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[00:06] <Brunzmeflugen> So without a license I wouldn't be able to purchase a tranciever?
[00:07] <KT5TK> At least not from an official store
[00:08] <KT5TK> in the US
[00:08] <KT5TK> Why don't you simply try to pass the exam? It's not that hard and costs less than $20
[00:12] <Brunzmeflugen> Iv'e just had trouble finding classes in my area, and I've been thinking a test HAB might be good as a school project, but I'm not totally committed yet
[00:14] <LeoBodnar> Brunzmeflugen: good receiver is cheaper than good transceiver usually.
[00:14] <LeoBodnar> And if you transmit with a low power ISM device you don't need HAM license either
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[00:19] <LeoBodnar> gn
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[00:41] <KT5TK> Brunzmeflugen: A hab is certainly a good school project. If you need all this fast, you may team up with a ham who is already licensed. Where in the US are you.
[00:41] <Brunzmeflugen> Southern California
[00:42] <Brunzmeflugen> More specifically San Diego
[00:51] <KT5TK> I guess you should contact arko (also in this IRC). http://www.arkorobotics.com He is in LA
[01:04] <Brunzmeflugen> Oh thanks, I will look into it
[01:05] <KT5TK> You can learn for the ham license online btw.
[01:05] <KT5TK> No need for a class
[01:07] <KT5TK> if you have questions feel free to ask here on the chat. There are quite a few hams here.
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[02:34] <wb8elk_> KT5TK I just sent you a private message
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[05:50] <eroomde> morn
[05:50] <Upu> morning
[05:51] <Maxell> hai
[05:53] <eroomde> surely it's antisocial o'clock for you Maxell
[05:53] <eroomde> unless you're working nights
[05:54] <x-f> morning
[05:55] <eroomde> and you
[05:59] <x-f> it's 9am
[06:03] <eroomde> i waas going the wrong way
[06:04] <eroomde> because it was 6.30am here so going the right way is difficult
[06:06] <x-f> wakey-wakey!
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[06:24] <DL7AD> good morning
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[06:54] <ibanezmatt13> morning
[06:55] <eroomde> morning
[06:58] <adamgreig> morning
[06:58] <eroomde> we are all agreed
[06:58] <eroomde> then it is settled
[06:58] <adamgreig> quorum is reached
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[07:03] <ibanezmatt13> I tried to get a quote for car insurance for my 17th birthday lastnight...
[07:04] <ibanezmatt13> I won't be driving til I'm 21, guarenteed
[07:04] <ibanezmatt13> For a 1 litre fiat panda on my mother's insurance, £3000
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[07:07] <DL7AD> morning
[07:08] <eroomde> wow
[07:08] <eroomde> nice ibanezmatt13
[07:08] <eroomde> 3rd party i guess
[07:08] <ibanezmatt13> yea
[07:08] <eroomde> maybe be a named driver on her policy
[07:08] <eroomde> i was 3rd party for the first year or two
[07:08] <ibanezmatt13> we looked at that too
[07:08] <eroomde> still cost about £750
[07:08] <ibanezmatt13> it was about £2000
[07:08] <eroomde> i also did pass-plus which helped
[07:08] <ibanezmatt13> yeah, I'm going to do that
[07:09] <eroomde> maybe even advanced driving at that kinda price
[07:09] <eroomde> is it your bday then?
[07:09] <ibanezmatt13> well, next July
[07:09] <ibanezmatt13> :)
[07:10] <eroomde> nice
[07:10] <ibanezmatt13> I heard something about having your car fitted with a box which rewards you for driving well. Apparently that helps with insurance.
[07:10] <eroomde> were you assuming you had a liensewhen applying for quotes?
[07:10] <ibanezmatt13> yes
[07:10] <ibanezmatt13> and that I'd been driving over a month :P
[07:10] <eroomde> yeah, i don't like the idea of those boxes though
[07:10] <ibanezmatt13> nor do I, but if it saves money then
[07:10] <adamgreig> haha
[07:11] <adamgreig> those boxes
[07:11] <adamgreig> I won't say anything in public. but I wouldn't buy one. :X
[07:11] <adamgreig> you should be able to find a way to be a named driver on your mother's insurance on her car for a lot less
[07:11] <adamgreig> I still do that when I need a car and it's not very expensive
[07:11] <adamgreig> but typically can only be done for like up to 6 months of the year or something
[07:11] <ibanezmatt13> you'd think so, but bear in mind I'll only have just passed my test :P
[07:12] Action: eroomde -> work
[07:12] <adamgreig> yea same
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[07:12] <ibanezmatt13> right, off to college to do some maths and stuff, yay!
[07:13] <ibanezmatt13> see you :
[07:13] <adamgreig> enjoy
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[07:19] Nick change: MichaelC|Sleep -> MichaelC|Food
[07:19] Nick change: MichaelC|Food -> MichaelC|Away
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[07:23] <Maxell> bertrik: RevSpace is fully configured already :-D
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[07:24] <Maxell> Except we have some QRM on 2 of the 3 freqencies.
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[07:26] <Maxell> Oh, it's gone now.
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[07:26] <Maxell> I already tried adding a third VFO bertrik, but it ended up not working that great after all
[07:26] <Maxell> And will be hard to keep track of if the payload start drifting.
[07:27] <Maxell> We might setup a second virtual cable so we can do a third VFO.
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[08:17] Nick change: DL7AD_Work -> DL7AD
[08:17] <M6GTG_nerdsville> When I open dl-fldigi-HAB it always opens using the full width of the screen, is this normal?
[08:17] <daveake> yes
[08:18] <daveake> I don't know if there's a way of overriding that
[08:19] <M6GTG_nerdsville> thx dave, just when vnc'ing into my box at home the PC at work has a much smaller screen.. ;-)
[08:19] <adamgreig> there is a command line argument
[08:19] <adamgreig> like --geometry or --width or something
[08:19] <adamgreig> but I can't remember what it is
[08:20] <M6GTG_nerdsville> I know adam.. need to RTM ;-)
[08:20] <fsphil> I've submitted a patch to allow normal resizing
[08:20] <fsphil> well /submitted/applied to my own git branch/
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[08:21] <adamgreig> maybe you should pull req that ;)
[08:22] <fsphil> yep. never done that before, must give it a go
[08:22] <adamgreig> it's super easy and fun
[08:23] <fsphil> like all things in git? sweet :)
[08:23] <adamgreig> like all things on github* :P
[08:23] <M6GTG_nerdsville> ;-) it is only a minor issue, I have had corrupted register entries in the past that have put program windows off the screen, wondered if it was something like that - GIT never something so well named ;-)
[08:23] <adamgreig> M6GTG_nerdsville: named after the creator!
[08:24] <adamgreig> literally having pushed a branch to your repo, you just click "create pull req" on your rpo's page and you are done
[08:24] <fsphil> indeed
[08:25] <M6GTG_nerdsville> never really got to grips with source/version control
[08:26] <M6GTG_nerdsville> well apart from a big pile of floppy disks on the desk going back in chronological order.. the bad/good old days
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[08:36] Action: daveake remembers the days of punch cards and no backups or versions or anything
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[08:36] <daveake> Security was a rubber band :p
[08:38] <M6GTG_nerdsville> you don't look old enough dave ;-)
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[08:39] <daveake> gee thanks :)
[08:40] <daveake> Our Uni mainframe was a bit behind the times
[08:41] <Maxell> "offsite backup" --> you kept the old version at home, *somehwere*
[08:46] <M6GTG_nerdsville> Funny found some offsite backups when clearing the loft the other week, a box of 5.25" floppies and a carrier bag full of old tape drives.. no idea how they had got up there
[08:47] <GMT> I can remember working with 8" floppies
[08:47] <GMT> and paper tape
[08:48] <fsphil> my first computer stored data on audio tapes
[08:48] <Penfold> Algol 60, coding forms, sent off for SOMEONE ELSE to punch onto cards.
[08:48] <GMT> same, same, but with COBOL
[08:48] <Penfold> :D
[08:49] <gonzo_> has steve posted an update on his two flights??
[08:49] <GMT> last I saw was 9.30/10.30
[08:50] <LeoBodnar> Disk packs GMT
[08:51] <LeoBodnar> Penfold: usually girls
[08:52] <LeoBodnar> Nagging them to do it same day
[08:52] <Penfold> LeoBodnar: heh. Indeed. Thius was a deal between school and local uni (actually brokered through my dad before I started, apparently)
[08:53] <Penfold> (he being senior lecturer in CS there)
[08:53] <M6GTG_nerdsville> first proper job was using an ancient HP development system, with 8" floppy drives a tape drive (they were the size of VHS tapes) and a 40MB hard drive the size of a small fridge
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[08:55] Nick change: KipK_away -> KipK
[08:58] <GMT> Ooooh 40MB - a power-user!
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[08:59] <eroomde> iain is drinking coffee
[08:59] <eroomde> result
[09:00] <GMT> Leo: the disk packs that I used were top-loaded into a drive-unit about the size of a spin-dryer - this was 1978
[09:00] <eroomde> more grandad chat
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[09:00] <GMT> shut-it you young whipper-snapper!
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[09:06] <gonzo_> I started on a dev system woth twin 8" drives. But it was very obsolete by then
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[09:07] <gonzo_> anyone else still have their zx81?
[09:07] <gonzo_> steve. Launches still going ahead?
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[09:08] <Maxell> gonzo_: HAB timezone
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[09:08] <Maxell> & terug
[09:08] <Maxell> wrong chan
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[09:09] <GMT> after my ZX81 died I made it into a solder-station!
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[09:12] <LeoBodnar> eroomde: Not sure what's the deal is. I am setting output to 3V 0.3A and the PSU is sinking 0.51A bang on until battery hits 3.0V and goes into CV mode
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[09:12] <LeoBodnar> When I set 0A it sinks 250mA
[09:12] <LeoBodnar> Looks like it adds predetermined current. Not sure where it is setup.
[09:13] <eroomde> yeah, i think a lot of the second hand ones often come with surprises from previous end user setups
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[09:14] <LeoBodnar> Maybe it was a custom firmware. I'll look further into this. Manual says sink current tracks positive setting so I would have expected sinking 0.3A if CC is setup to 0.3A
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[09:20] <RocketBoy> running my usual a bit late - 1st launch in about 30mins
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[09:22] <LeoBodnar> eroomde: have you done any scripting for PSUs? I am trying to do automated battery testing system
[09:22] <Ugi_> gonzo_: my ZX81 gave up the ghost but I still have my Atari games console - now hooked up to a 42" LCD TV and running fine!
[09:23] <LeoBodnar> caps dried out?
[09:23] <Maxell> XABEN on the map!
[09:24] <Laurenceb> huh
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[09:24] <Laurenceb> what kind of PSU is scripted?
[09:24] <Laurenceb> GPIB ?
[09:24] <LeoBodnar> http://www.home.agilent.com/en/pd-838596-pn-6632B/100-watt-system-power-supply-20v-5a?&cc=GB&lc=eng
[09:25] <LeoBodnar> It has RS232 port as well
[09:25] <Laurenceb> ooh nice
[09:25] <Laurenceb> so you can actually program the psu itself?
[09:26] <Laurenceb> not just commands over rs232/GPIB
[09:26] Action: Laurenceb is probably too used to cheap nasty stuff or even just USB
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[09:29] <M6GTG_nerdsville> is there an archive of ssdv pictures? Was looking for the ones from Adams flight last week, but habhub page is blank here
[09:29] <fsphil> you can use http://ssdv.habhub.org/<date>/<callsign>
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[09:29] <Laurenceb> as long as it doesnt use VISA
[09:29] <Laurenceb> thats horrible to get working
[09:30] <M6GTG_nerdsville> thanks Phil
[09:30] <fsphil> or <callsign>/<date>
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[09:30] <fsphil> I can't remember which :)
[09:30] <fsphil> date should be yyyy-mm-dd
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[09:31] <fsphil> yea, http://ssdv.habhub.org/HABE/2013-09-20
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[09:33] <M6GTG_nerdsville> just worked it out Phil, thanks
[09:34] <mfa298> we could probably do with a list of links to flights/dates somewhere, especially for the older ssdv flights otherwise it's a case of trawling through the mailing list
[09:35] <eroomde> LeoBodnar, nope not touched the data interface of these things yet
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[09:36] <LeoBodnar> Laurenceb: there is a simpler command set called COMP that is just the ticket
[09:37] <Laurenceb> ah i see
[09:38] <LeoBodnar> http://www.mikrocontroller.net/attachment/51145/6614C_ProgrammingGuide.pdf page 83
[09:38] <LeoBodnar> ASCII commands both ways over RS232
[09:38] <LeoBodnar> VISA is HORRIBLE
[09:38] <Laurenceb> yeah
[09:39] <Laurenceb> i tried to get a Thor labs spectrometer working with VISA
[09:39] <Laurenceb> and gave up
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[09:40] <F1VJQ> Im wondering if B-13 is on predicted path... should soon be trackable in Shetlands!! No GTs there though.
[09:40] <fsphil> I had a listen a few minutes ago from N.Ireland, nothing heard
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[09:40] <Laurenceb> im wondering if it takes a day or so to completely trash the battery
[09:40] <fsphil> suspect it was too far away even if it was still transmitting
[09:40] <Laurenceb> explaining why B-12 was dead for 2 days
[09:41] <LeoBodnar> yeah we need either very good batteries or very crappy ones
[09:41] <Laurenceb> hehe
[09:41] <Babs> Laurenceb - arrived this morning and ready to be incorporated in Gimbal mk2 http://imgur.com/aZ3GLmX
[09:41] <Laurenceb> ah that looks familiar :P
[09:42] <F1VJQ> fsphil - We must hope that it is still airborne and can reach Poland where there are lots of GTs!
[09:42] <fsphil> indeed
[09:42] <db_g6gzh> XABEN1 up
[09:42] <fsphil> is there a longer-term prediction for B-13?
[09:42] <fsphil> is it coming back down over central europe?
[09:43] <LeoBodnar> passes med and off to china japan usa
[09:43] <Laurenceb> http://www.coolcomponents.co.uk/catalog/lithium-polymer-battery-110mah-p-778.html
[09:43] <Mik_WD8MNV> good luck
[09:43] <fsphil> we need a flag for spacenear.us that tells it it's a floater
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[09:44] <fsphil> have it predict the next 24 hours
[09:44] <daveake> I see that B-13 went to Spain. Bad timing that :p
[09:45] <fsphil> should have left a receiver daveake :)
[09:45] <daveake> :)
[09:45] <fsphil> solar powered 3g-connected Pi
[09:45] <F1VJQ> fsphil good idea with floater
[09:45] <Mik_WD8MNV> there should be cheap receivers everywhere
[09:45] <daveake> Is Steve trying to land on his house?
[09:45] <F1VJQ> solar powered RX on that shed roof!!
[09:46] <F1VJQ> Mik - but no power or inet connection in remote places!r
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[09:46] <daveake> solar + 3g will sort most places
[09:46] <daveake> the uk fails on both :p
[09:46] <Laurenceb> http://uk.farnell.com/bak/lp-402025-is-3/battery-lithium-pol-3-7v-165-mah/dp/2077885
[09:47] <adamgreig> lol farnell prices
[09:47] <adamgreig> £10!
[09:47] <fsphil> there is an internet company here with a wifi access point on the local mountain
[09:47] <fsphil> I wonder if I asked them nicely would they allow an X-50 on the top of the mast :)
[09:47] <Laurenceb> also that one is only -20C
[09:47] <Mik_WD8MNV> can't insolate it?
[09:48] <fsphil> daveake: looks like he's trying to land in the sea
[09:48] <F1VJQ> Needs some freebies from batt manufacturer... to test their products at altitude!!
[09:49] <Babs> Stabilotron II gimbal taking shape http://imgur.com/xyP6QQm
[09:49] <F1VJQ> You could drain it with only 165mA/H before launch!!
[09:49] <Mik_WD8MNV> i have a GPRS shield for arduino... and an arduino too
[09:50] <LeoBodnar> I am creating an automated setup and then will go wild on testing frozen LiPos
[09:50] <nats`> hi
[09:50] Nick change: Upu -> Upu_M0UPU
[09:50] <LeoBodnar> it's time to do it properly
[09:50] <Laurenceb> hah
[09:51] <Laurenceb> Sparkfun say -25C
[09:51] <Laurenceb> but their datasheet says -20C
[09:51] <LeoBodnar> Laurenceb: I think B-13 failing because I have never taken fresh new battery to above 4.0V
[09:51] <Mik_WD8MNV> cool it with dry ice?
[09:52] <nats`> ohh shit I missed the B13 launch and way near paris
[09:53] <LeoBodnar> I am sure you had better things to do nats` :D
[09:53] <Maxell> It's not climbing that quick.
[09:54] <nats`> LeoBodnar uhhmmmmm don't know what you're talking about :D
[09:54] <Laurenceb> http://www.fentbattery.com/en/Cylindrical.asp?id=468&pid=108
[09:54] <nats`> some of you have reference of rotating antenna mount ?
[09:54] <nats`> my motor control is working and I'm designing the V2 specifically fir that case
[09:54] <nats`> for
[09:54] <nats`> but I'll not do the mechanic part
[09:55] <tweetBot> @jgrahamc: Debugging for high-altitude balloon enthusiasts (and others!): http://t.co/7FToJWv3Ko #ukhas
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[10:01] <fsphil> 3m/s ascent
[10:02] <fsphil> wonder if he's trying to float this
[10:02] <daveake> hmm
[10:02] <Maxell> it is damn close to the sea
[10:06] <Geoff-G8DHE> I wish I could work out Steve's numberig/callsign system!
[10:07] <daveake> Oh, I can explain that
[10:07] <daveake> He uses the first tracker he lays his hands on
[10:07] <Geoff-G8DHE> :)
[10:08] <adamgreig> if he incremented the number for every launch like the rest of us he'd probably break habitat, it'd be too long
[10:08] <G0TDJ_Steve> Good Morning Guys - daveake Whats the u for in uXABEN - Is it small or something?
[10:09] <daveake> micro
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[10:09] <Maxell> µ
[10:09] <G0TDJ_Steve> So it's a small tracker
[10:09] <Geoff-G8DHE> He does these are supposed to be 56 and 57, so the callsigns are 0 and 1 :/
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[10:10] <Geoff-G8DHE> and just as an extra 1 lanuches before 0 :-)
[10:10] <Geoff-G8DHE> I bet he's changed the freq's as well!
[10:12] <Geoff-G8DHE> At least the freq's are QRM free thanks Steve ;-)
[10:13] <GMT> what does the XABEN stand for then?
[10:13] <Maxell> Geoff-G8DHE: ssst you'll jinx it
[10:14] <Geoff-G8DHE> You should see the rest of the band from here!
[10:14] <Laurenceb> LeoBodnar: http://biz.maxell.com/files_etc/6/catalog/en/Prismatic%20Li-ion_13e.pdf
[10:15] Action: Maxell zaps Laurenceb
[10:15] <Laurenceb> haha
[10:15] <ATCC> can I have the exact freq for todays flight please Andy
[10:15] <daveake> 4.3m/s now
[10:15] Action: Maxell plays Laurenceb a very sad song http://mrminer.files.wordpress.com/2008/08/maxell_xlii_90.jpg
[10:16] <G0TDJ_Steve> ATCC: XABEN1 434.300MHz XABEN0 434.250MHz uXABEN 434.350MHz
[10:16] <ATCC> steve is this the exact dial freq? aerial is low and cant hear it in EASTLEIGH
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[10:17] <Geoff-G8DHE> I make the current one 434.303 center
[10:17] <ATCC> .303?
[10:18] <Geoff-G8DHE> 3Khz high
[10:18] <GMT> ATCC: 434.303
[10:18] <ATCC> Many thanks on 303
[10:18] <Maxell> 434.302 Mhz and RTTY signal @ 2000 Hz
[10:19] <ATCC> got tit under call G6WTR many tnx
[10:19] <G0TDJ_Steve> ATCC: Sorry, I was AFK - I use http://www.heywhatsthat.com/ to see if there's terrain in the way too. Very useful.
[10:20] <ATCC> using folded 2m dipole at 12 ft in industrial estate
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[10:20] Action: Maxell hauls in the first green packets
[10:20] <G0TDJ_Steve> I have partial here surprisingly
[10:21] <LeoBodnar> What's so special about these Maxells apart from the name?
[10:22] <eroomde> a webform in which a password i entered had an apostrophe has complained to me that I must only use ascii characters
[10:22] <adamgreig> lol
[10:22] <adamgreig> I don't even know where to start with that
[10:22] <adamgreig> someone needs a smack
[10:23] <LeoBodnar> NULL is ASCII
[10:23] <LeoBodnar> NUL
[10:23] <adamgreig> so is apostrophe
[10:23] <adamgreig> and yet I doubt it would accept NUL either
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[10:24] <eroomde> someone does need a smack yes
[10:24] <adamgreig> does it have a length limit too? just while they're at it
[10:24] <fsphil> it's sooo stupid
[10:25] <fsphil> it's like they want me to use password1234
[10:25] <GMT> just be thankful that lady from Hawaii is not filling-in that form
[10:25] <fsphil> haha
[10:25] <Maxell> WARNING: passwords are saved as cleartext!
[10:26] <GMT> many, many years ago I had to create some pw's for 4 users - chose "whale", "isle", "beef" and "hooked"
[10:27] <Maxell> Aaaaand, it's gone
[10:27] <Geoff-G8DHE> Indeed
[10:27] <daveake> I once worked on an old MOD system. Password was held as plain text. "1234"
[10:27] <Maxell> Intresting fade
[10:27] <Maxell> Went away completly
[10:28] <Maxell> And now stronger than ever.
[10:28] <fsphil> the fades are coming
[10:28] <Maxell> Hide you kids!
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[10:28] <Geoff-G8DHE> Humm, didn't do my freq tracking any good either jumped away :-(
[10:28] <Maxell> s/you/yo/
[10:28] <fsphil> up to 5m/s now
[10:29] <GMT> did the MOD1 team from y'day have any pics?
[10:29] <M6GTG_nerdsville> can you run two instances of dl-fldigi on the same pc?
[10:29] <fsphil> M6GTG_nerdsville: yep
[10:30] <M6GTG_nerdsville> from just one directory, or do need two copies?
[10:30] <Maxell> M6GTG_nerdsville: same dir will work
[10:30] <Maxell> just feed them different sound inputs
[10:30] <Geoff-G8DHE> He had a camera onboard, but given the lack of communication Im not sure we will ever see anything :-(
[10:31] <M6GTG_nerdsville> thanks trying to use two VCO feature of SDR-Radio using same dongle
[10:31] <Geoff-G8DHE> I'n running 3 at the moment M6GTG_nerdsville
[10:31] <Ugi_> G0WXI should be getting a fairly clear signal!
[10:31] <Geoff-G8DHE> That's same as what I'm doing
[10:31] <fsphil> Ugi_: you'd think, but being directly below the payload can result in a fairly weak signal
[10:31] Nick change: LazyLeopard -> LazyL_M0LEP
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[10:31] <M6GTG_nerdsville> mind you as Scotty would say "I'm not sure she can take it Captain!"
[10:31] <LazyL_M0LEP> Late to the party as usual...
[10:32] <Upu_M0UPU> its ok it only just started
[10:34] <Ugi_> fsphil: I realise a lot of the antenna gain is at the horizon for both transmitter & receiver but surely at that distance it must be OK - either that or ditch the fancy antenna in favour of a bit of wire lying on the table!
[10:34] <fsphil> Ugi_: yea it won't fade out totally, just gets weaker
[10:34] <Maxell> Ugi_: yeah, directional beams or very high gain dipoles have blind spots.
[10:34] <fsphil> I've driven under a payload in flight and didn't lose it, but it did get fairly quiet
[10:35] <Maxell> fsphil: I solved that by not buying a high gain monopole for chase car
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[10:35] <Maxell> it's near enough to pick it up with a no-gain 20 cm rod
[10:35] <fsphil> I was using a cheap 2m/70cm thing
[10:36] <fsphil> I'd probably have lost it with a higher gain one
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[10:36] <fsphil> chase cars should probably have a patch antenna on the roof
[10:36] <fsphil> aiming up
[10:36] <LazyL_M0LEP> Yeah, my tri-bander doesn't start having significant problems til the payload's at about 30 degrees or more, and then it's likely to be a whole lot closer... ;)
[10:38] <jarod> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VYiov0qwQSQ - Airbus widebody family flight with the A350 XWB, A380 and A3
[10:38] <LazyL_M0LEP> Erf. Something happened there...
[10:38] <jarod> awesome role out at the end
[10:38] <Upu_M0UPU> Drify little bugger
[10:38] <Upu_M0UPU> 434.305
[10:38] <Geoff-G8DHE> Just slightly!
[10:39] <Geoff-G8DHE> Its got a permanent slope in the waterfall on mine
[10:39] <LazyL_M0LEP> Yeah, the auto-re-tune is being kept busy
[10:39] <Upu_M0UPU> yep
[10:39] <Maxell> -auto0re-tune?
[10:39] <Maxell> do want for rtl-sdr
[10:39] <Upu_M0UPU> yeah would be nice :)
[10:40] <Geoff-G8DHE> Use SDr-Radio it supports rigCAT files
[10:40] <Upu_M0UPU> but I suspect will be a thing of the past soon
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[10:40] <fsphil> need the sdr software to suppport remote control
[10:40] <Geoff-G8DHE> I have one for it if you want to try it!"
[10:41] <Geoff-G8DHE> humm drifting into the QRM now
[10:41] <Maxell> Geoff-G8DHE: holy shit i already use SDR-console
[10:42] <Geoff-G8DHE> Pick this up still Aplpha http://360.g8dhe.net\HAB_Flights\sdr_test_VFO_A.xml
[10:43] <Geoff-G8DHE> even Alpha ;-)
[10:43] <M6GTG_nerdsville> just had some interest QRM here http://i.imgur.com/4GetDbz.jpg
[10:43] <M6GTG_nerdsville> interesting even
[10:43] <Maxell> Geoff-G8DHE: how does that work?
[10:43] <Geoff-G8DHE> You need version 2 or 2.1 to enable te remote control and then you can just setup extra virtual com ports for each copy of dl-fldigi to run with
[10:44] <Maxell> ah
[10:44] <Geoff-G8DHE> Ask for a copy of VSP manager for the virtual ports
[10:45] <Geoff-G8DHE> Its free for Aamateur use
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[10:47] <G0TDJ_Steve> What's Steve's callsign?
[10:47] <Maxell> G0TDJ
[10:47] <Maxell> :+
[10:47] <G0TDJ_Steve> LOL... *DOH* Not me
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[10:48] <Upu_M0UPU> G8KHW
[10:48] <G0TDJ_Steve> Thank you Anthony
[10:48] <F1VJQ> LEO - Are you about? I just contacted a chap in Shetlands... he'll have a listen on remote RX... and he also said this> "Does it have any passive radar reflectors ?. Can ask a mate at Sumburgh to have a look"
[10:48] <Geoff-G8DHE> Maxell, In the dl-fldigi config select rigCAT and choose the file and ports, then in SDR-Radio under Tools select Program Options and set up serial ports to use.
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[10:49] <Geoff-G8DHE> There is currently a bug in that the currently selected VFO also responds to the VFO-A commands but I have raised as a bug.
[10:51] <RocketBoy> no 2 away
[10:51] <Maxell> Geoff-G8DHE: fancy stuff
[10:52] <F1VJQ> Maybe raising false hopes but ---> "Sumburgh seeing 'ping' at 30Km West of Unst, but might be a boat. Some ducting toward Faroes giving false echo's. He will watch it to see if he can get altitude"
[10:53] <fsphil> cool
[10:54] <fsphil> would be well out of range if that is it
[10:54] <fsphil> range of me*
[10:54] <SpeedEvil> F1VJQ: It's got no designed in reflectors - however it's a metallised 60cm balloon - as i understand it
[10:54] <fsphil> I don't think those balloons are conductive?
[10:55] <SpeedEvil> fsphil: They're not very conductive
[10:55] <Geoff-G8DHE> XABEN1 is fading a lot now
[10:55] <SpeedEvil> but they do have ~500nm or so of aluminium.
[10:55] <SpeedEvil> That's only 20* thinner than kitchen foil
[10:56] <Geoff-G8DHE> and it will also, being curved, disperse the signal rather than reflect back
[10:56] <SpeedEvil> True.
[10:56] <fsphil> one side will
[10:56] <fsphil> the other side will act like a dish
[10:56] <SpeedEvil> Both sides
[10:56] <fsphil> ah yea
[10:56] <SpeedEvil> A dish with a focal length of 40cm
[10:56] <fsphil> just realised :)
[10:57] <SpeedEvil> Also there is a + of wire at the bottom as a groundplane - unless I'm misremembering
[10:57] <G4AIU-Eugene> first green here in Wellington, Somerset
[10:57] <SpeedEvil> this may well act as a corner reflector of sorts for some wavelengths
[10:57] <fsphil> if his radar is sensitive enough to get a position, we should see it move with the prediction
[10:58] <Laurenceb> <LeoBodnar> the Maxell thingys seem to have moderatly better low temp
[10:58] <Laurenceb> at least they claim so - doesnt seem too good
[10:59] <Laurenceb> looks like there are -40C lipo cells in existence
[10:59] <Laurenceb> hard to get tho
[10:59] <F1VJQ> fsphil I think it is a professional radar... maye at the airport!
[10:59] <Maxell> Geoff-G8DHE: intresting stuff
[10:59] <fsphil> xaben0 has launched
[10:59] <F1VJQ> We will see if any further reports
[10:59] <fsphil> uxaben too
[10:59] <fsphil> they on the same balloon I wonder
[10:59] <Maxell> however, I'd rather not mess with a active flight/decoding session
[11:00] <Geoff-G8DHE> Maxell, Agreed been playing with it for a week or two now and its beginnning to settle down nicely.
[11:00] <F1VJQ> What's the bet that it will burst just as I get near to receiving a signal from XABEN!!!
[11:00] <fsphil> anyone ever seen a bug in fldigi/pulseaudio where the waterfall starts moving really fast?
[11:00] <fsphil> and the audio becomes very choppy
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[11:01] <SpeedEvil> fsphil: That's when you need your star power.
[11:01] <F1VJQ> fsphil no... but I saw w/fall go backwards yesterday when I had heavy CPU load!!
[11:01] <M6GTG_nerdsville> two payload simultaneous decoding achived from the same FCDP+! well I'm happy, not sure my PC is ;-)
[11:01] <fsphil> hah
[11:01] <fsphil> I'm receiving xaben1
[11:01] <fsphil> well, I can see it but not decode it
[11:02] <fsphil> 434.307 -- it's drifted quite a bit
[11:02] <Maxell> M6GTG_nerdsville: ah, FCDP+ has like 200 kHz of bandwith right?
[11:02] <Geoff-G8DHE> very choppy now with me, must be some refraction going on
[11:02] <fsphil> 192khz
[11:02] <Maxell> HAHA!
[11:02] <M6GTG_nerdsville> Maxell yes 192kHz
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[11:03] <F1VJQ> Radar echo from Sumburgh update....... "Boat being 'naughty' No AIS info just echo" ... so no news of B-13
[11:03] <fsphil> aw
[11:03] <fsphil> thanks for checking though, that's a neat system
[11:04] <Maxell> What using miltary radar systems for tracking HABs
[11:05] <F1VJQ> If you know someone, why not!!!
[11:05] <Maxell> I should have done that internship at Robin Radar... http://robinradar.nl/systems/2d-mobile
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[11:06] <Geoff-G8DHE> I though Sumburgh was a civilian airport ?
[11:07] <F1VJQ> Geoff yes, I think so too
[11:09] Action: Maxell is going to focus on µXABEN.
[11:10] <Maxell> Seems like that one is special
[11:10] <Geoff-G8DHE> XABEN0 up
[11:10] <Geoff-G8DHE> and can see it
[11:10] <Maxell> And has the least listeners!
[11:12] <Geoff-G8DHE> Can't seeuXABEN however
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[11:16] <Maxell> µXABEN is at 434.354.800 Hz, dl-fldigi @ 1613 Hz
[11:17] pa3hdm (d97bd8c6@gateway/web/freenode/ip. joined #highaltitude.
[11:17] <pa3hdm> hello all
[11:18] <enkidu> something is going to float english channel
[11:18] <F1VJQ> fsphil - still 434.307 ???
[11:19] <fsphil> 434.408 USB now
[11:19] <F1VJQ> pa3hdm hello
[11:19] <fsphil> I don't know how accurate my fcd++ is
[11:19] <Maxell> F1VJQ: XABEN1 is 434.307 MHz, dl-fldigi @ 1500 Hz
[11:19] <F1VJQ> blimey, that's some drift!!
[11:19] <Maxell> hey pa3hdm
[11:19] <LeoBodnar> eroomde: http://cp.literature.agilent.com/litweb/pdf/5962-8196.pdf page 50 "Sink Current Tracking, Compatibility mode: -250mA" wtf?
[11:20] <Maxell> start tracking! :P
[11:20] <daveake> XABEN0 is nicve and stable, and stronger too
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[11:20] <fsphil> pulseaudio keeps messing up here
[11:20] <F1VJQ> 308 not 408 phew!!!
[11:20] <LeoBodnar> "SCPI mode1: 0.4% + 1mA"
[11:20] <Maxell> daveake: µXABEN is pretty weak here in the west coast of .nl!
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[11:22] <Maxell> daveake: and XABEN0 way stronger
[11:23] <Maxell> Thanks, QRM http://i.imgur.com/4JbfRoB.png
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[11:30] <enkidu> fsphil: loopback cable, alsa, no pulseaudio
[11:31] <enkidu> or - even better - external soundcard with own power source
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[11:32] Herman__ (53560375@gateway/web/freenode/ip. joined #highaltitude.
[11:32] <Herman__> gm all
[11:33] <Herman__> wat is the shift of xaben1 ??
[11:33] <darkstar-20011> fsphil: I modded my dl-fldigi to read from a named pipe. The pipe is then filled by my gnuradio flowgraph. So no pulse audio - woohoo!!
[11:36] <fsphil> darkstar-20011: sneaky
[11:37] <fsphil> I'd like to try tcp so I can stream it over the lan
[11:37] <daveake> Herman__, 475Hz
[11:37] <Laurenceb> bluetooth low energy over 434mhz
[11:37] <Laurenceb> you know it makes sense
[11:39] <Herman__> <daveake> tnx i listening to a rong rtty signaal now he is 9++ here
[11:39] <darkstar-20011> At some point I'll tidy up my dl-flgigi and let people know. At the moment it, for example, has the path name to the pipe hardwired in...makes it kinda tricky to have more than one fldigi running!....
[11:40] <Maxell> hey Herman__
[11:41] <Herman__> hey maxell
[11:42] <Maxell> Herman__: stay tuned for 434.348 Mhz: if XABEN1 comes down XABEN0 will still be up
[11:42] <fsphil> bah, broke again
[11:42] <F1VJQ> It's below my LoS horizon but I'm seeing some smears on 307
[11:42] <fsphil> this is making me angry :)
[11:42] <Herman__> i must go to working abt 1100 gmt i wil tying
[11:42] <Maxell> :P
[11:42] <Herman__> trying
[11:43] <Herman__> o wat time he going up maxell ??
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[11:46] <Maxell> Herman__: already up
[11:46] <Maxell> 3 payloads in the air
[11:46] <Maxell> The µXABEN is pretty weak: it's around 434.354 MHz
[11:47] <F1VJQ> Got a RTTY sig... will see if decodes!!
[11:47] <F1VJQ> dial reads 306
[11:49] <Maxell> Why didn't I took the time to figure out how I get a second virtual cable - I could have tracked 3 payloads at once!
[11:49] <gonzo_> uXABEN does seem quite weak. I'm only getting occasional decodes
[11:49] <fsphil> grr this is impossible
[11:49] <x-f> Maxell, you're greedy :)
[11:50] <fsphil> it's like it's only writing a partial buffer
[11:50] <gonzo_> if I could get VAC to separate out LH and RH chans, I could do that too
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[11:52] <Geoff-G8DHE> Maxell, setup for 6 VAC and 6 VFO's then you won't be caught ou ;-)
[11:52] <mfa298> gonzo_: you can get VAC to provide several virtual cables
[11:53] <Laurenceb> is XABEN1 50 baud?
[11:53] <mfa298> the only annoyance I've found is you can't be using any of the VACs when you change the number of them.
[11:54] <Geoff-G8DHE> Indeed have to be setup before hand
[11:54] <gonzo_> mfa298, the prob I have is, spectrvue will allow me to make two decod ewindows, in the stereo channel. But splitting that out to two chans for fldigi to decode is a pain
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[11:55] <Geoff-G8DHE> I just use a batch file now to open SDR-Radio, then open up a VAC and Dl-Fldigi for each channel I need
[11:55] <gonzo_> there is a way I could put two chans on one mono feed, without killing the NF, but that's bodgy
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[11:56] <mfa298> I think someone did something like that by having one radio input cover 0-1500 and the other 1500-3000 but that gives less space for drifty payloads and needs payloads with a fairly small shift
[11:57] <gonzo_> I've nkit looked at any other progs other than spetravue, as it's simple and reasonabbly processor efficient n my slow old pc
[11:57] <fsphil> you can configure fldigi to have a 4khz waterfall
[11:57] <fsphil> gives you more room
[11:57] <fsphil> radio permitting
[11:57] <gonzo_> mfa298, that was what I was thinking of
[11:57] <gonzo_> but you have to put filtering in the feeds, or thyou will be adding noise on the other chan
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[11:58] <mfa298> I think the person who did that was using an sdr radio so had a shark cut at 1500hz on them (one only doing audio under that and the other above)
[11:59] <gonzo_> where is that bandwidth setting phil?
[11:59] <mfa298> I've found sdr# and sdr-radio aren't too bad cpu wise now.
[12:00] <fsphil> gonzo_: Configure > Waterfall > FFT Processing
[12:00] <fsphil> there's an Upper limit setting
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[12:00] <fsphil> goes up to 4000 hz
[12:00] <mfa298> the atom proc in my netbook can certainly run sdr# and dl-fldigi happily. and I had an atom nettop machine running sdr-radio and 3x dl-fldigi the other day.
[12:01] <Herman__> i must go to working bey bey to all
[12:02] <gonzo_> thanks. Though l9ooks like I muust have found that before. Already at 4k
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[12:03] Nick change: Geoff-G8DHE_ -> Geoff-G8DHE-M
[12:03] <Maxell> x-f: yes I am. I screwed something up, it's not decoding a single payload anymore
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[12:05] XE3G3VZV_Graham (bb993159@gateway/web/freenode/ip. joined #highaltitude.
[12:05] <XE3G3VZV_Graham> jim_g3wgm Good morning
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[12:06] <fsphil> xe3?
[12:06] <F1VJQ> Good loud signal now, but still no decode :-(
[12:06] <fsphil> I've had a single string decoded so far
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[12:07] <Laurenceb> maybe some odd timing error
[12:07] <Maxell> grmbl $$$$$lABbN,46,2:0z91L52.
[12:07] <jim_g3wgm> XE3G3VZV_Graham, GM t u 2! Try I've just logged onto skype, if u're interested!
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[12:09] <Maxell> And setting back to two VFOs works again
[12:09] <Maxell> Bummer!
[12:09] <G0TDJ_Steve> Steve going for a record or something? 42k+
[12:09] <Laurenceb> into the top 10
[12:09] <Laurenceb> seems so
[12:09] <daveake> bursty
[12:09] <LazyL_M0LEP> yeah
[12:09] <XE3G3VZV_Graham> XE3 - Mexico - too far to do any tracking:(
[12:10] <G0TDJ_Steve> daveake: Could you hear it in the tones?
[12:10] <PH3V> XABEN1 > Burst @ 42345 m!
[12:10] <daveake> saw it on the waterfall
[12:10] <G0TDJ_Steve> Good eyes!
[12:10] <F1VJQ> Sudden loss of volume on RTTY!!!!
[12:11] <daveake> it's prety obvious
[12:11] <Geoff-G8DHE> Wow the drift is getting silly!
[12:11] <LazyL_M0LEP> Yeah, there's often a distinct change in signal when the balloon bursts. ;)
[12:11] <G0TDJ_Steve> I'll have to see if I can spot the other two go
[12:11] <GMT> I got a partial decode at 42345
[12:11] <G0TDJ_Steve> I don't monitor the sound as yet
[12:12] <LazyL_M0LEP> Depends what else is going on. I happened to be listening this time...
[12:12] <enkidu> -52.2 m/s
[12:12] <enkidu> does it have chute?
[12:12] <daveake> Was higher earlier ... 268mph max
[12:12] <Upu> its at 30km enkidu :)
[12:12] <daveake> These speeds are normal
[12:12] <Upu> chute will be having very little effect at this time
[12:13] <LazyL_M0LEP> Yes, it'll slow down when it has some air to work with. ;)
[12:13] <enkidu> I know :) but speeds at first moment are getting higher and higher
[12:15] <enkidu> still the magic netherland football of death was a thunder fast
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[12:17] <fsphil> http://i.imgur.com/YnfnO5p.png
[12:18] <enkidu> nice drift, indeed
[12:18] <F1VJQ> XE3/G3VZV Too bad Graham!!
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[12:20] <PE2G> XABEN1's parachute is working well at 15 km
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[12:23] <G0TDJ_Steve> I'd like to know what the 'Flags' are on uXABEN The value hasn't changed
[12:24] <Upu> it will be a status code of some sort I suspect
[12:24] <G0TDJ_Steve> I
[12:24] <fsphil> hearing xaben0
[12:24] <G0TDJ_Steve> I'll ask Steve when he's about
[12:24] <fsphil> nowhere near decoding it though
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[12:34] <G4AIU-Eugene> copying uXABEB - my print-out looks good - I am getting a green line decode - the checksum says 'good' but no print-out in the boxes - Why not?
[12:34] <F1VJQ> fsphil 250 or drifting?
[12:34] <fsphil> they always drift :)
[12:34] <fsphil> my dial is at 434.248.6
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[12:35] <fsphil> there is quite a loud signal a few khz below it causing trouble
[12:35] <F1VJQ> OK thanks
[12:36] <fsphil> can see uxaben on the sdr waterfall but it looks pretty weak
[12:37] <Upu> uxaben is the weakest
[12:37] <Maxell> Note to self: computer doesn't like >2 VFO's
[12:37] <Geoff-G8DHE> XABEN1 should be an easy find
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[12:40] <XE3_G3VZV_Graham> is the XABEN1 descent rate rather unusually high?
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[12:41] <F1VJQ> G4AIU Is the decoded output formatted in some way? CSV for example... I haven't seen a successful one yet!
[12:41] <Upu> yes it is high Graham
[12:42] <eroomde> parachute kerfuffle?
[12:42] <Upu> I suspect its bringing the balloon back with it, which initially acted as a parachute but is now just a dead weight
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[12:42] <Upu> it was fine then about 9km it accelerated
[12:42] Wouter-[PA3WEG] (5f805f21@gateway/web/freenode/ip. joined #highaltitude.
[12:43] <gonzo_> what's this? Steve landing in a field without power cables?
[12:43] <eroomde> they don't usually go from =ve to -ve like that unless they've actually tangled
[12:43] <Geoff-G8DHE> F1VJQ, http://360.g8dhe.net/hab_flights/XABEN55_20130923/Capture2.JPG
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[12:43] <Upu> mine did it, decent was <2m/s then it hit some cloud and I suspect the balloon parachute collapsed and it came down way quicker
[12:44] <G4AIU-Eugene> the decode appears good and getting constant green decode - call box says uXABEN but time, Lat, Long and Alt boxes are blank
[12:44] <Upu> have you selected the payload G4AIU-Eugene ?
[12:44] <F1VJQ> G8DHE OK THanks
[12:45] <G4AIU-Eugene> Yes - selected correct payload several times - thanks
[12:46] <Geoff-G8DHE> I guess the payload document is right
[12:46] <eroomde> i can't visualise a mechanism by which the balloon adds to the drag then suddendly doesn't, unless some bit of it breaks off or it starts to affect the chute
[12:46] <Upu> well they split Ed
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[12:46] <Upu> so act like a parachute
[12:46] <Upu> but as they enter thicker air the split becomes a tear
[12:46] <Upu> and they collapse
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[12:46] <eroomde> is this pico or biggo?
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[12:47] <Upu> pico
[12:47] <eroomde> ah right
[12:47] <eroomde> beg your pardon
[12:47] <eroomde> i was assuming latex
[12:47] <Upu> oh
[12:47] <eroomde> for steve's launch
[12:47] <Upu> no latex sorry
[12:47] <Upu> pico payload
[12:48] <eroomde> hmm. the forces on the balloon are the same the whole way down. they should change when the altitude lowers
[12:48] <eroomde> but i guess after 15 mins of flapping around then bits could break off.
[12:49] <Upu> I don't know exactly how it works
[12:49] <F1VJQ> I claim the DX hrd but not decoded for XABEN1 !!! About 750km
[12:49] <tweetBot> @daveake: LOHAN team's week in Spain http://t.co/ATUti8ImQK #RaspberryPi #UKHAS
[12:49] <Upu> but we've seen some odd things
[12:49] <Upu> my Pico took 3 hours or something daft to come down
[12:49] <Upu> then in the last 4km came down at 14m/s
[12:50] <daveake> yes that was weird
[12:50] <daveake> The latex looked like it could easily have made a parachute shape
[12:51] <F1VJQ> 434.252 two bips a second... anyone recognise this ?
[12:51] <jim_g3wgm> Is there any info on what the flags/numbers towards the end of the uXABEN packets mean?
[12:51] Action: LazyL_M0LEP wasn't listening when XABEN0 burst...
[12:51] <F1VJQ> bips just stopped
[12:51] <fsphil> ah, was afk - looks like I got a xaben0 decode
[12:52] <fsphil> 551.4km :)
[12:52] <LazyL_M0LEP> ;)
[12:54] <F1VJQ> fsphil - I'm sure the bips were from the balloon, and they stopped as it burst... I didn't recognise the mode of transmission
[12:56] <Wouter-[PA3WEG]> hi all
[12:56] <Wouter-[PA3WEG]> just turned on tracking
[12:56] <Wouter-[PA3WEG]> XABEN0
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[12:57] <Maxell> hey Wouter-[PA3WEG]
[12:58] <Maxell> Wouter-[PA3WEG]: dials: 434.248 MHz and 434.354 MHz
[12:58] <fsphil> wtf? bbc have cancelled the Sky at Night?
[12:58] <Maxell> Wouter-[PA3WEG]: why not track µXABEN? It has less tracker!
[12:59] <F1VJQ> fsphil - nobody fat with a monacle to take over prog?
[12:59] <G0TDJ_Steve> Where's that reported fsphil ?
[12:59] <Wouter-[PA3WEG]> Just turned on, it was the first one I found, and Hi Jeroen ;)
[12:59] <Maxell> Hey
[13:01] <fsphil> can't find official word from bbc G0TDJ_Steve, could be a rumour
[13:01] <G0TDJ_Steve> I think their website would report it
[13:01] <G0TDJ_Steve> Not there
[13:01] <Wouter-[PA3WEG]> uXABEN drifting like crazy here
[13:01] <daveake> fsphil I've just seen rumours on twitter
[13:01] <Maxell> Wouter-[PA3WEG]: same here
[13:01] <fsphil> yea that's all I can find too daveake
[13:02] <Maxell> Set dl-fldigi's automatic freq correction to high
[13:02] <fsphil> so possibly nothing
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[13:02] <Maxell> Can be found bottom right after right-clicking RTTY
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[13:03] <Ugi_> XABEN1 went to 42km?
[13:03] <daveake> Sign here just in case http://www.change.org/en-GB/petitions/the-bbc-please-do-not-axe-the-sky-at-night
[13:04] <Babs> I wouldn't put it past the BBC to claim that its as a result of Voyager going into interstellar space
[13:05] <Babs> "Well, with that move into interstellar space we've done the solar system now so we are instead moving to put Dick and Dom on the telly more."
[13:05] <Babs> The slippery slope started when they axed Tomorrow's World
[13:05] <Babs> On that note, I found out the other day that Judith Hann is 72!!!!!
[13:05] <Babs> boy that makes me feel old
[13:06] <fsphil> I caught the last bit of Tomorrows World
[13:06] <PE2G> I'll sign that. I think BBC aren't aware that Sky At Night has viewers in other countries too
[13:06] <fsphil> remember a reported they did on DAB radio
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[13:06] Action: LazyL_M0LEP first saw a CD demonstrated on TW.
[13:07] <daveake> CD and jam
[13:07] <G0TDJ_Steve> Me too LL
[13:07] <LazyL_M0LEP> ;)
[13:07] <Babs> CD and jam!
[13:07] <Babs> that was a great episode
[13:07] <gonzo_> have a look at the bbc archives
[13:07] <gonzo_> loads of it on there
[13:07] <Maxell> Ugi_: it did
[13:07] <Babs> I remember seeing Ed's HOTOL pre-incarnation on there
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[13:08] <G0TDJ_Steve> The nearest thing on TV nowadays is BBC Click
[13:09] <Ugi_> Maxell: wow - that sounds pretty high! Do we know if it was intended as a high one? Tracker seems to have been set to anticipate 33km burst
[13:09] <gonzo_> http://www.bbc.co.uk/archive/tomorrowsworld/
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[13:13] <Maxell> Ugi_: not sure, Laurenceb said it's a new record for the top 10!
[13:14] <G0TDJ_Steve> http://ukhas.org.uk/general:uk_records
[13:15] <Ugi_> Good stuff - I wonder whether it was one of Steve's new 3000g balloons!?
[13:15] <G0TDJ_Steve> Steve's no stranger to high flyers by the looks
[13:15] <G0TDJ_Steve> Loosing XABEN0 here
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[13:17] <Ugi_> Clocks in at #10 on that table then - along with 3 other XABENs in the top 10!
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[13:18] <KevWal> My autotuning from dl-fldigi to SDR-Radio seems to have stopped auto tuning :( When I click Initialise I still get communication to SDR-Radio, which I see in the 'monitor' window in sdr-radio, but fl-digi doesn't tell sdr-radio to retune if the signal drifts above 2,000hz
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[13:18] <KevWal> any thoughts?
[13:20] <fsphil> is the auto-retune option still enabled and set to 2khz?
[13:21] <KevWal> DL-Client - Enable - Frequency Tracking is still enabled and set to 2000
[13:22] <Geoff-G8DHE-M> I found the drift at one point was faster than the software could keep up, there seems to be a minimum time between updates
[13:22] <KevWal> and AFC is clicked in the main UI and green
[13:22] <Geoff-G8DHE-M> opening the AFC range up to +/-100 Hz helped
[13:22] <KevWal> this isnt telling the radio to do anything, except when I click Initialise....
[13:22] <KevWal> where is afc range set Geoff-G8DHE-M ?
[13:23] <Geoff-G8DHE-M> Check using the monitor program in SDR-Radio what is actually being seen/sent ?
[13:24] <Geoff-G8DHE-M> In dl config enable you can set the points where the AFC operates to bring the Radio back on frequency, not sure what the step size is at the moment
[13:24] <KevWal> Geoff-G8DHE-M: I get a command, and a response in SDR-radio monitor window when I click "Initialize" in fl-digi, but that is the only command I ever see
[13:24] <KevWal> hangon, some screen shots needed, 2 secs
[13:25] <Geoff-G8DHE-M> I'll be back up stairs on the main rig in a moment and we can compare, I was having problems with multi VFO work as well this morning.
[13:26] Nick change: KipK -> KipK_away
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[13:27] <Geoff-G8DHE> KevWal, See here http://360.g8dhe.net/HAB_Flights/index.php?ind=1 mine are currently set for 1000Hz +/- 100Hz
[13:28] <gonzo_> I thought the landing was going for those power lines!
[13:28] <Geoff-G8DHE> So when the center freq. moves more than 100Hz it should step the VFO by an amount not sure what the amount is or what controls it yet
[13:30] <KevWal> Geoff-G8DHE: Ok, I can close mone up a bit, but I dont think that was the issue, it was drifitng above 2000 and still not retuning - http://i.imgur.com/1bIrozn.jpg
[13:30] <Geoff-G8DHE> The first step seems to shift it by 276Hz which is a weird value
[13:31] <Geoff-G8DHE> Ah no that was me clicking in the window rather than a AFC driven change
[13:32] <Geoff-G8DHE> Need a suitable signal as well of course
[13:32] <KevWal> Geoff-G8DHE: and - http://i.imgur.com/FBTpUGf.jpg
[13:33] <Geoff-G8DHE> Looks very similar to mine
[13:34] <Geoff-G8DHE> http://360.g8dhe.net/HAB_Flights/index.php?ind=2
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[13:34] <KevWal> could I get a copy of your xml to try please?
[13:34] <Geoff-G8DHE> One second get the URL
[13:35] <Ugi_> both XABENs seem to have found nice open spots to land.
[13:35] <Geoff-G8DHE> http://360.g8dhe.net\HAB_Flights\sdr_test_VFO_A.xml
[13:36] <KevWal> ta
[13:36] <Geoff-G8DHE> That one uses only FA commands back to SDR-Radio, change them for the other VFO's i.e. FA> FB>FC but there is still the bug
[13:36] <Geoff-G8DHE> that SDR-Radio also sends input to the "selected" VFO rather than just the VFO named :-(
[13:37] <KevWal> ok :)
[13:37] <Geoff-G8DHE> I'll just check the list and see if anyone has commented
[13:38] <enkidu> rigcat over network would be kickass
[13:38] <Geoff-G8DHE> Not so far http://groups.yahoo.com/neo/groups/sdr-radio-com/conversations/topics/17254
[13:39] <PE2G> Geoff-G8DHE: With these settings http://360.g8dhe.net/HAB_Flights/index.php?ind=1 there was no need for you to adjust dl-fldigi's cursor freq?
[13:41] <Geoff-G8DHE> I normally center the incoming audio on 1KHz, and with just the single VFO running it tracked well, even worked with 3 VFO's but sometimes an error would jump in
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[13:41] <Geoff-G8DHE> and VFO-B would take on the freq. of VFO-A or VFO-C from dl-fldigi
[13:42] <Geoff-G8DHE> the problem happens between any VFO as well so not quite sure what goes at the moment
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[13:43] <Geoff-G8DHE> I think its might be SDR-Radio as the command is sent on seperate serial ports and only comes together within SDR-Radio itself
[13:43] <Geoff-G8DHE> possibly tied up with the "selection" oddity as well
[13:44] <Geoff-G8DHE> When operating normally I can tune either from dl-fldigi or from the VFO Pane,
[13:45] <KevWal> mmmm
[13:47] <Geoff-G8DHE> You can never find a slowly drifting signal when you want one!
[13:48] <KevWal> :)
[13:49] <gonzo_> satellites?
[13:50] <Geoff-G8DHE> Ah no dl-fldigi needs actual data not just a carrier to track as well :-(
[13:51] <fsphil> this is why interrupt-driven rtty is nice
[13:51] <fsphil> the interrupt can send NUL's while waiting for data
[13:51] <KevWal> as if by magic, I am now gettin a stream of commands between the two....
[13:51] <Geoff-G8DHE> Which file were you using before ?
[13:53] <KevWal> SDR-Radio
[13:54] <KevWal> which worked when I first did that post to the list...
[13:54] <Geoff-G8DHE> Is that the file from the archive or the one I put up then ?
[13:55] <Geoff-G8DHE> I found the one on the archive, sent commands from fldigi, command were sent back but were not recognised and it closed the port.
[13:56] <enkidu> fsphil: try to tune into B13
[13:56] <enkidu> http://ready.arl.noaa.gov/hypubout/17847_trj001.gif
[13:56] <KevWal> sdr-radio.xml, from http://www.w1hkj.com/xmlarchives.html used to work for me, but stopped today
[13:56] <Geoff-G8DHE> So I then tried out the K2.xml file from the archive and it started to function, so modified it for the SDR-Radio commands and that is what seems to work.
[13:56] <KevWal> and now the file yuo just sent me made it start working again...
[13:57] <KevWal> ahh, ok
[13:57] <Geoff-G8DHE> Yup that one does not on my setup, fldigi doesn't recognise the comands and closes the port.
[13:57] <KevWal> I did reinstall dl-fldigi between my original attempt and today...
[13:58] <Geoff-G8DHE> I think it might have something to do with the INIT command that is specified in the rigCAT document :-(
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[13:59] <KevWal> sorted now, ready for the next drifter :)
[13:59] <fsphil> enkidu: nothing
[14:00] <KevWal> I am keeping half an eye on 434.500 for B-13, but keep getting a load of interference on there :(
[14:00] <KevWal> Thanks Geoff-G8DHE
[14:01] <Geoff-G8DHE> Ah you can get it to trigger the AFC by using the adjust Cursor controls on the bottom
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[14:02] <Geoff-G8DHE> Right yes it adjust the freq. by 1/2 the total AFC range as you might expect!
[14:03] <KevWal> Geoff-G8DHE: yes, or by clicking on the waterfall
[14:03] <KevWal> above 2000 hz in my case...
[14:03] <Geoff-G8DHE> Yes but clicking on the waterfall send it to the offset from where you clicked
[14:05] <Geoff-G8DHE> That file by the way still needs work doing to it, but it works OK at present!
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[14:13] <Wouter-[PA3WEG]> back to waiting for B13 here..
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[14:15] <HixWork> did B12 ever pop up in NA?
[14:21] <fsphil> there where no reports
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[14:24] <Maxell> fsphil: whats your status on B-13?
[14:24] <fsphil> nothing heard Maxell
[14:24] <fsphil> I'm watching the waterfall from the office
[14:26] <Maxell> heh
[14:28] <Maxell> Bummer. I wonder if launching a hab to hear other habs would be any useful
[14:28] <fsphil> would be an interesting experiment
[14:29] <fsphil> programming the payload to find and decode the signal would be an interesting project
[14:29] <fsphil> or could just send it up and record everything, decode on the ground after recovery
[14:29] <Maxell> Nah, just a transponder
[14:30] <Maxell> However, it might pick up a lot of signals up there
[14:30] <fsphil> if I was sure I was going to get my next flight back I'd love to fly an rtlsdr sometime
[14:30] <Maxell> DomEX would drown in the QRM
[14:30] <fsphil> have it record various bands for a few minutes at a time
[14:30] <Maxell> fsphil: RevSpace was almost doing it
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[14:31] <fsphil> at 30km the FM broadcast band will be a mess :)
[14:31] <Maxell> lack of time and dedication crushed the plans
[14:31] <Maxell> We would execute it like this: bash script that would pipe the output of rtl_sdr to SD-card
[14:32] <fsphil> filename could contain the time, position and altitude
[14:34] <Maxell> and hop every 5 minutes from 27 mhz, fm broadcast, acars, APRS, PMR446, etc etc etc
[14:34] <fsphil> exactly
[14:34] <fsphil> that'd be rather cool
[14:34] <Maxell> And not that hard to impplment
[14:35] <Maxell> `rtl_sdr -s 1024000 -f 144800000`
[14:35] <Maxell> would do aprs
[14:36] <Maxell> and ~half a megahertz of bandwith on it's sides
[14:37] <RocketBoy> all recovered
[14:37] <Maxell> rtl_fm, a simple narrow band FM demodulator for RTL2832 based DVB-T receivers
[14:38] <Ugi_> RocketBoy: good stuff.
[14:38] <Maxell> might even save some storage
[14:38] <Maxell> but requires the dongle not to shift
[14:38] <Ugi_> both in good shape? First seemed to be coming down hard
[14:38] <Maxell> so better take the whole megaherz of spectrum at once
[14:38] <Maxell> RocketBoy: niec
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[14:49] <Wouter-[PA3WEG]> I was actually already working on such a payload, but for a satellite ;)
[14:50] <mfa298> Maxell: newer versions of rtl_fm appear to support USB/LSB/AM as well - although my tests so far have had limited success
[14:53] <Wouter-[PA3WEG]> http://amsat-uk.org/2013/07/20/qb50-amateur-radio-transponder-payloads-to-launch-2014/
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[14:55] <Wouter-[PA3WEG]> one of the SDR functions will be to use it as spectrum analyzer from space, either max-holding a large chunk, or recording data
[14:55] <Wouter-[PA3WEG]> but the main challenge is getting the data down\
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[15:03] <Maxell> I remember something about decoding AIS from space
[15:03] <Maxell> and the recievers overloaded
[15:03] <Maxell> and not suffcient time slots
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[15:03] <Maxell> so they launched 6 with more directional antennas
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[15:04] <gm8apx> exit
[15:04] <costyn> hello peeps
[15:04] <Wouter-[PA3WEG]> heey costyn
[15:04] <Wouter-[PA3WEG]> how are you?
[15:04] <Wouter-[PA3WEG]> weather++ ?
[15:05] <gm8apx> exit
[15:05] <Wouter-[PA3WEG]> @maxell, thats my work ;)
[15:05] <costyn> Wouter-[PA3WEG]: sure, weather is always good... sometimes a bit too much
[15:05] <gm8apx> quit
[15:06] <Maxell> gm8apx: /quit
[15:06] <costyn> gm8apx: try /quit
[15:06] <Maxell> Wouter-[PA3WEG]: doeeeet make habtracker station from space :P
[15:06] <gm8apx> thanks
[15:06] <Wouter-[PA3WEG]> http://www.isispace.nl/cms/index.php/news/latest-news/124-dutch-nanosatellite-triton-1-delivered-for-launch
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[15:06] <Maxell> :P
[15:06] <Wouter-[PA3WEG]> shameless link to my work
[15:06] <Maxell> brb time to bike from delft to home ;_;
[15:07] <costyn> Wouter-[PA3WEG]: very cool. it's so tiny!
[15:07] <Wouter-[PA3WEG]> talk to you later, same is going to happen for me
[15:07] <Wouter-[PA3WEG]> as in biking to home, but later today
[15:08] <Wouter-[PA3WEG]> if you want to listen to me, fire up the local 70cm repeater on 430.350 ;) but hardly worth it
[15:08] <Wouter-[PA3WEG]> yes costyn, we are very proud of it
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[15:08] <Maxell> Wouter-[PA3WEG]: i might be "ouwehoeren" soon with you :P
[15:09] <Wouter-[PA3WEG]> but we still need the launch, that will also contain FUNcube-1, which I also built
[15:09] <costyn> Wouter-[PA3WEG]: yea en you should be :)
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[15:09] <costyn> Maxell: you getting a license?
[15:10] <Wouter-[PA3WEG]> I have three designs of me on that launch, the FUNcube-1 radio (and other parts) as hobby, the Delfi-N3XT transponder idea and the AIS satellite as work
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[15:14] <Wouter-[PA3WEG]> I would be a shame if the rocket blew up.....
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[15:18] <Ugi_> Wouter-[PA3WEG]: You designed a sat' as a hobby and had it launched?
[15:18] <gonzo_> looking forward to those launched wouter
[15:18] <gonzo_> launches
[15:23] <Wouter-[PA3WEG]> my fist one (university project Delfi-C3) has been launched
[15:23] <Wouter-[PA3WEG]> and the hobby one, FUNcube-1, is due for launch end of november
[15:24] <Wouter-[PA3WEG]> together with the work one (Triton-1) and the second University one (Delfi-N3XT)
[15:24] <Ugi_> I imagined you would need a budget the size of the GDP for a small country to launch your own sat'!
[15:24] <Laurenceb> do any of them have uplink?
[15:25] <Laurenceb> its only ~£10k
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[15:26] <Wouter-[PA3WEG]> depends on the launch opportunity, but FUNcube-1 was largely funded by donations to AMSAT-UK, and the RCF
[15:26] <Wouter-[PA3WEG]> and yes, uplinks as well
[15:26] <Laurenceb> useful for ballooning?
[15:26] <Wouter-[PA3WEG]> FUNcube-1 has a linear transponder for radio amateur use
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[15:27] <Ugi_> Laurenceb: wow! that's not too bad - I'm owed a midlife crisis and I'd much rather have a sat' than a sports car!
[15:27] <Wouter-[PA3WEG]> might be useful, but I did not have any time yet to further develop the idea. Plus it will be illegal to use in mist countries under a balloon
[15:27] <Laurenceb> what frequency?
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[15:28] <Wouter-[PA3WEG]> but I got myself involved in so many projects I will kjeep myself busy for the coming 10 years anyway
[15:28] <Wouter-[PA3WEG]> http://funcube.org.uk/
[15:29] <Wouter-[PA3WEG]> website in need of, and being, overhauled
[15:29] <Wouter-[PA3WEG]> downlink for telemetry will be 145.935MHz
[15:29] <Wouter-[PA3WEG]> and we will provide the decoder on the website (now in beta testing stage)
[15:30] <Wouter-[PA3WEG]> oh, and recarding the funding: some of you have bought the FUNcube dongle, and helped funding FUNcube with that, so thank you
[15:31] <Wouter-[PA3WEG]> if you bought the RTL dongles and feel guilty, you can donate ;)
[15:31] <Wouter-[PA3WEG]> <end of shameless fundraising>
[15:34] <fsphil> we should stick an ssdv transmitter on one of these satellites :)
[15:37] <Laurenceb> i was thinking for pico uplink
[15:39] <fsphil> it wouldn't be wise putting a satellite uplink covering an ism band
[15:39] <Laurenceb> hehe
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[15:41] <gonzo_> it's bad enough tyring to get weather and notams in place for a launch, trying to time it for a 20min sat pass could be a prob!
[15:42] <gonzo_> ssdv downling would be interesting through. With an onboard cam
[15:42] <gonzo_> though they usually run 1200 or 9600bd fsk, as the power budgets are higher than hab
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[15:43] <fsphil> would allow bigger images
[15:44] <fsphil> at 1200 baud ssdv is about the same speed as sstv for a 320x240 image
[15:44] <fsphil> well depending on content
[15:44] Action: SpeedEvil wants a FCD.
[15:44] <SpeedEvil> Toy budget is overstretched though.
[15:44] <SpeedEvil> And - to be realistic - time.
[15:44] <SpeedEvil> I don't need another (admittedly small) box sitting on the shelf rotting.
[15:45] <SpeedEvil> I'll probbaly need one with usb8 by the time i get round to it.
[15:45] <mikestir> fsphil: are you familiar with this COFDM-based hd sstv that I've seen a bit of on HF?
[15:45] <fsphil> mikestir: easypal?
[15:45] <mikestir> yes
[15:45] <mikestir> anyone done any work on trying that from a HAB?
[15:45] <fsphil> I've tried it a bit, but it's very difficult to get any kind of decode at all
[15:45] <fsphil> it's very fragile
[15:46] <mikestir> yeah I was just away on holiday in the middle of nowhere. good radio environment
[15:46] <mikestir> didn't get any decodes though
[15:46] <mikestir> although I only had the telescopic
[15:46] <fsphil> I've never got a decode here, but did via the SDR in .nl
[15:46] <fsphil> it needs a good percentage of the image data before it'll decode too
[15:47] <fsphil> side effect of using jpeg2k I think
[15:47] <fsphil> and the modulation scheme would be impossible with current hardware
[15:47] Action: fsphil waits to be corrected
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[15:47] <adamgreig> we can't do cofdm with any transmitter we're using on habs atm
[15:47] <adamgreig> pretty confident
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[15:48] <ibanezmatt13> afternoon
[15:48] <adamgreig> my bladeRF on a HAB, otoh...
[15:48] <fsphil> howdy ibanezmatt13
[15:48] <fsphil> would you really launch a bladerf? :)
[15:48] <adamgreig> yea
[15:48] <adamgreig> especially if it weren't mine
[15:48] <fsphil> oh yea
[15:48] <mikestir> lol
[15:48] <fsphil> good plan
[15:48] <adamgreig> (CUSF got money specially for buying some SDRs recently)
[15:48] <adamgreig> but it needs a usb3 host to do much out of the box
[15:49] <adamgreig> I think I'll be waiting for my hackRF to arrive in jan
[15:49] <adamgreig> smaller, cheaper
[15:49] <fsphil> the mode that codec2 is using could be interesting -- it can re-sync faster after losing lock
[15:49] <adamgreig> as someone mentioned earlier
[15:49] <adamgreig> easypal is neither easy nor pal
[15:49] <mikestir> I suppose an the mod could be dealt with in reasonable power an on an fpga, but then there's the complexity of upconversion and PA
[15:49] <adamgreig> I think dvb-s in some incandation would make more sense
[15:49] <mikestir> -an
[15:49] <adamgreig> mikestir: well that's why you'd send a bladerf
[15:49] <adamgreig> it's an FPGA and a tuner with a small PA
[15:49] <mfa298> a few of us tried easypal on 2m fm a couple of years ago and even that was a bit fun to get decodes on
[15:50] <fsphil> codec2 uses an "FDMDV-derived" modem
[15:50] <adamgreig> for simplicity though
[15:50] <adamgreig> dvb-s
[15:50] <fsphil> but for satellites I'd just stick with FSK or PSK
[15:50] <adamgreig> one bpsk stream with mpeg2
[15:50] <fsphil> much easier to track drift
[15:50] <adamgreig> easier to transmit, easier to receive
[15:50] <fsphil> indeed
[15:50] <adamgreig> easier to decode
[15:50] <adamgreig> easier to encode too for that matter
[15:51] <adamgreig> I have a few experiments along those lines in mind once I have the hackrf
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[15:51] <adamgreig> might actually buy a raspberry pi for the first time!
[15:51] <fsphil> whoa
[15:51] <adamgreig> but probably just use a beaglebone ;)
[15:51] <mikestir> well we actually got our NOTAM so I should actually have some HAB experience within the next fortnight
[15:51] <mikestir> after which I can spend some time with those camera modules I bought
[15:51] <adamgreig> maybe a PC104 :)
[15:52] <ibanezmatt13> can anybody spare a minute or so to go through a pretty straight forward A level maths question? I almost got it but I can't understand what I missed
[15:52] <adamgreig> I can try
[15:52] <ibanezmatt13> thanks: http://www.toothill.notts.sch.uk/data/files/dept/maths/aqaalevel/AQA-MD01-W-QP-JAN05.PDF
[15:52] <ibanezmatt13> question 7d
[15:53] <ibanezmatt13> you may not remember decision maths that well
[15:53] <adamgreig> haha
[15:53] <adamgreig> do you remember me mentioning my experience with D1?
[15:53] Action: fsphil claims 434.650 MHZ for two weeks time :)
[15:53] <ibanezmatt13> Not entirely :)
[15:54] <ibanezmatt13> basically, I got a lower bound of 44 and an upper bound of 51. But they got a lower bound of 45
[15:54] Action: mikestir claims 434.300 MHz for some time within the next two weeks
[15:54] <adamgreig> the recap is: teacher wouldn't teach it, but let us sit it as an extra module so it could be like a spare, so we all decided to learn it by ourselves, then we all didn't, then the day before I picked up the textbook for the first time, then we all did terribly
[15:54] Action: adamgreig claims 435+-5MHz for the rest of the year
[15:54] <ibanezmatt13> ah I see
[15:55] <adamgreig> anyway
[15:55] <adamgreig> that was years ago
[15:55] <ibanezmatt13> Well, they got a lower bound of 44, but the interval is 45<=t<=51
[15:55] <ibanezmatt13> So I wondered where the extra 1 came from
[15:55] <ibanezmatt13> that's all :)
[15:55] <ibanezmatt13> http://www.toothill.notts.sch.uk/data/files/dept/maths/aqaalevel/AQA-MD01-W-MS-JAN05.PDF mark scheme
[15:55] <Babs> "Find the optimal Chinese postman route" - page 3
[15:56] <Babs> good to see that racial stereotypes are still prevalent in exam papers
[15:56] <ibanezmatt13> haha, apprently it was named after a Chinese postman who had to deliver to lots of places and wanted to find an optimal route
[15:56] <Babs> They'll be asking how much wood is required to support a jerry built lean to next
[15:56] Action: fsphil claims the visible spectrum
[15:56] <fsphil> that'll show them!
[15:56] <fsphil> oh
[15:57] <ibanezmatt13> any ideas adamgreig? :/
[15:57] <adamgreig> lol they'll see the error of their ways I'm sure fsphil
[15:57] <Babs> fsphil - I am sure they will see your point of view.
[15:57] <Babs> *bows*
[15:57] <Babs> damn, adamgreig beat me to that by milliseconds
[15:57] <fsphil> so much for that bright idea
[15:57] <adamgreig> by like 4 seconds
[15:57] <adamgreig> >_>
[15:58] <adamgreig> that does seem a bit weird on first glance ibanezmatt13
[15:58] <Babs> My laptop is at Lagrange point 1
[15:58] <adamgreig> oh well fair enough then
[15:59] <ibanezmatt13> hmm, I'll just wait until I see my Maths teacher again
[15:59] <adamgreig> ibanezmatt13: so
[15:59] <adamgreig> the mark scheme says the interval is max(45, their(b)) <= T
[15:59] <adamgreig> which should be a clue
[15:59] <ibanezmatt13> I don't know what any of that means
[15:59] <ibanezmatt13> "their"
[15:59] <ibanezmatt13> ?
[15:59] <adamgreig> it means the lower bound on the interval is the larger of 45 and whatever answer you got for (b)
[15:59] <adamgreig> (i.e. 44, so max(45,44)=45)
[16:00] <ibanezmatt13> where's the 45 from?
[16:00] <adamgreig> "by deleting F, another lower bound of 45 miles is obtained"
[16:00] <adamgreig> text to part c
[16:01] <ibanezmatt13> ooooh
[16:01] <ibanezmatt13> I see
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[16:01] <LeoBodnar> eroomde: It was a COMP mode quirk, sorted it by going into SCPI mode
[16:01] <adamgreig> I think perhaps having deleted F, the 44 path you found in (b) is not valid
[16:01] <adamgreig> so if 45 miles is the lower bound once F is deleted, obviously that's the bottom of the interval
[16:01] <ibanezmatt13> I used my answer to part 1 only, I forgot about the other lower bound :P
[16:01] <adamgreig> lol
[16:01] <adamgreig> "read the fine question"
[16:02] <ibanezmatt13> :)
[16:02] <ibanezmatt13> yes yes
[16:02] <ibanezmatt13> thanks adamgreig
[16:03] <adamgreig> np
[16:03] <LeoBodnar> Beautiful, beautiful, beautiful, thoroughly huggable power supply http://leobodnar.com/balloons/files/LiFePO4.png
[16:03] <adamgreig> oh very nice LeoBodnar
[16:04] <LeoBodnar> No averaging or any data massaging, straight from the acquisition
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[16:05] <LeoBodnar> Curve steps are courtesy Excel
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[16:06] <Wouter-[PA3WEG]> sorry guys work interrupt
[16:06] <Wouter-[PA3WEG]> SSDV is on the wish list, as is CODEC2 and DVB-S
[16:06] <Wouter-[PA3WEG]> but we are not sure yet
[16:07] <Wouter-[PA3WEG]> SSDV is easy to stick into the BPSK downlink, as is CODEC2
[16:07] <Wouter-[PA3WEG]> DVB-S requires some symbol rate changes, as that needs to be higher for off-the-shelf boxes
[16:08] <Wouter-[PA3WEG]> in any case, it nicely fits in with changes in the CubeSat market
[16:10] <Wouter-[PA3WEG]> biking home now....cheers all
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[16:39] <Maxell> omg hax http://science.slashdot.org/story/13/09/23/1151245/ballooning-spiders-use-electrostatic-forces-to-generate-lift
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[16:41] <enkidu> actually, we could use similar things to steer floaters
[16:46] <eroomde> LeoBodnar, noted thanks
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[17:01] <SpeedEvil> Maxell: I failed to actually read the original article.
[17:01] <SpeedEvil> is it 'oooh - this could be' or 'I measured the electric filed on the spider silk line at ..
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[17:42] Nick change: darkstar-20011 -> darkstar-2001
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[17:43] <arko> http://i.imgur.com/11hGmBW.png
[17:43] <arko> (language)
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[17:48] <mattbrejza> http://i.imgur.com/TMQrUut.png fixed arko
[17:48] <arko> hahahaha
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[17:48] <arko> my favorite is the comment "Fuck it, numerical methods it is" (sorry for lang)
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[17:50] <tweetBot> @daveake: Photos from the second LOHAN test flight #UKHAS #RaspberryPi http://t.co/U3jOiPJpua
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[18:23] <Lunar_Lander> hello
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[18:26] Nick change: MichaelC|Away -> MichaelC
[18:26] <enkidu> Estonians going to start space expedition?
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[18:33] <x-f> they have ESTCube-1 in the orbit since last year
[18:34] <enkidu> actualy I was thinking of EES
[18:35] <enkidu> strange beeps, but no modulation... pure hate
[18:35] <x-f> actually it was launched in May this year, sorry
[18:35] <x-f> enkidu, i asked Tramvai, he said that EES is just a temporary name, no deeper meaning
[18:35] <enkidu> ok
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[18:45] <jcoxon> evening all
[18:45] <arko> yo yo
[18:45] <arko> mr jcoxon
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[18:49] <eroomde> boss: 'so, er... what are you doing for food?'
[18:50] <arko> that sandwich place with the turkey and bluecheese
[18:50] <eroomde> 'the same thing you were thinking of suggesting. 10 mins?'
[18:50] <eroomde> nope curry
[18:50] <eroomde> it's 8pm
[18:50] <arko> hahaha
[18:50] <arko> oh yeah, that place
[18:50] <eroomde> usually happens if we're still here at about 8
[18:50] <eroomde> always slightly tentative
[18:51] <eroomde> even though we both know it'll be curry
[18:51] <arko> drive through those crazy roads in the rain
[18:51] <eroomde> 'any, er, you know, foodie plans?'
[18:51] <eroomde> they are not crazy
[18:51] <arko> :P
[18:51] <arko> haha, you need some discussion to at least make it seem like you had to think about it
[18:52] <eroomde> just you arefrom LA so windy british country roads in the rain at 50mph, to you, is like mountain passes on black ice at 40mph in norway by norwegians, to us
[18:52] <eroomde> where i was terified
[18:52] <eroomde> and it was quite normal to them
[18:52] <eroomde> they'd drift out of roundabouts
[18:52] <eroomde> and gradually straighen up maybe 30/40 yards after the exit
[18:52] <arko> yeah that was one of those "im sure ed knows what he's doing" moments
[18:53] <eroomde> and i hoped Pewal knew what he was doing
[18:53] <arko> Pewal?
[18:53] <eroomde> who was the man who took me on a 1hr drive through the norwegian dark to go fishin in some random fjord like 200 miles north of the arctic circle
[18:53] <eroomde> where i was certain i would meet my death
[18:54] <eroomde> Pewal was his name
[18:54] <eroomde> the random man who i was told by the local dodgy guy who owned the ports that i was to go fishing with
[18:54] <daveake> They have to be able to drive on snow to pass their driving test, I believe
[18:54] <eroomde> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jTwDe7Srhws
[18:54] <daveake> And no doubt they start driving sideways pretty early on
[18:55] <eroomde> there is never not snow in this place
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[18:55] <eroomde> that is peal
[18:55] <eroomde> at midday
[18:55] <eroomde> camera autoexposure makes it difficult to see but the pink on the horizon was as bright as it got
[18:55] <eroomde> like in the hour just before dawn
[18:55] <eroomde> but it was pretty dark
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[18:56] <eroomde> i actually took the video so that when my body washed up they could piece the evidence back together
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[18:56] <daveake> lol
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[18:57] <arko> ahhh
[18:57] <arko> hahaha
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[19:05] <mfa298> reading back a bit, the worse bit is when you phone up the curry house and get told we missed your order last week.
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[19:06] <mfa298> we were known for phoning 5 minutes after they opened on a sunday evening with a good sized order though.
[19:07] <eroomde> would be nice to go into a nice curry place and say 'the usual' and then switch off
[19:10] <mfa298> unfortunately the people ordering changed too much for it to be able to phone and say the usual, but it was always a decent sized order.
[19:10] <Willdude123_> Finished bf3.
[19:11] <Willdude123_> Not bad for >$10
[19:11] <eroomde> there is no upper bound
[19:11] <Willdude123_> *<$10
[19:11] <eroomde> :)
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[19:12] <Willdude123_> Mon French exchange is coming over a week on Wednesday. My room is a mess, seriously there's loads of coax and bare wire and boards and jumper wires and breadboards and stuff everywhere
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[19:15] <ibanezmatt13> wow, you get students coming from other countries to your place? The final memories of my school was 2 people getting stabbed by a pen knife :P
[19:16] <ibanezmatt13> college is a much nicer place
[19:16] <daveake> That's what happens when your exchange school is Swiss
[19:16] <mattbrejza> generic northeners comment
[19:16] <mattbrejza> much nicer in the south :P
[19:16] <ibanezmatt13> :)
[19:17] <mattbrejza> although not sure about london
[19:17] <mfa298> London's oop norf isn't it ?
[19:17] <Upu> anywhere below Sheffield is down south
[19:18] <mattbrejza> where does 'up north' become 'oop norf'?
[19:18] <Upu> above Sheffield
[19:19] <Upu> Sheffield people have more of an accent than I do
[19:19] <mfa298> maybe London is only up north, they've got a different silly accent
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[19:19] <daveake> and sharper knives
[19:19] <Paul-M6PFX> evening
[19:19] <ibanezmatt13> lol
[19:19] <Upu> Evening
[19:20] <eroomde> someone described oxford as 'south midlands' the other night
[19:20] <Upu> London is stabby capital of the UK
[19:20] <Upu> Birmingham
[19:20] <Upu> and then Manchester
[19:20] <Upu> http://www.theguardian.com/uk/2008/jul/17/knifecrime.ukcrime2
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[19:21] <eroomde> glascow for murder
[19:21] Action: mfa298 reads the first paragraph and then wonders which are the three biggest cities.
[19:22] <mfa298> I wonder if they're London, Birmingham and Manchester
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[19:22] <mattbrejza> did they forget to divide through by population?
[19:22] <eroomde> that stabbing article is totals
[19:22] <eroomde> it looks like
[19:22] <eroomde> not normalised by population
[19:23] <mfa298> certainly the first couple of paragraphs seem to imply it's totals
[19:23] <eroomde> i.e. basically the three biggest cities have the 3 largest numbers of stabbings, which is hardly surprising and not very useful as a statistic
[19:23] <adamgreig> but if they did divide through by population
[19:23] <Upu> but makes a good head line
[19:23] <Upu> SPACE
[19:23] <adamgreig> willing to bet the #1 would be some tiny town
[19:23] <adamgreig> because tiny population means you only need to stab one dude
[19:24] <Willdude123_> Urgh my interwebs are soo sloow
[19:24] <mattbrejza> needs to be done by borough or somthing like that
[19:24] <adamgreig> it's http://press.princeton.edu/chapters/s8863.pdf all over again
[19:25] <adamgreig> though I still don't understand why he calls that thing de moivre's equation
[19:25] <adamgreig> I mean, it's not de moivre's equation at all
[19:25] <adamgreig> so ?_?
[19:25] <mattbrejza> !g stabbiest borough uk
[19:26] <adamgreig> I guess if you call it "the most dangerous equation" you've gotta name it something scary
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[19:40] <ibanezmatt13> I think I should head off to bed now, been a long day of maths and physics
[19:40] <ibanezmatt13> night all :)
[19:41] <ibanezmatt13> well, listen to radio 4 extra for a bit, then bed :P
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[19:45] <iain_G4SGX> Very off topic request.. Is anyone online knowledgeable about large 3 phase motor starting and/or connections thereof? ie. a proper high current electrician?
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[19:48] <enkidu> it can be started using external 1ph motor or using "star diagram" connections
[19:49] <enkidu> then when running, it is shifted to "triangle"
[19:50] Nick change: LazyL_M0LEP -> LazyLeopard
[19:50] <enkidu> http://www.k3pgp.org/graphics_3phase/fig2.gif
[19:50] <enkidu> for 9 pole terminal
[19:52] <enkidu> iain_G4SGX: what exactly do you need?
[19:54] <iain_G4SGX> I got a report from a so called engineer, about a failed 3 phase fan and Im trying to work out what he's on about. ie. what failed and what to do on next install to make it right. Only 3 sentences, little info.
[19:54] <iain_G4SGX> Anything over 100mA im lost! lol
[19:55] <SpeedEvil> ##electronics
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[19:56] <Willdude123_> Sorry for the join and quits, my internet connecrion is dodgy
[19:57] <iain_G4SGX> SpeedEvil: did look for an electrician channel, will try electronics later.. tnx
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[19:59] Nick change: Geoff-G8DHE_ -> Geoff-G8DHE-M
[20:02] Action: mfa298 seems to recall Willdude123_ saying he never complained about internet at home.
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[20:02] <Willdude123_> I didn't do it as much as when I was on holiday
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[20:03] <mfa298> it seems to be fairly regularly that you complain about it.
[20:03] <Willdude123_> Sorry, that was my useless interwebs again.
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[20:04] <mfa298> and often it's pointed out that if you have a torrent client running that will make is slow.
[20:04] <Willdude123_> I don't.
[20:04] <arko> i just znc it yo
[20:04] <Willdude123_> Sorry, I'll shut up about my lack of good internet and consequently lack of a life.
[20:05] <mfa298> you don't need internet to have a life.
[20:05] <arko> too much internet is bad for you too
[20:05] <arko> i got my cousins a puzzle as a gift and they looked at me like "wtf is this?"
[20:05] <arko> continued playing games on their iphones
[20:06] <arko> what happen man, life was so simple
[20:06] <mfa298> or if you really need internet to have a life then you need to pay for an internet connection for that level of life. ADSL has no SLA's on it so can quite legitimately go down for long periods (days/ weeks/ months)
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[20:10] <Willdude123_> I need an internet connection to have a life.
[20:11] <mfa298> if you *need* an internet connection to have a life then there's something wrong.
[20:11] <arko> Willdude123_: get a bicycle dude
[20:11] <Willdude123_> mfa298, I know there's something wrong.
[20:12] <Willdude123_> My general lack of a life.
[20:12] <Willdude123_> arko, nah.
[20:12] <Willdude123_> I had an accident about a year ago.
[20:12] <Willdude123_> My leg was covered in blood.
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[20:13] <LeoBodnar> Blood is manly
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[20:13] <Willdude123_> I vowed so long as I have a mark from it, I'm not cycling again.
[20:13] <arko> it's just your awesomeness trying to escape
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[20:13] <mfa298> it sounds like we're back to CANTDude rather than *WILL*dude
[20:14] <enkidu> Willdude123_: amateur. I had accident on mtb competition, my ankle was cut open. I finished competition
[20:14] <arko> LeoBodnar: no word from B-13?
[20:14] <Willdude123_> Lovely.
[20:14] <Willdude123_> mfa298, I stopped using that nick ages ago.
[20:14] <Willdude123_> And it was WONTdude not CANTdude
[20:15] <enkidu> no signs of bees around
[20:16] <arko> beads?
[20:16] <mfa298> from what you've said over the last few days/weeks it sounds like CANTdude or WONTdude. everytime someone suggests something your response is I cant do it.
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[20:18] <enkidu> should I open a stream from my SDR?
[20:19] <LeoBodnar> arko: no signs yet, will be possibly coming in range tomorrow
[20:20] <arko> cool
[20:21] <enkidu> http://ready.arl.noaa.gov/hypubout/13088_trj001.gif
[20:21] <Willdude123_> mfa298, most of the time I can't.
[20:22] <LeoBodnar> You have a computer Willdude123_, write an OS for heavens sake
[20:22] <Willdude123_> How?
[20:24] <arko> 0's and 1's
[20:24] <daveake> I prefer 1's and 0's
[20:24] <daveake> That's the way I roll
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[20:24] <LeoBodnar> Like Kildall, Gates, Torvalds, Voz and many others
[20:24] <LeoBodnar> Scrap Gates he bought it
[20:25] <LeoBodnar> But even he could program
[20:25] <mfa298> I read that first one as killall
[20:25] <Maxell> LeoBodnar: you joking m8?
[20:25] <Willdude123_> Ooh I have an idea.
[20:25] <Willdude123_> There was a project I abandoned a while ago.
[20:26] <LeoBodnar> Why's that? Evry kid should write an OS
[20:26] <LeoBodnar> You don't even have to know machine code anymore
[20:26] <enkidu> LA3EQ should be in range for 13
[20:26] <Willdude123_> I figured if I could start a torrent downloading while I'm at school or before I go to school, I could make it download during the day and then stream it later.
[20:26] <Willdude123_> Where do I start then?
[20:26] <LeoBodnar> [cross]assembler will do
[20:26] <Maxell> ×
[20:27] <fsphil> I wrote a HelloWorldOS
[20:27] <fsphil> it didn't do much
[20:27] <fsphil> but what it did, it did very well
[20:28] <daveake> Or write a compiler. That's another good one.
[20:28] <mfa298> closest I got to that was trying to do a custom linux router platform - so just have a single program at startup to configure routing, vlans, ports etc.
[20:28] <Willdude123_> daveake, how do I do that?
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[20:29] <daveake> Well I read a book then went and did it
[20:29] <fsphil> now I've never written a compiler
[20:29] <bertrik> what does the SDL pin do on the RFM22 breakout board?
[20:29] <daveake> use of brain is a good place to start
[20:29] <mfa298> I think I've still got a book on compilers - I can't remember much of it.
[20:29] <Willdude123_> Interesting how nowadays when people learn about computers they start at a high level and then come down
[20:30] <enkidu> bertrik: it is SDI
[20:30] <Maxell> [19:10] <Upu> "There is a labelling error on the PCB the pin marked SDI is connected to SDO, the pin marked SDL is actually SDI"
[20:30] <enkidu> Serial Data Input
[20:30] <Willdude123_> As in people start using a computer and gradually figure out how it works, rather than the other way round
[20:30] <Maxell> oh, not this "19:10" btw :P
[20:31] <daveake> I read "Writing interactive compilers and interpreters" by P. J. Brown, Wiley. Very readable.
[20:31] Action: fsphil makes a note
[20:31] <bertrik> Maxell: thanks
[20:31] <bertrik> RFM22 version = 6 I get now
[20:31] <Maxell> bertrik: use teh google friend
[20:34] <mfa298> Willdude123_: even 15 (and probably more) years ago people started at a high level. I started off with {BBC|Quick|Visual} Basic, It was at Uni I started more computer architecture stuff and programming in C.
[20:35] <Willdude123_> Our school teaches GCSE computing with Visual Basic
[20:35] <Willdude123_> It seems soooo simple
[20:35] <daveake> simple and crap
[20:35] <Willdude123_> Even my mum used to know VB
[20:36] <daveake> I started with BASIC. I still haven't recovered normal brain function.
[20:36] <Willdude123_> I guess that describes IT in schools pretty well daveake. Simple and crap.
[20:36] <mfa298> depends on what you want to do with it. Great for interfaces, impossible to do some more advanced stuff (or at least was when I last used it - vb3 days)
[20:36] <LeoBodnar> Do you think FORTRAN IV is better? This was highest level language 40 years ago.
[20:36] <Willdude123_> That would make a good motto for my school.
[20:37] <LeoBodnar> not sure about "est" but very high anyway
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[20:37] <daveake> FORTRAN 77 was half reasonable.
[20:38] <LeoBodnar> Agree * formatting almost saved the world
[20:38] <LeoBodnar> daveake: Have just looked at NOAA txt data format help file: "2F9.3 - starting latitude, longitude"
[20:38] Action: LazyLeopard started on FORTRAN IV, then (briefly) Microsoft BASIC, then Z80 Assembler, then IBM Assembler, then...
[20:38] <LeoBodnar> http://ready.arl.noaa.gov/hypub/trajinfo.html#FORMAT
[20:39] Action: fsphil resists commenting on VB
[20:39] <daveake> My route was (Southampton) BASIC - Z80 - FORTRAN IV - BCPL - 77 - C - Pascal
[20:40] <enkidu> Ive started with basic, then pascal, php, js, C++
[20:40] <LeoBodnar> Pascal after C is unusual route
[20:40] <cm13g09> mfa298: ping
[20:40] Action: LazyLeopard managed to avoid Pascal, and only flirted very briefly with BCPL.
[20:40] <mfa298> there's too many forms of BASIC (of which I'm not sure that VB can really be called BASIC)
[20:40] <enkidu> delphi after c++ is unusual route
[20:40] <mfa298> cm13g09: pung
[20:41] <enkidu> I've been told to remake old project written in pascal purely into c++
[20:41] <enkidu> my brain could be put on shelf that month
[20:43] <daveake> I wonder if some programming languages should have health warnings like on cigarette packets
[20:43] <daveake> PIC assembler for a start
[20:43] <enkidu> haskell
[20:44] <enkidu> subroutine separation by indentation
[20:44] <enkidu> most f***d up is only whitespace language
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[20:50] <LeoBodnar> enkidu: This tab-significance concepts still makes me feel as if it's can't be true
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[20:50] <enkidu> someone was trying to teach developers about proper indentations ;)
[20:50] <LeoBodnar> *correct to taste
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[20:51] <LeoBodnar> However FORTRAN statements had fixed position on a punchcard. I don't know... Nurse!!!
[20:52] <Willdude123_> Brainfuck is pretty messed up.
[20:52] <Willdude123_> The name makes me thing of cluster headaches
[20:53] <Laurenceb__> is it safe to put regular lubricating oil on a delrin, nylon, silicone rubber, and polycarbonate construction?
[20:53] <LeoBodnar> What's "regular lubricating oil" Laurenceb__ ?
[20:53] <Laurenceb__> wd40 or whatever
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[20:53] <Laurenceb__> 'mineral oil'
[20:54] <enkidu> Ive seen silicone rubber dissolved by bike chain oil
[20:54] <LeoBodnar> Oh, not K&Y then?
[20:54] <Laurenceb__> heh
[20:54] <LeoBodnar> I have no idea lol
[20:54] <Laurenceb__> its a quick release pneumatic connector im design for work stuff
[20:54] <Laurenceb__> wondering how to lubricate it
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[20:54] <enkidu> ptfe lube
[20:55] <LeoBodnar> Silicon lubricant are so greasy it's impossible to get rid of it
[20:55] <LeoBodnar> which is good in my book
[20:55] <LeoBodnar> *s or *is
[20:56] <LeoBodnar> All industrial stuff should have rating of compatible fluids
[20:56] <Laurenceb__> heh apparently regular oils dissolve polycarbonate
[20:56] <Laurenceb__> that not too helpful
[20:56] <LeoBodnar> You are the most chemistry-ish here I though?
[20:57] <Laurenceb__> heh
[20:57] <Laurenceb__> i guess
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[20:57] <LeoBodnar> Use silicon lubricants and blame failures on me
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[20:58] <LeoBodnar> Apparently "lubricant" is the wrong term, grease is
[20:59] <staylo> grease is the word?
[20:59] <Laurenceb__> yeah i guess
[21:00] <Laurenceb__> http://www.efunda.com/designstandards/oring/oring_chemical.cfm?SM=none&SC=Silicone%20Grease
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[21:00] <Laurenceb__> apparently not suitable - i need a dynamic seal to a silicone o-ring
[21:00] <Laurenceb__> very annoying
[21:01] <Willdude123_> Can anyone help with linux permissions?
[21:02] <Willdude123_> I'm running transmission.
[21:02] <Willdude123_> Error: Permission denied (/home/tim/t/Monsters University 2013 HDTS XviD-Feel-Free/vlcsnap-2013-07-14-09h18m16s182.png)
[21:02] <enkidu> man chmod
[21:02] <enkidu> man chown
[21:02] <Willdude123_> /home/tim/t was create by tim and seems to be running by tim.
[21:02] <Willdude123_> But is transmission running from root?
[21:02] <LeoBodnar> Set group ownership to FAST
[21:02] <Willdude123_> If so, how do I give it to root?
[21:03] <mfa298> root should normally have permission toeverything by default
[21:03] <Willdude123_> Hmm. I wonder why I get this error then
[21:03] <mfa298> and you really shouldn't run stuff as root
[21:04] <mfa298> it maybe that what you're running as root is actually changing to another user in which case you need to see its config file
[21:04] <LeoBodnar> send a message to root on your system and kindly ask them to grant you permissions
[21:04] <LeoBodnar> possibly in Chinese
[21:05] <Laurenceb__> hahahaha
[21:05] <Laurenceb__> vegetable oil
[21:05] <Laurenceb__> perfect, problem solved
[21:05] <LeoBodnar> get one with garlic flavour
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[21:06] <Laurenceb__> yup
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[21:06] <LeoBodnar> And put expenses through work
[21:06] <Willdude123_> Not sure if it's actually running as root or not.
[21:06] <Willdude123_> I just installed it and it worked
[21:06] <Willdude123_> Using sudo
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[21:11] <Laurenceb__> interesting - cinnamon oil dissolves silicone
[21:12] <LeoBodnar> What, crystalline silicon?
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[21:14] <LeoBodnar> Laurenceb__: apparently LiPo "formation" process can take a few weeks for a properly QCed battery. I don't believe these little LiPo cells that cost £1-2 go through anything like that
[21:14] <SpeedEvil> the 'e' is important
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[21:15] <LeoBodnar> Lol indeed
[21:16] <Laurenceb__> LeoBodnar: interesting - i was looking for some of the low temperature lipo batteries
[21:16] <LeoBodnar> So "inhibitor myth" could be just caused by under-formationed (sp?) cells that were not put through all the cycles at the factory
[21:16] <Laurenceb__> couldnt find any on webstores
[21:16] <Laurenceb__> i see
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[21:17] <Laurenceb__> it seems for most cells their useful capacity drops off exponentially below -20C
[21:17] <Laurenceb__> probably what you were seeing
[21:17] Action: SpeedEvil was wondering earlier about just how hard it is to make lead acid.
[21:17] <Laurenceb__> thats a point - could NiCd work
[21:17] <LeoBodnar> I can'r find any details of the process but the idea is to bring up the battery to its working state from fully discharged one
[21:19] <LeoBodnar> The problem is ion starvation in the cold electrolyte which is most pronounced when peak currents are drawn
[21:19] <LeoBodnar> Maybe combining LiPo with a supercap would do the trick?
[21:19] <Laurenceb__> maybe
[21:19] <LeoBodnar> Silly GPS wakes up and demands 100mA of current at the peak
[21:19] <Laurenceb__> looks like B-13 maybe died like that
[21:20] <Laurenceb__> but there are -40C lipo cells being made
[21:20] <LeoBodnar> standing tall like a hero!
[21:21] <Lunar_Lander> yeah :D
[21:21] <Maxell> snif- R.I.P. B-13
[21:22] <Laurenceb__> might see it over Poland tomorrow
[21:22] <LeoBodnar> I guess cold batteries need veeery thin layer of electrolyte and thus are very expensive due to cathode/anode material becoming large proportion of weight
[21:23] <Laurenceb__> i wonder if that means the high C stuff is better
[21:23] <Laurenceb__> the RC kit
[21:24] <Maxell> Never forget--- hey look B-14 is filling up
[21:24] <LeoBodnar> I have been told by my LiPo supplier that when they wanted larger capacity cells they just asked girls to put thicker layer or paste on the cathode/anode
[21:24] <LeoBodnar> Which would work fine at normal temperatures but not in colder ones
[21:25] <Laurenceb__> interesting
[21:25] <Laurenceb__> http://www.hardingenergy.com/pdfs/6%20Lithium%20Polymer.pdf
[21:25] <Laurenceb__> page 3
[21:26] <Mik_WD8MNV> maybe use solar cell to heat battery??
[21:27] <enkidu> LeoBodnar: actually they differs in electrolyte
[21:28] <Laurenceb__> grrr
[21:28] <Laurenceb__> http://www.powerstream.com/LLL-low-temp.htm
[21:28] <Laurenceb__> want mini version
[21:29] <Laurenceb__> i suspect itd be worth trying an RC battery
[21:29] <Laurenceb__> as the ESR will be lower
[21:29] <Laurenceb__> it seems the ESR goes up as temperature decreases
[21:30] <enkidu> yes, it is true
[21:30] <enkidu> esr is related to ion movability
[21:31] <Laurenceb__> http://www.indoorflyer.co.uk/fr-130mah-cell-117-p.asp
[21:31] <Laurenceb__> but no stock
[21:31] <Laurenceb__> http://www.indoorflyer.co.uk/fr-200mah-cell-411-p.asp
[21:31] <Laurenceb__> bbl
[21:32] <LeoBodnar> enkidu: I understand that electrolyte is similar to engine oil, you can have a winter one or hot summer one but not one that is good in both
[21:32] <enkidu> actually you could engineer electrolyte covering very wide temperature range
[21:32] <Upu> how big (mah) is the cell you are currently putting on these LeoBodnar ?
[21:32] <LeoBodnar> So cold electrolyte remains active at lower temeratures but becomes unstable at lower temperatures as well which is a safety hazard
[21:33] <LeoBodnar> 160mAh
[21:33] <enkidu> http://www.wewinbattery.com/en/html/products/2012-2-4/201224161128.html
[21:33] <Upu> impressive that lasts all night
[21:36] <enkidu> there are some coin size batteries that may be used at -20 degrees
[21:37] <enkidu> Lithium Manganese Dioxide rechargeables
[21:37] <Laurenceb__> win battery
[21:37] <Laurenceb__> must be good
[21:40] <enkidu> 2032 size, 3g, but only 65mah
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[21:46] <RAMM25> hello
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[22:01] <craag> mfa298: No indexes apart from row id on the batc chat table.
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[22:02] <craag> Add indexes for 'room' and 'active', the two columns used in querying for new messages.
[22:02] <RAMM25> bye
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[22:04] <Lunar_Lander> evening craag
[22:04] <Lunar_Lander> Upu, hope you are getting better with time? :)
[22:06] Action: craag is considering writing this batc system up as how *not* to do php/mysql.
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[22:06] <craag> Just found the db user used for *reading* the chat logs has access to *all* the payment data..
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[22:08] <adamgreig> payment data?!
[22:09] <adamgreig> the same user that's probably wide open to any number of SQLi?
[22:09] <adamgreig> what's that URL again? :P
[22:09] <craag> I really didn't think it would be this deep..
[22:11] <mattbrejza> how long until people start typing '; DROP TABLE into the chat...
[22:11] <craag> noooooooooooooooooo
[22:12] <enkidu> actually it should be escaped already
[22:12] <mfa298> craag: based on performance I'm not surprised by the lack of useful indexes.
[22:13] <craag> things are db escaped it looks like
[22:13] <craag> phew
[22:13] <mfa298> certainly the chat stuff coming back had backslashes on ' etc.
[22:13] <craag> just not html/js escaped.
[22:13] <mattbrejza> tbh if it was open to that i think someone would have worked it out a while ago
[22:13] <craag> yeah
[22:13] <WillTablet> Wow bf3s ending is complicated
[22:14] <WillTablet> I didn't manage to figure out the problem with transmission.
[22:14] <WillTablet> Problem is with computers is sometime you spend so long trying to find a solution for it you just give up
[22:16] <mfa298> i wouldn't be surprised if people hadn't probed it much for insecurities.
[22:16] <mfa298> most of the probing I see on my web code is automated stuff for known exploits in various common apps.
[22:16] <mfa298> stuff like exploits in phpMyAdmin and wordpress.
[22:18] <WillTablet> I actually have no clue what the problem is now.
[22:18] <WillTablet> It should have acesss.
[22:18] <WillTablet> I better check which user owns the process, probably root.
[22:19] <WillTablet> If it is running as root it should have access to the folder
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[22:31] Nick change: heathkid|2 -> heathkid
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[23:53] <arko> was there a southern calfornian here last night?
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[00:00] --- Tue Sep 24 2013