highaltitude.log.20130103

[00:00] <arko> should be fun
[00:00] <arko> i have to start saving now
[00:00] <arko> im budgeting like $4k
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[00:03] <Lunar_Lander> do you know if there are JST connectors with three pins?
[00:03] <Lunar_Lander> I am searching round and round on ebay
[00:03] <fsphil> yes
[00:03] <fsphil> I do know :)
[00:06] <fsphil> (the answer is yes :p)
[00:06] <Lunar_Lander> yea
[00:06] <fsphil> sparkfun sell them
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[00:07] <Lunar_Lander> yea
[00:07] <Lunar_Lander> that is good
[00:07] <Lunar_Lander> my humidity sensor feds me up
[00:07] <Lunar_Lander> something is wrong because the program shows 1417 or so
[00:07] <Lunar_Lander> no matter if the sensor is connected or not
[00:08] <Dan-K2VOL> make sure you've got the aref source selected properly
[00:09] <Lunar_Lander> that is in correctly
[00:09] <Lunar_Lander> as the battery reading works
[00:10] <Dan-K2VOL> try reading another voltage with that pin
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[00:14] <Lunar_Lander> the humidity pin?
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[00:19] <Lunar_Lander> or how do you mean?
[00:19] <Lunar_Lander> another battery voltage?
[00:20] <Dan-K2VOL> to check your analog in pin
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[00:23] <Habjoe> test.....!
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[00:28] <Lunar_Lander> Dan-K2VOL, yes
[00:28] <Dan-K2VOL> yes?
[00:28] <Dan-K2VOL> it works ok with another source?
[00:29] <Lunar_Lander> no, I just wanted to make sure that I understood you
[00:29] <lz1dev> EspacioCercano: the picture is of ntx2
[00:29] <Lunar_Lander> because I am taking notes what to try in the lab tomorrow
[00:29] <Dan-K2VOL> ah
[00:29] <lz1dev> EspacioCercano: the HX1 might have the same thing, im not sure
[00:29] <Habjoe> Hi, read that Ineed to post a request that my flight documents be published. Current planning a launch on Friday at approx 10:30 from Malvern. All approvals in place. Flight Document 'Habjoe One'.
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[00:30] <EspacioCercano> lz1dev: yes, I noticed that& thanks!
[00:30] <Habjoe> Frequency 434.650mhz
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[00:35] <Habjoe> So details: 434.650mhz, launch location: 52.11352,-2.31611, 'Habjoe One' 4/1/2013 at 10:30am (approx)
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[01:15] <Dark3D> EspacioCercano: sorry, I went awol.
[01:16] <EspacioCercano> Dark3D: no problem
[01:24] <Lunar_Lander> fsphil, I now found what I looked for :)
[01:25] <Lunar_Lander> those three wire JSTs were sold as elongation wires for something called a "lipoly balancer"
[01:28] <Dark3D> EspacioCercano: I'm in U.S., I just looked at the hx1 144.390 nbfm and I see a pot on it-but I haven't turned the nerd knob yet.
[01:28] <Darkside> the pot adjusts the deviation slightly
[01:29] <Dark3D> Darkside: Now I don't need to turn it. :)
[01:29] <Darkside> if you have the HX1 modules with the -3 on the end, the deviation should be OK
[01:29] <Darkside> if you drive it with 3.3v that is
[01:30] <EspacioCercano> Darkside: nice find& thanks, will look into it!
[01:30] <Darkside> one pot is deviation, the other is centre freq
[01:31] <Darkside> you shouldn't need to adjust either of them if your input levels are ok
[01:31] <Dark3D> Darkside: If the HX1 and NTX2 are both 3.3v capable, why do their datasheets differ so much on power requirements?
[01:31] <Darkside> and i've found 3.3v PWM straight into the TXD pin is fine
[01:31] <Darkside> er
[01:31] <Darkside> the HX1 needs a 5v supply
[01:31] <Darkside> but driving th TXD pin with 3.3v PWM gives the correct deviation
[01:31] <Dark3D> yeah, that's screwing me at the moment
[01:33] <Dark3D> I wish they would sell the RF61 like they do the RFM22 modules
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[01:43] <KT5TK_QRL> Dark3D: Why not build your own?
[01:44] <KT5TK_QRL> transmitter
[01:45] <Dark3D> KT5TK_QRL: Time, mostly. Are you referring to the RF61 or a complete one-off build?
[01:45] <KT5TK_QRL> This one is well tested now: http://kt5tk.tkrahn.com/download/PecanPico/PecanPico.jpg
[01:46] <KT5TK_QRL> Or maybe the next version: http://kt5tk.tkrahn.com/download/PecanPico2/
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[01:49] <Dark3D> KT5TK_QRL: I was talking with KF7FER about that a few weeks ago, but I forgot about him mentioning your board. UHF, correct?
[01:49] <KT5TK_QRL> VHF and UHF
[01:49] <KT5TK_QRL> whatever you want
[01:50] <KT5TK_QRL> I mainly use it for 2m APRS
[01:50] <Dark3D> I can't read the model, is that a 7012?
[01:50] <KT5TK_QRL> ADF7012
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[01:50] <KT5TK_QRL> http://kt5tk.tkrahn.com/download/PecanPico2/PecanPico2Sch.pdf
[01:51] <KT5TK_QRL> Sorry, the old board is http://kt5tk.tkrahn.com/download/PeanutPico/PeanutPicoSch.pdf
[01:51] <KT5TK_QRL> The new one uses a Si4464
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[01:52] <Dark3D> Nice.
[01:53] <Lunar_Lander> evening KT5TK
[01:53] <KT5TK_QRL> Hi Lunar
[01:54] <Dark3D> I've been exposed to development side of things for only a few months. I'm a networking guy that is now going back and getting my EE
[01:55] <KT5TK_QRL> I flew one of the PecanPicos on the N)D flight http://tkrahn.dyndns.org/gallery2/main.php?g2_itemId=8921
[01:55] <Dark3D> So, basically I started with the trackuino, and added the same baro sensor on your old board bmp085 and I was going to add some logging.
[01:56] <KT5TK_QRL> Good. I only have a degree in Biotechnology. Not related to EE at all...
[01:56] <Lunar_Lander> KT5TK_QRL, my code is almost done I would say and the system as such too
[01:56] <Lunar_Lander> I only have to see why the humidity sensor gives 1147 no matter if the sensor is plugged in or not
[01:56] <KT5TK_QRL> Sure it's not 4711?
[01:57] <Dark3D> KT5TK_QRL: I think you're gallery is offline
[01:57] <Lunar_Lander> xD
[01:58] <KT5TK_QRL> try this first http://tkrahn.dyndns.org/ and then again the link to the gallery
[01:58] <KT5TK_QRL> dyndns.org is sometimes faky
[01:59] <KT5TK_QRL> flaky
[02:00] <KT5TK_QRL> http://tkrahn.tk/ may work
[02:00] <Dark3D> KT5TK_QRL: Bingo, works.
[02:00] <KT5TK_QRL> It's the last album in the gallery
[02:02] <KT5TK_QRL> Lunar_Lander: So when are you planning to launch?
[02:03] <KT5TK_QRL> Make sure that you get in touch with some DARC clubs. They certainly can help you track
[02:03] <Lunar_Lander> KT5TK_QRL, sometime this month
[02:03] <Lunar_Lander> yea
[02:03] <Lunar_Lander> I already know one ham who wants to track :)
[02:04] <KT5TK_QRL> You'll need many more. But if you find a good club they'll help you
[02:05] <KT5TK_QRL> Go to http://www.darc.de/ and see where in your area there are clubs. Go to their monthly meetings and make contacts to them
[02:05] <Lunar_Lander> yea
[02:06] <Lunar_Lander> I know that
[02:06] <Lunar_Lander> I actually know two hams
[02:06] <Lunar_Lander> and I think they can spread the word
[02:06] <Lunar_Lander> and I also got in touch with the club here in Osnabruck
[02:06] <Lunar_Lander> I already got in touch with them when I asked who of them would go to Ham Radio in Friedrichshafen and would give me a ride
[02:07] <KT5TK_QRL> Have you been there in Friedrichshafen?
[02:08] <Lunar_Lander> in 2010 yea
[02:09] <KT5TK_QRL> Nice exhibition! I've been there frequently when I was living in Germany.
[02:10] <Lunar_Lander> yea
[02:10] <Lunar_Lander> I actually saw the balloon double launch that they had there that year
[02:11] <KT5TK_QRL> Was that the one that was stolen ?
[02:11] <Lunar_Lander> yes
[02:12] <KT5TK_QRL> We probably need to check if parts of your payload comes from there ;)
[02:12] <Dark3D> KT5TK_QRL: Mind if I build one of your design so I can learn the hardware?
[02:12] <KT5TK_QRL> No problem. I can send you a PCB if you wnt
[02:13] <Lunar_Lander> XD!
[02:13] <KT5TK_QRL> you need to solder yourself though
[02:13] <Dark3D> KT5TK_QRL: That would save me a few weeks!
[02:13] <KT5TK_QRL> Did you solder SMD before?
[02:14] <Dark3D> Yes, I have hot air station, but usually use iron.
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[02:15] <KT5TK_QRL> OK, PM me your address, then I canmaile you one
[02:16] <Dark3D> done
[02:16] <Dark3D> I'll send you a few bucks to cover your board and costs. :)
[02:17] <Dark3D> I built a HamHud years ago, don't know if you recall those.
[02:17] <KT5TK_QRL> I don't do it commercially. Just make sure that you actually build it.
[02:18] <Dark3D> Absolutely
[02:18] <Dark3D> I have some ublox coming from Upu supposed to ship out later this week so I can have it done by Feb most likely
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[02:21] <KT5TK_QRL> Here is most what you need: http://www.mouser.com/ProjectManager/ProjectDetail.aspx?AccessID=43c1181007
[02:25] <Dark3D> KT5TK_QRL: Yes, that helps tremendously. I've done 1206, 0402 will be a new one for me. I look forward to it. Thank you!
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[02:27] <KT5TK_QRL> Use solder paste like here: http://tkrahn.dyndns.org/gallery2/main.php?g2_itemId=7269
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[02:28] <KT5TK_QRL> http://www.sparkfun.com/tutorials/59
[02:31] <Dark3D> I'm good on paste and flux and what not.
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[02:32] <Dark3D> KT5TK_QRL: My main problem is hand tremors and components sticking to tweezers
[02:33] <Dark3D> I can't do much about #1
[02:33] <KT5TK_QRL> Hold tweezers with two hands. that helps
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[02:52] <arko> heh
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[07:49] <nosebleedkt> Habby new year everyone !
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[07:56] <SamSilver> thanx nosebleedkt and the same to you
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[08:33] <griffonbot> Received email: Trevor Cousins "Re: [UKHAS] Re: Fogging Camera Lenses - Problem?"
[08:35] <griffonbot> Received email: Anthony Stirk "Re: [UKHAS] Re: Fogging Camera Lenses - Problem?"
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[09:23] <SpeedEvil> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=13oB8qWMhhY&feature=youtube_gdata_player
[09:23] <SpeedEvil> hydrogen balloon slowmo explosion
[09:27] <Darkside> oh that is cool
[09:35] <costyn> awesome
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[09:44] <griffonbot> Received email: Steve Aerospace "Re: [UKHAS] Re: Fogging Camera Lenses - Problem?"
[09:48] <griffonbot> Received email: Trevor Cousins "Re: [UKHAS] Re: Fogging Camera Lenses - Problem?"
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[10:52] <WillDuckworth> Quick question: what transmission style do most satellites use? Do they use SSB, something else, or is it mostly a kind of FM?
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[10:58] <eroomde> usually phase shifting
[10:59] <eroomde> but sometimes very fast, as in spread spectrum, on several freuqencies at once and with several spreading codes at once
[11:00] <costyn> ie lots of spreading
[11:00] <gonzo__> what kind of satellites are you refering to?
[11:01] <WillDuckworth> nothing particular - something like weather for example. Just curious
[11:02] <gonzo__> most commercial and military satellites use a transponder, which will receive a whole band of frequencies and retransmit them on a different band. So you pass any mode through them
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[11:03] <gonzo__> sats that are transmitting scientific data tend to use psk type modes (though it is possible they use spread spectrum too these days)
[11:03] <gonzo__> GPS is sperad spectrum. but that is part of the nav system rather than for communications
[11:04] <eroomde> i think it's qpsk for digital sattelite tv
[11:04] <gonzo__> amateur sats use a mixture of transponders, FM and PSK
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[11:04] <eroomde> which is phase shift keying when you can have lots of phase shifts, not just 180 degree phase shifts
[11:04] <russss> wait, GPS is about as non-spread-spectrum as you can get, isn't it?
[11:04] <gonzo__> think you are right, qpsk
[11:05] <gonzo__> gps uses the spreading as part of the rangeiong system.
[11:05] <gonzo__> The underlying data is just slow psy I think
[11:05] <eroomde> gps is apread spectrum yep
[11:05] <eroomde> 1.023MHz chip rate
[11:06] <WillDuckworth> is PSK something we should look at for balloons?
[11:06] <gonzo__> the tv sats use transponders. So it's pretty much technology neutral
[11:07] <gonzo__> so the shift from analogue sat tv to digital was easy to do
[11:07] <eroomde> 1023 bit long code sent 1000 times per second, and an information bit is composed of 20 instances of a code
[11:08] <eroomde> thus the data rate is (1000/20) = 50 baud
[11:08] <gonzo__> psk for HABs would need someone to do some hardware development. And make boards available
[11:09] <gonzo__> But fsk at low baud rates works. Limited by the horizon. So little point going to PSK for that
[11:09] <eroomde> yes, the thing srtopping its adoption has always been the notion that we'd have to get it certed ourselves as couldn't find an off the shelf unit
[11:09] <costyn> SamSilver: you asked for new vids, here you go http://vimeo.com/56534375
[11:10] <eroomde> and also, when you are power constrained rather than bandwidth constrained (which we are) then FSK offers a better bit error rate
[11:10] <eroomde> not that we use our existing link budget to anything like anything efficient
[11:11] <gonzo__> some fec would be nice to mitigate the burst/bit errors we get on the LPD bands
[11:11] <eroomde> fo sho
[11:11] <gonzo__> and may help wioth fluttery payloads
[11:11] <eroomde> and in getting those last few decodes on the way down
[11:13] <WillDuckworth> so some fec would be a better way to improve link reliability then?
[11:13] <fsphil> definitely
[11:14] <fsphil> ssdv uses RS codes, and people reported decoding image data before they got telemetry
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[11:20] <SamSilver> costyn: thanx a ton was making lunch will watch shortly
[11:22] <x-f> costyn, just watched - scary + awesome!
[11:24] <costyn> x-f: yea very impressive footage
[11:24] <costyn> x-f: I never did any base myself, but I do know some of the guys flying
[11:24] <costyn> brb lunch
[11:27] <gonzo__> fsphil, I got image frames from your first launch that I really didn't expect, given the low sig strength
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[11:30] <PE2G> Hi all, De Bilt will start an ozone sonde in a few minutes time.
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[11:31] <PE2G> I 'll put it on APRS
[11:31] <fsphil> anyone know if sonde data is published anywhere?
[11:31] <PE2G> http://aprs.fi/#!mt=roadmap&z=11&call=a%2FPE2G-11&timerange=10800&tail=10800
[11:31] <fsphil> the uk met office seem to require registration
[11:32] <PE2G> The link will become active moments after the launch
[11:32] <griffonbot> Received email: GMT "[UKHAS] Re: Radio to receive 70cm HAB transmissions"
[11:32] <griffonbot> Received email: Trevor Cousins "Re: [UKHAS] Re: Fogging Camera Lenses - Problem?"
[11:35] <PE2G> fsphil: if you mean weathersondes
[11:35] <PE2G> http://weather.uwyo.edu/upperair/europe.html
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[11:35] <fsphil> perfect! thanks
[11:36] <PE2G> the ozone sonde is up
[11:39] Action: bertrik receives it :)
[11:40] <PE2G> Hi Bertrik
[11:40] <PE2G> The sonde is aiming for the Gummersbach area, Germany
[11:42] <PE2G> At that distance, I may loose it at 3000-4000 m in the descent
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[11:43] <costyn> PE2G: are you 'jijdaar'?
[11:44] <bertrik> PE2G: I can see it quite clearly in the waterfall view of my RTLSDR software, but I doubt if it's clear enough for decoding
[11:45] <PE2G> No, I'm PE2G, not jijdaar
[11:45] <PE2G> I'm in Almelo
[11:45] <costyn> PE2G: ah... there's a guy @ the Bilt always listening in on UKHAS launches, with callsign (on spacenear) 'jijdaar'
[11:46] <PE2G> Yes, that's Marc. He sometimes listens form the roof of the KNMI building
[11:46] <costyn> ah ok
[11:46] <bertrik> nice :)
[11:47] <costyn> he gets really nice range out of his equipment
[11:47] <PE2G> Altitude is everything!
[11:47] <PE2G> Antenna altitude, I mean
[11:48] <costyn> yup
[11:48] <PE2G> My antenna is at 38 m AGL, which is not bad
[11:48] <bertrik> it's starting to fade for me
[11:49] <costyn> bertrik: what antenna are you using?
[11:49] <costyn> (I keep forgetting)
[11:50] <bertrik> costyn: a coaxial folded dipole designed for 434 MHz (basically just bits of HEMA RG-6 coax cable)
[11:51] <costyn> bertrik: ah your home-made one eh
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[11:58] <PE2G> If you can put up a yagi
[11:58] <PE2G> Thiecom has a cheap one
[11:58] <PE2G> http://www.thiecom.de/aby7lb-70cm-band-richtantenne.html
[11:59] <PE2G> It works on 403 and 432 MHz
[12:02] <costyn> fsphil: I just had a guy from Dell techsupport. Talked Dutch with an Irish accent... that was weird :)
[12:03] <fsphil> I can't imagine that at all
[12:03] <costyn> fsphil: no I had a hard time placing it, it sounded somewhere british, but not really. I think his first language was English and he learnt Dutch later. he was search for words :)
[12:04] <costyn> and wasn't familiar with the Dutch phonetic alphabet when I started spelling my name to him
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[12:08] <Habjoe> Hi all, confirming post of yesterday. Currently planning a launch tomorrow (Friday 4/12013) at approx 10:30am from Malvern - 52.11352,-2.31611,
[12:08] <Habjoe> flight documents on habitat as 'Habjoe One' and CAA notam in place.. Transmitting on 434.650mhz, carrier shift, 850. RTTY 50 baud,7bit + 2 stop bits. Expected landing around Didcot!!
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[12:08] <fsphil> oooh launch
[12:08] <fsphil> good luck!
[12:09] <Habjoe> thanks
[12:09] <daveake> Habjoe Didcot is just a few miles fro here; let me know if you want help chasing
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[12:09] <fsphil> what sort of altitude are you expecting?
[12:09] Action: daveake removes "pull down aerial" from todo list
[12:09] <Habjoe> about 100,000 if lucky
[12:09] <fsphil> you mean 30km? :)
[12:09] <Habjoe> yes
[12:10] <Habjoe> 30500m
[12:10] <fsphil> I might get a few strings from that, will have a listen out for you
[12:10] <Habjoe> many thanks
[12:11] <daveake> If it does land near Didcot, I might go up the the Ridgeway to track - should get it down to the ground from up there
[12:12] <fsphil> have you run a prediction Habjoe?
[12:12] <Habjoe> yes.
[12:13] <daveake> When you're chasing, the highest point for many miles round here is https://maps.google.co.uk/maps?q=51.553273,+-1.310101&num=1&t=h&vpsrc=0&ie=UTF8&z=16&iwloc=A
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[12:14] <daveake> Get up there, where there's a car park either side of the road. Ideal place to track
[12:14] <Habjoe> prediction this morning from - 52.11352,-2.31611 landing at watlington
[12:14] <Habjoe> 51.6466,-1.0341
[12:15] <Habjoe> thanks dave. willdo.
[12:15] <daveake> 51.6466,-1.0341 is about 3 miles from where my first flight landed :)
[12:17] <Habjoe> I see that there are a couple of airfields close.Will get their numbers.
[12:18] <navrac_work> whens the launch?#
[12:18] <daveake> I have a meeting (at home, conveniently) from 10 till 12 or so tomorrow, but I should be able to get the tracking started once it's in the air.
[12:19] <Habjoe> tomorrow approx 10:30am
[12:19] <daveake> ISH
[12:19] <daveake> :)
[12:19] <fsphil> I kinda broke ISH
[12:19] <navrac_work> ok, I'll put thr aerial back up in the morning then
[12:19] <Habjoe> thanks
[12:19] <daveake> You and Steve both broke it :)
[12:20] <gonzo__> steve's excuse was better though
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[12:23] <daveake> We expect nothing but the best from Steve, even excuses :)
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[12:30] <costyn> fsphil: well that's unexpected, the guy from Dell has a Dutch name. So he's Dutch but probably lived there for quite a while
[12:35] <cm13g09> costyn: if I recall rightly, Dell's EU Tech Support is based in Ireland. Maybe he has Dutch parents, and they all moved to Ireland? who knows
[12:38] <costyn> cm13g09: could be, but I once did get a job-offer from a recruiter asking me if I wantd to relocate to Ireland. This guy might be born & raised in the Netherlands but moved to Ireland to work for Dell
[12:38] <cuddykid> habjoe: are you launching from Malvern?
[12:39] <cm13g09> costyn: fair enough
[12:41] <cuddykid> launching from Worcs area this time of the year usually dumps them near daveake :)
[12:42] <daveake> :)
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[12:59] <Habjoe> hi,sorry popped out.Malvern Yes
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[13:13] <PE2G> The burst of the De Bilt ozone sonde at 35 km
[13:15] <fsphil> nice
[13:16] <PE2G> Yes, I have my doubts about the parachute though
[13:16] <costyn> PE2G: why?
[13:16] <PE2G> descent of 38 m/s at 26 km is rather fast
[13:17] <PE2G> Ideally it should be ~26 m/s at 26 km
[13:19] <PE2G> Descent is decelerating now
[13:19] <costyn> it's at -21 at 21k now
[13:19] <daveake> perfect for 5m/s landing
[13:19] <PE2G> Yes, that's good
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[13:26] <PE2G> This is a good parachute
[13:27] <griffonbot> Received email: Geoff Mather "[UKHAS] Re: Radio to receive 70cm HAB transmissions"
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[13:32] <bertrik> completely lost the O3 sonde signal here in Gouda
[13:33] <Darkside> you live in cheese?
[13:33] <Darkside> :P
[13:33] <costyn> Darkside: and you're upside down
[13:33] <PE2G> Let's see when I loose it
[13:34] <PE2G> I'm still on the yagi now.
[13:34] <Randomskk> all right. my new tracker has incredible range ;)
[13:34] Action: Randomskk got his rockBLOCK in the post today
[13:34] <Randomskk> https://randomskk.net/u/iridium.png
[13:34] <PE2G> But at low altitudes the GP is sometimes better
[13:34] <Randomskk> hello global reception
[13:35] <daveake> Hello English Channel :p
[13:35] <daveake> Must get one for myself
[13:36] <costyn> daveake: :)
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[13:39] <WillDuckworth> how much per month for the privilege randomskk?
[13:39] <daveake> zero
[13:39] <daveake> unless you use it :D
[13:39] <daveake> It's per-byte
[13:41] <gonzo__> £'s/byte ?
[13:41] <daveake> Oh, sorry, there is a monthly cost - £8
[13:42] <daveake> And it's about 10p for 50 bytes
[13:42] <daveake> http://rockblock.rock7mobile.com/?page_id=103
[13:46] <russss> you only need to pay for the months you use it
[13:47] <daveake> yup
[13:47] <daveake> Not actually paid for one myself :p
[13:48] <gonzo__> 12p/byte. Nice!!!
[13:49] <craag> gonzo__: 12p per 50 characters.
[13:50] <craag> I'm assuming thats 50 bytes, as long as they aren't meaning hex characters.
[13:50] <daveake> yes 50 bytes of the message payload
[13:51] <fsphil> is it proper 8-bit?
[13:51] <daveake> Yes
[13:53] <PE2G> I lost it at 2615 m GPS altitude according to SondeMonitor
[13:53] <daveake> The command I use to pass the message isn't for binary, but there is a command that does allow that
[13:53] <PE2G> http://gyazo.com/0233c2fcca84386d805e5db16bd6aee1
[13:53] <daveake> At the receiving end (a web POST or an email) the message is in hex
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[13:55] <PE2G> Pressure alt. 800.4 hPa would mean 1837 m ASL
[13:56] <PE2G> Lüdenscheid QNH is 1030 hPa
[13:57] <eroomde> my boss got an adaptor for his canon 5d to his meade 10" scope for christmas
[13:57] <Randomskk> eroomde: :D
[13:57] <eroomde> it's outrageous
[13:57] <Randomskk> in a good or a bad way? I had an frankly terrible one
[13:57] <eroomde> we can read no smoking signs 400m across an airfield
[13:58] <Randomskk> but then my scope was terrible
[13:58] <Randomskk> haha excellent
[13:58] <SpeedEvil> :-)
[13:58] <eroomde> we could do some weapong-grade industrial espionage with this thing
[13:58] <eroomde> just install it in the back of his landrover and go hunting from the hilltop of whatever is the target
[13:58] <Randomskk> totally discreet
[13:59] <SpeedEvil> or a slightly larger balloon, and v2.0 of earlier project
[13:59] <eroomde> that would be fun too
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[14:04] <nick_> eroomde: was it crazy expensive?
[14:04] <nick_> I have access to a telescope that I would like to set up as a remotely operated observatory with a digital camera
[14:05] <eroomde> the adaptor?
[14:05] <eroomde> not sure
[14:05] <Randomskk> my electronic scope mount was too weedy to support the weight of my 450D :(
[14:06] <Randomskk> need a counterweight or something really
[14:09] <fsphil> I've got an adaptor for my 400D <> Meade scope. I find it nearly impossible to focus it properly
[14:09] <fsphil> the 400D has no live preview
[14:09] <Randomskk> I had that problem
[14:09] <Randomskk> ended up taking loads of photos, looking on the screen, adjusting between each shot
[14:09] <Randomskk> hmm
[14:09] <Randomskk> I guess I had the 400D when I was playing with the scope
[14:10] <fsphil> I tried that but I never got far with it
[14:10] <fsphil> yea the 450 has the preview
[14:10] <Randomskk> I later wore down a thing on the scope adapter. it was made of some stupidly soft metal and didn't really connect to my camera properly ever anyway
[14:10] <Randomskk> I lost my 400D on the first day of a month trekking in mongolia :(
[14:10] <Randomskk> got a 450D later
[14:10] <fsphil> ahh man
[14:10] <Randomskk> should get the scope out again one of these days
[14:10] <Randomskk> I know!!! but better than losing it on the last day with all the photos I guess
[14:10] <Randomskk> I ended up buying a new fuji p&s on the market for a hundred USD or something hilarious
[14:11] <fsphil> I think this was my best photo with it, http://www.sanslogic.co.uk/images/astrophotography/orion_nebula_20070127.jpeg
[14:11] <Randomskk> not bad. the iridium module's self-reported position is only 1km wrong
[14:12] <Randomskk> wow, nice!
[14:12] <fsphil> still out of focus :)
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[14:12] <fsphil> although I'm not sure if that was just bad tracking or optical focus
[14:12] <Randomskk> best I got was this dodgy blur of saturn http://www.flickr.com/photos/randomskk/2345750355
[14:12] <Randomskk> with a lovely comment
[14:13] <daveake> lol
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[14:13] <fsphil> haha
[14:13] <daveake> It's a UFO!
[14:13] <fsphil> I have a saturn shot somewhere
[14:14] <daveake> One day when I stop spending all my money on HAB I'll upgrade my 400Ds
[14:14] <fsphil> http://www.sanslogic.co.uk/images/astrophotography/saturn_now_and_then.jpeg
[14:14] <Randomskk> niiice
[14:14] <fsphil> I was chuffed
[14:14] <Randomskk> maybe I should get a new adapter ring
[14:14] <Randomskk> not convinced the scope is hugely worthwhile though
[14:14] <fsphil> the small inset one was taken with a tv camera
[14:14] <Randomskk> that said I also can't remember what scope I have right now :P
[14:14] <Randomskk> celestron 8" or something I think
[14:14] <fsphil> that's not bad
[14:15] <fsphil> the really important part is the mount
[14:15] <Randomskk> and yet it doesn't seem to really accomplish much
[14:15] <Randomskk> admittedly I didn't ever really understand the focal lengths printed on the eyepieces
[14:15] <Randomskk> but nothing I tried gave very much resolving power
[14:15] <fsphil> you where doing eyepiece projection?
[14:15] <Randomskk> jupiter was at best a bright dot with some smaller bright dots near it
[14:15] <Randomskk> no, just looking into the thing
[14:15] <fsphil> ahh
[14:15] <Randomskk> is that a rookie mistake
[14:15] <Randomskk> I don't really know
[14:16] <fsphil> wait my scope isn't even meade, it's celestron too. shows you how much I use it
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[14:16] <Randomskk> the mount is kind of nice, in that it is electronically steerable and can automatically work out where it is on the earth by pointing it at some bright stars and stuff
[14:16] <fsphil> that's nice
[14:16] <Randomskk> but apparently not powerful enough to hold on to my camera :P
[14:16] <fsphil> this one is older, it tells you which stars to point at
[14:16] <Randomskk> this can do that too I think
[14:16] <fsphil> which always leaves me googling where the star is
[14:16] <Randomskk> hehe
[14:16] <Randomskk> and once it knows where it is it can point itself at anything you want
[14:17] <Randomskk> but I was never convinced
[14:17] <fsphil> yep
[14:17] <Randomskk> mainly because frankly I didn't know what I was looking at and it wasn't very magnifyy
[14:17] <fsphil> although always slightly out of the eyepiece view
[14:17] <Randomskk> heh
[14:17] <Randomskk> but yea, mainly it didn't seem to magnify anything usefully
[14:17] <fsphil> possibly bad eyepieces?
[14:17] <Gnea> fsphil: www.stellarium.org
[14:17] <fsphil> that's what I use now Gnea :)
[14:17] <Randomskk> entirely probably I was just using it wrong. I never even figured out what the difference between the "4mm" and "32mm" eyepieces was, except that the 4mm was much harder to use :P
[14:17] <Gnea> :)
[14:18] <Randomskk> they were meant to be nice :/
[14:18] <Randomskk> Gnea: google sky map :P
[14:18] <Randomskk> so good
[14:18] <Gnea> Randomskk: it's okay
[14:18] <Gnea> I like celestia as well
[14:18] <fsphil> Jupiter should easily show belts with your scope
[14:18] <fsphil> my small refractor shows the two main belts
[14:19] <Randomskk> :/
[14:19] <Gnea> I haven't gotten to use my scope lately... I've used it to look at the moon
[14:19] <fsphil> it helps if the planet is up high
[14:19] <Gnea> yeah
[14:19] <Gnea> Jupiter is in prime position these days
[14:19] <fsphil> Mars rarely shows me anything but a featureless disk
[14:20] <Gnea> eh, we have curiosity ;)
[14:20] <fsphil> haha, yea that's a much better position though :)
[14:20] <x-f> Randomskk, from the focal length of the scope and the eyepiece you can calculate the magnification. 32mm should give quite a wide field to look at (for Andromeda, Orion nebula, the Moon, ..)
[14:20] <fsphil> 32mm would be the one to start with
[14:21] <Randomskk> 4mm had a much narrower field of view but didn't appear to alter magnification
[14:21] <Randomskk> everything was essentially still a bright dot
[14:21] <fsphil> even planets?
[14:22] <x-f> if you are looking at a star, it will be a dot at any magnification :)
[14:22] <fsphil> except the sun
[14:22] <fsphil> but then you probably have no eyes left
[14:22] <x-f> don't look at the sun, please
[14:22] <Gnea> unless you use a welding mask
[14:22] <fsphil> Gnea: not through a telescope :)
[14:22] <Gnea> heh, probably not a good thing
[14:22] <x-f> Gnea, the light would melt the eyepiece anyway
[14:23] <fsphil> I melted an eyepiece with my old refractor
[14:23] <Gnea> ouch
[14:23] <Gnea> I'll keep that in mind
[14:23] Action: Gnea writes a note, "save the eyepieces!!"
[14:23] <Gnea> "...and the eyes!"
[14:23] <fsphil> this was with a small telescope. I imagine an 8" lens could make a mess
[14:25] <x-f> i have the Baader solarfilm, that goes in front of the scope so it'is safe then, but it's only useful for sunspots, no prominences and other beautiful stuff
[14:25] <Gnea> went to a local astronomy club for the first time a few months ago, someone was showing off a homemade dob scope that he spent 2 years making
[14:25] <fsphil> those hydrogen alpha filters are sooooo expensive
[14:26] <Gnea> it rotated around the base freely and he had taken a measuring tape and wrapped it around the bottom of the base
[14:26] <x-f> yeah, a few thousands too expensive :/
[14:26] <Gnea> well, the base was internal, the tape was on the outside, so it wasn't really around the base
[14:27] <Gnea> he said he found most of the parts in the garbage, but had re-used a few parts from a scope
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[14:28] <Gnea> have any of you seen the new weather predictor for high altitude ballooning?
[14:28] <x-f> my best daylight picture - http://x-f.lv/x-files/pics/astro/venus-transit-2012/IMG_1013_resized.JPG
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[14:28] <fsphil> venus!
[14:28] <Gnea> nice
[14:29] <Gnea> although, not sure what that planetoid is on the bottom left...
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[14:30] <fsphil> I've only managed http://flic.kr/p/dt8Zag
[14:30] <fsphil> I don't really have the setup to image the sun
[14:30] <fsphil> only got away with that one because of the thick cloud
[14:30] <fsphil> and the fact that most of it was hidden
[14:30] <Gnea> oh, venus.. the sun... *drinks more coffee*
[14:30] <fsphil> could be Vulcan I suppose :)
[14:31] <x-f> fsphil, it's got to be somewhere!
[14:32] <Randomskk> Gnea: what new weather predictor for high altitude ballooning?
[14:33] <fsphil> there's a transit of the earth in 2084. sadly you need to be on Mars to see it
[14:33] <daveake> sadly you have to still be alive too :p
[14:33] <fsphil> and the moon too I guess
[14:34] <fsphil> https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/2/28/EarthTransit2084.jpg
[14:34] <Gnea> Randomskk: http://www.aerodynelabs.com/forecast
[14:34] <fsphil> that's not really a predictor
[14:34] <fsphil> also slightly North America
[14:36] <fsphil> daveake: so far so good :)
[14:36] <Gnea> well, when the rest of the world starts using NAM and/or GFS data on a more consistent level, I'm sure they would accomodate it
[14:37] <daveake> fsphil Yeah but the prediction isn't looking that good ;)
[14:38] <fsphil> I should have my neural network map downloaded by then. just hope there's no bugs in brain.c
[14:39] <Gnea> https://picasaweb.google.com/101480136813184976086/PartialLunarEclipseJune42012
[14:39] <fsphil> nice
[14:39] <fsphil> I like lunar eclipses
[14:40] <fsphil> they're not as expensive as solar ones :)
[14:40] <daveake> :)
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[14:41] <x-f> and they're almost twice per year
[14:42] <x-f> nice photos, Gnea
[14:42] <fsphil> no full lunar eclipses in 2012 or 2013
[14:43] <fsphil> the next good total lunar eclipse for europe isn't until 2015 :/
[14:44] <fsphil> it'll be cloudy that night. how's that for a weather forecast!
[14:44] <x-f> plausible
[14:49] <zyp> I was once mid-flight during one
[14:49] <zyp> http://farm4.staticflickr.com/3221/2731248501_17d47053c8_b.jpg
[14:49] <Gnea> we got lucky on those shots
[14:50] <Gnea> awesome
[14:50] <fsphil> oh brilliant zyp
[14:50] <griffonbot> Received email: chris G7OGX "Re: [UKHAS] Radio to receive 70cm HAB transmissions"
[14:50] <fsphil> that's the best way to beat the clouds
[14:50] <griffonbot> Received email: chris hillcox "Re: [UKHAS] Re: Fogging Camera Lenses - Problem?"
[14:50] <zyp> shame with the reflections though
[14:51] <eroomde> they look like a bunch of mini satturns have come out to herald the eclipse
[14:51] <fsphil> haha
[14:51] <fsphil> I tried doing some astrophotography on my flight home, and a lot of them are just the inside of the cabin reflected
[14:52] <fsphil> the stars are amazingly steady up there
[14:52] <fsphil> right down to the horizon
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[14:52] <eroomde> we're going to have a go here with the camera and scope
[14:52] <eroomde> too fun to not give it a try really
[14:52] <fsphil> definitely
[14:53] <fsphil> you should try following a balloon launch with it
[14:53] <eroomde> especially with the comet this year
[14:53] <eroomde> or a >100km rocket launch
[14:53] <eroomde> hypothetically
[14:53] <eroomde> ...
[14:53] <fsphil> who'd do such a thing?!!!1
[14:54] <eroomde> someone who wanted to poke the ukhas alt record up a bit from the zone of death at 44km
[14:54] <eroomde> :)
[14:54] <fsphil> we'd need a separate table...
[14:55] <daveake> Yep .. tables for Pico, Latex and ROOOAAAARRRR
[14:55] <eroomde> nah cos then i'd be lonely :)
[14:55] <eroomde> it's ukhas alt record not ukhab :)
[14:57] <daveake> Well there you go- it's lonely at the top
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[15:00] <eroomde> is it still the case that you have to recover it for alt records to count?
[15:01] <eroomde> this was A Debate a few years ago
[15:01] <eroomde> where the answer was 'yes' else people would do 1.5m/s ascent rates and let them drift out to sea as they spent hours and hours climbing
[15:01] <Randomskk> I don't believe there's exactly a definitive ruling...
[15:01] <eroomde> but this was pre howyees going super pressure and all that
[15:04] <eroomde> i suspect that would be tricky for a hypotehtical
[15:04] <eroomde> as range requires mean landing 300km down range in the sea
[15:04] <eroomde> hypothetically
[15:04] <Randomskk> sweet. I've got two-way comms working with my iridium module
[15:04] <daveake> :)
[15:04] <Randomskk> that's kinda cool to think of
[15:05] <Randomskk> satellites are great
[15:06] <daveake> Talking of the UK record table, are non-UK flights allowed on it?
[15:06] <daveake> 'cos there's at least one non-UK there atm
[15:08] <eroomde> i guess arhab is canonical and ukhas is ukhas members which is a wooly area
[15:08] <eroomde> people who chat or are on the mailing list
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[15:11] <eroomde> or have flight docs on habitat
[15:12] <Laurenceb> did someone say 100km rocket ?!
[15:12] <Laurenceb> do it
[15:13] <eroomde> no one said anything Laurenceb
[15:13] <Laurenceb> heh
[15:13] <Laurenceb> you know what my thoughts are
[15:13] <eroomde> not sure i do
[15:14] <Laurenceb> spun stabilised estes D motor
[15:14] <Laurenceb> with nozzle extension
[15:14] <eroomde> difficult to get some decent instrumentation on that one, i suspect
[15:14] <Laurenceb> indeed
[15:14] <Laurenceb> struggle to put a tx on it
[15:15] <Laurenceb> i pondered launching into the sunrise/sunset
[15:15] <eroomde> ...
[15:15] <Laurenceb> might get you 20km or so if done well
[15:15] <WillDuckworth> fin spun or other means Laurenceb?
[15:15] <Laurenceb> nope
[15:15] <Laurenceb> too heavy
[15:16] <Laurenceb> stick it on the end of a big brushless rc motor
[15:16] <Laurenceb> sorted
[15:16] <WillDuckworth> cool - how rad/s
[15:16] <WillDuckworth> many
[15:17] <Laurenceb> if you do the maths, estes are crap as they are effectively hitting a brick wall of air
[15:17] <Laurenceb> the isp is poor, but noth that poor
[15:17] <eroomde> someone launched an N5800 recently in a minimum diameter rocket
[15:17] <Laurenceb> about 500 or so
[15:17] <eroomde> only weighed about 25kg
[15:17] <eroomde> that would do you
[15:18] <eroomde> and you could make it much lighter than that as the aerodynamic forces are much reduced at alt
[15:18] <eroomde> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TMbIrYpB9vw
[15:18] <Laurenceb> if you stick an estes motor on a lathe.. trim off the cardboard and stick in a CF tube...
[15:18] <Laurenceb> but thats very naughty :P
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[15:20] <Laurenceb> it could get you to 80Km for 40Km when i took a look with some sim code
[15:21] <fsphil> don't worry eroomde, I could add my water rockets to the table ;)
[15:21] <eroomde> just beast all your fuel out at launch to cut your gravity uses and make waht little use of 2km of atmosphere you can
[15:21] <eroomde> loses*
[15:21] <fsphil> 5m, 7m, 15m, 121000m....
[15:22] <eroomde> one of akin's laws of spacecraft design which i like
[15:22] <eroomde> 'you can't get to the moon by climbing successively taller trees'
[15:22] <Laurenceb> heh
[15:22] <Laurenceb> thats why n-prize is stupid
[15:23] <Laurenceb> all the doable designs dont scale
[15:23] <fsphil> would a jet engine be more efficient at lower altitudes than a rocket?
[15:23] <Laurenceb> fsphil: in b4 rocketry flamewar
[15:23] <eroomde> yes :)
[15:23] Action: Laurenceb heads off to do some work
[15:23] <fsphil> first stage jet engine would be nifty
[15:24] <WillDuckworth> what you need is some sort of aeroplane which can do both.........
[15:24] <fsphil> some sort of sky lon?
[15:24] <WillDuckworth> that's the badger
[15:24] <eroomde> it doesn't scale down all that well sadly
[15:25] <eroomde> and massive overkill for just going to 100km
[15:25] <fsphil> aye
[15:25] <fsphil> this hypothetical launch better have a camera :)
[15:25] <WillDuckworth> or it didn't happen
[15:26] <eroomde> sure but it wouldn't be coming back
[15:26] <eroomde> hypothetically
[15:26] <eroomde> so would need some telemetradizzle
[15:26] <fsphil> some kind of slow image transfer
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[15:27] <Randomskk> you could totally transfer small jpegs over iridium
[15:27] <Randomskk> just take a little while
[15:27] <fsphil> daveake worked out the price for that
[15:27] <fsphil> it's not cheap :)
[15:27] <Randomskk> it's very cheap compared to the rocket
[15:27] <fsphil> fair point
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[15:27] <Randomskk> 4p per 50 bytes in qty
[15:27] <x-f> aww.. water rockets! (i remembered childhood)
[15:28] <eroomde> i think i can design something a little cheaper
[15:28] <fsphil> my water rockets have not gotten higher than about 10m x-f :)
[15:28] <Randomskk> admittedly that's still expensive for large quantities of data
[15:28] <Randomskk> you're not recovering HD video ;)
[15:28] <fsphil> a 320x240 image could be squeezed into about 4k
[15:29] <Randomskk> write to a few different SD cards, eject at altitude, put in floating high-viz boxes
[15:29] <Randomskk> hope it washes up somewhere with internet access
[15:29] <x-f> fsphil, but they were rockets! cheap and reusable! and mine were way lower than 10m anyway
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[15:30] <eroomde> SD crads in a bottle might not be a bad idea
[15:30] <Randomskk> they'd probably wash up eventually
[15:30] <Randomskk> heck, put a wifi modem in them and hope you wash up near a hotel ;)
[15:31] <daveake> Send up a Polaroid camera and eject the prints :p
[15:31] <eroomde> given all the telemetry would be hypothetically be wanted, probs best to just have a robust downlink as plan A
[15:32] <costyn> cm13g09: turns out you were right. his parents are Dutch and he has a Dutch pasport, but never actually lived in NL
[15:33] <x-f> costyn dug deep to the core of this mystery
[15:34] <costyn> x-f: well talked to the guy on the phone again :)
[15:34] <x-f> costyn, i like your determination :)
[15:35] <costyn> x-f: well I didn't call him to ask him
[15:35] <costyn> that would be weird
[15:36] <x-f> i know, chill :)
[15:36] <costyn> :)
[15:36] <costyn> sorry forgot the smileys
[15:36] <costyn> trying to multitask
[15:38] <SpeedEvil> trained pigeon, with a respirator and string vest.
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[16:01] <Habjoe> Hi,quick question.Any one know the weight of a meter of gas line 10mm width i.e from the ground to the brass screw i'm allowing 300grm for a metre off the ground to the filler head (calculated separately). Does this sound about right?
[16:02] <daveake> That's similar to my He filler
[16:02] <daveake> which is 300-something for the filler bit plus the hose to the ground
[16:02] <eroomde> there is no such standard thing as 'gas line' so the answer is that it depends on what its made of and the wall thickness. i think by far the easiest thing to do would be to weigh it
[16:03] <Habjoe> Hi, dave. great. thanks
[16:03] <daveake> Do wot Ed sez though :)
[16:04] <Habjoe> yes. did that but its not all lifted when the balloon is filled.I'll go with 300grm. thanks
[16:04] <daveake> My H2 filler is 540g, as the hose is much heavier
[16:05] <eroomde> you could use some fish scales to measure the force exerted on the neck by the fill rig
[16:05] <eroomde> both from weight and stiffness and tension
[16:06] <Habjoe> i'm using 10mm iso3821 tube
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[16:15] <SpeedEvil> eroomde: skip the scales, just use an appropriately picked fish.
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[16:36] <STRATODEAN_Mark> I have an Arduino Uno, NTX2 radio and the 5v gps breakout board with ublox from the upuaut store. im currently testing with 4 AA batteries. Will I need 4 or 6 batteries for the proper launch?
[16:39] <daveake> IIRC the Uno has a 2V drop-out regulator, meaning it needs at least 7V Vin
[16:41] <STRATODEAN_Mark> so the 4x AA batteries giving out ~6v wont cut it for flight really will it?
[16:41] <daveake> No
[16:41] <daveake> Then if you look at http://data.energizer.com/PDFs/l91.pdf you'll see that (at room temp) an AA Lithium Energizer maintains >1.2V till very close to the end of the discharge curve
[16:41] <daveake> It'll be lower if cold
[16:41] <daveake> So yeah, 6 of them
[16:43] <daveake> Or 6 AAAs. Total current draw is likely to be around 70-100mA (suggest you measure it). AAAs are 1200mAh so that's 12-15 hours from them, which is plemty for a normal flight
[16:43] <STRATODEAN_Mark> ah great yes, that will help with weight too
[16:44] <daveake> Now, if you'd bought a Mini Pro instead of an Uno, you'd only need 3 of them ;)
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[16:45] <STRATODEAN_Mark> ha yes true.
[16:46] <STRATODEAN_Mark> talking of weight, is ~1kg a lot?
[16:47] <daveake> ish. It's about average for 3 cameras
[16:48] <fsphil> I'd consider 2kg a lot
[16:49] <STRATODEAN_Mark> ok thats alright then.
[16:49] <fsphil> just make sure you have an appropriate parachute
[16:49] <daveake> If we were in the USA, 1kg counts as a Pico :p
[16:49] <fsphil> "What's a kg?" :)
[16:49] <daveake> that too :)
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[16:50] <STRATODEAN_Mark> thanks for the help from here the other day, took delivery of my mr77 antenna yesterday, works great
[16:51] <STRATODEAN_Mark> and my backup gsm gps cheap chinese job too
[16:52] <daveake> I used one a coulpe of times. First time it didn't work at all. Second time it did work, and correctly reported a position 10 miles offshore :(
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[16:53] <STRATODEAN_Mark> haha ok, i havent tested it yet so will see
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[16:57] <Elijah_> hey, don't be making fun of our silly units now ;-)
[16:58] <STRATODEAN_Mark> ok thanks for your help for now, I'm sure I'll be back!
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[17:54] <jarod> http://78.129.167.24:9920/listen.pls aircraft in troubles....
[17:54] <jarod> now
[17:54] <arko> omg
[17:54] <arko> that sucks
[17:54] <jarod> in contact with amsterdam tower
[17:54] <jarod> cant speak over
[17:54] <jarod> NCA
[17:55] <jarod> 120.55
[17:55] <jarod> tuned....
[17:55] <arko> im on the other side of the world
[17:56] <arko> i also dont have the appropriate software to play that file
[17:56] <arko> hope they are going to be ok
[17:56] <arko> :/
[17:59] <bertrik_> jarod: which aircraft?
[17:59] <jarod> NCA 800 i heard
[17:59] <jarod> 800 NCA they call him
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[17:59] <jarod> so not sure
[17:59] <Elijah_> what's going on with him?
[17:59] <arko> small plane?
[18:00] <jarod> NCA, could be cargo.... china
[18:00] <russss> NCA is Nippon Cargo Airlines
[18:01] <russss> but that's not a radio callsign
[18:02] <bertrik_> can't open the .pls, opens rhythmbox for me and that generally doesn't work as an audio player
[18:02] <Elijah_> yeah, here either. All I have atm is windows media player though
[18:02] <bertrik_> and liveatc.net manages to hide the "listen" button by poor page layout
[18:02] <cuddykid> opens in itunes (mac)
[18:03] <Elijah_> around here they seem to use the flight number to refer to commercial planes
[18:03] <jarod> http://78.129.167.24:9920 in windows media player works
[18:03] <jarod> just open url
[18:03] <jarod> but its damn silent now
[18:04] <Elijah_> oh ok... was about to ask if something was wrong or they just weren't saying anything
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[18:06] <arko> it's been a few minutes now
[18:06] <Elijah_> just broke squelche
[18:06] <jarod> yup....
[18:06] <Elijah_> -e
[18:06] <arko> wonder if they are still airborne
[18:06] <arko> ....
[18:06] <jarod> talk
[18:06] <jarod> recording all
[18:07] <x-f> "respond with one click"?
[18:07] <jarod> yup
[18:07] <jarod> 1x mic in
[18:07] <Elijah_> yeah, apparently his mic is not working or something?
[18:07] <jarod> or hijacked.... cant speak... but can click
[18:08] <Elijah_> aah, maybe....
[18:09] <Elijah_> not sure why they wouldn't want him to talk then
[18:09] <jarod> and unaware of hijackers, gonna land @ Groningen and sent in the military
[18:09] <jarod> because hijacker hear them talk then
[18:09] <jarod> now they just think they are going flight stuff
[18:09] <Elijah_> aah true
[18:09] <jarod> he had to change squak to 7000
[18:09] <jarod> lets google
[18:10] <Elijah_> 7000 is a distress code, can't recall what it means though
[18:10] <jarod> exactly....
[18:11] <bertrik> is it visible on flightradar24?
[18:11] <Elijah_> 7500 is the hijack code...
[18:11] <russss> it's not on flightradar24
[18:11] <russss> but if it's not a passenger airliner it may not be required to carry ADS-B
[18:12] <jarod> i think its a NCA flight
[18:12] <Elijah_> This code does not imply VFR; 7000 is used as a general conspicuity squawk (UK)
[18:12] <jarod> Elijah_ 7500 could be said also, it was in a blind of an eye
[18:12] <jarod> 118.7
[18:12] <Elijah_> oh, ok
[18:12] <jarod> crap, cant receive that
[18:13] <Elijah_> oh, this is your scanner?
[18:13] <jarod> ya
[18:13] <Elijah_> crap, what were we on before?
[18:13] <arko> change freq?
[18:13] <jarod> yes 118.7
[18:13] <jarod> groningen airport
[18:14] <arko> so they can only respond in clicks?
[18:14] <jarod> yap
[18:14] <Elijah_> I mean what freq were we listening to before
[18:15] <jarod> 120.55
[18:15] <Elijah_> aah
[18:15] <jarod> started here:
[18:15] <jarod> 128,575,000 AM Schiphol EHAA Sector 2 - Oost inbound
[18:15] <jarod> main radar for the east
[18:15] <jarod> then plane was asked to move to:
[18:15] <jarod> 120,550,000 AM Schiphol EHAA RADAR Ijsselmeer sector, ARTIP holding
[18:16] <jarod> which is a special freq for the waypoint ARTIP... where planes can circle to wait to prepare to land
[18:16] <jarod> wasn't in use
[18:16] <Elijah_> aah ok
[18:16] <jarod> and now its at:
[18:16] <jarod> 118.7 MHz AM Eelde EHGG, Netherlands TWR
[18:16] <jarod> so its going to land
[18:17] <Elijah_> aah ok, your scanner can't tune that low?
[18:18] <jarod> it can, but Tower signals aren't that strong
[18:18] <Elijah_> oh, but we can probably hear the plane for awhile
[18:18] <Elijah_> although I guess, clicks won't be very interesting ;-)
[18:19] <Elijah_> hehe
[18:19] <Elijah_> there he is
[18:19] <arko> NxxxCA?
[18:20] <arko> N800CA
[18:20] <russss> that's a plane
[18:21] <russss> http://www.airliners.net/search/photo.search?regsearch=N800CA
[18:21] <arko> http://img.planespotters.net/photo/234000/original/N800CA-Beech-1900_PlanespottersNet_234243.jpg
[18:21] <Elijah_> it's breaking up
[18:21] <arko> yeah
[18:23] <arko> no clicks, they are not in distress
[18:23] <arko> one click for approach
[18:24] <arko> i guess they are ok
[18:24] <griffonbot> Received email: Trevor Cousins "Re: [UKHAS] Re: Fogging Camera Lenses - Problem?"
[18:24] <Upu> the thread that will not die...
[18:24] <arko> more like the admin that wont kill it :P
[18:24] <arko> jk
[18:24] <daveake> And I thought "Don't use the case" covered it
[18:24] <russss> why is everyone so obsessed with damn fogging camera lenses
[18:25] <daveake> I've never used a case or filter and, funnily enough, I've never had any fogging either
[18:25] <Upu> they aren't its this one guy who despite all the really good solid advice from people with experience is determined to ignore it all
[18:26] <Upu> good luck to him
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[18:27] <Upu> I'm not responding
[18:27] <Upu> like smashing your head against a wall
[18:28] <jarod> http://x264.nl/dump/n800ca-in-trouble.mp3
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[18:35] <arko> isn't there some authorative figure who can just chime in and be like, "answer is blah, thread closed"
[18:36] <SamSilver> yes Chuck Norris
[18:36] <arko> i use to like chuck norris
[18:36] <arko> until he started backing these nutty politicians, then i got all sad
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[18:45] <Randomskk> arko: I can close the thread
[18:45] <Randomskk> :P
[18:45] <arko> heh
[18:45] <Randomskk> but people have been giving him authoritative advice for ages
[18:45] <Randomskk> and he's just ignoring it
[18:45] <arko> ugg
[18:45] <arko> all too common
[18:45] <arko> our hackerspace list has that issue now and then
[18:46] <arko> they guy who runs it, will be like "listen to them or shut up, thread closed"
[18:46] <arko> although it's still left open, no one respondes
[18:46] <arko> crazy kids
[18:47] <russss> air traffic controllers talk crazy fast
[18:47] <Randomskk> haha
[18:47] <Randomskk> we have spoken to some different air traffic controllers ;)
[18:47] <russss> on the radio at least
[18:47] <Randomskk> or, rather, the people who answer the phones at ATC are not themselves air traffic controllers
[18:47] <cuddykid> "It's hotter than an African sun up there" :D
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[18:53] Action: mfa298 wonders what would happen if he was told to go do some experiments and report back once he knows the answers
[18:55] <SamSilver> wonders what would happen if he went on safari and did not take the advice of the game ranger
[18:55] <SamSilver> could end up with a rhino dick in my ear
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[19:06] <OZ1SKY_Brian> soldering iron warm, now i better get on with it, hi
[19:07] <fsphil> love the smell of solder in the evening
[19:08] <jarod> dutch but, about the plane: http://twitter.com/LuchtvaartN_NL
[19:08] <OZ1SKY_Brian> yes, lots of led for ya :-)
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[19:15] <zyp> fsphil, what about the smell of solder paste? :)
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[19:15] <arko> neat
[19:15] <fsphil> that's not bad
[19:15] <arko> The plane concerns N800CA (Raytheon 1900D), they have now landed safely at Eelde airport. # 7600 Time: 1931 LT
[19:15] <zyp> I just ran a board in the oven
[19:16] <fsphil> I've got a bad habit of burning myself on boards just out of the oven
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[19:16] <zyp> the smell is not similar to cookies in the oven, but the feelings it invokes is almost the same :)
[19:16] <fsphil> lol yea
[19:16] <arko> haha
[19:16] <fsphil> freshly baked pcbs
[19:16] <fsphil> mmm
[19:16] <arko> we have two ovens one labelled "food" the other labelled "cancer generator"
[19:17] <zyp> http://bin.jvnv.net/f/Mv7rw.JPG <- my first attempt at BGA, worked out quite nicely
[19:17] <arko> neat
[19:17] <arko> looks slim
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[19:21] <SamSilver> 3 or 4 layer
[19:23] <SamSilver> nn
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[19:27] <OZ1SKY_Brian> anyone else got stall problems with the arduino software in win7 ?
[19:29] <fsphil> I had crashy problems with it in linux
[19:29] <arko> which release?
[19:29] <OZ1SKY_Brian> 1.0.3
[19:29] <OZ1SKY_Brian> opening menus takes forever
[19:30] <arko> odd
[19:30] <arko> haven't had issues like that
[19:30] <fsphil> recent version of java?
[19:31] <OZ1SKY_Brian> not sure what version i got
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[19:34] <OZ1SKY_Brian> ill try reinstall java
[19:38] <OZ1SKY_Brian> that didnt help
[19:38] <OZ1SKY_Brian> if i press like "tools" it takes forever to open
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[19:39] <arko> hmm
[19:39] <arko> what else is your computer doing?
[19:39] <OZ1SKY_Brian> cpu and mem are not overloaded
[19:40] <OZ1SKY_Brian> 5% cpu usagde
[19:40] <OZ1SKY_Brian> 1.7GB free mem
[19:40] <arko> try the Arduino Enhanced Release
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[19:42] <OZ1SKY_Brian> will try that
[19:44] <OZ1SKY_Brian> dont see that under download?
[19:46] <jcoxon> evening all
[19:47] <OZ1SKY_Brian> Hi james
[19:48] <Gadget-Mac> zyp: NIce board :)
[19:49] <arko> http://arduino.cc/forum/index.php?PHPSESSID=1f7f44f726ef238d6e32436607047362&/topic,118440.0.html
[19:50] <arko> how about there
[19:51] <OZ1SKY_Brian> thanks, will try that
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[19:55] <Lunar_Lander> hello
[19:59] <Lunar_Lander> Upu, today I tried out "impossible" values for the GPS, like 94°N, 184°E (and the opposites) and something like 64328 m (and the negative of that)
[19:59] <Lunar_Lander> all came out well
[20:04] <OZ1SKY_Brian> arko that did it, much better. thanks
[20:04] <arko> nice, glad i could help
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[20:06] <OZ1SKY_Brian> "blink" project working, now what next LOL
[20:06] <Lunar_Lander> OZ1SKY_Brian, you got an arduino?
[20:06] <Lunar_Lander> cool!
[20:06] <OZ1SKY_Brian> yes trying to make a tracker
[20:06] <Lunar_Lander> yea
[20:06] <Lunar_Lander> try "Fade" next :)
[20:06] <OZ1SKY_Brian> my first one ever, lol
[20:06] <Lunar_Lander> check the arduino IDE, File Examples Digital Fade
[20:07] <Lunar_Lander> or so
[20:07] <OZ1SKY_Brian> it is correct i need to reset it each time, before i upload a new project?
[20:07] <Lunar_Lander> no, if you hit upload on the IDE
[20:07] <Lunar_Lander> it sends a reset signal that stops the program before data transfetr
[20:07] <Lunar_Lander> -t
[20:08] <Lunar_Lander> that you had to hit reset was with arduino 2009 sometimes
[20:08] <OZ1SKY_Brian> on the ide, what to you mean?
[20:08] <Lunar_Lander> did you download that programming environment from the arduino website?
[20:09] <OZ1SKY_Brian> yes
[20:09] <Lunar_Lander> that thing is called IDE
[20:10] <OZ1SKY_Brian> ok i uploaded fade, what should that do?
[20:10] <Lunar_Lander> wait
[20:11] <Lunar_Lander> do you have just the arduino or an LED hooked up to it?
[20:11] <OZ1SKY_Brian> ok uploaded blink again and thats working, so i must clear before upload. just wanted to make sure
[20:11] <Lunar_Lander> yea
[20:11] <OZ1SKY_Brian> only the board atm and the onboard leds
[20:11] <Lunar_Lander> OK one sec
[20:11] <Lunar_Lander> can you see in the fade program
[20:11] <OZ1SKY_Brian> yes
[20:11] <Lunar_Lander> pinMode(9, OUTPUT);
[20:11] <Lunar_Lander> and analogWrite(9, brightness);
[20:11] <Lunar_Lander> exchange the 9 by a 13
[20:12] <Lunar_Lander> and the onboard LED should then get dimmer and brighter again
[20:12] <Lunar_Lander> like a slowmo blink
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[20:13] <OZ1SKY_Brian> its just on/off, maybe it cant fade
[20:13] <Randomskk> you need to use a PWM pin
[20:13] <Randomskk> one of the ones with PWM written next to the pin, on the arduino board
[20:14] <Lunar_Lander> dang yea
[20:14] <Lunar_Lander> sorry
[20:14] <Lunar_Lander> thanks Randomskk
[20:14] <OZ1SKY_Brian> but ok, we found out i can get stuff onto the board
[20:14] <Lunar_Lander> Brian, do you have a breadboard alreaddy?
[20:14] <Lunar_Lander> yea
[20:15] <OZ1SKY_Brian> Lunar_Lander no didnt plan to have any, never used those boards when making circuts
[20:16] <OZ1SKY_Brian> i like the birdsnests factor lol
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[20:16] <Lunar_Lander> ah :)
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[20:42] <arko> http://hackaday.com/2013/01/03/an-absurdly-clever-thermal-imaging-camera/
[20:42] <arko> that is so damn clever
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[20:44] Nick change: [1]Boggle -> Boggle
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[20:48] <costyn> very cool
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[20:59] <OZ1SKY_Brian> to test the gps, i should connect it to pin0 (rx) and pin1 (tx) on the pro mini, but there are no 0 and 1 pins on the pro mini, do they have another name, im thinking TXO and RXI ?
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[21:00] <costyn> OZ1SKY_Brian: yes
[21:01] <Randomskk> Upu: around?
[21:01] <costyn> OZ1SKY_Brian: http://arduino.cc/en/Main/ArduinoBoardProMini <-- you can use the txo and rxi on the left hand side or the rxi/txo on the bottom left hand
[21:01] <Randomskk> or anyone who's used a rockblock for that matter
[21:01] <fsphil> OZ1SKY_Brian: make sure your voltages match (3.3v / 5v)
[21:02] <costyn> OZ1SKY_Brian: I was going to say, I'm assuming you have 3.3v pro mini?
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[21:02] <OZ1SKY_Brian> yes 3.3V
[21:02] <fsphil> ah, np. then you can directly connect them
[21:02] <OZ1SKY_Brian> so i should use the 3VRX and 3VTX on the gps right?
[21:02] <fsphil> you need extra bits to connect a 3.3v gps to a 5v arduino
[21:02] <costyn> OZ1SKY_Brian: for power, make sure the GND on the left is really GND (on my chinese copy it wasn't) or use BLK (which is also GND)
[21:03] <jcoxon> evening all
[21:03] <fsphil> howdy jcoxon
[21:03] <OZ1SKY_Brian> fsphil its a 3.3V arduino
[21:03] <OZ1SKY_Brian> costyn with a dc meter i got 3.3V on VCC and GND
[21:04] <costyn> OZ1SKY_Brian: ok good :) i spent too much time getting my gps talking to my pro mini because of this sillyness :)
[21:04] <jcoxon> hey fsphil
[21:04] <fsphil> I'm not familiar enough with arduino to be certain :)
[21:04] <jcoxon> i reckon i've my current repeater setup isn't legal
[21:04] <costyn> OZ1SKY_Brian: I have to go, good luck :)
[21:05] <OZ1SKY_Brian> costyn so i should use the 3VRX and 3VTX on the gps right?
[21:07] <fsphil> in what way jcoxon?
[21:08] <jcoxon> well the direct repeating
[21:08] <jcoxon> basically we'd be using callsigns at 10mW
[21:08] <jcoxon> not licence exempt at all
[21:09] <fsphil> I'd considered this when I was gonna do it
[21:10] <fsphil> I decided that the ISM rules allow me to transmit any voice audio
[21:10] <number10> evening jcoxon
[21:10] <fsphil> it says nothing about content
[21:10] <fsphil> so what if there's an amateur callsign in it
[21:10] <fsphil> the rules conflict, it's annoying
[21:11] <fsphil> both are secondary users, neither has priority
[21:12] <fsphil> I believe it should be fine for me to use my callsign via RTTY for example
[21:12] <fsphil> there's nothing stopping someone else use it, it's just data
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[21:13] <fsphil> (within the ISM rules)
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[21:13] <Randomskk> fsphil: it does say about content
[21:13] <Randomskk> we're specifically operating under an exception for airborne telemetry iirc
[21:13] <fsphil> content for analogue can be voice, no music
[21:13] <fsphil> or unspecified data
[21:14] <fsphil> for digital
[21:14] <Randomskk> airborne telemetry
[21:14] <fsphil> I don't have the doc handy, but isn't it non-specific?
[21:15] <Randomskk> can't remember. one was definitely specific. that might have been the older one. there were a load of allowable categories
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[21:15] <Randomskk> but I think the main thing is that it being airborne changes the nature of things slightly
[21:15] <Randomskk> I mean at the end of the day it's a pretty minor quibble..
[21:15] <fsphil> "non-specific short range devices"
[21:16] <fsphil> only restriction is analogue, where it can only be voice/speech
[21:17] <jcoxon> so here is my work around...
[21:17] <jcoxon> instead i build a packet decoder
[21:17] <fsphil> you can't broadcast music on the amateur bands anyway :)
[21:18] <jcoxon> which gets the packet and strips out hte callsign
[21:18] <jcoxon> and then retransmit it as rtty in the downlink telem
[21:18] <jcoxon> so the comment is just transmitted
[21:18] <jcoxon> we then setup a packet network on 434.075
[21:18] <Lunar_Lander> costyn, the pro mini has 2 UARTs?
[21:19] <jcoxon> and hte balloon listens in and extracts data and retransmits it
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[21:20] <fsphil> what packet format?
[21:21] <jcoxon> well we could just use aprs
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[21:21] <jcoxon> so you'd be tx'ing aprs on 434.075
[21:21] <jcoxon> instead of 144.800
[21:23] <fsphil> it might need a fair bit of power
[21:24] <fsphil> guess we won't know until it's in the air
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[21:36] <chrisg7ogx> Is Astra1 straining at the leash?!
[21:36] <fsphil> I thought I knew the difference between holland and netherlands. now I'm just confused: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eE_IUPInEuc
[21:37] <OZ1SKY_Brian> does that ublox max-6 draw alot of power, usb port resets when i connect it and VCC drops from 3.4V to 2.6V?
[21:37] <fsphil> the 3.3v supply on the arduinos is a bit weak
[21:38] <OZ1SKY_Brian> yes seems like it
[21:38] <Lunar_Lander> we once measured it to draw about 60 mA, while the pins give 50 mA
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[21:39] <OZ1SKY_Brian> ok that dont work then
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[22:15] <OZ1SKY_Brian> trying to test the gps in u-center, but i get a error when starting u-center, that the labjack driver does not mach the api im using. any ideas?
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[22:26] <OZ1SKY_Brian> god i hate windows and its driver problems
[22:32] <Lunar_Lander> yea
[22:32] <Lunar_Lander> linux? :P
[22:32] <OZ1SKY_Brian> when i look at the data comming from the gps in the serial monitor, should that look like garbage?
[22:32] <Lunar_Lander> but I know that u-center is for windows only
[22:32] <Lunar_Lander> OZ1SKY_Brian, you mean like just data spilling out all the time?
[22:32] <OZ1SKY_Brian> yes but garabe
[22:33] <OZ1SKY_Brian> nothing in clear text
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[22:33] <Lunar_Lander> hm
[22:33] <OZ1SKY_Brian> ?åë·q_qYS§§§??§??§§§§??§§§?«?yåë·q_qgg§§§§§§S§c«??åë
[22:33] <OZ1SKY_Brian> like that
[22:33] <Lunar_Lander> yea that looks crappy
[22:33] <OZ1SKY_Brian> yes
[22:33] <OZ1SKY_Brian> thats all im getting from the gps
[22:33] <Lunar_Lander> you should be able to see something like 999999999 or GPGGA or so
[22:34] <OZ1SKY_Brian> just getting garabe
[22:35] <Lunar_Lander> which code do you use?
[22:35] <OZ1SKY_Brian> just the loop, void setop(){} void loop (){}
[22:38] <Lunar_Lander> wait
[22:38] <Lunar_Lander> you got the ublox from Upu right?
[22:38] <OZ1SKY_Brian> yes
[22:39] <Lunar_Lander> the pro mini
[22:39] <Lunar_Lander> is it a 5V or 3.3V arduino?
[22:39] <Lunar_Lander> or do you have the GPS with level converter
[22:39] <Lunar_Lander> this one http://ava.upuaut.net/store/wiki/doku.php?id=levelconvertor
[22:39] <OZ1SKY_Brian> 3.3V board
[22:39] <Lunar_Lander> ah
[22:39] <Lunar_Lander> anyway did you try the code on the page I just linked?
[22:40] <Lunar_Lander> like http://ava.upuaut.net/store/wiki/doku.php?id=levelconvertor#software_setup1
[22:40] <OZ1SKY_Brian> i will try that
[22:40] <Lunar_Lander> yea
[22:40] <Lunar_Lander> wait
[22:41] <Lunar_Lander> let me look up the pro mini
[22:41] <Lunar_Lander> ah the problem is it has only one UART
[22:41] <Lunar_Lander> and if I get it right all the arduinos have UART 0 on the computer connection as well
[22:42] <Lunar_Lander> (which is why I use Mega)
[22:42] <Lunar_Lander> xD
[22:43] <Lunar_Lander> so you could try the Software example further up
[22:43] <Lunar_Lander> but that is not so good for a flight
[22:43] <Lunar_Lander> but just to try to get data out of the GPS
[22:44] <OZ1SKY_Brian> didnt help much:
[22:44] <Lunar_Lander> try this instead, with softwareserial
[22:44] <Lunar_Lander> http://ava.upuaut.net/store/wiki/doku.php?id=levelconvertor#hardware_setup
[22:44] <OZ1SKY_Brian> 562624240FFFF63000010270050FA0FA06402C10000000000000016DC * Reading ACK response: (FAILED!)
[22:44] <OZ1SKY_Brian> B562624240FFFF63000010270050FA0FA06402C10000000000000016DC * Reading ACK response: (FAILED!)
[22:44] Last message repeated 2 time(s).
[22:44] <Lunar_Lander> ah wait
[22:44] <Lunar_Lander> let me think
[22:45] <Lunar_Lander> don't change the circuit
[22:45] <Lunar_Lander> can you tell me what wires go to where at the moment?
[22:45] <OZ1SKY_Brian> pin4 to RX and pin5 to tx
[22:45] <Lunar_Lander> yes
[22:45] <Lunar_Lander> can you connect a wire from Arduino's GND to the GPS GND?
[22:46] <OZ1SKY_Brian> ah didnt think of that
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[22:47] <OZ1SKY_Brian> had to use a external supply for the gps, so didnt think about that gnd
[22:49] <Lunar_Lander> yeah
[22:49] <Lunar_Lander> I had the very same problem
[22:49] <Lunar_Lander> as the circuit isn't closed without it
[22:49] <Lunar_Lander> and also because I typed the code in manually (laptop at the lab has no internet) I spent a day getting FAILED because I missed out two of the hex numbers
[22:50] <OZ1SKY_Brian> gnd didnt help
[22:51] <Lunar_Lander> hm
[22:51] <Lunar_Lander> short question
[22:51] <Lunar_Lander> which code do you use now?
[22:51] <Lunar_Lander> the top one or the bottom one
[22:52] <OZ1SKY_Brian> http://ava.upuaut.net/store/wiki/doku.php?id=levelconvertor#hardware_setup
[22:52] <OZ1SKY_Brian> that one
[22:53] <Lunar_Lander> that's strange
[22:54] <Lunar_Lander> :( sorry now I am out of ideas
[22:55] <jcoxon> shall i help OZ1SKY_Brian
[22:56] <OZ1SKY_Brian> please :-)
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[22:57] <jcoxon> okay
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[22:57] <jcoxon> so whats the hardware?
[22:58] Nick change: UPu2 -> Upu2
[22:58] <OZ1SKY_Brian> ublox max-6 breakout and pro mini 3.3v 328 board
[22:59] <jcoxon> okay
[22:59] <jcoxon> and do you have a ftdi?
[22:59] <OZ1SKY_Brian> yes
[22:59] <Upu2> yeah wire it direct to the FTDI
[23:00] <Upu2> thought the Arduino Pro Mini can supply enough current
[23:00] <OZ1SKY_Brian> its connected direct to the ftdi
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[23:01] <arko> what baud rate?
[23:01] <OZ1SKY_Brian> and i tryed to program it with the "blink" project and that worked
[23:01] <Lunar_Lander> OZ1SKY_Brian, you have wired the GPS to the FTDI?
[23:02] <Lunar_Lander> or the arduino to the FTDI
[23:02] <OZ1SKY_Brian> ok wait, the gps to the ftdi direct?
[23:02] <Lunar_Lander> ah nevermind I once did that
[23:02] <Lunar_Lander> I forgot the program I used though
[23:02] <Lunar_Lander> it's on the lab laptop
[23:03] <Lunar_Lander> GPS Viewer or so
[23:03] <Lunar_Lander> no that wasn't it
[23:03] <Upu2> just trying to upload an image but my card reader isn't playing ball give me a few
[23:04] <OZ1SKY_Brian> getting confused now, what should i wire to the ftdi, the board or gps?
[23:04] <arko> OZ1SKY_Brian: is the config GPS->Arduino->FTDI->Computer ?
[23:04] <arko> or GPS->FTDI->Computer
[23:04] <OZ1SKY_Brian> GPS->Arduino->FTDI->Computer
[23:04] <arko> ok
[23:04] <arko> your computer is set to 9600baud correct?
[23:04] <Upu2> ok Brian
[23:04] <Upu2> unplug it
[23:05] <OZ1SKY_Brian> arko yes
[23:05] <OZ1SKY_Brian> unpluged
[23:05] <Upu2> I'll post you 2 3.3v tomorrow
[23:05] <Upu2> http://i.imgur.com/4yiwi.jpg
[23:05] <OZ1SKY_Brian> but this also is 3.3V+5 or am i missing something?
[23:06] <Upu2> it is but the 3.3v bit doesn't seem to be working correctly
[23:06] <OZ1SKY_Brian> re picture, yes thats how i connected it
[23:06] <Upu2> it works but it draws way too much current
[23:06] <Upu2> I need to work out why it used to work on the older revision of the PCB's
[23:06] <OZ1SKY_Brian> oh ok
[23:06] <Upu2> but my FTDI is getting hot which is never a good sign
[23:06] <Upu2> I'll post you some out tomorrow sorry about that
[23:06] <Upu2> I'll have to work out why thats happening
[23:07] <Lunar_Lander> does anyone remember the program that one can use to readout the GPS if connected directly to FTDI?
[23:07] <Upu2> u-center
[23:07] <Lunar_Lander> no, not that one
[23:07] Nick change: Upu2 -> Upu
[23:07] <Lunar_Lander> there was a version from the company which was commercial
[23:07] <Lunar_Lander> but also one that was free
[23:08] <Lunar_Lander> something with XP
[23:08] <OZ1SKY_Brian> Upu2 ok very nice, i hope that will fix it. untill then i have power for the gps from a external psu now, and that should work right?
[23:08] <Upu> let me check the maximums
[23:09] <OZ1SKY_Brian> or should i use 5V external ?
[23:09] <Upu> ok you can put anything up to 30v in on the 5v wire but I wouldn't go over 7 really
[23:10] <Upu> then wire the Arduino to the 3V RX & TX
[23:10] <Lunar_Lander> OZ1SKY_Brian, !
[23:10] <Lunar_Lander> here http://www.visualgps.net/visualgps/
[23:10] <Lunar_Lander> that is what I used when I wired the GPS directly to the FTDI to just see it working
[23:10] <OZ1SKY_Brian> Upu ok 5V to the 5V pin and 3VRX and 3VTX to the board?
[23:11] <arko> jcoxon: you around?
[23:11] <Upu> yep
[23:11] <Upu> and common GND
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[23:19] <Upu> I need to head off Brian
[23:19] <Upu> let me know how that works out
[23:22] <OZ1SKY_Brian> will do had some wire problems
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[23:25] <OZ1SKY_Brian> not even getting garabe now, are we sure i still have to use the 3V RXTX when i use the 5V supply pin?
[23:26] <Upu> Should be, let me double check
[23:28] <jdtanner> Evening all
[23:28] <OZ1SKY_Brian> hi jd
[23:29] <Upu> yep that work Brian
[23:29] <OZ1SKY_Brian> ok? not getting anything from it now
[23:29] <Upu> GND connected together ?
[23:30] <OZ1SKY_Brian> yes
[23:30] <Upu> http://i.imgur.com/Z2SHw.jpg
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[23:31] <Upu> all I can say is seems to work here
[23:31] <Upu> check RX and TX are the correct way round
[23:31] <OZ1SKY_Brian> ok funny
[23:31] <Upu> unplug and replug the FTDI
[23:31] <arko> question
[23:32] <arko> why is there an ftdi connected directly to the gps?
[23:32] <Upu> just diagnostics, see if you get serial output
[23:32] <arko> ok
[23:33] <Upu> if you do can move on to wiring it direct to Arduino
[23:33] <arko> that should be 4800baud though right?
[23:33] <arko> since it's nmea
[23:33] <Upu> 9600 on the ublox by default
[23:33] <arko> woah cool
[23:33] <arko> glad to see that
[23:33] <Upu> can drop it to 4800 if needed
[23:33] <arko> neat
[23:33] <Lunar_Lander> arko, yea I use that VisualGPS there for FTDI to GPS
[23:34] <arko> Upu, where did you get that notebook?
[23:34] <Upu> ok I have to go, if you can't get it working Brian I'll get some 3.3V out tomorrow
[23:34] <Upu> some intel conference about 6 years ago
[23:34] <Upu> night all
[23:34] <arko> hah
[23:34] <arko> night
[23:36] <OZ1SKY_Brian> gn upu, cant get any data from it in that config
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[23:36] <Lunar_Lander> OZ1SKY_Brian, :(
[23:38] <OZ1SKY_Brian> wonder if the high/low on the 3VRDXTX is 3V since i have to use them
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[23:47] <OZ1SKY_Brian> ok got gabage at 5V also now, as soon as i ground them together, the garabe stops
[23:48] <Lunar_Lander> ground them together means?
[23:48] <OZ1SKY_Brian> LOL no now, got data now
[23:48] <OZ1SKY_Brian> BUT!
[23:49] <OZ1SKY_Brian> with TX>TX and RX>RX
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[23:49] <OZ1SKY_Brian> GPGSA,A,1,,,,,,,,,,,,,99.99,99.99,99.99*30
[23:49] <OZ1SKY_Brian> $GPGSV,1,1,01,12,,,30*78
[23:49] <OZ1SKY_Brian> $GPGLL,,,,,,V,N*64
[23:49] <OZ1SKY_Brian> $GPRMC,,V,,,,,,,,,,N*53
[23:49] <OZ1SKY_Brian> $GPVTG,,,,,,,,,N*30
[23:49] <OZ1SKY_Brian> $GPGGA,,,,,,0,00,99.99,,,,,,*48
[23:49] <OZ1SKY_Brian> $GPGSA,A,1,,,,,,,,,,,,,99.99,99.99,99.99*30
[23:49] <OZ1SKY_Brian> $GPGSV,1,1,01,12,,,29*70
[23:49] <OZ1SKY_Brian> $GPGLL,,,,,,V,N*64
[23:50] <Lunar_Lander> hm
[23:50] <Lunar_Lander> but the data looks good :)
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[23:51] <OZ1SKY_Brian> its connected TX0>3VTX and RX1>3VRX the wrong way around, but NOW its working ?????????????????
[23:51] <arko> magic
[23:52] <OZ1SKY_Brian> and simply this code:
[23:52] <OZ1SKY_Brian> void setup()
[23:52] <OZ1SKY_Brian> {
[23:52] <OZ1SKY_Brian> }
[23:52] <OZ1SKY_Brian> void loop()
[23:52] <OZ1SKY_Brian> {
[23:52] <OZ1SKY_Brian> }
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[23:55] <OZ1SKY_Brian> and at 3.3V its also working
[00:00] --- Fri Jan 4 2013