highaltitude.log.20140105

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[00:04] <SpeedEvil> Laurenceb_: Sigh.
[00:05] <SpeedEvil> Laurenceb_: I have a really low threshold for this sort of thing.
[00:06] <Laurenceb_> well they showed it didnt work
[00:07] <gonzo_> they are indeed made from arrow shafts
[00:07] <gonzo_> as they are nice light strong ali tubes
[00:08] <WillTablet> Ah right
[00:08] <gonzo_> the bloke who makes them is an automation nut. He has bespoke machines to do evert operation on the antennas
[00:09] <WillTablet> Might go for an Elk or build a dual bander
[00:09] <gonzo_> they are really nice antennas, but expensive
[00:09] <WillTablet> An elk is probably easier
[00:09] <SpeedEvil> Laurenceb_: yeah.
[00:09] <gonzo_> what are you bgoing to use it for?
[00:09] <SpeedEvil> Laurenceb_: And there aren't eleven million magnet sales vendors spamming little old ladies with arthritus cures?
[00:09] <gonzo_> pft what a waste, they are better used increasing the mpg of your car
[00:10] <gonzo_> or stopping yoru boiler furing up
[00:11] <mfa298> WillTablet: depending on what you're aiming for it's possible to make antennas with a bit of effort.
[00:11] <WillTablet> I'm not sure
[00:12] <WillTablet> I can probably afford one but I probably ought to get a proper rig first
[00:12] <SpeedEvil> Bits of random insulator and conductor in the right shape are pretty much all that's needed.
[00:12] <SpeedEvil> Bamboo, wire and string works just fine.
[00:13] <mfa298> For recieving most things a simple dipole will do a reasonable job.
[00:13] <ike> WillTablet you can make artificial dualband antenna just using paper clip
[00:13] <fsphil> good old bamboo
[00:13] <fsphil> made a few antennas with that
[00:13] <fsphil> and pvc pipe
[00:13] <mfa298> most of my antenna components come from B&Q / Wickes
[00:13] <WillTablet> ike: as opposed to a naturally occurring antenna?
[00:14] <mfa298> PVC pipe makes for a good antenna boom (and also mounting for a vertical)
[00:14] <fsphil> if I was putting something up on the roof I'd buy it
[00:14] <fsphil> I wouldn't trust something I built to last long exposed to the elements
[00:15] <mfa298> for long term outdoors, especially if it's not easily accessible, I'd go for a bought antenna
[00:16] <WillTablet> Will think about it
[00:16] <WillTablet> Need to convince dad to let me put up the club's vertical in the front garden on a mast supported only by guys
[00:17] <WillTablet> And convince him it won't crush the cars
[00:17] <gonzo_> with a little care you can build stuff that is far better than commercial ants
[00:17] <SpeedEvil> Willdude123: I've grown my own antennas.
[00:17] <SpeedEvil> - homegrown bamboo
[00:17] <mfa298> mast with guys (if done well) should be pretty safe.
[00:18] <mfa298> just need to make sure the guys are strong enough and anchored well.
[00:19] <gonzo_> I came up with a nice driven element feed box. Heavy duty wx proof outdoor junction boxes, that take threaded compression glands. not only are they geary for sealing the elements as the enter the box, but hold then rigid and alsy you can seal the coaxs for the feed and the balun loop (if you buse one)
[00:20] <fsphil> also make sure the guys are well fed and take regular breaks
[00:21] <gonzo_> all our club vhf antenna have used jbeam boxes/baluns for years and were patched/repaired, i replaced them with my junction boxes at last nfd. Hell of an improvement mechanically
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[00:21] <WillTablet> It is quite difficult to figure where to start in terms of equipment
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[00:22] <gonzo_> you can always put extra guys to an upstairs window, so that it could only fall so far if the worst happened
[00:22] <mfa298> where to start depends on what you're doing
[00:23] <gonzo_> it's amateur radio. You don't start with a wish list, youy start by asking 'what do I have lying around'. that way you learn
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[00:23] <WillTablet> It'd be nice to go to the amsat colloquium but parentd
[00:23] <WillTablet> *parents
[00:23] <WillTablet> My parents thought hams were dodgy as soon as I mentioned whips
[00:23] <mfa298> with limited funds buy a radio and make antennas
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[00:24] <WillTablet> Might build a G5RV
[00:24] <ike> WillTablet google for Artificially Evolved Antenna
[00:24] <WillTablet> I saw a QSL card with G5RV at ml and s
[00:25] <mfa298> G5RV is reasonable for HF although you can probably make it cheaper than buying them
[00:25] <gonzo_> the amsat crew are a good bunch. Not your usual stinky old hams, droaning on about who that have worked on hf
[00:25] <WillTablet> Mhm
[00:25] <gonzo_> most are proper engineers
[00:25] <mfa298> ideally you need to get it fairly high (>=10m if possible)
[00:26] <WillTablet> Can do, got trees
[00:26] <WillTablet> Well
[00:26] <WillTablet> Not sure how I'd get them on them
[00:26] <WillTablet> I can't visualise 10m
[00:27] <WillTablet> Shame I can't go to conferences and things (like the ukhas one)
[00:27] <gonzo_> could you not put a pole mast close to the house and anchor it to something. Window frame etc? just enough to get it up at roof level
[00:27] <mfa298> I got a G5RV for HF as I needed something fairly quickly, although I've now replaced the feeder section with ladder line and take it into a Z-Match tuner (properly balanced tuner)
[00:27] <WillTablet> My dad doesn't want any external masts
[00:28] <WillTablet> Because it would ruin the view that nobody but us experience
[00:28] <K9JKM> All ya need to do is spend a quarter million to buy your own place and then you can put up any mast you like
[00:29] <WillTablet> Well, not really :-)
[00:30] <gonzo_> I had a sinple 2mtr dipole al a place I lodged at. It was just a domestic band 2 dipole, cut down a bit (B&Q for about a tenner?) on a bit of brrom handle. It was propped on the window sill outside the window and just tied through the fly window with a bit of rope. Just got it above the gutters
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[00:30] <gonzo_> do you have a tv antenna on a pole on the roof?
[00:30] <WillTablet> No
[00:31] <gonzo_> the attenuation of roof tiles is not that bad, so the loft could be your friend
[00:31] <WillTablet> K9JKM: I don't think 13 year olds can buy houses
[00:31] <SpeedEvil> gonzo_: depends on frequency
[00:31] <SpeedEvil> Willdude123: Sure they can, in some places.
[00:31] <WillTablet> Well, I lent my parents money to buy one before
[00:31] <WillTablet> But that doesn't count
[00:31] <K9JKM> Yeah, guess that's true ... but now you have goal to aim for
[00:33] <gonzo_> lower freqs, up to 70cm, and depending on the tiles, shoudl go. And better than nowt
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[00:34] <gonzo_> better to go for something doable and get on air. You can always improve later
[00:34] <gonzo_> I've seen some interesting nests of yagi in lofts
[00:35] <mfa298> that's what I like with cheap home built antennas. They're nice and easy to do new versions and compare. Then rip apart the old one to make it even better.
[00:35] <SpeedEvil> Indeed
[00:35] <gonzo_> I used to have a 250meg helix in the loft for satcom rx.
[00:35] <gonzo_> (also there are no wx/wind issues in the loft)
[00:36] <SpeedEvil> hopefully
[00:36] <WillTablet> Amsat seems remarkably fabulous
[00:37] <WillTablet> But of course I can't go to the colloquium
[00:37] <WillTablet> So I basically spend £18 for a magazine four times a year
[00:37] <K9JKM> Tell your parents AMSAT-UK meets at the University of Surrey
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[00:37] <gonzo_> actually my first AR antenna wasa 7/8ths 2mtr mobile whip on a sweet tin, with bits of wire for a groundplane. And I brought the coax in by poking a hole in the plasterboard, behind the wardrobe
[00:37] <mfa298> and possibly access to some good resources, and helping out a good organisation
[00:38] <WillTablet> K9JKM: do they now?
[00:38] <gonzo_> the AMSAT do has moved to the local hotel
[00:38] <K9JKM> They don't have monthly meetings per se ... but the annual Colloquium is at University of Surrey
[00:39] <gonzo_> but they do trips to the sat fabrication facility on the uni science park
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[00:39] <gonzo_> nope, just the anual gathering
[00:39] <K9JKM> Yeah, some sessions are at a hotel but they also visit the satellite labs, etc. at the university
[00:39] <gonzo_> annual
[00:40] <WillTablet> Hmm
[00:40] <WillTablet> I see the colloquium is at a hotel
[00:40] <K9JKM> AMSAT-UK also participates at activities at Bletchly Park radio museum
[00:40] <WillTablet> I wish I had a relative interested in this
[00:40] <WillTablet> It's not as if I have much non immediate family
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[00:42] <gonzo_> it's a two day event, so there is a night in a hotel. But you can come along to the day events. if you can sort ttransport
[00:42] <WillTablet> It said 25th to 27th
[00:42] <gonzo_> (trains? someone would give you a lift to/from the station i'm sure)
[00:42] <WillTablet> Hmm
[00:42] <WillTablet> Might do
[00:43] <gonzo_> the friday is beginners sessions. Sat/sun are the lectures. And sat night is a booz up. But I didn't say that!
[00:44] <WillTablet> Hmm
[00:44] <WillTablet> Parents wouldn't trust me, would need an adult most likely anyhow
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[00:48] <WillTablet> Ahh the joy of having an atypical hobby
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[00:55] <gonzo_> all hobbies are the same when it's a male dominates thing. All meetings end up with a beer
[00:55] <gonzo_> football or AR, its all the same
[00:56] <Lunar_Lander> yea
[00:56] <gonzo_> Except the conversation is (or can be) a bit more educated
[00:57] <gonzo_> (I exclude the stinky moany old men from ath. They just like to grumble)
[00:57] <WillTablet> But footbal
[00:57] <gonzo_> I ws thinking of people who play it, not just 'suppoort' it
[00:58] <mattbrejza> the quantity of beer probably also varies
[00:58] <gonzo_> I could never understand that. When asked who I support, i ask them what they do yto support. Involved ij the running of the club? fundraising? Nope, it involves buying a shote shirt to wear in the pub
[00:58] <mattbrejza> and how its drunk
[00:59] <gonzo_> yep, and how drunk they are
[00:59] <mfa298> dont know about quantity, but the quality of beer is probably very different.
[01:00] <mattbrejza> mfa298: been around clowns/jesters on a wednesday? :P
[01:01] <mfa298> the closest I've been to clowns/jesters is the Hobbit.
[01:02] <mattbrejza> well geographically that is pretty close
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[01:02] Action: SpeedEvil sighs.
[01:03] <SpeedEvil> https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Laser_Interferometer_Space_Antenna - I want to see results from.
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[01:03] <SpeedEvil> But 2034 is a while off.
[01:03] <mfa298> in ~15 years I can proudly say I've not yet entered Clowns / Jesters :)
[01:04] <mattbrejza> missing out :P
[01:10] <mfa298> the only "club" I enjoyed was the Frog and Frigate.
[01:10] <mfa298> where tables were re-inforced and not used for putting drinks on!
[01:12] <gonzo_> the mind boggles!
[01:14] Action: WillTablet hates being 13, wished he could go to ukhas conf
[01:19] <mfa298> this might give an idea of what the tables were for http://southampton-pubs.co.uk/frogandfrigate/frog7/crd.jpg they were down the left hand side.
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[01:21] <mattbrejza> the google images search for 'jesters southampton' sum it up pretty well
[01:22] <mfa298> this seemed to sum up most of what I've heard of Jesters http://wikimapia.org/7333/Jesters-and-Clowns
[01:22] <mfa298> although misses out the bit about it being voted 2nd worst nightclub in FHM.
[01:22] <WillTablet> What is that?
[01:24] <mfa298> looking at the images: I had heard the stories of needing special Jesters shoes :p
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[01:24] <mattbrejza> while it is wise to wear old shoes, make sure they are still waterproof
[01:25] <WillTablet> Where are we talking of?
[01:26] <mattbrejza> see 01:21
[01:26] <gonzo_> I went to a university reunion last year. The whole SU building had been changed so nothing was recognisable. Except the smell of one original bit of the bar. The beer sticky carpet smell
[01:26] <mattbrejza> carpet? :P
[01:26] <mfa298> WillTablet: Jesters is a nightclub in Southampton.
[01:26] <WillTablet> Ah play
[01:26] <WillTablet> *okay
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[01:27] <WillTablet> Going to Southampton on tuesday
[01:27] <WillTablet> City College I think
[01:28] <mattbrejza> could be soton solent uni (there are two southampton unis)
[01:28] <mattbrejza> theyre based in the centre of town
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[01:28] <WillTablet> I think it is a sixth form
[01:29] <mfa298> I think City College is something different. Solent Uni used to be Southampton Institute (Hence Dimstitute)
[01:29] <mattbrejza> perhaps, tbh never heard of it
[01:29] <mfa298> WillTablet: if you take a radio you might want to try calling/listening on 145.350 as well as 145.500
[01:30] <WillTablet> Hmm
[01:30] <WillTablet> Maybe not
[01:30] <WillTablet> mfa298: its a school stem trip
[01:30] <WillTablet> So naah
[01:30] <WillTablet> It'd be good though
[01:31] <WillTablet> Probably wouldn't let me
[01:31] <WillTablet> And it'd look a bit weird
[01:32] <gonzo_> ls
[01:32] <gonzo_> oops
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[01:35] <WillTablet> gonzo_: everyone has done that once
[01:38] <mfa298> im sure there are worse things to type in to irc
[01:39] <WillTablet> Like the all the boobs I wank typo (I wasn't looking to be fair)
[01:39] <WillTablet> I meant all the books I want
[01:39] <mfa298> or pa55w0rd
[01:40] <WillTablet> Lel
[01:40] <mfa298> related: http://www.bash.org/?244321
[01:40] <WillTablet> I think I'll end up wanting to take my radio every place I go
[01:40] <gonzo_> I prefer the boods I think
[01:40] <gonzo_> boobs
[01:41] <WillTablet> mfa298: I love quote dbs
[01:41] <WillTablet> Awfulnet's one is pretty good
[01:41] <gonzo_> I used to take my 2mtr radio on the bus to college. so I could liste to the pirates on the b'ham repeater on the way
[01:43] <WillTablet> Pirates?
[01:43] <WillTablet> http://awfulnet.org/quotes/?15
[01:43] <mfa298> I used to take my 2m hand held into sixth form (didn't do the RAE early enough to have it at school)
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[01:44] <WillTablet> I'm not quite sure why I'm congratulated for getting my license
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[01:44] <WillTablet> It wasn't hard
[01:44] <gonzo_> people who used to wind up the local hams, music swearing etc
[01:44] <WillTablet> http://awfulnet.org/quotes/?207
[01:44] <WillTablet> Right
[01:45] <gonzo_> some were just hilarious
[01:45] <WillTablet> Ah yes G3PJD mentioned that to me the other day
[01:45] <WillTablet> He was talking about raids
[01:45] <WillTablet> And he went with ofcom on a raid apparently
[01:45] <WillTablet> And they can kick doors down
[01:45] <gonzo_> usually called squeakies, as they talked in squeaky high voices to discuise who they were
[01:46] <WillTablet> Apparently most pirate stations are operated remotely
[01:46] <WillTablet> How did they get rid of them?
[01:46] <gonzo_> I mean the people abusing the AR repeaters, not pirate broadcast
[01:46] <mfa298> im not sure ofcom domany raids,
[01:47] <mfa298> unless you're doing something to seriously endager life
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[01:48] <WillTablet> mfa298: apparently there was a Nigerian station that was completely innocent but it was wiping out Heathrow approach
[01:48] <gonzo_> there was one on the aylesbury repeater ages ago (last time I used a repeater) why was just denying the grumpy old men the repeater. So I called qsk in a squeaky voice and put a call out in the same way. Friend came back squeaky, so the pirate just let us use the repeater as we were having a laugh with him. As soon as the grumpies came on again they got keyed out
[01:49] <WillTablet> They have a field force team
[01:49] <WillTablet> How do they find them?
[01:49] <gonzo_> direction finding usually
[01:50] <mfa298> if you're taking out an airport approach frequency then that would probably count as endangering life
[01:50] <WillTablet> But that only gives you a direction
[01:50] <WillTablet> mfa298: do they not care otherwise?
[01:50] <gonzo_> take two bearings and triangulate
[01:50] <mfa298> do it from a few locations and those directions will give you a position
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[01:51] <mfa298> with several listening posts and some clever reception tricks you could probably get a good estimate of distance from each reception point as well.
[01:51] <gonzo_> or you can just get a bearing and go that way till you are close and home in. As the df contest (and hab) do it
[01:52] <WillTablet> . In 2007, Ofcom carried out over 900 enforcement operations resulting in 37 people being convicted of offences related to illegal broadcasting.
[01:52] <gonzo_> the pirate broadcase stations tend to be on rooftops, or baracaded in disused flats in high rised blocks
[01:52] <WillTablet> It must be awfully exciting taking down pirate radio statiobs
[01:53] <gonzo_> dangerous I recon
[01:53] <gonzo_> unless they are just kids messing about, then it has to be funded somehow. Usually drug mioney
[01:55] <gonzo_> right ttfo for me
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[06:32] <gurgalof> Upu: where do you buy PSA4-5043+ for HABamp?
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[07:54] <DJ3AK_det> $$B-37,1,075049,140105,54.6165,8*7_98,12239,5,-48,3.41,0.58*601D $$B-37,2,075324,140105,54.6198,8.7833,1149545,-50,3.37,0.55*FBE3
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[08:00] <DJ3AK_det> gm all, B-37 is audible here, position updates every 5 minutes (n 54.6198 e 08.7833)
[08:01] <DL1SGP1> Morning nachbar
[08:02] <G8KNN> DJ3AK_det: B-37 is also showing on aprs.fi as M0XER-7
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[08:02] <DJ3AK_det> Hi G8KNN, ty for info. did not find it at aprs.fi due to unknown call hihi
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[08:05] <DL1SGP1> hehe, I better get my station set up again after breakfast before another British Balloon Fleet is sent our way
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[08:18] <Upu> are you not uploading ?
[08:18] <Upu> DJ3AK_det
[08:18] <Upu> I'm importing from APRS
[08:19] <DJ3AK_det> Upu, gm, trying to upload but sig on 434.498 is weak
[08:20] <Upu> ok
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[08:24] <gurgalof> Upu: where do you source the PSA4-5043+ LNA for the HABamp?
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[08:28] <Upu> morning gurgalof, Minicircuits directly but in volumes of 50
[08:28] <Upu> are you after some ?
[08:28] <gurgalof> okay, yes I would like some
[08:28] <Upu> how many ?
[08:29] <Upu> can see you getting partials DJ3AK_det
[08:29] <gurgalof> how much do they cost?
[08:29] <Upu> Hopefully Brian will wake up soon
[08:29] <Upu> I'll have to check at work
[08:30] <Upu> I don't normally sell them on as components
[08:30] <Upu> PM me you mail address and I'll have a look later today or tomorrow
[08:30] <Upu> best go walk the dog now
[08:30] <Upu> bbs
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[08:37] <jcoxon> morning all
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[08:37] <jcoxon> looks like B-37 is coming down over denmark
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[08:54] <OZ1SKY_Brian> morning
[08:54] <jcoxon> hey OZ1SKY_Brian
[08:54] <OZ1SKY_Brian> Got B-37 $$B-37,14,085041,140105,55.2062,9.1152,2355,12,-10,3.94,0.49*346E
[08:55] <OZ1SKY_Brian> But its not updating
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[08:56] <jcoxon> refresh OZ1SKY_Brian the map
[08:56] <jcoxon> it is now for me
[08:56] <OZ1SKY_Brian> yes not it is
[08:56] <OZ1SKY_Brian> oh its going down :-(
[08:57] <jcoxon> know anyone near by who could recover it?
[08:57] <OZ1SKY_Brian> No not really :-(
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[08:59] <jcoxon> no one nearby on aprs either
[08:59] <OZ1SKY_Brian> ups its landing very close to a military airport
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[09:01] <jcoxon> oh yes
[09:01] <jcoxon> eek
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[09:02] <OZ1SKY_Brian> And in the trees by the look of it
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[09:05] <Upu> killed APRS
[09:05] <Upu> morning Brian
[09:06] <OZ1SKY_Brian> Morning Anthony. Not hearing it anymore
[09:06] <Upu> keep uploading, I had the APRS importer running
[09:06] <Upu> ok
[09:06] <Upu> ah ok
[09:06] <OZ1SKY_Brian> so please update the APRS
[09:06] <Upu> 997m at last
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[09:10] <OZ1SKY_Brian> Looking in the logbook, if i should have had any qso with stations in that area on 70cm
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[09:12] <Upu> nothing coming in via APRS or UKHAS now
[09:13] <Upu> might take off again as it warms up
[09:13] <OZ1SKY_Brian> found a call, but cant find any email on him
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[09:15] <jcoxon> ping craag
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[09:27] <DL1SGP1> morning OZ1SKY_Brian and *
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[09:31] <OZ1SKY_Brian> morning felix
[09:32] <DL1SGP1> re-installing equipment in the shack, always a good opportunity to re-route some wires
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[09:34] <OZ1SKY_Brian> Upu im on duty call here to 2200 tonight, so i have a problem to go get it
[09:34] <OZ1SKY_Brian> DL1SGP1 good idea :-)
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[09:55] <vk4hia> Darkside, are you around ?
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[09:59] <OZ1SKY_Brian> Upu found a HAM in the area, waiting for reply on email
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[10:09] Nick change: Geoff-G8DHE_ -> Geoff-G8DHE-M
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[10:17] <Reb-SM3ULC> ah, there has been a B-37
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[10:27] <OZ1SKY_Brian> LeoBodnar ping
[10:28] <DL1SGP1> :)
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[11:05] <jcoxon> anyone have issues if i stop heathkid coming back and forth?
[11:07] <Upu> nope
[11:08] <Upu> just block the nickname so he can join with another nickname
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[11:08] #highaltitude: mode change '+o Upu' by ChanServ!ChanServ@services.
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[11:09] heathkid|hd7 kicked from #highaltitude by Upu: fix your connection pls
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[11:11] <Upu> grr :)
[11:12] #highaltitude: mode change '+b *!108.166.14@*' by Upu!~Upu@2a00:14f0:e028:0:6438:eb38:ff71:f3fd
[11:12] heathkid|hd7_2 kicked from #highaltitude by Upu: fix your connection pls
[11:12] <qyx_> heh
[11:12] <qyx_> you can use heathkid* btw
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[11:49] <Upu> sigh
[11:49] #highaltitude: mode change '+b heathkid*!*@*' by Upu!~Upu@2a00:14f0:e028:0:6438:eb38:ff71:f3fd
[11:49] <Upu> didn't want to have to do that
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[11:51] <YO9ICT> Hi, any news on B-37 ?
[11:51] <Upu> landed
[11:52] <YO9ICT> Yes UPU, i know that. Wonder if the final location is known
[11:53] <Upu> not heard at this time
[11:53] <YO9ICT> Ok, thanks. Any recovery efforts ?
[11:54] <DL1SGP1> too bad :( one day too late, was passing the area yesterday :)
[11:54] <Upu> Brian said someone locally was going to have a listen later
[11:57] <YO9ICT> tnx! keep us posted please
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[12:10] <aware> grrrr
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[12:20] <vk4hia> beingaware, nightowling again i se
[12:21] <vk4hia> beingaware
[12:26] <beingaware> ?
[12:26] <beingaware> oh night
[12:26] <beingaware> yep
[12:27] <beingaware> always up at night haha
[12:27] <eroomde> where are you beingaware ?
[12:27] <eroomde> aus?
[12:27] <vk4hia> Mate, if yr around tomorrow, we are doing some payload testing up at howells knob
[12:28] <vk4hia> tomorrow, should have a good view to the south
[12:28] <vk4hia> 0945 local
[12:30] <vk4hia> eromode, yes
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[14:21] <OZ1SKY_Brian> B-37 Recovered !
[14:21] <craag> :)
[14:21] <Laurenceb_> nice
[14:21] <Laurenceb_> any idea on failure mode?
[14:22] <Laurenceb_> burst?
[14:22] <SpeedEvil> Woo!
[14:22] <OZ1SKY_Brian> yes burst
[14:22] <OZ1SKY_Brian> ruptured on two sides
[14:22] <LeoBodnar> Cool!
[14:23] <wd8mnv> yay!!
[14:24] <LeoBodnar> need to work on seams technique
[14:24] <OZ1SKY_Brian> Recovery team was OZ1HYG and son
[14:24] <Laurenceb_> this was a diy envelope?
[14:24] <LeoBodnar> yeah
[14:24] <DL1SGP1> nice OZ1SKY_Brian :)
[14:25] <Laurenceb_> arg
[14:25] <Laurenceb_> so annying that data is missing
[14:25] <Laurenceb_> you need onboard eeprom
[14:25] <LeoBodnar> I think it floated at about 14.5km overnight and came down with sunset
[14:25] <Laurenceb_> what was the expected float?
[14:25] <Laurenceb_> ah
[14:25] <Laurenceb_> http://x-f.lv/dev/habitat-graphs/payload/2f9a4f2987cc84bac3e4963ec6c15844#g/altitude,battery,temperature_internal,satellites
[14:26] <Laurenceb_> yeah, it must have floated
[14:26] <LeoBodnar> sink rate was quite high at the first APRS datapoint
[14:26] <Laurenceb_> yeah
[14:26] <LeoBodnar> like 23m/s
[14:26] <Laurenceb_> heh
[14:26] <LeoBodnar> -3m/s
[14:26] <Laurenceb_> ah ok
[14:26] <LeoBodnar> and it sort of extrapolates to sunrise time
[14:27] <Laurenceb_> with large envelope you can afford an insulated battery :D
[14:27] <LeoBodnar> yeah I think I am going to do some failure testing first
[14:28] <Laurenceb_> blood pressure cuff time
[14:28] <LeoBodnar> solar gain is vicious mistress (as Upu said)
[14:29] <LeoBodnar> You can keep superpressure as small as nearly zero but the Sun heating increases it a lot
[14:30] <fsphil> oh nice, recovered
[14:30] <LeoBodnar> and with lower ambient temperatures the effect worsens
[14:30] <Laurenceb_> really?
[14:30] <LeoBodnar> You can keep superpressure as small as nearly zero *during the night time
[14:30] Action: SpeedEvil ponders the ideal ass laws.
[14:30] <Laurenceb_> how does ambient temperature effect it?
[14:30] <LeoBodnar> I'd like to study this law
[14:31] <Laurenceb_> heh
[14:31] <SpeedEvil> If the shell is rigid - I guess it's as simple as that.
[14:31] <SpeedEvil> Increase the delta-T to 27C, and get ~9% increase in delta-P
[14:31] <LeoBodnar> not deltaP but internal P
[14:31] <SpeedEvil> err - 9% in internal pressure
[14:32] <LeoBodnar> yep
[14:32] Action: Laurenceb_ signs Leo up to buttman magazine
[14:32] <SpeedEvil> which could be quite a large increase in delta-p indeed
[14:32] <LeoBodnar> delta P increases by the factor of x10
[14:32] <SpeedEvil> Internal pressure measurements would be interesting.
[14:32] <SpeedEvil> Or at the least plots of burst pressure vs temperature.
[14:33] <Geoff-G8DHE> It looks a much more gradual descent on GE http://360.g8dhe.net/HAB_Flights/2014_Flights/B-37_20140104/index.php?ind=1
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[14:34] <LeoBodnar> First APRS point was at 12239m http://aprs.fi/#!call=a%2FM0XER-7&timerange=21600&tail=21600
[14:36] <LeoBodnar> First two data points result in -4.89m/s sink rate
[14:36] <Geoff-G8DHE> That obviously didn't get transffered to snus then, the first point on snus is at 8721m
[14:36] <LeoBodnar> Which is consistent with rupture rather than leak
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[14:39] <Laurenceb_> i wouldnt expect the delta P under solar heating to change significantly wiht ambient temperature
[14:40] <Laurenceb_> i guess as altitude increases it probably going to increase a little
[14:41] <LeoBodnar> I think ambient temperature can vary by about 20C which is probably translating to about 10% difference in dP at the same solar flux
[14:42] <Laurenceb_> ok id believe that
[14:42] <Laurenceb_> it is going to change things a little
[14:43] <LeoBodnar> And the Sun is lower so heating is probably stronger
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[14:44] <LeoBodnar> I am struggling to come up with a clean solution to join gores at the sphere poles
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[14:45] <SpeedEvil> LeoBodnar: I am seriously considering making a plywood icosahedron vacuum chamber.
[14:45] <SpeedEvil> Probably a few too many joins to be nice though for a balloon
[14:45] <LeoBodnar> Hmm
[14:45] <LeoBodnar> keep us posted
[14:46] <Laurenceb_> SpeedEvil: nice
[14:46] <LeoBodnar> it's a reverse problem
[14:46] <SpeedEvil> https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:Icosahedron_flat.svg
[14:46] <Laurenceb_> LeoBodnar: yeah CUSF has the same issue
[14:47] <SpeedEvil> I think you need to seal 10 joints
[14:47] <LeoBodnar> I made 1m dia sphere but put it aside at the last moment when the polar joins didn't join cleanly
[14:47] <SpeedEvil> If you start out with the cutout pattern above
[14:47] <SpeedEvil> (not for the plywood one, obviously
[14:48] <SpeedEvil> But icosahedron is likely overkill for most flexible materials.
[14:48] <LeoBodnar> How deep is the vacuum?
[14:48] <SpeedEvil> LeoBodnar: All the way. (ish)
[14:48] <LeoBodnar> Isn't plywood too porous?
[14:48] <SpeedEvil> Well - of course.
[14:48] <SpeedEvil> Glue on a foil liner.
[14:48] <LeoBodnar> put it inside the balloon :D
[14:49] <LeoBodnar> Vacuum camera is the ideal place for balloon pressure testing
[14:49] <LeoBodnar> You can seal the envelope properly
[14:51] <Laurenceb_> there is always the tetroon
[14:51] <LeoBodnar> Icosahedron still requires 5 gores to come together in a single point
[14:51] <Laurenceb_> dunno how it would work
[14:51] <Laurenceb_> under pressure
[14:51] <LeoBodnar> B-37 was a pillow shaped sausage again
[14:52] <SpeedEvil> LeoBodnar: I do wonder about tennis ball shaped things - or variants of.
[14:52] <Babs> LeoBodnar. I have always done it by making the gores connect to each other in a flat circle at the top of the balloon
[14:52] <Babs> and then just cover with a disc
[14:52] <Babs> albeit that was with tissue paper rather than the plastic that i guess you are probably using
[14:52] <LeoBodnar> I considered baseball pattern
[14:52] <LeoBodnar> SIbot tennis ball in real tearms
[14:53] <Babs> ping Geoff-G8DHE
[14:54] <LeoBodnar> With thin foil it is extremely difficult to work with 3D seams so anything flat is real bonus
[14:54] <LeoBodnar> I have made a sphere from 4 gores
[14:54] <LeoBodnar> it can be kept flat at all times
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[14:55] <LeoBodnar> Tetroon is rubbish in volume/surface ratio
[14:57] <SpeedEvil> icosahedron is pretty close to sphere
[14:57] <LeoBodnar> It's great but 5 butt seams coming together in one point is a challange
[14:58] <LeoBodnar> Maybe a seal patch would help
[14:58] <Laurenceb_> how are you sealing?
[14:58] <LeoBodnar> but it has to be o the inside
[14:58] <SpeedEvil> LeoBodnar: yeah
[14:58] <LeoBodnar> heat sealing with temperature controlled soldering iron
[14:58] <SpeedEvil> LeoBodnar: Well - you can do a truncated icosahedron - to avoid the points
[14:58] <SpeedEvil> - a football
[14:59] <SpeedEvil> Though a truncated polyhedron of lower order may be more sane
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[14:59] <Laurenceb_> a football can be donw with only three sections max joining at any point right?
[14:59] <SpeedEvil> https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:Icosahedron_flat.svg
[15:00] <SpeedEvil> yes
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[15:01] Nick change: KipK -> KipK_away
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[15:01] <Laurenceb_> SpeedEvil: i guess varnish would work for vacuum chamber
[15:02] <SpeedEvil> Laurenceb_: Pretty much.
[15:02] <Laurenceb_> then epoxy or maybe pva the joints
[15:02] <SpeedEvil> Laurenceb_: For higher vacuum stuff - foil
[15:02] <Laurenceb_> how to seal the door?
[15:02] <Laurenceb_> hmm.. polywell
[15:03] <SpeedEvil> I was sort-of wondering about foil tape.
[15:03] <SpeedEvil> though better solutions likely exist.
[15:04] <Laurenceb_> plywood fusion reactor, just to troll ITER
[15:04] <LeoBodnar> Can you seal the door with a strip of Kapton each time?
[15:05] <LeoBodnar> Or even cellotape
[15:05] <LeoBodnar> *s
[15:05] <SpeedEvil> LeoBodnar: basically
[15:06] <SpeedEvil> Hotmelt doesn't have a truly terrible vapour pressure.
[15:08] <Laurenceb_> i'd worry about a "cascading failure" with foil tape
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[15:08] <Laurenceb_> if it once gets some air under it it'd from a bubble
[15:08] <Laurenceb_> maybe paint inside with epoxy and stick on alu foil
[15:08] <Laurenceb_> then vacuum epoxy and foil strips at the joints
[15:08] <SpeedEvil> exactly
[15:09] <Laurenceb_> i guess if the door has a foil return then its hot glued for each use..
[15:09] <Laurenceb_> might work
[15:09] <SpeedEvil> The load is only worst-case 10kg/cm^2 on the sealing
[15:09] <Laurenceb_> not too bad
[15:10] <Laurenceb_> what thickness plywood and overall size enclosure?
[15:10] <Laurenceb_> or chamber
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[15:11] <Laurenceb_> http://iecfusiontech.blogspot.co.uk/2009/06/boys-at-talk-polywell-have-struck.html
[15:13] <SpeedEvil> Laurenceb_: I'm initially going to be trying a sheet of 18mm ply, and making it into the largest number of equilateral triangles I can do.
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[15:15] <SpeedEvil> Some very preliminary maths indicates it should work.
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[15:15] <SpeedEvil> But if not - it will give a better idea as to the forces, as I can easily measure deformation IRL
[15:15] <Laurenceb_> you have to build a plywood polywell :D
[15:15] <SpeedEvil> :)
[15:16] <Laurenceb_> " It is expected that higher ion drive capabilities will be added, and that a “PB11” reaction will be demonstrated. "
[15:16] <Laurenceb_> wow these guys are going for it
[15:18] <SpeedEvil> Laurenceb_: Awesome!
[15:18] <SpeedEvil> I love peanut butter.
[15:18] <Laurenceb_> proton-boron11
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[15:22] <SpeedEvil> yes, I know. :)
[15:26] <LeoBodnar> Isn't dodecahedron more suitable for vacuum chamber? From layman's perspective at least
[15:27] <LeoBodnar> Three panels at each joint max
[15:27] <ike> can't you make it from big water pipe?
[15:27] <LeoBodnar> And seemingly lesser total length of seams
[15:28] <LeoBodnar> Or disused submarine
[15:29] <navrac_home> Hi LeoBodnar - I've just been reading back and I see that you've hit the same problems I did with DIY superpressure - Sadly I never came up with a good answer to sealing the gores at the ends other than a disc and a lot of swearing
[15:29] <LeoBodnar> Five plywood panels coming together at one pint sounds like DIY disaster
[15:30] <LeoBodnar> Oh, did it float in the end?
[15:30] <LeoBodnar> *during the day?
[15:31] <navrac_home> Mixed degrees of success with mine - 1 died quite quickly and obviously burst, two floated during the day but obviously started leaking after 5-6 hours
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[15:33] <LeoBodnar> Ah, so maybe leak saved them from bursting?
[15:33] <navrac_home> I just put it down to seals failing - a mixture of soldering iron with thick bit and a domestic iron aren't really hitec sealing methods
[15:33] <LeoBodnar> Yeah, I tried both and concur
[15:33] <navrac_home> yes - the good two went straight to the float point then stayed there then slowly started coming down till I lost contact
[15:35] <LeoBodnar> What size/altitude did they get to? Are there any details left of these flights? Any info still remaining on habitat for these callsigns?
[15:35] <Laurenceb_> typed diy vacuum chamber into google...
[15:35] <Laurenceb_> http://i1.ytimg.com/vi/7lrAcJ67b78/maxresdefault.jpg
[15:36] <Laurenceb_> vacuum chamber fail
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[15:36] <DL1SGP1> omg that sucks
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[15:36] <DL1SGP1> :)
[15:36] Nick change: DL1SGP1 -> DL1SGP
[15:37] <navrac_home> I didnt do them on habitat - they were 'private' tests on a low wind day where I could track them without problem.. From memory the smaller 0.8m diameter did about 7,500m and the 1m one did about 9000m - quite heavy (80gm) payloads
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[15:38] <navrac_home> I will boot up my old machine tomorrow morning and see if I can get the data off it from those flights
[15:38] <LeoBodnar> AH, OK, thanks for the details
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[15:38] <DL1SGP> navrac_home: sounds like interesting tests and good data retrieved :)
[15:39] <navrac_home> I did a tetroon as well, at least that was easy to make!
[15:40] <Laurenceb_> i wonder how small you could make a longwave ir balloon
[15:40] <LeoBodnar> I have plugged the details into a calc sheet and came up with 0.8 dia/80g payload/5g free lift -> 7370m float
[15:40] <Laurenceb_> i need to learn to use Elmer multiphysics
[15:40] <navrac_home> I had a tissue hot air balloon kit which had a nice cut out pattern for the 1m one which helped - sealing one end with a disc of material was quite easy. ~But sealing the other end becomes a nightmare
[15:41] <Laurenceb_> http://ballonsolaire.pagesperso-orange.fr/en-historique3.htm
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[15:41] <Laurenceb_> that scaled down
[15:41] <LeoBodnar> Daytime superpressure is x3 the night one with 15C supertemperature
[15:41] <Laurenceb_> simple scaling might suggest 3m diameter
[15:42] <navrac_home> I used a horrible chart from some 1960's book I found on the net and blew up to A3 and stuck it on my wall
[15:42] <LeoBodnar> However 1m with 80g payload / 5g free lift suggests float at 11200m
[15:43] <LeoBodnar> http://leobodnar.com/balloons/files/IMG_1679.jpg
[15:43] <navrac_home> I seem to remember using one of steves calculators on the wiki and was about 20% out from what I expected.
[15:44] <navrac_home> lol - thats a familiar sight - except I did it on the dining room table and left burn marks on it - much to my wifes displeasure
[15:44] <LeoBodnar> I have made up parabolic gore profile but it should really be cosine
[15:45] <navrac_home> I scaled the 0.8m one from an online hot air balloon design program I found and then scaled it down. As I said the 1m one came from a tissue balloon kit
[15:45] <navrac_home> I was just happy to be able to seal them.
[15:46] <navrac_home> Funnily enough when I tested them with a homebrew manometer they werent far off the burst pressure I measured on one of the qualtex
[15:47] <navrac_home> I suspect part of the problem was the force put on by the payload on the neck/filling tube
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[15:48] <LeoBodnar> Qualatex bursts at about 4.5kPa
[15:48] <navrac_home> ah for info free lift was 2g - I've just weighed the bit of plastic I used when filling them
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[15:49] <LeoBodnar> Your 0.8m dia baloon would have had suprepressures of 1.4 / 3.9 kPa (night/day
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[15:49] <navrac_home> really 4.5KPa? for the qualatex - my test sample split at about half that
[15:50] <LeoBodnar> But the envelope stress would be beyond ultimate tensile stress for the plastic
[15:50] <LeoBodnar> Yeah
[15:50] <LeoBodnar> This is from test flight but I think somebody did ground tests too
[15:51] <LeoBodnar> Steve did http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hr6x3r8phvE
[15:51] <LeoBodnar> Pressure is pretty irrelevant when geometry changes, it is stress that matters
[15:53] <Laurenceb_> someone needs to get one of those blood pressure meters hacked into a pressure tester
[15:53] <SpeedEvil> LeoBodnar: On vacuum. The panels are simply glued.
[15:53] <LeoBodnar> I am going to
[15:54] <SpeedEvil> LeoBodnar: Plus - accurate triangles are easier (for me at least) to cut than accurate pentagons.
[15:54] <LeoBodnar> Ah, just filling the gaps with hot glue works?
[15:54] <Laurenceb_> i have a pneumatic controller that would work
[15:54] <Laurenceb_> but its only 1L/minute and needs to talk to labview over thernet
[15:54] <Laurenceb_> dont laugh
[15:54] <SpeedEvil> LeoBodnar: Plus - the increased flat area means greatly increased bending moments on the ply
[15:55] <Laurenceb_> of course i could just add a simple usb interface
[15:55] <Laurenceb_> SpeedEvil: how do you chamfer the edges? jigsaw or table saw ?
[15:55] <SpeedEvil> Laurenceb_: Table saw.
[15:55] <Laurenceb_> cool
[15:55] <SpeedEvil> Laurenceb_: Or possibly router.
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[15:56] <SpeedEvil> Laurenceb_: Probably table saw though
[15:56] <Laurenceb_> yeah router on plywood is tricky
[15:56] <SpeedEvil> Router in principle could be nice, as it could use bearing guided cutters
[15:56] <LeoBodnar> Order 5 kits and sell 4 :D
[15:56] <SpeedEvil> Make one accurate shape, and then copy it precisely.
[15:57] <Laurenceb_> yeah, i think it can be done with the right head
[15:57] <Laurenceb_> im no expect
[15:57] <Laurenceb_> *expert
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[15:57] <SpeedEvil> Laurenceb_: Or a tilted table/router.
[15:58] <LeoBodnar> There are some router bits with 45º cut
[15:58] <SpeedEvil> LeoBodnar: yes - it's not 45.
[15:59] <LeoBodnar> http://www.datapowertools.co.uk/Products/Router_Cutters_Chamfering_Bits/CBTT916B1/2?gclid=CLqqwL6z57sCFW3JtAoddGQA8w
[15:59] <LeoBodnar> Ah, bummer. Intuition fail
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[16:04] <SpeedEvil> I think it's 20.7 degrees
[16:05] <Laurenceb_> you can pad with epoxy to a bit of depth
[16:06] <Laurenceb_> but ply is hard to cut with a router
[16:07] <navrac_home> I wonder if the best way to seel the polar ends is to put a thin disc of rubber with glue on it inside the balloon then a slightly curved bowl shaped piece of thinnish plastic on the outside with glue then squeeze them together
[16:07] <SpeedEvil> I was meaning cut perhaps 2-3mm oversize on the tablesaw, and then using a template - cut exactly to size with the router
[16:08] <navrac_home> time to walk the dog
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[16:12] <Laurenceb_> or..lasercut
[16:14] <LeoBodnar> It would have been easier to work if the balloon was stretched over a sphere
[16:14] <YO9ICT> Do you guys have any idea how to hot seal black polyethilene foil ?
[16:15] <LeoBodnar> For solar balloon or superpressure?
[16:15] <YO9ICT> Solar balloon
[16:16] <SpeedEvil> YO9ICT: bag sealer type thingies can work well
[16:16] <SpeedEvil> Laurenceb_: for ply - well - that would require a rather larger laser than I have.
[16:18] <YO9ICT> SpeedEvil only hot seal type
[16:18] <YO9ICT> I'm tired of using tape
[16:18] <SpeedEvil> YO9ICT: Tape can be OK - if you have an appropriate jig.
[16:18] <SpeedEvil> But not freehand.
[16:24] <Laurenceb_> it is feasible to use tape for sealing balloons
[16:24] <Laurenceb_> .. i think
[16:24] <Laurenceb_> dunno about creep
[16:27] <Laurenceb_> but in theory the silicone transfer adhesives should be perfect
[16:27] <Laurenceb_> i have some but its a pita to buy
[16:28] <Laurenceb_> i managed to get samples from 3M
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[16:32] <Laurenceb_> im guessing itd be easier to assemble complex joints
[16:32] <Laurenceb_> and its probably possible to remove it from mylar
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[16:34] <LeoBodnar> I think if the seal is hot-sealed then the seam properties are matched to the material itself
[16:34] <LeoBodnar> I thought about using Kapton for testing
[16:34] <LeoBodnar> Well made seam is extremely strong
[16:35] <Laurenceb_> ok
[16:35] <Laurenceb_> i was just thinking for "resealable" seals
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[16:36] <jeffewil> Hi, is Dave Akerman there? I have some questions about making a HAB with a Raspberry pi.....?
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[16:36] <jcoxon> evening all
[16:36] <LeoBodnar> evening James
[16:37] <navrac_home> Last thing I was experimenting with before I had to stop 'playing' with balloons was to create a small lightweight pressure relief valve - I got as far as creating a tube of mylar - like the next of a qualtex and putting two bits of short plastic around it held on by a elastic band
[16:38] <navrac_home> when the pressure gets high it forced the plastic apart and let air escape - seemed to work quite repeatredly but never got round to temperature testing as I couldnt get the pump hose thru the freezer door very well
[16:38] <jcoxon> if anyone could launch a latex floater now you'd get an awesome flight path
[16:38] <jcoxon> http://predict.habhub.org/#!/uuid=7b0f098ad585b6cfbbf39f1ba82318d194883da3
[16:38] <LeoBodnar> So it's a sort of zero-pressure setup?
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[16:39] <navrac_home> superpressure with an overpressure release valve
[16:39] <jcoxon> ping craag
[16:39] <SpeedEvil> jeffewil: many people can in princple answer. What questions.
[16:40] <LeoBodnar> So on a larger scale... Does ballooning causes the Sun to cool down faster?
[16:40] <navrac_home> (last post should have been 'like the neck of a qualtex'
[16:40] <LeoBodnar> Yeah I have guessed.
[16:41] <LeoBodnar> But after the sunset it will become zero-pressured I guess
[16:43] <jeffewil> well.... I guess its quite a generic question.. I;m trying to select a radio and GPS for integration into tracker / camera combo. The NTX2B seems to be a favourite for the radio, but what about the GPS unit?
[16:43] <navrac_home> depends what level you set the valve at really - as you say there is a big difference between day and night, i was just trying to take off any excess pressure above the envelope strength at peak times
[16:44] <navrac_home> so say 2.5KPa day and 1KPa night
[16:45] <jeffewil> What should I make my decision based on?
[16:46] <LeoBodnar> Well if the same amount of gas can be below burst pressure and still provide positive buoyancy in the night then you can just as well launch after sunset with minimal free lift
[16:46] <navrac_home> jeffewil - look for one that doesnt cut out at 18000m
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[16:46] <LeoBodnar> The problem is that you either get one or the other
[16:46] <jcoxon> jeffewil, ublox is the best to go with
[16:47] <Babs> go to habsupplies jeffewil, they have all of the chips and breakout boards there
[16:47] <jeffewil> which ublox one? there are a few recommended there. are some better than others?
[16:48] <navrac_home> true - it just seemed to me that I could never get an accurate enough fill - and I've lost several balloons due to too low lift either thanks to trees or getting knackered by rain
[16:48] <navrac_home> max6 is pretty well tested to death.
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[16:48] Nick change: Geoff-G8DHE_ -> Geoff-G8DHE-M
[16:50] <navrac_home> I quite like the 'space anchor' technique where you have a secondary balloon with a parachute silk limiting enclosure to give you a good float
[16:51] <Upu> hey jeffewil there aren't many GPS modules that work above 18km. The Adafruit Ultimate tops out at 27km
[16:51] <Upu> so also recommending ublox
[16:52] <Upu> I am biased though as I sell them http://ava.upuaut.net/store/
[16:52] <LeoBodnar> With latex innards?
[16:52] <Upu> but read this : http://ukhas.org.uk/guides:gps_modules
[16:53] <jeffewil> great I'll have a read
[16:53] <jeffewil> thanks!
[16:53] <craag> jcoxon: pong
[16:53] <Upu> and when you come to buy the NTX2B come speak to me on here
[16:53] <Upu> don't buy it anywhere else unless you like urinating money
[16:54] <jcoxon> craag, i've started #ukhasnet
[16:54] <craag> jcoxon: I saw that, already in it :)
[16:54] <navrac_home> LeoBodnar - yes
[16:55] <jeffewil> I'm thinking of buying one today.....
[16:55] <navrac_home> upu will remember the link to a website about the space anchor - I have to ask him everytime I want to look it up
[16:55] <Upu> private message jeffewil
[16:57] <LeoBodnar> we have tried netted latex last week but too much lift
[16:57] <navrac_home> Glad someone got around to trying it.
[16:58] <navrac_home> I'll stick with trying to write an RFM69HCW library
[16:59] <Laurenceb_> LeoBodnar: i'd worry about envelope degrading
[16:59] <Laurenceb_> even if it worked
[16:59] <LeoBodnar> possibly
[17:00] <navrac_home> but if you're floating lower there is less force on the envelope so it may last long enough to do a one lap of the world
[17:01] <LeoBodnar> http://imgur.com/hlLGCzX
[17:02] <navrac_home> 17:01 sun is over the yard arm - glass of wine time
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[17:16] <OZ1SKY_Brian> B-37 landing site https://maps.google.dk/maps?q=55.208937,9.260776&ie=UTF-8&hq=&hnear=0x464b55c772cc33a3:0xeb03fb753f0cbad9,55.208937,9.260776&gl=dk&ei=8WTJUp2uNIHw4gSmyoDIDQ&ved=0CCwQ8gEwAA
[17:17] <Upu> located ?
[17:17] malgar (~malgar@adsl-ull-104-3.44-151.net24.it) joined #highaltitude.
[17:18] <OZ1SKY_Brian> yes its now home with OZ1HYG
[17:18] <Upu> awesome
[17:18] <Upu> any pics ?
[17:18] <OZ1SKY_Brian> yes i sent some to leo
[17:19] <daveake> ah cool
[17:19] <daveake> always good when a flight gets recovered
[17:19] <Upu> super
[17:19] <Upu> Leo flightsisn't great at recovery though
[17:19] <Upu> nice English Anthony
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[17:26] <OZ1SKY_Brian> OZ1HYG sent 1 hour from home to recovery, so pretty easy
[17:26] <OZ1SKY_Brian> spent
[17:27] <Laurenceb_> anyone here any good at troubleshooting wifi on linux?
[17:27] <SpeedEvil> ?
[17:28] <Laurenceb_> wifi just disconnected
[17:28] <Laurenceb_> now im seeing no networks at all
[17:29] <SpeedEvil> Have you pressed the 'disable wifi' button/switch - and/or has your USB stick fallen out
[17:30] <Laurenceb_> heh
[17:30] <Laurenceb_> nope
[17:30] <Laurenceb_> im wondering if its interference, ive seen this before
[17:30] <Laurenceb_> need a scanner
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[17:31] <Laurenceb_> unless mini pci card fell out
[17:31] <Laurenceb_> i should be seeing _something_
[17:32] <SpeedEvil> https://twitter.com/MissLollipopMFC/status/416770275955326976 (nsfw)
[17:32] <Zuph> I had that happen in a laptop once. Antenna wire wasn't properly seated in the channel, and it got yanked out when I opened it.
[17:32] Vrooom (~Vrooom@188-223-37-74.zone14.bethere.co.uk) joined #highaltitude.
[17:32] <Vrooom> hi..
[17:32] <Laurenceb_> hmm
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[17:32] <Upu> afternoon
[17:32] <SpeedEvil> Laurenceb_: What sort of card is it. Is it still showing up - and have you tried removing the module and reinstalling
[17:32] <Laurenceb_> maybe some sort of hardware issue
[17:32] <Laurenceb_> no i havent tried anything yet
[17:33] <Laurenceb_> its some sort of mini pci card iirc
[17:33] <Laurenceb_> came pre installed on motherboard
[17:33] <SpeedEvil> ah
[17:33] <Laurenceb_> its a thinkpad
[17:33] <SpeedEvil> you do know where the disable wifi switch is?
[17:33] <SpeedEvil> because there is an actual hw one on thinkpads
[17:34] <Laurenceb_> oh
[17:34] <Laurenceb_> ill try it
[17:34] <Vrooom> Good evening, lads. has anyone send the stuff up in Themosphere line?
[17:34] <SpeedEvil> Vrooom: Impossible.
[17:35] <Vrooom> :(
[17:35] <Laurenceb_> seems to be Fn + F5
[17:35] <SpeedEvil> Vrooom: It's way, way too rarefied to do balloons in
[17:35] <Laurenceb_> but no difference there
[17:35] <SpeedEvil> Laurenceb_: there is an actual physical switch on some models too.
[17:35] <Laurenceb_> not on here
[17:35] <Vrooom> why its impossible? apart from balloon issue.
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[17:36] <SpeedEvil> Vrooom: the density of the air is too small to support any reasonable balloon
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[17:36] <SpeedEvil> Rockets - sure
[17:37] <Zuph> XCOR aerospace (among others) are eyeing this part of the atmosphere for their suborbital launches.
[17:37] <Vrooom> has anyone done that?
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[17:38] <SpeedEvil> Vrooom: the problem for balloons is that the typical balloon max altitude is of the order of 45km.
[17:38] <Vrooom> i may sound like a walter mitty types but i would love put stuff in space.
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[17:39] <SpeedEvil> Vrooom: This is about 300 times the density at 85km
[17:39] <SpeedEvil> There is no real good reason to call 85km 'space'
[17:39] <SpeedEvil> I personally would call it 'space' when the mean free path of a molecule of atmosphere exceeds half an orbit.
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[17:39] <SpeedEvil> But that is quite arbitrary.
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[17:43] <SpeedEvil> At 0.3Pa, for example, thermal conduction by the air of large objects is similar to at sea level.
[17:43] <SpeedEvil> (convection is absent)
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[17:44] <LeoBodnar> B-37 recovery http://leobodnar.com/balloons/B-37/
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[17:45] <SpeedEvil> :)
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[18:17] <OH7HJ-1> Oh it was found! Shall it refly soon..?
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[18:19] <Reb-SM3ULC> OH7HJ-1: would be nice to have a balloon i our neighbourhoods again soon.. :)
[18:21] <OH7HJ-1> I have been excitedly waiting for one, too!
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[18:23] <wd8mnv> needs a solar cell refurb to fly
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[18:23] <OH7HJ-1> My refill station is ready for sevice any time...! Fly here, get free hydrogen to continue... :)
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[18:24] <OH7HJ-1> NP, not much sun here this time year anyway
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[18:26] Nick change: Geoff-G8DHE_ -> Geoff-G8DHE-M
[18:27] <OH7HJ-1> I wll furnish it with a flashlight to boost the solar cells. Plus a larger balloon of course to lift it.
[18:27] <SpeedEvil> Ok - time to lay off for a bit. I just went to wolfram alpha to compute the circumference of a pentagon of sides s
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[18:28] <jeffewil> hi
[18:28] <OH7HJ-1> There is a long way to go to Asia, Pacific and North America, not a job for small balloons...
[18:29] <OH7HJ-1> They will suae you for spionge in Pentagon ;)
[18:29] <jeffewil> Reading the guide on UkHAS it recommends several Rx / Tx sets, notably the Yaesu FT-790R, form the reviewsI've read it seems like a good option, but what is the general option on the handheld Rx scanners - they are much cheaper?
[18:30] <OH7HJ-1> Ouch, a-letter jumping
[18:30] <jeffewil> Also any thoughts on the Yaseu FT7900 (New model of the 790 I guess? )
[18:31] <SpeedEvil> OH7HJ-1: they generally do not support SSB mode
[18:32] <SpeedEvil> In general, most any recent radio will do - if it supports SSB on 70cm
[18:33] <OH7HJ-1> Who do not support SSB? Pentagon?
[18:34] <SpeedEvil> It will say SSB very obviously on the spec if it does
[18:37] <OH7HJ-1> With balloons, the Rx seems not the problem. I have several of them and all work OK.
[18:37] <jeffewil> the handhelds are fine then?
[18:37] <OH7HJ-1> The real problem is to have a balloon come within their range... ;)
[18:38] <mfa298> the handheld radios I've used aren't as sensitive as the larger radios but they work
[18:38] <daveake> jeffewil The 7900 is FM only so no use for tracking our balloons
[18:39] <mfa298> (I've only experience of the MVT-7100 and TH-F7E compared to something like the FT-817 and the 817 is much better)
[18:40] <OH7HJ-1> The reception range and performance is determined by the aerial. Rx quality is less important.
[18:40] <daveake> I've tried 3 scanners and the 817 is significantly better than any of them
[18:40] <jeffewil> I see - so I need a 70cm capable of SSB...
[18:40] <daveake> yes
[18:41] <OH7HJ-1> Actually, many handhelds are very sensitive, However they have inferior band filters.
[18:41] <jeffewil> FT-817 is pretty expensive
[18:41] <OH7HJ-1> So they are sensitive to interference, too.
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[18:41] <daveake> it is
[18:41] <jeffewil> are those handhelds any good?
[18:42] <mfa298> with a decent antenna the handheld scanners will do a reasonable job.
[18:42] <OH7HJ-1> The trick to get handheld perform is to get the aerial high enough,
[18:42] <jeffewil> daveake - have been reading your blog over christmas after receiving an RPi as a gift... currently planning my own build
[18:42] <daveake> Yes the aerial is the main factor
[18:43] <jeffewil> ok so - handheld and a good antenna is the best bargain option...
[18:43] <daveake> Unless you're trying to track balloons a long way away, a handheld will do fine
[18:43] <daveake> and if you are, get a funcuble pro plus
[18:43] <OH7HJ-1> High aerial screens out most local interference.
[18:43] <daveake> antenna is a big factor
[18:43] <daveake> Get it high and use decent cable
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[18:44] <jeffewil> on top of my house.... any recco... also for in a chase car, would a external antenna with mag mount be a good idea?
[18:44] <mfa298> mag mount is the way to go in a car
[18:44] <daveake> yes that's what almost everyone uses
[18:45] <daveake> CPC have one for about £12 + vat
[18:45] <OH7HJ-1> If you have no possibility to get a good high aerial, and live in an urban envirinment with lots of local interference,
[18:45] <mfa298> the antennas that come with the various radios generally won't work that well unless you're really close.
[18:45] <jeffewil> I have one from an old HF project... hopefully it uses the same connectors
[18:45] <OH7HJ-1> then a good quality expensive rig is the better option.
[18:46] <mfa298> If it's a magmount for HF (CB?) it won't be suitable for 70cms. They're generally designed for a particular range of frequencies (or two)
[18:46] <daveake> could cut it :)
[18:47] <mfa298> and/or removing any loading coils
[18:47] <jeffewil> The mag mount is designed for specific frequencies? as well as the antenna? (I had many different antennas for HF)
[18:47] <daveake> yup
[18:47] <daveake> The mount isn't the aerial is
[18:47] <OH7HJ-1> On 70 cm band it is even more important what you have below the aerial, than the aerial itself.
[18:47] <mfa298> the mount part should be fairly standard but most I've bought are magmount + antenna
[18:48] <mfa298> If it's a decent magmount you could make a 1/4 wave 70cms whip for it (I'm not sure you'de find any to buy)
[18:48] <OH7HJ-1> That is how high above the interfering and noisy environment you get it.
[18:48] <daveake> These work well and are cheap http://cpc.farnell.com/moonraker/12-028/dual-band-micro-antenna/dp/AP01509
[18:48] <jeffewil> I had to buy separate mount and antenna. (needed to try lots of bands to reach a boat in the caribbean.... long story)
[18:51] <jeffewil> OH7HJ-1 - what to you mean the rig or a good ground plane?
[18:53] <OH7HJ-1> On VHF and 70cm, every aerial has its own RF ground. Only on low HF, the real 'earth ground'comes important.
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[18:54] <OH7HJ-1> By rig I mean tranceiver or receiver.
[18:56] <OH7HJ-1> When going to VHF and UHF, better forget about grounding, and start thinking about how to get the aerial high above the ground... :)
[18:56] <jeffewil> Thanks - I didn't know that!
[18:57] <jeffewil> that's good as grounding it was a pain in the **s
[18:58] <OH7HJ-1> A dipole, for example has its own RF ground built in.
[18:58] <OH7HJ-1> That is its other half.
[18:59] <OH7HJ-1> Think it as a quarter wave GP, with its radials replaced with another 1/4 wave element.
[19:00] <OH7HJ-1> Together tay make a 1/2 wave dipole. No need for further grounding.
[19:00] <jeffewil> I see. Need to get our my theory books again :-)
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[19:03] <OH7HJ-1> Repeatedly when measuring RF spectrums I see that the distance to man made electric interference is critical factor for hearing with your Rx.
[19:03] <jeffewil> Thanks for the help!
[19:03] <jeffewil> I'll let you know how I get on
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[19:04] <OH7HJ-1> NP, tnx for interest!
[19:13] <Willdude123> craag: I see we now have 2m
[19:13] <craag> Willdude123: yep
[19:14] <craag> We're only able to run 2x dongles at a time at the moment
[19:14] <craag> due to some bottleneck
[19:14] <craag> and the 23cm preamp has filled up water, so that's off :)
[19:15] <Willdude123> craag: awesome
[19:16] <craag> did you see my tweet about the funcube telemetry earlier?
[19:17] <craag> ping mfa298
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[19:19] <mfa298> pong
[19:19] <craag> evening
[19:20] <craag> did you say you were interested in the ukhasnet thing?
[19:20] <mfa298> sounds like it could be interesting.
[19:21] <mfa298> although I might need to work out how to get the rfm22, 328 and bits onto the sreipboard - or possibly get something a bit more useful than the stripboard I've got
[19:21] <craag> well I only have one 868mhz rfm22 it seems..
[19:21] <mfa298> I shall have to check my box of bits but I think I got one to play with, although I think it was the one with a silly pitch header (not 0.1")
[19:22] <qyx_> me probably too \o/
[19:22] <qyx_> interested
[19:22] <qyx_> ..in the net thing
[19:22] <craag> well we have #ukhasnet channel
[19:22] <qyx_> O_o
[19:22] <craag> although im the only one there atm :P
[19:22] <qyx_> ok
[19:23] <craag> James and I have fixed the repeating loop bug
[19:23] <craag> so it now all works as planned
[19:23] <mfa298> and now there are two in there.
[19:23] <craag> mfa298: Just noticed the SMT version is EOL on farnell..
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[19:24] <craag> I'll have to get the headers
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[19:40] #highaltitude: mode change '+bbbb heathkid*!*@* *!*950b6832@*.149.11.104.50 *!*akawaka@*.lightspeed.irvnca.sbcglobal.net *!*@app15.chatmosphere.org' by rothfuss.freenode.net
[19:40] #highaltitude: mode change '+q *!*@94-195-174-233.zone9.bethere.co.uk' by rothfuss.freenode.net
[19:40] Topic changed on #highaltitude by !rothfuss.freenode.net: welcome to #highaltitude - discuss anything to do with high altitude projects! please read the wiki - http://wiki.ukhas.org.uk
[19:43] Upu (~UpuWork@2a02:b80:12:1:9441:fc8e:ccc5:3c1b) joined #highaltitude.
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[19:53] Nick change: Gadget-Mac_ -> Gadget-Mac
[19:53] Possible future nick collision: Gadget-Mac
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[19:56] Possible future nick collision: zeusbot
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[20:03] darkstar-20011 (~matt@dsl-217-155-229-6.zen.co.uk) joined #highaltitude.
[20:03] Nick change: MichaelC1 -> MichaelC
[20:04] Willdude123 (~tim@unaffiliated/willdude123) got lost in the net-split.
[20:04] Upu_M0UPU (~Upu@2a00:14f0:e028:0:ac98:b92a:39cc:91b) got lost in the net-split.
[20:04] crash_18974 (~crash_@2605:8900:1000:1001:8:0:e:2) got lost in the net-split.
[20:04] UpuWork (~UpuWork@2a02:b80:12:1:9441:fc8e:ccc5:3c1b) got lost in the net-split.
[20:04] aetaric (~aetaric@2606:db00:0:7::92cb:247d) got lost in the net-split.
[20:04] adamgreig (adam@druid.randomskk.net) got lost in the net-split.
[20:04] LWK (~LWK@pdpc/supporter/student/lwk) got lost in the net-split.
[20:04] bfirsh (sid1308@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-gcybjbejwvmsilqj) got lost in the net-split.
[20:04] KT5TK (~thomas@2601:e:1e00:da6:c18f:3b5:d07c:59e1) got lost in the net-split.
[20:04] KyleYankan (KyleYankan@hive76/member/KyleYankan) got lost in the net-split.
[20:04] mclane_ (~quassel@p5498C81B.dip0.t-ipconnect.de) joined #highaltitude.
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[20:11] -:#highaltitude- [freenode-info] if you're at a conference and other people are having trouble connecting, please mention it to staff: http://freenode.net/faq.shtml#gettinghelp
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[20:18] Possible future nick collision: zeusbot
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[20:21] Nick change: Kodar -> 21WAB3TT3
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[20:26] Upu (~UpuWork@2a02:b80:12:1:9441:fc8e:ccc5:3c1b) left irc: Ping timeout: 264 seconds
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[20:26] Nick change: davo_ -> davo
[20:26] YO9ICT_ (8d550061@gateway/web/freenode/ip.141.85.0.97) joined #highaltitude.
[20:26] <YO9ICT_> test
[20:27] <nigelvh> test2
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[20:28] Babs (5eaf0925@gateway/web/freenode/ip.94.175.9.37) left irc: Ping timeout: 272 seconds
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[20:29] Joel_re_ (~jr@103.31.146.110) got lost in the net-split.
[20:29] mclane_ (~quassel@p5498C81B.dip0.t-ipconnect.de) got lost in the net-split.
[20:29] darkstar-20011 (~matt@dsl-217-155-229-6.zen.co.uk) got lost in the net-split.
[20:29] gonzo__ (~gonzo@78.150.14.133) got lost in the net-split.
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[20:32] Steve_G0TDJ_HNY (d49f4aee@gateway/web/freenode/ip.212.159.74.238) left irc: Ping timeout: 272 seconds
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[20:36] SpeedEvil (~quassel@tor/regular/SpeedEvil) left irc: Remote host closed the connection
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[20:36] XtremD (~XtremD@unaffiliated/xtremd) left irc: Remote host closed the connection
[20:36] nv1d_ (~chris@4hv.org) left irc: Write error: Connection reset by peer
[20:36] netsoundWW (netsound@netsound-work.tcw.co) left irc: Write error: Connection reset by peer
[20:36] BrainDamage (~BrainDama@dynamic-adsl-94-36-245-138.clienti.tiscali.it) got netsplit.
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[20:38] BrainDamage (~BrainDama@dynamic-adsl-94-36-245-138.clienti.tiscali.it) returned to #highaltitude.
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[20:38] cm13g09 (~chrism@panther.cmtechserv.co.uk) returned to #highaltitude.
[20:38] Elijah_ (~elijah@71-209-231-179.phnx.qwest.net) returned to #highaltitude.
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[20:40] <YO9ICT> test
[20:40] gb73dx (gb73d@79-68-246-234.dynamic.dsl.as9105.com) left irc: Quit: Look out Dave she's gonna blow !
[20:40] <Lunar_LanderB> hello
[20:40] <YO9ICT> hi LL
[20:40] <YO9ICT> having some connection issues here, seems resolved
[20:40] <YO9ICT> how are you?
[20:41] VikingIV (~VikingIV@c-24-15-172-72.hsd1.il.comcast.net) returned to #highaltitude.
[20:43] Zuph (~Zuph@74-132-141-44.dhcp.insightbb.com) joined #highaltitude.
[20:43] <nigelvh> Freenode's being DOS'd, lots of people are having issues.
[20:44] <YO9ICT> fair enough :-)
[20:45] <Lunar_LanderB> I am good thanks
[20:46] hoeq_ (hoeg@kone.hoeg.net) got lost in the net-split.
[20:46] <Lunar_LanderB> yeah I was kicked out twice earlier also
[20:46] <nigelvh> So far I've managed to stay connected, but now that I say it, it's going to kick me.
[20:47] <Lunar_LanderB> yea
[20:47] <Lunar_LanderB> :(
[20:49] Nick change: arko_- -> arko
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[20:52] Nick change: LWK_ -> LWK
[20:53] <Geoff-G8DHE> Ping babs
[20:53] <Geoff-G8DHE> http://360.g8dhe.net/default.php?1026
[20:54] <Geoff-G8DHE> first cut, need to look for some more images!
[20:54] <OZ1SKY_Brian> this channel should be renamed #netsplit
[20:55] <OZ1SKY_Brian> very nice Geoff
[20:57] <OZ1SKY_Brian> wait, is that where B-37 landed?
[20:58] Nick change: BitEvil -> SpeedEvil
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[20:59] <OZ1SKY_Brian> no its not, airport just looked like it
[20:59] <Geoff-G8DHE> No they are an image from babs flight last year BABSHAB, where he had a DSLR mounted on a gimbal
[20:59] <OZ1SKY_Brian> ah ok very nice
[21:00] <Geoff-G8DHE> he is FTP me the images to have a play making Pano's and dragging a bit more dynamic range out of the RAW files than you can see in the JPG's!
[21:01] <Geoff-G8DHE> the above is just the first attempt, the gimbal actually slows the whole process down nicely but it takes about 2 minutes or more
[21:01] <Geoff-G8DHE> to make a complete circle so the vapour trails and clouds have all moved ;-)
[21:01] <LeoBodnar> cool panorama
[21:02] <Geoff-G8DHE> I've got some 500+ images 40Gbytes to wade thru!
[21:04] <Geoff-G8DHE> did I say 500+ already up to 900 and only 21GBytes .....
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[21:49] <not_heath> anyone around?
[21:50] <craag> yep
[21:50] <not_heath> sorry about last night/this morning... that was my android tablet that was "having issues". Can "heathkid" please get unbanned???
[21:50] <craag> Ah you need to talk to upu
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[21:51] <not_heath> ok
[21:52] <SpeedEvil> <jcoxon> anyone have issues if i stop heathkid coming back and forth?
[21:52] <SpeedEvil> <Upu> nope
[21:52] <SpeedEvil> <Upu> just block the nickname so he can join with another nickname
[21:52] <not_heath> right
[21:52] <not_heath> I saw that
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[21:54] <not_heath> jcoxon: if you're around can you please unban heathkid?
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[21:56] Nick change: not_heath -> heathkid
[21:58] <fsphil> you probably can't send messages with that nick
[22:00] <mfa298> I'm slightly surprised you can change nick to it. although it sort of makes sense
[22:00] <cm13g09> evening mfa298
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[22:00] <mfa298> evening cm13g09
[22:00] #highaltitude: mode change '+o jcoxon' by ChanServ!ChanServ@services.
[22:01] <jcoxon> hold on, let me find hte command
[22:01] <mfa298> I think: /mode -b heathkid*!*@*
[22:01] <cm13g09> mode -b :P
[22:01] <cm13g09> mfa298 has got it ;)
[22:01] <cm13g09> jcoxon: ^^
[22:02] #highaltitude: mode change '-b heathkid*!*@*' by jcoxon!~jcoxon@host86-163-166-232.range86-163.btcentralplus.com
[22:02] #highaltitude: mode change '-o jcoxon' by ChanServ!ChanServ@services.
[22:02] <cm13g09> there ya go heathkid
[22:02] <heathkid> thanks!
[22:02] <heathkid> can anyone see me now?
[22:02] <cm13g09> a little help from an operator, plus the nearby IRC commands manual that is mfa298
[22:03] <cm13g09> yep
[22:03] <cm13g09> I can see ya
[22:03] <heathkid> :)
[22:03] <heathkid> thanks
[22:03] <mfa298> I'd just looked up the ban list so the hard bit was just a copy/paste
[22:03] <cm13g09> hehe
[22:04] <heathkid> I don't know what was going on with my tablet early this morning
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[22:23] <MLow> so i got my gps module from upu
[22:23] <MLow> trying to figure out how to put the battery holder on and what type of battery it uses
[22:23] Upu (~Upu@2a00:14f0:e028:0:ac98:b92a:39cc:91b) joined #highaltitude.
[22:23] <MLow> and speak of the devil
[22:24] <MLow> Upu: o/
[22:25] <Upu> I wuz split
[22:25] <Upu> it was me and Adam
[22:25] <Upu> so I decided to reconnect
[22:26] <MLow> got a parcel yesterday
[22:26] <Upu> anything nice /
[22:26] <Upu> ?
[22:27] <MLow> why yes
[22:29] <MLow> https://www.dropbox.com/s/598jd3353anxk9i/2014-01-05%2016.27.00.jpg
[22:29] <Lunar_LanderB> evening Anthony
[22:29] <Upu> evening lunar
[22:29] <Upu> I see bits :)
[22:29] <Upu> and my trade mark boxes
[22:29] <Lunar_LanderB> nice MLow !
[22:30] <Lunar_LanderB> ah nice an NTX2B
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[22:33] <MLow> i do have a question though
[22:34] <MLow> https://www.dropbox.com/s/f1da52ke4emcya9/2014-01-05%2016.33.57.jpg how do
[22:35] <Upu> ok
[22:35] <Upu> its not easy once the header is installed
[22:35] <Upu> but tin one pad
[22:35] <Upu> then heat and slide the clip on with tweezers
[22:35] <Upu> (you need three hands)
[22:35] <Upu> then solder the other pad down
[22:35] <Upu> but you don't need the battery anyway
[22:36] <MLow> wont it lock faster?
[22:36] <Upu> not from cold
[22:36] <Upu> only from warm start
[22:36] <Upu> and they aren't exactly slow anyway
[22:37] <MLow> im just thinking to maximize the utility of it
[22:37] <MLow> at the very least I wont to use the fancy battery holder you sent me
[22:38] <MLow> do i tin the center pad first?
[22:40] <MLow> so it has a better surface?
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[22:43] <Lunar_LanderB> hello to NL Hoogvlieger
[22:46] <chrisstubbs> cuddykid cm13g09 http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=S3a7KFQr0es hexacopter funtimes :)
[22:46] <Hoogvlieger> Hi Lunar
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[22:47] <cuddykid> ha very good chrisstubbs
[22:47] <cuddykid> I was waiting for you to fly it through the arch!
[22:47] <cuddykid> and then you did
[22:47] <cuddykid> :)
[22:47] <chrisstubbs> ;)
[22:48] <chrisstubbs> Gimbal is getting closer to working properly now, not so much twitching
[22:48] <chrisstubbs> not quite level and a bit of vibration to deal with now
[22:49] <chrisstubbs> sorry about the music.. it just seemed fitting :P
[22:49] <MLow> https://www.dropbox.com/s/dypz7ltdj76pjvo/2014-01-05%2016.48.07.jpg not the prettiest i've soldered but looks solid
[22:49] <MLow> oddly enough, my camera detected the battery holder as a face...
[22:49] <chrisstubbs> Aha, looks like it should do fine MLow
[22:50] <MLow> im still amused that my phone thought the battery holder was a face..
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[22:51] <MLow> my final question is kinda important i guess, the wording on the back is clear
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[22:51] <MLow> but if i want to use a battery i cut the jumper, but if i switch back to straight power.... do I re-jump?
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[22:52] <Upu> yes MLow
[22:52] <Upu> though you can run it with the vbatt floating
[22:53] <Upu> but data sheet says GND
[22:53] <MLow> got it
[22:53] <Upu> http://ava.upuaut.net/store/wiki/doku.php?id=frontpage:productfaqs#i_want_to_use_a_battery_how_do_i_break_the_link
[22:53] <MLow> this guy is awesome though
[22:54] <MLow> locks in a few seconds indoors
[23:02] <MLow> https://www.dropbox.com/s/p8fbw18gx23ufah/2014-01-05%2017.01.04.jpg ok i dont think i mauled your board too much :D
[23:04] <Upu> looks good
[23:04] <MLow> wow that looks pretty good for a camera phone
[23:04] <Upu> right bed time for me night all
[23:04] <MLow> good night and thank you
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[23:05] <WillTablet> Gn Upu
[23:05] <MLow> alright so question about the ntx2b
[23:05] <MLow> for anyone
[23:05] <MLow> my module says one frequency, but seems to transmit on another
[23:06] <Lunar_LanderB> night Upu
[23:07] <DL1SGP> Good Morning Continental Europe, good night Upu
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[23:08] <MLow> lol ok nvm, seems like as my rtl-sdr heats up the frequency shifts more and more and more
[23:09] <cm13g09> MLow: that's normal
[23:09] <MLow> im watching it and the warble gets higher and higher pitch lol
[23:09] <cm13g09> yeah lol
[23:09] <cm13g09> chrisstubbs and I experienced similar the other week
[23:09] <cm13g09> very pronounced when outside
[23:09] <cm13g09> and it's maybe 2C
[23:09] <cm13g09> and you turn it on
[23:10] <cm13g09> and it warms up
[23:10] <MLow> i thought i had adjusted the shift
[23:11] <OZ1SKY_Brian> GN All
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[23:14] <MLow> if my NTX2B is 434.225, does this look right? http://screencloud.net/v/olvg
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[23:21] <Geoff-G8DHE> Yup, remember the Freq its set for is with 0 volts on the tuning line, rather than two +ve voltages
[23:21] <MLow> im trying to set the ppm correction
[23:21] <MLow> for my rtl-sdr
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[23:22] <Geoff-G8DHE> find a known station as high in frequency as possible like a repeater if you trust them
[23:22] <MLow> hm
[23:23] <Geoff-G8DHE> otherwise a broadcast station but its difficult with the wider bandwidth and sub-carriers
[23:23] <MLow> i have a couple HT ham radios
[23:23] <Geoff-G8DHE> Yup should be reasonable remember you won't get the dongle smack on when adjusting by 1ppm anyway
[23:23] <MLow> could i just transmit on them?
[23:24] <MLow> hm i see
[23:26] <MLow> ok well i set my HT, and tuned my sdr to that freq
[23:26] <MLow> seems to line up..
[23:27] <MLow> pretty close
[23:27] <MLow> would it be incorrect of me to use shift to correct small difference?
[23:29] <Geoff-G8DHE> which shift is that ?
[23:30] <MLow> the tick box
[23:30] <Geoff-G8DHE> that will also be a constant shift rather than a %of the freq. so it will only apply to one band at a time
[23:30] <MLow> for instance i did this
[23:30] <MLow> http://screencloud.net/v/iyX8
[23:32] <Geoff-G8DHE> well if that's all the difference you have then I wouldn't worry drift in the dongle, the Tx nd everthing else will soon make the odd 100Hz negligible!
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[23:52] <MLow> lol ok Geoff-G8DHE
[23:54] <MLow> another thing i've noticed is that the shift between tones doesnt seem to be really 425hz
[23:56] <mfa298> the shift will depend on the resistors you're using if you're using the guide from the wiki
[23:56] <MLow> using what i found on upu's blong
[23:56] <MLow> no resistors
[23:57] <mfa298> I'm assuming that's the pwm method then
[23:57] <MLow> yes
[23:57] <mfa298> I think it also assumes the default deviation on the ntx2b which might be slightly different.
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[23:59] <MLow> http://screencloud.net/v/jhz5
[00:00] --- Mon Jan 6 2014