highaltitude.log.20121201

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[07:40] <daveake> Morning number10
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[07:53] <G0MJW> Don't seem to be able to configure the flight on fl-digi
[07:53] <JFS1> Morning to anyone out there. Any news about the Leisctertershire flight?
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[07:56] <number10> morning daveake
[07:56] <natrium42> hi guys
[07:56] <number10> hi
[07:57] <number10> G7PMO-Home: are you still at home?
[07:59] <daveake> hi natrium42. Thanks Very much for working on spacenear
[07:59] <natrium42> hope it works :)
[07:59] <natrium42> actually if you could send some positions it would be nice
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[08:01] <number10> I just sent a couple seems to just say refreshing at the mo
[08:01] <natrium42> sorry, was fumbling with the server
[08:01] <natrium42> try again
[08:01] <number10> but not for a currently aproved flight
[08:01] <natrium42> ah, ok
[08:02] <number10> if that makes a difference
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[08:02] <daveake> morning natrium42 Upu here
[08:02] <daveake> thx for sorting that out much appreciated
[08:02] <natrium42> np
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[08:04] <daveake> Lovely sunny day -2.5'c
[08:05] <GW8RAK> Morning People. Tracker not loading here. Problems?
[08:05] <junderwood> Prom appears to be in the air
[08:05] <junderwood> 434.167
[08:06] <daveake> natrium42, doesn't appear to be loading any positions
[08:06] <daveake> Confirming PROM is in the air, not appear on Spacenear.us natrium42
[08:06] <number10> BOB is on 434.07483
[08:07] <number10> not aploading to spacenear
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[08:09] <natrium42> ping DanielRichman, Randomskk
[08:10] <G0MJW> Hearing it but not uploading
[08:10] <natrium42> is it uploading to habitat?
[08:10] <natrium42> didn't change the spacenear.us interface that habitat is using
[08:10] <natrium42> so it should work
[08:11] <junderwood> prom is definitely uploading to habitat but not showing on spacenear.us
[08:11] <number10> same with bob
[08:12] <G0MJW> I am not showing a a site on spacenear
[08:12] <G0MJW> http://habitat.habhub.org
[08:13] <natrium42> could switch back to old code
[08:13] <mclane> data appear in the logtail (habitat.habhub.org/logtail)
[08:13] <G0MJW> Bob i very weak here.
[08:14] <number10> current track for BOB http://i.imgur.com/UNnUd.jpg
[08:18] <natrium42> dunno, it's something with habitat
[08:18] <natrium42> switching back to old tracker
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[08:21] <natrium42> switch completed
[08:22] <Upu_M0UPU> thx
[08:22] <daveake> Interesting decode .. http://imgur.com/WEVOd
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[08:31] <G0MJW> What am I doing wrong this time - still not on the tracker. Mind you bob is weak and Prom inaudible here.
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[08:31] <g0hww> morning
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[08:32] <GW8RAK> What frequency is Prom on?
[08:32] <junderwood> 434.167
[08:33] <GW8RAK> ty
[08:33] <GMT> I'm tracking BOB okay from London; nice sigs, u/l to spacenear
[08:34] <g0hww> has the balloon already gone up?
[08:34] <Upu_M0UPU> Just spoke to Kevin, can anyone run a prediction for him on where abouts its likely to land
[08:34] <Upu_M0UPU> g0hww there is an early launch, The Register is later on about 10-11
[08:35] <g0hww> ok, thanks, just gettting the sw
[08:35] <junderwood> What is predicted burst altitude?
[08:35] <Upu_M0UPU> 500g balloon
[08:35] <Upu_M0UPU> unsure of payload weight but I'd guess abotu 400
[08:37] <daveake> bacon buttie cam
[08:39] <junderwood> Based on current rate of ascent (2.6) and burst at 30km, it will burst just north of Ramsgate
[08:40] <junderwood> at about 11:10
[08:41] <Upu_M0UPU> landing ?
[08:42] <junderwood> depends on the ballistic coefficient. Anywhere between the english channel and France
[08:43] <Upu_M0UPU> uh
[08:44] <G0MJW> Found out why bob was weak - it is North not East . So much junk on spacenear!
[08:45] <GMT> okay, for anyone trying to point a beam, its just north of Bedford at the moment
[08:46] <G0MJW> Yes. Got it now. I am trying an experiment to receive 3 at the same time. Two is working.
[08:47] <Darkside> its Upu_M0UPU !
[08:47] <Darkside> morning upu
[08:47] <Darkside> enjoying your bacon muffins?
[08:47] <daveake> Mornign Darkside. You missed the bacon and brown sauce
[08:47] <Darkside> heh
[08:47] <Darkside> sad
[08:47] <Darkside> brown sauce was nice
[08:47] <Upu_M0UPU> http://track.spacenear.us/
[08:47] Nick change: number10 -> number10_M0MDB
[08:47] <Upu_M0UPU> now working
[08:48] <Upu_M0UPU> thanks natrium42
[08:48] <daveake> Broadcast on bacon-tc.com
[08:48] <junderwood> Current prediction. Any burst below 28km is likely to land in Kent. Above that, Davey Jones gets it.
[08:49] <daveake> 2.2m/s. That's a slow ascent
[08:49] <G0MJW> Much better. A very strong signal has appeared at 434.130
[08:49] <G0MJW> And just gone. Was that you Dave?
[08:49] <daveake> Nope
[08:49] <JFS1> Any chance it will float at that rate of accent?
[08:50] <daveake> Dunno. Only a 500g balloon and not sure what those do at this ascent rate
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[08:51] <g0hww> what is bob's freq? sorry for silly q but just trying to get going quickly and not even had a coffee yet
[08:51] <natrium42> guys, refresh spacenear.us for the new tracker
[08:51] <natrium42> hopefully it works
[08:51] <daveake> Looks good cheers :)
[08:52] <G0MJW> Thanks - any idea why I am not appearing on the tracker? I am uploading I think. Well it says I am uploading
[08:52] <mclane> but data displayed are different???
[08:52] <natrium42> different?
[08:53] <mclane> yes, compare spacenear/us and track.spacenear.us - different coordinates for the same payload
[08:53] <mclane> sorry spacenear.us/tracker
[08:53] <fsphil> I would trust track. more at this point
[08:54] <natrium42> i don't know how that's possible, mclane
[08:54] <number10_M0MDB> there is also something wrong with dlfldigi v2.21.50 - it says my station logged on 21 hours ago - that was when I sued 3.20.29 as I wasnt showing on the map either
[08:54] <number10_M0MDB> used
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[08:56] <number10_M0MDB> just tested it. ran fldigi 3.20.29 and refreshed the tracker now I am on the map - where as the same test for 3.21.50 I did not appear on the map
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[08:57] <G0MJW> Ah - I am using 3.21.50. Where do I downgrade.
[08:57] <G7PMO-Kev-Home> argh, looks like not enough Helium in Bob/Prom ....
[08:57] <jcoxon> morning all
[08:58] <number10_M0MDB> I am not sure if its still available - I just had it on my PC and kept using it as it worked G0MJW
[08:58] <jcoxon> G7PMO-Kev-Home, what balloon is it?
[08:58] <Upu_M0UPU> moring James
[08:58] <G7PMO-Kev-Home> 500g
[08:58] <jcoxon> hey Upu_M0UPU - got your parcel
[08:59] <G0MJW> Hi James - just in time to tell me where to get fl-digi
[08:59] <jcoxon> what os?
[08:59] <Upu_M0UPU> cool finally :)
[09:00] <jcoxon> Upu_M0UPU, to big for the door post box thingy
[09:00] <G0MJW> DOZE7
[09:00] <jcoxon> http://wiki.ukhas.org.uk/projects:dl-fldigi
[09:00] <Upu_M0UPU> really ?
[09:00] <Upu_M0UPU> Same as last time
[09:00] <jcoxon> nah its them being lazy
[09:00] <G0MJW> Thats the new version.
[09:00] <number10_M0MDB> jcoxon: thete is a problem with the latest version running windows where your station doesnt appear on the map
[09:00] <Upu_M0UPU> I'll put a message on the packet next time
[09:01] <jcoxon> number10_M0MDB, oh
[09:01] <jcoxon> any output?
[09:01] <number10_M0MDB> but when you run the old version 3.20.29 it works
[09:01] <junderwood> number10_M0MDB, did you put the altitude in?
[09:01] <fsphil> that's odd
[09:01] <number10_M0MDB> ah - mI will check
[09:02] <G0MJW> Altitude?
[09:02] <junderwood> AMSL
[09:02] <jcoxon> whats the freq?
[09:02] <jcoxon> for the current fligth
[09:02] <Upu_M0UPU> 434.167
[09:02] <G0MJW> Ah - two position menus?
[09:02] <G7PMO-Kev-Home> Guys tracking Bob & Prom - firstly thank you very much, how is the signal looking compared between the two? Bob is a NTX with a good aerial, Prom is an RFM with a not so good aerial...
[09:03] <G8KNN-Jon> Bob generally stronger with me
[09:03] <G0MJW> WTH - to to speak.
[09:03] <junderwood> Prom is fine for me.
[09:03] <GMT> BOB is very good with me, not tried PROM yet
[09:03] <G7PMO-Kev-Home> Thanks G8KNN-Jon
[09:03] Nick change: junderwood -> junderwoodM0JCU
[09:03] <JFS1> Bob has certainly been stronger in S London
[09:03] Nick change: junderwoodM0JCU -> junderwood_M0JCU
[09:04] <jcoxon> are both on teh same freq?
[09:04] <Upu_M0UPU> no
[09:04] <Darkside> lol last minute fixes?
[09:04] <Upu_M0UPU> other is somewhere aournd 075
[09:04] <junderwood_M0JCU> Latest prdiction is still for the middle of the English Channel :(
[09:04] <Upu_M0UPU> yeah
[09:04] <Upu_M0UPU> SPEARS won't be transmitting
[09:04] <Darkside> what happened?
[09:04] <Upu_M0UPU> its frequency will conflict with BOB
[09:04] <Darkside> oh
[09:04] <number10_M0MDB> junderwood_M0JCU: the altitude was not set - for some reason it (or I) didnt save it
[09:05] <G0MJW> I can ee both on the same Waterfall, the lower frequency (Bob) is stronger by a fairly large margin
[09:05] <Darkside> Upu_M0UPU: if its using a NTX2, can you twiddle the knobs?
[09:05] <junderwood_M0JCU> I think it's new in the latest version
[09:05] <Darkside> get it a few KHZ off freq?
[09:05] <jcoxon> the reason the altitude is required is for calculating distance etc from station to payload
[09:05] <number10_M0MDB> I remember setting it - but that may have been a different pc
[09:05] <jcoxon> Darkside, teh drift should help
[09:06] <arko> Bleh
[09:07] <G0MJW> James - I can see that but it would help if it were in the position menu for operator rather than hidden under dl-client
[09:07] <jcoxon> G0MJW, its more that there are lot more features now then just putting you on the map
[09:08] <jcoxon> just as using GPS, chase cars etc
[09:08] <jcoxon> it really needs its own tab
[09:08] <jcoxon> do we have a prediction fro bob/prom?
[09:08] <g0hww> i've got dl-fldigi running on my linux box now, but nothing in the flight list
[09:09] <fsphil> yea I saw that too g0hww
[09:09] <jcoxon> which version?
[09:09] <g0hww> from git
[09:09] <natrium42> jcoxon: live predictions are disabled for the scalable tracker
[09:09] <G7PMO-Kev-Home> jcoxon - if I am luckj sout east coast, or france, if I am unluky - english channel!
[09:09] <jcoxon> G7PMO-Kev-Home, london flyover?
[09:10] <G7PMO-Kev-Home> jcoxon - looks that way, predicter said cambridge at 5am today!
[09:10] <GMT> def will fly over london
[09:10] <G0MJW> James - I would like to get the antenna control working too at some point
[09:10] <jcoxon> g0hww, did you use on of the tags or the latest off git
[09:10] <jcoxon> ?
[09:11] <jcoxon> G0MJW, sure - i think a few people are keen for that
[09:11] <junderwood_M0JCU> Predicted landing point is English Channel on a line between Margate and Dunkirk
[09:11] <jcoxon> junderwood_M0JCU, so a swing east in a bit
[09:11] <g0hww> i went for the tip, following http://ukhas.org.uk/projects:dl-fldigi:build-ubuntu
[09:12] <GMT> sigs from BOB getting weak for me, dunno why?
[09:12] <jcoxon> g0hww, can i check a few things
[09:12] <G0MJW> Then I could leve the dongle attached to the PC and run it via the internet
[09:12] <g0hww> although i didn't perform the apt-get as it wanted to change a load of stuff that i wasn't happy with
[09:12] <g0hww> jcoxon, by all means
[09:13] <jcoxon> g0hww, so the client is online, and is not doing any errors in the bottow window of dl-fldiig?
[09:13] <jcoxon> especially when you refresh?
[09:13] <junderwood_M0JCU> jcoxon, Potters Bar, Enfield, Rmford, Canvey Island then down the Thames Estuary
[09:13] <junderwood_M0JCU> Bursting North of Margate
[09:14] <g0hww> jcoxon, correct. refresh? how?
[09:15] <jcoxon> g0hww, if you go to Dl-client menu and refresh there
[09:15] <g0hww> btw, i have not bothered with CAT control, as the 8600mk2 is noisy on RS232
[09:15] <jcoxon> nah thats okay
[09:15] <g0hww> ah
[09:15] <g0hww> yeas
[09:15] <g0hww> Caught runtime error: Invalid response: bad key in row
[09:16] <jcoxon> hmmm
[09:16] UpuMobile_ (~UpuMobile@daveake.plus.com) left irc:
[09:16] <jcoxon> okay
[09:16] <jcoxon> https://github.com/danielrichman/dl-fldigi/issues/32
[09:16] <jcoxon> i worried this might happen
[09:16] <Upu_M0UPU> moving out back soon
[09:17] <Darkside> k
[09:17] <number10_M0MDB> what time islaunch Upu_M0UPU ?
[09:17] <number10_M0MDB> 10 ish still?
[09:17] <jcoxon> G0MJW, is that version working for you?
[09:17] <daveake> Setting off in 10 mins or so
[09:18] <daveake> Can't see this one being a quick launch :)
[09:18] <g0hww> ok, do i need to do anything with http://beta.habitat.habhub.org/genpayload mention in that ticket?
[09:18] <GMT> how many 'helpers' you got today Dave?
[09:19] <jcoxon> g0hww, give me a sec - i'm on the case about that
[09:20] <g0hww> jcoxon, no woriies
[09:20] <g0hww> damn my typing
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[09:22] <G0MJW> Hi James 3.21.50 is working now
[09:23] <jcoxon> g0hww, the simplest answer is to use https://github.com/danielrichman/dl-fldigi/tags
[09:23] <jcoxon> what you've got there is the new new version of dl-fldigi
[09:23] <g0hww> okey dokey
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[09:24] <jcoxon> but
[09:24] <jcoxon> lets try something...
[09:24] <g0hww> oops. better build it again, just did a make clean
[09:25] <jcoxon> !msh chanserv op #highaltitude
[09:25] <jcoxon> thats better
[09:25] <fsphil> forward slash?
[09:25] #highaltitude: mode change '+o jcoxon' by ChanServ!ChanServ@services.
[09:25] <GW8RAK> At last I'm starting to get something that looks like a decode. Thought something was broken.
[09:25] <jcoxon> oh yeah tahts a zeusbot command
[09:25] <jcoxon> g0hww, go for the clean build from that tag
[09:25] <jcoxon> it'll work quicker
[09:25] <g0hww> ok
[09:25] <G0MJW> Here is a thing - I am running it twice. The second copy is not giving azimuth an elevation yet the first is. Wierd.
[09:26] <jcoxon> i was thinking we could add the current payloads to the beta DB
[09:26] <fsphil> still a bit too low for me
[09:26] <jcoxon> but i'd need someone to activate it
[09:26] <G0MJW> Or is that a difference between Prom and Bob?
[09:30] <g0hww> jcoxon, that tag doesn't build for me: fatal error: jsoncpp.h: No such file or directory
[09:30] <g0hww> compilation terminated.
[09:30] <Darkside> oh god
[09:30] <Darkside> blame DanielRichman for that
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[09:31] <Darkside> g0hww: unfortunately, jsoncpp is not the same json lib you can get from the debian repos
[09:32] <g0hww> hmm, but the git tip built ok
[09:33] <g0hww> never mind no biggy
[09:33] <jcoxon> g0hww, could you use the available debs?
[09:33] <G0MJW> Jut looking for Truss - not visible here.
[09:34] <g0hww> configure seems happy though
[09:35] <g0hww> so, i might just as well run from the git tip, and forget about the database
[09:35] <jcoxon> g0hww, working now then?
[09:36] <g0hww> no, i fethched the tag and configure was happy, but didn't build. i guess configure doesn't figure out that there's a version mismatch
[09:36] Action: G7PMO-Kev-Home sits at home in the warm, waiting to see if I am going for a long trip to Dover, or a swim in the channel, or to France!
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[09:37] <jcoxon> g0hww, its a bit frustrating though, they have changed the server database for the new versions and haven't really provided a way to make it work
[09:37] <g0hww> lol
[09:37] <g0hww> that does sound a touch frustrating
[09:38] <jcoxon> the question is how far back to i need to go to get it working
[09:38] <jcoxon> and i think its teh subproject that is the problem
[09:38] <GMT> PMO-Kev - what are the last 2 values in the data stream, currently showing as '-11' and '-36'?
[09:39] <jcoxon> rather than dl-fldigi
[09:39] <G7PMO-Kev-Home> GMT - temps. internal and external
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[09:39] <GMT> thanks
[09:39] <G7PMO-Kev-Home> Internal is on the board next to the NTX, external is outside the payload
[09:40] <G7PMO-Kev-Home> on PROM temp is from the RFM22B temp sensor
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[09:48] <g0hww> i'm seeing something that looks a bit wider than the rtty modem and also looks quite unstable. i can see it in dl-fldigi, using an 8600mk2 and signalink-USB and with my USRP and gnuradio stuff
[09:48] <g0hww> on 434.167
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[09:49] <UpuMobile_> morning
[09:49] Nick change: UpuMobile_ -> UpuLaunchSite
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[09:49] <jcoxon> g0hww, thats probably it, about 480 hz shift?
[09:50] <fsphil> what frequency are these on?
[09:50] <fsphil> spacenear doesn't have it listed
[09:51] <UpuLaunchSite> TRUSS 434.225
[09:51] <UpuLaunchSite> ROCK 434.650
[09:51] <UpuLaunchSite> stream will be up shortly
[09:51] <g0hww> yep, abt 480
[09:51] <jcoxon> PROM is .167
[09:52] <fsphil> oh sorry spacenear does have it. just refreshed
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[09:54] <fsphil> what's BOB on?
[09:54] <UpuLaunchSite> ok stream up
[09:55] <G7PMO-Kev-Home> Bob started on 434.075Mhz
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[09:56] <g7ogxchris> heard it just now now gone..is tx interval big/
[09:56] <UpuLaunchSite> stream ok ?
[09:56] <G7PMO-Kev-Home> stream is good
[09:56] <UpuLaunchSite> super
[09:56] <G7PMO-Kev-Home> good fps
[09:57] <jcoxon> g7ogxchris, which are you listening for?
[09:57] <g7ogxchris> 434.074 usb
[09:57] <g7ogxchris> 075
[09:57] <fsphil> still a bit low here
[09:58] <g7ogxchris> stream m0upu
[09:58] <G7PMO-Kev-Home> $$BOB should be the more stable of the two
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[09:58] <jcoxon> for PROM there is only a short gap in telem
[09:59] <g7ogxchris> prom short gap cheers
[09:59] <jcoxon> i must be the closest station
[09:59] <jcoxon> thats a rarity
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[10:00] <fsphil> does BOB still transmit a carrier between strings?
[10:01] <number10_M0MDB> move in with dad jcoxon you would be the center of HAB
[10:01] <number10_M0MDB> yes fsphil
[10:01] <G7PMO-Kev-Home> fsphil - yes it does
[10:01] <fsphil> ta. I can see a wandering carrier, that might be it
[10:01] <jcoxon> number10_M0MDB, haha, i'd just end up launching all the time
[10:01] <jcoxon> so wouldn't be the centre at all
[10:02] <number10_M0MDB> lol
[10:02] <number10_M0MDB> that would be cool
[10:02] <fsphil> nothing wrong with launching all the time :)
[10:02] <g7ogxchris> intermittant high tone?
[10:02] <G7PMO-Kev-Home> fsphil - its about 2 seconds of carrier in between sentances
[10:02] <number10_M0MDB> just get a job at west suffolk
[10:02] <jcoxon> pah
[10:03] <jonsowman> morning all
[10:03] <fsphil> morning!
[10:04] <number10_M0MDB> looks like UpuLaunchSite is sending up some scaffolding
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[10:04] <g0hww> some screenshots of the signal i'm seeing http://www.g0hww.net/2012/12/high-altitude-balloon-tracking.html
[10:06] <jcoxon> g0hww, yeah thats it
[10:06] <jcoxon> you might find BOB easier
[10:06] <jcoxon> on .074 i think
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[10:06] <jcoxon> on dl-fldigi if you go to modems/ RTTY you can open up the filters a bit
[10:06] <G7PMO-Kev-Home> BOB has a better aerial
[10:06] <jcoxon> should help
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[10:07] <G0MJW> Right - after some fiddling I have two funcube dongles and a TS2000, 3 copies on DL-FL-Digh all running
[10:08] <g0hww> bob's way stronger. damn. forgot about bob
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[10:08] <g0hww> doesn't look like it will decode though
[10:08] <junderwood_M0JCU> Updated burst position. 30km altitude, north of Whitstable over the Thames estuary
[10:09] <g7ogxchris> nice set up gomjw
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[10:09] <GMT> Don't panic HWW, within the hour you'll have 3 others to track!
[10:09] <junderwood_M0JCU> If you get REALLY luck it could land in Kent
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[10:09] <G0MJW> 29% CPU use
[10:09] <g7ogxchris> nothing seen in sunny bognor
[10:09] <UpuLaunchSite> its made of paper tubes number10_M0MDB
[10:09] <UpuLaunchSite> quite light
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[10:09] <eroomde> you're in bognor g7ogxchris?
[10:10] <UpuLaunchSite> is anyone on the batc.tv stream answering q's ?
[10:10] <g7ogxchris> using pro plus here anyone using cheaper tv dongle?
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[10:10] <g7ogxchris> yes bognor regis God's waiting Room
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[10:11] <fsphil> g0hww: funcube dongle?
[10:11] <g0hww> should the signal be that much wider than the modem's red lines in dl-fldigi? it sounds loud enough to decode, and the scope looks pretty clean
[10:12] <GMT> I've got a £10 tv dongle, RTL-SDR
[10:12] <jcoxon> so BOB has a different shift to PROM
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[10:12] <g0hww> nope, ar8600mk2 for fldigi and a USRP/wbx for gqrx
[10:12] <fsphil> aaah the usrp
[10:12] <fsphil> I can't justify buying one :)
[10:12] <G0MJW> It would be useful to have a multi-carrier demodulator, then it would only need the one receive dongle
[10:13] <G0MJW> fsphil - buy two Pro+ FCDs instead.
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[10:13] <fsphil> the one will do for now :) I've got the new and old dongle
[10:14] <fsphil> and BOB has appeared on my waterfall
[10:14] <G7PMO-Kev-Home> junderwood_M0JCU - where are you doing predictions from John?
[10:14] <fsphil> very weak
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[10:14] <G7PMO-Kev-Home> fsphil - cool :)
[10:14] <G0MJW> Same as me. But the old Dongle has no case as I had to use the cae for the pro+.
[10:14] <fsphil> the shift is more like 560Hz than 600
[10:14] <junderwood_M0JCU> G7PMO-Home, my own predictor.
[10:15] <g0hww> i've put a couple of screenies of bob up now on the same page
[10:15] <junderwood_M0JCU> it's usually good providing you know the ballistic coefficient (or sea level rate of descent)
[10:15] <junderwood_M0JCU> ... and burst altitude
[10:16] <junderwood_M0JCU> It's been remarkably constant today. The only change in prediction was due to the increase in rate of ascent
[10:17] <G7PMO-Kev-Home> ta
[10:17] <jcoxon> PROM has got very wavey
[10:17] <junderwood_M0JCU> .. but still decoding nicely
[10:17] <G7PMO-Kev-Home> I ran the cusf predictor at 5am today and it should be landing N of Cambridge! The Wind didnt listen to the predictor :)
[10:17] <g0hww> i've got an rtl dongle up in the loft hoovering up ADSB data
[10:17] <junderwood_M0JCU> Hmm. I think it must have old gribs
[10:17] <fsphil> planesnear.us? :)
[10:18] <G0MJW> I have a couple of RTL dongles. Keep meaning to attach them to a PI and do something similar. Rountuit isue
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[10:18] <number10_M0MDB> G7PMO-Kev-Home: if you run predicitions this morning over several possible launch times you will see that it was going to change at some point
[10:18] <junderwood_M0JCU> and your rate of ascent being low will also screw things up
[10:18] <mclane> junderwood_M0JCU: I would be interested in your predictor
[10:19] <G7PMO-Kev-Home> number10_M0MDB - indeed, combination of wind changed sooner than predicted and under inflation...
[10:19] <mclane> we had some strange experience with the CUSF predictor
[10:19] <junderwood_M0JCU> one of these days I plan to release in as open source. Just not got round to it.
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[10:19] <junderwood_M0JCU> (and it is nowhere near clean enough yet)
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[10:19] <g0hww> bob is certainly loud enough to decode. which modem should i be using
[10:20] <G7PMO-Kev-Home> I dont know why ascent is soo slow, I checked my calcs and had more lift than I thought I needed
[10:20] <jcoxon> RTTY, 50BAUD, ascii-7, no parity, 2 stop
[10:20] <G7PMO-Kev-Home> My Plan was : 500g Balloon, 600g payload all in, needs a neck lift of 1.23kg to achieve an ascent rate of 4.9m/s, which will give a burst altitude of 26,488 Meters, after 90 mins. It will need 1.7m3 of Helium. My filling adapter, with 40cm of hose, weighs 0.35kg, therefore my additional neck weight to judge free lift for launch needs to be 1.23kg - 0.35kg = 0.88kg
[10:21] <g0hww> HAB-50?
[10:21] <jcoxon> g0hww, you'll need custom settings
[10:21] <g0hww> ah
[10:21] <jcoxon> as your dl-fldigi isn't chatting with the server properly
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[10:21] <fsphil> in the all-payloads list, you should still see BOB
[10:21] <fsphil> dl client -> configure -> dl client -> all payloads
[10:21] <fsphil> it's listed on mine as G7PMO $$Bob
[10:22] <jcoxon> fsphil, the problem is that g0hww is using the latest git
[10:22] <jcoxon> which is using the new cpp-connector
[10:22] <fsphil> I am too
[10:22] <jcoxon> which requires the new database it seems
[10:22] <jcoxon> which BOB isn't on
[10:22] <G0MJW> At this Rate Bob is going to Belgium or France
[10:22] <fsphil> hmm.. it shouldn't be on my list either
[10:22] <fsphil> it might have cached it
[10:22] <jcoxon> need to talk with DanielRichman
[10:23] <G7PMO-Kev-Home> Is http://spacenear.us/tracker/ working for anyone?
[10:23] <jcoxon> try http://track.spacenear.us/
[10:23] <junderwood_M0JCU> http://track.spacenear.us/
[10:24] <d0wnl0rd> junderwood_M0JCU, mclane: and that's mildly put - it was way off with even the very latest data the last two times
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[10:24] <G7PMO-Kev-Home> I can't resolve dns for track.spacenear.us
[10:24] NickF (027bc91d@gateway/web/freenode/ip.2.123.201.29) joined #highaltitude.
[10:24] <jcoxon> there is an argument to say that its related to data rather than the predictor
[10:25] <G0MJW> Just nipping out to the shop
[10:25] <fsphil> track.spacenear.us has address 46.137.178.45
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[10:26] <g0hww> ok, its decoding now
[10:26] <junderwood_M0JCU> fsphil, that probably won't work for http
[10:26] <G7PMO-Kev-Home> ta fsphil, that works
[10:26] <junderwood_M0JCU> wow!
[10:26] <fsphil> lol
[10:26] <fsphil> still too weak to decode here
[10:26] <fsphil> getting partial strings
[10:26] <G7PMO-Kev-Home> not using HTTP1.1 host headers, as it does work :)
[10:26] Nick change: fsphil -> fsphil_MI0VIM
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[10:27] <fsphil_MI0VIM> even if that didn't, you could add it to hosts as a last resort
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[10:27] <junderwood_M0JCU> true
[10:27] <fsphil_MI0VIM> nice collection of receivers in .nl
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[10:27] <g0hww> bad checksums though, something not quite right
[10:27] <d0wnl0rd> Anyone having prediction paths on the tracker for bob/prom?
[10:28] <jcoxon> towards margate then out over the channel
[10:28] <jcoxon> depends greatly on burst alt
[10:28] <fsphil_MI0VIM> if it bursts now it could make land
[10:29] <junderwood_M0JCU> any time in the next 10 minutes or so is OK for land. After that ...
[10:29] <d0wnl0rd> Otherwise you would have to rely on help from the continent :-)
[10:30] <jcoxon> d0wnl0rd, they've often stepped up to help
[10:30] <jcoxon> :-)
[10:30] <fsphil_MI0VIM> the luckiest ever landing was in .nl
[10:31] <fsphil_MI0VIM> jcoxon might have the picture :)
[10:31] <d0wnl0rd> You would have to beat some records that we might step in (bavaria, germany)
[10:31] <g0hww> what is bobs shift? i've using 560
[10:31] <fsphil_MI0VIM> 560 here too
[10:31] <x-f> was the ascent rate on PROM/BOB intended to be so low or something didn't go according to the plan?
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[10:32] <G7PMO-Kev-Home> x-f - the plan was 5m/s!
[10:32] <jcoxon> d0wnl0rd, http://www.flickr.com/photos/jcoxon77/4383328360/in/set-72157623226106480
[10:33] <x-f> oh
[10:33] <G7PMO-Kev-Home> x-f : 500g Balloon, 600g payload all in, needs a neck lift of 1.23kg to achieve an ascent rate of 4.9m/s, which will give a burst altitude of 26,488 Meters, after 90 mins. It will need 1.7m3 of Helium. My filling adapter, with 40cm of hose, weighs 0.35kg, therefore my additional neck weight to judge free lift for launch needs to be 1.23kg - 0.35kg = 0.88kg
[10:33] <G7PMO-Kev-Home> x-f if you can spot a problem, let me know :)
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[10:34] <x-f> G7PMO-Kev-Home, fingers crossed it lands on the land somewhere
[10:34] <d0wnl0rd> jcoxon: We had to overcome this challenge the last time: http://www.pirnay.com/index.php/m-missionen/m-pysy3/mnu-landung
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[10:35] <G7PMO-Kev-Home> x-f - indeed, s my firat balloon with camer and video camera on board as well as 2 trackers, land would be nice :)
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[10:35] <fsphil_MI0VIM> that looks familiar d0wnl0rd :)
[10:35] <jcoxon> d0wnl0rd, hehe
[10:35] <number10_M0MDB> you have camera on it G7PMO-Kev-Home ?
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[10:36] <fsphil_MI0VIM> d0wnl0rd: http://www.flickr.com/photos/fsphil/5821005077/in/set-72157626013096240
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[10:37] <g0hww> bobs getting much weaker with me now
[10:37] <G7PMO-Kev-Home> number10_M0MDB - yea, an 808 #16 and a Powershot A810
[10:37] <number10_M0MDB> oh thats a shame -= I am not sure I would have risked it seen as the winds were showing such a change
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[10:38] <jcoxon> its not over yet!
[10:38] <G7PMO-Kev-Home> yea, hindsight is a wonderfull thing :)
[10:38] <G7PMO-Kev-Home> jcoxon - :)
[10:38] <number10_M0MDB> :)
[10:38] <junderwood_M0JCU> G7PMO-Home, do you have a passport?
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[10:39] <G7PMO-Kev-Home> M0JCU - If it lands in a foreign country I would be pleased right now....
[10:39] <junderwood_M0JCU> :)
[10:40] <g0hww> and bob is now much stronger, got a green line :)
[10:40] <fsphil_MI0VIM> nothing near a full string here yet
[10:40] <g0hww> $$BOB,806,10:40:18,51.477829,0.817340,28370,12,4270,-1,-26*C685
[10:41] <jcoxon> urgh dirty data
[10:41] <g0hww> $$BOB,809,10:41:06,51.477139,0.839910,28566,12,4238,-1,-26*D919
[10:41] <g0hww> got a green line again
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[10:41] <SP9UOB> hi all
[10:41] <x-f> hi, SP9UOB
[10:42] <Dutch-Mill> loads of green lines here
[10:42] <SP9UOB> freq for BOB/PROM
[10:42] <SP9UOB> ?
[10:42] <number10_M0MDB> 434.07566 for bob SP9UOB
[10:42] <g0hww> bob 434.075
[10:42] <Dutch-Mill> BOB lines
[10:43] <SP9UOB> Dutch-Mill: You Should saw my HF ballon 45 listeners :-)
[10:43] <SP9UOB> number10_M0MDB: thanks, ill setup my funcube dongle
[10:44] <junderwood_M0JCU> G7PMO-Home, if it doesn't burst in the next couple of minutes, you need to get to 38km to land in Ostend
[10:44] <g0hww> jcoxon, why do you say "dirty data"?
[10:44] <jcoxon> not your data
[10:44] <Dutch-Mill> Most hams like HF ;-)
[10:44] <g0hww> phew
[10:44] <jcoxon> on the map a rogue point has got through
[10:44] <g0hww> eek
[10:44] <g0hww> oh yeah
[10:44] <jcoxon> its cause the server was moved to accomadate extra load
[10:45] bbd020 (516671d5@gateway/web/freenode/ip.81.102.113.213) joined #highaltitude.
[10:45] <jcoxon> and some of the little scripts to avoid that had to be left behind
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[10:45] <g0hww> shit happens
[10:45] <jcoxon> indeed
[10:45] <jcoxon> we'll swtich back after today
[10:45] joph (~joph@2607:f358:1:fed5:22:46ab:47ee:35a9) joined #highaltitude.
[10:45] <jcoxon> and all will be happy agan
[10:45] <jcoxon> again*
[10:46] <junderwood_M0JCU> burst
[10:46] <x-f> G7PMO-Kev-Home, calculations seem right, that's the same i would do on my launch, unless the helium was very mixed with air, or the balloon lifted the fill hose only partially, or the balloon has a leak (but not in this case, obviously)
[10:46] <G7PMO-Kev-Home> :)
[10:46] <junderwood_M0JCU> Fingers crossed
[10:46] <Dutch-Mill> Morning James is there a Rest API for the tracker?
[10:46] <number10_M0MDB> burst
[10:47] <Dutch-Mill> Yep
[10:47] <jcoxon> its spinning
[10:47] <jcoxon> very quickly
[10:47] <junderwood_M0JCU> It's going to be VERY close. Somewhere near Sandwich if it comes down quickly enough
[10:48] <junderwood_M0JCU> ... somewhere off Deal if it doesn't
[10:50] <G7PMO-Kev-Home> gosh this is so many mixed emotions :)
[10:50] <junderwood_M0JCU> I think you may just get away with it
[10:50] <costyn> morning
[10:50] <SP9UOB> hi costyn
[10:51] <G7PMO-Kev-Home> morning
[10:51] <costyn> so many payloads on the tracker I ddint' see on the mailing list? PROM? BOB?
[10:51] <costyn> TRUSS?
[10:51] Action: costyn is confused
[10:51] <fsphil_MI0VIM> hah
[10:51] <fsphil_MI0VIM> same here
[10:51] <G7PMO-Kev-Home> PROM & BOB are on 1 balloon, just burst
[10:52] <costyn> G7PMO-Kev-Home: yours?
[10:52] <SP9UOB> are there still alive ?
[10:52] <x-f> bob and prom were on the mailing list twice :)
[10:52] <SP9UOB> BOB
[10:52] <SP9UOB> Time: 2012-12-01 08:44:52
[10:52] <G7PMO-Kev-Home> costyn - yes, first flight, about to land very close to / in the sea :)
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[10:52] <number10_M0MDB> yes SP9UOB, I am still receiving bob
[10:53] <jcoxon> prom is not happy
[10:53] <UpuLaunchSite> filling
[10:53] <costyn> G7PMO-Kev-Home: ah ok... then I just wasn't paying attention to the payload names. I remember your email
[10:53] <jcoxon> prom has gone it seems
[10:53] <gonzo___> spacenearus having probs?
[10:53] <hackvana> UpuLaunchSite: All the best mate from Hackvana!
[10:54] <G7PMO-Kev-Home> prom had a crap aerial,
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[10:55] <G7PMO-Kev-Home> gonzo - yes, try http://46.137.178.45/
[10:55] <jcoxon> or try track.spacenear.us
[10:56] <gonzo___> thanks both
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[10:56] <junderwood_M0JCU> G7PMO-Home, predicted landing point is moving inland. I think you're going to be lucky.
[10:57] <jcoxon> G7PMO-Kev-Home, sadly i don't live in kent anylonger
[10:57] <jcoxon> or i could of collected for you
[10:58] <G7PMO-Kev-Home> jcoxon - thanks for the thought :)
[10:59] <G7PMO-Kev-Home> It is def heading South,,,,,,
[11:00] <G7PMO-Kev-Home> im in the edge of my flippin seat :)
[11:00] <fsphil_MI0VIM> eep
[11:00] <fsphil_MI0VIM> I needa head out too
[11:00] Action: fsphil_MI0VIM tries to press pause
[11:01] <costyn> G7PMO-Kev-Home: exciting :)
[11:01] <costyn> why is there no live prediction?
[11:01] <g0hww> what is ROCKS frequency?
[11:01] <jcoxon> costyn, the server has been moved so prediction isn't setup currently
[11:02] <costyn> ah ok
[11:02] <costyn> does make it more exciting :)
[11:02] <jcoxon> old school
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[11:03] <x-f> from BATC chat: "01/12 11:03 g3xvabr : Two guys doing all the work, four managers standing around. How unusual..."
[11:04] <fsphil_MI0VIM> well, technically they're all standing around doing nothing :)
[11:04] <G7PMO-Kev-Home> so it is going to make land, but will it overshoot....
[11:05] <jcoxon> G7PMO-how effective is your parachute is the question
[11:05] NAN (51938ef3@gateway/web/freenode/ip.81.147.142.243) joined #highaltitude.
[11:05] <jcoxon> landfall
[11:05] <junderwood_M0JCU> Current predictions show it landing near Sandwich.
[11:05] Nick change: NAN -> Guest68829
[11:05] <junderwood_M0JCU> on the beach
[11:05] <fsphil_MI0VIM> looking good
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[11:06] <x-f> tension grows
[11:06] <fsphil_MI0VIM> the dog can wait a few minutes for his walk
[11:07] <G7PMO-Kev-Home> Im grinning like a cheshire cat and shaking like a leaf at the same time here :)
[11:07] <junderwood_M0JCU> Estimated landing time 11:32
[11:08] <pseudonoise> Hi has the LOHAN test launched what freq should I listen to G!PVZ
[11:09] <junderwood_M0JCU> Correction. Landing at 11:24 between Sandwich and Deal.
[11:09] <g0hww> i'm on 434.075
[11:10] <fsphil_MI0VIM> pseudonoise: it's about to land
[11:10] <fsphil_MI0VIM> or splash
[11:10] <junderwood_M0JCU> Is the tide in? :)
[11:10] <fsphil_MI0VIM> looking like land
[11:10] <junderwood_M0JCU> fsphil_MI0VIM, it's going to be REALLY close
[11:11] <fsphil_MI0VIM> the worst thing is, there are no receivers in the immediate area
[11:11] <junderwood_M0JCU> it should swing to the east again
[11:11] <fsphil_MI0VIM> will we even know?
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[11:11] <junderwood_M0JCU> should be line of sight from Callais
[11:11] <junderwood_M0JCU> s/Callais/Calais/
[11:11] <pseudonoise> ok I cant see it on spacenearus
[11:11] <g7ogxchris> receiving RTTY on 434.078 NJNJ2:V26&€Ä:8:>:>N*:F2>:6N:F66&6>N&2>*N::N.:2NJ:>NJ2>Vf.€Ä:N:::>6&N*:F2>&.N:F662.>N&:"N::N.:2NJ:>NJ2>V2&¹D6>N:::>.6N*:F2>.:>N:F626**>N&>":N::N.:2NJ:>NJ2>V€Ä6:N:::>
[11:12] <g7ogxchris> is this Rock?????
[11:12] <G0MJW> Very trong of coure
[11:12] <gonzo___> looks like wrong baud rate
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[11:12] <gonzo___> 50bd, 7n1
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[11:12] <g7ogxchris> ok cheers gonzo
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[11:13] <mfa298_> UpuLaunchSite: video stream appears to have frozen
[11:13] UpuLaunchSite (~UpuMobile@94.197.127.58.threembb.co.uk) joined #highaltitude.
[11:13] <gonzo___> (actually it's 7n2, but seting 1 stop is prob better for rx)
[11:13] <UpuLaunchSite> sorry
[11:13] <g7ogxchris> 600 Hz shift?
[11:13] <G0MJW> No ign of Spear though
[11:13] <UpuLaunchSite> lost wireless as we went into the field
[11:13] <G0MJW> 500-600
[11:14] <g0hww> 560 was good for me
[11:14] <g7ogxchris> teak it till lines up
[11:15] <g0hww> is bob about to land?
[11:15] <fsphil_MI0VIM> yep
[11:15] <costyn> still got a while to go
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[11:15] <mfa298_> UpuLaunchSite: the masses watching were getting restless.
[11:15] Nick change: Hawkeye -> Guest93163
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[11:16] <junderwood_M0JCU> Oh dear. Prediction is moving offshore :(
[11:16] <fsphil_MI0VIM> noooo
[11:16] <g0hww> and prom hasn't been tracked for 30 mins?
[11:16] <fsphil_MI0VIM> I think it died
[11:17] <g0hww> ah
[11:17] <g0hww> poor PROM
[11:18] <costyn> looks like it's gonna get wet
[11:18] <GMT> I'm loosing sigs from BOB, now switching to one of DaveAke's recent launches
[11:18] <G7PMO-Kev-Home> PROM was in a bag half way down the line, between parachute and BOB, it may have got eaten in the spinning
[11:18] <fsphil_MI0VIM> turning south east
[11:18] <costyn> although the wind at ground level is almost south
[11:19] <junderwood_M0JCU> prediction 1km off shore
[11:19] <jcoxon> where has spears gone?
[11:19] <G7PMO-Kev-Home> all final sentences from $$BOB appreciated....
[11:19] <costyn> G7PMO-Kev-Home: I think our French friends are our best bet
[11:19] <junderwood_M0JCU> I'vost it
[11:20] <costyn> f5apq: you still gettin git?
[11:20] <number10_M0MDB> its really quite annoying when you track and upload but it doesnt appear on spacenear
[11:20] <costyn> err.. getting it?
[11:20] <fsphil_MI0VIM> you are appearing number10_M0MDB
[11:20] <number10_M0MDB> yes just now
[11:20] <number10_M0MDB> but previously not
[11:21] <fsphil_MI0VIM> not looking good
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[11:22] <GW8RAK> What frequency is Truss on please?
[11:22] <fsphil_MI0VIM> 434.225MHz according to spacenear
[11:23] <GW8RAK> Thanks Phil
[11:23] <g7ogxchris> rock has dissapeared
[11:23] <junderwood_M0JCU> G7PMO-Home, hard luck. I thought you were going to get away with it for a while then
[11:23] <fsphil_MI0VIM> and it's over the water
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[11:23] <x-f> :/
[11:23] <G7PMO-Kev-Home> Indeed, cheers guys...
[11:24] bob__ (b0f9adbb@gateway/web/freenode/ip.176.249.173.187) joined #highaltitude.
[11:24] <G7PMO-Kev-Home> could always wash up and get found
[11:24] <UpuLaunchSite> Kevs in the drink :(
[11:24] <fsphil_MI0VIM> indeed
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[11:24] <costyn> G7PMO-Kev-Home: I assume you were planning on retrieving it?
[11:24] <UpuLaunchSite> all the cool people land in the sea
[11:24] <fsphil_MI0VIM> lol
[11:24] <costyn> UpuLaunchSite: haha
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[11:24] <G0MJW> Where is Bobs freq - I forget and los Prom
[11:25] <fsphil_MI0VIM> some nice tracking from france
[11:25] <costyn> G0MJW: Bob is gone
[11:25] <Darkside> ahh i see i'm not too late
[11:25] <costyn> G0MJW: watery grave and all that
[11:25] test_ (d57bebe5@gateway/web/freenode/ip.213.123.235.229) joined #highaltitude.
[11:25] <G0MJW> Frequency - Darn it I lost a packet from TRUSS moving the antenna
[11:25] <number10_M0MDB> lost it http://track.spacenear.us/
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[11:26] <number10_M0MDB> $BOB,974,1:25:06,521789,1.41653,460,12,026,-3,0*5D6
[11:26] <G7PMO-Kev-Home> costyn - were being the operative word
[11:26] <Koolibah> Truss is gone
[11:27] <gonzo___> bit too far out for it to float back on the tides in a sensible time
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[11:28] <G0MJW> Found Bob 215
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[11:31] <UpuLaunchSite> daves magical mystery tour has begun
[11:31] <UpuLaunchSite> oops
[11:31] <Darkside> lol
[11:31] <Darkside> magical mystery tour...
[11:32] <Darkside> yup turning off the stream
[11:32] <Darkside> not worth it
[11:32] <hitman> hi guys , did u manage to launch?
[11:32] Action: g0hww nips ip to 435.850 for the FO-29 pass
[11:32] <hitman> im jsut abt to start tracking
[11:32] <g0hww> nips up, even
[11:32] <hitman> jst
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[11:35] <Darkside> hmm
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[11:40] <craag> LOL at bsod!
[11:40] <UpuLaunchSite> Dave's car PC just dropped dead
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[11:40] <UpuLaunchSite> never said this before
[11:40] <Darkside> uh oh
[11:40] <UpuLaunchSite> just pulling over to reboot
[11:41] <UpuLaunchSite> can someone delete that naff position from the db if poss thx
[11:41] <jcoxon> its already gone
[11:42] <jcoxon> ages ago
[11:42] <UpuLaunchSite> thx
[11:43] <x-f> UpuLaunchSite, any chance on running the chasecar app there?
[11:43] <UpuLaunchSite> trying
[11:43] <x-f> nice
[11:43] <UpuLaunchSite> should be on
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[11:45] <x-f> it is, thank you
[11:46] <G0MJW> Soon got to Alton.
[11:47] <g0hww> ok, what is that on 434.225? shift, etc. please?
[11:47] <G0MJW> Truss. 100 baud Ascii 7 bit
[11:47] <number10_M0MDB> 450 shift 7N2 100baud
[11:47] <G0MJW> 500Hz shift
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[11:49] <g0hww> ok, thanks
[11:49] <g0hww> i just spotted it in the 1MHz chunk of spectrum i'm monitoring, when i came back from listening to FO-29
[11:50] <fsphil_MI0VIM> shifts are rarely as advertised
[11:50] <UpuLaunchSite> cold and all that
[11:50] <SP9UOB> another crazy tracker ;-) http://sp9uob.verox.pl/balon/tracker-50MHz.jpg - 50.800 MHz 500 mW RTTY tracker - pcb layout by SP9IZM :-)
[11:51] <g0hww> decoding truss nicely now
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[11:51] <Darkside> SP9UOB: could get some nice ducting with that
[11:52] <UpuLaunchSite> now
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[11:55] <SP9UOB> Darkside: I build it to test 100g kaymont balloons - i tave 10 of them
[11:55] <SP9UOB> have
[11:55] <SP9UOB> tracker with batteries weight 90 grams
[11:56] <SP9UOB> cheapet than medium pizza ;-)
[11:56] <SP9UOB> cheaper
[11:56] <fsphil_MI0VIM> mmmm
[11:56] <fsphil_MI0VIM> pizza with bacon
[11:57] <jcoxon> where is this going to land?
[11:57] <f5apq> <costyn>sorry i was not in the shack. I should prefer chase the balloon in France
[11:58] jim (5244226e@gateway/web/freenode/ip.82.68.34.110) joined #highaltitude.
[11:58] <number10_M0MDB> that looks good SP9UOB
[11:59] <SP9UOB> fsphil_MI0VIM: 3 minutes by feet from my flat: http://www.pizzeriavinci.pl/strona/index.php?option=com_content&view=article&id=99&Itemid=104 Bring You some ;-) ?
[11:59] Nick change: jim -> Guest4727
[11:59] <fsphil_MI0VIM> bit more than three minutes from here :)
[11:59] <fsphil_MI0VIM> that looks like a really nice spot
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[12:00] <SP9UOB> fsphil_MI0VIM: my record from here to London by car is 17 hours :-)
[12:01] <fsphil_MI0VIM> we don't have a tunnel from here annoyingly, and the ferry is stupidly expensive
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[12:03] <fsphil_MI0VIM> but I did get from poland to london in about 1.5 hours, with the help of an Airbus A580 :)
[12:03] <SP9UOB> fsphil_MI0VIM: Pizza is delicious, but potato pancakes with stew (Hungarian Cake?) is awesome !
[12:03] <SP9UOB> fsphil_MI0VIM: cheater ;-)
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[12:04] <fsphil_MI0VIM> potatoe pancakes. sounds a bit like potato bread that we have here
[12:04] <hackvana> fsphil_MI0VIM: Airbus A580? Now I have device envy
[12:04] <fsphil_MI0VIM> goes well with a fried egg and bacon
[12:05] <SP9UOB> fsphil_MI0VIM: about 5 hours by little Cessna - im planning to do the licence in 2013 :-)
[12:05] <fsphil_MI0VIM> or A380 even. I get my numbers mixed up
[12:05] <fsphil_MI0VIM> ah sweet SP9UOB
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[12:05] <fsphil_MI0VIM> I did a lesson once, would love to do more but probably not gonna happen
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[12:06] <SP9UOB> fsphil_MI0VIM: why?
[12:06] <fsphil_MI0VIM> never have the time
[12:07] <SP9UOB> fsphil_MI0VIM: just like me, but im planning to do the licence since high school :-)
[12:07] <x-f> it's not the lack of time, it's the wrong priorities :)
[12:07] <SP9UOB> x-f: right :-)
[12:07] <fsphil_MI0VIM> lol
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[12:08] <SP9UOB> fsphil_MI0VIM: thats what we call "Hungarian pancake" https://www.google.pl/search?hl=pl&newwindow=1&safe=off&q=placek+po+w%C4%99giersku+po+angielsku&bav=on.2,or.r_gc.r_pw.r_cp.r_qf.&bpcl=39314241&biw=1918&bih=1000&pdl=300&um=1&ie=UTF-8&tbm=isch&source=og&sa=N&tab=wi&ei=8_G5UJDKHaGL4AS__IGgAw
[12:09] <SP9UOB> i dont know why hungarian
[12:09] <SP9UOB> but is delicious :-)
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[12:10] <fsphil_MI0VIM> hey that does look good
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[12:10] <number10_M0MDB> latkes are nice too https://www.google.co.uk/search?q=latkes&hl=en&client=firefox-a&hs=WYS&sa=X&tbo=u&rls=org.mozilla:en-GB:official&tbm=isch&source=univ&ei=rfO5UL_7EMfY0QWJzYCgBg&ved=0CFMQsAQ&biw=899&bih=307
[12:11] <G7TXU> I'm not showing on the map, what should I check for guys ?
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[12:11] <jcoxon> G7TXU, make sure you've put in your lat, lon and altitude
[12:11] <jcoxon> and that the client is online
[12:11] <SP9UOB> number10_M0MDB: thats regular potato pancakes - also good :-)
[12:12] <number10_M0MDB> what are they called in polish SP9UOB ?
[12:12] <UpuLaunchSite> chase car tracker broke again
[12:12] <SP9UOB> number10_M0MDB: Placek ziemniaczany
[12:12] <SP9UOB> https://www.google.co.uk/search?q=latkes&hl=en&client=firefox-a&hs=WYS&sa=X&tbo=u&rls=org.mozilla:en-GB:official&tbm=isch&source=univ&ei=rfO5UL_7EMfY0QWJzYCgBg&ved=0CFMQsAQ&biw=899&bih=307#hl=en&client=firefox-a&hs=7u7&tbo=d&rls=org.mozilla:en-GB%3Aofficial&tbm=isch&sa=1&q=placek+zniemniaczany&oq=placek+zniemniaczany&gs_l=img.3...2006.2827.2.3862.2.2.0.0.0.0.287.506.2-2.2.0...0.0...1c.1.SCXBrk0GI0g&pbx=1&bav=on.2,or.r_gc.r_pw.r_qf.&fp=999bd3f23a7d907&b
[12:12] <G7TXU> I've put in 50.8448 -0.09490 for lication and my Maidenhead for Locator
[12:13] <fsphil_MI0VIM> google have uselessly big urls now
[12:13] <g0hww> i've been putting screenshots up here as i'm not getting to feed the server: http://www.g0hww.net/2012/12/high-altitude-balloon-tracking.html
[12:13] <SP9UOB> ok im little bit hungry by now :-)
[12:13] <G7TXU> I'm online under DL Client and Habitat
[12:13] <hackvana> fsphil_MI0VIM: There's a button to use goo.gl to shorten the link
[12:14] <number10_M0MDB> I cook them with bacon pieces in SP9UOB
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[12:14] <jcoxon> G7TXU, it can sometimes take a bit of time to upload the coords
[12:15] <jcoxon> often quicker to close and restart dl-fldigi
[12:15] <hackvana> Will you just stop? How am I going to get stuff like that in China? http://capn.blogspot.com/2012/01/cravings.html
[12:15] <fsphil_MI0VIM> hackvana: where abouts?
[12:15] <SP9UOB> number10_M0MDB: i must try - sounds good :-)
[12:16] <fsphil_MI0VIM> I'm really hungry now :(
[12:16] <hackvana> Shenzhen. Those two lovely black PCBs aboard LOHAN passed through my hands :-)
[12:16] <fsphil_MI0VIM> ooh, I have chocolate digestives
[12:16] <UpuLaunchSite> looks like we are getting a boat to recover this one
[12:16] <jcoxon> hackvana, very nice work!
[12:16] <fsphil_MI0VIM> I'm making a pcb at the moment, you'll probably end up getting that hackvana
[12:16] <hackvana> There's a boat?
[12:16] <UpuLaunchSite> not yet there isn't
[12:16] <Darkside> i think this is where a cutdown would be useful
[12:16] <hackvana> fsphil_MI0VIM: I'd say use me, but I'm biased.
[12:17] <hackvana> I'd say ask Upu, but I've programmed him to be biased too :-)
[12:17] <fsphil_MI0VIM> it's upu's fault
[12:17] <hackvana> It always is.
[12:17] <fsphil_MI0VIM> I've never done a pcb the entire way through, so if you see a dodgey one it's probably mine
[12:18] <hackvana> Every one you make will be better than the last. We all started somewhere. Enjoy the journey.
[12:18] <fsphil_MI0VIM> indeed
[12:18] <hackvana> Anyway, if we're to talk PCBs, better not clutter up #highaltitude. You're welcome to hop over to #hackvana
[12:18] <hackvana> "As lurked in by Upu!"
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[12:20] <fsphil_MI0VIM> getting the odd bit of data from truss
[12:20] <fsphil_MI0VIM> nothing that resembles a full string
[12:21] <fsphil_MI0VIM> burst?
[12:21] <UpuLaunchSite> burst
[12:21] <Darkside> yup
[12:21] <fsphil_MI0VIM> ah well
[12:22] <G0MJW> Burst - was that on purpoe?
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[12:23] <hackvana> jcoxon: Thank you.
[12:23] <g0hww> is that doppler due to a scarey descent i see? the signals wobbling like mad
[12:23] <Darkside> g0hww: more likely temp variations
[12:24] <Darkside> you'll only see that kind of doppler if you're directly under the payload
[12:24] <G0MJW> Hardly had to retune Roll, Truss is all over the place
[12:24] <hackvana> Darkside: hi!
[12:24] <Darkside> evening hackvana
[12:24] <hackvana> :-)
[12:24] <fsphil_MI0VIM> yea it's Darkside's fault too
[12:24] <g0hww> its ROLL i'm looking at
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[12:26] <G0MJW> Parachute seems to be working
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[12:30] <squire_pug> everyone idling ?
[12:30] <joph> no no
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[12:31] <squire_pug> just seems that way :-)
[12:31] <joph> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FshkO8HqQ10
[12:33] <jcoxon> fsphil_MI0VIM, you know when we were working on APRS on an atmega328
[12:33] <junderwood_M0JCU> Looks like another seaside landing in prospect.
[12:33] <jcoxon> do you remember which pin we ended up using
[12:33] <jcoxon> junderwood_M0JCU, i was thinking that too
[12:33] <junderwood_M0JCU> I wonder which side of the coast this time
[12:33] <jcoxon> i'm thinking watery
[12:33] <GMT> I'm still (mostly) decoding TRUSS and uploading
[12:33] <fsphil_MI0VIM> it was PD7 on my atmega644p jcoxon
[12:33] <fsphil_MI0VIM> although something tells me it was different for you
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[12:34] <jcoxon> https://github.com/jamescoxon/Eurus/blob/master/2mTracker/Combo/Combo.ino#L569 suggests its pin 11
[12:34] <jcoxon> what do you think?
[12:35] <G0MJW> Have you got APRS working on the Arduino then Jame?
[12:35] <fsphil_MI0VIM> whichever pin has the OC2A or OC2B output
[12:36] <junderwood_M0JCU> Bad news folks. Should be a nice view of splashdown from Worthing
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[12:36] <jcoxon> G0MJW, yeah
[12:36] <jcoxon> but others have done it before to tell the truth
[12:36] <Darkside> we fly it often
[12:36] <Darkside> the trackuino codebase works pretty well
[12:36] <G0MJW> Receive?
[12:36] <Darkside> no, not RX
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[12:36] <G0MJW> Oh. Was hopeful
[12:36] <jcoxon> there is arduino code for a tnc
[12:36] <jcoxon> but its not open
[12:37] <Darkside> mm
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[12:37] <Darkside> we have had plans for a flying digipeater for a while
[12:37] <Darkside> but we havent had time to do it
[12:37] <jcoxon> https://sites.google.com/site/ki4mcw/Home/arduino-tnc
[12:37] <Darkside> mm
[12:37] <Darkside> we were going to use the opentracker stuff
[12:37] <G0MJW> I am still trying to implment a BPSK modem.
[12:38] <Darkside> ok sleep time for me
[12:38] <Darkside> night
[12:38] <junderwood_M0JCU> 6.5 km off Worthing. Splash
[12:39] <jcoxon> to make the best of a bad situation
[12:39] <fsphil_MI0VIM> which avr is it jcoxon?
[12:39] <jcoxon> ROCK should work in the sea
[12:39] <jcoxon> atmega328
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[12:40] <SP9UOB> jcoxon: line 472 "!/%s%sO /A=%06ld|%s|",
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[12:40] Nick change: jim -> Guest69889
[12:40] <G0MJW> Geting weaker - not a good direction for me.
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[12:40] <SP9UOB> jcoxon: i dont know avr gcc but i think altitude should be unsigned
[12:40] <SP9UOB> jcoxon: long :-)
[12:40] <fsphil_MI0VIM> pin 17 on the avr
[12:41] <G0MJW> Not if you launch from the Netherlands
[12:41] <fsphil_MI0VIM> the arduino pin will be different
[12:41] <jcoxon> fsphil_MI0VIM, http://arduino.cc/en/Hacking/PinMapping
[12:41] <fsphil_MI0VIM> yes, pin 11
[12:41] <SP9UOB> G0MJW: lol :-)
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[12:42] <fsphil_MI0VIM> right, bbl - heading out for some food. good luck with the recovery guys!
[12:42] <UpuLaunchSite> thx Phil
[12:42] <jcoxon> 100km/h
[12:42] <jcoxon> eek!
[12:42] <G7TXU> jcoxon, should I be entering my coords in the banner at the top of dl-fldigi ? I can't enter any data there, it won't let me. TRUSS heading straight at me and getting quite strong now
[12:43] <UpuLaunchSite> we could do with tracking as close to the ground as possible as we are likely to have to get a boat
[12:43] <jcoxon> G7TXU, go to dl-client menu
[12:43] <jcoxon> and select configure
[12:43] <junderwood_M0JCU> over the beach
[12:43] <jcoxon> then go to location
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[12:46] <jcoxon> G7TXU, i can see you on the map now
[12:47] <x-f> nice location for him!
[12:47] <PE2G> Anyone who knows something about the DFM-06 on 430.750 currently descending over Bedford?
[12:47] <GMT> I think that TXU is going to be the closest, so make sure you keep decoding/uploading the data
[12:47] <PE2G> Sorry freq is 403.750
[12:47] NAN (5686ea0e@gateway/web/freenode/ip.86.134.234.14) joined #highaltitude.
[12:47] <G7TXU> Great stuff j, thanks for that, I thought it was drawing the data under Operator location
[12:48] Nick change: NAN -> Guest44211
[12:48] <jcoxon> G7TXU, it used to
[12:48] <GMT> ->PE2G, how long has that sig on 403 been active, I can track it once TRUSS is down
[12:49] <PE2G> It is stil active, come down wit 20 m/s
[12:50] <PE2G> I discovered it a only a few minutes ago.
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[12:51] <G0MJW> Losing it now
[12:51] <PE2G> Last position: 52.314475 -0.429293 , alt 18 km
[12:52] <GMT> I'm losing TRUSS badly, over to 'TXU for the final moments!
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[12:54] <G0MJW> Faded now.
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[12:55] <G7TXU> Still receiving but with fading
[12:55] <jcoxon> i'm out
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[12:56] <g7ogxchris> have truss easy
[12:56] <jcoxon> g7ogxchris, you uploading?
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[12:57] <GMT> PE2G - what mode is that on 403 ... I can see a signal but cant work out the mode
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[12:59] <UpuLaunchSite> awesome
[12:59] <G7TXU> Lost it now
[12:59] <x-f> 01/12 12:58 G4GUO : I suddenly lost the signal guess it has ditched
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[12:59] <UpuLaunchSite> perfect
[12:59] <UpuLaunchSite> thanks G7TXU
[12:59] <UpuLaunchSite> ok boat time
[12:59] <g7ogxchris> one minute 22 seconds was splash
[12:59] Action: jcoxon is watching ROCK now
[13:00] <UpuLaunchSite> well
[13:00] <UpuLaunchSite> it stopped 25 mins ago
[13:00] <hackvana> fsphil_MI0VIM: Even if you never get to travel on an A580, you can still travel on a Boeing 929. I have, many times.
[13:00] <UpuLaunchSite> annoyingly
[13:00] <jcoxon> it might start...
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[13:01] <UpuLaunchSite> well
[13:01] g0ktd (502ad6e2@gateway/web/freenode/ip.80.42.214.226) left irc: Quit: Page closed
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[13:01] <UpuLaunchSite> wasn't exactly water proof
[13:01] <jcoxon> eek
[13:01] <UpuLaunchSite> and I'm sure super caps and sea water don't get on
[13:01] <PE2G> GMT, you can use FM mode and SondeMonitor to decode it. It's a weathersonde probably launched by weather station Nottingham-Watnall - WMO : 03354
[13:02] <g0hww> so, is spears still to come? nobody has mentioned that, as far as i recall
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[13:03] <UpuLaunchSite> no spears wasn't txing
[13:03] <UpuLaunchSite> we pulled the antenna so as not to conflict with BOB
[13:03] <g0hww> ah, ok
[13:03] <UpuLaunchSite> or PROM
[13:03] <UpuLaunchSite> one of the two
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[13:04] <griffonbot> Received email: Adam Cudworth "[UKHAS] Re: Fogging Camera Lenses - Problem?"
[13:04] <g0hww> cool. in that case i heard them all, so i'm happy
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[13:05] <UpuLaunchSite> anyone know the format marine GPs works in can convert TRUSS's last position ?
[13:05] <cuddykid> whats up with space near us?
[13:05] <UpuLaunchSite> your DNS
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[13:06] <UpuLaunchSite> track.spacenear.us
[13:06] <cuddykid> tried that
[13:06] <cuddykid> one sec
[13:06] <x-f> cuddykid, try http://46.137.178.45/
[13:07] <RG_LZ1DEV> guest368
[13:07] <RG_LZ1DEV> :
[13:07] <RG_LZ1DEV> Anyone there in the UK know how to call a ship?
[13:07] <RG_LZ1DEV> lol
[13:07] <g0hww> "Ahoy there" I think
[13:07] <cuddykid> thanks x-f
[13:07] <UpuLaunchSite> lol
[13:08] <cuddykid> just needed to clear the cookies - then it worked
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[13:08] <cuddykid> lots of sea ditching :(
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[13:10] <griffonbot> Received email: Liz Henriquez "Re: [UKHAS] Re: Fogging Camera Lenses - Problem?"
[13:10] <G0MJW> Well off shore.
[13:10] <gonzo___> Rename it 'Little Jim'
[13:11] <g7ogxchris> i think the confidante has left its area and has steamed NE towards splash
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[13:12] <UpuLaunchSite> we are about 10 miles from SHoreham
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[13:13] <g7ogxchris> look here for confidante http://www.marinetraffic.com/ais/default.aspx?mmsi=111232504&zoom=10
[13:15] <g7ogxchris> picked it up or given up
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[13:19] <g7ogxchris> nothing on IMM channels I cover the SE coast from Bognor
[13:19] <g7ogxchris> no lifeboats launced will continue to moni lol
[13:20] <jcoxon> thanks g7ogxchris
[13:20] <UpuLaunchSite> appreciated
[13:20] <UpuLaunchSite> just coming into worthing
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[13:21] <G7TXU> UpuLaunchSite : I'm on GB3SR if you need any local knowledge 145.600 145.000 88.5Hz
[13:21] <g7ogxchris> littlehampton mobile (rnli) at Rustington hall
[13:22] <UpuLaunchSite> THx G7TXU we have an 817 but no microphone
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[13:22] <UpuLaunchSite> Dave doesn't have license
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[13:23] <UpuLaunchSite> I suppose I could operate his rig
[13:23] <UpuLaunchSite> sadly no microphone
[13:24] <g0hww> cw?
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[13:24] <UpuLaunchSite> lol
[13:24] <g0hww> RTTY?
[13:24] <UpuLaunchSite> which is about the length of the message I could TX
[13:25] <g0hww> i suppose irc is easier
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[13:25] <G0MJW> Mesage in a bottle?
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[13:25] <g0hww> from high altitude?
[13:25] <fsphil> Any updates?
[13:26] <G0MJW> This keyboad has a failing "s"
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[13:26] <UpuLaunchSite> just in worthing
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[13:30] <UpuLaunchSite> can see the sea
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[13:32] <UpuLaunchSite> driving on the front
[13:33] <GMT> how are you gonna get a boat ... just look for a sailor and try to chat him up?
[13:33] <jcoxon> i used to live in worthing
[13:33] <UpuLaunchSite> nothing RX'd
[13:34] <UpuLaunchSite> close GMT
[13:34] <UpuLaunchSite> £100 in tenners usually works
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[13:37] <UpuLaunchSite> in a jam
[13:37] <UpuLaunchSite> out there somewhere if anyone is still watching the feed
[13:38] <NickF_> yeah
[13:38] <x-f> of course
[13:38] <jcoxon> fsphil_MI0VIM, yay got it working again
[13:38] <G0MJW> Yes - though it isn't much fun when stuck in traffic.
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[13:47] <RG_LZ1DEV> watching live steam of traffic in the uk
[13:48] Action: Maxell is still keeping an eye on the cam
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[13:48] <number10_M0MDB> UpuLaunchSite: position in d.m.m is 50°43.862'N, 0°19.450'W
[13:48] <number10_M0MDB> d m.m
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[13:50] <UpuLaunchSite> check the second one pls
[13:50] <UpuLaunchSite> I get 0 18'8
[13:50] <UpuLaunchSite> ish
[13:51] <number10_M0MDB> for this position in raw logs 50.7310279,-0.3241608
[13:51] <UpuLaunchSite> ta
[13:52] <UpuLaunchSite> passing daves fish and chip shop
[13:52] <UpuLaunchSite> thx
[13:52] <g7ogxchris> somebody is hungry!!
[13:53] <number10_M0MDB> tahtw was last pos in raw logs on rjh
[13:56] <jcoxon> number10_M0MDB, what alt is that?
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[13:56] <number10_M0MDB> 837 on truss
[13:57] <jcoxon> on spacenear.us there is a better one
[13:57] <number10_M0MDB> ok
[13:57] <jcoxon> 50.726629,-0.302349
[13:57] <jcoxon> at 103m
[13:57] <jcoxon> 108 sorry
[13:58] <number10_M0MDB> that gives 50°43.598'N, 0°18.141'W
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[14:00] <g7ogxchris> another dredger "thames" has sailed from Shoreham by sea heading towards splash area
[14:00] <g7ogxchris> coincidence
[14:01] <eroomde> i wish they would dredge the bit of thames by our back garden
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[14:02] <g7ogxchris> LOL i'll ask them to take a run at it!!
[14:02] <navrac> I think confidante went to it - it went to 50'43'17 18'27'42 then steamed back
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[14:02] <navrac> too much of a coincidence
[14:02] <g7ogxchris> i agree with navrac
[14:03] <jcoxon> hey navrac
[14:03] <g7ogxchris> what is the page listing future launches please?
[14:03] <navrac> hiya james
[14:03] <jcoxon> g7ogxchris, the best place is the mailing list
[14:03] <jcoxon> i've got a solar powered APRS setup
[14:04] <navrac> nice one
[14:04] <jcoxon> can get a single packet off with a 3.7v 100mA solar cell (under a 20watt bulb indoors) via 0.5F supercap and lipower
[14:05] <navrac> how many mW out
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[14:05] <jcoxon> so its a Hx-1
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[14:06] <navrac> are you allowed to tx airbourne once out of the uk with auklicense
[14:06] <jcoxon> in theory no
[14:06] <jcoxon> i happen to know someone with a uk and US licence
[14:06] <jcoxon> :-)
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[14:06] <navrac> ah fair enough
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[14:07] <slipf> so, what happened?
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[14:07] <GMT> what about if you're in an aeroplane (a small one, eg) and sign as '/P'?
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[14:08] <jcoxon> GMT, in theory you can't
[14:08] <GMT> in theory you can, legally you can't - I think is what you mean
[14:09] <jcoxon> indeed
[14:09] <emdeedee> Afternoon all, did everything go according to plan? Seems like I missed all the action
[14:10] <navrac> depends on what the plan was - unless it includeda boat trip was included
[14:10] <astrodog> Heh.
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[14:10] <emdeedee> Oh dear, saw the icon on the map, wasn't sure whether to trust it
[14:10] <GMT> Dave & UPU are trying to chat-up sailors on the beach at Shoreham, to try to get a boat to take them out to recover
[14:10] <slipf> so what happened to the ignition test?
[14:11] <emdeedee> I am in Kent, but not a boat owner!
[14:12] <astrodog> Do they still have a signal from it, or did it sink?
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[14:12] <GMT> it should float (polystyrene box, etc)
[14:13] <astrodog> GMT: Just wondering if it's still tracked, or is it drifting?
[14:13] <g7ogxchris> how do they time the descent?
[14:13] <emdeedee> Isn't it still saying 500m?
[14:13] <astrodog> (If it's drifting, we can probably work out where it'll wash up, if that'd be helpful.)
[14:13] <UpuLaunchSite> its drifting south
[14:13] <g7ogxchris> i mean what triggers the descent?
[14:13] <UpuLaunchSite> current status is
[14:13] <UpuLaunchSite> in the sea
[14:13] <emdeedee> OK
[14:13] <UpuLaunchSite> probably drifting south
[14:14] <NickF_> it'll more than likely float but the electronics may not survive the salt water. dont think it was waterproofed
[14:14] <GMT> well, it's position is very dependent on the TX & GPS, so if it got flooded in the landing we can only go on its last reported posn
[14:14] <g7ogxchris> is it just natural burst?
[14:14] <emdeedee> Humidity, 100% !
[14:14] <UpuLaunchSite> we have tried to get a boat but so far been unsucessful
[14:14] <UpuLaunchSite> they are all either out or coming in
[14:14] <GMT> it was a natural burst
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[14:15] <astrodog> Alright. Nothing from the tracking system after it hit, then?
[14:15] <g7ogxchris> ok tks just seemed convenient to the sea
[14:15] <UpuLaunchSite> no
[14:15] <UpuLaunchSite> 70cms doesn't work well via water
[14:15] <astrodog> Alright.
[14:15] <GMT> the burst point was somewhere over the south downs
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[14:15] <astrodog> It's going to turn around, shortly.
[14:16] <slipf> but what happened to the igniter test?
[14:17] <UpuLaunchSite> we don'tknow
[14:17] <UpuLaunchSite> until we recover the camera
[14:17] <astrodog> At... lets see, 18:15, it should start drifting back to the north.
[14:18] <slipf> wut? You had all this transmitter equipment and you weren't streaming pics or data?
[14:18] <astrodog> How long has it been in the water?
[14:18] <James-reading> Astrodog, have your got a tidal program running?
[14:18] <GMT> been in the water abt 1h20m
[14:19] <astrodog> James: Tides and some current modeling stuff. Maybe everyone will get lucky, and it'll wash up somewhere today. *grin*
[14:19] <g7ogxchris> predominant will be drift east by north east
[14:19] <UpuLaunchSite> we've been told south by some sea faring type
[14:20] <g7ogxchris> my money is on Newhaven/Seaford if it is floating
[14:20] <James-reading> High tide was at 12:35ish, so it will be ebbing and moving west.
[14:20] <g7ogxchris> does it have contact details on it?
[14:20] <astrodog> Upu: It'll head South until ~16:15... then it'll reverse to the NE.
[14:21] <fsphil_MI0VIM> and back
[14:21] <James-reading> I only know the inshore tide from sailing in brighton - and we get that wrong sometimes :)
[14:21] <emdeedee> My money is on the Goodwin Sands - everything seems to end up there
[14:22] <g7ogxchris> wind in the splash position is 15 knots from the west
[14:22] <G8DHE> Wind is from NW shipping traffic in area http://www.marinetraffic.com/ais/default.aspx?mmsi=235052172%C2%A2erx=-0.3276017%C2%A2ery=50.70778&zoom=10&type_color=3
[14:22] <g7ogxchris> could be where all the jobs are
[14:22] <g7ogxchris> jeopardy
[14:22] <astrodog> How much does it weigh, anyway?
[14:23] <fsphil_MI0VIM> nice, someone got a packet from 108m up
[14:23] <g7ogxchris> whats the freq of bob please? have to go downstairs now so want to leave everthing on
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[14:24] <fsphil_MI0VIM> didn't bob landed ages ago?
[14:24] <James-reading> I know someone with a boat in Brighton, but he is not volunteering the use of the boat
[14:24] Nick change: fsphil_MI0VIM -> fsphil
[14:24] <James-reading> yet
[14:24] <UpuLaunchSite> ok
[14:24] <astrodog> Worst case... you'll probably get another shot at the boats tonight.
[14:24] <g7ogxchris> BOB Time: 2012-12-01 08:44:04 Position: 52.1661,-0.4514 Altitude: 7743 m Temperature: -2C Battery: 4.29 V Satellites: 9 Temperature, External: -37 °C Receivers: JFS1, 2E0KPI, G6SUQ, G0MJW, M0MDB, F5APQ
[14:24] <UpuLaunchSite> boat hired
[14:24] <astrodog> As they go out with the tide again.
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[14:25] <x-f> woo!
[14:25] <fsphil> sweet
[14:25] <g7ogxchris> Bob is over Bedford according to map
[14:25] <UpuLaunchSite> 30 mins till we sale
[14:25] <Koolibah> anyone know what is happening at Worthing?
[14:25] <fsphil> your map is wrong - bob is in the water
[14:25] <G8DHE> Not alot
[14:25] <fsphil> about 1km off shore
[14:25] <James-reading> good job on the boat. Sea state does not look that bad, but its still going to be a b*tch to find
[14:26] <g7ogxchris> ok phil tks
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[14:26] <fsphil> try refreshing? make sure you're on http://track.spacenear.us/
[14:26] <fsphil> there are no balloons in the air atm
[14:26] <g7ogxchris> near splash is a 300 feet met mast....climb it!
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[14:28] <g7ogxchris> ok qrt now any launches tomorrow? addictive stuff
[14:28] <fsphil> don't believe so
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[14:28] <fsphil> are you on the mailing list?
[14:28] <g7ogxchris> no don't know link for list
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[14:28] <fsphil> http://ukhas.org.uk/ukhas:mailing_list
[14:28] <fsphil> launches are announced there
[14:28] <fsphil> usually
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[14:29] <g7ogxchris> phil tks again tks fer company all see you soon
[14:29] <fsphil> cya!
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[14:29] <Koolibah> can anyone confirm that a boat has been hired at Shoreham
[14:29] <UpuLaunchSite> confirmed
[14:29] <UpuLaunchSite> this is hilarious
[14:29] <Koolibah> Hope they find it
[14:30] <UpuLaunchSite> someone has just bought the boat
[14:30] <UpuLaunchSite> and we are renting it
[14:30] <fsphil> how's that for timing
[14:30] <x-f> it needs a test ride!
[14:30] <Koolibah> They ony have about 1.5 hours of light
[14:30] <UpuLaunchSite> might have to let this laptop
[14:30] <UpuLaunchSite> I know
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[14:30] <UpuLaunchSite> its going to be right
[14:31] Nick change: daveake -> SailorDave
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[14:31] <fsphil> Rock stopped workign? aww
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[14:31] <SailorDave> It did better than expected actually
[14:32] <fsphil> hah
[14:32] <SailorDave> But yes it would have been ideal now
[14:32] <Koolibah> 1.5 hrs of light about 10 miles out they will only have half an hour search time at best
[14:32] <fsphil> indeed
[14:32] <UpuLaunchSite> check stream
[14:32] <astrodog> Might I suggest, on future attempts, attaching a dye packet? *grin*
[14:32] <Koolibah> or a flashing light
[14:33] <Koolibah> per lifejacket
[14:33] <James-reading> stream is looking good
[14:33] <astrodog> So... you probably want to be looking about 1 NM SSW, unless you can get a data feed from it.
[14:34] <UpuLaunchSite> we are't going out
[14:36] <UpuLaunchSite> Lester is
[14:36] <astrodog> Something to consider, that may be easier to find... is a helicopter. Some of those guys would give you an hour for ~100GBP. *grin*
[14:36] <UpuLaunchSite> I think lester just bought the boat
[14:36] <astrodog> Ha.
[14:36] <G8DHE> You can hire them from Shoreham airport as well!
[14:37] <fsphil> that's dedication
[14:37] Nick change: UpuLaunchSite -> NauticalUpu
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[14:37] <fsphil> Captain aHAB
[14:37] <shyted> Only came with 2 paddles?
[14:37] <G0MJW> Skylark! All Aboard.
[14:37] <NauticalUpu> Just waiting on these guys to finish buying the board
[14:38] <NauticalUpu> boat
[14:38] <SailorDave> lol fsphil
[14:38] <G0MJW> Watch for Whales.
[14:39] <fsphil> I did wonder for ages what captain ahab had against the welsh
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[14:40] <NauticalUpu> ok so currently we are just waiting on the sailors to finish buying the boat
[14:40] <NauticalUpu> and for Lester to go get some money out
[14:40] <astrodog> (Also... with this new boat, can we expect some sort of deep sea expedition in the future?)
[14:40] <GMT> you may be able to hire a helicopter, but they probably won't fly over the sea.
[14:40] <NauticalUpu> I think in about 30 mins astrodog
[14:40] <G0MJW> Launch from a boat and it might end up on land.
[14:41] <NauticalUpu> they are getting some fuel for the boat
[14:41] <GMT> make sure you get enough fuel!
[14:41] <astrodog> GMT: I'm sure there are tour pilots that'll go out over the sea, but once its nightfall... no real point.
[14:41] <G0MJW> When you say "boat" what do you mean? An inflatable?
[14:41] <NauticalUpu> err
[14:42] <NauticalUpu> sort of like a bath tub
[14:42] <NauticalUpu> with an engine
[14:42] <astrodog> Ha.
[14:42] <bertrik> if the sea expedition is more expensive than the thing you're trying to recover, maybe you should just forget about it
[14:42] <G0MJW> Sloop?
[14:42] <NauticalUpu> bertrik the images and data are worth the money
[14:42] <astrodog> bertrik: I think it's about the data, at this point.
[14:42] <NauticalUpu> the payload is recked
[14:42] <NauticalUpu> wrecked
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[14:42] <NauticalUpu> salt water + electronics never ends well
[14:43] <shyted> Take it the images are on waterproof mem card then?
[14:43] <G0MJW> Ooh - jut looked up Bathtub Boat. Very fast
[14:43] <fsphil> you'd be surprised how hard SD cards are
[14:43] <fsphil> many have been recovered from the ocean and worked fine
[14:43] <NauticalUpu> SD cards are faily hardy
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[14:43] <NauticalUpu> mine spent 18 hours bobbing about
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[14:44] <NauticalUpu> I think the one from Apex Alpha was in for weeks
[14:44] <shyted> having follded an underwater camera before I disagree
[14:44] <GMT> there was a BBC report during the summer about an entire camera lost overboard for about a week; camera caught by fishermen, check photos on mem card & and found owner!
[14:45] <astrodog> It's kind of a hit or miss thing. If it shorts across the battery, everything may be in... passable shape. If it shorted across the card, it'll be toast.
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[14:46] <shyted> for future ref they do waterproof cards for dive cams.
[14:46] <priyesh> http://www.apexhab.org/apex-iii/launch-1/
[14:46] <NauticalUpu> we don't generally intend to land in water
[14:46] <astrodog> How big is the container, anyway?
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[14:46] <priyesh> apex III spent ~3 weeks in the water
[14:47] <priyesh> sd cards were fine afterwards
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[14:47] <priyesh> the payload still worked!
[14:47] <NauticalUpu> 2 containers
[14:47] <astrodog> Nautical: You are, sadly, not the first to discover the wonder of water landing. *grin*
[14:47] <priyesh> more details on the link above
[14:47] <NauticalUpu> Oh I know :)
[14:47] <fsphil> water landings are annoyingly common in the uk
[14:47] <NauticalUpu> yours beat mine by a mile
[14:47] <fsphil> I've a payload in the north sea somewhere
[14:47] <NauticalUpu> afk
[14:48] <astrodog> fsphil: That's not fun.
[14:48] <bertrik> priyesh: cool story and nice summary! :)
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[14:48] <fsphil> indeed. I knew it was a risk, so I didn't put the big camera in it
[14:48] <fsphil> only live images
[14:48] <priyesh> we slapped a gopro on that one
[14:48] <priyesh> went all out
[14:49] <G8DHE> When you say a Bath Tub you do realise that in Shoreham they mean this sort of thing http://www.shorehamherald.co.uk/community/adur-bath-tubbers-raise-money-for-pakistan-flood-appeal-1-1212544
[14:50] Action: jcoxon has had lots of water landings
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[14:51] <g0hww> G8DHE, lol
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[14:55] <astrodog> So... if they don't find it today, we can break out the modeling software, and see if we can determine where it's going to drift to.
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[15:05] <SailorDave> right
[15:05] <SailorDave> upu here
[15:05] <SailorDave> boat has left port
[15:05] <Randomskk> hah nice
[15:05] <SailorDave> can someone relay that to BATC
[15:06] <NickF_> done
[15:06] <SailorDave> thanks
[15:06] <jcoxon> can we track teh boat?
[15:06] <SailorDave> sadly not
[15:06] <SailorDave> as my engineers didn't put my 3g card back in
[15:06] <SailorDave> they have my netbook on the boat
[15:07] <SailorDave> to see if theyg get a signal
[15:07] <SailorDave> it is really flipping cold here
[15:07] <SailorDave> they are going to seriously be cold ou there
[15:07] <SailorDave> however
[15:08] <SailorDave> we are off to the pub
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[15:09] <James-reading> That sounds like a good plan Dave - should not have much trouble finding a pub in Shoreham
[15:09] <Boldman> I'm afraid I've missed all the action - what happened?
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[15:14] <GMT> somebody should change 'SailorDave' to 'PubDave'
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[15:16] Nick change: SailorDave -> DaveInPub
[15:17] <DaveInPub> Status update ... Upu, Julie, Mrs Neil and I are sat in a cosy pub at the harbour
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[15:17] <DaveInPub> Lester and Neil are currently in a boat
[15:17] <SpeedEvil> http://www.amazon.co.uk/Soak-Your-Nuts-Cleansing-Secrets/dp/1570672644
[15:17] <RG_LZ1DEV> on a boat
[15:17] <RG_LZ1DEV> FTFY
[15:17] <SpeedEvil> seems on topic then
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[15:18] Nick change: Ionian -> Upu2
[15:18] <Upu2> ah beer
[15:18] <astrodog> DaveInPub: Let me know if it seems like it'd be worth running the drift models.... not having anything specific for the area will make it rough, but it'll be better than nothing if you've gotta try and recover it tomorrow.
[15:18] <Upu2> this recovery is hard work
[15:19] <jcoxon> Upu2, on a side note - i've got a solar powered aprs beacon working
[15:19] <jcoxon> beacons 2 every 2 mins under a lamp
[15:19] <Upu2> hey at least its not in a tree
[15:19] <jcoxon> 1 packet evey 2 mins
[15:19] Action: SpeedEvil imagines 5 years time, when spacenear incorporates tide and water currents.
[15:20] <RG_LZ1DEV> predictor for water currents?
[15:20] <SpeedEvil> yeah.
[15:21] <Upu2> they are heading to the last location
[15:21] <SpeedEvil> also a tree database.
[15:21] <SpeedEvil> is there any possibility it may still be transmitting?
[15:21] <Upu2> possible
[15:21] <DaveInPub> http://www.flickr.com/photos/daveake/8235307300/in/photostream
[15:21] <Upu2> the truss tracker was wrapped in bubble wrap
[15:22] <DaveInPub> They have a netbook with dl-fldigi, scanner and aerial on the boat
[15:22] <Upu2> its likely to still be txing
[15:22] <DaveInPub> It's the signal strength because aerials are going to be underwater
[15:22] <Upu2> the rock box wasnt exactly water tight
[15:23] <Upu2> was the old r in the pi box
[15:23] <DaveInPub> nope
[15:23] <GMT> they look so 'comfortable' in that pic! Not at all concerned, no siree!
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[15:24] <DaveInPub> Hopefully we'll get a photo as they return. There may be a difference in demeanour
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[15:28] <DaveInPub> Boat as it was about to leave - http://www.flickr.com/photos/daveake/8234259639/in/set-72157632136764003
[15:30] <griffonbot> Received email: Anthony Stirk "Re: [UKHAS] Re: Fogging Camera Lenses - Problem?"
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[15:32] Action: costyn missed all the (cold & wet) fun it seems
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[15:33] <costyn> were there 2 The Reg balloons? Rock&Roll and Truss?
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[15:33] <Upu2> both under 1 balloon
[15:34] <costyn> Rock&Roll and Truss were under 1 balloon?
[15:34] <Upu2> yes
[15:34] <costyn> ah ok
[15:34] <Upu2> 1000g with 5kg neck lol
[15:34] <costyn> woa
[15:35] <costyn> I missed the ascent, what was the rate?
[15:35] <Upu2> 7+
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[15:35] <costyn> nice
[15:35] <costyn> so why did it end up wet?
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[15:35] <astrodog> Wind is a bitch.
[15:35] <Upu2> dunno prediction was out miled
[15:35] <Upu2> miles
[15:36] <costyn> hmmm too bad
[15:36] <Upu2> all figures were right
[15:36] <costyn> and there's some people out in a boat looking for it I see?
[15:36] <Upu2> yep
[15:37] <astrodog> DaveInPub: If they go about 1nm SSW of the last reported location, they *should* be near the edge of where it might have drifted to.
[15:37] <VinceH> On BATC, someone has asked for mission critical information: What is being drunk?
[15:37] <Upu2> we however are sat in the pub
[15:37] <Upu2> carling
[15:38] <Upu2> choice of the fisherman
[15:38] <Upu2> passing info on thx
[15:38] <VinceH> Duly passed on. :)
[15:39] <x-f> eek, 1nm is a quite a long stretch to search
[15:39] <Upu2> passed location info on
[15:39] <Randomskk> the radios not working?
[15:39] <Upu2> in the water
[15:40] <Upu2> maybe up close
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[15:40] <astrodog> x-f: Yeah. Thankfully, it's a relatively straight line... they should be able to just run SSW slowly. If they can get the aerial in the water as they go, they have a better chance of picking up a signal if it's actually submerged. (Though... if it is, I'm not sure wwhat step 2 is.)
[15:40] <Upu2> been in water 2 hours
[15:41] <Upu2> astrodog, any coordinates ?
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[15:41] <astrodog> Upu: I can work some out. Lemme get this over to some GIS software.
[15:41] <Upu2> ya
[15:41] <Upu2> ta
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[15:42] <Upu2> your suggestion matches what some old seadog said
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[15:42] <astrodog> Upu2: Good to know the model might actually be worth a shit out there... I'm used to running this kind of thing for the GoM, and that's a bit different. :P
[15:42] <Upu2> gom ?
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[15:42] <astrodog> Gulf of Mexico.
[15:43] <astrodog> I work in oil and gas.
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[15:43] <Upu2> rgr
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[15:44] <astrodog> Upu: Is there a CSV or something with the last 300m of decent locations? That'll give us decent surface wind information.
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[15:44] <Koolibah> Are they out boating at the moment, any news?
[15:44] <Upu2> err can someone tell astrodog how to extra info from
[15:44] <Upu2> db
[15:44] <costyn> Upu2: sure
[15:44] <Randomskk> http://habitat.habhub.org/ept/
[15:44] <Randomskk> uhm
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[15:44] <Randomskk> what payload would be good
[15:44] <costyn> astrodog: http://habitat.habhub.org/ept/
[15:44] <Upu2> Koolibah, yes boat is out
[15:44] <Upu2> truss
[15:45] <Randomskk> http://habitat.habhub.org/habitat/_design/ept/_list/csv/payload_telemetry/flight_payload_time?include_docs=true&startkey=[%229d5c438b6b9962f7c1ac5c8b0b2b8f85%22,%22c4f222aa3a6a4e47e727b9ed5de690db%22]&endkey=[%229d5c438b6b9962f7c1ac5c8b0b2b8f85%22,%22c4f222aa3a6a4e47e727b9ed5de690db%22,[]]&fields=latitude,longitude,altitude
[15:45] <astrodog> Got it.
[15:45] <Randomskk> latitude, longitude, altitude
[15:45] <Randomskk> for the whole flight
[15:45] <Randomskk> look at the last few positions
[15:45] <Upu2> sorry on an iphone
[15:45] <astrodog> You guys want a website with this stuff? (Just, for the love of god, don't link it all over the place, or my sad little WMS setup will die.)
[15:45] <Koolibah> Upu2 thank you
[15:46] <Upu2> yes but dont link it here astrodog
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[15:47] <Upu2> pm UpuWork ill pick it up from home
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[15:48] <DaveInPub> Photos from the day (so far) ... http://www.flickr.com/photos/daveake/sets/72157632136764003/
[15:48] <astrodog> Are these GPS coords?
[15:49] <Upu2> yes in dd.ddddd format
[15:49] <astrodog> Alright, just making sure it's WGS84.
[15:50] <costyn> DaveInPub: nice Audi there
[15:51] <Upu2> if its black thats mine
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[15:51] <costyn> Upu2: sweet ride
[15:51] <Upu2> cheers
[15:52] <astrodog> -0.3070 50.7090 is the first run on coords. Lemme get all of this loaded, and you'll have an uncertainty cone over time.
[15:52] <smiker> If you need local wind data.. http://www.shorehambeachweather.co.uk/weather/indexweather1.html CUrrently about 10 knots WNW (300degrees)
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[15:53] <Upu2> cheers smiker
[15:54] <astrodog> Upu: Any idea how much of the thing would be poking out of the water?
[15:55] <Upu2> payloads tend to ride quite high in the water
[15:55] <Upu2> i speak from experience
[15:55] <astrodog> Ha. How big is the container?
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[15:56] <g7ogxchris> confidante is moving toward splash point
[15:57] <Upu2> err pi box wasnt massive
[15:57] <Upu2> lohan was reasonably large but covered in grey gaffer
[15:58] <Upu2> 48" parachute though
[15:58] <SP9UOB> Upu2: Are You drowned Raspberry?
[15:58] <g7ogxchris> dont think confidante is dredging but surveying..ships' track has formed a cross north of Rampion Metioriological Mast
[15:58] <g7ogxchris> is there a transponder aboard?
[15:59] <astrodog> Upu: Interesting. I've never tried to model something with a 'chute on it.
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[16:00] <astrodog> So... the closest thing I can find to you guys with real current data is drifting at 0.7 knots @ 62 deg now.
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[16:02] <Upu2> sorry disconnected
[16:03] <astrodog> So... the closest thing I can find to you guys with real current data is drifting at 0.7 knots @ 62 deg now. It's further out in the channel, though.
[16:03] <costyn> astrodog: cool, we've never had that kind of data befvore
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[16:04] <Upu2> any coords ?
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[16:04] <CanadaDave> UPU2: This was posted while you were offline: <astrodog> So... the closest thing I can find to you guys with real current data is drifting at 0.7 knots @ 62 deg now.
[16:04] <astrodog> Not yet, I'm trying to get a better control point for the model.
[16:04] <Upu2> yep give me some coords
[16:05] <Upu2> and ill pass on
[16:05] <Upu2> well just stab in the dark
[16:05] <CanadaDave> ooops he had reposted (I need to learn to scroll down!!)
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[16:05] <astrodog> Tell them to go east, slowly.
[16:05] <Upu2> if you get it right you will be a reg hero
[16:05] <astrodog> Ha.
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[16:07] <costyn> must be getting dark there too?
[16:07] <Upu2> yep
[16:07] <astrodog> Christ... *no one* has current buoys anywhere near there.
[16:07] <DaveInPub> Lester's phone rings, so they haven't sunk
[16:07] <Upu2> we tried to call but they didnt answer
[16:08] <costyn> telephone? When you've got a car full of radios? :)
[16:08] <Upu2> im the only one with a license
[16:08] <Upu2> anyway
[16:09] <Upu2> damn
[16:09] <astrodog> Okay, new coords in a moment.
[16:09] <Upu2> would have have had to use M0UPU/MM
[16:09] <Randomskk> "have"
[16:09] <Randomskk> prefixes aren't even required any more :P
[16:09] <Randomskk> still
[16:09] <Randomskk> a great chance to use it
[16:09] <Upu2> yup
[16:10] <Randomskk> you'd need to get permission from the ship's captain, too, right :D
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[16:10] <Upu2> indeed just told Dave that
[16:10] <costyn> I'm assuming the boat has an onboard radio? Or aren't you allowed to talk on those bands as an amateur?
[16:11] <Upu2> you can listen to anything you want
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[16:11] <Upu2> tx is restricted to you license schedule
[16:11] <astrodog> -0.2991, 50.6705. I'm going to start running the uncertainty cones now, though.
[16:11] <Upu2> can some one turn that into nautical ?
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[16:12] <astrodog> (FWIW, if you're going to lose one of these in the water... the North Sea has a hell of a lot more data, oddly.)
[16:12] <costyn> Upu2: right, I meant talk to the boat at this moment with your radio, but I guess there's issues and laws about that :)
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[16:12] <Upu2> yep
[16:13] <mfa298_> marine band required a whole different course and some weird licensing.
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[16:13] <bwombler> So a redezvous with the Confidante? Anyone know if they saw the chute?
[16:14] Nick change: mfa298_ -> mfa298
[16:14] <bwombler> Have a fiver bet with myself about why it headed straight for the likely landing area...
[16:14] <bwombler> Then appeared to go back to surveying...
[16:14] <Upu2> you need a full license and permissions from the captain
[16:14] <Upu2> the wont stop for it
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[16:16] <astrodog> Upu: If the chute is dragging in the water, the thing could be moving ~1 m/s, instead of the nice, sedentary ~1knot.
[16:16] <x-f> Upu2, 0S 17' 56", 50S 40' 13"
[16:16] <Upu2> aye i think its down to a little luck now
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[16:16] <Upu2> sure Xf ?
[16:16] <DaveInPub> Upu: This chasing is hard, cold, wet work, don't you think? http://imgur.com/7lSbg
[16:17] <costyn> DaveInPub: :)
[16:17] <fsphil> You landlubbers
[16:17] <astrodog> If I switch to modeling it assuming the chute is dragging it... basically, all of the distances double.
[16:18] <Upu2> getting dark out there
[16:18] <astrodog> Upu2: Have a location for them, right now?
[16:18] <Upu2> no idea
[16:18] <fsphil> shame they're not running the chase app
[16:18] <Upu2> they arent answering the phone
[16:18] <Upu2> noise probably
[16:19] <costyn> Upu2: got that too 0° 17' 56.7594", 50° 40' 13.7994"
[16:19] <costyn> (according to http://transition.fcc.gov/mb/audio/bickel/DDDMMSS-decimal.html)
[16:19] <astrodog> Upu2: Let me know if you get one, and I'll give them a heading/speed.
[16:19] <fsphil> what a horrible format
[16:19] <x-f> yes, was about to paste the same as costyn
[16:19] <fsphil> why would anyone use that over simple decimal?
[16:19] <Randomskk> ask the people who made all the imperial systems
[16:20] <Randomskk> hello feet, yards, chains, lbs, oz, ...
[16:20] <Upu2> ok thx
[16:20] <Upu2> passed on
[16:20] <Upu2> lets sit back and wait
[16:20] Action: fsphil sits back and has a nice cup of hot choclate
[16:20] <astrodog> Upu2: Longer term models will actually be a bit more reliable if they miss it tonight at least.
[16:21] <g0hww> nice name though, the sexagesimal system
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[16:21] <fsphil> very nice
[16:21] <g0hww> " It originated with the ancient Sumerians in the 3rd millennium BC"
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[16:23] <x-f> minutes and seconds for longitude are easy to understand, because that's how the Earth turns, for latitude it's different thing tho
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[16:29] <James_ReadingUK> How are you calculating tide rates. Inshore off Brighton the flow rate is 1.6knots at peak flow (half way between high and low) - tide is east to west flow after high tide (emptying the north sea)
[16:29] <James_ReadingUK> flow rates for hour intervals are roughly 0, 1/3, 2/3, 3/3, 2/3, 1/3, 0 of the peak
[16:30] <astrodog> James: I'm using ship observations, corrected for location.
[16:31] <James_ReadingUK> Ok :)
[16:33] <jcoxon> any news?
[16:33] <DaveInPub> nope
[16:33] <astrodog> James: Unfortunately, the models I have are set up for the GoM, so I'm sort of stuck just throwing the Channel's bathymetry data in and seeing where it looks like it'll end up.
[16:33] <DaveInPub> waiting on a call
[16:33] <DaveInPub> its dark now
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[16:34] <astrodog> Dave: Think it'd be worth starting to run drift models for where it might end up over a bit more time?
[16:35] <DaveInPub> <- Upu
[16:35] <DaveInPub> don't worry astrodog
[16:35] <DaveInPub> cheers for your help
[16:36] <G8DHE> Last known and latest est on google maps; https://maps.google.com/maps/ms?msa=0&msid=210506883775956164607.0004cfcced4eb6faaf1f8
[16:37] <astrodog> Dave: It's kinda fun trying to use these tools this way.
[16:37] <DaveInPub> daves soozing
[16:37] <DaveInPub> snoozing
[16:37] <costyn> long day eh
[16:41] <DaveInPub> Not found; they're coming back
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[16:42] <Randomskk> :(
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[16:43] <scobla> hi all
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[16:44] <DaveInPub> could someone relay to batc
[16:44] <G8DHE> It has been
[16:44] <astrodog> Dave: Gotcha. I'll kick off the longer run with uncertainty cones. A quick run gives it a 60% shot of ending up somewhere near Southsea. If it misses there, it'll be a bitch to find.
[16:44] <scobla> i am learning about radio tracking and wondering what band they use
[16:44] <scobla> ?
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[16:44] <G7TXU> I can listen out just in case it rights itself, batteries are good and the brine hasn't affected it. What would the temperature corrected frequency be ?
[16:45] <scobla> anyone?
[16:45] <G8DHE> $$TRUSS 434.225Mhz 100 baud RTTY 500 shift 7N2 $$ROLL 434.650Mhz 100 baud RTTY 450 shift 7N2 $$ROCK Iridium upload no RF TX $$SPEARS 434.073Mhz 50 baud RTTY shift 500 8N1
[16:45] <G8DHE> were the reported freq's
[16:45] <GMT> scoble, it was txing on 434 mhz
[16:46] <scobla> i don't get it
[16:46] <scobla> lol
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[16:46] <GMT> scobla, nobody gets it, it's in the ebglish channel!
[16:47] <GMT> ebglish=english
[16:47] <costyn> scobla: the band is the 70cm band, more specifically we use the 434.000 - 434.650 MHz frequency range
[16:47] <G8DHE> What don't you get ? 4 beacons TRUSS, ROLL, ROCK and SPEARS, on 4 different channels in 70cms band using RTTY
[16:47] <scobla> do you know what band the radio use? is it HF, VHF, SHF?
[16:47] <costyn> scobla: UHF
[16:48] <GMT> UHF
[16:48] <G8DHE> 434MHz which is UHF
[16:48] <scobla> ok i get it now
[16:48] <costyn> scobla: look up radio bands on wikipedia for more info :)
[16:48] <scobla> hi costyn
[16:49] <scobla> the reason am asking about bands is that some banrs are not allowed for the public in my country
[16:49] <astrodog> Okay, that's kind of fun. The fast drift model indicates that it may end up in Scotland... in a few months. (~3%)
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[16:50] <Randomskk> astrodog: :D
[16:50] <Randomskk> that's some cool modelling
[16:50] <costyn> scobla: sure, that's in every country, but most countries have several frequency bands that amateurs are allowed to use, even unlicensed
[16:50] <G8DHE> Is that a Clockwise or Anticlockwise drift ;-)
[16:50] <costyn> astrodog: yea very cool
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[16:52] <astrodog> It looks like your best bet will be to put up fliers in Southsea for the next week or so. Heh.
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[16:56] <GMT> Scobla, which country are you in?
[16:56] <scobla> Saudi
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[16:57] <GMT> Okay, another Saudi person. You will need to check about amateur radio in your country, and what freqs are available
[16:57] <scobla> is it possible to track a balloon using any if these bands HF, SHF, VHF?
[16:57] <astrodog> scobla: Yep.
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[16:58] <scobla> there is no another saudi in here... its me
[16:58] <scobla> only
[16:58] <astrodog> That's... kind of fun. So... if Southsea misses, then your next shot is near Plymouth about a week later... after that, no locations have any particular likelihood until a month or two out.
[16:58] <mfa298> scobla: those are pretty wide definitions of spectrum.
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[16:58] <GMT> Scoble, what happens is that the balloon has a small GPS attached to it, and the low-power UHF (434 mhz) transmits the lat/long of the balloon, and we decode the signal
[16:58] <astrodog> scobla: You might check and see exactly which bands are allowed in SA.
[16:59] <mfa298> shf (3GHz to 30GHz) probably isn't a good bet for a tracker (unless you have lots of power - and want to cook things)
[16:59] <scobla> HF, SHF, VHF are allowed
[17:00] <G8DHE> Scobla: try these links http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Radio_spectrum and http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Amateur_radio_frequency_allocations
[17:00] <scobla> ok
[17:00] <GMT> scobla, we are not actually tracking the balloon ... it is sending out a signal telling us where it is
[17:00] <astrodog> I'm curious... did any useful data make it out, or was there only location telemetry?
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[17:01] <minorDiversion> anyone know why the tracking site shows 2 separate paths - one ending near sandwich bay and the other near worthing
[17:01] <mfa298> scobla: you need to find some better definitions. HF can mean anything up to 30MHz *or* 3MHz to 30MHz depending on who you talk to.
[17:01] <scobla> am new to this, so bare with me
[17:01] <jcoxon> scobla, i think the questions are
[17:01] <jcoxon> do you have an amateur radio licence?
[17:02] <GMT> there are some low powered VHF transmitters in the 173 MHz (VHF) band, don't know if allowed in Saudi
[17:02] <jcoxon> also are radios allowed to be airbourne
[17:02] <scobla> no, i do not have a license
[17:02] <astrodog> I do have a suggestion, perhaps, for future flights. Perhaps have a pyrotechnic to cut away the chute if you get within 1 km of the ocean?
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[17:03] <mfa298> minorDiversion: two different baloons.
[17:03] <astrodog> A smashed payload being somewhat more desirable than a sunk one.
[17:03] <minorDiversion> ah - i thought the lohan team was only launching one today
[17:03] <minorDiversion> tx
[17:03] <Randomskk> the parachute can cut away too, astrodog
[17:03] <Randomskk> it's been done
[17:03] <Randomskk> but it adds complexity to the flight so a lot of people just try to only launch when predictions are favourable
[17:03] <Randomskk> (as I think they were today - I wonder why it went so far off prediction)
[17:03] <zyp> astrodog, not for the one standing below the payload when it comes down
[17:03] <mfa298> minorDiversion: lohan launched one, someone else launched the one that went towards sandwich bay earlier
[17:04] <jcoxon> scobla, okay if you don't have a licence then you need to look into licence exempt radio or someother means
[17:04] <astrodog> zyp: Injuries in the name of science!
[17:04] <minorDiversion> ah probably used same frequencies - i see... thank you
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[17:05] <astrodog> I really should hop on here sooner next time. It'd be interesting to run these through a spatial package as they occur.
[17:05] <GMT> astrodog - the balloon burst quite a way inland, so your '1km from the ocean' idea wont work
[17:05] <mfa298> minorDiversion: I think they had different freqs but use the same method of tracking. Most uk amateur balloons use the same system.
[17:05] <astrodog> GMT: I'm thinking cut away the chute if the location gets within 1 km of the ocean, rather than worry about where the balloon popped off.
[17:06] <Randomskk> the notice of variation for these launches often specifies that the payloads must descend by parachute
[17:06] <minorDiversion> as far as the 1km to ocean bit - do any of the rtty links allow for uplink capability so a command could be sent to cut
[17:06] <Randomskk> yup, that's also been done
[17:07] <astrodog> Randomskk: When does the chute normally trigger? Right when the balloon pops, or?
[17:07] <G8DHE> Scobla: http://www.southgatearc.org/news/june2007/saudi_arabia.htm
[17:07] <junderwood> What you really need is a ram-air parachute and a controller to take it to the closest land :)
[17:08] <junderwood> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Joint_Precision_Airdrop_System
[17:08] <astrodog> I know clients have done drops where they released the chute a few hundred feet before the thing hit the ground.
[17:09] <minorDiversion> I prefer the soviet style *hard* landings
[17:09] <minorDiversion> if ya cant survive it dont try
[17:09] <astrodog> That was a supply pallet, though... not sure how the rules work with the balloons.
[17:09] <scobla> G8DHE, thanks
[17:10] <minorDiversion> :)
[17:10] <G8DHE> also this one http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Amateur_radio_callsigns_of_the_Middle_East might be of interest
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[17:10] <minorDiversion> i wondered about using 200ft of mylar as a streamer for slowing decent instead of parachute
[17:10] <minorDiversion> it would look cool
[17:11] <Randomskk> astrodog: the chutes are normally pre-deployed
[17:11] <Randomskk> so yes, they open when the balloon pops, though it takes a while before there' enough atmos for them to work well
[17:11] <astrodog> Random: Ah.
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[17:14] <astrodog> Random: Why not throw one of those altitude triggered reserve chutes on these? The ones for skydivers aren't that pricey, as I recall.
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[17:14] <jcoxon> oh scob1a has gone
[17:14] <jcoxon> this would have been useful
[17:14] <jcoxon> http://www.volny.cz/horvitz/os-info/saudi.html
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[17:20] <G8DHE> Cheers all, hope the payloads are found, I'll keep an eye on Worthing's beaches!
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[17:23] <x-f> and the one near Sandwich, too..
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[17:25] <G7TXU> I've sent a FB message to all my beachcombing friends to watch out for a large condom attached to some geek gear if it ever washes up
[17:25] <BeerForBreakfast> Hmm. I wonder. Playmanaut was involved in "Black Ops" recently. Maybe this is a cover for a mission to take back Brittany as part of the U.K.?
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[17:28] <x-f> event coverage for yesterday and today has been great and fun, thanks to Upu_M0UPU, daveake and all
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[17:28] <x-f> just that offshore landing trend
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[17:49] <astrodog> Finally.
[17:51] <astrodog> I have LOHAN's track overlaid with live currents, if anyone wants it.
[17:51] <jcoxon> is it a web link?
[17:52] <astrodog> Yes... though if it's widely distributed, I'll have to kill it. :P
[17:52] <navrac> thereso nly
[17:52] <navrac> a few of us one here
[17:52] <navrac> most just stay logged on
[17:53] <astrodog> Alright, one sec, I'll throw up a screengrab while I switch this to something I can make public.
[17:53] <jcoxon> navrac, is there an easy way to measure RF output from my aprs setup?
[17:54] <navrac> hmm not really without a swrmeter
[17:54] <navrac> easiest way istomeasurethe supply currentandthen lookon the dayasheet
[17:55] <navrac> sorry space key has goneintermittant
[17:56] <g0hww> http://www.phy6.org/outreach/edu/greaspot.htm
[17:56] <g0hww> grease spot photometer?
[17:57] <g0hww> variable voltage dc supply and a light bulb on one side and a light bulb as dummy load on the other
[17:57] <navrac> or if you have a tx and rx use the same aerial andcomparesigstrength
[17:58] <navrac> interesting idea
[17:58] <navrac> or measure the temperatureincrease on a 50 ohm resistor
[18:00] <astrodog> http://imgur.com/WtQtt The neon green dots are the prediction points.
[18:01] <g0hww> too impatient to wait for the map to full load?
[18:02] <astrodog> No, just no current data over there, and Google Earth is being annoying with me. *grin*
[18:02] <astrodog> http://imgur.com/WtTeH is a zoomed out version.
[18:02] <g0hww> it looks like the sea was made in minecraft
[18:03] <astrodog> It's gridded current observation data.
[18:03] <astrodog> The lighter the color, the faster the current.
[18:03] <astrodog> The lines give you direction.
[18:04] <g0hww> good work, btw
[18:04] <SpeedEvil> astrodog: neat!
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[18:04] <SpeedEvil> astrodog: where is this from?
[18:04] <astrodog> That can be re-run every few hours, to generate uncertainty cones.
[18:04] <g0hww> is there a sweepstake?
[18:04] <astrodog> Speed: I'm running a current model within some GIS software.
[18:05] <astrodog> The data itself is from the Met.
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[18:09] <g0hww> I wouldn't trust data from the police
[18:09] <SpeedEvil> ah
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[18:11] <astrodog> http://imgur.com/tWgYY - Same deal, with a rough uncertainty cone.
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[18:12] <astrodog> Roughly 1.5 square miles of "possible location" at the moment.
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[18:14] <SpeedEvil> say you could see it ad 50m, then that's only a few hundred miles of searching
[18:14] <SpeedEvil> dozen
[18:15] <astrodog> By morning, it'll be about 4 square miles, annoying on a boat, but doable from the air.
[18:15] <astrodog> Clearly, Lester needs a helicopter.
[18:15] <astrodog> :P
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[18:16] <astrodog> It's a shame I can't find any bouy data out there. It'd tighten up the estimate by a lot.
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[18:18] <astrodog> Hopefully, it stays on the inland side of that track. That'll dump it on the shore somewhere. On the seaside... it gets to go to Scotland. :P
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[18:27] <jcoxon> ping eroomde
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[18:31] <NickF> whats the latest on The Registers SPB launch? I know they gave up the search earlier - anything new?
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[18:33] <DMDeck16> r, wondering also
[18:34] <jcoxon> the search is off for tonight
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[18:35] <NickF> are they retrying tomorrow or is it a lost cause?
[18:35] <jcoxon> not sure
[18:35] <jcoxon> more likely it'll get washed up somewhere
[18:35] <jcoxon> but if they didn't hear it when searching earlier i doubt it'll survive
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[18:41] <Lunar_Lander> hello
[18:43] <DMDeck16> orite
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[19:03] <astrodog> http://imgur.com/hBxsH Latest run, red is assuming the 'chute is dragging it through the water... white-ish is assuming it's not
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[19:04] <x-f> dude
[19:04] <x-f> will you stick with this chatroom in the future, please? :)
[19:05] <Randomskk> astrodog: out of interest, what do you do this modelling for normally?
[19:05] <astrodog> Randomskk: Seismic survey correction, and finding things that fell off of rigs, basically.
[19:05] <Randomskk> cool
[19:06] <Randomskk> for a company or academic or?
[19:06] <astrodog> I'm a consultant for oil and gas companies... my... more day to day thing is manging and interpreting exploration data.
[19:07] <eroomde> astrodog: fascinating!
[19:07] <eroomde> is there much signal processing?
[19:07] <astrodog> In seismic data, there's quite a bit.
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[19:08] <eroomde> Randomskk and I have both done a bit of study of some signal processing techniques that are either born from the oil and gas industry or at least heavily used there
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[19:09] <astrodog> My math background isn't strong enough, sadly... but if you ever want to run something through the processing software, or see how it works, lemme know.
[19:09] <eroomde> bayesian techniques for things like spotting when you drill through geologically strata from a very noisy signal of slurry pressure data
[19:09] <eroomde> are you based in the uk?
[19:10] <astrodog> The US. I've worked in Asia a bit... went to a EuroBSDCon in the UK a few years ago, though.
[19:10] <eroomde> cool
[19:10] <eroomde> well, sterling work you're doing
[19:10] <eroomde> on the drift stuff
[19:11] <eroomde> given you're good at modelling how floaty stuff moves ontop of the sea, did you have any involvement with the deepwater horizon modelling?
[19:12] <astrodog> We modelled a lot of what went on with the Macondo well, yeah.
[19:12] <eroomde> fascinating
[19:12] <astrodog> Had a very fun map setup for that... showing the plume reports, predictions, and the ROV locations with live streams.
[19:12] <eroomde> so, do you work for a smaller consultancy or are you part of a big oil company?
[19:13] <eroomde> sorry for the twenty questions, i just find this all very interesting
[19:13] <astrodog> Small company... just me and a handful of others.
[19:13] <astrodog> We work for a few big companies, a few medium sized ones... and a pile of little ones.
[19:13] <eroomde> :)
[19:13] <eroomde> so are there gloabbly published datasets for water movement?
[19:14] <eroomde> for example an equivalent to the gloabl forecast system we use for our flight computer, but for water currents?
[19:14] <eroomde> globaly*
[19:14] <astrodog> You can cover the entire globe in open data... but it's all regional, if that makes sense.
[19:14] <eroomde> sure
[19:15] <astrodog> So, for this, I had to dig up the UK Met datasets to do the longer timed runs.
[19:15] <eroomde> so are you modelling it opn surface winds or water currents?
[19:15] <eroomde> and are they correlated?
[19:15] <eroomde> again, sorry for the interogation
[19:17] <astrodog> The predictions you're seeing there use both. One assumes the chute is tied up with the container, and the wind is a major factor... the other assumes the chute is acting like a sail in the water, and that the current is far and away the predominant impact.
[19:17] <eroomde> interesting
[19:18] <astrodog> Since we don't have any details about how the container rides in the water, it's hard to model what the wind might do to it.
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[19:18] <eroomde> if it's ok to keep asking questions, with the oil leek stuff, presumably there are datasets for water currents at different depths. how is this data gathered? is there some analogue for weather balloons which capture wind data at different alts in the atmosphere?
[19:18] <astrodog> There are.
[19:18] <Randomskk> buoys, I imagine :P
[19:19] <eroomde> also sorry for the slack typing, a friend popped over with a stilton cheese he won and some port earlier
[19:19] <eroomde> i'm in a merry place
[19:19] <astrodog> Buoys, or you can do direct measurement with ROVs at a well site.
[19:19] <DMDeck16> tis a good place to be
[19:20] <eroomde> so for example, you can assign some vector to the current given what the rob is having to do to station-keep?
[19:20] <eroomde> rov not rob sorry
[19:20] <eroomde> or do they have actual direction and velocity instrumentaion?
[19:21] <astrodog> Some carry instrumentation, but generally what you do is take where the ROV actually went... against where it would go in that configuration in calm water.
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[19:21] <eroomde> sure
[19:21] <eroomde> interesting
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[19:22] <eroomde> as a few others have said, do please hang around in the channel :)
[19:23] <eroomde> this is fascinating stuff
[19:24] <astrodog> Sure.
[19:24] <eroomde> i'm also interested as a few of my friends from university ended up in oil and gas
[19:24] <eroomde> it gets a good share of bright engineers
[19:25] <mclane> github gqrx
[19:25] <eroomde> i also worked in oil and gas for a year, although as a smaller subcontractor for a bit of tech used in turbomachinery
[19:25] <mclane> sorry wrong window
[19:25] <eroomde> but i was always very impressed by the scale of things
[19:25] <astrodog> eroomde: It does. It'll be interesting to see how it develops in Europe.
[19:26] <astrodog> The Paris Basin is... very large.
[19:26] <eroomde> my last job involved quite a few north sea ferries
[19:26] <eroomde> and it's amazing how busy the north sea is
[19:26] <astrodog> Every time Russia twists the knife... the French move a little closer to letting people drill it.
[19:26] <eroomde> you think of the kind of projects that if government do, attract huge amounts of press scrutiny
[19:26] <eroomde> new motorways, buildings, military procurement, or whatever
[19:27] <astrodog> Oh, yeah... the scale can be kind of insane.
[19:27] <eroomde> the become A Huge Thing
[19:27] <eroomde> but the oil and gas industries do things like this the whole time that you never even hear about
[19:27] <eroomde> and they just seem to get it done
[19:27] <eroomde> although, a lot of my more directly connected friends have their share of horror stories
[19:27] <eroomde> but still
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[19:28] <astrodog> Well... rigs can cost hundreds of thousands of dollars per hour to have sitting around with staff... so there's a very strong incentive to do things like run out a road, pipeline, or port quickly.
[19:29] <eroomde> one watched documentaries about how proper maintaine dhighways in africa would promote trade, but it's just too big and expensive a project
[19:29] <eroomde> but compared to a lot of the energy infrastrucure done privately, it seems like small bananas
[19:30] <eroomde> i worked on a subsea pipe project called ormen lange
[19:30] <eroomde> the geology was fascinating
[19:30] <astrodog> Part of the problem the industry runs into is corruption. Operating somewhere like Africa... they'd much rather just make their own highway, than try to pay their way through the permit process to make it public when they're done.
[19:30] <eroomde> but the engineering was incfredible
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[19:31] <eroomde> we were connecting a site halways up norway off the coast to scotland
[19:31] <eroomde> which is a huge distance
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[19:31] <astrodog> *nod*
[19:31] <eroomde> just when you consider how much steel and subsea turbomachinery that is
[19:32] <eroomde> it was breath-taking
[19:32] <eroomde> i work in a much smaller field now
[19:32] <eroomde> but it was a valuable lesson in the power of capital
[19:33] <astrodog> What always blew me away was just the scale of the businesses involved... a small oil and gas company may only have 20 people... but it'll be directing billions of dollars in capital.
[19:33] <eroomde> yeah
[19:34] <eroomde> for all our fancy tech, it's really nothing compared to digging stuff out the grand
[19:34] <eroomde> when you looks at the kind of money involved
[19:34] <eroomde> ground*
[19:36] <astrodog> Directional drilling is another... kind of incredible process... it's the engineering equivilent of chaining enough straws to go completely across a football pitch... then poking one into the lid of a cup with it hooked sideways. :P
[19:36] <eroomde> oh that's mind boggling
[19:36] <eroomde> there was a big Schlumberger research centre at my uni
[19:36] <eroomde> so inevitably there were a few sponsored talks and drinks things from them
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[19:36] <eroomde> so one got to see some of the stuff they did
[19:37] <eroomde> and it's really impressive
[19:37] <eroomde> the accuracy of the drill heads
[19:37] <eroomde> the precision they can get with such noisy feedback
[19:37] <eroomde> it's very eye-opening
[19:38] <eroomde> or just being able to transmit that kind of torque through 90 degree bends
[19:38] <astrodog> A well I'm following right now is following a 6 foot formation for ~5,000 feet, at a depth of ~12,000 feet.
[19:38] <eroomde> Neil, who is doing some of the electronics for this lohan thing, did a lot of electronics consultancy for drill heads
[19:38] <eroomde> and he inevitably has some old sea-dog tales
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[19:39] <eroomde> but it's well impressive
[19:39] <eroomde> just like that thing you just boshed off
[19:39] <Randomskk> har har
[19:39] <Randomskk> "well" impressive
[19:39] <astrodog> It's on a 98 degree bend... drilling entirely on the motor in the drillhead. The fact that it works at all is incredible.
[19:39] <eroomde> 0.1% accuracy
[19:39] <eroomde> i mean, that's instrumentation-grade stuff
[19:40] <eroomde> i so wish someone found an oil field or gas pocket in space
[19:40] <eroomde> the amount of R&D money we'd get...
[19:40] <astrodog> Titan. *grin*
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[19:40] <eroomde> lol
[19:40] <eroomde> yes true
[19:40] <astrodog> (I've actually got a reserve report for Titan somewhere around here.)
[19:40] <eroomde> shame about the 9 year round trip
[19:40] <eroomde> feally!?
[19:40] <eroomde> really*
[19:41] <eroomde> tongue in cheek or for reals?
[19:41] <astrodog> It's a legitimate analysis... but it was done to poke fun at some shareholders.
[19:41] <eroomde> :)
[19:41] <eroomde> too much peter diamandis bs
[19:41] <astrodog> They were, basically, asking what the company would do if it had ARAMCO's capital.
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[19:42] <eroomde> it's depressing
[19:42] <astrodog> Their response was a reserve analysis of Titan, including fun things like estimated transportation cost. :P
[19:42] <eroomde> we have what we think is a really cool breakthrough bit of technology
[19:43] <eroomde> for terestrial and space transport
[19:43] <eroomde> and we could fund the next phase of it with aramco's pencil budget
[19:43] <astrodog> That was, I think, the client's point. If they had that sort of capital, all sorts of things become possible.
[19:43] <eroomde> but the reality of fund raising for the next phase is very much harder
[19:43] <eroomde> yeah
[19:44] <eroomde> but one, with one's own interests (fervently held but nonetheless), thinks 'if only they knew about uas'
[19:44] <eroomde> us*
[19:44] <eroomde> problem solved overnight
[19:44] <eroomde> astrodog: there's a chap on this channel
[19:44] <eroomde> my old bos
[19:44] <eroomde> who designed the landing system for huygens
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[19:45] <eroomde> he's not on right now
[19:45] <eroomde> thought i'd mention it topically given the titan chat
[19:45] <eroomde> very interesting guy
[19:45] <astrodog> Most of the current space-based stuff in oil and gas is driven by remote sensing. They have some very cool proposals for things like microsats.
[19:46] <eroomde> well, that's partly my motivation
[19:46] <eroomde> we have a tech that we think should reduce the cost/kg gto orbit by about 100
[19:46] <eroomde> and the main motivation for my working on it is with what it enables in low earth orbit for earth observation
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[19:46] <astrodog> If you consider that the average medium to large sized oil and gas company currently spends 10-20M a year on data that's derived from space sources... the economics actually get interesting.
[19:47] <eroomde> just in terms of how ones uses's the earth's land, agriculturally, to support the world's population
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[19:47] <eroomde> there are some astonishing statistics
[19:47] <eroomde> eg that only 14% of the food harvested in india makes it to the shop shelves
[19:48] <astrodog> What happens to the rest of it?
[19:48] <eroomde> for all our compaining about the faceless megacorps like tesco and walmart, they're increidibly efficient at supply chain
[19:48] <eroomde> oh, it just rots
[19:48] <eroomde> it sits in storage a day too long
[19:48] <eroomde> or the roads can't support the haulage volume that would be required
[19:49] <eroomde> or whatever
[19:49] <astrodog> Yeesh.
[19:49] <eroomde> yeah exactly
[19:49] <eroomde> and nearly half the population is at riask of starvation
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[19:49] <eroomde> yet it's not an unsolvable problem
[19:49] <eroomde> it's maddening
[19:50] <eroomde> whilst my work doesn;t directly address supply chain management, i think if every 'poor' country could afford a suite of agrivultural monitoring sats, it would change things
[19:50] <DMDeck16> have The Register been using this channel as their base for much of their HA project?
[19:50] <eroomde> DMDeck16: i beleive this is the first time properly
[19:51] <eroomde> but there has been a friendly cooperation egtween the register lot and the hobby scene here for a while
[19:51] <eroomde> between*
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[19:51] <eroomde> since PARIS
[19:52] <DMDeck16> I see, thanks, I've only very loosely followed their project because it's become so unwieldly! So hopefully it went okay today
[19:52] <eroomde> i think things got a bit wet
[19:52] <astrodog> DMD: As it stands now... their payload is somewhere in the English Channel.
[19:52] <eroomde> but you know, SCIENCE!
[19:52] <DMDeck16> oh dear
[19:52] <DMDeck16> can they track it?
[19:52] <astrodog> Sadly, no.
[19:53] <eroomde> often we design our payloads with the antenna pointing down
[19:53] <eroomde> works fine when the payload is at a higher altitude than you
[19:53] <DMDeck16> note to El Reg: next time use more tupperware
[19:53] <eroomde> but when you're in an electrolytic solution like slaty seawater, not so good
[19:53] <eroomde> salty*
[19:53] <astrodog> eroomde: You know... something that'd be easy to add, and would greatly aid in finding something in the water is a dye packet and a sonar source.
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[19:54] <eroomde> sonar source would be interesting
[19:54] <astrodog> (A more complex, though very cool solution that's been used on ROVs is a tethered balloon)
[19:54] <eroomde> ukhas has grown enough in the last couple of years that we might be able to afford a sonar bouy in the english channel
[19:54] <eroomde> it claims enough payloads to justify the expense :)
[19:55] <astrodog> Ha.
[19:55] <eroomde> before we wrote the predictor, balloon flights were literally sacrife-a-goat-to-aeolus to hope for a dry landing
[19:55] <DMDeck16> so presumably no footage, tracks or anything to be had from the day?
[19:55] <astrodog> On some of the larger ROVs... when they lose their tether... they automatically surface, try to radio location, and release a small tethered balloon.
[19:55] <astrodog> Tracks, but that's it.
[19:55] <eroomde> DMDeck16: often stuff washes up
[19:56] <eroomde> and SD cards are quite amazing
[19:56] <eroomde> the group i used to run lost a fair new to the north sea
[19:56] <eroomde> and the often washed up in denmark
[19:56] <eroomde> and we could get pictures off the sd card
[19:56] <BrainDamage> random idea: a weight on rails and a motor to shift the center of gravity of the payload to make it flip in the case it detects it's in water, the antenna would still be awfully close to water, but at least not n it
[19:56] <astrodog> eroomde: It'd be pretty easy to develop that if people are consistently having this problem.
[19:56] <BrainDamage> ofc only suitable for large ones
[19:56] <DMDeck16> before launching did they have to notify any authority to ensure they didn't stick it into the turbine of a passing jet?
[19:57] <eroomde> this was the flight computer after one particular sea landing and 3 months at sea
[19:57] <eroomde> http://www.flickr.com/photos/cuspaceflight/3863616068/in/set-72157622038400075/
[19:57] <astrodog> Brain: I think the problem is that the seawater will destroy the electrical environment anyway. Even if you can get the antenna pointed in the right direction... if it's been dunked, things won't play nice.
[19:57] <eroomde> but we got data off the sd card in the sd slot on it
[19:57] <BrainDamage> you can seal the payload provide you provide a pressure equalizing system
[19:57] <BrainDamage> even a simple latex ballon
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[19:58] <eroomde> astrodog: as you can see, the seawater did Bad Things to the flight computer
[19:58] <astrodog> Yeah.
[19:58] <eroomde> but a wirebrush tool on the dremel to clean up the sd card contacts, and it was fine
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[19:59] <eroomde> i was suitably impressed
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[20:00] <DMDeck16> on their page they mention usb transmitters onboard... did anyone successfully pick those up?
[20:01] <astrodog> They have telemetry all the way to about 100m above the sea.
[20:01] <astrodog> After that... *shrug*
[20:01] <DMDeck16> an expensive firework then, but good fun
[20:02] <astrodog> We'll see... the current model gives it a 65% chance of washing up relatively nearby.
[20:02] <chris_99> someone should totally do, high altitude fireworks
[20:02] <astrodog> chris: There wouldn't be much to see.
[20:02] <chris_99> you'd record it with a camera though
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[20:12] <DMDeck16> well good luck on future projects
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[21:30] <Willdude123> Can anyone help with an Arduino thing? People in #arduino won't help me.What should I do with http://pastebin.com/Gg3LtnjB to make it work?
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[21:35] <Lunar_Lander> Willdude123, can I give you a general hint?
[21:35] <Lunar_Lander> http://paste.ubuntu.com/ is much better (no ads and stuff :))
[21:36] <Willdude123> OK.
[21:36] <Willdude123> Thanks.
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[21:36] <Lunar_Lander> you're welcome
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[21:36] <daveake> I'll give a better hint. Show us the code that isn't working. 90%+ of what you listed isn't used in your code, and you're missing all the interesting stuff
[21:37] <daveake> Also ... did you write it? What do you expect it to do?
[21:38] <Willdude123> I am trying to use remote codes for samsung tvs and transmit them through irsend.
[21:39] <daveake> Your program appears to just send the "on" code forever. Which seems a bit strange.
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[21:40] <Willdude123> I am a shit programmer. I really have no idea how the fix this.
[21:40] <Willdude123> :(
[21:41] <daveake> Well can you read it? Can you see what it's doing?
[21:42] <Willdude123> Maybe I should have it as a void setup loop so it only sends it when it first boots.
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[21:44] <Willdude123> How do I define IRremote? Shouldn't it have been defined in the library?
[21:44] <daveake> Maybe. If that's what you want - for it to send once only. I don't know what your intentions are so it's difficult to know. However, calling it in an infinite loop is very likely not what you intended.
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[21:44] <Dan-K2VOL> hi Daveake
[21:44] <daveake> If you've included the IR lib in your project then that bit is done for you
[21:44] <daveake> hi Dan
[21:45] <Dan-K2VOL> how did the iridium go on the flight
[21:45] <daveake> Anyhoo, if it's not doing anything to your TV, it could be .... IR diode reverse; IR diode on wrong pin; wrong code for your TV
[21:46] <daveake> Not bad Dan. It did stop unfortunately, which is something we saw in testing but didn't get an answer from Rock in time, so flew it anyway
[21:46] <Willdude123> But, it isn't defined for some ridiculous reason.
[21:46] <daveake> #include the library then
[21:47] <daveake> What happens is that after running a session including sending a message, it sometimes gives no result string and won't reply to any more commands, even though the message was sent OK
[21:48] <daveake> It managed quite a few messages during flight but stopped at 12km during descent IIRC
[21:48] <daveake> The spacenear gateway worked perfectly
[21:48] <Dan-K2VOL> how often were you sending them?
[21:48] <Dan-K2VOL> and at what interval?
[21:49] <daveake> During flight (>500m) it started a new one 2 mins after the last one was successfully sent.
[21:49] <daveake> <=500m it was every 10 mins
[21:49] <daveake> The problem happened during ground testing at the 10 min rate
[21:49] <Dan-K2VOL> the interval was precisley 10 minutes?
[21:49] <Willdude123> I have #included the library.
[21:50] <daveake> 10 mins after the end of one session it started the process for the next one
[21:50] <daveake> Which was ... Get sig strength ... if >0 then copy message and then start session
[21:51] <Willdude123> #include <IRremote.h>;
[21:51] <daveake> then if the message send failed it waited 10 secs (I think, might have been 30) then tested rssi again
[21:51] <daveake> You don't need the ; btw
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[21:52] <Willdude123> Oh. But still, won't work. I really have no clue. I have included the library, which should have defined it.
[21:52] <daveake> "won't work" means what?
[21:52] <daveake> why do you think the routine is not defined?
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[21:54] <Willdude123> It says that it isn't when I verify the code.
[21:55] <Willdude123> http://paste.ubuntu.com/1403159/
[21:56] <Willdude123> This code says it isn't defined in the setup scope.
[21:56] <Willdude123> So far, I can't even get the code on the board.
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[21:59] <daveake> And you've added this library to the project?
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[22:05] <Willdude123> Yep.
[22:05] <Willdude123> hence the #include <IRremote.h>
[22:06] <x-f> where did you get that code from?
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[22:09] <mfa298> Is the #include enough to initalize the library, often #include only makes the library available to use it doesn't set anything up.
[22:11] <daveake> It simply includes the contents of the .h file, which normally would just contain definitions
[22:11] <DrLuke> I think you can think of it as if you copy and pasted the entire contents of the file you're including into that part of your code
[22:11] <daveake> yep
[22:11] <x-f> there is no definition what pin to use for sending
[22:13] <x-f> and his replies take too long..
[22:13] <x-f> good night, folks.
[22:13] <daveake> nn :)
[22:13] <Dan-K2VOL> night x-f
[22:14] <fsphil> some people include code in .h files. they need slapped
[22:14] <DrLuke> why?
[22:14] <Dan-K2VOL> lol or a helping hand, some of us don't program off
[22:14] <Dan-K2VOL> ten
[22:14] <DrLuke> oh wait
[22:15] <fsphil> slapped, then helped
[22:15] <Dan-K2VOL> heh
[22:15] <Dan-K2VOL> they'll remember better
[22:20] <g7ogxchris> Can some kind soul explain why I get this message everytime I launch the HAB variant of fldigi please?"CAUGHT RUNTIME ERROR HTTP 403"
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[22:22] <wokstation> Evening.
[22:22] <Dan-K2VOL> so how are the regs in the UK if you guys wanted to do heavier flights?
[22:22] <Dan-K2VOL> is there an application/review process as in the US?
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[22:25] <SpeedEvil> yes
[22:25] <SpeedEvil> you need to apply to the CAA
[22:26] <Laurenceb_> how do i change a file to -rwxr-xr-x ? using chown?
[22:27] <daveake> chmod
[22:27] <Dan-K2VOL> do people do it that often SpeedEvil?
[22:27] <daveake> g7ogzchris Try downloading latest version
[22:27] <Laurenceb_> oh
[22:27] <Laurenceb_> chmod what arguments?
[22:27] <SpeedEvil> Dan-K2VOL: all out fligjtrs other than the pico ones require approval
[22:27] <daveake> chown changes owner
[22:27] <BrainDamage> chmod a+x g+rx u+rwxr
[22:27] <BrainDamage> all, group, user
[22:27] <SpeedEvil> chmod 755?
[22:27] <jonsowman> yeah
[22:27] <jonsowman> chmod 755 file
[22:27] <wokstation> Any word from that vulturey lot?
[22:27] <Laurenceb_> ok
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[22:28] <Dan-K2VOL> ahhh that's interesting SpeedEvil, so if you're going for approval, is there a next larger class of rules that you must follow, or just hope they like your plan
[22:29] <SpeedEvil> not looked into it
[22:29] <daveake> when does "heavier" start?
[22:29] <Dan-K2VOL> I mean when you need to get approval
[22:30] <daveake> That was my question :)
[22:30] <Dan-K2VOL> oh, it's like 1 cu m of balloon, isn't it?
[22:30] <Dan-K2VOL> something very small like that
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[22:31] <daveake> Oh, if you mean "when do you need permission", it's ">2m in any directiona at any point during the flight"
[22:31] <Dan-K2VOL> ah diameter
[22:31] <daveake> Well.... if you have a 1.5m dia balloon and 0.5 of string/payload underneath, that's the limit
[22:32] <daveake> And this is at any point during flight
[22:32] <Dan-K2VOL> rather restrictive
[22:32] <daveake> So basically that's a pretty small latex balloon
[22:32] <daveake> indeed
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[22:33] <daveake> I /thought/ you were asking about very large payloads. I don't recall anything about some upper limit. Largest I've done was 1.5kg of payloads total
[22:33] <daveake> Today we had 5kg of neck lift to keep the landing on land. Still didn't work :(
[22:34] <Dan-K2VOL> I suppose I was, yes, I mean are there CAA rules you have to follow
[22:34] <daveake> Ascent rate/burst/descent rate all very very close to predictions, but the flight path wasn't
[22:34] <daveake> Only "use a parachute"
[22:34] <Dan-K2VOL> ah forecast models
[22:34] <Dan-K2VOL> interesting
[22:34] <daveake> We think it was because the path changed a fair bit during the day, and the change happened earlier than expected
[22:35] <daveake> We aimed for 6.5m/s ascent and got it. Aimed for 27km burst and got it. Aimed for 6m/s landing speed and got it.
[22:35] <Dan-K2VOL> in the US (and international law too) we basically are allowed to launch up to 5.4kg without approval, and then a significant number of restrictions and requirements are applied that you either must meet, or ask for permission to not meet
[22:35] <Dan-K2VOL> nice
[22:35] <daveake> Aimed for the land and missed the coast by 6 miles :(
[22:36] <Dan-K2VOL> that sucks, that iridium is expensive
[22:36] <daveake> Prediction had it landing well inland
[22:36] <daveake> well i didn't pay for it :p
[22:36] <Dan-K2VOL> oh?
[22:36] Action: SpeedEvil sighs.
[22:36] <daveake> Flight was for The Register
[22:36] <Dan-K2VOL> nice
[22:36] <Dan-K2VOL> what was their angle
[22:36] <SpeedEvil> I'd love a nice bar of Rh/Ir.
[22:37] <daveake> I was just providing the launch site, though as they sent me the 9602 I added that as an extra test
[22:37] <Dan-K2VOL> cool
[22:38] <daveake> It was only put together a few days before, and then only because I had it and felt duty bound to at least try it
[22:38] <wokstation> 6miles offshore? Hope the playmobile guy can swim :(
[22:38] <daveake> Hired a boat but couldn't find it
[22:38] <Dan-K2VOL> ugh
[22:39] <daveake> By then it was 2 hours after splashdown, and none of the transmitters could be heard
[22:39] <daveake> About time I made a waterproof tracker :)
[22:40] <wokstation> which coast?
[22:41] <daveake> south
[22:42] <wokstation> No chance of it showing up my way then, am out on the east
[22:43] <daveake> It's on a clockwise journey apparently
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[22:48] <g7ogxchris> dave you had a lot of followers this afternoon me included a great afternoon hope you enjoyed it too.
[22:48] <griffonbot> Received email: Steve Aerospace "Re: [UKHAS] Re: Fogging Camera Lenses - Problem?"
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[22:49] <wokstation> Well, I must be away. A big shame about LOHAN.
[22:50] <wokstation> Suppose now we gotta convince em to try again. Cyas.
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[22:54] <fsphil> if I want a mosfet that can be switched with 3.3v, the value I need to look for is VGS?
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[22:55] <mattbrejza> fsphil: yep
[22:55] <SpeedEvil> no
[22:55] <mattbrejza> lol
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[22:56] <SpeedEvil> vgs(th) is largely irrelevant
[22:56] <mattbrejza> also ron/vin curves
[22:56] <mattbrejza> is best?
[22:56] <SpeedEvil> you want to look at the RDS(on) volts age
[22:56] <SpeedEvil> voltage
[22:56] <SpeedEvil> is it specified at 3.3v
[22:56] <fsphil> right
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[22:57] <SpeedEvil> Vgs(th) is the voltage at which it passes (say ) 250uA
[22:57] <SpeedEvil> also beware that the voltage threshold drifts up a lot at -20c
[22:58] <SpeedEvil> meaning you need to apply more volts
[22:58] <fsphil> I knew it wouldn't be that simple :)
[22:58] <SpeedEvil> what are you switching?
[22:59] <fsphil> power to a servo
[22:59] <fsphil> which to be honest, I might not even need to bother with
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[23:16] <SpeedEvil> http://www.digikey.com/product-detail/en/BSL802SN%20L6327/BSL802SN%20L6327INCT-ND/2268924
[23:17] <SpeedEvil> for ex
[23:18] Nick change: NickF -> NickSF
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[23:29] <fsphil> thanks
[23:29] <fsphil> still over my head but I'll read up some more
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[23:35] Nick change: Upu_M0UPU -> Upu
[23:36] <astrodog> Anyone know if they're going to take a shot at finding LOHAN tomorrow?
[23:36] <Randomskk> https://www.dropbox.com/s/zmtwm8h7ou48hn9/2012-12-01%2022.14.40.jpg :D
[23:37] <astrodog> Ha, fun.
[23:37] <daveake> It's a bit crude, but I've overlaid the actual flight path on top of this morning's prediction. We hit the ascent/descent rates and burst alt within tiny error margins, yet ... http://i.imgur.com/y4OZR.jpg
[23:37] <daveake> oo pointy
[23:37] <Upu> no astrodog
[23:37] <astrodog> dave: Do you have the X/Ys for the prediction?
[23:37] <Upu> 220miles in 2h 40 :)
[23:38] <daveake> Prediction: http://habhub.org/predict/#!/uuid=eaa4ba54fc9c5148e9b8deb33ffa2d3ec3da03c6
[23:38] <astrodog> Alright, one sec.
[23:38] <daveake> Clearly Upu you horizontal speed exceeded predictions. Theme of the day :D
[23:38] <Randomskk> weeeird.
[23:38] <Randomskk> that's incredibly wrong
[23:38] <daveake> your*
[23:39] <Randomskk> I've never seen it be so inaccurate.
[23:39] <daveake> Not even the same shape
[23:39] <daveake> Nor me
[23:39] <Randomskk> for reference what were the ascent and descent?
[23:39] <Dan-K2VOL> how old was the GFS file
[23:39] <daveake> Nowhere near
[23:39] <astrodog> Random: I'm gonna overlay that on some weather data.
[23:39] <daveake> I mean, I've not seen it anywhere near that inaccurate
[23:39] <daveake> midnight last night
[23:39] <Dan-K2VOL> if the GFS file was old, that would explain it
[23:39] <Randomskk> GFS model was _apparently_ 2012/12/01 0000Z
[23:39] <daveake> The 6am one would have come in about launch time, so we could have redone it maybe
[23:40] <Upu> it was extremely odd
[23:40] <daveake> That said, the prediction hadn't noticeable changed for 2 days
[23:40] <Upu> especially considering we got the ascent rate and burst spot on
[23:40] <Upu> burst within 300 meters of what we wanted
[23:40] <Randomskk> what were the ascent rate and burst?
[23:40] <daveake> So I wasn't expecting it to change a lot from 00:00 to 06:00
[23:40] <astrodog> What's the format for the CSV that spits out? I've got lat... but I can't find anything under lon.
[23:40] <Upu> 7m/s up 6m/s down
[23:41] <daveake> 6.5 expected, and we got 6.47 or seomthing
[23:41] <Lunar_Lander> hi Upu
[23:41] <Randomskk> astrodog: I think the long is just the wrong way around
[23:41] <Randomskk> i.e. subtract it from 360
[23:41] <Upu> 27km burst
[23:41] <Randomskk> it's time (unix timestamp), lat, lng, alt
[23:41] <daveake> Burst was only 300m or so above prediction
[23:41] <Upu> hi Lunar
[23:41] <astrodog> Random: Oh. That's awful. One sec. *grin*
[23:41] <Randomskk> daveake: Upu: 6.5 or 7? :P
[23:41] <Randomskk> astrodog: yea I dunno why it's done that :P
[23:41] <daveake> Landing prediction was about 6m/s and we got 6.4 @ 2km
[23:41] <daveake> 6.5
[23:42] <Upu> sorry ignore me
[23:42] <Randomskk> upwards
[23:42] <daveake> Ignore Upu; I did the predictions :)
[23:42] <Upu> I was rounding up
[23:42] <Randomskk> haha okay
[23:42] <Randomskk> yea
[23:42] <Randomskk> still
[23:42] <Randomskk> so wrong
[23:42] <Randomskk> very weird
[23:42] <daveake> lol
[23:42] <Upu> we wouldn't have launched if it had gone so close to the coast
[23:43] <Randomskk> yea
[23:43] <astrodog> daveake: Any idea what the prediction looks like with the next GFS run?
[23:43] <Randomskk> something's very weird that
[23:43] <Randomskk> there
[23:43] <daveake> No sorry
[23:44] <astrodog> Well... assuming that one is... equally wrong, maybe we can figure out what else the predictor needs to do better. *grin*
[23:44] <Upu> it was spot on for my flight if that helps
[23:44] <Randomskk> astrodog: if you do the same launch right now, with the latest data, you get...
[23:44] <Randomskk> http://habhub.org/predict/#!/uuid=f497ec2d9a44eabb98a2ab10ae282ea2bf7aa2c8
[23:44] <Randomskk> which is a _lot_ better
[23:44] <Randomskk> i.e. looks more accurate
[23:44] <astrodog> Yeah.
[23:44] <Randomskk> I wonder what the 06z model would have looked like
[23:44] <Randomskk> hmm
[23:44] <astrodog> Any way to test it with the 6...
[23:44] <astrodog> Yeahj.
[23:45] <Upu> yeah unsurprisingly we wouldn't have launched with that :)
[23:45] <Upu> http://imgur.com/a/LPQED
[23:45] <Upu> Anyway big thanks to all who helped out
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[23:46] <Upu> there are no plans to recover
[23:46] <Upu> may wash up one day
[23:46] <astrodog> Upu: Better luck next time. You might get lucky in the next few days on recovery.
[23:46] <Upu> probably £500's of kit on it
[23:46] <Upu> used once, slightly damp
[23:46] <astrodog> Heh.
[23:49] <astrodog> http://imgur.com/MjvDh
[23:49] <astrodog> There's a bit cleaner version of the difference between prediction and actual.
[23:49] <Randomskk> crazy
[23:50] <astrodog> I'm gonna see if I can add some winds aloft data... what should have been in the GFS model.
[23:50] <astrodog> Oh.
[23:50] <astrodog> Yeah.
[23:51] <astrodog> You were toast. Heh.
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[23:52] <Lunar_Lander> daveake, do you want to hear a new stupidiest champion moment from me?
[23:52] <daveake> Go on
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[23:54] <Upu> astrodog
[23:54] <Upu> that imaged you linked
[23:54] <Upu> can I give it to Lester ?
[23:55] <astrodog> Sure.
[23:56] <Lunar_Lander> one moment
[23:56] <Upu> did you find your way here via the reg ?
[23:56] <astrodog> Me? Yeah.
[23:56] <Upu> I said I'd mail him to explain how the predictor works and why it could have been off
[23:57] <astrodog> Also... looking at GFS, the model was right... it'd just shifted.
[23:57] <Randomskk> though honestly that's just bizarre
[23:57] <Upu> that image should answer some questions as I suspect readers will be questioning the prediction
[23:57] <Upu> but yeah its very odd I've never seen anything as off as that
[23:57] <Randomskk> it looks like their model changed a lot
[23:57] <Upu> but it is prediction not guaranteed results
[23:57] <astrodog> It's not as off as it looks... lemme see if I can show you.
[23:57] <daveake> Lester obeying all the H2 safety rules . http://s156.beta.photobucket.com/user/nailed_barnacle/media/Lohan%20December%2001%202012/PC011392.jpg.html?sort=3&o=23
[23:58] <Dan-K2VOL> oh, it happens, the weather in the real world often differs severely, and they take that into account every few years when they update the models to see if they can get it right in the future
[23:58] <daveake> My guess is that the winds predicted for later in the day happened early
[23:59] <Upu> yeah we got the 2pm prediction not the 11am one
[23:59] <Upu> and sorry about the feed going down at launch
[23:59] <Upu> my cock up
[23:59] <daveake> Only way to avoid that is to adopt a rule "if it changes to a "don't fly" within x hours of launch, don't launch
[23:59] <astrodog> It's also important to remember that things like GFS don't have any actual tie in to real location. They're only tied to where they think a given front/system/etc is when they're run.
[23:59] <Upu> my netbook didn't have its usual 3G car in so I was using daveake's wireless and walked out of range
[00:00] --- Sun Dec 2 2012