highaltitude.log.20130810

[00:00] <arko> they filmed it near my place
[00:00] <arko> 1 of the scenes
[00:00] <arko> the rest of it was in burbank
[00:00] <arko> its pretty funny and stupid
[00:00] <arko> i watched 5 minutes of it though
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[00:06] <Laurenceb_> looks good
[00:06] <Laurenceb_> not as good as death race 2000
[00:06] <Laurenceb_> NOT the remake
[00:06] <Laurenceb_> wtf were they thinking with a remake
[00:07] <Laurenceb_> http://www.rottentomatoes.com/m/death_race_2000/
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[00:08] <Laurenceb_> www.youtube.com/watch?v=IOW0frZhKVQ
[00:08] <Laurenceb_> lolling
[00:11] <arko> music
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[00:56] <Steve_2E0VET> is there an easy way to convert an integer to char
[00:57] <K9JKM> I think the trick was to add something like 0X41 to the integer [0..9] and the resulting sum was the ascii equivalent
[00:58] <K9JKM> Need to look on a hex ascii character table what the values for the digits are
[00:59] <Steve_2E0VET> thats too late at 2am lol
[00:59] <K9JKM> Good project after the morning coffee
[01:02] <LeoBodnar> 0x30 = '0'
[01:02] <K9JKM> Yeah ... there ya go!
[01:03] <LeoBodnar> I can't believe you need a table for that
[01:03] <LeoBodnar> 0x41 = 'A'
[01:03] <LeoBodnar> 0x61 = 'a'
[01:03] <LeoBodnar> etc
[01:03] <LeoBodnar> 0x20 = " "
[01:03] <LeoBodnar> That's all you need to know when you enter the big life
[01:04] <Steve_2E0VET> arh no what i meant was (bare with me i am new to all ths) i have a number that i want to print out but its complaining that i cannot convert int to char if that makes sense
[01:05] <LeoBodnar> Extra points for those who remember any EBCDIC codes
[01:06] <LeoBodnar> printf ?
[01:06] <LeoBodnar> int does not fit into char
[01:06] <LeoBodnar> char can hold only 256 values
[01:06] <LeoBodnar> int is usually +-32K
[01:07] <Steve_2E0VET> this is the code logEvent(freeRam());
[01:07] <LeoBodnar> if you know it's small you can force it
[01:07] <Steve_2E0VET> the error is invalid conversion from int to const char
[01:07] <LeoBodnar> ahm, what language this is in?
[01:07] <Steve_2E0VET> its on the srduino
[01:07] <LeoBodnar> const char?
[01:07] <Steve_2E0VET> *arduino
[01:07] <LeoBodnar> Oh, I'm off lol
[01:08] <LeoBodnar> consts are usually fixed and cannot be altered at runtime
[01:08] <LeoBodnar> drop const maybe?
[01:08] <LeoBodnar> I have never used Adruino
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[01:09] <Steve_2E0VET> no probs, i'll look again in the morning
[01:09] <LeoBodnar> Good night! XD
[01:10] <LeoBodnar> The purpose of CONST is to stop you accidentally altering it during the runtime
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[06:17] <WB8ELK> Can someone approve my Flight Doc for a flight I'm doing today August 10th at 1800 UTC?
[06:17] <WB8ELK> My Flight Doc # b59d97c83e04e645395ebae2805563a5
[06:17] <Upu> sure 1 sec Bill
[06:17] <Upu> approved
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[06:19] <WB8ELK> Thanks Anthony
[06:20] <Upu> welcome have a good flight
[06:20] <WB8ELK> hitching a ride with the local Ozonesonde flight today
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[06:21] <Upu> flying anything interesting ?
[06:22] <WB8ELK> Flying the $4 SparkFun 434 MHz module. AM modulating it with RTTY so I don't have to track the frequency drift during the flight.
[06:22] <WB8ELK> And the MAX-7
[06:23] <Upu> ok cool
[06:23] <Upu> Should be test flying the PAVA8 next week
[06:23] <WB8ELK> It takes about 2 minutes longer to get a good lock with the MAX-7 than it does with the MAX-6 but once it is locked it works great
[06:23] <WB8ELK> DId I send you the flight test data on the MAX7 when I flew it in June?
[06:24] <WB8ELK> Actually you can download it from SpaceNear
[06:25] <Upu> yeah you can get it
[06:25] <Upu> http://habitat.habhub.org/ept/
[06:26] <Upu> right need to walk dog back in 30
[06:27] <WB8ELK> I'll email you the flight data...it's the June 22nd flight
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[07:27] <ibanezmatt13> Morning :)
[07:34] <x-f> morning
[07:36] <ibanezmatt13> Is launching at Cambridge a good idea? I've ran the predictor every day this week and it's always ending up in the North Sea :/
[07:36] <Upu> weather changes
[07:37] <ibanezmatt13> I can't see the weather changing much. I'm hoping for a slight Eastily wind or none at all. Westily winds at Cambridge are not good
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[07:38] <Upu> http://predict.habhub.org/hourly/cambridge/
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[07:38] <ibanezmatt13> Upu: Could you open a PM for a second
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[07:45] <G0TDJ_Steve> Morning :-)
[07:46] <ibanezmatt13> Are these lines on the waterfall are normal: https://join.me/295-378-275
[07:47] <G0TDJ_Steve> ibanezmatt13: I'd say they were very strong because you are right on top of it.
[07:47] <ibanezmatt13> most likely yeah
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[07:47] <ibanezmatt13> So they'll be a lot weaker in flight?
[07:47] <G0TDJ_Steve> Can you attenuate somehow? Perhaps damp the reciever bu putting something in the way?
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[07:48] <G0TDJ_Steve> I guess so but remember you're talking to someone who hasn't had a launch yet
[07:48] <g0hww> what receiver are you using?
[07:48] <ibanezmatt13> alinco djx-10
[07:48] <ibanezmatt13> I could move the payload downstairs to another part of the house
[07:49] <ibanezmatt13> It's all portable in it's box now
[07:49] <G0TDJ_Steve> That would be good
[07:49] <ibanezmatt13> I'll try it, one sec
[07:49] <g0hww> are you just taking the audio out of the headphone socket? if so can you just turn the volume down?
[07:50] <G0TDJ_Steve> g0hww: Might still be good to get the tx a little ways away don't you think?
[07:50] <g0hww> yeah perhaps :)
[07:50] <ibanezmatt13> woa, this is nice. It's on the complete other side of the house, no antenna on the payload. Just a duck aerial on the receiver: https://join.me/905-381-505
[07:50] <ibanezmatt13> let me turn the volume down a bit
[07:51] <g0hww> i'd turn the volume down then turn it up until the back diamond in fldigi turns green (with only noise input, no signal)
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[07:52] <g0hww> mind you, its only 13dB SNR
[07:53] <ibanezmatt13> Is there something wrong?
[07:53] <ibanezmatt13> Is 13db not a bit low
[07:53] <g0hww> just saying that it doesn't look like a massively strong signal
[07:54] <ibanezmatt13> hmm
[07:54] <g0hww> so it doesn't seem to be close to overloading the rx or anything like that
[07:54] <ibanezmatt13> how can I tell if it was?
[07:55] <g0hww> whats does the S-meter read on the radio?
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[07:55] <g0hww> ah, you are txing into no antenna
[07:55] <g0hww> thats perhaps not such a good idea
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[07:56] <g0hww> you are txing into no antenna?
[07:56] <G0TDJ_Steve> How did you work that out g0hww?
[07:56] <ibanezmatt13> no
[07:57] <ibanezmatt13> I have the standard antenna on at the moment
[07:57] <g0hww> you said "woa, this is nice. It's on the complete other side of the house, no antenna on the payload. Just a duck aerial on the receiver"
[07:57] <ibanezmatt13> yep
[07:57] <ibanezmatt13> :/
[07:57] Action: G0TDJ_Steve isn't actually awake yet
[07:57] <ibanezmatt13> ah sorry, you asked are you txing, I thought rxing
[07:57] <g0hww> i wouldn't tx with no antenna attached
[07:58] <ibanezmatt13> I could tx with the 1/4 wave I made
[07:58] <G0TDJ_Steve> Not good, even at 10mW
[07:58] <g0hww> better to disconnect the rx antenna than the tx antenna
[07:58] <g0hww> or use a 50ohm resistor as a tx antenna
[07:58] <Steve_2E0VET> is it possibleconvert an interger to a string
[07:59] <ibanezmatt13> does the alignment of the radials and main element not matter
[07:59] <Steve_2E0VET> **is it possible to convert an interger to a string
[07:59] <g0hww> a bit
[07:59] <ibanezmatt13> why Steve_2E0VET
[07:59] <g0hww> in C? itoa()
[07:59] <Steve_2E0VET> ibanezmatt13, I have a subroutine that accepts a string but i want to send it a number as the string
[07:59] <Steve_2E0VET> arduino
[08:00] <ibanezmatt13> just declare the argument in your function as integer then convert it in the function
[08:01] <g0hww> ibanezmatt13, r your question "does the alignment matter?", i'd say a bit, but a wonky antenna probably better than none
[08:02] <ibanezmatt13> even if it's downstairs?
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[08:02] <g0hww> you need a proper load on the output stages
[08:02] <Steve_2E0VET> ibanezmatt13, http://pastebin.com/cXej93BK that may make it easier to understand
[08:02] <Steve_2E0VET> i want to send "v"
[08:02] <g0hww> a mismatched load might make the pitput stage fail
[08:02] <Steve_2E0VET> to the message logger
[08:02] <g0hww> output
[08:04] <g0hww> a wonky antenna may well present a reasonable load, but a missing antenna won't
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[08:04] <ibanezmatt13> Steve_2E0VET: I may be grasping at straws here but could you write a line before you send your characters to be written that automatically converts it to string whether it is or not anyway?
[08:05] <ibanezmatt13> I'll try it g0hww
[08:05] <ibanezmatt13> That way you always pass in a string
[08:06] <Steve_2E0VET> ibanezmatt13, i dont understand
[08:06] <Steve_2E0VET> ibanezmatt13, I am new to arduino and this programming
[08:06] <ibanezmatt13> ok, I'm not 100% with C but I'll have a go. Got your code?
[08:06] <ibanezmatt13> oh yes
[08:06] <ibanezmatt13> sorry
[08:07] <Steve_2E0VET> there is no real reason why "v" in freeram is an integer
[08:07] <ibanezmatt13> what's the error when you try to send v
[08:07] <Steve_2E0VET> it could be a string, its only the amount of free ram for diag purpouses
[08:07] <Steve_2E0VET> ibanezmatt13, invalid conversion fron int to const char
[08:08] <g0hww> is there no itoa() function in the standard library for arduino?
[08:08] <ibanezmatt13> ok... you're using a pointer there. Why don't you try without the pointer to see if that's the problem.
[08:09] <Steve_2E0VET> ibanezmatt13, you have lost me again
[08:10] <g0hww> it seems there is itoa(): http://playground.arduino.cc/Code/PrintingNumbers
[08:10] <ibanezmatt13> hmm, I know of some people on here who'd have you up and running with this in no time and I don't really want to mess anything up.
[08:11] <Upu> whats that temp sensor you're using ibanezmatt13 ?
[08:11] <ibanezmatt13> I'm not :)
[08:11] <ibanezmatt13> DS18B20
[08:11] <Upu> no on your PCB
[08:11] <ibanezmatt13> Oh that, god knows
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[08:11] <ibanezmatt13> Is it a MCP9700 or something
[08:11] <Upu> thats promising :)
[08:12] <ibanezmatt13> how come?
[08:12] <Upu> trying to find a temp sensor that runs at 1.8V
[08:12] <Upu> it doesn't
[08:12] <ibanezmatt13> ah right
[08:13] <ibanezmatt13> I'm gonna go play my piano for a bit
[08:14] <mikestir> tmp102 upu
[08:14] <Upu> oh nice thanks
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[08:15] <mikestir> or tmp112 which I think is the same die but binned for tighter tolerance
[08:19] <g0hww> Steve_2E0VET, it seems there is native support for converting strings to integers with the String class. of course i know nothing of arduino development per se. http://arduino.cc/en/Reference/StringConstructor
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[08:20] <g0hww> sorry, i meant integers to strings
[08:20] <Steve_2E0VET> g0hww, i will take a look, but in the meantime i am just going to firstly change the logging routine to take a simple string, nothing fancy
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[08:21] <ibanezmatt13> g0hww: I've put my 1/4 wave on the payload downstairs and I've now got no antenna upstairs. Still getting decodes
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[08:22] <g0hww> does the signal look cleaner in the waterfall?
[08:22] <ibanezmatt13> g0hww: https://join.me/990-579-033
[08:24] <g0hww> it doesn't look dissimilar (other than being very fast) from most of the signals i've seen
[08:24] <g0hww> the transmitter will be happier now though
[08:25] <ibanezmatt13> cool. Thanks
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[08:26] <ibanezmatt13> btw daveake, shaking the multimeter I hear something moving inside. (I think many months ago I probably did short the ammeter part out when I was learning :/ You were correct
[08:27] <g0hww> anything going up in the uk today?
[08:28] Action: G0TDJ_Steve is watching PYSY in Germany preparing on Tracker
[08:28] <_cOdaC_> hi guys, I'm on my first project and I need some advice for chosing the right balloon. I'm trying to build a payload <500g with a camera on board in order to take photos/video. What do I need to consider buying a balloon?
[08:31] <Upu> hey _cOdaC_
[08:31] <_cOdaC_> hey Upu
[08:31] <Upu> Two tools
[08:31] <Upu> http://habhub.org/calc/
[08:31] <Upu> and
[08:31] <Upu> http://habhub.org/predict
[08:31] <Upu> generally aim for about 5.5m/s ascent rate
[08:32] <Upu> You can buy the balloons here : http://www.randomengineering.co.uk/Random_Aerospace/Balloons.html
[08:33] <_cOdaC_> jesus.. brilliant
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[08:33] <_cOdaC_> thanks Upu!
[08:33] <Upu> welcome
[08:34] <G0TDJ_Steve> Upu: Thanks for sorting my friend Lee M6DRS out - He's a happy puppy :-)
[08:34] <Upu> Was that the rotator contoller ?
[08:34] <G0TDJ_Steve> Yep
[08:34] <Upu> nps
[08:34] <G0TDJ_Steve> I@m trying to egt him in here but he's not really a 'chat' type of person LOL
[08:35] Action: G0TDJ_Steve really needs to learn to type
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[08:36] <G0TDJ_Steve> Anyone from the PYSY team in the house?
[08:37] <d0wnl0rd> yupp, just joined
[08:37] <G0TDJ_Steve> Oh hi d0wnl0rd How goes it?
[08:38] <d0wnl0rd> We have some issues with the server, wen can upload telemetry data (success) but the data wont be shown on the map
[08:38] <d0wnl0rd> Right now 26.9 k
[08:38] <d0wnl0rd> Could someone with access to the server check please whats going on there
[08:38] <Upu> whats call sign ?
[08:39] <d0wnl0rd> PYSY6
[08:39] <d0wnl0rd> Sorry PYSY
[08:39] <Upu> sure you're uploading
[08:39] <Upu> nothing seen on log
[08:39] <Upu> online ?
[08:39] <d0wnl0rd> Yupp, other wise i couldnt chat, could i :-)
[08:39] <Upu> ibanezmatt13 can you just go offline please for a few mins
[08:40] <Upu> I mean dl-fldigi
[08:40] <Upu> is it set to online ?
[08:40] <d0wnl0rd> Green, message uploaded telemetry successfully
[08:40] <Upu> in dl-fldigi
[08:40] <Upu> DL Client
[08:40] <Upu> is online checked ?
[08:41] <d0wnl0rd> Yes it is, I just switched from online to offline and i got the warning message
[08:41] <Upu> ping ibanezmatt13
[08:41] <Upu> past a valid string here
[08:41] <ibanezmatt13> yep Upu :)
[08:41] <Upu> turn your dl-fldigi offline pls
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[08:41] <ibanezmatt13> ok
[08:41] <d0wnl0rd> Inaide the green bar: $$PYSY,383,08:40:53,48.76905,12.33235,27943,8,5514,-3.-2,-6.-9,64*01F5
[08:41] Geoff-G8DHE-M (~Geoff-G8D@90.218.232.253) joined #highaltitude.
[08:42] <d0wnl0rd> Inside log window: $$$$$PYSY,385,08:41:31,48.76975,12.32813,28152,8,5533,-3.-2,-6.-3,64*EFA5
[08:42] <Upu> [2013-08-10 08:42:31,773] DEBUG habitat.parser MainThread: Exception in UKHAS main parse: ValueError: Incorrect number of fields (got 10, expect 9)
[08:43] <d0wnl0rd> Mclane just blushed
[08:43] <d0wnl0rd> He mentions yo should switch to micropysy
[08:44] Hiena (~boreger@81.93.195.181.datatrans.hu) joined #highaltitude.
[08:44] <Upu> let me see if I can work it out hang on
[08:45] <g0hww> -3.-2
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[08:45] <g0hww> missing comma
[08:45] <g0hww> -6.-9
[08:45] <g0hww> likewise
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[08:46] <g0hww> is that whats wrong, Upu ?
[08:46] <Upu> its the 64 on the end
[08:46] <Upu> what is that d0wnl0rd ?
[08:46] <Upu> payload doc doesn't have that
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[08:48] <g0hww> what about the '.' chars that one might expect to be ',' chars? does that matter?
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[08:50] <LeoBodnar> Launch?
[08:50] <G0TDJ_Steve> Hopefully PYSY in Germay LeoBodnar if they fix a few issues
[08:50] <G0TDJ_Steve> And Good Morning
[08:50] <ibanezmatt13> Could I just ask how long a typical flight would be with a 5.9m/s accent rate (1200 balloon, 800g payload) roughly
[08:51] <LeoBodnar> Morning everyone! XD
[08:51] <ibanezmatt13> morning LeoBodnar
[08:51] <PE2G> d0wnl0rd: Thanks for the tip. I supposed it wasn't up yet.
[08:51] <PE2G> $$$$$PYSY,415,08:51:12,48.77517,12.25968,31731,8,5524,-2.-1,-3.-2,64*28E4
[08:52] <Upu> I am trying to fix it
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[08:54] <PE2G> PYSY's freq is slightly wobbly, but strong signal
[08:54] <d0wnl0rd> Unfortunately we do have an issue with the flightdoc, so telemetry data gets uploaded but throws some exceptions...
[08:55] <Upu> it is being looked at
[08:55] <Upu> but pretty pls test before launching
[08:55] <PE2G> http://s16.postimg.org/3ualh2ys5/Screen1011.jpg
[08:56] <d0wnl0rd> So for all the listeners out there: we are at 33,6 k and still rising (1200 g Hwoyee with about 650 g of payload so max height about 36k)
[08:57] <Willdude123> Morning people.
[08:58] <LeoBodnar> Upu: how did French solar balloon use APRS, isn't airborne APRS not allowed in France?
[08:58] <G0TDJ_Steve> d0wnl0rd: 434.650?
[08:58] <Upu> its not :)
[08:58] <d0wnl0rd> 434650
[08:58] <LeoBodnar> OK
[08:59] <G0TDJ_Steve> d0wnl0rd: OK Sadly can't hear it here yet but will monitor
[08:59] <Willdude123> Woah my znc bouncer just gave me a load of stuff like (354) 152 #highaltitude Willdude123 H
[08:59] <d0wnl0rd> Current height 34.7 k
[08:59] <PE2G> I have PYSY on 434.6516
[09:00] malgar (~malgar@adsl-ull-171-23.49-151.net24.it) joined #highaltitude.
[09:00] <Willdude123> And (354) 152 #highaltitude Up* H
[09:00] <Willdude123> This is weird.
[09:00] <Willdude123> Any launches today?
[09:00] <PE2G> Distance 560 km now
[09:01] <PE2G> PYSY Burst
[09:02] <d0wnl0rd> 35437 m, burst
[09:02] <Upu> should be appearing on the map soon keep uploading
[09:02] <PE2G> http://s7.postimg.org/olbyqkzq3/Screen1012.jpg
[09:04] <Upu> you're on the map
[09:04] <Upu> thanks to DanielRichman
[09:04] <DanielRichman> and Randomskk
[09:04] <DanielRichman> there were two problem to fix ;-)
[09:04] <Upu> yes and Randomskk
[09:08] <Willdude123> Upu will 8 pin headers be fragile on the Ublox board? Is there a way I can mount them to the surface?
[09:10] <PE2G> Losing it already: http://s21.postimg.org/l6im3c9l3/Screen1014.jpg
[09:11] <d0wnl0rd> UPU: thanks a lot to everyone who helped around our issues
[09:12] <d0wnl0rd> DanielRichman: mclane will apologize later :-)
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[09:13] <d0wnl0rd> looks like our pyro cutdown has worked :-)
[09:13] <LeoBodnar> Upu: got APRS finished last night on my tracker
[09:14] <LeoBodnar> Why oh why don't I use AVR or C?
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[09:15] <LeoBodnar> I didn't know AX.25 uses HDLC framing
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[09:19] <Darkside> LeoBodnar: you didn't code in C?
[09:19] <LeoBodnar> ASM all the way baby
[09:19] <Darkside> oh my god
[09:19] <Darkside> you implemented APRS in assembly
[09:20] <Darkside> on a PIC
[09:20] <LeoBodnar> Like everything else
[09:20] <Darkside> you are
[09:20] <Darkside> well
[09:20] <Darkside> im not sure what you are
[09:20] <Darkside> either very very brave
[09:20] <Darkside> or insane
[09:20] <LeoBodnar> a bit of both
[09:20] <Darkside> still
[09:20] <Darkside> wow
[09:20] <Darkside> just wow
[09:20] <LeoBodnar> Modulating Si4462 digitally as well to boot
[09:21] <LeoBodnar> Phase continuous and all that jazz
[09:21] <Darkside> so you did FM APRS using the 010101 method?
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[09:21] <LeoBodnar> No, shifting the carrier frequency as you need pr-emphasis as well
[09:21] <Darkside> where you transmit repeats of 0101 at 1200 or 2400 baud, to get your 1200 or 2400 hz FM tones
[09:21] <iain_g4sgx> Leoodnar: Dont suppose you post your asm code on github? Just for a guide of course..;)
[09:22] <LeoBodnar> otherwise demodulated signal looks crap, 1200Hz tone is twice the level of 2200Hz
[09:22] <Darkside> mm
[09:22] <Darkside> how do you get the carrier shift resolution then?
[09:22] <Darkside> or are you PWMing that
[09:22] <LeoBodnar> So 1200Hz deviation should be somewhere around 1.5kHz while 2200Hz is 3kHz
[09:23] <Darkside> k
[09:23] <LeoBodnar> I'm changing the PLL freq - it has 7Hz resolution
[09:24] <Darkside> cool
[09:24] <Steve_2E0VET> Upu, does this mean its broken http://imgur.com/iaJpaFR
[09:24] <LeoBodnar> Had to write state machine for all the timing between possible 0<->1 transitions as they can end up in different phase on 2200Hz segment
[09:25] <LeoBodnar> It's very tight because even though Si446x uses SPI it needs some time to digest the command
[09:26] <Darkside> yeah i was wondering how that works
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[09:26] <Darkside> Steve_2E0VET: yes
[09:26] <Darkside> very much so
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[09:26] <Darkside> you will need a new antenna
[09:27] <LeoBodnar> Pulling VCXO would be so much easier like everyone else is using
[09:27] <Steve_2E0VET> can it just not be soldered
[09:27] <LeoBodnar> very sad looking Sarantel
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[09:27] <Steve_2E0VET> just as i thought i got it working i dropped it
[09:28] <Steve_2E0VET> what sort of antenna would i need, are there just 2 types active and possibly non active
[09:29] <LeoBodnar> iain_g4sgx: I am planning to but it's just an initial test atm
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[09:53] <Upu> yes Steve_2E0VET thats knackered
[09:53] <Upu> needs a new one
[09:53] <Upu> hey LeoBodnar
[09:53] <Upu> hope you put some geofencing code in there too :)
[09:54] <LeoBodnar> Not yet but it will be there XD
[09:54] <LeoBodnar> I haven't decided how it should work yet
[09:55] <Willdude123> ping Upu
[09:56] <Upu> and you don't have a full license
[09:56] <Upu> :)
[09:56] <Upu> morning Will
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[10:03] <Steve_2E0VET> Upu, do you have replacement antennas and how much are they?
[10:04] <Upu> http://ava.upuaut.net/store/index.php?route=product/product&path=59_65&product_id=80
[10:05] <Upu> post it back to me, purchase the antenna and I'll fit it for you
[10:05] <Upu> you'll need a hot air to remove the old bit
[10:05] <Steve_2E0VET> upu dont suppose you are open today?
[10:05] <Upu> Nope
[10:06] <Steve_2E0VET> ok, i'll post it back to you, or may drop through your letterbox if you have one.
[10:06] <Upu> business park may be closed
[10:06] <Steve_2E0VET> will any "non" active antenna work on it
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[10:07] <Upu> well I would put the Sarantel back on as the pads are designed for that
[10:07] <Steve_2E0VET> its just i can get one with a lead on, which i need for testing as i am in the garage with no windows, then purchase a complete module for the flight
[10:08] <Upu> no idea if it will work
[10:08] <chrisstubbs> I dont suppose the lands for the sarantel are the same for an SMA?
[10:09] <Upu> not quite but an SMA may fit
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[10:16] <LeoBodnar> You can try just a piece of 2" wire for testing but make sure it is insulated as you can zap MAX-6 with static via antenna port
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[10:17] <Steve_2E0VET> i dont know if the ublox is knackered either after dropping it
[10:17] <LeoBodnar> Going to get full licence before I fly it Upu
[10:17] <Darkside> eh?
[10:17] <Darkside> flying APRS?
[10:17] <LeoBodnar> Over Europe
[10:18] <Darkside> aha
[10:19] <Steve_2E0VET> LeoBodnar, anythings worth a try so i can carry on testing, any idea where the wire would be soldered too
[10:19] <LeoBodnar> Middle pad of the three
[10:19] <gonzo_p> anything flying in the uk today?
[10:20] <Steve_2E0VET> LeoBodnar, cheers
[10:20] <LeoBodnar> Steve_2E0VET: you should at least time lock
[10:20] <LeoBodnar> *get
[10:20] <Steve_2E0VET> LeoBodnar, thats all i really want for now
[10:21] <LeoBodnar> Steve_2E0VET: http://leobodnar.com/balloons/B-5/Images/3.jpg
[10:22] <Steve_2E0VET> LeoBodnar, is that insulated?
[10:22] <LeoBodnar> But get a proper one from Upu, he needs cash
[10:22] <LeoBodnar> XD
[10:22] <LeoBodnar> No, that's probably how I have zapped MAX-6
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[10:22] <Steve_2E0VET> LeoBodnar, i will be getting a proper one, but im going to be without anything for a week
[10:23] <LeoBodnar> I have been testing it for days but killed MAX-6 at launch - probably because there was a lot of polystyrene around, ballon inflating, etc
[10:24] <LeoBodnar> Regular insulated wire is OK
[10:24] <Steve_2E0VET> i really need some form if external antenna for testing
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[10:25] <LeoBodnar> Actually this one flew as shown, it's B-6 that got zapped
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[10:29] <Steve_2E0VET> http://imgur.com/Bhn6Ess
[10:33] <Steve_2E0VET> LeoBodnar, we got time.... cheers mate
[10:34] <LeoBodnar> nps
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[10:34] <Steve_2E0VET> LeoBodnar, +2 sats at the moment
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[10:37] Nick change: ibanezmatt13_ -> ibanezmatt13
[10:38] <ibanezmatt13> is this cool or is this cool? https://www.dropbox.com/s/hy5a17qkfty8ca0/edsktop.png
[10:38] <ibanezmatt13> to scale as well :)
[10:40] <LeoBodnar> If this is a panel you need tooling strips :)
[10:40] <Willdude123> Upu, still around? will 8 pin headers be fragile on the Ublox board?
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[10:41] <Willdude123> Morning daveake
[10:45] <Upu> don't understand what you mean Willdude123 ?
[10:45] <Upu> the ones I supply ?
[10:45] <Willdude123> On the ublox board if I solder headers to it, will they snap off easily, as they're a few centimeters above the board?
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[10:46] <Upu> nah still zero idea what you're on about
[10:46] <Upu> there are holes for the header ?
[10:46] <Willdude123> Ah right. Nvm then
[10:47] <Willdude123> Also, why is there i2c, if hardware serial is better?
[10:47] <Upu> its not better its just a different way of doing it
[10:50] <mfa298> some people have a good reason for using i2c rather than serial (the uC serial port might be busy doing something else)
[10:50] <Willdude123> OK I'll use async serial.
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[10:53] <ibanezmatt13> Upu: What was the name of that step up I was using when first learning Eagle? Was it a TPS61201 or something like that?
[10:54] <iain_g4sgx> Hey, the new GQRX is out with inbuilt support for FCD pro+, ppa available
[10:55] <Upu> thats the one
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[10:55] <ibanezmatt13> I'm gonna have a look into it for a different project. What's the general way to use one of these?
[10:56] <Lunar_LanderU> hello
[10:56] <ibanezmatt13> Morning Lunar_LanderU
[10:56] <ibanezmatt13> just about
[10:57] <bertrik> Any launches this weekend?
[10:57] <Lunar_LanderU> mattbrejza: I thought about our discussion today
[10:58] <Lunar_LanderU> maybe I will use the PCB I now got, without populating the stepup and instead installing a 12 V battery
[10:58] <Lunar_LanderU> but that would be a configuration in which the LM311 would be run at 12V
[10:58] <ibanezmatt13> has anybody got a schematic that uses a step up regulator?
[10:59] <Lunar_LanderU> ibanezmatt13: http://s.gullipics.com/image/3/d/c/ji1rd83-kuqr5f-j4i/PINSchematicV1.png
[10:59] <Lunar_LanderU> top left
[10:59] <ibanezmatt13> thanks :)
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[11:00] <ibanezmatt13> Lunar_LanderU: MC34063?
[11:00] <Lunar_LanderU> yea
[11:01] <Lunar_LanderU> MC34063A in fact, from ON Semi
[11:01] <ibanezmatt13> I've never really understood what an inductor actually is
[11:01] <ibanezmatt13> Google time
[11:01] <daveake> opposite of a capacitor
[11:02] <ibanezmatt13> I'm trying to visualise what the opposite of a capacitor would be :)
[11:02] <ibanezmatt13> give out charge
[11:02] <ibanezmatt13> nah
[11:02] <Randomskk> stores energy magnetically instead of electrically
[11:02] <daveake> Capacitor tries to stop the voltage across it changing; inductor tries to stop the current through it from changing
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[11:03] <Randomskk> capacitors pass AC and block DC while inductors pass DC and block AC
[11:03] <ibanezmatt13> right, so why are they needed in step up regulator circuitS?
[11:03] <Randomskk> they are needed in some designs of step up regulators because
[11:03] <Randomskk> well
[11:04] <Randomskk> do you understand how a step up works?
[11:04] <ibanezmatt13> not really looked into it
[11:04] <Randomskk> a flyback style one anyway. there are ones that just need capacitors and diodes
[11:04] <Randomskk> okay
[11:04] <Randomskk> so a very quick explanation
[11:04] <Randomskk> you take your input DC and short circuit it through an inductor
[11:04] <Randomskk> that develops a high current in the inductor, which creates a magnetic field
[11:04] <Randomskk> the magnetic field stores energy
[11:04] <Randomskk> then you stop the current very quickly
[11:05] <Randomskk> the inductor tries to keep the current going (that's what they do - the magnetic field is still around)
[11:05] <Randomskk> but there's nowhere for the current to flow because you've just closed the switch
[11:05] <Randomskk> the consequent collapsing magnetic field induces a higher and higher voltage in the inductor as it tries to dissipate the energy
[11:05] <Randomskk> once that voltage is high enough, it goes through a diode and is stored in a capacitor
[11:06] <Randomskk> this whole process repeats very fast, effectively charging the capacitor up to some high voltage
[11:06] <ibanezmatt13> wow, that's the best explanation of a step up ever. Thank you very much
[11:06] <Randomskk> bear in mind there are other designs - they generally all involve switching DC on and off though
[11:06] <Randomskk> but that ^ is very common
[11:06] <ibanezmatt13> So it's similar to a transformer in a way
[11:06] <ibanezmatt13> same sort of principle
[11:07] <LeoBodnar> The opposite of capacitor is no capacitor
[11:07] <Randomskk> an inductor is physically very similar to a transformer
[11:07] <Randomskk> yes
[11:07] <Randomskk> both are basically (typically) coils of wire, often with an iron core
[11:07] <ibanezmatt13> right, thanks for the info Randomskk :)
[11:07] <Randomskk> the only real difference is that the inductor only has two terminals while the idea with the transformer is to use the magnetic field to _transfer_ energy to the other coil
[11:07] <Randomskk> there are other cool ways of doing step ups though
[11:07] <Randomskk> one really really simple example
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[11:08] <Randomskk> take two capacitors in parallel and charge them on your battery
[11:08] <fsphil> put two inductors side by side and you get a bad transformer :)
[11:08] <Randomskk> then connect them in series
[11:08] <Randomskk> and you'll have twice the voltage
[11:08] <Randomskk> if you do that switching electrically, and smooth the output, you have a 2x step up
[11:08] <LeoBodnar> http://www.linear.com/product/LTC1515
[11:08] <fsphil> eevblog had a video on that kind of step-up recently
[11:09] <ibanezmatt13> ah cool. So what's the best way I can step up from a 1.5v cell to supply 3v3
[11:09] <Lunar_LanderU> the cockroft-walton multiplier?
[11:09] <fsphil> that's the one
[11:09] <Randomskk> there are a few multiplier architectures. the one I just described is switched capacitor
[11:09] <Randomskk> ibanezmatt13: the best way is to buy a little step up PSU board
[11:09] <jcoxon> hey fsphil,
[11:09] <Randomskk> building your own step up supply (even using a microchip) is really hard to get right, and very frustrating
[11:10] <jcoxon> playign with iss stuff again (not got some optoisolators)
[11:10] <Randomskk> especially if you don't have good diagnostic equipment (like a fast scope)
[11:10] <fsphil> I want to repeat that experiment they did on bbc science club -- lightning in the sheet of perspex
[11:10] <Randomskk> fsphil: oh man I want to try that too
[11:10] <mfa298> as a simple model when dealing with AC/RF you can also think of inductors and capacitors as frequecny dependant resistors.
[11:10] <Randomskk> did you know that can happen in people
[11:10] <Randomskk> it makes a scar pattern
[11:10] <fsphil> jcoxon: yea some good passes coming up
[11:10] <Randomskk> the coolest scar ever
[11:10] <mfa298> fsphil: that was a good experiment
[11:10] <LeoBodnar> What's that bbc experiment?
[11:11] <jcoxon> quick question with audio side of things, what sort of voltage should i be sourcing on the radio side?
[11:11] <jcoxon> found a test point that gives 3.3v
[11:11] <daveake> LeoBodnar https://twitter.com/daraobriain/status/332240248291618816/photo/1
[11:11] <mfa298> It was on BBC Science club (Thurs evening on bbc2) - Charged up a perspex sheet and then tapped it with a hammer which was connected to ground
[11:12] <ibanezmatt13> Lunar_LanderU: In that schematic top left, what is the VIN to that step up?
[11:12] <Randomskk> http://www.break.com/pictures/8-amazing-lightning-scars-2352766
[11:12] <LeoBodnar> cool
[11:12] <Lunar_LanderU> ibanezmatt13: 3.3V
[11:12] <ibanezmatt13> 3.3v in, 3.3v out?
[11:13] <fsphil> jcoxon: hmm that's a good question. I think it might be 1v peak to peak
[11:13] <ibanezmatt13> oh I see Lunar_LanderU
[11:13] <ibanezmatt13> 3.3v in, 5v out?
[11:13] <Lunar_LanderU> 9V out
[11:13] <jcoxon> guess i could voltage divider it down to 1v then
[11:14] <ibanezmatt13> wow
[11:14] <fsphil> the radio probably has some kind of auto-gain anyway
[11:14] <jcoxon> so go for 1v then?
[11:14] <mfa298> jcoxon, fsphil: I'd have said around 1v p-p for line level as well (although I think it varies sligtly depending if your pro or not)
[11:14] <fsphil> daveake: interestingly that wasn't the one they had in the show
[11:14] <daveake> yup
[11:15] <fsphil> they must use that tesla coil the guy in the background has to charge the sheet
[11:15] <daveake> yes
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[11:16] <daveake> I want that job :p
[11:16] <fsphil> haha
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[11:22] <ibanezmatt13> ping Upu
[11:24] <ibanezmatt13> Hey Upu, I'm looking at that TPS61201. For an input of 1.5v which overtime will drop, will the standard config for the TPS61201 be ok for a 3v3 output? I've been looking at the datasheet and it's a fixed 3v3 output but I can't find what the minimum and maximum input voltages are. http://www.ti.com/lit/ds/slvs577d/slvs577d.pdf
[11:33] <ibanezmatt13> Would an ATMEGA328, ublox max 6 and ntx2 all at 3v3 draw more than 300mA
[11:33] <ibanezmatt13> in fact, I should really be checking the datasheets myself
[11:34] <Darkside> ibanezmatt13: so you really want to be soldering one of those chips ?
[11:34] <ibanezmatt13> 0603 size is fine :)
[11:34] <Darkside> er
[11:34] <Darkside> its more that its QFN
[11:34] <Darkside> it doesnt have legs
[11:34] <ibanezmatt13> what doesn't have legs?
[11:35] <Darkside> wait
[11:35] <Darkside> yeah, that is the chip im thinking of
[11:35] <ibanezmatt13> the TPS61201?
[11:35] <Darkside> its certainly possible to hand solder it
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[11:35] <Darkside> its just more involved
[11:36] <ibanezmatt13> It'll be difficult but good soldering practice
[11:36] <Hiena> Flip it, glue it, wire it.
[11:36] <Darkside> Hiena: nah
[11:36] <Darkside> you just ned flux
[11:36] <Darkside> and a wide-tipped soldering iron
[11:37] <ibanezmatt13> Darkside: I've never soldered on a small scale before. The finest soldering I've done is 2.54mm headers :)
[11:37] <Hiena> I know, but sometimes the flip BGA works better.
[11:37] <Darkside> well i'd do something with 06034s first
[11:37] <Darkside> 0503s*
[11:37] <Darkside> 0603s*
[11:37] <Darkside> argh
[11:37] <Darkside> cant type tonight
[11:37] <Darkside> anyway, dont put one of those QFNs on your first pcb :P
[11:37] <Darkside> els pain will result
[11:37] <ibanezmatt13> haha, ok :)
[11:38] <Hiena> Try some qfn to dil konverter.
[11:38] <ibanezmatt13> what is the way to solder on such small scale anyway? How would you go about for instance soldering a ublox max 6 chip?
[11:38] <Darkside> ahh tue ublox i do pin-by pin
[11:38] <Darkside> with a finer tip
[11:38] <Gadget-Mac> Going to be using the TPS61201 cousin as a test for my home made reflow oven, was thinking of a board with selectable outputs of
[11:39] <Gadget-Mac> 1.8v, 2v,3v3 and 5v fed from 1 or 2 AA's
[11:39] <ibanezmatt13> So literally, a spot of solder on the iron and touch the pin while using a microscope Darkside?
[11:39] <Gadget-Mac> Anyone interested ?
[11:39] <Darkside> ibanezmatt13: no
[11:39] <Darkside> heat up the joint, then feed in solder
[11:39] <Darkside> same with all solder joints
[11:39] <Darkside> dont put solder on the iron first
[11:39] <Darkside> well, any more than to tin it
[11:40] <ibanezmatt13> So put some on then wipe the excess off to tin it? Then heat up the ublox pin and add solder to it while under heat?
[11:40] <ibanezmatt13> I thought there'd be more to it than that to be honest being so small
[11:41] <Darkside> nah
[11:41] <Darkside> its just like most other components
[11:41] <ibanezmatt13> steady hand required
[11:41] <Iain_G4SGX> I needed some solder braid to clean up afterwards on my first attempt cos i used slightly too much solder. Worked a treat though.
[11:41] <Darkside> ibanezmatt13: yeah
[11:41] <Darkside> the pin pitch is pretty small
[11:41] <ibanezmatt13> I look forward to my PCBs arriving :)
[11:42] <Darkside> i did have a go at doing them with drag soldering
[11:42] <Darkside> it workd, but not as well as it does with TQFP devices
[11:42] <ibanezmatt13> what's drag soldering
[11:42] <ibanezmatt13> ?
[11:43] <Darkside> youtub eit
[11:43] <ibanezmatt13> ok
[11:43] <Darkside> its where you don't solder pin-by-pin
[11:43] <ibanezmatt13> ah right
[11:43] <Darkside> but use a wide tipped soldering iton and flux
[11:43] <Iain_G4SGX> I also had to buy a maplins mag light cos my eyes are not so good. http://www.maplin.co.uk/22w-fluorescent-daylight-magnifier-lamp-47980
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[11:56] <ibanezmatt13> Darkside: just watched EEVBlog's SMT soldering video and drag soldering was showed
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[12:04] <Hiena> Grrrr...Another botched pcb. I need to invent something to manufacture perfect 10 mil single layer PCBs...
[12:06] <Darkside> china
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[12:09] <charolastra> how to open dl-fldigi in HAB mode?
[12:09] <d0wnl0rd> Just a quick feedback: PYSY payload has been recovered after 1,5 hours of trying (and swearing) from the top of a spruce at about 25m height !
[12:09] <daveake> nice :)
[12:10] <Hiena> Ehem.
[12:10] <daveake> We should have a list of "defeated tree species" in the wiki :)
[12:11] <d0wnl0rd> PYSY vs. spruce trees = 2:0 :-)
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[12:13] <charolastra> ok, --hab; but what's Slim HAB UI mode?
[12:14] <d0wnl0rd> Leaving now - we will enjoy now a beer and a pizza
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[12:26] <charolastra> does anyone have a recorded audio of a flight i could use for testing?
[12:26] <Upu> there is one on the wiki
[12:27] <charolastra> without any paramters specified, only get garbage decoded
[12:28] <Upu> have you got the Icarus flight downloaded ?
[12:28] <charolastra> Icarus flight?
[12:29] <charolastra> the .wav you mean?
[12:29] <Upu> yes
[12:31] <charolastra> yeah, with a shift of 400Hz i assume
[12:31] <charolastra> ah, baudrate 50 was the problem
[12:37] <chrisstubbs> Laurenceb, I see you are on the CHDK IRC. How's your knowledge of it?
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[12:41] <mclane> PYSY finally recovered from a high tree
[12:41] <G0TDJ_Steve> Well done mclane - Sorry I couldn't track it
[12:42] <mclane> Many thanks to upu for correcting my fsulty flight foc
[12:42] <mclane> faulty
[12:42] <Upu> wasn't me it was Randomskk & DanielRichman
[12:43] <mclane> Then my thanks go to them!
[12:43] <Randomskk> mostly DanielRichman at that
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[12:46] <jcoxon> ping fsphil
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[12:49] <bertrik_> what's the frequency of icarus?
[12:49] <Upu> its someone testing
[12:49] <Upu> ignore it
[12:49] <bertrik_> ok, sorry
[12:50] <Upu> no need to apologise :)
[12:50] <G0TDJ_Steve> I'll admit, I was confused bertrik_ when I saw the 24103m alt
[12:50] <Upu> its confusing as it has other trackers
[12:50] <G0TDJ_Steve> Upu: Wouldn't it be a good idea (and easy) for tested to suffix their callsigns _TEST or is this not feasible
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[12:51] <G0TDJ_Steve> sorry, testers..
[12:51] <Upu> not sure
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[12:51] <G0TDJ_Steve> It would make it a lot easier to see 'real' flights
[12:51] <Willdude123> Upu, got the Ublox header soldered on.
[12:51] <chrisstubbs> G0TDJ_Steve, for payloads or for stations?
[12:52] <Willdude123> Well I didn't.
[12:52] <Willdude123> My dad did.
[12:52] <G0TDJ_Steve> For payloads chrisstubbs
[12:52] <Willdude123> Soldering's too dangerous for me.
[12:52] <chrisstubbs> You would have to create a seperate payload doc for testing and flight, and part of the testing is to test your payload doc youw ant to use in flight :)
[12:52] <G0TDJ_Steve> Willdude123: I was taught to solder at 7 years old, with a gas flame heated soldering iron :-) You should learn
[12:52] <chrisstubbs> to make sure there are no parse errors
[12:53] <Willdude123> I know how to.
[12:53] <G0TDJ_Steve> You should go for it Willdude123
[12:53] <Willdude123> I'm not allowed.
[12:53] <G0TDJ_Steve> chrisstubbs: I still think it would be a good idea. Can't be hard to create two docs one for test, one for run.
[12:54] <G0TDJ_Steve> OK Will - Fair enough
[12:54] <mfa298> I've met adults for whom soldering is too dangerous (at least based on the damage they've done to soldering irons / qualtity of solder used)
[12:54] <chrisstubbs> Clutter :)
[12:54] <G0TDJ_Steve> Well, clarity at the expense of clutter
[12:54] <G0TDJ_Steve> mfa298: I know what you mean
[12:54] <chrisstubbs> What would be a better solution is another view for spacenearus that shows all payloads, and the defualt view to show only payloads with an active flight doc
[12:55] <G0TDJ_Steve> Sounds good chrisstubbs
[12:55] <mfa298> G0TDJ_Steve: I think there had been some talk about having a test version of spacenear - possibly based on flight docs
[12:55] <mfa298> as chrisstubbs just said...
[12:55] <G0TDJ_Steve> It just seems logical to me to seperate tests from actual flights somehow
[12:56] <mfa298> like many things I suspect it's on the todo list for the relevant people
[12:56] <charolastra> in this case it was historical data from an old flightrecodring; didn't realise that the server accepts everything. so the settings for tests would have to be on the server side
[12:56] <G0TDJ_Steve> It would save all the bandwidth in 'Is that flight active, what's the freq' questions... Probably mfa298
[12:57] <G0TDJ_Steve> charolastra: Not having a go :-) Just trying to fix a problem.
[12:57] <G0TDJ_Steve> I'm sure the relevant parties know, just giving some incentive
[12:58] <charolastra> btw, what's the timeout of things on the map; 24 hours?
[12:58] <SpeedEvil> manual
[12:58] <chrisstubbs> charolastra, until an admin clears it
[12:58] <mfa298> I'm pretty sure it has been discsussed in the past. It just needs to get to a suitable level on someones todo list.
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[12:58] <G0TDJ_Steve> Is there one? I thought it got overwritten by the next one
[12:59] Action: G0TDJ_Steve was almost right
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[12:59] <chrisstubbs> G0TDJ_Steve, an incentive would be free beer ;)
[13:00] <chrisstubbs> I think there is a feature suggestion on github?
[13:00] <G0TDJ_Steve> LOL I'll start saving :D
[13:00] <G0TDJ_Steve> chrisstubbs: Don't get me started ;-)
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[13:09] <ibanezmatt13> So I have an AVRISP MKII and I need to program an ATTINY85. I need to make the chip run at 5v and I'm not sure on two things: Whether I need to set the fuses to make it run at 5v and whether I need an external crystal or not.
[13:10] <ibanezmatt13> Can I power it with 5v and still use its internal clock?
[13:11] <mikestir_> yes
[13:11] <Willdude123> What's the difference between RX and RXD, TX and TXD ?
[13:11] <ibanezmatt13> RX = receive, TX = transmit
[13:12] <Willdude123> I know.
[13:12] <mikestir_> the D is for Data
[13:12] <Willdude123> Right
[13:12] <ibanezmatt13> mikestir_: I have this very popular programmer yet I can't get it to work. It may be that I'm not wiring it up properly as I don't have the ICSP header
[13:13] <mikestir_> it's the real Atmel AVRISP?
[13:13] <charolastra> maby you mixed up the MISO/MOSI pins?
[13:14] <mikestir_> don't cross the MOSI/MISO pins like you would do for a SPI device
[13:14] <mikestir_> the ISP header pins are named as the pins you connect them to
[13:15] <ibanezmatt13> yes, the real one
[13:15] <Gadget-Mac> Have to admit this has proved very useful on many occasions https://www.sparkfun.com/products/8508 saves thos MOSI/MISO mixups
[13:15] <ibanezmatt13> Yes, I just connected MISO on the chip to the MISO on the programmer, etc
[13:16] <ibanezmatt13> I connected reset of the programmer to reset of the chip via a 10 k
[13:16] <mikestir_> why via 10k?
[13:16] <ibanezmatt13> I thought that was standard
[13:16] <ibanezmatt13> for a pull up
[13:17] <mikestir_> yes but do you mean you're connecting the /RESET from the AVRISP to the AVR via 10k
[13:17] <mikestir_> or do you mean there's a 10k pullup to vcc?
[13:17] <ibanezmatt13> there's a 10k pullup to vcc already on the chip. I just connect the reset on the programmer via a wire to the reset pin on the chip after the resistor
[13:18] <mikestir_> that sounds ok
[13:18] <mikestir_> the programmer needs to be able to override any pullup you have on the board
[13:19] <ibanezmatt13> So I had it wired up correctly I thnk
[13:19] <mikestir_> think so
[13:19] <ibanezmatt13> It could be adriver issue
[13:19] <ibanezmatt13> for the programmer
[13:19] <mikestir_> do you have Vcc on the ISP connected?
[13:19] <ibanezmatt13> yes
[13:20] <mikestir_> and you're still powering the board externally?
[13:20] <ibanezmatt13> yes
[13:20] <mikestir_> the AVRISP uses that to sample the required logic level
[13:20] <ibanezmatt13> I tried arduino ide, amtel studio and avrdude
[13:20] <ibanezmatt13> like I say, could be usb issue. In amtel studio it didn't detect the programmer was connected
[13:20] <ibanezmatt13> when it was
[13:21] <mikestir_> sounds like it
[13:21] <mikestir_> I use avrdude under linux
[13:21] <ibanezmatt13> Which after some troubleshooting led me to believe that I'd never get it working with win 8
[13:21] <ibanezmatt13> :)
[13:21] <mikestir_> we're having a lot of trouble with USB devices on windows 8 at work
[13:21] <ibanezmatt13> it's a crazy OS
[13:21] <mikestir_> specifically the drivers need to be signed
[13:22] <mikestir_> and we don't have a cert for doing that yet
[13:22] <ibanezmatt13> right
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[13:22] <ibanezmatt13> Reckon I could get avrdude on the Pi? It is linux
[13:22] <mikestir_> yes
[13:23] <Willdude123> Hmm
[13:23] <ibanezmatt13> I'm not sure how to use avrdude really. I read up on it. It's just one command with a load of parameters I think
[13:23] <Willdude123> I think I'm shorting something here.
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[13:24] <mfa298> ibanezmatt13: I think avrdude is used to transfer the compiled program onto the chip and set thigns like fuses
[13:24] <ibanezmatt13> I need to make my ATTINY85 run off its internal clock and also upload an arduino sketch onto it
[13:24] <mikestir_> yes it's just a programmer. You would use it with an editor or ide like eclipse, and avr-gcc
[13:24] <mfa298> so you could develop the whole lot on linux where you use a suitable version of gcc to compile C/C++ into something suitable
[13:25] <mikestir_> ibanezmatt13: do you know if the ATTINY is currently set to run off an external clock?
[13:25] <mfa298> I think by default on an avr the fuses are set to internal clock (although check data sheets)
[13:26] <mikestir_> they are
[13:26] <ibanezmatt13> no idea, they've got no bootloader on them I think
[13:26] <mikestir_> if it's brand new then it will be set to internal clock with a /8 prescale (for 1 MHz)
[13:26] <mikestir_> iirc
[13:26] <ibanezmatt13> it's completely new
[13:26] <mfa298> mikestir_: that sounds familiar (not checked for a while)
[13:26] <Willdude123> Hmm
[13:26] <mikestir_> I was asking because if you set the fuses for external oscillator then you must provide an external clock for ISP to work
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[13:27] <Willdude123> Nothing is coming out of my serial port, loopback doesn't work.
[13:27] <Willdude123> Also with logic analyser, it's just detected as constant logic low.
[13:28] <ibanezmatt13> Ok so the chip is on a breadboard. ON the chip, VCC to +5v, GND to GND, SCK to SCK on programmer, MISO to MISO on programmer, MOSI to MOSI on programmer. Reset via a 10k to VCC and RESET on programmer into this rail too. GND on programmer to GND. Correct?
[13:29] <mikestir_> sounds fine. let me just check the datasheet in case there is something specific to the 8 pin devices
[13:29] <ibanezmatt13> http://www.atmel.com/images/atmel-2586-avr-8-bit-microcontroller-attiny25-attiny45-attiny85_datasheet.pdf
[13:29] <mikestir_> you should have two green lights on the AVRISP if it is happy
[13:30] <ibanezmatt13> two green lights even before I hit upload?
[13:30] <Laurenceb_> attn CUSF
[13:30] <Laurenceb_> http://www.timeshighereducation.co.uk/world-university-rankings/2012-13/world-ranking
[13:31] <Willdude123> On the 3v3 ublox board is the power 3v3, as well as serial?
[13:31] <ibanezmatt13> yes Willdude123
[13:31] <mikestir_> yeah that looks ok. Mine in front of me is sitting idle, although connected to a board, and I have two greens
[13:31] <ibanezmatt13> ok, I'll hook it up, thanks
[13:32] <mikestir_> some of the AVRs have the ISP SPI on different pins than the actual SPI peripheral, but that's not the case here
[13:32] <mikestir_> it's mainly the big ones
[13:33] <ibanezmatt13> ah ok
[13:33] <mikestir_> brb
[13:34] <fsphil> pong jcoxon
[13:34] <jcoxon> so i've optoisolated everything
[13:34] <jcoxon> and it works when there is no antenna on the radio
[13:34] <jcoxon> but as soon as i add the antenna everything resets again :-(
[13:35] <fsphil> has to be picking it up somewhere
[13:35] <fsphil> did you try ferrites on the power cable?
[13:37] <jcoxon> which power cable?
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[13:39] <ibanezmatt13> mikestir_: after a quick google, for the mkii on win 8 I must disable driver integrity checks whatever that is. Just done it
[13:39] <fsphil> or any lines going to the arduino
[13:40] <Willdude123> ping someone with saleae logic software.
[13:40] <fsphil> the cable would be picking up the signal, and a ferrite on the cable near the arduino would help filter it out I believe
[13:41] <Lunar_LanderU> oh well
[13:41] <Lunar_LanderU> my circuit is a disappointment unfortunately
[13:41] <Lunar_LanderU> connected it all up and then did a connection to the oscilloscope
[13:41] <Lunar_LanderU> only 50 Hz waves
[13:42] <Willdude123> Is anyone familiar with saleae logic software available to help me? Basically the problem is, the gps is rxing the commands, from what I can see.
[13:42] <Willdude123> But is not txing.
[13:42] <Willdude123> I have the logic data for the tx line.
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[13:46] <jcoxon> fsphil, okay i've added an short coax extension onto the radio
[13:46] <jcoxon> and added a ferrite ring to all the lines out of the arduino
[13:48] <ibanezmatt13> On the avrisp mkii, is the red wire of the 6 pin header MISO?
[13:48] <mikestir_> yes
[13:48] <mikestir_> the marked wire on a ribbon cable should always be pin 1
[13:49] <mikestir_> Willdude123: You can add a decoder in Logic to show you the actual serial data on the tx line
[13:51] <ibanezmatt13> mikestir_: I checked the device manager in windows and the MKII was on there but it said, no driver currently installed for this device. So I'm downloading amtel studio and reinstalling the USB driver now that I've "disabled integrity check" on the driver, what ever that means
[13:51] <mikestir_> yeah I think that's what we ended up doing at work
[13:51] <mikestir_> I wasn't involved in that thankfully
[13:51] <mikestir_> I think the software guys drew straws on who was going to have to use windows 8
[13:57] <jcoxon> fsphil, seems to be working
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[14:00] Nick change: bertrik_ -> bertrik
[14:01] <fsphil> interesting, must have been RF getting in. wonder how it was resetting it
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[14:06] <chrisstubbs> So after explaining the crap regulators I was sent the other day to the seller (one of which was missing components, which i sent photos of) she then proceeded to ask that if the item is eventually delivered I send it back....
[14:07] <chrisstubbs> Idiocity +=1
[14:09] <mfa298> ask them to send a courier at their expense as the items are faulty
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[14:13] <Iain_G4SGX> Its been a good day for my linux setup today. Got GQRX working perfectly with FDC pro+ AND got dl-fldigi to read my onboard GPS. Chase pc sorted..
[14:16] <Iain_G4SGX> Anyone know the extra argument to fire up the HAB version of fl-fldigi from command line? Found out I have to start it as root not sudo
[14:17] <jcoxon> ./dl-fldigi --hab
[14:18] <Iain_G4SGX> Huh? Its appeared on the map as G4SGX_CHASE, sure i didnt do that. will have to check my settings or does it auto do that if using GPOS
[14:18] <Iain_G4SGX> GPS
[14:18] <Iain_G4SGX> Tnx jcoxon
[14:18] <mfa298> It adds the _Chase if you've got the GPS on
[14:18] <Iain_G4SGX> gotcha.
[14:19] <mfa298> you might just need to change the permissions of the gps device so you can run it as a normal user
[14:20] <mfa298> on fedora I think I just added my normal user to the dialout group as they had rw access to the serial device for the gps
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[14:23] <Iain_G4SGX> Means i can finally stop using my Win7 partition. Will investigate, thanks.
[14:23] <mfa298> looks like that's what I did on the pi (so ubuntu might be similar)
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[14:25] <mfa298> this is the command I used to update group membership: usermod -a -G dialout pi
[14:25] <mfa298> or you can just edit /etc/group
[14:26] <mfa298> you'll probably need to logout and log back in for it to pick up the change
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[14:39] <ibanezmatt13> ping mikestir_
[14:39] <mikestir_> pong
[14:40] <ibanezmatt13> is it possible to install the arduino ide on a Pi
[14:40] <Iain_G4SGX> Sorted. needed sudo adduser 'user' dialout, now works a treat
[14:41] <mikestir_> ibanezmatt13: not sure. It's java isn't it?
[14:41] <mikestir_> in which case I think not
[14:41] <mikestir_> however it is very easy to install on linux, so you could try
[14:42] <ibanezmatt13> Ah right. I don't think you can get Java on a pi
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[14:42] <ibanezmatt13> All I need to do basically is program this ATTINY with the mkii. Windows 8 is a no goer
[14:42] <ibanezmatt13> mikestir_: did you say you had an mkii on linux?
[14:42] <chrisstubbs> ibanezmatt13, xp or win7 in a vm?
[14:43] <chrisstubbs> ^ or linux
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[14:43] <mikestir_> yes I use a avrisp2 on linux
[14:43] <ibanezmatt13> I tried on win8, failed. Only other OS in the house is on my Pi: Linux
[14:43] <mikestir_> if you can get avrdude installed I can give you some commands to try
[14:44] <ibanezmatt13> sudo apt-get install avrdude?
[14:45] <mikestir_> probably, if you're running raspbian
[14:45] <ibanezmatt13> yes it is, it's just installed
[14:45] <ibanezmatt13> ok, how about the usb driver?
[14:45] <mikestir_> doesn't need one
[14:45] <mikestir_> this isn't windows
[14:45] <ibanezmatt13> cool
[14:45] <ibanezmatt13> I'm ready for using avrdude now
[14:46] <mikestir_> you do need to sort out permissions, but you can run as root for now
[14:46] <mfa298> you can get Java on a pi but you might find the arduino ide isn't very responsive.
[14:47] <chrisstubbs> ibanezmatt13, pendrivelinux?
[14:47] <mikestir_> ok try "avrdude -p t85 -c avrispv2 -P usb -t
[14:47] <ibanezmatt13> dudn't know that was possible
[14:47] <ibanezmatt13> ok mikestir_
[14:47] <ibanezmatt13> in the terminal?
[14:47] <mikestir_> yes. ignore that leading quote
[14:48] <mikestir_> oh and sudo if you're not actually logged in as root
[14:48] <ibanezmatt13> ok
[14:48] <ibanezmatt13> hang on, Pi is rebooting. One sec
[14:48] <ibanezmatt13> wait, mikestir_ I've not got any chip hooked up
[14:49] <ibanezmatt13> shall I hook up the attiny first
[14:49] <mikestir_> yes. it will check the signature bytes first
[14:50] <ibanezmatt13> ok, may take me 10 minutes to hook it all yp
[14:50] <ibanezmatt13> up*
[14:51] <ibanezmatt13> would help if I knew where it was
[14:55] <Willdude123> Right
[14:55] <Willdude123> Debugging the Ublox
[14:56] <ibanezmatt13> mikestir_: two green leds
[14:56] <ibanezmatt13> I'm gonna try it with an ATMEGA328
[14:57] <ibanezmatt13> I'd like to use avrdude to flash a simple arduino sketch onto the atmega to make an led blink
[14:57] <mikestir_> did you get a prompt that says "avrdude>"?
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[14:57] <ibanezmatt13> mikestir_: I'm using putty with my Pi
[14:58] <mikestir_> that's ok
[14:58] <ibanezmatt13> I've not tried the command yet
[14:58] <ibanezmatt13> The programmer is hooked up to the atmega, shall I try the command now
[14:58] <mikestir_> if you want to try it with a mega328 then change t85 to m328
[14:58] <ibanezmatt13> ok
[14:58] <Willdude123> Right so it's receiving the PUBX sentences, there must be a problem with the bbb's rx line/the ublox's tx line
[14:59] <ibanezmatt13> ok mikestir_ I ran the command
[14:59] <ibanezmatt13> avr part m328 not foud
[14:59] <ibanezmatt13> then a list of valid parts
[14:59] <charolastra> and arduino sketch to blink an LED is overkill when it can be done in a few lines of ASM/C/BASIC
[15:00] <ibanezmatt13> ah mikestir_ it's m328p
[15:00] <mikestir_> what version of avrdude is it? (avrdude -v)
[15:00] <mikestir_> ah right yes. Is yours really a 328P or a 328?
[15:00] <ibanezmatt13> 5.11.1
[15:00] <ibanezmatt13> 328p
[15:01] <mikestir_> ok that's fine. this board I have is a 328, and I had to patch avrdude to make it work
[15:01] <ibanezmatt13> tried it and got errors:
[15:01] <ibanezmatt13> oh, forgot sudo
[15:02] <ibanezmatt13> ok it worked
[15:02] <ibanezmatt13> mustn't be connected right
[15:02] <ibanezmatt13> it said to double check connections
[15:03] <ibanezmatt13> however, I was sort of expecting that as this particular chip hasn't been working properly
[15:03] <ibanezmatt13> I'm gonna go find my attinys
[15:03] <mikestir_> it should say "avrdude: AVR device initialized and ready to accept instructions"
[15:03] <mikestir_> and then some other stuff
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[15:03] <Willdude123> Hmm This is extremely temperamental
[15:04] <ibanezmatt13> yeah it failed initialisation
[15:04] <ibanezmatt13> I'll find some chips which work
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[15:53] <ibanezmatt13> guys, on the 6 pin female header on the avrisp mkii, for the MISO pin indicated by the red wire on the cable, is the correct socket on the header the one furthest or nearest to the wires?
[15:54] <ibanezmatt13> 6 wires going into two rows of three. Which row, furthest away from wires or nearest to wires, is connected to the red wire (miso)
[15:54] <ibanezmatt13> ping mikestir_
[15:55] <LeoBodnar> Reading amateur licence terms on Ofcom webiste: "The Licensee shall not establish or use the Station on any vessel, other than in Inland Waters, or in any aircraft or other airborne vehicle."
[15:55] <mikestir_> pin 1 is marked with a little triangle on the header
[15:55] <ibanezmatt13> oh really. I'll check now
[15:55] <mikestir_> then pin two is next to it on the other side
[15:55] <LeoBodnar> What does "establish" mean in this context
[15:55] <mikestir_> then 3 is the pin next to the arrowed one, and so on
[15:55] <chrisstubbs> LeoBodnar, interesting interpretation
[15:55] <mikestir_> so you have a row of odds and a row of evens
[15:55] <Laurenceb_> LeoBodnar: lend your kit to someone else?
[15:55] <G0TDJ_Steve> LeoBodnar: chrisstubbs I read it to mean 'set up'
[15:55] <ibanezmatt13> ok mikestir_ Ok, that says I've wired my tiny up correctly. I'm now ready to properly test avrdude
[15:56] <mikestir_> ok give it a go
[15:56] <LeoBodnar> So technically it is illegal to fly APRS by UK radio amateur even over countries allowing to do so
[15:56] <ibanezmatt13> what was the previous command mikestir_ ?
[15:56] <G0TDJ_Steve> Yes, with a UK callsign I would say
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[15:57] <LeoBodnar> Or having APRS capable equipment flying over UK even when not transmitting
[15:57] <mikestir_> ibanezmatt13: avrdude -p t85 -c avrispv2 -P usb -t
[15:57] <ibanezmatt13> thanks
[15:58] <G0TDJ_Steve> LeoBodnar: No, that's OK because it's not active.
[15:58] <LeoBodnar> "Established" though?
[15:58] <G0TDJ_Steve> Yeah, see what you mean. Like chrisstubbs I think it's deliberately open to interpretation
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[15:59] <chrisstubbs> Its just our crappy laws
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[15:59] <ibanezmatt13> I think it worked mikestir_
[15:59] <ibanezmatt13> it has a device signature
[15:59] <G0TDJ_Steve> Yep. ISS has been transmitting APRS on 145.825 for a LONG time with no ill effects
[15:59] <ibanezmatt13> and it's booted into avrdude
[16:00] <mikestir_> yeah it worked. brb screaming baby...
[16:00] <ibanezmatt13> :
[16:00] <ibanezmatt13> :)
[16:00] <chrisstubbs> Huh thats a good one, at what altitude does that law stop? I guess the ISS enters our airspace from time to time
[16:00] <G0TDJ_Steve> Twice a day
[16:00] <G0TDJ_Steve> At least
[16:01] <LeoBodnar> Space that hight is not considered national airspace I think
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[16:01] <G0TDJ_Steve> So what about a balloon that is higher than a jets cruising alt?
[16:03] <mfa298> with some of those rules you might need to read other rules and it might be partially dependant on the license type
[16:04] <mfa298> Full license can be setup in International waters but must have the permission of the vessels captain (or something like that)
[16:04] <Babs__> UK national guidelines (in all areas) are deliberately set vague to give the authorities maximum wriggle room if they need to prosecute
[16:04] <Babs__> In my experience anyway
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[16:04] <Babs__> The FSA rules which financial firms need to adhere to are a good example
[16:05] <LeoBodnar> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Airspace: There is no international agreement on the vertical extent of sovereign airspace (the boundary between outer spacewhich is not subject to national jurisdictionand national airspace), with suggestions ranging from about 30 km (19 mi) (the extent of the highest aircraft and balloons) to about 160 km (99 mi) (the lowest extent of short-term stable orbits).
[16:05] <ibanezmatt13> mikestir_: just a thought, will I be able to upload an arduino sketch onto the tiny if it's fresh out of the factory?
[16:05] <Babs__> "If there is ambiguity in the formal rules at any point then the spirit of the (financial) code prevails"
[16:06] <mfa298> With the airborne use I think we decided that as you're under the CEPT recipricoty (I'm not even going to try and spell that) you're OK once over a suitable country
[16:06] <mfa298> but you need a full license to be allowed to operate your license abroad
[16:06] <Babs__> They make it sound like jedi
[16:06] <LeoBodnar> We consider this give
[16:06] <LeoBodnar> n
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[16:07] <mikestir_> ibanezmatt13: I'm not that familiar with arduino. Is the tiny85 supported by the arduino ide?
[16:07] <mikestir_> it's pretty limited
[16:08] <Willdude123> Ping Upu
[16:08] <ibanezmatt13> don't think so. All I need to do is turn 3 digital pins on and off with a delay. Could I do that in C?
[16:08] <mikestir_> yes easily
[16:08] <ibanezmatt13> I've never done it
[16:08] <ibanezmatt13> Any header files required
[16:08] <mikestir_> it's all part of avr-libc, which should be in the repo
[16:09] <ibanezmatt13> Ah right, so is there a command to turn a digital pin on and off?
[16:09] <ibanezmatt13> and will I need to set the pins up to be outputs?
[16:09] <mikestir_> well you just write directly to the port register
[16:09] <mikestir_> and likewise the port direction register
[16:09] <ibanezmatt13> sounds complex
[16:09] <mikestir_> it's not at all
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[16:10] <mikestir_> you are just setting bits in a register to make the corresponding pin an output
[16:10] <LeoBodnar> The whole law thing is bizarre. I remember from aviation that according to Chicago convention you don't need a prior permission to enter other country's airspace in a foreign registered aircraft unless it is a regular commercial flight.
[16:10] <ibanezmatt13> mikestir_: I'll try and find some example code
[16:10] <mikestir_> I have a set of macros I use for IO which allows you to specify all your board config in one place
[16:11] <mikestir_> I can strip that down to a bare minimum later if you want
[16:11] <G0TDJ_Steve> LeoBodnar: chrisstubbs mfa298 Babs__ What it needs is a professional proposal to either the ITU or Ofcom requesting sensible options with justification from previous experiences.
[16:11] <ibanezmatt13> that would be good mikestir_. I've just realised that the chip is supported by arduino
[16:11] <mfa298> G0TDJ_Steve: there's already some work being done with RSGB and Ofcom to see if we can get some limited airborne use in the UK
[16:11] <mfa298> probably low power on 2m
[16:12] <G0TDJ_Steve> mfa298: I'd like to know the progress.
[16:12] <mfa298> probably as an experimtal permit or NoV (so will need a Full license)
[16:12] <ibanezmatt13> but as was mentioned earlier, using arduino to turn a few leds on is a bit overkill mikestir_. I'd love to see that code later :)
[16:12] <LeoBodnar> I am not sure where HABs come into the airlaw because they are unmanned but for the purpose of other stuff they are equated to aircraft (AR operation, etc)
[16:12] <G0TDJ_Steve> Not a problem
[16:12] <mfa298> it's happening slowly (I think waiting on some of the spectrum/licensing reviews which are due sometime this year)
[16:13] <G0TDJ_Steve> Yeah, I read about it in PW
[16:13] <mfa298> From the AR side I think it's banned from airborne use rather than aircraft specifically
[16:13] <G0TDJ_Steve> It would be nice if there were a place where you could check the status of such though.
[16:14] <Babs__> LeoBodnar: http://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Denby_Eco-Link
[16:15] <Babs__> Now, on the face of it not much relevance
[16:15] <Willdude123> Line 0 here is the GPS's txd
[16:15] <Willdude123> http://imgur.com/PKDdEsx
[16:15] <Babs__> But
[16:15] <Willdude123> Line 1 is rxd
[16:15] <mfa298> it might be a case of not having anything too public/documented yet in case it upsets ofcom etc. Maybe something to discuss at the Conf.
[16:15] <charolastra> LeoBodnar: have you already forgotten how eva morales was grounded eventhough there where esteblished overflight licenses?
[16:15] <Willdude123> Not sure what the heck line 0 is doing.
[16:15] <Babs__> It is interesting that the way the haulier tested the regs was to inform the authorities what he was doing, and invite them to turn up
[16:15] <mikestir_> Willdude123: I think it's not the gps txd
[16:16] <G0TDJ_Steve> mfa298: Whatever happened to transparency... *sigh*
[16:16] <Willdude123> It's clipped to it.
[16:16] <LeoBodnar> I am interested in the legal side of e.g. entering other country airspace by the balloon (and launched for the sole purpose of doing so.)
[16:16] <Babs__> So writing to them to say this is my circuit, code and intention to (for example) turn on aprs above 30km
[16:16] <mfa298> G0TDJ_Steve: I'm not sure if there's any real problem but I've only been involved in dicsussions here.
[16:16] <Willdude123> It's receiving OK, just not sure if it's on, although it's plugged in.
[16:17] <Babs__> Come along and monitor it etc
[16:17] <mikestir_> Willdude123: It starts off looking reasonable. Is it connected to the bbb as well?
[16:17] <G0TDJ_Steve> Yeah, it's just that in general, there's no knowledge of these things until the licence changes. It's a little frustrating.
[16:17] <Willdude123> yes
[16:17] <Willdude123> How peculiar
[16:18] <mikestir_> Disconnect the bbb so that the gps tx is only connected to the logic analyser
[16:18] <Willdude123> I left the code running and fiddled with the wires and it was sptting sentences out.
[16:18] <mikestir_> rule out the bbb dragging the pin down
[16:18] <mfa298> Assuming the relevant people are there it could be a good thing to discuss at the conf and maybe see if having a wiki page with progress is sensible or not
[16:18] <Willdude123> Now it's working :)
[16:18] <mikestir_> short circuit
[16:19] <Steve_2E0VET> i need to brush up on my soldering skills
[16:19] <Willdude123> Now it isn't
[16:19] <G0TDJ_Steve> mfa298: Yeah, would be a good place to do it
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[16:20] <Willdude123> Now it is.
[16:20] <G0TDJ_Steve> BRB
[16:20] <LeoBodnar> Maybe sign a petition or consultation request of some sort?
[16:21] <mikestir_> ibanezmatt13: http://www.mike-stirling.com/2013/02/implementing-the-elv-fht-protocol-with-an-rfm23/ has a link to some code in the second to last paragraph
[16:21] <ibanezmatt13> thank you
[16:22] <mikestir_> board.h has my IO macros in it. main.c does the setup. That example is quite complicated, but I'll cut it down to a minimal example later on
[16:22] <Iain_G4SGX> Slight prob. Although i have my gps card working and uploading, its associating the chase location with my home location and follows it around. Have i missed a setting in dl-fldigi?
[16:22] <Babs__> LeoBodnar: I think they would probably welcome a sit down discussion with some people given how many groups are now doing it
[16:23] <Babs__> However, there is clearly a risk that by opening it up for discussion, they start bringing more regs to bear rather than opening it up
[16:23] <ibanezmatt13> mikestir_: Does it turn any digital pins on or off?
[16:23] <Babs__> So it's potentially a double edged sword
[16:23] <LeoBodnar> Well we are erring on the side of caution now anyway so there's not much to lose anyway
[16:24] <Willdude123> ping jcoxon Can you take questions over IRC for the conf. Q and A?
[16:24] <Babs__> Ish - stats are definitely on our side in terms of safety
[16:25] <mfa298> Iain_G4SGX: make sure you have the Upload GPS position and Always enable GPS on startup enabled it should them work
[16:25] <Babs__> But sometimes getting the authorities to think about a problem sends them into a tailspin when they try to assess risks they didn't contemplate before and/or don't understand
[16:26] <mikestir_> ibanezmatt13: yes - the TRX_OFF/ON macros in board.h do that
[16:26] <Willdude123> Wow this gps is extremely tempremental.
[16:26] <jcoxon> Willdude123, we can try
[16:26] <Willdude123> I nudged it one bit and the whole thing stopped working.
[16:27] <mfa298> Willdude123: sounds like you've got a dodgy connection
[16:27] <chrisstubbs> Willdude123, dry joint ont eh header solder?
[16:27] <Iain_G4SGX> mfa298: yes done that but still locks them together. The antenna icon follows the car icon around. Maybe some delay in initialising..
[16:27] <Willdude123> Huh?
[16:28] <mfa298> Iain_G4SGX: it will do, both locations are tied into the location set in dl-fldigi
[16:28] <ibanezmatt13> mikestir_: this header file I found before: <avr/io.h> is that already on the chip?
[16:28] <charolastra> does anyone have contacts to the guys from radiosonda.sk?
[16:28] <LeoBodnar> This is even better: 4(4) The Station shall be capable of receiving Messages on the same frequencies and with the same classes of emission in use for the transmission of Messages by the Station.
[16:28] <mikestir_> the avr/ headers are all part of avr-libc
[16:28] <LeoBodnar> Beacons are illegal then?
[16:29] <mfa298> ibanezmatt13: in general header files in <> are system headers and headers in "" are ones with the source code
[16:29] <mikestir_> aptitude install avr-libc binutils-avr gcc-avr
[16:29] <Willdude123> Jesus this is so temperamental
[16:29] <mikestir_> then you should be able to build that code on your pi just by typing make
[16:29] <mfa298> LeoBodnar: I don't think beacons can be run on a standard license. But you get a NoV (Notice of Variation) which will alter the terms for them
[16:30] <ibanezmatt13> So it's already on the chip mfa298 ?
[16:30] <Iain_G4SGX> Damn, i can send really fast morse but cant read it..!
[16:30] <mikestir_> it's not on the chip - it's part of the c library
[16:31] <mfa298> ibanezmatt13: on the system for the compiler - they generally provide hints for the compiler about function calls. With the AVR you'll end up with machine code
[16:31] <mikestir_> ibanezmatt13: are you familiar with the C standard library headers like stdio.h?
[16:31] <ibanezmatt13> yeah
[16:32] <mikestir_> well think of these avr/ headers in the same way, but they add support for AVR specific features
[16:32] <ibanezmatt13> If I write the code in nano on my Pi, that should have the library already installed I guess?
[16:32] <mikestir_> if you install those packages I mentioned
[16:32] <jcoxon> fsphil, okay
[16:32] <ibanezmatt13> ok, I'll install it
[16:32] <jcoxon> its installed outside now
[16:33] <mikestir_> biab. I need to nip to screwfix. ibanezmatt13: I'll do two examples later both with and without my IO macros so you can see how it really works
[16:33] <Willdude123> All of these connections are extremely dodgy
[16:33] <ibanezmatt13> thanks mikestir_, see you
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[16:35] <Willdude123> Not sure if it's these headers or what
[16:37] <mfa298> Willdude123: can you take a picture of how it's setup or if not draw a quick diagram and provide a reasonably detailed description of how it's setup
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[16:38] <Willdude123> Sure GPS_TXD-> BBB_RXD
[16:38] <Willdude123> GPS_RXD -> BBB_TXD
[16:39] <Willdude123> GPS_GND -> BBB_GND
[16:39] <Willdude123> GPS_VCC -> BBB_VCC
[16:39] <mfa298> I was meaing more detail than that. Like what sort of headers you're using, how what your using to connect them
[16:39] <Willdude123> -> = dodgy header
[16:40] <mfa298> and in this instance a picture is worth a thousand words
[16:40] <Willdude123> Jumper Wires ( also dodgy.
[16:40] <Iain_G4SGX> Strange. Although adding mu user to the dialout group enables dl-fldigi to open the port OK, it still doesnt receive any data unless i run it as root still. Only error is 'no data or End of file' from the terminal
[16:40] <Willdude123> I will go and do a continuity test on the headers/jumper wires.
[16:42] <mfa298> Willdude123: my best guess is that the wire doesn't make a good enough connection in the headers (assuming you've got a similar type of header on the ublox as is on the BBB)
[16:42] <mfa298> in which case you might just need to find some better jumper wires
[16:43] <mfa298> Iain_G4SGX: what does it show if you do "ls -l /dev/ttyGPS" replacing the ttyGPS with the real gps device name
[16:45] <fsphil> jcoxon: going for the next pass?
[16:45] <jcoxon> yeah
[16:45] <jcoxon> the problem is that i'm at teh hackspace so the antenna is quite low
[16:45] <jcoxon> and there are no local repeaters to test basic aprs against on 144.800
[16:45] <fsphil> next pass here is in an hour
[16:46] <jcoxon> thats quite low here
[16:46] <fsphil> yea pretty low here too
[16:46] <jcoxon> next proper pass will be at 1949
[16:46] <jcoxon> and then 2124 and 2301
[16:47] <fsphil> I'll setup an igate, though it usually has good coverage anyway
[16:47] <charolastra> what's the typical volume of a balloon at ground level? i read about 3000 liters H, which would be 3m³ which is huge
[16:48] <mclane> yea, but thats it
[16:48] <fsphil> depends on the balloon. usually a meter and a bit
[16:48] <fsphil> metre
[16:48] <Iain_G4SGX> mfa298: crw-rw---- 1 root dialout 188, 2 Aug 10 17:14 /dev/ttyUSB2
[16:49] <Iain_G4SGX> mfa298: as my normal user not as root
[16:49] <charolastra> fsphil: diameter?
[16:49] <Willdude123> OK replaced jumper wires, these ones are defo continuous
[16:50] <fsphil> yea diameter
[16:50] <fsphil> the 1600g balloons are quite tall
[16:50] <mfa298> Iain_G4SGX: you might then want to also run groups and check that you're in the dialout group
[16:51] <daveake> 3 cubic metres is about average
[16:52] <mfa298> although remembering back, I had a similar issue with a bluetooth gps where one of the bits of stuff in the system thought the gps serial port was a dialup modem meaning the device was locked
[16:52] <Willdude123> I really should get my own multimeter
[16:54] Action: Willdude123 strokes his beard (or lack thereof)
[16:55] <Willdude123> Hmm
[16:55] <Willdude123> Connection still dodgy
[16:55] <charolastra> someone having too much fun: http://i.ebayimg.com/16/!B4RkDnQCWk~$%28KGrHqUOKikEyZMqnFvZBMpOdtsG8!~~_12.JPG
[16:55] <Iain_G4SGX> mfa298: Think its a device specific prob with the Gobi2000 card, there are some specialised serial comms updates about for it I'm just using standard qserial. Not gonna go down that road..
[16:56] <chrisstubbs> Are there any latex balloons that fall into the <2m category?
[16:56] <chrisstubbs> Need to test my new boards at altitude to see if I fixed that gps bug
[16:57] <daveake> <100g
[16:57] <chrisstubbs> Yeah i figured they would be borderline, steves site says over 2m
[16:58] <Willdude123> ping anyone willing to help.
[16:58] <chrisstubbs> I wonder what those 36" ones are like at burst
[16:58] <mfa298> Willdude123: it could be a mismatch between the size of the wires and the size of the socket you're plugging it into
[16:59] <Willdude123> Well, it's just an 8 pin header.
[16:59] <Willdude123> http://www.coolcomponents.co.uk/catalog/stackable-header-p-348.html
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[17:01] <mfa298> and what wire do you have ?
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[17:05] <ibanezmatt13> On my PC in notepad I've made a .c file. I need to compile this into a .hex file so that I can use avrdude to flash it onto my avr. Could anybody help with this?
[17:05] <Willdude123> mfa298 Jumper wires
[17:06] <Willdude123> They're continuous though.
[17:06] <mfa298> Willdude123: jumper wires doesn't mean much
[17:07] <Willdude123> 75 Piece Jumper Wire Bundle
[17:07] <Willdude123> That's all I know
[17:07] <Willdude123> If they're continous, it doesn't matter.
[17:07] <Willdude123> Because it worked before.
[17:07] <Willdude123> With the same wires.
[17:08] <mfa298> my guess is that the wires are too small for the headers you've got so you don't always get a good connection
[17:08] <Willdude123> So I have no clue what's wrong.
[17:08] <Willdude123> I do though
[17:08] <Willdude123> I tested them
[17:08] <mfa298> how did you test them ?
[17:08] <Willdude123> And they are always perfectly continuous
[17:08] <Willdude123> Multitester
[17:08] <mfa298> the wires might be good on their own. but they might not be a good connection in the socket
[17:09] <ibanezmatt13> mfa298: In amtel studio, is it possible to write a C file and compile it and save the compiled files in a folder?
[17:09] <mfa298> what did you test the multitester to?
[17:09] <mfa298> ibanezmatt13: should be possible - been a while since I did it
[17:09] <ibanezmatt13> cool
[17:09] <ibanezmatt13> thanks
[17:10] <mfa298> there should be a button maked build (from memory) that compiles it.
[17:10] <mfa298> you probably need to tell it which chip it's compiling for
[17:10] <Willdude123> mfa298 One end of the wire and the pins of the headers (under the board)
[17:11] <Willdude123> That doesn't mean the header is continuous with the board though
[17:11] <Willdude123> But it looks it
[17:11] <chrisstubbs> Willdude123, are the joints your dad did shiny and clean?
[17:11] <chrisstubbs> solder joints that is
[17:12] <mfa298> in the process of testing that you might have also been putting pressure on the wires meaking they made a good contact, but when you're not testing them they could be loose
[17:12] <Willdude123> Yeah he only goes for the best cigarettes.
[17:12] <Willdude123> Reasonably.
[17:12] <chrisstubbs> hmm
[17:12] <Willdude123> I think the problem must be with the header, I don't know how though.
[17:12] <Willdude123> I might desolder it and solder some wires directly on to it, however.
[17:13] <chrisstubbs> the solder may have not wicked along the pad/pin properly leaving a bad connection
[17:13] <mfa298> I think the most likely place for issues is the header to wire interface. It's not that different to using breadboard and you know how many issues that's caused people
[17:14] <mfa298> some decent pictures of the soldering and how it's setup would really help here.
[17:15] <ibanezmatt13> ping mikestir_
[17:16] <ibanezmatt13> I tried to compile a C file and I got the error: avr/io.h No such file or directory. Is that because I need the avr/io.h to be in the same directory as the code?
[17:16] <ibanezmatt13> I've got the C code in the /home/pi directory and I don't know where the avr/io.h would be
[17:16] <mikestir_> no that implies you don't have avr-libc installed
[17:17] <mikestir_> did you compile it with avr-gcc?
[17:17] <Willdude123> I know, because my dad won't let me solder, I should order a PCB with around 100 pointless connections on it, just to annoy him to the point he lets me do it.
[17:17] <ibanezmatt13> no, just gcc
[17:17] <mikestir_> or are you in avrstudio here?
[17:17] <ibanezmatt13> no, I'm on my Pi
[17:17] <ibanezmatt13> terminal
[17:17] <mikestir_> Willdude123: Why won't he let you solder? I think my dad taught me to solder when I was about 6
[17:17] <ibanezmatt13> I've got a .c file and I just need to compile it so that I can flash it
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[17:18] <Willdude123> Thinks I'll burn myself and my granddad has Parkinson's.
[17:18] <mikestir_> ibanezmatt13: You need to link it as well. It's easier with a makefile
[17:19] <ibanezmatt13> not sure what to do :/ I've made the .c
[17:19] <ibanezmatt13> shall I put the .c in a new folder
[17:19] <mikestir_> I'm just chucking a little example together with a makefile. You can then just use that makefile as a basis for everything else
[17:19] <mikestir_> it handles all the avrdude stuff as well
[17:20] <ibanezmatt13> cool, thanks
[17:22] <ibanezmatt13> it's still implying avr/io.h isn't installed :(
[17:22] <mikestir_> ibanezmatt13: http://mike-stirling.com/files/blinky_minimal.tar.gz
[17:22] <Willdude123> Geez youtube geek week has nothing cool
[17:22] <Willdude123> It's all sci fi
[17:23] <ibanezmatt13> mikestir_: how should I get it onto my Pi fin the terminal?
[17:23] <ibanezmatt13> wget?
[17:23] <mikestir_> yes that would work
[17:23] <Willdude123> I thought it'd all be xkcd and stuff.
[17:23] <Willdude123> *like xkc
[17:23] <Willdude123> *like xkcd
[17:23] <ibanezmatt13> got it mikestir_
[17:24] <mikestir_> extract it and just type "make"
[17:24] <mikestir_> you should end up with, among other things, blinky.hex
[17:24] <cde> Willdude123: what is youtube geek week?
[17:24] <ibanezmatt13> how do I extract? tar -zxvf or something?
[17:24] <Willdude123> Youtube it
[17:24] <mikestir_> tar xzf blah.tar.gxz
[17:24] <Willdude123> :P
[17:24] <mikestir_> gz*
[17:24] <cde> k
[17:24] <mfa298> Willdude123: that probably depends on how old you are. I know many people who think this is cool https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=74r-EbIqt9s
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[17:25] <Lunar_Lander> helo
[17:25] <Lunar_Lander> +l
[17:25] <ibanezmatt13> mikestir_: Ok, make done
[17:26] <ibanezmatt13> what should I do next?
[17:26] <ibanezmatt13> oh I see
[17:26] <mikestir_> well you could just type "make program", but you'd need a mega328
[17:26] <ibanezmatt13> flash the hex file onto the avr?
[17:26] <ibanezmatt13> using avrdude
[17:26] <Willdude123> mfa298 they look way too young to be the original cast.
[17:26] <mikestir_> yes. make program will take care of programming the fuses and the program
[17:27] <mikestir_> are you testing this on the attiny?
[17:27] <ibanezmatt13> yep
[17:27] <mikestir_> have you got a led on one of the GPIOs?
[17:27] <ibanezmatt13> no, any particular one?
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[17:27] <mikestir_> suppose PB3 or PB4 since that won't interfere with any of the ISP connections
[17:27] <Willdude123> mfa298 seems more like a panto
[17:28] <ibanezmatt13> ok, one sec
[17:28] <mikestir_> use 470R or so if you're running off 5V
[17:28] <mfa298> Willdude123: I've only watched a few minutes of it so far. But that TV Program was very popular when it was on.
[17:29] <ibanezmatt13> ok mikestir_ ready
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[17:29] <mikestir_> so in blinky.c just change DDRD and PORTD to DDRB and PORTB respectively
[17:29] <ibanezmatt13> what's the differencE?
[17:29] <mikestir_> different ports
[17:29] <ibanezmatt13> how do I know which port is which?
[17:29] <mikestir_> the AVRs have multiple 8-bit ports, but the arduino hides that
[17:30] <mikestir_> on the datasheet you'll see the pins are named PAn, PBn, PCn, etc.
[17:30] <ibanezmatt13> I'll look at it now
[17:31] <mikestir_> you'll also need to change the pin numbers in blinky.c. I defined two LEDs (because that was what was on my board) but I only flash the green one
[17:32] <ibanezmatt13> so I change the pin number to the physical or GPIO pin number?
[17:32] <mikestir_> assuming you put your LED on PB3, change LED_GREEN to 3. You might as well change LED_RED to 4 so you can stick another LED on PB4.
[17:32] <mikestir_> GPIO pin number
[17:32] <ibanezmatt13> ok
[17:32] <mikestir_> the CPU doesn't care about physical pins
[17:32] <Lunar_Lander> chrisstubbs, the PCB failed :(
[17:32] <chrisstubbs> uh oh
[17:32] <ibanezmatt13> ok mikestir_ it's on D4
[17:32] <ibanezmatt13> digital 4
[17:33] <chrisstubbs> time to recomple chdk this should be fun
[17:33] <mikestir_> which physical pin is that?
[17:33] <ibanezmatt13> err, 3 I think
[17:33] <ibanezmatt13> yes 3
[17:33] <mikestir_> ok. That's PB4
[17:34] <mikestir_> the digital n stuff is arduino specific
[17:34] <ibanezmatt13> "change DDRD and PORTD to DDRB and PORTB respectively" what did you mean by this again?
[17:34] <mikestir_> DDRD becomes DDRB, PORTD becomes PORTB
[17:35] <ibanezmatt13> So I change those
[17:35] <mikestir_> yes. take a look at the datasheet pinout for one of the bigger AVRs - it might make more sense then
[17:36] <mikestir_> you'll see how there are several 8-bit ports
[17:36] <ibanezmatt13> I'll look tonight
[17:36] <ibanezmatt13> Ok, I've modified blinky.c
[17:36] <mikestir_> then you need to modify the Makefile for the new target
[17:36] <ibanezmatt13> do I need to recompile?
[17:36] <mikestir_> after you mod the makefile
[17:36] <ibanezmatt13> ah, ok so into the makefile
[17:37] <mikestir_> so you may just need to change MCU to attiny85
[17:37] <mikestir_> and AVRDUDE_MCU to t85
[17:37] <ibanezmatt13> Are those fuse settings in the makefile ok for the attiny's internal clock?
[17:37] <mikestir_> I'm just going to check that
[17:38] <ibanezmatt13> I've never looked at a makefile before. Looks quite complex :)
[17:39] <ibanezmatt13> mikestir_: I'm powering the attiny with 5v
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[17:39] <ibanezmatt13> if that helps
[17:40] <mfa298> makefiles are fairly simple once you understand how they go together - and really useful
[17:40] <ibanezmatt13> I like C but I'm very new to how it all works with all these files
[17:40] <ibanezmatt13> I'm used to, run program.py
[17:41] <KT5TK-5> BLT34 is up. and coming close to burst. Check KT5TK-4 and W5ACM-11 on APRS.fi
[17:41] <mfa298> Makefiles aren't just for C (although that's their most common use)
[17:42] <KT5TK-5> It's posting updates on Twitter (hashtag #BLT34)
[17:42] <mfa298> they just provide a set of rules of how to create one type of file from some source files
[17:42] <ibanezmatt13> mikestir_: in the fuses part of that makefile, in brakets it says 1.8v. That could cause some issues
[17:42] <mikestir_> no that's just minimal voltage
[17:42] <ibanezmatt13> ok
[17:42] <mikestir_> minimum rather
[17:42] <mikestir_> it's for the brownout detector
[17:43] <ibanezmatt13> no idea what that is :)
[17:43] <mikestir_> it resets the chip if vcc falls too low
[17:43] <ibanezmatt13> ah right ok
[17:43] <ibanezmatt13> are the fuses ok in that file for the tin85?
[17:43] <ibanezmatt13> tiny*
[17:43] <KT5TK-5> AF5LI has a airplane rx (SSR) and is still linking down on 926 MHz 19k2 FSK
[17:43] <mikestir_> not quite. 0xff, 0xde, 0x52
[17:44] <mikestir_> but the EXT fuse will probably need some tweaking
[17:44] <mikestir_> some of the bits are usually unimplemented. avrdude will complain and you can derive the correct value from the error message
[17:44] <jcoxon> KT5TK-5, cool
[17:44] <mikestir_> http://mike-stirling.com/files/blinky_attiny.tar.gz
[17:45] <mikestir_> that's untested
[17:45] <ibanezmatt13> I'll try it anyway
[17:45] <mikestir_> it should be pretty much where you are now anyway
[17:45] <ibanezmatt13> how do I delete the old one?
[17:45] <mikestir_> the old hex file?
[17:45] <mikestir_> make clean
[17:45] <KT5TK-5> we also have live analog video from the balloon
[17:46] <ibanezmatt13> this link you sent me, shall I redownload it mikestir_ ?
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[17:46] Nick change: mikestir_ -> mikestir
[17:46] <mikestir> you can do if you want to check your changes
[17:46] <mikestir> it will extract to a different directory
[17:47] <ibanezmatt13> That's fine, I'll do that
[17:47] <KT5TK-5> 2 W FM NTSC TV transmitter. Receiving with helical and amping up with 915 MHz HABamps
[17:48] <ibanezmatt13> ok mikestir. I ran "sudo make" on the new one I just downloaded
[17:48] <mikestir> ok. the only thing you need to sudo is make program, though
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[17:48] <ibanezmatt13> ah right
[17:48] <ibanezmatt13> did you edit the makefile on the new verison?
[17:49] <mikestir> yes
[17:49] <mikestir> and it built ok, but I don't have an attiny85 to test it on
[17:49] <ibanezmatt13> ok. What's the next step?
[17:49] <ibanezmatt13> i'll try it
[17:49] <mikestir> with your avrisp connected, sudo make program
[17:49] <ibanezmatt13> ok, one sec
[17:49] <mikestir> then your led should start flashing
[17:50] <ibanezmatt13> program fuses error 1
[17:50] <ibanezmatt13> oh, m328 still part of it
[17:50] <mikestir> ok I was expecting that - can you pastebin it
[17:50] <mikestir> did you change the AVRDUDE_MCU line in the makefile?
[17:50] <ibanezmatt13> it's the part mikq
[17:50] <ibanezmatt13> no
[17:50] <ibanezmatt13> not the new one
[17:51] <ibanezmatt13> also have the ports been changed like before on the new .c file?
[17:51] <mikestir> oh this is using my new example. That should be ok. Where is it still mentioning the m328?
[17:52] <ibanezmatt13> in the command
[17:52] <ibanezmatt13> which file is the avrdude command in?
[17:52] <mikestir> the makefile, but it's generated by macros
[17:52] <ibanezmatt13> hmm
[17:53] <ibanezmatt13> which file do you set the avr ?
[17:53] <mikestir> makefile
[17:53] <ibanezmatt13> ill chec kit
[17:53] <ibanezmatt13> ah yes
[17:53] <ibanezmatt13> still m328
[17:53] <mikestir> I just tried it here, baring in mind I have a mega328 connected, and it correctly complained it wasn't a tiny85
[17:54] <ibanezmatt13> didn't you change the fuses though?
[17:54] <mikestir> yes, but it won't touch the cpu until it knows it's the right one
[17:54] <mikestir> that's what the signature thing is about
[17:54] <ibanezmatt13> Ok, I've modified the Makefile to have the t85 name. What do I do now?
[17:54] <Lunar_Lander> chrisstubbs, standby for PCB remarks
[17:55] <mikestir> sudo make program
[17:55] <mikestir> the makefile should have "MCU = attiny85" and "AVRDUDE_MCU = t85"
[17:55] <mikestir> does that look right?
[17:55] <ibanezmatt13> avrdude: safemode: efuse changed! Was 6, and is now fe Would you like this fuse to be changed back? [y/n]
[17:55] <ibanezmatt13> it works now apart from this ^
[17:57] <Lunar_Lander> chrisstubbs, OK what I noticed
[17:57] <ibanezmatt13> mikestir: should I go ahead with the changed fuse?
[17:57] <Lunar_Lander> the resistors seem to be good for metal film ones, but for carbon ones, the holes are just fitting
[17:57] <mikestir> no this is the error I was expecting
[17:57] <Lunar_Lander> probably one needs to select a bigger grid size for carbon resistors
[17:57] <ibanezmatt13> ok
[17:57] <Lunar_Lander> also the solder didn't look like it would come through the holes to connect to the top layer tracks
[17:58] <mikestir> ctrl-c and edit the makefile to change FUSES_EXT
[17:58] <mikestir> the value in the error isn't quite what I was expecting though
[17:58] <ibanezmatt13> ok, what shall I change it to?
[17:59] <Lunar_Lander> wait
[18:00] <Lunar_Lander> I also got that error once
[18:00] <Lunar_Lander> i.e. I wanted 0xff and it said it was 0x07
[18:00] <Lunar_Lander> it is not a severe error IIRC
[18:00] <mikestir> Lunar_Lander: that's more what I was expecting, since bit 0 is the only one that actually does anything
[18:00] <mikestir> some of the bits are physically unimplemented so read as 0 instead of 1
[18:00] <Lunar_Lander> yea
[18:01] <mikestir> ibanezmatt13: try 0x07
[18:01] <ibanezmatt13> ok
[18:01] <mikestir> tbh it doesn't really matter at this stage - that fuse doesn't do anything critical
[18:01] <ibanezmatt13> btw, are fuses irreversible
[18:01] <mikestir> no
[18:01] <mikestir> they are flash
[18:01] <ibanezmatt13> cool, one sec
[18:01] <Lunar_Lander> chrisstubbs, I hope I don't have the Photodiode in backwards, but I checked with the datasheet before
[18:01] <mikestir> the only thing is if you set it to an external clock when you aren't providing one
[18:02] <ibanezmatt13> mikestir: same error, avrdude: safemode: efuse changed! Was 6, and is now fe Would you like this fuse to be changed back? [y/n]
[18:02] <Lunar_Lander> it is apperantly obvious which side is cathode, so I don't think I was wrong there
[18:02] <mikestir> just accept it then
[18:02] <mikestir> and hopefully that will work
[18:02] <ibanezmatt13> "n"?
[18:02] <mikestir> y
[18:02] <ibanezmatt13> what is fe?
[18:02] <mikestir> 254
[18:02] <ibanezmatt13> what is 0x07?
[18:03] <mikestir> 7
[18:03] <mikestir> it's hex
[18:03] <ibanezmatt13> So isn't that not changing it to 7?
[18:03] <mikestir> fe should be written as 0xfe
[18:03] <ibanezmatt13> as in the makefile?
[18:03] <mikestir> no. that's what's confusing me. it doesn't seem to be setting bit 0, which according to the datasheet is the only implemented one
[18:04] <ibanezmatt13> ok, the programmer is flashing green
[18:04] <ibanezmatt13> one led is permanent orange, the other is flashing green
[18:04] <mikestir> programming should be pretty quick
[18:04] <ibanezmatt13> nothing happening in terminal
[18:04] <mikestir> it will run avrdude 4 times
[18:05] <ibanezmatt13> it's not doing anything I think. It's just hanging after entering y
[18:05] <mikestir> ctrl-c and repeat then try n instead then!
[18:05] <ibanezmatt13> i tried n and it said fuses error 1
[18:06] <ibanezmatt13> ill do a pastebin
[18:06] <mikestir> ok edit the makefile, find the line immediately below the one that starts "program_fuses:"
[18:06] <mikestir> and comment it out with a #
[18:06] <mikestir> then try again
[18:06] <ibanezmatt13> mikestir: http://pastie.org/8224961
[18:06] <mikestir> I'll have to come back to this later - little man needs his bath
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[18:07] <ibanezmatt13> okie dokie
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[18:19] <Willdude123> ping Upu
[18:31] <cm13g09> anything going up tomorrow?
[18:32] <mikestir> ibanezmatt13: just looked at your pastie - the makefile looks like it's trying to set the wrong efuse value
[18:33] <ibanezmatt13> yeah, I've not fixed it uet
[18:33] <mikestir> take a look at the new makefile and see what the differences are
[18:33] <ibanezmatt13> yet
[18:33] <ibanezmatt13> ok
[18:33] <mikestir> the values are set near the top where it says FUSES_EXT, FUSES_HIGH and FUSES_LOW
[18:34] <ibanezmatt13> ext is 0x07
[18:34] <ibanezmatt13> bodlevel[2:0] = 6
[18:34] <mikestir> it was 0x06 when you did that pastie
[18:34] <ibanezmatt13> oh right, I changed it to 7 and it didnt work
[18:34] <ibanezmatt13> are those fuses commented out
[18:34] <ibanezmatt13> "#"
[18:34] <mikestir> I think 0xff will work
[18:35] <mikestir> only the FUSES_x lines are real
[18:35] <mikestir> the rest are just comments describing how the value was derived
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[18:35] <ibanezmatt13> I've only been changing the ones after a # :
[18:35] <ibanezmatt13> :/
[18:35] <mikestir> that would be the problem
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[18:35] <ibanezmatt13> damn
[18:35] <mikestir> it's good practice to do that, but you need to calculate the combined hex value as well
[18:36] <mikestir> just copy the new makefile over - it should work straight off
[18:36] <ibanezmatt13> which new makefile?
[18:36] <mikestir> the one in the blinky_attiny archiv
[18:36] <ibanezmatt13> oh have you edited the one on the link?
[18:36] <mikestir> e
[18:36] <mikestir> I sent another link. I took the original version and changed it for attiny85
[18:37] <ibanezmatt13> that should be the same makefile then
[18:37] <ibanezmatt13> FF, 5F and 62 are in for the fuses at the minute then
[18:37] <mikestir> where did that come from?
[18:37] <mikestir> ff, de, 52
[18:38] <ibanezmatt13> they were already in the makefile
[18:38] <ibanezmatt13> you want me to change it to EXT- FF, HIGH - DE, LOW - 52?
[18:38] <mikestir> the atmega makefile has 06, d9, 52, and the attiny one has ff, 5f, 62
[18:38] <mikestir> sorry no, i'm copying your bit there
[18:38] <mikestir> the attiny one has ff, de, 52
[18:39] <mikestir> yes
[18:39] <ibanezmatt13> o, I'll change it then
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[18:39] <mikestir> I think we have got out of sync. That's probably my fault because I was rushing before
[18:40] <ibanezmatt13> it's ok. The fuses are now FF, DE and 52
[18:40] <ibanezmatt13> and the MCU name is attiny85 and t85
[18:40] <ibanezmatt13> I think we're ready
[18:40] <mikestir> ok. try sudo make program again then
[18:40] <ibanezmatt13> 2 greens on programmer here we go
[18:41] <mikestir> ...
[18:41] <mikestir> it should only take about 2 seconds
[18:41] <ibanezmatt13> wait, I just ran the first command we had and it said that it failed initialsation
[18:41] <ibanezmatt13> no point doing sudo make program just yet
[18:41] <ibanezmatt13> wonder what that could be
[18:42] <mikestir> disconnect and reconnect the avrisp
[18:42] <ibanezmatt13> ok
[18:42] <mikestir> sometimes it gets its knickers in a knot
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[18:42] <ibanezmatt13> didn't work mikestir
[18:42] <mikestir> is it possible you set the fuses to something weird?
[18:44] <ibanezmatt13> not sure
[18:44] <ibanezmatt13> I have another attiny85 anyway
[18:44] <ibanezmatt13> I'll change them over
[18:45] <mikestir> ok. I was just looking to see what those funny values would have done. The only notable change would have been to disable the reset pin.
[18:46] <ibanezmatt13> ok, new attiny in position
[18:46] <ibanezmatt13> and I have a device signature!
[18:46] <mikestir> double check the fuse values in the makefile before you hit program!
[18:47] <ibanezmatt13> I thought they were irreversible? :)
[18:47] <ibanezmatt13> ok, what should the fuses be before I commit?
[18:47] <mikestir> ff, de, 52
[18:47] <ibanezmatt13> ok, are capitals ok?
[18:47] <mikestir> yes
[18:48] <ibanezmatt13> here wego
[18:48] <Lunar_Lander> :)
[18:48] <Lunar_Lander> Arthur Dent
[18:48] <ibanezmatt13> ok mikestir it worked perfectly
[18:48] <ibanezmatt13> but no led
[18:48] <ibanezmatt13> flashing
[18:49] <mikestir> pastie your c file
[18:49] <ibanezmatt13> here's the output firstly: http://pastie.org/8225027
[18:50] <mikestir> looks fine
[18:50] <ibanezmatt13> the .c file has not been touched at all since I downloaded the file
[18:50] <ibanezmatt13> Ah, still set to pins 6 and 7
[18:51] <mikestir> I thought you downloaded the new version I did?
[18:51] <ibanezmatt13> I must be getting confused between them. I don't know how to delete directories
[18:51] <mikestir> rm -rf directoryname (with great care)
[18:52] <ibanezmatt13> I have a blinking led!
[18:52] <mikestir> nice
[18:52] <ibanezmatt13> now...
[18:52] <ibanezmatt13> I really need to understand how to make my own program to control 3 leds
[18:53] <ibanezmatt13> I suppose I could just change it a bit
[18:53] <mikestir> well start by sticking another LED on PB3 and seeing if you can make them blink alternately
[18:53] <ibanezmatt13> But Id love to know how to do this: Write my .c file, compile it, then use a standard command in avrdude to flash it
[18:53] <ibanezmatt13> including the header files I import
[18:53] <mikestir> just use that makefile
[18:54] <mikestir> further down you will see "TARGET = " which you can set to the name of your project
[18:54] <mikestir> then list all the c files that make up your project in "SRC = "
[18:54] <mikestir> and set up your device type and fuses (and clock if you change it)
[18:54] <mikestir> it will take care of the rest
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[18:55] <ibanezmatt13> fantastic, thank you very much for that file. It's very helpful
[18:56] <mikestir> np. I've got some painting to do so I'll be back on later. You should be able to modify that program to blink two LEDs. Basically you are just doing logical OR and logical AND of bits in the PORTB register
[18:56] <mikestir> OR a bit to 1 to turn that pin on
[18:56] <mikestir> AND it to 0 to turn it off
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[19:23] <mikestir> ibanezmatt13: I was thinking... use make program_flash if you have recompiled your code but the fuses are the same
[19:23] <mikestir> that will skip fuse programming
[19:23] <ibanezmatt13> oh cool. I've just finished editing the .c. I'll try that shortly. Cheers :)
[19:26] <Lunar_Lander> hi mikestir
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[19:26] <ibanezmatt13> mikestir: I've redone the .c on another pc and I'm trying to use winscp to get it onto the Pi. It won't let me replace the .c already there
[19:27] <ibanezmatt13> in fact, I have an idea
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[19:36] <ibanezmatt13> I know this is a pretty basic thing but I need to calculate a good resistor value for my LED.
[19:36] <ibanezmatt13> 5v logic
[19:36] <ibanezmatt13> it's a normal led
[19:37] <ibanezmatt13> in fact, ignore me
[19:37] <Lunar_Lander> ibanezmatt13, what are you doing at the moment?
[19:37] <Lunar_Lander> getting the avrispII to work?
[19:37] <ibanezmatt13> got it working Lunar_Lander :)
[19:37] <ibanezmatt13> I resorted to linux on the Pi
[19:38] <ibanezmatt13> I'm making my brother a traffic lights sequence using an attiny85
[19:38] <ibanezmatt13> I've managed to program it and I was trying to work out the colour code for a 430 ohm resistor
[19:38] <Lunar_Lander> cool
[19:38] <ibanezmatt13> or something pretty close
[19:38] <Lunar_Lander> so you program via the Pi?
[19:38] <ibanezmatt13> yep
[19:38] <ibanezmatt13> using avrdude
[19:40] <Lunar_Lander> yay :)
[19:40] <Lunar_Lander> and I hope your windows 8 still works :)
[19:41] <ibanezmatt13> haha, probably not :)
[19:41] <Lunar_Lander> xD
[19:41] <ibanezmatt13> I probably did it some good
[19:42] <ibanezmatt13> ok, I'm off to find a 430ohm resistor in a big box full of them. See you later
[19:42] <cm13g09> ibanezmatt13: Have fun :P
[19:42] <cm13g09> Yellow, Orange, Brown (or Yel, Orange, Blk, Blk)
[19:42] <cm13g09> FWIW
[19:43] <ibanezmatt13> thank you! :)
[19:43] <cm13g09> Depends if you have 4-colour or 3-colour
[19:44] <charolastra> next time google for "graphical resistor calculator"
[19:48] <mfa298> or learn the colours
[19:48] <cm13g09> lol
[19:48] <cm13g09> yeah - that does help mfa298
[19:49] <cm13g09> mfa298: For reference, I still haven't figured out my problem at work
[19:49] <cm13g09> although I have a couple of leads for tomorrow night
[19:49] <cm13g09> so I can test them on Monday
[19:50] <mfa298> well it is windows, what do you expect
[19:50] <cm13g09> lol
[19:50] <cm13g09> I think this is actually an Intel-ism that's causing the issue
[19:51] <cm13g09> Intel seem to have some funky network card feature that means that for N packets, one interrupt is generated....
[19:51] <mikestir> ibanezmatt13: just been reading back - you were presumably editing the original c file as root
[19:51] <cm13g09> rather than N packets = N interrupts!
[19:51] <ibanezmatt13> yes, just did it mikestir. It's working perfectly
[19:51] <ibanezmatt13> I have traffic lights :)
[19:51] <mikestir> nice one
[19:51] <ibanezmatt13> thank you
[19:52] <mikestir> np
[19:52] <mfa298> just dont visit Southampton with your traffic lifghts, we've got enough already.
[19:52] <cm13g09> mfa298: lol
[19:52] <mikestir> fwiw I use a variation on that makefile for ARM as well, so it's a good basis if you want to step up
[19:54] <mikestir> cm13g09: Linux has a kernel feature that takes advantage of that kind of sparse interrupt approach so it's probably not unique to Intel
[19:54] <mikestir> I remember coming across it when I was porting a driver for an embedded ethernet MAC for something at work
[19:55] <mfa298> In high bandwidth stuff that sort of feature is useful. You don't want a CPU core to be the limiting factor of throughput
[19:56] <cm13g09> mfa298: yep, you need interrupt aggregation
[19:56] <mikestir> yes I think that's the basic idea - the CPU is just keeping a vague eye on what's going on while the actual transfer is happening by DMA
[19:56] <cm13g09> but our NICs seem to be doing a bit more that it's supposed to
[19:57] <cm13g09> and therefore WDS is slowing down the TFTP transfer
[19:57] <cm13g09> I long for the day that TFTP gets replaced with something slightly more sane
[19:58] <mfa298> tftp is good for what it was deisnged for. It's not so good for larger files.
[19:58] <cm13g09> yeah
[19:59] <cm13g09> 200MB is far larger than it was designed for
[20:01] <Willdude123> mfa298 it must be the headers, I'm thinking
[20:02] <Willdude123> Well the header
[20:02] <Willdude123> Because if there's continuity with the pins, through the header, it must be a problem with the header's connection to it.
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[20:04] <Willdude123> Given there's no ack or nack from the Ublox
[20:05] <SP9UOB> Evening All
[20:05] <Willdude123> And it's obvious it's txing the commands ok.
[20:07] <mfa298> Willdude123: do you mean an issue in the header itself or the connection between the wires and the header or the connection between the header and the uBlox board.
[20:08] <mfa298> based on my experience I'd have thought the most likely place for it to be dodgy is the connection between the jumper wire and the header
[20:08] <Willdude123> Header and Ublox board.
[20:08] <Willdude123> Except it isn't/
[20:08] <Willdude123> There's continuity
[20:09] <mfa298> if it was between the header and the ublox board that would suggest a bad solder job (which isn't easy to do on something like that)
[20:10] <mfa298> If you put some pressure on the jumper wires where they connect to the ublox does it work better?
[20:11] <Willdude123> Nope.
[20:13] <Willdude123> Thing is, the header looks fine.
[20:14] <Willdude123> And it worked for a bit.
[20:14] <Willdude123> ping Upu
[20:15] <Upu> Evening Will
[20:15] <mfa298> you might want to check the resistance along the wires (but check the meter reads 0 first with just the probes first)
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[20:16] <SP9UOB> Greetings from Italy :-)
[20:16] <Upu> Where abouts SP9UOB ?
[20:17] <SP9UOB> UPU: Bibione, near (80 km) Venice : http://aprs.fi/#!mt=roadmap&z=11&call=a%2FSP9UOB-9&timerange=86400&tail=86400
[20:17] <Upu> that is a long drive
[20:18] <SP9UOB> about 10 hours. Driving to London takes me 26 hours
[20:18] <Upu> I've been to Trieste close to there
[20:18] <Upu> for about 10 mins
[20:18] <Upu> drove straight over the border into Slovenia
[20:18] <Upu> enjoy it anyway :)
[20:19] <SP9UOB> thanks :-)
[20:19] <Lunar_Lander> hi SP9UOB, wish you a nice vacation!
[20:19] <Lunar_Lander> and hi Upu
[20:19] <Upu> hi Lunar
[20:20] <Willdude123> Good news is GPS headers are on.
[20:20] <SP9UOB> Hi Lunar_Lander :-), thanks.
[20:20] <Willdude123> Bad News is they don't work
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[20:20] <Willdude123> I've got the logic analyser just under the txd line.
[20:20] <Willdude123> It's txing nothing
[20:20] <Lunar_Lander> Upu, I got a PCB design question
[20:21] <Willdude123> But it's rxing the commands, with no ACK
[20:21] <Upu> shoot
[20:21] <Lunar_Lander> how big should one choose a drill? just the size of the component leads or bigger?
[20:21] <Willdude123> Upu: Are you available to look at the logic analyser files?
[20:21] <Upu> not atm
[20:21] <Upu> 2 mins Lunar
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[20:23] <cyclops> hi
[20:23] <cyclops> Just preparing the flight doc
[20:23] <cyclops> Well last check
[20:24] <Willdude123> Upu, Just to check the VCC on the 3v3 board is 3v3?
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[20:25] <Upu> yes it is
[20:25] <Upu> hey cyclops
[20:25] <Upu> is it tomorrow ?
[20:25] <cyclops> yes it is
[20:25] <Upu> Lunar_Lander stick with 0.5mm for vias
[20:25] <Upu> wow
[20:25] <Upu> good luck will be watching
[20:25] <Upu> what time are you launching ?
[20:25] <cyclops> Thanks!
[20:25] <cyclops> pretty early
[20:25] <cyclops> 8AM
[20:25] <Upu> go do the flight doc and I'll approve it
[20:26] <cyclops> 6AM in london
[20:26] <cyclops> im currently checking everithing is ok
[20:26] <Willdude123> So the board must be powered.
[20:26] <Upu> ofc
[20:26] <cyclops> Ah and i added the 2cond sensoor
[20:26] <Upu> make sure the telemetry works
[20:26] <cyclops> Seems to worl perfectly
[20:26] <cyclops> but its wired reverse of yours
[20:26] <Upu> lets get you on the map
[20:26] <Upu> odd
[20:27] <Lunar_Lander> Upu, and component holes?
[20:27] <Lunar_Lander> good luck cyclops
[20:27] <Upu> holes for what Lunar ?
[20:27] <Lunar_Lander> the holes where through hole components are inserted
[20:27] <cyclops> thanks Lunar_Lander
[20:27] <cyclops> Im very Stressed now :P
[20:27] <x-f> cyclops, that's normal :)
[20:29] <Upu> do you know your knots ?
[20:29] <cyclops> Upu I do have to "Add" a payload to the document right?
[20:29] <Upu> yes
[20:29] <cyclops> i saw the ones on the wiki
[20:29] <Upu> know the alpine butter fly
[20:29] <Willdude123> Hmm
[20:29] <Upu> put the payload on the map cyclops
[20:29] <Willdude123> This makes me think the board isn't powered.
[20:29] <Willdude123> But I don't have a DMM yet.
[20:29] <Willdude123> So can't test that.
[20:30] <cyclops> Upu: telemetry changed so I mightedit that one or create a new
[20:30] <cyclops> Can you delete that one and Ill create one?
[20:31] <Upu> just create a new one
[20:31] <Upu> it overrides the old one
[20:31] <cyclops> Right
[20:32] <ibanezmatt13> Upu: I'd like to contribute to the wiki in some way. Is there anything that would be hepful that I could do?
[20:32] <ibanezmatt13> helpful*
[20:32] <Upu> anything you think is missing
[20:33] <ibanezmatt13> There's not a lot about Pi's
[20:33] <ibanezmatt13> And there are several people on here with Pi's
[20:35] <ibanezmatt13> Upu: I would have done something on the Pi n Chips if it was something people could buy :)
[20:35] <Upu> well
[20:35] <Upu> I am talking with Dave about a "habduino" for the Pi
[20:36] <Upu> but its going to end up with an AVR on it
[20:36] <ibanezmatt13> ah right, cool
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[20:36] <Upu> damn just realised I sat through at least a minute of JLS on the jukebox..
[20:36] <Upu> uff
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[20:37] <ibanezmatt13> lol
[20:37] <mfa298> you need a better jukebox
[20:37] <Babs__> Makes a change from S Club 7 though surely Upu?
[20:37] <Upu> Girls Aloud purleeez
[20:38] <daveake> and the soundtrack CD of Pretty In Pink
[20:38] <Willdude123> Upu I will check once I get a DMM if the module is receiving power.
[20:38] <charolastra> uhm, what's the baseline powerdraw of a RPi again; something like 700mA@5V; won't the power supply be way to heavy for ballooning?
[20:38] <Willdude123> daveake said "If you have a beard and sandals you may scoff at this challenge" pretty sure he has sandals, not sure about the beard.
[20:38] <Babs__> Don't say stuff you can't take back daveake - that soundtrack is awesome
[20:38] <Babs__> ;-)
[20:39] <Babs__> Although I do have the title track downloaded on my iPhone
[20:39] <Babs__> I hope that admission doesn't mean my invitation to the conference is revoked
[20:39] <daveake> charolastra model A 115mA
[20:39] <Willdude123> I think it probably is, which leaves few possibilities.
[20:40] <Willdude123> I somehow doubt it's faulty
[20:40] <Lunar_Lander> Upu, reason I was asking is because when I soldered my board today, it didn't look like the solder came through to the top at some holes
[20:40] <Willdude123> Because Upu is infallible
[20:40] <Willdude123> We all need Upu here.
[20:42] <ibanezmatt13> has anybody done a flight where they TX to the payload while it's up?
[20:42] <daveake> Darkside has done it
[20:42] <cyclops> Upu: done
[20:42] <daveake> That was radio. I'm doing an Iridium one soon.
[20:43] <cyclops> the timezone is GMT+2
[20:43] <Upu> super
[20:43] <ibanezmatt13> iridium?
[20:43] <Willdude123> Upu what are the chances of it being faulty?
[20:43] <Upu> done a flight doc ?
[20:43] <cyclops> Yes Upu
[20:43] <ibanezmatt13> daveake: communicating via satellites to your payload?
[20:43] <cyclops> payload is allready in the map
[20:44] <Willdude123> This is why I love reddit http://www.reddit.com/r/WTF/comments/1k3ald/nsfw_lady_flips_out_and_takes_all_of_her_clothes/cbkynug
[20:44] <cyclops> you see both temps
[20:44] <Upu> Al-Espacius Launch ?
[20:44] <cyclops> Yes Upu
[20:44] <Upu> Willdude123
[20:44] <Willdude123> Yeah
[20:44] <Upu> is that on topic or even remotely suitable for the channel ?
[20:44] <cyclops> Upu: I can send you the code i have for the second sensor if you want
[20:44] <Willdude123> I was reading the comments, just thought it was funny.
[20:45] <Willdude123> Sorry
[20:45] <Upu> please do I can integrate it
[20:45] <Willdude123> Will keep things on topic.
[20:45] <cyclops> ill send you an email
[20:45] <Willdude123> Anyways. Upu what are the chances of it being faulty?
[20:45] <Upu> thanks
[20:45] <cyclops> after launch if it works
[20:45] <Upu> is this your flight : Al-Espacius Launch ?
[20:45] <cyclops> Yes it is
[20:45] <Upu> what being faulty Willdude123 ?
[20:45] <Willdude123> The Ublox
[20:45] <Upu> approved
[20:46] <Upu> good luck
[20:46] <Upu> its fine I tested it before I posted it out
[20:46] <Willdude123> It's not txing.
[20:46] <Willdude123> I've got the logic analyser on the rx line and it should be rxing.
[20:46] <cyclops> thanks Upu
[20:46] <Willdude123> Also the tx line and it's txing nothing.
[20:47] <Willdude123> Connected properly by the looks of it.
[20:47] <cyclops> so Upu at the time I put it will be available at the autoconfigure right?
[20:47] <ibanezmatt13> Willdude123: Do you understand the code yet?
[20:47] <Upu> yes
[20:47] <Willdude123> ibanezmatt13, As in my code
[20:47] <Willdude123> ?
[20:47] <ibanezmatt13> yeah
[20:47] <cyclops> Perfect then
[20:47] <cyclops> I got 2 trackers allready
[20:48] <Willdude123> Well duh I wrote it
[20:48] <ibanezmatt13> did you?
[20:48] <Willdude123> Yes
[20:48] <ibanezmatt13> Have you got it handy to look at?
[20:48] <Willdude123> Yep
[20:49] <ibanezmatt13> may I?
[20:49] <Willdude123> It had worked before so it's a hardware issue but I don't see why not.
[20:49] <Upu> its at this point you step back
[20:49] <Willdude123> Me?
[20:49] <Upu> connect the 3V FTDI to it and plug it into your PC
[20:49] <daveake> +100000
[20:50] <Willdude123> Do you doubt I wrote it ibanezmatt13
[20:50] <ibanezmatt13> I didn't say that at all
[20:50] <Willdude123> And connect it to what?
[20:50] <Upu> GPS -> FTDI -> PC
[20:50] <Upu> open Putty
[20:50] <Upu> oh btw
[20:50] <Upu> run Windows
[20:50] <Willdude123> http://pastie.org/8225244
[20:50] <cyclops> well guys
[20:51] <cyclops> i have to prepare the car
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[20:51] <cyclops> And pack everithing
[20:51] <Willdude123> Ah OK
[20:51] <x-f> heh, WB8ELK landed in the woods
[20:51] <Upu> good luck cyclops
[20:51] <cyclops> Thanks a lot for the help, Ill connect tomorrow before launch :D
[20:51] <Upu> if you come on here
[20:51] <Upu> we can guide you in
[20:51] <cyclops> I will
[20:51] <Upu> if you loose it
[20:51] <Upu> get to a high point
[20:51] <Upu> good luck
[20:51] <cyclops> I have a backup tracker
[20:52] <cyclops> GSM
[20:52] <cyclops> just in case
[20:52] <Willdude123> Upu Shall I run U-center?
[20:52] <daveake> Yeah get 3G working it's a massive help
[20:52] <Upu> I secretly hope it fails and habduino saves the day
[20:52] <Upu> :)
[20:52] <daveake> loll
[20:52] <cyclops> I hope so
[20:52] <Upu> just open a terminal
[20:52] <Upu> see if you're getting NMEA
[20:53] <cyclops> See you tomorrow
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[20:54] <ibanezmatt13> Willdude123: If absolutely everything else fails, try this: http://pastie.org/8225250
[20:56] <Willdude123> Upu yes it is.
[20:57] <ibanezmatt13> another thing Willdude123, on the Pi, you have to edit a few files to get the hardware serial to actually work. Is this the case with the BBB. Have you researched hardware serial on the BBB? Also, are you on the correct pins and are they the right way round? TX on Ublox to RX on Pi, RX on Ublox to TX on Pi
[20:57] <ibanezmatt13> Not Pi, BBB :) Sorry
[20:58] <Willdude123> Yes I've done that
[20:58] <Willdude123> Now it isn't, different jumper wire
[20:59] <Willdude123> Ahah
[20:59] <Willdude123> Dodgy header connection
[20:59] <ibanezmatt13> working?
[20:59] <Willdude123> No
[21:00] <Willdude123> Well, if I put my finger where it's connected dodgily, it works.
[21:00] <ibanezmatt13> Picture?
[21:00] <Willdude123> Sorry can'y
[21:02] <ibanezmatt13> Has the header been damaged, are your jumpers damaged?
[21:02] <Willdude123> Header I think
[21:02] <ibanezmatt13> what's up with it?
[21:02] <Willdude123> Solder must've dripped
[21:02] <ibanezmatt13> did you solder it on yourself
[21:04] <ibanezmatt13> Does the header move when you touch it?
[21:07] <ibanezmatt13> Upu: When it comes round to soldering the atmega tqfp, are we drag soldering?
[21:07] <Upu> I don't
[21:07] <ibanezmatt13> each leg
[21:08] <Upu> yeah but its really quick
[21:08] <Upu> I can drag solder
[21:08] <Upu> but then I spend the next 5 mins removing bridges
[21:08] <ibanezmatt13> ah yeah
[21:08] <mikestir> you'll need a flux pen ibanezmatt13
[21:09] <ibanezmatt13> I've got one mikestir. Though for a first one, I'm getting a little assistance
[21:09] <ibanezmatt13> brb
[21:09] <mikestir> they're a big help for removing the inevitable bridges
[21:09] <charolastra> solder wick helps too
[21:10] <mikestir> yes
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[21:14] <ibanezmatt13> Upu: When we've done some small scale soldering, all I need to be able to do it at home is a fine tip soldering iron, a flux pen, some desoldering braid and solder. That's ok for ublox chips, tqfp's etc?
[21:14] <Upu> yeah you should be able to do it
[21:14] <ibanezmatt13> cool
[21:14] <Upu> the Metcal you used has some ultrafine tips on
[21:14] <Lunar_Lander> Upu, currently considering making an SMD board
[21:15] <Upu> don't consider it Lunar do it
[21:15] <Lunar_Lander> yea, got a question however
[21:15] <Lunar_Lander> http://www.maximintegrated.com/app-notes/index.mvp/id/2236
[21:15] <Lunar_Lander> how is the trimpot there supposed to work?
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[21:15] <Upu> err
[21:15] <Upu> trims up and down ?
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[21:16] <Lunar_Lander> I am just confused that the thing is hooked up to + of the MAX987
[21:17] <Upu> it will be adjusting the bias
[21:17] <Geoff-G8DHE_> The +/- are the inputs of the op-amp/compartor, the supplies are on the sloping edges.
[21:17] <Lunar_Lander> ok, so they take a trimpot and attach the
[21:18] <Lunar_Lander> how could you call it
[21:18] <Lunar_Lander> sweeper?
[21:18] <Lunar_Lander> to the + IN
[21:18] <Geoff-G8DHE_> Compartor it compares the voltage on the +ve input against the -Ve input and sends the ouptut in the apporppriate direction
[21:19] <Lunar_Lander> ok
[21:19] <Lunar_Lander> sorry for being stupid there
[21:20] <Lunar_Lander> just was confused by the way they drew it
[21:20] <Lunar_Lander> the oscilloscope screenshot shows a pulse as 5V
[21:20] <Lunar_Lander> can we have it at 3.3V by just feeding 3.3V where it says 5V?
[21:21] <Geoff-G8DHE_> In essence yes but check that the op-amps will work at 3.3 volts
[21:24] <ibanezmatt13> Upu: Why would anybody ever need to put a 0ohm resistor in anything? It's on your PAVA board and we've talked about it using PWM to control the NTX2
[21:24] <ibanezmatt13> On the pava board it's on the TPS61201
[21:24] <Upu> its effectively just connects something
[21:25] <ibanezmatt13> will a standard track not be ok?
[21:25] <Upu> so somewhere where I may put resistors on say the variable voltage version of the regulator I can put a 0r0 and it can be used with a fixed voltage version
[21:25] <ibanezmatt13> Aaaah, got you :)
[21:26] <ibanezmatt13> Do you have the schematic for any of your boards that use the tps61201 just out of curiosity?
[21:26] <Upu> sure habduino
[21:26] <ibanezmatt13> ah yes, is it on your Github?
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[21:27] <Upu> Hi I'm Griffonbawt !
[21:27] <Upu> https://github.com/HABduino
[21:27] <ibanezmatt13> lol, thank you
[21:27] <fsphil> this new bot is much better
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[21:27] <fsphil> few bugs but it's nearly convincing
[21:28] <Upu> hah
[21:30] <ibanezmatt13> Upu: Where you put in a 0R0 if needed, would soldering the two pads for the resistor do the same thing?
[21:30] <ibanezmatt13> I assume so
[21:30] <Upu> yes
[21:31] <fsphil> it's quite tricky making a solder bridge sometimes
[21:31] <Lunar_Lander> Geoff-G8DHE, both opamps can be used from 2.7 to 5.5V
[21:31] <Lunar_Lander> :)
[21:31] <Upu> but its easier to put a 0603 0R0 in
[21:31] <fsphil> the solder mask does a good job of stopping it
[21:31] <Geoff-G8DHE_> Sounds good then!
[21:31] <ibanezmatt13> Yeah, I'd still put the resistor in to make it look neater
[21:31] <fsphil> so either a short wire or the 0R resistor
[21:31] <fsphil> and yes the 0R looks better
[21:31] <Upu> that too
[21:32] <fsphil> I must get a few
[21:32] <Geoff-G8DHE_> You will still need +12v to bias the PIN diode however!
[21:33] <Lunar_Lander> of course
[21:33] <Lunar_Lander> A23 Minialkaline
[21:33] <Lunar_Lander> ;)
[21:33] <Geoff-G8DHE_> Yup shold be adequate no current to speak of!
[21:34] <ibanezmatt13> Upu: Looking at the schematic, I'm a little confused as to why the two resistor values mentioned regarding the tps61201 are in different places.
[21:35] <Lunar_Lander> yeah
[21:35] <Lunar_Lander> could you power it off coin cells too?
[21:35] <Lunar_Lander> but that would be bigger and heavier than a A23 I think
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[21:36] <Geoff-G8DHE_> Your talking of 12picoamps draw, maybe just a large capacitor charged before launch would be sufficent for a few hours!
[21:36] <Lunar_Lander> wonder if one should use all SMD
[21:36] <Lunar_Lander> yeah :)
[21:37] <ibanezmatt13> Upu: Say I simply wanted to use that boost converter to output 3v3 only. Would I not need the bidirectional level shifter you're using at the moment?
[21:37] <ibanezmatt13> I wouldn't actually, it's a fixed 3v3 step up :P
[21:38] <Willdude123> ibanezmatt13, No and yes
[21:39] <ibanezmatt13> Ok, better question: I've been looking into using those step ups and I understand a lot more how they work. However, I still can't work out what resistor values I'd need to step up a 0.8-1.5v single cell supply to 3v3 :/
[21:39] <ibanezmatt13> Upu: ^
[21:39] <ibanezmatt13> Willdude123: no and yes to the header moving?
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[21:40] <ibanezmatt13> So you need a new header or a new board by the sounds of things
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[21:40] <Lunar_Lander> Geoff-G8DHE, just wondering if one should use all SMD or use through-hole for the caps and resistors
[21:41] <Willdude123> No and yes respectively
[21:41] <Willdude123> :)
[21:42] <Geoff-G8DHE_> Use SMD for the front-end to minimise noise / leakage and capacitance. Once you've done that you might as well use SMD elsewhere
[21:43] <mikestir> ibanezmatt13: the regulator will adjust the output to keep the feedback pin equal to its internal reference voltage. so you set the resistors to divide your desired output voltage down to vref (0.5V in this case)
[21:43] <Willdude123> ibanezmatt13, I like your poetry ;)
[21:43] <Geoff-G8DHE_> Your biggest problem with the above circuit will be temperature atability I suspect.
[21:44] <Geoff-G8DHE_> *stability
[21:44] <ibanezmatt13> mikestir: that sort of makes sense. Are you familiar with the TPS61201?
[21:45] <mikestir> I haven't used one but I've been reading the datasheet recently for a possible design
[21:45] <Willdude123> Your love, your hate, your dream, your glory
[21:45] <mikestir> and this is the way you program virtually any adjustable regulator
[21:45] <Willdude123> Intertwined with the words of this on-going story
[21:45] <ibanezmatt13> woa Willdude123
[21:45] <ibanezmatt13> where do you find that
[21:45] <Willdude123> A story of problems though happiness too
[21:45] <Willdude123> This site
[21:45] <ibanezmatt13> booksie
[21:45] <Willdude123> It's amazing
[21:46] <Willdude123> No
[21:46] <Willdude123> :P
[21:46] <Lunar_Lander> Geoff-G8DHE, ah ok
[21:46] <Willdude123> Actually, it gets a bit rubbish in places.
[21:46] <Willdude123> I bet the author is some hippie weirdo. :P
[21:46] <ibanezmatt13> I didn't write it :P
[21:47] <Willdude123> Hi, I am a fifteen year old student from Greater Manchester in the North West of Britain.
[21:47] <Willdude123> That's not you then?
[21:47] <ibanezmatt13> as is my friend
[21:48] <ibanezmatt13> but yes, that's my profile
[21:48] <mikestir> Britain != England fail
[21:48] <Willdude123> you stole it?
[21:48] <ibanezmatt13> no, he wanted it publishing, I did it for him on mine. Anyway, a little irrelevant :)
[21:49] <Geoff-G8DHE_> Lots of gain sitting about, no compensation anywhere, breadboard it and test I thin, then consider going digital at as an early stage as possible if it looks suspect!
[21:49] <Willdude123> Did you answer the comments yourself?
[21:49] <ibanezmatt13> yes
[21:50] <ibanezmatt13> as Upu would say, it's quite off topic :P
[21:50] <Willdude123> I've never really attempted or felt the need to form a diary
[21:50] <Willdude123> extract; though now I believe that I have no choice. The past few
[21:50] <Willdude123> weeks have been arduous, with numerous teeth-pulling occasions
[21:50] <Willdude123> for which I had to endure.
[21:51] <Willdude123> Is this made up or did it actually happen?
[21:51] <ibanezmatt13> that's not mine either. Please understand, the account was set up in my name for a friend to upload his pieces to.
[21:51] <ibanezmatt13> I've no ides
[21:51] <ibanezmatt13> idea
[21:52] <ibanezmatt13> I cba talking about this now, can we revert back to topic please
[21:52] <Willdude123> Right sure
[21:52] <ibanezmatt13> cool
[21:52] Action: Willdude123 is afk-ftb
[21:52] <Willdude123> I really need to get FSX on this pc.
[21:55] <ibanezmatt13> mikestir: if a resistor is unpopulated, does that mean you leave the connection unconnected or do you solder a 0R0 to it?
[21:55] <mikestir> unpopulated means unconnected
[21:56] <ibanezmatt13> I ws just curious because on the Habduino schematic it says for the tps61201, for 3.3v use, r1 = 0R0; r4 = unpopulated
[21:56] <mikestir> that will be for the UVLO rather than the feedback
[21:57] <mikestir> there are two dividers - one is the feedback divider that sets the output voltage, the other is a bit like the brownout detector on the AVR
[21:57] <ibanezmatt13> I wish I could find a schematic for the tps61201 that took 0.8v-1.5v and stepped it up to 3v3 :/
[21:57] <mikestir> isn't the 61201 the fixed version?
[21:57] <ibanezmatt13> yes
[21:58] <ibanezmatt13> I just want to get the resistor values and other things like that correct for this input voltage
[21:58] <ibanezmatt13> for a 1.5v cell
[21:58] <mikestir> it's independent of input voltage
[21:58] <ibanezmatt13> what, really?!
[21:58] <mikestir> yes. it's a voltage regulator
[21:59] <ibanezmatt13> with which setup I mean.
[22:00] <ibanezmatt13> mikestir: http://postmyimage.com/img2/820_kmfd.png
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[22:01] <ibanezmatt13> I'm looking at that and trying to work out what setup will give me 3.3v out from 0.8to1.5v in
[22:02] <Steve_2E0VET> anyone have a sketch for i think its a bmp085 temp sensor?
[22:02] <mikestir> that should do it. I assume those comments relate to a version of the schematic that had a divider to FB, and used the TPS61200
[22:03] <ibanezmatt13> it had other parts yes
[22:03] <mikestir> but the 61201 is fixed 3.3V. Think of it as having a 3.3V Vref instead of 0.5V, so you just connect FB straight to the output
[22:03] <ibanezmatt13> So FB = VOUT+
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[22:04] <mikestir> for the 61201 yes
[22:04] <ibanezmatt13> no resistors required?
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[22:04] <mikestir> from the datasheet: Voltage feedback of adjustable versions, must be connected to VOUT at fixed output voltage versions
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[22:05] <ibanezmatt13> does that mean no resistors at all are required? Just the caps
[22:05] <mikestir> If you can afford the board space I'd still put them in though, and just fit a 0R to Vout
[22:05] <mikestir> in case you want to populate a board with a 61200 and run it at a different voltage
[22:06] <mikestir> cu
[22:06] <mikestir> *correct
[22:06] <mikestir> just caps and the inductor
[22:06] <ibanezmatt13> cool, thanks
[22:07] <mikestir> right i'm off. are you likely to be testing your tracker tomorrow? I was going to see if I could pick it up from here
[22:08] <ibanezmatt13> where are you?
[22:08] <mikestir> wirral
[22:08] <ibanezmatt13> I'm not on any great heigh though. It would be on my desk.
[22:08] <ibanezmatt13> Would it still pick up?
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[22:09] <mikestir> do you know your approx height above sea level?
[22:09] <ibanezmatt13> not really. It's a fair bit above I believe
[22:09] <mikestir> I mean you can't be that far from winter hill
[22:10] <ibanezmatt13> I could find out in gmaps
[22:10] <ibanezmatt13> no, I'm not. But no one would be able to take me there tomorrow :/
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[22:11] <mikestir> give it a go tomorrow anyway. Would be interesting to try
[22:12] <ibanezmatt13> suppose so, I can do. I'm surrounded by houses though
[22:13] <mikestir> gn
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[22:17] <chrisstubbs> movie maker rendered my landscape video as portrait
[22:17] <chrisstubbs> arse
[22:18] <LeoBodnar> watch it from a sofa?
[22:19] <ibanezmatt13> :)
[22:20] <Lunar_Lander> XD
[22:20] <mfa298> chrisstubbs: you need to tell moviemaker about http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Bt9zSfinwFA
[22:22] <chrisstubbs> mfa298, Saw this one coming
[22:22] <chrisstubbs> not even clicked it yet
[22:22] <chrisstubbs> Yep VVS :)
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[22:23] <mfa298> well it's such a good public service announcement
[22:30] <wrea> yeah
[22:31] <chrisstubbs> "Its not crack or nuffin, its just bad"
[22:33] <ibanezmatt13> chrisstubbs: I'm trying to choose an inductor to use on a step up regulator. Are there any particular kind that I would use on a PCB that is in Eagle? :)
[22:33] <chrisstubbs> coilcraft
[22:33] <chrisstubbs> err
[22:33] <ibanezmatt13> The one Upu uses is in a library called steve's Coil craft
[22:33] Action: chrisstubbs rummages through rubbish on desk
[22:33] <ibanezmatt13> But I don't know where to get it
[22:34] <chrisstubbs> I measured the inductor
[22:34] <chrisstubbs> and just picked some standard inductor pads that looked right
[22:34] <ibanezmatt13> Do you know how I could find that library?
[22:35] <chrisstubbs> Upus one? No idea would have to ask him
[22:35] <ibanezmatt13> I will tomorrow, thank :)
[22:35] <chrisstubbs> will look at mine now, i havent actually test fitted it though
[22:35] <ibanezmatt13> bound to not exist
[22:36] <Upu> LPS4018
[22:36] <Upu> Coilcraft
[22:36] <Upu> or ELLVGGG Panasonic
[22:36] <ibanezmatt13> where can I find the library Upu ?
[22:36] <Upu> Colicraft is slightly larger
[22:36] <ibanezmatt13> Could either be used?
[22:36] <Upu> https://github.com/Upuaut/Eagle-Libraries
[22:36] <Upu> yes
[22:37] <Upu> Coilcraft is slightly larger and more robust
[22:37] <Willdude123> Upu did I tell you I figured out what's wrong with it?
[22:37] <Upu> Panasonc smaller and easier to solder but not quite as robust
[22:37] <Upu> but I've only broken one and it still worked
[22:37] <ibanezmatt13> Ok, thanks. And, if I wanted to use the tps61201 for a fixed 3v3, no resistors required?
[22:38] <ibanezmatt13> just the caps and the basic circuit
[22:39] <Willdude123> Upu I'll take that as a no, it was a dodgy ground connection.
[22:39] <Upu> back to basics check all connections :)
[22:39] <ibanezmatt13> Also Upu, the only inductor I can find in your library is a bournes one
[22:39] <Upu> get ameter
[22:39] <Willdude123> The header wasn't soldered properly on that pin, I think some of the solder dirpped.
[22:39] <Upu> ibanezmatt13 1 sec
[22:39] <ibanezmatt13> sure
[22:39] <Willdude123> So will resolder.
[22:40] <Willdude123> I'll be getting a dmm tomorrow
[22:40] <Upu> ELLVGG_INDUCTOR
[22:40] <ibanezmatt13> oh right
[22:40] <Upu> ah
[22:40] <Upu> interesting
[22:40] <Upu> coilcraft isn't in that library
[22:40] <Upu> 1 sec
[22:40] <ibanezmatt13> yes that's what was confusing me :)
[22:41] <Upu> https://www.dropbox.com/s/lrp3k4q3jpjamzl/StevesCoilCraft.lbr
[22:41] <ibanezmatt13> Perfect thanks. And, if I wanted to use the tps61201 for a fixed 3v3, are no resistors required? just the caps and the basic circuit
[22:42] <ibanezmatt13> with the inductor of course
[22:42] <ibanezmatt13> chrisstubbs: https://www.dropbox.com/s/lrp3k4q3jpjamzl/StevesCoilCraft.lbr for future inductor usage :)
[22:43] <chrisstubbs> :)
[22:44] <ibanezmatt13> Upu: Last question of the evening: For a fixed 3v3 output from the tps61201, are no resistors required? Just the basic circuit consisting of the inductor and caps?
[22:44] <ibanezmatt13> :)
[22:44] <Upu> FB connects to VOUT
[22:45] <ibanezmatt13> cool, thanks
[22:45] <Upu> for the variable versions you have two resistors, one from FB to VOUT, the other from FB to GND
[22:45] <ibanezmatt13> so no resistors for the fixed
[22:45] <Upu> so if you wire it like that and put an 0R0 from FB to VOUT fixed regulator is fine but gives you the option to use the variable version and resistors
[22:46] <ibanezmatt13> right, thanks for that info. I'm off to bed. :)
[22:46] <ibanezmatt13> night night
[22:46] <chrisstubbs> laters ibanezmatt13
[22:46] <ibanezmatt13> night chris
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[23:00] <chrisstubbs> Holy rtty batman! http://i.imgur.com/kgxNcTO.png
[23:00] <chrisstubbs> 8n1 300 baud so a little tricky to sync, but it works!
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[23:04] <chrisstubbs> Upu do you have any of those long SMA connectors at right angles?
[23:08] <chrisstubbs> If its 8 bit i guess i could add a 1 at most sig. bit to have bodged 7n2
[23:08] <chrisstubbs> the hardware _might_ support 7 bit but i think its stuck to 1 stop bit
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[23:19] <fsphil> haha
[23:19] <fsphil> that's brilliant chrisstubbs
[23:20] <chrisstubbs> Thanks fsphil :)
[23:20] <chrisstubbs> The guys on #chdk are super helpful if you adjust your body clock to US time
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[23:21] <chrisstubbs> If you are around tomorrow I would appreciare your help with SSDV :)
[23:21] <fsphil> certainly
[23:21] <chrisstubbs> Fantastic
[23:22] <fsphil> how much computer power do you have on that thing?
[23:22] <chrisstubbs> er
[23:22] <chrisstubbs> probably between little-to-none and sod-all
[23:22] <fsphil> haha
[23:22] <chrisstubbs> more than an arduino less than a pi I expect
[23:22] <fsphil> oh loads then
[23:22] <chrisstubbs> 4mb ram springs to mind
[23:22] <fsphil> and plenty of memory
[23:23] <fsphil> can you compile C code for it?
[23:23] <chrisstubbs> LUA
[23:23] <WillTablet> This the camera?
[23:23] <fsphil> that'll be fun
[23:23] <chrisstubbs> Yeah Willdude123
[23:23] <chrisstubbs> http://i.imgur.com/kgxNcTO.png
[23:23] <chrisstubbs> just tried to <tab> filldude
[23:23] Action: chrisstubbs needs sleep
[23:23] <WillTablet> I did some lua today
[23:23] <WillTablet> For computercraft
[23:24] <WillTablet> Wow
[23:24] <chrisstubbs> fsphil, I translated the rtty code for arduino on the wiki accross and that worked okay
[23:24] <WillTablet> What about the gps?
[23:24] <chrisstubbs> timing was well out thought
[23:24] <chrisstubbs> though
[23:24] <WillTablet> How did you translate it?
[23:24] <chrisstubbs> with my hands
[23:24] <WillTablet> Can I see the translation?
[23:24] <chrisstubbs> and brain
[23:24] <chrisstubbs> and gogole
[23:24] <chrisstubbs> google
[23:24] <chrisstubbs> sure, its messy though
[23:24] <chrisstubbs> flashes RTTY out over the print LED on the camera
[23:25] <WillTablet> That's clever.
[23:25] <WillTablet> What about gps though?
[23:25] <chrisstubbs> I will either just stick a cheapo board next to it
[23:25] <fsphil> do any of the cameras have a uart?
[23:25] <chrisstubbs> or get a canon camera with gps for geo tagging and hope it workes above 12k
[23:25] <chrisstubbs> fsphil, yeah thats what im using
[23:26] <fsphil> ah ha
[23:26] <chrisstubbs> got the memory address for the uart console and dropped the speed to 300 baud
[23:26] <WillTablet> I'm actually possibly going to make a cc serial thing, so your code might be handy.
[23:26] <chrisstubbs> timing is awsum now
[23:26] <chrisstubbs> cc?
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[23:27] <chrisstubbs> WillTablet change your nick to will0tablet so it takes priorty over Willdude123
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[23:28] <chrisstubbs> He didnt like that idea
[23:28] <Willdude123> You can live with it
[23:28] <fsphil> lol
[23:28] <fsphil> there are many copies
[23:29] <Willdude123> Code please
[23:29] <Willdude123> For some reason my BNC isn't, well, BNCing
[23:29] <chrisstubbs> just booting netbook
[23:29] <chrisstubbs> sd reader on my pc has died
[23:29] <Willdude123> Right
[23:30] <fsphil> "Previous versions of Lua (before 5.2) did not include bitwise operators"
[23:30] <fsphil> yikes
[23:31] <chrisstubbs> this did
[23:31] <chrisstubbs> luckily
[23:31] <fsphil> well that's half of ssdv sorted
[23:32] <chrisstubbs> :)
[23:32] <chrisstubbs> will ___paultech_____ http://paste.chris-stubbs.co.uk/8dLaDiOQ
[23:32] <chrisstubbs> oops
[23:32] <chrisstubbs> Willdude123, ^^
[23:32] <chrisstubbs> the print("123...'s are crude microsecond delays
[23:32] <fsphil> that nick needs more understore
[23:32] <fsphil> score
[23:33] <Willdude123> There's no delay function?
[23:33] <Willdude123> Os.sleep(
[23:33] <chrisstubbs> there is a ms delay
[23:33] <chrisstubbs> need microseconds for rtty really
[23:34] <chrisstubbs> I got it down to about 45 baud with this code, but the timing was all over the place
[23:34] <chrisstubbs> not useable
[23:34] <Willdude123> What about 300baud?
[23:35] <chrisstubbs> No chance :P
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[23:35] <chrisstubbs> Using uart now
[23:35] <chrisstubbs> http://paste.chris-stubbs.co.uk/IgJ0FlfA
[23:35] <Willdude123> And checksum code?
[23:35] <chrisstubbs> yeah didnt get that far
[23:35] <Willdude123> Is it useable with the uart
[23:35] <chrisstubbs> checksum should be doable
[23:35] <chrisstubbs> yeah its great with uart
[23:35] <fsphil> should be simple enough to do the checksum
[23:36] <fsphil> just copy the C code
[23:36] <Willdude123> But it's lua
[23:36] <chrisstubbs> then smash head against wall to convert to LUA
[23:36] <chrisstubbs> lua is kinda c-ish and kinda not, i dont really get it
[23:37] <fsphil> it's an evil mix of BASIC and C
[23:37] <Willdude123> I know some but only for CC
[23:37] <Willdude123> CC is rather cool
[23:38] <fsphil> apparently in LUA "4 and 5" == 5
[23:38] <chrisstubbs> what is cc?
[23:38] <chrisstubbs> carbon-copy?
[23:38] <Willdude123> I really love it. Computercraft
[23:38] <chrisstubbs> oh right sorry
[23:38] <chrisstubbs> minecraft okay with you now
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[23:39] <Willdude123> It's good
[23:39] <fsphil> I can't seem to find out how to do an & in lua
[23:40] <chrisstubbs> fsphil, 4 bitwiseand 5?
[23:40] <Willdude123> Very good. But no good servers.
[23:40] <Willdude123> Might try and implement serial in it.
[23:41] <fsphil> "The operator and returns its first argument if it is false; otherwise, it returns its second argument"
[23:41] <fsphil> what
[23:41] <Willdude123> Even though it's possible with rednet.
[23:41] <chrisstubbs> Yeah, nothing makes sense
[23:41] <Willdude123> Why is bitwise and done in rtty?
[23:41] <fsphil> it's not
[23:41] <Willdude123> Why not = ?
[23:42] <chrisstubbs> it is
[23:42] <chrisstubbs> well, I use it to check LSB AND 1 = 1
[23:42] <fsphil> oh yes forgot about that
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[23:43] <Willdude123> chrisstubbs do you play mc?
[23:43] <fsphil> bitand()
[23:43] <fsphil> it's a function
[23:43] <chrisstubbs> Willdude123, have done a little ages ago
[23:43] <chrisstubbs> good fun but did get bored after a while
[23:43] <chrisstubbs> kinda adictive if you get back into it :P
[23:43] <chrisstubbs> fsphil, thats the one
[23:43] <Willdude123> Try cc
[23:43] <Willdude123> It's good
[23:43] <fsphil> I'm not sure I'll like LUA
[23:43] <chrisstubbs> where are you getting this from? CHDK forum?
[23:44] <chrisstubbs> fsphil, you wont :)
[23:44] <fsphil> googlestorming
[23:44] <Willdude123> What from?
[23:44] <chrisstubbs> I opened your github and have still not even looked at the ssdv code
[23:44] <fsphil> ssdv is simpler than my code
[23:44] <fsphil> but still not trivial
[23:45] <fsphil> mostly bit operations, and keeping track of state
[23:45] <chrisstubbs> FEC sounds complex
[23:46] <chrisstubbs> and i remember something about the jpeg having to be stripped of some data?
[23:46] <fsphil> yea I didn't write that bit :) RS codes are a bit too mathy for me
[23:47] <fsphil> the jpeg headers are the main bit that goes
[23:47] <chrisstubbs> okay I might not get on with RS either, my maths is pretty bad
[23:47] <fsphil> and a few other jpeg-y bits that really are not needed
[23:48] <fsphil> byte stuffing, restart markers
[23:48] <fsphil> so you're able to read the JPEG from the memory card from LUA?
[23:48] <chrisstubbs> Should probably check that
[23:48] <chrisstubbs> pretty sure you can
[23:48] <fsphil> that'd be an important one :)
[23:48] <chrisstubbs> I have written to a txt file before
[23:48] <chrisstubbs> so i presume you can read back somehow
[23:48] <chrisstubbs> as bytes?
[23:48] <fsphil> yea
[23:49] <fsphil> it'll need to be binary
[23:49] <fsphil> the jpeg will need to be fairly small too, or for there to be some way to scale it down
[23:49] <chrisstubbs> An ascii art interpreter would be a lot more fun
[23:49] <fsphil> you'd still need to write a jpeg decoder
[23:50] <chrisstubbs> Im hoping i can change the image res before capturing
[23:50] <chrisstubbs> whats a sensible size? 640*480?
[23:51] <fsphil> I've used 320x240, I believe dave used 480x240
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[23:51] <fsphil> at 300 baud that would be about 4 minutes
[23:51] <chrisstubbs> hmm
[23:51] <fsphil> 640x480 would probably be 10 minutes
[23:52] <fsphil> per image
[23:52] <chrisstubbs> Shame, with the proper camera the optics and CCD would be much better
[23:52] <fsphil> depending on how much cloud there is in it
[23:52] <fsphil> yea
[23:52] <fsphil> if it can do 600 that might be fine
[23:52] <fsphil> 600 baud
[23:52] <chrisstubbs> will still have it store 5mp snaps on the card between images
[23:52] <chrisstubbs> Yeah should do
[23:52] <fsphil> 1200 is possible but it's a pain to decode on the ground
[23:52] <chrisstubbs> could do 115200 if i dont want anyone decoding it
[23:53] <chrisstubbs> that was the defualt uart
[23:53] <fsphil> man that'd be nice
[23:53] <fsphil> 1024x768 live images :)
[23:54] <chrisstubbs> dominoex rtty would be interesting
[23:54] <fsphil> which one? :)
[23:54] <fsphil> brb
[23:55] <chrisstubbs> sorry
[23:55] <chrisstubbs> domino ssdv
[23:55] <chrisstubbs> Just thinking, I have a feeling cameras like this have a proper jpeg decoder/encoder chip on them. wonder if that could do the heavy lifting
[23:58] Nick change: MichaelC1 -> MichaelC
[00:00] --- Sun Aug 11 2013