highaltitude.log.20140205

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[00:16] <Oddstr13> i think i've gotten streaming working now :3
[00:16] <Oddstr13> http://satomi.openshell.no:8000/am_radio.ogg
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[04:07] <Team> Anyone home?
[04:12] <adwiens_KC0WYS> ya
[04:16] <SpeedEvil> somewhat
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[08:28] <Team> Trying again anyone home?
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[08:29] Action: fsphil is at work
[08:29] <x-f> i'm at work :/
[08:29] <Team> roger that
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[08:31] <UpuWork> +! for work
[08:31] <UpuWork> 1
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[08:36] <x-f> spectacular photos from Slovenia - http://www.apollo.lv/galerija/zinas/635647/499837
[08:38] <fsphil> ice!
[08:40] <UpuWork> wow
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[08:42] Action: fsphil stops complaining about the local weather
[08:44] <UpuWork> oh since I went to Iceland I never complain about the rain
[08:44] <UpuWork> if you can open your eyes its not raining
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[09:23] <LeoBodnar> morning gents
[09:23] <fsphil> morn!
[09:24] <DL1SGP1> good morning!
[09:26] <Reb-SM3ULC> x-f: icy
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[09:42] Action: mfa298 read's scrollback (/me was trying to get on the motorway)
[09:42] <LeoBodnar> Alan Bean: Since then I have not complained about the weather one single time, he says. Im glad there is weather. Ive not complained about traffic  Im glad there are people around. On his return, he used to visit shopping malls just to watch the people go by. Id think, boy, why do people complain about the Earth? We are living in the Garden of Eden.
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[10:17] <tjanos_> goodday!
[10:18] <tjanos_> Upu: some minutes ago I put short notes on ukhas googlegroup. It appeared for a minut, and after disapeared. Was it too OffTopic?
[10:18] <UpuWork> hmm
[10:19] <UpuWork> hang on may be in the moderation queue
[10:19] Nick change: Sytex_AWAY -> Sytex
[10:19] <tjanos_> I am strupid, because I havenot any copy of this text... it cotains a short time table of our mini-conference too...
[10:21] <UpuWork> posted
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[10:40] <tjanos_> Upu: Thank you! it is readable now
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[10:45] <Chetic> how much calibration do you folks do on your ntx2 and rtl sdr?
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[10:59] <SpeedEvil> Almost none, I gather. What do you mean by 'calibration' ?
[11:00] <fsphil> the sdr I'll sometimes compare against a broadcast FM station
[11:00] <fsphil> just to make sure it's not wildly off
[11:00] <fsphil> but that only really helps for weak signals
[11:00] <fsphil> for a nearby payload the signal will be pretty obvious
[11:00] <SpeedEvil> Due to their design - a crystal - they are either likely to broadly work, or not at all
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[11:02] <LeoBodnar> Does Microsoft make a rocket launch simulator?
[11:02] <Reb-SM3ULC> I ususally use some pager-signals. Not so wide and ususally very accurate
[11:02] <SpeedEvil> LeoBodnar: orbiter?
[11:02] Nick change: Sytex -> Sytex_AWAY
[11:03] <LeoBodnar> I don't understand the magic because rocket launch. I thought you just push a button and it goes up.
[11:03] <LeoBodnar> *behind
[11:06] <Vostok> LeoBodnar: you should probably get into some mission checklists
[11:07] <Vostok> LeoBodnar: http://space.stackexchange.com/questions/1295/what-is-the-purpose-of-having-a-countdown-during-a-rocket-launch
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[12:27] <Lunar_LanderU> hello
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[12:49] <fsphil> yo
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[13:14] <Lunar_LanderU> hello LeoBodnar_
[13:14] <LeoBodnar> hi!
[13:16] <DL1SGP1> Guten Tag Kevin, Hi LeoBodnar, greetings @ all
[13:16] <Lunar_LanderU> hallo DL1SGP1
[13:16] Nick change: DL1SGP1 -> DL1SGP
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[13:39] <brainles71> morning guys
[13:39] <brainles71> how is everyone?
[13:40] <Vostok> splömp splömp
[13:41] <brainles71> Vostok: what does that mean?
[13:41] <fsphil> still waking up here
[13:41] <fsphil> it's 13:41, so another few hours at least
[13:42] <mfa298> fsphil: surely it's time to start winding down at work !
[13:42] <Vostok> pretty much nothing
[13:42] <Lunar_LanderU> oh hi to Finland :)
[13:42] <brainles71> i did try google translate& it thought it was swedish
[13:44] <brainles71> fsphil: come on! chug down that coffee! its only 00:44 here and I'm wide awake
[13:44] <Vostok> brainles71: i bet that's not in any dictionary of any language
[13:44] <brainles71> probably not :)
[13:45] <brainles71> you and your crazy made up languages Vostok
[13:45] <Vostok> you can think of it as the sound that a very large, hollow elastic cylinder makes when bouncing down a staircase
[13:46] <brainles71> thats awesome :)
[13:47] <Vostok> so that's just a sound i made up. but here are some existing finnish words: http://depressingfinland.tumblr.com/post/67479015304/amazing-onomatopoeic-finnish
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[13:50] <brainles71> interesting
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[13:55] <brainles71> anyone working on anything interesting today?
[13:56] <brainles71> fsphil: how is your understanding of consciousness going at the moment?
[13:58] <brainles71> Vostok: are you Finnish?
[13:58] <Vostok> yes
[13:58] <brainles71> enjoying the end of winter over there?
[13:58] <Vostok> no. i hate snow
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[13:59] <Vostok> we didn't get any, for an unusually long period
[14:00] <Vostok> but a few weeks ago the skies opened
[14:00] <brainles71> hmm
[14:00] <Vostok> everyone is thrilled, but i've seen enough of it already :)
[14:00] <brainles71> have you lived there your whole life?
[14:01] <brainles71> come to australia we get virtually none
[14:01] <brainles71> ill swap with you
[14:02] <x-f> brown snow will annoy you quickly
[14:02] <Vostok> yeah, everything's brown
[14:03] <brainles71> well crap
[14:03] <brainles71> we have enough of that here
[14:04] <Vostok> i wouldn't mind spending a few of our winter months down under
[14:04] <Vostok> i'd figure out plenty to do
[14:04] <Vostok> watch southern stars i've never seen before and fly sailplanes
[14:04] <brainles71> yeah we get anywhere from 25-42 here in summer
[14:06] <brainles71> degrees i should add
[14:06] <Darkside> 42, is that all :P
[14:06] <Vostok> i hope it's celsius :)
[14:06] <Darkside> we hit 46.1 a few weeks back
[14:06] <brainles71> yes it is
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[14:06] <brainles71> bloody hell Darkside
[14:07] <Darkside> brainles71: adelaide.
[14:07] <brainles71> we are having rain and cool weather down around 22
[14:07] <brainles71> sydney
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[14:07] <Darkside> lucky you
[14:07] <brainles71> I'm hoping it warms up! i have my engagement party next saturday
[14:07] <brainles71> send us your warm weather!
[14:08] <brainles71> dark side have you used altium?
[14:08] <brainles71> *Darkside
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[14:10] <Darkside> brainles71: yup
[14:10] <Vostok> we're constantly waving between -15 and +5
[14:10] <Darkside> fairly experienced in it
[14:10] <Vostok> which is very annoying
[14:10] <Vostok> the snow is turning brown very quickly :P
[14:10] <brainles71> Whats your thoughts on it? Pretty good?
[14:11] <brainles71> Vostok: thats crap! not even stable enough weather for decent ski snow
[14:11] <Darkside> altium is brilliant
[14:11] <Darkside> bit of a learning curv
[14:11] <Darkside> but not as steep as eagle or kicad imo
[14:11] <brainles71> i obtained a copy and I'm going to have a play
[14:11] <Darkside> also its used a lot in the electronics industry in ausralia
[14:12] <brainles71> well thats good to know
[14:12] <brainles71> I'm not exactly looking to get into it but still
[14:12] <brainles71> altium is an australian company i think!
[14:12] <Darkside> yup
[14:14] <brainles71> i figured its time to play with some PCB designs and learn a bit
[14:14] <Darkside> yup
[14:14] <Darkside> always good to know :-)
[14:15] <brainles71> hows your phd coming?
[14:15] <Darkside> getting there..
[14:18] <brainles71> are you going to be using your new cutdown device to increase the size of your balloon/launch payload?
[14:18] <Darkside> 'new'
[14:18] <Darkside> its like 2 years old
[14:18] <brainles71> new to me :)
[14:19] <Darkside> we flew large payloads before the cutdown >_>
[14:19] <Darkside> but the cutdown makes flying them a bit safer
[14:19] <Darkside> havent flown anything >4kg though
[14:19] <brainles71> which is where you need the cutdown
[14:19] <Darkside> depends
[14:19] <Darkside> theres a lot of stuff in that medium category which is a bit impractical
[14:19] <brainles71> i see how you are partially flying under the light balloon category
[14:20] <Darkside> yes
[14:20] <Darkside> you'll note that the light balloon category doesnt allow for balloons >some diameter
[14:20] <Darkside> or something like that
[14:20] <brainles71> yeah that was my only question about that
[14:20] <brainles71> i suppose you get the NOTAM under the light anyway
[14:20] <Darkside> yeah
[14:21] <brainles71> and it won't expand to ridiculously below 35000 feet which is the fly zone for commercial aircraft
[14:22] <Vostok> höplön pöplön
[14:22] <Darkside> right, sleep time for me
[14:22] <brainles71> damit Vostok
[14:22] <brainles71> what does that mean
[14:23] <brainles71> cya Darkside
[14:23] <Vostok> i don't know
[14:23] <brainles71> haha you making up words again?
[14:26] <Vostok> yes sir
[14:27] <brainles71> very good! carry on!
[14:27] <brainles71> how did you get interested/involved in high altitude ballooning Vostok?
[14:29] <Vostok> i joined this channel after absorbing the huge hype that LeoBodnars balloons caused in finland
[14:30] <brainles71> did one of his balloons cause trouble or something?
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[14:30] <Vostok> no, they were just awesome
[14:31] <Vostok> and they kept coming!
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[14:31] <craag> Hopefully when the weather improves, you'll get a few more!
[14:32] <craag> Maybe some others too trying to complete the arctic cchallenge
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[15:04] <Lunar_LanderU> hi craag
[15:04] <craag> Afternoon Lunar_LanderU
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[15:11] <henryplumb> Hi all. Making a Pi flight computer. Have a shell script capturing pictures using the PiCam every 30 seconds. I want to SSDV some of these. How would I go about reducing the resolution (size) and then radio them in my tracker python program?
[15:12] <fsphil> imagemagick has a command line program (convert) that can scale images
[15:12] <fsphil> alternativly I'm sure there are ways of doing it directly from within python
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[15:13] <fsphil> something along the lines of http://jargonsummary.wordpress.com/2011/01/08/how-to-resize-images-with-python/
[15:14] <mfa298> you can even capture the images from the pi cam in python (see the last update on the pi wiki page)
[15:14] <fsphil> oh yes
[15:14] <fsphil> I must try that
[15:14] <mfa298> you can also define the resolutions to use so could capture high res and low res images.
[15:15] <henryplumb> I know that bit but, I don't know how to go about sending them. Do I stop my telemetry, send the image, then restart telemetry or what?
[15:15] <mfa298> as a non python programmer it seems to work pretty well. Shame the C++ libraries I've found don't seem to be as good (video port only).
[15:15] <fsphil> the ssdv encoder will give you a large binary file
[15:15] <fsphil> which is a series of 256 byte packets
[15:15] <fsphil> you can send these 256 byte packets separaretly if you want
[15:15] <henryplumb> right...
[15:15] <fsphil> with telemetry between them
[15:16] <henryplumb> That's the bit I don't know how to do
[15:16] <mfa298> it's pretty much the same as sending telemetry, but instead of creating a string to send you get the next 256 bytes from the file.
[15:17] <henryplumb> Okay, I'll try making some code and see what I can come up with. Cheers mfa298 and fsphil
[15:17] <fsphil> just make sure the serial port is opened for 8-bit data
[15:17] <henryplumb> Yup, I do that in the same fashion as I have done for telemtry right
[15:17] <henryplumb> ?
[15:17] <fsphil> yea
[15:17] <henryplumb> Okay, cheers
[15:18] <fsphil> python makes no distinction between telemetry and image data
[15:18] <fsphil> all just strings to it
[15:18] <henryplumb> Okay :)
[15:18] <henryplumb> So still opening the port like I have done:
[15:18] <henryplumb> serial.Serial('/dev/ttyAMA0', 50, serial.EIGHTBITS, serial.PARITY_NONE, serial.STOPBITS_TWO)
[15:18] <fsphil> that's fine
[15:18] <henryplumb> But, higher baud rate?
[15:19] <mfa298> if you havn't yet it's well worth creating an account on github and use git to manage your code. That way when you have issues with the code you can link us to the current code in github and people can hopefully help you out.
[15:19] <fsphil> though images at 50 baud will be slow :)
[15:19] <henryplumb> I have github :)
[15:19] <henryplumb> I don't update it regularly enough though, I kind of gave up on git :L
[15:20] <mfa298> Woohoo (lots of people seem to stay away from any form of SCM without seeing how it makes life much easier in the long run)
[15:21] <henryplumb> I just use dropbox now tbh
[15:21] <craag> nooooo
[15:21] <craag> github!
[15:21] <henryplumb> Haha
[15:21] <mfa298> getting into the process of make some changes, test, commit is very good.
[15:21] <craag> Honestly, version control is awesome.
[15:22] <craag> "What changes have I made since this last worked?" is a 1 line command
[15:22] <mfa298> means when it all stops working you can see what changed and if needed revert
[15:22] <henryplumb> I used to like it but, I just kind of phased out of it with all of my code projects
[15:23] <adamgreig> maybe phase it back in, then
[15:23] <craag> Often it does feel like too much work, but when you get to some point that you need it, it will all be worth it!
[15:23] <adamgreig> it's like no work. make it so your editor lets you commit very easily and just remember to do it often
[15:23] <adamgreig> so so so worthwhile
[15:23] <henryplumb> I might try moving back then
[15:24] <henryplumb> Anyway, for SSDV what baud rate should I use? 300? 400? 600?
[15:24] <fsphil> 400 is non-standard
[15:24] <craag> henryplumb: Where are you launching?
[15:24] <henryplumb> Haven't got permission or anything yet but, hopefully my house :L
[15:24] <fsphil> geographically :)
[15:24] <craag> If it's in southern england, 600 baud will be fine ( we have plenty of listeners)
[15:24] <henryplumb> South Suffolk / North Essex
[15:24] <henryplumb> good good :)
[15:24] <mfa298> if you're developing on the pi, get the ssh keys setup for your github and it's just a case of add/commit regularly, and push from time to time (eg at the end of each day or when you need someone to see the current code)
[15:24] <fsphil> 600 will be fine
[15:25] <craag> Go for 600 then I reckon.
[15:25] <henryplumb> I live half way between Cambridge and Colchester
[15:25] <craag> Plenty of habbers round you then!
[15:25] <henryplumb> Yup :)
[15:25] <fsphil> I highly recommend doing a range test if you can
[15:25] <craag> Yep, range test will still be needed.
[15:25] <fsphil> the higher baud rates can be a problem if your antenna is a bit iffy (but still good enough for short range)
[15:25] <henryplumb> okay :)
[15:26] <craag> Someone local should be able to help you out with that when you get to that point.
[15:26] <fsphil> is this just a raspberry pi launch?
[15:26] <henryplumb> Yeah
[15:26] <craag> No other radio tracker board?
[15:27] <fsphil> ok. if you had been flying another camera or something like a gopro I'd have suggested a slower baud rate backup
[15:27] <henryplumb> I'll probably be putting in GSM/SMS based tracker for after landing in the hope of landing in signal
[15:27] <fsphil> that might do
[15:30] <WillDWork_> are you using c, c++ or python on the pi?
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[15:32] <henryplumb> python
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[15:34] <mfa298> there only seems to be a few of us mad enough to use C/C++ on the pi.
[15:35] <WillDWork_> yeah - i was having fun with baud timings with python so was wondering if c would be better - but that could be just me
[15:36] <mfa298> if you're bit banging rtty on the gpio then it's doable in C but even then you may have timing issues (I've got it to work with a higher thread priority and alternative scheduling altogithm)
[15:36] <mfa298> using the UART is probably the safer way and is well tested.
[15:37] <mfa298> and works with C/Python or probably even shell scripts (I don't think anyones done a bash tracker yet)
[15:40] <henryplumb> What res image should I go for at 600 baud?
[15:42] <fsphil> how long do you want to wait?
[15:43] <fsphil> there's no easy answer, it depends on what you're after
[15:43] <fsphil> best to just experiment with different settings
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[15:44] <SpeedEvil> And perhaps consider several different sizes alternating
[15:45] <mfa298> or different sizes at different points in the flight
[15:45] <fsphil> yes, a trick daveake came up with was to transmit small images while near the ground
[15:46] <henryplumb> Okay, I'll experiment
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[15:48] <WillDWork_> i like the layered images, or whatever that was, for the animated ones
[15:49] <fsphil> that worked well, though it was sooooo slow
[15:51] <gonzo___> when you are at alt, then how many low res cloudscapes/black sky do you want
[15:51] <gonzo___> may as well send high res then
[15:51] <Lunar_LanderU> oh well the fun of building something
[15:51] <fsphil> you could set a size limit, encode to lots of sizes and pick the one that's nearest the limit
[15:54] <mfa298> or use daveake's patented* image selection algorithm. *(may not actually be patented)
[15:54] <craag> lol
[15:55] <gonzo___> painted then?
[15:55] <craag> do we owe him some license fees?
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[15:55] <gonzo___> owe him royalites, a few future kings be enough?
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[16:17] <gb73d> 7 MIN TO launch
[16:17] <gb73d> http://www.nasa.gov/multimedia/nasatv/#.UvJer9JkTh4
[16:18] <brainles71> what are they launching gb73d
[16:21] <adwiens_KC0WYS> soyuz?
[16:21] <adwiens_KC0WYS> just guessing because it looks dark outside there
[16:21] <adwiens_KC0WYS> cosmodrome yeah has to be
[16:23] <brainles71> cool
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[16:24] <brainles71> iss support rocket
[16:25] <Lunar_LanderU> ah progress
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[16:26] <Lunar_LanderU> is it flying?
[16:26] <brainles71> yup
[16:26] <Lunar_LanderU> (no audio available here)
[16:26] <Lunar_LanderU> cool!
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[16:37] <gb73d> nice 1
[16:37] <gb73d> byeeee
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[16:40] <jededu> Hi im trying out the NORB python code for the pi it runs ok but I get 0's for the GPS data has anybody ever used this
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[16:47] <Oddstr13> http://satomi.openshell.no:8000/am_radio.ogg <-- that'd be wwv i'm receiving?
[16:47] <Oddstr13> at 10MHz
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[16:47] Nick change: Geoff-G8DHE_ -> Geoff-G8DHE-M
[16:54] <mfa298> jededu: it may only work for UBlox gps modules (I think that code may be polling the gps for values rather than parsing nmea)
[16:55] <mfa298> also it generally worth writing your own code rather than just using someone elses. People tend to make assumptions of how the hardware will be setup which may not be the same.
[17:01] <adwiens_KC0WYS> woohoo
[17:01] <adwiens_KC0WYS> goodies from upu have arrived
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[17:01] Nick change: Sytex_AWAY -> Sytex
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[17:07] <Sytex> Evening all!
[17:08] <Sytex> I looking for a suitable SMD 30Mhz TCXO for RFM22B/SI4432, but I cannot find any in Hungary. Can someone recommend a type, which I could order from different country?
[17:09] <SpeedEvil> Sytex: does hu.farnell.com exist?
[17:09] <Sytex> farnell will be the last choise, they ship to Hun at very very high price
[17:10] <SpeedEvil> ah
[17:11] <Sytex> And at farnell there is 27Mhz and 32.768Mhz, no 30Mhz can found in the list
[17:14] <adwiens_KC0WYS> actually 30 mhz isn't required
[17:15] <Sytex> than the 27Mhz type will be good for me? What changes if I change the frequency (freq calculation, ISP timing, etc)???
[17:15] <Sytex> ISP=SPI
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[17:16] <adwiens_KC0WYS> oh si4x3x, I was thinking about the si4x6x
[17:17] <adwiens_KC0WYS> the si4x6x can take any crystal between 27mhz and 32mhz
[17:17] <adwiens_KC0WYS> that may or may not apply to the si4x3x
[17:19] <adwiens_KC0WYS> I'm almost positive you can use a 27mhz crystal with the si4432, you would just have to set the pll slightly differently to get the same center frequency
[17:21] <Sytex> Thanks, I will one if I can't find nothing else
[17:23] <adwiens_KC0WYS> just checked, technically the 4x6x can take a crystal as low as 25mhz
[17:24] <adwiens_KC0WYS> sure
[17:25] <Sytex> I know 4x6x are newer, better, but I have some 4432 panels (not only IC) from ebay, and I want to use them firstly
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[17:25] <adwiens_KC0WYS> gotcha
[17:25] <Sytex> And I have some future plans for 'commanding' ...
[17:26] <adwiens_KC0WYS> commanding?
[17:26] <Sytex> And as I read 4x6x are transmitters only, the cannot receive (but I can be wrong)
[17:26] <adwiens_KC0WYS> i think there are 4x6x transceivers
[17:26] <Sytex> drop payload/release ballon, switch between telemetry and picture sending, just for playing
[17:27] <adwiens_KC0WYS> actually all the 4x6x parts are transceivers, so they can all tx and rx
[17:27] <adwiens_KC0WYS> transceiver != transmitter
[17:27] <Sytex> Okay, than I missread something...
[17:27] <Sytex> In some datasheet
[17:28] <adwiens_KC0WYS> sorry i meant all the 446x, 406x are tx and 436x are rx
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[17:29] <Sytex> okay, so it's clear now, I read 406x dataheet before, and I thought all 4x6x are transmitters only
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[17:34] <Team> Hello!
[17:34] <Team> Anyone flying the ardupilot on HiBall's in the UK?
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[17:38] <Team> Sytex contact Flytron
[17:39] <Team> For TXCO module
[17:42] <Team> New Forum for HAB stuff http://teamprometheus.org/forum/
[17:42] <Sytex> Team: flytron.com ?
[17:43] <craag> Team: There's not much pilot-ing to do on HABs.
[17:43] <Team> Yeah Flytron.com is in Hungray
[17:43] <Team> Yes but the ardupilot is useful in other ways!
[17:44] <craag> Most of us just write our own firmware.
[17:44] <Team> You can run simulated missions with it
[17:44] <Team> In X-Plane
[17:44] <Sytex> Team: thanks, I will search their site
[17:44] Nick change: Sytex -> Sytex_EAT
[17:44] <Team> Contact directly
[17:47] <Team> I have email wait one
[17:49] <Team> melih@melihkarakelle.com
[17:49] <Team> For Flytron
[17:49] <Team> Tell him Monroe from Team Prometheus sent you
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[17:51] <Team> If you talk to him personally he will most likely find the part for you
[17:52] <Team> Ardupilot is great for getting telemetry too!
[17:53] <Team> You can write new code for it easily as well to do other things
[17:53] <Team> Mavlink is great protocoll
[17:53] <Team> Use it to activate experiments or cutdown whatever you want
[17:54] <Team> Can interface with Raspbery Pi as well
[17:56] <Team> You can also run software like Mission planner for tracking in moving map
[17:56] <craag> Tracking on a map, what an awesome idea :P
[17:57] <Team> You can connect to X-Plane and watch the payload in flight
[17:57] <Team> Yeah but with this you can share with team members not at the launch
[17:58] <Team> Over the internet
[17:58] <craag> Team: Have you looked at the UKHAS system?
[17:58] <craag> You might want to...
[17:58] <craag> It does all this
[17:58] <Team> Perhaps I have not seen the proper site
[17:59] <Team> can you give me a link?
[17:59] <craag> Info on: http://ukhas.org.uk/
[17:59] Nick change: Sytex_EAT -> Sytex
[17:59] <Sytex> re
[17:59] <craag> map on: http://spacenear.us/tracker/
[17:59] <Sytex> Team: thanks for the mail addr
[17:59] <Team> You are welcome he can help
[17:59] <craag> Designed for HABs, and tested many, many times.
[17:59] <Team> Yes I have seen that
[18:00] <Team> You can not connect to X-Plane and run hardware in the loop testing with it
[18:00] <Team> can you?
[18:00] <craag> erm, why would I want to?
[18:01] <Team> Can you have multipul command consoles with it anywhere in the world?
[18:01] <Team> If you are flying a complicated mission HIL testing does help
[18:02] <craag> Command consoles? So uplink? That's not going to work at 40km up on license-free radios.
[18:02] <Team> Nope
[18:02] <craag> Oh yes gps-simulation sure, but that's easy to do.
[18:02] <Team> You need a lisense
[18:02] <craag> Right, ours you don't :)
[18:03] <craag> But no uplink I must admit.
[18:03] <Team> We do live video so we need it anyway
[18:03] <craag> Ah ok. Which frequency bands do you use?
[18:03] <Team> Yes I'm in the States 900 Mhz
[18:04] <Team> 1.5 watt
[18:04] <Team> Telemetry is 433 Mhz
[18:04] <craag> Ok. This was developed in the UK, so uses 434MHz, 0.01 watt
[18:04] <Team> Yes it is nice
[18:04] <Team> I like the SDR reciever
[18:05] <Team> Tracking device
[18:05] <craag> Anyway gtg, uni spaceflight meeting.
[18:05] <Team> Is this only for your hardware here?
[18:06] <Sytex> LOL flytron is in Turkey, not in Hungary
[18:07] <Team> Your right
[18:07] <Team> my bad- can he help you?
[18:08] <Team> The Ardusat guy's I worked with are from Hungary
[18:08] <Team> got them mixed up
[18:08] <Sytex> You gave me the link and address 10 minutes ago, I haven't hade time to write to them... but I will search firstly more here in Hun befeore i try to contact any another county company
[18:08] <Sytex> (shiping price)
[18:09] <Team> Yes I understand
[18:09] <Sytex> Ardusat, Hungary?
[18:09] <Team> I have some Beeline modules on 144.39 Mhz
[18:09] <Sytex> I haven't hear from them
[18:10] <Team> Arudsat CEO is from Hungry
[18:10] <Team> One guy from Belgum
[18:10] <Team> Another from Canada
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[18:11] <Sytex> I found a video: Team Prometheus parners with Ardusat. Which is you? The one with the blue rocket in his hands?
[18:11] <Team> Thats Stewart I'm the other guy
[18:12] <Sytex> okay
[18:12] <Team> We dropped som gliders from 30km last year
[18:13] <Team> 3 crashed
[18:13] <Team> The last one did well
[18:13] <Team> That's haow we started using Ardupilot for HAB launches
[18:14] <Team> Now we have been using the UAV stuff ever since
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[18:16] <Team> Actually we fly the Virtual Robotics autopilot VR Brain from Italy
[18:16] <Team> It is 32 bit and came out before the Pixhawk 3D Robotics now sells
[18:17] <Team> It has been ported for the Ardupilot software
[18:18] <Team> http://www.virtualrobotix.com/
[18:19] <Team> Robert Navaro
[18:20] <Team> Reberto
[18:20] <Team> Crap!
[18:20] <Team> Roberto!
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[18:29] <kc1bca> anyone on the air?
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[18:33] <Team> here
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[18:52] <fsphil> evening all
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[18:53] <DL1SGP> good evening fsphil
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[19:52] <Lunar_Lander> hello
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[20:08] <db_g6gzh> ibanezmatt13_: just looked at the map 8-)
[20:08] <ibanezmatt13_> lol yeah. Getting nearer and nearer :)
[20:09] <ibanezmatt13_> or further and further away if you base it on the weather
[20:09] <ibanezmatt13_> oh you mean the test data
[20:09] <ibanezmatt13_> yes thanks for that! Just what I needed :)
[20:09] Action: fsphil checks the hourly predictor
[20:10] <fsphil> well, at least it isn't getting worse
[20:10] <ibanezmatt13_> No, at least I get to have some nice dutch pancakes
[20:13] <db_g6gzh> yes, the test data, glad it was useful
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[21:15] <cm13g09> mfa298: ping
[21:17] <mfa298> cm13g09: pong
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[21:19] <Sytex> g'night all!
[21:19] Nick change: Sytex -> Sytex_AWAY
[21:24] <ibanezmatt13_> the joyous moment when you go to throw an "empty" box of chocolates in the bin before realising that another layer of more chocolates lie underneath!
[21:25] <Upu> 434.525 ibanezmatt13_
[21:25] <ibanezmatt13_> is that close to 434.550? (My radio knowledge is dire)
[21:26] <Upu> thats not radio thats maths Matt :)
[21:26] <Upu> its far enough away
[21:26] <ibanezmatt13_> :P
[21:26] <ibanezmatt13_> Thanks!
[21:26] <Upu> 434550000 Hz - 434525000hz
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[21:26] <ibanezmatt13_> of course
[21:26] <ibanezmatt13_> silly me
[21:27] <Upu> you'll get both of them within the bandwidth of a fun cube
[21:27] <ibanezmatt13_> cool
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[22:37] <kc1bca> hi, im trying to get some info on software to track with a radio.
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[22:39] <chrisstubbs> Hi kc1bca
[22:39] <chrisstubbs> Sounds like your after dl-fldigi
[22:40] <chrisstubbs> http://ukhas.org.uk/projects:dl-fldigi
[22:41] <Upu> evening kc1bca, yup chrisstubbs has pointed you in the correct direction
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[22:42] <Uggy> Hi, I'm tring to choose what would be the most appropriate GPS breakout on HAB Supplies
[22:42] <Upu> Hi Uggy
[22:42] <Upu> there is a table at the top of here : http://ava.upuaut.net/store/index.php?route=product/category&path=59_60
[22:42] <Uggy> ;)
[22:43] <Uggy> yep... was a bit confused
[22:43] <Uggy> I would like a passive antenna
[22:43] <Upu> haha ok
[22:43] <Upu> first question what are you connecting it too ?
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[22:43] <Uggy> and this is to connect to Raspberry
[22:43] <Uggy> so it looks uBLOX MAX-7 Breakout With Sarantel Antenna
[22:43] <Upu> ok so any of them really
[22:43] <Uggy> could be ok ?
[22:44] <Upu> yep that works
[22:44] <Upu> all have I2C and serial on them
[22:44] <Upu> http://ava.upuaut.net/store/index.php?route=product/product&path=59_60&product_id=51
[22:44] <Upu> so that one really
[22:44] <Uggy> ok .. perfect
[22:44] <Upu> use code UKHAS on your shopping cart
[22:44] <Upu> 10% off
[22:45] <Uggy> I have been confused as you write at top:
[22:45] <Uggy> uBLOX MAX-7 Breakout for Active Antenna (+an active antenna).
[22:45] <Uggy> is probably choice for Raspberry
[22:46] <Upu> well
[22:46] <Uggy> thx for the code :)
[22:46] <Upu> they let you use an active antenna
[22:46] <Upu> which are better for ground testing
[22:46] <Uggy> ok I see..
[22:46] <Upu> but the Sarantel passives work fine in the air
[22:46] <Uggy> ok..perfect ! :)
[22:46] <Upu> and pretty good on the ground unless you're buried in a basement or something
[22:47] <Uggy> ok great .. ! ;)
[22:47] <Uggy> will order in few min
[22:47] <Upu> no probs will ship tommorrow now :P
[22:48] <Uggy> ok..it's to France
[22:48] <Uggy> Will try to not forget one line into the shipping adress this time ;)
[22:48] <Uggy> even if last shipping arrived fine anyway :)
[22:50] <Uggy> Thx Upu
[22:50] <Upu> nps
[22:50] <Uggy> are the PCB made from Hackvana ?
[22:50] <Upu> yep
[22:51] <Uggy> ok ... as the preAmp filter too ?
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[22:54] <Uggy> then I could use for exemple chrisstubs python code on the Rasp to enable the "flight mode" I guess ?
[22:54] <Uggy> (thx chrisstubs for the code)
[22:55] <kc1bca> hi chrisstubbs, does dl-fldigi require an internet connection?I need to track from my chase car.
[22:56] <chrisstubbs> No worries, I would advise you to write your own actual tracker code, as my "flightcode.py" has never actually flown. and is a mess.
[22:57] <chrisstubbs> kc1bca, it needs an internet connection to upload the data you receive to habitat/spacenear.us
[22:57] <chrisstubbs> but not to just decode the rtty/whatever to text
[22:57] <chrisstubbs> also the autoconfiguration settings are downloaded, so you would have to set them up manually
[22:57] <Uggy> chrisstubbs: ok.. good to know. In fact I was thinking about the flight mode code.. node tracker code
[22:57] <Upu> yes Uggy
[22:58] <Upu> http://gerblook.org/pcb/ystw2zkxPdXQ7QRwaza4oT <-
[22:58] <Uggy> Upu: Seems it's not in stock ?
[22:58] <kc1bca> chrisstubbs:i'll b tracking thru eastern colorado where inet is spotty at best. I'll be throwing a cellphone in there, but was hoping to track via radio as my primary.
[22:58] <Upu> yeah people keep buying them :)
[22:58] <Upu> if you order one it will be 2 days
[22:59] <Uggy> ok.. thx ;)
[22:59] <Upu> I'm going to make a batch of 1090, 434 and 144Mhz ones tommorrow
[22:59] <Upu> and some Sonde ones too
[22:59] <Upu> 403Mhz
[22:59] <craag> kc1bca: Yep you can track fine, you'll just have to navigate to the lat/lon shown in dl-fldigi rather than having it on a map
[22:59] Action: chrisstubbs wonders how long before upu has his own factory
[22:59] <LeoBodnar> Newsshite is talking about everybody everybody needing to know "how to code"
[22:59] <Upu> I have my own factory :)
[22:59] <craag> But plenty of iphone/android apps for that
[22:59] <Upu> * bench
[22:59] <Uggy> Upu: thx for gerblook url.. nice
[23:00] <Upu> kc1bca we generally have 3G coverage so upload via that
[23:00] <Upu> but its more than possible to track it without
[23:00] <Upu> just need some one to assist navigating
[23:00] <LeoBodnar> Presenter asking a guest what coding is. Neither has any idea what it is. There was one reference to html
[23:00] <kc1bca> upu-is there an android app for that?
[23:01] <Upu> just go to http://habhub.org/mt
[23:01] <Upu> on the device
[23:01] <LeoBodnar> * despair
[23:01] <chrisstubbs> LeoBodnar someone asked me at college "how do I make a hack? Do I have to use command prompt?" today lol
[23:01] <Upu> and it will upload your chase car position to spacenear.us
[23:01] <craag> Upu: Not going to work without internet
[23:01] <Upu> true
[23:01] <Upu> daveake has an offline tracking but generally its a case of get the coordinates from dl-fldigi
[23:01] <craag> Just use dl-fldigi, and navigate to the decoded lat/lon with a compass phone app.
[23:01] <Upu> and stick them in your ... what craag just said
[23:02] <LeoBodnar> Kevin Mitnick used a phone to hack
[23:02] <Upu> heh
[23:02] <Upu> true fact
[23:02] <LeoBodnar> hands up those who remembers Kevin Mitnick
[23:03] <LeoBodnar> hey! no googling at the back
[23:03] <chrisstubbs> I googled :(
[23:04] <Upu> haha
[23:04] <Upu> he was quite famous
[23:04] <Upu> right I'm off night all
[23:04] <chrisstubbs> same, laters!
[23:05] <Uggy> LeoBodnar: I'm working at IT Security.. so for me easy :)
[23:05] <LeoBodnar> laters! gn
[23:05] <LeoBodnar> heh know your heros
[23:05] <LeoBodnar> or villains
[23:05] <kc1bca> upu-i just took a look at the site via mobile. looks like it should do the trick. do u know how often it updates the balloon track?
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[23:07] <Prometheus> Looks like you guy's in the UK are sneeking ahead of us over here in the states!
[23:07] <Prometheus> Lot's more going on here it appears
[23:08] <Prometheus> Is there any interest in smaller zero pressure balloons here?
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[23:09] <Uggy> Upu:ublox order placed.. (thx for coupon code ;) )
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[23:12] <Prometheus> For perhaps 3 cubic meter or 6 cubic meter equivalant to 600 and 1200 gram latex balloons
[23:14] <craag> Prometheus: There has been some interest, but it's been difficult to get it to stay up at night after much of the Helium has escaped during the day.
[23:15] <Prometheus> Yes that is true you would have to carry half you weight in ballast
[23:15] <Prometheus> and you would need a controller to drop it
[23:16] <craag> Yes, but that means extra weight, which makes it more difficult with a small balloon
[23:17] <craag> There's certainly interest in it
[23:17] <Prometheus> Japan actually bobmed the US with balloons made of paper in WWII
[23:18] <Prometheus> They kept it secret
[23:18] <Prometheus> http://news.nationalgeographic.com/news/2013/05/130527-map-video-balloon-bomb-wwii-japanese-air-current-jet-stream/
[23:19] <Prometheus> Actuall quite a few made it across the ocean
[23:20] <Prometheus> They where zero pressure balloons with timed balast drops
[23:20] <craag> yep
[23:20] <Prometheus> Pretty interesting stuff
[23:21] <Prometheus> I'd actually like to give it a try sending you guy's a balloon from the states
[23:21] <Prometheus> Coradnate with someone to recover it
[23:21] <craag> Sure. Several have made it across here.
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[23:21] <Prometheus> Yeah I've noticed that
[23:22] <craag> Bit hard to co-ordinate ahead of time as it's difficult to predict where they'll end up
[23:22] <Prometheus> Yeah you would need a fair network to observe it
[23:22] <craag> APRS is the best you can do radio-wise
[23:23] <Prometheus> We are developing some tracking and control software right now
[23:23] <craag> satellite is nice, but expensive and comparatively heavy
[23:23] <Prometheus> For a balloon network
[23:24] <Prometheus> The only problem is you need a goto telescope for antenna pointing
[23:24] <Prometheus> About $250 us for a cheap Celestron Nexstar
[23:25] <LeoBodnar> you are oversweating it i think
[23:25] <craag> right.. again I point you towards our network, where I've tracked with a $20 receiver and a piece of wire :)
[23:25] <LeoBodnar> people are willing to stay up all night just to track manually
[23:25] <Prometheus> Well if you want high banwith telemetry and video you need directional antennas
[23:26] <LeoBodnar> which is wonderful and very humbling
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[23:26] <Prometheus> yeah is does have it's merit hand tracking
[23:27] <LeoBodnar> the lower your RX equipment requirement the more chance you have I think
[23:27] <LeoBodnar> unless you are NASA
[23:27] <Prometheus> But if your payload is worth $2k
[23:27] <LeoBodnar> usually simplest works best
[23:27] <LeoBodnar> unless you are NASA lol
[23:27] <Prometheus> We are running our own little space program yeah
[23:28] <Lunar_Lander> ah btw
[23:28] <Lunar_Lander> the Japanese Type B balloons were superpressure
[23:28] <Lunar_Lander> there is a smithsonian PDF about them
[23:28] <Uggy> I'm playing with habhub genpayload Sentence Wizard, and my latitude / longitude are not automatically detected as decimal coordinates.. not an issue as I can setup manualy, but does it means there is something wrong with coordinates provided ?
[23:28] <Prometheus> Paper super pressure balloons in WWII?
[23:29] <Prometheus> Really?
[23:29] <craag> Uggy: Paste a string here?
[23:29] <Uggy> $$UGGY,1,12:43:19,47.945076667,3.016490000,114,9,2.4,18.4,17.3*4A12
[23:29] <craag> Looks ok
[23:29] <craag> Just do it manually
[23:29] <craag> btw that's a *lot* more accurate than required
[23:29] <craag> I usually only use 4 decimal places
[23:30] <Lunar_Lander> Prometheus, http://www.sil.si.edu/smithsoniancontributions/AnnalsofFlight/pdf_lo/SAOF-0009.pdf
[23:30] <Prometheus> By the way I'd like to invite you guy's to our forum http://teamprometheus.org/forum
[23:30] <Uggy> ok.. was just surprised that sentence_id and time were "detected" and not coordinates
[23:30] <Uggy> thx
[23:30] <Prometheus> It's international
[23:30] <Lunar_Lander> Prometheus, ah I forgot
[23:30] <Prometheus> Just getting started I'd appreacieat some help with UK balloon links
[23:30] <Lunar_Lander> Type B was rubberized silk
[23:31] <Lunar_Lander> a Navy project
[23:31] <Lunar_Lander> while Type A paper was an Army project
[23:31] <craag> Uggy: sentence id is nearly always at the start, time is easy to spot due to ':', lat/lon are just numbers, and not every payload sends them.
[23:31] <Prometheus> That's right I remember now thanks
[23:31] <Uggy> craag: ok..thx for explanation
[23:31] <Prometheus> That was brillaint back in WWII
[23:31] <Lunar_Lander> yeah
[23:31] <craag> np :)
[23:32] <LeoBodnar> what gas did they use?
[23:32] <Lunar_Lander> the book even gives the construction pattern of the Type A balloon
[23:32] <Lunar_Lander> hydrogen
[23:33] <Prometheus> Hydrogen is cheaper and better IMO
[23:33] <Prometheus> Can you fly it in the UK? Hydrogen?
[23:35] <Prometheus> Hey want a tip for sealing polyethaline balloons?
[23:35] <Prometheus> I use a thumb type sandwhich bag sealer to make my zero pressure balloons :)
[23:36] <Prometheus> $3 last a long time make lots of balloons
[23:36] <Lunar_Lander> go to page 49 in the PDF I linked
[23:37] <Lunar_Lander> that shows how the paper balloons were made
[23:37] <Prometheus> Thanks will do
[23:38] <Prometheus> Wow that is a great PDF!
[23:38] <Prometheus> Thanks awesome find
[23:40] <Lunar_Lander> you're welcome :)
[23:40] <Prometheus> Really that was cool thanks
[23:41] <Prometheus> I have not seen that one and I reasearched it quite a bit
[23:41] <Uggy> craag: you use 4 decimal.. ok.. will check how less accurate it is and possibly remove some ;) Thx
[23:41] <Prometheus> that's the best one I've seen
[23:42] <craag> Uggy: 4 is a bit juddery (good enough for me), but 5 should be plenty.
[23:42] <LeoBodnar> what are your results with ZP Prometheus ?
[23:43] <Uggy> craag: ok.. Is 5 dec the most common ?
[23:43] <craag> Errm I think so
[23:43] <Prometheus> Just as good as any Latex for their size stay aloft much longer
[23:44] <Prometheus> Problem with retrieving them however if you do not have a cutdown
[23:44] <LeoBodnar> how much longer? and what altitudes do they reach?
[23:45] <Prometheus> !20kft is our record once they get over the ocean however we loose APRS
[23:45] <LeoBodnar> ZP needs ballast control to get through the night
[23:45] <Uggy> craag: 5th dec seems to be 1.1m.. so you are 100% right.. I have to remove some ;) Thx !
[23:45] <Prometheus> So far we have not attemped that
[23:45] <Prometheus> We use a geofenc cutdown
[23:46] <LeoBodnar> where's SIbot when you need him?
[23:46] <LeoBodnar> 120000 ft
[23:46] <LeoBodnar> bleh
[23:46] <Prometheus> That way we can limit the recovery range
[23:46] <craag> ha LeoBodnar, people got annoyed
[23:46] <craag> So I switched it off
[23:47] <Prometheus> The ardupilot we fly has geofence built in
[23:47] <LeoBodnar> that's 36.5km
[23:47] <LeoBodnar> so it's one day duration for now?
[23:47] <Prometheus> Oh yeah sorry about that I'll try to remember meters not feet
[23:47] <fsphil> craag: nooooooooo!!
[23:48] <LeoBodnar> the end of the era craag :D
[23:48] <fsphil> keep it in, it doesn't have to be automatic :)
[23:48] <daveake> we didn't have it furlong enough
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[23:48] <fsphil> yay!
[23:48] <craag> 120ft
[23:48] <SIbot> In real units: 120 ft = 37 m
[23:48] <daveake> WB :)
[23:48] <fsphil> I was inching towards madness without it
[23:48] <Prometheus> hehe :)
[23:49] <craag> lol
[23:49] <LeoBodnar> back on its feet again
[23:50] <Prometheus> actually it's pretty easy to make your own ZP balloon and way cheaper
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[23:50] <LeoBodnar> I am trying to build superpressure one
[23:50] <Prometheus> Using the thumb style sandwich bag sealer I mentioned
[23:51] <Prometheus> You could use that sealer for a SP balloon too
[23:51] <LeoBodnar> do you have a link?
[23:51] <Prometheus> I have not done a SP balloon yet :)
[23:51] <Prometheus> IFor the sealer?
[23:51] <LeoBodnar> yeah
[23:52] <Prometheus> of a how too link?
[23:52] <Prometheus> I get mine on ebay
[23:52] <Prometheus> hang on a sec
[23:52] <LeoBodnar> to the device you use
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[23:53] <LeoBodnar> somebody gave me a self-made clamp sealing thing they use to build balloons for indoor model flying control
[23:55] <craag> LeoBodnar: What's the solar => lipo charger ic you use?
[23:55] <Prometheus> http://www.ebay.com/itm/DAMOA-Hand-sealer-Mini-sealing-machine-seal-held-heat-bag-impulse-food-/111270600822?pt=Kitchen_Tools_Gadgets&hash=item19e83ea076
[23:55] <LeoBodnar> some ST thing
[23:56] <LeoBodnar> let me check
[23:56] <craag> cheers
[23:56] <LeoBodnar> SVP1040
[23:56] <Prometheus> First one I could find but you can find them for $3 USD on ebay of this same type
[23:57] <LeoBodnar> so you press on it and slide along?
[23:58] <LeoBodnar> SPV1040 craag
[23:58] <Prometheus> Yep!
[23:58] <craag> LeoBodnar: Yep found that :) thanks
[23:58] <Prometheus> Takes a little pratice for the .3mil poly
[23:58] <Prometheus> but you can get the hang of it
[23:59] <LeoBodnar> might be quite difficult for the material I use as it is very thin and creases easily http://leobodnar.com/balloons/files/IMG_1679.jpg
[23:59] <LeoBodnar> what is the weight of the
[23:59] <LeoBodnar> stuff you use in g per sq.m?
[00:00] --- Thu Feb 6 2014