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[00:25] <OZ1SKY_Brian> gn
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[06:17] <DL7AD> morning
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[07:38] <Brian-g0hdi> Morning all, bit chilly this morning 5.3c here but dry.
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[07:48] <Brian-g0hdi> 'Morning DL7AD..
[07:48] <DL7AD> morning Brian-g0hdi and qall
[07:48] <DL7AD> morning Brian-g0hdi and @all
[07:49] <Brian-g0hdi> Hows the wx the friend?
[07:49] <Brian-g0hdi> there
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[07:57] <DL7AD> ehm good Brian-g0hdi
[07:57] <DL7AD> dry air no clouds sunny
[07:57] <Brian-g0hdi> Cloudy but dry here. 5.4c Chilly wind brrrrrr
[07:59] <DL1SGP1> dry air, partially cloudy but a lot of sun at -3c (-5c when I left for walking the dog)
[07:59] <DL7AD> i was frozen as well out there ^^
[08:01] <Brian-g0hdi> I don't like minus. I have cats....Low maintenance hi. I can stay in the warm... nice!
[08:04] <Brian-g0hdi> Have to go qrt now, so have a nice day y'all. Back later. Bye!! 73
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[09:35] <jcoxon> morning all
[09:38] <DL1SGP1> good morning jcoxon
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[09:53] <fsphil> mornings
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[09:55] <Andrew_M6GTG> morning all
[09:59] <x-f> monday
[09:59] <fsphil> it ends soon
[10:00] <fsphil> 14 hours to go
[10:00] <daveake> 14 looong hours
[10:02] <Andrew_M6GTG> what ends soon? have I missed another Mayan prophecy? ;-)
[10:03] <fsphil> the monday prophecy
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[10:03] <Andrew_M6GTG> ;-)
[10:03] <fsphil> http://predict.habhub.org/#!/uuid=f06d7569e0a19943f05648439ddb30340876beeb
[10:04] <fsphil> weird sharp turn
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[10:06] <DL7AD> morning
[10:08] <Andrew_M6GTG> is the redirection to the mobile version of the tracker still on? or is it just my browser being a clown?
[10:08] <adamgreig> just your browser
[10:08] <adamgreig> though to be fair
[10:08] <adamgreig> not sure whether the redirection was a permanent one or a temporary, in http terms
[10:09] <adamgreig> so it might be fair enough that it's caching it
[10:17] <fsphil> it was temporary
[10:18] <fsphil> not sure why browsers have cached it for so long
[10:18] <Andrew_M6GTG> firefox being an t**t, cleared everything and now okay
[10:18] <Andrew_M6GTG> thanks
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[11:16] <jcoxon_> eek my old macbook is so out of date in regards to packages
[11:17] <fsphil> yea I've found it's not as easy to keep macs up to date
[11:17] <jcoxon_> and its at its max OSX version i think
[11:17] <jcoxon_> think its time to use brew to update things unix style
[11:18] <fsphil> not tempted just to put linux on there?
[11:18] <fsphil> even in a vm?
[11:20] <eroomde> i have now fully abandoned the osx ship
[11:20] <eroomde> dev-wise
[11:21] <jcoxon_> i think its a bit of a faff on these old mac books
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[11:25] <mfa298_remote> I've seen Ubuntu on an early intel mac mini and I don't think it was a huge effort to get working
[11:26] <fsphil> shouldn't be
[11:26] <fsphil> intel mac's are basically PCs
[11:26] <fsphil> I've got a PPC mac mini. have an ancient version of fedora on it
[11:26] <fsphil> that was a pain to get going
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[11:27] <mfa298_remote> I can see that it might have been harder with the early core2s as I think Apple were using EFI then but no one else did.
[11:27] <mfa298_remote> althoguh that shouldn't be as much of a problem now
[11:27] <jcoxon_> thats probably what it is (which is causing me to avoid it)
[11:28] <jcoxon_> i think i'll download the latest of xcode and work my way up
[11:28] <jcoxon_> all i wanted to do is have python/ruby with a serial port library
[11:28] <cm13g09> yay - OS X
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[11:29] <mfa298_remote> I don't think EFI should be as much of a problem with newer distros, it a lot more common now (although it seems to be hidden behind the more traditional bios interface)
[11:31] <cm13g09> mfa298_remote: sadly... yes
[11:31] <cm13g09> EFI is too common for my liking!
[11:32] <DL7AD> does anyone know with which current i can discarge a lithium battery? (non rechargeable)
[11:33] <DL7AD> (maximum rate)
[11:33] <jcoxon_> DL7AD, like an energizer lithium AA?
[11:33] <DL7AD> jcoxon_: yes
[11:33] <jcoxon_> i think its something like 2A
[11:33] <jcoxon_> its pretty impressive
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[11:34] <UpuWork> 3A actually
[11:34] <UpuWork> http://data.energizer.com/PDFs/l91.pdf
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[11:34] <DL7AD> jcoxon_: i thought it would be more because Lithium ion can do more.
[11:34] <Steve_G0TDJ> 'Morning Guys
[11:34] <jcoxon_> search for a L91 energizer datasheet
[11:35] <UpuWork> -----/\
[11:35] <Brian-g0hdi> Morning Steve!
[11:35] <jcoxon_> max is 3.0 amps
[11:35] <Steve_G0TDJ> Hi Brian
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[11:35] <jcoxon_> thought it could do 5.0 amps at 20% duty cycle
[11:35] <jcoxon_> well 2secs on 8 secs off
[11:39] <fsphil> that's quite a lot
[11:40] <cm13g09> hmm... I wish we didn't have customers at times....
[11:40] <fsphil> hehe
[11:40] <fsphil> necessary evil
[11:40] <cm13g09> fsphil: yeah - agreed
[11:41] <cm13g09> (just had one who failed to follow the instructions for a second time in a row...)
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[11:42] <fsphil> some peoples ability to not read large red text is impressive
[11:43] <cm13g09> yeah
[11:43] <cm13g09> in our case: "Please email us a time that would be convenient to ring you"
[11:43] <cm13g09> Customer rings us....
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[11:45] <fsphil> oh looks like there was a brief flight last night
[11:45] <fsphil> SP5NVX
[11:46] <x-f> that particular payload had two brief flights yesterday
[11:46] <x-f> rain brought it down in a field the first time
[11:46] <x-f> http://obrazki.elektroda.pl/1384158000_1385305237.jpg
[11:47] <fsphil> cute payload
[11:48] <x-f> solar panel as a rain shield
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[12:19] <eroomde> adamgreig: http://www.amazon.co.uk/Filco-Majestouch-2-Tenkeyless-Action-Keyboard/dp/B004HYATT2/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1385381051&sr=8-1&keywords=filco+majestouch+tenkeyless+click
[12:19] <eroomde> expensed
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[12:21] <jonsowman> eroomde: I have the exact same one
[12:21] <eroomde> awesome
[12:21] <eroomde> like it?
[12:22] <eroomde> i was convinces after using adam's das last weekend
[12:22] <eroomde> but don#t want nupad
[12:22] <jonsowman> yep
[12:22] <eroomde> num*
[12:22] <jonsowman> I didn't want a numpad either
[12:22] <jonsowman> had mine about 15 months now
[12:22] <jonsowman> it's excellent
[12:23] <jonsowman> good choice on the blue switches
[12:24] <WillDuckworth> hundred quid for a keyboard?!
[12:25] <jonsowman> more than worth it
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[12:28] <fsphil> amazon seems to have more javascript each time I visit
[12:28] <jonsowman> everyone loves js though right
[12:28] <adamgreig> eroomde: nice, enjoy :)
[12:34] <adamgreig> incident post mortems are always great http://www.csb.gov/assets/1/19/CSB_CaseStudy_NDK_1107_500PM.pdf
[12:35] <adamgreig> large high pressure vessel for making the quartz crystals in your electronics blew up
[12:35] <adamgreig> sending a bit of steel beam 600' away where it hit and killed a hugely unfortunate member of the public
[12:35] <adamgreig> as ever a great combination of mechanical failure and management failure
[12:36] <adamgreig> like a less-bad challenger disaster
[12:36] <nats`> I think murphy wanted him dead
[12:37] <fsphil> robocop?
[12:37] <nats`> the secu cam view is impressive
[12:37] <adamgreig> plus as the story in the report develops you get this great picture of how the blame is inevitably going to work out
[12:38] <adamgreig> "NDK performed weld repairson the cracks near the pressure sensor connections on the vessel closure heads. The ASME code strictly prohibits welding for SA-723 forged steel."
[12:39] <nats`> I bet it's cheaper to do that than replacing defective part, even with all the consequence
[12:39] <adamgreig> not cheaper now that it's exploded, killed someone and the insurer isn't paying out ;)
[12:40] <nats`> picture page 6 are impresive
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[12:47] <nats`> adamgreig I don't really understand why those structure are not underground
[12:47] <nats`> that would be safer
[12:51] <adamgreig> very expensive to dig that deep
[12:51] <adamgreig> plenty of safe ways to operate that sort of thing aboveground
[12:52] <adamgreig> and an upwards concentrated eruption could still be pretty deadly
[12:52] <nats`> anyway the public case publication is interesting
[12:52] <nats`> I just finished to read it I don't understand everything but that's interesting :)
[12:53] <adamgreig> I think making these things public is fairly common. they are good to read.
[12:53] <nats`> I should try to find some in electronic field :)
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[13:13] <eroomde> WillDuckworth: worth it
[13:13] <eroomde> especially if company buying
[13:14] <WillDuckworth> yeah - if only I was that lucky
[13:14] <eroomde> and i'm using it like 5hrs a day so it's probably worth spending more on than...
[13:14] <eroomde> a car
[13:14] <eroomde> a gf
[13:14] <eroomde> and oven
[13:14] <WillDuckworth> combined
[13:14] <eroomde> exactly
[13:14] <eroomde> though not the office chair
[13:14] <eroomde> working up to that
[13:15] <adamgreig> aeron <3
[13:15] <fsphil> you don't want to be so comfortable that you slow down :)
[13:15] <adamgreig> though I like the look of a few of the new herman miller chairs
[13:15] <adamgreig> aeron is still such a classic
[13:16] <adamgreig> eroomde: by that metric you should be spending an awful lot of money on your bed :P
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[13:16] <eroomde> i did spend quite a lot on my mattress
[13:18] <adamgreig> same. super worth it.
[13:18] <adamgreig> and my duvet and pillows and bedsheets.
[13:20] <jonsowman> apparently my teacup needs to cost several million pounds
[13:20] <adamgreig> but what a teacup it would be
[13:21] <Laurenceb> chair is your gf?!
[13:22] Action: Laurenceb passes kleenex
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[13:38] <WillDuckworth> whats the standard microcam for habbing at the moment? still those 808s - but with some sort of shielding?
[13:40] <mattbrejza> you can always put the 808 in a seperate box a few m away from the tracker
[13:41] <craag> Yeah I had no issues with an 808 about 40cm away.
[13:41] <craag> Tested with the gps antenna sitting on the 808, also no issues, but guess I was lucky with that one.
[13:46] <laudenclaer> Hi, I started to work on my own HAB project a few weeks ago, and I have a design question for you guys: I got the radiometrix working using Trinket (that's the adafruit' arduino), and I managed to send and decode some data using Yupiteru and dl-fldigi. My next step is to connect the GPS to Raspberry Pi in order to generate the telemetric string and send it over to the radiometrix. I read in the wiki "...this means that the
[13:46] <SpeedEvil> cut off after 'means that the'
[13:47] <craag> laudenclaer: You realise you can connect the GPS straight to the 'trinket' right?
[13:47] <laudenclaer> (yeah here is the rest:) to read the GPS, then switch before transmitting" (to 300 and 9600 baud). Is that the common approch for this? How hard does it gets trying to fit to each module transmission speed? For example, can I use an SPI connection in one baud and the serial TX/RX in another baud? thanks a lot for your help
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[13:48] <craag> laudenclaer: Is this system using the trinket or the pi?
[13:48] <laudenclaer> craag: i do, but i what am i going to do with the images?
[13:49] <craag> ah you want ssdv :)
[13:49] <laudenclaer> I plan to use the pi as the tracker
[13:49] <craag> WHat part is the trinket playing?
[13:50] <laudenclaer> good question. I only bought it because I thought the pi wasn't enough to handle the transmission, but now I'm not so sure
[13:50] <craag> Ok, firstly it's not a good idea to run the pi as a primary tracker.
[13:50] <daveake> damn
[13:50] <daveake> :)
[13:50] <craag> haha
[13:51] <craag> unless your software is well-tested!
[13:51] <daveake> :)
[13:51] <fsphil> you'll have to start from scratch again daveake
[13:51] <craag> like daveake's
[13:51] <laudenclaer> :-_
[13:51] <laudenclaer> :-)
[13:51] <laudenclaer> I'm definitely on dave's side
[13:51] <fsphil> it's a bit easier to use an arduino
[13:52] <craag> That aside, to use tne NTX2 and GPS with the Pi, you can connect them both, but will need to switch baudrates in software between them.
[13:52] <craag> Or you can (although I haven't got it working yet myself) connect the GPS via i2c
[13:52] <laudenclaer> or SPI ?
[13:53] <fsphil> don't believe ublox modules can talk SPI
[13:53] <daveake> You need to find a suitable SPI GPS first
[13:53] <daveake> No ublox don't have SPI
[13:53] <laudenclaer> Since I'm a true newbie, i got a lot from adafruit, so I do have a GPS that support SPI
[13:53] <daveake> I don't know of any high-altitude GPS modules that do haveSPI
[13:54] <craag> Ah, adafruit's GPSs don't work well at high altitudes
[13:54] <daveake> varies
[13:54] <daveake> I think one of them does
[13:54] <mattbrejza> there is no reason not to swtich between 9600 and 300 though?
[13:54] <daveake> Upu will remember
[13:54] <craag> they've got the 27km one?
[13:54] <daveake> No you can switch baud rates
[13:54] <fsphil> mattbrejza: works but you get a gap in the transmittion
[13:54] <daveake> Close the port then re-open at the new rate
[13:54] <craag> But Upu doesn't recommend it iirc.
[13:55] <daveake> Or use i2c like wot I do
[13:55] <mattbrejza> well if you increase the data rate outpuit of the ublox, increase the baud, then the gap will be pretty small
[13:55] <fsphil> I'm using the shared uart method for Orion
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[13:55] <fsphil> I've had to put a short delay before talking to the ublox
[13:55] <mattbrejza> turn off all but gpgga
[13:55] <fsphil> it gets a bit confused by the rtty data
[13:55] <mattbrejza> or just poll...
[13:55] <laudenclaer> poll?
[13:56] <mattbrejza> you can use a gpio to stop the ublox getting the rtty
[13:56] <mattbrejza> i seem to remember a lovely ms paint diagram i once drew
[13:56] <fsphil> mattcad
[13:56] <mattbrejza> laudenclaer: poll means asking for gps rather than waiting it to output the position
[13:56] <mattbrejza> fsphil: http://i.imgur.com/1mKOKE3.png
[13:57] <mattbrejza> then you wont need the wait
[13:57] <mattbrejza> and minimal other components
[13:57] <laudenclaer> I see. well, also according to dave's web I can just "forget" to connect my tx to the GPS, right? as long as it doesn't need INIT
[13:57] <fsphil> switch from low output to input?
[13:57] <mattbrejza> yea
[13:57] <mattbrejza> well high to input
[13:58] <fsphil> ah yes, stop bit
[13:58] <mattbrejza> yea it idles high
[13:58] <fsphil> will give that a try
[13:58] <laudenclaer> is the other case, I just need to wait for a full transmission from the GPS, in order to be able to extract the data, right?
[13:59] <fsphil> yea you just wait for a GPGGA string
[13:59] <fsphil> by default it sends them every few seconds
[14:00] <laudenclaer> oh ok, now i got it - GPGGA
[14:00] <fsphil> that line will contain the time, position and altitude
[14:00] <fsphil> plus some other stuff
[14:00] <mattbrejza> well you can increase how often it sends out data so you dont have to wait so much
[14:00] <fsphil> http://aprs.gids.nl/nmea/
[14:02] <laudenclaer> just one more newbie question about communication: if you use arduino as a tracker, do you calculate the timing involved in connecting to the different modules, or is there well-written libraries to handle the different connections?
[14:02] <laudenclaer> (i mean the different bauds)
[14:03] <fsphil> the arduino library has functions to set the hardware uart's baud rate
[14:03] <craag> laudenclaer: Generally we connect the GPS to the hardware serial, so that's managed by the arduino hardware.
[14:04] <craag> (and controlled by the arduino library as fsphil says)
[14:04] <fsphil> it's actually not that difficult to set it directly via registers
[14:04] <fsphil> but if you're using arduino, stick with the official way :)
[14:06] <fsphil> the rtty is slow enough that you can do it using just delays
[14:06] <craag> Then the timing for the RTTY can either be done with delays, or interrupts. I think there's example code for each on the wiki.
[14:06] <fsphil> the bitbanging method
[14:08] <laudenclaer> :) ok, I'll play with it some more. Thanks a lot guys, and one big special thank-you to dave, who's to blame for making me addict to something i cannot explain why I'm doing...
[14:08] <fsphil> lol
[14:09] <daveake> Guilty as charged
[14:09] <daveake> as usual
[14:10] <fsphil> I'm not sure who to blame. probably jcoxon
[14:11] <daveake> Or Rob. He must be to blame for quite a few
[14:11] <laudenclaer> seeking for patient zero?
[14:12] <fsphil> oh that'll be Bill
[14:12] <jcoxon> say what!
[14:12] <jcoxon> yeah probably me
[14:12] <jcoxon> sorry
[14:14] <eroomde> Rob has a lot to answer for
[14:14] <laudenclaer> :-) my wife asked me "shouldn't we return this helium tank you got for the kid's birthday" and i said: "naaa... this one stays..."
[14:15] <mattbrejza> the idea for APEX I was pulled out of thin air though
[14:15] <mattbrejza> in 08
[14:15] <eroomde> CUSf was started after the canadian glider project
[14:15] <eroomde> then carl discovered james had just done one
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[14:15] <eroomde> and no Carl is no more
[14:16] <mattbrejza> we need some sort of project 'family tree'
[14:16] <jcoxon> i blame Dan-K2VOL
[14:17] <eroomde> CUSF was probably directly descenied from the canadian glider, with a bit of creepy-man-next-door from jcoxon
[14:17] <daveake> Last time I said "we need ..." (the listener timeline map) it was only a few hours before craag had it done and dusted :)
[14:17] <jcoxon> eroomde, not sure thats complete fair...
[14:18] <jcoxon> completely*
[14:18] <eroomde> nice man next door
[14:18] <eroomde> the one mum never talks about
[14:19] <jcoxon> what i remember of the beginnings of CUSF it wasn't really Carl
[14:19] <eroomde> but she insists your father is your father
[14:19] <eroomde> It was Carl's idea though, after his (and later my) DOS found the canadian glider project and sent it to him as somethin he might want to try
[14:19] <eroomde> as he was complained about how theoretical the degree was
[14:20] <jcoxon> yes that was my point
[14:20] <jcoxon> twas that DOS's suggestion
[14:20] <eroomde> a good suggestion too
[14:21] <mattbrejza> need a page on the wiki for 'project' with fields for 'founded by' 'inspired by' 'has inspired' 'members went on to...' 'new listeners recruited' etc
[14:21] <eroomde> new listeners put off by
[14:21] <eroomde> (I have to win something)
[14:21] <daveake> lol
[14:22] <jcoxon> eroomde's prize - actually making a career out of all this
[14:23] <eroomde> yes, that has been a good payof
[14:23] <eroomde> so far
[14:23] <eroomde> though no balloons for a while
[14:23] <laudenclaer> goodbye guys. thanks again
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[14:38] <Herman-PB0AHX> balloon which now hangs in the air over England and what is the frequency
[14:39] <mfa298_remote> I suspect it's just testing (spacenear is a bit slow to load over 3g)
[14:39] <mfa298_remote> if it's icarus you're looking at it's probably someone playing back a recording from the wiki
[14:39] <x-f> it is icarus from the sample recording on wiki, false alarm
[14:40] <Herman-PB0AHX> ok tnx info
[14:40] <Herman-PB0AHX> pffffffffff i thinking i mist one hihihi
[14:44] Action: jcoxon is getting his old altitude dial to work with habitat
[14:45] <jcoxon> so it'll display the altitude
[14:45] <craag> altitude dial?
[14:46] <craag> a mechanical one?
[14:46] <jcoxon> yeah
[14:46] <jcoxon> just hunting a pic hold on
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[14:47] <craag> Awesome!
[14:47] <jcoxon> http://www.flickr.com/photos/jcoxon77/2373496641/
[14:48] <craag> :D
[14:48] <craag> Isn't going to work for very long though..
[14:48] <craag> 400 feet..
[14:48] <SIbot> In real units: 400 ft = 122 m
[14:48] <jcoxon> you see that range dial
[14:48] <craag> ah
[14:49] <craag> turns the a number whell
[14:49] <jcoxon> it switches it to 4 -> 40
[14:49] <jcoxon> so if you forget the feet and think metric
[14:49] <craag> :)
[14:49] <craag> Great stuff
[14:49] <jcoxon> well if you ignore that completely and think K
[14:49] <craag> Where are you going to install it?
[14:49] <wd8mnv> adafruit *claims* 50K altitude on their Ultimate GPS
[14:50] <jcoxon> i'm putting together a little radio dashboard of various displays i've got
[14:50] <jcoxon> but this is the first part
[14:52] <craag> jcoxon: Cool stuff. Looking forward to seeing it!
[14:54] <mfa298_remote> sounds like an alternative set of things for showing off at the next conference (assuming things are transportable)
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[14:58] <jcoxon> hey navrac_work
[14:58] <jcoxon> long time
[14:59] <navrac_work> hiya - yes - it has been an exceptionally busy year so far - hoping it will start getting back to normal so i have time for a hobby again!
[15:00] <jcoxon> leo has taken on your mantle :-)
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[15:00] <navrac_work> I noticed - if his payloads get any lighter he wont need helium...
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[15:01] <navrac_work> how have his home made balloons being going
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[15:02] <navrac_work> how have his home made balloons been going?
[15:03] <jcoxon> i think he has always ended up going back to the standard 36 mylar
[15:04] <navrac_work> making your own is a lot of work it has to be said - it was a bit irritating spending 3 days making a balloon for it to go pop in a nearby tree
[15:05] <navrac_work> I must admit I'm at a bit of a loss on which direction to go - lightweight & solar seems to be done about as far as it can
[15:05] <craag> captive latex I think is probably the next avenue.
[15:06] <craag> Which leo has tried, but not got as far yet.
[15:06] <navrac_work> the space anchor method - i must admit that does sound interesting
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[15:07] <jcoxon> navrac_work, i'm going back to latex floating
[15:08] <navrac_work> I might go back to finding a decent tx/rx chipset and see if repeaters could work - or i guess if i get the time a flyable domino rx.
[15:09] <navrac_work> i think you're right james, pico is about exhausted on range etc, time to float some bigger things i think
[15:10] <navrac_work> since I'm only 5m ASL here a tethered receiver would be quite handy for me!
[15:10] <jcoxon> i certainly think the repeater idea would be fun to play with
[15:10] <jcoxon> balloon to balloon comms
[15:11] <jcoxon> navrac_work, did you see that one of hte cubesats has an rfm22 onboard
[15:11] <navrac_work> blimey - i bet they didnt uses the inbuilt oscillator!
[15:11] <jcoxon> apparently they are...
[15:11] <x-f> i tried to listen for it yesterday on three passes but couldn't hear it :/
[15:12] <kokey> sounds like they are then
[15:12] <fsphil> hope they're able to reset it every so often
[15:13] <jcoxon> ooo they've released software
[15:13] <jcoxon> https://www.dropbox.com/sh/l3919wtfiywk2gf/84H9TuIgQr/Software
[15:14] Action: fsphil notices the language
[15:14] <jcoxon> yeah
[15:14] Action: fsphil does not comment
[15:15] <fsphil> at least they released it
[15:15] <fsphil> more should do that
[15:15] <kokey> they're running it on CHDK?
[15:15] <jcoxon> i think its a picaxe
[15:15] <fsphil> oh not that bad
[15:16] <kokey> actually, Novell used to have web servers that ran .BAS scripts
[15:16] <fsphil> chdk basic is possibly the worst one
[15:16] <jcoxon> when is it next due over
[15:16] <mattbrejza> http://www.picaxeforum.co.uk/showthread.php?24846-PICAXE-is-in-Space/page8 is apparently still going
[15:17] <x-f> yeah, there area couple reports on their Yahoo group too, good
[15:18] <fsphil> what are they sending over rtty?
[15:18] <fsphil> does it have a space rated gps receiver?
[15:18] <jcoxon> fsphil, you can see the circuit diagram on their dropbox
[15:19] <navrac_work> RFM= rapid frequency meanderings - nice to be able to read the source though
[15:19] <jcoxon> i think they've added a crystal
[15:20] <fsphil> I just see software
[15:20] <jcoxon> go up a level
[15:21] <fsphil> dropbox doesn't seem to be offering me a link up
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[15:21] <navrac_work> 'The RFM22 can go into POR (power on reset) when transmitting at high power.' - they noticed that then.
[15:21] <fsphil> good
[15:22] <fsphil> that killed the only pico to get near me :)
[15:22] <jcoxon> https://www.dropbox.com/sh/l3919wtfiywk2gf/-HxyXNsIr8
[15:22] <fsphil> thanks jcoxon
[15:22] <fsphil> not sure what's going on there
[15:22] <Reb-SM3ULC> jcoxon: some ad hoc routing on balloon maybe, olsr, aodv etc.. :)
[15:24] <jcoxon> we should listen out for its next pass
[15:24] <gonzo__> $50sat shoudl be roughly the same place as funcube
[15:24] <gonzo__> next pass at 1947hrs
[15:24] <gonzo__> if I rewire the system, I may be able to get that and FC at the same time?
[15:24] <eroomde> I just closed a terminal that had eaglecad running in bg
[15:25] <navrac_work> hmm - a bit brave putting the rx code up there.
[15:25] <eroomde> lost about 1 hour's work which was a really tricky layout
[15:25] <eroomde> that's jolly jolly annoying, and now I'm annoyed
[15:25] <gonzo__> so they have publicided their commanding?
[15:26] <jcoxon> eroomde, i sometimes find that doing it again makes it even better
[15:27] <eroomde> yes
[15:27] <SpeedEvil> eroomde: On that topic - I have had my confirmation letter from Jolla mobile that my order went through.
[15:27] <eroomde> but doing it again also costs an extra £150
[15:27] <SpeedEvil> (No, not very related)
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[15:31] <eroomde> imagine if you were operating on someone and accidently left your watch inside them
[15:31] <eroomde> but then said 'don't worry! I usually find I do a better job the second time round!'
[15:31] <eroomde> that's sort of what just happened
[15:31] <jcoxon> eek
[15:31] <eroomde> but with less chance of infection and death
[15:31] <eroomde> unless I have to use windows
[15:32] <jcoxon> when put that way...
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[15:33] <fsphil> it's a monday thing
[15:34] <fsphil> mondays always suck
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[15:42] <navrac_work> looking at the 50sat 'Communications - Release Version V1_0.pdf' page 17 they havent put an external oscillator on it
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[15:50] <UpuWork> hey navrac long time no see
[15:53] <navrac_work> hi upuwork , yes it's been 'a bit of a year' as they say - I'm hoping some form of normality is coming up - but I've been hoping that for months now!
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[15:58] <Brian-g0hdi> Noticed Icarus on tracking map. Is that a test or what? Any info please.
[15:59] <jcoxon> its a test
[15:59] <Brian-g0hdi> Ok thanks!
[16:00] <fsphil> a very old test
[16:00] <navrac_work> upuwork - do you remember what the usable frequency range of the habamp was?
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[16:02] <fsphil> it's about 8mhz isn't it?
[16:02] <fsphil> drops of at the edges of the 70cm band
[16:03] <navrac_work> just seeing if it would include the s50sat on 437.5 which it looks about it just about does
[16:04] <Brian-g0hdi> Interesting! That means my embedded version of tracker doesn't refresh then, unless I auto refresh my own page..Oh well, live and learn hi
[16:04] <fsphil> 7mhz, http://rfhead.net/?p=484
[16:05] <navrac_work> yep thats where i just found it - pretty much on the -3db point
[16:05] <mattbrejza> Brian-g0hdi: youll automatically get new positions, but unless you referesh payloads wont disappear
[16:06] <Brian-g0hdi> Ok, thanks.
[16:07] <UpuWork> navrac_work sure 1 sec
[16:08] <UpuWork> ~ 430 - 440Mhz
[16:08] <UpuWork> https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/63720513/PDFS/B3580_433.pdf
[16:09] <navrac_work> I'll slip the antenna up then and have a quick listen tonight then
[16:09] <Laurenceb> JIG-SAW
[16:09] <Laurenceb> would you like to play a game?? i call it HAB
[16:13] <eroomde> and it's after 4 all of a sudden
[16:13] <eroomde> this is a stupid day and I want it to end already
[16:14] <eroomde> Laurenceb:
[16:14] <Laurenceb> lol
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[16:34] <eroomde> clever algorithms: farnell's randomization algorithm to decide just in which current browser tab it should display the PDF you just clicked on in a different tab
[16:34] <eroomde> and possible a different desktop workspace
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[16:34] <eroomde> they should use it as a source for dev/urandom
[16:35] <adamgreig> isn't it wonderful
[16:35] <adamgreig> ugh. the div F cluster I just found out I have access to..
[16:35] <craag> It's already used to select results for their search :P
[16:36] <adamgreig> what. it's a mix of ubuntu 10.04, 12.04 and SuSE 11
[16:36] <adamgreig> how on earth are you meant to write software to target that
[16:36] <adamgreig> if I'm lucky I get a 12.04 box that has python3.2
[16:36] <adamgreig> but 3.2 is terrible
[16:36] <daveake> And to convert between Farnell and CPC pricing
[16:36] <adamgreig> daveake: I thought you multiply by the factor difference in delivery time ;)
[16:37] <daveake> ah yes that too :)
[16:38] <daveake> They should order from each other. Then CPC would have much better stock levels :p
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[16:38] <fsphil> cpc are normally very good at delivery for me. but my last order seemed to take longer than usual
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[16:39] <eroomde> ping someone about it
[16:39] <eroomde> tell them to just bumpt everything up
[16:40] <nats`> someone know some rig or receiver kit for 400MHz ?
[16:40] <fsphil> I use the FCD for 400mhz, but I believe it's a bit random if it covers that frequency
[16:41] <fsphil> the rtlsdr should be able to
[16:42] <nats`> I prefere to avoid rtlsdr
[16:42] <nats`> that's usefull for poking
[16:42] <nats`> but the drift is still huge and dynamic bad
[16:43] <DL1SGP1> nats`: it should be all-mode I guess?
[16:43] <jcoxon> nats`, FT 790r
[16:43] <nats`> jcoxon I have a FT790R
[16:43] <nats`> but I mean really 400MHz
[16:43] <jcoxon> oh right
[16:44] <nats`> not the ham band in 430
[16:44] <nats`> :)
[16:44] <jcoxon> as in radiosondes etc
[16:44] <nats`> yep
[16:44] <nats`> DL1SGP1 preferably
[16:44] <nats`> after I can try to mod the FT790R if it's possible
[16:44] <nats`> since I have a 857 for standard band
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[16:45] <fsphil> the baofeng uv3r can do 400mhz iirc
[16:46] <nats`> I should give a try to all those low cost baofeng
[16:46] <nats`> never had one in hands
[16:46] <jcoxon> bbl
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[16:47] <fsphil> definitly feel cheap but they work well
[16:48] <nats`> I check on ebay ;=)
[16:48] <nats`> thanks for informations
[16:49] <wd8mnv> baofeng is FM only
[16:50] <fsphil> the sondes use FM
[16:51] <mfa298> I think the options for multimode at 400MHz are fairly limited. Some of the wideband scanners might manage it
[16:51] <wd8mnv> in theory you could get a NA/SA 602 up in the 400 MHz range
[16:51] <DL1SGP1> or you hack an IF out into a non-multimode device :)
[16:52] <wd8mnv> NE602 and its variants
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[16:53] <nats`> NE602 the mixer ?
[16:53] <nats`> like SA602 ?
[16:53] <wd8mnv> yep
[16:53] <nats`> could do it for strong signal
[16:54] <nats`> but the noise figure is soooooooo crappy that I doubt for a radiosonde it'll work
[16:54] <nats`> but the idea is not bad I could maybe use some mini circuit mixer on the FT790R input
[17:04] <chrisstubbs> mfa298, did your ovivo sim come today?
[17:06] <mfa298> chrisstubbs: it did
[17:06] <mfa298> Not tried it yet
[17:06] <chrisstubbs> just tried mine
[17:06] <chrisstubbs> 244ms ping
[17:06] <chrisstubbs> 0.41 up
[17:06] <chrisstubbs> download failed
[17:06] <chrisstubbs> :P
[17:07] <chrisstubbs> sorry 0.41 down, upload failed
[17:07] <chrisstubbs> need to find more signals
[17:07] Action: craag just googled ovivo - waaat?!
[17:07] <craag> £0
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[17:08] <mfa298> that was our thinking!
[17:08] <craag> huh
[17:08] <fsphil> I can almost pronounce that
[17:09] <mattbrejza> ad supported...
[17:10] <mfa298> Hopefully avoidable with SOCKS
[17:10] <chrisstubbs> aw man it knows im using ABP
[17:10] <eroomde> i've said this a few times before but the symbols provided by farnell's eagle parts really are of the very poorest quality
[17:11] <eroomde> can bus isolator and tranceiver, you'd think you have all the logic level inputs on the left, and the logic level vdd and gnd on the left, and the isolated can outputs on the right, and the isolated buss VDD and GND on the right
[17:11] <eroomde> alas no
[17:12] <eroomde> all down one side, VDD1, VDD2, GND1, GND2, CANH, Tx, CANL, Rx
[17:12] <eroomde> etc
[17:12] <eroomde> pathetic
[17:12] <DL1SGP1> uh
[17:12] <eroomde> there should be some japanese inspired cultural movement to kill yourself when you do something shit
[17:13] <SpeedEvil> http://www.gizmag.com/new-wave-energy-creates-aerial-power-plants/29849/
[17:13] <mattbrejza> mfa298: / chrisstubbs is there any small print saying you have to spend so much a year or something? or do they spam you with advertising even if you dont go on the net?
[17:13] <mattbrejza> or do they assume most people have smart phones and so will see their advertising?
[17:14] <fsphil> add-supported ISPs haven't worked well in the past
[17:14] <SpeedEvil> Also - wirelessly - are they on crack?
[17:14] <mattbrejza> by the time i bother to transfer they would have probably gone bust
[17:14] <mfa298> there didn't seem to be any small print abou spending more. But it sounded like you could get a fair bit of advertising when web browsing
[17:15] <fsphil> there used to be an ISP that had an 0800 number, and adverts on a banner at the top (windows only, obviously)
[17:15] <chrisstubbs> yeah every now and again you get redirected to their site with loads of ads
[17:16] <SpeedEvil> fsphil: I used a mouse on a fan.
[17:16] <mfa298> Interesting, I've got a 172.18 address I think that's the first time I've seen someone use that private address space
[17:16] <fsphil> I wrote a little program that hid the banner
[17:16] <chrisstubbs> no popups or annoying things, you just have to navigate there again
[17:16] <SpeedEvil> fsphil: I altered my monitor geometry to remove it
[17:16] <fsphil> nice
[17:17] <fsphil> could probably have just run a proxy server on that box
[17:17] <fsphil> don't think I had any kind of network back then, other than the modem
[17:17] <fsphil> ethernet cards used to be expensive :)
[17:18] <mfa298> hmm, that test failed, tried to ssh into a vps and it used ipv6 over wifi instead of ipv4 over 3g :(
[17:18] <mfa298> one time I don't want IPv6 to work !
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[17:20] <mfa298> SSH works over it :D
[17:20] <craag> awww Devices such as GPS trackers, satellite navigation, data-enabled cameras or other machine to machine devices are prohibited and will be disconnected from OVIVO's network, resulting in your service being withdrawn.
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[17:20] <craag> I was just thinking that would be awesome :P
[17:21] <chrisstubbs> mfa298, see how long it lasts, Im finding connections just stop working after a few mins until you go and get more ads
[17:21] <chrisstubbs> Geoff-G8DHE, Did you say you didnt see any ads on yours?
[17:22] <mattbrejza> does it get in the way of apps that use the itnernet?
[17:22] <mfa298> only had adds on my first page load attempt
[17:23] <mfa298> after ssh, the one to test is dl-fldigi and mosh, if they all keep working what more do you need ?
[17:24] <mfa298> ah, just got another set of adds
[17:24] <chrisstubbs> only having one bar of signal isnt helping things my end
[17:26] <mfa298> according to the 3G dashboard I'm getting 760+ kbit/s
[17:27] <mfa298> just hit 2mbps download :D
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[17:28] <chrisstubbs> mfa298, http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FPqk_eKwVLY
[17:29] <mfa298> now flash is hopefully updated I might be able to do a real speed test
[17:30] <mfa298> these ads might get annoying. although I wonder how simple their algoritm is for checking
[17:30] <mfa298> a simple get request on a regular basis might work
[17:31] <chrisstubbs> maybe
[17:31] <chrisstubbs> i was thinking just a vb/python/whatever program in the background that just loads google every couple of mins
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[17:48] <mfa298_remote> chrisstubbs: http://www.speedtest.net/my-result/3124808540
[17:49] <mfa298> allthough the adverts got annoying trying to do the speedtest.
[17:49] <chrisstubbs> haha
[17:50] <mfa298> I shall have to try getting 3g to work on linux then see if it's possible to bypass them.
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[17:54] <daveake> have fun with that :)
[17:55] <daveake> Normally OK once you've persuaded the modem that it's a modem and not a CD drive
[17:56] <mfa298> It looks relativly simple, I've just never bothered trying. I've usually used the 3G router instead
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[18:05] <daveake> Yeah it's not bad
[18:05] <daveake> I got it working from http://shkspr.mobi/blog/2012/07/3g-internet-on-raspberry-pi-success/
[18:07] <mfa298> although the guide I found which looked easy has different options for usb modeswitch to the ones on fedora
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[18:08] <craag> recently I've found just installing usb-modeswitch automatically takes care of the mode-switching side whenever you plug a new dongle in
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[18:09] <daveake> ah, didn't know that
[18:10] <daveake> I should do another flight with 3G backup
[18:10] <mfa298> hmmm, I really should have watched the logs - looks like that has happened :)
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[18:12] <jcoxon> SP3OSJ, is in the air
[18:12] <jcoxon> and my altitude gauge/dial tells me its at 1200m
[18:12] <craag> nice jcoxon :)
[18:12] <jcoxon> its not well suited to picos currently
[18:14] <eroomde> you should have a x10 option
[18:14] <eroomde> for MABs
[18:14] <jcoxon> flicking the range dial would give me 0-4
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[18:17] <jcoxon> but thats not really high enough
[18:17] <jcoxon> bbl
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[18:19] <eroomde> talk of the devil
[18:19] <Dan-K2VOL> oh?
[18:19] <Dan-K2VOL> afternoon gents
[18:20] <eroomde> we were talking about a family tree of inflence in UKHAS
[18:20] <eroomde> jcoxon was just here
[18:20] <eroomde> you influenced him getting into HAB
[18:20] <eroomde> the canadian glider project influence CUSF
[18:20] <eroomde> there are probably a lot of siblings between those two
[18:20] <eroomde> siblings/offspring
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[18:23] <Dan-K2VOL> :-)
[18:23] <Dan-K2VOL> I've been impressed with the pico flying these days
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[18:24] <eroomde> it's superpressure on the cheap. which is cool
[18:25] <Dan-K2VOL> very cool!
[18:25] <eroomde> one of two things could make me happy right now: 1) a drink, 2) supermarket sweep on MSC industrial
[18:25] <Dan-K2VOL> hehe
[18:25] <eroomde> how is work going with you? the bits you can talk about anyhoo]
[18:27] <Dan-K2VOL> It's been an amazing balloon engineering whirlwind so far!
[18:28] <Dan-K2VOL> So many balloon subsystem R&D experiments in one place, it's a dream
[18:29] <eroomde> can you share any interesting details?
[18:29] <Dan-K2VOL> yes
[18:29] <Dan-K2VOL> we've been sharing a series of video answers to good questions here: https://plus.google.com/+ProjectLoon/posts
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[18:29] Nick change: pericynthion -> dove3_henry
[18:29] <Dan-K2VOL> normally i wouldn't just plug fluff PR, but you get to see into the labs, and see our equipment up close
[18:29] <eroomde> dove3_henry: ping
[18:29] <eroomde> success?
[18:29] <eroomde> right orbit?
[18:30] <Dan-K2VOL> I've been working hard on temperature sensing at high altitudes - it's a LOT harder than I ever imagined
[18:30] <dove3_henry> eroomde: yeah, and I beat JSpOC to identifying the orbit with my CC1110 time-of-flight ranging :D
[18:30] <Dan-K2VOL> but it was figured out in the 1960s by the GHOST and EOLE guys just fine
[18:31] <Dan-K2VOL> also the IR input at night severely impacts your superpressure
[18:32] <Dan-K2VOL> and flying a simple IR temp sensor provides a fantastic view into why you've lost superpressure
[18:32] <DL7AD> evening
[18:33] <eroomde> Dan-K2VOL: video is annoying
[18:33] <eroomde> 'how we built the antenna' has nothing to do with antennas
[18:33] <eroomde> just about injection moulding a plastic radome
[18:33] <eroomde> dove3_henry: cool!
[18:33] <Dan-K2VOL> even if not used quantitatively, the superpressure will track with the IR input
[18:33] <Dan-K2VOL> haha yeah not all are that substantive
[18:34] <Dan-K2VOL> but the Up and Down one is good
[18:35] <Dan-K2VOL> the Last so Long one is pretty good too
[18:35] <eroomde> yeah just watched that
[18:35] <eroomde> neat
[18:36] <eroomde> though a seemingly v small vent
[18:36] <Dan-K2VOL> yeah
[18:37] <Dan-K2VOL> you get to see the inside of the zeppelin Hangar at Moffett Field (NASA Ames) in the Last so Long one
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[18:41] <eroomde> enjoying that last one Dan-K2VOL
[18:41] <eroomde> dove3_henry: how long do you expect it to be up?
[18:41] <eroomde> there were 2 weren't there?
[18:42] <Dan-K2VOL> there are still 3 airship hangars at Moffett, two still fully functional, and the biggest, Hangar 1, has no roof, but is preserved for when NASA has money for a roof someday
[18:42] <Dan-K2VOL> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hangar_One_(Mountain_View,_California)
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[18:42] <eroomde> yes, i know of it
[18:42] <eroomde> had a wonder around earlier in the year
[18:42] <eroomde> it did look a bit sad without the cladding
[18:42] <Dan-K2VOL> oh that's right!
[18:43] <Dan-K2VOL> The airport's rotary light beacon is on the top of it still,
[18:43] <Dan-K2VOL> and it shines in my bedroom window now that the leaves have fallen!
[18:44] <S_Mark> I've driven passed Moffett
[18:45] <S_Mark> Was amazing
[18:45] <Dan-K2VOL> This is a neat PDF detailing a report inspecting one of the other remaining hangars: http://historicproperties.arc.nasa.gov/map_reuse/reuse_forms/hangar2_reuse_2006.pdf
[18:48] <S_Mark> on the way to this http://imgur.com/PIyaQ2y
[18:48] <Dan-K2VOL> haha cool!
[18:50] <eroomde> ha
[18:50] <S_Mark> lol and this http://imgur.com/TZUTqjB
[18:51] <eroomde> i went round it before i went to visit google :)
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[18:51] <arko> haha
[18:51] <S_Mark> Yeah we got as far as that sign too lol
[18:51] <DL1SGP1> good evening all and LeoBodnar
[18:52] <LeoBodnar> good evening DL1SGP1
[18:52] <arko> S_Mark: you in the bay area now?
[18:52] <eroomde> i had a friend on the inside :)
[18:52] Nick change: DL1SGP1 -> DL1SGP
[18:52] <S_Mark> No this was last year unfortunately!
[18:52] <arko> ahh
[18:52] <S_Mark> Ah awesome, eroomde, as good as expected?
[18:52] <eroomde> food was lovely
[18:52] <S_Mark> I need some friends on the inside of stuff
[18:52] <eroomde> i'd still rather be part of a smaller team though
[18:52] <S_Mark> Ah yeah
[18:53] <eroomde> what you need is a research division powered by a company hat has a license to print money
[18:53] <ve6ts> i'd rather be in research then operations
[18:54] <arko> its too big to make a difference
[18:54] <eroomde> like Bell labs (monopoly on telecoms in the US in the day), Xerox Park (office stuff), Microsoft research (paid for by sales of microsoft word), Google X (payed for by AdWords)
[18:54] <arko> ooo
[18:54] <arko> google x is cool
[18:54] <arko> self-driving cars
[18:54] <Dan-K2VOL> and balloons arko ;-)
[18:54] <arko> ah yes :)
[18:55] <eroomde> somewhere wehn you can say 'we're going to spent $10 in the next couple of years and it might not work'
[18:55] <eroomde> and they say 'sure'
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[18:55] <eroomde> $10m*
[18:55] <arko> hahaha
[18:55] <arko> i was like $10?
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[18:55] <qyx_> i was \o/
[18:55] <S_Mark> Hmmm
[18:55] <eroomde> or $500m in the next 3 years
[18:55] <eroomde> but we're confident it'll work :)
[18:55] <qyx_> i am also going to smend $10 in the next couple of yeras
[18:56] <arko> thats the power of google money
[18:56] <S_Mark> Anyone need a Business Development Manager for IT!?
[18:56] <eroomde> I want someone who can
[18:56] <eroomde> do purchasing
[18:56] <eroomde> turn
[18:56] <eroomde> weld
[18:56] <eroomde> all in the same package
[18:57] <Dan-K2VOL> that's a busy person!
[18:57] <eroomde> this person would be extremely useful
[18:58] <eroomde> well, right now we don't really have enough of any single on eof those to be full-time
[18:58] <eroomde> but between them there's a full-time job
[18:59] <eroomde> we'll have a huge fabrication effort shortly for this new engine that we're firing in spring, but after that it'll just be fixing stuff if it goes wrong, which is not often enough to jutify having someone around full time
[19:01] <SpeedEvil> eroomde: 'like Bell labs (monopoly on telecoms in the US in the day), ' - you missed out Lyons.
[19:01] <Dan-K2VOL> neat
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[19:02] <SpeedEvil> http://new.livestream.com/spacex/SES8 - SpaceX in about 3 hours to GTO
[19:02] <eroomde> but no, sadly no business development for IT S_Mark :)
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[19:03] <S_Mark> Haha well thanks for the consideration
[19:03] <S_Mark> I also have the problem/blessing of being a public sector worker
[19:03] <S_Mark> good for flexi time, bad for market value salary
[19:03] <arko> woah
[19:04] <arko> they are going geostationary?
[19:04] <Dan-K2VOL> wow cool
[19:04] <SpeedEvil> arko: yes
[19:04] <arko> nice
[19:04] <arko> good luck to them
[19:04] <SpeedEvil> Actually - well beyond GEO
[19:04] <SpeedEvil> 2*
[19:04] <Dan-K2VOL> big secondary burn I suppose?
[19:04] <SpeedEvil> For fuel saving reasons.
[19:04] <SpeedEvil> Dunno if they're going straight up.
[19:05] <SpeedEvil> I expect they'll need to relight at least once
[19:05] <SpeedEvil> hence them being worried about the sencond stage not relighting last time, and the customer saying publically they are happy with teh fix
[19:05] <Dan-K2VOL> ah
[19:06] <eroomde> S_Mark: be a startup worker
[19:06] <eroomde> good for flexitime
[19:06] <eroomde> bad for actual time
[19:06] <eroomde> salary spans an enormous spectrum :)
[19:06] <eroomde> though too little, initially
[19:07] <S_Mark> Yeah, need to move to somewhere where this stuff actually happens - out of the Forest
[19:07] <S_Mark> and soon
[19:08] <S_Mark> Unless I make my own
[19:09] <Dan-K2VOL> where are you S_Mark
[19:09] <eroomde> the latter is cool
[19:09] <S_Mark> Forest of Dean - UK
[19:09] <eroomde> you just need that first customer/contract to make the leep
[19:09] <S_Mark> yeah defo
[19:09] <eroomde> something that'll give you security for 6+ months
[19:09] <eroomde> that was my threshold anyway
[19:11] <jcoxon> i suspect being part of a startup is very exciting
[19:11] <jcoxon> and very stressful
[19:11] <Dan-K2VOL> Mike Coffet, KJ4Z from UTARC and Spirit of Knoxville has moved out here with me, he's looking to get involved in a startup in silicon valley too
[19:11] <eroomde> yes
[19:11] <Dan-K2VOL> Coffey
[19:12] <eroomde> wait until helen is a consultant, james
[19:12] <Dan-K2VOL> :-)
[19:12] <jcoxon> there is a chance i'll beat her to it
[19:12] <eroomde> well i'm not matching your salary when skylon needs a flight surgeon
[19:13] <jcoxon> i can't imagine it'll be a full time position :-p
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[19:16] <Geoff-G8DHE> chrisstubbs, It seems my wife had the first adverts appear on Saturday, we've had it for 3 weeks and used 5 or 6 times for an hour or so without anything appearing!
[19:16] Nick change: KipK -> KipK_away
[19:19] <jcoxon> SP3OSJ has an interesting flight path
[19:21] <SP3OSJ> http://ready.arl.noaa.gov/hypubout/118617_trj001.gif
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[19:22] <jcoxon> cool
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[19:24] <jcoxon> anyone going to listen out for $50dollarsat?
[19:25] <qyx_> what's the freq for SP3OSJ?
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[19:28] <fsphil> jcoxon: what frequency again?
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[19:28] <x-f> $50 - 437.505, SP3OSJ - 437.7
[19:29] <fsphil> now I just need to find my FCD
[19:29] <x-f> :)
[19:29] <fsphil> they need to make a bigger version so I don't lose it
[19:29] <qyx_> x-f: thanks, i'll try my new diy collinear if it comes nearby
[19:29] <jcoxon> 437.505
[19:29] <x-f> where are you, qyx_?
[19:29] <fsphil> ah got it
[19:29] <qyx_> BA/SK
[19:30] <qyx_> x-f: ^
[19:30] <x-f> cool
[19:31] <fsphil> does the 50d satellite have a code?
[19:31] <fsphil> for tracking with
[19:31] <dove3_henry> eroomde: this one will be up 25+ years
[19:31] <jcoxon> fsphil, from what i can work out the morse is FM and rtty is ssb
[19:31] <dove3_henry> nice high orbit
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[19:32] <jcoxon> fsphil, i think we should be using unisat5
[19:32] <fsphil> checking for that
[19:32] <dove3_henry> hey jcoxon, how are you doing?
[19:32] <fsphil> 1, 2 and 3
[19:32] <fsphil> no 5
[19:32] <dove3_henry> (Henry from CUSF)
[19:32] <fsphil> I'll see if I can grab the TLEs
[19:32] <jcoxon> hey dove3_henry yeah i guessed
[19:32] <jcoxon> good thanks
[19:32] <dove3_henry> we are also trying to contact unisat 5, it has our satellite hostage inside of it
[19:32] <jcoxon> you?
[19:32] <dove3_henry> not bad
[19:33] <fsphil> space piracy? :)
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[19:33] <fsphil> it was suppose to be released from unisat 5?
[19:34] <dove3_henry> yep
[19:34] <dove3_henry> but the Italians haven't been able to contact unisat yet
[19:34] <fsphil> ooch
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[19:35] <dove3_henry> and the TLEs are all confused... oy vey
[19:35] <fsphil> I have a TLE for UNISAT-5
[19:35] <fsphil> not sure how recent it is
[19:35] <dove3_henry> do you know where you got it from?
[19:36] <fsphil> picaxeforum -- not sure where they got it
[19:36] <fsphil> gpredict won't accept it
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[19:36] <fsphil> I'm getting a lot of that recently
[19:37] <dove3_henry> got a link? :)
[19:37] <fsphil> http://www.picaxeforum.co.uk/showthread.php?24846-PICAXE-is-in-Space&p=250568
[19:37] <fsphil> there's also one in http://www.celestrak.com/NORAD/elements/tle-new.txt
[19:38] <fsphil> which didn't work either
[19:38] <dove3_henry> didn't work as in gpredict wouldn't accept it?
[19:38] <dove3_henry> thanks
[19:38] <dove3_henry> brb pass
[19:38] <fsphil> yea I've put it into a file and told gpredict to import from it
[19:38] <fsphil> but it's not finding it
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[19:42] <SP3OSJ> # habhub
[19:43] <fsphil> listening on 437.505
[19:43] <fsphil> I think
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[19:49] <fsphil> not hearing it
[19:50] <jcoxon> its quite far away on this pass isn't it?
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[19:50] <fsphil> yea if it's similar to the funcube it's very low
[19:50] <SP3OSJ> #habhub
[19:51] <fsphil> aah
[19:51] <fsphil> doppler
[19:52] <jcoxon> you got something?
[19:52] <fsphil> yea heard a signal dropping in frequency
[19:52] <fsphil> it's gone again
[19:52] <gonzo__> O heard notw
[19:52] <fsphil> there is a strong data signal on 437.550
[19:53] <gonzo__> but it cuts into FC rxing time, and I am trying to work up the packerts heard ranking
[19:53] <fsphil> ok now a signal rising in frequency
[19:54] <fsphil> too quick to track
[19:55] <fsphil> and gone
[19:55] <fsphil> didn't sound like rtty
[19:56] <fsphil> the change in direction of the frequency shift doesn't make sense
[19:56] <fsphil> if it was a satellite I heard
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[19:59] <jcoxon> next funcube pass around 21:21?
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[20:01] <fsphil> yea matches what I have
[20:01] <gonzo__> hearing cw with doppler on 145.984
[20:01] <gonzo__> fc is out of range, so must be another sat
[20:03] <gonzo__> now what sounds like 400bd telem on 145.938
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[20:05] <gonzo__> certainly a busy bit of the spectrum. Been a while sice I've listened
[20:05] <gonzo__> alsmot as busy as 434 when Leo os launching
[20:06] <fsphil> except I can hear it :)
[20:17] <dove3_henry> fsphil: is it EAGLE that you're listening to?
[20:17] <fsphil> not sure what it was
[20:18] <dove3_henry> hehe, right
[20:18] <dove3_henry> there's some chance that NORAD has incorrectly identified unisat
[20:18] <dove3_henry> they definitely misidentified both of our satellites
[20:18] <dove3_henry> we're trying to sort it out with them
[20:18] <dove3_henry> but that might explain some of the difficulties
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[20:39] <DL1SGP> hi ibanezmatt13
[20:40] <ibanezmatt13> Hey Felix :')
[20:40] <ibanezmatt13> I'm hacking my TV
[20:41] <ibanezmatt13> Well, trying to get an infrared LED to flash in the right sequence to turn volume up and down on my Sky Box. So not TV. Can't seem to figure how this damn Sky protocol thing works
[20:45] <DL1SGP> do you happen to have a logic analyzer?
[20:45] <ibanezmatt13> I have a scope, and I've hooked it all up. I'm seeing the square waves coming through when I use the IR Led
[20:45] <DL1SGP> that is a start
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[20:46] <ibanezmatt13> Yep, so I'm right of course thinking that the sky remote will operate at the same freq as the sky receiver :P
[20:46] <DL1SGP> and now you try to send the same command through arduino?
[20:47] <ibanezmatt13> Well, I can't work out how I send the same command through Arduino, so how to get the IR codes or whatever to work with Arduino :)
[20:47] <ibanezmatt13> http://www.remotecentral.com/cgi-bin/codes/sky/sky/
[20:47] <ibanezmatt13> they look like they could be useful, but not a clue what they represent.
[20:47] <fsphil> you need to turn on and off a PWM signal
[20:47] <DL1SGP> indeed
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[20:48] <ibanezmatt13> yep fsphil, precisely. Just working out how to do it for the right IR codes though
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[20:48] <ibanezmatt13> So once I know the freq, I know how many pulses per second to do with the PWM, I guess that's how it works
[20:50] <DL1SGP> ibanezmatt13: I had a sweet video on that matter not long ago want me to get the link?
[20:50] <DL1SGP> afaik it included some code to get you started
[20:50] <ibanezmatt13> oh yes, that would be very helpful
[20:50] <ibanezmatt13> thank you
[20:50] <DL1SGP> ok gimme a minute
[20:50] <ibanezmatt13> awesome
[20:51] <DL1SGP> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BUvFGTxZBG8&noredirect=1
[20:51] <ibanezmatt13> thanks!
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[20:53] <ibanezmatt13_> damn BT
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[20:57] <Lunar_Lander_> hello
[20:57] <Geoff-G8DHE> ibanezmatt13_, Its the RC5 protocol that is used to control the disply/televsion see here http://www.sbprojects.com/knowledge/ir/rc5.php
[20:58] <ibanezmatt13_> Geoff-G8DHE: is that the same protocol for Sky?
[20:58] <Geoff-G8DHE> The codes used to control the Sky box itself are different and NOT part of the RC5 family
[20:58] <ibanezmatt13_> ah
[20:58] <Geoff-G8DHE> but the Sky box doesn't control the Volume thats the display
[20:58] <Geoff-G8DHE> or televsion
[20:59] <ibanezmatt13_> so when you buy a spare remote and sync it to your TV, does that have a preset in for Sky or is there something that will always work with Sky, some common protocol?
[21:00] <Geoff-G8DHE> In effect you have two remotes in one - and some keys always talk RC5 others switch depeniding if the TV or SKY button was last pressed!
[21:00] <ibanezmatt13_> ah cool, I see
[21:01] <ibanezmatt13_> So I could send a load of RC5 stuff to the skybox to control volume and it'll work.
[21:01] <ibanezmatt13_> but not for say the box office button
[21:01] <Geoff-G8DHE> The SKY controls are fixed, the TV controls vary by manurfacturer there is a common part for the manurfacturer and a part that is common for the standard kets
[21:02] <ibanezmatt13_> ah ok, that's not too bad then. I'll just look up the codes for my TV.
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[21:02] <Geoff-G8DHE> When you hit a SKY only key its sends only SKY commands much faster data rate.
[21:02] <Geoff-G8DHE> when you hit a TV control its sends RC5, channel/volume/On/Off are RC5 commands
[21:02] <ibanezmatt13_> ok, I think I'll leave sky out of the equation for now and focus on the TV itself, thanks! :)
[21:05] <ibanezmatt13_> oscilloscopes are awesome tools
[21:15] <chrisstubbs> Evening ibanezmatt13_
[21:16] <ibanezmatt13_> Hey chrisstubbs
[21:16] Nick change: ibanezmatt13_ -> ibanezmatt13
[21:19] <Reb-SM3ULC> Nice pass with funcube now
[21:21] <fsphil> hearing voices
[21:22] <fsphil> from the satellite, not in my head :)
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[21:22] <OH7HJ> Wow, who has got balloon THAT high? ;)
[21:25] <Reb-SM3ULC> OH7HJ: height easy, speed hard
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[21:26] <Reb-SM3ULC> trying to get my haed around fcd+sdrsharp for hab-tracker, seems to loose the frequency when sliding the window
[21:27] <Reb-SM3ULC> no trace of funcube here..
[21:28] <Reb-SM3ULC> anyone here awake and running fcd+sdrharp?
[21:29] <ve6ts> Reb-SM3ULC not currently running, but run it at home
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[21:31] <mikestir> surprisingly strong signal from funcube there
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[21:31] <Reb-SM3ULC> ve6ts: had any problem with the frequency ending up being offset when moving fq with background or selecting new fq in window?
[21:31] <Reb-SM3ULC> mikestir: not a trace here but dipol in in attic still so could be better....
[21:31] <mikestir> I just stepped out into the garden with the scanner+telescopic
[21:32] Nick change: KipK_away -> KipK
[21:32] <mikestir> heard a bit of morse and some voice calls on the transponder, plus the telemetry was quite loud
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[21:32] <SP3OSJ> CQ CQ CQ only Italia station
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[21:34] <Reb-SM3ULC> ve6ts: i can repruce it with select fq from freq-man, then click somewhere else in win, then click same mem-freq again, and it is totally offset.. :(
[21:34] <SP3OSJ> Whether you are here listening stations with Italia?
[21:35] <SP3OSJ> Spagetti, peperoni, fiat
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[21:38] <ibanezmatt13> when using a scope, do I connect the GND on the probe to the scope or to the device I'm probing?
[21:39] <ibanezmatt13> The GND on the scope or the GND on the device I'm probing, sorry
[21:39] <chrisstubbs> on the device your probing
[21:40] <ibanezmatt13> ah ok, makes sense
[21:40] <chrisstubbs> the GND on the scope probe is connected to the scope gnd (and often earth on the mains supply)
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[21:40] <chrisstubbs> so dont connect the GND to live (unless you have a floating probe)
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[21:40] Nick change: Geoff-G8DHE_ -> Geoff-G8DHE-M
[21:40] <chrisstubbs> (or like blowing fuses)
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[21:41] <ibanezmatt13> right, thanks
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[22:10] <Laurenceb__> http://www.spacex.com/webcast/
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[22:13] <jcoxon> ping arko
[22:13] <arko> jcoxon: yo
[22:13] <Laurenceb__> 25 minutes :D
[22:13] <jcoxon> on your habex2 website the link to dl-fldigi is old
[22:13] <arko> ah
[22:14] <arko> thanks!
[22:14] <arko> whats the new one?
[22:14] <jcoxon> goes to the google code rather then wiki
[22:14] <jcoxon> http://wiki.ukhas.org.uk/projects:dl-fldigi
[22:14] <arko> ahh
[22:14] <arko> thanks for that
[22:15] <mattbrejza> after previous discussion today, start populating this page: http://ukhas.org.uk/general:family_tree
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[22:17] <jcoxon> mattbrejza, hehe
[22:18] <eroomde> dove3_henry: awesome
[22:18] <mfa298> hmmm, Apex started by Megabyte, JavaScript and BO
[22:18] <WillTablet> I'm actually going to start soldering these resistors soon
[22:18] <WillTablet> Im really scared though
[22:18] <mattbrejza> hopefully itll get a bit more populated and other key fields added before i email the list
[22:18] Action: mfa298 thinks something's being too clever at spotting abbreviations
[22:19] <ibanezmatt13> mattbrejza, added
[22:19] <ibanezmatt13> NORB
[22:19] <mattbrejza> thans :)
[22:20] <ibanezmatt13> np
[22:20] <mattbrejza> might have to add items when people think about them
[22:20] <mattbrejza> the idea is to get a nice network between projects
[22:21] <WillTablet> 0805s are so tiny, I'm afraid. Is it worth continuing practicing on a different board?
[22:21] <jcoxon> mattbrejza, worth an email to the mailing list
[22:21] <jcoxon> WillTablet, its always worth practicing if you can
[22:21] <mattbrejza> yea ill do it in a bit
[22:21] <WillTablet> They are so tiny, I keep moving them inadvertently
[22:21] <WillTablet> Ah well
[22:21] <WillTablet> Practice makes perfect
[22:22] <Laurenceb__> dove3_henry: ping
[22:22] <eroomde> there is always a knack
[22:22] <ibanezmatt13> I think I must have lost at least 20 making NORB Will, maybe more
[22:22] <Laurenceb__> i was thinking about cubesat solar thermal - not such a smart idea
[22:23] <mfa298> mattbrejza: that looks like the sort thing a semantic wiki could actually be useful for.
[22:23] <tweetBot> @stratodean: #Santa is coming to STRATODEAN for help! http://t.co/rgF8U9dj02 #ukhas #1monthtogo
[22:23] <ibanezmatt13> WillTablet: A decent pair of tweezers certainly helps
[22:23] <mattbrejza> semantic wiki?
[22:23] <Laurenceb__> dove3_henry: how to do it> infoscience.epfl.ch/record/128798/files/EPFL_TH4255.pdf
[22:24] <mfa298> have you not been brainwashed into the semantic web stuff yet then.
[22:24] <Laurenceb__> mfa298: im still at the WEBTWOPOINTZERO
[22:24] <mattbrejza> na, 'semantic web' gets an automatic turn off in my brain
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[22:25] <Laurenceb__> what if its synergistically metasemantic?
[22:25] <mfa298> there's semantic wiki extensions for mediawiki (which I think didn't come from ECS) which allow you to run queries on data in the wiki, It can allow you to do some interesting things - or make you pull all your hair out.
[22:25] <Upu> 0805's are tiny ? :)
[22:26] <Upu> haha
[22:26] <mattbrejza> that relies on people using the wiki to document their project :P
[22:26] <Upu> 0805 are to SMD what Duplo is to Lego
[22:27] <mattbrejza> i soldered a 6 pin leadless device to stripboard the other day (0.9mm pitch)
[22:27] <mattbrejza> stop complaining :P
[22:28] <mfa298> with your family tree stuff if you had a page per project you could have it automatically generate some of the links between projects - although it's probably better for your sanity if you just do it manually
[22:28] <mattbrejza> im not a web scientist, this .txt document is fine :P (imo)
[22:29] <dove3_henry> Laurenceb__: hi
[22:30] <dove3_henry> Laurenceb__: yeah I think there's a group at MIT working on that
[22:31] <Laurenceb__> hi, yeah solar thermal isnt really practical
[22:31] <Laurenceb__> compared to this FEEP stuff
[22:31] <Laurenceb__> which looks very well suited
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[22:32] <Laurenceb__> you could get enough delta v to do earth escape with one of those thruster
[22:32] <dove3_henry> do you know anything about the electrical efficiency? I had the idea that it was rather limitingly low
[22:32] <dove3_henry> thanks for the paper, I will read it properly later on
[22:32] <Laurenceb__> theres quite a few PhDs on the topic
[22:33] <Laurenceb__> that one is notible for use of room temperature liquid salt
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[22:33] <Laurenceb__> meaning you dont need an electron gun so you can get down to sub 2W power
[22:33] <Laurenceb__> FEEP == ion emission, that seems to be easier to achieve and high efficiency
[22:34] <Laurenceb__> colloidal == droplet, not as well demonstrated and harder to get high efficiency
[22:34] <dove3_henry> ok, makes sense
[22:34] <Laurenceb__> brb, watching spacex
[22:34] <Laurenceb__> arg hold
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[22:37] <Laurenceb__> FEEP tends to suffer from poor power/thrust due to crazy high ISP
[22:38] <Laurenceb__> but that paper i linked is down in the 1000 to 2000s range, perfect for cubesat boost
[22:38] <Laurenceb__> the 2W -> 100µN range
[22:40] <qyx_> grr the stream is constantly failing
[22:40] <Laurenceb__> it seems to suffer from degredation and stuff, but those problems have been mitigated in other FEEP devices
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[22:40] <dove3_henry> that would be a pretty good power range, but at that thrust it would take years to earth escape
[22:40] <Laurenceb__> ALTA space have 10k hour life at 200µA current/emittor for indium
[22:41] <Laurenceb__> for a 1U it would take a year or so
[22:41] <Laurenceb__> i was thinking of PC104 integrated ionic liquid FEEP
[22:41] <WillTablet> Oh, eroomde I finished reading the fall btw
[22:41] <dove3_henry> don't do PC104
[22:42] <dove3_henry> it's big, dumb and annoying
[22:42] <Laurenceb__> yeah
[22:43] <Laurenceb__> do you do proper mechanically integrated stuff?
[22:43] <dove3_henry> yeah
[22:43] <dove3_henry> it's not any more difficult if you have half a brain
[22:43] <Laurenceb__> what kind of power does dove3 get from fold out panels
[22:43] <Laurenceb__> heh
[22:43] <dove3_henry> well that would be telling
[22:43] <Laurenceb__> heh
[22:44] <Laurenceb__> is 2W on a 1U sane?
[22:44] <dove3_henry> totally
[22:44] <Laurenceb__> neat
[22:44] <dove3_henry> much more than that would start to get tricky
[22:44] <Laurenceb__> looks doable then
[22:45] <dove3_henry> yeah and you could get a 1U pretty light if you had reason to
[22:45] <dove3_henry> most cubesats are not at all mass-constrained, and more mass is even useful because it prolongs the orbit life
[22:45] <Laurenceb__> obviously it would require a teeny vac chamber to develop the thruster
[22:45] <Laurenceb__> yeah
[22:45] <Laurenceb__> do you use off the shelf radios?
[22:45] <Laurenceb__> oh
[22:45] Action: Laurenceb__ remembers hearing about RFM22B use
[22:45] <dove3_henry> I think the micromachining fabrication would at least as difficult
[22:46] <dove3_henry> I've never used the RFM22B
[22:46] <dove3_henry> but no, they're not off the shelf
[22:46] <Laurenceb__> cool
[22:46] <dove3_henry> I'm hoping to release the design for our low speed transceiver sometime in the next few months
[22:46] <Laurenceb__> the MEMS is totally daft imo
[22:47] <dove3_henry> the radio situation with most cubesats is embarassing
[22:47] <Laurenceb__> you could do the same with PCB and cnc milled PEEK/Nylon with glass microcapillaries
[22:47] <dove3_henry> how fine do the capillaries have to be?
[22:47] <Laurenceb__> 50µm
[22:47] <Laurenceb__> you can buy that off the shelf very easily
[22:48] <Laurenceb__> then microscope + tweezers :P
[22:48] <dove3_henry> nice
[22:48] <Laurenceb__> might need acid etched stainless for the electrode emission apertures
[22:49] <dove3_henry> well if you want to try it, I have a vacuum system sitting idle in my parents' garage in Devon, and I have launch opportunities out the wazoo
[22:49] <Laurenceb__> theres a paper somewhere where someone made a FEEP from only stainless using complex acid etching and laser
[22:49] <Laurenceb__> nice
[22:49] <Laurenceb__> im highly tied up atm
[22:49] <Lunar_Lander_> good night
[22:49] <Laurenceb__> i was just considering how to make cubesat useful :D
[22:50] <Laurenceb__> with "real" space flights
[22:50] <dove3_henry> yeah
[22:50] <dove3_henry> comms becomes the next tricky part
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[22:50] <dove3_henry> my record range so far is only 3400 km
[22:50] <Laurenceb__> yeah, but we have experience of that with HAB :P
[22:50] <Laurenceb__> not bad
[22:52] <Laurenceb__> -6 minutes hold?
[22:53] <dove3_henry> abort, I think
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[22:55] <qyx_> is the stream ok?
[22:55] <qyx_> the interruptions are annoying
[22:56] <Laurenceb__> something went wrong
[22:56] <Laurenceb__> seems to be another hold?
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[22:56] <ibanezmatt13> yep, problem just before switching from ext to internal power
[22:57] <eroomde> you will not go to space today
[23:00] <Laurenceb__> reset to -13
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[23:09] <OE1FEA> good morning, OK1IKO or SP2OSJ here?
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[23:10] <OE1FEA> can't find signal of SP3OSJ ... 437,700 within +- 20 kHz ... :(
[23:13] <x-f> usually it isn't more than +/-3 kHz
[23:13] <x-f> OE1FEA, it isn't continous signal
[23:14] <OE1FEA> ol, I will look longer on one frequency ...
[23:15] <x-f> it sounds like a ping-pong that is getting faster and then comes a telemetry line
[23:15] <Kodar> still working ?
[23:15] <OE1FEA> ms x-f on which freq you see?
[23:16] <Reb-SM3ULC> Laurenceb__: what launch?
[23:16] <x-f> i
[23:16] <mattbrejza> http://www.spacex.com/webcast/
[23:16] <x-f> OE1FEA, i'm not listening, but his payloads are usually like that
[23:18] <Reb-SM3ULC> mattbrejza: thanks
[23:18] <mattbrejza> np
[23:18] <ibanezmatt13> Reb-SM3ULC: http://new.livestream.com/spacex/SES8
[23:18] <OE1FEA> msg x-f I see NOTHING fitting im my waterfall :( but there must be a signal, which OK1IKO receives ...
[23:21] <x-f> OE1FEA, latest information on Polish forum (3h ago) is 437.700.1
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[23:24] Nick change: heathkid|2 -> heathkid
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[23:26] Nick change: Geoff-G8DHE_ -> Geoff-G8DHE-M
[23:26] <ibanezmatt13> damn
[23:27] <mikestir> game over
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[23:28] <Reb-SM3ULC> OE1FEA: saw that OM1ATS
[23:28] <Reb-SM3ULC> is receiveing
[23:28] <ibanezmatt13> was looking forward to that
[23:29] <eroomde> oh
[23:29] <eroomde> nvm
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[23:32] <OE1FEA> om 70 cm I can connect to relais in LINZ (~ 150 km) without problem ...
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[23:37] <eroomde> this has so many possible captions
[23:38] <eroomde> involving the space industry
[23:38] <eroomde> http://i.imgur.com/XcYNkhC.gif.jpg
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[23:38] <ibanezmatt13> LOL, that was almost me on Sunday :-)
[23:40] <WillTablet> I just had a yolo moment and spent half an hour using my nexus 7's accessibility features with my eyes shut
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[23:40] <WillTablet> Because YOLO swag
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[00:00] --- Tue Nov 26 2013