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[00:08] <nigelvh__> I've done a couple launches a year for a few years now.
[00:08] <MobileNathan> Wow. Have you always found your payload in the end?
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[00:35] <MobileNathan> Does anyone know how to attach an external battery to a GoPro without soldering?
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[01:19] <nigelvh> No, we recover about half of our payloads
[01:19] <nigelvh> On average.
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[07:24] <ibanezmatt13> Morning :)
[07:25] <ibanezmatt13> Annoyingly, SSDV still isn't working. I've spent several hours trying to determine why it isn't working and I can't come to a conclusion. It was working fine at one stage.
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[07:53] <ibanezmatt13> I finally worked out what was wrong with the program! :) SSDV is working perfectly now.
[07:55] <ibanezmatt13> Just like before I got my telemetry program working, when I opened the serial port and set the baud rate, I didn't set the eight character bits, no parity, and two stop bits. So with my RTTY setup in dl-fldigi, it had no idea how to decode the info. As soon as I changed this it worked and I received almost a full image. :)
[07:55] <fsphil> you gotta watch those bits, always misbehaving
[07:56] <ibanezmatt13> yeah, pleased I eventually found it though. I'm gonna try to interlace my telemetry in between the packets now.
[07:57] <fsphil> I've all this to look forward to soon
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[08:00] <Guest79872> Received email: "Re: [UKHAS] Spare Chute for sale"
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[08:01] Nick change: Brace_ -> Brace
[08:14] <ibanezmatt13> functions are a right pain...
[08:15] <fsphil> functions exist to make your life happy
[08:15] <ibanezmatt13> hmm
[08:15] <fsphil> you just have to know when and how to use them
[08:16] <ibanezmatt13> I'm trying to interlace the GPS data with the SSDV. So I thought I'd have a "process image" function, a "read gps" function, and a "send" function
[08:16] <fsphil> sounds logical
[08:16] <ibanezmatt13> it does, but it seems to not be working. I'll keep going with it
[08:18] <ibanezmatt13> so I'm currently trying to put this https://gist.github.com/ibanezmatt13/5663226 into this https://gist.github.com/ibanezmatt13/5694404 using different functions.
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[08:25] <ibanezmatt13> I'm gonna have to have one function which sends telemetry and SSDV packets. At the moment to send packets, I have a while loop which states that "e
[08:25] <ibanezmatt13> sorry, while packets != ''
[08:25] <ibanezmatt13> And then it sends the packet and re-reads the packet file ready for the next loop
[08:26] <ibanezmatt13> So somewhere I have to incorporate the telemetry sending into this while loop, and, out of the while loop in case the while loop is not executed
[08:27] <ibanezmatt13> Is it possible to call two variables from two different functions into one function without executing that function twice at different times?
[08:28] <ibanezmatt13> I a variable called "packets" to be sent to a function, and from another function, I need a variable called "datastring" to be sent to that same function.
[08:29] <fsphil> I think you're doing this the hard way
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[08:29] <ibanezmatt13> I have a tendancy to overcomplicate things without realising
[08:29] <fsphil> at a basic level, all you need is a loop that
[08:29] <fsphil> tried to send an image packet
[08:29] <fsphil> then tries to send a telemetry line
[08:29] <fsphil> tries*
[08:30] <fsphil> and repeats that forever
[08:30] <ibanezmatt13> To get the image packet and the telemetry line, would I use functions for that? Or would it all be part of one giant while loop?
[08:30] <fsphil> functions keep things nice and tidy
[08:31] <fsphil> the main loop should be pretty simple
[08:31] <ibanezmatt13> Ok, I'll start without functions because they seem to be causing me some grief, and then I'll work on putting that into functions.
[08:31] <fsphil> do I have packets? no, try to read some more
[08:31] <fsphil> if I have a packets send one
[08:31] <fsphil> then try sending gps data
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[08:32] <fsphil> a packet*
[08:32] <ibanezmatt13> Ok, thanks. I'll have a go :)
[08:32] <fsphil> my grammer hate mornings
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[08:58] <ibanezmatt13> In SSDV, is there something I can do to make sure I receive most of the packets?
[08:59] <fsphil> you should be receiving them all at short range
[09:00] <ibanezmatt13> it's forming a lot of the picture, but I've received 49 and lost 17
[09:01] <ibanezmatt13> There are some gaps
[09:01] <fsphil> are there fixes?
[09:01] <ibanezmatt13> 86 bytes
[09:01] <chrisstubbs> ibanezmatt13: you may be missing some decodes due to the instability of your power supply
[09:02] <fsphil> yea 86 bytes would suggest signal problems
[09:02] <ibanezmatt13> a right. There are slight fluctuations in the frequency of the NTX2, so the power supply could be the culprit
[09:02] <ibanezmatt13> now 93 bytes
[09:03] <chrisstubbs> You will find with a high resistance usb cable and standard power supply that you get little shifts in the voltage that dl-fldigi takes a second to catch onto. Your dc-dc regulator board and a nice reliable power source should fix that
[09:03] <ibanezmatt13> yeah it should, everything's being powered off the Pi from the mains at the moment...
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[09:03] <fsphil> LCR can be a pain
[09:04] <ibanezmatt13> I'll get some Lithium Cells today.
[09:04] <fsphil> test with rechargable batteries :)
[09:04] <fsphil> lithiums are expensive
[09:04] <chrisstubbs> ibanezmatt13: with your dc-dc regulator you can feed it up to 30 volts
[09:04] <ibanezmatt13> never thought of that. Some alkaline rechargables?
[09:05] <ibanezmatt13> chrisstubbs, yeah, it's pretty good for £1.03
[09:05] <fsphil> any really - won't get the same run time as the lithiums but fine for testing
[09:05] <chrisstubbs> so try somthing with a little more go in it, Maybe a 1 amp 12v power supply to test from the mains
[09:05] <chrisstubbs> saves money on batteries :)
[09:06] <fsphil> I need another bench PSU. wish they where not so expensive
[09:06] <ibanezmatt13> I wouldn't be allowed to do things with high voltages like that. I think until I can surpass my father's regulations I'll stick with the rechargables :)
[09:07] <chrisstubbs> ibanezmatt13: yeah batteries are a bit safer, but messing about with 12v at one amp isnt going to do much unless you stick your fingers in the mains outlet
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[09:08] <ibanezmatt13> I'll have a think about it. Thanks :) What exactly are "fixes" ? It's gone up to 121
[09:08] <fsphil> my PV array puts out 50 volts DC, that scares me a bit
[09:08] <fsphil> in each 256 packet the FEC can correct up to 32 bytes if they where received incorrectly
[09:09] <ibanezmatt13> oh right, so I really need to sort my power supply
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[09:10] <fsphil> http://ssdv.habhub.org/
[09:11] <ibanezmatt13> oh wow! Never knew it went online :)
[09:11] <fsphil> well only when you're in online mode :)
[09:11] <fsphil> the idea being that many people can receive the images
[09:11] <ibanezmatt13> Am I allowed to be online this morning?
[09:12] <fsphil> there's less chance that a packet will be missed
[09:12] <fsphil> certainly
[09:12] <fsphil> ssdv page anyway
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[09:12] <ibanezmatt13> cool :)
[09:12] <fsphil> there was to be a flight today iirc
[09:12] <fsphil> or did I remember that wrong
[09:12] <HixWork_> fsphil, not in stock as usual, but these are really good value http://uk.farnell.com/jsp/search/productdetail.jsp?CMP=comingsoon_email&sku=2251946
[09:14] Nick change: HixWork_ -> HixWork
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[09:15] <ibanezmatt13> fsphil, I now have my program sending a packet, then a line of telemetry. It's going really well. However, I really need to sort it into functions at some point later today, it looks really untidy
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[09:21] <fsphil> HixWork: ooh that is good
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[09:27] <LazyLeopard> Mental note: If ever developing SSDV code, take care where the camera's pointing when testing. ;)
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[09:28] Nick change: Randomskk_ -> Randomskk
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[09:32] <HixWork> heh LazyLeopard
[09:32] <Upu> ping cuddykid
[09:32] <Upu> http://ava.upuaut.net/store/index.php?route=product/category&path=72
[09:32] <Upu> new hab amp if anyone was waiting for one
[09:32] <HixWork> fsphil, they are very reasonably priced, hence never in stock :/
[09:32] <cuddykid> cheers Upu :)
[09:32] <cuddykid> I'll get one ordered
[09:33] <Upu> 2-3 day lead time
[09:33] <fsphil> good advice LazyLeopard :)
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[09:34] <fsphil> Tenma a good brand?
[09:34] <fsphil> or one of those cheap-but-still-alright ones?
[09:35] <Randomskk> fsphil: tenma's a farnell brand iirc
[09:35] <HixWork> Upu - how are you modifying the Hammond enclosures?
[09:35] <Randomskk> good and cheap
[09:35] <Upu> I have a drill press
[09:35] <Upu> just three holes
[09:35] <Upu> I should put more margin on those takes me ages
[09:36] <HixWork> ok, I've been doing a bit of work with nickjohnson with Hammond enclosures, turns out its cheaper to get 25 modified by hammond than the std item from farnell
[09:36] <Upu> interesting
[09:37] <Upu> never thought about that
[09:38] <HixWork> we were shocked that a: its onlt 25 or more and b: its cheaper than a massive importer
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[09:38] <Upu> any details on the service ?
[09:38] <HixWork> well worth looking into. If you give me the hammond part number and some dims I can do you a CAD model to send them for quote
[09:38] <Upu> 1590H
[09:39] <HixWork> sorry no. Nick is the interface - I'm just a trained CAD monkey in this instance :)
[09:39] <Upu> http://uk.farnell.com/hammond/1590h/enclosure-diecast-52-5x38x31mm/dp/4273059
[09:39] <HixWork> k I'll look into the 1590H
[09:39] <Upu> thanks
[09:39] <HixWork> nps
[09:39] <fsphil> that's a neat service
[09:39] <HixWork> speak to nick re: ordering info
[09:39] <Upu> that would be ace as I suck at drilling
[09:39] <HixWork> they seem really good. They do screen printing aswell, though that isn't cheap
[09:40] <Upu> can imagine
[09:40] <HixWork> CNC>=Upu
[09:40] <Upu> lol not arguing that one
[09:43] <HixWork> http://dangerousprototypes.com/2013/05/24/tinkerers-tricorder-update/ is whats been brewing - could be of interest to a few HABers
[09:43] <HixWork> some proper info on the tool here: http://dangerousprototypes.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=5366&p=52355
[09:45] <Upu> be interested to see how he gets on with that
[09:46] <chrisstubbs> Upu I noticed much better performance last night from the chip antenna on the new board design
[09:47] <chrisstubbs> the ground plane on the GPS seems to have taken it from 7 sats to 10 or 11 :)
[09:47] <Upu> well imagine that :)
[09:47] <Upu> datasheets ftw :)
[09:47] <chrisstubbs> lol your training has paid off
[09:47] <HixWork> chrisstubbs, I was advised to ringfence the antenna area with vias too, stops RF leakage
[09:47] <Upu> he has
[09:48] <chrisstubbs> Yup done that too, another upu tip :)
[09:48] <HixWork> ok. Also look at AppCAD, free RF design and analysis tool, came highly recommended
[09:50] <chrisstubbs> Ah cool, will take a look at that
[09:50] <chrisstubbs> lol lead time on the rpi camera on farnell is nearly 4 months
[09:50] <Brace> hum
[09:51] <fsphil> yikes
[09:51] <Brace> I'd been thinking of buying a few of them to use as webcams in our garden birdboxes
[09:51] <Brace> I'll have to look at something else
[09:51] <fsphil> you'd be too late this season anyway
[09:51] <Brace> yeah
[09:51] <chrisstubbs> Actually looks like just over 3 months, stil far too long though
[09:51] <chrisstubbs> they are on ebay for £35 but only £16 from farnell
[09:51] <fsphil> I'm going to put a few in the boxes here
[09:51] <Brace> also planning on doing a hedgehog box
[09:52] <Brace> fsphil: how are you planning to power them?
[09:52] <fsphil> Brace: poor mans PoE
[09:52] <chrisstubbs> fsphil: apparently the pi webcam made a brief appearance on springwatch last night
[09:52] <Brace> I was planning on linking mine into wifi and running them off batteries
[09:52] <Brace> but I thought that'd be expensive with batteries
[09:53] <fsphil> single cat5, two pairs for network and the other two for power
[09:53] <Brace> i.e. I'd like them to be totally wireless
[09:53] <chrisstubbs> Brace: could use rechargable SLA's or somthing
[09:53] <fsphil> solar
[09:53] <Brace> solar? you could run a pi of solar?
[09:53] <fsphil> and a battery
[09:53] <chrisstubbs> with a big enough panel and regulator!
[09:54] <chrisstubbs> one of those caravan ones topping up a car battery would work a treatr
[09:54] <fsphil> yea
[09:54] <Brace> if so that'd be ace, put a panel on the top of the bird box
[09:54] <fsphil> some way for the Pi to monitor voltage would be neat too, have it shut down if it's too low
[09:54] <cn8dn> please lien modul gps
[09:54] <chrisstubbs> perhaps my solution is a little extreme
[09:54] <fsphil> wifi is neat too
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[09:55] <fsphil> I originally used a video sender but there was too much interference on 2.4ghz here
[09:55] <fsphil> wouldn't be as much of a problem on wifi
[09:55] <HixWork> Brace, http://goo.gl/6A41z & http://goo.gl/tkeVk
[09:55] <Brace> fsphil: it seemed like sensible idea when I was watching springwatch last night
[09:55] <Brace> and the wife went 'I want one of them'
[09:55] <fsphil> but a single cat5 cable would work a treat
[09:55] <Brace> and (stupidly went) I'll make you some
[09:55] <fsphil> hah
[09:55] <cn8dn> compatible arduinno
[09:55] <HixWork> s'what happened with me
[09:56] <HixWork> cn8dn, think the arduino is for channel control for multi cam setups
[09:56] <Brace> HixWork: that looks good
[09:56] <fsphil> you may need to modify the Pi cam, remove the IR filter
[09:56] <HixWork> they're not too bad at all
[09:56] <fsphil> or run it with white lights, making sure the lights switch off at night
[09:57] <HixWork> http://goo.gl/OX9RA is the 500mW that i bought though probably OTT
[09:57] <fsphil> solar powered lighting would be nifty
[09:57] <fsphil> a small PV panel powering a few LEDs
[09:58] <HixWork> Brace, this sony camera too http://goo.gl/PjPT5 f1.2!!! great low ligjht performance and no IR filter
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[09:58] <fsphil> if only wifi had longer range, we could stream the h264 from a payload
[09:58] <fsphil> it would be interesting to do it for at least launch though
[09:59] <fsphil> and maybe landing if the chase car was near enough
[09:59] <HixWork> http://goo.gl/L98wQ looks a pretty neat package too
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[10:01] <Brace> HixWork: yeah, does look good
[10:05] <cn8dn> HixWork, raspberry ok or arduino ? ref gps ?
[10:10] <GW8RAK> I'm assuming those cameras are fixed focus, so what is the depth of field like?
[10:16] <HixWork> depth of field is pretty poor tbh, though you can change lenses
[10:16] <HixWork> cn8dn, don't follow, sorry
[10:16] <HixWork> schoolboy error - don't hide the unrouted layer in eagle :/ 2 days working out why it was broken
[10:17] <GW8RAK> Does anyone have any recommendations on camera modules which will allow zoom and auto focus?
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[10:20] <eroomde> oh dear HixWork
[10:20] <HixWork> eagle? yup :/
[10:21] <eroomde> I'm speccing a valve for 4000 bar
[10:21] <eroomde> that actually hurts my head when i think about it
[10:22] <HixWork> little higher than a common rail injector then ;p
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[10:24] <SpeedEvil> eroomde: That's a lot of bars.
[10:24] <SpeedEvil> I'm guessing a really, really awesome pressure washer.
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[10:27] <eroomde> correct
[10:28] anerDev (~anerDev@ left irc: Quit: I'm going to sleep
[10:29] <HixWork> eroomde, that'll do it i reckon ;p http://goo.gl/I7poE
[10:32] Action: SpeedEvil realises that is right on the yield strength for structural steels.
[10:32] <SpeedEvil> You can blow bubbles with girders.
[10:33] <gonzo___> a whole flock of bars
[10:33] <gonzo___> (awaits sheep puns....)
[10:34] <HixWork> baaa, so obvious
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[10:34] <fsphil> sheep puns have been baaared
[10:34] <HixWork> don't try to pull the wool over our eyes
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[10:35] Action: SpeedEvil notes that wool prices have crashed to about 70p/kg.
[10:35] <GW8RAK> Make sure they don't fleece you over the price
[10:35] <SpeedEvil> Which is uneconomic.
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[10:51] <DrLuke> oh are we shearing sheep puns?
[10:52] <HixWork> yuo can cut that out
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[10:53] <chrisstubbs> this is baarmy
[10:53] <SpeedEvil> Sheep puns are the worst.
[10:53] <SpeedEvil> they make me all crotchety.
[10:53] <SpeedEvil> I wooldent like to hear any more.
[10:53] <HixWork> I've herd them all before
[10:55] <SpeedEvil> red card.
[10:57] <daveake> goat ewe jail
[10:58] <GW8RAK> Stop bleating about goats
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[11:07] <HixWork> get ovine it
[11:08] <GW8RAK> You had to work for that one! :)
[11:09] <GW8RAK> When it comes to goat puns, we can milk them to death
[11:11] <HixWork> billy for you
[11:11] <daveake> I'm not sure whether the wether likes the weather
[11:12] <HixWork> you should be castrated for that one
[11:13] <GW8RAK> Don't know what you're getting so gruff about?
[11:14] <daveake> You need angora management
[11:14] <GW8RAK> lol
[11:15] <GW8RAK> If you're going to be like that I'll got the udder IRC channel
[11:15] <GW8RAK> damn. I'll go to the udder etc
[11:16] <HixWork> this need rounding up
[11:20] <gonzo___> we shoudl try and shepherd this thread away
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[11:35] <cn8dn> http://www.ebay.fr/itm/Very-Small-MT3339-PA6C-GPS-multiwii-multirotor-arduino-flight-controller-/271079582518?pt=FR_YO_MaisonJardin_Bricolage_ElectroniqueComposants&hash=item3f1d9a2b36
[11:35] <cn8dn> good ?
[11:38] <Upu> not sure they work > 18km ?
[11:39] <Upu> http://ava.upuaut.net/store/index.php?route=product/category&path=59_60
[11:39] <Guest79872> Received email: Jens Pirnay "[UKHAS] Re: Balcan One Launch Announcement 02.06.2013"
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[11:42] <Guest79872> Received email: John Underwood "Re: [UKHAS] Launch announcement - Chalgrove 5/6/7 June - Vortex
[11:45] <Guest79872> Received email: David Akerman "Re: [UKHAS] Re: Balcan One Launch Announcement 02.06.2013"
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[11:56] <eroomde> what is up
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[11:58] <Geoff-G8DHE_> UpuWork Ah excellent the pre-amps are available! Ordered...
[12:01] <Upu> thanks
[12:01] <Upu> please bear with me on delivery
[12:01] <Upu> off ill atm and don't have any made
[12:05] <Geoff-G8DHE_> Let you off! Is it for delivery before the 14th ?
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[12:05] <Geoff-G8DHE_> next friday
[12:09] <Upu> oh yeah
[12:11] <Geoff-G8DHE_> That's allright then! Will be off in the campervan after that!
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[12:23] <SpeedEvil> http://phys.org/news/2013-06-all-solid-sulfur-based-battery-outperforms-lithium-ion.html - Ooooh
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[13:06] <LeoBodnar> we might be launching B-1 later today, can we get an approval please?
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[13:11] <chrisstubbs> LeoBodnar: try asking in #habhub
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[13:19] <number10> LeoBodnar: is B-1 likeley to float?
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[13:27] <fsphil> oooh a launch
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[13:30] <mfa298> question is whether it will get high enough for us to recieve it.
[13:30] <GW8RAK> B1 is presumably ibanezmatt13, but who is Habuino?
[13:30] <mfa298> I think B1 is LeoBodnar
[13:31] <fsphil> yea
[13:31] <mfa298> Matt_test is ibanezmatt13
[13:31] <GW8RAK> New name on me
[13:31] <fsphil> habuino I've no idea
[13:31] <LeoBodnar> Yeah, we might be launching in a few hours. Can't wait :)
[13:31] <fsphil> same setup as last time LeoBodnar?
[13:31] <LeoBodnar> Yes
[13:32] <fsphil> how do the predictions look?
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[13:32] <LeoBodnar> If we make it to the nearest lamppost it is a success
[13:32] <GW8RAK> I'm out tonight and you would have been my closest launch LeoBodnar.
[13:32] <fsphil> I flew one past you onece GW8RAK :)
[13:32] <LeoBodnar> More will come RAK
[13:32] <fsphil> once*
[13:32] <GW8RAK> I could probably rx you almost from the ground.
[13:32] Nick change: Maxell_ -> maxell
[13:33] <GW8RAK> I wasn't on air that day unfortunately
[13:33] <fsphil> if this wind turns around I'll be sending another
[13:33] <fsphil> it's heading in the opposite direction atm
[13:33] <fsphil> http://hourly.sanslogic.co.uk/ :(
[13:34] <fsphil> unless someone wants to drop a buoy in the atlantic? :)
[13:34] <GW8RAK> Oh, to have a yacht.
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[13:40] <gonzo___> A luxury yacht, called Raymond
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[13:47] <griffonbot> Received email: Andrew Myatt "Re: [UKHAS] Re: Balcan One Launch Announcement 02.06.2013"
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[13:53] <griffonbot> Received email: Anthony Stirk "Re: [UKHAS] Re: Balcan One Launch Announcement 02.06.2013"
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[13:53] <ibanezmatt13> Afternoon :) Just finished soldering some wires onto my regulator
[13:53] <ibanezmatt13> Can't use it today though, I don't have any batteries.
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[14:11] <ibanezmatt13> I still can't get the Pi Cam to save the images with different names. Even in Python, using a time stamp doesn't work.
[14:11] <fsphil> how are you trying to do it?
[14:11] <x-f> how come?
[14:12] <ibanezmatt13> I'm not sure why it's not working. I've tried pretty much everything I can think of.
[14:12] <ibanezmatt13> I've tried using an incrementing variable, a time stamp. But it doesn't seem to like the way I put it into the cammand
[14:12] <ibanezmatt13> command*
[14:13] <ibanezmatt13> os.system('raspistill -o /home/pi/to_transmit/' + time + '.jpg')
[14:13] <ibanezmatt13> time is a variable I've been experimenting with
[14:14] <mfa298> you might want to try seperating it into two steps
[14:14] <mfa298> create a variable for the filename: filename = /home/pi/to_transmit/' + time + '.jpg'
[14:14] <mfa298> then just use filename in the os.system call
[14:14] <ibanezmatt13> yeah I could try that.
[14:14] <mfa298> that way you can also print the filename it's supposed to be using as a debug message
[14:15] <ibanezmatt13> of course, yes. I'll just write this down
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[14:25] <Brace> personally, I'd just build the variable 'command' and pass that to os.system(command)
[14:25] <Brace> and do
[14:25] <Brace> command = 'command' + time + '.jpg'
[14:25] <Brace> but I'm definitely a python noob, so ignore if you want, just a random thought
[14:26] <Randomskk> really you should do os.system("rapistill -o /home/pi/to_transmit/{0}.jpg".format(int(time.time())))
[14:26] <Randomskk> or similar
[14:27] <Randomskk> I'd probably use datetime and strftime rather than an integer, but whatever goes
[14:27] <lz1dev> you can do -o -
[14:27] <lz1dev> and directly suck in the output
[14:27] <lz1dev> but hey
[14:27] <mfa298> Brace: for this it probably doesn't make much difference what's in the variable. Partly I just wanted to show the benefit of putting it in a variable to it can be printed out as a check
[14:28] <mfa298> never underestimate the power of being able to print out variables when debugging stuff
[14:31] <Brace> mfa298: yeah, I agree totally, that's what I'd do as well
[14:31] <Brace> hence putting it all in one variable, so you can print it, as you suggest
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[14:38] <Brace> but I'm definitely a python n00b, so I'm surprised that I knew that!
[14:40] <mfa298> the only python I've "written" is editing some of ibanezmatt13's code to show him better ways of doing things. But a lot of this is fairly standard coding skills (and I've used plenty of other languages)
[14:41] <Brace> fair enough. I've tried to learn to program lots over the years, but it's never really stuck until recently
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[14:41] <Brace> even managed to scrape through a Masters in CompSci
[14:41] <Brace> so I know a lot of the ideas and principles, but actually writing proper working code is often beyond me
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[14:45] <eroomde> just need an interesting project
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[14:47] <eroomde> it's very motivating once you have one
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[14:48] <mfa298> having a project you want to work on helps a lot.
[14:48] <mfa298> as well as finding ways to break it into managable chunks so you can see progress
[14:48] <Brace> yeah
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[14:48] Nick change: [1]Geoff-G8DHE -> Geoff-G8DHE_
[14:48] <Brace> definitely
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[14:49] <Brace> I used to try and write it all in one go and then wonder why nothing worked
[14:49] <Brace> writing line by line, function by function helps
[14:50] <Brace> also as my job I'm having to do a lot of programming (well, don't have to, but it helps and I want to learn)
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[15:15] <WillDuckworth> are there any updates at all on the ukhas conference?
[15:15] <Upu> no I need to pester James
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[15:25] <Laurenceb> any samaba gurus here?
[15:25] <Laurenceb> *samba
[15:25] <Laurenceb> i have a really weird error i can't fix
[15:25] <mfa298> samba is good at weird errors
[15:25] <Laurenceb> non of my server names seem to exist
[15:26] <LeoBodnar> we have a launch of B1 - 434.600MHz 50 baud, 7N2
[15:26] <x-f> now?
[15:26] <Laurenceb> [Thu Jun 6 16:19:02 2013 BST, 0 smb_server/smb/service.c:126:make_connection()]
[15:26] <Laurenceb> make_connection: couldn't find service <name>
[15:26] <Laurenceb> where <name> is name of my service
[15:26] <Laurenceb> any idea wtf just happened?
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[15:27] <LeoBodnar> yes now
[15:28] <mfa298> Laurenceb: only thing I can think of is that it's not loaded all the condig file. I think there is a program you can run to test the config is valid which might be worth trying
[15:28] <x-f> i see
[15:28] <x-f> LeoBodnar, good luck with the flight!
[15:28] <Laurenceb> mfa298: i see
[15:28] <Laurenceb> its a default config
[15:28] <Laurenceb> that share home directories
[15:29] <mfa298> it's been a while since I've really played with samba so i'm not really sure what else to suggest
[15:29] <Laurenceb> :(
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[15:29] <Laurenceb> im supposed to maintaining this thing :-/
[15:31] <Laurenceb> all i did was reboot now everything is hosed
[15:31] <mfa298> hmm, I suppose I should think about sticking an antenna out and see if I can hear this balloon.
[15:31] <Brace> Laurenceb: is samba running?
[15:31] <Laurenceb> i dunno
[15:31] <Brace> and is this on a linux server?
[15:31] <Laurenceb> yes
[15:31] <LeoBodnar> ta
[15:32] <Laurenceb> no
[15:32] <Laurenceb> looks like samba is quitting
[15:32] <Laurenceb> so whats leaving the log messages?
[15:32] <Brace> Ubuntu? Debian?
[15:32] <mfa298> LeoBodnar: I'm not sure if I'll hear much, it might be a bit too far away and might just be too far east for me to hear (I'm not in a good location for a lot of balloons)
[15:32] <Laurenceb> ubuntu 10.04
[15:32] <Laurenceb> udo restart smbd
[15:32] <Laurenceb> restart: Unknown instance:
[15:32] <Laurenceb> that suggests it is quitting
[15:33] <Laurenceb> somethign is causing it to quit
[15:33] <mfa298> Laurenceb: it might be worth running testparm
[15:33] <Brace> is that from /var/log/messages?
[15:33] <mfa298> as that should test the config and print out what it thinks the config should be doing
[15:33] <Brace> and have you tried a normal restart of samba?
[15:33] <Laurenceb> log is at /var/log/samba/samba.log
[15:34] <Laurenceb> how do i do a normal restart?
[15:34] <Brace> oh yeah, I see that you've tried the restart
[15:34] <mfa298> will "restart smbd" restart samba, I thought restart was normally used to restart the system
[15:35] <Brace> mfa298: no, on ubuntu is talks to the upstart initd
[15:35] <Brace> s/is/it
[15:35] <HixWork> LeoBodnar, have you just launched from the office car park ;p
[15:35] <mfa298> ok, obviously its doing something different to pretty much every other Linux / Unix
[15:36] <Brace> mfa298: that's the ubuntu way!
[15:36] <LeoBodnar> yes :)
[15:36] <Brace> but there are scripts in /etc/init.d/ which you can also use
[15:36] <Brace> Laurenceb: try stopping and then starting the smbd
[15:37] <Brace> sudo /etc/init.d/smbd stop
[15:37] <Brace> sudo /etc/init.d/smbd start
[15:37] <Laurenceb> ok
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[15:37] <Brace> cause sometimes services can get stuck
[15:37] <Brace> and won't respond to a restart
[15:37] <Laurenceb> well it gave a pid for the restarted service
[15:38] <Laurenceb> but [Thu Jun 6 16:37:44 2013 BST, 0 smb_server/smb/service.c:126:make_connection()]
[15:38] <Laurenceb> make_connection: couldn't find service
[15:38] <Laurenceb> testparm runs ok
[15:38] <Brace> Laurenceb: is smb still running then?
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[15:38] <Brace> pgrep -l smbd
[15:39] <Laurenceb> ooh
[15:39] <Laurenceb> nothing
[15:39] <Brace> shoud give you the pid
[15:39] <Brace> ok
[15:39] <Laurenceb> it must be quitting
[15:39] <Brace> well in /var/log/messages
[15:39] <Brace> or syslog
[15:39] <Brace> there might well be something saying why it's crashing straight away
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[15:40] <Brace> I know it's a naff way to fix things, but a reboot might be worth a try
[15:40] <HixWork> I used to run TOP and then kill the pid
[15:40] <HixWork> is that a bad thing to be doing?
[15:40] <Brace> HixWork: nope
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[15:40] <Brace> but at the moment, smbd isn't running at all
[15:41] <Laurenceb> nothing in syslog
[15:41] <Laurenceb> last stuff was a usb stick
[15:41] <Brace> messages?
[15:41] <Laurenceb> more usb
[15:42] <Laurenceb> ooh shit
[15:42] <Laurenceb> broken usb
[15:42] <Laurenceb> this is not good
[15:42] <Brace> does the smbd serve up data from the usb drive?
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[15:43] <Laurenceb> no
[15:43] <Laurenceb> this is unrelated
[15:43] <Brace> also in /var/log/samba/ there's lots of logs (which I thinkyou know)
[15:43] <Brace> any of them say anything useful?
[15:43] <Brace> oh
[15:43] <Laurenceb> bluetooth module went _bad_
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[15:44] <Laurenceb> no
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[15:44] <Laurenceb> nothing in messages from samba
[15:44] <mfa298> ls -ltr in /var/log/samba will show you the log files sorted by time - makes looking at the current ones a lot easier
[15:45] <mfa298> LeoBodnar: is it still transmitting ? I can't see anything in the waterfall yet.
[15:45] <Laurenceb> ah found it
[15:46] <Laurenceb> http://pastebin.com/x3cYv4Gf
[15:47] <mfa298> dumping core isn't a good sign
[15:47] <Laurenceb> yeah
[15:48] <Brace> odd that it can't open up the socket
[15:48] <mfa298> sounds like the system still things something is still listening on tcp/445
[15:48] <mfa298> it might just be in TIME_WAIT
[15:48] <Brace> Laurenceb: have you just updated the server?
[15:48] <Laurenceb> how do you mean updated?
[15:49] <Laurenceb> apt-get udate?
[15:49] <mfa298> "netstat -ntp" might show you what state that port it in
[15:49] <Brace> apt-get update or similar
[15:49] <Laurenceb> probably this morning...
[15:49] <Brace> there's a couople of threads on google about folk having issues post update
[15:49] <Laurenceb> tcp 0 0 ESTABLISHED 30917/gvfsd-smb-bro
[15:49] <Brace> I'm tempted to say that a reboot will fix tbh
[15:49] <Laurenceb> ^is that it?
[15:50] <Laurenceb> i see
[15:50] <Laurenceb> thats a mild pita
[15:50] <Brace> yup
[15:50] <Laurenceb> there are other services on here
[15:50] <Brace> I always reboot servers post upgrade
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[15:50] <Brace> to clear things down
[15:50] <Brace> and ensure that it'll reboot clean if there's a panic
[15:51] <Brace> also quite a few people saying
[15:51] <Brace> I did an update and it broke
[15:51] <Brace> and then did another and it started again
[15:52] <Brace> however
[15:52] <Brace> one thing you could do
[15:52] <Brace> is to kill that gvfsd-smb-bro
[15:53] <Laurenceb> i see
[15:53] <Brace> thats a odd gnome virtual file system thing
[15:53] <Brace> but I'm not sure why it's on your server
[15:54] <Brace> it's a gui thing iirc
[15:54] <Brace> pgrep gvfsd-smb-bro
[15:54] <Brace> and see if it comes up with 30917
[15:55] <mfa298> that looked to be on tcp/139 so probably isn't what samba was complaining about
[15:55] <mfa298> although gui programs on a server isn't good
[15:55] <Laurenceb> well ive got rid of it
[15:56] <Laurenceb> but it still looks like "bind failed on port 445"
[15:56] <Laurenceb> and on 139
[15:56] <Brace> netstat -vatn | grep 139
[15:57] <mfa298> might be worth a try of " netstat -n | grep 445
[15:57] <Brace> do you get anything from that?
[15:57] <Brace> yeah mfa298's command as well
[15:57] <Laurenceb> tcp 0 0* LISTEN
[15:58] <Laurenceb> yeah, both tcp listen
[15:58] <Brace> this link: https://bugzilla.redhat.com/show_bug.cgi?id=726936
[15:59] <Laurenceb> ill try the fix
[15:59] <Brace> talks about it being an ipv6 issue
[15:59] <mfa298> might be worth those two commands with a "p" as part of the netstat options as that should list the process listening
[15:59] <Brace> comment #3
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[15:59] <Brace> I've got to go now tho, I'm afraid
[15:59] <Laurenceb> thanks for the help
[16:00] <Laurenceb> really useful thanks
[16:00] <Brace> my normal troubleshooting method is to google the fudge out of it
[16:00] <Laurenceb> heh
[16:00] <Brace> so take the error messages and google away
[16:00] <Brace> it's a common prog, so you'll probably find out what to do eventually
[16:00] <Geoff-G8DHE> Is the B-1 flight today an extra one or what quite ?
[16:00] <mfa298> the LISTEN output on the ps command suggests something is running and using that port
[16:00] <Brace> also there's at least two people who had the issue post upgrade
[16:01] <Brace> and then upgraded again and it fixed it
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[16:01] <Laurenceb> arg
[16:01] <Laurenceb> #3 doesnt fix it
[16:01] <Brace> not ideal, but if all else fails
[16:01] <mfa298> Geoff-G8DHE: I think it was just announced on here just before launch (and some discussion of it possibly flying on here when he was asking about flight docs)
[16:01] <Brace> good luck
[16:02] <Geoff-G8DHE> Ah right can just see something on the waterfall with a 156Hz shift but weak at the mo...
[16:03] <Ugi> Don't seem to be many trackers online ATM - B-1 has been off the map for 15 mins.
[16:03] <Laurenceb> lol fixed it
[16:03] <mfa298> that's a pretty old bug report, you'de hope that ubuntu aren't doing things that fedora was doing last year
[16:03] <Laurenceb> manually unplugged ethernet
[16:03] <Laurenceb> then restarted
[16:03] <Ugi> Just got my 2nd hand radio & I wish I was not at work & could try it out!
[16:03] <Laurenceb> plug back in, process is running
[16:04] <mfa298> Ugi: there should be plenty of flights on Saturday
[16:04] <mfa298> which radio have you got ?
[16:04] <Ugi> Yes, I'll have to try for some of those.
[16:05] <Ugi> mfa298: old FT790 off e-bay.
[16:06] <mfa298> Ugi: nice, I think that's been a popular receiver with others so should work well
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[16:07] <Ugi> It seemed to be the cheapest way in barring software radio & I wasn't too sure how well that worked.
[16:08] <Ugi> I think the key thing is that it has the USB mode
[16:08] <eroomde> it's a fasnatic receiver
[16:08] <eroomde> really sensitive
[16:08] <eroomde> slightly more sensitive than the 817s on paper at least too
[16:08] <mfa298> the rtl-sdr's seem to be a bit hit and miss. FCD Pro+ is a good sdr reciever but has a price tag to match
[16:08] <Ugi> Well, we will see what state this one is in but it was receiveing _something_ when I put batteries into it last night
[16:08] <eroomde> we used one as our only radio for a good couple of years
[16:09] <HixWork> seriously, that cosycave E4000 dongle is better than my AR8000
[16:09] <Ugi> I need to work on a better antenna, I think but I hoped I might get something on the built-in if I took it outside.
[16:10] <SpeedEvil> 'Elon Musk (@elonmusk) tweeted:
[16:10] <mfa298> I've had limited success with my E4000 dongle but it was an earlier E4000 dongle.
[16:10] <HixWork> you'd be surprised how good a duck is outdoors
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[16:10] <SpeedEvil> now that's a kinda awesome tweet
[16:10] <mfa298> Ugi: with it outside you will probably hear something if you've got a reasonable location
[16:12] <Ugi> I'll have to find a hill to stand on!
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[16:12] <mfa298> Geoff-G8DHE: well done, looks like you're doing better than me at recieving this one than I am - seems to be fading a bit
[16:13] <Geoff-G8DHE> looks like the GPS has a problem on B-1 ?
[16:13] <Upu> oh forgot about that
[16:13] <Upu> what frequency is it on ?
[16:13] <Geoff-G8DHE> $$B-1,261,16:13:05,0.00000,0.00000,530,6,0.05,35*3677
[16:13] <Geoff-G8DHE> its on 434.602
[16:13] <mfa298> 434.600 ish
[16:14] <Geoff-G8DHE> Ah it has lock back again
[16:14] <Upu> very small shift
[16:14] <Upu> yeah got it
[16:14] <Geoff-G8DHE> very dodgy GPS as well
[16:15] <Geoff-G8DHE> the latitude now looks OK but Long is stuck on 0
[16:15] <Ugi> To the extent that I understand these things, doesn't that put it over somewhere south of Ghana!
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[16:15] <Upu> legit now
[16:15] Nick change: Upu -> Upu_M0UPU
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[16:16] <Upu_M0UPU> this is interested its a large latex party balloon I think
[16:16] <Geoff-G8DHE> very fluttery signal as well as a long fade time on it
[16:17] <mfa298> seems to be a pretty stable frequency though
[16:17] <Upu_M0UPU> yup
[16:17] <Upu_M0UPU> very narrow shift
[16:17] <Ugi> Did I read somewhere that those tiny cameras can affect GPS? Was planning on using one.
[16:17] <Upu_M0UPU> and boom goes the GPS again
[16:18] <Upu_M0UPU> yes they do
[16:18] <Upu_M0UPU> and you can test and it will be fine on the ground
[16:18] <Upu_M0UPU> if you use one put the tracker well away from it i.e 10 meters under it
[16:18] <Ugi> Always? Or some makes? Or unknown, I guess?
[16:18] <mfa298> Ugi there have been some issues (others have had little/no issues)
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[16:19] <Upu_M0UPU> lots of reports from the US as well
[16:19] <Ugi> Like put the camera right under the balloon & the box at the other end of the line?
[16:19] <SpeedEvil> yes
[16:20] <Ugi> Would it help to wrap it in foil?
[16:20] <Upu_M0UPU> yes that does help
[16:20] <HixWork> lead flashing ;p
[16:20] <Geoff-G8DHE> Foil doesn't help the lens much ;-)
[16:20] <Ugi> Or put it _below_ the GPS? - I guess satalites are above even a HAB!
[16:21] <Geoff-G8DHE> need a ground plane for the GPS antenna
[16:21] <eroomde> just slightly
[16:21] <LeoBodnar> we have some lat/long issues! how exciting :)
[16:21] <Ugi> Good point re lens! I was not meaning the _whole_ thing!
[16:21] <Upu_M0UPU> hey LeoBodnar
[16:21] <eroomde> you don't need ground planes for QFH (the common sarantel) gps antennas
[16:21] <Upu_M0UPU> predictor is set for 20km burst
[16:21] <HixWork> thinkn he's driving
[16:21] <Geoff-G8DHE> No but it helps keep noise out from below!
[16:21] <Upu_M0UPU> if its that party balloon I'm guess its will burst sooner
[16:22] <HixWork> oh hes back
[16:22] <eroomde> that's certainly true!
[16:22] <LeoBodnar> yes, we don't expect it to go high
[16:22] <LeoBodnar> stopped for now
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[16:22] <Upu_M0UPU> well garbage on GPS but still txing
[16:22] <Upu_M0UPU> sure that isn't coding ?
[16:23] <Upu_M0UPU> time is incrementing fine
[16:23] <LeoBodnar> we put it together in two days, no time for threads lock checks!
[16:23] <Upu_M0UPU> did you put it in flight mode ?
[16:23] <LeoBodnar> yes
[16:24] <SpeedEvil> If you're having locking problems - try some loctite.
[16:24] <Geoff-G8DHE> some drify to the high side as well
[16:25] <Upu_M0UPU> note for next time : a little more shift pls :)
[16:25] <Geoff-G8DHE> good decodes now but lat/long is the problem
[16:25] <Upu_M0UPU> interesting altitude seems ok though
[16:25] <Upu_M0UPU> and time
[16:25] <Geoff-G8DHE> 6350m for a pico is rather high ?
[16:25] <Upu_M0UPU> pico under a latex
[16:25] <eroomde> picoliarly high
[16:25] <Upu_M0UPU> don't expect it to get up to what a 100g hwoyee will do
[16:26] <LeoBodnar> ok, i thought narrow shift is better
[16:26] <Upu_M0UPU> larger ~ 350-500 is fine
[16:26] <Upu_M0UPU> its not a problem its decoding ok
[16:26] <HixWork> does a 100g neet a NOTAM?
[16:26] <Upu_M0UPU> yes
[16:26] <LeoBodnar> the whole payload with parachute was 47 grammes
[16:26] <Upu_M0UPU> they exceed 2 meter at burst
[16:26] <Upu_M0UPU> LeoBodnar you could get into the arhab top 10 lightest payloads with that
[16:27] <HixWork> bugger
[16:27] <Upu_M0UPU> anyway when you're done pics pls :)
[16:27] <LeoBodnar> Sure!
[16:27] <Upu_M0UPU> GPS is back
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[16:28] <Upu_M0UPU> hmm latest wind data brb
[16:28] <HixWork> Upu_M0UPU, http://leobodnar.com/files/IMG_1209.jpg & http://leobodnar.com/files/IMG_1210.jpg really sweet board
[16:28] <Upu_M0UPU> I meant as it was sent up :)
[16:28] <Upu_M0UPU> saw those yesterday
[16:28] <Upu_M0UPU> looks great
[16:28] <HixWork> ah oki
[16:29] <HixWork> yeah, backs up my U.FL plan
[16:30] <HixWork> woo hoo escape time. laters
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[16:33] <Geoff-G8DHE> Clmbing nicely http://360.g8dhe.net/hab_flights/B-1/
[16:34] <Geoff-G8DHE> very regular breaks in the GPS data when you look at the plot
[16:34] <Ugi> Completely different question - the NTX2 on HAB supplies says: Come and see us before you order this. Anyone know what that's all about?
[16:35] <eroomde> yes
[16:35] <eroomde> pm Upu
[16:35] <Upu_M0UPU> Yep
[16:35] <Upu_M0UPU> PM
[16:35] <Ugi> Care to share?
[16:35] <eroomde> pm upu
[16:35] <eroomde> like it says
[16:36] <LeoBodnar> must be tasks timing issues
[16:36] <Upu_M0UPU> odd the time and altitude are both ok though
[16:36] <Geoff-G8DHE> back on again
[16:38] <Geoff-G8DHE> LeoBodnar Are you habdling the Lat/Long differently in a seperate thread ?
[16:40] <craag> gmail on android now shows convo participants profile pics next to the convo email in inbox
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[16:41] <craag> everwhere i scroll, theres a upu staring at me!
[16:41] <LeoBodnar> There is a lot of going on in the code and it is all written in assembly :)
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[16:41] <LeoBodnar> No wonder
[16:41] <Geoff-G8DHE> Ah right!
[16:43] <LeoBodnar> HixWork, are you there
[16:43] <Upu_M0UPU> I think he left for the day
[16:43] <Upu_M0UPU> 434.602
[16:44] <griffonbot> @AnthonyStirk: B-1 in the air right now 434.602Mhz any listeners appreciated #ukhas [http://twitter.com/AnthonyStirk/status/342683485129035776]
[16:44] <LeoBodnar> We have two transmitters on board
[16:45] <Upu_M0UPU> is there another frequency ?
[16:45] <Geoff-G8DHE> Oh where is the other one
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[16:45] <LeoBodnar> It's a very low power tracker on 105.66MHz
[16:45] <Upu_M0UPU> haha
[16:45] <Upu_M0UPU> ok I'll give that one a miss
[16:45] <LeoBodnar> Ignore that
[16:46] <Upu_M0UPU> thats Balgalore FM or something round here
[16:46] <Geoff-G8DHE> Ah outside my 2MHz tuning then!
[16:46] <LeoBodnar> 146.8 MHz
[16:46] <Geoff-G8DHE> could put the other dongle on if I had known!
[16:46] <Upu_M0UPU> yeah filtered for 70cms sorry
[16:46] <craag> 146.8?
[16:46] <LeoBodnar> It's not a tracker, just beeping beacon
[16:47] <Geoff-G8DHE> That's something missing in the pre-amps a pass thru option
[16:47] <craag> That is soon to be a ham band, what is it now?
[16:47] <Upu_M0UPU> I know its been mentioned Geoff-G8DHE
[16:47] <G8KNN> just audible on 146.798
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[16:50] <LeoBodnar> It's 30msec beeps with about 1.5 sec period
[16:51] <G8KNN> yup, sounds like that here
[16:51] <Upu_M0UPU> can't here it here on a colinear
[16:51] <G8KNN> it's quite weak here
[16:53] <bertrik> some animal trackers are in the 2m band and they do beep with about that length and period
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[16:57] <Geoff-G8DHE> Any pictures of this balloon arrangment ?
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[16:59] <LeoBodnar> later tonight
[16:59] <Upu_M0UPU> ok off to walk dog bbs
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[17:08] <Geoff-G8DHE> Oh is that intended I think not carrier only
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[17:13] <iain_G4SGX> Now very wobbly carrier.. burst?
[17:13] <Geoff-G8DHE> Could be
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[17:17] <Geoff-G8DHE> bbl
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[17:19] <Upu_M0UPU> oh dear
[17:20] <cuddykid> hi Upu_M0UPU - at some point, could you briefly run through the stuff for this hab amp
[17:21] <cuddykid> I don't have an SMA connector on the end of this dongle
[17:21] <Upu_M0UPU> ok
[17:21] <Upu_M0UPU> you'll need a converter of some sort
[17:23] <cuddykid> do you have any or shall I look on ebay?
[17:23] <Ugi> That's a point too - do I need a pre-amp for my new (old) FT790 or do they help for SDR only?
[17:23] <cuddykid> in fact, not sure what the connector is on it
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[17:24] <cuddykid> https://www.cosycave.co.uk/product.php?id_product=267
[17:24] <cuddykid> ^ that's what I've got
[17:24] <Upu_M0UPU> belling leee
[17:24] <Upu_M0UPU> -e
[17:24] <cuddykid> "Terrestrial Antenna Input"
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[17:37] <chrisstubbs> cuddykid, depending how handy you are feeling with your soldering, you can get a long end launch SMA connector to replace the antenna socket
[17:38] <cuddykid> chrisstubbs: good idea - however, 1 problem - I'm well known for destroying things soldering haha
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[17:38] <chrisstubbs> haha yeah i think i had to use some wick to get up all the soder around the edges first
[17:38] <chrisstubbs> its not too difficult
[17:38] <fsphil> soldering in the first degree
[17:38] <cuddykid> chrisstubbs: might try that
[17:39] <fsphil> http://spaceinimages.esa.int/var/esa/storage/images/esa_multimedia/images/2013/06/liftoff_of_ariane_5_va213_with_atv-44/12869870-4-eng-GB/Liftoff_of_Ariane_5_VA213_with_ATV-4.jpg
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[17:40] <chrisstubbs> cuddykid, something like this http://bit.ly/16NbtsW
[17:40] <chrisstubbs> rip off postage
[17:40] <cuddykid> Upu sells them I believe too
[17:40] <cuddykid> cheers
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[17:43] <fsphil> it's unusual to see so few trackers on the map
[17:43] <chrisstubbs> fsphil, thanks for reminding me, need to buy a longer 3.5mm cable
[17:43] <fsphil> yes. np :)
[17:44] <chrisstubbs> this calls for some more horrific quality ebay cables
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[17:44] <fsphil> is it worth it really?
[17:46] <chrisstubbs> I guess we will find out!
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[17:50] <Upu_M0UPU> carrier is fading
[17:50] <Upu_M0UPU> possibly close to being down
[17:50] <LeoBodnar> ionosphere?
[17:51] <Upu_M0UPU> gone
[17:51] <Upu_M0UPU> no below my horizon
[17:51] <fsphil> gps fail again?
[17:51] <Upu_M0UPU> you should be able to DF it if you have a Yagi
[17:51] <fsphil> just noticed the timestamp
[17:51] <Upu_M0UPU> stopped transmitting data
[17:52] Nick change: daveake_ -> daveake
[17:52] <Upu_M0UPU> actually can still see it very faintly
[17:53] <Upu_M0UPU> now its gone
[17:53] <daveake> Wossup? Saw Upu's call on twitter so I quickly set up but got nowt.
[17:54] <Upu_M0UPU> has been carrier only since 16:07
[17:54] <Upu_M0UPU> err 18:07
[17:54] <Upu_M0UPU> think its down now
[17:54] <daveake> ah ok
[17:54] <daveake> that explains it then
[17:54] <Upu_M0UPU> yup :)
[17:55] <KT5TK_QRL> Upu: http://kt5tk.wordpress.com/2013/06/06/ublox-max-6q-vs-max7c-comparison/
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[17:57] <griffonbot> @DAnastase: 10 ans #Festipop ! Frontignan (34) les 6 & 7 septembre #CUSF ( Culture Urbaine Sans Frontière) http://t.co/JlTiccgW6d [http://twitter.com/DAnastase/status/342701867857481728]
[17:57] <fsphil> hmm
[17:59] <chrisstubbs> There does appear to be a balloon in their logo think
[17:59] <chrisstubbs> *thing
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[18:07] <GadgetDroid> Evening all
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[18:09] <GadgetDroid> Upu in
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[18:57] <ibanezmatt13> Good evening :)
[18:58] <fsphil> it is a bit
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[18:58] <ibanezmatt13> what's the frequency of the B-1?
[18:58] <fsphil> it's landed
[18:59] <fsphil> stopped transmitting data shortly after launch
[18:59] <ibanezmatt13> ah right
[18:59] <fsphil> well I say shortly, 1.5 hours
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[19:01] <ibanezmatt13_> By the way, once I solder the wires from the regulator to my Pi's TP1 and TP2 points, will I still in the future be able to power it off the mains?
[19:03] <ibanezmatt13_> Did B-1 stop transmitting due to not going into flight mode like Balcan 1?
[19:03] <daveake> Just use a 9V DC regulator into the Vin on the regulator
[19:04] <fsphil> don't know why it stopped
[19:05] <ibanezmatt13_> So if I detach the switching reg I have, will I be able to plug it into the mains again without affecting it?
[19:05] <daveake> of course then you're back where you started
[19:05] <fsphil> if you've not modified the Pi it'll work as before
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[19:06] <ibanezmatt13_> Yeah, I thought so. It's just, I may want to use it for something in the house if I ever recover it so I was just making sure :)
[19:06] <ibanezmatt13_> I'm currently transmitting telemetry between packets on spacenear.us/tracker and ssdv.habhub.org
[19:06] <Upu_M0UPU> ping GadgetDroid
[19:07] Nick change: Upu_M0UPU -> Upu
[19:07] <GadgetDroid> How goes
[19:07] <Upu> hah
[19:07] <Upu> could be worse I guess
[19:07] <Upu> how's you ?
[19:08] <jcoxon> evening all
[19:08] <Upu> evening jcoxon
[19:08] <fsphil> howdy
[19:09] <Upu> did you get my mail by any chance ?
[19:09] <jcoxon> yeah
[19:09] <jcoxon> been oncall
[19:09] <jcoxon> haven't powered it up
[19:09] <GadgetDroid> Not bad. Any news on amps
[19:09] <Upu> ok if you could just power up the recrystalled one and tune in ~ 434.475 I think
[19:09] <Upu> and just wait for 20 lines and tell me if it reboots properly I'd really appreciate it
[19:10] <jcoxon> will do
[19:10] <Upu> Hi GadgetDroid if you mean the ADS-B on, Darkside has one for testing now
[19:10] <number10> evening jcoxon
[19:10] <Upu> sorry been off work all week with salmonella or something similar
[19:10] <Upu> so not had chance to make the other one up
[19:10] <GadgetDroid> Cool. Still happy to test when your ready
[19:11] <Upu> I'll see if I can knock one up next week
[19:11] <Upu> the new 433Mhz versions are on the shop
[19:11] <GadgetDroid> OK.
[19:11] <GadgetDroid> Wondering about trying one of these http://www.conrad-uk.com/ce/en/product/190073/Aurel-650200313-433MHz-Radio-Kit
[19:12] <Upu> quite neat
[19:12] <Upu> but you can make one for £1.50 :)
[19:12] <GadgetDroid> Sure. Its all about time
[19:13] <Upu> I know
[19:13] <GadgetDroid> Wondered about cutting down for ads
[19:14] <jcoxon> haha http://www.conrad-uk.com/ce/en/product/123344/Basetech-BSK-100-Endoscope/?ref=detview1&rt=detview1&rb=1
[19:14] <Upu> every house should have one
[19:14] <jcoxon> "Not suitable for use on humans and animals! "
[19:14] <jcoxon> disappointing
[19:14] <Upu> ping daveake
[19:15] <Upu> The bandwagon has passed so I've decided to power up my RPi
[19:15] <Upu> what O/S should I put on it ?
[19:15] <GadgetDroid> Raspian is pretty good imho
[19:15] <fsphil> it's the best supported
[19:16] <Upu> sounds good to me
[19:16] <GadgetDroid> Or rasplex if you want plex
[19:16] <Upu> going to make a Stratum 1 NTP server for giggles
[19:16] <Upu> whats plex ?
[19:16] <fsphil> pidora is nice too, remix of fedora
[19:17] <GadgetDroid> NTP is good :-)
[19:17] <ibanezmatt13_> Looking at ssdv.habhub.org I'm trying to work out the resolution of the images used on PIE6. That's the resolution I would prefer but it doesn't say
[19:17] <fsphil> you'll need to get a small screen and write a program to display a clock Upu
[19:18] <fsphil> I'm sure the browser will say if you right click on them and go to properties
[19:18] <GadgetDroid> Nah, nixi tubes
[19:18] <fsphil> never saw the attraction of nixi's
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[19:18] <ibanezmatt13_> fsphil: of course...
[19:19] <Upu> yeah that a nice idea
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[19:20] <fsphil> a RPi.A would be cheaper than my radio controlled clock
[19:20] <daveake> pong Upu
[19:20] <Upu> see if I can drive a 2 x 16 LCD
[19:20] <fsphil> though a PSU, SD card and screen would push it over
[19:20] <Upu> hi Dave its ok
[19:20] <Upu> you can go back to sleep thanks
[19:20] Action: daveake returns to sleep
[19:20] <fsphil> return(sleep)
[19:21] <daveake> me.sleep(many hours)
[19:21] <GadgetDroid> Adafruit i2c rgb LCD would be my choice
[19:21] <fsphil> easy to interface
[19:21] <Upu> lovely :)
[19:22] <Upu> all ideas :)
[19:22] <Upu> I have to get a Pi working first
[19:22] <fsphil> needs an old bell alarm, just for a retro touch
[19:22] <GadgetDroid> Cool idea
[19:23] <fsphil> such a loud alarm probably wouldn't be that healthy
[19:23] <GadgetDroid> http://www.argos.co.uk/m/static/Product/partNumber/2552271.htm
[19:24] <Upu> out of the box does RPi get an IP and open SSH ?
[19:24] <mfa298> you could always grab a recording of a suitable bell and play it back, not as fun but could be quieter
[19:24] <Upu> as I don't have a cable for the video
[19:24] <russss> Upu: yes, raspbian does
[19:24] <daveake> yes
[19:24] <fsphil> it does dhcp
[19:24] <russss> username pi, password raspberry
[19:24] <mfa298> rasbian i think you have to enable ssh
[19:24] <Upu> super
[19:24] <fsphil> yea not sure on ssh
[19:24] <daveake> no it's enabled by default
[19:24] <russss> ssh is on by default
[19:24] <fsphil> nmap'll find it
[19:24] <mfa298> but there's a config tool to easily turn it on (and do other stuff)
[19:25] <fsphil> GadgetDroid: perfect
[19:25] <GadgetDroid> Be interesting to work out how to get it working electronically
[19:27] <fsphil> it might be possible to get one from an old phone
[19:27] <fsphil> they had something very similar
[19:27] <SpeedEvil> grab what?
[19:28] <fsphil> the bell
[19:29] <GadgetDroid> Quite like the visual of the hammer though
[19:30] <SpeedEvil> Oh
[19:30] <fsphil> yea
[19:32] <GadgetDroid> http://www.gizmodo.com.au/2012/10/old-fashioned-bell-guarantees-youll-never-sleep-through-your-alarm/
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[19:32] <LeoBodnar> Hi all
[19:32] <Upu> hey Leo
[19:33] <Upu> any news ?
[19:33] <LeoBodnar> B-1 payload tracked down and successfully recovered!
[19:33] <fsphil> congrats
[19:33] <LeoBodnar> Ta!
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[19:33] <Upu> oh nice one how did you manage that ?
[19:33] <Upu> backup ?
[19:34] <LeoBodnar> luckily UF was stuck with CW carrier on
[19:34] <LeoBodnar> With extreme direction finding :) we had two trackers on it
[19:34] <LeoBodnar> UHF
[19:34] <LeoBodnar> lots to debrief
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[19:36] <fsphil> ah sweet
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[19:40] <LeoBodnar> Are RF22 modules from Hope known for crashing and locking up? I am using the same bare chip on my tracker...
[19:40] <chrisstubbs> LeoBodnar, if they are subject to low temps for a long time
[19:40] <chrisstubbs> its a good idea to power cycle them every 50 or so lines
[19:41] <mattbrejza> one theory is that its due to the crystal rather than the ic
[19:41] <mattbrejza> its aloways a good idea to power cycle but they ahve still died
[19:42] <Upu> The issue with the RFM22B's is the crystal
[19:42] <Upu> if it gets too cold they hang
[19:42] <LeoBodnar> Crystal was OK because I had a carrier going and stuck
[19:42] <Upu> not usually an issue on a short duration flight
[19:42] <Upu> true
[19:42] <Upu> in answer
[19:42] <Upu> yes
[19:42] <Upu> my code reboots it every 20 telemetry lines
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[19:43] <mattbrejza> sounds like the micro stopped rather than the radio?
[19:44] <LeoBodnar> It's still powered up and running undisturbed and waiting to be probed.
[19:44] <LeoBodnar> To see if micro still runs
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[19:46] <LeoBodnar> OK, thanks for the hints
[19:46] <mattbrejza> btw add a watchdog to future code
[19:46] <LeoBodnar> yes, good idea
[19:48] <Upu> Evening Nik if your lurking :)
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[19:50] <Upu> did you note coordinates of the landing LeoBodnar ?
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[19:55] <LeoBodnar_> Landing of B-1 was here http://maps.google.co.uk/maps?q=52.307173,-0.978639&hl=en&ll=52.308715,-0.971346&spn=0.007399,0.01929&sll=51.518718,-0.110702&sspn=0.12049,0.308647&t=h&z=16
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[20:01] <ibanezmatt13_> I've just got four pieces of this sized stripboard: http://sdrv.ms/11krrBY I've started marking on it in pencil where I'm gonna solder everything, but I really don't think I know how to do it exactly. Would it be a problem if the GPS and NTX2 where on the same board?
[20:01] <LeoBodnar_> see you guys later
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[20:02] <fsphil> not really ibanezmatt13_
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[20:02] <Lunar_Lander> hell
[20:02] <fsphil> gps will be happy as long as the antenna has no metal near it
[20:02] <Lunar_Lander> +o
[20:02] <Lunar_Lander> xD
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[20:02] <fsphil> bad day Lunar_Lander ? :)
[20:02] <Lunar_Lander> no, just a mistype xD
[20:02] <fsphil> lol
[20:02] <anerDev> Hi guys !
[20:02] <fsphil> evening anerDev
[20:02] <Upu> well I guess it burst about 15km them Leo
[20:02] <anerDev> Arrived balloon and parachute
[20:03] <anerDev> finished cad of polistyrene box
[20:03] <anerDev> and I'm waiting autorization of Italy Air Force for the launch ! =D
[20:03] <ibanezmatt13_> fsphil: thanks. I'll try and draw up a schematic for my veroboard prototype and send it to you.
[20:03] <Upu> tbh fsphil Babs stuck the antenna right over the Arduino and it worked fine
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[20:04] <fsphil> Upu: interesting .. I've had it misbehave with wires near it
[20:04] <fsphil> though the wire was resting on the plastic cap
[20:05] <fsphil> might just be a bit too near
[20:05] <Upu> http://www.flickr.com/photos/91049302@N00/8626444876/in/set-72157632733154985
[20:06] <ibanezmatt13_> that is pretty close :)
[20:06] <fsphil> yikes
[20:06] <fsphil> I wonder what I did then
[20:07] <fsphil> will have to do a little experiment
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[20:22] <ibanezmatt13_> fsphil: http://sdrv.ms/1121Gao
[20:22] <ibanezmatt13_> I've never been very good at these things...
[20:23] <ibanezmatt13_> The black rectangle at top represents NTX2
[20:23] <ibanezmatt13_> Imagine the lines of notepad are lines on veroboard
[20:24] <ibanezmatt13_> The pink lines represent normal wire
[20:24] <fsphil> looks ok at first glance
[20:25] <ibanezmatt13_> the headers will be used on a prototype board. If it works, I'll make the real thing permanent. Are there any possible improvments that could be considered?
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[20:25] <LeoBodnar> evening all
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[20:26] <ibanezmatt13_> Hello Leo
[20:26] <eroomde> hi Leo
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[20:26] <eroomde> have you managed a recovery?
[20:26] <eroomde> it's difficult to keep track of flights during work hours :)
[20:27] <fsphil> weekday launches certainly don't get the same attention
[20:28] <mfa298> especially with little notice
[20:28] <ibanezmatt13_> What's the best thing to use to mark a circuit onto some veroboard before soldering? I thought pencil, but I'm not sure
[20:29] <fsphil> I used a pencil on the top
[20:29] <ibanezmatt13_> not the copper side?
[20:29] <fsphil> nah, best to keep those clean
[20:29] <eroomde> it doesn;t really stick
[20:29] <ibanezmatt13_> ok, thanks.
[20:29] <eroomde> + yes, what fsphil says
[20:29] <fsphil> just remember it's backwards, or you'll have a few D'oh moments
[20:30] <mfa298> I've just tended to draw the layout on squared paper and then follow that when soldering onto the board
[20:30] <fsphil> done that a few times
[20:30] <ibanezmatt13_> I'll be careful :)
[20:31] <eroomde> and translating between top layer and bottom layer is a happy mental challenge
[20:31] <ibanezmatt13_> happy :)
[20:31] <eroomde> i'm really bad at it
[20:32] <eroomde> every so often i get a footprint mirror imaged on a pcb
[20:32] <ibanezmatt13_> I imagine I'll be terrible! :')
[20:32] <fsphil> one tip, when cutting a line of tracks, do it on two lines if you have space
[20:32] <LeoBodnar> Yes, we have found the payload with stuck UHF carrier signal via direction finding -3 element yagi.
[20:33] <fsphil> a straight line of cut tracks creates a weakness in the board
[20:33] <eroomde> excellent
[20:33] <ibanezmatt13_> So according to my diagram, how should I cut them? With a file?
[20:33] <fsphil> you can get a tool for that
[20:33] <ibanezmatt13_> ah right, does it have a name?
[20:33] <fsphil> or some people use a drill bit or screwdriver
[20:34] <fsphil> http://cpc.farnell.com/unbranded/22-0239g/spot-face-cutter/dp/PC00066
[20:34] <fsphil> or cheaper, http://cpc.farnell.com/duratool/3360568a/cutter-track/dp/PC01227
[20:35] <eroomde> i use a drill with a screwdriver
[20:35] <eroomde> but i reground the angle of the drill to be a bit flatter
[20:35] <eroomde> do it doesn;t dig in too far to the fibreglass
[20:35] <mfa298> I think I've just used a sharp knife, but be careful of fingers
[20:35] <LeoBodnar> Here is a page with some photos from today. http://leobodnar.com/balloons/B-1/ Thanks to everybody who helped while tracking it down. :)
[20:35] <ibanezmatt13_> Thanks for that, I'll have a think. I need to get some headers for testing which the male to female jumper wires will fit into from the GPIO pins on the Pi to the header? Do they have to be a particular size, I'm sure if I know the size I could find some on ebay pretty cheap.
[20:36] <fsphil> 2.54mm
[20:36] <eroomde> LeoBodnar: so you're in silverstone?
[20:36] <ibanezmatt13_> thanks :)
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[20:37] <fsphil> cute payload
[20:37] <ibanezmatt13_> in fact, I may already have some headers...
[20:38] <LeoBodnar> yes, we are. The recovery man is Pete Brown my business partner, not me.
[20:38] <eroomde> very cute payload
[20:38] <eroomde> i imagine working there is quite fun
[20:39] <LeoBodnar> madness and fun at once :)
[20:40] <LeoBodnar> We flew with LiPo battery in the end.
[20:40] <eroomde> we're not too far away at westcott, on the a41 between bicester and aylesbury
[20:40] <LeoBodnar> Both trackers were on Lipos
[20:40] <LeoBodnar> I am amazed the one on the outside of the payload has survived
[20:41] <ibanezmatt13_> fsphil: http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/2x-One-Row-40-Pin-Female-Header-2-54mm-Pitch-/111051240676?pt=UK_BOI_Electrical_Components_Supplies_ET&hash=item19db2b74e4 could I break these apart as required?
[20:42] <SpeedEvil> yes
[20:43] <ibanezmatt13_> excellent, thanks
[20:43] <LeoBodnar> eroomde drop in when you are near to say hi :)
[20:43] <SpeedEvil> The easy way is with a sharp chisel
[20:43] <SpeedEvil> but you can do it with anything ifyou're willing to screw one of the pins up
[20:44] <mfa298> a pair of pliers (or two) might do a reasonable job.
[20:44] <mfa298> you might want a small file to clean up the end afterwards
[20:45] <ibanezmatt13_> thanks a lot, I'll make sure I'm prepared :)
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[20:49] <fsphil> ibanezmatt13: all your images have an ID of 0
[20:50] <fsphil> they're overlapping on the live page
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[20:55] <anerDev> good night guys
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[21:55] <LeoBodnar> It turned out PIC has locked up on the B-1 payload. UHF chip and GPS modules were OK.
[21:56] <Randomskk> queue comments about PICs... now
[21:57] <Ugi> You recovered the B-1 payload?
[21:57] <Ugi> How high did it get?
[21:57] <fsphil> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9SK0QyHcCIw
[21:58] <LeoBodnar> Well, I had another VHF tracker strapped to the OUTSIDE of the payload and it still works now flawlessly. It uses PIC but different model. http://leobodnar.com/balloons/B-1/Images/18.jpg
[21:59] <LeoBodnar> Ugi, 10878 m
[21:59] <Ugi> That's pretty good for a party balloon isn't it!
[22:00] <LeoBodnar> Yeah! I thought it won't go that high
[22:00] <SpeedEvil> Did you inflate it to normal sort of levels?
[22:00] <SpeedEvil> What was the ascent?
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[22:02] <LeoBodnar> We have inflated it to have 20g buoyancy and ascent rate was 1.5m/s on average
[22:02] <SpeedEvil> :)
[22:02] <LeoBodnar> Is it too slow? :)
[22:02] <Lunar_Lander> cool
[22:02] <LeoBodnar> Recovery was 30 min before sunset. Perfect timing .
[22:03] <Upu> interesting to know what the mode of failure was
[22:03] <Upu> always helps to get it back
[22:03] <Randomskk> neat looking payload!
[22:03] <LeoBodnar> I think internal oscillator on PIC has stopped
[22:03] <Upu> it probably went higher than 11km
[22:03] <Upu> my guess is 15km
[22:03] <Upu> oh yeah don't use internal oscillators
[22:04] <Ugi> I'm going to turn in - good to hear that you got the payload back.
[22:04] <Ugi> 'night all
[22:04] <Upu> you can use the XOUT on the Si chip
[22:04] <Upu> some how
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[22:05] <LeoBodnar> Ugi has left but I had the XOUT on the wrong pin of the PIC - too late for Rev.A nahge
[22:05] <LeoBodnar> change
[22:05] <KT5TK_QRL> LeoBodnar: which Si chip did you use?
[22:05] <LeoBodnar> Thanks Randomskk
[22:06] <LeoBodnar> Si4032
[22:06] <KT5TK_QRL> OK, I use Si4464/Si4463
[22:07] <LeoBodnar> Let me check my notes.
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[22:07] <LeoBodnar> I have Si4060 slated for new design.
[22:08] <KT5TK_QRL> Here is how you can connect an external oscillator to the XOUT: http://kt5tk.files.wordpress.com/2013/05/pecanpico3.pdf
[22:08] <LeoBodnar> It's more efficient at +10dBm if you don't want +20dBm power
[22:08] <KT5TK_QRL> Likely all Si chips use the same general layout for the oscillator
[22:08] <KT5TK_QRL> http://kt5tk.wordpress.com/2013/05/14/pecanpico3/
[22:09] <KT5TK_QRL> I had trouble when I tried to connect to Xin
[22:09] <KT5TK_QRL> a 22 ... 47 pF capacitor is fine
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[22:11] <LeoBodnar> Thanks for the ideas. I have Si outputting 15MHz clock but it is used for PIC baudot timing instead of running the whole chip
[22:12] <LeoBodnar> I don't know why, I am used to use internal PIC oscillators, this one has 0.5% tolerance. Shame it stopped.
[22:12] <KT5TK_QRL> 2 things may be critical for this:
[22:12] <KT5TK_QRL> 1. Oscillation may stop at low temperature
[22:13] <LeoBodnar> Good board!
[22:13] <SpeedEvil> REad the datasheet carefully. Some say 'need recalibration on temperature change'
[22:13] <KT5TK_QRL> 2.) voltage may drop at low temperature so that the oscillator comes out of the comfortable voltage range
[22:13] <SpeedEvil> Not specifically talking about pics
[22:13] <LeoBodnar> Good looking PCB KT5TK_QRL
[22:14] <KT5TK_QRL> Yours certainly too
[22:14] <KT5TK_QRL> It's an APRS tracker though
[22:14] <LeoBodnar> Watchdogs, watchdogs, watchdogs
[22:15] <LeoBodnar> I am usually a careful datasheet reader, will go through it again
[22:15] <KT5TK_QRL> I have started playing with a tiny RTC on PecanPico3, but I haven't written code for that yet. It's supposed to be used as a watchdog as well
[22:16] <KT5TK_QRL> Those are the 8 pads between the uBlox and the VCXO
[22:18] <LeoBodnar> Why do use xtal on Atmega? Can you run it off vcxo? Frequency shift is too small to affect timing
[22:19] <KT5TK_QRL> Because the VCXO is off most of the time for power saving
[22:20] <LeoBodnar> I see, I wondered what were those pads?
[22:20] <LeoBodnar> :)
[22:20] <LeoBodnar> So APRS uses burst transmissions, not modulated CW?
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[22:22] <KT5TK_QRL> Yes, that stupid APRS requires AFSK
[22:22] <KT5TK_QRL> Therefore I modulate it with the VCXO
[22:22] <KT5TK_QRL> with audio generated from the ATmega
[22:23] <LeoBodnar> I see, can you not shift frequency of the Si PLL?
[22:23] <LeoBodnar> Si4464 has 14.3Hz freq resolution
[22:23] <KT5TK_QRL> Well, you could use the four frequency states of 4GFSK
[22:24] <LeoBodnar> I need to go read APRS details I guess :)
[22:24] <KT5TK_QRL> but that requires some tricks to get around the built in API
[22:25] <fsphil> you can't use amateur radio from a balloon in the uk
[22:25] <mfa298> LeoBodnar: for UK HABS there's not much point in APRS. The standard frequency can't be used airborne and needs an amateur radio license
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[22:29] <LeoBodnar> I am not going to use it, it's just for general knowledge. I don't have HAM license.
[22:29] <LeoBodnar> But I do receive morse code :)
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[22:29] <fsphil> I'm really bad at morse
[22:30] <heathkid> congrats LeoBodnar! long live code!!! :)
[22:30] <LeoBodnar> K
[22:30] <mfa298> i ought to get back into trying to learn morse again. I started making some progress a few years ago
[22:31] <heathkid> might save your life some day
[22:31] <LeoBodnar> How difficult it is to get license in the UK?
[22:31] <fsphil> hehe, http://habhub.org//predict/#!/uuid=407d69efb151900e5f826da9671f83a8c557ca48
[22:31] <mfa298> LeoBodnar: its not that hard
[22:31] <fsphil> foundation license is very simple
[22:32] <mfa298> there are three levels, foundation is often done as a weekend course for complete beginners
[22:32] <heathkid> fsphil: that doesn't look like a very good prediction...
[22:32] <heathkid> unless you're launching a habsub
[22:32] <fsphil> good if I was looking rid of something
[22:33] <heathkid> true
[22:33] <LeoBodnar> THanks guys, I'll get the license then. For now good night!
[22:33] <heathkid> I can think of cheaper ways to get rid of something though
[22:33] <heathkid> :)
[22:34] <heathkid> goodnight LeoBodnar
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[00:00] --- Fri Jun 7 2013