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[00:00] <OZ1SKY_Brian> RocketBoy lost you payload
[00:00] <G8APZ> MLow yes same balloon
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[00:00] <RocketBoy> hey ho - thanks for tracking OZ1SKY_Brian
[00:01] <solarballoonman> Cloudy is still moving fast.. 295kph / 183mph
[00:01] <RocketBoy> wonder where it will end up
[00:01] <Reb-SM3ULC> OZ1SKY_Brian: i would like a predicted dot on the line where the balloon should be respectedly from last datapoint
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[00:02] <PD0RKC> Anyone knows if next weekend balloons launched?
[00:02] <G8APZ> Funny that Missy didn't burst!
[00:02] <Lunar_Lander> RocketBoy, yea, I remember that there was a thread in the mailing list about how so many flights become "suspend something in front of the HAB camera"
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[00:03] <OZ1SKY_Brian> Reb-SM3ULC dont have any idea, but im sure it didnt make landfall, its was way to slow moving
[00:03] <solarballoonman> D**** tough sex dolls they make in the US. :P
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[00:04] <DL7AD> i can hear it beeping but i cant see it on the waterfall
[00:05] <Laurenceb_> LeoBodnar: i wonder if this would help even out current draw
[00:05] <Laurenceb_> http://www.digikey.com/product-detail/en/PHV-5R4V505-R/283-4189-ND/3878063
[00:05] <Laurenceb_> with lipo stuff
[00:05] <G8APZ> OZ1SKY_Brian You need to recruit more trackers in OZ!
[00:06] <DL7AD> $$B-36,575,000417,131229,53.9475,13.546,23940,6:-G0,=!LV.JCB;$(B-36,5<6,000523,131229,53.9481,13.5828,23988,6,-71,1.19*0FB5
[00:06] <OZ1SKY_Brian> G8APZ i tryed, but havent had much luck
[00:06] <LeoBodnar> Got them planned Laurenceb_
[00:06] <PE2G> DL7AD: Well done!
[00:06] <LeoBodnar> They complement each other very well
[00:06] <Laurenceb_> you are always one step ahead
[00:06] <G8APZ> SP3MCY received B-36
[00:06] <LeoBodnar> limping ahead
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[00:07] <Laurenceb_> it looks ok on aprs
[00:07] <bbjunkie> wow.. Ukraine is a massive size of a country
[00:07] <bbjunkie> taking CLOUDY ages to cross it
[00:07] <fsphil> ah it's resetting again
[00:08] <LeoBodnar> Shame that 2.7V supercaps are a bit too low and 5.4v is a bit too much for LiPos
[00:08] <Laurenceb_> i dont see it
[00:08] <DL7AD> got it!
[00:08] <Laurenceb_> i wonder how well it runs at low temperatures
[00:08] <Laurenceb_> (supercap)
[00:08] <bbjunkie> see there's a Russian station tracking it now
[00:09] <G8APZ> RN3ZF tracking CLOUDY
[00:09] <LeoBodnar> I did test in the freezer and they are holding up to their spec
[00:09] Action: Laurenceb_ refreshes spacenear
[00:09] <Laurenceb_> i see no CLOUDY
[00:09] <LeoBodnar> maybe doc has expired?
[00:09] <Reb-SM3ULC> bbjunkie: check out Kazakhstan.. where seba went by...
[00:09] <G8APZ> LeoBodnar resistive splitter on the 5.4v one?
[00:09] <LeoBodnar> maybe it's an ex-doc?
[00:10] <PE2G> DL7AD: One B-36 decode counts for 10 :)
[00:10] <DL7AD> :P
[00:10] <G8APZ> Bonus points for DL7AD
[00:10] <LeoBodnar> I think 5.4v is just very well matched pair of 2.7v made by Cooper Bussmann themselves
[00:11] <LeoBodnar> well done DL7AD
[00:11] <bbjunkie> yeah Reb-SM3ULC - makes the mind boggle
[00:11] <DL7AD> damn... next cycle way broken right at the end
[00:11] <DL7AD> *was
[00:12] <G8APZ> DL7AD that is annoying! I see some packets that get corrupted in only one character! I'm sure some errors can be corrected... I'd even have a go at writing some software to do it!
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[00:13] <Laurenceb_> i see no CLOUDY updates
[00:13] <DL7AD> G8APZ: are you working on dl-fldigi?
[00:13] <G8APZ> DL7AD no....
[00:13] <solarballoonman> G8APZ: there is almost 200feet between payloads B34 & B36?
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[00:14] <G8APZ> solarballoonman you would need to ask Leo!
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[00:14] <bbjunkie> take the lib from fldigi and make a copy/paste gui to enter the frame manually, should be pretty straight forward?
[00:14] <DL7AD> but contestia is pretty impressive. how does it work?
[00:15] <G8APZ> DL7AD I agree ... very robust compared with RTTY
[00:15] <fsphil> dl-fldigi sources are available :)
[00:15] <Laurenceb_> is someone actually receiving CLOUDY?!
[00:15] <Laurenceb_> i dont see it
[00:15] <bbjunkie> last was at 23.43
[00:15] <solarballoonman> Ok, that right Leo?
[00:16] <DL7AD> i'll try shortwave soon
[00:16] <DL7AD> for SP9UOB
[00:16] <PE2G> 515 km for B-34: http://s27.postimg.org/3x2ju7rib/Screen1283.jpg
[00:16] <G8APZ> fsphil what is fl-digi written in?
[00:16] <LeoBodnar> solarballoonman: it's just a time difference between updates
[00:17] <fsphil> G8APZ: C++
[00:17] <LeoBodnar> they are 2m away from each other
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[00:17] <solarballoonman> ok.
[00:17] <Laurenceb_> what the heck
[00:17] <Laurenceb_> spacenear is being weird
[00:17] <G8APZ> fsphil OK another languague I may have to master!!
[00:17] <fsphil> it's not too bad, although fldigi is not terribly well written
[00:18] <bbjunkie> Laurenceb - seems the position info wasnt received at the same time as the last SSDV packets
[00:18] <G8APZ> fsphil the usual thing... developed on the hoof!!
[00:18] <LeoBodnar> Write it in !C
[00:18] <solarballoonman> Laurenceb: true, shows no change in location or speed, since my speed post
[00:18] <Laurenceb_> odd
[00:18] <DL7AD> fsphil: well and thats my problem. :P
[00:18] <fsphil> LeoBodnar: x86_64 assembly
[00:18] K9ILU (46e3a706@gateway/web/freenode/ip. joined #highaltitude.
[00:18] <Laurenceb_> LeoBodnar: you need C+=
[00:19] <fsphil> c*=2
[00:19] <LeoBodnar> variable command length meh
[00:20] <G8APZ> fsphil it needs something like WSJT uses... takes partial decodes and averages several to get the picturea
[00:20] <K9ILU> any information on todays kc9vhe-11 balloon flight ?
[00:20] <LeoBodnar> good night all, see you tomorrow and thanks for tracking!
[00:20] <DL7AD> LeoBodnar: bye
[00:21] <solarballoonman> PD5JD: any luck in finding snow yet?
[00:21] <G8APZ> B-36 soon to cross Polish border
[00:21] <fsphil> there's some ice outside
[00:21] <G8APZ> GN LeoBodnar
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[00:23] <G8APZ> A very interesting day. Thanks to all involved with making and losing balloons and payloads
[00:23] <fsphil> it definitly was
[00:24] <G8APZ> fsphil are you Phil Crump?
[00:25] <fsphil> nope, that's craag
[00:25] <G8APZ> OK!
[00:25] <fsphil> yea it's confusing sometimes :)
[00:25] <G8APZ> I notice on craag's tracking page that valid uploads don't always appear
[00:26] <DL7AD> omg.... im tired
[00:26] <G8APZ> I was tracking B-34 for some time and it kept reverting to a single tracker
[00:26] <fsphil> it can depend on when the page fetches the data
[00:26] <fsphil> when it queries the server it's possible only one or a couple of stations have uploaded the string
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[00:27] <G8APZ> DL7AD you need some ale and a plate of hacksen and wurst and kartopfel
[00:27] <fsphil> I really fancy a bowl of cocopops right now
[00:27] <G8APZ> fsphil yuk!!
[00:27] <fsphil> mmm
[00:27] <DL7AD> G8APZ: i just need a currywurst
[00:28] <DL7AD> :D
[00:28] <G8APZ> fsphil maybe some blue stilton and a few crispbreads!!
[00:28] <fsphil> I'm not brave enough to eat cheese that isn't yellow
[00:29] <G8APZ> DL7AD you like curry? I've had curry in Spain, France and Holland, but it is not like real curry!!
[00:29] <x-f> CLOUDY is still working/rebooting - there are picture fragments on the SSDV page
[00:29] <fsphil> poor thing
[00:30] <DL7AD> G8APZ: it's Berlin-like curry :P
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[00:30] <fsphil> I know to put a big capacitor on my next flight with a cutdown
[00:30] <G8APZ> DL7AD I went to a Spanish "Indian" restaurant and ordered the curried pork.... what I got was a prk chop , a portion of pudding rice, and some mild bland curry sauce on top!
[00:31] <fsphil> my local indian restaurant has a curry that could burn you just by looking at it
[00:31] <G8APZ> fsphil can you activate a relay to pull a pin out and let go?
[00:32] <fsphil> I prefer the melt-the-cord method. less mechanical
[00:32] <x-f> is anybody here receiving ANU? what's the current frequency?
[00:32] <G8APZ> fsphil humdinger of a ring stinger!
[00:32] <fsphil> me and mechanical things don't get on well
[00:32] <DL7AD> G8APZ: hm yes its propably customized to the spanish taste
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[00:34] <G8APZ> DL7AD I got caught by "Local taste" in Andorra C3 ...I bought 200 JPS cigarettes.... and they were foul!!
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[00:34] <fsphil> vile things
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[00:34] <DL7AD> G8APZ: smoking is a mistake ^^
[00:35] <DL7AD> in general :P
[00:35] <G8APZ> DL7AD I wrote to the John Player company in UK... and they said they were manufactured by Tabacalera SA to the local taste!!
[00:35] <DL7AD> :D
[00:35] <solarballoonman> x-f ANU still going acording to SN
[00:35] <DL7AD> rofl
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[00:36] <x-f> solarballoonman, yeah, it should be appearing above my horizon anytime soon
[00:36] <G8APZ> DL7AD Then they wrote again to say they were made under licence by another company in Belgium.... and sent me free 200 UK cigarettes!!
[00:36] <solarballoonman> Who's the tracker near Rushden? @ G8APZ nice.
[00:36] <DL7AD> lol... have to turn my antenna the amstrong way
[00:37] <G8APZ> DL7AD I paid say £4 for the cigs in C3 and UK price was say £16
[00:38] <DL7AD> wow...
[00:38] <OZ1SKY_Brian> x-f i have ANU at 434.341 now
[00:39] <x-f> thanks, Brian
[00:39] <G8APZ> DL7AD I really miss the German food .... went to Weinheim several times and Bad Durcheim Wurstmarkt.... pork and dumplings ... knoedel?
[00:39] <DL7AD> you'll would drive to poland if you want cigarrettes
[00:39] <DL7AD> knödel? yum yum
[00:40] <G8APZ> DL7AD perhaps... but the ferry and petrol and hotels... I would need a huge van!!
[00:40] <OZ1SKY_Brian> i allways get a currywurst, when i go shopping in DL :-)
[00:40] <DL7AD> G8APZ: to transport all the food?
[00:41] <OZ1SKY_Brian> I OE i need a wienersnitzel :-)
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[00:41] <G8APZ> DL7AD I was talking to my UK friends in English when we were looking at the menu... the very well endowed serving lady with low cut top heard me say " That is a nice pair of dumplings"
[00:41] <solarballoonman> rofl
[00:42] <OZ1SKY_Brian> lol
[00:42] <G8APZ> DL7AD she said nein, these are knoedle
[00:43] <DL7AD> :D
[00:43] Action: WillTablet is planning a dxpedition to the end of his garden
[00:43] <Broliv> night all
[00:43] <G8APZ> same in Austria... I said "Proost" when raising my glass.... the serving wench mit der big boobies said "Nei deese are Broost, say Proost"
[00:44] Broliv (chris.athe@host-92-5-96-136.as43234.net) left irc:
[00:45] <x-f> OZ1SKY_Brian, B-34/36 stopped transmitting?
[00:45] <OZ1SKY_Brian> x-f ill chack
[00:45] <OZ1SKY_Brian> check
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[00:45] <DL7AD> are B-34 and B-36 connected to each other?
[00:45] <solarballoonman> Getting ready for bed. No longer checking on spacenear.
[00:46] iain_g4sgx (~yahalimu@ left irc: Quit: HydraIRC -> http://www.hydrairc.com <- Chicks dig it
[00:46] <x-f> DL7AD, they both are under the same balloon
[00:46] <OZ1SKY_Brian> x-f still there
[00:46] <DL7AD> x-f ah okay
[00:47] <OZ1SKY_Brian> 434.491 for B-34
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[00:47] <x-f> ok, just no updates for 19 minutes
[00:47] <OZ1SKY_Brian> x-f i cant track two at a time right now
[00:47] <OZ1SKY_Brian> was on ANU before
[00:48] <DL7AD> OZ1SKY_Brian: cant hear B-36 anymore
[00:48] <OZ1SKY_Brian> DL7AD i never heard it here
[00:48] <DL7AD> its very weak. about 20...30db less
[00:48] Nick change: heathkid|2 -> heathkid
[00:48] <x-f> OZ1SKY_Brian, i'm not blaming you :) i was just wondering, because there are many Polish trackers too
[00:49] <G8APZ> B-36 is at JO74CL on APRS
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[00:49] <OZ1SKY_Brian> x-f its just the beebs atm
[00:49] <OZ1SKY_Brian> on B-34
[00:50] <x-f> i see, maybe it got too cold and went to sleep then
[00:50] <G8APZ> OZ1SKY_Brian I think at night it sends every 5 minutes
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[00:51] <OZ1SKY_Brian> maybe, only beebs
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[00:52] <DL7AD> OZ1SKY_Brian: yes its beeping only
[00:52] <solarballoonman> BBC running B-34 now? lol. OZ1SKY_Brian: 'the beeb', is a nick for the BBC.
[00:52] <DL7AD> and shifting
[00:52] Nick change: Adran -> S[_]
[00:53] <OZ1SKY_Brian> cbeebies, yeah i know :-)
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[00:54] Nick change: g_ -> Guest70713
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[00:54] <G8APZ> B-36 is doing 78 MPH alt 77575 ft
[00:54] <SpeedEvil> :)
[00:55] <G8APZ> Temp: -73.900
[00:55] <OZ1SKY_Brian> just had a startup sek. on B-34 and then back to bib
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[00:55] <OZ1SKY_Brian> something is wrong
[00:55] <G8APZ> OZ1SKY_Brian When I was in France as F1VJQ it was you who got me hooked on this balloon tracking!!
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[00:56] <OZ1SKY_Brian> G8APZ ahh yes that right :-)
[00:56] <solarballoonman> G8APZ: fastest speed I worked out was 223 mph. Forgoten what the balloon was, wasn't cloudy, though that got to ~210 mph.
[00:57] <DL7AD> solarballoonman: SP9UOB even reached 320 kph
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[00:57] <G8APZ> OZ1SKY_Brian It is addictive!! Best packets I received were at > 700km with a high alt balloon .... but I had not mastered FL digi... I selected RTTY instead of USB!
[00:58] <G8APZ> solarballoonman that's Feckin fast!
[00:58] <OZ1SKY_Brian> yes i remeber we talked about it, on 6meters right?
[00:59] <G8APZ> OZ1SKY_Brian could be... I had 6m in France... and 144Mhz MS, tropo and EME!
[00:59] <OZ1SKY_Brian> B-34 data
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[01:00] <solarballoonman> Opps got it wrong:( Think it was cloudy at about 205 mph. SP9OUB =198mph.
[01:00] <G8APZ> OZ1SKY_Brian Caught a spectacular opening on 2m and 70cm.... to LA / OZ/ and SM! SSB
[01:01] <G8APZ> OZ1SKY_Brian from IN95 that is a fair distance!!
[01:01] <OZ1SKY_Brian> looking in the log, we had a qso back in 2006, that was before all of this HAB. So i think its been on on4kst chat then.
[01:01] <kb0ylq> did b34 and b36 get launched from the same location, same time same everything?
[01:02] <G8APZ> OZ1SKY_Brian yes probably.... My paper log takes a long time to find a QSO!!!
[01:02] <x-f> kb0ylq, including same balloon :)
[01:02] <kb0ylq> lol, too funny
[01:02] <G8APZ> kb0ylq yes... same balloon
[01:02] <kb0ylq> i was starting to get too curious why the telemetery was almost identical
[01:03] <G8APZ> kb0ylq otherwise some collisions!
[01:04] <kb0ylq> baloon strings twisted together hihi
[01:04] <OZ1SKY_Brian> G8APZ yeah on 2/70cm it would have been a good dx, maybe also odx on 70cm here
[01:05] <G8APZ> OZ1SKY_Brian are you QRV on microwave bands? I go out with M1CRO/p all bands up to 24GHz (3W and GPS lock)
[01:05] <OZ1SKY_Brian> G8APZ no only up to 70cm here
[01:06] <DL7AD> cant find B-36 anymore
[01:06] <solarballoonman> what about B-34?
[01:06] <DL7AD> is LeoBodnar already to bed?
[01:07] <wd8mnv> B-36 may be on aprs?
[01:07] <G8APZ> OZ1SKY_Brian I used to write the microwave activity column in Scatterpoint.... and I did some articles on skewed paths on microwave, particularly regarding Laeso Island
[01:07] <DL7AD> wd8mnv: yes it is
[01:07] <G8APZ> DL7AD yes he isn't up to the night watch!
[01:07] <solarballoonman> DL7AD: he's still shown on here
[01:08] <solarballoonman> must have forgotten to quit
[01:08] <G8APZ> B-36 is on APRS > http://aprs.fi/#!mt=roadmap&z=9&call=a%2FM0XER-6&timerange=3600&tail=3600
[01:09] <G8APZ> solarballoonman It isn't a sacking offence!
[01:09] <OZ1SKY_Brian> Laeso? how come?
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[01:10] <solarballoonman> true, I go off a forum I use and stay signed in sometimes.
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[01:11] <solarballoonman> tend to quit on chatrooms though.
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[01:12] <x-f> many here stay logged in 24/7, irc client lives on a server
[01:13] <OZ1SKY_Brian> G8APZ Laeso? how come?
[01:14] <solarballoonman> I know, just don't like people thinking I'm on, when I'm not. Not so bad on a forum, but on chat someone might want to PC you..
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[01:17] <WillTablet> solarballoonman: you could set your nickname to say that you're away
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[01:18] <solarballoonman> forgot about that, d'oh!
[01:19] Nick change: S[_] -> Adran
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[01:21] <OZ1SKY_Brian> time to sign off here, gn everyone.
[01:21] <x-f> finally found it, weak signal from ANU
[01:21] <x-f> good night
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[01:21] <solarballoonman> ok, still flying?
[01:22] <x-f> yep
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[01:22] <x-f> partial decodes, but it is improving
[01:22] <solarballoonman> good, wonder how long it'll go?
[01:23] <x-f> that's a good question
[01:23] <x-f> it may or may not be low enough to survive the sunrise
[01:24] <x-f> unfortunatelly it will be out of listeners by then
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[01:25] <solarballoonman> I know during WW2 the Japaneese sent balloons over the pacific, in the jet stream. Not sure if they are still the record holders for distance,
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[01:25] <solarballoonman> by unmanned balloons
[01:26] <x-f> yeah, i read about them, they were paper balloons, iirc
[01:26] <solarballoonman> yes, treated paper, so they could hold gas.
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[01:29] <kb0ylq> what is your thoughts on cloudy? you think it will start transmitting again when it is on the way down and the batteries warm up?
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[01:30] <solarballoonman> x-f: Have a look at this.. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fire_balloon
[01:34] <x-f> green from ANU! :)
[01:34] <G8APZ> x-f where are you?
[01:34] <x-f> in Latvia
[01:35] <G8APZ> town?
[01:35] <x-f> Sigulda
[01:35] <kb0ylq> what is you all's thoughts on cloudy? you think it will start transmitting again when it is on the way down and the batteries warm up?
[01:36] <x-f> 531 km, 0.5deg
[01:36] <x-f> solarballoonman, impressive sizes and payload weights
[01:36] <x-f> kb0ylq, maybe, but it is more likely that its battery will be completely flat by then
[01:37] <G8APZ> x-f try this....> http://www.beaconspot.eu/locator.php and get yor QRA locator!
[01:38] <x-f> G8APZ, KO27KD
[01:38] <G8APZ> x-f add that to your nick!!
[01:38] <x-f> why? :)
[01:39] <G8APZ> so we know where you are!
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[01:40] <G8APZ> x-f just a thought!
[01:40] <solarballoonman> i.e x-f,Latvia or something like that.
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[01:41] <x-f> i'm always here and many people know where i am from, if there's runaway balloon or anything
[01:41] <G8APZ> Time I went! put up a Diamond X-50 on top of a 20m mast today.... great results!!
[01:41] <solarballoonman> any how off to bed for me. Good night.
[01:42] <x-f> good night, guys
[01:42] <G8APZ> GN all
[01:42] Nick change: solarballoonman -> solarballoonman-
[01:42] <G8APZ> ========================================
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[01:52] <DL7AD_> okay. still someone active from poland?
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[02:03] <SQ5NWI> DL7AD: Yes, but not for a long :)
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[02:15] <x-f> ANU is at 1.1deg elevation and won't get higher, however the signal is strong
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[02:25] <DL7AD_> x-f could i pass over b-34 soon? :P
[02:25] Nick change: DL7AD_ -> DL7AD
[02:26] <x-f> i'm trying to setup two receivers for that
[02:26] <x-f> what's the freq for it?
[02:28] <x-f> Polish trackers will get it for longer anyway as i'm on the edge of its footprint here
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[02:37] <Lunar_Lander> WOW Cloudy made it to Ukraine?
[02:38] <x-f> and further, but just wasn't transmitting proper telemetry anymore
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[02:39] <Lunar_Lander> awesome!
[02:41] <DL7AD> x-f my rx is tuned to 434,488,660 . my rx if shifting at 1.5khz (my_rx tuned at 434,501,500 will rx 343,500,000)
[02:42] <DL7AD> Lunar_Lander: noch wach?
[02:43] <Lunar_Lander> ja
[02:44] <DL7AD> Lunar_Lander: wow.... du nachteule :D
[02:44] <DL7AD> x-f: its beeping all the time currently
[02:44] <Lunar_Lander> xD
[02:44] <x-f> checking, thanks
[02:47] <bbjunkie> gn
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[02:50] <DL7AD> x-f: the frequency is currently rising steadily. thats a sign for dropping temperature and voltage.
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[02:51] <DL7AD> x-f: oh its beeping steadily now. beep bap beep bap beep bap
[02:51] <x-f> i'm not seeing the beeps yet, but will keep checking
[02:51] <DL7AD> currently its beeping several times a second
[02:52] <DL7AD> presume error (too cold)
[02:52] <x-f> we should be asleep
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[02:55] <DL7AD> it stopped transmitting now x-f
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[02:55] <x-f> meh
[02:57] <DL7AD> :P
[02:58] <DL7AD> B-36 is still transmitting aprs and contestia. but constestia is very weak. so lets say unusable
[03:00] <DL7AD> x-f: received 2 signle beeps from B-34
[03:00] <x-f> i won't find it then
[03:02] <DL7AD> i will tell you when its transmitting again if it will in the next hour.
[03:03] <DL7AD> x-f: beeps again for a short time
[03:04] <Lunar_Lander> good night! :)
[03:04] <x-f> that's nice, but i can't keep my eyes open anymore
[03:04] <x-f> good night
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[03:05] <x-f> it has APRS anyway and i will be 450 km from it
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[03:11] <DL7AD> okay ^^ i think i will go to bed soon as well @ x-f
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[03:18] <cactus> Problem with FAST-23's launch today?
[03:21] <DL7AD> cactus: no information
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[03:23] <qyx_> uf, too many baloons and receivers on the tracker, it is hardly usable
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[04:15] <craag> You can filter the map btw
[04:16] <craag> eg http://spacenear.us/tracker/?filter=SNOW
[04:16] <craag> http://spacenear.us/tracker/?filter=SNOW;CLOUDY
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[04:18] <craag> or if you're just complaining about the slowness, use this one instead :)
[04:18] <craag> http://habmap.philcrump.co.uk/
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[04:21] <qyx_> it is more responsive, but still firefox shows the message "script is not responding"
[04:22] <qyx_> i think it's caused by too many overlays
[04:23] <qyx_> when i open plain osm or gmap it pans and zooms smoothly
[04:24] <qyx_> with the filter applied it is somewhat more usable
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[04:40] <hurraaa> good morning..
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[04:41] <hurraaa> lusers
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[05:14] <A1Recon> http://spacenear.us/tracker/ What are those green towers which look like they are transmitting something....
[05:16] <craag> A1Recon: It's a bad choice of icon really.. they're receiving stations.
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[05:31] <Dunk_> How did cloudy do?
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[05:37] <kb0ylq> well is ther any baloons left? Looks like its been a bit for that last one to be seen any telemetry from
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[06:41] <uu4jlm_Valery> Hi all guys show screenshot reception for "CLOUDY - 434.200Mhz RTTY 300 SSDV" on DL-fldigi.
[06:43] <YO9ICT> I can hear seba6, but weak
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[07:04] <uu4jlm_Valery> What frequency "ANU" ?
[07:07] jcoxon (~jcoxon@host86-163-166-232.range86-163.btcentralplus.com) joined #highaltitude.
[07:07] <jcoxon> morning
[07:07] <jcoxon> go ANU!
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[07:11] <jcoxon> uu4jlm_Valery, ANU is 434.350Mhz
[07:11] <jcoxon> SEBA6 is alive!
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[07:13] <uu4jlm_Valery> jcoxon thank you
[07:14] <jcoxon> uu4jlm_Valery, thank you for tracking hte balloons
[07:15] <tweetBot> @jamescoxon: SEBA6 now just north of Lake Baikal on 21.115Mhz #ukhas #hamr #hamradio
[07:16] <uu4jlm_Valery> yes, but do not accept :(
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[07:19] <es5nhc> Ah... was too tired to try overnight listening
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[07:20] <es5nhc> plus, have a trip to ES6 today
[07:23] <es5nhc> so sry... busy today
[07:26] #highaltitude: mode change '+o jcoxon' by ChanServ!ChanServ@services.
[07:27] Topic changed on #highaltitude by jcoxon!jcoxon@host86-163-166-232.range86-163.btcentralplus.com: welcome to #highaltitude - discuss anything to do with high altitude projects! - seba6 on 21.115Mhz and ANU on 434.350Mhz - please keep tracking
[07:27] #highaltitude: mode change '-o jcoxon' by ChanServ!ChanServ@services.
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[07:30] <SP9UOB-Tom> Hey !
[07:30] <SP9UOB-Tom> this is not the end :-)
[07:30] <jcoxon> SP9UOB-Tom, still flying
[07:30] <SP9UOB-Tom> yeah! So kazakstan was real :-)
[07:30] <jcoxon> yup
[07:31] <jcoxon> it all fits
[07:31] <SP9UOB-Tom> im receiving it
[07:31] <jcoxon> where on the WF is it?
[07:31] <SP9UOB-Tom> but with errors
[07:31] <jcoxon> poor old GPS
[07:31] <SP9UOB-Tom> I: apply: RSID: DOMINOEX_22 @ 1712 Hz
[07:32] <SP9UOB-Tom> dial: 21.115
[07:33] <jcoxon> cool i'll listen out on some of hte GTs
[07:33] <SP9UOB-Tom> $oa$ ba6nrth058,073256,5936.5511232.7377,35400,330,891,0b*aab2
[07:33] <jcoxon> SP9UOB-Tom, i think you've still got float
[07:34] <SP9UOB-Tom> $$$$seba6,1059,073411,5935.1209,11238.5496,13768,318,894,0b*e89e
[07:34] <SP9UOB-Tom> green !
[07:34] <SP9UOB-Tom> shame for the gps
[07:35] <jcoxon> i think some of the altitudes will be correct
[07:36] <jcoxon> not that one though
[07:36] <SP9UOB-Tom> if speed remains, there is a chance for US today :-)
[07:37] <jcoxon> SP9UOB-Tom, might be worth an email to UKHAS and GPSL
[07:37] <jcoxon> asking for listeners
[07:37] <SP9UOB-Tom> jcoxon: can You do this for me? Your english is much better :-)
[07:37] <jcoxon> yup
[07:37] <SP9UOB-Tom> thanks
[07:38] <SP9UOB-Tom> $$seba6,1062,073819,5945.0988,11258.4600,35126,338,891,0b*e68f
[07:43] <Reb-SM3ULC> SP9UOB-Tom: wow, still flying :)
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[07:44] <SP9UOB-Tom> Reb-SM3ULC: need Your antenna :-)
[07:44] <jcoxon> SP9UOB-Tom, done
[07:44] <SP9UOB-Tom> need more antennas @21 MHz :-)
[07:44] <SP9UOB-Tom> jcoxon: thanks
[07:44] <Reb-SM3ULC> SP9UOB-Tom: turing on stuff.. hope kids tay away a few moments...
[07:44] <iain_g4sgx> moening!
[07:46] <Reb-SM3ULC> SP9UOB-Tom: morse short + data?
[07:46] <jcoxon> on Google Earth ANU has travelled 2500km
[07:47] <jcoxon> while seba6 is 3765km
[07:47] <jcoxon> roughtly
[07:48] <Reb-SM3ULC> SP9UOB-Tom: have something else at +2359 hz
[07:48] <SP9UOB-Tom> SP9UOB-Tom: + 1700
[07:49] <SP9UOB-Tom> Reb-SM3ULC: morse + data domex22
[07:49] <jcoxon> SP9UOB-Tom, reassuring battery voltage
[07:50] <SP9UOB-Tom> jcoxon: yes
[07:51] <SP9UOB-Tom> in freezing cold it was 7.2
[07:51] <SP9UOB-Tom> UHF should also wake up
[07:51] <jcoxon> not sure people are around to hear it
[07:51] <iain_g4sgx> Nothing here yet, but only just dawn
[07:52] <SP9UOB-Tom> someone from Japan, Alaska
[07:55] <jcoxon> very exciting
[07:55] <jcoxon> shame no one can hear ANU
[07:55] <number10_> morning
[07:56] <number10_> good flight jcoxon :)
[07:56] <jcoxon> yes, very good
[07:56] <jcoxon> nice low float
[07:57] <jcoxon> SP9UOB-Tom, can you screenshot a waterfall pic for me
[07:57] <jcoxon> just so i can see what it looks like when hunting on globaltuners
[07:57] Nick change: number10_ -> number10
[07:57] <SP9UOB-Tom> on next conference please kick me in the a... for the gps
[07:57] <SP9UOB-Tom> jcoxon: sure
[07:58] <DL5SFI_Steffen1> good morning
[07:58] Nick change: DL5SFI_Steffen1 -> DL5SFI_Steffen
[07:59] <SP9UOB-Tom> http://sp9uob.verox.pl/pliki/seba6dump.png
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[08:01] <SP9UOB-Tom> jcoxon: got it?
[08:02] <jcoxon> i'll got searching
[08:02] <jcoxon> go*
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[08:03] <arko> hmm is seba6 really in russia?
[08:03] <arko> that doesnt look right....
[08:03] <jcoxon> arko, yeah its correct
[08:03] <number10> so is ANU arko
[08:03] <arko> wow
[08:03] <number10> not as far
[08:03] <arko> jcoxon: really?
[08:04] <jcoxon> it all fits
[08:04] <arko> damn
[08:04] <arko> thats crazy
[08:04] <jcoxon> taking into account predictions and windspeed
[08:04] <arko> i cant believe it
[08:04] <arko> wow
[08:04] <jcoxon> its travelling at 350km/h
[08:04] <arko> O_O
[08:04] <jcoxon> its coming your way
[08:04] <arko> is this is a distance record?
[08:04] <arko> :D
[08:04] <arko> getting my radio ready
[08:04] <jcoxon> not yet
[08:04] <arko> whats picking it up?
[08:05] <DL5SFI_Steffen> If Seba6 was received by SP8CGR, the OM has loud QRZ.COM vertical antennas for HF, then one would have received in Germany with a 15m beam in the direction of the signal right?
[08:05] <arko> i dont see any stations?
[08:05] <jcoxon> arko, its on HF
[08:05] <jcoxon> 21.115Mhz
[08:05] <arko> power?
[08:05] <jcoxon> 500mW
[08:05] <jcoxon> everyone should listen for it
[08:05] <arko> wow
[08:05] <arko> this is crazy
[08:06] <Reb-SM3ULC> SP9UOB-Tom: no big signals here :/
[08:06] <arko> it really props that far?
[08:06] <jcoxon> can do
[08:06] <iain_g4sgx> Propopgation models say there is a very short window, maybe 2 hrs from uk from now til 10am
[08:07] <SP9UOB-Tom> transmitting now
[08:07] <arko> thats awesome
[08:07] <Upu> wow
[08:07] <Upu> go SEBA
[08:07] <SP9UOB-Tom> arko: wake up US duys
[08:08] <SP9UOB-Tom> guys
[08:08] <Upu> GPSL
[08:08] <Upu> send me the mail you want sending I'll forward it
[08:08] <SP9UOB-Tom> morse
[08:08] <arko> SP9UOB-Tom: they wont be awake until 8amish PST
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[08:08] <jcoxon> Upu i thought i'd done it already
[08:08] <arko> i'll probably sleep soon and try to hear it in the morning
[08:08] <Upu> oh sorry eys you cc'd them in
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[08:09] <arko> i know a few HF guys here in so cal
[08:09] <Upu> is SP9UOB on the same balloon?
[08:09] <SP9UOB-Tom> Upu: yes, and it shuould be awake
[08:09] <DL5SFI_Steffen> do you think that I would hear him from Germany from ... we have at the club station a FT-1000 and a Beam! http://test.ov-p24.de/Bilder/IMG_2773_mod.jpg ?
[08:10] <jcoxon> DL5SFI_Steffen, its worth a try!
[08:10] <Upu> B-36 may defrost as well
[08:10] <arko> :D thatd be awesome
[08:11] <jcoxon> seba6 isn't at 21m don't panic!
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[08:12] <SP9UOB-Tom> jcoxon: in fact it is at 21 M(Hz) ;-)
[08:12] <jcoxon> hehe
[08:12] <DL5SFI_Steffen> I would have to drive over, ok what do I need? a sound cable from Ft-1000 to laptop and DL-FL-DIGI? more?
[08:13] <jcoxon> that should be it
[08:13] <jcoxon> internets
[08:13] <DL5SFI_Steffen> yes we have on club
[08:13] <jcoxon> don't forget your power cable for your laptop
[08:13] <Upu> well the question where do these floaters go when they are out of range is getting answered
[08:13] Action: jcoxon has been there before, batteries running out
[08:13] <DL5SFI_Steffen> ;-)
[08:14] <Upu> Seba is back in the dark btw
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[08:14] <Upu> so if its floating now its got a really good chance of staying that way
[08:14] <jcoxon> yes its slight dropped in altitude
[08:14] <jcoxon> slightly*
[08:15] <jcoxon> it might make the Arctic challenge
[08:16] <iain_g4sgx> saw a very slight trace..heard dominex
[08:17] <SP9UOB-Tom> iain_g4sgx: cool !
[08:17] <SP9UOB-Tom> morse now
[08:17] <SP9UOB-Tom> very weak
[08:17] <SP9UOB-Tom> domex now
[08:18] <iain_g4sgx> was very weak but my come up a bit for an hour
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[08:18] <iain_g4sgx> yep, all zeros?
[08:19] <SP9UOB-Tom> could be
[08:19] <SP9UOB-Tom> GPS issue
[08:19] <iain_g4sgx> just popped out of the noise
[08:19] <DL5SFI_Steffen> ok i drive to the club .. wish me luck!
[08:19] <DL5SFI_Steffen> :)
[08:19] <jcoxon> good luck DL5SFI_Steffen
[08:20] <iain_g4sgx> be quick, greyline.. Good luck
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[08:23] <iain_g4sgx> Aww still too weak..
[08:24] <iain_g4sgx> Anyone tried long path? he he.
[08:24] <jcoxon> lots of zeros
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[08:28] <jcoxon> lots of people are getting partials
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[08:30] <Upu> can we make a good one from them ?
[08:30] <McLane> Dl5sfi is going to recover one of theballoons?
[08:30] <jcoxon> Upu, they are just 0s
[08:30] <jcoxon> so no real point
[08:30] <Upu> ah ok
[08:31] <Upu> GPS frozen up ?
[08:31] <jcoxon> the gps doesn't like the high speed + cold
[08:31] <jcoxon> its got time
[08:31] <jcoxon> and that SP9UOB-Tom keeps turning it off and on!
[08:31] <Upu> I suspect its very very cold up there
[08:31] <Upu> lol
[08:31] <Upu> that probably
[08:31] <jcoxon> its a poor old lassen
[08:31] <Upu> oh wow
[08:31] <Upu> what a way to bow out
[08:32] <jcoxon> we are losing altitude
[08:32] <jcoxon> (slowly)
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[08:38] <SP9UOB-Tom> ataL840,0 u*caf8053,2a
[08:39] Last message repeated 1 time(s).
[08:39] <SP9UOB-Tom> was position
[08:41] <SP9UOB-Tom> ^$e 9tl1109,084057,tHioe=7.7305,11809?8522,0294,281,817,0f*e2e3
[08:42] <jcoxon> someone got this: $$se6,1109,084057,6107.7305,11809.4e522,30294,281,817,0f*e2e3\n
[08:42] <jcoxon> in the logs
[08:42] <jcoxon> now back to 0s
[08:44] <SP9UOB-Tom> well deltaloop preforms better now
[08:45] <SP9UOB-Tom> yy
[08:45] <SP9UOB-Tom> $$$maiaeba6,1112,084527,6111.4600,11830.2911a 0342,23917,0f*0ae9
[08:46] <jcoxon> map updated
[08:46] <jcoxon> by SQ9EKJ
[08:46] <SP9UOB-Tom> im wondering if its leaking
[08:47] <jcoxon> it could just be cooling down
[08:47] <jcoxon> heading further north and is also in darkness
[08:48] <SP9UOB-Tom> and also its slowing down
[08:48] <SP9UOB-Tom> 30024 m
[08:48] <SP9UOB-Tom> too slow for parashute
[08:49] <SP9UOB-Tom> QSBS
[08:49] <jcoxon> hmmmm cusf says its going to go much further north
[08:50] <jcoxon> http://predict.habhub.org/#!/uuid=75c6c9423b413dc86dd275bc428b2370bec1ab0e
[08:51] <SP9UOB-Tom> amazing track
[08:52] <jcoxon> i'm just running hysplit
[08:52] <jcoxon> can't go as high with hysplit, max is about 26000m
[08:52] <SP9UOB-Tom> stations, more listeners !
[08:54] <arko> aww
[08:54] <arko> doesnt look like it will make it to the US
[08:55] <jcoxon> hysplit pretty much agrees: http://ready.arl.noaa.gov/hypubout/152352_trj001.gif
[08:55] <arko> awww
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[08:56] <PA1SDB> GM
[08:57] <number10> prediction for ANU http://predict.habhub.org/#!/uuid=8073110ed3efb62256b81a45c1c8577b2e686846
[08:58] <SP9UOB-Tom> voltage is dropping - getting cold
[08:58] <number10> should be over you on monay evening (UTC) arko :)
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[08:58] <number10> monday
[08:58] <SP9UOB-Tom> 8.04 V
[08:58] <arko> hah
[08:58] <arko> whats the balloon anyway?
[08:58] <arko> it survived sunrise
[08:59] <number10> 1600g with H2 - 70cm tracker
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[08:59] <arko> oh wow
[08:59] <arko> how did it survive sunrise?
[09:00] <number10> the float altitude was lowish
[09:01] <number10> altitude was increasing so may have burst
[09:01] <arko> ah
[09:02] <number10> it had no vent - jcoxon was going to launch one with a vent yesterday
[09:02] <number10> would have been interesting to see how that went
[09:03] <SP9UOB-Tom> i've send an email to some Canadian hams
[09:04] <jcoxon> map updated
[09:04] <SP9UOB-Tom> :-)
[09:05] <jcoxon> shame there isn't a globaltuner in Yakutsk
[09:05] <jcoxon> :-)
[09:05] <number10> :)
[09:06] <SP9UOB-Tom> so far in Asia :-) 21 MHz was good choice :-)
[09:06] <SP9UOB-Tom> $$$$seba6,129,090626,6134.7777,11950.2aa9t-76w20,7920f*b295
[09:06] <SP9UOB-Tom> allmost!
[09:07] <Upu> needs more FEC
[09:08] <SP9UOB-Tom> and lower baudrate
[09:08] <SP9UOB-Tom> and Ublox
[09:08] <SP9UOB-Tom> :-)
[09:08] <jcoxon> ublox would help
[09:10] <jcoxon> $$seba6,1131,090857,6137.5012,11958.5061,29196,216,788,0f*0cf7
[09:10] <jcoxon> i've fixed that line
[09:10] <jcoxon> just needed one character
[09:10] <jcoxon> Upu, could you input it?
[09:10] <Upu> yep
[09:10] <x-f> good morning
[09:11] <Upu> done
[09:11] <jcoxon> hehe i didn't rx it
[09:11] <jcoxon> not sure who did
[09:11] <jcoxon> :-p
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[09:14] <qyx_> a bit offtopic question, is there any "75ohm version" of SMA? is it SMB?
[09:14] <qyx_> which is commonly used i mean
[09:14] <Darkside> no
[09:14] <Darkside> they are all 50 ohm
[09:14] <Darkside> there are 75 ohm vrsions of BNC and N i blieve
[09:15] <Darkside> i'd be wondeirng why you want a 75 ohm SMA socket
[09:15] <SP9UOB-Tom> gone now
[09:15] <SP9UOB-Tom> not traces at all
[09:16] <qyx_> i don't want SMA, i want just comparably small alternative, which is 75ohm
[09:16] <Darkside> why 75 ohm?
[09:17] <SP9UOB-Tom> https://plus.google.com/photos/113191216049170277500/albums/5962470539276946385?banner=pwa&authkey=CLLP87y0rsKGMw
[09:17] <Darkside> i'd just be using 50 ohm connectors, its a 1.5:1 mismatch, so you lose 3.8% of your signal
[09:17] <Darkside> which is pretty much negligible
[09:18] <mikestir> I have a vague recollection I've seen some video gear with SMB, and they would be 75 ohm
[09:18] <Darkside> most SMB is 50
[09:18] <mikestir> a quick google does suggest 75 ohm SMBs exist
[09:18] <Darkside> also SMB is a pain in the ass to work with
[09:19] <Darkside> highly not rcommended
[09:19] <qyx_> hmm, ok, accepted
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[09:19] <Darkside> qyx_: so whats this for?
[09:19] <qyx_> i will use u.fl to sma pigtails
[09:19] <Darkside> connecting to a rtlsdr or something?
[09:19] <qyx_> uhm, lightning receiver
[09:19] <Darkside> ah
[09:19] <Darkside> yeah just use 50 ohm stuff
[09:19] <Darkside> its not going to make a difference
[09:20] <qyx_> but i have already done cheap RG6 cabling
[09:20] <qyx_> k, thanks
[09:20] <Darkside> then shoehorn a connector onto it
[09:20] <Darkside> :P
[09:20] <Darkside> for lightning detection its not going to matter
[09:20] <Darkside> you can get away with a LOT at HF
[09:20] <PA1SDB> Is 21.115,000 MHz wf ~1700 Hz still the best setting for SEBA6 ?
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[09:21] <SP9UOB-Tom> PA1SDB: yeah
[09:21] <Darkside> thats landed, right?
[09:22] <PA1SDB> Tnx
[09:22] <jcoxon> Darkside, no its still flying
[09:22] <Darkside> kk
[09:22] <jcoxon> the GPS is unhappy
[09:23] <Darkside> so information on its transmit cycl?
[09:23] <jcoxon> but when it does report it reports something slightly sensible
[09:23] <jcoxon> it is slowly descending
[09:23] <jcoxon> last partial puts it at 29218m
[09:23] <Darkside> mmk
[09:23] <Darkside> so how often does it transmit?
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[09:24] <jcoxon> SP9UOB-Tom, ?
[09:24] <jcoxon> about every 2 mins from what i've seen
[09:24] <pyropetepete> Morning all
[09:24] <x-f> was once per minute yesterday
[09:25] <Darkside> ok
[09:25] <Upu> morning pyropetepete
[09:25] <Darkside> not sur when trans-equatorial 15m works from here
[09:25] <pyropetepete> How is it all looking?
[09:25] <Upu> http://spacenear.us/tracker/
[09:25] <Upu> messy
[09:26] <SP9UOB-Tom> Darkside: once per minute
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[09:26] <jcoxon> Upu, might be worth cleaning it up
[09:26] <pyropetepete> Uho not looking good
[09:26] <jcoxon> i tried to yesterday
[09:26] <Herman-PB0AHX> Good morning all
[09:26] <Upu> let me take some screen shots first
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[09:28] <jcoxon> last partial of use was $$seba6,1aFiea 092201,6153.0401,12036.2405,29218,20a,766,0f*ce5d\n
[09:28] <jcoxon> at 09:22
[09:29] <Darkside> mmk
[09:29] <Darkside> this is the point whre you'd want japanse listeners
[09:29] <jcoxon> indeed
[09:30] <Darkside> actually it looks good for australia too
[09:30] <Darkside> but i dont have an antenna up
[09:30] <jcoxon> Darkside, anyone you can contact about it?
[09:30] <jcoxon> HF operators from project Horus etc
[09:31] <jcoxon> $seba6,1148,092954,62e2.5Et\\9,12059.8128,29nraqt9,2 C63,!faeo7t\n
[09:31] <Darkside> yeah im contacting who i can
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[09:32] <Darkside> how do i get a spacenearus tracker link with just a single payload
[09:32] <SP9UOB-Tom> jcoxon: quiet here
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[09:33] <jcoxon> http://spacenear.us/tracker/index.php?filter=seba6
[09:33] <Darkside> chers
[09:33] <jcoxon> SP9UOB-Tom, well any data is useful - its still alive
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[09:35] <MLow> lol so apparenly it's been my radio that sucks cause i can decode this old HX1 i messed with
[09:35] <MLow> thanks to the rtl-sdr !, i was able to fiddle with the trim pots and tune it
[09:35] <Darkside> ffs
[09:35] <Darkside> dl-fldigi keeps crashing
[09:35] <Darkside> with no error message either
[09:35] <MLow> log file
[09:35] <Darkside> it just.. closes
[09:35] <MLow> ?
[09:35] <jcoxon> Darkside, on start up?
[09:35] <malgar> who is receiving seba?
[09:35] <Darkside> jcoxon: nope, randomly
[09:35] <jcoxon> oh
[09:36] <jcoxon> delete your config file and start again
[09:36] <MLow> ok so does anyone know anything about aprs?
[09:37] <Darkside> sure
[09:37] <jcoxon> MLow, ask the question, you should get an answer from someone
[09:38] <Darkside> right, ive posted to th australian ham radio facebook group
[09:38] <malgar> how is possible that SQ9KEJ is receiving seba6? it is very far away!
[09:38] <Darkside> malgar: HF
[09:38] <malgar> oh
[09:39] <Darkside> refraction off the ionosphre, etc
[09:39] <MLow> well id like someone to take a look at the waterfall on sdr# and tell me if this is normal
[09:39] <malgar> wow
[09:39] <Darkside> MLow: you'r talking more about FM deviation there
[09:40] <Darkside> working out FM deviation from a waterfall plot is a pain
[09:40] <Darkside> btter to see if you can decode it
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[09:43] <MLow> i can
[09:45] <MLow> http://screencloud.net/v/jl0K
[09:45] <SP9UOB-Tom> any news, someone has signal ?
[09:45] <SP9UOB-Tom> no propagation in Poland now
[09:46] <Darkside> MLow: at that close distance eits probably OK
[09:46] <jcoxon> SP9UOB-Tom, no partials
[09:47] <MLow> hm so your saying to get proper judgement on if my signal is ok, i need to be farther away? :P
[09:47] <nats`> hi
[09:47] <Darkside> MLow: or hav more attenuation betwen your transmitter and receiver
[09:47] <Darkside> take the antenna off the receiver, for example
[09:48] <MLow> ah
[09:49] <MLow> http://screencloud.net/v/4R95
[09:49] <MLow> much different
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[09:49] <Darkside> looks like you have a long preamble
[09:49] <Darkside> but it looks ok i think
[09:49] <MLow> yeah really long
[09:49] <Darkside> check you can get into your local APRS ntwork
[09:50] <MLow> wide2-2 ?
[09:50] <Darkside> hah
[09:50] <Darkside> uhm
[09:50] <Darkside> maybe on the ground
[09:50] <Darkside> in the air.. no
[09:50] <MLow> well you said...
[09:50] <Darkside> use wide2-2 to test on the ground
[09:50] <Darkside> as you'll likly ned it to get into APRS-IS
[09:50] <Darkside> in the air, you dont want that many hops
[09:51] <MLow> *cough* http://arhab.org/aprs.pdf
[09:51] <Darkside> as you'll likly b in range of an igate all the time
[09:51] <jcoxon> $$seba6,1166,0950n n4,000.0,000.0,0,0,734,0*90b3\n
[09:51] <jcoxon> from SQ3LLJ
[09:51] <SP9UOB-Tom> still alive then
[09:51] <Darkside> MLow: yeah
[09:51] <uu4jlm_Valery> CLOUDY Silent??
[09:51] <Darkside> wide2-1 in the air
[09:51] <MLow> really?
[09:52] <Darkside> its what they recommend
[09:52] <Darkside> and its what we've flown
[09:52] <Darkside> works pretty well
[09:52] <MLow> 500mw but ok
[09:52] <MLow> i was thinking do an altitude check, if the altitude is unknown go for wide2-1
[09:52] <jcoxon> MLow, yeah you don't need much
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[09:52] <x-f> uu4jlm_Valery, CLOUDY wasn't mean to operate that long, it is probably on the ground by now and with an empty battery
[09:53] <MLow> if its <5000ft 2-2 , and > 5000ft pathless
[09:53] <Darkside> MLow: sounds good actually
[09:53] <LeoBodnar> you need at least WIDE2-1 path in Italy
[09:53] <Darkside> we were going to do something similar
[09:54] <MLow> here is pretty good coverage
[09:54] <Darkside> but we never bothered to implement it as wide2-1 worked well
[09:54] <Darkside> and the aprs network operators were happy it was getting used
[09:54] <jcoxon> SP9UOB-Tom, looks like a partial from OM5KV
[09:54] <MLow> dont even try to load aprs.fi in texas
[09:54] <jcoxon> in teh US they get a bit stressed out when the path settings are wrong
[09:54] <MLow> unless you have like a quad-core
[09:54] <LeoBodnar> In Italy everything is flooded so unless you get digipeated there is very little chance to go direct
[09:55] <SP9UOB-Tom> jcoxon: have voltage decoded ?
[09:55] <MLow> Darkside: something wrong with long preamble?
[09:55] <jcoxon> 7.34V
[09:55] <LeoBodnar> how long is long?
[09:55] <SP9UOB-Tom> not so bad
[09:56] <LeoBodnar> morning!
[09:56] <Darkside> MLow: its probably ok
[09:56] Action: jcoxon is watching telemetry logs
[09:56] <MLow> i was thinking i could half it
[09:56] <MLow> worst that happens is more battery use in tx right?
[09:56] <LeoBodnar> MLow: what is your preamble length?
[09:56] <jcoxon> SP9UOB-Tom, $$seba6,117aer,095200S.0,000.0,0,n28,0c*L528\n
[09:57] <MLow> 60
[09:57] <LeoBodnar> msec?
[09:57] <Darkside> so 600ms?
[09:57] <LeoBodnar> wow
[09:57] <LeoBodnar> 100ms works fine
[09:57] <MLow> hm ill try that
[09:57] <LeoBodnar> are they flags or zeros ?
[09:57] <SP9UOB-Tom> i've heard 2 and more SECONDS preamble in Italy
[09:57] <SP9UOB-Tom> LeoBodnar: flags
[09:58] <LeoBodnar> this is not the best
[09:58] <SP9UOB-Tom> LeoBodnar: should be flags
[09:58] <LeoBodnar> use zeroes and then a single flag
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[09:58] <MLow> i use zeros
[09:58] <SP9UOB-Tom> why ?
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[09:58] <SP9UOB-Tom> Hi Brian
[09:58] <LeoBodnar> good, zeroes have equal quantity of both frequencies and flags are primarily one
[09:58] <jcoxon> SP9UOB-Tom, 7.15V
[09:58] <OZ1SKY_Brian> hi
[09:59] <LeoBodnar> *tones
[09:59] <OZ1SKY_Brian> SP9UOB-Tom Hi Tom
[09:59] <nats`> OOT question: I would like to buy a quadcopter kit for my brother anybody has advice ? (I don't know anything on those stuff)
[09:59] <LeoBodnar> this makes decoder to lock in better
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[09:59] <SP9UOB-Tom> jcoxon: 1.19V / cell
[09:59] <SP9UOB-Tom> its freezing
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[10:00] <OZ1SKY_Brian> SP9UOB-Tom i see seba6 is in siberia, cool
[10:00] <SP9UOB-Tom> cool as hell ;-)
[10:00] <SP9UOB-Tom> or opposite ;-)
[10:00] <LeoBodnar> It's pointless to keep sending flags sequentially apart from if you are sending two packets back-to-bakc where it is a requirement
[10:00] <MLow> aprs-is showing me :D
[10:01] <MLow> with wide2-1 so i can reduce TTL
[10:01] <OZ1SKY_Brian> SP9UOB-Tom not hearing anything on 21.115 here though
[10:02] <SP9UOB-Tom> OZ1SKY_Brian: try long-path ;-)
[10:02] <jcoxon> its very satisfying getting into the aprs network for the first time
[10:02] <OZ1SKY_Brian> SP9UOB-Tom lol its a GP, so im doing both :-)
[10:02] <SP9UOB-Tom> OZ1SKY_Brian: both at once, wash and go ;-)
[10:04] <MLow> aha i can decode my repeat as well, this is so cool
[10:04] <MLow> WD5IYT-2 is digipeating
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[10:06] <MLow> 10mi away wow
[10:08] <LeoBodnar> MLow: in the air you can routinely get 300 miles on 10mW
[10:08] <MLow> it is a piece of wire on my desk at ground level
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[10:10] <jcoxon> $$ANU,987,17:57\\58,52.92207,2.80905,11237,9*97DA\n
[10:11] <MLow> LeoBodnar: afsk1200?
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[10:11] <LeoBodnar> yeah MLow
[10:11] <MLow> pretty incredible
[10:11] <OZ1SKY_Brian> jcoxon where are you getting that, on a GT?
[10:11] <jcoxon> hmmm is someone repeating that
[10:11] <jcoxon> yeah its a copy
[10:12] <jcoxon> its from 17:57
[10:12] <jcoxon> perhaps decoding a wav
[10:12] Nick change: Steve_G0TDJ_AFK -> Steve_G0TDJ
[10:12] <LeoBodnar> MLow: http://aprs.fi/#!call=a%2FM0XER-6&timerange=3600&tail=3600 this is on dying 1xAA battery
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[10:12] <Steve_G0TDJ> Morning folks
[10:12] Meower (d40a638c@gateway/web/freenode/ip. left irc:
[10:13] <jcoxon> one more seba6 packet
[10:13] <LeoBodnar> floaters, make friends use date :D
[10:13] <jcoxon> thats all i want :-)
[10:14] <raspTortoise> seba6's flight has been great, pictures of the siberian tundra would be so cool.
[10:14] <Darkside> you'd be pushing to get that kind of throughput over HF
[10:14] <SP9UOB-Tom> raspTortoise: this is not the end :-)
[10:14] <Darkside> certainly possible, just a pain in the ass
[10:15] <Darkside> and will require more transmit power
[10:15] <LeoBodnar> And very small jpegs too. It's just dark green with patches of white
[10:15] <Darkside> haha
[10:15] <SP9UOB-Tom> jcoxon: paste please
[10:15] <OZ1SKY_Brian> SP9UOB-Tom next time 40m,30m,20m,15m,10m beacons on it please :-)
[10:15] <jcoxon> oh sorry i meant that i just wanted one more packet
[10:15] <Darkside> OZ1SKY_Brian: lol
[10:15] <Darkside> OZ1SKY_Brian: flying fan dipol
[10:16] <Darkside> dipole*
[10:16] <OZ1SKY_Brian> yep :-)
[10:16] <SP9UOB-Tom> OZ1SKY_Brian: that would be require trapped antenan
[10:16] <Darkside> yeah or that
[10:16] <Darkside> flying 40m is scary
[10:16] <SP9UOB-Tom> and wideband PA
[10:16] <SP9UOB-Tom> which is not very efficient
[10:16] <Darkside> yep
[10:16] <Darkside> well
[10:16] <Darkside> hrm
[10:16] <Darkside> i had ideas about using multiple class-D/E output chains
[10:16] <Darkside> and relay switch them
[10:17] <SP9UOB-Tom> im using E Class pa
[10:17] <Darkside> yah, you use multiple output chains, one for each band
[10:17] <SP9UOB-Tom> BS170 driven by AD9851 comparator output
[10:17] <Darkside> switch the square wav einput to them using a logic mux
[10:17] <Darkside> and relay switch the output
[10:17] <Darkside> into the antenna
[10:17] <SP9UOB-Tom> maybe PIN-diode switches
[10:18] <Darkside> that way you preserve the efficiency, and get around having to have a duplexer
[10:18] <SP9UOB-Tom> avoid mechanics
[10:18] <Darkside> yeah
[10:18] <Darkside> there are some good RF relays that are rated down to -50 or so
[10:18] <Darkside> but pin diodes would be a good idea
[10:18] <SP9UOB-Tom> i have to try :-)
[10:19] <Darkside> im thinking of doing somethign like this for a HF remote telemetry station
[10:19] <Darkside> whre you have maybe 3-4 channels
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[10:20] <Darkside> almost like in old radios, whre you had crystal oscillator boards :-)
[10:20] <Darkside> but instad of oscillators, you have tuned power amplifiers
[10:21] <SP9UOB-Tom> Darkside: nice idea
[10:21] <raspTortoise> SP9UOB-Tom thanks, I'm also looking forwad to SP3OSJ looks like it might make it to the USA .. is that prediction accurate since its just been launched?
[10:21] <SP9UOB-Tom> it is relatively easy
[10:21] <Darkside> SP9UOB-Tom: you could probably make it physically small if you wanted to
[10:22] <SP9UOB-Tom> raspTortoise: im affraid not
[10:22] <fsphil> wow, it's over half way past russia
[10:22] <SP9UOB-Tom> Darkside: yeah
[10:22] <Darkside> dpends what your harmonic filtering requirements are :-)
[10:22] <Darkside> i know in the US its -35dBc
[10:22] <Darkside> however, in australia, for a 5W transmitter, its -49dBc
[10:22] <Darkside> which is more of a pain in the ass to meet
[10:23] <Darkside> have to use a 7th order chebyshev, and that doesn't match the output impdance of the class D to 50 ohms properly, so i lose a bit of efficiency
[10:24] <Darkside> i'm now playing with a bit of software called genesys, to optimise a circuit to do the impdanc matching and filtering
[10:25] <SP9UOB-Tom> Darkside: i'll google for genesys
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[10:25] <fsphil> how long was the battery on seba6 due to last?
[10:25] <Darkside> SP9UOB-Tom: $$$$$ software
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[10:29] <jcoxon> SP9UOB-Tom, i've got to go, will pop back later
[10:29] <jcoxon> hopefully some more data will come in soon
[10:29] <raspTortoise> http://www.home.agilent.com/en/pc-1297125/genesys-rf-and-microwave-design-software
[10:29] <Darkside> thats the one
[10:29] <LeoBodnar> Oh wow, seba is deep into Russia
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[10:30] <LeoBodnar> Heading for epicentre of cold
[10:30] <SP9UOB-Tom> Darkside: ohh
[10:31] <LeoBodnar> -40C on the ground level
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[10:31] <Darkside> SP9UOB-Tom: the lowst options are like $9000
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[10:33] <fsphil> is it even still transmitting?
[10:33] <x-f> yes!
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[10:34] <SP5NON> Good morning all
[10:34] <x-f> good morning
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[10:35] <fsphil> anyone know the current offset from 21.115?
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[10:35] <fsphil> I'll leave my radio on it today
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[10:37] <x-f> still @ 1700, from what was reported here
[10:37] Nick change: KipK_away -> KipK
[10:40] <fsphil> http://www.voacap.com/prediction.html
[10:40] <fsphil> seems my best chance was an hour ago :)
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[10:50] <SP9UOB-Tom> any signs of life ?
[10:51] <Steve_G0TDJ> Hi Tom
[10:51] <SP9UOB-Tom> Hi Steve :-)
[10:52] <Steve_G0TDJ> I've been listening for seba6 but I haven't heard anything
[10:52] <fsphil> yea not even hints of it here
[10:52] <fsphil> but then it is very far away
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[10:53] <Steve_G0TDJ> Yes, I was going to ask, will seba6 now hold the amateur distance record?
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[10:54] <fsphil> has it beat the transatlantic one ye?
[10:54] <fsphil> t
[10:54] <fsphil> looking at the map it could be close
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[10:54] <Steve_G0TDJ> Yeah, who looks after the figures?
[10:55] <fsphil> in the case of ukhas, everyone - just add it to the wiki :)
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[10:56] <RocketBoy> is there a cube sat with something useful like a global tuner on it - or one that can be re-purposed?
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[10:57] <Steve_G0TDJ> RocketBoy: I've said several times that we need one of the AmSats to constantly scan for balloons and relay telemetry
[10:57] <RocketBoy> yeah - that would be brill
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[10:58] <Steve_G0TDJ> It can't be that hard, surely. Especially for APRS on a set freq.
[10:58] Nick change: Crashjuh -> Crashjuh|Away
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[10:59] <MLow> agreed
[10:59] <RocketBoy> I'm sure its not
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[10:59] <Steve_G0TDJ> Perhaps we should put together some sort of proposal and send to AmSat to see what reaction we get?
[10:59] <RocketBoy> Its just frustrating that the flights go out of range - and you never know what happened to them
[10:59] <Steve_G0TDJ> Exactly
[10:59] <RocketBoy> yeah
[10:59] <fsphil> a general sdr cubesat
[10:59] <RocketBoy> yeah
[11:00] <fsphil> that would indeed be cool
[11:00] <RocketBoy> and not vasty difficult
[11:00] <RocketBoy> other than getting it launched
[11:00] <Steve_G0TDJ> You could probaby do it ina similar way to the one wht went up made of a mobile phone innards
[11:00] <fsphil> it would only have an omni antenna though
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[11:01] <fsphil> would it be sensitive enough to hear a payload?
[11:01] <Steve_G0TDJ> We may be able to piggy-back on another project for launch
[11:02] <Steve_G0TDJ> I hear ISS/ARRISAT-1/Sats on my vert
[11:02] <RocketBoy> well - i guess you could use a ground facing antenna for a bit of gain
[11:02] <fsphil> they've more power than 10mw thoug
[11:02] <RocketBoy> magnatorqued
[11:02] <Steve_G0TDJ> True....
[11:02] <RocketBoy> I can get about 100km off my car mounted groundplane
[11:03] <DF2MZ> why not use HF beacons?
[11:03] <Steve_G0TDJ> Maybe we should get a couple of the AmSat gusy in here for a chat
[11:03] Nick change: KipK -> KipK_away
[11:03] <fsphil> it also needs a camera. cause space pics are cool :)
[11:03] <x-f> Steve_G0TDJ, we have one - Wouter PA3WEG
[11:03] <RocketBoy> :-)
[11:03] <Steve_G0TDJ> LOL
[11:04] <Steve_G0TDJ> Ah cool. Nest time we 'see' Wouter....
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[11:04] <LeoBodnar> HF are scary
[11:05] <DF2MZ> why LEO?
[11:05] <Steve_G0TDJ> An APRS digipeater would be useful to lots of 'Ham's' as well as balloons...
[11:05] <LeoBodnar> powerlines
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[11:05] <RocketBoy> my biggest worry about HF antennas
[11:05] <LeoBodnar> not scary but uncomfortable
[11:06] <DF2MZ> I don't agree
[11:06] <RocketBoy> having had 3 HABs touch or get caught in powerlines
[11:06] <RocketBoy> one with cord dangling to the ground
[11:06] <Steve_G0TDJ> Zapped?
[11:07] <SP9UOB-Tom> 0.8 mm^2 wire just vaporise when in contact with power line - with no harm to powerline
[11:07] <DF2MZ> Balloons and HF is a natural combination
[11:07] <RocketBoy> one was zapped
[11:07] <Steve_G0TDJ> Ouch
[11:07] <DF2MZ> HF works without local infrastructure
[11:07] <DF2MZ> that's exactly what ballons need
[11:07] <RocketBoy> still worked - but the cutdown gets were fried
[11:07] <RocketBoy> fets
[11:08] <LeoBodnar> It;s not harm to powerlines I am worried about
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[11:08] <LeoBodnar> But a wire dangling down from a line to the ground
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[11:09] <SP9UOB-Tom> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mqRT7J86rco
[11:09] <DL7AD> good morning
[11:09] <Steve_G0TDJ> GM
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[11:10] <DF2MZ> Tom, can it be that your balloon sent out random locations and altitude yesterday?
[11:10] <DF2MZ> on the CW beacon?
[11:10] <SP9UOB-Tom> DF2MZ: not random but with glitches
[11:10] <DL7AD> Hey SP9UOB-Tom ! your balloon did it very far :) congrats
[11:10] <DF2MZ> ok
[11:10] <DF2MZ> I have a short log
[11:10] <SP9UOB-Tom> DL7AD: thanks, i hope thats not the end
[11:11] <DF2MZ> where should I send it?
[11:11] <SP9UOB-Tom> DF2MZ: sp9uob@kalety.net
[11:11] <DF2MZ> ok
[11:11] <SP9UOB-Tom> or post to the UKHAS google group
[11:12] <RocketBoy> why HF antennas are scary http://www.flickr.com/photos/16828840@N07/11621713984/
[11:12] <MLow> lol
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[11:12] <MLow> what do you do in that situation
[11:12] <MLow> just kinda stare at it?
[11:12] <DF2MZ> I am on the 21.115 but haven't heard it today
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[11:13] <Upu> Can yuo guys see this : http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bkd3hL6hJ80
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[11:13] <LeoBodnar> Is that ballon renmians by the pole base?
[11:13] <DL7AD> SP9UOB-Tom: i cant hear anything on the frequency
[11:13] <daveake> Upu yes
[11:13] <Upu> ah yes
[11:13] <Upu> watch that
[11:13] <RocketBoy> LeoBodnar: yes
[11:14] <DF2MZ> its always scary when ballons meet powerlines
[11:14] <MLow> the sound in that video is scary
[11:14] <MLow> where is the wind noise
[11:14] <DL7AD> Upu: how did you get it back?
[11:15] <Upu> walked into the field
[11:15] <Upu> it bounced off the HT lines
[11:15] <Upu> and fell off
[11:15] <Upu> note it stops for a second then falls to the grounf
[11:15] <Upu> ground
[11:15] <MLow> wowza
[11:15] <MLow> just got to that part
[11:15] <RocketBoy> There were two other flights I've been involved with where the payload has touched a power line on the way down
[11:15] <Upu> that was one of them Steve :)
[11:16] <Darkside> we've had a payload land draped across an 11kv line, over a dry field
[11:16] <RocketBoy> no thats a 3rd
[11:16] <Upu> oh ok :)
[11:16] <Darkside> that was *not* something we want to repeat
[11:16] <Darkside> in the UK its all wet, you dont hav to worry as much about starting bushfires
[11:16] <daveake> One of my flights just missed one. I calculated the payload was 37 metres above the ground when it passed the line
[11:16] <Darkside> around here, if we screw up, we could cause a major bushfire
[11:16] <RocketBoy> there was a early flight - found under a power line where the 1Hz GPS track shows a distinct bounce
[11:17] <RocketBoy> and the James May thing
[11:17] <RocketBoy> and that photo was the one show
[11:18] <RocketBoy> so the odds are pretty high
[11:18] <RocketBoy> don't ask me why
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[11:19] <RocketBoy> Darkside: we just have to worry about wet nylon line dangling from the power line
[11:19] <Darkside> yeah
[11:19] <DL7AD> SP9UOB-Tom: does you balloon beep ?
[11:19] <Darkside> at least in our case it was dry
[11:20] <Darkside> we could just cut it and pull the lin over
[11:20] <LeoBodnar> ...and standing knee-deep in mud pulling the said wet nylon line
[11:20] <SP9UOB-Tom> DL7AD: i didnt hear anything here
[11:20] <RocketBoy> yeah - best to get it turned off
[11:20] <daveake> number10 had one over an 11kV power line, on a dry day, so a cut of the line freed it
[11:21] <RocketBoy> actually I remember - one other incident on launch - where an under filled balloon dragged a payload over 2 power lines
[11:22] <RocketBoy> one after the other
[11:22] <DL7AD> SP9UOB-Tom: what about WSPR ?
[11:22] <daveake> I bet that was tense
[11:22] <RocketBoy> twas
[11:22] <LeoBodnar> You should know lol
[11:22] <LeoBodnar> and Upu too
[11:22] <RocketBoy> good adrenaline rush though
[11:22] <daveake> hah
[11:22] <SP9UOB-Tom> DL7AD: disabled, 4 minutes @300mA its too much
[11:22] <Upu> lol
[11:23] <LeoBodnar> We need to do it again
[11:23] <daveake> What do you think of flights that take off horizontally, LeoBodnar ?
[11:24] <DF2MZ> just sent the log by e-mail Tom
[11:24] <LeoBodnar> All beautiful flying machines do
[11:24] <Upu> haha
[11:24] <SP9UOB-Tom> thanks
[11:24] <daveake> :)
[11:24] <LeoBodnar> ugly things go straight up
[11:25] <DF2MZ> a rocket isn't ugly
[11:25] <LeoBodnar> Grace is slow
[11:25] <DL7AD> LeoBodnar: this night B-34 went into strange states. first it made double beep on two frequencies permanently. then it went to signle beep several times a second and after a while it stopped transmitting. then again some beep groups from time to time.
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[11:26] <LeoBodnar> Well it was at about -65C at the time. I am not sure whet electronics is supposed to do at that temperatures
[11:26] <LeoBodnar> That was definitely not intended
[11:27] <DL7AD> LeoBodnar: indeed. even my frigde is not that cold :P
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[11:30] <DF2MZ> beer at -65 °C is just too cold
[11:31] <DL7AD> have a look to german camera: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=d1VLo-S617M :P
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[11:35] <DF2MZ> Tom what kind of antenna are you using on the balloon? For the 15m beacon?
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[11:39] <SP9UOB-Tom> DF2MZ: vertical dipole 1/2 lambda
[11:39] <DF2MZ> center feed or end feed?
[11:39] <SP9UOB-Tom> DF2MZ: got the mail - thanjks
[11:39] <DF2MZ> yw
[11:39] <SP9UOB-Tom> DF2MZ: center feed
[11:39] <SP9UOB-Tom> DF2MZ: https://plus.google.com/photos/108111435264693957520/albums/5962384967562756657?partnerid=gplp0
[11:40] <Upu> going to start clearing payloads from the tracker
[11:40] <x-f> SP5NVX airborne too
[11:40] <LeoBodnar> daveake Upu thanks for your help yesterday! Julie too!
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[11:40] <daveake> np :)
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[11:41] <Upu> no probs
[11:41] <Upu> was fun
[11:41] <LeoBodnar> Upu: I got B snapshot
[11:41] <Upu> well can leave those on a little
[11:41] <LeoBodnar> indeed
[11:41] <Upu> http://imgur.com/a/8gPVe#1
[11:41] <DF2MZ> thanks Tom nice pictures
[11:42] <daveake> LeoBodnar Pix from yesterday https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/368443/HAB/LaunchAThonPix.zip
[11:42] <DF2MZ> the signal was pretty loud sometimes yesterday
[11:42] <DF2MZ> always significant QSB
[11:42] <LeoBodnar> Tom, do you fill in the hangar?
[11:43] <SP9UOB-Tom> LeoBodnar: not this time
[11:43] <SP9UOB-Tom> i have to avoid carryng h2 cylinder in my car
[11:43] <SP9UOB-Tom> :-)
[11:44] <tweetBot> @daveake: Google Earth model of yesterday's flight showing how CLOUDY successfully landed SNOW on Holland! http://t.co/Cbf3SK0SPz #raspberrypi #UKHAS
[11:44] <MLow> daveake: thats really neat
[11:44] <daveake> I didn't do it :)
[11:46] <MLow> still really cool
[11:46] <daveake> it is
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[11:47] <raspTortoise> where did cloudy end up?
[11:47] Nick change: KipK_away -> KipK
[11:47] <daveake> no idea :p
[11:47] <daveake> batteries ran out last night
[11:48] <number10> only suitable for 26kv http://www.arco.co.uk/product?productcode=1457900 so you have to know your power line types
[11:48] <Steve_G0TDJ> Excellent pics LeoBodnar Thanks
[11:48] <daveake> number10 Added to your chase kit then? :p
[11:48] <number10> :)
[11:49] <eroomde> Steve_G0TDJ: i think daveak's message was aimed at Leobodnar, rather than using LeoBodnar in the possessive
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[11:49] <eroomde> such ambiguity could be removed with correct use of grammar
[11:49] <Steve_G0TDJ> Ah! Sorry daveake I thught Leo was posting the images
[11:50] <eroomde> i once sat next to someone who was a natural language processing researcher
[11:50] <eroomde> To illustrate why his field was difficult he just said
[11:50] <LeoBodnar> I was on observer to them peing posted
[11:50] <eroomde> Time flies like an arrow, fruit flies like a banana
[11:50] <LeoBodnar> *being
[11:50] <Steve_G0TDJ> :-)
[11:51] <eroomde> and then i understood that his field was difficult
[11:51] <LeoBodnar> *their maybe
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[11:52] <LeoBodnar> summon Willdude123
[11:53] <LeoBodnar> Steve_G0TDJ well I was modelling in the shots so I take your thanks anyway
[11:53] <Steve_G0TDJ> :-)
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[11:54] <x-f> number10, what transmitter did you use on ANU?
[11:54] <LeoBodnar> Tom, who's the guy in a suit and tie?
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[11:54] <eroomde> 2014 resolution: stop writing whole python scripts to do an awk one-liner
[11:54] <number10> rfm22b x-f
[11:55] <VK4HIA> upu- what was cloundys' payload?
[11:55] <Darkside> eroomde: hahaha
[11:55] <Darkside> eroomde: next you'll be using sed and regexes
[11:55] <LeoBodnar> awk is paradise
[11:55] <eroomde> i just wrote something needlessly complicated to turn a csv of position data into a kml
[11:56] <Darkside> and then you'll be writing perl one liners
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[11:56] <VK4HIA> fat fingers
[11:56] <Darkside> eroomde: you can do it with awk?
[11:56] <eroomde> then redid it as a 3-line bash script
[11:56] <eroomde> no, not going near perl
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[11:56] <Darkside> i used a pthon library to do that last
[11:56] <eroomde> Darkside: yes
[11:56] <Darkside> python*
[11:56] <x-f> number10, thanks, it was slowly drifting about 1 kHz from one side to another and then back, otherwise it was strong and stable, got decodes from 0.5deg
[11:56] <eroomde> Darkside: do what exactly?
[11:57] <Darkside> parse a flight log, and output a kml
[11:57] <number10> thats pretty good x-f
[11:57] <eroomde> munge the data to a kml with python? yes, that was how i did it first. but it was much quicker in bash
[11:57] <Darkside> hh ok
[11:57] <eroomde> this wasn't a flight log but th principle would be the same
[11:57] <Darkside> i guess you need to supply a file with the appropriate chunk of xml?
[11:57] <eroomde> yes
[11:57] <number10> most people seemed to do better than me at tracking
[11:57] <eroomde> i just sed-ed it into that
[11:58] <Darkside> yeah
[11:58] <Darkside> that makes sense
[11:58] <LeoBodnar> awk is good for anything apart from binary files i/o
[11:58] <Darkside> i've done that before, when i used to code java
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[11:58] <Darkside> as in, creating a kml file that way
[11:58] <eroomde> i wonder if awk+gnuparallel is the 'big data paradigm' everyone has been waiting for
[11:59] <eroomde> (I'm not sure if i'm being serious)
[11:59] <Darkside> heh
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[11:59] <Darkside> ok gnight all
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[11:59] <LeoBodnar> Microsoft needs to release VisualAWK
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[11:59] <Darkside> flying VK7 -> VK3 -> VK5 tomorrow
[12:00] <eroomde> microsoft needs to make a proper posix terminal
[12:00] <LeoBodnar> gn Darkside
[12:00] <eroomde> then they might have a more usable OS
[12:00] <eroomde> i'm still really impressed with the BSDs
[12:00] <eroomde> don;t want them as my desktop, but for Correctness they're really good
[12:01] <eroomde> using them in the firing bay for stuff where i might use linux, just because they're more solid and better documented
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[12:23] <Willdude123> Has anyone here ever made a voice QSO with NA1SS?
[12:24] <DF2MZ> no
[12:25] <DF2MZ> tried a couple of times
[12:25] <Willdude123> Heh
[12:25] <Willdude123> Well, you may as well keep trying
[12:25] <fsphil> I tried when doug was up there
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[12:25] <fsphil> they haven't been doing it very often since
[12:26] <Willdude123> Blargh
[12:26] <DF2MZ> well, I listened to Luca Parmitano he was quite active
[12:26] <Willdude123> Funny how you refer to them by first names
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[12:26] <Willdude123> What about Chris/
[12:26] <DF2MZ> but it was like 'Good evening, you are 59, 73"
[12:26] <DF2MZ> like contesting
[12:26] <fsphil> first name becuase I can't spell doug's surname :)
[12:26] <DF2MZ> not too interesting actually
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[12:27] <Willdude123> Right
[12:27] <DF2MZ> you can't have a chat, not even a short one
[12:27] <Willdude123> Amateur satellites may well be more interesting
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[12:27] <Willdude123> I'm trying to decide whether to get a duplexer
[12:27] <fsphil> it's quite neat getting a packet repeated by the iss
[12:27] <DF2MZ> they just have such massive QRM up there
[12:28] <fsphil> there's a great video of I think doug operating the radio
[12:28] <fsphil> what you can hear on it is just a mess
[12:28] <DF2MZ> as soon as they call the get 100s of responses
[12:28] <Willdude123> Is it worth trying?
[12:28] <Willdude123> Could arrange a school contact maybe
[12:28] <DF2MZ> I stopped trying
[12:29] <fsphil> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=h73EYcyszf8
[12:29] <Willdude123> Ah I think I saw that
[12:30] <Willdude123> I am thinking about getting one of these http://www.arrowantennas.com/arrowii/146-437.html
[12:30] <fsphil> all thinkpad laptops
[12:30] <Willdude123> That a bad thing?
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[12:31] <DF2MZ> Looks good Willdude123
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[12:31] <S_Mark_> anyone here a bt engineer?
[12:31] <chrisstubbs> I was for 2 weeks
[12:32] <S_Mark_> for a couple of days now, broadband <1mb and no dialtone on phone. have reported fault but no news yet
[12:32] <DF2MZ> what is bt?
[12:32] <S_Mark_> BT - UK phone company
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[12:32] <Willdude123> I just need to decide whether to get a duplexer
[12:32] <fsphil> Bloody Terrible
[12:32] <chrisstubbs> haha
[12:32] <S_Mark_> haha
[12:32] <S_Mark_> agreed
[12:33] <DF2MZ> we have such T-guys too in Germany
[12:33] <Willdude123> If I get a duplexer then I will have to use half duplex on a single radio
[12:33] <Willdude123> But I'm not sure if I need either a full duplex or another radio
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[12:33] <DF2MZ> depends what you want to do
[12:34] <DF2MZ> SSB/CW is difficult without full duplex
[12:34] <Willdude123> I think most sats are fm
[12:34] <DF2MZ> no
[12:35] <DF2MZ> at this time most are linear transponders
[12:35] <DF2MZ> FM is a waste of resources
[12:35] <Willdude123> Ah right
[12:35] <Willdude123> So they just chuck out whatever mode gets put in?
[12:35] <DF2MZ> yes, but don't use FM on them
[12:35] <Willdude123> Right.
[12:36] <Willdude123> Will inquire in #amsat
[12:36] <mfa298> for full duplex you either need two seperate radios, or a radio with two seperate radios inside (like the ts-2000)
[12:36] <Willdude123> Yeah
[12:36] <Willdude123> Do I need it though?
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[12:36] <DF2MZ> For linear transponder you need it
[12:37] <mfa298> or a single radiowill do half duplex as long as it can do cross band split operation
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[12:37] <DF2MZ> there are already too many guys on the sats who don't have control of their signals
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[12:38] <DF2MZ> I am using an FT-847
[12:38] <DF2MZ> you get good used ones for under 1000$
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[12:40] <Willdude123> Is the FT-847 just like the 857 but with full duples?
[12:40] <Willdude123> *duplex
[12:42] <DF2MZ> http://www.yaesu.com/indexVS.cfm?cmd=DisplayProducts&ProdCatID=102&encProdID=1F9F41E47B926F9590C43C638C5EFD00
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[12:42] <DF2MZ> FT-857 is very different
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[12:46] <mfa298> best bet is to download the brochure/manual and have a read
[12:47] <Willdude123> OK
[12:49] <DF2MZ> if you want current production, go for the IC-9100
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[12:50] <Willdude123> DF2MZ: that's about £2000 out of my price range
[12:51] <mfa298> of the older radios the 847 probably beats the ts-2000 for sat work as it looks like both receivers are all modes. The TS-2000 probably wins out in other categories.
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[12:52] <ei3kd> Hi all, is seba6 HF continuous, or every few minutes?
[12:53] <DF2MZ> the digital beacon is once a minute, the cw beacon once each 5 minutes
[12:53] <Willdude123> FT-847 looks tempting. I think I'll buy one of those arrows, with a duplexer, and try it with my HT
[12:53] <Willdude123> Then I can probably take out the duplexer if needed
[12:53] <eroomde> i don't care much for ham-radio politics
[12:53] <ei3kd> DF2MZ tnx, I heard cw+digital once a few minutes ago, but nil since
[12:53] <ec4tr> Received in Madrid IN80 21.115 and some pulses? in 434.350
[12:54] <eroomde> but lookign at the IP issues makes me think that D-STAR is a carbunckle
[12:54] <eroomde> and should die quickly
[12:54] <DF2MZ> oh really ei3kd?
[12:54] <fsphil> agreed
[12:54] <ei3kd> DF2MZ yes, using 3 x 3el on 15m
[12:54] <DF2MZ> what was cw carrier frequency?
[12:54] <fsphil> I'm still surprised dstar is even allowed
[12:54] <eroomde> if i were to ever design a digital mode (strictly hypothetical) it would have to be completely free
[12:55] <Willdude123> Not in the US I don't think
[12:55] <Willdude123> eroomde: see codec 2
[12:55] <DF2MZ> wow, that's quite an antenna!
[12:55] <eroomde> even if that restricts some convolutional error correction codes with pleasing performance
[12:55] <ei3kd> DF2MZ I would say cw was a bit high, maybe 2200Hz in WF with rig on 21.115
[12:55] <fsphil> there should be enough bandwidth on 144mhz to allow opus to be used
[12:56] <DF2MZ> ok, it was on 21116.7 yesterday
[12:56] <DF2MZ> haven't heard it today with my vertical
[12:56] <fsphil> I just received some commas and numbers. could just be the noise playing tricks on me
[12:56] <DF2MZ> did you decode digital or cw?
[12:57] <eroomde> i'm sad arithmetic codes are patented. they seem nice
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[12:57] <ei3kd> DF2MZ unfortunately I had dl-fldigi set to the wrong payload, so no decode
[12:57] <fsphil> I don't think they are anymore eroomde
[12:57] <fsphil> at least they re-added them to libjpeg recently
[12:57] Nick change: KipK -> KipK_away
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[12:58] <Willdude123> http://www.law.cornell.edu/cfr/text/47/97.309
[12:59] <Willdude123> I'm not sure if D-Star breaks it
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[13:01] <mfa298> good job US law doesn't apply in the UK then
[13:02] <Willdude123> Not really. I think it's sensible
[13:02] <fsphil> I would consider d-star to be a secret code
[13:02] <Willdude123> ^^
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[13:04] <DF2MZ> I agree Will
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[13:04] <fsphil> it should be possible to add arithmetic coding support to ssdv, but I don't think it would gain very much
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[13:05] <eroomde> fsphil: you should tackle mackay
[13:06] <fsphil> I'm not sure I have the maths tools to deal with it
[13:06] <eroomde> you intuitively get all this stuff, your ssdv code more than demonstrates you can get half-way into the book withough breaking a sweat
[13:06] <eroomde> it's *just* a question of translating mathematical notation to something you can visualise
[13:06] <fsphil> I think I have a pdf of it somewhere
[13:07] <eroomde> which is really all I do with maths 90% of the time. you start at the nicely typeset equation and try to translate that into 'what are you actually saying>'
[13:08] <fsphil> yea I try to get a mental image of something
[13:08] <fsphil> even code
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[13:08] <eroomde> that's the trick for me
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[13:10] <eroomde> thought even in the solutions section i sometimes get stuck with his derivation, i.e. from one line of maths to the next line, i think 'woa, how did you get from this to that'. it's usually just a question of trying out all the rules for half an hour or so to see if you can transform it into something that looks right]
[13:10] <eroomde> 99% of it is manipulating it according to: chain rule, product rules, bayes rule
[13:10] <eroomde> product rule*
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[13:13] <fsphil> now to see if my nexus can view pdfs
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[13:14] <k> oi
[13:14] <fsphil> aye aye
[13:14] Nick change: k -> Guest15530
[13:15] <Guest15530> I am Brazil, and you?
[13:15] <eroomde> uk here
[13:15] <eroomde> greetings
[13:15] <eroomde> and good morning, I suppose
[13:15] <Guest15530> pedro.costa@sistemajangadeiro.com.br
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[13:16] <eroomde> that's you Guest15530 ?
[13:17] <Guest15530> Good day, is exactly 10:16
[13:17] <Guest15530> ok
[13:18] <Guest15530> I bought my raspberrypi two months, I'm trying to make a link of audio over ip, to apply to broadcast
[13:19] <Guest15530> Has anyone managed to close a rtp link?
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[13:21] <Guest15530> Has anyone managed to close a rtp link?
[13:22] <fsphil> I've not done much audio stuff on the Pi at all
[13:23] <fsphil> last time I tried the audio driver crashed
[13:23] <fsphil> hmm.. the nexus has a pdf reader but i can only launch it from firefox
[13:23] <fsphil> weird
[13:25] <mfa298> I've sent video over the network using cvlc or ffmpeg from the pi
[13:26] <mfa298> but that doesn't use any of the audio hardware on the pi
[13:26] <fsphil> which can only playback anyway
[13:27] <Guest15530> already found several projects using video stream, audio however few and almost none have worked, wanted to stream audio using a microphone, I have a usb audio adapter converter
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[13:28] <mfa298> the first bit would be to get an audio stream from the microphone in a useful format. Then I'd use clvc or ffmpeg to put it into an rtp stream
[13:29] <fsphil> vlc will be able to do that
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[13:30] <mfa298> streaming from a wav/mp3 file is easy enough in vlc - (it's a great test of how resilient a network is)
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[13:30] <Guest15530> you have some tutorial, hint, site where I can search?
[13:31] <mfa298> for getting a stream out of vlc there's a lot of good examples on the vlc site (and google)
[13:31] <mfa298> the hard decision tends to be how you want to stream it.
[13:32] <Guest15530> unable to make the mp3 stream and the stream using VLC, but I can not access using a computer, only the own raspberrypi
[13:34] <Willdude123> Hmm. I'm finding the maths in Computer Networks by Tanenbaum to be rather difficult
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[13:35] <eroomde> Willdude123: it's designed for undergraduates, you're 14, so to a first approximation, you probably should find it difficulter. but don't bve put off
[13:35] <eroomde> what specifically in this case is causing you problems?
[13:36] <mfa298> Guest15530: this may not be the best place for audio streaming help. I've only got examples that are likely to confuse even more.
[13:36] <Reb-SM3ULC> Guest15530: what input?
[13:37] <Willdude123> eroomde: I could understand the first chapter reasonably well, and solved a few of the problems.
[13:37] <Willdude123> But it gets complex at question 9
[13:38] <eroomde> i don't have the book so i don't ahve much context, but if you have a specific extract with a specific bit of maths that you don't yet fully grok, i might be able to help
[13:38] <Guest15530> <Reb-SM3ULC> Behringer: U-CONTROL UCA222
[13:39] <Guest15530> my input Behringer: U-CONTROL UCA222
[13:39] <Reb-SM3ULC> Guest15530: cvlc is a great choice to begin with, as mfa298 said
[13:40] <mfa298> Guest15530: have you got the input device working locally. Audio on the Pi is known to be challenging (and buggy)
[13:42] <Guest15530> I managed to do the RTP stream, but I can only play on Pi itself, in my notebook does not recognize it, but it runs in pi, both the server and the player, I used ffmpeg
[13:43] <fsphil> if seba6 is still flying, it should be a good chunk of the way over russia now, not too far from alaska
[13:43] <Guest15530> the idea is to make an audio stream between two raspberry, for use in broadcast
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[13:45] <Guest15530> any suggestions besides the vlc?
[13:45] <Willdude123> eroomde: well, I had a peek at chapter 2 with deals with fourier analysis. That looks confusing. But before that there's the problem set for chapter one.
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[13:46] <Willdude123> ANd I'm just trying to locate the bit I struggled with
[13:46] <mfa298> vlc or ffmpeg are good for point to point streaming. If it's for lots of listeners you might need somethign else
[13:48] <eroomde> fourier analysis might not make much sense until you've done some calculaus
[13:48] <mfa298> Willdude123: fourier analysis might be a bit beyond you at the moment (I think it was at least 2nd year maths at Uni when I did it). Although in particular places it might be possible for someone here to explain what it's doing in a particlar case.
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[13:49] <eroomde> 1st year maths i think
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[13:50] <Reb-SM3ULC> Guest15530: you can play with sox and/or netcat
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[13:51] <eroomde> Willdude123: fourier analysis in a nutshell
[13:51] <Willdude123> eroomde: it applies to nutshells? :P
[13:51] <Willdude123> eroomde: should I go off and study some "high-school" algebra so I at least fit the prereqs for most calculus courses?
[13:52] <eroomde> you can take a time-series dataset (eg a wav file, or the price of cheese vs the month of the year, or the temperature of a swimming pool each second, or whatever) and do a transform on it that shows it in a different way, as a collection of frequencies and phases
[13:52] <eroomde> so that's take a trivial example
[13:53] <eroomde> you ahve you ntx2 sending a single tone
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[13:53] <mfa298> in terms of Computer Networks you might not need to know much about fourier analysis, just what the results are.
[13:53] <eroomde> in time series, if you record the voltage at the receiver vs time, it looks like a sine wave
[13:53] <eroomde> yes?
[13:54] <eroomde> eg http://forum.unity3d.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=57480&d=1371803533
[13:55] <mfa298> the first example of fourier analysis I came accross was what radio signals looked like. They're uually described as a set of varying sine waves (time domain). But it's often more use to look at them in the frequency domain (as you see on the websdr).
[13:55] <Willdude123> Sort of
[13:56] <Willdude123> Not really
[13:57] <eroomde> so, if i say my radio is just transmittinga 434MHz carrier wave, if you record the voltage against time at the transmitter or receiver, it'll be a line wiggling up and down 434 million times every second
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[13:58] <Willdude123> Right
[13:58] <eroomde> or if an opera singer sings a pure note into a microphone, and you record the voltage output, it might be a line wiggling up and down 2000 times a second, perhaps
[13:59] <Willdude123> Right
[13:59] <eroomde> well we describe that wiggle as sinusoidal - it's shaped like a sine wave
[13:59] <eroomde> rather than a triangular wave or a square wave or something else
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[14:00] <eroomde> we can define a sine wave with a picture as being the point projected opnto an axis by a point orbiting a spot ina circle
[14:00] <eroomde> a picturea speaks 1000 words
[14:00] <eroomde> http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/8/89/Unfasor.gif
[14:01] <eroomde> look at the circle at the bottom
[14:01] <Willdude123> Okay
[14:01] <eroomde> the point on the 'x' axis is the 'projection' of the point on the circumference of the circle onto the x axis as it goes around at a constant rate
[14:02] <eroomde> the thing coming out above it is what you would get if you put a pen on the point on the x-axis of the circle, and had that over a conveyor-belt of paper moving underneath it
[14:02] <eroomde> that would draw a sinusoid onto the paper moving underneath
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[14:03] <eroomde> can you visualise that?
[14:03] <Willdude123> Erm
[14:04] <Willdude123> Yup
[14:04] <eroomde> cool
[14:04] <eroomde> so it's just like a plotter
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[14:04] <eroomde> ok
[14:04] <eroomde> http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/9/92/Sumafasores.gif
[14:04] <eroomde> look at that
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[14:04] <eroomde> all the waves coming out of it have the same frequency
[14:05] <eroomde> because they're all from the same circle rotating at the same rate
[14:05] <eroomde> however, they are all drawn from lines with a different radius and a different agle relative to each other
[14:06] <Willdude123> Ah right
[14:06] <eroomde> so the blue line is drawn from a rotating point with a different radius that the red and purcple lines
[14:06] <Miek> ooh, that's a nice way to visualise phase difference, i didn't know about that
[14:06] <eroomde> and it's angle is also different
[14:06] <Willdude123> I sorta get that now
[14:06] <eroomde> ok, so we're going to introduce a couple of new terms now but they are just different names for what we've just been seeing
[14:07] <eroomde> all of those rotating radiuses are called 'phasors'
[14:07] <Willdude123> Right
[14:07] <eroomde> and they can be described with three properties: an amplitude (length of the radius) and frequency (how many cycles per second they do) and a phase (their angle relative to each other)
[14:08] <Willdude123> That gif is beautiful.
[14:08] <Willdude123> Sorry go on
[14:08] <eroomde> so i could completely describe a phasor to you by saying: it does 27 cycles per second (27Hz) with a radius of 2cm on your screen and a phase offset of 45 degrees
[14:08] <eroomde> it is beautiful yes
[14:09] <eroomde> i could just as easily describe your ntx2 transmitting as being a phasor
[14:09] <Willdude123> Right
[14:10] <Willdude123> On a different and unrelated note ,is it possible to tell if a transmission has CTCSS tones in it from a recording from an SDR?
[14:10] <Willdude123> I'm not activating a repeater that I want to
[14:10] <eroomde> it does 434 million cycles per second with an amplitude of 2V into your antenna, and a phase of zero degrees (phase is a relative term)
[14:10] <adamgreig> quite a related note there Willdude123
[14:11] <eroomde> yes, you'll be ablso to answer your own question soon willdude
[14:11] <eroomde> so, before we go on, are you know roughly happy with this concept of a 'phasor'?
[14:12] <eroomde> i.e. you see what i mean if i say that in that gif there are 3 phasors, all with the same frequency but with different amplitudes and phases
[14:14] <Willdude123> Yep
[14:14] <Willdude123> I get that
[14:14] <Willdude123> Really? That was completely unrelated I thought
[14:15] <eroomde> not unrelated
[14:15] <eroomde> ok so
[14:15] <eroomde> now i'm going to blow your mind
[14:15] <Willdude123> OK,
[14:15] <eroomde> you can describe *any signal* you can think of as the sum of a bunch of phasors
[14:15] <Willdude123> WOah
[14:16] <eroomde> a recording of you singling along to an erasure cd
[14:16] <eroomde> the temperature of my armpit throughout the year
[14:16] <eroomde> the movement of comets in the sky vs time
[14:16] <eroomde> whatever
[14:16] <mattbrejza> http://www.reactiongifs.com/wp-content/uploads/2011/09/mind_blown.gif
[14:16] <eroomde> you can describe it as a much of phasors added together
[14:17] <eroomde> so let's take a simpler example
[14:17] <eroomde> imagine a square wave
[14:17] <Willdude123> eroomde: never heard of erasure. Well I have but I am 99% sure it's not what you mean
[14:17] <eroomde> can you sort of see that a square wave has a fundamental frequency that could be approximated by a sinusoid
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[14:18] <Willdude123> Kinda
[14:18] <eroomde> eg, a square wave has 10 cycles or pulses per se ond
[14:18] <eroomde> or rather, imagine a square wave has 10 cycles or pulses per second
[14:18] <eroomde> well, then compare it to a sin wave of 10Hz
[14:18] <eroomde> they sort of look perhaps slightly similar
[14:18] <Willdude123> OK
[14:19] <Willdude123> Well, except one's square
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[14:19] <eroomde> yes, so the sin wave is a pretty crap approximation of the sqare wave
[14:19] <eroomde> so the sin wave is one phasor
[14:19] <Willdude123> Right
[14:19] <eroomde> as i just mentioned, we can describe any singla we want as the sum of a series of phasors
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[14:20] <eroomde> so let's see if we can get closer to the shape of a square wave by adding another phasor
[14:21] <eroomde> what we're doing when we add two phasors is we stick a new rotating radius onto the end of our first rotating radius, or more correctly, we add another phasor onto the end of our first phasor
[14:21] <eroomde> this gif should demonstrate that
[14:22] <eroomde> it starts just with one phasor (or sinusoid) then it progressively adds more phasors until the output of the conveyor-belts looks a lot more like a square wave
[14:22] <eroomde> observer
[14:22] <eroomde> http://24.media.tumblr.com/dc2b4d5c066cbd9f6022d8427fe58d8c/tumblr_mhlswzuNIY1qfg7o3o1_r1_400.gif
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[14:22] <eroomde> observe*
[14:23] <eroomde> do you sort of see what i'm getting at?
[14:24] <mattbrejza> http://gif-explode.com/ might be useful
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[14:25] <eroomde> you can keep on adding phasors together to make something that looks more and more like a square wave, the more phasors you add. for the square wave, you keep on adding phasors that are smaller and smaller (the circles are smaller and smaller, and of higher frequencies)
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[14:28] <eroomde> Willdude123: still with me or has your brain melted?
[14:29] <Reb-SM3ULC> :)
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[14:30] <number10> shame Willdude123 - there are not many places you could get such free personal tuition
[14:31] <Willdude123> eroomde: sorry
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[14:31] <Willdude123> Was just shooting some homophobic Chinese people/
[14:31] <Willdude123> Wekk]
[14:31] <Willdude123> *well
[14:32] <Willdude123> Well, people playing as CHinese people
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[14:33] <eroomde> sounds like a waste of time
[14:34] <Willdude123> It really is
[14:34] <Willdude123> But it's a fun game so
[14:35] <Willdude123> But I could be doing something more productive
[14:35] <eroomde> you won't get anywhere with your studies if you can't apply yourself for a few hours on one topic without being distracted
[14:36] <eroomde> especially if someone is taking the time to try and explain something to you
[14:36] <Willdude123> Right sorry
[14:36] <Willdude123> I needed a break though it was tough to get my head around
[14:37] <es5nhc> Hello World! Just got back from the trip
[14:37] <es5nhc> Just read x-f's post on Estonian ham forum
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[14:38] <number10> hi es5nhc
[14:39] <x-f> looks like it won't reach you, es5nhc :(
[14:39] <es5nhc> Yup
[14:39] <es5nhc> Descending
[14:39] <es5nhc> Interesting that ES8TJM is hearing it
[14:39] <x-f> but i'm very impressed by ES9TJM's performance, he's way outside the blue circle
[14:40] <Willdude123> eroomde: so you just add phasors on top of phasors to turn a sine wave into more of a square wave. Am I correct in assuming a perfect square wave is impossible (in the same way that e doesn't really exust(?
[14:40] <es5nhc> Just in case, what's the params?
[14:41] <es5nhc> for SP3OSJ
[14:41] <x-f> now spot on 144.700
[14:41] <es5nhc> Though... looks like ES8TJM has also lost reception
[14:41] <es5nhc> last report 3 mins ago
[14:41] <eroomde> Willdude123: in as much as they both need an infintely long sequence of phasors/numbers to describe them, yes
[14:41] <SpeedEvil> Willdude123: exactly
[14:41] <x-f> i just have a veeery weak RTTY :/
[14:42] <eroomde> e does exist!
[14:42] <eroomde> this is a philosophical point
[14:42] <es5nhc> so did the balloon start leaking?
[14:43] <eroomde> you can exactly describe a square wave in the time domain, but in the phasor domain it takes an infinitely long sequence. that doesn't mean it 'doesn't exist', it just means i can't perfectly represent it with the way i've chosen to represent it
[14:43] <eroomde> take for example pi
[14:43] <adamgreig> and your time domain signal is assumed to be infinitely repeating
[14:43] <adamgreig> but whatever
[14:43] <eroomde> in decimal, i can't exactly represent it, but that doesn't mean it doesn't exist
[14:43] <OE8SPQ> Exist a hompage/infopage? Is it this Baloon? https://18146902043181806997.googlegroups.com/attach/b52f16ba2b61b548/1.jpg?part=4&view=1&vt=ANaJVrFR2Ywete6omDmG9AYi1U_4OewdZaNlha8GDltabsdUGItAdluTOJSt2hPD72VEB_n6Alzx9SPjMxzQuDmXfgDsHnz3SbXteq6DvSrqO6fjQ-nbWOg
[14:43] <x-f> es5nhc, rain clouds on the radar
[14:43] <eroomde> i can perfectly represent it some other way
[14:43] <adamgreig> like in base pi? :P
[14:44] <eroomde> take a circle whose circumference is C and whose radius is r
[14:44] <eroomde> pi = C/(2*r)
[14:44] <Willdude123> eroomde: right
[14:44] <eroomde> there, I have perfectly represented pi
[14:44] <Willdude123> Okay.
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[14:46] <Willdude123> eroomde: interesting
[14:46] <Willdude123> Very interesting how you can't actually represent it
[14:46] <Willdude123> In decimal
[14:46] <Willdude123> Wait so how do I solve my CTCSS problem?
[14:47] <eroomde> ok so we've not quite finished the puzzle just yet
[14:47] <eroomde> let's say i give you a bunch of phasors in a box
[14:47] <Willdude123> Right
[14:47] <eroomde> and you want the 'recipe' for how to make a square wave
[14:47] <eroomde> how should i give it to you?
[14:47] <Willdude123> Okay
[14:48] <Willdude123> PDF?
[14:48] <eroomde> i could give you a list: 1 phasor of 10Hz and amplitude 1 + another phasor of 30Hz and redius 0.5 + another phasor of 50Hz + radius 0.3, say
[14:49] <eroomde> that's just an example
[14:49] <eroomde> I could also give it to you graphically, i.e. a graph of the amplitude of the phasor in the 'y' axis and the frequency of it in the 'x' axis
[14:50] <Willdude123> How how does the frequency increase?
[14:50] <eroomde> it might look a bit like this
[14:50] <eroomde> http://www.johnloomis.org/ece303L/lab4/series_demo/Fourier_Square_01.png
[14:50] <eroomde> dB is amplitude in on this particular graph
[14:51] <eroomde> harmonic is just a multiplier of the 'fundmamental' frequency
[14:51] <eroomde> so if the fundamental frequency is 10Hz, the '2nd harminic' would be 20Hz
[14:51] <eroomde> 3rd harmonic = 30Hz etc
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[14:52] <eroomde> so each vertical line there is a phasor, and the position of the line on the x axis tells you the frequency of the phasor, and the height of the line tells you its amplitude
[14:53] <eroomde> that's just another way, this time a graphical way, of giving you a recipe of how to build this particular signal from phasors
[14:53] <Willdude123> Right
[14:54] <eroomde> well, that graph is also just signal strength vs frequency
[14:54] <eroomde> i.e. is a frequency-domain representation of a square wave
[14:54] <eroomde> you're actually quite used to seeing frequency-domain representations of of time-series signals
[14:54] <eroomde> e.g. here's one of rtty
[14:54] <eroomde> http://www.nonstopsystems.com/radio/spectrum-RTTY-4545-170-DM780.JPG
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[14:55] <eroomde> that graph is actually just a recipe of phasors for described the voltage-vs-time signal that is soming into your soundcard from your radio
[14:55] <eroomde> for describing*
[14:56] <ike> did you know DDS AD9850 does it have more powerfull odd or even harmonics?
[14:56] <Willdude123> OK
[14:56] <Willdude123> Makes sense
[14:56] <eroomde> we more normally call this process - converting a time-series signal into a frequency representation - as a 'fourier transform'
[14:57] <eroomde> and 'fourier theory' is all about convering between time and frequency representations of a signal
[14:57] <eroomde> this is the 'fourier series' of a square wave: http://www.johnloomis.org/ece303L/lab4/series_demo/Fourier_Square_01.png
[14:57] <SpeedEvil> The annoying bit is the actual details of the mathematics.
[14:57] <eroomde> mr fourier was a mathematician who figured this all out
[14:57] <SpeedEvil> In concept, it can be quite simple.
[14:57] <eroomde> so, your ctcss tone
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[14:58] <eroomde> if it's there, when you take the foutier transform of the signal that the repeater is seeing, you should hopefully see a peak in your fourier transform at the ctcss frequency
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[15:01] <DL7AD> good afternoon.
[15:01] <DL7AD> balloon launched
[15:01] <Willdude123> eroomde: I still don't get the complex equations but I havea good enough understanding now
[15:01] <Willdude123> Thanks
[15:01] <Willdude123> So
[15:02] <Willdude123> How do I look at the fourier transform?
[15:03] <eroomde> i'm not sure in your particular case
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[15:04] <eroomde> you'd need some kind of fm receiver (dongle?) tuned to the freq your transmitting on
[15:04] <eroomde> get an fm decoder and take the fourier transform of it
[15:04] <eroomde> see if you see a peak in the spectrum at the ctcss tone you want
[15:05] <Willdude123> eroomde: I have a recording off the websdr
[15:05] <eroomde> that might help
[15:06] <eroomde> the thing is, you need to convert the fm signal into an audio signal
[15:06] <adamgreig> do you have an audio recording?
[15:06] <ike> some radios have 300KHz audio filter
[15:07] <adamgreig> 300kHz?
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[15:07] <Willdude123> I have an audio signal recorded with audacity through a VAC
[15:07] <ike> I made mistake
[15:07] <ike> 300Hz
[15:07] <adamgreig> Willdude123: if you listen to it, can you hear a low frequency buzzing? :P
[15:07] <adamgreig> odds are reasonable your recording has already cut off any CTCSS that may or may not be present, depending on settings
[15:07] <adamgreig> but if it's there, you'll probably be able to hear it.
[15:08] <eroomde> yeah, a lot of rm receivers have eg 100Hz HPFs on
[15:08] <mfa298> Willdude123: easiest option might be to use your FCD and sdr software as they will be doing some of the sourier for you (depenndong on the software)
[15:08] <eroomde> which kills off much chance of getting rtty from an fm receiver
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[15:08] <eroomde> (relatedly)
[15:08] <mfa298> sdr-radio at least will show you the audio space
[15:08] <Willdude123> mfa298: I can't actually get my SDR to pickup fm signals that are close
[15:09] <Willdude123> When I tx the noise just goes down
[15:09] <mfa298> you might need to remove all antennas for it to see something
[15:10] <mfa298> you should still see the signal, The noise is likely to go down as the reciever adjusts the agc for a strong signal
[15:18] <Willdude123> Right
[15:18] <Willdude123> Can see it
[15:19] <Willdude123> I've just realised, I stutter, but only on the air
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[15:19] <Willdude123> So what am I looking for?
[15:19] <x-f> what happened to the FAST floater from USA?
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[15:22] <ike> SP3OSJ are you here?
[15:22] <ike> I have a question for you
[15:23] <Willdude123> This is so weird
[15:23] <Willdude123> I can't put my words together when operating
[15:23] <mfa298> Willdude123: if you're using something that shows the audio frequenct plot (I'm not sure sdr# does that, sdr-radio does have that as a feature) you should see a spike at the cctss frequency
[15:24] <Willdude123> SDR#
[15:24] <Willdude123> I opened it
[15:24] <Willdude123> Or someone else did
[15:24] <Willdude123> What was wrong with toneburst? :)
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[15:27] <mfa298> I'm not sure sdr# will show you the audio plot which is what you need to look at, although you could try recording the audio from it and then look in audacity
[15:28] <mfa298> you might need to adjust the filters in sdr# though. (possibly just change filter order to 0)
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[15:31] <Willdude123> How do I plot audio in audacity>
[15:32] <eroomde> fsphil: where is vens rising this eve?
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[15:32] <eroomde> skies clear here
[15:32] <fsphil> immediatly after sunset it should be just above where the sun is
[15:32] <fsphil> and a little to the left
[15:33] <fsphil> but you'll have to be quick
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[15:33] <fsphil> it'll be quite low and setting
[15:33] <eroomde> will try
[15:34] <fsphil> it has a lovely cresent at the moment
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[15:34] <fsphil> crescent*
[15:34] <mikestir> I take it that was venus in the sunset pictures from cloudy yesterday?
[15:34] <fsphil> yea
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[15:35] <fsphil> some of the later images have a faint dot that might be jupiter
[15:35] <mikestir> what I assume to be jupiter was quite clear last night as well, later on in the east
[15:35] <fsphil> yea
[15:35] <fsphil> try for that through your binos too eroomde
[15:36] <fsphil> you should be able to make out the galilean moons
[15:36] <eroomde> stellarium was death-by-opengl for me
[15:36] <eroomde> is there something more text-based/
[15:36] <eroomde> oh, heavens-above
[15:36] <adamgreig> stellarium is so great though
[15:36] <fsphil> yep, it's perfect
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[15:39] <fsphil> doesnt accept coordinates in degrees though
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[15:43] <SP9UOB-Tom> Hi all
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[15:43] <ike> SP9UOB-Tom hi
[15:43] <SP9UOB-Tom> any news from 21 MHz :) ?
[15:43] <ike> I have question for you
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[15:44] <SP9UOB-Tom> ike: yes?
[15:44] <ike> about DDS AD9850
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[15:44] <SP9UOB-Tom> ike: im using 9851
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[15:44] <ike> nevermind
[15:44] <ike> so
[15:44] <ike> if I output 19800KHz
[15:44] <ike> will I get 144.800
[15:45] <ike> 19.800+125.000 = 144.800?
[15:45] <ike> 125 is AD9850 base freqeuency
[15:45] <SP9UOB-Tom> ike: that can be image, but -60dB r less
[15:46] <ike> I think that AD9850 is the same as AD9851, but AD9851 have internal PLL that multiply x6 xtal
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[15:46] <SP9UOB-Tom> ike: really not usefull
[15:46] <ike> what about 18.100*8=144.800 is that more practical?
[15:47] <ike> It's too bad that there are not 18.100MHz xtals
[15:47] <fsphil> oh it does
[15:47] <fsphil> I just clicked in the wrong place
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[15:47] <SP9UOB-Tom> You should do this "normal way" and output lets say 12.066 MHz and multply this by 12
[15:47] <fsphil> orion nebula is worth a look too
[15:47] <ike> is 12.066 MHz better than 18.100?
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[15:48] <SP9UOB-Tom> ike: I have 12.0666 MHz crystals for sale if You want :-)
[15:48] <ike> 18 is closer to 144 right?
[15:48] <SP9UOB-Tom> multiplication is easier
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[15:49] <SP9UOB-Tom> x3 x2 x2
[15:49] <ike> how can I multipy by 12? Can I have 1 transistor xtal at 12.066 and then other transistor tuned at 144.800
[15:50] <SP9UOB-Tom> crystal working on 3rd overtone
[15:50] <SP9UOB-Tom> then 2 stages x2
[15:50] <ike> can I do it with 1 stage 4x?
[15:51] <Willdude123> Hmm
[15:51] <Willdude123> I want to get an arrow antenna dual band yagi
[15:51] <Willdude123> But the shipping i s$50
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[15:51] <ike> SP9UOB-Tom there are some LOCO PLL up to 200MHz and 8x multi so 18.100MHz is better than 12.066
[15:52] <ike> if you can find 18.100
[15:52] <ike> Willdude123 you can DIY
[15:52] <mikestir> ike: you could always get one made
[15:52] <Willdude123> ike: true
[15:52] <ike> but they are not cheaper than $2.50
[15:53] <SP9UOB-Tom> ike: x12 was chosen for allmost every pre-dds VHF radios :-)
[15:53] <Willdude123> May well be a little difficult and could be just as expensive
[15:53] <LeoBodnar> what are you guys trying to do?
[15:54] <LeoBodnar> PSK modulation?
[15:54] <ike> LeoBodnar someting that you can do with your eyes closed
[15:54] <ike> ;)
[15:54] <LeoBodnar> oh
[15:54] <ike> cheap APRS
[15:54] <LeoBodnar> I have used CDCE913 for cheap DDS
[15:54] <ike> you can do that with si4063 or si4463
[15:54] <LeoBodnar> *cheap APRS
[15:55] <LeoBodnar> *not sure about cheap, sorry
[15:55] <LeoBodnar> Cheap as in easy or cost per component?
[15:56] <ike> let's say cost and repeatability
[15:56] <ike> so everyone can do it
[15:56] <SP9UOB-Tom> ike: si446x then
[15:56] <ike> I looks like I can sample CDCE913PW
[15:57] <LeoBodnar> do it using MCU internal PLL
[15:57] <LeoBodnar> that would be sleek
[15:57] <nigelvh> si446x can be hard to solder for those inexperienced.
[15:57] <LeoBodnar> I wanted to do it for a long time but never got around to
[15:57] <ike> nigelvh you are so right
[15:57] <ike> it's hard for me to solder
[15:57] <LeoBodnar> use CDCE913
[15:57] <ike> I have played with SMD and I hate it
[15:57] <SP9UOB-Tom> many of modern IC's are hard to solder
[15:57] <nigelvh> Just something to keep in mind if it's a design aimed at general usability
[15:57] <LeoBodnar> it's TSSOP
[15:58] <ike> and SMD require some eagle skills ;)
[15:58] <Willdude123> I doubt it'd be cheap though
[15:58] <ike> those modules are great https://www.tindie.com/products/DORJI_COM/ham-radio-amateur-radio-wireless-audio-module-walkie-talke-module/
[15:59] <ike> but they are not 144
[15:59] <ike> you can use them if you need 434MHz and 30dBm
[15:59] <ike> I basically need module like this but for VHF
[16:00] <ike> and it shouldn't cost more than dual band radio
[16:00] <nigelvh> VHF modules tend not to be terribly cheap.
[16:00] <nigelvh> It's not an ISM band, so there's less incentive to make them
[16:00] <ike> and UHF are like potato chips
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[16:02] <ike> those http://www.ebay.com/itm/SI4432-470MHz-1000m-Wireless-Module-470M-433mhz-Wireless-Communication-Module-/200981576579?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item2ecb6f7b83
[16:02] <ike> are so cheap
[16:02] <ike> too bad that they are not VHF
[16:03] <SP9UOB-Tom> ike: just change matching section
[16:03] <SP9UOB-Tom> ike: and you are on VHF: -)
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[16:04] <SP9UOB-Tom> ike: oh sorry
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[16:04] <SP9UOB-Tom> ike: datasheet says minimum frequency is 240 MHz
[16:04] <nigelvh> Unrelatedly, Looks like I am the lone listener in the US.
[16:04] <nigelvh> Hoping for a chance at seba6
[16:04] <SP9UOB-Tom> nigelvh: HF?
[16:04] <nigelvh> Yeah
[16:04] <SP9UOB-Tom> nigelvh: at about 21 UTC it should be in daytime
[16:05] <nigelvh> Yeah, that's a few hours yet.
[16:05] <SP9UOB-Tom> maybe then
[16:05] <ike> SP9UOB-Tom new version is with si4463 and they can go down to 140MHz
[16:05] <nigelvh> It's just before sunrise here.
[16:06] <nigelvh> But the radio is on, and dl-fldigi is running, so we'll see.
[16:06] <ike> SP9UOB-Tom and just changing matching section is too hard for me, I know what I can't do
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[16:07] <nigelvh> Some WSPR would be cool on a flight sometime too.
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[16:07] <SP9UOB-Tom> nigelvh: i've disabled it
[16:07] <ike> this is just change matching module http://www.ebay.com/itm/Si4463-module-wireless-RF-transceiver-module-Arduino-Picaxe-/201005147060?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item2eccd723b4
[16:07] <SP9UOB-Tom> nigelvh: code is ready and working
[16:08] <nigelvh> Yeah, I've got some WSPR code as well, but haven't run it yet.
[16:08] <SP9UOB-Tom> nigelvh: but that requires 4 minutes TX on
[16:08] <ike> it's doable daytime
[16:08] <nigelvh> Yeah, I just had an unamplified DDS, so it wasn't going too far.
[16:09] <SP9UOB-Tom> nigelvh:i've got US with DDS-60 board
[16:10] <SP9UOB-Tom> and vertical antenna
[16:10] <SP9UOB-Tom> 500mW for 4 minutes will drain batteries quickly
[16:11] <ike> not if you have 1W solar power
[16:12] <nigelvh> Yeah. I just used some little DDS that I threw in with a sparkfun order I had.
[16:12] <nigelvh> Was very very low power output.
[16:12] <nigelvh> But it did work
[16:12] <SP9UOB-Tom> nigelvh: any traces @21.115 MHZ ?
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[16:13] <ike> nigelvh you can ask SP9UOB-Tom for class E amp with DDS
[16:13] <SP9UOB-Tom> nigelvh: should be domex22 once per minute
[16:13] <jcoxon> afternoon
[16:13] <nigelvh> Haven't seen anything on the waterfall, and I would be very interested in a little transistor amp
[16:13] <SP9UOB-Tom> afternoon
[16:14] <SP9UOB-Tom> nigelvh: it is simple - one BS-170 driven by square wave (50% duty)
[16:14] <SP9UOB-Tom> nigelvh: in drain there is L/C tank which resonates on required frequency
[16:15] <SP9UOB-Tom> nigelvh: then simple matching
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[16:15] <nigelvh> Yeah, I was working on a little push pull dealie, but never took the time to get it quite right.
[16:15] <SP9UOB-Tom> nigelvh: google for class-E matching
[16:16] <SP9UOB-Tom> nigelvh: relatively high efficiency
[16:16] <jcoxon> SP9UOB-Tom, any news?
[16:17] <SP9UOB-Tom> jcoxon: nope, at about 21 utc it should be in daylight, so US propagation
[16:18] <SP9UOB-Tom> jcoxon: nigelvh is ready to pickup
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[16:18] <jcoxon> fingers crossed
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[16:19] <nigelvh> Yep. It'll be interesting to see if I pick up anything.
[16:22] <SP9UOB-Tom> nigelvh: few hours
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[16:25] <ike> SP9UOB-Tom why don't you choose 27MHz
[16:26] <ike> those cheap SDR radios can do 27MHz I think
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[16:27] <SP9UOB-Tom> because i cannot lagally transmit @27 MHz
[16:27] <ike> R820T 24 - 1766 MHz
[16:28] <ike> 26.957 MHz 27.283 MHz 326 kHz 27.120 MHz Worldwide http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/ISM_band
[16:28] <Upu> ISM Ike
[16:28] <SP9UOB-Tom> and 21MHz gives good coverage, here in Poland we are able to pickup
[16:28] <SP9UOB-Tom> ike: 500mW output...
[16:28] <ike> 27 is close to 21
[16:28] <SP9UOB-Tom> ike: but differs sightly in terms of propagation
[16:29] <ike> what is the limit for 27MHz in Poland?
[16:29] <ike> power limit
[16:29] <Upu> Ike its not the power
[16:29] <Upu> its how it propagates
[16:29] <ike> isn't the same?
[16:29] <SP9UOB-Tom> for home-made devices? none, abadonned
[16:30] <SP9UOB-Tom> forbiden i mean
[16:30] <SP9UOB-Tom> sorry again for my english
[16:30] <ike> I bet that in your local supermarket there are 27MHz RC toy cars
[16:31] <ike> with 100mW Tx power
[16:31] <SP9UOB-Tom> yes, but certified
[16:31] <WillTablet> ike if there was sporadic e propagation that would be funny
[16:32] <mfa298> also not all ism is allowed airborne (at least for uk)
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[16:33] <Lunar_Lander> hello
[16:33] <jcoxon> also ism freqs are often very crowded with interference
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[16:34] <mfa298> especially the ones around 27MHz
[16:35] <LeoBodnar> 27MHz ISM is allowed airborne
[16:35] <LeoBodnar> in the UK
[16:35] <LeoBodnar> pity it did not work
[16:35] <LeoBodnar> well it worked but very poorly
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[16:38] <ike> mfa298 it looks like nothing is allowed in UK
[16:38] <ike> you should move to Canda
[16:38] <jcoxon> ike, we get by
[16:38] <ike> there everything is allowed
[16:38] <nigelvh> Same here in the US.
[16:38] <Upu> yeah we've done ok with the limitations
[16:38] <RocketBoy> restriction is the mother of invention
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[16:38] <mfa298> there's enough things to do some interesting stuff, and it's meant we're more inventice
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[16:39] <ike> no one will bother to look for you in the Candian ice land
[16:39] <Lunar_Lander> ah the balloon above Siberia, is that true or an error?
[16:40] <jcoxon> its true
[16:40] <Lunar_Lander> is there HF onboard?
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[16:41] <eroomde> are you on the mailing list Lunar_Lander ?
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[16:42] <Lunar_Lander> I am but please excuse that I don't know everything by heart
[16:43] <nigelvh> Lunar_Lander: I believe what jcoxon means is that all these questions are answered in an email to the list.
[16:43] <eroomde> merely, there is conversation today explaining that it's over siberia and how it got there
[16:43] <nigelvh> Ah, apologies, meant eroomde rather than jcoxon
[16:44] <jcoxon> :-)
[16:44] <nigelvh> Hands got away from me.
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[16:44] <WillTablet> craag how can you have a 2km WiFi link?!!
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[16:44] <nigelvh> WillTablet: I have a 12 mile 5GHz wifi link.
[16:44] <jcoxon> WillTablet, focused antennas
[16:44] <Lunar_Lander> yea thanks nigelvh and eroomde
[16:44] <nigelvh> And we've tested with links to 100miles
[16:45] <mfa298> the right equipment, settings and good locations
[16:45] <RocketBoy> how about 400Km wifi http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Long-range_Wi-Fi
[16:45] <nigelvh> ^^^
[16:46] <nigelvh> https://www.hamwan.org/t/tiki-index.php
[16:46] <nigelvh> That's a project I've been working on around the area
[16:46] <jcoxon> i guess you wouldn't use the windows wireless network manager :-p
[16:47] <eroomde> s/windows wireless network manager//
[16:48] <eroomde> tiresome passive-aggressive nerdjoke (tho perfectly serious)
[16:48] <RocketBoy> but understood by sed devotees
[16:48] <mfa298> eroomde: I don't think you want windows in the match term :p
[16:49] <eroomde> oh yes whoops
[16:50] <fsphil> NERD!!! (yea I noticed that too)
[16:50] <fsphil> did you catch venus?
[16:51] <eroomde> cloudy horizons
[16:51] <eroomde> which could be the name of a yacht
[16:51] <eroomde> but is actually why i can't see venus
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[16:51] <fsphil> and weirdly also why venus is so bright
[16:53] <nigelvh> SP9UOB-Tom: Just to confirm, though I assume already, that the 21.115 is USB?
[16:54] <fsphil> last update on the venus express website is from June
[16:54] <fsphil> I get the impression ESA put a spacecraft in orbit there and forgot about it
[16:56] <Willdude123> nigelvh: do you need a license?
[16:56] <Willdude123> Long range wifi sounds intereesting
[16:57] <nigelvh> Certain parts of the network are licensed bands (Ham radio), and other parts of the network are unlicensed wifi bands.
[16:57] <nigelvh> But these are US rules. You'll need to find what the rules are where you live.
[16:58] <fsphil> there are limits on the gain of the antenna here
[16:58] <fsphil> my 2.4ghz colinear is over the limit I think
[16:59] <fsphil> for the power I'm putting into it
[16:59] <Willdude123> Will talk to craag when he comes back online
[17:00] <nigelvh> Yeah, our highest gain dishes are 34dBi.
[17:01] <Willdude123> Am currently looking at a dual band yagi, which would cost $50 to ship to the UK
[17:01] <Willdude123> So it'd be a third of the price
[17:01] <Willdude123> Might not be worth it
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[17:03] <SP9UOB-Tom> nigelvh: yes domex22
[17:03] <ike> Willdude123 I have question for you
[17:03] <ike> if you have from 4MHz to 5Mhz bandwith for you
[17:04] <nigelvh> SP9UOB-Tom: Yep, just wanted to confirm which side. Nothing heard yet. It's on it's own system, so it can happily run for however long.
[17:05] <jcoxon> SP9UOB-Tom, it'll be very exciting if we do get a signal again
[17:05] <ike> if you use 1000 TX modules that runn at 4 000 001Hz, 4 000 002 Hz ... 4 999 999Hz can you transmit 1000 * 100 000bps = 100 000 000 or 100 mbps?
[17:05] <SP9UOB-Tom> nigelvh: it should be at 1700 Hz (when dial 21.115 USB)
[17:06] <nigelvh> SP9UOB-Tom: OK, I've got fldigi set at about 1700.
[17:06] <SP9UOB-Tom> nigelvh: You can also enable RSID, for finetune
[17:06] <SP9UOB-Tom> nigelvh: http://sp9uob.verox.pl/pliki/rsid.png
[17:07] <nigelvh> SP9UOB-Tom: Enabled.
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[17:11] <eroomde> ike: are you asking honestly?
[17:12] <jcoxon> SP9UOB-Tom, do you have GT access?
[17:12] <SP9UOB-Tom> jcoxon: no
[17:13] <SP9UOB-Tom> jcoxon: something heard ?
[17:13] mfa298 (~mfa298@gateway.yapd.net) got netsplit.
[17:13] Scorpia (~tw16g08@login.ecs.soton.ac.uk) got netsplit.
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[17:13] <jcoxon> well i'm not sure
[17:13] <jcoxon> the problem is there is a big carrier right over it at 1750hz
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[17:14] <SP9UOB-Tom> jcoxon: could You record few minutes for me ?
[17:14] <SP9UOB-Tom> with dl-fldigi rx capture option ?
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[17:15] <jcoxon> hmmm i don't think its anything
[17:15] <jcoxon> its not periodic
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[17:15] <SP9UOB-Tom> ok
[17:18] <ike> eroomde I'm ass-king Willdude123
[17:18] <ike> he is better than you
[17:19] <Willdude123> Wut?
[17:19] <ike> Willdude123 I have question for you if you have from 4MHz to 5Mhz bandwith for you if you use 1000 TX modules that runn at 4 000 001Hz, 4 000 002 Hz ... 4 999 999Hz can you transmit 1000 * 100 000bps = 100 000 000 or 100 mbps?
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[17:19] Nick change: KipK_away -> KipK
[17:19] <Willdude123> WHy do you ask?
[17:20] <ike> I'm just bicurious
[17:20] <nigelvh> ike: short answer, no. There's a number of things wrong with that.
[17:20] <Willdude123> ike: is english your first language?
[17:21] <ike> nop
[17:21] <Willdude123> Because I sure as hell would not make that mistake
[17:21] <fsphil> this has all gone a bit off topic
[17:22] <Willdude123> Bi-curious is a phenomena in which people of a heterosexual or homosexual identity who, while showing some curiosity for a relationship or sexual activity with a person of the sex they do not favor, distinguish themselves from the bisexual label.
[17:22] <Willdude123> :P
[17:22] <fsphil> ok more than a bit
[17:22] <Willdude123> Anyway any particular reason for asking me?
[17:22] <jcoxon> right back to topic please
[17:23] <jcoxon> the rest of this conversation can take place somewhere else
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[17:24] <ike> so Willdude123 can you TX 100mbps using bandwith from 4 to 5MHz only?
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[17:24] <SP9UOB-Tom> aplay californiaGT.wav
[17:24] <SP9UOB-Tom> oops
[17:24] <Upu> could have been worse
[17:24] <eroomde> ike: the answer depends on the signal-to-noise ratio, for your info.
[17:25] <adamgreig> and the channel
[17:25] <ike> 20 db S/N
[17:25] <eroomde> the amount of data you can get down a channel (depending on the channel) is a function of its bandwidth and the SNR at the receiver
[17:25] <nigelvh> And in the real world, 5MHz is not going to carry 100Mbit
[17:25] <SP9UOB-Tom> ask Shannon and Kotielnikov, Nyquist will also be helpfull
[17:26] <tweetBot> @AnthonyStirk: Well @daveake and I possibly got the Guiness World record for a paperplane write up here :
[17:26] <tweetBot> http://t.co/OjOSXySox5 #ukhas #hamr thx trackers!
[17:27] <mattbrejza> ike: youll need at least 128QAM, and if you look at this graph you wont get reliable comms at 128QAM with 20dB SNR http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:Channel_capacity_for_complex_constellations.svg
[17:28] <gb73d> sri i missed the saturday balloons I overslept
[17:29] <ike> mattbrejza what is Channel capacity? how many bits you can fit in 1Hz bandwith?
[17:29] <eroomde> it's the information rate a channel can hold
[17:29] <eroomde> hold, sorry shit language
[17:29] <eroomde> the amount of data you can relaibly communicate over a channel, i.e. with an arbitrarily low error-rate
[17:30] <eroomde> for a channel 1MHz wide with 20dB SNR, the theoretical maximum for a gassian channel (which is a good starting point) is about 6Mb/s
[17:30] <Gadget-Mac> Upu: Nice pAVA board, hand built ?
[17:30] <Upu> stencil
[17:31] <Upu> right dog needs a walk
[17:31] <Upu> bbs
[17:31] <mattbrejza> also its not 128QAM, rather 2^100QAM
[17:31] <ike> eroomde is it the same if you are using from 5 to 6MHz than if you use 5 000 000 000 to 5 000 000 002Hz
[17:32] <ike> *5 001 MHz sorry
[17:32] <eroomde> well no, because the bandwidth of your first example is 1MHz, and of your second example is 2Mhz
[17:32] <ike> I made a mistake
[17:32] <ike> from 5 000MHz to 5 001MHz
[17:32] <eroomde> it doesn't matter where in the spectrum you are theoretically, just depends on bandwidth
[17:33] <eroomde> however practically different bits of the spectrum will have different channel characteristics.
[17:35] <eroomde> it is a common technique to, as you suggest, use a chunk of spectrum by splitting it up into lots of smaller chunks, each with their own slower datarate, and then add them all back together at the end to get the same overall datarate
[17:36] <eroomde> that has a number of advantages when you have difficult channel characteristics
[17:39] <nigelvh> Good job america. Just saw a commercial on TV for a product that's supposed to help you make bowls out of bacon to put other things in as appetizers.
[17:39] <adamgreig> why would you need help doing that? bacon weave is fun and easy
[17:39] <nigelvh> Because we're also lazy
[17:39] <adamgreig> aah
[17:39] <adamgreig> just put bacon in a blender with some transglutaminase then?
[17:39] <nigelvh> MEHRIKUH!!!
[17:40] <adamgreig> http://theanticraft.com/archive/beltane08/porkprincess.htm
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[17:41] <adamgreig> "You are going to be working with an enzyme that bonds protein. You are made of protein. Unless you want to glue your lungs together or glue your eyelids to your eyeballs, you absolutely must follow these safety rules."
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[17:43] <nigelvh> That is amazing
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[17:47] <nigelvh> Both incredible and disturbing...
[17:52] <Laurenceb_> hi all
[17:52] <Laurenceb_> seba6 is epic
[17:52] <Laurenceb_> how was it being recieved?
[17:52] <Upu_M0UPU> HF
[17:53] Nick change: Upu_M0UPU -> Upu
[17:53] <Laurenceb_> wow
[17:53] <nigelvh> Dunno about how was, but am hoping to receive it in not too long (I'm on the west coast of the US)
[17:53] <Laurenceb_> what Tx power?
[17:53] <Upu> 100mW
[17:53] ilyarctr (59b31e27@gateway/web/freenode/ip. left irc: Quit: Page closed
[17:53] <Laurenceb_> amazing
[17:53] <Laurenceb_> looks like it burst at daylight?
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[17:53] <Upu> no I think GPS was giving odd info out ?
[17:53] <SP9UOB-Tom> Upu: 500mW
[17:54] <Upu> sorry thx Tom
[17:54] <Laurenceb_> ah
[17:54] <Upu> Still
[17:54] <Laurenceb_> does anyone still see it on HF?
[17:54] <Upu> http://i.imgur.com/QRe37Yu.gif <- This
[17:54] <es5nhc> x-f, can tell weather was very rainy... was near ES/YL border earlier today, was rather dull weather over there as well
[17:58] <x-f> yeah, it's raining here all day
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[18:00] <ike> soo who will be the first to break the law?
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[18:01] <ike> did you know that you can TX with 1KW power masking your transmiter to look like F22 radar
[18:01] <ike> and no one can detect you
[18:01] <eroomde> i suspect someone would see the 1kW bit
[18:01] <ike> well they can detect you like they can detect F22
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[18:01] <eroomde> F22s from unexpected places would likely raise an alarm
[18:02] <nigelvh> Except for the bit that your signal is modulated, and that your signal is not in the place a F22 is.
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[18:03] <ike> with si4463 and SDR donge recivers Ultra-wideband communication is totally posible
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[18:04] <ike> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ultra_wideband
[18:05] <eroomde> it would have to be seriously UWB to hide 1kW
[18:05] <eroomde> doubt your si chip could jump around fast enough
[18:06] <ike> you don't need hi speed
[18:06] <ike> you can send bit here and there from time to time
[18:07] <eroomde> i don't think that will do what you think it will
[18:08] <Laurenceb_> eroomde: so i looked at Stockham auto-sort with arm cortex M4 assembly for GPS acquisition
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[18:09] <Laurenceb_> looks like 3.7ms acquisition is feasible
[18:09] <Laurenceb_> at 168Mhz
[18:09] <Laurenceb_> processor clock
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[18:10] <eroomde> as in, aquiring from 3.7ms worth of data?
[18:10] <Laurenceb_> no, aquire 1ms data, search for 4 sats in 3.7ms
[18:10] <Laurenceb_> so if you wanted to track a single sat you could search the whole delay space in real time :D
[18:11] <eroomde> ah i see
[18:11] <eroomde> a lot of current just to tell the time :)
[18:11] <Laurenceb_> yeah
[18:11] <Laurenceb_> i think "A-GPS" type techniques on arm could be very exiting
[18:12] <Laurenceb_> *exciting
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[18:12] <nigelvh> Just think of how much current the satellites are using, he's much more power efficient than that.
[18:12] <eroomde> yeah
[18:12] <eroomde> maybe a blackfin
[18:12] <eroomde> dual 600MHz alu
[18:12] <Laurenceb_> if you know time to a few seconds and position to a few tens of km, you can find location with 1ms of data
[18:12] <eroomde> still very good power consumption specs
[18:13] <SP9UOB-Tom> nigelvh: any traces ?
[18:13] <Laurenceb_> shrug
[18:13] <nigelvh> SP9UOB-Tom: Nothing yet...
[18:13] <Laurenceb_> arm cortex isnt that far away
[18:13] <Laurenceb_> theres 200Mhz LPC stuff
[18:14] <jcoxon> SP9UOB-Tom, i'm listening on the west canada GT
[18:14] <Laurenceb_> eroomde: I thought of a very very silly idea
[18:14] <eroomde> on a beaglebone black (has a beefy omap) you'd probably be laughing
[18:14] <Laurenceb_> whole receiver is a kalman filter
[18:14] <Laurenceb_> baseband is the measurement
[18:15] <SP9UOB-Tom> jcoxon: also nothing?
[18:15] <Laurenceb_> it might actually work for tracking
[18:15] <jcoxon> nothing yet
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[18:19] <Willdude123> Really can't get what's wrong with this radio
[18:22] <Willdude123> It is almost definitely doing a ctcss tone
[18:23] <jcoxon> hmmm really need to persuade G0WXI from decoding recorded wavs with upload setup
[18:24] <eroomde> send someone round to his house with an axe
[18:24] <fsphil> should probably disable online when playing back in dl-fldigi
[18:24] <mikestir> jcoxon: why not place a limit on the timestamp on habhub? maybe allow some means of circumventing it for authorised users
[18:25] <eroomde> i like my solution best
[18:25] <eroomde> more scaleable
[18:25] <Willdude123> eroomde: not a good idea
[18:25] <Willdude123> What would you do with the axe?
[18:25] <adamgreig> ice axe
[18:26] <jcoxon> fsphil, that said there are situations when people record and send us wavs
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[18:26] <eroomde> yes, ice axe
[18:26] <jcoxon> i guess we can always do a manual upload
[18:29] <fsphil> have it go offline when playing back, but allow it to be put online again
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[18:30] <fsphil> or require the date in the telemetry line :)
[18:30] <adamgreig> hah
[18:30] <adamgreig> good luck
[18:30] <adamgreig> people mess up the other fields enough as it is
[18:30] <jcoxon> unix time
[18:30] <adamgreig> we'd have a y2.1k problem too
[18:30] <adamgreig> unix time gives us a y2038 problem along being quite wasteful
[18:31] <adamgreig> though I guess you get date and time all in one
[18:31] <adamgreig> but it's less human readable bla bla bla
[18:31] <adamgreig> so many things to fix
[18:31] <fsphil> unix time / 24 hours
[18:31] <adamgreig> haha
[18:31] <fsphil> getting complicated
[18:31] <adamgreig> but that doesn't even fit in a 16 bit int, annoyingly
[18:31] <nigelvh> UNSIGNED LONG FTW
[18:32] <eroomde> i-frames
[18:32] <fsphil> I've been thinking about that
[18:33] <Laurenceb_> i sign your ints
[18:33] <fsphil> a binary stream that periodically sends something like an i-frame
[18:33] <eroomde> i'm not sure i like that
[18:33] <eroomde> having state between tlelemetry packets
[18:33] <eroomde> i guess if it's streamy that's not so bad
[18:34] <fsphil> you could consider the i-frame to before the next i-frame as the packet
[18:34] <fsphil> yea it would stream it
[18:35] <eroomde> wonder if we can't just gzip everything before sending
[18:35] <eroomde> probably bollocks performance on short packiets
[18:36] <eroomde> make a huffman table from the entire habitat back catalogue
[18:37] <mikestir> coarse data, heavily FECed, followed by some less well protected high res deltas
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[18:42] <fsphil> nah, FEC the whole lot
[18:42] <fsphil> easier
[18:42] <eroomde> yeah
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[18:46] <SP9UOB-Tom> eroomde: base91 + 8 bit + fec
[18:47] <SP9UOB-Tom> can be easilly recognized and backward compatible
[18:48] <SP9UOB-Tom> 30 bytes position+telemetry channels - aprs style
[18:48] <jcoxon> nothing should be aprs style
[18:49] <SP9UOB-Tom> ;-)
[18:49] <SP9UOB-Tom> jcoxon: im takling about compression
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[18:51] <fsphil> nah binary
[18:52] <fsphil> base256 :)
[18:52] <fsphil> actually not even
[18:52] <fsphil> forget bytes
[18:52] <fsphil> this is a bitstream
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[18:53] <SP9UOB-Tom> fsphil: yes, but its hard/impossible to implement with domino/psk and other motulation types
[18:54] <fsphil> they're all bitstreams too
[18:54] <fsphil> at the radio level it's just bits
[18:55] <fsphil> in this case it's text, encoded with a varicode
[18:55] <eroomde> yeah, this is all premodulation
[18:55] <fsphil> but the bitstream could be anything
[18:55] <eroomde> you basically just want the modulator to receiver what looks like randomness
[18:55] <SP9UOB-Tom> fsphil: yes, but they are using "alphabets" so to keep compatibility should be used as is
[18:55] <eroomde> with an equal weight of 0s and 1s (for a gaussian channel)
[18:55] <eroomde> the alphabets don't care either
[18:56] <SP9UOB-Tom> again You will stick to dedicated software
[18:56] <fsphil> it's going to need custom software anyway
[18:56] <SP9UOB-Tom> and in "compatible" mode receiver can catch the frame and send via elmail
[18:57] <eroomde> this would be a custom mode i think (assuming the convo has transmogrified into a convo about getting the most from out 10mW)
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[18:58] <fsphil> better as a custom mode, but no reason it couldn't use the thor or domex modulator
[18:58] <fsphil> as they work with existing hardware
[18:59] <fsphil> and would be a simple modification to dl-fldigi
[18:59] <Willdude123> Conditions on UHF here really really vary for me
[18:59] <Willdude123> Earlier I was getting through to the sdr S9
[18:59] <Willdude123> Now I can't hear myself at all
[18:59] <eroomde> yeah, tho FSK is not very efficient
[18:59] <eroomde> for our bandwidth
[18:59] <Willdude123> Very odd
[18:59] <fsphil> aye
[19:00] <SP9UOB-Tom> eroomde: QAM512 then ;-)
[19:00] <adamgreig> bpsk!
[19:00] <adamgreig> shame the hardware won't really work :P
[19:00] <eroomde> well, i think 16QAM would probably be a good enough start
[19:00] <adamgreig> if you had a QAM modulator surely bpsk would be better for our conditions?
[19:00] Nick change: KipK -> KipK_away
[19:01] <SP9UOB-Tom> linear power stage - no efficiency at all
[19:01] <adamgreig> right, bpsk doesn't need linear PA
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[19:01] <adamgreig> just need to do able to do that irritating phase flip
[19:01] <adamgreig> sadly suspect we'll be stuck with FSK for the hardware we have
[19:01] <SP9UOB-Tom> exor gate working @500 MHz ;-)
[19:01] <eroomde> linear PA doesn't have to be aweful compared to currently
[19:01] <adamgreig> though I wonder sometimes about a guassian channel
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[19:01] <adamgreig> continuous frequencies
[19:02] <eroomde> i mean the ntx2 using >60mW to produce 10mW of RF
[19:02] <adamgreig> rather than discretised steps
[19:02] <SP9UOB-Tom> eroomde: yes, but driver stage also needs power
[19:02] <eroomde> what do you mean?
[19:02] <adamgreig> encode data as roughly gaussian distributed frequencies around centre
[19:03] <SP9UOB-Tom> adamgreig: GMFSK?
[19:03] <adamgreig> the absolute value of the current signal compared to centre gives the number
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[19:03] <adamgreig> no
[19:03] <adamgreig> well
[19:03] <adamgreig> no
[19:03] <adamgreig> not that at all
[19:03] <adamgreig> not FSK
[19:03] <adamgreig> just FM really
[19:03] <number10> anyone know why the tracker would suddenly show a past position
[19:03] <adamgreig> someone uploading a recorded WAV
[19:04] <SP9UOB-Tom> adamgreig: fm? You mean audio ?
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[19:04] <number10> anu now back in north sea with several listeners
[19:04] <jcoxon> yeah someone is playback recorded data
[19:05] <adamgreig> number10: it'l show all old listeners for that position when anyone sends in that packet
[19:05] <number10> ah ic
[19:05] <adamgreig> SP9UOB-Tom: no, not audio
[19:05] <adamgreig> turn your signal to be transmitted into a stream of roughly gaussian distributed real numbers
[19:05] <number10> so if one person played it back it would show all the people who received it
[19:05] <adamgreig> and send the resulting waveform into your FM modulator
[19:05] <SP9UOB-Tom> ok
[19:05] <adamgreig> number10: yes
[19:05] <number10> cheers adamgreig
[19:05] <SP9UOB-Tom> thats GMFSK
[19:06] <adamgreig> pretty sure it's not
[19:06] <SP9UOB-Tom> g3RUH style
[19:06] Last message repeated 1 time(s).
[19:06] <adamgreig> GMFSK is when you use a gaussian filter to transition between discrete MFSK frequencies
[19:06] <number10> it wasnt me who played it back - someone like the sound of rtty :)
[19:06] <number10> +s
[19:06] <adamgreig> I'm basically proposing MFSK with M at infinity
[19:07] <eroomde> how does decoding work?
[19:07] <adamgreig> left as a challenge for the receiver
[19:07] <eroomde> it can't really say what's the most likely frequency other than the middle one, can't it?
[19:07] <eroomde> or rather, if it doubt it'll always head to the middle
[19:07] <adamgreig> ?
[19:07] <adamgreig> you tune your FM to the centre freq and the output from the FM demodulator is the same waveform as went in
[19:08] <eroomde> oh FM, sorry i though you meant moving the carrier around
[19:08] <adamgreig> basically like encoding audio into an FM transmitter, but instead of audio or anything like it, the input waveform is just gaussian noise
[19:08] <adamgreig> but very carefully selected gaussian noise
[19:10] <adamgreig> HMMM
[19:10] <Willdude123> mfa298: in sdr-radio, how do I get the frequency plot?
[19:10] <adamgreig> the first sentence in this "G3RUH" "GMFSK" article is
[19:10] <adamgreig> "The theoretical minimum audio bandwidth required to send 9600 baud binary data is 4800 Hz."
[19:10] <adamgreig> shannon called, it's for you
[19:10] <adamgreig> http://www.amsat.org/amsat/articles/g3ruh/109.html
[19:11] <SP9UOB-Tom> Modulation: FM. Audio applied direct to TX varactor. +/- 3 kHz deviation gives RF spectrum 20 kHz wide (-60db). Fits standard channel easily.
[19:11] <eroomde> maybe nbfm has some well specified sqelch snr or something
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[19:11] <adamgreig> SP9UOB-Tom: that still has no similarity to what I'm proposing, beyond both being FM techniques
[19:11] <eroomde> but yes that first sentence is just Wrong
[19:11] <eroomde> in an absolute sense
[19:12] <adamgreig> this looks just like many amateur radio attempts at digimodes
[19:12] <adamgreig> lacking in fundamentals
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[19:13] <adamgreig> I enjoy that his mode also basically encrypts the data
[19:13] <adamgreig> just publishes one possible key
[19:14] <SP9UOB-Tom> :-)
[19:14] <adamgreig> eroomde: in any event what I describe is roughly one way of doing my phd thing on a real life radio link
[19:15] <adamgreig> in other words: a pretty terrible idea
[19:15] <adamgreig> but it might be fun to try! and it'd work with current hardware
[19:20] <adamgreig> or rather, my phd tells you how to turn your data signal into a series of gaussian random numbers, and how to recover it at the other end
[19:20] <adamgreig> though it does assume your data is itself a series of gaussian random numbers ;)
[19:20] <eroomde> yeah linear drive and PA will be a fun thing
[19:20] <eroomde> sorry that was without context
[19:20] <eroomde> the context was me thinking about modulationa dnPA
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[19:22] <SP9UOB-Tom> n3qik: hi, do You have 21 MHz band SSB receiver ?
[19:22] <ike> adamgreig so what will hapend if you have 256 sets of random data and send one of them for every byte?
[19:22] <ike> will that work?
[19:23] <adamgreig> to a first approximation yes
[19:23] <adamgreig> but you won't perform as well as you could
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[19:24] <adamgreig> that's basically a shannon random codebook with n=256
[19:24] <adamgreig> or m, whatever
[19:24] <adamgreig> I mean 8.
[19:24] <adamgreig> wow, 8. quite small
[19:24] <adamgreig> ike: basically you could do it for 2^1024 sets of random data and send one for every 1024 bits
[19:24] <adamgreig> and then it'd be fairly good
[19:24] <adamgreig> but you might notice that 2^1024 is a lot of sets of random data
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[19:26] <ike> I can fit that in 2^960 universes
[19:27] <adamgreig> anyway there are tricks you can do basically
[19:27] <adamgreig> you can collapse the codebook exponentially and then superpose selections
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[19:27] <adamgreig> but decoding becomes a lot trickier
[19:27] <ike> so guys I have one inconvenient question for you
[19:27] <ike> this balloons is stupid right
[19:28] <ike> when are you going to send Voyager 3 and track it into the Deep Space 9
[19:28] <eroomde> SDA Physical Layer
[19:28] <eroomde> whoopsie
[19:28] <eroomde> wrong window
[19:29] <fsphil> so it turns out avr-gcc is rubbish at division
[19:29] <eroomde> ike: there are a number of people here who are perfectly serious about space comms
[19:29] <eroomde> fsphil: 49,000 cycles?
[19:29] <adamgreig> fsphil: s/-gcc//
[19:29] <fsphil> hah
[19:30] <fsphil> I removed some / and % from my interrupt, and it's executing in half the time
[19:30] <eroomde> yeah modulo is annoyingly expensive
[19:31] <fsphil> I suspect it was that more than the division
[19:31] <eroomde> this is why all my char buffers are 256 long
[19:31] <adamgreig> what
[19:31] <eroomde> so it just automatically wraps back rather than having to modulo it with a smaller char-buffer size
[19:31] <adamgreig> oh
[19:31] <adamgreig> cute
[19:31] <eroomde> (on 8-bit arch)
[19:31] <fsphil> for the thor stuff it was % 18 and % 160 in various places
[19:32] <adamgreig> doesn't work so great on 64bit archs
[19:32] <eroomde> no :)
[19:32] <fsphil> replacing it with if(i >= 18) i -= 18; makes it much faster
[19:32] <adamgreig> though you can just &0xf
[19:32] <adamgreig> uhm. 0xff
[19:32] <eroomde> yeah the branch predicotr can probably do well on that too...
[19:32] <eroomde> ...oh wait
[19:32] <adamgreig> :P
[19:32] <adamgreig> to be fair I think most 64b architectures probs have okay division
[19:32] <eroomde> yep
[19:33] <ike> >>
[19:33] <RocketBoy> I saw if((x % 2) == 1)) in some C code the other day - replaced it with if(x & 1)
[19:33] <ike> and <<
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[19:33] <eroomde> modulo being slow and printf taking up all the flash on a 16k micro were two early surprises for me
[19:33] <mclane_> question to ssdv: i am getting more "green" picture packets then data telemetry packets. Would it make sense to put some FEC on the telemetry data?
[19:33] <gurgalof> I just started to constuct a pico tracker with a STM32F100C6 microcontroller, RFM22B radio, uBlox neo6 gps and BMP180 pressure sensor
[19:34] <fsphil> nice
[19:34] <gurgalof> oh and a DS18B20 temp sensor
[19:34] <fsphil> more people should use arm
[19:34] <fsphil> be wary of the rfm22b, they've a habit of failing
[19:34] <eroomde> gurgalof: excellent
[19:34] <eroomde> mclane_: it does have FEC
[19:34] <eroomde> fsphil did it
[19:35] <SP9UOB-Tom> nigelvh: gotsomething?
[19:35] <mclane_> the ssdv packets have, but the telemetry you send inbetween the packets does not
[19:35] <mclane_> to my knowledge
[19:35] <SP9UOB-Tom> in an hour it should be in daylight
[19:35] <gurgalof> fsphil: how do they fail, is it because the cold?
[19:35] <SP9UOB-Tom> gurgalof: because of chinese ;-)
[19:36] <fsphil> gurgalof: I believe so
[19:36] <fsphil> I had one fail, but to be fair it was at about -70c at the time
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[19:36] <Willdude123> Well this is weird. I'm not receiving anything whatsoever on SDR Console
[19:37] <Willdude123> It's got noise
[19:37] <Willdude123> And should be connected
[19:37] <Willdude123> But isn't behaving
[19:37] <fsphil> someone (can't remember who now) tested them in a freezer, and was able to get it transmitting again by regurlarly sending a reset
[19:37] <gurgalof> wow -70, thats cold
[19:37] <fsphil> yea there was no insulation on that flight, or very little
[19:37] <SP9UOB-Tom> fsphil: it was me
[19:37] <fsphil> and it was launched at night
[19:37] <jcoxon> SP9UOB-Tom, fingers crossed
[19:37] <fsphil> the gps failed just before the radio did
[19:38] <Willdude123> So it's 5w
[19:38] <Willdude123> And adjacent to the SDR
[19:38] <Willdude123> But it's not getting it
[19:38] <fsphil> mclane_: yea, hopefully that can be fixed soon too
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[19:46] <mikestir> my RFM22B based trackers had a watchdog function that ran periodically to read back some key registers, then it would be a full reset if there was any inconsistency
[19:46] <mikestir> I don't think it ever triggered though, but they were well insulated
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[19:48] <daveake> mikestir mine do the same
[19:48] <mclane_> fsphil,: how would you do it?
[19:49] <mclane_> I guess, some modification in dl-fldigi is needed
[19:49] <fsphil> definitly
[19:50] <mclane_> rs8 to be applied to the telemetry string?
[19:50] <fsphil> difficult because it's variable length
[19:50] <mclane_> could be made fixed length
[19:51] <mclane_> - ah no, because ut's defined by the individual project s
[19:51] <mclane_> It's
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[19:52] <fsphil> it'll probably be a new format
[19:52] <eroomde> zero padding :)
[19:52] <eroomde> (yuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuk)
[19:52] <fsphil> indeed
[19:53] <mclane_> yea, why not
[19:53] <fsphil> ssdv does do that in the last packet (well it fills it with random data) but it was the simplest approach at the time :)
[19:54] <mclane_> but what to do with the crc at the end of the telemetry string?
[19:54] <fsphil> and it's a small percentage of the overall iamge data
[19:54] <fsphil> the new format will still have a crc
[19:55] <fsphil> 32-bit (since we're basically sending 5 characters at the moment, still an improvement)
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[20:03] <SpeedEvil> Also - CRC - FEC?
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[20:04] <jcoxon> SP9UOB-Tom, anything?
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[20:07] <nigelvh> jcoxon: SP9UOB-Tom: Nothing here yet.
[20:08] <SP9UOB-Tom> :-(
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[20:09] <jcoxon> nothing on the western canada GT
[20:10] <SP9UOB-Tom> soon it should reach sunrise
[20:11] <nigelvh> SP9UOB-Tom: What's the transmit pattern? I just saw a trace blink down.
[20:11] <SP9UOB-Tom> if it isnt down already
[20:11] <jcoxon> unless its too far north to get sunrise
[20:11] <jcoxon> nigelvh, dominoex22 every minute
[20:11] <jcoxon> and CW ID every 5 mins
[20:11] <SP9UOB-Tom> nigelvh: every one minute dominoex22
[20:11] <SP9UOB-Tom> morse every 5 min
[20:11] <SP9UOB-Tom> jcoxon: :-)
[20:11] <nigelvh> K, it wasn't dominoex22, Just wanted to know if there was anything else.
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[20:32] <Astro_> Where did Cloudy come down at?
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[20:33] <Upu> who knows Astro_
[20:33] <Upu> batteries died in the air
[20:34] <Astro_> That's what I thought, but it had come back from the dead before....
[20:34] <Upu> it was on life support when it started rebooting
[20:35] <Astro_> Maybe it will be found on the ground, you can always hope.
[20:36] <Upu> I doubt it came down anywhere populated
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[20:36] <Upu> likely to be over Kazakhstan
[20:36] <Upu> could still be up
[20:37] <Astro_> But still a pretty cool flight for a few 100 in parts.
[20:37] <Upu> didn't float very high
[20:37] <Upu> it did well :)
[20:37] <Upu> performed the important bit anyway and dropped the plane
[20:37] <Upu> good job we didn't attach a second one
[20:37] <Astro_> That's the part that I love, more and more people are trying this. Did you get a good track on the plane?
[20:38] <Upu> yep : see http://ava.upuaut.net/?p=650
[20:38] <Astro_> BRB
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[20:40] Nick change: Geoff-G8DHE_ -> Geoff-G8DHE-M
[20:42] <Astro_> Cool article, so for the record you don't have to have the plane at the end?
[20:42] <Upu> not sure
[20:42] <Upu> going to submit and see what they say
[20:43] <Astro_> Does the plane have contact info on it if someone finds it?
[20:43] <Upu> yep
[20:43] <Upu> my e-mail address
[20:43] <Upu> and a little message
[20:43] <eroomde> does anyone know if the ISS have ever tried the reentering-paper-plane experiment?
[20:43] <jcoxon> they never did it in the end
[20:43] <Astro_> I know in High Power Rockets that you have to have the rocket at the end. Little message written on a fiver? :-)
[20:43] <eroomde> whereby the ballistic coefficient is apparently low enough for a safe reentry
[20:44] <adamgreig> though if you were an astronaut
[20:44] <jcoxon> the japanese were planning it
[20:44] <adamgreig> totally fun to grab a sheet of scratch paper
[20:44] <adamgreig> scribble "from space! plz phone" on it
[20:44] <adamgreig> and drop
[20:44] <Upu> well
[20:44] <Upu> I did put "I've fallen from SPACE!" on the plane
[20:44] <Upu> kill me already Ed :)
[20:44] <eroomde> they have paper manuals for every experiment
[20:44] <eroomde> they could turn them into planes one day then blast them out of the airlock
[20:45] <Astro_> @upu /snicker that should get them to write to you.
[20:46] <Upu> well it took less space up than "Hello good fellow I appear to have decended from 30% of the altitude attributed to the Karman line which is the internationally accepted altitude of "space""
[20:46] <Upu> "Space! Lolz!"
[20:47] <Astro_> No room for "All your base belong to us!" ??
[20:48] <SP9UOB-Tom> or... "we are borg resistance is futile"
[20:49] <SP9UOB-Tom> http://www.timeanddate.com/worldclock/sunearth.html?n=262&day=29&month=12&year=2013&hour=22&min=54&sec=0
[20:49] <SP9UOB-Tom> wake up seba ! PLS
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[20:50] <Upu> btw : http://habitat.habhub.org/mobile-tracker/ click cogs -> day light overlay on
[20:50] <SpeedEvil> Upu: did the plane have tracking?
[20:51] <SpeedEvil> oh - nvm
[20:51] <Upu> yes SpeedEvil
[20:51] <Upu> all the way until its GPS froze up
[20:51] <Upu> was transmitting all the way to the ground
[20:51] <SpeedEvil> Upu: Two whole grams?
[20:51] <SpeedEvil> :)
[20:51] <Upu> I know
[20:51] <Upu> :)
[20:52] <Upu> anyone would have though I made the tracker with this purpose in mind
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[20:52] <SpeedEvil> Upu: I guess that it could co much further with proper trimming
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[20:53] <Upu> most likely yes
[20:53] <Upu> it didn't fly too badly actually but was a little nose heavy
[20:53] <SP9UOB-Tom> Upu: it can bee too far north to get sunlight :-(
[20:53] <Upu> the A3 plane needed some flaps
[20:53] <SP9UOB-Tom> be
[20:54] <Upu> the A2 one had enough lift
[20:54] <Upu> yes it could be SP9UOB-Tom
[20:54] <Upu> however if it does reappear you may have won the polar challenge
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[20:54] <jcoxon> indeed
[20:54] <jcoxon> this would be accepted as an attempt
[20:54] <SpeedEvil> Polar challenge? Fly over the pole?
[20:55] <jcoxon> arctic circle challenge
[20:55] <SpeedEvil> ah
[20:55] <Upu> http://ukhas.org.uk/ukhas:arctic_challenge
[20:55] <SP9UOB-Tom> The Rules
[20:55] <SP9UOB-Tom> The balloon and payload has to be launched from the UK
[20:55] <SP9UOB-Tom> UK includes Scotland and Scottish Isles
[20:55] <Upu> its ok
[20:56] <Upu> I'm sure they'll let it go
[20:56] <Upu> see rule 6
[20:56] <jcoxon> yeah rule 6
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[20:58] <ei3hmb> Hi there
[20:58] <Upu> hi ei3hmb
[20:59] <ei3hmb> SP9UOBTom - I live just half an hour from UK border and have valid UK licence :) joint-venture?
[20:59] <SP9UOB-Tom> hehehe
[21:00] <SpeedEvil> https://maps.google.com/maps?ll=60.85,-0.866667&q=loc:60.85,-0.866667&hl=en&t=h&z=15
[21:00] <Lunar_Lander> ei3hmb, hello to Ireland :)
[21:00] <WillTablet> Upu you have an arrow dual band right?
[21:00] <Upu> no 434
[21:01] <SpeedEvil> https://maps.google.com/maps?ll=60.85,-0.866667&q=loc:60.85,-0.866667&hl=en&t=h&z=15 I meant
[21:01] <WillTablet> Ah OK, how much did you pay for shipping?
[21:01] <Upu> its quite a bit
[21:01] <Upu> and you'll get shafted for import duty as well
[21:02] <Upu> why do you want one of those ?
[21:02] <WillTablet> They quoted me $50
[21:02] <Upu> yeah sounds about right £30
[21:02] <Upu> they are great antennas but portables designed for field work
[21:02] Action: SpeedEvil buys a fareo island, and gives it to the Queen, to cheat.
[21:03] <WillTablet> Upu satellites
[21:03] <Upu> ok fair enough
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[21:03] <WillTablet> Import duty and vat is a lot isn't it?
[21:03] <Upu> the 434-5 cost me about £70 all done
[21:04] <WillTablet> Not many alternativws
[21:04] <Upu> you can make one
[21:04] <SpeedEvil> https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pictish_Free_State
[21:06] <WillTablet> Upu, they do have a parts list
[21:06] <jcoxon> SP9UOB-Tom, not to get you too excited but SQ5OVK just rx'd $$"15672\n
[21:06] <WillTablet> But how do I work with aluminium?
[21:06] <Upu> you don't
[21:06] <Upu> make it out of wood
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[21:07] <SP9UOB-Tom> quiet here
[21:07] crash_18974 (~crash_@2605:8900:1000:1001:8:0:e:2) left irc: Remote host closed the connection
[21:07] <jcoxon> probably just random text
[21:07] <SP9UOB-Tom> <<2013-12-29T20:42Z DominoEX 22 @ 21115000+1732>>
[21:07] <SP9UOB-Tom> !!!!!!!!11
[21:07] <SP9UOB-Tom> RSID
[21:07] <SP9UOB-Tom> received!
[21:07] Nick change: crash_18974_ -> crash_18974
[21:07] <Upu> http://www.nr6ca.org/70cmyagi.html
[21:07] <SP9UOB-Tom> in log
[21:08] <jcoxon> SP9UOB-Tom, any data?
[21:08] <SP9UOB-Tom> no
[21:08] <ei3hmb> Tom, do you think is seba6 still airborne?
[21:08] <SpeedEvil> I guess a launch from https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/British_Antarctic_Territory would be worth a special mention.
[21:08] <jcoxon> ei3hmb, no way of knowing
[21:08] <jcoxon> was still flying last time we heard from it
[21:08] <ei3hmb> BAT is not the UK :)
[21:09] <SP9UOB-Tom> false RSID is allmost impossible
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[21:09] <SP9UOB-Tom> and the offset and modulation are ok
[21:10] <jcoxon> better get everyone listening
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[21:10] <PD0RKC> Hello balloon friends does anyone knows if there is still a balloon alive far east, its a pitty there are not much observers stations.
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[21:11] <Willdude123> Upu so you just make a small 70cm yagi and put a 2m one on the same boom Upu?
[21:11] <Upu> PD0RKC just talking about it possibly transmitting on 21.115 MHz
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[21:11] <Upu> if you have ability please have a listen
[21:11] <Lunar_Lander> hi chrisstubbs
[21:11] <Upu> Willdude123 2 separate
[21:12] <Upu> google home brew yagi
[21:12] <Lunar_Lander> yeah Antarctica is something special
[21:12] <Upu> http://www.amateurradio.bz/tri-band_yagi.html
[21:14] <Willdude123> Upu so one in one hand, the other in the other hand, then The HT with a third hand?
[21:16] <Willdude123> :-P
[21:16] <PD0RKC> Also easy to make a yagi from measure tape http://tinyurl.com/mnojzdt
[21:16] <Willdude123> I think I'm sort of running before I can jump
[21:16] <Willdude123> that isnt the phrase is it
[21:16] <Willdude123> Running before I can walk
[21:17] <Willdude123> I should probably get a proper station set up first
[21:18] Nick change: KipK_away -> KipK
[21:18] <Willdude123> Meh idk
[21:21] <chrisstubbs> Hello Lunar_Lander
[21:21] <chrisstubbs> Hello Everyone
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[21:23] <chrisstubbs> congrats on your possible record upu and daveake
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[21:26] <Geoff-G8DHE> For those who like them Flight Path for Cloudy and Snow yesterday http://360.g8dhe.net/HAB_Flights/2013_Flights/Snow_20131228/Cloudy_and_Snow.html
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[21:28] <Willdude123> chrisstubbs what recoed
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[21:29] <chrisstubbs> https://twitter.com/AnthonyStirk/status/417345914131337216
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[21:30] <PD0RKC> ------====Does anyone knows when next balloons lanches is, or is somewhere a website with all the info?
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[21:31] <chrisstubbs> PD0RKC, the ukhas mailing list is where flight details are posted
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[21:31] <chrisstubbs> https://groups.google.com/forum/#!forum/ukhas
[21:31] <SpeedEvil> Though lurking here may also work
[21:32] #highaltitude: mode change '+o jcoxon' by ChanServ!ChanServ@services.
[21:32] <SP9UOB-Tom> so next attempt will be at 14 MHz :-)
[21:32] Topic changed on #highaltitude by jcoxon!jcoxon@host86-163-166-232.range86-163.btcentralplus.com: welcome to #highaltitude - discuss anything to do with high altitude projects! please read the wiki - http://wiki.ukhas.org.uk
[21:32] <PD0RKC> chrisstubbs thanks for the url I will read!
[21:33] #highaltitude: mode change '-o jcoxon' by ChanServ!ChanServ@services.
[21:33] <PD0RKC> SP9UOB Tom 14Mhz would be nice if also GPS data will be sended down to see how far it goes.
[21:33] <chrisstubbs> you can subscribe and get updates by email
[21:34] <eroomde> yo, in imagemagik (or similar) does anyone know how i can ask it to compress down to a specific filesize?
[21:35] <Geoff-G8DHE> There is also an iCal http://habitat.habhub.org/calendar/
[21:35] <Geoff-G8DHE> Paintshop / Photshop will do it using the Wizard specify size and it will compress to it
[21:35] <eroomde> found it
[21:36] <eroomde> convert original.jpeg -define jpeg:extent=300kb output.jpg
[21:36] <PD0RKC> Geoff-G8DHE I cant open that page what file format is that? what need to view?
[21:36] <eroomde> daveake: do you have an example 320x240 ssdv test image you use for stuff?
[21:36] <eroomde> that you could share?
[21:36] <eroomde> from hab altitude
[21:37] <daveake> Try http://www.imagemagick.org/RMagick/doc/comtasks.html#resizing
[21:37] <eroomde> already got there
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[21:38] <Geoff-G8DHE> It will send you a file for inclusion in any iCal display program say wcalendargadget google it if you use Windows 7
[21:38] <Geoff-G8DHE> http://wlcalendargadget.codeplex.com/
[21:38] <SP9UOB-Tom> still nothing - what a pity
[21:39] <eroomde> whaddayawant SP9UOB-Tom, the world on a stick?
[21:39] <Willdude123> Wait are most rtty and arduino circuits using pwm now?
[21:39] <daveake> I use http://www.daveakerman.com/wp-content/uploads/2013/05/snap314_ifl-1024x768.jpg and resize to whatever i need
[21:39] <eroomde> i don't know, do an email survey
[21:39] <eroomde> probably not
[21:39] <eroomde> next
[21:39] <eroomde> thanks daveake
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[21:40] <daveake> Hasb images always end up as smaller files than ground testing
[21:40] <daveake> Hab
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[21:44] <SP9UOB-Tom> eroomde: whaddayawant ?
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[21:45] <JonnyBoats> Great to see Rasperry PIs flying.
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[21:46] <eroomde> nice to see them landing in salt-water
[21:46] <eroomde> SP9UOB-Tom: dunno, something an old boss of mine used to say
[21:46] <eroomde> in a sort of karl-marx voice
[21:46] <eroomde> err.... groucho marx
[21:47] <jcoxon> SP9UOB-Tom, what ever happens it was a great flight
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[21:47] <SP9UOB-Tom> jcoxon: yeah, nera US record
[21:48] <jcoxon> we'll keep listening but chances are its down
[21:48] <cuddykid> what's going on with ANU?
[21:48] <SP9UOB-Tom> near
[21:48] <jcoxon> HF is hard, doesn't have the predictability of UHF
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[21:50] <SP9UOB-Tom> jcoxon: 21 MHz performs very well in line-of-sight
[21:52] <SP9UOB-Tom> ok time to sleep
[21:52] <SP9UOB-Tom> night all
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[21:57] <PD0RKC> ----===Why are there no names on the payload of the balloons on the tracker websites?
[21:58] <eroomde> Tor
[22:01] <Geoff-G8DHE> Click the Balloon or its path etc for details of the balloon might need to Zoom in as Google Maps changed API recently and its a bit of a pain
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[22:04] <Laurenceb_> so someone got a RSID packet?
[22:04] <Willdude123> eroomde are you around tomorrow as I have a few more questions about all that maths stuff
[22:04] <jcoxon> sp9uob did
[22:05] <eroomde> Willdude123: not sure
[22:05] <eroomde> poss not
[22:05] <eroomde> ask away and see if you get an answer
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[22:08] <Willdude123> eroomde thanks for helping me earlier
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[22:08] <Willdude123> I know I'm probably coming across as lacking intuition
[22:08] <eroomde> no, this is all New Stuff
[22:09] <eroomde> and i'm working hard to try and keep it visual
[22:09] <eroomde> the maths will make sense when you get to it, if you can visulaise what is actually going on
[22:11] <ike> eroomde you helped me too
[22:12] <ike> any way Willdude123 don't buy dualband yagi
[22:14] <mclane_> jcoxon: I have downloaded the dl-fldigi sources. Where do you separate the ssdv data from ordinary telemetry?
[22:17] Nick change: KipK -> KipK_away
[22:18] <Willdude123> ike not going to
[22:18] <Willdude123> But why?
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[22:18] <Willdude123> Will probably make my own
[22:19] <Willdude123> So for dual band can I literally just put one antenna on the dsame boom as another
[22:20] <Geoff-G8DHE> Yes if at right angles, not the best idea if you keep the plane the same however, but not the end of the world.
[22:20] <Geoff-G8DHE> But for a first aerial why not a two band colinear
[22:21] <Willdude123> qAm probably gfoing to go for a w-50
[22:21] <Geoff-G8DHE> you will get much more use out of it.
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[22:26] <ike> Willdude123 with dual band yagi you will need duplexer and balloon
[22:26] <ike> or your antenna won't work
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[22:32] <fsphil> mclane_: why would you want to?
[22:33] <Upu> hey Geoff-G8DHE thx for pano linked it in my blog article
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[22:34] <Geoff-G8DHE> Your welcome, if you ever need copies of the files shout!
[22:34] <Upu> I just linked direct
[22:34] <mclane_> I would like to create a version which can deal with fec on the telemetry strings
[22:34] <Upu> your mastery of Google Earth is better than mine
[22:34] <fsphil> ah
[22:34] <fsphil> good luck :)
[22:34] <Geoff-G8DHE> Its normally easier as there are several scripts to handle flash and html5 etc
[22:35] <fsphil> I think a better effort will be in replaceing the ukhas string style
[22:35] <Geoff-G8DHE> If have put an article on the Wiki
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[22:36] <Willdude123> ike so?
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[22:36] <mclane_> fsphil: probably you are right, but I would like to stay compatible with habhub
[22:37] <fsphil> oh the replacement will still be used with habitat
[22:37] <mclane_> do you have already concrete plans?
[22:37] <fsphil> just ideas at the moment
[22:37] <Geoff-G8DHE> Sounds nasty for Michael Schumacher :-(
[22:38] <Herman-PB0AHX> sleep well all
[22:38] <mclane_> I need to have reliable telemetry data since I live in Germany with very less trackers
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[22:39] <fsphil> I'm usually the only tracker on my flights
[22:39] <fsphil> rtty works pretty well
[22:39] <bbjunkie> yeah Geoff-G8DHE - had heard earlier abt his accident, but just saw the news.. seems its much worse than 1st thought :(
[22:39] <fsphil> but yea it could be better
[22:39] <mclane_> mostly I am the only tracker
[22:40] <mattbrejza> http://ukhas.org.uk/communication:binary_protocol
[22:40] <mclane_> and I have seen a considerable difference in reliability comparing 50 baud (with my current tracker) and 300baud (ssdv on Pi)
[22:42] <mclane_> - thanks for the hint in the wiki, did not see that so far
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[22:56] <fsphil> msgpack definitly the way to go you think mattbrejza?
[22:56] <Willdude123> I am trying to think what on earth is causing my radio to not work.
[22:57] <Willdude123> To make it more fun,the serial rarely works, there are no 64 bit drivers and the manual is writtwn in poor english
[23:00] <Willdude123> I mean the ctcss tone is almost certainly therre
[23:00] <Willdude123> I can use them fine if they are open
[23:00] <Willdude123> I just cant open them
[23:01] <Geoff-G8DHE> You do realise that lots of repeaters require both CTSS and Speech before they open ? Its to stop blippers!
[23:02] <Geoff-G8DHE> So call CQ as soon as you start key down
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[23:02] <mattbrejza> fsphil: saves having to come up with sometihng ourselves :P
[23:03] <mattbrejza> it pretty much does what i was orginally thinking of doing
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[23:11] <ei3hmb> sp9uob-Tom are you there?
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[23:15] <fsphil> it's not very good at storing small floating point numbers
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[23:18] <solarballoonman> Where is ANU? Spacenear shows it back over the North Sea, heading back to the UK.
[23:19] <fsphil> someone played back a recording and uploaded an old data point
[23:19] <arko> is tom's SP9UOB tracker active as well?
[23:19] <fsphil> it isn't coming back
[23:19] <solarballoonman> ok.
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[23:23] <solarballoonman> arko: SN shows it 'landed' in Poland, almost on top of a tracking mast symbol :)
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[23:24] <Willdude123> Geoff-G8DHE: of coursse
[23:24] <fsphil> something here is generating noise on 21.115mhz, it's clear above and below it
[23:24] <fsphil> annoying
[23:30] <mikestir> nothing heard from it on US west coast yet?
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[23:34] <Willdude123> fsphil: do you suspect its qrm or qrn?
[23:34] <arko> all is quiet on the western front
[23:34] <fsphil> probably something local
[23:38] <Willdude123> arko we watched that film in history
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[23:44] <mikestir> I think I've got my HF antenna plan past my mrs :)
[23:44] <fsphil> bribery?
[23:44] <mikestir> I think more a total lack of interest on her part
[23:44] <Willdude123> My internet isnt fast enough for google
[23:44] <Willdude123> It's OK for mosh but woth a lot of lag
[23:44] <mikestir> this may change once it's up
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[23:46] <solarballoonman> Just incase there are any F1 fans out there:- http://bbc.co.uk/news/world-europe-25545993
[23:48] <mikestir> Willdude123: are you going to have a go at a dual band yagi?
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[00:00] --- Mon Dec 30 2013