highaltitude.log.20130705

[00:00] <craag> Yes, the ublox GPSes are either 1.8V or 3.3V unless you got the special 5V version.
[00:01] <WILLdude> I have the 5v breakout, but can I use 3.3v serial? There's a 3.3v power pin.
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[00:02] <craag> I'm not familiar with it.
[00:04] <craag> Yay live webcam pics off pi, (fswebcam ftw), now need to get it 12V powered.
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[04:40] <heathkid> actually I'm working on a beaglebone black based tracker that does pretty much everything...
[04:41] <heathkid> but you'll never do a pico launch with a linux based SBC
[04:41] <heathkid> maybe a 600g
[04:41] <heathkid> maybe
[04:42] <heathkid> we need more 1.8v sensors!
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[05:36] <x-f_> tgif, good morning
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[06:05] <Maxell> *yawn*
[06:05] Action: Maxell looks at PAVA's predicted flight path
[06:08] <x-f> looks good, you're in the right place
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[06:51] <costyn_> it's coming our way?
[06:51] <costyn_> ah yes
[07:00] <UpuWork> probably won't make it there
[07:00] <UpuWork> that path is 45 hours long
[07:00] <UpuWork> well 50
[07:01] <number10> my battery is only about 30 hours
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[07:01] <number10> and my last two attempts to float ditch in the north sea well befor that.. but there is hope :)
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[07:04] <ibanezmatt13> Good Morning :)
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[07:16] <griffonbot> Received email: Kristaps "[UKHAS] Re: Launch announcement - LAASE-1 - July 6, 2013"
[07:16] <ibanezmatt13> ping UpuWork
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[07:21] <WILLdude> Morning
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[07:21] <UpuWork> hey ibanezmatt13_
[07:22] <WILLdude> Hi UpuWork.
[07:23] <WILLdude> I was looking into getting a beaglebone black upu.
[07:23] <WILLdude> Nobody's made a tracker on it yet.
[07:23] <ibanezmatt13_> Hi UpuWork, its not arrived yet :( I fear the worst
[07:24] <UpuWork> oh give it a week or two
[07:24] <ibanezmatt13_> that long?
[07:24] <UpuWork> hell yeah
[07:24] <WILLdude> I think I might have asked you this before, but does the 5v breakout support 3v3 serial?
[07:24] <ibanezmatt13_> I thought they'd post it straight back if it had a return address on the back...
[07:24] <UpuWork> yes WILLdude but you still need to supply 5V to the board for power
[07:25] <WILLdude> Ah good. The bbb has 5v, but none on gpio.
[07:26] <WILLdude> I'll have to figure what value resistor I need for the NTX2 on 3v3.
[07:26] <WILLdude> *resistors
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[08:09] <daveake> Yeah, wouldn't work for me earlier
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[08:50] <Ugi> mornin' all
[08:50] <x-f> morning
[08:50] <Ugi> do we know how they got on recovering Tudor yesterday?
[08:51] <Ugi> it all seemed a bit of a surprised to everyone!
[08:53] <x-f> yes!
[08:53] <x-f> 23:47:41 <aie93> Recovered the payload
[08:54] <x-f> (that's 21:47 your time)
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[08:55] <Lunar_LanderU> hello
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[08:56] <x-f> good morning, LLU
[09:00] <Ugi> Great - it was a pretty hap-hazard launch but it seemed to work well in the end!
[09:01] <costyn_> x-f: so do you have any people in Poland listening in?
[09:01] <costyn_> x-f: did you contact SP9UOB?
[09:02] <x-f> costyn_, thanks for the reminder, will email him now
[09:02] <costyn_> x-f: and the guy who does aprs.fi, he's on here sometimes (I forget his handle)
[09:03] <costyn_> x-f: and Brian/OZ1SKY in Denmark :)
[09:03] <Lunar_LanderU> x-f: great to hear that you finally got permission to launch :)
[09:03] <x-f> Brian is out of range :/
[09:04] <costyn_> x-f: ok
[09:04] <x-f> costyn_, ifreq from ##rtlsdr already covered "up North", he posted this info in #aprs.fi apparently and said he emailed it to some hams too
[09:04] <x-f> Lunar_LanderU, yeah, i feel great and very nervous about this all in the same time :)
[09:05] <Lunar_LanderU> yeah :)
[09:05] <Lunar_LanderU> like I did before the first launch
[09:05] <costyn_> x-f: ok cool
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[09:05] <Lunar_LanderU> hi costyn_
[09:05] <costyn_> x-f: god yes... being nervous is expected :) make sure you have checklists, they provide some ease of mind
[09:06] <costyn_> x-f: I had a script, a list that I follow during launch, step by step to make sure I didn't forget things
[09:06] <costyn_> Lunar_LanderU: hello
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[09:08] <x-f> we have a checklist, but i think it could be improved every time i look at it
[09:10] <S_Mark> eroomde, remember that crimp for the connections you mentioned the other day, it arrived this morning - ebay special. Thanks for pointing it out, did a quick test this morning, much better and professional looking.
[09:10] <S_Mark> so thanks!
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[09:37] <Lunar_LanderU> I found one of those SMA connectors in the lab
[09:37] <Lunar_LanderU> :)
[09:37] <Lunar_LanderU> problem is that the white cylinder won't go into the golden part
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[09:39] <Maxell> Use more force :P
[09:40] <Ugi> Use the force Luke
[09:44] <Geoff-G8DHE> You are putting it in from the right end aren't you ? Its easy to try to reverse it!
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[09:45] <UpuWork> did Tudor thingy get recovered ?
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[09:45] <Lunar_LanderU> well I assume that you insert it from the front end
[09:46] <mattbrejza> i hope youre still talking about connectors
[09:46] <Lunar_LanderU> yea
[09:46] <Geoff-G8DHE> Normally inserted from the end that the cable appears from, it has a small step at the front to set the position correctly.
[09:46] <x-f> UpuWork, yes, he said so late last night
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[09:46] <UpuWork> oh cool
[09:47] <Maxell> There are two kind of SMA right? Reversed SMA? Or is the name for female/male?
[09:47] <Lunar_LanderU> thing is that the connector has like the part with the screw thread and in there is a cylindrical thing
[09:47] <Lunar_LanderU> and I can't disassemble these
[09:48] <Geoff-G8DHE> Is this a plug or socket also a manual or crimp ?
[09:48] <Lunar_LanderU> it is a plug and our lab tech said it is a solder one
[09:49] <mfa298> Maxell: Reversed Polarity (often used on Wifi) swaps the pin from the plug to the socket like this: http://nosparts.net/images/400-smaExamples.jpg
[09:51] <Geoff-G8DHE> The white PTFE tube goes in from the the slightly smaller nut end whilst your trying it out
[09:51] <Maxell> mfa298: ah, that would be bad to mix those up.
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[09:51] <Lunar_LanderU> hm
[09:51] <Lunar_LanderU> OK once more
[09:51] <mfa298> Maxell: yes, especially when done on a flight, Not that anyone has done that
[09:51] <Maxell> pfft
[09:51] <Maxell> :x
[09:51] Action: mfa298 mentions no names
[09:52] <Lunar_LanderU> the one end has a small opening for the center of the coax to go in
[09:52] <Geoff-G8DHE> one second I'll put a photo up
[09:52] <Lunar_LanderU> he other end has the screw thread for connection
[09:52] <Lunar_LanderU> thanks
[09:52] <Lunar_LanderU> :)
[09:53] <mattbrejza> its a shame you cant get (easily) end mount bnc, they are much less hassle
[09:54] <Lunar_LanderU> yea
[09:54] <Maxell> mattbrejza: chassis bnc? They are not that hard iirc
[09:54] <Maxell> Just no chassis female bnc *anywhere*
[09:54] <WILLdude> Geography lesson
[09:54] <mattbrejza> i ment the ones that straddle the pcb
[09:54] <WILLdude> :)
[09:55] <mattbrejza> well farnell used to do them, but they also took up a but more space
[09:55] <WILLdude> Supposedto be researching earthquake and tsunami.
[09:56] <Geoff-G8DHE> See here http://360.g8dhe.net/HAB_Flights/index.php?ind=7
[09:56] Nick change: WILLdude -> WILLschool
[09:56] <Lunar_LanderU> yes
[09:57] <Geoff-G8DHE> The ptfe tube has a collar which rest on the step to set the depth position.
[09:58] <Lunar_LanderU> ok
[09:58] <Lunar_LanderU> mine hasn't
[09:58] <Lunar_LanderU> sadly have no camera currently to show
[09:59] <Lunar_LanderU> brb
[10:01] <fsphil> morning all
[10:01] <Ugi> Maxell: like this? http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/300648900595
[10:02] <Geoff-G8DHE\M> They do vary a bit, but the end towards the rear will mate with the little top cap
[10:02] <mattbrejza> hmm that thing is a bit odd Ugi
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[10:03] <Ugi> Yeah -stumbled on it when I was looking for solder BNC connectors and thought it might be useful in some slightly bizarre set of circumstances
[10:03] <fsphil> oh that's a vertical pcb mounted male BNC connector.
[10:04] <fsphil> when would that ever be used?
[10:04] <Ugi> Yes - I though that was what someone was looking for.
[10:04] <Ugi> I don't know
[10:04] <Ugi> it just struck me as a useful thing to know about
[10:04] <SpeedEvil> fsphil: Making little things that go on plugs
[10:04] <daveake> What a strange thing. Won't be easy to use.
[10:05] <SpeedEvil> -cables
[10:05] <WILLschool> Thinking about the BBB as a possible tracker controller.
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[10:06] <eroomde> use an arduino
[10:06] <Ugi> WILLschool: BBC Model B? too heavy
[10:06] <WILLschool> The gpio is better than the PIs.
[10:07] <fsphil> Ugi: would survive a war though
[10:07] <Ugi> true 'dat
[10:07] <Ugi> Mine is still running
[10:08] <Jess--> didn't I hear of a bbc-b on a chip a while back
[10:08] <Ugi> Arduino probably has enough power to run a BBC emulator!
[10:09] <adhoc> Jess--: on an FPGA?
[10:10] <Jess--> Not sure what it was on, but it was meant to be be a complete bbc b (minus any add on roms like adfs)
[10:10] <WILLschool> Beaglebone black .
[10:11] <eroomde> it's not really worth it WILLschool
[10:11] <eroomde> the choice of flight computer is not an important choice, at all
[10:11] <eroomde> i'd just get a working tracker with an arduino first
[10:11] <eroomde> you'll learn far more foing that than spending mental cycles comparing small linux boards
[10:12] <eroomde> especially if C still causes you to head-desk
[10:12] <eroomde> trying to learn the guts of embedded linux at the same time as C is going to be a battle
[10:14] <daveake> Also, most of the experience here, and most of the relevant info in the wiki, is re C on the Arduino. Step away from that well-worn path and fewer people here will be able to help you.
[10:15] <Maxell> Ugi: FUUUUUUUU :(
[10:16] <Ugi> Que?
[10:16] <Maxell> 12:01:57 < Ugi> Maxell: like this? http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/300648900595
[10:16] <Ugi> Ah. Yes.
[10:16] <Ugi> saced the hell out of me, but might be useful sometime.
[10:16] <Maxell> I ended up using some piece of coax tough.
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[10:28] <Maxell> The /topic is outdated.
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[10:42] <Ugi> With connectors in mind, do you guys know what the official name for a standard UK TV aerial plug is?
[10:42] <Ugi> I need an adaptor for my SDR
[10:43] <Ugi> also, the HABamp is SMA, which means I need to go SDR-TVaerial-SMA-HABamp-SMA-BNC-Antenna.
[10:43] <Ugi> there must be a better way!
[10:44] <Ugi> not that I have the HABamp yet
[10:44] <fsphil> belling lee?
[10:45] <Ugi> Friend of yours?
[10:45] <Ugi> Oh No. I see.
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[10:45] <fsphil> https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/TV_aerial_plug
[10:45] <Ugi> OK - Google is your friend. Sorry. Should have done that first!
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[10:46] <fsphil> they're horrible plugs
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[10:47] <fsphil> they should have been replaced a long time ago
[10:49] <Ugi> They are certainly insecure.
[10:49] <Ugi> wondering whether to jack open the dongel and solder something else on
[10:50] <fsphil> some have replaced it with an SMA socket
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[10:51] <Ugi> that would take the HABamp better I guess.
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[10:55] <SpeedEvil> Belling-lee
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[10:56] <Tramvai> Anyone used 18650 batteries on the flight?
[10:57] <fsphil> that's quite a lot
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[10:58] <Darkside> Tramvai: dont use lithium ions
[10:58] <Darkside> they will freeze and die
[10:58] <Darkside> same with lipos
[10:59] <Tramvai> Ah, cheers
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[10:59] <mattbrejza> well dont charge lithiums when cold, but they sorta discharge okish when they get a bit cold, so if insulated and you appriciate the capacity will be less you could get away with it
[11:00] <mattbrejza> (it has been done)
[11:02] <Tramvai> Alright
[11:02] <Lunar_LanderU> back
[11:02] <Lunar_LanderU> Geoff-G8DHE: got it :)
[11:03] <Lunar_LanderU> now the stupidiest champion thing
[11:03] <Lunar_LanderU> both connectors have a spike in the middle
[11:03] <SpeedEvil> http://dx.com/p/six-axi-quad-wing-4-ch-2-4ghz-radio-controlled-r-c-rolling-aircraft-w-gyro-outer-frame-orange-225449
[11:03] <SpeedEvil> hah
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[11:27] <Tramvai> Will this work with the Radiometrix NTX2? http://dx.com/p/92096
[11:27] <Tramvai> It has a FM receiving range of 78~108MHz, can it receive the NTX2 signal?
[11:28] <x-f> it will work
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[11:28] <zyp> you will not use the FM mode
[11:29] <mfa298> the key item is the chipset it uses - Chipset: RTL2832
[11:29] <x-f> Tramvai, have you ordered it already?
[11:29] <Tramvai> Was about to
[11:29] <x-f> you can get a better one from ebay
[11:29] <mfa298> depending on where you are you can probably get it cheaper elsewhere
[11:30] <x-f> that too
[11:30] <x-f> comments suggest it has a FC0013 tuner, which is so-so compared to a R820T one
[11:31] <mfa298> I recently got one with the model number SPC-0155 which is around £7 from China or a little bit more if you find a UK dealer
[11:31] <x-f> it would work anyway though, but have a look on ebay first
[11:31] <Tramvai> DX offers quality, some sellers on eBay sell Chinese copies of Chinese copies :P
[11:32] <mfa298> if you want to recieve the payload at any distance you will need a better antenna (and potentially a habamp_
[11:32] <zyp> hah
[11:32] <zyp> now I've heard that
[11:32] <zyp> «DX offers quality»
[11:32] <Tramvai> I just wanted it for testing to be honest, I doubt it would receive the signal from a distance of 30km anyway
[11:32] <Tramvai> Well, better than eBay to be honest
[11:33] <Tramvai> At least you get what you pay for
[11:33] <mfa298> Tramvai: you'de be surprised. I've recieved payloads a fair distance with a better (yet cheap/homemade) antenna. It's not as good as the FCD or a HAM radio
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[11:34] <Tramvai> Ah :P
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[11:34] <Tramvai> What RTLSDR dongle would I want to look for on eBay, x-f?
[11:34] <mfa298> Tramvai: for these TV dongles the quality from ebay is likely as good as what you get from DX or other sites. Those guys are just buying them in bulk and adding a markup due to their popularity
[11:35] <mfa298> Tramvai: I've got one with the model number SPC-0155 which works
[11:35] <Chetic> Tramvai: the way I did it was to just search on ebay for rtl2832 and bought the cheapest one
[11:35] <Chetic> only regret I have is the port being MCX and not SMA
[11:35] <Chetic> but that was no biggie either
[11:35] <zyp> I've found dx to not be particularly cheap, their well known name allows them to take a higher margin
[11:36] <mfa298> The key is that it has the correct RTL chipset RTL2832U and a decent tuner chip E4000, R820T
[11:37] <mfa298> Chetic: I solved that by chopping the antenna cable in half and putting a BNC on the cut end so I have a MCX to BNC pigtail
[11:37] <x-f> Chetic and mfa298 are giving you good advices, Tramvai
[11:37] <Tramvai> :)
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[11:37] <Tramvai> http://goo.gl/5bTke Cheapest one, and it seems correct, looking at the description
[11:38] <Tramvai> So, there's no difference between that and the Ezcap one besides the antenna port?
[11:39] <x-f> there is - the tuner chip is different
[11:39] <griffonbot> Received email: David Akerman "[UKHAS] Re: Vague Launch Possibility Brightwalton 6th/7th July"
[11:40] <Tramvai> The DX one has the E4000 chip
[11:40] <mfa298> In terms of prices, if you look back to when this use was discovered the prices went from around £6 to £15+, the ebay sellers have now dropped back to the original prices, a lot of the web stores have kept those inflated prices.
[11:40] <x-f> where do you read that?
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[11:42] <Tramvai> x-f referring to me? Many reviews state that it's rtlsdr compatible and has the e4000 chip
[11:42] <Tramvai> Ah, that sounds plausible indeed mfa
[11:42] <x-f> Tramvai, a few mentioned FC0013 too, so you can't be sure
[11:43] <mfa298> looking at the reviews some say E4000, some say FC0013. As it's not stated in the description you could be entering a lucky dip
[11:43] <Tramvai> Heh, that's true
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[11:43] <Tramvai> Ebay one will probably be better then
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[11:44] <x-f> Tramvai, don't forget about the connectors - for example if you decide to have your (future) antennas with SMA or BNC connectors, get some MCX-SMA or MCX-BNC adapters too
[11:44] <Tramvai> Will do, thanks
[11:44] <x-f> like http://www.ebay.com/itm/271201499880
[11:44] <x-f> or a pigtail
[11:45] <mfa298> In terms of the coax connectors the one to go for depends on what you intend to do, If you're going to keep the existing connector MCX is the better connector but you'll need to buy/make a suitable pigtail, If you want to change it yourself to something better (SMA) go for the Belling-Lee connector (the larger one)
[11:46] <Tramvai> Most of these terms are beyond me right now
[11:47] <x-f> :)
[11:47] <Chetic> mfa298: I'm afraid I'll introduce interference if I try to make my own RF cables
[11:47] <Chetic> no idea how sensitive that stuff is so I just assume _a_lot_
[11:48] <x-f> Tramvai, if you decide you want a HABamp too, take into account it has only SMA female connectors so you'll probably need a SMA male-male for it too
[11:48] <mfa298> MCX, SMA, Belling-Lee, BNC are all types of antenna connector. Generally the dongle will come with Belling-Lee (which is the standard TV connector in the UK) or MCX the smaller one.
[11:49] Action: mfa298 can see another wiki page coming on... Too many Ideas, too little time.
[11:49] <x-f> i think he might have some information overload by now :)
[11:49] <Tramvai> Well, I understand the connectors part
[11:49] <Tramvai> The ebay one has the MCX one
[11:50] <Tramvai> But I have no idea about which antenna I will use, I haven't looked into it
[11:50] <mfa298> I'm thinking a wiki page of the HABbers guide to RF connectors could be useful (including the difference between RP-SMA and SMA)
[11:50] <craag> That would be a good idea.
[11:50] <mattbrejza> has anyone done the rp-sma cockup, its not as if the connections are easy to get hold of
[11:50] <craag> yes, dave has I believe.
[11:51] <x-f> twice, perhaps
[11:51] <mfa298> possibly twice (or almost twice)
[11:51] <craag> with 2x female connectors on an antenna..
[11:51] <mattbrejza> :/
[11:52] <x-f> oh, right, Upu luckily stopped him on the second time
[11:52] <griffonbot> Received email: Neil Toombes "Re: [UKHAS] Re: Vague Launch Possibility Brightwalton 6th/7th July"
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[12:16] <Lunar_LanderU> yeah earlier I found that I have in fact two male connectors
[12:18] <zyp> that's gay
[12:18] <staylo> I'm surprised you didn't discover that earlier
[12:20] <mfa298> I've made a quick (text only) start on a guide to RF connectors, next task: Lunch, I'll look at adding some pictures later, although anyone else is welcome to add more detail/images in the mean time. http://ukhas.org.uk/guides:rf_connectors
[12:25] <Ugi> thanks mfa298 - that looks extremely handy
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[12:26] <Jess--> Is it possible for a few people to have a quick read of this http://titanballoon.co.uk/hag and let me know anything I'm missing?
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[12:30] <S_Mark> You planning a UK launch Jess-- ?
[12:30] <Jess--> yes
[12:31] <Jess--> will take a lot to get it done in the uk (if at all)
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[12:32] <S_Mark> have you spoken to cuddykid about this? I dont think he could get CAA to approve his glider at all
[12:33] <Jess--> No I haven't, wasn't aware of anyone trying it before (that was the reason for writing it all out as ideas and asking for feedback rather than putting it all together first)
[12:33] <Ugi> Jess--: I may not have much to add but that looks like a cool project!
[12:33] <Darkside> yeah you wont get approval
[12:34] <Darkside> been tried
[12:34] <Darkside> we cant get it here in australia
[12:34] <Darkside> and we have way more clear airspace
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[12:46] <Jess--> I know that there is no chance of option one in the list getting approval, but I did think that 3 or 4 may be possible since they could be viewed in a similar way to the normal descent by parachute (in fact it could be listed as such because the final descent would be by parachute)
[12:46] <Jess--> not that I would ever play word games like that with the CAA of course
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[12:52] <Laurenceb> launch a guided parachute
[12:52] <Laurenceb> also flying something like that is hard
[12:52] <Laurenceb> theres lots of turbulence up there
[12:52] <Laurenceb> ive tried with rudder control and it went into a spin
[12:52] <Laurenceb> http://ukhas.org.uk/_media/projects:ukhas_glider_project:pict7924.jpg <- i switched to that
[12:52] <Laurenceb> imo they wont care about those options
[12:52] <Laurenceb> its about risk
[12:52] <Laurenceb> plane has the potential to be fast and dangerous
[12:52] <Laurenceb> thats why parachute is seen as safe
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[13:21] <Lunar_LanderU> ah welcome back xD
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[13:21] <Ugi> wow!
[13:21] <Lunar_LanderU> Jess--: no I am using the webchat as well
[13:21] <Lunar_LanderU> but on the gaming show, indeed the webchat people got kicked out all the time
[13:21] <Maxell> \o/ hello errybody
[13:22] <Jess--> that's what I meant Lunar_LanderU I think the webchat users (us) got split off
[13:22] Nick change: Guest61340 -> Steffanx
[13:22] <Maxell> it was a wonderfull trip on the netsplitwave
[13:22] <Lunar_LanderU> yeah
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[13:22] <Lunar_LanderU> interesting because I use it too
[13:22] <Lunar_LanderU> I'm on the Herbert server though
[13:22] <Maxell> It's called a netsplit. You must ride it ;) :P
[13:22] <Lunar_LanderU> xD
[13:22] <Darkside> craag: ping
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[13:23] <Darkside> trying to compil yourt fcdcontrol-proplus on OSX
[13:23] <Darkside> few errors
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[13:30] <eroomde> Darkside: fun isn;t it
[13:30] <eroomde> i can't get audio sinks to work properly in ubuntu 12.04 with gr-companion
[13:30] <eroomde> everything else works
[13:30] <eroomde> but it won't come out the speakers
[13:32] <Darkside> heh
[13:32] <Darkside> im trying to make a little fft display thing in just python
[13:32] <Darkside> no gnuradio
[13:32] <Darkside> IQ input gtom a funcube dongle pro plus, via portaudio
[13:32] <Darkside> i've got an updating FFT display working fine
[13:33] <Darkside> but i want to be able to change the frequency
[13:35] <Darkside> im just playing around at the moment
[13:35] <Darkside> the end goal is to make something that gives me a waterfall display, and lets me select a chunk of spectrum
[13:35] <Darkside> then output the power contained in that chunk of spectrum
[13:35] <Darkside> then do somethign with that data
[13:36] <Darkside> log it with respect to position, produce a audible tone based on strength
[13:36] <Darkside> whatever
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[13:45] <eroomde> DFpi?
[13:48] <Darkside> eh?
[13:48] <Darkside> not running this on a pi
[13:48] <Darkside> i doubt the pi would keep up
[13:50] <Darkside> would be interesting to try though
[13:50] <Darkside> frequency agile handheld sniffer
[13:50] <Darkside> i wouldnt want to go running around in a forest with it though
[13:51] <PSBPI> Hello to everyone .. Todd from CHNSA here in Sydney. The Project Space Balloon Team have asked me to co-ordinate input from the team on the ground as well as other HAM's who are able to receive the signal directly
[13:51] <Lunar_LanderU> just had my board on the window sill looking west and both ubloxes got as far as getting the time right and then the "acquisition mode" with 30°N and 40°W and 7 km altitude
[13:51] <mattbrejza> i reckon you could get it to run on a pi, just dont fft the who 1MHz
[13:51] <mattbrejza> whole*
[13:51] <PSBPI> We do not expect to recover the balloon, and will appreciate any assistance with getting data from the payload along the path, in Victoria, Southern NSW, ACT, and Tas.
[13:51] <PSBPI> All you need is a radio capable of receiving SSB at 434.650MHz, and a Mac/Windows/Linux computer with sound card input and access to the internet. High gain antenna is highly desirable. See instructions here: http://projectspaceballoon.net/ssd/
[13:51] <Lunar_LanderU> Upu: at least we now got farther than last time, probably was indeed a good idea to get the GPS away from the power lines
[13:52] <PSBPI> I will be relaying any updates from the team here as well as tweeting on hashtag #SpaceBalloonTV
[13:52] <eroomde> PSBPI: i think Darkside is the only current resident aussie here
[13:52] <PSBPI> LAtest update from the team is that all is go for tomorrow mid morning launch 11am AEST .. approx 11hrs from now
[13:53] <craag> Darkside: pong
[13:53] <PSBPI> I know that the request was sent far and wide for any HAM's listening to see where the signal could be picked up ....
[13:54] <PSBPI> For those not able to listen directly images will be posted to http://ssdv.habhub.org/ in real time
[13:54] <eroomde> yes but 434.650 is not going to get much past australia :)
[13:55] <PSBPI> :) Yes thats true but you are online you can look at the images as they come in at http://ssdv.habhub.org/
[13:56] <eroomde> indeed, everyone likes pictures
[13:57] <craag> Darkside: PM me the errors you're getting, not sure I'll be able to help much though, it was quite hacked together and I haven't touched it in a while.
[13:57] <PSBPI> I will post some updates in the morning as the team prepares for launch
[13:58] Herman-PB0AHX (53560375@gateway/web/freenode/ip.83.86.3.117) joined #highaltitude.
[13:58] <Herman-PB0AHX> hello to all
[13:59] <craag> Hello!
[13:59] <eroomde> PSBPI: are you using doing things in the standard ukhasey way?
[13:59] <eroomde> dl-fldigi + ukhas message spec etc
[14:00] <PSBPI> I believ so ... Andy who is working on the SSTV has documented how to listen in at http://projectspaceballoon.net/ssd/ .. he mentions the ukhas.org.uk site on this page
[14:00] <Herman-PB0AHX> so I'm ready for the weekend
[14:00] <PSBPI> using fl-digi 3.21.50 HAB mode
[14:01] <eroomde> cool
[14:01] <eroomde> so yes, v likely
[14:02] <PSBPI> :)
[14:02] <Herman-PB0AHX> I want to see if I can track this weekend for the 2nd time
[14:03] <eroomde> using a rasp pi?
[14:03] <eroomde> from the looks of the picture
[14:03] <SpeedEvil> medium altitude: http://www.ustream.tv/channel/birdie-breakfast-buffet
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[14:36] <HixWork> IRC looks very healthy today :)
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[14:48] <Laurenceb> http://ocw.mit.edu/resources/res-ll-003-build-a-small-radar-system-capable-of-sensing-range-doppler-and-synthetic-aperture-radar-imaging-january-iap-2011/projects/MITRES_LL_003IAP11_proj_in.pdf
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[15:04] <Laurenceb> meanwhile in matlab
[15:04] <Laurenceb> error: fitter.m at line -1, column -1
[15:05] <Ugi> I was reading the rsPi guide on the wiki and it appears that the main issue with this is making it handle the GPS and NTX2.
[15:05] <Ugi> Do you see any reason why I might not just use my Arduino tracker allong with the rPi?
[15:06] <eroomde> what would the raspi be doing in this arrangement?
[15:06] <Ugi> The '328 can handle the GPS & NTX2 and can just take video data by serial from the rasPi
[15:06] <Ugi> Handling video
[15:06] <Ugi> and sending data ready to send out by serial
[15:07] <Ugi> My tracker at the moment does not use the hardware UART
[15:07] <Ugi> as the GPS is on i2c
[15:08] <Ugi> so I could use the UART to talk to something else, like a Pi
[15:08] <mfa298> that's approaching something close to what daveake has done,
[15:08] <mfa298> I think he had the Pi doing images and gps and then sending the data over serial to an arduino to control multiple ntx2s
[15:09] <Ugi> The guide (which he appears to have written) has the Pi doing it all
[15:09] <eroomde> you could use the arduino as your interface to the real world, yep
[15:09] <Ugi> Ah - that would be cunning
[15:09] <eroomde> no reason why not
[15:09] <mfa298> that arrangment was when he flow the picam with two ntx2s
[15:10] <Ugi> That would be easy enough too, if the '328 has enough time at 8HMz
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[15:10] <Ugi> it's just that it might be an easy way in for me, having no linux background
[15:11] <Ugi> all I have to do is get the image data to the Pi UART and the rest I can handle with the Arduino
[15:15] <Ugi> Thanks guys - I might have a go at that, once I have a first flight under my belt to prove the tracker
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[15:18] <eroomde> Ugi: yep, getting the basics solid first is a very useful think, psychologically as much as anything
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[15:20] <Ugi> eroomde: Sure - I need to walk before I can run (or fly, or something) but it occurred to me that I happened to have a conventient setup
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[15:20] <Ugi> because I have the serial free
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[15:22] <Ugi> I think I might have to write my own GPS-parsing at some point too - tiny GPS seems to take soooo much flash and SRAM
[15:22] <Ugi> but this works so let's try this first
[15:23] <eroomde> yes, writing a parser is a useful exercise
[15:23] <eroomde> i hate semi-complicated libraries like that on micros
[15:23] <eroomde> they're a yerrible idea
[15:23] <eroomde> terrible*
[15:23] <eroomde> i especially dislike arduino libraries
[15:23] <Ugi> it's vrey useful first time, 'cos it's one part I don't need to debug
[15:23] <eroomde> they just confuse people the second they try and do somehting nontrivial
[15:24] <Ugi> but it seems very greedy
[15:24] <Ugi> for what I need at least
[15:24] <Ugi> The SD library is also huge and greedy
[15:25] <Ugi> but I'm not so confident that I could write that myself
[15:25] <Ugi> there is a very promising looking page on the wiki about SD cards
[15:25] <Ugi> but it's nearly empty :-(
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[15:27] <eroomde> it's better to just forget libraries for micros, honestly
[15:27] <eroomde> it will stop anything sinking in
[15:28] <eroomde> learn how to do a basic ring buffer and how to do interrupts, and how bitmasks work with registers
[15:28] <eroomde> with about those 3 things, you know enough to implement basically anything
[15:29] <eroomde> i saw the ring buffer specifically because it's a useful datastructure for handling IO a bit asynchronously, eg having a uart interrupt fire to put the lastest stuff into the buffer, then have you main 'userspace' code read from it when it wants
[15:29] <eroomde> SD cards become just an SPI device that fill up when you write to the SPI ring buffer, the stuff from the GPS just becomes a ring buffer of characters
[15:30] <Ugi> well, I have been practicing interrupts anyway - my little tracker uses an interrupt-driven RTTY code.
[15:30] <eroomde> there is no mystic or APIs or magic incantations you find in a blog post
[15:30] <Ugi> And I have used buffers that I suspect you would classify as ringbuffers before, although I didn't know they were called that.
[15:30] <eroomde> circular buffers, whatever
[15:31] <eroomde> one pointer to say where data is written up to, another pointer to say where you have read up to
[15:31] <mattbrejza> you might want to use fatfs for the SD card at least
[15:31] <eroomde> and maybe a bit of logic to handle what happens if your write pointer overtakes your read pointer
[15:31] <eroomde> sure, but that's built ontop of a simple driver which can be the wring buffer
[15:32] <eroomde> iirc, fatfs requires that you give it some fuction that it can send an array of 512 bytes too
[15:32] <mattbrejza> oh, i suppose you just give it a pointer and a count
[15:32] <eroomde> or something
[15:32] <eroomde> i.e. basically the driver that you write
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[15:32] <mattbrejza> yea you need to fill in the 10ms tick, sd functions etc (although examples given for avr)
[15:32] <mattbrejza> *spi not sd
[15:32] <eroomde> Ugi: some of the best tutorials on the whole net for this are in the tutorials section of the avrfreaks forum by a guy called 'abcminiuser'
[15:33] <eroomde> he gives brilliant tutorials on most of the major peripherals, starting from the basics and moving up
[15:34] <Ugi> cool - I must look out for those.
[15:35] <mattbrejza> im fairly sure that with arduino libraries, one library might use timer 1, then another one also wants to use timer 1 and then it all falls apart
[15:36] <eroomde> yes exactly
[15:36] <eroomde> that's precisely precisely why i dislike them
[15:36] <eroomde> they hide too much
[15:36] <eroomde> and don't do it well
[15:36] <eroomde> it's all quite simple stuff conceptually, but my putting it behind a black box you break people's ability to reason about what is actually going on
[15:36] <eroomde> by putting*
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[15:37] <Laurenceb> it needs synaptic package manager
[15:37] <Laurenceb> /jk
[15:37] <Laurenceb> to do dependency mapping
[15:37] <mattbrejza> ive only used arduino once, and there was a lot of lolwut
[15:37] <mattbrejza> took me a while to find main()
[15:37] <mattbrejza> why is it in .ino :/
[15:38] <mattbrejza> serial was a bit werid too
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[15:39] <eroomde> i've only found the number of 'i can't get blah to work' questions on the channel have risen substantially since arduino was introduced
[15:40] <Laurenceb> actually that might be feasible
[15:40] <Ugi> I would not be too surprised, however, to discover that those asking would not even have tried before.
[15:40] <Laurenceb> hack synaptic to fix arduino hardware use
[15:40] <eroomde> possibly it's because it's attracting people who wouldn't have even known where to start before and therefore not even started. But i also think it might partly be because it only makes it harder really
[15:41] <eroomde> as in, there's no magic if you have to program at a low level. you can see why stuff doesn't work
[15:41] <Ugi> It depends, I suspect, on how you use these things.
[15:42] <Ugi> writing everything in assembler is no necessary really
[15:42] <eroomde> no
[15:42] <eroomde> but just c
[15:42] <mattbrejza> people probably need to move past arduino once theyve got the hang of it, but that doesnt seem to happen
[15:43] <Ugi> I expect that you notice when it doesn't happen and don't notice when it does.
[15:43] <Ugi> but it is easy not to realise that there are more options available
[15:44] <Ugi> than "pure" ardu' code
[15:44] <eroomde> i guess on this irc channel we tend to get more people who want to launch a balloon than people who want to learn embedded development
[15:45] <eroomde> so they want to keep the straight taught and not go on great assides to learn x and y
[15:45] <Ugi> seems likely
[15:45] <eroomde> I think that's probably a false economy in the long run, but equally if you just want to get photos back
[15:45] <eroomde> but i'm less inclined to help
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[15:46] <Guest97955> Received email: Solar Balloonman "Re: [UKHAS] Launch Announcement - Brightwalton - 29th/30th June"
[15:46] <Guest97955> Received email: Solar Balloonman "[UKHAS] Re: ... and you think you have payload recovery problems ...."
[15:46] <WILLschool> Hello.
[15:46] <Ugi> I have to say that I think it is an easy way in
[15:46] <mattbrejza> someone just needs to write the arduino hab library in the spirit of arduino, will also save on effort helping people :P
[15:47] <Ugi> for people who would otherwise not try
[15:47] <Ugi> HAB supplies could just sell pre-made standard trackers with pre-flashed '328s
[15:47] <Ugi> but that would not really be the point for me
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[15:48] <mattbrejza> most people want to do hab as a project, if an organisation wants to send something up then they pay someone to do it for them, there isnt really an inbetween for a premade tracker
[15:50] <Ugi> I reckon there would be a market with schools
[15:50] <Ugi> but I think everyone here would get very fed up
[15:50] <Ugi> very fast
[15:50] <mattbrejza> yea but they would also want help with the launch
[15:50] <mattbrejza> and everything else
[15:51] <mattbrejza> people here will do a launch for a school at cost
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[15:58] <WILLschool> Why is the RTTY delay 20150 Microseconds for 50 baud?
[15:58] <Ugi> I wondered that too
[15:59] <fsphil> it should be 1000000 / 50
[15:59] <Ugi> = 20000
[15:59] <fsphil> yea
[16:00] <fsphil> someone may have been putting in random numbers, seeing what worked best for them
[16:00] <fsphil> I'd stick with 1000000 / 50
[16:00] <Ugi> that's the impression the article gives
[16:00] <fsphil> assuming the sleep function is any way accurate, that should be ideal
[16:00] <Ugi> I found 20000ms worked for my interrupt
[16:01] <fsphil> yea it's much more accurate when interrupt driven
[16:01] <Ugi> 20 ms
[16:01] <fsphil> rtty by delay can be jittery
[16:01] <fsphil> though fldigi seems happy enough with it
[16:01] <WILLschool> But why 20150?
[16:01] <WILLschool> Not 20000.
[16:01] <fsphil> see above
[16:02] <WILLschool> Seen above.
[16:03] <fsphil> "random numbers"
[16:04] <Ugi> you can always try a few different timings and see what works.
[16:04] <fsphil> to be fair, if 20ms delay doesn't work - something else is wrong
[16:04] <Ugi> 50th second seems to work well for me.
[16:05] <Ugi> I keep meaning to get the 'scope out and see how accurate it is.
[16:05] <Ugi> never time.
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[16:06] <fsphil> ironic
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[16:08] <HixWork> http://www.avrfreaks.net/index.php?name=PNphpBB2&file=viewforum&f=11
[16:08] <Ugi> at 8MHz I only have half the time of everyone else :-(
[16:08] <HixWork> is the forum eroomde referred to earlier, it looks like a gem of info. cheers
[16:08] <fsphil> Ugi: my boards all use 7.3728 mhz
[16:09] <fsphil> avrfreaks is handy
[16:09] <HixWork> not heard of it before
[16:10] <HixWork> In fact. I am inclined to ask the guy who writes them If i can create a wiki section using them if I credit him fully - so there is a resource on the wiki with links to all the info on there
[16:11] <Ugi> fsphil: that's a helpful number for calculating timings!
[16:11] <Ugi> why 7.3728?
[16:12] <mattbrejza> it devices nicely for baud rates
[16:12] <mattbrejza> *devides
[16:12] <mattbrejza> urgh close enough (divides)
[16:12] <eroomde> signs it's friday
[16:13] <UpuWork> I run at 2Mhz :)
[16:13] <Ugi> I see - is it a massive power of 2 that I don't recognise?
[16:13] <UpuWork> its enough
[16:13] <eroomde> 'undefined reference to getcar()' causing you to spend 1 hour bug hunting
[16:13] <eroomde> before finally realise you just spelt getchar wrong
[16:13] <mattbrejza> you should probably now invoke getcar
[16:13] <mattbrejza> and go home
[16:13] <HixWork> did that with sotwareSerial() :/
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[16:14] <HixWork> which is not an LDO library
[16:14] <HixWork> hmm. time for me time back later
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[16:15] <Ugi> UpuWork: you use 2MHz for lower power consumption? or so you can run below 3v3?
[16:16] <Ugi> or other?
[16:16] <UpuWork> well normally use 4Mhz
[16:16] <Laurenceb> any octave users here?
[16:16] <UpuWork> but 4Mhz crystals you can't get in small packages
[16:16] <UpuWork> so I run a 16Mhz with the DIV/8 fuse set
[16:17] <WILLschool> How many start and stop bits should I have?
[16:17] <Ugi> this is for picos? If you are worried about the size of a crystal.
[16:18] <Ugi> 1 start 2 stop seems normal
[16:18] <UpuWork> yep
[16:18] <UpuWork> ok afk
[16:19] <WILLschool> Okay.
[16:19] <WILLschool> I'll write them in. Can you do it as a delay?
[16:19] <mattbrejza> just the normal 5x3mm SMD XLs dont come in a 4MHz version it seems
[16:21] <Ugi> WILLschool: you could just hold the stop bit high for twice as long as a normal bit I would expect, but I'm not the best person to be answering this I'm afraid
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[16:21] <WILLschool> Hmm. Difficult to write in, but I'll try.
[16:22] <Ugi> then just do two normal bits
[16:22] <Ugi> what does the tutorial do for start & stop bits?
[16:22] <eroomde> Laurenceb: sometimes use octave
[16:23] <Laurenceb> nvm #octave are helping
[16:23] <WILLschool> So can I do it as a delay?
[16:23] <Laurenceb> weird issues with ignore_function_time_stamp ('none')
[16:23] <Laurenceb> sending me bonkers
[16:24] <WILLschool> Wait no.
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[16:25] <Ugi> Have you looked at the tutorial at http://ukhas.org.uk/guides:linkingarduinotontx2
[16:25] Nick change: Matt_soton -> mattbrejza
[16:25] <Ugi> ?
[16:26] <Ugi> in that, each byte is sent as a low bit (start), eight data bits from the character, then two high bits (stop)
[16:26] <Ugi> Not eight, seven
[16:27] <Ugi> each bit uses the same function and the same delay
[16:27] <Ugi> it's just that it's called twice for stop bits
[16:27] <Ugi> rtty_txbit (1); // Stop bit
[16:27] <Ugi> that line is repeated
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[16:30] <WILLschool> Well. My code is in a loop.
[16:30] <WILLschool> Not seperate functions.
[16:30] <WILLschool> It's in nested loops.
[16:31] <WILLschool> I'm not even sure if my delay is correct.
[16:31] <WILLschool> It sounds too fast,
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[16:31] <Ugi> IRC is not great for posting code so it's not too easy to help with that.
[16:32] <WILLschool> This is it http://pastie.org/8113281
[16:32] <Ugi> you should have something around a 20ms delay for each bit
[16:32] <WILLschool> Without the delay.
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[16:32] <WILLschool> Now I need to functionify it. :)
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[16:33] <WILLschool> Not sure how to break it up.
[16:34] <fsphil> the delay is kinda important :)
[16:34] <Ugi> OK - you need a delay in there
[16:34] <fsphil> your Serial.println is also introducing a delay
[16:34] Nick change: WILLschool -> WILLdude
[16:34] <WILLdude> I'll get rid of that, I know it works.
[16:35] <Ugi> sorry fsphil - you carry on.
[16:36] <fsphil> that PSBPI flight is 2am UK time :/
[16:36] <fsphil> silly timezones
[16:40] <fsphil> PSBPI: can I suggest using 2 stop bits, fldigi works better with that setting. not sure why
[16:40] Nick change: WILLdude -> WIlldude123
[16:41] <WIlldude123> Right.
[16:41] <PSBPI> i can pass that information on, but i know that andy has been testing it as per the config on the website and it seems to be working ok
[16:42] <WIlldude123> fsphil: What do you think is the best way of changing the code so I can add start bits and stop bits? I think I'll try and turn all of the loops into functions, but not too sure how.
[16:42] <fsphil> yea. it will work, but (on an older version at least) I got less byte errors using 2 stop bits
[16:42] <fsphil> I've not repeated the test with the recent releases
[16:43] <WIlldude123> And I need to get the delay right.
[16:43] <PSBPI> ok thanks ... will pass it on to Andy in the morning before launch
[16:43] <fsphil> WIlldude123: start and stop bits are just regular bits. I'd make a function that does just that, sends a bit and delays the appropriate time
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[16:43] <fsphil> that's your lowest level as far as rtty is concerned
[16:43] <fsphil> all that function needs to know is if it's a 1 or 0
[16:44] <fsphil> the it's easy .. just send start bit, x data bits, and the stop bit
[16:45] <fsphil> that could be a function too
[16:45] <WIlldude123> So I'll make a TX_1 function and a TX_0 function and then call them when I need to?
[16:45] <PSBPI> They are 300 but lowest is 110
[16:45] <fsphil> to send a complete byte
[16:45] <fsphil> WIlldude123: why two when one would do :)
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[16:46] <fsphil> PSBPI: the current flight doc says 110 baud .. are they sending images at that rate?
[16:46] <WIlldude123> so I'll start with void txbit(value){
[16:46] <fsphil> aye
[16:47] <fsphil> so that function will set your pin depending on what value you passed in
[16:47] <PSBPI> I think 300bps is what they are aiming at
[16:47] <fsphil> then delay
[16:48] <fsphil> that flight doc may not just be active yet
[16:48] <fsphil> I see one at 300 baud too
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[16:48] <WIlldude123> Does the stop bit go after each bit or byte?
[16:48] <fsphil> byte
[16:48] <fsphil> the start and stop bit frame the byte
[16:48] <fsphil> so the decoder knows where to begin and end
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[16:49] <Lunar_Lander> hello
[16:50] <Ugi> while we are talking about RTTY - I was advised that some null bytes between sentences were a good plan. Is two null bytes enough?
[16:50] <fsphil> evening Lunar_Lander
[16:50] <fsphil> two should be fine
[16:50] <Ugi> fab - that's what I have
[16:51] <WIlldude123> error: variable or field 'txbit' declared void ?
[16:51] <fsphil> sounds like you've defined the function wrong
[16:51] <WIlldude123> http://pastie.org/8113316
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[16:51] <Ugi> also, would it make sense to shorten the sentence (ditch all but the position data) after landing to make it easier to decode?
[16:51] <WIlldude123> How do I properly declare them?
[16:52] <fsphil> WIlldude123: guessing you've not read the K+R book :)
[16:52] <WIlldude123> Not yet.
[16:52] <Guest97955> Received email: Steve Aerospace "Re: [UKHAS] Launch Announcement - Brightwalton - 29th/30th June"
[16:52] <Ugi> you need to tell the compiler what "b" is.
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[16:53] <fsphil> there's a few mistakes there
[16:53] <eroomde> line 24
[16:53] <eroomde> if b = 1
[16:53] <eroomde> you want b == 1
[16:53] <fsphil> ()
[16:53] <fsphil> too
[16:53] <fsphil> = is assignment. == is comparason
[16:53] <fsphil> and I've made that error a few times :)
[16:54] <Ugi> Man that assignment vs comparison is _the_ main error in my code
[16:54] <Ugi> and it's a killer to spot!
[16:54] <Ugi> I grew up with BBC basic
[16:54] <Ugi> where there isn't a distinction
[16:54] <Ugi> and I _cannot_ remeber that ther eis in C
[16:54] <fsphil> I find having them separate to be useful
[16:54] <Ugi> I can see it could be useful.
[16:55] <fsphil> I don't like = having two different meanings depending on context
[16:55] <WIlldude123> At least 10 errors.
[16:55] <Ugi> I am just too old to assimilate the difference
[16:55] <fsphil> WIlldude123: C also reads things from top to bottom. you're calling the function before it exists
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[16:55] <WIlldude123> Ah right.
[16:56] <fsphil> you can either move the function up, or make a prototype
[16:56] <fsphil> which I'm not a fan of
[16:56] <WIlldude123> Arrgh,
[16:56] <WIlldude123> 4 errors.
[16:57] <fsphil> getting there :)
[16:57] <Ugi> OK - I'm probably going to regret this, but when do you need to pre-define a function?
[16:57] <WIlldude123> http://pastie.org/8113333
[16:57] <WIlldude123> When you use it later.
[16:57] <Ugi> when I call from loop() or setup() you don't seem to need to
[16:57] <Ugi> but from within another function you do.
[16:58] <fsphil> Ugi: the arduio library already knows about loop and setup
[16:58] <fsphil> if you went into the code you'd probably find a extern prototype for them
[16:58] <WIlldude123> Code that produced those: ^
[16:58] <WIlldude123> char datastring[80]="RTTY\n";
[16:58] <WIlldude123> void setup() { pinMode(13, OUTPUT); Serial.begin(9600);
[16:58] <WIlldude123> }
[16:58] <WIlldude123> void txbit(b){ if b == 1{
[16:58] <WIlldude123> digitalWrite(13, 1);
[16:58] <WIlldude123> delayMicroseconds(10000);
[16:58] <WIlldude123> delayMicroseconds(10150);}
[16:58] <WIlldude123> else{
[16:58] <WIlldude123> digitalWrite(13, 0);
[16:58] <WIlldude123> delayMicroseconds(10000);
[16:58] <WIlldude123> delayMicroseconds(10150);}}
[16:58] <eroomde> naughty
[16:58] <WIlldude123> void loop(){
[16:58] <WIlldude123> int len = strlen(datastring);
[16:58] <WIlldude123> for (int x = 0; x < len; x++){
[16:58] <WIlldude123> char c = datastring[x];
[16:58] <eroomde> still naughty
[16:58] <WIlldude123> for (int bits = 0; bits < 8; bits++){
[16:58] <WIlldude123> if (c & 1){
[16:58] <fsphil> you pasteie.org'd the errors, and not the code?
[16:58] <WIlldude123> txbit(1);
[16:58] <WIlldude123> } else {
[16:58] <WIlldude123> txbit(0):
[16:59] <WIlldude123> }
[16:59] <WIlldude123> c = c >> 1;
[16:59] <eroomde> stop being naughty
[16:59] <WIlldude123> }
[16:59] <Ugi> sure but if I call my own function from within setup() it's quite happy if that's not been reached yet
[16:59] <WIlldude123> }
[16:59] <WIlldude123> }
[16:59] <WIlldude123> Shit
[16:59] <WIlldude123> Sorry
[16:59] <WIlldude123> Damn sure I copied the pastie link.
[16:59] <WIlldude123> Anyway teatime.
[16:59] <eroomde> :)
[16:59] <fsphil> hah
[16:59] <fsphil> Ugi: C++ might be different
[16:59] <Ugi> I have been caught by it sometimes
[16:59] <Ugi> but I can't work out the rule
[17:00] <fsphil> WIlldude123: there's a sneaky : in there
[17:00] <fsphil> instead of an ;
[17:00] <Ugi> still need to define what b is I think WIlldude123
[17:01] <fsphil> yea and you're still missing () around the comparason
[17:01] <fsphil> I'm surprised the compiler isn't complaining about that
[17:02] <fsphil> and read the K+R book :)
[17:02] <fsphil> all this would be explained there
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[17:03] <Ugi> also you are still trying to send 8 bits instead of 7 WIlldude123
[17:04] <mfa298> WIlldude123: this sounds like you're trying to run before you can even crawl, a good book (like K+R) will teach you how to crawl, walk and run (and probably some other stuff as well). It's also going to help you mind to think in the right way to write code.
[17:04] <Ugi> I gotta run guys - thanks for the advice.
[17:04] <Ugi> TTFN
[17:04] <fsphil> I've been using C and I learned a few things from it. (trigraphs -- which to be fair, are ugly things)
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[17:06] <mfa298> one of these days I ought to read K&R I suspect I'll learn a lot from it
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[17:19] <mikestir> evening
[17:20] <mikestir> has anyone been doing anything on rtty demodulation, other than what's already in fldigi?
[17:22] <mfa298> mattbrejza has written a decoder in java which is either standalone or part of his android app
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[17:24] <Lunar_Lander> hi mikestir
[17:24] <mikestir> ok. because I have ended up splitting out that work I was doing on remote control for fldigi into a completely standlone web sdr. The next logical step would be to put the decoders in there too
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[17:25] <mikestir> and I'm going to try to get it to the point where I can release some code this weekend, family commitments permitting
[17:25] <number10> someone else decodes balloons with something other than fldigi 0 as the call sign is appended not_fldigi
[17:25] <mikestir> yeah I've seen that too
[17:25] <mfa298> i think that's matt using his app
[17:26] <SamuelBancroft> Hello everyone, just back from my Geography trip now. I'd like just like to thank everyone involved with the Zenith tracking last friday. We have loads of data including radiation counts, pressure, UV etc so it has been really appreciated. You certainly helped inspire a lot of people.
[17:26] <mfa298> you can find it at http://users.ecs.soton.ac.uk/mfb2g09/decoder/
[17:26] <SamuelBancroft> Heres some footage if you're interested: (better vid coming soon) https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=m9UB_ENmWwY
[17:26] <SamuelBancroft> and the cumberland news mentioned you: http://www.cumberlandnews.co.uk/news/brampton-students-launch-weather-balloon-to-edge-of-space-1.1067835?referrerPath=home
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[17:27] <mikestir> lunar_lander: did you get any sense out of your dallas sensor yet?
[17:28] <Lunar_Lander> yes, I swapped the sensor with another one
[17:28] <Lunar_Lander> and now it works
[17:29] <mikestir> funny failure mode. well at least you sorted it
[17:29] <Guest97955> Received email: John Underwood "Re: [UKHAS] Launch Announcement - Brightwalton - 29th/30th June"
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[17:33] <G0TDJ_Steve> I wonder if you're about craag ?
[17:34] <G0TDJ_Steve> maybe not.
[17:34] <G0TDJ_Steve> Any Linux (Raspberry Pi) experts in da house?
[17:34] <mfa298> I know a bit
[17:34] <G0TDJ_Steve> HI mfa298
[17:35] <G0TDJ_Steve> I'm trying to get a USB Bluetooth dongle to work
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[17:35] <mfa298> I suspect craag might be off getting stuff ready for VHF Field day
[17:35] <G0TDJ_Steve> Oh yes, I've already got mine ready...
[17:36] <G0TDJ_Steve> So, mfa298 How would I check if the Bluetooth dongle was recognised by the Pi? Any idea?
[17:36] <mfa298> hmm, the only bluetooth I've done on linux is on fedora and it had the stuff installed by default
[17:36] <mfa298> lsusb is a good starting place - that will show the usb devices it can see
[17:36] <G0TDJ_Steve> lsusb
[17:37] <G0TDJ_Steve> LOL Worng KBD
[17:37] <mfa298> I would also also tend to look at the output of /var/log/message when plugging it in
[17:37] <dutchtux> dmesg
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[17:37] <G0TDJ_Steve> Well, lsusb gives "Cambridge Silicon Radio, Ltd Bluetooth Dongle (HCI Mode)
[17:38] <dutchtux> my dongle uses the same chipset...
[17:38] <G0TDJ_Steve> dutchtux: That gives a heap of stuff
[17:39] <G0TDJ_Steve> lots of ...tx timeout
[17:39] <mfa298> lsmod could also be useful although you might want the before and after listing to compare
[17:40] <G0TDJ_Steve> I see DMSEG is the list of stuff that the machine boots with
[17:41] <G0TDJ_Steve> dutchtux: What programs have you got running on your box to get teh Bluetooth running?
[17:42] <dutchtux> the bluetooth software (bluez)
[17:42] <G0TDJ_Steve> OK That's what I have
[17:42] <dutchtux> http://wiki.debian.org/BluetoothUser
[17:43] <G0TDJ_Steve> thanks dutchtux I'll have a look
[17:44] <dutchtux> is your gps device on? than hcitool scan to look for your BT device
[17:46] <dutchtux> if the GPS is found it returns the mac-address and name of the device
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[17:50] <dutchtux> next step would be "sdptool browse <mac address>" to look for the available services of the device
[17:50] <G0TDJ_Steve> dutchtux: I've gone into XWindows and I have Blueman running. It says theres no adaptors available. hcitool scan gives "Cevice is not available: No such device"
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[17:51] <dutchtux> what's the output of "hcitool dev"?
[17:52] <G0TDJ_Steve> Devices:
[17:52] <dutchtux> so no devices??
[17:52] <G0TDJ_Steve> Nope
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[17:53] <G0TDJ_Steve> I've just SSHed in so I can cut'n'paste stuff if required
[17:54] <dutchtux> are the bluetooth drivers loaded? lsmod
[17:54] <G0TDJ_Steve> bluetooth 193568 14 bnep,btusb,rfcomm
[17:54] <dutchtux> ssh is good :)
[17:54] <dutchtux> and btusb?
[17:54] <G0TDJ_Steve> I was flicking from one screen to another, pain....
[17:54] <dutchtux> yes, ican see its loaded...
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[17:55] <gb73d> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3I_Vv8z8Wn0
[17:55] <G0TDJ_Steve> OK Cool
[17:55] <gb73d> look s like it lost a gyro to me
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[17:55] <G0TDJ_Steve> Hi daveake
[17:55] <daveake> evening
[17:56] <G0TDJ_Steve> dutchtux: I have the Bluetooth GPS flashing a few feet away
[17:56] <G0TDJ_Steve> Trying to get my Bluetooth GPS connected to my Pi daveake , dutchtux giving me a hand (and mfa298)
[17:56] <gb73d> engines look ok, guidance failed ireckon
[17:57] <daveake> ok. no idea never tried
[17:58] <dutchtux> the problem is that your dongle is somehow not recognized (hci0 not showing up)
[17:58] <dutchtux> that should be the first step.
[17:58] <G0TDJ_Steve> dutchtux: Yeah, I was thinking along those lines. Are they hot swap on RPi, can I unplug and plug or is it strictly on a restart?
[17:59] <Chetic> what antenna should I use for the receiver with the HABamp?
[17:59] <dutchtux> If I unplug the Rpi hangs (in my case) but should be hotplug\
[18:00] <chrisstubbs> Chetic, for use on a car or at home?
[18:00] <G0TDJ_Steve> I'm running Rasbian Weezy
[18:00] <G0TDJ_Steve> Fully updated
[18:00] <Chetic> chrisstubbs: on car
[18:00] <dutchtux> I think you're missing some software packages. I'm running raspbian (wheezy?)
[18:00] <G0TDJ_Steve> Yeah, wheezy
[18:01] <chrisstubbs> Chetic, In that case you are probably after a magmount suitable for 430mhz
[18:01] <G0TDJ_Steve> Any idea what?
[18:01] <dutchtux> i will have a look in my bookmarks for an instructional site
[18:01] <G0TDJ_Steve> Thanks dutchtux I appreciate your help
[18:02] <chrisstubbs> I use a watson W-7900
[18:02] <Chetic> chrisstubbs: does magmount imply the coiled part I see in most google results?
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[18:03] <mikestir> no it just refers to the fact that it has a magnet on the bottom to stick it to the car roof
[18:04] <gb73d> ive got a W7900 v good anttena
[18:04] <gb73d> esp on UHF
[18:04] <Chetic> so I basically just need any 70cm magmount antenna?
[18:04] <dutchtux> Steve: did you also install the bluez-utils package? If yes, then reboot
[18:04] <Chetic> not sure how sloppy I can be while picking
[18:05] <Chetic> I want good margins
[18:05] <G0TDJ_Steve> Funny dutchtux I just found a page with that on. I'm just installing now :-)
[18:06] <chrisstubbs> With the W-7900 ity jus has a PL259 connector on the base, so you need to get a seperate magnetic base (WM-14B) in my case
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[18:07] <G0TDJ_Steve> dutchtux: Rebooting
[18:07] <number10> evening jcoxon
[18:08] <dutchtux> ok, the "hcitool dev" command should give the hci0 device
[18:08] <jcoxon> hey number10
[18:09] <number10> still up early tomorrow?
[18:09] <jcoxon> yes
[18:09] <G0TDJ_Steve> Well done dutchtux Devices: hci0 00:15:83:3D:0A:57
[18:09] <jcoxon> will probably leave london just before 7
[18:09] <jcoxon> so meet at the barn at 0830?
[18:09] <chrisstubbs> Ah just the person! My latest payload weighs up at 38g all in, think it has a hope of floating on a 36" foil jcoxon?
[18:10] <number10> yes that fine
[18:10] <dutchtux> ok, you can now proceed with "hcitool scan" to look for BT devices
[18:10] <jcoxon> chrisstubbs, sure
[18:10] <jcoxon> so the slow the ascent rate the better
[18:10] <chrisstubbs> Oo :) It seemed a bit close to the 20-40g limit on steves site
[18:10] <chrisstubbs> may give one a go on sunday
[18:10] <jcoxon> the trick is to launch in as good as perfect weather
[18:10] <G0TDJ_Steve> Yep, scanning :D
[18:10] <jcoxon> number10, you got helium?
[18:10] <G0TDJ_Steve> Says it timed out LOL... I'll try again
[18:11] <daveake> jcoxon What frequency is your flight on tomorrow?
[18:11] <daveake> number10 Same question :)
[18:11] <dutchtux> your GPS is 'on', right? ;-P
[18:11] <number10> I have - I also have some foild balloons filled from what is left over
[18:11] <G0TDJ_Steve> Yes, I have GPS on and I run a BT Keyboard on my PC too
[18:12] <number10> just need to let a little out for yors if you want me to bring a filled one over jcoxon
[18:12] <number10> daveake: just small canister of balloon gas
[18:12] <dutchtux> I have used on older BT dongle that could not recognize modern BT hardware.. no devices showing up
[18:12] <jcoxon> number10, i've got that old canister
[18:13] <G0TDJ_Steve> Scanning ... Inquiry failed: Connection timed out
[18:13] <jcoxon> should do another ballloon
[18:13] <jcoxon> daveake, going for .175Mhz
[18:13] <daveake> tvm
[18:13] <number10> OK - i'll bring filled balloons and some gas jcoxon
[18:13] <number10> freq sorr daveake - one mo
[18:13] <G0TDJ_Steve> Any way around that dutchtux? Can I connect to the GPS by MAC or something if I find it out?
[18:14] <number10> 434.243 daveake
[18:14] <daveake> cheers
[18:14] <jcoxon> number10, you prefilling?
[18:14] <dutchtux> you could try "hcitool inq"
[18:15] <number10> last weekend I pre-filled 3 foil balloons with gas that was left over from flight at CUSF
[18:15] <G0TDJ_Steve> No, times out
[18:15] <number10> they are slaightly overfilled jcoxon.. but I also have some gas and an unfilled balloon
[18:15] <dutchtux> hmm, not sure what to do next.. you'll need the mac address of the BT device for the next steps
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[18:16] <G0TDJ_Steve> dutchtux: Well, It works on my PC. I can connect it temporarily and note it down.
[18:16] <jcoxon> number10, http://ready.arl.noaa.gov/hypubout/194_trj001.gif
[18:16] <dutchtux> does your phone has BT? You could try to scan that address
[18:16] <jcoxon> number10, bbl
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[18:17] <G0TDJ_Steve> Just trying that dutchtux but I understand that iPhones don't work with anything!
[18:17] <G0TDJ_Steve> Lets see if I can get some info off my PC - BBS
[18:17] <dutchtux> that's why i use android ;)
[18:18] <G0TDJ_Steve> Unplugging BT dongle didn't crash Pi
[18:18] <dutchtux> So if the dongle is connected to your pc you can scan for other devices, right?
[18:18] <G0TDJ_Steve> Yeah, works fine. I've had the GPS running through it. Actually, now come to think of it, it's a different dongle...
[18:19] <dutchtux> you know what to ...
[18:20] <dutchtux> what to do..
[18:20] <G0TDJ_Steve> I've swapped them out
[18:20] <mikestir> grr @ iphones. they don't work with anything because, although they use standard protocols, iOS will refuse to talk to you unless your device includes a proprietary authentication chip with a per-device royalty
[18:20] <G0TDJ_Steve> Scanning gives: Scanning ... 00:08:1B:0F:50:A4 BT GPS
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[18:21] <dutchtux> there it is!
[18:21] <G0TDJ_Steve> :D
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[18:21] <G0TDJ_Steve> Gah! And I got the other dongle specifically for the Pi....
[18:21] <dutchtux> at this point I thought 'almost there'.....
[18:21] <dutchtux> I was never so wrong,lol..
[18:22] <G0TDJ_Steve> LOL.... Sorry to be a pain
[18:22] <G0TDJ_Steve> How do I connect it?
[18:22] <dutchtux> went through this the last weeks..
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[18:23] <dutchtux> scan for services on the BT device
[18:23] <G0TDJ_Steve> Sorry, whats the command for that? I'll start taking notes I think!
[18:23] <dutchtux> sdptool browse <mac address>
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[18:24] <LeoBodnar> UpuWork: Thanks for the package!
[18:25] <G0TDJ_Steve> May have hung dutchtux
[18:25] <G0TDJ_Steve> sdptool browse 00:08:1B:0F:50:A4 Failed to connect to SDP server on 00:08:1B:0F:50:A4: Operation now in progress
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[18:26] <dutchtux> ok, if returns data, look for the channel with serial port
[18:26] <G0TDJ_Steve> browse 00:08:1B:0F:50:A4 Failed to connect to SDP server on 00:08:1B:0F:50:A4: Operation now in progress
[18:27] <dutchtux> no luck?
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[18:27] <G0TDJ_Steve> No, got browse 00:08:1B:0F:50:A4 Failed to connect to SDP server on 00:08:1B:0F:50:A4: Operation now in progress
[18:28] <dutchtux> then it's time for tea.
[18:28] <G0TDJ_Steve> :D
[18:28] <G0TDJ_Steve> I think a break is a good idea.
[18:29] <dutchtux> do some searching on the web for this error, mine went fine from here
[18:29] <G0TDJ_Steve> OK Cool. Many thanks for getting me this far
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[18:49] <Martin_G4FUI> Hello Biglrp30
[18:53] <fsphil> it's oddly nice here today
[18:55] <mfa298> by the sounds of the weather forcast earlier I suspect we'll all be complaining about it being too hot and drought conditions soon.
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[19:00] <HixPad> This is a good resource for C learning www.fourwalledcubicle.com/AVRArticles.php
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[19:04] <eroomde> that's the same chap as from the forum
[19:04] <eroomde> as u probs realise
[19:04] <eroomde> he works for atmel now
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[19:05] <G0TDJ_Steve> Hey dutchtux
[19:06] <dutchtux> Hi GOTDJ_Steve
[19:06] <G0TDJ_Steve> $GPGGA,190521.823,5127.1710,N,00010.5775,E,1,08,02.0,18.5,M,45.4,M,,*5F $GPGSA,A,3,03,06,15,18,19,21,22,27,,,,,3.2,2.0,2.5*30
[19:06] <eroomde> mfa298: i love it!
[19:06] <eroomde> i just went for a run along the thames
[19:06] <eroomde> was glorious
[19:06] <dutchtux> wow! nice... what was the problem?
[19:07] <G0TDJ_Steve> I'm in XWin but it's working. cat /dev/rfcomm0 gives the GPS output :D
[19:07] <G0TDJ_Steve> The dongle didn't like being in the hub. I've put it directly on the Pi
[19:07] <G0TDJ_Steve> I wouldn't mind dutchtux It is a powered hub...
[19:08] <mfa298> eroomde: agreed it's nice weather to be outside in. But you know us English, we'll always find a way to complain about the weather!
[19:08] <eroomde> yes i suppose so
[19:08] <eroomde> i still think i'm going to move to california
[19:08] <fsphil> you'd miss rain
[19:08] <eroomde> having to put the roof of my convertible mustang up, to stop sun burn, when driving around there in feb was a bit of an eye opener
[19:09] <dutchtux> you dont want to send that to space
[19:09] <eroomde> did i mention the convertible mustang?
[19:10] <G0TDJ_Steve> So dutchtux I just need to work out how to connect the GPS on the command line and that should be that - Thanks again for your help.
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[19:10] <dutchtux> there are many tutorials on the web. good luck!
[19:10] <G0TDJ_Steve> Gonna be off now. Cheers dutchtux and mfa298
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[19:14] <fsphil> I'd miss the snow
[19:14] <eroomde> mfa298: also, beer festival tomorrow
[19:14] <fz> Hey, I just created a NTX2 Fritzing part. I know some of you would find it useful.
[19:15] <fz> https://github.com/Reflejo/Fritzing-Parts
[19:15] <eroomde> what is a frittzing part?
[19:17] <fz> eroomde: http://fritzing.org/
[19:17] <eroomde> so it's like a pcb footprint for the fritzing pcb design software?
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[19:18] <fz> It's not only pcb. A part includes breadboard, schematac and pcb representations
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[19:21] <Martin_G4FUI> Hello biglrp301
[19:21] <eroomde> fz: interesting
[19:22] <biglrp301> Hello Mart
[19:22] <eroomde> Martin_G4FUI: wb
[19:27] Nick change: biglrp301 -> castgr
[19:30] <castgr> Nope dint work
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[20:28] <WIlldude123> Hello
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[20:42] <Lunar_Lander> hi jdtanner
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[20:49] <WIlldude123> Just to be clear a start bit is a bit where the pin is high for one bit before the character, and a stop bit is 0 and happens twice after the end of the bit?
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[20:54] <WIlldude123> Isn't decoding. http://pastie.org/8113832 I have the start and the stop bits in place.
[20:54] <Adam012> Looks like a lot of flights going up tomorrow. We're a bit worried about predicted landing spots for Horizon 2 - seems to be flying over Birmingham and landing in the suburbs o_0
[20:55] <daveake> http://ukhas.org.uk/guides:linkingarduinotontx2
[20:56] <daveake> ^^ will tell you about the correct use of start and stop bits
[20:56] <daveake> hint: you might be wrong about start being high
[20:56] <daveake> hint: there's only 1 start bit per byte
[20:57] <eroomde> flying near cities was always a nono in the past
[20:57] <eroomde> especially so landing near them
[20:57] <WIlldude123> Oh I thought it was per byte.
[20:57] <eroomde> we wouldn't even go near norwich...
[20:57] <daveake> Adam012 if you're stuck you could launch from here
[20:57] <jdtanner> Adam012: have you got a link to the predictor for your flight?
[20:57] <daveake> WIlldude123, It is per byte that's what I said
[20:57] <daveake> http://hourly.upuaut.net/
[20:58] <daveake> ^^ for here
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[20:58] <WIlldude123> I meant per bit sorry.
[20:59] <daveake> It would be strange WIlldude123 using a bit to define when a bit starts
[20:59] <jdtanner> Adam012: Likewise you can launch from here if you can get onto the CAA...they seem to be fine with launches from here. The Peaks might be a bit closer to you?
[21:00] <daveake> Adam012 I have 2 launches available in my permission for this weekend. I have one main flight and 1 which you could use
[21:01] <daveake> Up to you but don't go landing in a city, please!
[21:02] <WIlldude123> Ack still not decoding.
[21:02] <WIlldude123> It must be an error I made somewhere.
[21:02] <daveake> Yup
[21:02] Nick change: 13WAAPD7W -> arko
[21:02] <WIlldude123> Hmm.
[21:02] <mfa298> daveake: get the flgiht right and you might land at craag's Field Day site
[21:03] <daveake> Or where's that?
[21:03] <WIlldude123> mfa298: I'm going there.
[21:03] <mfa298> near basingstoke
[21:03] <daveake> Ah won't be that far south
[21:04] <WIlldude123> Well, I'm txing one bit with value zero, which is the start bit. Then later in the loop, I tx two stop bits with value 0. Correct?
[21:04] <mfa298> it's the afternoon predictions that looked closer although they're missing it a bit.
[21:05] <fsphil> not correct
[21:05] <mfa298> daveake: this is what they're planning and there's a link to a google map of the location. http://www.suws.org.uk/Outing:VHF_NFD_2013 I'm sure you'd be welcome if you wanted to stop by.
[21:06] <WIlldude123> daveake: It'd be nice to see you there. Not sure when I'll go.
[21:06] <daveake> WIlldude123, Do me a favour and read that page I linked to
[21:06] <WIlldude123> Which one?
[21:06] <daveake> Otherwise I might feel like not bothering
[21:06] <HixPad> From the sounds of it you don't want to meet craag on the Sunday ;)
[21:06] <daveake> The one above
[21:06] <WIlldude123> What so you don't have to?
[21:07] <daveake> WIlldude123, Consider yourself ignored
[21:07] <mfa298> WIlldude123: you've managed to persaude someone to take you along, that's good news. I'm sure they'll find a way to get you on a radio and it's a good way to learn a bit more about what amateur radio is about.
[21:07] <WIlldude123> daveake: I don't understand.
[21:07] <daveake> Evidently
[21:08] <daveake> Look, I linked you to a page that tells you what you did wrong'
[21:08] <daveake> Read oit
[21:08] <daveake> it
[21:08] <WIlldude123> Oh I didn't see.
[21:08] <mfa298> WIlldude123: hint - 21:55
[21:09] <WIlldude123> Ah the NTX2 tutorial page?
[21:09] <daveake> People put a lot of effort into the wiki and people put a lot of effort into helping out here
[21:09] <daveake> Return the favour by putting a bit of effort into reading it
[21:09] <WIlldude123> I had it open already.
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[21:09] <HixPad> I'm betting after the home page that it the most linked page on the whole of ukhas
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[21:10] <HixPad> *is
[21:10] <WIlldude123> It seems as though that is what I have done.
[21:10] <daveake> Cheers mfa298
[21:11] <WIlldude123> Yes.
[21:12] <mfa298> WIlldude123: when we tell you to read something it's because the link/book is likely to explain things better than we can on IRC. The key is to actually reading all the content rather than skimming it and thinking you understand it (there's a difference and doing the right thing is hard sometimes - I struggle to do it sometimes)
[21:12] <HixPad> WIlldude123: Pay special attention to comments in the code
[21:12] <jdtanner> Might be worth trying to start with the simple code that starts with the line "/* NTX2 Radio Test Part 1"
[21:12] <jdtanner> Get that working first
[21:13] <HixPad> Comments is there for plebs like me to get a grip on it
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[21:13] <eroomde> comments is beutiful
[21:13] <eroomde> beautiful*
[21:13] <jdtanner> agreed :)
[21:13] <mfa298> Comments are always an important part of writing good (maintainable) code.
[21:13] <eroomde> i think ipython notebook is basically the highest form of awesome the software engineering has reached so far
[21:13] <WIlldude123> That is what I have done. Before each byte, having 1 start bit, which is 1. You can see this in line 35. Later, I have 2 stop bits, equal to one.
[21:13] <eroomde> because you can do beutiful things between blocks of code
[21:13] <HixPad> They help me and I am nearly beyond help
[21:13] <WIlldude123> equal to zero I mean
[21:13] <WIlldude123> No.
[21:14] <daveake> One guy I worked with came out with the following during a code walkthrough (not of my code I should add) ... "Well I can see what the code is doing but I haven't a clue what the comments mean"
[21:14] <WIlldude123> That is what I have done. Before each byte, having 1 start bit, which is 0. You can see this in line 35. Later, I have 2 stop bits, equal to one.
[21:14] <Lunar_Lander> daveake, was he like trained in that sort of software?
[21:14] <daveake> <WIlldude123> Well, I'm txing one bit with value zero, which is the start bit. Then later in the loop, I tx two stop bits with value 0. Correct?
[21:14] <HixPad> Comments is free. Free is good
[21:14] <jdtanner> If you follow that wiki page to the letter...and it still doesn't work...then it is likely operator error :P
[21:15] <daveake> And as was pointed out by fsphil, that is wrong
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[21:15] <WIlldude123> Yeah I got confused, but the code is right.
[21:15] <HixPad> Rtfm or is that too strong?
[21:15] <daveake> friendly is a good word
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[21:15] <jdtanner> Read the friendly manual?
[21:15] <jdtanner> :P
[21:15] <daveake> yup
[21:16] <WIlldude123> HixPad: I read the fucking manual.
[21:16] <fsphil> haha
[21:16] <WIlldude123> And as far as I can see here, I've done what it says.
[21:16] <fsphil> there are not too many friendly manuals
[21:16] <daveake> WIlldude123, post the code
[21:16] <fsphil> mostly engrish ones
[21:16] <Lunar_Lander> daveake, or did that mean that the person writing the commentary in the program did that in a bad way?
[21:17] <daveake> Yes
[21:17] <HixPad> Fathomable was my f
[21:17] <WIlldude123> http://pastie.org/8113861#35,48-49
[21:17] <WIlldude123> Highligted are start and stop bits.
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[21:19] <mfa298> WIlldude123: *read* *all* the wiki guide and your mistake should become clear
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[21:20] <mfa298> although I might have been looking at the wrong version of your code then.
[21:20] <Lunar_Lander> evening James
[21:21] <fsphil> is your receiver setup correctly?
[21:21] <fsphil> 8-bit ascii, no parity, etc
[21:21] <Lunar_Lander> dave would you like to hear my newest error?
[21:21] <daveake> is it funny?
[21:21] <daveake> WIlldude123 As fsphil says check dl-fldigi
[21:21] <WIlldude123> Ah I might have had it on 7 lemme check.
[21:22] <daveake> and confirm it is set to the same as you are Txing
[21:22] <eroomde> lol
[21:22] <Lunar_Lander> hm semi funny
[21:22] <daveake> which is 8 bits (but needn't be)
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[21:22] <Lunar_Lander> I spent the time before lunch today mounting a SMA plug to my coax cable from the previous flight
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[21:22] <HixPad> eroomde: At the conf would you care for "tutoring" in Catia ?
[21:22] <Lunar_Lander> only to find that both that and the connector on the board are male
[21:22] <jdtanner> http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/3/3b/Paris_Tuileries_Garden_Facepalm_statue.jpg/300px-Paris_Tuileries_Garden_Facepalm_statue.jpg
[21:22] <daveake> I can beat that :)
[21:22] <Lunar_Lander> i.e. with a spike in the middle
[21:23] <fsphil> lol
[21:23] <daveake> lol
[21:23] <mfa298> WIlldude123: one thing to consider is that timing is important for rtty and every instruction in your code takes time.
[21:23] <daveake> Yes that's funny :)
[21:23] <WIlldude123> Doesn't work on 7 or 8.
[21:23] <Lunar_Lander> XD
[21:23] <Lunar_Lander> do you know "The Thinker"?
[21:23] <WIlldude123> So I'll do away with the print statements?
[21:23] <Lunar_Lander> I think it is also in paris
[21:23] <eroomde> WIlldude123: what kind of thing is the screen showing?
[21:23] <jdtanner> Facepalm...rather than the thinker
[21:23] <eroomde> HixPad: yes quite poss. let me have a good 2moz
[21:23] <eroomde> never used it before
[21:24] <Lunar_Lander> the thinker looks more like someone sitting on the toilet XD
[21:24] <eroomde> what i have seen of it SCARES ME A BIT
[21:24] <fsphil> the name sounds scary
[21:24] <HixPad> Good
[21:24] <WIlldude123> 69ek69ek... I think it quite likes sex positions.
[21:24] <fsphil> it sounds expensive
[21:24] <HixPad> I have ONE thing on you
[21:24] <Lunar_Lander> daveake, what did you mean by you can beat that?
[21:24] <Lunar_Lander> got an error you made?
[21:24] <eroomde> WIlldude123: have you tried hitting 'Rv' in the bottom right of fldigi?
[21:24] <eroomde> standard thing to try
[21:24] <eroomde> just incase
[21:25] <daveake> LL neither end had a pin
[21:25] <WIlldude123> Yup.
[21:25] <HixPad> It's solidworks with functioning cojones
[21:25] <fsphil> while in 8-bit?
[21:25] <daveake> WIlldude123, Your code is sending 8 bits set dlfldigi to 8
[21:26] <Lunar_Lander> ohhh
[21:26] <WIlldude123> Yahoo!
[21:26] <Lunar_Lander> that is bad
[21:26] <fsphil> SMA-RP is a silly thing
[21:26] <WIlldude123> Shitty search engine but good expression.
[21:26] <HixPad> Just to break things up a bit (see what I did there) has anyone given any thought to my swashplate passive stabilisation idea?
[21:26] <eroomde> niet
[21:27] <WIlldude123> Right. Now for the checksum.
[21:27] <HixPad> Dar.
[21:27] <WIlldude123> And I still need to make these into functions, but not yet.
[21:27] <HixPad> Is nice, is good
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[21:27] <fsphil> are you two talking in code?
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[21:28] <Lunar_Lander> btw at lunch I said "good that analogue communication still exists"
[21:28] <Lunar_Lander> "why?"
[21:28] <HixPad> And added to stabilotron would make for happyings
[21:28] <Lunar_Lander> "Imagine we would have to emit RTTY tones"
[21:28] <HixPad> Ruskii fsphil
[21:28] <fsphil> close enough
[21:28] <number10> fsphil: can you change title on tracker?
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[21:28] <fsphil> number10: yeppers
[21:28] <Lunar_Lander> also
[21:29] <Lunar_Lander> SMA connectors are a pain to solder
[21:29] <Lunar_Lander> they take ages to cool
[21:29] <daveake> Well add my flight then :)
[21:29] <fsphil> there's quite a lot launching tomorrow isn't there?
[21:29] <Lunar_Lander> and if you forget that...
[21:29] <Adam012> The 10am prediction at present: http://habhub.org/predict/#!/uuid=9b13c3112bf9f1a384970d20bdc87ea54885335a
[21:29] <WIlldude123> Yippe!
[21:30] <Adam012> The 3pm launch looks better: http://habhub.org/predict/#!/uuid=2b585139020be1d8cfd9be116e0ef7ddc899fa33
[21:30] <number10> fsphil: launch ~ 0930 so thats 0830 utc i think
[21:30] <fsphil> what callsign number10?
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[21:30] <WIlldude123> daveake: Are you going to pop in to the Field Day tomorrow?
[21:30] <fsphil> and what time/callsign daveake?
[21:30] <jdtanner> Seems to be quite close to Brum mate
[21:31] <number10> for NANU and PICO
[21:31] <fsphil> ah you're launching two at the same time?
[21:31] <daveake> fsphil: PURLEY 434.350Mhz /KINGSLEY 434.650MHz Brightwalton, UK 0830 UTC
[21:31] <fsphil> ANU and PICO are there atm number10
[21:31] <fsphil> change of time?
[21:32] <number10> yes fsphil
[21:32] <daveake> Adam012, Can you launch Sunday instead?
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[21:32] <WIlldude123> craag: Did you say you were hosting an IRC network there?
[21:32] <number10> it ill be earler than 11 bst anyway
[21:33] <mfa298> WIlldude123: I think they're planning a local IRC server for tent to tent comms.
[21:33] <HixPad> My combined swashplate and IMU has more freedoms than Guantanamo
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[21:35] <WIlldude123> Will it be signposted anywhere? Finding it with my navigational skills might be a little hard.
[21:35] <mfa298> WIlldude123: I doubt there'll be much to sign post it.
[21:36] <HixPad> Yagi it
[21:37] <HixPad> Dfftw
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[21:38] <mfa298> WIlldude123: looking at the map on the Field Day wiki I think the lat/long is 51.291902,-1.163533
[21:38] <jcoxon> ping upu
[21:38] <WIlldude123> I would develop the checksum code tonight, but I've had enough for tonight.
[21:38] <WIlldude123> mfa298: Yeah.
[21:38] <WIlldude123> Where can we park, do we just drive on to the field?
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[21:39] <mfa298> WIlldude123: pass, I know about as much as is on the wiki link that I posted earlier
[21:39] <mfa298> I suspect you can drive up the road a bit and then see what other cars are doing.
[21:40] <WIlldude123> mfa298: You going?
[21:40] <mfa298> Not sure yet, I may pop up but it depends a bit on what else I need to do.
[21:40] <fsphil> daveake: that ok?
[21:41] Action: mfa298 isn't sure there are enough flights tomorrow
[21:42] <fsphil> I've still to add the melbourne one
[21:42] <daveake> fsphil Yes, cheers :)
[21:42] <mfa298> need a USA one so you can have a later time as well and a proper global habbing day
[21:42] <HixPad> Gn all
[21:42] <fsphil> haha
[21:43] <fsphil> nite HixPad
[21:44] <daveake> nn
[21:44] Action: jcoxon is hot gluing
[21:44] <fsphil> doesn't seem to be any frequency clashes
[21:44] <fsphil> mmmm hot glue
[21:44] <Lunar_Lander> jdtanner, long time no speak
[21:44] <Lunar_Lander> how are you?
[21:44] <jcoxon> daveake, are you launching tomorrow?
[21:44] <daveake> yup
[21:45] <jdtanner> Hey Lunar...
[21:45] <jdtanner> Yeah. I changed jobs
[21:45] <daveake> Should be up and down before midday, and I chose frequencies to avoid clashes anyway
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[21:45] <Lunar_Lander> oh ok
[21:46] <jdtanner> Yeah...so ballooning had to take a back seat for 8 months :/
[21:46] <Lunar_Lander> yeah
[21:46] <Lunar_Lander> like here, I have to work on the balloon on weekends and spare time because the B.Sc. project is prime priority now
[21:48] <jdtanner> Gutted...I wish I could get paid for hobbies :D
[21:48] <fsphil> there's never enough free time!
[21:48] <WIlldude123> Hallo Lunar_Lander
[21:48] <jdtanner> Yeah...and shift working sucks
[21:49] <fsphil> yea
[21:49] <WIlldude123> How are you yah?
[21:49] <fsphil> I know I couldn't handle the time changes
[21:49] <Lunar_Lander> I'm good and still know proper english
[21:49] <WIlldude123> I got ze tracker werking tonight.
[21:49] <Lunar_Lander> jdtanner, ah no payment there
[21:49] <jdtanner> So, I decided that as I hardly get any time with the wife/dog..I'm going to spend some precious free time this weekend making a yagi :P
[21:49] <fsphil> lol
[21:50] <fsphil> that's the spirit!
[21:50] <Lunar_Lander> uni may not give paychecks for B.Sc. or M.Sc. thesis work
[21:50] <jdtanner> Yeah...I've almost convinced my wife it is "beneficial" :D
[21:51] <WIlldude123> ACHTUNG! Alles touristen und non-technischen peepers!
[21:51] <WIlldude123> Das machine control is nicht fur gerfinger-poken und
[21:51] <WIlldude123> mittengrabben. Oderwise is easy schnappen der springenwerk,
[21:51] <WIlldude123> blowen fuse, und poppencorken mit spitzensparken.
[21:51] <WIlldude123> Der machine is diggen by experten only. Is nicht fur
[21:51] <WIlldude123> geverken by das dummkopfen. Das rubbernecken sightseenen
[21:51] <WIlldude123> keepen das cotten picken hands in das pockets,
[21:51] <LeoBodnar> DFB
[21:51] <LeoBodnar> Yawn
[21:51] <WIlldude123> Sorry didn't anticipate the length.
[21:51] <daveake> IBYSTTATB
[21:52] <fsphil> lol
[21:52] <jdtanner> :)
[21:53] <Lunar_Lander> XD
[21:53] <WIlldude123> Hmm didn't know you like meatloaf daveake. :P
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[21:53] <fsphil> he's do anything for pun, but he won't admit to liking meatloaf
[21:53] <fsphil> that worked in my head
[21:54] <daveake> lol
[21:54] <WIlldude123> Orly? http://www.mlukfc.com/forums/showthread.php?t=15644
[21:54] <daveake> yup that'll be me
[21:54] <WIlldude123> What does IBYSTTATB mean?
[21:54] <mfa298> there isn't a dry eye in the house with that attempt at a pun
[21:55] <fsphil> I worked it out, and I'm quite slow with acronyms
[21:55] <Lunar_Lander> jdtanner, so we didn't talk since march?
[21:55] <Lunar_Lander> or even before
[21:55] <WIlldude123> Scotland Yard Gospel Choir is a google result.
[21:55] <fsphil> didn't know there was such a thing
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[21:56] <daveake> They have branches everywhere but that's a special one
[21:56] <WIlldude123> WTH does it mean? It's not a well documented acronym and dave is the only person who uses it.
[21:56] <daveake> It's a hot summer night
[21:56] <Lunar_Lander> Shakespeare?
[21:56] <WIlldude123> Argh what does it mean already.
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[21:57] <Ugi> Yay! my payload's on the map!
[21:57] <fsphil> it could also end with a G
[21:57] <WIlldude123> No, it's You Took the Words Right Out of My Mouth
[21:57] <daveake> <sigh>
[21:57] <WIlldude123> Please explain.
[21:58] <fsphil> nice one Ugi :)
[21:58] <fsphil> it's great getting on there. unless it appears in africa
[21:58] <fsphil> unless you're in africa at the time
[21:58] <jdtanner> Basically..."said the actress to the bishop"
[21:58] <Ugi> I didn't realise it would appear - I was just expecting to see it in the logtail.
[21:58] <jdtanner> but in slightly fewer words
[21:59] <Ugi> and yes - it's over my house, which must be a good sign!
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[21:59] <WIlldude123> But how?
[21:59] <WIlldude123> What does it stand for?
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[21:59] <fsphil> ITHGAWU
[22:00] <Lunar_Lander> IJAIA
[22:00] <daveake> I forget, but IACBTMN
[22:00] <fsphil> true
[22:01] <daveake> http://www.metrolyrics.com/you-took-the-words-right-out-my-mouth-lyrics-meat-loaf.html
[22:01] <fsphil> the answer is within
[22:02] <fsphil> I've not heard this song. the lyrics are, odd
[22:02] <daveake> spoken piece
[22:03] <Ugi> Do you know why I have a flight prediction on the map? I didn't post any flight docs - only the payload spec.
[22:03] <mfa298> I might have to fire up spotify, I can remember how parts of it go but the rest is a blank
[22:03] <daveake> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_wO8toxinoc
[22:03] <daveake> Ugi You don't have to
[22:03] <Ugi> apparently, however, I'm about to release it into the Thames estuary
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[22:04] <fsphil> never good
[22:04] <mfa298> then again a whole load of songs are odd if you actually look at the lyrics
[22:04] <WIlldude123> IDC any more.
[22:04] <daveake> IDC ... can you explain?
[22:04] <WIlldude123> About whatever that acronym was.
[22:04] <WIlldude123> I don't care about whatever that acronym is.
[22:05] <mfa298> I cheated when I couldn't work it out quickly. As is always the case google has the answer
[22:05] <daveake> That's a shame after I went to the trouble of linking you to it WIlldude123
[22:05] <LeoBodnar> Is it acronym or initialism?
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[22:06] <WIlldude123> Google doesn't help.
[22:06] <fsphil> sssh, it might hear you
[22:06] <WIlldude123> ;google IBYSTTATB
[22:06] <fsphil> I bet the first result is the logs to this channel
[22:07] <fsphil> oh it's gone again
[22:07] <mfa298> your google foo is obviously weak
[22:07] <fsphil> oh hi
[22:07] <WIlldude123> Ah
[22:07] <WIlldude123> I bet you say that to all the boys.
[22:07] <fsphil> bingo
[22:07] <WIlldude123> I presume the yahoo answers one was you too daveake.
[22:08] <Lunar_Lander> btw my acroym meant
[22:08] <Lunar_Lander> I jump around in ALDI
[22:08] <daveake> nope
[22:08] <daveake> I just posted the 2 links above to the answer, but you missed them
[22:08] <WIlldude123> Oh right.
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[22:09] <WIlldude123> Wow. I didn't anticipate the legnth. Are you referring to size of a phallus?
[22:10] <daveake> Just the length of this conversation
[22:11] <jdtanner> http://i.stack.imgur.com/jiFfM.jpg
[22:11] <jdtanner> Sorry...couldn't resist
[22:11] <Lunar_Lander> jdtanner, http://s.gullipics.com/image/8/a/j/5yvdks-ksysra-nxu6/IMG7828.jpeg
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[22:12] <jdtanner> Is that from your baloon Lunar?
[22:12] <WIlldude123> Then why did you use the equivalent of that's what she said?
[22:14] <jcoxon> Pico X current mass = 24.9g
[22:15] <Upu> bah
[22:15] <Upu> beat me
[22:16] <Upu> 25.2g
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[22:16] <Upu> I'm going to snip the antennas down :)
[22:17] <jdtanner> wow...are you magic? Surely that is nearly the weight on a battery?
[22:17] <LeoBodnar> Take the wrapper off the battery
[22:18] <fsphil> that's not as easy as you'd think. took me ages unwrapping one
[22:18] <Lunar_Lander> jdtanner, exactly :)
[22:20] <LeoBodnar> Thanks for the parcel Upu
[22:20] <Upu> welcome Leo
[22:20] <LeoBodnar> I haven't opened it yet so I might need to thank you again ;)
[22:20] <Upu> I could cheat and use an AAA like Leo :)
[22:20] <Upu> you may Leo :)
[22:21] <LeoBodnar> Oh, is it cheating? XD
[22:21] <Lunar_Lander> jdtanner, we flew to 22568 m :)
[22:21] <jdtanner> Cool!
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[22:22] <jdtanner> My tracker has managed to fly to 330m so far
[22:22] <jdtanner> by which I mean it has been switched on upstairs
[22:22] <LeoBodnar> Which one?
[22:24] <LeoBodnar> Would flying non-GPS balloon with just pressure and temperature be worthwhile?
[22:24] <jcoxon> LeoBodnar, not particularly
[22:24] <jcoxon> at least in my opinion
[22:24] <ideapod> Hi there - very new to this - are you guys from the bendigo project?
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[22:25] <fsphil> ideapod: morning. I don't believe they're here yet
[22:25] <Upu> hey ideapod
[22:26] <fsphil> PSBPI: you guys awake yet? :)
[22:26] <Upu> not heard of them
[22:26] <fsphil> they're launching near Melbourne in a few hours
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[22:26] <fsphil> I say near
[22:27] <fsphil> 150-ish km north
[22:27] <LeoBodnar> jcoxon: I have this sub-2g tracker that I wanted to stick baro sensor on and send it away on a tiny balloon. http://leobodnar.com/balloons/files/IMG_1274.jpg
[22:27] <LeoBodnar> QRPPP
[22:27] <fsphil> that's so cute
[22:27] <jcoxon> i guess we could DF it
[22:27] <jcoxon> what would it tx?
[22:28] <ideapod> yes - they will be using callsign PSBPI
[22:28] <LeoBodnar> DominoEX of course! XD but less lat/lon
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[22:28] <LeoBodnar> I mean barometric altitude and temperature
[22:29] <fsphil> would seem a shame not knowing where it is
[22:29] <Upu> put an accelerometer on and dead reckon
[22:29] <Upu> ?
[22:29] <fsphil> though you could work out how high it is
[22:29] <LeoBodnar> Would make it a bit more interesting to traingulate it
[22:29] <ideapod> http://projecthorus.org/index.php/blog/
[22:29] <jcoxon> LeoBodnar, it does look amazing
[22:30] <LeoBodnar> Maybe MAX-7 would work? What is its highest current draw?
[22:30] <Upu> Well Project Horus is Darkside on here
[22:30] <fsphil> this is where having accurate time signals would help, we could calculate positiong based on signal phase :)
[22:30] <Upu> 25mA @ 3.3V
[22:30] <fsphil> -g
[22:30] <Lunar_Lander> evening anthony
[22:30] <Upu> down to 6mA in 1 sec cyclic
[22:30] <Upu> hi Lunar
[22:30] <Upu> oh bendigo is doing SSDV
[22:31] <ideapod> I think it's on in 2.5 hours so I'll come back then. sorry to intrude. Would like to do a project myself next year so would like to come back for help sometime!
[22:31] <Upu> you're welcome to be here ideapod
[22:31] <Lunar_Lander> anthony I got the GPS as far as getting into data aquisition
[22:31] <Upu> you're not intruding
[22:31] <Lunar_Lander> i.e. where it gives readings in the atlantic
[22:31] <Lunar_Lander> hopefully get complete lock if I take it completely outside
[22:31] <Upu> Not sure what you're on about Lunar ?
[22:31] <Upu> Keep an eye on http://spacenear.us/tracker/ ideapod
[22:32] <Lunar_Lander> ah do you remember how I told you that my chip antenna GPS doens't get more than time lock?
[22:32] <SpeedEvil> yes
[22:32] <LeoBodnar> I might do it then. It would have to have reduced TX power so DominoEX might be just what doctor ordered
[22:32] <Lunar_Lander> and you suggested moving the GPS from the power lines
[22:32] <Upu> Did I ?
[22:32] <Upu> ok
[22:32] <Upu> :)
[22:32] <ideapod> what are you guys doing/designing?
[22:32] <ideapod> thx Upu
[22:32] <jarod> tomorrow, sit in sun + track balloons day? :D
[22:32] <Upu> all sorts tbh ideapod :)
[22:32] <Lunar_Lander> yeah
[22:33] <jcoxon> okay PICO is ready for launch
[22:33] <Lunar_Lander> Anthony and then I prepared the antenna from the first launch with an SMA screw connector
[22:33] <jcoxon> minus some insulation
[22:33] <Lunar_Lander> only to find that the PCB socket is also male
[22:34] <Lunar_Lander> jdtanner, also cool :)
[22:35] <fsphil> quite a few pico flights tomorrow
[22:35] <fsphil> could be a long weekend :)
[22:35] <Lunar_Lander> yea :)
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[22:37] <jcoxon> fsphil, or quite short
[22:37] <jcoxon> as they go into trees
[22:37] <fsphil> yes that is a risk
[22:38] <fsphil> or floating, along the ground
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[22:40] <fsphil> any changes with this one jcoxon?
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[22:41] <jcoxon> not really
[22:41] <jcoxon> very similar
[22:41] <jcoxon> but going for even slower ascent rate
[22:41] <jcoxon> mainly a reproduction flight
[22:42] <jcoxon> tried to get the RF22 lib working rather than rfm22
[22:42] <jcoxon> so i could do uplink
[22:42] <jcoxon> but it kept crashing
[22:42] <jcoxon> memory issue i suspect
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[22:43] <LeoBodnar> What mode do you use for the uplink jcoxon ?
[22:43] <jcoxon> well i'd use the standard on the rfm22 module
[22:43] <jcoxon> though we've got it down to 250baud
[22:44] <LeoBodnar> With 10mW transmit?
[22:44] <WIlldude123> craag, you around?
[22:44] <jcoxon> its all experimental
[22:44] <jcoxon> but we could use 458 to uplink
[22:44] <jcoxon> and use 100mW
[22:44] <fsphil> sneaky
[22:45] <fsphil> there's a 900mhz ism band being made available
[22:45] <LeoBodnar> Is it a UK ISM?
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[22:45] <fsphil> but no mention of rules yet, not sure if it can be done airbourne or at what power levels
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[22:46] <WIlldude123> craag, is the field day happening at woodgarston farm or walbury hill? Tim said there are stations at both, but I can't find reference to the other one anywhere.
[22:46] <LeoBodnar> But this is land-based TX so should be OK?
[22:46] <fsphil> I'm hoping they allow a bit more than 10mw from the payload for that
[22:46] <ideapod> when I looked into bulding a project last year (and not being that familiar with AX.25 - can you for example put a simultaneous stream of SSDV, AND APRS?
[22:46] <fsphil> but yea from the ground there are a lot more options
[22:47] <fsphil> 869mhz can use 500mw from the ground
[22:47] <fsphil> which might work well for an uplink
[22:47] <fsphil> in theory you can put ssdv inside aprs packets ideapod, though it's not recommended
[22:47] <LeoBodnar> I suppose you can build a good directional antenna array.
[22:48] <fsphil> some of the power limits include gain, so you often can't use a yagi
[22:49] <LeoBodnar> Is 500mW average or instantaneous?
[22:49] <fsphil> erp
[22:49] <fsphil> and it's limited to 10% duty
[22:49] <mattbrejza> theres 10% DC too
[22:49] <jcoxon> right
[22:49] <jcoxon> time for sleep
[22:50] <jcoxon> night all
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[22:50] <ideapod> fsphil - thx - is there a recommended way to multiplex some locations + images + telemetry?
[22:50] <fsphil> or listen before talk
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[22:50] <Ugi> Hey guys - anyone had any luck installing the virtual audio cable in XP?
[22:50] <Ugi> can't seem to make it work
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[22:51] <fsphil> ideapod: probably using 8-bit RTTY. you can alternate between SSDV packets and telemetry strings
[22:51] <fsphil> that's what I've been doing in my own flights
[22:52] <fsphil> the sort of telemetry strings we use are documented at http://ukhas.org.uk/communication:protocol
[22:52] <mattbrejza> lbt still has max talk time (1s)
[22:52] <fsphil> it's simpler than aprs - but you don't get the benefit of the large network
[22:53] <mattbrejza> and limits on how much tx in an hour
[22:53] <fsphil> shame
[22:53] <fsphil> but 10% is still fine for an uplink
[22:53] <mattbrejza> oh yea
[22:54] <mattbrejza> shame you cant (easily) tx on 424 and rx on 869
[22:54] <fsphil> saw filters?
[22:55] <mattbrejza> its more the match to the ic is freq dependant
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[22:55] <mattbrejza> i ment off the same ic
[22:55] <fsphil> ah from the same radio
[22:55] <fsphil> I was thinking two, so it could listen continously on 869
[22:55] <mattbrejza> different ics then yea use saw
[22:55] <mattbrejza> could use same abtenna too
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[22:56] <fsphil> a 434mhz quarter wave would be good for 869mhz?
[22:56] <LeoBodnar> You can sync RX time to TX time
[22:56] <fsphil> I thought half waves where quite poor
[22:57] <ideapod> fsphil - thanks. kids to get dressed, see you again later
[22:57] <fsphil> cya
[22:57] <LeoBodnar> You only need to RX for few msec now and then in a a pre-determined window.
[22:57] <mattbrejza> you can get dual band antennas probs? anyway if theres 4db loss put out 4db on the ground
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[22:57] <mattbrejza> more
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[23:07] <mfa298> feeding at the end of a half wave tends to be a very high impedance, so isn't always ideal
[23:07] <mfa298> that's my understanding at least
[23:09] <mfa298> although from some of the previous conversations on here I wonder if you could do something a bit different to make the antenna look better for both bands (although two resonant 1/4 waves might be easier
[23:10] <mattbrejza> you can always add some matching
[23:10] <mfa298> a trap on the driven element might also work so it appears to be a 1/4 wave on both bands
[23:11] <mfa298> and maybe a mixture of radials
[23:11] <LeoBodnar> traps on radials too?
[23:12] <mfa298> I dont think you'de need traps on the radials just the driven element
[23:12] <mattbrejza> tbh the neat solution would be to have a 1s break in tx, at which point the uplink sends is message
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[23:12] <mattbrejza> that would imply the same freq, so you cant dov500mW on ism, but ham instead
[23:13] <LeoBodnar> You can align RX window to GPS time with usec precision
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[23:14] <LeoBodnar> No need for upling to RX anything
[23:14] <mattbrejza> its oikely the ground tx will have rx though
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[23:15] <mattbrejza> depends whether you want gps on the ground. we are kinda solving a problem for unknown requirements...
[23:16] <LeoBodnar> Simple solution is to TX for 100msec at the start of each 1PPS pulse from GPS.
[23:20] <LeoBodnar> Ground TX: Wait for 1PPS rising edge, TX any pending command for 100msec, repeat.
[23:20] <LeoBodnar> Airborne RX: TX downlink data, wait for the nearest 1PPS rising edge, listen for 100ms, repeat.
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[00:00] --- Sat Jul 6 2013