highaltitude.log.20130619

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[02:04] <heathkid> I'm holding out for the new AirBus... :P
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[02:43] <heathkid> so no one is around tonight?
[02:44] <heathkid> UK sleeping... West coast not awake?
[02:44] <arko> im writing code and stuff
[02:44] <heathkid> hello arko
[02:44] <heathkid> I won't bother you then
[02:44] <heathkid> keep writing that code! :)
[02:45] <arko> i'll have a video update soon
[02:45] <heathkid> we're currently working on integrating the BMP085 and soon after the ADXL345
[02:45] <heathkid> have you used the BMP085?
[02:46] <heathkid> okay, so I'm bothering you...
[03:00] <arko> its
[03:00] <arko> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1Oa5dWs63I4
[03:00] <arko> all good
[03:01] <arko> its the DS18B20
[03:01] <heathkid> that's what we're using
[03:01] <arko> nice
[03:01] <heathkid> how do you get more than one to talk on the same bus?
[03:02] <arko> i didnt, i just used different digital pins
[03:02] <heathkid> oh
[03:03] <heathkid> thermal shock? dip in in LN2
[03:03] <heathkid> nice video though
[03:03] <Darkside> more than on DS18B20 is easy
[03:03] <arko> thats beyond thermal shock
[03:03] <Darkside> well
[03:04] <arko> i just didnt bother, i should have
[03:04] <Darkside> i just used the dallastemperature library :-)
[03:04] <arko> took about an hour to do
[03:04] <heathkid> nice
[03:04] <Darkside> part of my board bringup is to run a bit of code which spits the temp sensors addresses via RTTY
[03:05] <Darkside> then i plug those into my code, so i it locks down which sensor is which
[03:05] <heathkid> we've got one temp sensor (DS18b20) working...
[03:05] <heathkid> it's off a bit (about 10 degrees F depending...)
[03:05] <heathkid> not the most accurate thing
[03:05] <Darkside> dont forget is has a fair bit of theral mass
[03:06] <heathkid> true
[03:06] <heathkid> but I really want to get the ADXL345 working
[03:06] <heathkid> once we have I2C is shouldn't be difficult
[03:07] <heathkid> with the BMP085 (lots of examples)
[03:07] <heathkid> right?
[03:09] <arko> yeah, should be easy
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[07:28] <Willdude123> If I want to get a student ticket for UKHAS conference, do I have to show some ID? ( I have no student card)
[07:28] <Willdude123> *will I have to
[07:29] <daveake> will yuo won't
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[07:33] <Willdude123> Just checking. I'll ask my parents today.
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[07:35] <eroomde> Willdude123: i think we believe you
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[07:40] <ibanezmatt13> Good Morning :)
[07:41] <ibanezmatt13> Doing what I hope will be my last bit of soldering today: The 5v regulator, the SMA connector for the NTX2, and the battery holder.
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[08:02] <UpuWork> yes we believe you
[08:02] <UpuWork> and we don't need to see your Grandads bus pass either
[08:02] <UpuWork> http://ukhas.org.uk/general:ukhasconference2013
[08:05] <ibanezmatt13> Morning UpuWork :)
[08:05] <UpuWork> morning Matt
[08:05] <UpuWork> bringing your Dad to London ?
[08:06] <ibanezmatt13> yes. We're all coming down I think
[08:06] <ibanezmatt13> Oh you mean the conference?
[08:06] <UpuWork> yes
[08:06] <daveake> Yet again I get the shortened slot before lunch :p
[08:06] <UpuWork> oh timing I need to sort out
[08:06] <UpuWork> I just copied last years
[08:06] <ibanezmatt13> Yeah, my Dad will bring me I think
[08:07] <daveake> Also I think it's me doing the Pi workshop, but whatever :)
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[08:07] <ibanezmatt13> Just looked at the webpage, looks really good.
[08:08] <daveake> However, important things first ... has anyone found a good pub?
[08:08] <UpuWork> there is one quite close
[08:08] <UpuWork> getting details
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[08:19] <fsphil> http://www.nasa.gov/mission_pages/juno/main/index.html -- juno's sneaking up on the earth
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[08:21] <ibanezmatt13> looks interesting
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[08:23] <m3eav> is there anything going up today?
[08:24] <m3eav> i take that as a no then...
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[08:25] <cardre> Given the RasPi can act as an FM transmitter between 1-150MHz, is there any interest in using it directly (ie. no NTX2) to do FSK and if so, what would be a legal unlicensed freq to use in that range?
[08:26] <cardre> I am inclined to give it a go and have seen some talk, but haven't seen anyone do it yet.
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[08:35] <gonzo_> there are some HF allocations that you can use licence exempt and airborne. 27MHz has one I think
[08:36] <gonzo_> you have to then interface the ttl output to an antenna
[08:36] <cardre> what freq spread at 27Mhz?
[08:37] <gonzo_> have a look through:
[08:37] <gonzo_> http://stakeholders.ofcom.org.uk/binaries/consultations/wtexemption/summary/exemption.pdf
[08:37] <cardre> Yes, I realise that. GPIO4 needs initially a wire as a basic transmitter, but most likely would need some coax and either the 'hand made' antenna, or an sma adapter
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[08:38] <fsphil> fitlers
[08:39] <fsphil> filters even
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[08:39] <fsphil> you'll need a proper band pass filter or you'll be transmitting all sorts of harmonics
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[08:40] <gonzo_> low pass filtering and also some impeadence matching, to couple the gpio to an antenna
[08:41] <cardre> i guess the question then is, is it cheap/simple enough to make something to do the filter and antenna that is worth doing rather than just buy an NTX2?
[08:41] <gonzo_> alsi need to think about the power levels. to keep within the licence exempt limits
[08:41] <gonzo_> cheap and simple, yes. But some understanding and development is req
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[08:42] <gonzo_> (simple to impliment, not simple to design)
[08:42] <cardre> I'm no RF expert, but would a voltage divider driving a filter going to an antenna be a simple enough way to control RF power?
[08:43] <cardre> the filter also needs to be specific to the targetted tx freq range, so I guess if that's a known quantity, come up with a standard set of passive components necessary to make a suitable filter
[08:43] <cardre> is this worth the effort?
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[08:46] <fsphil> probably not
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[08:54] <cardre> i guess if there's no demand for using a RasPi this way, then as you say, prob not worth the effort
[08:55] <cardre> A band pass filter can be as simple as 2 RC passives and coouple of calculations, but measuring the output power is something I currently don't have the equipment to do the measuring
[08:56] <cardre> The software side I'm pretty comfortable with doing the FSK using other FM transmitter code, but the filter and tx power is where I wouldn't know if I'm stepping outside of legal limits
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[09:01] <gonzo_> ar rf frequencies the filter would be LC rather than RC
[09:01] <gonzo_> at
[09:02] <cardre> ah ok
[09:02] <gonzo_> there should be online calculators available
[09:02] <gonzo_> The matching needs a little more thought
[09:02] <Phil_M0DNY> If it'll do 27MHz then there's an ISM band there. I would suggest finding someone with RF metering/spectrum kit to check it before you fly it though.
[09:02] <cardre> looking at some now, but was on RC,not LC
[09:04] <gonzo_> for a 5V ttl o/p, you need some attenuation to get the right power level. So the matching could be resistive, which simplifies things a lot
[09:05] <cardre> that's what I was thinking as 5V is too powerful
[09:05] <gonzo_> attenuate to about 80mV, so that the o/p Z of the atten is about 75R. Then use a 75R LPF
[09:06] <cardre> hence even an initial voltage divider
[09:06] <gonzo_> straight TTL would be >300mW, though that assumes no Z at the port pin
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[09:19] <cardre> if I did the software, would someone be interested in working on the appropraite h/w filter?
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[09:21] <domlin> hallo all
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[09:23] <Babs_> Suddenly my obsession with orientating a camera under a balloon to capture a specific point on Earth looks a bit ordinary http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/science-environment-22963237
[09:23] <Babs_> Although mine is aiming to do it autonomously rather than being orientated by human beings on Earth.
[09:23] <Babs_> In your face NASA
[09:24] <daveake> lol
[09:25] <Babs_> I do love that pale blue dot photo though. I read that NASA actually had a big debate as to whether the brightness of the sun would knacker the voyager's camera before deciding to swing the camera around to photo the planets.
[09:25] <SpeedEvil> Quite
[09:27] <Babs_> In the grand scheme of things, its a more spectacular way of potentially voiding your cameras warranty than installing CHDK
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[09:29] <fsphil> I wonder why they worried about the camera .. what else was it going to image?
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[09:31] <Babs_> If it was the wrong way around when it was flying out of the solar system and hit an alien they would have presumably regarded it as a missed oppotunity?
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[09:54] <eroomde> Babs_: i'm looking forward to seeing that
[09:55] <Babs_> the alien, the picture or my comedy efforts on making a stabilised camera jig?
[09:56] <eroomde> blue dot 2
[09:56] <Babs_> agreed. blue dot 1 was mega.
[09:57] <eroomde> you should do a show and tell at the conference
[09:57] <eroomde> on babshab
[09:57] <eroomde> and babshab pointy edition
[09:57] <daveake> yes definitely
[09:57] <eroomde> it's the prettiest payload i've seen for donkies
[09:58] <eroomde> maybe the prettiest without qualification
[09:58] <daveake> And it's rare to see a payload intended for donkeys
[09:59] <Babs_> it is slightly less pretty now it ate soil at 8m/s
[09:59] <Babs_> but I could definitely do it if there is interest
[09:59] <eroomde> there is from me
[09:59] <Babs_> I would be reticent about doing babshab pointy edition until I can code above a 3 - year old level
[10:00] <eroomde> you're just encoding maths
[10:00] <eroomde> you can do maths
[10:00] <eroomde> tis fine
[10:00] <eroomde> i won;t ask any questions, if you like
[10:01] <Babs_> I could always bring it in fully assembled (which is the best way of explaining it), and then take the constituent bits apart (it was designed that way) and pass around the components
[10:01] <Babs_> (BABSHAB fully assembled)
[10:01] <UpuWork> bringing that rig to the conference Babs_ ?
[10:01] <Babs_> with a little bit of a slideshow thang to accompany it
[10:01] <Babs_> UpuWork - if everyone is interested it would be easy to do
[10:02] <UpuWork> If its not too much hassle dragging it across London
[10:02] <UpuWork> oh tickets on sale pls buy thx :)
[10:02] <Babs_> I have to move house with it beforehand anyway UpuWork, so it will be all packed up
[10:03] <UpuWork> ok
[10:04] <Babs_> I could also see about bringing cakes for everyone from the factory
[10:04] <costyn> Babs_: everybody loves cake
[10:04] <UpuWork> Cake is good
[10:04] <Babs_> everyone likes cakes
[10:04] <daveake> Quick, those tix will sell soon now
[10:04] <Babs_> costyn - hah! similar thoughts
[10:05] <eroomde> yes please bring cake
[10:05] Action: UpuWork goes and edits Wiki "ticket price includes cakes"
[10:05] <costyn> plural
[10:05] <costyn> Babs_: so you work at a cake factory!?
[10:07] <UpuWork> ping Phil_M0DNY
[10:07] <Phil_M0DNY> UpuWork: pong
[10:08] <UpuWork> hey Phil do you want a 868Mhz HABAmp ?
[10:11] <Babs_> costyn - not exactly. I sit on the board of a cake company, but only in a non-exec role
[10:11] <Babs_> although I do have extensive cake eating experience
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[10:13] <UpuWork> lol
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[10:16] <fsphil> the best kind of experience
[10:16] <gonzo_> a few calculations from the previous thread.... Looks like an 430R and a 91R to deck would make an atten to give 10mW out at 75R, from a TTL drive,
[10:17] <griffonbot> Received email: Steve Aerospace "Re: [UKHAS] Launch Announcement - XABEN-50 Sunday 15/06/13"
[10:17] <gonzo_> (I won't remember, so it's in the irc history now)
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[10:18] <Babs_> I'm booked in and will do a show and tell and slides on BABSHAB - don't know whether I need to tell anyone specifically or whether the fact that UpuWork, eroomde and daveake are on here is enough?
[10:19] <UpuWork> Welcome to do a workshop/presentation in the afternoon thanks
[10:21] <Babs_> excellent. will prep for that. thanks Anthony
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[10:33] <cardre> gonzo_: thanks for the calc, what about caps, or are you just talking about bringing the power down, no filter?
[10:33] <gonzo_> look for an online calculator
[10:34] <gonzo_> give it freq and the 75R impeadence and see what it gives you
[10:34] <cardre> already found one, but are we talking just RC now, or still using LC circuit as well?
[10:34] <gonzo_> lc for the filter
[10:34] <cardre> ok
[10:35] <Laurenceb> http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_embedded&v=ZKoPdrbuPIw
[10:37] <cuddykid> another good 32Gb MicroSD deal for those cameras - http://www.hotukdeals.com/deals/samsung-32gb-micro-sdhc-plus-uhs-memory-card-15-07-del-gizzmoheaven-poss-5-quidco-1583373
[10:38] <SpeedEvil> I keep thining 'I must buy 2 at that price - they can't be that cheap for long'
[10:38] <SpeedEvil> - never a good idea WRT storage.
[10:38] <SpeedEvil> Laurenceb: Boring
[10:41] <SpeedEvil> Fun though. Not technically highaltitude. Unless it goes _horribly_ wrong on the guidance.
[10:44] <costyn> Laurenceb: good lord... is that a south african accent? I can't place it
[10:45] <costyn> no wait... it's Scottish innit?
[10:47] <Laurenceb> yes
[10:47] <Laurenceb> scottish
[10:49] <griffonbot> Received email: Neil Toombes "Re: [UKHAS] Launch Announcement - XABEN-50 Sunday 15/06/13"
[10:50] <griffonbot> Received email: Anthony Stirk "Re: [UKHAS] Launch Announcement - XABEN-50 Sunday 15/06/13"
[10:52] <griffonbot> Received email: David Akerman "Re: [UKHAS] Launch Announcement - XABEN-50 Sunday 15/06/13"
[11:12] <cardre> gonzo_: having problems working out a 'loaded Q' value for the bandpass. Using http://www.raltron.com/cust/tools/band_pass_filters.asp: RL 75, Freq 27.045, Loaded Q = 27.045MHz / 10KHz??
[11:13] <cardre> Computed values are obviously wrong with Loaded Q values I'm using
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[11:30] <gonzo_> a band pass a few mhz wide is nore like what you want
[11:31] <gonzo_> or a low pass, starting to roll off at 30MHz?
[11:31] <cardre> yeah, more reading is showing me that. I've tried a LQ of 27045/200 = 135 and seems more reasonable
[11:32] <gonzo_> you would never get 10khz with LC. That would need crystal finters for that sort an bandwidth
[11:32] <cardre> well at least the values are starting to get closer
[11:33] <cardre> with the noise and harmonics coming off a raspi ttl pin, what would be the widest bandpass I could get away with and not tromp on too many other things?
[11:33] <gonzo_> lyou bonly really need a low pas, to stop the harmonics getting out
[11:33] <cardre> ok, well that simplifies things and reduces half the circuit basically
[11:34] <gonzo_> yep. possinly a simple Pi or T filter may do
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[11:34] <gonzo_> as we are taliing about such low powers anyway
[11:34] <gonzo_> talking
[11:35] Action: cardre is looking up Pi filter for use on a RasPi :)
[11:36] <Ugi> Hi guys - quick question about the NTX2 if you have a mo'
[11:36] <Ugi> Are they very easy to fry?
[11:36] <fsphil> a match made on heaven
[11:36] <fsphil> in(
[11:36] <fsphil> aarg
[11:37] <Ugi> Mine seems to be very unstable
[11:37] <fsphil> unstable how?
[11:37] <Ugi> The pitch keeps changing
[11:37] <fsphil> some drift is perfectly normal
[11:37] <Ugi> not like this
[11:37] <daveake> When? e.g is it when the sun shines on it, or when wind goes past it?
[11:37] <Ugi> you can hear the pitch bending on the receiver
[11:38] <fsphil> yep
[11:38] <gonzo_> or the soldering iron goes near
[11:38] <Ugi> and it's untouched on my desk
[11:38] <daveake> Because these things make good wind detectors!
[11:38] <Ugi> but it's Whoop Whhoping off the scale
[11:38] <daveake> Wrapp it up in bubble wrap see if the problem goes away
[11:38] <daveake> If not then it's electrical
[11:38] <fsphil> it's either temperature, or power
[11:39] <Ugi> I've tried all the electrical things I can think of
[11:39] <daveake> And power to the processor / bas resistors, rather than to the NTX2
[11:39] <daveake> bias
[11:39] <gonzo_> be sure you are listening to your ntx2, not the power monitor next door
[11:39] <Ugi> unstable at a singel frequency with the processor taken out
[11:39] <fsphil> can you make a recording
[11:40] <Ugi> well, to give you some idea, the trace on the waterfall is often at 45'
[11:41] <Ugi> then also jumps
[11:41] <Ugi> when it's stable for a mo' however, I get data so it's not just noise
[11:42] <fsphil> on breadboard?
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[11:44] <Ugi> no, soldered onto a PCB
[11:44] <fsphil> could it be the receiver?
[11:45] <Ugi> Good point, it could.
[11:47] <Ugi> Is there a stable signal somewhere that I can test the receiver against?
[11:50] <Ugi> Sounds like this: http://www.ugilabs.co.uk/Scrap/NTX2.wma
[11:50] <cardre> using http://www.calculatoredge.com/electronics/bw%20pi%20low%20pass.htm and 3 components (for Pi filter) Cutoff freq of 27.4, Z of 75 (& 3 components for Pi filter) seems to return sensible values
[11:51] <cardre> does this seem ok to you?
[11:51] <gonzo_> I have a feeling that the cutoff freq is at some specific attenuation. so you want that freq higher than your working freq
[11:51] <gonzo_> say 30-32MHz ish
[11:52] <x-f> Ugi, that sounds very weird
[11:52] <Ugi> Yeh. It's not great for sending data!
[11:52] <gonzo_> Igi, you have made a theramin!
[11:53] <cardre> ok, I'll try some values around that freq
[11:53] <Ugi> I have! Shame that was not my intention.
[11:53] <fsphil> haha
[11:54] <Ugi> I wonder whether it's the old second-hand receiver off ebay
[11:54] <fsphil> and that's with nothing connected to the TXD line, and a stable psu?
[11:54] <Ugi> On 2 x AA batteries at 3.2v no processor in the socket
[11:54] <fsphil> that should be enough
[11:55] <fsphil> I'd turn it off, and try to find another signal
[11:55] <fsphil> there should be some signals being radiated by other devices, ethernet cables and the like
[11:55] <fsphil> if they sound steady then it might be the ntx2
[11:56] <Ugi> The NTX2 doesn't have an antenna, just to be clear, but from a few meters that didn't seem like an isse.
[11:59] <fsphil> I've run it many times without one
[12:00] <Ugi> I think it may be the receiver.
[12:00] <fsphil> are other signals doing the same thing?
[12:00] <Ugi> It's much less obvious with the weaker noise signals but it sounds a bit similar
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[12:00] <fsphil> ah ha
[12:01] <fsphil> what kind of receiver is it?
[12:01] <Ugi> An old FT-790R
[12:01] <Ugi> it was working OK a week or so ago.
[12:01] <fsphil> batteries in it ok?
[12:01] <Phil_M0DNY> I've had similar issues with an FT-790r
[12:02] <Ugi> According to the meter they are
[12:02] <Phil_M0DNY> I think Dave has as well.
[12:02] <Ugi> I don't have any spares just now.
[12:02] <Ugi> Can they be serviced are is that not an economical proposition?
[12:02] <Ugi> _or_ is that
[12:02] <Phil_M0DNY> People I've talked to reckon a dead capacitor somewhere causing the VFO to wobble a lot.
[12:03] <Ugi> dead capacitor seems not unlikely at that age
[12:05] <Phil_M0DNY> I took a quick poke around with a schematic but with nowt more than a multimeter at the time I didn't get anywhere.
[12:05] <Ugi> I'll get some new batteries and if that doesn't fix it then I'll have a poke about.
[12:05] <Ugi> I have a cap' meter but it's not usually much help without unsoldering them first
[12:06] <Phil_M0DNY> I left mine on 14V supply for 2 days and it seemed to stabilise (adding to the dying capacitor theory), but returned as soon as I re-powered it.
[12:06] <mfa298> if you're unsoldering cap's to test them it's probably easier to just put new ones in (at least for the electrolytics)
[12:07] <Ugi> Exactly.
[12:07] <Phil_M0DNY> I have no idea what type of capacitor it could be, it's hard to find someone with that much in-depth knowledge of hardware rf nowadays, even at a university.
[12:08] <Darkside> especially at a university
[12:08] <Darkside> >_>
[12:08] <Darkside> (going from experience)
[12:08] <Ugi> I don't think ceramic caps go terribly easily
[12:08] <Darkside> some types are temperature sensitive
[12:09] <Phil_M0DNY> It's probably an electrolytic.
[12:09] <mfa298> electrolytic would be the best first guess
[12:09] <Phil_M0DNY> I've since acquired a scope, so might look further into it later this summer.
[12:10] <Laurenceb> photo of board?
[12:10] <Ugi> It's all so jammed in there that I'd need to take it all apart to even photo it.
[12:11] <Ugi> Will do sometime but don't have time just now.
[12:11] <daveake> Phil_M0DNY> I think Dave has as well
[12:11] <daveake> Sure have
[12:11] <daveake> Worked for a while then drift-o-rama
[12:11] <Ugi> Did you work it out?
[12:12] <Ugi> as in fix it
[12:12] <daveake> No gave it to someone more able to fix it. However it's still broke
[12:13] <Ugi> Damn!
[12:13] <griffonbot> Received email: David Bowkis "Re: [UKHAS] Launch Announcement - XABEN-50 Sunday 15/06/13"
[12:13] <griffonbot> Received email: F5APQ "Re: [UKHAS] Launch Announcement - XABEN-50 Sunday 15/06/13"
[12:13] <Ugi> That work out at about £20 per line received so far then.
[12:13] <Ugi> Not a great rate
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[12:14] <Phil_M0DNY> If I do work out how to fix mine, it should be easy to fix others.
[12:15] <Ugi> Agreed - I'm probably up to the task of actually fixing it. It's finding the issue which will be the killer.
[12:15] <Phil_M0DNY> And I do have access to some fancy kit, just need to find some time to sit down and work it out.
[12:15] <Phil_M0DNY> Yep..
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[12:16] <mfa298> might be worth looking for any groups/forums for the radio. Might help you see if there's a common failure
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[12:16] <ibanezmatt13> Afternoon :)
[12:16] <Ugi> Has anyone tried googling relevant keywords?
[12:17] <ibanezmatt13> I'm trying to solder a piece of one strand wire onto a battery pack but it isn't working
[12:17] <Phil_M0DNY> I did have a google around, couldn't find anything. You should give it a try though.
[12:17] <Phil_M0DNY> Let me know if you do find anything!
[12:18] <fsphil> lots of flux ibanezmatt13
[12:18] <fsphil> and sand the top and bottom of the battery, make it a bit rough
[12:18] <ibanezmatt13> I've got lots of flux though, and no matter how much I apply, the wire keeps falling off.
[12:18] <fsphil> you need to apply a bit more heat then
[12:19] <fsphil> but be quick
[12:19] <fsphil> use a big tip
[12:19] <daveake> scratch the surface; use plenty of flux; use your largest soldering iron/bit and turn it right up
[12:19] <mfa298> Ugi: only looked at a few posts in the thread but there looks to be some promising stuff: http://groups.yahoo.com/group/electrichandbag/message/569
[12:19] <daveake> with that lot you should be able to solder it very quickly
[12:19] <ibanezmatt13> Ok, I'll try more flux and scratching the surface. How should I sand the battery terminal?
[12:20] <mfa298> Yahoo groups seem to be popular for radio stuff
[12:20] <ibanezmatt13> well the battery pack terminal
[12:20] <daveake> I use the nearest wire cutters or screwdriver
[12:20] <ibanezmatt13> alright, thanks. I'll be back shortly :)
[12:20] <daveake> Oh soldering to the battery holder?
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[12:20] <daveake> take care the plastic melts easily
[12:20] <daveake> toooo late
[12:20] <fsphil> hmm.. pattery pack
[12:20] <Darkside> lol
[12:20] <fsphil> er
[12:21] <fsphil> battery pack .. could be either
[12:21] <daveake> yup
[12:21] <daveake> I have soldered to a holder but that is tricky
[12:21] <daveake> And holders aren't that reliable when the payload hits the ground anyway
[12:22] <fsphil> yea not worth the bother
[12:22] <fsphil> though I've been lucky and not had a problem when I did use them
[12:22] <fsphil> but I made sure they where well packed
[12:22] <daveake> PIE4 rebooted on landing because the batteries moved in the holder
[12:23] <daveake> They were taped down with gaffer tape, but not well enough obviosuly
[12:23] <daveake> Shame as the software didn't know it had landed, so didn't do the ftp image upload
[12:25] <x-f> at least we saw live video from it again
[12:25] <daveake> yup - that was programmed for launch and landing :)
[12:26] <daveake> that was ace. First we knew in the chase car was that the position had updated via 3G. Then the video srtarted
[12:26] <GW8RAK> cardre - looking throught his morning's conversations, if you want to use the RPi as the transmitter, it would need to conform to the standards in the Ofcom document IR2030, if I'm reading it correctly.
[12:27] <Ugi> mfa298: Thanks - that does look useful.
[12:28] <mfa298> it's probably worth a read through of the group - they can be a good source of info. I tend to watch the similar groups for the radios I've got
[12:33] <griffonbot> Received email: Steve Aerospace "Re: [UKHAS] Launch Announcement - XABEN-50 Sunday 15/06/13"
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[12:39] <Phil_M0DNY> Lots of people using the pi for ssdv, I'm surprised more aren't using it with a 3G dongl.e
[12:50] <Ugi> Well, this is a setback for me 'cos I can't easily test anything.
[12:50] <Ugi> Anyone got any tips on cheap but effective SDR?
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[12:51] <cardre> GW8RAK: yeah thanks, I've been going through the doc and have some preliminary calcs with gonzo_ help to keep it at 10mW for a 27Mhz ISM band
[12:51] <Ugi> Do you need a powerful PC to run SDR too?
[12:51] <mfa298> the rtl devices are cheap and certainly good enough for testing.
[12:51] <mfa298> some seem to be better than others for tracking
[12:53] <Ugi> What is RTL? Is that a make or a technology? (or other?)
[12:54] <mfa298> the tv tuner dongles
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[12:54] <fsphil> realtek
[12:55] <fsphil> they make chips, which a lot of DVB USB sticks have
[12:55] <fsphil> and someone figured out how to read data from them directly
[12:55] <mfa298> I've just ordered one of these http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/190855889353 so can let you know what it's like when it's delivered
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[12:56] <costyn> heh.. getting a lot of very low range/distance predictions on my hourly predictor. 1 - 8km :)
[12:56] <fsphil> do it!
[12:56] <mfa298> If you're pockets are a bit deeper go for the funcube Pro+ (but that's around £150 with VAT and Delivery)
[12:56] <fsphil> I missed an opportunity to launch one like that
[12:56] <costyn> mfa298: ah yea have that one at home here
[12:57] <costyn> mfa298: haven't really played with it
[12:57] <costyn> build quality is good though
[12:58] <mfa298> I tried doing the adsb thing and found my original E4000 based on cuts out a few MHz below the required frequency
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[12:58] <Ugi> Ah. I see - it's a chipset. I'll get one of those - and a HABamp?
[12:59] <fsphil> a habamp would definitely help for tracking a flight
[12:59] <fsphil> not really needed for local testing
[12:59] <UpuWork> ping Phil_M0DNY
[13:00] <Ugi> Cool - then I'll get one for launch-time so I can track locally on the move.
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[14:31] <ibanezmatt13> http://sdrv.ms/19RkBgt
[14:31] <ibanezmatt13> It's finished! Apart from the box and the coax cable
[14:31] <ibanezmatt13> I've even added a LED so I can see the flickering of the serial port
[14:32] <ibanezmatt13> The Pi is being powered off the batteries too. Now completely portable. :)
[14:32] <mfa298> ibanezmatt13: not bad
[14:32] <ibanezmatt13> The SMA connector unfortunately has to go in a bit of a dodgy place due to poor prior design, but still :)
[14:33] <ibanezmatt13> Thanks mfa298 :)
[14:33] <mfa298> now you have to fly it and then work on rev2 (maybe see if you can get the board smaller and have things like the regs on the board.
[14:34] <ibanezmatt13> That's what I will certainly do. I just thought for a first flight, getting it up there is the main thing. I can't wait to start a second, much better designed one as you say with regulators and stuff on the board.
[14:34] <ibanezmatt13> By the way, the bash scripts are working perfectly too from startup :)
[14:35] <Brace> ibanezmatt13: what did you do with the bash scripts in the end?
[14:35] <cm13g09> afternoon mfa298
[14:36] <mfa298> with rev2 there's probably a whole load of extra interesting things you could do with the code. But having something that works and that you understand is more important that having clever scripts that you don't understand.
[14:36] <mfa298> afternoon cm13g09
[14:36] <ibanezmatt13> I have two bash scripts: One for starting the tracker program and looping in case it failed, another for taking a 5 minute video every second. The bash scripts are executed from the rc.local
[14:36] <Brace> cool
[14:37] <gonzo_> a 5min video every second!
[14:37] <ibanezmatt13> mfa298: definitely. rev to will have two trackers, one for SSDV. It will have temp sensors too. Where gonna send one up in a foam box, the other in a cardboard box (apparently very high quality).
[14:37] <ibanezmatt13> You know what I mean :)
[14:37] <gonzo_> hehe
[14:37] <ibanezmatt13> record five minutes, wait a second, record another 5
[14:38] <ibanezmatt13> I think the frame rate in that video would be a little slow :p
[14:38] <ibanezmatt13> I must say as well, when the Pi Cam is outdoors, the 1080p video quality is pretty stunning for what it is.
[14:38] <ibanezmatt13> ping daveake
[14:39] <daveake> pong
[14:39] <ibanezmatt13> Hi daveake
[14:39] <daveake> hi
[14:39] <ibanezmatt13> I've got the Pi Model A running off batteries
[14:39] <daveake> good :)
[14:39] <ibanezmatt13> Just wondering, what is the decent voltage I should give it? Currently 5v
[14:40] <ibanezmatt13> It's powering a pi cam too
[14:40] <daveake> 5V to the 5V line :p
[14:41] <ibanezmatt13> Oh of course. I was thinking I could go lower than that but yeah. Thanks
[14:41] <daveake> Not without replacing the regulator on the Pi, no
[14:42] <ibanezmatt13> What type of coax do I need for the aerial again?
[14:42] <ibanezmatt13> RG74 or something like that?
[14:43] <daveake> doesn't matter so long as it's coax and 50 ohms - it's very short
[14:43] <daveake> I use RG174
[14:43] <ibanezmatt13> Oh right, thanks :)
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[14:43] <ibanezmatt13> And, when I disengage my Pi, would it cause any hardware issues if I just took a battery out of the pack? Surely I don't have to do a sudo halt
[14:44] <daveake> I've not had any trouble, but back up the SD to be sure
[14:45] <ibanezmatt13> Ok thanks. I'm off to do some more testing now. Have a good afternoon :)
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[15:04] <UpuWork> oh wow
[15:04] <UpuWork> KT5TK excellent :)
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[15:20] <WILLdude> UpuWork: Can't go to the conference.
[15:20] <UpuWork> ah thats a shame Will
[15:21] <UpuWork> We will try broadcast it live via the stream
[15:23] <WILLdude> Well, I could, if I had anyone who gave a shi* about it in my family.
[15:23] <WILLdude> Apparently, it's an adult event and not geared up for children.
[15:23] <WILLdude> It's not the same on a TV screen though.
[15:23] <fsphil> there was a baby at the last one :)
[15:23] <UpuWork> no its not
[15:23] <UpuWork> lol yeah
[15:23] <UpuWork> its for anyone with an interest
[15:24] <UpuWork> * just don't bring a baby k thx
[15:25] <WILLdude> Awh who's baby>
[15:25] <eroomde> there was a noisy baby last year
[15:25] <eroomde> or toddler at least
[15:26] <daveake> It was a tracker in disguise. It didn't know where it was and therefore transmitted a lot of noise.
[15:26] <fsphil> bad power supply?
[15:26] <daveake> Certainly needed capping
[15:27] <WILLdude> heh
[15:27] <eroomde> <reflow joke>
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[15:28] <WILLdude> I'm damned upset I can't go,
[15:28] <WILLdude> I wish other people gave a shi*
[15:30] <eroomde> get a five year calendar and cross off the days until you can get a driving license
[15:32] <WILLdude> I don't want to drive.
[15:33] <Laurenceb> use a train
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[15:33] <Laurenceb> if you are rich
[15:33] <eroomde> you can public transport before you can drive anyway
[15:33] <eroomde> win-win
[15:33] <Laurenceb> ill be under the bridge
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[15:38] <Brace> WILLdude: so you want to be lazy and get someone else to take you?
[15:38] <WILLdude> If possible.
[15:38] <Brace> get on a bus or train, it's what I did when I was your kind of age
[15:38] <WILLdude> But I can't go on my own.
[15:38] <Brace> how old are you again?
[15:38] <WILLdude> 12
[15:38] <Brace> ahhh
[15:39] <daveake> I used to go round London all the time at that age
[15:39] <Brace> well in that case that's what it's like to be 12 :)
[15:39] <Brace> it'll pass
[15:39] <Brace> and you'll find the fun world of being an adult
[15:39] <Brace> which involves lots of boring shit before you get to do what you want...
[15:40] <daveake> Then you marry and that stops too :p
[15:40] <Brace> daveake: married for 5 years
[15:40] <Brace> no kids so I've got a bit of freedom
[15:40] <daveake> yeah ditto actually
[15:40] <daveake> well s/5/27/ but otherwise :)
[15:40] <Brace> lol
[15:41] <UpuWork> yeah no coming without a responsible adult sorry WILLdude
[15:41] <UpuWork> but its meant for anyone
[15:41] <Brace> 27 years, I can't imagine what that'll be like
[15:41] <daveake> they fly by after the first 25
[15:41] <Brace> UpuWork: technically, he can't come till he's 18+ with out a responsible adult
[15:42] <Brace> so even if he could drive at 17, he's stuffed
[15:42] Action: Brace spends a bit of time on committees worring about minors in dangerous situations
[15:43] <HixWork> climbers?
[15:43] <Brace> yeah
[15:43] <HixWork> they bounce better than >35's
[15:43] <WILLdude> UpuWork: I understand.
[15:43] <WILLdude> Argh
[15:43] <HixWork> not so good for belay though :)
[15:43] <Brace> we have a standing rule in our club, no u18s unless accompanied by their parents
[15:43] <HixWork> WILLdude, the stream is pretty good, I couldn't go last year
[15:43] <HixWork> and it sufficed
[15:44] <UpuWork> Coming this year hix ?
[15:44] <WILLdude> I don't think there's any point continuing with my interest in HAB.
[15:44] <HixWork> yarp
[15:44] <UpuWork> on don't be darf WILLdude
[15:44] <Brace> as we had issues with parents trying to use club meets as a creche, dropping their 16/17 yr olds off
[15:44] <Brace> ahhh
[15:44] <Brace> the melodrama of a 12 year old
[15:44] <Brace> so glad I was barely on the interwebs when I was that age
[15:45] <HixWork> Tickets not going to be gone by Tues are they UpuWork?
[15:45] <UpuWork> nah
[15:45] <HixWork> Just had another hefty car parts payment go out :/
[15:45] <daveake> https://fbcdn-sphotos-e-a.akamaihd.net/hphotos-ak-ash3/1010578_684363594926430_1747462678_n.jpg
[15:45] <Brace> WILLdude: honestly tho, keep it up, it'll be worth it in the end :D
[15:45] <Brace> by it I mean the interest in science and electronics
[15:46] <UpuWork> Yeah I just had to get a new intake manifold runner @ £580
[15:46] <HixWork> WILLdude, you need to get a teacher at school on your side, so they can do it as part of a school activity
[15:46] <Brace> HixWork: that's an excellent idea
[15:46] <Brace> I bet there's a physics teacher who'd be keen
[15:46] <HixWork> I have 1 per millenium
[15:46] <KT5TK> Conference ticket booked. Europe tour scheduled.
[15:47] <daveake> burnt out now then?
[15:47] <WILLdude> Brace: Nope.
[15:47] <UpuWork> thats great KT5TK that you can come
[15:47] <KT5TK> Are there any launches planned in the week before the conference?
[15:47] <UpuWork> Wouldn't be a bad idea actually
[15:48] <daveake> We can't predict launches 3 days away let alone 3 months :)
[15:48] <UpuWork> :)
[15:49] <UpuWork> welcome to bring along your trackers and do a workshop/presentation if you want Thomas
[15:49] <fsphil> I totally want to do a launch when I'm over
[15:50] <UpuWork> we have quite a bit of time in the afternoon
[15:50] <KT5TK> It looks like the conference schedule is full already.
[15:50] <KT5TK> But I can prepare a few slides
[15:50] <KT5TK> maybe 10-15 mins if you want
[15:52] <KT5TK> PecanPico3 sounds like RTTY already on 70cms, but I have some timer issues
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[15:53] <UpuWork> I need to sort the schedule out
[15:53] <UpuWork> generally after lunch its a free for all
[15:53] <UpuWork> worked well last year
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[15:53] <fsphil> more space for people to setup demos this time, which is nice
[15:55] <UpuWork> yeah loads of time
[15:55] <UpuWork> space even
[15:55] <UpuWork> time and space technically
[15:55] <HixWork> there's a really good Nepalese restaurant in Greenwich too :)
[15:55] <HixWork> spacetime
[15:55] <HixWork> I suppose I need to launch before the conf
[15:56] <HixWork> set myself a deadline
[15:57] <HixWork> UpuWork, whats a manifold "runner"?
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[15:58] <Brace> I'm on holiday for the conference, pity, looks like fun
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[16:11] <BenBancroft> How would a ublox max-6 behave if not supplied with enough current?
[16:12] <Phil_M0DNY> Once the supply voltage drops out of it's range, not well, I doubt it would get a lock, may not even commmunicate correctly. Why?
[16:13] <BenBancroft> mine is communicating, but Im getting no lock
[16:13] <BenBancroft> which is why power is my suspicion
[16:13] <Phil_M0DNY> WHat are you powering it from?
[16:14] <BenBancroft> at the moment a microusb mains adapter, plugged into a Raspberry Pi
[16:14] <BenBancroft> but I have a battery setup to test
[16:14] <Phil_M0DNY> Ok.. what voltage are you giving the max-6?
[16:14] <BenBancroft> its on the 3.3v rail
[16:14] <Phil_M0DNY> phew..
[16:15] <BenBancroft> ;)
[16:15] <Phil_M0DNY> Should be fine current-wise. What antenna are you using?
[16:15] <BenBancroft> I went for the one without level converter
[16:15] <Phil_M0DNY> With the black stub antenna?
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[16:15] <BenBancroft> Sarantel Antenna
[16:16] <BenBancroft> from Hab suppliers
[16:16] <Phil_M0DNY> Ok that's a good antenna, have you tried leaving it on the windowsill.
[16:16] <Phil_M0DNY> ?
[16:16] <BenBancroft> its on my windowsill atm
[16:16] <Phil_M0DNY> How long have you left it?
[16:16] <BenBancroft> an hour or so
[16:17] <SpeedEvil> 12.5 minutes should be about the absolute max
[16:17] <Phil_M0DNY> yeah
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[16:17] <SpeedEvil> Unless you've got local interederence
[16:17] <BenBancroft> $GPVTG,,,,,,,,,N*30
[16:17] <BenBancroft> $GPGGA,161016.00,,,,,0,00,99.99,,,,,,*6
[16:17] <BenBancroft> thats what my program is returning
[16:17] <Phil_M0DNY> With the sarantel module on my pi it was about 30 seconds, 1 minute max.
[16:18] <BenBancroft> my phone can get gps on my window quite happily
[16:18] <Phil_M0DNY> Have you tried disconnecting and reconnecting the GPS?
[16:18] <BenBancroft> from the pi?
[16:18] <Phil_M0DNY> From the 3.3V, to reboot it.
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[16:18] <BenBancroft> wouldn't a reboot work?
[16:19] <Phil_M0DNY> You don't need to reboot the pi, just the GPS.
[16:19] <Phil_M0DNY> Or have you soldered it on?
[16:19] <BenBancroft> soldered
[16:19] <Phil_M0DNY> ;)
[16:19] <BenBancroft> onto a piece of veroboard atm
[16:20] <Phil_M0DNY> Shutdown the Pi, remove the power adaptor for 10s, plug it back in and boot it back up then.
[16:20] <BenBancroft> ok will try that now
[16:20] <SpeedEvil> Phil_M0DNY: you missed 'blow into the plug'
[16:20] <Phil_M0DNY> SpeedEvil: lol
[16:21] <Phil_M0DNY> "Take the power adaptor out of the room to fully discharge the circuit, then bring it back in."
[16:21] <BenBancroft> ok should reboot in a second
[16:22] <Phil_M0DNY> I've been given that one by tech support before..
[16:22] <BenBancroft> still same response
[16:22] <Phil_M0DNY> BenBancroft: Leave it for a few minutes.
[16:23] <Phil_M0DNY> You don't happen to have glare-film on your windows do you? like tinting?
[16:23] <BenBancroft> nope
[16:24] <BenBancroft> single glazed glass
[16:24] <BenBancroft> and window is open
[16:24] <SpeedEvil> Are you overclocking hte pi?
[16:24] <Phil_M0DNY> I've lost 2 hours debugging GPS before to find the lab windows were shielded.
[16:25] <BenBancroft> unless its done it without me knowing
[16:25] <BenBancroft> your check if rpiconifg?
[16:25] <WILLdude> Anyone know of any non-violent ways to make my parents let me go to the UKHAS conference?
[16:26] <Phil_M0DNY> Well next thing to try is probably to get it outside on a garden table somehow, the GPS should have no excuse then. If that doesn't work I'd also suspect the power, as that's the only other thing I can think of.
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[16:27] <Phil_M0DNY> Hi WILLdude, did you find much at the NADARS rally?
[16:27] <BenBancroft> im using ethernet to talk to my pi, so outside not really an option
[16:27] <Phil_M0DNY> BenBancroft: Thought it might not be, what's the distance between your pi and the gps module?
[16:28] <BenBancroft> about 15cm away currently
[16:29] <Phil_M0DNY> I've had success with it far closer than that.. so that shouldn't be an issue. You might want to check back a bit later in the evening and see if any of the regulars on here have any ideas.
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[16:30] <BenBancroft> is it normal for the GPGGA response to not have time in it for a while after I connect for first time?
[16:30] <Phil_M0DNY> Yes.
[16:30] <BenBancroft> ok
[16:30] <Phil_M0DNY> It has to get at least one satellite to get the time.
[16:30] <Phil_M0DNY> THen at least 4 or 5 to get a position.
[16:30] <BenBancroft> ok
[16:30] <BenBancroft> can I get satalite count
[16:30] <Phil_M0DNY> Do you have a USB-RS232 adaptor around by any chance?
[16:30] <BenBancroft> Im guessing its in one of the messages I disabled
[16:31] <SpeedEvil> GPGSV
[16:31] <BenBancroft> no sorry
[16:31] <SpeedEvil> is the 'satellite info' messages
[16:31] <BenBancroft> ok i will enable that
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[16:31] <SpeedEvil> There are satellite counts in GPGLL I think
[16:32] <Phil_M0DNY> Enable all messages, then put what you're getting after a minute or two onto pastebin.
[16:32] <SpeedEvil> GGA
[16:32] <SpeedEvil> http://aprs.gids.nl/nmea/#gga
[16:32] <SpeedEvil> But that too
[16:33] <Phil_M0DNY> The fact that it's getting a time means there isn't something disastrously wrong, it just isn't getting enough satellites for a position fix.
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[16:35] <SpeedEvil> Unless it's had a fix, and stored it somewhere
[16:35] <BenBancroft> my $GPGGA,163316.00,,,,,0,04,39.23,,,,,,*69
[16:35] <BenBancroft> is different to that link
[16:36] <BenBancroft> I seem to have more parameters
[16:36] <SpeedEvil> ,,, in general means it's got no sats
[16:37] <SpeedEvil> The time is off.
[16:37] <SpeedEvil> Unless that's old
[16:37] <BenBancroft> $GPGGA,163316.00,,,,,0,04,39.23,,,,,,*69
[16:37] <BenBancroft> thats a recent one
[16:37] <SpeedEvil> Ah - right
[16:38] <SpeedEvil> nvm
[16:38] <Babs_> oooo. shiny shiny tiny tiny http://www.freeimagehosting.net/1zowr#AcYyE02ERBs2gkBC.03
[16:38] <daveake> Wow. 10p. Nice
[16:38] <BenBancroft> thats new time: 163742.00
[16:38] <SpeedEvil> BenBancroft: no valid fix, yet a HDOP of 39.2
[16:38] <SpeedEvil> That's a _terrible_ HDOP
[16:39] <SpeedEvil> I wonder if you've got massive multipath or something
[16:39] <Babs_> daveake - open your right eye
[16:39] <Babs_> (and tilt your head 90 degrees to be fair)
[16:39] <Phil_M0DNY> BenBancroft: Is it a good view from your window, or are you blocked in by other buildings?
[16:40] <BenBancroft> right in front
[16:40] <BenBancroft> and an open area outside
[16:40] <Babs_> BenBancroft - why not just take it outside. PS I had issues when there was heavy low cloud overhead. Didn't get a fix for an hour even out in the open?.
[16:40] <BenBancroft> i think thats problem
[16:41] <BenBancroft> picked it up and 00 went to 04
[16:41] <BenBancroft> which i guess is satellites
[16:41] <SpeedEvil> It is.
[16:41] <BenBancroft> $GPGGA,164108.00,,,,,0,04,9.97,,,,,,*5F
[16:41] <BenBancroft> and that number went down
[16:41] <Phil_M0DNY> Has anyone else started receiving a lot of emails asking if their hab payloads can be adapted to track 'domestic wildlife'!??
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[16:42] <WILLdude> Oh hi Phil_M0DNY
[16:42] <Phil_M0DNY> That's the second one today...
[16:42] <WILLdude> Borrowed someone's receiver.
[16:42] <Babs_> isn't domestic wildlife a contradiction in terms?
[16:42] <SpeedEvil> Phil_M0DNY: You've not seen the horizon thingy then?
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[16:42] <WILLdude> And bought some copper wire to use as an aerial.
[16:43] <WILLdude> I'm really really disappointed I can't go.
[16:43] <Phil_M0DNY> SpeedEvil: I have... and Babs_ they mean cats, they're just trying not to look obvious.
[16:44] <SpeedEvil> I tried getting a cat from a shelter. They gave me a catraphact instead. I was most dissapointed - he wouldn't eat catfood.
[16:44] <SpeedEvil> Cataphract
[16:44] <Phil_M0DNY> WILLdude: I bought 50m of antenna wire and a couple of flightcases, was quite a good rally I think.
[16:44] <WILLdude> Doesn't work well at all though.
[16:45] <Babs_> its all based on this I would imagine http://www.bbc.co.uk/programmes/b02xcvhw
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[16:45] <BenBancroft> finally got fix: $GPGGA,164504.00,5456.99849,N,00240.42973,W,1,04,7.14,218.0,M,49.2,M,,*44
[16:45] <SpeedEvil> Woo!
[16:45] <BenBancroft> had to dangle it righ out my window
[16:45] <Phil_M0DNY> "Load up the weapons, we have his position!"
[16:45] <BenBancroft> ;p
[16:46] <BenBancroft> forgot about that ;)
[16:46] Nick change: Steffann -> Steffanx
[16:46] <Phil_M0DNY> Don't worry, if you're planning to build a HAB tracker you'll be appearing on spacenearus before long.
[16:47] <SpeedEvil> https://maps.google.co.uk/maps?safe=off&q=%4054.94997N,2.6738W&bav=on.2,or.r_qf.&bvm=bv.47883778,d.ZWU&biw=1440&bih=811&um=1&ie=UTF-8&hl=en&sa=N&tab=wl
[16:48] <BenBancroft> yep thats it
[16:49] <mfa298> WILLdude: have you actually talked to any of your teachers about it at school or are you just assuming they won't be interested ?
[16:49] <WILLdude> The latter.
[16:49] <mfa298> In that case talk to them about it, sell them it as an idea for doing cool science stuff, and show them what other schools have done.
[16:50] <mfa298> Never assume stuff. Chances are you'll be wrong.
[16:50] <Phil_M0DNY> Such as the Apex SGS project.
[16:50] <Phil_M0DNY> http://www.apexhab.org/
[16:50] <BenBancroft> Im doing my HAB as a school project
[16:50] <WILLdude> My school has less money than many hobos.
[16:51] <BenBancroft> we got a grant to pay for ours
[16:51] <Phil_M0DNY> As a school you might be able to get sponsors.
[16:51] <mikestir> the school I'm helping out got a grant oo
[16:51] <mikestir> too*
[16:51] <mfa298> stop being negative, if there are interested people then they'll find a way to do it.
[16:54] <WILLdude> IDK
[16:54] <Phil_M0DNY> I had a teacher pitch the idea of doing a camera hab to my mate and I when we were 16-17, he was really keen on it and we were the only guys studying electronics, I dismissed it as too complicated. Still kicking myself for that, only properly got into it about this time last year (I'm 22).
[16:55] <Phil_M0DNY> (the teacher was really keen on it)
[16:55] <daveake> WILLdude, before I start calling you WONTdude, remember that you lose nothing by asking. Your school may well find the money. If not there are possible sponsors. I'm doing a launch for a local school and the costs are being met by one of the parents (and I'm providing my time/tracker/etc for free). JUST GO AND ASK
[16:55] <WILLdude> Sponsors like?
[16:55] <daveake> Local businesses
[16:56] <WILLdude> Why would they be interested?
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[16:56] <daveake> To be seen helping a school
[16:56] <eroomde> you'd be amazed how little £100 is to a local business if it means they can help a local school
[16:56] <eroomde> do that x3 or x4 and you're sorted
[16:57] <daveake> This particular school (a private one) is using the launch to get sponsorship money to help fund the school's activities. So for them it gets money in, rather than being a spend
[16:57] <WILLdude> Heh
[16:57] Nick change: WILLdude -> WONTdude
[16:57] <mfa298> As daveake just said, you lose nothing by asking. The absolute worst that will happen is they'll say no (so the same as not asking). But if you ask about it (and sell them the idea) there's a decent chance they'll look into the idea and something might happen and you'll have acheived something. Much better than assuming it's impossible (that way nothing will ever happen)
[16:59] <WONTdude> Whatever.
[16:59] <WONTdude> I'll ask them, I guess.
[16:59] <Phil_M0DNY> WONTdude: Be positive about it, that'll help sell it!
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[17:00] <mfa298> Be positive, show your keen and tell them about the other schools doing similar projects.
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[17:02] <mikestir> I've just come back from the school to show the trackers and software to their astronomy club. I used up annual leave from work to do that, so don't underestimate how willing local people/businesses are to help out.
[17:02] <WONTdude> Maybe
[17:02] <Phil_M0DNY> The other schools might be willing to give your teachers a little advice on it if they're unsure.
[17:03] <mfa298> you've even got a couple of local people who've tracked HABs who are on here from time to time who you might be able to get involved
[17:03] <Babs_> WONTdude - in terms of sponsorship do you have Pasta King at your school?
[17:03] <Phil_M0DNY> Yeah, you're near Basingstoke right?
[17:03] <WONTdude> Babs_: No
[17:03] <WONTdude> Phil_M0DNY: Yes
[17:04] <Phil_M0DNY> We have a fledgling Spaceflight Society at Southampton Uni that might be able to help you out.
[17:04] <Phil_M0DNY> But, you need to sell it to the school first :)
[17:04] <WONTdude> Unlikely.
[17:05] <eroomde> WONTdude: how about this:
[17:05] <WONTdude> I'll ask my physics teacher on Monday.
[17:05] <eroomde> no more being mopey on the channel until you ask
[17:05] <eroomde> good
[17:05] <eroomde> do that
[17:05] <WONTdude> But my parent
[17:05] <WONTdude> s
[17:05] <WONTdude> Will still be annoying about it.
[17:05] <eroomde> if the teacher says 'yes but i will need some help' then come straight back to here because we will all help
[17:05] <eroomde> we can do that
[17:06] <WONTdude> They'll say what the fuck go eat lunch
[17:06] <mfa298> WONTdude: if you're negative about it you'll struggle to sell it to them. Be positibe about it. When you talk to people about things they will pick up on your attitude and that will impact how they respond to it.
[17:06] Nick change: WONTdude -> WILLdude
[17:07] <daveake> Exactly. Don't say "I know you won't let me but I got an idea about a balloon ..", say "Hey look I'm really interested in flying a balloon but I can#t do it alone is there a chance this could be a school project?"
[17:07] <mfa298> if the first person you ask about it say's they're not interested don't just give up, ask if they can suggest another teacher that might be interested in looking into it as a school project (it's all part of showing your keen)
[17:08] <WILLdude> I only have one science teacher who I actually like.
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[17:10] <mfa298> well start with them. But don't just give up if they say they're not interested ask if there's another teacher that might be interested. you might find one of the other teachers is super keen (and it's always possible it might not be a science teacher but someone that's got an interest in science/radio but teaches something completely different)
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[17:17] <mikestir> anyone got any experience with Upu's pico GPS modules with the chip antenna?
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[17:17] <Phil_M0DNY> mikestir: yep
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[17:17] <mikestir> are they a bit deaf?
[17:17] <Phil_M0DNY> Under an open sky (not in a building), no.
[17:17] <daveake> Absolutely fine outside; indoors not as good as a Sarantel
[17:18] <eroomde> they are deafer than other kinds of antenna but deaf is hard to define in an absolute sense
[17:18] <Phil_M0DNY> They take a little longer (maybe 20s longer) to get a fix than the sarantel ones.
[17:18] <mikestir> not done much with them yet because they only arrived yesterday, but I seemed to only manage a 4 sat fix outdoors, which seemed poor
[17:18] <mikestir> the house was blocking in one direction, so maybe the constellation was all over there at the time
[17:18] <Phil_M0DNY> Are you using it in power-saving?
[17:18] <mikestir> I haven't touched any settings yet, so it's default NMEA
[17:18] <cuddykid> lab rig weighs in at around 1.5kg
[17:18] <eroomde> ...
[17:19] <mikestir> I actually looked at the datasheets for the sarantel and the chip antenna, and got the impression the chip antenna was actually better!
[17:20] <Phil_M0DNY> It's not meant to be.
[17:20] <Phil_M0DNY> But once your balloon is >10m above the ground, they don't tend to show much difference in performance.
[17:21] <S_Mark> Is this the JTI chip?
[17:21] <Phil_M0DNY> Yeah
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[17:22] <S_Mark> Would you recommend them, or stick to sarentel?
[17:22] <eroomde> everything else being equal stick to sarantel
[17:22] <Phil_M0DNY> If you can afford the weight, you might as well go with sarantel.
[17:22] <eroomde> they're definitely better antennas
[17:22] <eroomde> but they're heavier
[17:22] <eroomde> which is pico unfreindly
[17:22] <eroomde> and also they hve gone under
[17:22] <eroomde> which is future unfriendly
[17:23] <S_Mark> lol
[17:23] <S_Mark> ok cool
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[17:23] <Phil_M0DNY> up_u is looking into similar replacements though.
[17:23] <mikestir> i'll do some more testing with the chip tomorrow and see if I can get any improvement
[17:24] <mikestir> I haven't spent much time with the gps because I was rushing to get something together for the demo this afternoon
[17:28] <Upu-> hey mikestir
[17:28] <Upu-> do you get a clock ?
[17:28] <mikestir> hi. stuff arrived yesterday thanks.
[17:28] <mikestir> yes
[17:29] Nick change: Upu- -> Upu
[17:29] <mikestir> and a fix eventually
[17:29] <Upu> yeah thats normal
[17:29] <mikestir> but it's pretty weak
[17:29] <Upu> I've found it can also change depending on what time it is
[17:29] <Upu> and local interference can be an issue
[17:29] <Upu> but overall outside, just as good as the Sarantel
[17:29] <mikestir> sure. there was a time a few years ago where the constellation was degraded and there were hardly any satellites visible in the UK at certain times of day
[17:30] <Upu> I just tested two here and they locked as quick as the Sarantel
[17:30] <Upu> however last week it took 5 mins + for all my boards to get a lock
[17:30] <mikestir> are there any settings that need changing, e.g. for flight mode?
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[17:33] <Upu> yes indeed
[17:33] <Upu> http://ava.upuaut.net/store/wiki/doku.php?id=frontpage:levelconvertor
[17:33] <Upu> some example code there
[17:34] <mikestir> ok ta
[17:35] <eroomde> i'd also recommend looking at the ublox receiver protocol description document
[17:35] <eroomde> 1) it's amazingly well documented compared to most GPS's
[17:36] <eroomde> 2) these units really can do a lot and it's quite interesting to peruse
[17:36] <mikestir> yes I've flicked through that but haven't read it properly yet
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[17:36] <mikestir> I'll have a proper look at this tomorrow. I was short for time today and just wanted to get it transmitting something vaguely GPS related over RTTY
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[18:07] <mikestir> so has anyone tried downconverting the 2nd IF of a cheap AM/FM receiver for soundcard capture and final filtering in software?
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[18:08] <mikestir> I'm thinking along the lines of the mods for receiving DRM
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[18:29] <LeoBodnar> mikestir: http://webpages.charter.net/wa1sov/technical/IF_Converter.htm
[18:29] <fsphil> mikestir: always tempted, but got the fcd++ now that can receive DRM wide signals
[18:30] <fsphil> turns out there are very few DRM signals :)
[18:30] <fsphil> suspect it's a dead format
[18:30] <LeoBodnar> I have used AD607 in a VHF receiver design and it works very well.
[18:30] <mikestir> actually I don't mean for DRM
[18:30] <mikestir> I mean for HAB
[18:30] <mikestir> as an alternative to an SSB receiver
[18:30] <mikestir> I have built a downconverter for DRM before and it worked well
[18:30] <LeoBodnar> Build a single chip receiver on AD607. It's good
[18:31] <LeoBodnar> Stupid reference voltages (Vdd/2) but no big deal
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[18:32] <mikestir> I'm thinking downconvert to 12 kHz or so for a final filter in software. should avoid the instant 3dB NF penalty of a simple zero IF design
[18:32] <mikestir> and since I was already thinking about putting direct IQ support into fldigi for use with RTLSDR...
[18:34] <fsphil> be quite interesting to just do it properly, and write a little program from scratch :)
[18:34] <fsphil> fldigi has too much history
[18:35] <mikestir> seems fairly modular though. I've also been working on a properly integrated web front end for it. I could really do with a decent remote solution
[18:35] <mikestir> or do you think there is appetite for a completely new HAB-specific solution?
[18:36] <eroomde> possiprobably
[18:36] <eroomde> i just wish everyone would run linux like normal people
[18:36] <mikestir> they do don't they? ;)
[18:37] <eroomde> then you could have a bunch of nice well defined tools that a script could connect up to get them to display a waterfall and upload to the tracker
[18:37] <eroomde> or... not display a waterfall and log to a file
[18:37] <fsphil> the html5 websdr is quite nice
[18:37] <eroomde> or.... output the raw bitstream to an experimental thing
[18:37] <mikestir> is that the one in holland?
[18:37] <eroomde> or...
[18:37] <eroomde> whatever
[18:37] <LeoBodnar> http://www.analog.com/static/imported-files/data_sheets/AD607.pdf single chip receiver with I/Q outputs for up to 500MHz. Do I sound like a broken record? Lol
[18:37] <Gadget-Mac> Evening all, nice to see mikestir again :)
[18:37] <fsphil> mikestir: yea
[18:37] <eroomde> just done in a proper unixy way
[18:37] <fsphil> really nice not to have to have Java
[18:38] <fsphil> cause frankly, life is too short
[18:38] <mikestir> they were offline for the longest time because they needed to blow a hole in a wall for a cable or something
[18:38] <mikestir> evening gadget-mac
[18:38] <fsphil> http://websdr.ewi.utwente.nl:8901/
[18:39] <fsphil> only with a better interface
[18:40] <Gadget-Mac> I'd quite like a plug and play HAB rx solution using Pi or beaglebone black, even if it has to use a bigger server somewhere.
[18:40] <mikestir> the problem I foresee is that there are too many variables for a fully automatic solution
[18:40] <mikestir> some sort of HTML5 type UI is probably a must at least until it's all locked on
[18:41] <Gadget-Mac> I'd be happy with that
[18:41] <LeoBodnar> I considered building dedicated black box rx but there are too many variables.
[18:42] <mikestir> the rx should be ok as long as it's tunable
[18:42] <LeoBodnar> E.g. some tx are drifting like something else
[18:42] <LeoBodnar> What mode it should work in?
[18:42] <mikestir> but if the rx sees it drift off the bottom then it can command the radio to retune
[18:42] <mikestir> just make sure the channels overlap
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[18:43] <fsphil> allow multiple modems too - so it could decode multiple flights if the sdr has the bandwidth, like the rtlsdr
[18:44] <mattbrejza> i have automatic shift,frequency,data/stop bit detection in my android decoder
[18:44] <mattbrejza> the only thing it doesnt auto is baud
[18:45] <fsphil> you could get that with an fft
[18:46] <Gadget-Mac> fsphil: make it modular / cheap enough and you can have as many as you like
[18:46] <LeoBodnar> Lol, make sure it supports digimodes. I have abandoned RTTY for DominoEX.
[18:46] <mikestir> I need something quick in the short term, and I've already mostly hacked a JSON web service into fldigi, but I'm prepared to spend some time on a dedicated receiver longer term
[18:46] <fsphil> http://www.southgatearc.org/news/june2013/raspberry_pi_long_distance_contact_challenge.htm
[18:47] <fsphil> related to the RPi discussion earlier
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[18:51] <mikestir> assuming I can get a reliable remote control solution I should be able to leave a groundstation on the school roof permanently. It's quite a good site and there doesn't seem to be that much in the north west
[18:52] <mikestir> they seemed quite keen on the idea
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[18:54] <eroomde> LeoBodnar: how is progress generally?
[18:54] <eroomde> you were using the stm32f4 right?
[18:54] <eroomde> or was that someone else?
[18:55] <mattbrejza> fsphil: is easy to detect 300 baud when decoding for 50 baud
[18:55] <mattbrejza> but never did anythnig with it
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[18:58] <mikestir> leobodnar: is your AD607 design synthesised or VFO?
[19:01] <arko> so whats the record of high altitude launched from?
[19:01] <arko> im thinking about going to my friends place in colorado to do a launch from 14,000ft
[19:01] <fsphil> 4.2km .. sheesh
[19:01] <fsphil> people LIVE that high up?
[19:02] <arko> yeah
[19:02] <arko> :)
[19:02] <arko> i can be a record holder of something at least
[19:03] <fsphil> I joked about launching from 500m, our local "mountain"
[19:03] <arko> well
[19:03] <arko> not on top of the mountain
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[19:03] <Lunar_Lander> hello
[19:03] <arko> but 7 miles away at 8500ft
[19:03] <arko> but still
[19:03] <KT5TK_QRL> Launching HABs that high is certainly an advantage. However consider the strong surface winds up there...
[19:04] <fsphil> yea winds are why I didn't :)
[19:04] <arko> i wonder if i could get a floater much more easily
[19:04] <fsphil> it's almost always windy at 500m
[19:04] <arko> haha
[19:04] <arko> yeah, filling in a shed then launching is probably best
[19:04] <fsphil> there is a small bowl shaped feature near the summit, it's nice and calm in that
[19:05] <fsphil> but it's a long walk from the road
[19:05] <KT5TK_QRL> Yea, that's probably the way to go
[19:05] <arko> heh
[19:06] <KT5TK_QRL> I also have plans to launch from some mountain in New Mexico, possibly this summer
[19:07] <KT5TK_QRL> Maybe a mylar pico
[19:07] <fsphil> http://www.digitaltrends.com/computing/not-just-for-nasa-anymore-how-one-man-is-taking-his-own-photos-from-space/ .. how's that for a URL
[19:07] <fsphil> just spotted on the amsat-uk twitter feed
[19:09] <daveake> hah
[19:09] <daveake> that was a 30-odd minute skype interview
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[19:19] <eroomde> AAkerman helped transform what was possible with HAB when he flew his first Raspberry Pi. Not only could the Raspberry Pi take better-quality images and store a lot more of them, it could also transmit those images via a live digital feed.
[19:19] <eroomde> Read more: http://www.digitaltrends.com/computing/not-just-for-nasa-anymore-how-one-man-is-taking-his-own-photos-from-space/#ixzz2WgvziB7c
[19:19] <eroomde> a) what an obnoxious copy-paste behaviour
[19:19] <eroomde> b) what total bullshit
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[19:23] <BenBancroft> If I want to send a temperature back from my payload, is it best to store it as an int or a float for transmission?
[19:24] <eroomde> it rather depends on how accurately you can measure it, and how accurately you want to measure it
[19:25] <eroomde> if
[19:25] <eroomde> whoops
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[19:25] <eroomde> if just to the nearest degree C is fine then a signed char fits the bill quite nicely
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[19:25] <mikestir> blurgh, floats on embedded
[19:25] <eroomde> hey, 1985 just called
[19:25] <eroomde> they say hi
[19:26] <mikestir> whatever. it's still slow even now if you don't have an FPU
[19:26] <eroomde> if you have gone to the expense of some singing and dancing PT100 based accurate thing, i guess you want to use a float
[19:26] <mikestir> or just scale it
[19:27] <eroomde> or you can jsut send back whatever the adc says and convert it on the ground
[19:27] <eroomde> there's probably not really an answer to your question without getting more specific
[19:27] <SpeedEvil> http://xkcd.com/630/
[19:27] <eroomde> yes but most habs aren't really cpu constrained
[19:27] <eroomde> they go up and bleep a bit
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[19:28] <mikestir> it's more code to go wrong. consumes more power
[19:28] <mikestir> there isn't any need to use floats, so why bother?
[19:29] <eroomde> for easy human-readable telem strings
[19:29] <eroomde> which is inkeeping with how the ukhas standard evolved the way it did
[19:29] <mikestir> so scale in decimal and insert a dp
[19:29] <mikestir> for temperature data I tend to work in 100ths degrees, for example
[19:30] <eroomde> sure, you can do that
[19:30] <eroomde> i don;t think people are too bothered by either
[19:30] <mikestir> and how are you printf'ing your floats? using the massive float-capable AVR printf?
[19:31] <eroomde> especially not bothered by the overheard in power consumption of float vs hand-rolled formatting
[19:31] <mikestir> the power consumption isn't really an issue for this, no, because it dwarf in comparison to the power consumed by the tx
[19:32] <eroomde> indeed. that's why i didn;t really understand why you suggested it as a drawback
[19:32] <mikestir> it's a drawback in general
[19:32] <eroomde> and based on my experience of new people problems, hand written string formatting code vs standard (for avr) libs is a bit of a no-brainer in terms of danger
[19:33] <mikestir> avr-libc has two versions of printf. you can choose one that doesn't support floats
[19:33] <eroomde> whois mikestir
[19:33] <eroomde> this time with added /
[19:33] <eroomde> i feel like i ahve talked to you before but can't remember
[19:33] <eroomde> where you here a while back?
[19:33] <mikestir> I've been lurking in here for a week or so
[19:34] <eroomde> hmm, might be misremembering then
[19:34] <LeoBodnar> eroomde: I am using Si4460
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[19:34] <ibanezmatt13> Good Evening :)
[19:34] <fsphil> it is!
[19:34] <eroomde> LeoBodnar: and what as your cpu?
[19:34] <LeoBodnar> mikestir: sythesized
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[19:35] <ibanezmatt13> http://sdrv.ms/191ERML
[19:35] <ibanezmatt13> Went for an old piece of cardboard and some cable ties. Only for testing though :)
[19:35] <mikestir> leobodnar: which synth did you use? I've used the natsemi PLLatinum series in the past, but they have gone a bit teeny-tiny for home projects
[19:37] <LeoBodnar> eroomde: PIC24FJ
[19:37] <eroomde> ah right
[19:37] <eroomde> there was someone on here who was using the stm32f4's dac to do a bunch of modes at th same time
[19:37] <eroomde> which was quite neat
[19:38] <LeoBodnar> mikestir: let me check, this was a matchbox SSB VHF receiver project for a friend for two fixed frequencies. It does not even have a micro in it.
[19:38] <ibanezmatt13> Now however, my batteries finally seem to be struggling with the load. 6 of them create a voltage of around 8v when charged. They last about 15 mins, then the whole thing starts turning off and on rapidly, and then the whole thing kinda fails. I assume this is because the total voltage must drop to a level insufficient to output 5v to the Pi. eroomde's advice on a nice PSU is what I really need to consider now, I think :)
[19:38] <LeoBodnar> mikestir: CDCE913
[19:39] <LeoBodnar> You can program frequencies into CDCE913 EEPROM memory and select them with a pin.
[19:39] <ibanezmatt13> Are the batteries likely to be the cause of this? Don't forget, only 6 batteries are powering the Pi, Pi Cam, NTX2 and GPS.
[19:40] <LeoBodnar> mikestir: the receiver worked from 100mAh LiPo for a day. Many PLLs are massive power hogs these days.
[19:41] <mikestir> was it ok for e.g. ref spurs? I often wonder how these programmable clock generator chips intended for SoCs compare with synths marketed as RF frequency synthesisers
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[19:42] <LeoBodnar> Programmable clock generator chips are *^%$£ and *&%$ with &^%$ attached. Don't even think about using them an anything related to radios :)
[19:43] <LeoBodnar> They have massive spectral noise and very dirty unstable signal.
[19:43] <mikestir> they seem to be descriping that thing as a clock generator in the datasheet
[19:43] <mikestir> describing*
[19:44] <LeoBodnar> Oh, I thought you mean programmable oscillators! This chip is quite good for its price and power consumption.
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[19:46] <LeoBodnar> Phase noise is acceptable but I have not measured it.
[19:46] <mikestir> no, I mean the completely self-contained multi-PLL jobbies like that, with CMOS-level outputs
[19:47] <mikestir> the ones I have used the vendor was really reluctant to release details on the register config
[19:47] <mikestir> they would only let you use their software to upload a pre-defined bitstream for a given set of frequencies
[19:47] <mikestir> but they were cheap!
[19:50] <LeoBodnar> If I had a proper RF PLL synth with 10mA current draw I'd rather use that. It was OK. TI suggest using it in low phase noise audio clock applications: http://www.ti.com/lit/an/scaa088/scaa088.pdf
[19:51] <mikestir> suppose they must exist. mobile phones should have driven down synth power consumptopn
[19:51] <LeoBodnar> How power hungry were yours?
[19:51] <LeoBodnar> They are mostly for 2-4GHz range and I really didn't want to use extra circuitry.
[19:52] <mikestir> the clock generators? can't remember and I don't have access to the datasheet anymore as it was NDA and I changed job
[19:52] <LeoBodnar> I see.
[19:52] <mikestir> wasn't TI, ICS I think
[19:52] <mikestir> we weren't interested in power consumption though
[19:53] <LeoBodnar> In such case there are tonnes of very good clean PLL synths. I think AD has a lot to offer there.
[19:54] <mikestir> that AD607 looks like a nice chip anyway. Another thing to add to my list of things to play with!
[19:55] <mikestir> right. off to pub
[19:55] <LeoBodnar> See you later!
[19:58] <ibanezmatt13> fsphil: During testing before I had everything being powered off the batteries: Pi, Pi Cam, NTX2 and Ublox. It worked perfectly as you saw on the video http://sdrv.ms/191ERML for about 15 minutes but then even the Pi started turning off and on very rapidly and then eventually it completely shut down. I'm guessing this is the batteries draining? I'm not quite sure but I hope it's not an unfixable issue...
[19:58] <ibanezmatt13> At full charge the batteries where operating at just under 8v
[19:59] <ibanezmatt13> When it all failed, they were still outputing over 6v but for some reason it started to fail and then failed
[20:01] <fsphil> what where they outputting under load?
[20:01] <ibanezmatt13> Coming out of the 5v reg, if I remember correctly less than 4
[20:01] <ibanezmatt13> I'll test it again now, one sec
[20:03] <ibanezmatt13> Ok it's working currently with only 4.89 out of the 5v reg
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[20:03] <ibanezmatt13> ok, it's just failed
[20:04] <ibanezmatt13> for some reason, the output is now down to 3.8v!
[20:05] <ibanezmatt13> now the Pi's red light is very dim, everything has failed
[20:05] <ibanezmatt13> I'm pretty sure the batteries are the problem. What do you think?
[20:06] <bertrik> how much current does it draw when running normally?
[20:06] <ibanezmatt13> I'm not sure, not really able to use the ammeter at the moment.
[20:06] <ibanezmatt13> Less than 1A
[20:06] <ibanezmatt13> Batteries are rated up to 3A
[20:07] <ibanezmatt13> But the voltage going to the Pi out of the 5v reg is really low. Before it worked for a short while and failed like this. Must be the batteries
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[20:08] <ibanezmatt13> Internet went off there sorry
[20:10] <ibanezmatt13> Batteries likely to be the culprit?
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[20:11] <fsphil> likely
[20:11] <bertrik> I don't know, 1A should be doable, should definitely las tlonger than 15 minutes
[20:11] <ibanezmatt13> They are rechargable AA's
[20:11] <ibanezmatt13> Ni-MH
[20:12] <ibanezmatt13> Perfect for say 1 hour of powering just NTX2 and UBLOX
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[20:13] <ibanezmatt13> I'm wondering how I can test to see if this is the problem. I don't have a bench PSU or anything
[20:14] <ibanezmatt13> brb, switching computers
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[20:16] <ibanezmatt13> I'm back
[20:21] <ibanezmatt13> Ok, so I'm charging the batteries now. In about an hour, I'll give it another test run. I'll check the voltage at start and the voltage when it fails to see if it's likely to be the problem. I guess if it lasts any longer than a few minutes (as it only did just now) is will confirm batteries are the issue. Is there a risk of this occuring with the Energizer Ultimate Lithiums? I'm looking at the datasheet for m
[20:21] <ibanezmatt13> y regulator but I can't seem to find where it mentions drop out voltage.
[20:26] <fsphil> an hour probably isn't enough time
[20:26] <fsphil> my charger normally takes about 6 hours
[20:27] <ibanezmatt13> I checked the voltage after half an hour before and it said 1.3v on each cell
[20:27] <fsphil> your charger should come with instructions telling you how long to charge them for
[20:27] <fsphil> it will vary by capacity of the battery
[20:28] <ibanezmatt13> ah right, I'll have a look
[20:28] <Lunar_Lander> one side thing
[20:28] <ibanezmatt13> My Dad suggested that it might be drawing some current from something else. What could that be?
[20:29] <mfa298> ibanezmatt13: not read all the scrollback but just because the batteries are 1.3v per cell that doesn't necessarily mean they're fully charged
[20:29] <Lunar_Lander> you have a pack of six batteries right?
[20:29] <ibanezmatt13> I didn't think it'd go much more than 1.3v anyway. Lunar_Lander Yes
[20:29] <Lunar_Lander> when I saw that right yesterday
[20:29] <Lunar_Lander> hm
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[20:29] <Lunar_Lander> so 9 V under normal conditions
[20:30] <Lunar_Lander> should be well enough
[20:30] <ibanezmatt13> Yeah, My Dad suggested that it might be drawing some current from something else
[20:30] <Lunar_Lander> yea
[20:30] <ibanezmatt13> Surely not though...
[20:30] <mfa298> they might sit around 1.3v per cell from when their partly charged until they're almost fully charged.
[20:31] <Lunar_Lander> on discharge you got a long way of rather slowly dropping voltage and then a final drop before they are dead
[20:31] <ibanezmatt13> never thought of that. I keep forgetting how batteries actually work. I'll charge them for a few hours
[20:31] <Lunar_Lander> but also from full charge you have a rather steep and short drop to that slow discharge
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[20:31] <steve_____> Upu: a little while back you recommended that I stick decoupling caps on the AVR and the gps unit of my tracker circuit & what is the benefit of doing that? Should I expect to be able to transmit a cleaner signal over the radio? Is it going to matter when the temperature drops?
[20:31] <fsphil> ibanezmatt13: read the manual, find out how many hours
[20:31] <ibanezmatt13> hmm, I may have to go for more batteries
[20:31] <fsphil> it could be many
[20:31] <ibanezmatt13> Yeah, I'll check
[20:32] <Upu> well its mainly to stop noise getting into the GPS
[20:32] <Upu> recommended on the data sheet
[20:32] <Upu> for both the GPS and the AVR
[20:32] <steve_____> ok - $$NAKI,29814,20:32:28,51.3254,-0.7728,109,11*CF01
[20:32] <steve_____> doesn't seem to be causing a problem for me
[20:33] <fsphil> decoupling caps are always recommended (I'd go further, essential) for digital ICs
[20:34] <steve_____> why fsphil - I take Upu's point about recommended on datasheet
[20:34] <Upu> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Decoupling_capacitor
[20:34] <ibanezmatt13> fsphil, I'm officially a numpty :p
[20:35] <fsphil> the output from them might go from 0 - VCC very quickly (ideally instantly)
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[20:35] <Upu> "Sometimes, for various reasons, a power supply supplies an AC signal superimposed on the DC power line. Such a signal is often undesirable in the powered circuit. A decoupling capacitor can prevent the powered circuit from seeing that signal, thus decoupling it from that aspect of the power supply circuit."
[20:35] <ibanezmatt13> AA 1600mAh - 8 hours AA 2100mAh - 11 hours 2400 not listed but I guess it's not that short! :)
[20:36] <ibanezmatt13> Most I've ever charged them for is 30 mins! Because I only looked at the voltage!
[20:36] <fsphil> inductance and probably other things can cause problems for that, meaning the IC can't source the current quickly enough
[20:36] <fsphil> your nice sharp logic levels became sloppy
[20:36] <fsphil> bad things can happen
[20:37] <fsphil> the decoupling cap gives the IC it's own little personal power source
[20:37] <fsphil> the way I'm describing this is probably confusing :)
[20:37] <steve_____> oh btw I have added a watchdog timer to my avr code which can safeguard against bad things - my avr didn't like loosing power
[20:38] <steve_____> no I understand
[20:38] <steve_____> What you are saying is also not new to me
[20:38] <steve_____> But I am not experiencing issues without them - so I thought I would ask
[20:38] <fsphil> yea. was new to me until recently... made a lot of sense
[20:39] <ibanezmatt13> Just for peace of mind if I leave it on overnight: http://www.digitalmediastore.co.uk/battery_chargers/aa,_aaa/Lloytron_Plug_In_Mains_Battery_Charger_for_AA__AAA__9V_NiMH__NiCD_Rechargeable_Batteries__LLY-B1502-D You reckon it'll not catch fire? :\
[20:39] <ibanezmatt13> It gets warm during charging
[20:39] <fsphil> that's normal
[20:39] <ibanezmatt13> ok, I'll leave it on all night then
[20:39] <mfa298> ibanezmatt13: you need to be careful leaving the batteries on too long. although that rate sounds low enough that it shouldn't be an issue
[20:40] <ibanezmatt13> it says it has "reverse polarity protection." And if 800mAh takes 8 hours - I guess 2400mAh should take 24
[20:41] <mfa298> overcharging is likely to be more of an issue if the charge time is around 5 hours or less
[20:41] <ibanezmatt13> So I'm safe to trust that website and leave it on?
[20:42] <mfa298> did those numbers come from a website or for the manual for the charger ?
[20:42] <mfa298> the place to get charge rate is from something for that charger (e.g. the manual)
[20:42] <ibanezmatt13> website. In fact I read that wrong. Should take 12h
[20:42] <mfa298> was it a site for that charger or just a random site ?
[20:43] <fsphil> does the charger have a timer?
[20:43] <ibanezmatt13> nope, not the most sophisticated thing
[20:43] <ibanezmatt13> on amazon too http://www.amazon.co.uk/Lloytron-Battery-Charger-Rechargeable-Batteries/dp/B003VT70RI
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[20:43] <Lunar_Lander> hi S_Mark
[20:43] <Lunar_Lander> steve_____, what is your power supply?
[20:43] <ibanezmatt13> can't beat dodgy chinese chargers :)
[20:44] <fsphil> I'm not a fan :)
[20:44] <steve_____> At the moment I am using the raspberry pi 3v3
[20:44] <ibanezmatt13> Well, I guess I'll just risk it
[20:44] <steve_____> But I have supplied via a 9 V battery
[20:44] <mfa298> you can work out how long it will take to charge.
[20:44] <steve_____> and one of those voltage regulator circuits you get on ebay
[20:45] <mfa298> look at the charge rate (AA=200mA if that site is correct)
[20:45] <ibanezmatt13> yep
[20:45] <mfa298> you need to put 2400mA into the battery, Simple maths will tell you how long that will take.
[20:45] <steve_____> so for the last 28 hours its been running from the 3v3 on the pi
[20:45] <ibanezmatt13> yep, 12 :)
[20:45] <mfa298> it will be a bit longer in reality as it's not a 100% efficient process - some of that power is going to heat
[20:46] <ibanezmatt13> I think I'm safe then
[20:46] <Lunar_Lander> the thing is that if you build up a voltage reg with the two capacitors on either side (according to the datasheets) and because you use batteries, the supply shouldn't oscillate much
[20:46] <Lunar_Lander> that is what I am thinking
[20:46] <Lunar_Lander> never hooked that up to the scope to look at it
[20:46] <mfa298> as it's a trickle charger it shouldn't overcharge. The real issues are if you have a fast charger
[20:46] <steve_____> thats what I thought as well
[20:47] <ibanezmatt13> thankfully not :)
[20:47] <steve_____> but someone here said those boards had big power oscillations
[20:47] <steve_____> I have not seen it yet
[20:48] <steve_____> a few caps is hardly worth fussing about - I should put em on and be done with it
[20:48] <steve_____> but I like to understand
[20:50] <ibanezmatt13> mfa298, I assume that they are still charged to some degree. Won't that lower the time needed to charge them. I don't think they're completely discharged as they are over 1.3v
[20:52] <steve_____> the atmega328 data sheet only mentions decoupling caps for ADC and says 'may be decoupled'
[20:52] <ibanezmatt13> New information: Looking at the batteries themselves, they say "standard charge 245mA for 16h." I guess what I just asked is irrelevant?
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[20:55] <mfa298> as it's a trickle charge I'd just got for the 16 hours.
[20:55] <ibanezmatt13> thanks
[20:55] <ibanezmatt13> I will
[20:56] <bertrik> I usually charge my AAs at 1A
[20:56] <steve_____> The ublox data sheet does recommend them for sure
[20:56] <ibanezmatt13> bertrik, That sounds very... sufficient :)
[20:57] <mfa298> 1A, that's the area you start needing to be a bit more careful how your charging
[20:58] <mfa298> unless you have > ~5Ah AA batteries
[20:58] <ibanezmatt13> yeah
[20:58] <steve_____> 0.1 µF
[20:59] <steve_____> I really do need to get a whole bunch of 0.1µF caps along with 1k and 10k resistors
[20:59] <steve_____> they seem to be stock standard...
[20:59] <SpeedEvil> And if you have 5Ah AA batteries - throw them away.
[20:59] <SpeedEvil> Or at least measure them to see what capacity they really are, because the label is lying.
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[21:00] <fsphil> yea
[21:01] <fsphil> there's a lot of fake batteries on ebay
[21:01] <fsphil> not fake as in they do work, but nowhere near the claimed capacity
[21:02] <ibanezmatt13> Thankfully I have no 5Ah batteries :)
[21:02] <SpeedEvil> The problem with that is that if a vendor is selling 2200mAh ones - they've probably tested them to see they meet that.
[21:02] <SpeedEvil> If they're selling 5Ah ones - they know it won't meet that - so they're not going to be testing to see if three are 2400mAh and one is 240.
[21:03] <ibanezmatt13> I hope mine are actually Duracell 2400s
[21:03] <ibanezmatt13> From Amazon
[21:04] <Lunar_Lander> ibanezmatt13, just for me to verify, you got a raspberry pi, right?
[21:04] <ibanezmatt13> yep :)
[21:05] <Lunar_Lander> and how does the circuit work, is it like batteries-regulator-raspberry?
[21:05] <Lunar_Lander> in that chain
[21:05] <ibanezmatt13> pretty much yeah
[21:06] <ibanezmatt13> http://sdrv.ms/191ERML
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[21:06] <Willdude123> Hi.
[21:06] <Willdude123> Looks like I'll be getting a discone instead of a colinear.
[21:06] <ibanezmatt13> batteries are connected to a 3.3v reg for NTX2 and Ublox, batteries are also connected to 5v reg to Pi Lunar_Lander
[21:07] <Lunar_Lander> I just thought that if you had a PSU that you could hook up to the regulator, then you could see the current draw
[21:07] <ibanezmatt13> not got a bench PSU
[21:07] <Lunar_Lander> yeah
[21:07] <ibanezmatt13> Really need one though
[21:08] <Lunar_Lander> that's what I meant
[21:08] <Lunar_Lander> :)
[21:08] <Lunar_Lander> is 13 your age?
[21:08] <ibanezmatt13> a little more than that :)
[21:08] <ibanezmatt13> 15
[21:08] <Lunar_Lander> ah
[21:08] <Lunar_Lander> just thought about to enroll you in physics at uni
[21:08] <Lunar_Lander> :P
[21:08] <Lunar_Lander> somehow
[21:09] <ibanezmatt13> hmm, judging by the questions I ask, that would be worrying :)
[21:09] <mfa298> Willdude123: why a discone ?
[21:09] <Willdude123> Cause tim said so. :-)
[21:10] <Lunar_Lander> well we got people asking many questions at uni too :)
[21:10] <Willdude123> ibanezmatt13, you going to the UKHAS conf?
[21:10] Nick change: manchild -> Laurenceb_
[21:11] <mfa298> I think for what you're likely to want to listen to with what you've currently got a discone wont do as well as some sort of tuned vertical
[21:11] <ibanezmatt13> Willdude123, Yes :)
[21:11] <Willdude123> Lucky bastard.
[21:11] <ibanezmatt13> can't make it?
[21:11] <Willdude123> I could make it.
[21:11] <Willdude123> But my parents.
[21:12] <ibanezmatt13> what's you age?
[21:12] <ibanezmatt13> your*
[21:12] <Willdude123> mfa298, I'l like to listen to some 6 m too.
[21:12] <Willdude123> 12
[21:13] <mfa298> you can get triband verticals, mine is 6/2/70
[21:13] <ibanezmatt13> Didn't know that. I thought you were a university graduate! :P
[21:14] <Willdude123> Really.
[21:14] <ibanezmatt13> Yep
[21:14] <Willdude123> mfa, http://pastie.org/private/dzh0yukip6abbdcbtfzw
[21:14] <Willdude123> Haha.
[21:14] <Willdude123> How did you persuade your parents?
[21:15] <Willdude123> Is your HAB project a school thing?
[21:15] <ibanezmatt13> No
[21:16] <ibanezmatt13> Well I'm nearly 16 and I guess my Dad thinks I should go to thing like this, he just said yes (which is really unusual I must say...) :)
[21:16] <Lunar_Lander> does he do Physics too?
[21:16] <ibanezmatt13> he did A level physics and degree level engineering maths
[21:16] <ibanezmatt13> hated it
[21:16] <steve_____> I am a dad and if my 12 year old was building something like this I would back em all they way - I wouldn't need much 'persuading'
[21:17] <ibanezmatt13> It's been a while since as his job has nothing to do with it
[21:17] <steve_____> where do you like WILLdude
[21:17] <mfa298> for a discone to work well it's going to need to be pretty big. Remember the rule of thumb that you can have two out of bandwidth, smaller physical size, efficiency.
[21:17] <steve_____> live...
[21:17] <steve_____> are you far away from London
[21:17] <mfa298> you want it to have a good bandwidth and reasonably efficient so it can't be small
[21:18] <ibanezmatt13> Willdude123, Have you launched a HAB before?
[21:18] <Willdude123> Basingstoke and don't be daft no.
[21:18] <Willdude123> :-)
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[21:19] <gonzo_> discones are wide bandwidth, but pretty inefficient and awful match
[21:19] <gonzo_> even a 1/4 wave gp would be better
[21:19] <Willdude123> Hmm
[21:19] <Upu> I made him one of those :)
[21:19] <ibanezmatt13> Willdude123, Are you planning to soon? Have you learned any programming launguages?
[21:20] <Willdude123> Nope and yes.
[21:20] <ibanezmatt13> which?
[21:20] <Willdude123> Python and a little C
[21:20] <ibanezmatt13> same here :)
[21:21] <Willdude123> Basically my parents said no.
[21:22] <ibanezmatt13> fair enough. You could build a tracker first maybe? That'll help secure your knowledge on some things and it's really cool to have something transmitting data at your hands! Or maybe that's just me... :)
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[21:23] <Willdude123> Building one, just deciding between buying antenna for ham stuff and tracking or an ftdi board.
[21:23] <ibanezmatt13> ah right, good stuff
[21:23] <Willdude123> You built one?
[21:24] <ibanezmatt13> yep, looking to launch first one soon
[21:24] <ibanezmatt13> Just finished soldering it all, next step is making the box
[21:24] <Willdude123> You using a pcb?
[21:24] <ibanezmatt13> just a piece of stripboard
[21:25] <ibanezmatt13> http://sdrv.ms/191ERML
[21:27] <Uggy> Hi
[21:27] <Uggy> still have some problems with dl-fldi... I can't decode RTTY even from .wav . Using playback feature, no problem..
[21:27] <Uggy> Failure with sound card http://pix.toile-libre.org/?img=1371676870.png and http://pix.toile-libre.org/?img=1371676907.png
[21:27] <Uggy> ok with playback http://pix.toile-libre.org/?img=1371676892.png
[21:27] <Uggy> Does someone on Linux have some ideas ?
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[21:28] <KT5TK_QRL> Did you try to click on the Rv button?
[21:29] <steve_____> ibanezmatt13: do you have two voltage regulators in your payload?
[21:29] <Uggy> yes.. display of char looks better.. as it become "regular".. but still weird srings
[21:29] <Lunar_Lander> Uggy, so if you play it in VLC for example it does not work?
[21:30] <Lunar_Lander> and it is a recorded file?
[21:30] <Willdude123> My parents have made it very clear that I'm not launching anything myself and I can't meet anyone I know online in person, but I will keep developing.
[21:30] <Uggy> Lunar_Lander: yes.. I play with totem (screenshot)
[21:31] <Uggy> the wav is downloaded from a link found on ukhas web site
[21:31] <Lunar_Lander> yea
[21:31] <Lunar_Lander> I heard from a friend that he had the same problem
[21:31] <LeoBodnar> They are probably worrying that your balloon payload will kill someone and they will end up paying for it.
[21:31] <Uggy> wav is fine unsing playback feature btw
[21:31] <Lunar_Lander> apperantly playback only works if you use the built-in playback
[21:31] <Willdude123> And I will buy an ftdi board when possible.
[21:31] <steve_____> WILLdude: sounds like your parents have your best interests at heart
[21:32] <KT5TK_QRL> Uggy has the signal on the waterfall, so that should be fine
[21:32] <Lunar_Lander> yea
[21:32] <Uggy> yes..that is the strange thing..
[21:32] <Uggy> also I tested on 2 other laptops.. same problem :(
[21:32] <Lunar_Lander> what I want to remark is that I installed PulseAudio here
[21:32] <steve_____> I wouldn't let my 12 year old go buy herself either
[21:32] <Uggy> so I probably do somehting wrong..
[21:33] <Willdude123> There's no purpose to me continuing.
[21:33] <Lunar_Lander> and with that I could select that in the source menu when I had the radio connected to the line in
[21:33] <KT5TK_QRL> Uggy, is your processor overloaded?
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[21:33] <Willdude123> Unless I can get school involved.
[21:33] <Uggy> I also tested using "pulsaudio" in dl-fldig settings..same problem
[21:33] <steve_____> I don't think thats true
[21:34] <Willdude123> steve_____, my best interest is to die asap, they've never respected that or kept it at heart.
[21:34] <Uggy> KT5TK_QRL: let me test
[21:34] <steve_____> I had fun using my tracker the other day driving around
[21:34] <KT5TK_QRL> just check with top in a terminal
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[21:35] <Uggy> KT5TK_QRL: cpu drop from 30% to 60%
[21:36] <steve_____> thats a bit over the top - the ftdi board sounds like fun
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[21:37] <Lunar_Lander> steve_____, do you do Physics :)?
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[21:37] <ibanezmatt13> Willdude123 sorry my internet went down
[21:37] <Uggy> Lunar_Lander: you have friend with same problem ?
[21:37] <steve_____> not recently :)
[21:38] <Willdude123> Ah ok
[21:38] <steve_____> I will be before launching I am sure
[21:38] <steve_____> I didn't do radio either before trying my hand at this..
[21:38] <Lunar_Lander> Uggy, I sent a RTTY recording from dl-fldigi to a friend
[21:38] <Lunar_Lander> and he could only decode it with the playback feature
[21:39] <Lunar_Lander> have no info if he has Windows or Linux
[21:39] <ibanezmatt13> im gonna have to go now as ive reached my time limit on my PC, my dad has good control of the parental limits. night all :-)
[21:39] <Uggy> Lunar_Lander: ok.. thank's.. so he has not solved the problem yet ?
[21:39] <mfa298> Willdude123: as you were told earlier. Be Positive. Talking like that you'll never get things done!
[21:40] <Willdude123> Haha ma t
[21:40] <Willdude123> Matt
[21:40] <ibanezmatt13> pretty much what i said :-)
[21:40] <ibanezmatt13> yes its stupid right :-)
[21:40] <Willdude123> What type of control?
[21:40] <ibanezmatt13> i keep telling him
[21:40] <Willdude123> I used to have that.
[21:40] <Lunar_Lander> Uggy, no, he just used the playback feature
[21:40] <Lunar_Lander> steve_____, ah
[21:40] <ibanezmatt13> its set into the home hub, no way to hack it im afraid
[21:40] <Lunar_Lander> what's your professional background?
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[21:40] <Willdude123> Then I built a PC and 'forgot' to put norton safety minder back on.
[21:41] <jcoxon> ping Upu
[21:41] <ibanezmatt13> ive literally got 1 min 34 seconds.
[21:41] <Lunar_Lander> ohh
[21:41] <Upu> hey jcoxon
[21:41] <steve_____> I work in commerce - mostly on the systems side
[21:41] <Willdude123> ibanezmatt13, Blocks all traffic or just that from your mac adress.
[21:41] <chrisstubbs> ibanezmatt13, factroy reset it
[21:41] <steve_____> e-commerce
[21:41] <Willdude123> ?
[21:41] <Uggy> Lunar_Lander: you are on linux.. and this is working for you ? What are your settings ?
[21:41] <SpeedEvil> ibanezmatt13: night.
[21:41] <Lunar_Lander> that sounds like Short Circuit 2 where Johnny 5 is dying with that timer on him
[21:41] <Lunar_Lander> :(
[21:41] <Willdude123> Hi Upu :-(
[21:41] <Upu> hey Will
[21:42] <Lunar_Lander> Uggy, you mean for when I have my radio connected?
[21:42] <Upu> head up keep at it
[21:42] <ibanezmatt13> sorry chris got to go, ill look into that. night :-)
[21:42] <Willdude123> * :-[
[21:42] <Lunar_Lander> night ibanezmatt13
[21:42] <chrisstubbs> night!
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[21:42] <ibanezmatt13> gnight
[21:42] <Lunar_Lander> hi chrisstubbs
[21:42] <Willdude123> Just started ksp today,
[21:42] <Willdude123> It's pretty good.
[21:42] <Uggy> Lunar_Lander: well radio.. or even local wav file
[21:43] <chrisstubbs> hey LL
[21:43] <Lunar_Lander> hm
[21:43] <Lunar_Lander> hi chrisstubbs
[21:43] <Lunar_Lander> well for the radio, in the SoundCard tab, Capture is set to "pulse"
[21:44] <Lunar_Lander> capture I can't try at the moment as I don't have a recording at the moment
[21:45] <LeoBodnar> Hey Upu, are you doing anything with Si4460 yet?
[21:45] <cuddykid> meh, wind and weather conditions not looking great for friday
[21:45] <Uggy> Lunar_Lander: ok..
[21:45] <LeoBodnar> If you need a chip or two I have a few spare ones
[21:45] <Upu> not yet LeoBodnar 24 hours in the day issues :)
[21:45] <LeoBodnar> I know lol
[21:45] <Upu> mainly sorting conference out and working on another two PCB's which need to be done first
[21:45] <chrisstubbs> cuddykid, when is this new weather website going to be up and running?
[21:45] <cuddykid> oh haha
[21:46] <cuddykid> possibly tomorrow
[21:46] <Uggy> Lunar_Lander: with "portaudio" / Pulse.. same problem..
[21:46] <cuddykid> chrisstubbs: will just be a "Yes" I think :)
[21:46] <cuddykid> that covers 95% of the days here
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[21:46] <chrisstubbs> Cant it use some really overcomplicated php?
[21:47] <Lunar_Lander> hm
[21:47] <Uggy> is someone else here using dl-fldigi on GnuLinux ?
[21:47] <LeoBodnar> I can do with some help re Si4460 programming
[21:48] <KT5TK_QRL> Uggi, sorry afk. Does the signal sound interrupted or do you have smooth tones?
[21:49] <Uggy> KT5TK_QRL: signal looks ok.. I can hear the 2 tones out of the speaker too
[21:49] <KT5TK_QRL> No interruptins?
[21:49] <KT5TK_QRL> interruptions^
[21:50] <Uggy> the wav has 2 or 3 little interuptions
[21:50] <Uggy> but wav is ok using "playback" feature.. and I don't hear some additional interruptions
[21:50] <KT5TK_QRL> OK, try to close your audio program and load the wav directly in fldigi
[21:51] <KT5TK_QRL> maybe the timing is not correct for decoding
[21:51] <Uggy> KT5TK_QRL: this is what i called "using playback feature"..
[21:51] <Uggy> what do you mean ?
[21:51] <Uggy> File / Audio / PLayback
[21:52] <KT5TK_QRL> yes
[21:52] <steve_____> Willdude123: one thing that I think is really cool is astronomy and I imagine most people here are in the same boat. Did you see this: http://www.raspberrypi.org/archives/tag/astronomy
[21:52] <KT5TK_QRL> So there is no difference?
[21:52] <steve_____> No launching involved
[21:53] <Uggy> KT5TK_QRL: it works fine with File/Audio/playback
[21:53] <Uggy> http://pix.toile-libre.org/?img=1371676892.png
[21:53] <Uggy> but not using "external"...
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[21:53] <Uggy> http://pix.toile-libre.org/?img=1371676870.png
[21:54] <KT5TK_QRL> I have dl-fldigi running on Debian but I need to get the file.
[21:54] <KT5TK_QRL> Do you have the link?
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[21:54] <Uggy> KT5TK_QRL: sure.. let me find the url again
[21:55] <steve_____> I think its pretty cool to be able to take a photo of saturn
[21:56] <Uggy> KT5TK_QRL: the wav is from http://tenbus.co.uk/icaruscapture.wav
[21:56] <Willdude123> No, I haven't seen that steve
[21:56] <Willdude123> Wow
[21:56] <Willdude123> Upu, deciding between aerials is so confusing: tim sent me this. http://pastie.org/private/dzh0yukip6abbdcbtfzw
[21:57] <Upu> who is Tim ?
[21:57] <Willdude123> Basingstoke Amateur Radio Club secretary.
[21:57] <Upu> ah ok
[21:57] <Willdude123> Lent me a receiver,
[21:57] <eroomde> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aZJZK6rzjns
[21:57] <Upu> it does all depend what you want to receive
[21:58] <Upu> heh Ed
[21:58] <Upu> love that clip
[21:59] <Upu> Discones are a compromise they have a wide range but don't perform particularly well at any specific frequency compared to an antenna dedicate to a specific frequency
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[21:59] <Upu> if you want to listen to amateur transmissions on 2 meters and HAB stuff I would still strongly recommend a colinear
[21:59] <Upu> the W-50 X-50 etc
[22:00] Nick change: eroomde -> eroomdeaway
[22:03] <KT5TK_QRL> Uggy: try 425 Hz shift
[22:05] <KT5TK_QRL> and maybe AFC
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[22:07] <Uggy> KT5TK_QRL: Same problem with 425...
[22:07] <Uggy> AFC is already checked
[22:07] <Uggy> so it's work fine on your side ?
[22:07] <KT5TK_QRL> What if you use a different computer for playback and connect the audio with a cable?
[22:08] <KT5TK_QRL> Yes, it works fine for me
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[22:10] <Uggy> KT5TK_QRL: did not tested with 2 computer (one plugged to another).. but I tested dl-fldigi on 2 other Dell laptops.. and same problem
[22:11] <Uggy> KT5TK_QRL: did you changed settings on alsamixer ?
[22:12] <KT5TK_QRL> No changes on alsa mixer, but just check if some channels are muted
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[22:15] <steve_____> here is something else to do for fun and profit: http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/technology-22961029
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[22:17] <Uggy> KT5TK_QRL: and you compiled last version from github ?
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[22:17] <KT5TK_QRL> I don't remember when I compiled it last time. Fldigi 3.21.43
[22:18] <Uggy> ok.. 3.21.50 here
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[22:19] <Uggy> and you are using "portAudio / default" ?
[22:20] <KT5TK_QRL> portAudio and HDA Intel: AD198x Analog (hw:0,0)
[22:21] <KT5TK_QRL> Try through an audio cable.
[22:21] <KT5TK_QRL> Using the same sound card for playback & recording simultaniously may have timing issues
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[22:22] <Uggy> KT5TK_QRL: ok.. you mean pluging audio headset out.. to mic in ?
[22:22] <KT5TK_QRL> Also my signal shows up a bit stronger. Maybe turn up the volume a bit
[22:22] <KT5TK_QRL> Yes
[22:23] <KT5TK_QRL> on different computers though
[22:23] <Uggy> KT5TK_QRL: ok.. Will try to get one jack cable..
[22:23] <Uggy> yes.. after the screenshot I increased volume..
[22:23] <Uggy> same problem.. but more colors :)
[22:24] <KT5TK_QRL> Maybe you could use a smartphone for playback
[22:24] <Uggy> KT5TK_QRL: ok.. good idea
[22:25] <KT5TK_QRL> It should even work through speaker and microphone
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[22:28] <Uggy> KT5TK_QRL: ok.. thank's for your help.. will try that tomorrow.. and will come back here :)
[22:28] <KT5TK_QRL> NP. Good luck
[22:29] <Uggy> thank's ;)
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[22:44] <Ugi> HI Guys - is Icharus up at the moment? If so, what frew?
[22:44] <Ugi> freq
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[22:52] <mfa298> Ugi: I think icarus is the test sample from the wiki
[22:53] <Ugi> I see, Thanks - just wanting to test my receiver on a real transmisson!
[22:53] <Ugi> See if it starts to drift after a while
[22:53] <mfa298> the clue is that it appears to be being picked up in a number of countries (UK, Australia, Italy at least)
[22:54] <mfa298> cuddykid was looking to launch friday i think
[22:54] <mfa298> (weather dependant)
[22:54] <Ugi> UK & Australia is a pretty impressive combination!
[22:54] <Ugi> OK. Great - I'll keep my eye out.
[22:54] <Ugi> Time for bed then
[22:54] <Ugi> Thanks
[22:55] <Ugi> & G'night
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[23:02] <Laurenceb_> https://twitter.com/HarpyFeathers/status/347006840703418368/photo/1
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[23:04] <arko> that flashlight looks sketchy
[23:07] <daveake> I bet the owner will be incandescent
[23:08] <fsphil> flash of genius there
[23:08] <daveake> I was LED to it
[23:10] <fsphil> you must have been blinded by it
[23:10] <SpeedEvil> I think I've linked this forum before - http://www.candlepowerforums.com/vb/showthread.php?280909-Ultrafire-18650-3000mA-exploded
[23:10] <daveake> Oh, they found the owner, but aren't going to press charges
[23:11] <daveake> Ultrafire is such an appropriate name
[23:11] <fsphil> isn't it
[23:11] <fsphil> name and warning all in one, very efficient
[23:12] <daveake> Kingbright too
[23:12] <fsphil> the other option they had was explodatron
[23:12] <daveake> lol
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[23:18] <SpeedEvil> To be fair - a hell of a lot of these explosions are due to battery mistreatment
[23:18] <SpeedEvil> Plus - well the whole 'let's make a pipe bomb' - with no thought to venting.
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[00:00] --- Thu Jun 20 2013