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[00:13] <arko> anyone know if Rock Seven will sell their modules to the US?
[00:15] <Lunar_Lander> ?
[00:16] <arko> http://rockblock.rock7mobile.com/?shopp_product=rockblock-naked
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[00:17] <willdude123> mfa298: Snapping,
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[00:19] <Lunar_Lander> ah
[00:19] <Lunar_Lander> sorry don't know
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[00:19] <willdude123> rockblock looks interesting.
[00:20] <willdude123> Have there been any successful UKHAS projects that aren't balloons?
[00:20] <mfa298> willdude123: you might have to be a bit more careful then. If you've got access to some suitable wire it shouldn't be too hard for you to make some replacements
[00:21] <mfa298> willdude123: what are you thinking of as UKHAS projects that aren't balloons ?
[00:21] <arko> willdude123: http://track.poseidon.sgsphysics.co.uk/
[00:21] <arko> these guys hang out here
[00:21] <arko> launching tomorrow i believe
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[00:25] <willdude123> Gliderd maybe.
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[00:26] <willdude123> arko, what is that?
[00:26] <mfa298> I think there was a bit of talk about gliders although legality for being really high possibly got interesting.
[00:26] <arko> it's a floating beacon they are dropping in the ocean
[00:26] <arko> the ocean currents will move it around as they study where it goes and monitor it's IMU and other sensor data
[00:26] <arko> very neat project
[00:27] <Lunar_Lander> yea
[00:27] <Lunar_Lander> damn
[00:27] <Lunar_Lander> shouldn't have talked about the idea too much
[00:28] <arko> ?
[00:28] <Lunar_Lander> ah I proposed the same thing shortly after my flight here
[00:28] <arko> why not talk about it?
[00:29] <arko> it's not a new thing :P
[00:30] <Lunar_Lander> xD
[00:31] <arko> i found out jpl makes a bunch of these beacons
[00:31] <arko> it's such a small project here that it's not very publicized
[00:32] <arko> they really should do mini documentaries about projects
[00:32] <arko> ...if only they let me be in charge of media outreach hehe
[00:32] <willdude123> I want something cool to do with my arduino.
[00:32] <arko> willdude123: floppy disk orchestra
[00:33] <arko> self-balance bots are fun too
[00:34] <Lunar_Lander> yea
[00:34] <Lunar_Lander> xD
[00:36] <mfa298> if you want things related to HAB you could experiment with other methods of transmitting data (instead of rtty)
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[00:41] <willdude123> Maybe.
[00:41] <willdude123> How do other methods work?
[00:43] <mfa298> there's various forms of MFSK (using more than 2 tones),
[00:44] <willdude123> Could be interesting.
[00:44] <mfa298> if you wanted something different you could always try interfacing the arduino to other things (lego could good for that if you still get motors and other bits of electrical stuff)
[00:45] <mfa298> you might even be able to get an arduino playing some sounds into a speaker
[00:48] <willdude123> I wonder how long the longest rc plane flight was.
[00:50] <willdude123> Can you fly RC planes very high?
[00:50] <mfa298> I think there are some legal limitations about how far that can go
[00:51] <mfa298> (I think the operator has to be in visual contact with it i.e. be able to see it)
[00:52] <willdude123> Are all floaters under foil balloons?
[00:52] <willdude123> Do all foil balloons float?
[00:52] <mfa298> technically weight is likely to be the limiting factor (more height probably needs more power which needs more batteries, which adds more weight making it harder to get it higher)
[00:52] <mfa298> todays attempted floater was a latex balloon
[00:54] <mfa298> you can have floaters with foil and latex, similarly both types can also do the up, burst, down flights
[00:54] <mfa298> foils tend to be limited to around 5km (as they can't stretch) and lighter payloads (they can't be filled as much)
[00:55] <willdude123> Does sending serial to an ntx2 make rtty?
[00:56] <mfa298> I think it can (that's effectivly what's done on the pi) but there are limitations in doing it that way
[00:57] <Darkside> you need to do some lvel shifting to get the right output frequency shift
[00:57] <Darkside> and you're limited to 300 baud
[00:57] <willdude123> When is PIE5 launching?
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[00:59] <mfa298> if you want to look up the technical side of RTTY it's a form of FSK (Frequency Shift Keying). You just need a way of having two frequencies transmitted which with the NTX2 you can do with two different voltages
[00:59] <mfa298> which is what you're doing by toggling the pin and the resistor network
[01:00] <mfa298> on the PI people are using the serial port as OS gets in the way of timing for toggling a GPIO pin like you're doing on the arduino
[01:02] <mfa298> as for PIE5 I think that's dependant on weather and getting suitable people together, there's likely to be an announcment on the mailing list a few days before it happens
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[05:18] <arko> https://web2py.excitedbit.com/ocean_current_predictor/
[05:18] <arko> woot, got it to follow field lines
[05:18] <arko> all thats left now is to add data :)
[05:18] <arko> man this is a lot of data >_<
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[06:55] <arko> damn tricky pounds, oh it's only 150 pounds.. converts to $250.. woah nvm
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[08:11] <jcoxon> morning
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[08:13] <jcoxon> have we got launches today?
[08:14] <craag> Steve's launching one with 2 trackers I think.
[08:15] <Upu> morning
[08:15] <craag> Probably this afternoo according to email.
[08:15] <jcoxon> looks like wb8elk is also launching
[08:17] <eroomde> morning
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[08:18] <fsphil> moooorning
[08:19] <number10> morning
[08:19] <daveake> moooning
[08:19] <Upu> rather you didn't its far too early
[08:20] <daveake> Yeah you had a busy day yesterday launching
[08:20] <daveake> Oh
[08:21] <number10> daveake: is that a new service you are offering - as I have a couple of payloads ready
[08:21] <Upu> was one of the more relaxing launches I've done
[08:21] <Upu> just sat in Yorkshire telling some bloke down south to launch it
[08:21] <daveake> number10 DIY is "Do It Yourself" not "Delegate It Yourself" :)
[08:21] <Upu> A++++ would use again
[08:21] <daveake> lol
[08:21] <number10> lol
[08:22] <Darkside> heh
[08:22] <Darkside> we did a steve yesterday
[08:22] <fsphil> no calls from an angry french farmer?
[08:22] <Darkside> stuck the balloon in a car
[08:22] <Upu> nope fsphil
[08:22] <Darkside> drove somewhere, pulled it out and let it go
[08:22] <number10> send the money for the gas and balloon only if successful?
[08:22] <Upu> did you get it back in the end Darkside ?
[08:22] <Darkside> nope
[08:22] <Darkside> its in a tree
[08:22] <Upu> thats the one number10
[08:22] <Darkside> still
[08:22] <Upu> shame
[08:23] <fsphil> is this a first for you guys?
[08:23] <Upu> didn't realise you had trees in Oz i though it was all sand
[08:23] <Darkside> lol
[08:23] <Upu> hahaha
[08:23] <Upu> AVA recovered
[08:23] <Upu> F5AQP
[08:24] <daveake> woah excellent
[08:24] <fsphil> ah, angry french amateur
[08:24] <LazyLeopard> Yay!
[08:24] <number10> did he have to dig it out Upu
[08:24] <daveake> Was a shovel needed?
[08:24] <LazyLeopard> ;)
[08:24] <griffonbot> Received email: F5APQ "Re: [UKHAS] AVA Launch Saturday 6th"
[08:24] <Upu> 6am
[08:24] <Upu> he's an early starter
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[08:25] <fsphil> hehe, still transmitting
[08:25] <jcoxon> thats a nice easy landing site
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[08:26] <craag> morning M0NSA
[08:26] <griffonbot> Received email: Anthony Stirk "Re: [UKHAS] AVA Launch Saturday 6th"
[08:26] <Upu> thankfully in a field
[08:27] <jcoxon> is it the red wire he needs to cut
[08:27] <daveake> noooooooooooooooooooo the blue one
[08:27] <Darkside> nah, green
[08:28] <fsphil> the sky is blue
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[08:28] <daveake> Upu that's your second flight that's been recovered in France
[08:29] <Upu> I know
[08:29] <Upu> well I never got the first one back
[08:29] <daveake> yeah strange
[08:29] <Upu> she went quiet on me
[08:29] <Upu> I have that effect on women
[08:29] <daveake> hah
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[08:32] <G4GUO> AVA seem to drift in frequency a lot. I had to keep manually re-tuning my radio (not got the remote ctrl hooked up)
[08:35] <griffonbot> @AnthonyStirk: AVA recovered in France at 6am this morning by @F5APQ @ 50.33949,1.64254 still transmitting yay! #ukhas @f6agv [http://twitter.com/AnthonyStirk/status/320817074769383424]
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[08:39] <eroomde> we shall chase them on the beaches
[08:41] <daveake> landing grounds, in fields
[08:43] <griffonbot> @daveake: RT (yesterday's flight) @AnthonyStirk: AVA recovered in France at 6am this by @F5APQ @ 50.33949,1.64254 still transmitting #ukhas @f6agv [http://twitter.com/daveake/status/320818984666685440]
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[08:45] <anerDev> hey hey guys ! =D
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[08:59] <Geoff-G8DHE__> I see SP9UBO goes in for more than Fish & Chips for there after party! http://www.facebook.com/photo.php?fbid=561982680508730&set=a.561982547175410.1073741826.227602693946732&type=1&theater
[09:01] Nick change: Geoff-G8DHE__ -> Geoff-G8DHE
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[09:06] <G4GUO> morning Geoff
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[09:06] <Geoff-G8DHE> Morning Charles how's life
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[09:08] <G4GUO> Not so bad, I'm about to start testing DATV-Express with a Raspberry PI. Just finished the FPGA code.
[09:08] <G4GUO> I see you and I were the last to hear AKA yesterday.
[09:09] <Geoff-G8DHE> Ah that could be interesting, could well be suprised given the setup at present just my 25 year old WX1 direct to an E4000 dongle!
[09:10] <Geoff-G8DHE> Must sort out a vertical for 868MHz and maybe a beam for when I get the aerials down to sort out the rotater!
[09:10] <fsphil> the the Pi has enough processing power to do DVB?
[09:10] <G4GUO> I was using a W30 and an FT817, I lost it at an altitude of 2300m.
[09:11] <Darkside> fsphil: if its just the mpeg2 decoding then it probably can
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[09:11] <Darkside> well, with the mpeg2 key
[09:11] <fsphil> generating DVB even
[09:11] <fsphil> the DATV-Express is a transmitter
[09:11] <G4GUO> Hi Phil, the PI will only manipulate the Transport stream. The FPGA will do the DVB-S encoding.
[09:12] <fsphil> ah
[09:13] <G4GUO> Phil has manage to drive a Digilite using an MK808, the RS encoding consumes most of the processing.
[09:13] <G4GUO> Sorry I meant Rob M0DTS
[09:13] <fsphil> Would I be right in thinking DVB-T would be too complex?
[09:13] <Geoff-G8DHE> Right well if XABEN is flying this afternoon I have a few jobs to do first, bbl
[09:14] <G4GUO> For a PI yes. However I have implemented DVB-T on a PC based Ubuntu system.
[09:14] <fsphil> transmitter?
[09:15] <G4GUO> it is the 2K and 8K FFTs that are the problem there. The rest uses the same FEC as DVB-S i.e RS and a K=7 convolutional code.
[09:16] <G4GUO> Yes transmitter. The FFT is written using MMX instructions to speed it up.
[09:16] <fsphil> ah fantastic
[09:16] <fsphil> using the same datv-express board?
[09:17] <G4GUO> Yes. I have some FPGA code for Express that acts as a glorified sound card. You just pump the baseband I&Q to it and it modulates the RF anywhere you like between 72.5 MHz and 2.48 GHz.
[09:18] <Darkside> G4GUO: so you're making a small DVB-S transmitter?
[09:18] <Darkside> how hard are the linearity requirements for DVB-S vs DVB-T
[09:19] <G4GUO> You could say that. DVB-S is much easier than DVB-T. The PAR is lower.
[09:19] <Darkside> hrm
[09:19] <G4GUO> Peak to Average Ratio (PAR)
[09:20] <Darkside> it's be fun to tly a DVB-S video transmitter
[09:20] <Darkside> but i'm betting the power requirements will be pretty
[09:20] <Darkside> scary
[09:20] <Darkside> and the heat dissipation
[09:20] <Darkside> yes, PAPR
[09:21] <G4GUO> With a Mitsubishi 18 watt brick you can get about 10 watts out on DVB-S but only about 2 watts on DVB-T before it starts to badly distort.
[09:21] <Darkside> ooh
[09:21] <Darkside> now thats interesting
[09:21] <G4GUO> I think those bricks are about 20% efficient.
[09:21] <Darkside> well that tels me a lot
[09:21] <Darkside> yeah
[09:22] <Darkside> heatsinking will be a bitch
[09:22] <Darkside> i think we'll just go with standard analog ATV
[09:22] <Darkside> at least we'll get *some* kind of picture with low signal
[09:22] <Darkside> versus no picture
[09:23] <G4GUO> yes I think you are right. There is someone in Texas that plans to fly digital TV but I think don't think he has worked out the power budjet yet.
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[09:24] <fsphil> that hardware works on 2.4ghz, but the ground antenna would need to be pretty big
[09:24] <costyn> cool that AVA was recovered :)
[09:25] <G4GUO> The advantafe of Digital is that there are sequence numbers in the signal and timestamps so you could have multiple receivers picking the signal up and forwarding it to central server that could use the information to re-build a good picture from all the broken ones.
[09:25] <jcoxon> G4GUO, a bit like SSDV
[09:25] <jcoxon> :-)
[09:25] <fsphil> only it doesn't lie about the V bit :)
[09:25] <Darkside> i think we'll just fly analog
[09:25] <Darkside> we have the hardware for that already
[09:26] <fsphil> I worked out a while back you'd need 1mbit/s to do basic video with SSDV
[09:26] <fsphil> 320x240
[09:26] <G4GUO> Yes, just Googled SSDV. I don't really see a reason for realtime video unless you have it in the nose of munitions or drones.
[09:27] <fsphil> there is the cool factor
[09:27] <G4GUO> I am hoping to use the PI camera and MPEG 4 in the future.
[09:28] <fsphil> that and having the fpga doing the dvb-t encoding would be cool
[09:28] <fsphil> instant HD channel
[09:29] <SpeedEvil> well, you can do multiple receivers with analog
[09:29] <G4GUO> The FPGA would not be big enough sadly. We designed the thing down to a price rather than up to a spec.
[09:29] <fsphil> ah
[09:30] <SpeedEvil> I was earlier wondering if you can correlate drifts between multiple receivers at 70cm, if they are fairly widely seperated, by receiving the correlated background noise
[09:31] <G4GUO> You will just have to content yourself with receiving DVB-S from the ISS later in the year.
[09:31] <fsphil> G4GUO: oooh I've not heard about this
[09:32] <fsphil> SpeedEvil: would there be correlated background noise?
[09:32] <G4GUO> Yes they are installing a DVB-S setup in the ISS soon. It will be transmitting around 2.42 GHz (probably get wiped out by WiFi sadly).
[09:32] <G0DJA> Is todays flight XABEN46 setting in FLDigi
[09:32] <SpeedEvil> fsphil: I mean background noise that can be picked up at multiple sites
[09:32] <SpeedEvil> fsphil: and yes, that's a queastuion
[09:33] <fsphil> SpeedEvil: yea, not as easy on 70cm
[09:33] <SpeedEvil> easy if you have an Ariel 'clock'
[09:41] Nick change: craag -> acting-sealevel-
[09:41] Nick change: acting-sealevel- -> acting-bot
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[09:48] Nick change: acting-bot -> craag
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[10:01] <SpeedEvil> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bkeVjkUKwF4 this is mostly not on topic.
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[10:15] <griffonbot> Received email: Nicole Blake "Re: [UKHAS] Re: Launch announcement - WUSAT - Sat 6th - near Welshpool"
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[10:23] <cuddykid> oh wow, just reviewing the footage from thurs flight - it came very close to a number of aircraft!
[10:23] <cuddykid> forgot there's a major route over south wales
[10:24] chrisstubbs (~chrisstub@host86-169-78-54.range86-169.btcentralplus.com) joined #highaltitude.
[10:24] <cuddykid> can make out one of the planes relatively clearly
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[10:26] <chrisstubbs> cuddykid is that the one i could hear?
[10:26] <cuddykid> chrisstubbs: think so - you can definitely hear them going past!
[10:26] <chrisstubbs> haha blimey
[10:27] <cuddykid> there are lots around at one point
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[10:27] <chrisstubbs> i tried to look through the video but i didnt see any, only heard the one at the end
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[10:28] <cuddykid> oh dear - the higher it climbs .. the louder the aircraft noises get!
[10:28] <costyn> cuddykid: haha cool
[10:28] <costyn> cuddykid: had that on my flight too, crazy
[10:28] <cuddykid> :D
[10:29] <costyn> cuddykid: http://youtu.be/AKNbJCVRXhA?t=5m
[10:29] <Upu> http://i.imgur.com/jTdD3Si.jpg
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[10:29] <Upu> note the dent in the ball
[10:29] <Upu> right afk
[10:29] <cuddykid> hahah nice costyn
[10:29] <costyn> cuddykid: if you heard the plane, the pilot must've seen the balloon :)
[10:30] <cuddykid> that's awesome
[10:30] <costyn> cuddykid: at 6 minutes there's a 2nd one
[10:30] <Upu> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BxbvysNy1sc
[10:31] <costyn> Upu: whats the deal with the bottle?
[10:31] <Upu> an experiment
[10:31] <Upu> which sort of worked
[10:31] <Upu> but will publish details later
[10:31] <Upu> possibly
[10:31] <Upu> :)
[10:31] <costyn> ok cool
[10:31] <costyn> hehe
[10:32] <costyn> Upu: but what a mess... no wonder it was plumetting down
[10:32] <Upu> I know
[10:32] <Upu> parachute was too big I think
[10:32] <Upu> http://imgur.com/a/MdXrr#0
[10:33] <costyn> well not much you can do with that much balloon remnants I think? they're going to be heavy in any case
[10:33] <Upu> well it was a 36" parachute so shouldn't have an issue with it but looks like it tangled
[10:33] <Upu> right afk for a bit
[10:34] <chrisstubbs> oo ava got it recovered in the end then?
[10:34] <costyn> i mean heavy that they're likely to overtake the parachute and payload in any case
[10:34] <Hix> costyn that video is pretty cool
[10:34] <Hix> AVA recovered then? whereabouts?
[10:35] <Hix> depsite mic being muted, I have an echo with every keypress
[10:35] <Hix> blair witch kinda feel to typing now :)
[10:35] <Hix> ahh, VLC being playful, cured
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[10:38] <costyn> Hix: thanks
[10:38] <costyn> Hix: 50.33949,1.64254 AVA landed here
[10:39] <GMT> I had an email from F5APQ last night about something else; he was aware of the flight. when I told him where it landed he said he'd look for it this morning
[10:39] <Hix> thats a bit of a bummer, radio worked but assume balloon went too high and burst?
[10:40] <costyn> GMT: ah cool, nice work then :)
[10:40] <costyn> Hix: yup
[10:40] <costyn> Hix: well too many striks in the balloon, so no float
[10:40] <Hix> drat!!
[10:40] <Hix> at least recvovered
[10:40] <costyn> yea
[10:40] <GMT> Yes, glad it was found; if it had burst maybe 1 minute earlier it would have landed in the sea?
[10:41] PE2G (~pe2g@a83-161-208-176.adsl.xs4all.nl) joined #highaltitude.
[10:42] <cuddykid> like mine, however if mine burst a couple of minutes later it would have dumped in the sea :) we've been lucky the past few days!
[10:44] <griffonbot> Received email: mclane "[UKHAS] Re: Newsky R820T Dongle"
[10:44] <Hix> eroomde: about?
[10:44] <PE2G> For those interested to hearing a DFM-06: an unexpected launch by Beauvechain AFB, Belgium: 403.710 MHz
[10:45] <PE2G> Climbing out of 5500 m now: http://gyazo.com/ed20cd5d9c0f85b6eb2df7d953943060
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[10:46] <griffonbot> Received email: Adrian Hicks "Re: [UKHAS] Re: Newsky R820T Dongle"
[10:46] <GMT> PE2G: not surprising, but not audible in London (yet!)
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[10:47] <griffonbot> Received email: mclane "Re: [UKHAS] Re: Launch announcement - WUSAT - Sat 6th - near Welshpool"
[10:47] <PE2G> Expect a burst at 23 km
[10:48] <GMT> did you say that these DFM06 sondes have no parachute?
[10:48] <PE2G> Usually no parachute indeed
[10:48] <PE2G> Very light sonde
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[10:49] <PE2G> Mostly reaches the ground undamaged without chute
[10:50] <willdude123> Hello.
[10:50] <GMT> can't imagine one of those getting to the UK!
[10:50] <GMT> hello willdude123
[10:51] <PE2G> Out of 7800 m now, climbing 5.7 m/s
[10:52] <GMT> PE2G: how far from B'chain do they usually travel?
[10:53] <PE2G> Totally dependent on the wind.
[10:54] <PE2G> Here is the expected track:
[10:55] <PE2G> http://habhub.org/predict/#!/uuid=0ddde555aed7af201e0857bcfaa92529bbed24c7
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[10:56] <GMT> okay, travelling in the opposite direction from me. If I can't hear it now, I won't hear it as it gets further away.
[10:57] <PE2G> 9900 m now, climbing 6.3 m/s
[10:57] <willdude123> Has XABEN already flown?
[10:58] <GMT> wd123, sometime this afternoon I think
[10:59] <chrisstubbs> its due to fly at 1400
[10:59] <GMT> 1400 utc, 1500 UK time
[10:59] <chrisstubbs> willdude123, launch times are posted on spacenear.us in the top lefft box
[11:00] <willdude123> Oh I see.
[11:01] <chrisstubbs> there is also an ical feed you can add to google cal or outlook which is handy
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[11:12] <PE2G> A bit late, but I've put the Beauvechain DFM-06 on APRS
[11:12] <PE2G> http://aprs.fi/#!mt=roadmap&z=11&call=a%2FPE2G-11&timerange=10800&tail=10800
[11:18] <Hix> even at 6m/s rocketboy looks like ditching in the plonk http://habhub.org/predict/#!/uuid=443c2317218eab6b374fb251d8bfc39dd7d11aaa
[11:38] <PE2G> GMT: Still not receiving Beauvechain?
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[11:43] <GMT> nothing showing on my SDR trace, too far from me! just using vertical colinear, no beam, so not best ant for this
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[11:45] <PE2G> It had a burst at ~25 km, descending with 30 m/s at 16 km
[11:50] <Geoff-G8DHE> I can here a carrier on 403.710 but not clear what modulation is present any idea ?
[11:52] <PE2G> FSK modulation, you can use NFM
[11:53] <PE2G> Sonde type: http://www.graw.de/home/products2/radiosondes0/dfm-060/
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[11:53] <daveake> Steve's car is on the map now
[11:55] <gonzo_> is he planning a launch today?
[11:56] <daveake> yes
[11:56] <daveake> 2m according to the panel on spacenear
[11:56] <daveake> 2pm
[11:59] <PE2G> I lost Beauvechain at 2789 m, dx 221 km
[12:01] <PE2G> http://gyazo.com/123ced75b549ca01fc29301bdae9c3bd (GPS wind indication is 180 deg wrong)
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[12:14] <willdude123> Looking forward to tracking xaben.
[12:18] <mfa298> willdude123: when you had the antenna out of your window did you have the vertical element pointing down or up ?
[12:22] <gonzo_> Thanks dave. My spacenear window had not updated for days
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[12:35] <GMT> ahhh, dinner is served!
[12:35] <daveake> BST had his an hour ago
[12:36] <x-f> i second that
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[12:44] <Morseman> Is XABEN46 the one for today in FLDigi?
[12:44] <Morseman> and does anyone know if both frequencies will be in use?
[12:45] <Upu> I think both are going up
[12:45] <Morseman> OK Upu - any idea if both will use same shift and baud rate?
[12:46] <Upu> no idea
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[12:46] <Upu> sure we'll work it out
[12:46] <Upu> Afternoon Alain
[12:47] <F6AGV> Glad to meet you Anthony
[12:47] <Geoff-G8DHE> uXABEN says its 50/470 whilst XABEN says 50/600
[12:47] <Upu> F5APQ did a good job :) Have you see the pictures F6AGV ?
[12:47] <Upu> http://imgur.com/a/MdXrr#0
[12:48] <F6AGV> no, F5APQ don't comunicate with me !
[12:48] <Upu> oh well images above
[12:48] <Upu> looks a nice day in France
[12:48] <Upu> if a bit cold
[12:48] <F6AGV> OK, I think prediction was good !
[12:48] <Upu> indeed
[12:48] <Upu> it did have a parachute
[12:49] <F6AGV> ahh
[12:49] <Upu> quite a big one just got tangled
[12:49] <daveake> Would probably have landed slower without one
[12:49] <GMT> what was the water-bottle for?
[12:49] <F6AGV> did you know what happens with altitude and burst ?
[12:50] <Upu> bottle was an experiment
[12:50] <Upu> purpose of which I'm not currently allowed to divulge
[12:50] <daveake> lol
[12:50] <Upu> F6AGV not sure, last one floated at 39km , this one didn't
[12:51] <Upu> F5APQ showing off : http://i.imgur.com/94aRHNH.jpg
[12:51] <Upu> guess which one was mine
[12:51] <F6AGV> OK, you have a calculation for study the flaoting ?
[12:52] <daveake> hah
[12:52] <Upu> I don't think there is any calculation Alain, basically sometimes with a slow ascent rate (<3m/s) 1600g Hwoyee balloons will enter a float
[12:52] <Upu> "sometimes"
[12:52] <F6AGV> OK,
[12:54] <F6AGV> I go to load pictures
[12:54] <Upu> nps
[12:55] <Upu> Make sure F5APQ gets credit :)
[12:55] <GMT> the bottle appears to be empty in the pics .... payload knew which country it was flying over ... hmmm, UPU has developed a bombing mission!
[12:56] <Upu> technically it was never full
[12:56] <Upu> anyway
[12:56] <GMT> half full or half empty?
[12:56] <Upu> both at the same time
[12:58] <Morseman> Movement!
[12:59] <daveake> movement?
[12:59] <Morseman> False alarm
[12:59] <Morseman> XABEN seemed to be moving upwards
[13:00] <daveake> It's much more dramatic than that when it does go
[13:00] <Morseman> But it dropped back again
[13:01] <eroomde> green flight traces on sattelite view = not great for uk flights
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[13:08] <G0DJA> Not sure whether to tune round 250 or 300
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[13:10] <GMT> any info about what's in this one - is there a camera, or just a tracker?
[13:12] <mattbrejza> hes sacrificing a pico to the sea god in return for the safe recovery of the three previous gopro flights
[13:13] <G0DJA> What are 'Flags' and 'Ignore' telling?
[13:14] <Geoff-G8DHE> He's trying out Semaphore and telling us to Ignore it
[13:15] <GMT> 'DJA: where are you seeing these 'flags' and 'ignore'?
[13:15] <Geoff-G8DHE> On the tracker panel
[13:16] <G0DJA> On the tracker page in the box marked uXABEN
[13:16] <G0DJA> http://spacenear.us/tracker/
[13:17] <G0DJA> And XABEN one is in the room... ;)
[13:18] <daveake> Second XABEN tracker on now
[13:19] <G0DJA> Anyone know which one will be which freq?
[13:20] <Geoff-G8DHE> Guess XABEN1 might be 434.250 as last time
[13:20] <junderwood> The calendar says XABEN1 on 434.250
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[13:21] <Morseman> Thanks
[13:21] <Morseman> Looks like I will miss it - Kate agitating about going swimming
[13:23] <G0DJA> I'll leave RX on just below 300 in the hope AFC picks it up
[13:28] <G0DJA> Nope - got to go
[13:29] <G8KNN-Jon> up
[13:29] <Morseman> AH good - Kate having last ciggy so time yet!
[13:29] <daveake> not up
[13:29] <G8KNN-Jon> no :-(
[13:29] <G0DJA> Shhot :(
[13:29] <G0DJA> Shoot
[13:30] <daveake> An increase of 2 metres altitude does not consitute a launch!
[13:30] <daveake> +t
[13:30] <Geoff-G8DHE> both KNN & KHW tracking now
[13:30] <G8KNN-Jon> up now :)
[13:30] <daveake> now up :)
[13:31] <G0DJA> KNN isn't far away
[13:31] <G0DJA> Yay
[13:31] <Hix> thought it was 15:00 GMT
[13:32] <Hix> rather BST
[13:32] <G0DJA> Hix - ish factor
[13:32] Nick change: junderwood -> junderwood_M0JCU
[13:32] <G0DJA> 14:00 UTC (ish)
[13:32] <junderwood_M0JCU> 434.299 for uXABEN
[13:33] <G0DJA> Thanks JCU
[13:33] <G8KNN-Jon> 247 for XABEN1
[13:35] <Upu> yep
[13:35] <Hix> -ve ISH, thats unusual
[13:35] <Upu> my take off to Cambridge is ace
[13:37] <G0DJA> Heard uXABEN briefly
[13:39] <Upu> uXABEN is strong
[13:39] <G0DJA> XABEN1 stronger here
[13:40] <G0DJA> OK hope AFC can keep lock as got to go
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[13:41] <Upu> no idea what balloon is on it
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[13:42] <Hix> bugger - left my 3.5mm jack to jack lead at home, got XABEN but can't feed it into dl-fldigi
[13:43] <SpeedEvil> speaker plus mic
[13:43] <SpeedEvil> who said that acoustic couplers are dead
[13:43] <Hix> too much ambient noise for that
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[13:44] <futurity> Afternoon
[13:44] <Upu> afternoon
[13:44] <Hix> Upu, dunno if its the duck antenna but the dongle is picking up nada
[13:44] <futurity> Currently tracking uXABEN
[13:44] <Hix> AR8000 with a duck is fine
[13:44] <Upu> mine doesn't pick anything up
[13:44] <Hix> hmm, might go to car and try Yagi
[13:45] <Upu> its fine if the payload is next to it but for the weaker signals its deaf as a post
[13:45] <Upu> swapped mine for a E4000 equipped EZCAP and it could see and decode the payload without a HABAmp
[13:45] <Geoff-G8DHE> Just rising out the noise for me
[13:45] <Upu> so I have assume the R820 dongle isn't working
[13:45] <futurity> Which of the two payloads is expected to have the most stable frequency? I need to go out soon but don't mind leaving equipment receiving
[13:45] <Hix> ahhhh damn - left sma to bnc at home too
[13:46] <Hix> massive fail
[13:46] <Upu> both are stable atm
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[13:46] <martijn__> Hi all
[13:46] <futurity> uXABEN is slowly drifting upwards
[13:46] <Geoff-G8DHE> uXABEN is rising in freq for me XABEN is staeady
[13:46] <Upu> hi martijn__
[13:46] <Upu> yeah concur with that
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[13:46] <futurity> ok switching to XABEN
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[13:47] <Hix> XABEN steady as a rock here too
[13:47] <martijn__> Are you all tracking uXABEN?
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[13:47] <Upu> yup
[13:47] <Upu> http://spacenear.us/tracker/
[13:47] <martijn__> oke cool
[13:47] <martijn__> I'm hoping I can catch it's signal today to
[13:47] <Morseman> Gave up on uXABEN - too many bad decodes - back on XABEN1 again now
[13:48] <Hix> although having said that the carrier inbetween sentences warbles a bit
[13:48] <Hix> kind of like a pulsing carrier
[13:49] <Morseman> Hix XABEN1 gives a sort of tick tick on the 'steady' carrier
[13:49] <Hix> signal must be pretty good as i had it ab <2000m on a rubber duck
[13:49] <Hix> ah oki Morseman
[13:49] <futurity> should the carrier shift place the red lines directly over the yellow lines?
[13:50] <Hix> yes
[13:50] <Morseman> futurity ideally
[13:50] <futurity> 600 seems to be well away from the yellow lines
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[13:50] <Lunar_Lander> hello
[13:50] <daveake> Try 670
[13:50] <Hix> Right click on RTTY bottom left to make it custom
[13:50] <futurity> i guess i cn just enter a new custom shift?
[13:50] <Lunar_Lander> congratulations to the Kraken team
[13:50] <Morseman> you can adjust in 'Modems' by selecting "Custom" under the shift and adjusting shift spacing
[13:50] <Lunar_Lander> but why aren't there new data infos?
[13:51] <Morseman> I've set mine to something like 650Hz
[13:51] <Hix> Lunar_Lander: think craag has a working tracker
[13:51] <Upu> shift is 670 here
[13:51] <Hix> Lunar_Lander: https://www.thecraag.com/kraken/
[13:52] <Lunar_Lander> XD #sealevel
[13:52] <Lunar_Lander> ROFL
[13:53] <mattbrejza> http://track.poseidon.sgsphysics.co.uk/
[13:53] <Lunar_Lander> yeah I know
[13:53] <Lunar_Lander> but there is nothing new since 1:49 pm
[13:53] <mattbrejza> (GMT)
[13:53] <Upu> is that actually floating now ?
[13:53] <mattbrejza> yep
[13:53] <Lunar_Lander> yea
[13:53] <Upu> oh wow
[13:53] <mattbrejza> Next Transmission
[13:53] <mattbrejza> 0 hours 4 minutes
[13:53] <Hix> out into the North Sea
[13:53] <Upu> rockblock ?
[13:53] <mattbrejza> yea
[13:53] <Hix> yup
[13:53] <Upu> whats battery life ?
[13:54] <Hix> https://www.thecraag.com/kraken/ Upu
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[13:54] <mattbrejza> theres like 70 AA lithiums
[13:54] <mattbrejza> so we shall see
[13:54] <Upu> lol
[13:54] <Upu> any pictures of it ?
[13:54] <Hix> Was Steve aiming for a ditch flight? Or has he got a cutdown
[13:55] <daveake> dunno
[13:55] <mattbrejza> https://twitter.com/sgsphysics
[13:55] <mattbrejza> are some pics
[13:55] <Hix> thought the prediction was a bit offshore earlier
[13:55] <daveake> I'm curious
[13:55] <Upu> the prediction is based on me having no idea at all what balloon is on there
[13:55] <Upu> Steve could be up to anything
[13:55] <Upu> £1 says they separate
[13:56] <Hix> I did one for 6ms and 30000m
[13:56] <Hix> and it still went offshore
[13:56] <Upu> This is Steve its not going in the sea unless he wants it too
[13:56] <Hix> s'what i thought
[13:57] <GMT> odd design of payload, given it's destination, would a boat shape be better?
[13:57] <Hix> maybe he's off to meet KRAKEN
[13:57] <Upu> whats the difference between craag's page and the Track the kraken one ?
[13:57] <Hix> how many HAB points for landing on KRAKEN ;p
[13:57] <Geoff-G8DHE> and now a rapid drift low on uXABEN
[13:57] <Lunar_Lander> XD!
[13:57] <fsphil> faster updates Upu
[13:57] <mattbrejza> they both get data from habitat i tihnk
[13:58] <Upu> ok
[13:58] <Upu> thats awesome btw :)
[13:58] <Hix> craag knocked it up this morining Upu
[13:58] <Randomskk> craag's has faster updates?
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[13:58] <Randomskk> the rockblock is the limiting factor I think :P
[13:58] Nick change: Upu -> M0UPU
[13:59] <fsphil> yes but we want to know asap :)
[13:59] <M0UPU> well you can transmit every 2 mins
[13:59] <M0UPU> if you can afford it :)
[13:59] <Hix> heh
[13:59] <Geoff-G8DHE> and now stable again wierd
[13:59] <Randomskk> as in, it's set to only transmit every few hours
[13:59] <Hix> gonna say money limiting factor
[13:59] <Randomskk> or, well, on an adjusting rate thing
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[13:59] <Lunar_Lander> yay new data
[13:59] <Randomskk> I don't think money was hugely a limiting factor
[13:59] <Randomskk> priyesh: ?
[13:59] <Hix> despite Rock7 sponsorship
[13:59] <M0UPU> put Kraken on Spacenear :)
[13:59] <Lunar_Lander> stupid question
[13:59] <mattbrejza> power issues too
[14:00] <Randomskk> M0UPU: it would be by default
[14:00] <Lunar_Lander> why do 70 batteries give 7 V?
[14:00] <Randomskk> we set it to not go on spacenear
[14:00] <Randomskk> Lunar_Lander: they are not all in series, that'd be insane
[14:00] <M0UPU> Lunar_Lander depends how you wire them
[14:00] <daveake> uXABEN lost GPS posn
[14:00] <daveake> $$$$$uXABEN,364,13:59:50,0.00000,0.00000,0,1.79,0.22,0070*A183
[14:00] <Lunar_Lander> good, that was a small physics test :)
[14:00] <M0UPU> hmm
[14:00] <Lunar_Lander> oh
[14:02] <junderwood_M0JCU> daveake, looks like the well known uBlox 2pm bug :)
[14:02] <number10_M0MDB> does it use power saving
[14:02] <M0UPU> thats the one with the max7 in
[14:03] <number10_M0MDB> its still reporting time
[14:03] <M0UPU> nope
[14:03] <M0UPU> its stopped
[14:03] <M0UPU> GPS module has hung
[14:03] <daveake> Has now yes
[14:03] <number10_M0MDB> oh yes - sott my mistake
[14:03] <daveake> Well let's hope the payloads aren't separating :)
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[14:04] <Hix> covert air drop from uXABEN?
[14:04] <Hix> nice recovery f5apq :)
[14:05] <M0UPU> hey f5apq :)
[14:05] <f5apq> thanks
[14:05] <Hix> bon effort
[14:05] <M0UPU> lovely pictures as well it looked nice at 6am :)
[14:05] <M0UPU> you get up early!
[14:05] <Hix> BST or CET?
[14:05] <number10_M0MDB> is there a link to pics?
[14:06] <f5apq> 5 utc hi
[14:06] <M0UPU> http://imgur.com/a/MdXrr#0
[14:06] <M0UPU> very early :)
[14:06] <Hix> too early :)
[14:07] <Hix> hmm, looks like I need to go to powersaving mode. bbl
[14:07] <number10_M0MDB> quite a bit of balloon on that...whats the bottle?
[14:07] <M0UPU> its a container for fluids and stuff
[14:07] <daveake> it's an empty bottle
[14:08] <Randomskk> haha
[14:08] <number10_M0MDB> yea so did you forget to take it of when measuring neck lift :P
[14:08] <daveake> hah no :)
[14:08] <Lunar_Lander> XD
[14:10] <daveake> It was a Vittel bottle; we thought we'd send it home
[14:10] <number10_M0MDB> let me guess - ballast with a cutdown... was it full of scotch as a sweetener for the damaged farmland
[14:11] <GMT> a ballast bottle with a cutdown would be dangerous
[14:11] <M0UPU> there was no cut down
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[14:12] <number10_M0MDB> of course - I only jest GMT
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[14:13] <GMT> others would see your 'idea' and think "ooh, thats clever, we will do that next flight"!
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[14:15] <GMT> has anyone ever tried any night flights?, not 'floaters', but just a late launch?
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[14:15] <number10_M0MDB> I think it was said on one line with a joke about scotch so I dont think so GMT
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[14:21] <costyn> well... I have no idea how this happened, my payload appeared in Kazakhstan: http://imgur.com/W9MASaE
[14:22] <M0UPU> it was commented on :)
[14:23] <costyn> M0UPU: ah, missed that :) Maxell might've been playing with it
[14:25] <martijn__> Does anyone have a picture or something to show me what the signal should look like?
[14:26] <M0UPU> yeah 1 sec
[14:26] <Geoff-G8DHE> dl-fldigi or sdr ?
[14:27] <M0UPU> http://i.imgur.com/peHWXM7.jpg
[14:27] <martijn__> Thanks al lot
[14:27] <costyn> martijn__: you from NL?
[14:27] <lz1dev> costyn: wierd, maybe its connect to http://habitat.habhub.org/mobile-tracker/?nyan
[14:27] <martijn__> jep
[14:28] <costyn> martijn__: ah I see you are near Eindhoven
[14:28] <martijn__> Yes I am :D
[14:28] <costyn> martijn__: cool, I'm in the Hague
[14:28] <martijn__> :o cool :D
[14:29] <costyn> martijn__: the balloon I launched earlier last month landed just north of Gemert
[14:29] <martijn__> Was that the one on hak5?
[14:29] <costyn> martijn__: yep
[14:29] <gonzo_> gps lock probs on uXABEN?
[14:29] <martijn__> ah nice
[14:30] <costyn> martijn__: anyways, welcome!
[14:30] <martijn__> I found out about this whole balloon thing from that show
[14:30] <costyn> aha
[14:31] <costyn> martijn__: I do plan to launch another one within a few months
[14:31] <chrisstubbs> m0upu are you running two instances of sdr#?
[14:31] <costyn> martijn__: just have to get our act together at our hackerspace :)
[14:31] <martijn__> awesome
[14:31] <costyn> anyways, I need to go... talk to you later
[14:31] <martijn__> ok bye
[14:31] <costyn> cya
[14:32] <M0UPU> in fairness this is the GPS module I broke
[14:36] <Geoff-G8DHE> ELK's moving to its takeoff location
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[14:42] <Lunar_Lander> xD Vittel
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[14:50] <sq9diq> who has receive XABEN1 ?
[14:51] <M0UPU> o7
[14:51] <M0UPU> 434247.500
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[14:51] <Darkside> Receivers: jijdaar, M6FTY, wrockets, M0UPU, ChrisStubbs, 2E0KPI, G6SUQ, F5APQ, M0JCU, ASTRA_NOT_FLDIGI, M0DTS, daveake, PE1BUD, PE2G, G8DHE-1, M0MDB, G8KNN-1, F4FWT, G0DJA, G0NZO, G8KHW
[14:51] <Darkside> they have all receive XABEN1
[14:51] <Darkside> >_>
[14:51] <chrisstubbs> started a little experiment earlier ;) http://flic.kr/p/e9mcK8
[14:51] <M0UPU> You're a little far our in Poland
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[14:52] <M0UPU> trying to make H2 ?
[14:52] <Randomskk> chrisstubbs: interesting. evolving hydrogen?
[14:52] <Randomskk> oh well
[14:52] <Randomskk> it does say "H2 generator"
[14:52] <chrisstubbs> :P
[14:52] <Randomskk> so if I had to guess... :P
[14:52] <M0UPU> tis a give away :)
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[14:52] <chrisstubbs> yeah thought i would give it a go and see if its possible to use for habbing
[14:52] <chrisstubbs> like small picos
[14:52] <Randomskk> soooo slow
[14:52] <Lunar_Lander> hey Darkside
[14:53] <chrisstubbs> yeah
[14:53] <chrisstubbs> very slow
[14:53] <Randomskk> yea I guess for small picos maybe
[14:53] <Randomskk> you need to up the current clearly
[14:53] <Hiena> Ehhh...So pintless.
[14:53] <Randomskk> that'l speed it up nicely
[14:53] <Randomskk> what're you feeding into that?
[14:53] <chrisstubbs> 12v 1.5a from a wall wart
[14:53] <Randomskk> haha
[14:53] <chrisstubbs> might swap it for a ATX psu
[14:53] <Randomskk> clearly need more current
[14:53] <Randomskk> yea get a solid few hundred watts going in there at least
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[14:54] <Hiena> If you want to fill the balloon with hydrogen from electrolysis, you will need much bigger setup, and thicker cable.
[14:54] <chrisstubbs> just an experiment atm
[14:54] <fsphil> typical, bursts just as I turn my radio on
[14:55] <Hiena> If i remember correctly 1 mol hydrogen requires 47kW which is 22litre at the atmosphreic pressure.
[14:55] <chrisstubbs> interesting figures
[14:55] <chrisstubbs> thats a fair bit of energy
[14:56] <junderwood_M0JCU> kW is power - not energy
[14:57] <Lunar_Lander> yea 1 mol of gas is 22.4 L
[14:57] <Hiena> Yup, that is why the "water energy", "joe cell", "water powered car" lunatics got nothing.
[14:57] <chrisstubbs> lol
[14:58] <Lunar_Lander> XD yeah
[14:58] <Lunar_Lander> what was it
[14:58] <sq9diq> M0UPU :maybe next time
[14:58] <Lunar_Lander> yesterday I read a great comment by someone
[14:58] <Lunar_Lander> like something about playing poker with physics
[14:58] <M0UPU> we'll keep trying to send one your way sq9diq
[14:58] <Lunar_Lander> but physics will have, in the right moment, a Royal Flush in all colours
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[15:00] <junderwood_M0JCU> Missed the fun again jcoxon
[15:00] <jcoxon> whats happened?
[15:00] <sq9diq> tnx, ok send me firs info via sq9diq@gmail.com
[15:00] <junderwood_M0JCU> Xaben1 went up then came down again
[15:00] <junderwood_M0JCU> (not really that much fun)
[15:01] <jcoxon> oh right
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[15:02] <junderwood_M0JCU> uXaben is still living in the past
[15:03] <jcoxon> who is NOT_FLDIGI?
[15:03] <Hiena> So chrisstubbs, try some aluminium+muriatic acid. Easier to handle amd much cheaper.
[15:03] <junderwood_M0JCU> Flags on uXaben are now 0030 if that means anything
[15:03] <M0UPU> Astra jcoxon
[15:03] <Geoff-G8DHE> ASTRA_ that's southampton isn't it ?
[15:03] <Lunar_Lander> well depends
[15:04] <Lunar_Lander> if you mean the beer it is Hamburg, if you mean the Satellite it is Luxemburg
[15:04] <Lunar_Lander> xD
[15:04] <mattbrejza> yea i dont have a better name then astra_not_fldigi
[15:04] <jcoxon> is it running your new code?
[15:04] <mattbrejza> yep
[15:05] <jcoxon> cool
[15:05] <mattbrejza> its beating fldigi today
[15:05] <M0UPU> uXABEN is drifting
[15:05] <daveake> just a bit
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[15:17] <junderwood_M0JCU> Unfortunate position for a wood
[15:17] <jcoxon> just my thoughts
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[15:18] Nick change: junderwood_M0JCU -> junderwood
[15:19] Nick change: M0UPU -> Upu
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[15:20] <Hix-Android> Xaben looks like it was cut down, was it?
[15:21] <Upu> either that or a 100g ballon
[15:21] <mattbrejza> payload decided against hte wood
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[15:22] <Geoff-G8DHE> Nope it likes it
[15:22] <Hix-Android> Weird ascent rate wasnt abnormal
[15:23] Nick change: number10_M0MDB -> number10
[15:23] <junderwood> Dead centre
[15:23] <mattbrejza> astra_not_fldigi destroyed astra_fldigi by 387 - 299 today :/
[15:23] <Geoff-G8DHE> Its down now
[15:25] <number10> thats promising gorund level there is about 40m
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[15:28] <GMT> that's in the Anglia Alps
[15:28] <daveake> Yeah, normally an altitude of 45 metres means "on the ground", but not there!
[15:30] <number10> os map has level 40m at that point
[15:30] <number10> 10m pole
[15:30] <daveake> Let's hope he has an 8m stick then :)
[15:30] <number10> yea I forgot the end bits are of little use
[15:31] <Geoff-G8DHE> It moved around a bit after passing 46m point as well
[15:31] <daveake> I guess Steve's tree-avoiding code was in the other tracker
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[15:46] <gonzo_> it's the tree-seeking code. The only woodland in miles
[15:47] <Morseman> What happened to uXABEN ?
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[15:51] <_ed> hi all, ive been doing a couple of tests with a parachute i have and a 1kg weight, although the parachute slows thing down well i was wondering if anyone has used two parachutes, or is it a no go due the possibilities of tangling?
[15:52] <Randomskk> avoid two chutes
[15:52] <Randomskk> use one bigger one if you need to
[15:53] <_ed> yeh thats what i was thinking i just thought id ask. do people avoid two due to tangling risk?
[15:54] <Randomskk> yes
[15:54] <_ed> brilliant thanks for that randomskk
[15:55] <Randomskk> no
[15:55] <Randomskk> np *
[15:57] <Morseman> I guess it must have stopped transmitting or something?
[15:57] <Morseman> Looks like I chose well leaving RX on XABEN1 then
[15:58] <Upu> GPS failed
[15:58] <jcoxon> hehe i found my gps module from Pegasus !
[15:59] <jcoxon> Pegasus I that is
[15:59] <Upu> lassen ?
[15:59] <jcoxon> no no
[15:59] <jcoxon> BR304
[15:59] <jcoxon> so its a SIRFII
[15:59] <Upu> never heard of it :)
[16:00] <Upu> 18km ?
[16:00] <jcoxon> yeah
[16:00] <jcoxon> http://www.pegasushabproject.org.uk/wiki/doku.php/missions:pegasus1
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[16:01] <Morseman> Sorry to hear that Upu. Payload attached to XABEN1 though I hope?
[16:02] <number10> someone has been messing about with the wiki jcoxon http://www.pegasushabproject.org.uk/wiki/doku.php/missions:pegasus1:construction
[16:02] <jcoxon> oh i remember
[16:02] <jcoxon> i copied it over
[16:02] <jcoxon> so its probably a dead link
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[16:21] <Geoff-G8DHE> Usual files ;-) Pano, Object movie also Little Planet and would you believe a Transverse Mercator for a bit of fun! http://360.g8dhe.net/hab_flights/XABEN46/index.php?ind=1
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[16:26] <SP9UOB_Tom> hi All
[16:27] <futurity> Hi, Is there a site which shows the stats about payload receivers? I'd like to find out the number of packets I successfully decoded today
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[16:28] <Randomskk> futurity: http://habitat.habhub.org/stats/
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[16:28] <futurity> Randomskk: Thanks
[16:34] <SP9UOB_Tom> here is Video from yesterdays flight: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=daKG1AVEXYo (yes, i know polish language is strange ;-)
[16:34] <lz1dev> /fq 3
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[17:29] <Upu> evening Steve, get it out of the tree ?
[17:29] <RocketBoy> nope not yet
[17:30] <RocketBoy> still here waiting for lamdowner
[17:30] <Upu> oh its not public land ?
[17:30] <RocketBoy> I'd say its 60ft up
[17:30] <Upu> ouch
[17:30] <Morseman> Oh dear :(
[17:30] <RocketBoy> na - its a managed woodland
[17:30] <Upu> ok
[17:31] <RocketBoy> so at least they have chainsaws
[17:31] <Upu> haha
[17:31] <jiffe1> well had our first successful launch yesterday
[17:31] <RocketBoy> i think it may come to that
[17:31] <Upu> sounds like you're about to be very specific about which tree needs "managing"
[17:31] <Upu> congrats jiffe1 where ?
[17:31] <RocketBoy> yeah
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[17:32] <jiffe1> launched our of western south dakota in the US
[17:32] <Upu> get some nice pics ?
[17:32] <Upu> good signal on both payloads btw RocketBoy, shame the GPS packed up
[17:33] <RocketBoy> ah - did it - I wasn't listening to uXABEn
[17:33] <RocketBoy> i knew somthing went wrong with it
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[17:33] <Upu> GPS froze
[17:33] <jiffe1> got some video http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gOYzmC96KnM, http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=v3qRvyMulwM, http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WHWk2dn8M9s
[17:34] <RocketBoy> oh
[17:34] <Upu> which is concerning
[17:34] <jiffe1> we used a veho muvi, it seems to record in 30 minute chunks
[17:34] <RocketBoy> yeah
[17:34] <Upu> be interested to know if it comes back after a power cycle
[17:34] <Upu> the MAX7C in mine was fine
[17:34] <Upu> that said that is the MAX7 I half destroyed
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[17:34] <RocketBoy> well mine had had a bit of a rough time ;-)
[17:34] <Upu> will check that later jiffe1
[17:35] <Upu> will have a chat later :)
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[17:36] <Upu> what balloon was this one btw ?
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[17:37] <Lunar_Lander> hello RocketBoy
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[17:39] <jiffe1> we used a totex 600g
[17:39] <Upu> APRS ?
[17:39] <jiffe1> aprs and we also had a SPOT personal tracker in there
[17:39] <Upu> ok yeah good back up
[17:40] <Upu> afk a bit
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[17:58] <jcoxon> if i want to decode something from a scope is it a matter of measuring the gaps
[17:58] <jcoxon> http://www.flickr.com/photos/jcoxon77/8627758967/in/photostream
[17:59] <jonsowman> basically yes
[17:59] <jonsowman> work out the bit period and write down the logic level at each period
[17:59] <jonsowman> you might want to zoom in a bit and scroll
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[18:11] <Morseman__> Arrrgh - "%$*)% ISP connection
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[18:12] <Morseman> Any recommendations for a half decent ISP (*NOT* TalkTalk) please?
[18:14] <Randomskk> AA
[18:14] <Randomskk> http://aaisp.co.uk/
[18:14] <Randomskk> prepare to pay
[18:14] <fsphil> worth it
[18:14] <Randomskk> precisely
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[18:15] <fsphil> the two problems I had with them turned out to be hardware on my own network
[18:26] <jcoxon> jonsowman, on that image i posted the really small spikes is that a logic level?
[18:26] <Randomskk> yes
[18:26] <Randomskk> you probably want to lower the scope timebase
[18:26] <Randomskk> looks like you should still fit it all on
[18:27] <Randomskk> and probably decrease the volts/div so that it's not such a big jump
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[19:08] <Gode> XABEN recovered yet ?.
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[19:51] <Morseman> Thanks Randomskk that looks very interesting...
[19:53] <Morseman> TalkTalk are about £15/month but would happily pay another £10 per month for no drop outs and no throttling at weekends and evenings
[19:54] <Morseman> Then I'd get Kate off my back when she's trying to play farmville and it's dropping out every 30 minutes as well...
[19:54] <mfa298> I've always used eclipse for ADSL and they've been reasonable (but also expensive)
[19:55] <mfa298> I've heard various people recommend aaisp in the past.
[19:56] <Morseman> Expensive is a relative term - Cheap but only gives slow speed and lots of drop outs is not cost effective...
[19:56] <mfa298> although if you're having dropouts that could also be down to the telephone line
[19:57] <Randomskk> we have eclipse at home and they are good, really good customer support etc
[19:57] <mfa298> I think when I've tested I've had most of the 8Mbps the exchange supports.
[19:57] <Randomskk> and the net's been fine
[19:57] <Morseman> I can get a cheap car but if it keeps breaking down and I can't get to work, so I get docked pay, it's a bad idea
[19:57] <Randomskk> (now on eclipse fibre. fibre to the cabinet is amazing if you can get it)
[19:57] <jonsowman> Morseman: are you on adsl?
[19:57] <Morseman> Yes
[19:57] <jonsowman> do you know how far away your exchange is?
[19:57] <Morseman> 2 lines - 1 work the other private
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[19:57] <Morseman> the work one (seperate line) is OK but Company pay for that
[19:57] <jonsowman> http://www.samknows.com/broadband/exchange_mapping
[19:58] <jonsowman> there's some chance you have an aluminium line
[19:58] <jonsowman> which are rubbish
[19:58] <Morseman> It's always faster than TT and more reliable (after the telephone Co sorted their cock-ups out)
[19:58] <Upu_> Zen Internet is also very good but expensive
[19:59] <Upu_> yeah Aluminum lines suck badly for FTTC
[19:59] Nick change: Upu_ -> UPu
[19:59] Nick change: UPu -> Upu
[19:59] <Morseman> Both are the same final connection to the same local exchange (same bundled cable from here to the local box)
[19:59] <jonsowman> we're on BT Infinity FTTC, it's been excellent. rock solid and 80MBps down, 20MBps up, and 10-12ms pigns to london
[19:59] <Upu> I quite like Entanet
[20:00] <Upu> I'm a reseller of
[20:00] <Morseman> Have a slight (for some value above 100) aversion to anything BT
[20:00] <jonsowman> Morseman: the D-side (cab to house) is what matters for FTTC
[20:00] <jonsowman> whereas with ADSL the E-side matters too
[20:00] <Upu> however
[20:00] <Upu> if you can get FTTC
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[20:00] <Upu> shortly you will be able to get FTTP on deman
[20:00] <Upu> demand
[20:00] <Morseman> I'm waiting to see when we get fibre here
[20:01] <Upu> which will have a ludicrous install charge but then revert to more realistic monthly
[20:01] <Upu> was Xaben recovered ?
[20:01] <fsphil> when I'm rich I'll totally have FTTP
[20:02] <Morseman> It's like buying solar panels - Free just means the installer makes the money over time - If you pay up front you get the longer term benefits - Same with energy efficiency stuff
[20:02] <mfa298> when ever our FTTC date gets close it gets changed maybe I'll get >8MB sometime by 2020
[20:09] <Morseman> AAISP says later this year here, but then again...
[20:10] <Morseman> Would anyone suggest Be over BT for "normal" home use. Personally, the more I can take off BT the better...
[20:11] <mfa298> I tend to look on samknows for FTTC and LLU info, tends to have everthing in the same place
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[20:26] <Morseman> Right. Having had a read of the Ts & Cs I'll give AAIPC a call tomorrow and see what they say
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[20:41] <Morseman> I used to be with Tiscali, which was OKish, but TalkTalk have been a major PiTA with connection issues
[20:41] <fsphil> my last three isps where bought out by talktalk
[20:42] <fsphil> each one becoming horrible within a few months of it
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[20:44] <Upu> Got it back Steve ?
[20:45] <Morseman> The big problem is lack of any customer service - I know the line is OK (the company ISP use a parallel line through same cable to same box and same exchange and there's not as many drop outs or throttling) and my modem is Ok
[20:46] <Morseman> But at least twice a night Kate shouts that the internet is down, and I have to scurry round to reset the ADSL connection
[20:46] <SP9UOB_Tom> fsphil: http://www.speedtest.net/result/2629992271.png
[20:46] <fsphil> there's no excuse for that SP9UOB_Tom :p
[20:47] Action: fsphil goes away and cries
[20:47] <SP9UOB_Tom> fsphil: im co-owner of ISP :-)
[20:47] <Upu> technically cheating but I'll let you have it
[20:47] <Morseman> Sometimes this PC defaults back to the company connection (I try not to use it for private use) and I don't realise until Kate moans or I go upstairs and the internet is down.
[20:47] <fsphil> lol
[20:47] <Randomskk> http://www.speedtest.net/result/1981753836.png
[20:47] <Randomskk> >_>
[20:47] <Randomskk> just putting that there
[20:48] Action: fsphil sobs
[20:48] <Randomskk> I think at that point it's not so much about "your internet connection" as "the load on their server right now and all the peering arrangements between your ISPs"
[20:48] <fsphil> yea
[20:48] <Upu> meanwhile back in reality : http://speedtest.net/result/2579929568.png
[20:49] <Randomskk> haha that's still pretty good!
[20:49] <fsphil> my fttc line is about 60mbit/s
[20:49] <fsphil> up from 39
[20:49] <Upu> yeah pay peanuts get shite service
[20:49] <fsphil> and to be honest, I've not noticed
[20:49] <Upu> Zen Internet are very very good
[20:49] <Upu> but expensive
[20:49] Action: SP9UOB_Tom have dedicated 1G fiber to the home (because 10G switch is really expensive) ;-)
[20:49] <Randomskk> SP9UOB_Tom: !! jealous
[20:49] <Randomskk> my home internet connection is much worse than the uni one: http://www.speedtest.net/result/2629997453.png
[20:50] <fsphil> I can't run the test, the only non-wifi machine here doesn't have flash
[20:52] Action: mfa298 probably gets the wooden spoon: http://www.speedtest.net/result/2630000693.png
[20:52] <Morseman> I just ran the www.broadbandspeedchecker.co.uk on Kates PC (hardwired to the ADSL router - not WiFi) and Download speed = 8.67mB/s upload = 0.820mB/s
[20:53] <mfa298> That's over wifi but it's not going to make any difference.
[20:53] <fsphil> that's pretty good for adsl
[20:53] <mfa298> Morseman: that's better than I get :(
[20:54] <Morseman> Yes but that's at 09:50 at night...
[20:54] <Morseman> If the USA are awake or it's a weekend or bank holiday...
[20:54] <mfa298> but this exchange is pretty poor, no FTTC, and there's now a massive 2 LLU providers and I think we've only just got into 21CN
[20:55] <Morseman> Then there's the regular break in service - You know when it says Morseman and/or G0DJA have left the building, that's usually because TalkTalk bombed out
[20:56] <Morseman> mfa298 without wanting to patronise, it's levels that we used to get in the 1990s over here - Things were supposed to get better!
[20:58] <fsphil> I think I was still on dialup then
[20:58] <mfa298> I think most of the UK was still on dialup in the 90's
[20:58] <fsphil> yea, I got ADSL in 2003
[20:59] <fsphil> a huge 256kbit/s
[20:59] <fsphil> 128kbit up
[20:59] <fsphil> I remember being really impressed :)
[20:59] <mfa298> dialup really took off in 98 with freeserve and 0845 number
[20:59] <fsphil> I could play mp3's as I downloaded them
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[21:00] <mfa298> I think I started on ADSL around 2002/2003 as well.
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[21:02] <Randomskk> I had dual bonded ISDN
[21:02] <Randomskk> the coolest kid on the block
[21:02] <Randomskk> that was super speedy
[21:03] <Morseman> OK I may have got ADSL 1 in 2000s, but at least it stayed on
[21:04] <Morseman> PowerGen paid for us to have a superdooper connection via a seperate line, but not internet IIRC
[21:05] <Morseman> I had dial up and then ADSL as soon as I could, but it used to stay connected
[21:07] <mfa298> whilst mine might be slow I don't get much in the way of noticeable disconnections (logs suggest it occasionally drops but comes straight back up)
[21:07] <Morseman> I'm not so fussed about absolute speed (I am not a gamer) but it does p*ss me off when I have to reset the TalkTalk box two or three times and the company ISP rarely misses a beat
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[21:08] <Morseman> It'll be worth an extra £10 a month if Kate is happy...
[21:08] <mfa298> it could also be worth changing to a different router and see if that improves things.
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[21:09] <Morseman> I don't think it's the router mfa298 I've had a couple and this Cisco one seems OK
[21:09] <mfa298> I stopped using the providers router when the one I had died, got replaced and then the replacement died.
[21:10] <Morseman> It's usually that the line stops responding, from what I can make out
[21:10] <Morseman> Yes, wouldn't touch a TalkTalk box with a bargepole
[21:10] <mfa298> ah if it's a real cisco then you're probably good (that's what I'm using)
[21:10] <Geoff-G8DHE_> Evening all
[21:11] <Morseman> Like I say mfa298 I could be wrong, but I've tried to eliminate the usual problems...
[21:12] <Morseman> The problem then is that the TalkTalk drones, on a script, blame the router if it's not one of theirs...
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[21:12] <Geoff-G8DHE_> Hi Steve did you getthat large mail OK ?
[21:12] <mfa298> you might be able to get BT to change the line properties via the ISP but that might be easier with an ISP that doesn't employ monkeys
[21:13] <SpeedEvil> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=V87VXA6gPuE
[21:13] <Geoff-G8DHE_> and to days flight http://360.g8dhe.net/hab_flights/XABEN46/
[21:13] <SpeedEvil> physics is beautiful
[21:13] <Morseman> Linksys by Cisco ADSL-2+ V2
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[21:14] <Upu> that your router Morseman ?
[21:14] <Morseman> Yes Upu
[21:14] <Upu> if so bin it they are useless
[21:14] <Morseman> OK
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[21:14] <Upu> we had so many issues with those
[21:15] <Morseman> What would you suggest instead?
[21:15] <Upu> they have this habit of defaulting their settings for no reason at all
[21:15] <Upu> Netgear are ok
[21:15] <Upu> Zyxel naff interfaces but work
[21:15] <mfa298> Draytek used to have a good name although I've not heard much from them recently
[21:15] <Upu> Yeah alot of people rate they highly and I think the hardware is good
[21:16] <Upu> but the interface is wtf
[21:16] <Morseman> I used to have a Netgear but it died on me
[21:16] <fsphil> I've had so many netgear PSUs fail
[21:16] <mfa298> probably a nicer interface than IOS (Cisco) for people that have never seen it before.
[21:16] <Morseman> The internet access system was a PiTA as well
[21:17] <Morseman> The company modem is a Draytek - no problems
[21:18] <Morseman> If I have an internet problem on the Draytek it's someone elses problem anyway :-)
[21:18] <Geoff-G8DHE_> RocketBoy Steve did you get that large mail the other night ?
[21:19] <Morseman> OK so what modem to get instead of the Cisco?
[21:20] <mfa298> if you're feeling rich and want to spend time learning the IOS commands buy a real Cisco (Not Linksys)
[21:20] <fsphil> I loved the DG834, mostly cause it looked really nice
[21:20] <Morseman> Bearing in mind this also means negotiation with Kate about uninstalling software and replacing with new (She's very defensive about her PC)
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[21:20] <fsphil> good routers need no software
[21:20] <fsphil> other than ssh or a web browser
[21:21] <mfa298> fsphil: or a serial cable ;)
[21:21] <Morseman> OK - so I delete (with permission) all the Cisco programmes and on my PCs - but what to replace it withy?
[21:21] <Morseman> with
[21:22] <RocketBoy> Geoff-G8DHE_: Yes - many thanks for that - sorry I haven't got back before - its been all go flight wise
[21:22] <Geoff-G8DHE_> That I can quite believe!
[21:22] <fsphil> I got burned by Netgear recently, my gigabit switch can only be configured with a Windows app
[21:22] <RocketBoy> I need to pass the pannos on yet
[21:23] <Geoff-G8DHE_> No problem, if they halp the cause!
[21:23] <Geoff-G8DHE_> *help
[21:23] <RocketBoy> gotta get the tree surgeons out to XABEN46 tomorrow
[21:24] <fsphil> uhoh
[21:24] <Upu> oh dear
[21:24] <Morseman> ops
[21:24] <Morseman> oops
[21:24] <mfa298> Morseman: Personally I'd probably go with Draytek or Netgear (if I wasn't doing real Cisco)
[21:24] <Randomskk> I also like netgear kit
[21:25] <Upu> just not Belkin
[21:25] <SP9UOB_Tom> night all
[21:25] <fsphil> never belkin
[21:25] <Randomskk> I have a netgear dgnd3700
[21:25] <fsphil> night SP9UOB_Tom
[21:25] <Randomskk> it's very lovely
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[21:25] <Morseman> I used to like Netgear but the access via a browser was a pain at times
[21:25] <Randomskk> superb wifi, a wan port, adsl2 modem, a ton of other nice features
[21:25] <Randomskk> they probably have a new version now
[21:26] <mfa298> you might also want to check the manuals first as whilst there might be software to configure it chances are you can also do it without the software.
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[21:27] <Morseman> Upu *Never* Belkin
[21:27] <mfa298> a couple of times I've had to look at Linksys ADSL routers it's been possible to configure them via a browser without installing software on the PC.
[21:27] <fsphil> belkin's cables are ok. hardware is meh. software is evil evil
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[21:28] <Morseman> mfa298 the browser access has been a problem when I have more than one router in the house and most PCs are connected via WiFi - Netgear used to need a hardwire connection to set/reset perameters...
[21:30] <Morseman> I had a really nice old Netgear, but it just stopped working one day.
[21:30] <Morseman> That's when I got the Linksys Cisco unit
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[21:31] <fsphil> try changing the psu on the netgear
[21:31] <mfa298> once you've got the wifi network configured it shouldn't be bard to configure the rest via a browser over wireless or physical cable.
[21:31] <Morseman> Maybe the answer is to run CAT5 cables to every room and do away with WiFi :)
[21:32] <fsphil> I've cat5 running out to the shed :)
[21:32] <Morseman> fsphil too late - I bined the Netgear when it stopped working over 12 months ago
[21:33] <Randomskk> cat5 is definitely the way to go
[21:33] <Randomskk> wifi is fine for like, my tablet or perhaps my laptop in bed
[21:33] <fsphil> or cat6, but it's annoying to crimp
[21:33] <Morseman> I need CAT5 for the magnetometer - but that's another story
[21:33] <mfa298> You could always look at getting a seperate Wireless AP (most stuff is physically wired but a lot of those don't have a wifi option - or it's expensive)
[21:33] <fsphil> long runs of cat5 do produce a fair bit of noise on 144mhz
[21:33] <Morseman> fsphil I'm thinking precriped anyway
[21:34] <Morseman> precrimped
[21:34] <Morseman> fsphil I don't do much (if any) 144MHz these days anyway
[21:34] <fsphil> nor me :)
[21:35] <mfa298> crimp tool and rj45 plugs were a very worthwhile investment, I've had so many clips on the rj45 plugs break off.
[21:35] <fsphil> I need to label all the cables running around the house
[21:36] <fsphil> I had them colour coded, but the tape didn't stick and they fell off after a while
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[21:36] <mfa298> you can get cable tie labels which aren't bad to labeling cables
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[21:37] <fsphil> not a bad idea
[21:38] <eroomde> https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=5503400
[21:38] <Morseman> mfa298 I agree about the clips - I tend to use tape to keep them in then ;)
[21:38] <eroomde> maybe relevent
[21:39] <Morseman> In MEB we used circular number/letter collars
[21:39] <Morseman> round the cable/cores
[21:39] <mfa298> fsphil: I've used the 2nd type in the pic on http://www.maplin.co.uk/marker-cable-ties-6230
[21:39] <mfa298> work well on cat5/cat6
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[21:42] <mfa298> ooh, reading the first paragraphs in there, one thing that could be worth looking for is a router that can take openwrt or dd-wrt then if you don't like the interface that could be an option (not that I've ever used any of those custom firmwares to comment on them)
[21:43] <mfa298> the cable tie labels also work on rg58, rg213, urm70, westflex103 and probably others.
[21:43] <Randomskk> openwrt was great fun, I used to run that
[21:43] <cuddykid> ping arko
[21:44] <mfa298> I keep thinking of trying the various -wrt options and then find that none of the devices I've bought support anything like that
[21:44] <Randomskk> eroomde: oh my goodness
[21:44] <Randomskk> that is truly appalling
[21:45] <Morseman> "openwrt" Ah, Linux. I tried that a couple of times. My intake of paracetamol went up exponencially
[21:52] <Morseman> OK - So tomorrow I look for a Netgear ADSL/WiFi box again and then maybe move to another ISP as well. Or, maybe I let the new ISP send me their ADSL/WiFi box and I reconfigure the house connections (PCs, laptops, Wii, mobile phones etc) again. Deep Joy.
[21:52] <fsphil> you shouldn't have any of that to do
[21:52] <Morseman> Why?
[21:52] <fsphil> dhcp
[21:52] <Morseman> pardon
[21:52] <fsphil> unless you've given everything a static IP, all your devices will just work
[21:53] <Morseman> They've all got standard non-static address (I think)
[21:53] <mfa298> the only thing you might have to reconfigure is the wireless network to talk to. But it should be as possible to change the wireless network name and secret on the router
[21:53] <fsphil> yea, setup the wireless to whatever it currently is
[21:54] <mfa298> The wireless network name doesn't have to be the default on the box (although it seems everyone in range of me thinkgs it does)
[21:54] <Elwell> last 3 telcos we've just used the same passwrd that the 1st one set - change once on router vs all devices
[21:54] <Morseman> OK (he said, not expecting it to be that easy because it never has been in the past...)
[21:55] <Morseman> OK bed time. Night all thanks for the advice
[21:56] <mfa298> If you know the network name and the wireless password that your devices are connecting to then it should just be a case of setting that on the router and everything will just connect
[21:56] <Elwell> you probably need to re-apply static dhcp lease to printers etc
[21:57] <fsphil> printers, always spoiling it
[21:57] <mfa298> for home networks I'm not sure that matters, I think the drivers just broadcast to find the printer
[22:02] <Morseman> No printers
[22:03] <Morseman> yet!
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[23:34] <arko> cuddykid: sup
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[00:00] --- Mon Apr 8 2013