highaltitude.log.20131114

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[00:07] <LeoBodnar> Use wirewrapping to add extra points
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[07:09] <DL7AD_> wow good morning. what about these type of balloons? :D http://youtu.be/0KoJCRsTcz4?t=10m19s
[07:11] <radim_OM2AMR_> morning :-) cheap hydrogen :-)
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[07:55] <eroomde_> natrium43: hbd!
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[08:20] <DL1SGP1> good morning
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[08:21] <fsphil> mor'
[08:21] <x-f> 'ning
[08:21] <DL1SGP> :D
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[08:32] <x-f> Stratocaching this Saturday in Czech Republic - http://stratocaching.idnes.cz/
[08:32] <x-f> featuring Slovak STS team
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[08:34] <eroomde_> that's an extremely fun idea
[08:34] <eroomde_> so it's for fox hunting?
[08:34] <x-f> seed - http://www.zadnaveda.cz/storage/cache/images/000/023/photo-5,large.JPG
[08:35] <fsphil> wouldn't want to get hit on the head by that
[08:36] <radim_OM2AMR_> :-) launch announcement soon
[08:38] <radim_OM2AMR_> will fly 4 trackers
[08:38] <radim_OM2AMR_> 1x APRS, 3x RTTY, two RTTY trackers will fly in Seeds
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[08:39] <x-f> radim_OM2AMR_, what size are those seeds?
[08:39] <radim_OM2AMR_> Stratocache/Seed: 93 g, 40cm long, falls down rotating as a maple pod (2,5 m/s), with a GPS tracker Meitrack
[08:40] <x-f> nice
[08:40] <radim_OM2AMR_> Radioseeds will be without GPS/GSM tracker, just our RTTY tracker
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[08:40] <x-f> webpage states that there will be 10 GPS seeds?
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[08:41] <radim_OM2AMR_> should be so, plus two additional radioseeds
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[08:42] <radim_OM2AMR_> I'm just preparing APRS/RTTY trackers for DROPION, Radioseeds trackers are based on our STS v3 tracker
[08:42] <eroomde_> have you tested the seeds at high alts before?
[08:43] <radim_OM2AMR_> eroomde, I'm not the right person to answer this question :-) We're just HAM/UKHAS tracking support
[08:44] <eroomde_> ah ok
[08:44] <radim_OM2AMR_> As I know, they tested one seed with meteo radiosonde, but it was frozen
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[08:44] <radim_OM2AMR_> ..and lost
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[08:45] <radim_OM2AMR_> they must do presentation for czech CAA - test of pyro release of seeds and balloon
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[08:46] Possible future nick collision: Muzer
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[08:47] <x-f> Dropion will transmit SSTV too?
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[08:48] <radim_OM2AMR_> x-f no SSTV, but IP video stream :-)
[08:48] <radim_OM2AMR_> on 5 GHz band
[08:49] <radim_OM2AMR_> it is their decision due to sponsors, I can't change it :-)
[08:49] <x-f> still cool, i hope you will publish the link for the stream here too :)
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[08:56] <Steve_G0TDJ> ..
[08:57] <Steve_G0TDJ> Good Morning Guys
[08:57] <ibanezmatt13> morning Steve
[08:58] <Steve_G0TDJ> Hey Matt :D
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[08:59] <Steve_G0TDJ> Anything going on today?
[08:59] <DL7AD_> a balloon
[09:00] <Steve_G0TDJ> OK1OMX?
[09:00] <DL7AD_> no that was a question
[09:00] <Steve_G0TDJ> Oh, no question mark :-)
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[09:01] <fsphil> ?
[09:02] <Steve_G0TDJ> Thanks Phil
[09:02] <fsphil> np
[09:02] <Steve_G0TDJ> Hey Phil, when you sending your one up?
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[09:03] <Andrew_M6GTG> morning Steve
[09:03] <Steve_G0TDJ> Hey Andy :-)
[09:03] Nick change: Mission-Critical -> MissionCritical
[09:04] <fsphil> good question Steve_G0TDJ. hopefully before it snows
[09:04] <Steve_G0TDJ> Ah, any time then LOL
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[09:04] <radim_OM2AMR_> Steve_G0TDJ, no they're testing probably - they will fly on saturday
[09:05] <Steve_G0TDJ> OK Radim, I'll watch for that.
[09:05] <radim_OM2AMR_> I instructed them for sending launch announcement to mailinglist
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[09:06] <ibanezmatt13> Sorry Steve_G0TDJ, had to run downstairs. Nope, nothing much today. Just maths at college :P
[09:07] <Steve_G0TDJ> :-) No worries. I have some bits I need to attend to. I'll be watching the 'stream' though
[09:08] <fsphil> that PSB launch in australia is on saturday
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[09:09] <Andrew_M6GTG> my payload is turning into something resembling a nasa probe
[09:10] <Steve_G0TDJ> LOL. Over complicating it?
[09:11] <Andrew_M6GTG> experimenting, got a LCD display for debugging, a gyro/accelerometer/temp/pressure/compass sensor, a RTC, EEPROM and now a SD card socket.. so yes
[09:12] <Steve_G0TDJ> He he. We need to see pics of that. I hope you're put some on your blog.
[09:13] <Andrew_M6GTG> yes will be, took it along to club last night
[09:13] <Steve_G0TDJ> Good response?
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[09:14] <Andrew_M6GTG> yes it well received, generated quite a bit of talk ;-)
[09:14] <LeoBodnar> morning!
[09:14] <Steve_G0TDJ> Oh good. Hopefully it will generate some more listeners :-)
[09:14] <Steve_G0TDJ> Morning Leo
[09:14] <Andrew_M6GTG> morning Leo
[09:17] <Andrew_M6GTG> just wish the GPS would arrive! is due today..
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[09:19] <Steve_G0TDJ> Still waiting for my PCBs and other bits Andy
[09:19] <eroomde_> until you have an lcd interface to your payload whose background is a colour photo of you doing a thumbs up, you don't yet get to claim overcomplication
[09:20] <LZ1CLA> Morning guys
[09:20] <ibanezmatt13_> lol
[09:20] <Andrew_M6GTG> lol
[09:21] <Andrew_M6GTG> it is character LCD and is just for debug.. I just had one lying about and thought why not ;-)
[09:21] <fsphil> you need this display: http://hackaday.com/2013/11/14/raspberry-pi-driven-128x32-led-sign/
[09:21] <eroomde_> http://ukhas.org.uk/_detail/projects:mihab:p1030033.jpg?id=projects%3Amihab%3Amihab3_glider_master_unit
[09:21] <Steve_G0TDJ> Morning LZ1CLA
[09:22] <LZ1CLA> Sorry to interrupt, but do you have any info about ntx2+arduino+DominoEX :)
[09:22] <LZ1CLA> i finally got my hands on ntx2 and have to start experimenting
[09:23] <Steve_G0TDJ> Who was trying to get Domino going the other day guys?
[09:24] <eroomde_> LZ1CLA: well, how all three work is available on the web
[09:24] <eroomde_> so it's just a question of combining them!
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[09:24] <Andrew_M6GTG> anyone ever done a night balloon with hi-intensity flashing LEDs?
[09:24] <eroomde_> DominoEX is an MFSK mode, i.e. you have to generate multiple frequs, which means you need to be able to generate multiple voltages to go into the ntx2
[09:24] <Steve_G0TDJ> I've been toying with the idea Andy
[09:24] <eroomde_> so you need dome means of doing that between your arduino and your ntx2
[09:25] <eroomde_> and then it's just a question of implementing the protocol, much like with rtty. the source code for fldigi is a good place to clook
[09:25] <Andrew_M6GTG> was it FITSAT-1 that had the LEDs?
[09:25] <DL1SGP> yes as far as I remember
[09:26] <fsphil> I saw something like FITSAT-1, but it wasn't over the horizon at the time
[09:26] <DL1SGP> morning Andrew_M6GTG. eroomde, Steve_G0TDJ
[09:26] <Steve_G0TDJ> Hiya Felix :-)
[09:26] <Andrew_M6GTG> morning Felix
[09:26] <LZ1CLA> Ok as far i have read, when you variate the voltage on txd pin of the module, you change the frequency
[09:26] <Steve_G0TDJ> I missed that one.
[09:26] <LZ1CLA> is that enough for Domino ?
[09:27] <eroomde_> yes, although you'll want to do some calculations as to whether the resolution of the voltage you can vary is enough
[09:27] <LZ1CLA> ok, thanks
[09:27] <eroomde_> to save you some calculation time, that means you want a resolution of about 12 bits or greater
[09:28] <eroomde_> you could use a DAC, or PWM with a filter
[09:28] <LZ1CLA> What about temp instability? How do you compensate it?
[09:29] <Andrew_M6GTG> LZ1CLA: I was wondering the same, just tinkering with an NTX-2 but very sensitive to voltage/temp new version has temp compensation
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[09:30] <eroomde_> LZ1CLA: well, i calibrated mine
[09:30] <eroomde_> LZ1CLA: will you be online in 30 mins?
[09:30] <eroomde_> i have to drive to work
[09:30] <LZ1CLA> yep
[09:30] <eroomde_> but i can explain all that i did once i get to work
[09:30] <eroomde_> cool, i'll talk to you then
[09:30] <LZ1CLA> thanks
[09:31] <eroomde_> np, see you in a bit
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[09:31] <x-f> B-29! in broad daylight!
[09:32] <Andrew_M6GTG> fires up VNC.. hoping I left the antenna connected ;-)
[09:32] <DL1SGP> heh
[09:33] <DL1SGP> have a safe flight B-29 :)
[09:33] <DL1SGP> any known fancy stuff on board that could extend range... such as HF experiments?
[09:34] Action: Steve_G0TDJ Warms up radio
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[09:36] <Andrew_M6GTG> I even have a preset in the SDR called Leo ;-)
[09:37] theo (05512b99@gateway/web/freenode/ip.5.81.43.153) joined #highaltitude.
[09:37] <Steve_G0TDJ> LOL That's prepared :-)
[09:38] <LZ1CLA> :)
[09:41] <Andrew_M6GTG> is B-29 a sausage?
[09:43] <jaeger195> hi, can someone help me with purchasing options on the HAB Supplies website?
[09:44] <jaeger195> im interested in the NTX2B
[09:44] <number10> jaeger195: - ask UpuWork
[09:44] <x-f> B-27 was a sausage, B-28 was a saucer (Leo's words), B-29 might be a potato or something else
[09:45] <jaeger195> thanks number10
[09:46] <Andrew_M6GTG> a saucer? paging Shaun Ryder! lol http://www.telegraph.co.uk/culture/tvandradio/tv-and-radio-reviews/10435859/Shaun-Ryder-on-UFOs-History-review.html
[09:46] <gonzo_> can't be, dave did a potato a few weeks ago
[09:47] <gonzo_> have to be more original than that
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[09:50] <Steve_G0TDJ> Courgette?
[09:50] <nats`> Tomate ?
[09:52] <seventeen> Cornish Pasty could work.
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[09:55] <Andrew_M6GTG> Klein bottle?
[09:56] <gonzo_> the accompamyment to saussage and saucer must logically be a cup of tea
[09:56] <gonzo_> HP sauce is a poss, but could be messy on landing
[09:57] <UpuWork> ping jaeger195 you have a PM
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[10:01] <Steve_G0TDJ> I like the predictions for B-29 - Coming my way ;-)
[10:03] <DL1SGP> :P
[10:03] <DL1SGP> cuppa coffee ready?
[10:04] <Steve_G0TDJ> Already on the tea
[10:04] <Steve_G0TDJ> (not a great coffee lover)
[10:04] <Steve_G0TDJ> brb phone
[10:05] <DL1SGP> tea can be great too :)
[10:07] <Steve_G0TDJ> B-29 up!
[10:07] <x-f> it's up
[10:07] <x-f> snap
[10:07] <DL1SGP> yay
[10:12] <eroomde> LZ1CLA, yo
[10:12] <eroomde> back
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[10:12] <LZ1CLA> yo :)
[10:12] <eroomde> so
[10:12] <eroomde> temp calibration
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[10:12] <eroomde> i mapped freq output vs voltage input at 3 or 4 different temperatures
[10:12] <eroomde> freezer, fridge, room temp, 50C
[10:13] <eroomde> that gave me a 2D calibration surface, hich I turned into a 2D lookup table in code
[10:13] <eroomde> so i could say 'send a tone of this freq' and the algorithm would, which a reading from the tmperature sensor and the lookup table, interpole the right voltage
[10:14] <eroomde> it's probably worth noting that the NTX2Bs have a temperature compensated crystal oscillator, meaning you probably don't need to calibrate them
[10:14] <Andrew_M6GTG> eroomde: thanks for that, interesting ;-)
[10:14] <eroomde> and sorry about my typing
[10:15] <eroomde> it's just awful
[10:15] <eroomde> I rely on the extreme redundancy of the english language in conveying a message to you
[10:15] <Andrew_M6GTG> typing isn't as bad as Steve_G0TDJ:
[10:15] <Steve_G0TDJ> LOL
[10:15] <eroomde> B-29 is heading south is it?
[10:16] <Andrew_M6GTG> oh hi Steve, you still here ;-)
[10:16] <eroomde> it's natrium43's birthday, btw
[10:16] <eroomde> or wa yesterday
[10:16] <Steve_G0TDJ> on the phone
[10:16] <eroomde> was*
[10:16] <eroomde> which too busy being a silicon valley bod these days, he started spacenear.us/tracker
[10:17] <eroomde> when the distributed listener was an irc bot that grepped the text log of normal fldigi
[10:17] <eroomde> and spat it into the irc channel
[10:17] <eroomde> he knocked up the tracking map which plotted what the bot was saying
[10:19] <Steve_G0TDJ> Nothing heard from B-29 yet. Off the phone now Andy ;-)
[10:19] <x-f> (that was short description of a chapter in eroomde's book about UKHAS)
[10:19] <Steve_G0TDJ> Book?
[10:20] <eroomde> I'm being one of those literary characters who announces they're writing a book
[10:20] <eroomde> but then doesn't
[10:20] <eroomde> but then for several years is described as being 'writing a book'
[10:20] <Steve_G0TDJ> Ah ha!
[10:20] <eroomde> I was going to do a short history of Habbing in the UK, up to about 2010
[10:20] <Steve_G0TDJ> That would be a good read for us noobs
[10:20] <eroomde> as that's when I stopped and so am not much qualified to speak about anything after that
[10:21] <Andrew_M6GTG> Steve_G0TDJ: you have flown.. you aren't a noob.. ;-)
[10:21] <Andrew_M6GTG> twice as well..
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[10:21] <Steve_G0TDJ> :-) Thanks Andy
[10:22] <eroomde> yeah, there's a lot that's happened in the past, and a lot of it was quite experimental
[10:22] <eroomde> and some of it is coming back again
[10:22] <eroomde> which is nice
[10:22] <Andrew_M6GTG> first flight was a bit Wright brothers distance mind.. ;-)
[10:22] <Steve_G0TDJ> ROTFL
[10:23] <eroomde> in the gran tradition!
[10:23] <Andrew_M6GTG> and I know I am courting Karma by making jokes...
[10:23] <Steve_G0TDJ> It was just as thrilling
[10:24] <LZ1CLA> Thank for all that info eroomde. :)
[10:24] <eroomde> no probs. it works, if you do the calibration, but if you have the option of getting an ntx2b for domex, it's probably a much easier way of doign things
[10:25] <eroomde> or, you can make a thermally stable payload enclosure
[10:25] <eroomde> that's the other option
[10:25] <Steve_G0TDJ> B-29 ascending very slowly
[10:26] <eroomde> there is something really quite primal about launching a hab
[10:26] <LZ1CLA> i have checked that i have the NTX2B, so no temp calibration ?
[10:26] <eroomde> i imagine it activates the same bit of your brain as when the eskimo father sends his eskimo son off hunting in a canoe for the first time
[10:26] <Steve_G0TDJ> Yeah, it's strange that Ed. I got that too.
[10:27] <eroomde> a sort of 'good luck, my pretty'
[10:27] <eroomde> and then it's on its own
[10:27] <Steve_G0TDJ> Rite of passage stuff
[10:27] <eroomde> until we get inflight software patches working anyway
[10:27] <daveake> There's also that "I wonder if I'll ever see you again" moment
[10:28] <Steve_G0TDJ> Teary eyes....
[10:28] <Darkside> or the 'oh shit, i forgot to fix that bug' moment
[10:28] <daveake> ha
[10:28] <daveake> and the "damn, did I check the camera is still running?"
[10:28] <DL1SGP> sometimes the "oh shit I forgot to attach the antenna" moment
[10:28] <Laurenceb> http://irclo.gr/i/131760/ssgEmOW.jpg
[10:29] <Steve_G0TDJ> I had a 'Did I switch the payload on?' moment on my second launch
[10:30] <Andrew_M6GTG> just seen faint DominoEx
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[10:30] <Steve_G0TDJ> Nothing here yet. I'm listening in audio for a change
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[10:32] <Andrew_M6GTG> two partials
[10:32] <Steve_G0TDJ> Andrew_M6GTG: Is it a constant sig or pips as well?
[10:32] Nick change: junderwood -> junderwood_M0JCU
[10:32] <junderwood_M0JCU> pips as usual
[10:32] <Andrew_M6GTG> pips
[10:32] <Andrew_M6GTG> $B-29,25,100038,52.081,-1.026i135,7,13,4.09,0.32*b491
[10:32] <junderwood_M0JCU> not all regular
[10:33] <Steve_G0TDJ> OK Thanks guys. junderwood_M0JCU Have you got a dial freq?
[10:33] <junderwood_M0JCU> The usual :)
[10:33] <junderwood_M0JCU> 434.499.966
[10:33] <Steve_G0TDJ> Bang on .500
[10:33] <junderwood_M0JCU> yes
[10:34] <Steve_G0TDJ> OK I'll leave it there. I'll be OK when it reaches 4/5000m
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[10:36] <Steve_G0TDJ> Saw it on the waterfall, very weak
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[10:37] <Andrew_M6GTG> two more red :-(
[10:38] <Andrew_M6GTG> got some noise today on Leo's freq
[10:38] <Steve_G0TDJ> Partial $B-29,nu10G747,131114,51.7645,-0.6988,2661,7,-1,4.Nx,0.56*aKJa
[10:38] <Andrew_M6GTG> 2 green ;-)
[10:39] <Steve_G0TDJ> Good stuff Andy
[10:39] <Steve_G0TDJ> When it clears the hill it'll be blowing my windows out LOL
[10:39] <Andrew_M6GTG> not bad for an antenna made out of old coathangers on the end of 10m of RG-58 ;-)
[10:40] <Steve_G0TDJ> Always good to make something and have it work well.
[10:40] <Andrew_M6GTG> it shouldn't work.. and out preforms my X-50 ;-)
[10:41] <Steve_G0TDJ> Typical!
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[10:42] <Steve_G0TDJ> Still partials
[10:43] <Steve_G0TDJ> It gives you an idea of how high the hill is I'm on if you look on the map. If I was at the top, I'd have it moments after launch.
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[10:43] <Reb-SM3ULC> B-29, wow
[10:44] <Andrew_M6GTG> 2 red on last one
[10:45] <Steve_G0TDJ> Still partial here but getting stronger
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[10:47] <Andrew_M6GTG> strong here, but got a faint carrier sitting in the window..
[10:47] <Steve_G0TDJ> So close: $$B-29,52,104714,131114,51.6886,-r6379,3356,7,-6,4.13,0.6G*e490
[10:49] <Steve_G0TDJ> one character out
[10:51] <Steve_G0TDJ> Must be QRM or something. i should have got that last lot
[10:51] <Steve_G0TDJ> YAY! First green
[10:57] <Steve_G0TDJ> Solid signal now
[10:57] <Andrew_M6GTG> Steve_G0TDJ: not sure but something looked odd on the waterfall, but others are decoding
[10:57] <Steve_G0TDJ> Odd?
[10:58] <Andrew_M6GTG> Got strong signal but the DominoEx pattern, might have just been the data but didn't look as clear as previous flights
[10:59] <Andrew_M6GTG> 'smudged' is the best way to describe it
[10:59] <Steve_G0TDJ> Could it be too strong? Over moddng?
[11:01] <Steve_G0TDJ> I've had to turn the radio down!
[11:06] <DL1SGP> heh sounds great Steve_G0TDJ
[11:07] <Steve_G0TDJ> It is drifting a little
[11:10] <Steve_G0TDJ> I take it that ICICIC is the same as RTTY's RYRYRY
[11:10] <DL1SGP> yes
[11:11] <fsphil> RYRYRY is a bit useless
[11:11] <DL1SGP> zes :)
[11:11] <DL1SGP> *yes even damn qwertz
[11:11] <Steve_G0TDJ> I thought RY was a specific test.
[11:12] <gonzo_> preamble with binary nulls is more useful. Helps get sync
[11:12] <Reb-SM3ULC> The other end of the runway this time.. :)
[11:12] <fsphil> it used to be used (according to wikipedia) to test mechanical baudot rtty printers
[11:13] <gonzo_> bugger missed another leo flight!
[11:13] <Steve_G0TDJ> Oh so it was just inherited
[11:13] <fsphil> yea
[11:13] <gonzo_> Ry is 10101 and 01010
[11:13] <Steve_G0TDJ> DOn't worry gonzo_ Plenty of time for you to track
[11:13] <DL1SGP> Steve_G0TDJ: the RYRYRY was used in times of mechanical RTTY as it excerciyed all five "Bits" of the Baudot code so if it came out fine the machine was running properly
[11:13] <Steve_G0TDJ> That makes sense, Thanks guys.
[11:13] <gonzo_> fingers corssed I have left the system in a remateable state
[11:14] <fsphil> but for fldigi a 0x00 byte works better
[11:15] <DL1SGP> to test if all letters worked fine you could have added "The quick brown fox jumps over the lazy dog" as it uses all letters of the alphabet
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[11:15] <Steve_G0TDJ> I'll send that before each set of sentences in DOM Felix ;-)
[11:15] <fsphil> hah
[11:15] <DL1SGP> hehe
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[11:16] <gonzo_> that was what I meant for nulls fsphil, just start/stop bits
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[11:18] <Steve_G0TDJ> Looks like I'm suffering like Andy. Strong signal but no decode
[11:19] <gonzo_> b29 is looking a little drifty (or doppler from propegation?) so have strong sigs but no decodes
[11:21] <Steve_G0TDJ> It does appear very 'wobbly'
[11:21] <SpeedEvil> Hey everyone.
[11:21] Nick change: craag_ -> craag
[11:21] <Steve_G0TDJ> Hiya SpeedEvil
[11:22] <SpeedEvil> Somewhat on-topic - http://nari.arc.nasa.gov/LEARNseminar2013 - 'Cooperative Gust Sensing and Suppression for Aircraft Formation Flight' 'Multichannel Sense-and-Avoid Radar for Small UAVs' - both look interesting tonight.
[11:22] <SpeedEvil> Webcasts tonight
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[11:25] <LeoBodnar> ICICIC is necessary to sync the receiver before telemetry starts. You can use some other chars if you want
[11:25] <Steve_G0TDJ> I see, I thought that was what the $s were for
[11:25] <DL1SGP> welcome back around LeoBodnar
[11:25] <Steve_G0TDJ> Very drifty signal this time Leo. Missing lots of sentences
[11:27] <LeoBodnar> Oh, interesting, must be dodgy TCXO again, this happened before
[11:27] <Steve_G0TDJ> http://i.imgur.com/9qbD9MZ.jpg Illustration
[11:27] <Steve_G0TDJ> Sorry it;s Imgur
[11:27] <LeoBodnar> Oh, this looks bad
[11:28] <LeoBodnar> Hmm.
[11:28] <Steve_G0TDJ> I@ve not had good telemetry for around 5 sets now
[11:28] <LeoBodnar> No idea why, I am using same batch of tcxo
[11:28] <LeoBodnar> Maybe conformal coating messes them up
[11:29] <Steve_G0TDJ> What's that?
[11:30] <Hix> waterproofing for pcbs
[11:30] <Hix> like a varnish
[11:30] <Hix> ish
[11:30] <Steve_G0TDJ> Oh, OK
[11:30] <Steve_G0TDJ> This is silly, I could practically lean out of the window and grab the thing and the signal is getting lower....
[11:31] <daveake> The null is approaching you
[11:31] <Steve_G0TDJ> Must be...
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[11:33] Action: Reb-SM3ULC playig wirh fr24 and altitude filter for B-29.
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[11:38] <LeoBodnar> Is it still bad Steve?
[11:39] <Steve_G0TDJ> Seems like less drift but not getting a good sig right now
[11:40] <Steve_G0TDJ> Ah, sig coming up again. Got one, lost the second
[11:41] <Steve_G0TDJ> Still a bit of drift but it doesn't seem as bad as before LeoBodnar
[11:42] <Steve_G0TDJ> Andrew_M6GTG: Are you using SDR remote?
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[11:49] <DL1SGP> thanks for the page on B-29 Leo
[11:53] <gonzo_> I have seen doppler from reflections from moving wx fronts (mainly on 23cm) Though this seems to be as it swings around
[11:54] <gonzo_> so effects opf the antenna detune getting back through the tx (seen often on ntx2) or gravity as it gets thrashed about in the air?
[11:58] <cm13g09> LeoBodnar: What is it with you and HAB? You seem to be launching one a day at the moment!
[11:58] <cm13g09> certainly one a week!
[12:00] <eroomde> picos are a very cost effective way of trying shit
[12:00] <eroomde> but equally, they're not really hab
[12:00] <eroomde> they're lower than airliners
[12:00] <eroomde> more like MAB
[12:00] <UpuWork> its ok Ed I've already told Leo he's going to launch under a big boy at some point
[12:01] <LeoBodnar> picos are better than nothing
[12:01] <LeoBodnar> arguably
[12:01] <Steve_G0TDJ> I'm using Picos as a learning platform
[12:01] <fsphil> not having to deal with the CAA is a huge plus
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[12:02] <eroomde> they're certainly better than nothing!
[12:03] <adamgreig> they're pretty super really
[12:03] <eroomde> hoho
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[12:04] <adamgreig> considering you've already smashed the duration record and covered all of europe in balloons
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[12:05] <gonzo_> pico's are certainly a boon here, with the amounto of controled airspace there is. Applications to the CA just seem to go into the bit bucket. Along with requests for advice on what sites would stand any chance of getting a notam
[12:05] <eroomde> just think though, when you get super-pressures big enough to go higher
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[12:05] <eroomde> and get above weather and the tropopause
[12:05] <adamgreig> indeed
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[12:06] <adamgreig> float 4eva
[12:06] <DL1SGP> do we have any info on what SP9UOB is flying HF wise right now?
[12:06] <eroomde> that's going to open up some really exciting possibilities
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[12:08] <x-f> DL1SGP, somebody played back a recording and uploaded that position by accident
[12:08] <DL1SGP> fine too :)
[12:08] <SpeedEvil> gonzo_: In principle, you can do a freedom of information request for all internal data and processes they use to make their decisions
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[12:09] <DL1SGP> thanks x-f
[12:09] <x-f> DL1SGP, he tried to come up with a more optimistic explanation too on the Polish forum - signal bounced off a comet and just now returned to Earth :)
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[12:10] <DL1SGP> haha
[12:10] <SpeedEvil> https://www.whatdotheyknow.com/body/caa
[12:11] <DL1SGP> onlz saw it appear on map, and as he announced that he wanted to fly something HFish the next few days I would have tuned in for it as Leo's float likely will not be making it here
[12:11] <SpeedEvil> https://www.whatdotheyknow.com/request/chemtrails_8#comment-39703 - hah
[12:12] <fsphil> http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/science-environment-24931002
[12:13] <x-f> B-29 is floating rather high this time
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[12:14] <x-f> hah
[12:14] <x-f> http://ready.arl.noaa.gov/hypubout/159990_trj001.gif
[12:15] <eroomde> that's an amazing hysplit
[12:15] <x-f> "oh no, i won't go over the water!"
[12:15] <fsphil> it just gives up
[12:15] <fsphil> "goes over france.. and then .. er,, spain, yea, spain..."
[12:16] <fsphil> hysplit seems to assume no lift
[12:16] <fsphil> too much vertical motion
[12:17] <fsphil> Isobaric .. can that be changed to a fixed height?
[12:18] <Steve_G0TDJ> B-29 seems to be pretty much stable now
[12:18] <SpeedEvil> Isobaric is probably ballpark for a floater
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[12:18] <SpeedEvil> It's certainly closer than fixed height - though you would indeed want to include
[12:18] <SpeedEvil> diurnal
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[12:20] <fsphil> http://ready.arl.noaa.gov/hypubout/160118_trj001.gif
[12:21] <Laurenceb> haha
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[12:21] <SpeedEvil> :)
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[12:22] <SpeedEvil> Laurenceb: See the UAV radar link I posted earlier? Maybe interesting.
[12:22] <adamgreig> fsphil: haha, wat
[12:22] <adamgreig> go home noaa, you are drunk
[12:22] <Herman-PB0AHX> GA all
[12:22] <Herman-PB0AHX> B-29 very very weekly here
[12:23] <Laurenceb> nope
[12:23] <Laurenceb> link?
[12:24] <es5nhc> Greetings all. ES5NHC here, a meteorology/weather enthusiast and a physics student, as well as ham opertor in Estonia. Been following with your experiments in last days with great interest. Can you tell me if there is any sources with info about upcoming launches as well? I am finding these experiments pretty neat... looking forward to being able to decode some in this part of the world too... Have an RTL-SDR and 2m/70 cm yagis ready to
[12:24] <es5nhc> use should any come.
[12:24] <SpeedEvil> <SpeedEvil> Somewhat on-topic - http://nari.arc.nasa.gov/LEARNseminar2013 - 'Cooperative Gust Sensing and Suppression for Aircraft Formation Flight' 'Multichannel Sense-and-Avoid Radar for Small UAVs' - both look interesting tonight.
[12:24] <Laurenceb> interesting
[12:24] <PE2G> Herman-PB0AHX: Congrats on your decodes outside the blue circle
[12:24] <x-f> es5nhc, welcome :)
[12:24] <SpeedEvil> There was a really interesting presentation on holey graphene supecaps.
[12:24] <Laurenceb> i was having a play with gust tracking on OpenPilot/Taulabs
[12:25] <Laurenceb> using pitot tube + gps
[12:25] <Herman-PB0AHX> yes i hrd him but very week but i have sometimes green lines
[12:25] <PE2G> Herman-PB0AHX: yeah, nice!
[12:25] <Laurenceb> "Additive Manufacturing of Ceramic Matrix Composites (CMCs) for Propulsion Systems"
[12:25] <Laurenceb> uh oh
[12:25] <Laurenceb> inb4 EEStor
[12:25] <Steve_G0TDJ> es5nhc: Best place to watch for launch announcements: https://groups.google.com/forum/#!forum/ukhas
[12:25] <x-f> es5nhc, launch announcements are usually posted on the UKHAS mailing list - https://groups.google.com/forum/#!forum/ukhas
[12:25] <Herman-PB0AHX> i using now the 7 elements yagi vertical
[12:25] <es5nhc> Ok, thanks
[12:25] <SpeedEvil> The NASA conference stuff is interedting - I was watching much of the Kepler conference (now archived) - it's amazing how much information you can get with fft(brightness)
[12:25] <Steve_G0TDJ> Great minds... x-f
[12:26] <Steve_G0TDJ> es5nhc: Lots of us have blogs
[12:26] <SpeedEvil> Laurenceb: naah - sane - SiC based
[12:26] <Herman-PB0AHX> lot of red lines also hihihihi
[12:26] <Laurenceb> i see
[12:27] <SpeedEvil> Laurenceb: And the 'pop tube' talk was insane.
[12:27] <PE2G> Herman-PB0AHX: Does your yagi have a free line of sight?
[12:27] <x-f> es5nhc, also i try to post information on foorum.erau.ee, if anything comes close to us (i'm from Latvia)
[12:27] <SpeedEvil> Laurenceb: Making nanotubes in 5 easy steps.
[12:27] <Laurenceb> ok
[12:27] <Laurenceb> http://nari.arc.nasa.gov/sites/default/files/attachments/11PALACIOS_ABSTRACT.pdf#overlay-context=node/270
[12:27] <es5nhc> Aha, yeah... I noticed an alert recently which eventually brought me to spacenear.us but missed that narrowly
[12:27] <Herman-PB0AHX> and also oa lot of qrm sometimes from rader
[12:27] <Laurenceb> might be of relevance
[12:28] <es5nhc> I have 4 el DK7ZB for 2m and 9 el DK7ZB yagi for 70 cm
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[12:28] <PE2G> Herman-PB0AHX: Which radar?
[12:28] <SpeedEvil> Laurenceb: Take carbon fibre cloth. Wash in acetone overnight.Dry Dip in toluene/ferrocene solution. Dry. Microwave for 45s - voila - your carbon fibres now look like wool, with teeny nanotubes on, and have significantly better shear strength
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[12:28] <Laurenceb> wow
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[12:29] <SpeedEvil> Laurenceb: They aren't very long nanotubes, and they stick out - but they are excellent for improving matrix adhesion
[12:29] <Herman-PB0AHX> pe2g other screen ??
[12:30] Action: cm13g09 sees NOAA model from earlier....
[12:30] <SpeedEvil> The archives tend to go up in a couple of days
[12:30] <cm13g09> agrees that it's drunk!
[12:32] <fsphil> be nice if it's accurate and it stays up that long
[12:32] <fsphil> they don't come back too often
[12:36] <cm13g09> fsphil: true....
[12:36] <cm13g09> B-29 - AKA the boomerang....
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[12:42] <LeoBodnar> SpeedEvil: How much stiffer do you think this will make a composite material?
[12:42] <SpeedEvil> LeoBodnar: It doesn't really make it directly stiffer
[12:42] <SpeedEvil> It reduces the tearout of the fibers.
[12:43] <LeoBodnar> So if one were to use standard CF cloth and nanotubed one to make say prop blades what benefits would it give? In layman terms
[12:43] <LeoBodnar> I have a guy here with a lot of CF and an autoclave and I want him to try it out
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[12:47] <SpeedEvil> LeoBodnar: It will likely bend more before delaminating
[12:47] <SpeedEvil> The ferrocene analogs with nickle and manganese (?) also showed promising results
[12:48] <SpeedEvil> I do wonder if the RF field plays any role - or if simple heating will work
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[12:59] <Steve_G0TDJ> Getting some major QRM on 434.5 but B-29 is managing to get through it.
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[13:07] <Herman-PB0AHX> i am the only dutch that is writing B-29 ??
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[13:10] <Hix> does anyone know why ssh -X user@host has been replaced by ssh -Y user@host for X forwarding?
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[13:13] <Miek> in what context? one isn't a replacement for the other, they do slightly different things
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[13:23] <Hix> I've only ever known of -X
[13:29] <fsphil> more rocket stuff on bbc news today: http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/magazine-24735423
[13:33] <LeoBodnar> very interesting
[13:34] <Andrew_M6GTG> back from an expensive lunchtime did i miss anything?
[13:39] <fsphil> the bill?
[13:43] <daveake> c:\our invitations
[13:43] <daveake> er
[13:43] <gonzo_> I go for a walk at lunch, if it's raining we go to Maplin etc. That can be an expensive linchtime
[13:44] <daveake> wondered where the c:\ went :p
[13:44] <Andrew_M6GTG> no nothing that fancy, just been out filled the car up £80, three new tyres fitted £451.. a trip round the local Aldi while waiting (bag full of sweets and rubbish) made do with a portion of chips ;-)
[13:45] <gonzo_> you are driving the wrong car if tyres are that much!
[13:45] <fsphil> petrol is stupidly expensive
[13:45] <Andrew_M6GTG> never be able to afford that FT-857d ;-)
[13:45] <daveake> s/wrong/right/
[13:46] <gonzo_> just buy a magic marker and draw the tread on, sove some money
[13:46] <daveake> The shadows take ages
[13:46] <LeoBodnar> Just draw the whole car
[13:47] <gonzo_> the LR tyres have such deep tread, you lose cyclists in there
[13:47] <daveake> I draw the line at that
[13:47] <Hix> does sound a little hefty for 3
[13:47] <gonzo_> need to penn in these puns
[13:48] <LeoBodnar> I feel tyred
[13:48] <daveake> We need balance
[13:48] <daveake> and tracking
[13:49] <LeoBodnar> Not on habhub?
[13:49] <Hix> add some weight to the conversation
[13:49] <daveake> tracking ... inflation ... seems oin topic to me :p
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[13:50] <Andrew_M6GTG> filled with Nitrogen not Helium ;-)
[13:51] <Hix> hydrogen makes burnouts real burnouts
[13:52] <daveake> mmmDonuts
[13:52] <gonzo_> H2-O2 mix.......
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[13:54] <LeoBodnar> Stratocache blade can be a futuristic weapon if equipped with sharp leading edgde
[13:56] <Andrew_M6GTG> I blame the misses she went out and brought the Nissan X-Trail with 18" wheels, with low profile tyres. Then find out only two tyres available of that size!
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[13:57] <craag> wow what an animation on the STS email
[13:57] <gonzo_> do any other rims fit the hubs?
[13:58] <daveake> low-profile on a proper 4x4? Is she mad? :)
[13:58] <Andrew_M6GTG> daveake: X-Trail isn't a proper 4x4 and no it was Nissan who were mad, all original specification
[14:00] <daveake> ah ok
[14:00] <daveake> not one I've looked at
[14:00] <gonzo_> any 3rd party suppliers of rims? Sometimes poss to get rull set of rims with tyores chepaer than getting rubber on the std rims. (No idea of what;s avail for foreign cars though)
[14:00] <Andrew_M6GTG> daveake: Sorry, it is sold as a 4x4, and it is a 4x4 but more a Chelsea tractor type, great for the caravan ;-)
[14:01] <daveake> The BMW X-things are sold as 4x4s but they get stuck on flat grass let alone a muddy hill
[14:02] <Andrew_M6GTG> gonzo_: Nearly went that route, first time the tyres needed changing there weren't any available.. they were swept of the loading bay in the Tsunami, no stock for months
[14:03] <Laurenceb> ooh nice
[14:03] <Laurenceb> https://www.cromwell.co.uk/LOC7255533D
[14:03] <Laurenceb> ive been searching for this stuff for ages
[14:03] <nats_laptop> http://evil.t4ke.me/~nats/big_sig.wav <= any idea on what this is ?
[14:03] <nats_laptop> it lasted 2 minutes and stopped now
[14:05] Nick change: DrLuke__ -> DrLuke
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[14:06] <Andrew_M6GTG> nats_laptop: what freq?
[14:07] <nats_laptop> 434.5 USB
[14:08] <LeoBodnar> hmm, sounds like some ISM
[14:08] <nats_laptop> some fsk stuff ?
[14:09] <LeoBodnar> yeah, sounds wideband
[14:09] <LeoBodnar> you are on the map
[14:09] <nats_laptop> yep :)
[14:10] <nats_laptop> I replaced the yagi by an omni for now
[14:10] <nats_laptop> my orientation is south
[14:10] <nats_laptop> I'll change when the balloon will cross paris
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[14:17] <Hix> getting a horrible feeling apt-get upgrade has shat itself
[14:21] <nats_laptop> your /var is screwed ? :D
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[14:42] <Hix> seems all is ok I'm ssh into it and thin the ssh service has halted i can still ping the ip so just wait it out
[14:43] <nats_laptop> try to run an apt-get update
[14:43] <nats_laptop> if there are problem with package it'll tell you
[14:43] <Hix> can't ssh into it for now
[14:44] <Andrew_M6GTG> I have a question about telemetry , if GPS lock is lost during a flight, should you keep sending last known position but with sats=0?
[14:45] <Hix> seems a little poinless
[14:45] <Hix> *pointless
[14:45] <nats_laptop> it allows to know if the balloon failed or only gps
[14:45] <nats_laptop> I think it makes sense
[14:45] <adamgreig> also you may not have received the first packet
[14:45] <adamgreig> so you get a chance to receive it later
[14:45] <adamgreig> and you might be able to triangulate the position
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[14:49] <Andrew_M6GTG> I know it was an obvious question ;-)
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[14:59] <Andrew_M6GTG> has anyone ever built in a dead reckoning backup? Just have got one of those gyro/accelerometer/compass modules looked an interesting diversion
[15:00] <Reb-SM3ULC> Souns cool to test
[15:00] <adamgreig> it might work for about half a second
[15:00] <adamgreig> you can maybe use the compass and a lookup table to guess your latitude via magnetic inclination
[15:00] <adamgreig> (with accel for level)
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[15:03] <nats_laptop> the big noise is back -_-
[15:04] <Andrew_M6GTG> it does look unlikely and complicated, just seen some info on a UAV page
[15:04] <nats_laptop> and stopped now
[15:05] <Andrew_M6GTG> nats_laptop: interesting getting some very wideband noise on my SDR
[15:05] <nats_laptop> After the balloon pass I'll do a capture witha rtl sdr dongle
[15:05] <nats_laptop> more BW
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[15:06] <nats_laptop> but should be very near I'm on a the omni now
[15:06] <nats_laptop> and it's bigger than with the yagi
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[15:14] <Andrew_M6GTG> I've been under a rock, but seriously Lady Gaga has a flying dress.. lol
[15:15] <LeoBodnar> Le Big Noise
[15:17] <Hix> how long should apt-get upgrade take on a 1.2Mb connection?
[15:17] Action: Hix thinks it is dead
[15:18] <fsphil> it's apt-get update that does the internet bit
[15:18] <fsphil> upgrade only works on local files
[15:18] <craag> Hix: For an LTS -> LTS update.. probably a fair few hours.
[15:18] <craag> If it's downloading package files.
[15:18] <Hix> even worse then, update was fine upgrade seems to have killed it. It's only the pi craag
[15:19] <craag> ah.. yeah shouldn't hang for more than 30s then.
[15:19] <Hix> balls
[15:19] <Hix> and its at home so i'm screwed now
[15:19] <fsphil> depends how old it is
[15:19] <fsphil> upgrading can be very slow
[15:19] <Hix> the distro is the latest installed yesterday
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[15:20] <craag> It should at least be giving you progress output though.
[15:22] <Hix> I can no longer ssh into it
[15:22] <Hix> though I can ping it's ip from unix
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[15:23] <craag> how long has it been running the upgrade for?
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[15:25] <Hix> I'd say about an hour and a half now. too bloody long
[15:26] <Reb-SM3ULC> Hix: it depends on when you ran it last time...
[15:26] <Reb-SM3ULC> Hix: so, installed yesterday.. should not be that much
[15:27] <Hix> when I ran what? upgrade? It's the newest build available
[15:27] <Reb-SM3ULC> Hix: running in shell?
[15:27] <Reb-SM3ULC> Hix: you should see tha packages beging downloaded
[15:27] <Hix> they downloaded it was installing them
[15:28] <Hix> man-db blahh blahh
[15:28] <Hix> s/blahh blahh/ i don't actually recall what it said as it was a good while back
[15:29] <Reb-SM3ULC> you can kill it, "ususally" :) no problem..
[15:29] <Reb-SM3ULC> just resume with apt-get -f install
[15:29] <craag> iirc the newest image is 09-25 or quite old.
[15:29] <craag> But yeah I'd say it's crashed, hard reboot and then 'apt-get -f install'
[15:30] <craag> if it's a vanilla image though, I'd be tempted to re-image and try again, to avoid any doubt about some corrupted lib somewhere.
[15:32] <Reb-SM3ULC> Hix: did you select download upgrades while installing?
[15:33] <Hix> I can't do anything as it is at home :/
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[15:33] <Reb-SM3ULC> Hix: 1.2 Mbit, what kind of line is that?
[15:33] <Hix> rubbish broadband
[15:33] <Hix> two days until 40 arrive :)
[15:33] <craag> woop :)
[15:34] <Reb-SM3ULC> 40 new ones? ;)
[15:34] <craag> yay bonded lines :D
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[15:37] <Reb-SM3ULC> been lobbying for fiber here for two years, nothing. this week, two companies are running around and trying to tie up customers.
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[15:38] <craag> We've got cable here, but it's heavily over-subscribed.
[15:38] <craag> They offered free installation and 12-month contracts to students.
[15:39] <daveake> Given the average age of neighbours where w're going, I'm hoping that won't be a problem for us :)
[15:39] <daveake> It'll be me and Richard Hammond
[15:39] <craag> haha
[15:40] <Reb-SM3ULC> how much for ftth in uk?
[15:40] <daveake> depends on distance to the cabinet
[15:41] <daveake> UpuWork will know
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[15:41] <daveake> The exchange gets converted to FTTC/H next year
[15:41] <fsphil> I'm just about 50m from the cabinet. tempting
[15:42] <fsphil> there's a fixed charge as well as per-metre
[15:42] <daveake> How much speed improvement would you get then?
[15:42] <fsphil> probably not that much
[15:42] <fsphil> I'm at 60mbit atm
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[15:42] <fsphil> fibre might get to a few 100mbit in future though
[15:43] <Reb-SM3ULC> AH, in Sweden there are a lot of drives on fiber, packagecost of about 2000 euro.
[15:43] <daveake> I'd pay that
[15:43] <daveake> We get 5M down 0.4 up
[15:43] <craag> We had 60Mbit, complained because it went down to ~2Mbit in the evenings. Got a free upgrade to 100Mbit that goes down to about 60 in the evenings... something is not linear there!
[15:43] <daveake> It's the "upu" that's the biggest issue
[15:44] <daveake> That said, if I had 40 each way, I'd have remote backups etc running
[15:44] <craag> 100 down, 10 up, it's lovely :)
[15:44] <daveake> er, "up"
[15:44] <fsphil> I've 20 up :)
[15:44] <adamgreig> man, I should get more up
[15:44] <adamgreig> http://www.speedtest.net/result/3024814049.png
[15:44] <adamgreig> 745Mbps just isn't cutting it
[15:44] <daveake> go away!
[15:44] <fsphil> pfft
[15:44] <craag> haha
[15:45] <craag> We've also got the firewall limiting everyone to 10Mbit burst up, 2.5Mbit sustained. So no slow-down because the housemate has left his torrents on again :)
[15:45] <Reb-SM3ULC> daveake: i will :) 36 month 100/10 inluded
[15:46] <daveake> ah not so bad
[15:46] <Reb-SM3ULC> daveake: comparing with my expensive 8/1 adsl that doesn't work in the summer-months...
[15:47] <daveake> Summer? In Sweden? How long does that last then? :p
[15:50] <Hix> probably longer than down here :)
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[15:58] <Hix> there isn't a way to send a reboot to an ip address as sudo is there?
[15:58] <Hix> I think I recall the ability to do it as root to a machine that had hung but have forgotten
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[16:04] <fsphil> you'll not be doing much if you can't ssh into it
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[16:04] <Hix> grr
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[16:10] <craag> PAVA-A was searched-for but not found :(
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[16:11] Nick change: Geoff-G8DHE_ -> Geoff-G8DHE-M
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[16:14] Nick change: number10_ -> number10
[16:16] <fsphil> ah well, no FTTP in my area
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[16:20] <SpeedEvil> fsphil: Allegedly next year here.
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[16:20] <Laurenceb> any gdb users here?
[16:20] <Laurenceb> ive got issues with auto-load
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[16:23] <SpeedEvil> fsphil: Allegedly next year here.
[16:25] <fsphil> is there a schedule somewhere?
[16:27] <nats_laptop> let me take a whisky first BPacket received !
[16:28] <nats_laptop> more exciting than seti project :D
[16:28] <fsphil> you've discovered life in the UK?
[16:29] <nats_laptop> no that's an urban legend
[16:29] <nats_laptop> nobody can leave with such bad food :p
[16:29] <nats_laptop> is it me or the balloon is experiencing ~100Hz drift right now
[16:30] <fsphil> it was said to be drifty earlier
[16:31] <nats_laptop> oky :)
[16:31] <nats_laptop> I have a wideband crap in the neighboorhood destroying all the packet I get
[16:32] <DL1SGP1> nats_laptop: destroy your neighborhood :)
[16:32] <SpeedEvil> fsphil: http://www.superfast-openreach.co.uk/where-and-when/
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[16:33] <nats_laptop> DL1SGP1, that's the plan
[16:33] <nats_laptop> crappy wideband stuff
[16:33] <DL1SGP1> good just checking :)
[16:33] <nats_laptop> like temperature sensors
[16:35] <LeoBodnar> -42C
[16:35] <mfa298_> if that openreach site is uses the same data as samknows I'm not sure I'd trust it. Over the last year whenever I've looked at samknows FTTC has been due within the three months of the day I've looked. Each time that day comes around it get's moved forward by three months.
[16:35] <fsphil> it's coming up empty here
[16:35] <mfa298_> it looks like you stick your postcode in and then click the local exchanges that appear on the map
[16:36] <SpeedEvil> mfa298_: and that
[16:36] Nick change: mfa298_ -> mfa298
[16:36] <SpeedEvil> mfa298: I've never had a '2013' result anyway
[16:36] <fsphil> just saying FTTC
[16:36] <fsphil> ah well
[16:36] <mfa298> I think we had June 2013, Sept 2013 and now Dec 2013
[16:36] <SpeedEvil> mfa298: It does seem to be the actual official openreach
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[16:37] <SpeedEvil> So in principle you'd hope they'd have the latest plans
[16:38] <mfa298> ooh, you can download a list of exchanges in the various categories
[16:39] <mfa298> my exchange is only listed as FTTC not FTTC/P
[16:39] Action: mfa298 wonders what Portable FTTC is :p
[16:40] <fsphil> everything is portable with a big enough forklift
[16:40] <SpeedEvil> mfa298: You get your own cable reel in the parking lot of the exchange.
[16:43] <mfa298> interesting, looks like the only Soton exchange so far to have FTTC/P is the one most students are connected to.
[16:43] <mfa298> Nasty Horrible Students :p
[16:43] <craag> :P
[16:44] <SpeedEvil> mfa298: Are you in line of sight?
[16:44] <SpeedEvil> mfa298: Students are often poor at securing their wireless.
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[16:49] <mattbrejza> mfa298: that the one on portswood road?
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[16:50] <mfa298> that's the one that seems to have FTTP as well as FTTC
[16:51] <mfa298> I'm connected to the one on burgess road (opposite bolderwood) and it's around 1/10 the size of most of the others in soton
[16:51] <mattbrejza> do VM use the exchanges?
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[16:51] <mfa298> at least there's not much contention for me :D
[16:51] <mfa298> I think virgin do their own thing unless it's virgin adsl in which case that might go back to the BT exchange
[16:52] <mattbrejza> i think all the virigin stuff here is fttc then coax?
[16:52] <mfa298> although I think a lot of the Soton cable infrastructure is quite old (was NTL, which was Cable&Wireless, which was Telewest - or something like that)
[16:52] <craag> mattbrejza:
[16:52] <craag> yep
[16:53] <craag> the main issue around here is the soton9 cab
[16:53] <mattbrejza> soton9 cab?
[16:54] <craag> yeah, VM's soton9 cabinet
[16:54] <craag> serves most of portswood and some of the flowers estate
[16:54] <craag> has a single 10gig link to the exchange :|
[16:55] <mattbrejza> ha lol
[16:55] <mfa298> sounds like a good design, put all the students on a single link :D
[16:55] <mfa298> mega contention
[16:55] <mattbrejza> my main issue with VM is that when you use remote desktop you get occasional dropouts of whatever and have to wait for remote desktop to reconnect
[16:56] <mattbrejza> may not have been VM 's fault mind you
[16:56] <mfa298> I might have to wait fo it, but hopefully when we get FTTC on the Bassett exchange it should be fast and not much contention
[16:56] Action: mfa298 lives in hope
[16:56] <mattbrejza> it was super bad at the start of the year though, but probably a cab fault
[16:57] <mattbrejza> is the VM portswood evening slow down noticable?
[16:57] <mattbrejza> or how noticeable?
[16:58] <craag> 60Mbit goes down to about 2Mbit
[16:58] <craag> it's noticeable alright :)
[16:59] <mattbrejza> well seems that we wernt on that cabinet last year
[16:59] <mattbrejza> how do you know about cab9?
[16:59] <craag> but... it seems if you get the 100mb plan, you get priority, the lowest we've seen since we got a free upgrade is 60mb in the evening.
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[16:59] <craag> graeme did some tracerouting, and got through to an engineer at vm.
[17:00] <mattbrejza> oh right
[17:00] <craag> (We're supposed to be on the bassett soton10, but they wired us wrong)
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[17:00] <mattbrejza> go to the street and change your cables over? :P
[17:01] <craag> ha wish we could :)
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[17:01] <craag> but seriously no problems since the plan changed.
[17:01] <craag> whereas my brother who lives 50m away on burgess road had 0.5mb down with a 2207ms ping last night!
[17:01] Action: mfa298 wonders if the street cabs use the same standard rack keys that everything else does.
[17:02] <x-f> nats`, B-29 not transmitting or too drifty?
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[17:03] <mattbrejza> i wonder if when ours was slow we were on the cab9, but they moved us to a different one :/
[17:03] <mattbrejza> o well, adsl now
[17:03] <mattbrejza> laters
[17:05] <nats_laptop> x-f, too drifty
[17:05] <nats_laptop> I have partial packet
[17:05] <nats_laptop> and now I'm seeking for it
[17:06] <Reb-SM3ULC> daveake1: (was off for dinnering stuff) yeah, "summer" degress above zero.. ;) problably i have problem with heat in the telestation...
[17:06] <daveake1> :)
[17:06] Nick change: daveake1 -> daveake
[17:07] <mfa298> nats_laptop: if no one else has got the packet and you've got a useable partial it might be worth sticking it on here as someone might be able to push it into the DB. Looks like you got a packet not long ago though (my map just updated)
[17:07] <nats_laptop> I give them to leo
[17:07] <nats_laptop> but I'll do a full copy of the buffer
[17:08] <mfa298> if they get uploaded there's probably not much point sticking them up here, just if there's been a gap with no data and you've got something that can be used.
[17:09] <x-f> nats_laptop, cool then, there were no updates for a while so i got worried, but drifty is better than nothing at all
[17:09] <mfa298> need some more tracker stations in southern france.
[17:09] <nats_laptop> LeoBodnar just upload last packet I had
[17:10] <nats_laptop> I'll try to realign the antenna
[17:14] <nats_laptop> I got hte beep back
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[17:16] <nats_laptop> back near 434.5
[17:17] <x-f> nice
[17:17] <x-f> oh look where F4GSM just appeared
[17:18] <jarod> yeah :D
[17:20] <nats_laptop> ok totally lost the signal now
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[17:29] <nats_laptop> try 501.400
[17:35] <Laurenceb> holy shit thats cold
[17:37] <x-f> battery is unhappy
[17:38] <ve6ts> are you talking about B-29?
[17:38] <x-f> yep
[17:39] <ve6ts> ah i see the temp now, wow that is cilly
[17:39] <ve6ts> the coldest i ever had was -68 at around 65000ft
[17:39] <SIbot> In real units: 65000 ft = 20 km
[17:39] <x-f> :>
[17:40] <ve6ts> :) i knew SIbot would kick that in
[17:40] <ve6ts> for 8000m that is cold though
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[17:41] <x-f> if nats` lost the signal AND there are no updates from other trackers AND battery went from 4.1 to 3.5 in less than an hour, then maybe B-29 is hibernating now :|
[17:41] <LeoBodnar> Didn't expect that
[17:41] <LeoBodnar> cold
[17:41] <nats_laptop> I lost the beep too
[17:41] <nats_laptop> they come back sometimes
[17:41] <nats_laptop> but no domino communication
[17:41] <Laurenceb> LeoBodnar: did you do any progressive power saving?
[17:41] <ve6ts> what does it have for a battery?
[17:41] <LeoBodnar> Yeah
[17:41] <LeoBodnar> LiPo
[17:43] <ve6ts> i assume that is outside temp? any idea what the inside temp is?
[17:43] <nats_laptop> http://pastebin.com/n0A1V5Xr
[17:43] <nats_laptop> last log I got
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[17:43] <DL7AD_> rofl... -50C :D
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[17:45] <DL7AD_> good evening SP9UOB-Tom
[17:48] <SP9UOB-Tom> evening all
[17:48] <Upu> evening
[17:49] <ve6ts> still morning here
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[17:55] <nats`> ok I ran away from the kitchen
[17:55] <nats`> my mom started to be a little agressiv :D
[17:56] <x-f> :))
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[18:06] Nick change: KipK -> KipK_away
[18:08] <UT3BW> &> B> 1K;> 478AO9?
[18:10] <acidtech> 0
[18:10] <acidtech> G>?
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[18:17] <es5nhc> Hmm... there have been no receptions of B29 since 1655 UT. With that cold out there... power issues?
[18:21] <SpeedEvil> https://connect.arc.nasa.gov/LEARNseminar?launcher=false UAV radars and FPGAs
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[18:23] <nats`> es5nhc seems so
[18:23] <nats`> or massive drift
[18:23] <nats`> it was drifting between eachbeep
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[18:34] <UT3BW> <SP9UOB-Tom> &> B> 1K;> 478AO9?
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[18:56] <Willdude123> Upu received antenna, thanks very much
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[19:29] <Lunar_Lander> hello
[19:31] <chrisstubbs> Evening Lunar_Lander
[19:31] <Lunar_Lander> how are you?
[19:35] <chrisstubbs> Ok thanks, had my interview for the electronic systems placement which went okay
[19:35] <chrisstubbs> and you?
[19:37] <Lunar_Lander> cool
[19:37] <Lunar_Lander> I am quite good too, thanks
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[19:46] <SP9UOB-Tom> UT3BW: english please :-)
[19:46] <SP9UOB-Tom> or polski :-)
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[20:21] <LeoBodnar> Any NOAA Hysplit gurus here?
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[20:23] <Upu> I used it once does that count ?
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[20:25] <LeoBodnar> http://leobodnar.com/balloons/B-29/NOAA.gif look at solar radiation - looks like the sunset is about 2100 UTC
[20:26] <LeoBodnar> While in reality it's closer to 1600UTC, 6 hours off
[20:26] <Upu> well it drops before that
[20:26] <Upu> is it some sort of average ?
[20:27] <LeoBodnar> no, used to be quite accurate
[20:27] <Upu> not sure
[20:29] <DL7AD_> blub
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[20:29] <LeoBodnar> I think maximum reading with the Sun in zenith is about 1000W/m2
[20:29] <tjanos_> I have this: http://ready.arl.noaa.gov/hypubout/170786_trj001.gif semms, it simlar
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[20:30] <LeoBodnar> You have used vertical velocity which would imply neutral buoyancy balloon
[20:30] <LeoBodnar> or smoke particle
[20:31] <LeoBodnar> Otherwise it is very much similar
[20:31] <tjanos_> What is the correct option?
[20:31] <LeoBodnar> Isobaric
[20:32] <LeoBodnar> is closest
[20:33] <tjanos_> Ok, I,ll try it
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[20:37] <tjanos_> here is the result, http://ready.arl.noaa.gov/hypubout/171470_trj001.gif the most visible differences appears in the next/second day
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[20:40] <ok1neu> hello
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[20:41] <Lunar_Lander_> hi ok1neu and dave
[20:41] <LeoBodnar> this is closer to the one I run. But solar flux prediction puzzles me. 2100 UTC sunset in November Paris.
[20:41] <ok1neu> is there some person from czech rep ?
[20:41] <LeoBodnar> hi Lunar_Lander_
[20:41] <Lunar_Lander_> hi leo
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[20:42] <ok1alx> hello everyone
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[20:43] <ok1neu> hello Libore :)
[20:43] <Upu> evening .cz
[20:43] <ok1alx> do anybody know a predictor, where i can set the parameters in URL and get a text output?
[20:44] <ok1alx> i woulo like to use it for some simple scripting in bash
[20:44] <ok1alx> *would
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[20:44] <ok1alx> cau Jindro :)
[20:45] <Upu> ok1alx ask on #habhub but be patient for an answer :)
[20:45] <ok1alx> ok i'll try
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[20:45] <ok1alx> thanks
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[20:52] <Lunar_Lander_> ah
[20:52] <Lunar_Lander_> I was in Prague in 2008, was the final class trip of our school
[20:52] <Lunar_Lander_> was very interesting
[20:53] <tjanos_> Leo, I didnot find any extra solar activity in this days ... maybe in this data: http://wattsupwiththat.com/2013/02/05/update-on-solar-cycle-24-hathaways-latest-predictions-show-smallest-sunspot-cycle-since-1906/
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[20:59] <LeoBodnar> But the Sun will be well below horizon at 2100 UTC...
[21:01] <tjanos_> And what will be the effect to your ballon?
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[21:09] <LeoBodnar> I am interested in solar flux data because balloon is powered from solar panels
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[21:13] <Laurenceb_> must resist urge to troll
[21:13] <Laurenceb_> http://www.ustream.tv/channel/jeri-ellsworth
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[21:13] <Laurenceb_> "do you think it is credible that you could develop a pico projector system that is beyond state of the art size for under $1M?"
[21:14] <Laurenceb_> "if you could develop such a system, why double the cost of the product with dual projectors"
[21:14] <Laurenceb_> and so on
[21:14] <tjanos_> Ok. If I start the perdiction from now, it seems, there are more turbulent moving there, it seems, a big taper over Barcelona
[21:15] <ibanezmatt13> seriously, what is this about: http://sdrv.ms/HW65t5 . If you apply a ring of glue 2" inside the tube, and then use the spacer to push the ring until the mark you marked on the spacer, you'll find that it goes way past the bit where you put the glue, twice as far pretty much. How stupid
[21:16] <DL1SGP> good evening all
[21:16] <ibanezmatt13> evening Felix. You any good with reading model rocket instructions :/
[21:17] <tjanos_> http://ready.arl.noaa.gov/hypubout/173006_trj001.gif
[21:18] <DL1SGP> no but I like things that blow up and produce impact craters ibanezmatt13
[21:18] <ibanezmatt13> awesome :-)
[21:18] <ibanezmatt13> Can't tell if the instructions are flawed or not :P
[21:18] <DL1SGP> and if that manual just is a bit lossy in english I might be able to extract useful info for you from other languages... preferably German or French
[21:19] <ibanezmatt13> well when there actually are words, the English is ok
[21:19] <DL1SGP> lol
[21:19] <LeoBodnar> spin cycle tjanos_ :)
[21:20] <ibanezmatt13> 9cm
[21:20] <tjanos_> Thanks, my English is pure... sry
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[21:40] <chrisstubbs> ping cm13g09
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[21:50] <ve6ts> has anyone here tried to split enough h2 to fill even a small balloon?
[21:51] <fsphil> I did, failed
[21:51] <fsphil> ended up making a lot of rust
[21:52] <ve6ts> same here
[21:52] <SP9UOB-Tom> i did, successfully :-)
[21:52] <fsphil> shush :p
[21:52] <SP9UOB-Tom> KOH + Al
[21:52] <fsphil> what's the secret?
[21:52] <ve6ts> SP9UOB-Tom: how much did you make?
[21:52] <SP9UOB-Tom> about 0.3 cu m
[21:52] <ve6ts> SP9UOB-Tom: how did you pressurize to fill a balloon?
[21:52] <SP9UOB-Tom> wait
[21:52] <ve6ts> wow that is alot
[21:52] <Laurenceb_> ive done a H2 filled picoballoon
[21:52] <Laurenceb_> just an LED flasher
[21:53] <ve6ts> Laurenceb_ did you make the H2? i use H2 for all of my flights (i buy it)
[21:53] <Laurenceb_> used Aluminium and NaOH
[21:53] <ve6ts> Laurenceb_ excellent
[21:53] <SP9UOB-Tom> ve6ts: https://scontent-b.xx.fbcdn.net/hphotos-frc3/423285_401141826578252_510651696_n.jpg
[21:54] <fsphil> that's how some of the earliest balloons where filled iirc
[21:54] <Laurenceb_> the reaction is hard to control
[21:54] <Laurenceb_> you need a good condenser
[21:54] <SP9UOB-Tom> reaction KOH + alluminium
[21:54] <ve6ts> wow didn't know it creates enough pressure
[21:54] <SP9UOB-Tom> warning it is egzotermic, so must be cooled
[21:54] <SpeedEvil> Laurenceb_: You lye!
[21:55] <SpeedEvil> What was the envelope?
[21:55] <SP9UOB-Tom> it creates enough pressure to fill latex balloon
[21:55] <ve6ts> i've tried before spiliting water
[21:55] <LeoBodnar> ve6ts: I did when I was a teenager. we have barely survived :D
[21:55] <ve6ts> didn't really work that well, VERY SLOW
[21:55] <fsphil> has anyone filled a balloon by using electrolysis?
[21:55] <LeoBodnar> HCl + Zn
[21:55] <SP9UOB-Tom> try to incerase surface
[21:55] <SP9UOB-Tom> i was using aluminium film (foil?)
[21:56] <Laurenceb_> i just used a wheely bin liner
[21:56] <ve6ts> when i was a teenager, i created clorine gas trying to split water (i thought adding salt would speed up the reaction) :)
[21:56] <fsphil> I used a kind of metal scrubber
[21:56] <fsphil> but I think my voltage was too high
[21:56] <fsphil> I was using 48V
[21:56] <ve6ts> i used 12V, it was too slow
[21:56] <SP9UOB-Tom> reaction is quick, but anyway i have to wait about hour
[21:56] <Laurenceb_> you need to have a good condenser
[21:56] <fsphil> well between 48-60V -- it was from my solar array
[21:56] <Laurenceb_> i bubbled through water
[21:57] <ve6ts> you can buy some great electrolysis machines on ebay, expensive but no pressure to fill a balloon
[21:57] <Laurenceb_> bbl
[21:57] <SP9UOB-Tom> there is lots of moisture in gas, so water is condensing, but it can be easilly removed
[21:58] <LeoBodnar> The problem is H2 contains water vapour
[21:58] <SP9UOB-Tom> yes, reaction is at about 80 deg celcius
[21:59] <ve6ts> LeoBodnar so too heavy for balloon launches?
[22:00] <LeoBodnar> Difficult to control. If it condenses/freezes you have lost lift
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[22:00] <SP9UOB-Tom> just have to wait and let the water out trough the neck (with minimum h2 loss
[22:01] <ve6ts> environment canada uses electrolysis to fill their balloons, i wonder how they remove the water vapor
[22:01] <ve6ts> maybe the electrolyser removes it first
[22:01] <LeoBodnar> some industrial desiccant ?
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[22:05] <SpeedEvil> Funky. Neat presentation on above mentioned conference - take a helicopter rotor - now use the delta-p in a sealed and unsealed at the tip tube to run pneumatic valves to run the flaps. Pezio activated. Looks like swashplateless rotors are plausible.
[22:05] <SpeedEvil> Alas - it only works for the full sized ones.
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[22:06] <arko> is W6RZO in here?
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[22:08] <edmoore> yoyo
[22:09] <arko> yoyoyo
[22:09] <arko> mr ed
[22:09] <edmoore> and that
[22:09] <edmoore> still at 1.8V?
[22:09] <arko> :)
[22:09] <arko> yes
[22:10] <arko> http://i.imgur.com/eEVatBy.jpg
[22:10] <arko> tested at school today
[22:10] <arko> works like a charm
[22:10] <arko> good lock
[22:10] <edmoore> awesome
[22:10] <arko> strong signal
[22:10] <arko> indeed
[22:10] <arko> im excited
[22:10] <edmoore> when's the flight?
[22:11] <arko> 25% saturday
[22:11] <arko> weather is taking a turn for the worse
[22:12] <edmoore> what's a turn for the worse in LA
[22:12] <edmoore> 20C and 10mph winds?
[22:12] <edmoore> a cloud?
[22:13] <Reb-SM3ULC> *lol*
[22:13] Action: Reb-SM3ULC has +2C and rain.
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[22:16] <arko> hahaha
[22:16] <arko> edmoore: dead on
[22:17] <arko> the wind is a bit much east into land so it gets blocked by mountains
[22:17] <edmoore> Reb-SM3ULC, not far off that here
[22:17] <edmoore> actually it's quite crisp this eve
[22:17] <edmoore> i'm in london
[22:17] <edmoore> had a nice walk over waterloo bridge
[22:17] <edmoore> all looking pretty, if cold
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[22:18] <arko> :)
[22:19] <arko> its 28 today
[22:19] <arko> not bad
[22:19] <arko> but its gonna cool down to 14 soon
[22:19] <arko> im excited
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[22:23] <edmoore> that's crazy
[22:23] <arko> yep
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[22:36] <arko> the wait for caffeine begins
[22:36] <LeoBodnar> arko: weather turns for the worst - http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=abFJuqp867g
[22:37] <DL1SGP> oh... caffeine... hmm
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[22:39] <arko> LeoBodnar: hahahahahaha
[22:39] <arko> this is amazing
[22:39] <LeoBodnar> Watch all Channel 9 clips
[22:39] <LeoBodnar> and the rest of "The Fast Show" at that
[22:40] <Upu> its funny arko because for 4 weeks previously the sketch had just been "scorticho"
[22:40] <arko> lol
[22:41] <arko> this is literally how the weather stations in los angeles are when there is even a drop of rain
[22:41] <arko> traffic jams up completely
[22:41] <LeoBodnar> You also need to know why the girl's surname is Fisch
[22:41] <arko> and everyone talks about the rain
[22:41] <Upu> Ed Winchester :)
[22:41] <arko> this is the first i've seen of this show
[22:41] <blakangel> {{{{{{arko}}}}}}
[22:42] <LeoBodnar> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uqs1YXfdtGE
[22:42] <arko> sup blakangel
[22:42] <Upu> ah yes we posted this one last week :)
[22:42] <arko> ah!!
[22:42] <arko> i get it now!
[22:42] <arko> fish
[22:43] <arko> poor michael fish
[22:43] <LeoBodnar> Suit you, Sir!
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[22:43] <Upu> lol yeah you need to go watch the fast show
[22:43] <arko> i shall
[22:44] <arko> once im done with all 43 seasons of university challenge
[22:46] <Upu> I still think that tweet last week from @MichaelFishBBC was funny
[22:46] <Upu> "Don't worry. I've got this shit under control this time."
[22:47] <Reb-SM3ULC> LeoBodnar: that was great.. :)
[22:48] <arko> haha
[22:48] <Upu> why would you want to watch 43 seasons of a program that just reminds you how thick you are ?
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[22:49] <SP9UOB-Tom> could be interesting: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3fZ4wDDWd2o
[22:49] <arko> thick?
[22:50] <LeoBodnar> arko: if you have no time for "The Fast Show" go watch at least "The Big Train" http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XTCWB7qPrlw
[22:50] <arko> i'll watch it, was i kidding
[22:50] <Laurenceb_> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DHycFtCxdjs
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[22:51] <SP9UOB-Tom> night all
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[23:06] Nick change: heathkid|2 -> heathkid
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[23:20] <edmoore> nearly home
[23:20] <edmoore> i like this bus
[23:21] <arko> ohh
[23:21] <arko> London to Ox?
[23:21] <arko> the chairs were comfy
[23:24] <edmoore> yes
[23:24] <arko> :)
[23:24] <edmoore> am thirsty tho
[23:25] <arko> stick you head outside and drink the rain
[23:25] <DL7AD_> good morning
[23:25] <arko> aww man now you've reminded me of how nice it was in the uk again
[23:25] <arko> :( i miss it
[23:26] <arko> that bus is very fast if you are drunk too, i remember slightly knocking out and waking up in oxford
[23:26] <arko> lighting speed
[23:28] Nick change: KipK -> KipK_away
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[23:33] <edmoore> you were passing in and out of conciousness
[23:34] <DL7AD_> just finished the frist version of my hab contact program www.dl7ad.de/hab_contacts/
[23:36] <arko> haha
[23:36] <Laurenceb_> sounds like one of my undergrad lectures
[23:36] <arko> done right
[23:36] <Laurenceb_> i still have some of my lecture notes
[23:36] <Laurenceb_> with writing that becomes more and more incoherent followed by dried drool
[23:36] <arko> DL7AD_: nice i just started one too!
[23:36] <arko> ahh
[23:36] <arko> derp
[23:37] <DL7AD_> arko: what did you start?
[23:37] <arko> spacepager.com
[23:37] <arko> its all running local for me at the moment as i develop
[23:38] <arko> im gonna throw it on github when i have the basics down
[23:38] <arko> but its going to take predicted data and habhub data and notify people when habs are nearby
[23:38] <DL7AD_> everytime asked if someone could help me with that... never got a response ;)
[23:38] <arko> well!
[23:38] <arko> now we can
[23:38] <arko> better to have one program than many
[23:38] <arko> but eh
[23:38] <DL7AD_> how far are you?
[23:38] <edmoore> ttfn
[23:39] <arko> not too far
[23:39] <arko> just outline
[23:39] <DL7AD_> okay. then we could merge our ideas
[23:39] <arko> im more interested in the smart backend that figures out who to email
[23:39] <arko> yep!
[23:39] <arko> DL7AD_: http://pastebin.com/hsaFD9FN
[23:39] <DL7AD_> my program is .... complete
[23:39] <arko> im trying to get people in the US to register
[23:39] <arko> well damn, thats goo
[23:39] <arko> d
[23:40] <arko> not sure how to merge it exactly
[23:44] edmoore (~ed@212.183.128.114) left irc: Ping timeout: 272 seconds
[23:52] <Laurenceb_> http://www.kickstarter.com/projects/214379695/micro-python-python-for-microcontrollers?ref=category
[23:57] bertrik (~quassel@rockbox/developer/bertrik) left irc: Ping timeout: 246 seconds
[00:00] --- Fri Nov 15 2013