highaltitude.log.20131017

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[00:30] <craag> Just got the next gen batc.tv server streaming over HTML5 :D
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[00:39] <Lunar_Lander> hi craag !
[00:41] <craag> Evening Lunar_Lander !
[00:42] <craag> What's keeping you up at this late hour?
[00:42] <Lunar_Lander> ah was listening to domian again
[00:43] <Lunar_Lander> and faced a fear from my early years
[00:43] <Lunar_Lander> I happend to see a segment of "The Ice Pirates" on TV and it horrified me
[00:43] <Lunar_Lander> now I came back to see the "space herpe" segment again
[00:43] <Lunar_Lander> and see how cheaply it was made
[00:44] <craag> Hmm haven't seen that
[00:45] <craag> Yeah looks like it was quite low budget
[00:45] <Lunar_Lander> yeah
[00:49] Last message repeated 1 time(s).
[00:49] <Lunar_Lander> well I was 9 maybe when that ran on TV
[00:49] <Lunar_Lander> and it scared me to the bone
[00:49] <craag> I can understand that
[00:50] <craag> My parents made me watch the old dr who episodes
[00:50] <craag> Those had me cowering behind the sofa!
[00:51] <Lunar_Lander> oh
[00:53] <Lunar_Lander> I remember at my grandmother's at holidays
[00:53] <Lunar_Lander> still with a black/white TV
[00:53] <Lunar_Lander> star trek II was on
[00:53] <Lunar_Lander> and there was the scene where the Ceti Eel comes out of Checkov's ear
[00:53] <Lunar_Lander> I was maybe 7
[00:53] <Lunar_Lander> guess the consequences
[00:56] <craag> nightmares
[00:56] <craag> yeah
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[01:00] <Lunar_Lander> yeah
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[02:27] <BenLTechSat> Any ideas for a transceiver like this, but cheaper, for 60k feet HAB? https://www.sparkfun.com/products/9411
[02:28] <BenLTechSat> or at least good places too look/shop for such things
[02:35] <SpeedEvil> what ate you trying to do.
[02:35] <SpeedEvil> and are you in the us?
[02:39] <BenLTechSat> im in the us
[02:39] <BenLTechSat> i'm just trying to send UART data from a gps to the ground
[02:40] <BenLTechSat> That transceiver is too much for my uses... i didnt notice that
[02:40] <BenLTechSat> 115kbps is too much
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[02:45] <SpeedEvil> we're using 433mhz 10mw
[02:45] <SpeedEvil> and it goes to the horizon
[02:46] <SpeedEvil> 50bps
[02:46] <SpeedEvil> https://www.sparkfun.com/products/10153 similar to
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[02:50] <BenLTechSat> wow
[02:50] <BenLTechSat> what do you mean "goes to the horizon"?
[03:13] <SpeedEvil> >500km
[03:14] <BenLTechSat> but how? doesn't it have to have a high power output to be able to transmit that far?
[03:26] Nick change: JMH_ -> XXX
[03:26] <SpeedEvil> you need to exceed the noise in the receivers bandwidth.
[03:26] Nick change: XXX -> NSFW
[03:26] Nick change: NSFW -> LGBT
[03:27] <SpeedEvil> there isn't much noise in a 400hz or so bandwidth
[03:27] <SpeedEvil> at 50bps or so
[03:27] <SpeedEvil> http://ukhas.org.uk/guides:radio_modules
[03:28] <SpeedEvil> http://ukhas.org.uk/guides:tracking_guide
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[04:27] <Joel_re> so I have this ntx2 module transmitting a string
[04:27] <Joel_re> can someone look at the wav file and tell me if its fin
[04:27] <Joel_re> Im not able to rtty decode though
[04:28] <Joel_re> I see the transmission in the waterfall and can distinctly hear each bit
[04:29] <Joel_re> all I get is $--------$
[04:29] <Joel_re> Im not using crc checking as yet
[04:29] <Joel_re> but I am tranmitting 'deadbeef'
[04:32] <Joel_re> Im not sure if my clock rate is too slow
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[05:47] <x-f> Joel_re, can you upload the recording somewhere?
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[07:26] <ibanezmatt13> morning
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[07:30] <ibanezmatt13> Wow, I just tried to buy a TMP102 from Farnell costing £1.18, and they charged a handling fee of £20!
[07:30] <ibanezmatt13> Then I look on Ebay, UK seller, TMP102, same thing, for 2 of them, £5 delivered
[07:31] <LeoBodnar> This is a rip-off
[07:31] <LeoBodnar> eBay
[07:32] <LeoBodnar> Is it a chap that copies all Farnell listings and puts 50%-100% markup on them
[07:32] <ibanezmatt13> probably
[07:33] <LeoBodnar> Just buy £20 of stuff off Farnell and get no handling charge and free delivery
[07:33] <daveake> The thing to do with Farnell etc is to always have something that you will use later and can add to the order now to hit the free-shipping-handling limit
[07:33] <ibanezmatt13> yeah, unfortunately I can't think of anything. I don't mind the £5 Ebay one
[07:34] <daveake> A Pi or camera or something
[07:34] <daveake> I have lots of those :/
[07:34] <daveake> They're basically consumables in this game
[07:34] <ibanezmatt13> lol, I may get another Pi Cam
[07:35] <ibanezmatt13> I don't think I'll be getting the sealant off the lens somehow :P
[07:35] <LeoBodnar> name there is "top-quality-tools" - thieving cnt
[07:35] <ibanezmatt13> :)
[07:35] <daveake> Things like boxes of AA batteries ... I often add those to CPC orders to get free shipping
[07:35] <LeoBodnar> He does not hold any stock, just automatically copies Farnell products to eBay
[07:35] <daveake> b'stard
[07:36] <eroomde> decent side cutters
[07:36] <daveake> There are some amazon copiers too
[07:36] <daveake> Yes buy some Lindstroms
[07:37] <ibanezmatt13> I could do with some cutting tools actually
[07:38] <LeoBodnar> daveake: Waitrose stopped selling all Energizer Lithiums - do you know what's the deal there?
[07:38] <daveake> oh, no, probably due to people not wanting to transport them
[07:39] <LeoBodnar> They were priced from reasonable to excellent
[07:39] <daveake> 7dayshop probably the best deal now
[07:39] <eroomde> lindstrom 8160, and a stripmaster
[07:39] <daveake> I bought as many as I could from Waitrose
[07:40] <LeoBodnar> And I cleared their stock here
[07:40] <gonzo_> I brought a load too, but clearing them out could have been a carrier bag full
[07:40] <daveake> so? :)
[07:41] <daveake> Set up HAB Battery Supplies :p
[07:41] <LeoBodnar> They had 2x for £5 on AAA
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[07:41] <LeoBodnar> That is 2x4 for £5
[07:41] <daveake> Yes, I know, I think it was me that spotted that :)
[07:41] <gonzo_> hehe, well, that could havebeen an idea. Shipping with an LED of course
[07:41] <LeoBodnar> Yes it was you
[07:42] <daveake> Can't remember why I popped in there.
[07:42] <daveake> Shame they didn't have AAs at the same price
[07:42] <LeoBodnar> Some Heston food should be sold with AAA inside
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[07:46] <ibanezmatt13> Just bought 30 0805 chip LEDs, selection of colours including 1st class delivery: £1.95
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[08:07] <M6GTG_Andrew> morning all
[08:08] <DL1SGP1> yawns good day all ... lovely morning drove mother to town at 6am, she went to see doctors and her cellphone battery was almost discharged
[08:09] <DL1SGP1> result: when she was done at 8am she could not call me for picking her up, was waiting in the car at nearby parking
[08:10] <DL1SGP1> at 9am I went to train station to get some hot coffee to warm up a bit... by then she had called my dad at work and he was there as well. such a mess
[08:13] <Lunar_LanderU> morning
[08:13] <DL1SGP1> Guten Morgen Lunar_LanderU
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[08:36] <LeoBodnar> moin moin *
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[08:50] <nats`> hi
[08:50] <M6GTG_Andrew> LeoBodnar: B-20???? Pleaseeeeeee.. need something to track
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[09:03] <nats`> we should do a crowdfunding for the Leo's balloons :)
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[09:05] <LeoBodnar> Right-o M6GTG_Andrew
[09:05] <LeoBodnar> We need coin-operated balloon launcher
[09:06] <M6GTG_Andrew> paypal donate button and one of those donation themometer thingies on IsLeoFlying.com?
[09:07] <Steve_G0TDJ> ping daveake And good morning guys
[09:07] <LeoBodnar> morning Steve
[09:07] <Steve_G0TDJ> Hi Andy
[09:07] <Steve_G0TDJ> Hi Leo
[09:07] <M6GTG_Andrew> morning Steve
[09:07] <Steve_G0TDJ> Jhon-boy...etc.
[09:07] <daveake> ponged
[09:07] <Steve_G0TDJ> Doh, typing
[09:07] <Steve_G0TDJ> Ah, Dave, how do I tell if my flight docs have been approved or not?
[09:08] <daveake> See if the flight shows in dl-fldigi
[09:08] <M6GTG_Andrew> see the publicity machine in full swing for your flight Steve_G0TDJ:
[09:08] <Steve_G0TDJ> *doh* again.... It's been a long night.
[09:08] <Steve_G0TDJ> Yeah, I saw Southgate have got hold of it, how cool
[09:08] <daveake> But that only happens during the time you specified e.g. launch date +/- 3 days
[09:08] <Steve_G0TDJ> Thank you daveake
[09:08] <daveake> It'll also appear in the iCal calendar feed
[09:09] <Steve_G0TDJ> OK
[09:09] <daveake> Otherwise ask in #habhub
[09:09] <Steve_G0TDJ> Well VAYU isn't thereso I@ll ask
[09:09] <Steve_G0TDJ> brb
[09:11] <Steve_G0TDJ> daveake: is that 3 days including flight day or added to?
[09:12] <daveake> Pass
[09:12] <Steve_G0TDJ> LOL OK
[09:12] <daveake> Ask in #habhub
[09:12] <Steve_G0TDJ> Well I asked and there's no response yet, lots of busy people I expect, I'll try again later
[09:12] <daveake> Am I sounding like a broken record yet? :p
[09:12] <Steve_G0TDJ> <daveake> Am I sounding like a broken record yet? :p
[09:12] <LeoBodnar> What's your flight name Steve_G0TDJ ?
[09:12] <Steve_G0TDJ> Sorry, couldn't resist :D
[09:12] <Steve_G0TDJ> VAYU-1
[09:14] <LeoBodnar> It shows the launch window as only one day
[09:14] <M6GTG_Andrew> Question, want to a demonstration of DL-FLDIGI decoding HAB flights at a radio club, was going to playback an SDR recording. If I were to this would it show green decodes even if I were disconnected from the internet and/or it is an old flight? I can't try it as I haven't got a handy recording! Also if I were connected to the net would it screw anything up on HABHUB?
[09:14] <Steve_G0TDJ> Do I need to edit it?
[09:14] <Steve_G0TDJ> Should do Andy
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[09:15] <Steve_G0TDJ> Go in to DL CLient and untick ONLINE and it won't send to Habitat M6GTG_Andrew
[09:15] <LeoBodnar> It will show up in dl-fldigi during launch window period so in your case on the launch day only
[09:15] <Steve_G0TDJ> Right, how can I make sure it will be done?
[09:16] <Steve_G0TDJ> Or has it been done but only show up then?
[09:16] <LeoBodnar> If it has been approved it will be there
[09:16] <Steve_G0TDJ> OK. Well I should have mobile internet so I'll ask on Sunday if required.
[09:16] <M6GTG_Andrew> Steve_G0TDJ: Thanks forgot about the Online box
[09:16] <LeoBodnar> These things can be fixed in a matter of minutes.
[09:16] <Steve_G0TDJ> np Andy
[09:17] <Steve_G0TDJ> Yeah, I know Leo, it's my first launch so I have 1st time nerves :D
[09:17] <LeoBodnar> Upu fsphil and others kindly did it for me and this is a great feeling that somebody can fix your screwups :D
[09:18] <Steve_G0TDJ> LOL Well everyone is very helpful in here
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[09:22] <daveake> Steve_G0TDJ I'll have internet via a mifi on Sunday. Can stream to batc too if you like
[09:22] <Steve_G0TDJ> That would be fantastic :D
[09:23] <Steve_G0TDJ> I take it you're able to come along then ;-)
[09:23] <daveake> so far so good
[09:23] <Steve_G0TDJ> Great
[09:25] <daveake> I can try out my chase car pi thing
[09:25] <M6GTG_Andrew> Steve_G0TDJ: I've got it all to come next year (or sooner if we have some test launches)
[09:25] <Steve_G0TDJ> Oh yeah, that would be good. I read the blog entry
[09:25] <Steve_G0TDJ> Cool stuff Andy
[09:26] <nats`> M6GTG_Andrew I think your idea of paypal donate button on is leo flying a great idea !
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[09:31] <mfa298> forget solar and batteries there's a new way to power your habs: http://www.amazon.com/dp/B000796XXM
[09:32] <ibanezmatt13> morning
[09:32] <daveake> "I purchased this product 4.47 Billion Years ago and when I opened it today, it was half empty." lol
[09:33] <Steve_G0TDJ> LOL :D
[09:34] Action: Joel_re doesnt get it :\
[09:34] <Joel_re> hah
[09:34] <x-f> customer reviews are great there
[09:34] <Joel_re> I did not look at the amazon link, ignore me
[09:34] <M6GTG_Andrew> daveake: but would it? It would be half full of Lead-206? (stolen from other comment.. )
[09:35] <daveake> well yeah if you want to be accurate .... :)
[09:35] <M6GTG_Andrew> just thinking best not order any if it is going to shipped by citilink
[09:36] <M6GTG_Andrew> citylink even
[09:40] <mfa298> apparently if you put it in your bags when flying it helps you locate your bags easily at the other end
[09:44] <gonzo_> I did like the luggage one.
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[09:45] <gonzo_> I use to order radioacive sources from the US. Things like polonium 210 have a short half life, so I was buying theme every 6mths. they just arrived in a jiffy bag through the mail
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[09:47] <mfa298> i did realise that some people here are probably too young to get the references about buying it from libyans in a mall car park
[09:47] <daveake> leobodnar Just spotted that Farnell-copier on fleabay
[09:47] <daveake> Outrageous markups
[09:47] <gonzo_> libians in VW beetles?
[09:47] <gonzo_> (nope camper vans, my mistake)
[09:52] <tweetBot> @thecraag: Hourly predictor set up for BATC HAB Launch: even with an early burst (100g hwoyee) it's not looking good :/ http://t.co/YoBlZSYYFR #ukhas
[09:53] <nats`> "Unfortuantly my mom opened my mail, because she does not respect people's privacy. She was pretty upset to see Uranium Ore. After a long argument and me running away from home again, she finaly stopped being such an idiot and I was able to get back to work."
[09:53] <nats`> mfa298 you made my day :D
[09:55] Nick change: Hix2 -> Hix
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[10:19] <WillTablet> Is that uranium ore legit?
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[10:43] <nats`> WillTablet I guess so
[10:43] <nats`> like americium in smoke detector
[10:43] <nats`> (not in france for sure)
[10:44] <nats`> until it doesn't go over the maximum radiation authorized that's fine
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[10:48] <Hix> anyone wise in the ways of photometry or know of anywhere that is a good resource?
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[11:09] <PE2G> Hi, I'll put the De Bilt (NL) ozone sonde on APRS, launch at about 11:30 UTC, if all goes well.
[11:09] <PE2G> http://aprs.fi/#!mt=roadmap&z=11&call=a%2FPE2G-11&timerange=10800&tail=10800
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[11:11] <PE2G> Groundwind is 7 m/s and gusting at the launch site, upper limit for the O3 sonde is 10 m/s
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[11:14] <PE2G> Expected track into Germany: http://predict.habhub.org/#!/uuid=b1f7fc927b2d75d4ff17dc780ed101e4ce8105d8
[11:16] <Lunar_LanderU> hey PE2G
[11:17] <Lunar_LanderU> cool!
[11:17] <PE2G> Hi Lunar_LanderU
[11:20] <Lunar_LanderU> how's life?
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[11:20] <PE2G> Pretty good, you're OK too?
[11:21] <PE2G> Strong wind here at 12th floor
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[11:23] <PE2G> Just put the yagi up and nearly lost it due to the wind
[11:23] <Lunar_LanderU> yeah stormy too here
[11:23] <Lunar_LanderU> I'm good, thanks
[11:24] <PE2G> Any news on your launch?
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[11:35] <Lunar_LanderU> PE2G: not yet, still working on the B.Sc. thesis and so on
[11:36] <PE2G> O3 sonde is up
[11:36] <PE2G> SondeMonitor still calibrating
[11:37] <PE2G> Lunar_LanderU: OK, you're busy
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[11:39] <Lunar_LanderU> yeah
[11:39] <Lunar_LanderU> busy but still kicking
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[11:39] <Lunar_LanderU> XD
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[11:44] <Lunar_LanderU> PE2G: and what are you working on?
[11:46] <PE2G> mainly, I'm technical translator for the consumer electronics industry
[11:46] <PE2G> I.e: I'm translating a lot of manuals
[11:48] <Lunar_LanderU> ah
[11:48] <Lunar_LanderU> which languages?
[11:48] <PE2G> English > Dutch and German > Dutch
[11:50] <Lunar_LanderU> cool
[11:50] <Lunar_LanderU> btw
[11:50] <Lunar_LanderU> ik kan ook een beetje nederlands spreken :)
[11:51] <gonzo_> recon a good line would be engrish to english
[11:51] <Lunar_LanderU> btw earlier I saw a woman in a red Saab which had an unlocked engine hood
[11:51] <PE2G> Lunar_LanderU: Ausgezeichnet!
[11:51] <Lunar_LanderU> it was still latched down, but it was open
[11:51] <Lunar_LanderU> thanks :)
[11:52] <Lunar_LanderU> spoorwegoverganges zijn manchmal gefarlijk
[11:52] <Lunar_LanderU> or something like that
[11:52] <Lunar_LanderU> xD
[11:53] <PE2G> Indeed
[11:54] <PE2G> O3's speed is 144 km/h, I wonder what the top speed will be
[11:54] <Lunar_LanderU> yea
[11:56] <PE2G> Speed is increasing at 7500 m
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[12:01] <PE2G> 244 km/h at 9100 m
[12:01] <Lunar_LanderU> yay
[12:02] <Lunar_LanderU> racing xD
[12:02] <PE2G> I haven't seen such speed often
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[12:04] <Lunar_LanderU> yea
[12:04] <Lunar_LanderU> remember the californian transatlantic balloons
[12:04] <Lunar_LanderU> ?
[12:04] <Lunar_LanderU> they were flying at over 300 km/h according to the APRS
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[12:05] <PE2G> That's a nice speed to cross the Atlantic
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[12:10] <PE2G> Max speed I saw was 254 km/h at around 10 k
[12:10] <PE2G> for the O3 sonde
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[12:57] <ibanezmatt13> afternoon
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[13:00] <fsphil> so it is. day is going quickly here
[13:01] <mattbrejza> still nice and sunny though :)
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[13:04] <ibanezmatt13> :)
[13:04] <DL1SGP1> cloudy and stormy here :)
[13:04] <ibanezmatt13> unbelievably it's quite nice up here
[13:05] <daveake> my todo list for today is the same depressing length it was at 8:30. New stuff added as fast as I can pick them off
[13:05] Action: mfa298 can see bits of blue sky
[13:06] Action: ibanezmatt13 can see no cloud
[13:06] Action: fsphil is stuck indoors so can't see cloud
[13:06] <fsphil> but it's probably there
[13:06] <daveake> make a cloudcam
[13:06] <Lunar_LanderU> PE2G: ozone still flying?
[13:06] Action: daveake has blinds to keep out that annoying sun thing
[13:06] <PE2G> Yes, at 32 km now
[13:07] <fsphil> actually there appears to be sunshine outside
[13:07] <fsphil> weird
[13:07] <wd8mnv> ut's at 106K FEET
[13:07] <fsphil> I prefer the socks unit myself
[13:07] <fsphil> that's 86.757 socks
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[13:08] <fsphil> sorry, ksocks
[13:08] <daveake> It's a much bigger number in "toes"
[13:09] <PE2G> Burst at 33km
[13:09] <fsphil> is that big toes or little toes?
[13:09] <Lunar_LanderU> female toes
[13:09] <Lunar_LanderU> xD
[13:09] <daveake> pinkies
[13:10] <ibanezmatt13> I have a computer science exam in 20 minutes :P
[13:11] <DL1SGP1> good luck ibanezmatt13
[13:11] <Lunar_LanderU> yeah good luck
[13:11] <ibanezmatt13> cheers. Should be ok but there are a lot of definitions to remember
[13:11] <Lunar_LanderU> :)
[13:11] <fsphil> technical exam? or just general computery questions?
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[13:13] <ibanezmatt13> erm
[13:13] <ibanezmatt13> well questions like: "define the term variable" or something
[13:13] <fsphil> ah, fairly technical then
[13:14] <ibanezmatt13> "what is a pre-conditioned loop" blah
[13:14] <ibanezmatt13> yea
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[13:14] <fsphil> what is a pre-conditioned loop?
[13:14] <ibanezmatt13> A loop that only starts to run when a set condition is met?
[13:15] <fsphil> nice
[13:15] <ibanezmatt13> a post condition loop would enter regardless and will loop while the condition holds true
[13:15] <DL1SGP1> meh storm just tuned my log periodic antenna :D gonna have to go on the roof for a quick fix in a bit
[13:15] <ibanezmatt13> or for x times
[13:15] <mattbrejza> so a fancy name for a while loop?
[13:15] <fsphil> basically
[13:15] <ibanezmatt13> yep
[13:15] <mattbrejza> not entirely sure these are things that need names
[13:15] <ibanezmatt13> me neither
[13:15] <daveake> nope
[13:15] <fsphil> I've never heard it called that before
[13:15] <ibanezmatt13> rogue value
[13:15] <fsphil> so I'd probably fail this exam :)
[13:15] <daveake> lol
[13:16] <fsphil> rogue value?
[13:16] <ibanezmatt13> they call it rogue value, which is basically, in a loop it breaks if it gets to an "unexpected" value
[13:16] <ibanezmatt13> or condition
[13:16] <daveake> Answer everything with "Well, it's obvious, innit?"
[13:16] <ibanezmatt13> lol
[13:16] <fsphil> "Google it."
[13:17] <DL1SGP1> or answer 42 :)
[13:18] <ibanezmatt13> or answer "N/A"
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[13:19] <fsphil> http://www.rmbconsulting.us/a-c-test-the-0x10-best-questions-for-would-be-embedded-programmers
[13:19] <fsphil> some interesting questions in that article
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[13:20] <ibanezmatt13> they seem far harder than a level computing questions :P
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[13:20] <ibanezmatt13> on saying that, it generally looks quite straight-forward
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[13:21] <ibanezmatt13> did you pass the C test fsphil? :)
[13:22] <fsphil> yes, but I marked it myself so maybe :)
[13:22] <ibanezmatt13> :)
[13:22] <ibanezmatt13> right gotta go to this test. See you :)
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[13:27] <PE2G> Uh oh, a very good parachute and a lot of wind below 10 km. This one will probably fly out of my radio range
[13:28] <Lunar_LanderU> ohhhhhhh
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[13:29] <PE2G> only -7 m/s at 14km, O3 sondes don't show these figures often
[13:30] <PE2G> -14 m/s at 14 km is the norm
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[13:32] <fsphil> a balloonachute maybe
[13:32] <Lunar_LanderU> ballute
[13:32] <PE2G> Yes, could be
[13:32] <Lunar_LanderU> was a NASA term for that I think
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[13:40] <mfa298> I thought the standard answer in an exam was "I am a Fish" repeated many times
[13:40] <eroomde> ballutes are air-inflated
[13:41] <eroomde> by the dynamic pressure of falling
[13:41] <eroomde> if it's just a balloon it'd be called something else
[13:41] <LeoBodnar> paroon
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[13:43] <fsphil> mfa298: only if you're a smeg head
[13:44] <mfa298> although just checking my quote it's 400 times and then you have to funny little dance and faint
[13:44] <staylo> And don't forget the triple salute
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[13:50] <PE2G> Hardly any correct decode anymore at 1 deg elev.
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[13:56] <adamgreig> hey eroomde
[13:56] <adamgreig> guess who has joined div f
[13:56] <adamgreig> as a professor
[13:57] <eroomde> gimme an M?
[13:58] <adamgreig> yup!
[13:58] <adamgreig> http://www.cam.ac.uk/research/news/david-mackay-appointed-regius-professor-of-engineering
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[13:59] <eroomde> i knew he'd joined CUED
[14:00] <eroomde> but didn't know it was div f
[14:00] <eroomde> i thought it was div c stuff which seems to be the sustainable dev ubrella
[14:00] <adamgreig> hmm
[14:00] <adamgreig> yea actually I'm not completely sure he's in div f
[14:00] <adamgreig> he got mentioned at the div f welcome party though
[14:01] <eroomde> because he is god
[14:01] <adamgreig> on jan's list of new people
[14:01] <eroomde> ah cool
[14:01] <adamgreig> so might be f
[14:01] <adamgreig> his mugshot isn't on the div F staff/students atm though (mine is!)
[14:02] <eroomde> shame the whiteboard in the tea room doesn't still have
[14:02] <eroomde> 'Love MacKay Hate Frequentism' on it
[14:02] <adamgreig> haha yes
[14:03] <nj_> does anyone have advice on how to debug rtty signal? i'm generating rtty with a pic but cannot decode it. I have a feeling it is a timing issue
[14:03] <adamgreig> can you remember if ipynb has magic for multiprocessing?
[14:03] <adamgreig> nj_: oscilloscope
[14:03] <eroomde> it's often a timing issue
[14:03] <eroomde> how are you doing your iming?
[14:04] <eroomde> does the output look totally wrong or just a bit wrong?
[14:04] <eroomde> have you hit 'Rv'?
[14:04] <eroomde> who yo mamma?
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[14:04] <nj_> i don't have an oscilloscope? can you use a software audio anaylsis for it?
[14:04] <eroomde> sorry that last question just came out, and is not part of the debugging process
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[14:04] <nj_> it looks and sounds really close
[14:04] <nj_> eroomde hehe
[14:04] <eroomde> ok
[14:04] <eroomde> so yes, probably a timing issue
[14:05] <nj_> I'm launching micro balloons in Canada, and have previously used morse code, but want to switch to rtty for more error free decoding
[14:05] <Willdude123> Urgh. Je suis tres bored.
[14:05] <mattbrejza> you can analyse the timing on the pc but theres no neat way of doing it
[14:05] <nj_> ah i see, thanks that will be my winter project this year
[14:06] <nj_> I'm looking to run a HF beacon on CW which will fly (hopefully) across canada
[14:06] <PE2G> Last decode not visible on APRS: https://maps.google.com/maps?q=51.37799+8.96808 (3336 m)
[14:07] <nj_> anyone tried using cr2032 batteries for micro balloon launchs? a 9v is just too heavy
[14:07] <nj_> my last micro was like 10 grams but the battery was 45 grams
[14:08] <mattbrejza> you can use AAA cells
[14:08] <mattbrejza> coin cells have a too high internal resistance
[14:09] <eroomde> nj_, how are you generating your timing?
[14:09] <nj_> eroomde using the pic's usleep
[14:09] <Willdude123> I need something cool to read up on, anyone got any ideas?
[14:09] <SpeedEvil> nj_: single li-ion cells have been used
[14:10] <nj_> mattbrejza i might try the litium aaa and see what they weigh
[14:10] <mattbrejza> like 7g
[14:10] <eroomde> nj_, busy-waits are gack
[14:10] <eroomde> user a timer to generate an interrupt every 20ms
[14:10] <nj_> Willdude123 you can see my previous launchs here: http://arawr.ca
[14:10] <nj_> i also have a write up on rdf tracking
[14:10] <fsphil> use interrupts if you can
[14:10] <SpeedEvil> Willdude123: http://brainsciencepodcast.com/episodes-page - for interesting podcasts.
[14:10] <SpeedEvil> Willdude123: Going into the science of the brain - and how it makes us who we are.
[14:11] <nj_> eroomde thanks for the help i will try interrupts
[14:11] <nj_> 20ms is the timing between state changes in rtty 100 baud?
[14:11] <fsphil> 50 baud
[14:11] <nj_> thanks, i will definately try that
[14:11] <fsphil> 10ms delay for 100 baud
[14:11] <nj_> i'm really enjoying the micro launches
[14:12] <fsphil> how many have you done?
[14:12] <nj_> 15 large balloons and 4 micro
[14:12] <mattbrejza> you can always toggle a pin for each bit and use a freqency counter to check the baudrate
[14:12] <fsphil> sweet
[14:12] <nj_> all 15 large balloons recovered
[14:12] <nj_> photos and videos posted
[14:12] <nj_> all 4 micro balloons lost (no GPS on board yet)
[14:12] <mattbrejza> canada is quite a big target, less sea issues :P
[14:12] <fsphil> if you're using rtty it would be a short step to using http://spacenear.us/tracker/
[14:12] <nj_> yes that is for sure, i'm near the middle
[14:13] <eroomde> what size are the micro ones?
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[14:13] <Lunar_LanderU> nj_: finally someone from Canada! :D
[14:13] <nj_> fsphil yes i want to make it work with that tracker
[14:13] <nj_> Lunar_LanderU thanks, not much balloon launching in canada currently
[14:13] <Lunar_LanderU> yeah
[14:13] <nj_> i know about 5 groups
[14:13] <fsphil> I only remember one launch in canada before
[14:13] <eroomde> natrium
[14:14] <fsphil> you've got some excellent areas for doing it
[14:14] <fsphil> it was a doll wasn't it?
[14:14] <Lunar_LanderU> ah the Lego astronaut figure
[14:14] <Lunar_LanderU> or so
[14:14] <nj_> i'm trying to get a local group going for group launches
[14:14] <nj_> Lunar_LanderU the lego astronaut was done illegally though, I have filed notams for all of my launches
[14:14] <nj_> even the micro ones!
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[14:15] <eroomde> what size are the micro ones nj_ ?
[14:15] <fsphil> that happens here sometimes :(
[14:15] <nj_> i've helped out a school launch 5000 km from my qth
[14:15] <nj_> eroomde my smallest was 55 grams
[14:15] <SpeedEvil> :)
[14:15] <eroomde> nice
[14:15] <nj_> eroomde my largest was 100 grams (i was just learning)
[14:16] <nj_> my largest payload was 2KG for the large balloons
[14:16] <eroomde> i udnerstand it gets quite addictive
[14:16] <SpeedEvil> nj_: http://leobodnar.com/balloons/B-10/
[14:16] <nj_> eroomde ya that is for sure
[14:16] <eroomde> people trying for ever smaller payloads
[14:16] <nj_> ya i saw B10, that was a great flight
[14:16] <Lunar_LanderU> yeah
[14:16] <eroomde> round here people are getting down to 12g payloads
[14:16] <Lunar_LanderU> nj_: ohhhhhhhh
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[14:17] <nj_> eroomde that is impressive
[14:17] <nj_> i use h2 for all of my balloon flights, i've had alot of practice
[14:17] <eroomde> that was one of the Bs
[14:17] <fsphil> much smaller and these trackers will be able to float on breezes
[14:17] <eroomde> sporehab
[14:18] <nj_> i like the large launches, but the micro i think are even more fun
[14:18] <fsphil> the small ones are certainly less predictable
[14:18] <nj_> i've been playing around alot with radio direction finding and have bought a dopler system
[14:18] <eroomde> i quite like big heavy lauches :)
[14:18] <eroomde> well, i like complicated payloads anyway
[14:19] <nj_> i did 4 large launches in a row (weekends)
[14:19] <eroomde> i can't say i particularly enjoy lauching the big ones
[14:19] <eroomde> it can be quite hairy
[14:19] <nj_> i have prefected cutdown as well
[14:19] <nj_> i now have a cabin in a small village that i launch my large balloons from
[14:19] <eroomde> nice
[14:19] <eroomde> how do you do your cutdowns?
[14:19] <nj_> this place is far away from the city and everything
[14:20] <nj_> i use a 10 ohm resister tied inside the nylon rope and hit it with 0.5a at 7 volts
[14:20] <nj_> 10 seconds later it is done
[14:21] <daveake> one of those numbers is wrong :p
[14:21] <eroomde> cool
[14:21] <nj_> my last launch landed right in the middle of a road in a rual area (cosmic hole in 1)
[14:21] <eroomde> oh yes!
[14:21] <eroomde> lol
[14:21] <daveake> but yeah similar to mine, though fewer volts and lower ohms
[14:21] <eroomde> i wasn't even reading critically
[14:21] <eroomde> i quite like pyroctechnic cutdowns
[14:21] <eroomde> they go when you tell them
[14:21] <nj_> someone almost drove right over it
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[14:22] <daveake> I had one land in front of a guy who was about to drive out of a parking lot
[14:22] <nj_> this is my balloon launch location: http://pic.obsd.com/2013-10-12/DSC_2153.JPG_lg.jpg
[14:22] <fsphil> my last flight landed on a road in the middle of nowhere
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[14:23] <fsphil> no traffic except for us, and we nearly drove over it
[14:23] <nj_> here is the landing on the road: http://pic.obsd.com/2013-10-12/DSC_2166.JPG_lg.jpg
[14:23] <nj_> that is increadable
[14:23] <fsphil> https://secure.flickr.com/photos/fsphil/8364495945/
[14:23] <eroomde> that's a great launch location
[14:23] <eroomde> and a lovely HQ
[14:24] <nj_> fsphil that is a great pic
[14:24] <nj_> eroomde i just bought it 1 month ago
[14:24] <eroomde> for HAB?
[14:24] <nj_> eroomde it is 1.5 hour drive from my home in the city
[14:24] <eroomde> well, i guess it has other uses :)
[14:24] <nj_> eroomde well for hab and other reasons (vacation property and investment!)
[14:24] <DL1SGP1> three days ago we had a radiosonde from met-service hanging with the cord and parachute in high power lines and payload on a frequented path, police and energy supplier took care of it
[14:25] <nj_> http://arawr.ca/?page=site here is more pics of my launch location
[14:25] Action: fsphil is envyous of that launch location
[14:25] <nj_> DL1SGP1 i've always worried about one of ours landing there
[14:25] <daveake> Well if we're doing road landings, I was stood on the road when I took this http://www.daveakerman.com/wp-content/uploads/2012/07/P1040688-e1343741607204-682x1024.jpg :)
[14:25] <fsphil> that said when I launch from work, I can fill the balloon indoors -- massively helpful
[14:25] <DL1SGP1> scout activity daveake?
[14:26] <nj_> fsphil thanks, i paid $45K cdn for that one acre lot with the cabin, no water or gas but i do have electricity
[14:26] <daveake> yes
[14:26] <fsphil> well now I want to move to canada even more
[14:26] <Lunar_LanderU> and Project HARP :)
[14:27] <craag> road landings :) http://goo.gl/ndWI3E
[14:27] <daveake> ok has anyone landed in a field? :p
[14:27] <eroomde> we have had just one powerline landing so far
[14:27] <nj_> daveake almost every launch lands in a field for us
[14:27] <eroomde> daveake, of the between 50-100 habs i've launched, maybe 2 or 3 haven't landed in a field
[14:28] <Lunar_LanderU> I landed in a river
[14:28] <eroomde> the joy os east anglia
[14:28] <daveake> 1 out of 1 too LL
[14:28] <nj_> i landed in a swap and recovered everything
[14:28] <nj_> i lost a camera in a puddle once
[14:28] <Lunar_LanderU> yeah
[14:29] <nj_> are most of you in the UK? i lived in The Neatherlands for a while, born in and mostly lived in western Canada
[14:29] <daveake> nj_ I landed one at sea and it came in on the tide 2 hours later
[14:29] <nj_> daveake that is cool, the sea is 1000km from here
[14:29] <eroomde> oh no wait that's bs
[14:29] <eroomde> i should say of those that have landed on land
[14:29] <eroomde> have lost 3 or 4 to the sea
[14:29] <nats`> <Lunar_LanderU> I landed in a river <= there are rivers on the moon ? oO
[14:29] <fsphil> the ocean is 40km from here
[14:30] <DL1SGP1> nats`: must be the case there is a Sinatra song called "Moon River" :D
[14:30] <fsphil> only landed in it once so far
[14:31] <fsphil> actually no, that was in the north sea -- which is kinda the atlantic
[14:31] <nats`> If sinatra said so !
[14:31] <craag> I have 1/3 in a field so far. (road, tree (still up there), field)
[14:32] <nj_> i love this shot: http://pic.obsd.com/2013-09-01/vlcsnap-2013-09-01-15h06m41s4.png it is the balloon busting at 122,000 ft with a hydrogen gas bubble
[14:32] <nj_> it was a 2000 gram balloon
[14:32] <eroomde> lovely pic
[14:32] <fsphil> very nice
[14:32] <Lunar_LanderU> PE2G: did the ozonesonde land?
[14:32] <eroomde> i think a lot of those spheres are talc
[14:32] <fsphil> is that the gas or the powder on the balloon?
[14:33] <eroomde> rather than gas
[14:33] <nj_> notice the key word there: "Was" :)
[14:33] <nj_> i'm guessing the powder
[14:33] <Lunar_LanderU> yeah the talc
[14:33] <Lunar_LanderU> nats`: XD
[14:33] <fsphil> it's horrible stuff
[14:33] <daveake> yup
[14:33] <fsphil> gets everywhere
[14:33] <daveake> this is why I have grey hair
[14:33] <daveake> no other reason
[14:33] <nj_> yup, i'm usually covered after inflation
[14:33] <fsphil> lol
[14:33] <Lunar_LanderU> ah nj_ kan je ook een beetje nederlands spreken?
[14:33] <Lunar_LanderU> xD
[14:33] <PE2G> Lunar_LanderU: Yeah, last position rxed by a German HAM: https://maps.google.com/maps?q=51.35469+9.13542 (2319 m)
[14:34] <nj_> Lunar_LanderU enn biejta (sorry spelling)
[14:34] <Lunar_LanderU> :) cool!
[14:34] <DL1SGP1> Biertjes?
[14:34] <Lunar_LanderU> my favourite dutch word still is spoorwegovergang
[14:34] <Lunar_LanderU> xD
[14:34] <nj_> by the way my new callsign is VE6TS (TS = Terresterial sat) :) perfect for ballooning
[14:35] <Lunar_LanderU> :)
[14:35] <Lunar_LanderU> we have someone here who has PB0NER (no joke :))
[14:35] <nj_> Lunar_LanderU i lived in wassenaar when i lived there, but went to an english speaking school
[14:35] <Lunar_LanderU> ah
[14:36] <nj_> here is my launch site radio beacon: http://aprs.fi/#!mt=roadmap&z=11&call=a%2FVE6TS-4 (soon to be replaced by a weather station)
[14:37] <Lunar_LanderU> PE2G: cool, thanks
[14:37] <nj_> it is a very unpopulated area, have you ever heard of the canadian badlands? it is in there where they found alot of dino bones
[14:38] <eroomde> i didn't think canada did badlands
[14:39] <nj_> yup, world famous, we have some large parks there my "launch site" also borders a creek
[14:39] <eroomde> beautiful
[14:39] <eroomde> you can presumably launch some big stuff there
[14:39] <eroomde> the population density of the uk can make it a bit hard
[14:39] <nj_> ya, we could i have a large front yard
[14:39] <nj_> brb
[14:40] <Lunar_LanderU> lol got an e-mail inviting me to a speech here at uni
[14:40] <Lunar_LanderU> Oct. 29
[14:40] <Lunar_LanderU> but I am not sure if I can make it
[14:40] <Lunar_LanderU> it's 18000 years into the future, the subject line says "Oct 29 20013"
[14:40] <LeoBodnar> Yesterday I got an email sent in July 2011
[14:41] <fsphil> great scott!
[14:41] <eroomde> from the house of time lords
[14:41] <DL1SGP1> LeoBodnar: was it something nice at least?
[14:41] <LeoBodnar> No
[14:42] <DL1SGP1> meh
[14:42] Nick change: DL1SGP1 -> DL1SGP
[14:46] <SpeedEvil> http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/SN9F-1pcs-DS18b20-Waterproof-Temperature-Sensors-Thermistor-Temperature-Control-/400589853291
[14:46] <SpeedEvil> hmm
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[14:49] <Lunar_LanderU> going home, catch you later
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[14:49] <eroomde> oh no you won't
[14:50] <x-f> what did i do?
[14:50] <eroomde> who can say who can say
[14:51] <LeoBodnar> Who can, say who can say.
[14:53] <Willdude123> Waiting for boards is boring.
[14:53] <Willdude123> The teachers are on strike today. Not got much to do
[14:54] <eroomde> run around a frolic in the leaves
[14:54] <eroomde> anyone working on any fun PCBs or tronicery atm?
[14:54] <SpeedEvil> I am making a house DC bus.
[14:55] <SpeedEvil> 500W solar + 500Wish DC PSU -> 100Ah@24V
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[14:55] <SpeedEvil> I want to make a nice sine wave inverter.
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[14:57] <SpeedEvil> ^+shunt regulator
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[15:01] <nj_> SpeedEvil that is a cool idea
[15:01] <LeoBodnar> So you are Tesla follower, not Edison one?
[15:01] <adamgreig> no one likes edison
[15:01] <LeoBodnar> Ask elephants
[15:01] <SpeedEvil> The key to doing it without subsidy is to keep the solar panel to about a couple of times your base load.
[15:02] <SpeedEvil> And to be able to trigger appliances to use power when it's available.
[15:02] <nj_> SpeedEvil we don't get subsidy in these parts
[15:02] <mattbrejza> http://notice.usa.gov/ silly america, i thought you were supposed to have got back to work...
[15:02] <SpeedEvil> mattbrejza: refresh your cache
[15:03] <LeoBodnar> My browser has shut down
[15:03] <mattbrejza> http://www.grc.nasa.gov/WWW/CEAWeb/
[15:03] <mattbrejza> seems not :/
[15:04] <eroomde> mattbrejza, whatcha up t?
[15:04] <eroomde> up to*
[15:04] <mattbrejza> we (susf) want to do a hybrid
[15:04] <eroomde> people who need gordon and mcbride are usually up to something
[15:04] <eroomde> ah cool
[15:04] <mattbrejza> i have nothing better to do atm so i was going to arse around with some software
[15:04] <eroomde> everyone seems to want to do hybrids
[15:04] <eroomde> i don't understand why
[15:04] <eroomde> they suck
[15:05] <mattbrejza> well someones first idea was to make our own solid motors but this seems safer
[15:05] <mattbrejza> im probably not going to be involved in it too much though
[15:05] <eroomde> and also not Definitely Illegal
[15:06] <mattbrejza> someone reckoned it was legal unto a certian size, but he gave no reference
[15:06] <mattbrejza> either way the internet video on how to do it didnt fill with confidence
[15:06] <mattbrejza> seems a bit pointless when the black powder ones are so cheap anyway
[15:08] <SpeedEvil> Solids are very illegal in the UK
[15:08] <SpeedEvil> As they are fireworks, and you need to comply with the fireworks regulations.
[15:08] <mattbrejza> noted
[15:08] <SpeedEvil> - for manufacture anyway
[15:08] <SpeedEvil> The fireworks manufacture regulations are barking mad - unless you have a _lot_ of land.
[15:08] <eroomde> also hardly any of them use black powder
[15:08] <eroomde> its performance is crap
[15:08] <nj_> in canada we are allowed upto a certain size
[15:09] <SpeedEvil> Hybrids and biprops as I understand it are not regulated at all - at least until you fly them.
[15:09] <mattbrejza> oh for some reason i thought the estes ones were black powder
[15:09] <SpeedEvil> Other than stuff like noise regulations.
[15:09] <eroomde> the estes ones might be
[15:09] <eroomde> but they're tiny
[15:09] <mattbrejza> well we shall hopefully be able to test in the uni's facilities so dont have to worry about noise
[15:09] <eroomde> i'm talking about the sort of normal hobby rocketry size
[15:10] <mattbrejza> ah right
[15:10] <eroomde> noise regulations are non trivial at our scale
[15:10] <eroomde> might have some stories ot tell on that front, but not for a couple of years
[15:10] <mattbrejza> yea its more the incase something blows up thing
[15:11] <eroomde> yes
[15:11] <eroomde> that's less cool
[15:12] Action: SpeedEvil sighs.
[15:12] <eroomde> if you're getting something in as the oxidiser, i'd start working with your safety people now
[15:12] Action: SpeedEvil hasn't gotten his rocket up and running.
[15:12] <SpeedEvil> Stupid health issues.
[15:12] <eroomde> i know CUSF had a lot of painful farting about getting N2O in
[15:12] <mattbrejza> jonsowman can handle that lol
[15:13] <mattbrejza> i think once hte paperwork is done they should be reasonably happy
[15:13] <eroomde> well i don't think they managed it in the end
[15:13] <mattbrejza> oh right
[15:13] <eroomde> it only happened because i stepped in wearing my propulsion research centre hat
[15:14] <eroomde> rather than my ex-CUSF hat
[15:14] <eroomde> and emailed the department
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[15:14] <Willdude123> I need something HABish to do.
[15:14] <Willdude123> I have nothing
[15:15] <mattbrejza> we shall have to see then
[15:16] <mattbrejza> although you were asking about electronics projects what im doing is making a rocket logger to go on rockets that are qctually launched
[15:16] <mattbrejza> and altimeter and stuff
[15:16] <adamgreig> eroomde: ever used ipython's cluster/parallel stuff?
[15:16] <adamgreig> I think I'm gonna try it instead of multiprocessing.Pool. looks nicer. plus run on remote hosts = sexy
[15:17] <adamgreig> in theory it can run on a full on proper supercomputer too
[15:17] <adamgreig> supports all the normal interfaces
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[15:20] <eroomde> adamgreig, never tried
[15:20] <eroomde> but interested
[15:20] <eroomde> how does it work, roughly?
[15:21] <adamgreig> you run lots of worker programs and a manager program and it deals with all the gnarly bits
[15:21] <adamgreig> depending on your problem you can magically parallelise in a line of code or you can get a bit gritty
[15:21] <eroomde> so you have to write the manager program - presumably that just splits up the dataset?
[15:21] <adamgreig> don't think it's quite magic enough to for instance just work with huge numpy matricies
[15:21] <eroomde> and does the manager have to run locally?
[15:21] <adamgreig> oh no I mean you use the ipy manager
[15:21] <adamgreig> you just interact with it
[15:21] <adamgreig> and the manager needn't run locally
[15:22] <adamgreig> I mean I don't understand it either yet, check http://ipython.org/ipython-doc/stable/parallel/parallel_intro.html
[15:22] <adamgreig> has a diagram
[15:22] <eroomde> ok, but do you have to write something to, say, take some huge dataset and split it up?
[15:22] <eroomde> ok
[15:22] <adamgreig> I think yes you do
[15:22] <adamgreig> I don't think it lets you just deal with huge numpy arrays and magically do the right thing in the background
[15:24] <eroomde> ok
[15:24] <eroomde> what would be cool would be an aws plugin
[15:24] <adamgreig> which is a shame - that'd be great
[15:25] <eroomde> where you say 'you can spend up to $x dollars an hour'
[15:25] <adamgreig> http://ipython.org/ipython-doc/stable/parallel/parallel_process.html#ipython-on-ec2-with-starcluster
[15:25] <adamgreig> like that?
[15:25] <eroomde> and it spins up as many instances as you can afford
[15:25] <eroomde> yes like that
[15:25] <adamgreig> starcluster looked really neat when I looked into it before summer
[15:25] <adamgreig> was considering using it for my MEng
[15:25] <adamgreig> but in the end rolled my own (simpler?) solution
[15:26] <adamgreig> because my work was like "take about 100 bytes of configuration, return about a hundred bytes of result, but spend a very long time working that out" it parallelised very happily
[15:26] <adamgreig> so just had a simple queue system
[15:26] <adamgreig> suspect if I'd set up starcluster before or had one already going it would have been quicker to use
[15:26] <adamgreig> but setup times were not in my favour really
[15:26] <eroomde> ima look into it
[15:26] <eroomde> brb
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[15:49] <Hix> Steve_G0TDJ have you submitted your board for fab yet?
[15:49] <Steve_G0TDJ> Yes, the small VAYU one. On it's way back now. Due any day/
[15:50] <Hix> ignore me, i missed the groundplane update, was going to say hold-fire
[15:50] <Steve_G0TDJ> Ah :D
[15:51] <Steve_G0TDJ> Oh, you're looking at the VAYU-NTX board. I@m not getting those done until I test the small ones
[15:51] <Steve_G0TDJ> Thanks for thinking of me anyway Adrian.
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[15:54] <Hix> yo chrisstubbs
[15:54] <Hix> nps Steve_G0TDJ
[15:55] <chrisstubbs> Afternoon Hix, hows things?
[15:55] <Hix> no too bad, yourself?
[15:55] <chrisstubbs> Not too bad either considering how much AutoCAD I have been doing recently
[15:56] <chrisstubbs> it just randomly crashes and closes itself, what the hell is wrong with the people that made that terrible software
[15:56] <craag> Steve_G0TDJ: How are things looking for this wkend?
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[15:57] <Hix> eugh. I think the crashing thing is a generic CAD trait....
[15:57] <daveake> CAD stands for Ctrl Alt Del
[15:57] <Hix> My engine went pop the other night on the way home from work. JOY!
[15:58] <Hix> Curse At Display daveake
[15:58] <daveake> ah
[15:58] <Hix> or Crap All Day
[15:58] <Steve_G0TDJ> craag: Depends what site you look at
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[15:58] <Steve_G0TDJ> I'll decide on Sat afternoon yes or no
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[15:59] <chrisstubbs> Ah bad news hix :(
[15:59] <chrisstubbs> I gotta go for a bit, bbl
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[15:59] <craag> Steve_G0TDJ: Fingers crossed!
[15:59] <Steve_G0TDJ> craag: Yeah, for us both.
[16:00] <Steve_G0TDJ> I have to go for a while. Be back later with a bit of luck - 73 fer nw
[16:00] <craag> 73
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[16:12] <eroomde> i was amused the SW keeps reminding me with things like 'You haven't saved this file for 20 minutes!'
[16:12] <eroomde> ah windows, how I haven't missed you.
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[16:16] Action: Laurenceb stumbles back to his pc
[16:16] <Laurenceb> 7hour board meeting....
[16:17] <fsphil> did it result in anything? other than pain?
[16:17] <SpeedEvil> Ow.
[16:17] <Laurenceb> patents...
[16:17] <fsphil> urg
[16:17] <SpeedEvil> Does a board meeting use biscuit joints?
[16:17] <Laurenceb> no we talk about filing and auditing of IP
[16:18] <SpeedEvil> If I need to file stuff when IP - I find that drinking more water helps.
[16:18] <Laurenceb> lolz
[16:18] Action: SpeedEvil wishes patents were harder to get.
[16:19] <Laurenceb> they are "hard"
[16:19] <Laurenceb> as in a pita
[16:19] <SpeedEvil> You should never ever be able to get a patent for being the first to think about a problem that others will inevitably hit.
[16:20] <Laurenceb> yeah
[16:20] <LeoBodnar> All patent does is give you more chance in court
[16:20] <Laurenceb> im overall unconvinced by the whole patent idea
[16:20] <eroomde> or inform the chinese
[16:20] <LeoBodnar> You still have to pay to chase to perpetrator
[16:20] <SpeedEvil> Unless the solution you come up with is truly novel and that under (say) 10% of engineers with a weeks work would come up with it.
[16:20] <LeoBodnar> the
[16:20] <Laurenceb> we dont know what we are patenting...
[16:21] <Laurenceb> some kind of ... thing
[16:21] <Laurenceb> needs to be patented
[16:21] <Laurenceb> apparently
[16:21] <LeoBodnar> ask Dyson, he knows how to patent stuff. Like digital motor
[16:21] <Laurenceb> lol
[16:21] <fsphil> it only rotates a bit
[16:21] <LeoBodnar> It's all cozy modern stuff
[16:22] <eroomde> we're just keeping all our stuff a secret
[16:22] <Laurenceb> http://www.dyson.co.uk/vacuumcleaners/ddm.aspx
[16:22] <Laurenceb> psml
[16:22] <eroomde> every industry i've worked on, which is to say oil and gas before the space stuff, just keeps their stuff secret
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[16:22] <eroomde> would be a nightmare to enforce
[16:22] <Laurenceb> we dont have anything to keep secret
[16:22] <LeoBodnar> still using kW of energy and m3 of air to pick up a microgram of dust off the carpet
[16:22] <Laurenceb> or patent ofr that matter..
[16:23] <Laurenceb> electrostatic vacuum :P
[16:23] Action: Laurenceb applies for patent
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[16:23] <Laurenceb> uh oh
[16:23] <Laurenceb> http://www.google.co.uk/url?sa=t&rct=j&q=&esrc=s&source=web&cd=1&cad=rja&ved=0CDYQFjAA&url=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.atm.ox.ac.uk%2Fgroup%2Feodg%2Fmphys_reports%2F2008_Blaxter.pdf&ei=9Q5gUqGhNoeThQe5kIGQBA&usg=AFQjCNEisI-sLWqMHj8ObxWTuCQS2ArvUA&bvm=bv.54176721,d.ZG4
[16:23] <Laurenceb> i see prior art
[16:23] <SpeedEvil> Laurenceb: 'zero carbon emissions'
[16:23] <Laurenceb> haha
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[16:24] <Laurenceb> different carbon
[16:24] <LeoBodnar> car-bon
[16:24] <Laurenceb> on that note my like was a carbon negative device
[16:24] <Laurenceb> *link
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[16:26] <eroomde> i hadn't come across the dyson digital motor
[16:26] <eroomde> but, jesus
[16:26] <LeoBodnar> Apparently it spins faster than Formula 1 engine so kneel
[16:27] <SpeedEvil> http://www.dysonairblade.co.uk/hand-dryers/airblade-tap/airblade-tap.aspx?cc=UK04-GOOG0070-AIRBLADETAP0213&gclid=CI_ip9WknroCFRMftAod_yAARw
[16:27] <SpeedEvil> Dysons tap.
[16:27] <SpeedEvil> I decided not to look further about the price when I discovered that they can supply it on finance.
[16:28] <Laurenceb> lol
[16:28] <Laurenceb> isnt the motor just an RC style permanganate magnet brushless?
[16:29] <SpeedEvil> yes.
[16:29] <Laurenceb> arg autocorrect
[16:29] <Laurenceb> lol
[16:29] <SpeedEvil> http://www.ebay.com/itm/90mm-aewesome-fan/281013998769
[16:29] <LeoBodnar> "Moving to a separate hand drying area with wet hands means that water is often dripped on the floor. This can create problems in the washroom." Don't wash your hands. Problem solved.
[16:29] <Laurenceb> eww
[16:30] <LeoBodnar> It's only eww until marketing and PR got onto it
[16:30] <Laurenceb> Iron core rotor with no windings
[16:30] <Laurenceb> huh
[16:30] <Laurenceb> so its induction?
[16:31] <LeoBodnar> Iron core in induction motor? hmm
[16:31] <adamgreig> pretty sure there are windings somewhere
[16:31] <SpeedEvil> Variable reluctance
[16:31] <adamgreig> looks like magnet rotor and winding stator
[16:31] <LeoBodnar> Maybe reluctance one?
[16:31] <SpeedEvil> It works by attracting the iron rotor between an electromagnet
[16:31] <eroomde> the nice thing about working on rockets is that when silly people like james dyson get uppity about their 100,000rpm electric motor that is 1.6kW and the size of a drinks can, you can just point them at one of your turbopumps
[16:31] <Laurenceb> usually theres a soft iron core in induction motors
[16:31] <SpeedEvil> eroomde: :)
[16:32] <eroomde> which for about the smae size is 500,000rpm and about 500kW
[16:32] <LeoBodnar> Dyson is a disgrace of British engineering
[16:33] <SpeedEvil> LeoBodnar: I dunno. The guy that did the wind up radio.
[16:33] <Upu> why a disgrace ?
[16:33] <Laurenceb> cuz it was a massive fudge?
[16:34] <LeoBodnar> He sold his soul to marketing for 12 patents
[16:34] <Upu> and made quite a bit of dosh in the process I suspect
[16:35] <adamgreig> their hoovers and hand dryers are pretty alright
[16:35] <LeoBodnar> It's still just a vacuum cleaner, if there is a measure of highest energy/result ratio it must be in vacuum cleaning industry
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[16:36] <LeoBodnar> But amount of spin is enormous
[16:36] Action: SpeedEvil wishes magnetic bearings were easier.
[16:36] <eroomde> they are not too difficult
[16:36] <eroomde> magnetic bearings used to be my job
[16:36] <Laurenceb> passive magnetic looks doable?
[16:36] <SpeedEvil> Yeah.
[16:36] <eroomde> active
[16:37] <SpeedEvil> 'Cheap' '30000RPM' '1 ton' 'vacuum'
[16:37] <SpeedEvil> and it gets less easy
[16:37] <Laurenceb> inb4 steorn
[16:37] <eroomde> no idea who that is
[16:38] <Laurenceb> http://www.steorn.com/
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[16:39] <Laurenceb> lol climbdown
[16:39] <Laurenceb> http://www.steorn.com/orbo/papers/
[16:40] <eroomde> how do passive ones work?
[16:40] <SpeedEvil> eroomde: As I understand it there are two sorts of 'passive'
[16:40] <Laurenceb> permanent magnets
[16:40] <Laurenceb> they induce current in conductor
[16:40] <SpeedEvil> The sunon-like ones that use a mechanical point suspension
[16:40] <Laurenceb> giving repulsion
[16:40] <Laurenceb> but also drag :-/
[16:41] <SpeedEvil> And that - basically like indutrack sort of
[16:41] <Laurenceb> yeah
[16:41] <eroomde> so do they only work when it's spinning?
[16:41] <Laurenceb> yes
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[16:41] <eroomde> sounds crap
[16:41] <Laurenceb> lol
[16:41] <eroomde> active mag bearings are where it's at
[16:42] <eroomde> that site points out that active mag bearings use power, but in almost all cases I've seen them applied to the power they used was less than the frictional losses to conventional bearings
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[16:43] <SpeedEvil> especially if you can use permenant magnets to bias them
[16:43] <eroomde> we never did that
[16:44] <eroomde> it was all about dynamic response
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[16:44] <eroomde> we biased them with dc current to get them into the highest gradient bit of the current vs force curve
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[16:44] <eroomde> so that the smellest change in current gave the biggest change in force
[16:44] <SpeedEvil> yeah - I can imagine for a turbopump you're not really caring about passive power consumption
[16:45] <eroomde> that was because of the high inductance making it hard to charge the current
[16:45] <Laurenceb> http://pesn.com/2012/09/24/9602194_Steorn_Definitely_Not_Dead_--_Free_Energy_Technology_Coming/
[16:45] <Laurenceb> lolwat
[16:45] <eroomde> we also ran them at a nominal 48V but with 600V at the start of each switching pulse to really drive the inductance
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[16:46] <eroomde> i should say i don't think they've ever ben used on a rocket turbopump
[16:46] <eroomde> they tend to use super black magic fluid bearings and dynamic seals
[16:46] <eroomde> and that's a whole area i want to understand better
[16:46] <SpeedEvil> Ah
[16:47] <SpeedEvil> Well - I imagine whatever it was, it was ridiculously high powered stuff.
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[17:12] <malgar> NTX2B: IMPORTANT : Before placing your order for the module please come visit us on IRC so we can advise you on the ordering options for this module.
[17:12] <malgar> so.. advise me! :)
[17:13] ik1hgi (4f18cdb0@gateway/web/freenode/ip.79.24.205.176) joined #highaltitude.
[17:14] <malgar> who is behind hab supplies? :)
[17:14] <ibanezmatt13> Upu is
[17:15] darkstar-2001 (~matt@dsl-217-155-229-6.zen.co.uk) joined #highaltitude.
[17:16] <malgar> Upu: ? :) knock knock
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[17:20] <LeoBodnar> Try UpuWork
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[17:27] <malgar> UpuWork: : ? :) knock knock
[17:28] <LeoBodnar> ping Upu
[17:28] <LeoBodnar> Anthony's probably on his way home
[17:29] <LeoBodnar> try in half an hour malgar
[17:29] <malgar> :D I can't see his car on spacenear.us/tracker
[17:29] <malgar> :P
[17:29] <LeoBodnar> Faulty tracker: :D
[17:29] <malgar> payload lost?
[17:29] <LeoBodnar> No listeners
[17:30] <malgar> ok
[17:30] <malgar> lol.. hab humor :P
[17:30] <craag> it just goes up and up :)
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[17:48] <keydash> hey men
[17:48] <keydash> can i test the temp sensors putting the arduino and ntx2 on the fridge inside a shoes box?
[17:49] <keydash> or maybe thats crazy
[17:49] <craag> sure
[17:49] <craag> the freezer is often used for cold-temp testing
[17:51] <keydash> right now the temp is descending quickly
[17:51] <keydash> and the voltage also
[17:51] <keydash> now is around 4.6V
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[17:52] <keydash> 4.4V
[17:52] <keydash> what's the minimun? 3..3V?
[17:53] <craag> This is voltage from the batteries?
[17:53] <nj_> my friend works at a hospital and uses the -70C freezers for testing
[17:54] <keydash> yeah
[17:54] <keydash> the battery is a 9v battery
[17:54] <craag> and is only putting out 4.4v?
[17:54] <craag> that's a dead battery
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[17:54] <keydash> it's a chinese battery xD
[17:55] <keydash> maybe i programmed bad the getvoltage function
[17:55] <keydash> new it gaves 4.9V
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[17:55] <craag> is it voltage/2 then?
[17:55] <SpeedEvil> nj_: I discovered my domestic freezer will hit under -50c if I hit the 'boost' button and leave it a couple of days.
[17:56] <craag> keydash: I would measure the voltage across the battery now with a multimeter
[17:56] <keydash> i dopn't have one :(
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[17:56] <craag> ah
[17:57] <craag> a $10 one would be a worthwhile investment
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[17:58] <malgar> isn't slowed arduino by low temp?
[17:58] <keydash> well if the voltage falls down, what would happen?
[17:58] <craag> keydash: Arduino may crash running at less than it's rated voltage.
[17:58] <craag> Or just spew garbage
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[17:58] <keydash> but can I hurt the system?
[17:58] <craag> malgar: Not by much if you use an external crystal
[17:58] <craag> keydash: No
[17:59] <craag> It'll just stop working
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[17:59] <keydash> ahhh you let me breath quietly now
[17:59] <keydash> xD
[17:59] <malgar> craag: I don't know anything about external crystals for arduino
[17:59] <malgar> :(
[17:59] <keydash> over 3Cº now
[18:00] <craag> malgar: Most arduinos come with external crystals (external to the black chip)
[18:00] <malgar> craag: ok
[18:00] <craag> They look like tiny metal boxes near the black chip.
[18:00] <malgar> arduino uno rev.3?
[18:01] <craag> yep
[18:01] <keydash> yep
[18:01] <malgar> other questions.. does ntx2b work without antenna for indoor/desk/freezer testing during development?
[18:01] <craag> yes
[18:01] <keydash> seeems that I didn't made the under 0ºC code for the tempo sensors
[18:01] <keydash> yeah
[18:02] <keydash> i think
[18:02] <keydash> i'm using right now the ntx2
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[18:02] <craag> ntx2b is the same, signal will just drift around less on the waterfall
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[18:03] <keydash> I had to adjust whte shift and the frequency while the temp was descending
[18:03] <keydash> it doesn't give me negative values for the temp
[18:03] <malgar> craag: perfect.. what's the range without antenna? If I have the system in the freezer and the receiving antenna of the sdr dongle in another room.. should it works? :)
[18:04] <keydash> yeah
[18:04] <malgar> ok
[18:04] <craag> malgar: No idea, depends on walls/freezer construction
[18:04] <keydash> i'm doing that right now
[18:04] <craag> :)
[18:04] <malgar> perfect
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[18:05] <keydash> I don't know why it doesn't read negative values for temp
[18:05] <keydash> I added the resistor on the ground and analog pin
[18:05] <craag> what temp sensor?
[18:05] <keydash> klm35
[18:05] <keydash> *lm35
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[18:06] <craag> Right, what value does it give you for minux temperatures?
[18:06] <craag> does it give 240 or something
[18:06] <keydash> dunno
[18:06] <keydash> 10mV for ºC I think
[18:07] <keydash> but it stuck on 0 for a while right now
[18:07] <craag> Yes, so you need to look at the function you're using to convert the analog voltage into a temperature value
[18:07] <keydash> temp += (5.0 * analogRead(sensor) * 100.0)/1024.0;
[18:07] <keydash> in theory
[18:07] <craag> That's never going to produce anything negative
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[18:08] <craag> what in there would ever go negative?
[18:08] <keydash> I knew it
[18:08] <keydash> I supposed the analogread
[18:08] <keydash> but now im reading the arduini
[18:08] <keydash> doesn't have negative voltage
[18:08] <craag> nah, that gives a 0-1024 iirc
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[18:08] <keydash> but i added a resistor because of that
[18:09] <craag> how does a resistor help?
[18:09] <keydash> let me find the article where i read that
[18:11] <keydash> I knew that connceting it raw won't give negative values
[18:12] <keydash> that's why I set the resistor
[18:12] <craag> Ah I see now
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[18:13] <keydash> it says
[18:13] <keydash> conenct the resistor between the analog and the gnd
[18:13] <keydash> to read negative values
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[18:13] <keydash> oh my damn
[18:13] <keydash> i connected it to 3.3v isntead of 5
[18:14] <craag> erm datasheet says you need a negative supply for negative temp
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[18:15] <craag> As output is 0V + 10mV/degree
[18:15] <DL1SGP1> yes
[18:15] <craag> Then the arduino won't read negative voltages
[18:15] <keydash> yeah
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[18:17] <keydash> so
[18:17] <keydash> it won't read never negative temperature
[18:17] <craag> No :/
[18:17] <craag> Not in your circuit
[18:17] <keydash> noooooo
[18:18] <craag> You could do something with running it off 4.5V ground, so it thinks 0V is -4.5V, but that is quite complex to set up.
[18:19] <craag> Also might not work if your 9V battery voltage drops
[18:20] <craag> An easier sensor would be TMP36, which I have used.
[18:22] <DL1SGP1> yeah tmp36 is quite nice displaying negative temp through positive voltages. less fuzz
[18:23] <keydash> then i'll buy that
[18:23] <keydash> thanks
[18:24] <keydash> TMP36GT9Z ?
[18:24] <craag> Yep :)
[18:27] <craag> keydash: this was my first payload using 2xTMP36 http://www.philcrump.co.uk/CRAAG1
[18:28] <keydash> i'm going to dinner
[18:28] <keydash> i'll see that in a bit and
[18:28] <keydash> highly possibly
[18:28] <keydash> ask you different things
[18:28] <keydash> jaja
[18:28] <keydash> brb
[18:28] <craag> np, im off to the pub :)
[18:29] <craag> cya
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[18:43] <henryplumb> Hi all :)
[18:44] <ibanezmatt13_> hey there
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[18:44] <henryplumb> Anyone recommend a good magmount antenna for 433/434MHz?
[18:45] <ibanezmatt13_> yes
[18:45] <ibanezmatt13_> I have a Diamond MR-77
[18:45] <ibanezmatt13_> not super cheap but very good
[18:46] <ibanezmatt13_> there are others which do the trick just as good I believe but I can't really comment.
[18:46] <ibanezmatt13_> £30
[18:46] <ibanezmatt13_> http://www.radioworld.co.uk/catalog/mr-77_2m_70cm_70w_50cm_long_black_metal_whip_magmount_4m_cable_with_pl-259_plug-p-8894.html
[18:46] <henryplumb> Cheers :)
[18:46] <ibanezmatt13_> np
[18:47] <ibanezmatt13_> to put it into context, we (who never ever receieve any HAB at all normally), tracked the HAB the whole flight, while it was transmitting :P
[18:47] <keydash> with that antenna you can track 30km high balloons?
[18:47] <ibanezmatt13_> ^ I did
[18:48] <ibanezmatt13_> Of course, if you're stationary, a colinear is probably the best way to go. But that option isn't that practical while heading down the motorway at 70mph with the laptop on your knee :)
[18:48] <keydash> good one
[18:48] <ibanezmatt13_> knees* assuming you have two legs
[18:48] <keydash> then i'll buy that for my flight
[18:49] <keydash> yeah, luckly i have two
[18:49] <keydash> at the moment
[18:49] <ibanezmatt13_> ask around first but I can't fault it after experience
[18:49] <keydash> i'll do thanks
[18:49] <keydash> know I gotta fix the negative temp values
[18:50] <keydash> surely i'll get the tmp36 sensor
[18:51] <ibanezmatt13_> can't really go wrong with tmp36
[18:51] <ibanezmatt13_> Arduino?
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[18:53] <keydash> yep
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[18:55] <qyx_> hai
[18:55] <qyx_> one radio-related question here
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[18:55] <qyx_> i did my own collinear for 434MHz according to http://www.rason.org/Projects/collant/collant.htm
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[18:57] <qyx_> can someone explain that part about toroid mounted on the coax?
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[18:58] <jedas> i'm not a rf guru but as far as i know they are used to match capacitance of antenna
[18:59] <RobertPol> It's a chocke filter, protecting cable shield radiation
[18:59] <jedas> here is calculator for those things http://www.see.ed.ac.uk/~jwp/radio/software/loading.html
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[19:00] <jedas> or maybe that :)
[19:00] <qyx_> i understand the matching part
[19:00] <qyx_> and also filtering using toroids
[19:00] <qyx_> but why..?
[19:02] <qyx_> so it protects reflected energy from going back?
[19:02] <qyx_> *prevents
[19:05] <malgar> Upu: ping
[19:05] <malgar> UpuWork: ping
[19:05] <Upu> hi malgar
[19:06] <malgar> hi Upu ! I want to order an NTX2B.. I read that I have to ask about it here
[19:06] <RobertPol> I don't thing so. Doesn't prevent, as has no impact on transmission line, but on external shield only.
[19:06] <Upu> you do indeed
[19:06] <Upu> quick private message
[19:07] <RobertPol> Think ;)
[19:07] <eroomde> qyx_, it looks like a higher value resistor to higher frequencies
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[19:07] <RobertPol> Yes, but put onto external surface of cable shield, not in series with cable
[19:08] <qyx_> eroomde: yep, i just don't understand why there should be any noise going back which it should filter out
[19:09] <eroomde> oh, in that case they're just being used as inductors
[19:09] <qyx_> /o\
[19:09] <eroomde> so, the antenna has to look like a 50-ohm resistor to your rf power amplifier
[19:09] <eroomde> that's what we mean by 50-ohm impedence
[19:11] <mclane> upu: are the NTX2b on stock in the mean time?
[19:11] <eroomde> and impedance is a two-dimensional thing, made up of two parts, resistance, and reactance
[19:11] <Upu> how do you mean mclane ?
[19:11] <qyx_> eroomde: because in one part he writes about noise (or whatever it is) filtering
[19:11] <Upu> I'm still waiting on Radiometrix to delivery them atm
[19:11] <Upu> but really should be within a week
[19:11] <qyx_> eroomde: and later on he says you have to move toroid to get lowest SWR, eg. to get 50ohm impedance match
[19:12] <mclane> I have ordered 2 of them :-)
[19:12] <eroomde> qyx_, where in that document?
[19:12] <qyx_> so it confused me
[19:12] <qyx_> eroomde: "Because a collinear antenna is hot with RF along the shield of the coax, it is necessary to prevent the RF from coming back through the coax"
[19:12] <Upu> yeah as soon as they come in
[19:12] <Upu> I spoken to RMX on Monday
[19:12] <Upu> and mailed them again on Wednesday
[19:12] <eroomde> oh righty, yes that is back to square 1
[19:12] <eroomde> right
[19:12] <eroomde> sorry i have read the aticle now
[19:12] <qyx_> and then If you prefer, apply RF to the antenna at this point and slide the toroids up and down until minimum SWR is found
[19:13] <Upu> was promised them this week but so far nothing
[19:13] <eroomde> yeah, so the toroid should stop rf power going through it down the coax shield
[19:13] <mclane> ah ok
[19:13] <eroomde> it's not being injected up the shield in the first place, note
[19:13] <eroomde> but in the core
[19:15] <qyx_> ok, i am back at the beginning, i will simply put it there and try to find someone with swr meter :)
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[19:15] <qyx_> although i assume it is not so important if only receiving
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[19:17] <jedas> for 2.4 ghz antennas, i've found that it's quite easy way to tune antenna, is to measure TX power. when it's tuned for optimal size, it consumes least energy
[19:17] <jedas> not sure if that would work well on 433mhz, but maybe :)
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[19:54] <Willdude123> Upu you know you said you'd check if you had a spare Taoglas? Have you?
[19:54] <Willdude123> :)
[19:55] <Upu> nope
[19:55] <Willdude123> OK well thanks for checking.
[19:55] <Upu> I've mailed myself
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[19:55] <Upu> will check tomorrow
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[19:57] Nick change: cuddykid_ -> cuddykid
[19:57] <Willdude123> Thanks
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[20:06] <henryplumb> What do you lot think about the AOR AOR8000?
[20:08] <eroomde> people have used them successfully in the past
[20:08] <eroomde> they're not quite as sensitive as a normal amatuer radio rig
[20:09] <henryplumb> AOR8000 or MVY 7100
[20:09] <henryplumb> *MVT
[20:10] <henryplumb> ?
[20:13] <malgar> Upu: ping
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[20:15] <mikestir> henryplumb: I have aor8200mk3. very pleased with that
[20:15] <Upu> hi malgar - pm
[20:15] <henryplumb> Cheers mikestir
[20:16] <mikestir> don't have a 70cm-only rig to compare against on sensitivity, but it is certainly very stable
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[20:16] <mikestir> it has a tcxo though, and I'm not sure the 8000 does
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[20:19] <ve6ts> i have the ft817nd for tracking my 70cm payloads
[20:19] <ve6ts> it has worked well on the 3 flights i have used it for
[20:20] <fsphil> great little radio
[20:20] <ve6ts> yes
[20:20] <ve6ts> i'm still working on better mobile tracking antennas thouggh
[20:22] <Reb-SM3ULC> ve6ts: big dome on the roof? ;)
[20:22] <ve6ts> hehe
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[20:41] <Geoff-G8DHE> I may have over done the size of my mobile aerial http://www.g8dhe.net/pictures\2013\06\20130601\DSCF5490.JPG
[20:43] <eroomde> that's amazing
[20:43] <eroomde> a dish?
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[20:46] Action: Laurenceb_ wonders how to open without crashing firefox
[20:46] <Laurenceb_> stupid jpeg "support"
[20:48] <Laurenceb_> i see lots of marks http://www.kickstarter.com/projects/technicalillusions/castar-the-most-versatile-ar-and-vr-system
[20:50] <ve6ts> hehe cool antenna
[20:50] <Laurenceb_> just realised all the photos are a mockup
[20:50] <Laurenceb_> where is the antenni from?
[20:50] <Laurenceb_> off the sehlf?
[20:54] <Geoff-G8DHE> Yey I found this old ex-CAA radar setup didn't seem to be doing much up on the top of Portland Bill, so just bolted it on top ;-)
[20:54] <ve6ts> that antenna must drag alot at hyway speed
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[20:55] <Geoff-G8DHE> Don't worry about that my Wife drives - and she took the photo ;-)
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[21:00] <Laurenceb_> so you are saying she can handle your large ball?
[21:01] <eroomde> Geoff-G8DHE, you totally had me
[21:01] <eroomde> i've just been on google maps and street view to confirms the large geodesic dome
[21:02] <Laurenceb_> hahaha
[21:02] <DL1SGP> hehe
[21:02] <eroomde> honestly thought you'd got some car roof accessory
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[21:03] <Geoff-G8DHE> I was actually up the very top doing a Pano, whilst she took the photo, she let me find it that night when I was downloading them all! The scale actually looks sort of possible!
[21:03] <Geoff-G8DHE> The aerial I actually use is at the cack of the van the little 2m/70cms whip it works quite well!
[21:03] <eroomde> the shadows work and everything
[21:04] <eroomde> did the people there think you were getting data to plan a breakout?
[21:05] <Geoff-G8DHE> We did wonder, it is so close to the prison! Not sure I actually published the Pano, the clouds were moving rather fast and it was a pig to get an even exposure.
[21:08] <Geoff-G8DHE> Nope decided I didn't like it much this was the preview and its not the best http://www.g8dhe.net/pictures\2013\06\20130601\Portland_pano\Portland_equi.preview.jpg
[21:09] <Willdude123> Hi peopel
[21:09] <Willdude123> *people
[21:09] Lunar_Lander (~kevin@p5488A422.dip0.t-ipconnect.de) joined #highaltitude.
[21:09] <DL7AD> Willdude123: rofl.... :D
[21:10] <Lunar_Lander> hello
[21:10] <DL7AD> good evening
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[21:10] <DL7AD> Willdude123: peopel is really similar to a german word :D
[21:10] <Willdude123> Wow. You must have a really sensitive sense of humour if that makes you roll on the floor
[21:10] <DL7AD> Willdude123: search for popel
[21:11] <Lunar_Lander> XD!!!
[21:11] <Willdude123> Uhuh
[21:11] <DL7AD> :D
[21:12] <DL1SGP> Moin Sven
[21:12] <DL7AD> DL1SGP: moin felix :)
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[21:15] <DL7AD> have everything ready for the balloon flight :) https://www.dropbox.com/s/vefbttwa7m6ng73/IMG_20131017_225150.jpg
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[21:16] <eroomde> nice
[21:16] <eroomde> extreme tidyness
[21:16] <DL7AD> yep thats just my portable equipment...
[21:17] <DL7AD> helium is stored in my garage due to explosiveness for sure :P
[21:18] <DL1SGP> heh
[21:18] <Geoff-G8DHE> Better not show you my bench then! Its the other extreme!
[21:19] <eroomde> i don't think helium explodes :p
[21:19] <DL7AD> Geoff-G8DHE: everything was pushed to one edge when i took the photo :P
[21:19] <DL1SGP> DL7AD: just did not want to tell that the helium-truck would not fit into his workspace
[21:19] <eroomde> :)
[21:19] <DL7AD> rofl
[21:20] <SpeedEvil> eroomde: it does if you get it hot enough
[21:21] <eroomde> fission hot?
[21:21] <DL7AD> my chemistery teacher told us that he had a huge bottle which fell down and went through his door like a rocket.
[21:22] <eroomde> our maintenance man used to say it would go off 'like a shagging torpedo'
[21:22] <eroomde> we called a rocket The Shagging Torpedo in his honour
[21:22] <SpeedEvil> :-)
[21:23] <SpeedEvil> did you paint it pink?
[21:23] <eroomde> no
[21:23] <eroomde> that's an upu thing
[21:24] <DL7AD> damn.... forgot the tube..... -.-
[21:25] <eroomde> right, home
[21:25] <eroomde> ttfn
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[21:28] <DL1SGP> k folks I need sleep. be safe :D
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[21:38] <Lunar_Lander> night DL1SGP
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[21:38] <DL1SGP> Good Night Lunar_Lander
[21:38] <Lunar_Lander> :)
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[21:47] <tweetBot> @AMSAT_UK: Amateur radio operators set to help in tracking comet http://t.co/gFlEkIQy3L #amsat #hamr #ukhas #hab #ison
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[21:54] <Willdude123> craag just wondering, what do you study at southampton uni>
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[21:58] <SpeedEvil> Meh.
[21:58] <SpeedEvil> The moon is not visible here at the moment.
[21:58] <SpeedEvil> And I got out of bed specially
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[22:00] <fsphil> is the eclipse tonight?
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[22:00] <fsphil> well, sorta eclipse
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[22:39] <craag> WillTablet: I study Electronic Engineering
[22:39] <WillTablet> Oh cool. My mum got a prospectus from a local college
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[22:41] <craag> ECS is awesome (electronics and computer science), but all the engineering is pretty good.
[22:41] <craag> If that's what you want to go into
[22:41] <heathkid> Moon is 97% full
[22:42] <craag> I don't know much about the other bits of campus :P
[22:42] <craag> We need more moonspace!
[22:43] <heathkid> can't even defragment it at this point...
[22:43] <heathkid> but I guess that means there is 3% free...
[22:43] <heathkid> I won't be greedy... I'll only take 1%
[22:43] <heathkid> the rest is up for grabs!
[22:45] <WillTablet> craag, there's free WiFi according to the prospectus. I'm in
[22:45] <craag> Haha, of course, eduroam
[22:46] <craag> Might even be in halls by the time you get here
[22:46] <craag> Most unis have eduroam across campus now tbh.
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[22:47] <craag> We're also looking at setting up a rooftop access point just for 100mb+ internet links from private houses.
[22:47] <heathkid> my LG Lithium 18650 batteries finaly arrived... I'm charging now to do a test of our tracker using a single one. I got right at 5 hours from a single 14500 800mah so I'm hoping these (2800mah) will do even better.
[22:49] <heathkid> well... I also got holders for them this time! :)
[22:49] <heathkid> easier to test that way
[22:50] <WillTablet> Wow cool
[22:50] <WillTablet> craag surely WiFi can't go that far.
[22:50] <WillTablet> Is there Ethernet in halls?
[22:50] <WillTablet> Could a student set up his own WiFi networl
[22:51] <craag> WillTablet: It can with yagis and line-of-sight (tall buildings on campus)
[22:51] <craag> Yes there is 100mb ethernet (100mb internet) to each rooms in halls
[22:51] <WillTablet> Oh so you aim it at people's houses?
[22:52] <WillTablet> Is there a fair use policy?
[22:52] <craag> They do some blocking of torrenting
[22:52] <craag> and you are responsible for your own internet connection
[22:52] <craag> so you can set up a wifi access point
[22:52] Action: WillTablet gasps
[22:52] <WillTablet> No torrents.
[22:53] <WillTablet> I'm not going :-)
[22:53] <craag> but if someone uses it for something illegal, and gets caught, you're the one getting stuck for it.
[22:53] <craag> I say *some*
[22:53] <craag> It's easy to get around
[22:53] <WillTablet> Do they monitor what you look at?
[22:53] <WillTablet> And most importantly, do they block porn?
[22:55] <craag> THey won't do any monitoring
[22:55] <craag> They don't block anything
[22:55] <WillTablet> OK I need backup. I'm into an argument about python
[22:55] <craag> But, if you do something illegal, they'll track it straight back to you.
[22:55] <craag> brb
[22:55] <WillTablet> My friend says it's useless.
[22:56] <WillTablet> Because you can't declare null variables
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[23:29] <Laurenceb_> so today i finally debunked steorn orbo
[23:29] <adamgreig> uhm
[23:29] <adamgreig> it's not hard to debunk
[23:29] <adamgreig> "second law of thermodynamics"
[23:30] <Laurenceb_> http://www.steorn.com/orbo/papers/jm-rice-report-28april-2008.pdf
[23:30] <Laurenceb_> page 40
[23:31] <Laurenceb_> can you see it yet?
[23:31] <adamgreig> PDF page 40, with the KE test 25-26?
[23:32] <Laurenceb_> yeah
[23:32] <Laurenceb_> they forgot energy from residual magnetization
[23:32] <Laurenceb_> thats where the energy "gain" is from
[23:32] <adamgreig> also second law of thermodynamics
[23:32] <SpeedEvil> Sigh.
[23:33] <adamgreig> "consultant engineer"
[23:33] <adamgreig> "B.E., M.B.A."
[23:33] <SpeedEvil> How much magnetic energy does a typical rare earth magnet store per cm^3 I wonder
[23:34] <Laurenceb_> if they repeat the test the "energy" wont appear again
[23:34] <SpeedEvil> I'd guess several orders less than a battery
[23:34] <Laurenceb_> it was put in as they assembled the device
[23:34] <SpeedEvil> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Magnetic_refrigeration
[23:40] <Laurenceb_> interesting stuff
[23:40] <Laurenceb_> if steorn based all their claims of this rotation test....
[23:41] <Laurenceb_> i see they no longer claim net energy gain
[23:41] <Laurenceb_> on their site
[23:41] <SpeedEvil> So they have a pretty bit of clockwork?
[23:42] <Laurenceb_> yup
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[23:57] <Laurenceb_> they built a semi chaotic magnetic energy storage device
[23:58] <Laurenceb_> energy went in as they were fiddling with it
[23:58] <Laurenceb_> then came out later
[23:58] <WillTablet> Afk, I need to masticate.
[23:58] <Laurenceb_> ewww
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[23:59] <WillTablet> Why? I needed to chew something :-)
[00:00] --- Fri Oct 18 2013