing
[22:01] <fsphil> I can't remember who atm
[22:02] <K5KXF> A 22 channel GPS will try and find 22 sats
[22:02] <kd2eat> So the test I'll do tonight is to back the transmission off to 5 minutes or so while watching the debugs. if the GPGSV messages stabilize then I'll assume it's the transmissions that are messing it up.
[22:02] <fsphil> it can take longer than that to get a lock
[22:02] <K5KXF> it wont but is it not saying it has 22 chanels
[22:03] <aadamson> I was using an antenna connected to the sma connector on my board (granted different than thomas' and I removed *all the passives* on the Rx side. With that antenna I was having all kinds of feedback problems. Got a dummy load while testing and and sma jumper and adapter and poof, no more problems
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[22:04] <kd2eat> K5KXF: I'm seeing quite a variety in the observed satellites in the GPGSV messages: 1,1,1,2,1,10,9,8,1,11,1,1,1,1,4,8,1,10.... it's flapping all over.
[22:04] <aadamson> without some form of a counterpoise the RF goes to the ground which is shared everywhere, and ultimately it goes right back into the computer if it's connected
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[22:05] <K5KXF> does sound like noise
[22:05] <kd2eat> aadamson.. yanno, I got these boards to lock on just a few times. The most reliable was when I was using a few lengths of wire for a cheezy dipole.
[22:05] <aadamson> yep, RF is your problem
[22:05] <kd2eat> That would give it a much better counterpoise.
[22:05] <aadamson> at least part of it
[22:05] <kd2eat> (my problem with these boards, anyway. For a full list of problems, consult TheMrs).
[22:06] <aadamson> I can't remember if Thomas has code to turn down the RF or not, but you can go get mine if you want and just add the function and call it with a value of 6 which will give you .01mw of power :)
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[22:07] <kd2eat> When I was having output power problems, I added an explicit call to set the power to max. Easy enough to make it a subroutine, and dial it down while trying to acquire a lock.
[22:07] <K5KXF> Is this the KT5TK board?
[22:07] <kd2eat> Yes
[22:07] <kd2eat> A clone, anyway.
[22:07] <kd2eat> I just added another riser exposing the I2C pins and a few other GPIOs off the AVR.
[22:08] <K5KXF> Ok I'll look over there
[22:08] <K5KXF> same GPS module?
[22:08] <kd2eat> It's a clone of the Pico 4. I'm using the UBLOX MAX7 though. He used a Max 6.
[22:08] <K5KXF> roger
[22:08] <kd2eat> At aadamson's suggestion, I removed a pull-up resistor on the reset line.
[22:09] <aadamson> ???
[22:09] <kd2eat> Reviewing the datasheets, that's about the only difference I could find that should have mattered.
[22:09] <kd2eat> Wasn't it you?
[22:09] <aadamson> nope
[22:09] <aadamson> mine was getting you on xin
[22:09] <kd2eat> I blame the 70s.
[22:09] <aadamson> instead of xout
[22:09] <kd2eat> Did that oo.
[22:09] <kd2eat> too
[22:09] <aadamson> and a few software changes to fix the result code issue, etc
[22:09] <kd2eat> .. and your code modes for the si6463.
[22:10] <aadamson> yup xi4463
[22:10] <aadamson> si4463 duh
[22:10] <kd2eat> OK. There's also a pullup resistor on pin 9 for the Ublox in the Pico4. That's not needed for the Max7 GPS.
[22:10] <K5KXF> hummm
[22:10] <kd2eat> lol
[22:11] <kd2eat> I guess I forget who told me to remove that. lol
[22:11] <kd2eat> I never got one to lock on until I did.
[22:11] <aadamson> oooo
[22:11] <K5KXF> no biggie
[22:11] <aadamson> you know that pin is the reset pin right?
[22:11] <kd2eat> Yes
[22:12] <aadamson> yep, that's in the hardware manual to remove the pullup on the max7
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[22:14] <kd2eat> "With MAX-6, if Reset input is used, it implements the 3k3 resistor from pin 9 to pin 8. This also works with MAX-7. If used with MAX-7, do not populate the pull-up resistor."
[22:14] <aadamson> I'd put a scope on that however and make sure that it's not being diddle from software
[22:14] <kd2eat> I did. It looked stable.
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[22:17] <kd2eat> Well, time for our local ham club meeting. I'll leave chat open here in case others have ideas. Thanks to all :-)
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[22:34] <jededu> Is it not possible to predict the flight path of pico foil balloons
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[22:35] <SpeedEvil> Of course it is
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[22:35] <SpeedEvil> To some degree
[22:37] <jededu> In the predictor
[22:37] <jededu> Thats what i meant sorry
[22:38] <aadamson> tell is some low bust altitude like 7 or 8k mtrs and some really low decent rate like 1e-4 or something ridiculous
[22:46] <jcoxon> was B-40 the most northly object in hte APRS network at the time
[22:47] <jcoxon> (i think it is
[22:47] <jcoxon> )
[22:47] <Upu> short of a some ships going round up there I doubt there is much else up there
[22:47] <Upu> ships going go to Archangel in Russia maybe
[22:48] <jcoxon> they aren't really aprs
[22:48] <Upu> some carry APRS
[22:48] <Upu> I've see some on APRS before
[22:48] <jcoxon> not just AIS?
[22:48] <Upu> ah possibly yes
[22:49] <Upu> http://aprs.fi/#!lat=60.169998&lng=24.94
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[22:50] <craag> YOu can filter AIS out with the filter button on the right
[22:51] <Upu> yup M0XER-10 was probably the most Northern Station at that time
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[22:52] <jcoxon> :-D
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[22:55] <jcoxon> from my random searches i can't find anything
[22:56] <LeoBodnar> Actually 22 channel GPS will try to wind 32 sats but will be able to track only 22. [22:02] <K5KXF> A 22 channel GPS will try and find 22 sats
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[23:35] <Willdude> mfw I discovered tab completion in a terminal after not using it for about a year http://i.imgur.com/edcCdWA.gif
[23:40] <craag> Willdude: I'm about to blow your mind..
[23:40] <craag> Crtl+R
[23:40] <craag> Searches your bash history
[23:41] <Willdude> No shit, wow
[23:41] <Willdude> Apologies
[23:41] <Maxell> craag: inverse search, even better
[23:41] <craag> Took me nearly 5 years to find that out
[23:42] <Maxell> ^l for clearing term
[23:42] <Maxell> etc
[23:42] <craag> nice maxell
[23:42] <Willdude> Oh my god
[23:42] <craag> I used 'clear'
[23:42] <Willdude> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EXSijgdztCg
[23:43] <Willdude> Good course so far
[23:43] <Maxell> also: dat feel when plugging in CAT cable for hab trackage and hamlib works out of the box: http://www.reactiongifs.com/r/tumblr_n0g19201461qf1116o1_400.gif
[23:43] <Maxell> it had the "WINDOWS USERS: install drivers first" label on it!!
[23:44] <Willdude> We should have mfw mondays
[23:45] <Maxell> mfw Willdude introduces mfw monday http://www.reactiongifs.com/r/angtft.gif
[23:46] <Willdude> So 2013
[23:46] <Willdude> Much old
[23:46] <Willdude> I like this section so far
[23:46] <Willdude> I like the guy doing it
[23:46] <Willdude> So I decided to go for the more comfortable one
[23:47] <Willdude> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EXSijgdztCg#t=380
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[00:00] --- Tue Feb 18 2014