highaltitude.log.20130312

[00:00] <HANoob> how far have you gotten with yours? I'm pretty sure mines wired correctly and I can get both the ntx2 and gps to work separately.
[00:00] <Sierra004> I assume you have gotten your NTX2 working with dl-fldigi?
[00:01] <Sierra004> on its own
[00:01] <HANoob> yeah
[00:01] <Sierra004> and your gps works through the serial monitor?
[00:01] <Sierra004> over USB
[00:02] <HANoob> yup. I even got it to log to an sd shield.
[00:02] <Sierra004> Nice, thats basically the same as me then
[00:03] <HANoob> well at least I'm not the only one that's stuck
[00:03] <Sierra004> I'm stupidly new to this so I'm not the best person to talk to
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[00:04] <Sierra004> guys like eroomde and daveake seriously know their stuff
[00:04] <Sierra004> I was told that basically softwareSerial trashes your RTTY and with the ublox6 it's really time sensative
[00:05] <Sierra004> And that using hardware serial is the better method
[00:05] <Darkside> yes
[00:05] <Sierra004> I'm working on that now
[00:05] <arko> just use an arduino leonardo
[00:05] <arko> usb and uart
[00:05] <HANoob> well at this point I'm only using software serial for the sd shield.
[00:05] <arko> i forget the chip nap
[00:05] <arko> name*
[00:05] <Darkside> arko: as long as you don't want to do anything time-critical while talking usb
[00:05] <Darkside> arko: ATMega32U4
[00:05] <arko> ah!
[00:05] <arko> that
[00:05] <arko> yeah
[00:06] <arko> Darkside: right
[00:06] <Darkside> i've made a board using it
[00:06] <arko> im working on a pico with it
[00:06] <Darkside> the issue is the usb interrupt has a higher priority than all others (i think)
[00:06] <arko> for lulz
[00:06] <arko> fun weekend project after my hab
[00:06] <arko> hmm
[00:06] <arko> i was thinking: get gps, rtty, usb out what you just did, repeat
[00:07] <HANoob> it shouldn't matter if I'm using software serial for the sd shield as long as I'm using hardware serial for the gps, correct?
[00:08] <Darkside> if its just transmit only, then that should be ok
[00:08] <HANoob> alright, thanks
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[00:09] <Sierra004> Thanks for the help everyone, I'm out
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[01:21] <arko> oh great, the snake has escaped from the tank again
[01:21] <arko> we practically sealed it off and it still managed to escape
[01:21] <nigelvh> It's called not keeping a snake.
[01:21] <nigelvh> Fixes that issue.
[01:21] <arko> now we have a snake problem
[01:21] <arko> uggg
[01:22] <arko> wasn't my choice anyway
[01:24] <nigelvh> What's the snake for anyway?
[01:24] <arko> to do snake stuff
[01:24] <nigelvh> Slither, Eat mice, Freak out people
[01:24] <arko> i guess
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[04:02] <mrShrimp> Hi! Anyone here?
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[04:07] <mrShrimp> 0.o
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[05:01] <arko> http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_embedded&v=ACKMPD6MySs
[05:01] <arko> wowo
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[06:03] Nick change: azend -> aZn
[06:06] Nick change: aZn -> azend
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[07:05] <griffonbot> Received email: James Coxon "Re: [UKHAS] Re: Downlink code help"
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[07:29] <eroomde> it is painfully cold here this morning
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[07:35] <x-f> i see your "painfully cold" and raise you our -26
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[07:44] <griffonbot> Received email: Costyn van Dongen "Re: [UKHAS] Re: Downlink code help"
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[08:17] <Elwell> impressive grasshopper vid http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_embedded&v=WFAfF1aTjNI
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[08:52] <kokey> it was 32 degrees here yesterday
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[09:13] <kokey> haha
[09:13] <kokey> only noticed the cowboy on the spacex grashopper now
[09:14] <kokey> eroomde: is that scotland rocket launch video from the other month public?
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[09:47] <eroomde> kokey: from this time last year?
[09:47] <eroomde> yes
[09:48] <eroomde> http://www.cusf.co.uk/martlet-1/
[09:51] <kokey> eroomde: ah yeah that one, thanks :)
[09:53] <kokey> good thing you kept the 'f me' audio in there
[09:53] <kokey> it's one of the best bits
[09:53] <eroomde> shane has just arrived
[09:53] <eroomde> the perpetrator of the commentry
[09:54] <fsphil> it was almost poetry
[09:54] <kokey> haha
[09:54] <eroomde> he has a new desk
[09:54] <eroomde> we are going up in the world
[09:54] <kokey> you never did find the second stage in the end?
[09:55] <eroomde> 2 people are becoming 4.5
[09:55] <eroomde> ope
[09:55] <eroomde> 5 even
[09:55] <eroomde> 5.5
[09:57] <fsphil> one of them go on a diet?
[09:59] <gonzo___> or one ate too much
[10:04] <eroomde> half an admin person
[10:04] <eroomde> engineers gotta engineer
[10:05] <eroomde> not spend days putting together swagelok orders
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[10:06] <gonzo___> have argued here that people who do half a job should only get half a car park space
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[10:10] <eroomde> we work on an akirfield
[10:11] <eroomde> parking is not a constraint
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[10:44] <Laurenceb> eroomde: so on your parafoil, are you going to have a RC receiver?
[10:44] <Laurenceb> personally I'd use a 4Chan
[10:44] <Laurenceb> el receiver
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[11:41] <kokey> ooh, parafoil?
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[11:46] <HixWork> parafoil ?
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[13:04] <eroomde> HixWork: bought the salae yet?
[13:05] <HixWork> Nope, I have resisted well
[13:06] <eroomde> but it's soooo nice
[13:06] <daveake> Illogical captain; resistance is futile.
[13:06] <HixWork> sshhhhhh
[13:06] <daveake> All the cool boys have them
[13:06] <daveake> I have one too
[13:07] <HixWork> heh
[13:07] <HixWork> tbh, i'm thinkning hot air is going to be before salae on the list
[13:09] <Elwell> salae salae, or knockoff salae?
[13:09] <HixWork> salae salae
[13:09] <Elwell> nice
[13:10] <eroomde> i'm cool and i have one
[13:10] <Elwell> I'm skint and I don't
[13:10] <eroomde> i took this random still-life picture for Hixwork yesterday
[13:10] <eroomde> http://i.imgur.com/XP0xwjw.jpg
[13:11] <Elwell> that the new 'wireless probe' model?
[13:11] <Elwell> and is tat the PCB you were designing?
[13:12] <eroomde> that's a previous pcb
[13:12] <eroomde> not the current one
[13:12] <Elwell> ah K - was going to say thats a bloody fast turnaround
[13:12] <HixWork> enough of this hot air about salae, what think ye of this model? http://goo.gl/xYf3Z
[13:13] <Elwell> cheap but guesstimate on temp
[13:16] <HixWork> hmm, but then with air it's always going to be a guesstimate as the flow rate is variable too
[13:16] <HixWork> right, lunch. biab
[13:21] <kokey> salae?
[13:21] <jonsowman> *saleae
[13:22] <fsphil> yea I keep spelling it wrong too
[13:23] <daveake> me three
[13:24] <eroomde> saleae
[13:24] <eroomde> the spellling is illogical
[13:25] <jonsowman> How do you pronounce "Saleae," and what does it mean?
[13:25] <jonsowman> Say-lee-'A'. It's just a made up word we came up with a long while back; among other things we went through the periodic table for ideas, and we're pretty confident it was based on Selenium.
[13:25] <eroomde> guff
[13:25] <eroomde> it's called Say-Lee
[13:26] <eroomde> let us appropriate their nonesense from them
[13:27] <fsphil> I've pronounced it as "sah-le-ah"
[13:27] <fsphil> in my head anyway, I've never needed to actually say it
[13:28] <eroomde> same
[13:30] <Elwell> wiznet 5100 shield for under a tenner? suspicuiusly cheap?
[13:30] <eroomde> linky?
[13:30] <Elwell> http://www.aliexpress.com/store/product/New-2012-version-Ethernet-W5100-Shield-For-UNO-Mega-2560-1280-328-only-W5100-Development-board/413752_672387522.html
[13:31] <kokey> one of the vendors that does a part of our product
[13:31] <kokey> I haven't had to pronounce their product name for the past three years of dealing with it
[13:31] <Elwell> and also 15 dollahs for atmeta2560 http://www.aliexpress.com/store/product/MEGA-2560-R3-ATmega2560-AVR-USB-board-USB-cable-ATMEGA2560-ATMEGA8U2-Arduino-compatible-funduino-2560/413752_724400409.html
[13:31] <UpuWork> got the wrong headers on it ?
[13:31] <kokey> and when I actually started working in the same room as the rest of the team I discovered it's quite a tongue twister for me to say 'oempro'
[13:32] <UpuWork> I use a Seeeduino for developing
[13:32] <UpuWork> I like the 3.3v switch
[13:32] <kokey> I was looking around to find a local supplier for rfm22b modules
[13:33] <kokey> came across some guy who mentioned it in one of his projects and emailed him
[13:33] <kokey> turns out he's also interested in hab
[13:33] <kokey> and is now going to do his masters working with the square kilometer array
[13:34] <kokey> could be interesting, considering that the wind from cape town tends to go into the general direction of the SKA site
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[14:05] <eroomde> bash help
[14:05] <eroomde> have a tab delimited list of
[14:05] <eroomde> [number] [some text]
[14:05] <eroomde> can i show only lines whose number is greater than x?
[14:06] <mfa298> you could probably do it with awk
[14:06] <eroomde> i know i could do with with a grep and regex the number for only numbers greater than my desired threshold, but that seems horribly ugly
[14:06] <daveake> The answer's gonna be awk. It always is
[14:06] <eroomde> i feared so
[14:06] <daveake> I've never used it myself
[14:07] <daveake> Anyhoo a little C program could do that easily
[14:07] <mfa298> it might be possible in bash as well but that might be ugly
[14:07] <eroomde> i've been putting off trying to learn it properly, but it is fruitless
[14:07] <mfa298> failing awk there's also perl
[14:07] <eroomde> sure, or python
[14:07] <eroomde> but it seems like something you should be able to do in bash
[14:07] <eroomde> although perhaps not
[14:07] <mfa298> it's probably something like: awk '{ if ($1>num) print $0}'
[14:08] <mfa298> in bash I think you can use: if [ $1 -gt num ]; then
[14:09] <eroomde> that's exactly what it is, infact
[14:09] <eroomde> thank you very muchly
[14:10] <eroomde> cat logger_event_log | cut -d' ' -f5 | sort -n | uniq -c | awk '{ if ($1 > 50) print $0}'
[14:11] <eroomde> so i can triage the causes of upsets in my logging software
[14:11] <jonsowman> nice
[14:12] <mfa298> cut really needs an option to replace -d' ' as I'm sure that's what most people do with it
[14:12] <eroomde> i wish i had learnt the command line better sooner
[14:12] <eroomde> yes, it assumes tabs
[14:12] <eroomde> which is often not
[14:12] <eroomde> at least not to me
[14:13] <mfa298> awk and sed can be really useful. I'm not that good with them but know enough.
[14:13] <eroomde> but i must have written loads of 20 line python scripts that do the same was one command line
[14:13] <eroomde> i vaguely know sed just because of the vim overlap
[14:14] <eroomde> but i should really properly learn sed, grep and awk
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[14:16] <mfa298> I've got into sed a bit more as a way of scripting changes to config files for builds/documentation
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[14:16] <Darkside> eroomde: awake now?
[14:17] <eroomde> yes
[14:17] <eroomde> but i'm at work
[14:17] <Darkside> :P
[14:17] <eroomde> and i doubt you want to pay the conulting rate
[14:17] <Darkside> yeah lol
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[14:17] <eroomde> especially for typing of my quality
[14:17] <daveake> I always wanted to be a conultant
[14:18] <Darkside> i just wondered if you knew any techniques for generating a noise sequence that has a similar distribution to an existing noise dataset
[14:18] <Darkside> i.e. my atmospheric noise data
[14:19] <Elwell> hmm. I appear to have 'lost' dl0fldigi
[14:19] <Elwell> s/0/-/
[14:19] <eroomde> well, not specifically wrt noise
[14:20] <eroomde> but if you frame it as a model selection problem, then there are ways
[14:20] <eroomde> but it might not be the happy thing you want
[14:20] <Darkside> probably not
[14:20] <mfa298> Elwell: the other good use of sed syntax, correcting yourself on IRC
[14:20] <Darkside> eroomde: at the moment i can generate the burst start times and durations
[14:20] <eroomde> darkside my a bot for that
[14:20] <Darkside> but its the structure of the bursts i'm not sure about
[14:20] <Darkside> i can bring regexbot in here if you really want it..
[14:20] <jonsowman> no
[14:20] <Darkside> :P
[14:20] <jonsowman> don't do that
[14:20] <eroomde> well, can you turn them, in your real dataset, into events at times?
[14:21] <eroomde> and then see if you can fit a fish to it?
[14:21] <Darkside> eroomde: hrm
[14:21] <Darkside> eroomde: hmmmmmm
[14:21] <eroomde> that's an easy enough model selection problem
[14:21] <Darkside> if i can build up enough of a collection of noise burst events, that may be a way of doing it
[14:21] <eroomde> as fish only have a couple of parameters
[14:21] <Darkside> hell, i could jsut ransomly select a noise burst profile from the dataset
[14:21] <Darkside> and play that
[14:22] <Darkside> then maybe do some munging of the burst event data to stretch it into shape
[14:22] <eroomde> indeed
[14:22] <eroomde> sounds good
[14:22] <eroomde> that'll be £100 please
[14:22] <Darkside> good start point i think
[14:22] <Darkside> :<
[14:24] <Darkside> i'll probablt write something to look for burst events in the dataset tomorrow, and then extract said events
[14:25] <eroomde> yeah, if you can get something to spit out events vs time, that's good
[14:25] <fsphil> that's probably 25 AUD at the current rates...
[14:25] <eroomde> a house deposit
[14:26] <fsphil> all these stories about the value of the pound falling, it makes it sound like it's a massive difference
[14:27] <Darkside> ok i need to be up in 6 hours..
[14:27] <Darkside> gnight
[14:27] <kokey> Darkside: what's the mw limitation on ISM 433/434 in aus?
[14:27] <daveake> nn
[14:27] <eroomde> horrible
[14:28] <Darkside> kokey: 25
[14:28] <kokey> Darkside: thanks
[14:28] <Darkside> though we don't operate under ISM regs when we launch
[14:28] <kokey> at first glance it looks like it might be more here in SA
[14:28] <Darkside> if we were to do any data obsfucation, which we might be doing for a contest in june, we would have to though
[14:29] <eroomde> is FEC obfuscation?
[14:29] <Darkside> well, encryption
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[14:29] <kokey> RF is obfuscation I'm sure
[14:29] <Darkside> the plan was to do a launch at a big foxhunting comp
[14:29] <Darkside> and encrypt the data after burst
[14:30] <kokey> cool
[14:30] <fsphil> eroomde: nope
[14:30] <fsphil> as long as it's documented
[14:30] <kokey> you're going to give the payload a smell?
[14:30] <eroomde> that was going to be my loophole
[14:30] <eroomde> nvm
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[14:30] <Darkside> kokey: radio direction finding
[14:30] <Darkside> often called foxhunting
[14:30] <kokey> oh
[14:31] <kokey> like with enriched uranium
[14:31] <Darkside> >_>
[14:31] <Darkside> ok i'm going to sleep now
[14:31] <Darkside> gnight
[14:31] <kokey> night Darkside
[14:31] <Babs> Afternoon all - for tracking of balloons from the Chasecar using a Yaesu 817ND, is the included antenna good enough or is a colinear or yagi necessary (outside of when close to the payload when for obvious reasons the yagi is better from a directional point of view). Notwithstanding the yagi's benefits from a low power transmitter, I'm thinking that hanging outside of the car pointing a yagi into the sky for 2 hours might get a li
[14:32] <eroomde> i think you would find something on the roof useful
[14:32] <eroomde> vs inside the car
[14:32] <eroomde> you don;t need a yagi
[14:33] <eroomde> just a decent whip, most here I think use magmounts
[14:33] <Babs> Thanks eroomde. So a mag mount 1/4 wave whip would work?
[14:33] <eroomde> yep
[14:33] <eroomde> used nothing but that on many tens of flights, it's fine for chasing
[14:33] <eroomde> as you say, save the yagi for direction finding
[14:34] <Babs> Awesome. Thanks. Did you build your own or just grab a cheap one of the internet?
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[14:34] <gonzo___> foxhunting now banned in the UK. So you'll have to do a HAB drag hunt. Where you have to dress up in women's clothing
[14:34] <eroomde> neither
[14:34] <eroomde> i bought a moderately expensive one from ML&S
[14:34] <eroomde> but i think ebay ones would work just as well
[14:35] <NigelMoby> Yey
[14:35] <fsphil> and an angry-jcoxon
[14:35] <jonsowman> james is about to get a very confusing email
[14:35] <eroomde> i think that just goes to james
[14:35] <eroomde> as does
[14:35] <NigelMoby> kol
[14:35] <fsphil> to be fair, he wrote it so neener :p
[14:36] <NigelMoby> u can't summon god he's afk in conclave.
[14:36] <gonzo___> hold yopur horses... Would need a bread bap for that
[14:36] <NigelMoby> mustard to
[14:37] <gonzo___> mmm
[14:39] <daveake> summon beef_lasagne ..?
[14:39] <daveake> hoping for an infinite loop?
[14:39] <eroomde> though i might be able to loop zeusbot to death
[14:39] <eroomde> does it work not at the beginning of a string !summon ed
[14:40] <eroomde> no
[14:40] <NigelMoby> hmm
[14:42] <Elwell> ping darkside when you're up -- can you have airbourne APRS in .au?
[14:42] <fsphil> they have done before Elwell, so guessing yes :)
[14:42] <Elwell> thats what I thought, Just checking
[14:43] <eroomde> airborne*
[14:43] <fsphil> they also flew an audio repeater
[14:43] <fsphil> which I'd love to try
[14:43] <eroomde> a typo to which I have become highly attuned
[14:43] <NigelMoby> gonzo if I can get the helium Thursday looks ok for a relay.
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[14:44] <NigelMoby> of course it will probably snow / rain / sleet / hail / blow a gale
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[14:45] <fsphil> don't forget lightning, and probably a tornado
[14:45] <NigelMoby> lol might as well chuck those in too
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[14:46] <mfa298> there might even be some sort of dangerous yellow/orange orb hanging in the sky - as there appears to be here at the moment
[14:47] <fsphil> that sounds scary
[14:47] <NigelMoby> well that's the forecast...sun and 6degrees...
[14:47] <fsphil> kelvin?
[14:47] <fsphil> oh wait, that's not a degree
[14:47] <NigelMoby> lol
[14:49] <x-f> go hunt the C/2011 L4, if it's still clear on the evening!
[14:50] <fsphil> cloudy here
[14:50] <fsphil> typical
[14:50] <fsphil> has anyone seen it?
[14:51] <x-f> i'm driving to the sea in an hour to test my luck
[14:51] <NigelMoby> hmm might try hunting that with itelescopes 24" cdk
[14:52] <gonzo___> NigelMoby, I'm working during the day, but about afterwatds.
[14:53] <gonzo___> I have plenty of H2 and foils
[14:53] <gonzo___> so can send back whenever
[14:53] <NigelMoby> oh nicey
[14:53] <gonzo___> +- trees/water/etc
[14:55] <NigelMoby> lol take chainsaw this time
[14:56] <NigelMoby> fsphil .. http://www.itelescope.net/telescope-t21/
[14:56] <NigelMoby> the 24inch isn't online yet :(
[14:57] <gonzo___> I'd have needed rock climbing kit to even get to the tree, if last time is anything to go by.
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[15:02] <NigelMoby> yikes
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[15:22] <fsphil> isn't that a bit big NigelMoby?
[15:22] <NigelMoby> nah that's still a baby
[15:22] <fsphil> a comet would look better with a wide field
[15:23] <NigelMoby> mm a nice takahashi
[15:25] Action: HixWork makes a mental not to get the W.O ED80 out of the cupboard and find the Nikon adaptor
[15:25] <HixWork> *note
[15:25] <arko> Mornin
[15:26] <fsphil> good *ing
[15:26] <NigelMoby> oo the ed 80 is lovely
[15:26] <fsphil> ED209 not so nice
[15:26] <HixWork> woefully underused these days - living on the outer egde of london is pants for that
[15:27] <fsphil> I was quite surprised how much you could see in the night skies over Edinburgh
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[15:27] <fsphil> London is pretty awful, just orange
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[15:29] <NigelMoby> Cardiff just sucks
[15:30] <NigelMoby> http://www.green-witch.com/acatalog/Takahashi_TOA-150.html
[15:30] <NigelMoby> buy me 1 phil
[15:32] <fsphil> just one?
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[15:33] <NigelMoby> well if u got spare cash how about 2? :p
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[15:35] <NigelMoby> hixwork what mount you got for that ed80 btw ?
[15:36] <HixWork> the ancient HEG5 with the chinese motors that arent actually steppers
[15:36] <NigelMoby> ahh
[15:36] <HixWork> HEQ5, jesus c'mon hands
[15:36] <NigelMoby> get a cgem!
[15:37] <HixWork> my buying things like that days are gone.. ::
[15:37] <HixWork> :/
[15:37] <NigelMoby> :(
[15:38] <fsphil> that bright orange thing has appeared here
[15:38] <fsphil> should we panic?
[15:38] <NigelMoby> run for the hills
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[15:40] <HixWork> that disc in the sky fsphil? Saw that today, though i haven't had an alien break out ffrom my torso yet so I think we're ok of thte moment
[15:41] <HixWork> NigelMoby, I have been looking into a yahoo group called PICGoto, some Italian guy has created a PIC driven boards for the HEQ6 and I may well try and replicate it on a smaller board for the HEQ5
[15:42] <HixWork> though he is only giving up the hex file
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[15:42] <fsphil> no fun
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[15:42] <HixWork> but that's fine i think
[15:42] <NigelMoby> I saw that, looks interesting
[15:42] <HixWork> ICSP will burn that wont it.
[15:42] <fsphil> will yea
[15:42] <fsphil> but you won't be able to fix bugs, add features
[15:42] <HixWork> yup
[15:43] <eroomde> atxmegas are awesome
[15:43] <eroomde> just for egenral interest
[15:43] <NigelMoby> oo hex only, that sucks
[15:43] <eroomde> general*
[15:43] <HixWork> also issue is there are no schematics only pdfs or jpegs of boards
[15:43] <jonsowman> why so good er?
[15:43] <NigelMoby> hm
[15:43] <jonsowman> * eroomde
[15:44] <HixWork> reverese blind engineering to burn a blind hex - what could possibly go wrong there?
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[15:44] <NigelMoby> lol oo let me think...
[15:45] <Elwell> do you have a magic smoke refil to hand?
[15:45] <NigelMoby> lol
[15:46] <HixWork> I've used up all my magic smoke
[15:47] <mfa298> sounds like you need one of these
[15:47] <mfa298> http://www.aerostich.com/a-to-b-utilities/special-products/electrical-smoke-re-concentrator.html
[15:49] <Elwell> heh
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[16:44] <fsphil> anyone know a chart that shows coax loss per metre?
[16:44] <HixWork> NigeyM fsphil found the simple version of PICGoto schematics http://i.imgur.com/xVKRM6Ls.jpg
[16:44] <fsphil> I can only find them in ye old world units
[16:44] <HixWork> and http://i.imgur.com/bsXuqaFs.jpg
[16:45] Action: fsphil squints
[16:45] <mfa298> fsphil: I've never found a good chart with everything on
[16:45] <HixWork> http://www.rfcafe.com/references/electrical/coax-chart.htm any use, was looking at that t'other day
[16:46] <fsphil> nah, dB/100 ft
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[16:46] <HixWork> http://i.imgur.com/bsXuqaF.png http://i.imgur.com/xVKRM6L.png oops
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[16:46] <fsphil> I can see!
[16:47] <HixWork> fsphil, metric sir? http://pira.cz/rvr-fm-cables.pdf
[16:47] <fsphil> ah ha!
[16:47] <fsphil> ta very muchly
[16:48] <HixWork> or http://vhfdx.radiocorner.net/CoaxCable.html prob better
[16:49] <mfa298> HixWork: that's a pretty decent find.
[16:49] <fsphil> I've got RG213 going to my colinear atm, considering replacing it
[16:49] <fsphil> just looking at the options
[16:49] <mfa298> Westflex 103 is good (better than 213 but not much more expensive)
[16:49] <UpuWork> I use Westflex
[16:49] <HixWork> googled "dB/100m"
[16:50] <fsphil> seems obvious now HixWork
[16:50] <fsphil> been a long day
[16:50] <HixWork> 20/20 hindsight
[16:50] <HixWork> beautiful thing
[16:50] <UpuWork> http://www.universal-radio.com/catalog/cable/coaxperf.html
[16:50] <mfa298> after westflex I think you start getting into lots of money /m
[16:50] <UpuWork> in feet
[16:51] <UpuWork> Westflex is 7.5db / 100 Meters
[16:51] <fsphil> nevada have that for £14 per metre
[16:51] <fsphil> yikes
[16:51] <UpuWork> a METER ? :)
[16:51] <UpuWork> nah
[16:52] <fsphil> er
[16:52] <fsphil> sorry
[16:52] <fsphil> per 10 metres
[16:52] <fsphil> like I was saying, long day
[16:52] <fsphil> £140 for 100m reel
[16:52] <Elwell> and I guess connectors aren't cheap either
[16:52] <UpuWork> RG213 is 15.5db / 100 meters
[16:52] <UpuWork> no you need larger connectors for the 103
[16:53] <UpuWork> @ 434Mhz
[16:53] <Elwell> homeoclock
[16:53] <UpuWork> I think I decided W103 was the best balance between cost and performance
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[16:54] <mfa298> I came to the same conclusion about W103
[16:54] <UpuWork> http://www.nevadaradio.co.uk/cables-leads-plugs/plugs-adaptors/ssb-electronic-7367
[16:54] <UpuWork> http://www.nevadaradio.co.uk/cables-leads-plugs/plugs-adaptors/nevada-uhf-242
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[16:54] <mfa298> although it's not so good for temporary installs
[16:56] <fsphil> RF58 seems fine for HF
[16:56] <fsphil> RG58*
[16:56] <HixWork> W103 not too expensive here http://goo.gl/CC3pK
[16:56] <mfa298> rg58 is fine for HF but starts getting lossy for VHF
[16:57] <fsphil> same price as nevada HixWork
[16:57] <fsphil> for 100m anyway
[16:57] <HixWork> as that was goog urp which eas banned at work its now http://goo.gl/idt5g
[16:57] <HixWork> ah oki
[16:57] <HixWork> I'm onto Gotos at the mo :)
[16:57] <HixWork> nearly time to leave though, should save the little work I've actually done :)
[16:57] <eroomde> http://www.ebay.com/itm/LMR-400-Ultraflex-Coaxial-Cable-30ft-N-Male-Real-LMR400-/330476529809
[16:57] <fsphil> I might get 25m of the stuff
[16:58] <eroomde> almost cheaper than buying lmr400 new
[16:58] <fsphil> "Cheap thin Chinese Commie cable"
[16:59] <eroomde> W103, £139 on amazon for 100m
[16:59] <fsphil> same price as everywhere else
[17:00] <mfa298> with the copper content in W103 it's probably a good investment.
[17:01] <fsphil> shame my antenna as one of those shelded bananna plug sockets
[17:01] <mfa298> I think the drum I bought 5 years ago was just over £100
[17:01] <fsphil> as/has
[17:02] <HixWork> oym orf, bbl
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[17:02] <mfa298> fsphil: could be worth looking to see if you can change it to an N
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[17:03] <fsphil> how much would it really lose me at 432mhz?
[17:04] <mfa298> I'm not really sure. I've seen stuff saying PL259 is fine and other things saying they're useless
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[17:05] <craag> They're a horrible impedance discontinuity
[17:05] <craag> But it doesn't really cause much loss until the discontinuity is as long as a significant fraction of the wavelength.
[17:06] <eroomde> £6/m for LDF4-50A
[17:06] <eroomde> that's actually incredibly good value
[17:06] <eroomde> if you want something really good
[17:07] <craag> I'd suggest aircell-7 if you can get it
[17:08] <fsphil> the data on nevadaradio suggest that's more lossy than wf103
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[17:09] <craag> fsphil: It might be slightly, but it's a lot easier to work with.
[17:09] <eroomde> the ldf4-50A is 4.7dB @ 450MHz over 100m
[17:10] <DanielRi1hman> to the owner of MONTY1: your time format is bad and you should feel bad
[17:10] Nick change: DanielRi1hman -> DanielRichman
[17:12] Action: daveake wonders if that one is written in Python
[17:12] <mattbrejza> just wait until the payload gets lock and go knocking
[17:12] <eroomde> it's only possible to write nice things in Python
[17:13] <eroomde> except for something I once saw for which I almost sold my possessions on ebay to hire a hit man
[17:13] <eroomde> some_list[-True]
[17:13] <eroomde> to get the last element
[17:13] <eroomde> i simply don't understand what would possess someone to do something so wierd and flakey
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[17:16] <fsphil> or people who use ++i in for loops
[17:16] <fsphil> everyone knows i++ is better
[17:17] <craag> fsphil: I meant ecoflex-10 coax, not aircell-7, my bad. It's got a stranded centre that makes it far easier to solder, and is just a double braid/foil sheild so is far more flexible then heliax.
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[17:26] <jarod> http://www.flightradar24.com/data/airplanes/ph-cde seems to be coming back to the airport
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[17:42] <arko> I dont know why, but i jump a little when washington calls
[17:42] <arko> I got a call from the faa
[17:42] <arko> Saying since im less than 4lbs and below the max density, i dont need a waiver
[17:43] <eroomde> you are more than 4lb
[17:43] <eroomde> sorry arko
[17:44] Action: arko eats ice cream while watching tv and crys himself to sleep
[17:44] <jonsowman> lol
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[17:45] <arko> Is this right?
[17:46] <arko> I mean, the faa told me directly.. but i dont believe them
[17:46] <arko> Shady people
[17:47] <mfa298> can you ask them for it in writing?
[17:47] <eroomde> no i have read and heard of exactly that before too
[17:47] <eroomde> on several occassions
[17:47] <eroomde> re the US waiver
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[17:55] <arko> Kk
[17:55] <arko> Gonna double check
[17:55] Nick change: number10_ -> number10
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[18:01] <arko> Thx eroomde
[18:01] <eroomde> NO PROBLEM ARKEYBABY
[18:08] <Upu> who ever was interested in the MAX6G 1.8V GPS modules, I have no fixed date on the MAX7 arriving so I've ordered some more today, should be in the shop Thursday
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[18:31] <x-f> good evening
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[18:33] Nick change: ghoti_ -> ghoti
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[19:04] <x-f> i went to the sea, and in best traditions it was absolutely clear sky, except for the western direction - found the 1% illuminated Moon finally, but no comet though.
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[19:11] <fsphil> no sign of it here either
[19:12] <fsphil> but the horizon was a bit cloudy
[19:12] <fsphil> didn't spot the moon either
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[19:41] <Lunar_Lander> hello
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[19:42] <chrisstubbs> evening lunar
[19:43] <griffonbot> @sebasrossa: Comenzando la cuarta semana de curso de ingreso del #CUSF. [http://twitter.com/sebasrossa/status/311563160547102720]
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[19:55] <Babs> Hi - I'm testing my tracker's ability to parse data through to habitat here http://habitat.habhub.org/genpayload/
[19:55] <Babs> The example telemetry string I'm testing is $$$$$BABSTEST,54,19:55:22,51.46995,-0.19130,59,1,4,3553*1CC6
[19:56] <lz1dev> Babs: http://habitat.habhub.org/logtail/
[19:56] <Babs> but I'm getting a checksum error (presumably the 355*1CC6 component of the string above)
[19:57] <Upu> evening Babs
[19:57] <lz1dev> it might be better to create a payload, and then you can watch the logtail to see if its parsing ok
[19:57] <Upu> I know the issue
[19:58] <Upu> either a) change $$$$$ to $$ or b) amend the crc procedure from 2 to 5
[19:58] <Upu> i.e for (i = 2; i < strlen(string); i++)
[19:59] <Upu> to for (i = 5; i < strlen(string); i++)
[19:59] <lz1dev> Upu: his string looks ok on the logtial
[19:59] <Upu> ping cuddykid - looks like a duff RFM22B I'll put a new one on tomorrow
[20:00] <Upu> actually yeah it does
[20:00] <Upu> where are you getting CRC error Babs ?
[20:00] <cuddykid> Upu: ah, thought that might be the issue - thanks!
[20:00] <Upu> did you fry it ?
[20:01] <Upu> or do anything that could damage it ?
[20:02] <eroomde> i told you that shelf above the van der graff generator wasn't a good idea cuddykid
[20:02] <Upu> haha
[20:02] <cuddykid> Upu: yeah, i put 5V through it.. oops!
[20:02] <Upu> ah ok
[20:02] <Upu> that would do it
[20:03] <Upu> go buy another one through the shop :)
[20:03] <cuddykid> will do
[20:03] <chrisstubbs> Lunar_Lander, did you use a 18B20 temp. sensor?
[20:03] <Lunar_Lander> yes
[20:04] <chrisstubbs> what library did you use?
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[20:08] <Lunar_Lander> ah OneWire
[20:08] <Lunar_Lander> :)
[20:08] <Lunar_Lander> it's available at arduino
[20:10] <griffonbot> @arkorobotics: Este bot debe tener un lenguaje detectar #CUSF [http://twitter.com/arkorobotics/status/311569839573590016]
[20:10] <arko> Si!
[20:16] <Lunar_Lander> XD!
[20:17] <Lunar_Lander> chrisstubbs, are you having that sensor too? :)
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[20:17] <chrisstubbs> I do
[20:18] <chrisstubbs> with my payload code it would get the correct temp. but every so often just output -1000
[20:18] <chrisstubbs> indicating a onewire error of some kind
[20:19] <bertrik> 1-wire is time sensitive, so if you're doing something else during a 1-wire transfer, you might get an error
[20:19] <chrisstubbs> ahh that could be the problem
[20:20] <chrisstubbs> my code is a complete mess
[20:26] <Lunar_Lander> yeah
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[20:31] <fsphil> ideally you want to disable interrupts during 1-wire operations
[20:31] <Lunar_Lander> oh
[20:32] <chrisstubbs> ok sure i should be able to do that :)
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[20:32] <Babs> Thanks everyone - got it all working now - Babs
[20:34] <Lunar_Lander> btw does anyone of you play FTL?
[20:35] <Lunar_Lander> that space combat game
[20:35] <cuddykid> Upu: paid, I haven't selected a delivery yet - can you ship it cheapest (2nd class probably) and unrecorded - let me know how much it is and I'll paypal you or whatever
[20:36] <Upu> if you want but recorded is only 90p extra
[20:36] <Willdude123> Evening guys.
[20:36] <cuddykid> Upu: I'll risk it :)
[20:36] <Upu> nps
[20:36] <Upu> evening Will
[20:36] <Lunar_Lander> oh what
[20:37] <Lunar_Lander> Steve is out of stock for almost all balloons
[20:37] <cuddykid> yeah
[20:37] <Upu> should be in stock tomorrow I think
[20:37] <cuddykid> looks like I nabbed the last 800g
[20:37] <Lunar_Lander> he doesn't list the kaymont 2000 and 3000 anymore
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[20:39] <cuddykid> Lunar_Lander: demand isn't there
[20:39] <Lunar_Lander> hm
[20:39] <Lunar_Lander> but I may have demand
[20:39] <Lunar_Lander> :D
[20:40] <Lunar_Lander> hypothetically
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[20:40] <cuddykid> :)
[20:40] <cuddykid> could contact one of the balloon companies directly
[20:40] <fsphil> I demand a pony, but nobody has got me one yet
[20:40] <Lunar_Lander> xD
[20:40] <Lunar_Lander> yeah I once asked for a 4500 balloon
[20:41] <Lunar_Lander> because I read a research paper of a japanese team flying a cryosampler in antarctica
[20:41] <Lunar_Lander> some 17 kg IIRC
[20:41] <Lunar_Lander> and they flew it on a 4500 g rubber balloon
[20:41] <cuddykid> nice!
[20:41] <Lunar_Lander> yea
[20:41] <fsphil> imagine paying to fill that with Helium
[20:41] <Lunar_Lander> yeah
[20:41] <cuddykid> remortgage the house lol
[20:41] <Lunar_Lander> I mean you need Helium twice
[20:41] <Lunar_Lander> the balloon
[20:42] <Lunar_Lander> and liquid helium in the cryosampler
[20:42] <mfa298> Is that where you ask BOC to turn up with a tanker
[20:42] <Lunar_Lander> xD
[20:42] <fsphil> or tap into the LHC storage tanks
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[20:50] <SpeedEvil> bigger balloon and ch4
[20:51] <Elwell> I see aprs.fi does the rings now http://aprs.fi/#!call=a%2FDL9AS-11&timerange=3600&tail=3600
[20:53] <arko> Haha, this office where I'm registering the NOTAM got upset because I gave si units (31000m, 1800g, etc)
[20:53] <Elwell> USA?
[20:53] <arko> Im going to pretend I'm a good troll
[20:54] <arko> Yes usa
[20:54] <Elwell> oooh evil :-)
[20:54] <arko> :D problem?
[20:55] <Lunar_Lander> do they really expect feet, gallons, ounces and stuff?
[20:56] <arko> Absolutely
[20:56] <mfa298> give then the distances in furlongs
[20:56] <arko> Aircraft are all imperical
[20:56] <arko> Feet, lbs, miles, knots
[20:56] <arko> I hate it
[20:57] <Elwell> knots as nm relates directly to latitude tho
[20:58] <Elwell> ewwwww dog dribble on keyboard
[20:59] <arko> Haha
[21:00] <Upu> whos balloon is DL9AS's ?
[21:00] <Elwell> sonde
[21:00] <Upu> ah ok
[21:00] <Upu> so no transmitting APRS then
[21:01] <Elwell> nah, injected into aprs-is by user I think
[21:03] <Elwell> http://projetoicaro.wordpress.com/sm2aprs_en/
[21:03] <arko> That's illegal there right?
[21:06] <oh7lzb> Elwell: I proudly stole your rings and put them there
[21:09] <Elwell> ah hi Hessu - didn't see you lurking :-)
[21:10] <Elwell> 's not my rings - /me points to the tracker folks ->>
[21:10] <nigelvh> arko, putting non-ham data onto APRS-IS isn't illegal, as it's just a web service, if it were to be retransmitted by another ham user, then it becomes questionable.
[21:11] <arko> Oh, I meant habs having aprs in eu
[21:11] <nigelvh> Just depends on the country.
[21:11] <nigelvh> UK doesn't allow it, others do.
[21:11] <arko> I know its legal in the US
[21:11] <gonzo__> in the UK it's the responsibility of the licence holder to prevent non ham traffic coming out of their tx
[21:11] <arko> Yeah
[21:12] <Elwell> how did (someone) get on with their map of allowed airborne (sp?) aprs transmission?
[21:13] <nigelvh> I believe Upu was working on something like that.
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[21:13] <Upu> http://ukhas.org.uk/general:aprs_legislation
[21:14] <Ciemon> Upu I wonder if that page needs a little clarification... in that the APRS protocol can be used... but you can't use it airborne on Ham freqs
[21:15] <mfa298> it's also not so much the aprs being illegal from the air but the HAM license prohibits airborne use (and also required shutdown within a certain time period if requested)
[21:15] <Upu> First sentence ?
[21:15] <Ciemon> Well you can use APRS for balloons. APRS being a protocol.
[21:16] <Upu> well I intend the page to be "using APRS airborne in a balloon"
[21:16] <Upu> as it has to be that specific
[21:16] <Upu> as say France you're not allowed to use it in a plane but you are in a met balloon
[21:17] <arko> Weird
[21:17] <mfa298> I think it's probably more about amateur radio usage airborne rather than APRS usage which might need some clarification
[21:17] <Ciemon> That was my point mfa298
[21:18] Action: chrisstubbs throws DS18B20 in bin
[21:18] <Ciemon> You can't use ham radio airborne, but you certainly can use the APRS protocol on 434.075
[21:18] <Lunar_Lander> chrisstubbs, oh why?
[21:19] <chrisstubbs> got a fresh one out of the bag and it worked fine. must have been a dud!
[21:19] <arko> Is the problem jamming the aprs network?
[21:19] <Lunar_Lander> yea
[21:19] <arko> Yikes
[21:19] Last message repeated 1 time(s).
[21:19] <arko> I'm scared my payload will do that
[21:19] <Lunar_Lander> ?
[21:19] <Upu> oh ok the page isn't meant to clarify that Ciemon
[21:19] <Lunar_Lander> the yea was for chris
[21:19] <arko> Oh nvm
[21:19] <nigelvh> arko, set your path properly and you'll be fine.
[21:19] <mfa298> arko: the UK amateur radio license has a clause saying that you cannot use AR from any airborne vehicle (or something like that)
[21:19] <Upu> but see what you're getting at
[21:19] <arko> Yah I did
[21:20] <nigelvh> What is your path set at?
[21:20] <Upu> 9(3) Without prejudice to Clause 1 of this Licence, the Licensee shall not establish or use the Radio Equipment in any Aircraft or other Airborne Vehicle
[21:20] <Upu> Section 17 Interpretation goes on to define Airborne Vehicle as : c) Aircraft and Airborne Vehicles includes full size and models and also includes balloons whether tethered or free;
[21:20] <arko> Wide1-1 I think
[21:20] <Lunar_Lander> yea
[21:20] <Lunar_Lander> the british way of formulating things :P
[21:20] <nigelvh> WIDE1-1 isn't recommended.
[21:20] <Elwell> oh7lzb: while you're here (see you shouldn't have announced your prescence) -- the different font sizes in 'other SSIDs' larger = recently heard?
[21:20] <arko> Or was it 2-1
[21:20] <nigelvh> WIDE2-1 would be the choice if you need digipeating.
[21:20] <arko> I'll check
[21:21] <Lunar_Lander> I would not wonder if it says "the Licensee shall not establish or use Radio Equipment on a Level Crossing of the Railways of Great Britain"
[21:21] <Lunar_Lander> xD
[21:21] <arko> Oh kk
[21:21] <Elwell> Lunar_Lander: 'whilst partaking of afternoon tea'
[21:21] <Lunar_Lander> xD!
[21:22] <nigelvh> WIDE1-1 ends up being somewhat wider than WIDE2-1, and you won't need the extra from a balloon.
[21:22] <daveake> Must not be used unless in the presence of a beard
[21:22] <craag> Why is wide1-1 not recommended out of interest?
[21:22] <craag> oh
[21:22] <craag> Wait, isn't that the other way round?
[21:22] <Elwell> ps - http://www.itu.int/pub/R-REG-RR-2012
[21:22] <Elwell> The ITU has published the Radio Regulations texts (including all ITU-R
[21:22] <Elwell> etc) for free for a limited time; download as a zip of PDFs or .docs.
[21:22] <nigelvh> WIDE1-1 allows for "fill in digis" to digipeat as well, WIDE2-1 limits to permanent, larger digipeaters, so you'll have fewer repeats.
[21:23] <Lunar_Lander> daveake, lol
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[21:24] <chrisstubbs> hm. I say it was a dud. the issue could be that i am powering and grouding the sensor just using GPIO pins
[21:24] <nigelvh> Often, from a car, they'll use a path of WIDE1-1,WIDE2-1 so in the case where you can't reach a larger digipeater, the fill in digi will repeat, and hopefully reach the larger station, but you don't need the help from a balloon, so you exclude the fill in digis and only allow the main digipeaters.
[21:25] <Lunar_Lander> chrisstubbs, gpio?
[21:25] <craag> nigelvh: Ah ok. 1-1 might still be useful near the ground though.
[21:26] <nigelvh> Generally it's really not needed. You get up 50 feet and you're pretty much guaranteed to be able to reach a larger digipeater, so a 2-1 path works fine.
[21:26] <nigelvh> Unless you KNOW that you're a LOOOOONG way away from a real digipeater and you've set up a temporary one.
[21:26] <chrisstubbs> lunar i mean just the digital pins. One set to low for ground and one set to high for power
[21:26] <chrisstubbs> amazingly bad practice
[21:26] <Lunar_Lander> ah
[21:26] <Lunar_Lander> so you use I/O pins for drawing power?
[21:27] <chrisstubbs> yeah
[21:27] <Lunar_Lander> yea
[21:27] <craag> nigelvh: Ok, thanks. I don't think we have quite the APRS coverage here in the uk that you do.
[21:27] <Lunar_Lander> never heard of that before
[21:28] <chrisstubbs> Lunar_Lander, probably becuase nobody else is stupid enough to do it ;)
[21:28] <nigelvh> Really, ideally you'd use no path. The balloon is high enough that it should reach an igate station without digipeating, but if you're in an area with few igates, then a single 2-1 hop is acceptable.
[21:28] <Lunar_Lander> XD
[21:28] <Lunar_Lander> hey btw
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[21:28] <Lunar_Lander> that one ham operator who tracked OERNEN-II had been here right?
[21:28] <Lunar_Lander> like last thursday or so
[21:29] <Lunar_Lander> he has cool ideas
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[21:29] <Lunar_Lander> like flying an ATV transmitter or so
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[22:30] <chrisstubbs> Ah man and someone just cleared spacenear.us Sorry :(
[22:33] <mattbrejza> what did you want from it?
[22:33] <chrisstubbs> Oh no i just started fldigi in hab mode to test NSE1, and its no longer clear :P
[22:34] <chrisstubbs> happy it works, feel free to clear it again if you wish
[22:34] <mattbrejza> yea dw, there are no flights soon
[22:34] <daveake> It doesn't matter it'll get cleared before a flight
[22:34] <daveake> Free for all till then
[22:34] <chrisstubbs> daveake is that automatic?
[22:34] <daveake> No
[22:35] <daveake> Only rule is don't test during a flight
[22:35] <chrisstubbs> okay, and yeah thats fair :)
[22:38] <fsphil> yea. cause we know where you live (or are testing at least)
[22:38] <chrisstubbs> :O
[22:38] <chrisstubbs> how? ;)
[22:38] <fsphil> our super secret tracking network
[22:39] <nigelvh> Also the GPS on your payload...
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[22:39] <chrisstubbs> Lol
[22:41] <mrShrimp> I have a question about using GSM enabled phones for redundancy trackers... Is it worth the weight?
[22:41] <SpeedEvil> maybe
[22:41] <fsphil> if the payload is worth more than the gsm tracker, then possibly
[22:42] <nigelvh> They tend to cut out a few thousand feet up.
[22:42] <SpeedEvil> and may not regain lock on the way down
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[22:42] <mrShrimp> That's why I'm wondering if it is worth it. It might land in the middle of a no coverage zone
[22:42] <mrShrimp> ya
[22:42] <fsphil> and sometimes they report inaccurate locations
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[22:43] <mrShrimp> I have read that they are accurate to within a couple hundred meters.
[22:43] <fsphil> but I do know of a few flights where they saved the day
[22:43] <mrShrimp> hm
[22:46] <mrShrimp> Is it usually required to have a data plan to be able to use the tracking devices on phones? I don't have anything else than a Copernicus2 right now, but I've never bothered with data plans for my phone (which just so happens to be GSM enabled).
[22:47] <fsphil> yea you'll need a sim
[22:48] <mrShrimp> Is that all?
[22:48] <fsphil> and some credit on it
[22:51] <mrShrimp> I was thinking of using my everyday phone, which has a sim card and runs with an unlimited texting plan from AT&T.
[22:51] <nigelvh> Keep in mind the risk of not recovering it.
[22:52] <mrShrimp> I've had it for years, and I've been thinking of getting a new one anyways haha.
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[22:57] <mrShrimp> Are the applications that send the location data phone specific?
[22:57] <chrisstubbs> only for as far as iphone/java/android i think
[22:58] <mrShrimp> The ones that run on my phone are java.
[22:58] <chrisstubbs> there are a couple of tracker style apps i used to use on my old nokia
[22:58] <mrShrimp> How did you get them to periodically send texts?
[22:59] <chrisstubbs> the app i used uploaded the position online
[22:59] <mrShrimp> ok
[23:00] <mrShrimp> aha! perfect: http://www.mobiles24.com/downloads/s/483102-m1148-watchee_145
[23:02] <chrisstubbs> nice :) i think the app i used is no longer functional as they closed down the server
[23:03] <mrShrimp> Thanks for the help!
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[23:35] <chrisstubbs> night
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[00:00] --- Wed Mar 13 2013