highaltitude.log.20121120

[00:00] <justinatomatic_> 2 recoverd rest tracking, getting more data locally that what is getting to the map
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[00:01] <fsphil> hehe, nothing received here
[00:01] <fsphil> but I'm surrounded by large buildings
[00:02] <natrium42> fsphil: are you listening to launches in australia :O
[00:02] <natrium42> ?
[00:02] <justinatomatic_> all heading down now so lost you shot, i'll try to post at peak for the next launches
[00:02] <fsphil> I'm in Sydney natrium42 :)
[00:03] <fsphil> ah
[00:03] <Darkside> justinatomatic_: starbuck is still going up
[00:03] <fsphil> it's starbuck I'm listening for
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[00:03] <Darkside> or is that just it not being updated in a while
[00:03] <fsphil> last line was just a few minutes ago
[00:03] <natrium42> fsphil: since when are you in aussie land?
[00:04] <fsphil> natrium42: just a week, and for a week longer :)
[00:04] <Darkside> looks like skulls is still going up, thats the one with an APRS tracker on it too
[00:04] <Laurenceb_> http://www.anorak.co.uk/wp-content/gallery/10-at-10-the-trophy-wife/ferdinand.jpg
[00:05] <natrium42> ah, cool
[00:05] <fsphil> Sydney is pretty much like London
[00:05] <fsphil> only with better weather
[00:06] <justinatomatic_> actually starbuck is still up at 20km
[00:06] <justinatomatic_> now 21
[00:06] <Darkside> hmm, i might be able to hear starbuck if it keeps going
[00:07] <fsphil> I don't think I will, unless it got a lot closer
[00:07] <justinatomatic_> Due to pop any moment :)
[00:07] <fsphil> someone needs to launch a floater in the next week :)
[00:07] <Darkside> fsphil: i could, but it wouldn't get to sydney
[00:08] <Darkside> unless we do horus 16 again
[00:08] <fsphil> you wouldn't want to risk landing here
[00:09] <justinatomatic_> Coming back down now
[00:09] <fsphil> I bet that was a busy launch site
[00:10] <fsphil> where there any pics taken?
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[00:22] <justinatomatic_> lots busey prepping for the next launch
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[00:37] <natrium42> what was wrong with tracking?
[00:51] <heathkid> anyone using a Trackuino?
[00:52] <heathkid> it's transmitting just fine... but I'm looking for software to decode it using my sound card. Any suggestions?
[00:52] <heathkid> ax.25 1200 baud packets
[00:52] <RG_LZ1DEV> mixw
[00:53] <heathkid> thanks! downloading now...
[00:53] <RG_LZ1DEV> you will need to select packet as mode
[00:53] <RG_LZ1DEV> and then configure it to standard 1200/2200 setting
[00:57] <heathkid> it's $50... anything free?
[00:58] <RG_LZ1DEV> its free
[00:58] <RG_LZ1DEV> no need to pay the 50$
[00:59] <RG_LZ1DEV> afraik you get all the features with the free version
[01:00] <heathkid> for 15 days
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[01:20] <natrium42> Laurenceb: http://goatse.cx
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[01:26] <yyta> anyone here?
[01:27] <yyta> is darkside here?
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[01:35] <yyta> anyone knows how to power supply the ground yagi antenna while its on the car?
[01:38] <fsphil> not sure what that means?
[01:40] <yyta> the receiver powered on the car
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[01:41] <fsphil> the radio? depends on the model, most have adaptors that plug into the cars 12V socket
[01:43] <yyta> do u know where to buy it?
[01:44] <fsphil> I don't know what radio you have :)
[01:44] <fsphil> and the likely answer is ebay :)
[01:45] <yyta> ARROW Mk.II 146/437-10WBP has 10W diplexer, split boom, cable using this one
[01:45] <yyta> frequency is 434 MHz
[01:46] <fsphil> that's an antenna?
[01:47] <yyta> its a yagi antenna
[01:48] <fsphil> what are you plugging it into?
[01:48] <yyta> car
[01:49] <fsphil> what radio though?
[01:49] <fsphil> you have to have a radio that works on 434mhz
[01:50] <fsphil> http://ukhas.org.uk/guides:tracking_guide
[01:52] <yyta> thx
[01:56] <heathkid> I still think the first two characters of a packet *should* contain what MODE it is... so any program would recognize the digital packet mode and automatically decode anything... just my opinion.
[01:57] <Darkside> there's already stuff for that
[01:57] <Darkside> the TxID stuff fldigi does
[01:57] <Darkside> but i dont think it includes things as detailed as shift for RTTY
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[02:12] <justinatomatic_> Maverick at 18.5 km if anybody's intrested
[02:13] <natrium42> that's a lot of balloons, justinatomatic_
[02:25] <Darkside> justinatomatic_: can't hear it here
[02:28] <fsphil> nor here
[02:29] <justinatomatic_> not surprising didn't make it over 20km
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[02:30] <justinatomatic_> another time we will have go for some height :)
[02:30] <Darkside> you've got 38.807km to beat :P
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[03:13] <heathkid> why can't I get ftdigi to decode my APRS packets? AX-25 1200 baud?
[03:13] <heathkid> wrong setting?
[03:13] <heathkid> won't do AFSK?
[03:17] <heathkid> I'm not the worlds greatest programmer (maybe not the worst... but I don't even consider myself a programmer).... but if I could do it.. I'd do a Raspberry Pi based stand-alone tracker... radio in... LCD display... done.
[03:18] <heathkid> a digipeater would be next on the list... but for starters just a stand-alone tracker...
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[03:18] <heathkid> where's a digipeater shield for the Arduino?
[03:19] <heathkid> or ARM based
[03:19] <heathkid> kinda overkill for packet though
[03:27] <heathkid> can I get ftdigi to work with AX-25 1200 baud? (APRS)
[03:27] <heathkid> so far I haven't found *any* setting that will decode the packets
[03:39] <stilldavid> heathkid: I've tried as well, I don't think it's possible.
[03:40] <heathkid> what are you using then?
[03:43] <heathkid> is APRS the wrong choice for a US launch?
[03:43] <heathkid> high-altitude/short duration float?
[03:44] <fsphil> I don't believe the current vresion of fldigi can do APRS
[03:44] <arko> evening gents
[03:44] <arko> it can't
[03:44] <fsphil> although there was code in the development branch a wihle back
[03:44] <heathkid> any suggestions on what can?
[03:44] <fsphil> which did work
[03:44] <arko> MixW
[03:45] <arko> heathkid: http://polysat.calpoly.edu/earthstation/software/mixw/index.php
[03:45] <arko> open your sql and adjust volume
[03:46] <heathkid> the latest version is $50 to register...
[03:46] <heathkid> is this a free version?
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[03:48] <arko> the one i have is free
[03:48] <heathkid> I'll give it a try
[03:48] <arko> sadly everything i could find that could decode aprs sucked :/
[03:48] <arko> gl
[03:53] <fsphil> aprs in general sucks a bit
[03:54] <arko> yep
[03:54] <arko> ax25 sucks
[03:54] <heathkid> heh
[03:55] <Darkside> gqrx will give you the demodulated ax25 packts
[03:55] <heathkid> MixW has more settings than the Space Shuttle did for a launch...
[03:55] <Darkside> oh god bloody MixW
[03:55] <heathkid> *help*
[03:55] <heathkid> Darkside: can you fix me?
[03:55] <Darkside> not for mixw
[03:55] <Darkside> i've only used it oce
[03:55] <Darkside> once*
[03:55] <heathkid> anything!
[03:56] <heathkid> I've downloaded dozed of programs now
[03:56] <heathkid> dozens
[03:56] <arko> heathkid: Yeah! but it would be nice if half those settings worked!
[03:56] <Darkside> so you're tryin gto demodulate AX25?
[03:56] <Darkside> well, gqrx will do it, but only with a SDR
[03:57] <heathkid> omg
[03:57] <Darkside> apart from that, i guess MixW might do it, or AGWPE on windows
[03:57] <heathkid> what am I doing? Trackuino anyone???
[03:57] <Darkside> what about trackuini?
[03:57] <heathkid> AGWPE what?
[03:57] <Darkside> AGWPE is a ax25 packet engine for windows
[03:57] <heathkid> that's what I'm using... well... it the mini-trackuino...
[03:57] <Darkside> other programs connect to it and use it as a modem
[03:58] <heathkid> $$$?
[03:58] <heathkid> which program?
[03:58] <Darkside> nah, free
[03:58] <heathkid> where? link?
[03:58] <heathkid> please?
[03:58] <Darkside> UI-View32 is the one most people seem to use
[03:58] <heathkid> help?
[03:58] <Darkside> though it is pretty crap
[03:58] <Darkside> just google it
[03:58] <Darkside> unfortinately there is no simple solution for AX25 decoding
[03:58] <Darkside> which is annoying, i know
[03:58] <Darkside> UI-View is a pain to get setup
[03:58] <Darkside> tbh i'd suggest you try and get MixW working first
[03:59] <Darkside> set a receiver to the local APRS frequency, and get it demodulating some packets
[04:00] <heathkid> "UI-View32 cannot be used without a registration."
[04:00] <heathkid> I give up
[04:00] <Darkside> use MixW then
[04:00] <Darkside> get it demodulating local APRS traffic first
[04:00] <Darkside> which it can do
[04:00] <heathkid> anyone want to buy a complete 600g Kaymont HAB system with APRS?
[04:01] <arko> whats the APRS system?
[04:01] <Darkside> don't give up!
[04:01] <heathkid> it shouldn't be this hard for AX25
[04:01] <Darkside> heathkid: use MixW
[04:01] <Darkside> it will demodulate it fine
[04:01] <heathkid> hold on... let me try it
[04:01] <Darkside> arko: custom trackuino pcb
[04:02] <arko> cool
[04:02] <Darkside> slightly bigger than a micronut :P
[04:02] <heathkid> what settings?
[04:02] <Darkside> heathkid: err
[04:02] <Darkside> 1200 baud AFSK or something
[04:03] <Darkside> i dont know
[04:03] <Darkside> i think you choose AX.25, then you go into the settings for that modem and change it to VHF 1200 baud
[04:03] <Darkside> oh wait - Mode -> Packet
[04:03] <Darkside> then Mode -> Mode Settings
[04:09] <arko> its in that cal poly link
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[04:17] <sparkgap> heathkid, having some trouble?
[04:17] <heathkid> just a bit
[04:18] <sparkgap> if it helps any, I had not much trouble with AGWPE
[04:18] <heathkid> which one? link?
[04:18] <heathkid> to the exact AGWPE software?
[04:18] <sparkgap> http://www.sv2agw.com/ham/agwpe.htm
[04:19] <heathkid> right... which program?
[04:19] <heathkid> there is a list of them
[04:19] <sparkgap> http://www.sv2agw.com/downloads/agwpe.zip that does the actual decoding, and then I used the TCPIP driver to talk to that from my application
[04:20] <sparkgap> using this http://www.codeplex.com/AgwpePort
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[04:26] <heathkid> sparkgap: I'm still trying to load the page... I'll take a look but I have to get some sleep...
[04:26] <heathkid> more tomorrow night....
[04:26] <heathkid> nite all....
[04:28] <sparkgap> night
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[08:31] <costyn> crap
[08:31] <fsphil> flush?
[08:31] <costyn> uploaded some test trackpoints to the tracker by accident
[08:31] <costyn> fsphil: if you could, plz
[08:31] <fsphil> hyperon?
[08:31] <costyn> deleted my callsign, should prevent uploads in the futre
[08:31] <costyn> fsphil: thats the one :)
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[08:32] <fsphil> gone. there are some amount of flights on there
[08:32] <costyn> indeed
[08:32] <costyn> aussies are going all-out
[08:33] <costyn> almost impossible to tell whats going on with that many balloons
[08:34] <costyn> I think we need more colors; there's 2 red, 2 green and 2 blue balloons
[08:34] <costyn> and 2 yellow
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[08:42] <jcoxon> the map has gone crazy!
[08:42] <Darkside> probably about time to clear that
[08:42] <Darkside> since they'll be launching tomorrow morning
[08:42] <jcoxon> what are the aims of these flights?
[08:42] <Darkside> they're all down
[08:43] <jcoxon> apart from art on the tracker
[08:43] <Darkside> not many packets got into habitat
[08:43] <Darkside> dunno why
[08:43] <jcoxon> i wonder if it was they way they had their timing
[08:43] <jcoxon> i suspect the planned to track all the flights from one station
[08:44] <jcoxon> but the difference in drift probably made it quite hard to follow each switch
[08:45] <fsphil> yea there's be almost no time to adjust
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[08:47] <jcoxon> shame we can't help out
[08:47] <jcoxon> fsphil, how long are you in Oz for?
[08:48] <fsphil> just till the end of the week
[08:48] <jcoxon> holiday? or work?
[08:49] <fsphil> holiday - came over to see the eclipse last week
[08:49] <Upu> thats a cool holiday :)
[08:49] <jcoxon> awesome
[08:49] <fsphil> it was a good plan :)
[08:49] <Upu> hey Darkside
[08:49] <jcoxon> wow 800km, thats an impressive record
[08:49] <Upu> did you see my post about the noise levels
[08:49] <Upu> yeah
[08:50] <Upu> propagation we think as it wasn't high at the time
[08:50] <fsphil> cloud got in the way: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yN_rx2d4BcY
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[08:51] <jcoxon> booo to clouds
[08:51] <Upu> indeed
[08:52] <jcoxon> a balloon could of got above the clouds...
[08:52] <Upu> Next solar eclipse I am putting multiple balloons up with cameras
[08:52] <fsphil> too much stuff to carry :)
[08:52] <Upu> 2016 I think
[08:52] <Darkside> svalbard?
[08:52] <fsphil> there's one in the US in a few years
[08:53] <fsphil> we could all invade Dan's house :)
[08:53] <Darkside> lol
[08:53] <Upu> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Solar_eclipse_of_March_20,_2015
[08:53] <Darkside> thats probably like saying "there's an eclipse in australia, let's all go to darkside's place'
[08:53] <Darkside> even though i'm THOUSANDS of km away from the eclipse area
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[08:53] <fsphil> haha yea
[08:53] <fsphil> three hour flight from sydney
[08:54] <fsphil> had a really nice cheese and ham toaste on the flight
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[09:05] <fsphil> there's one in 2015 visible from just north of the uk -- I wonder if being up higher would allow it to be seen from a UK launch site
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[09:07] <junderwood> Say it's at a latitude of 65deg. The sun in June is 23 deg above the equator so it would be at 40 deg above the horizon - say 45.
[09:08] <junderwood> The path of totality is about 200 miles north of Scotland
[09:08] <junderwood> so you would need an altitude of about 200 miles above Scotland to see it
[09:08] <fsphil> ah well :)
[09:08] <fsphil> anyone got a boat?
[09:08] <junderwood> e&oe
[09:09] <junderwood> That's for midday. If it happens closer to dawn or dusk, there may be more chance
[09:12] <hibby> everyone to hibby's then?
[09:15] <hibby> the north of scotland would be a good place to start, and we could try to commandeer one of the work's Ku band dishes to use for telem. The riggers can do without a link back to base for a few hours... what's the worst that could happen?
[09:15] <fsphil> unless you know someone with a house in the Faroe Islands...
[09:16] <hibby> as a matter of fact...
[09:16] <hibby> lemme just ping him
[09:20] <hibby> we shall find out indue course.
[09:20] <hibby> first hab launch from Faroes? a mesh network of floaters?
[09:22] <fsphil> not sure if you'd try to image the sun, or just go for a wide-angle and image the shadow on the earth
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[09:26] <hibby> hence the mesh!
[09:26] <hibby> have them aware of the direction the side designated as front is facing, use reaction wheels to align them facing in different directions!
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[09:27] <hibby> if we start working on it now, it might become a reality(!)
[09:28] <jcoxon> :-)
[09:29] <fsphil> hah
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[09:31] <hibby> to quote from the book of Clarkston, 1:1, "And he said unto his fellow enthusiasts 'How hard can it be?', And noises of agreement were heard"
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[09:38] <New2Balloon> Hi all, been scanning around the net, found a refernce to NigelS and some code he wrote to connect the Arduino>NTX2>GPS http://www.mattltm.co.uk/2011/02/18/basic-tracking-transmitter/ I notice NigelS not here as a user but the legacy says he has been... anyone point me in the direction said code? cheers all, great resource at UKHAS :)
[09:40] <jcoxon> New2Balloon, seen this? http://wiki.ukhas.org.uk/guides:linkingarduinotontx2
[09:42] <New2Balloon> jcoxon, yes thanks. got that working fine, it is the linking of a sensor to the code and having it's output sent via the ntx2 i'm lloking at. Mattltm suggests the code is out there but doesn't link it?
[09:42] <hibby> god, whatever happened to nigey? Not being here in ages,you come to miss the regular faces.
[09:43] <jcoxon> New2Balloon, okay well it depends on the sensor
[09:44] <New2Balloon> i hoped you wounldn't say that :)
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[09:44] <jcoxon> its not that straightforward unfortunately
[09:45] <New2Balloon> I have a Ublox GPS, advice on that would put this complete coding novice in the right direction to try and fail... or fail and try :)
[09:46] <jcoxon> okay
[09:46] <jcoxon> so ublox is a good choice
[09:46] <jcoxon> have you wired it up?
[09:47] <New2Balloon> not yet for feer of frying it... that is a project for this afternoon
[09:47] <jcoxon> okay well http://ukhas.org.uk/guides:ublox6
[09:47] <jcoxon> has code
[09:47] <jcoxon> do you have a usb-serial convertor?
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[09:49] <New2Balloon> jcoxon, nope using the neo-6m, i believe that ouputs serial data?
[09:50] <jcoxon> yup
[09:50] <jcoxon> basically GPS modules are nice and simple
[09:50] <jcoxon> you need Power (VCC) which is usually 3.3v, ground
[09:50] <jcoxon> and then serial out
[09:51] <jcoxon> once you apply power it just start sending data out
[09:51] <jcoxon> your first job is to actually see the data
[09:51] <New2Balloon> OK
[09:52] <jcoxon> what arduino do you have?
[09:52] <New2Balloon> Uno R3
[09:52] <jcoxon> where did you get your gps from?
[09:54] <New2Balloon> ebay...
[09:54] <New2Balloon> http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/230844278722?ssPageName=STRK:MEWNX:IT&_trksid=p3984.m1497.l2649
[09:55] <jcoxon> did you get hte usb-ttl convertor as well?
[09:55] <New2Balloon> yes...
[09:56] <New2Balloon> I hoped it was a bargain... you going to tell me otherwise?
[09:56] <jcoxon> no
[09:56] <New2Balloon> phew..
[09:56] <jcoxon> its not bad at all for price
[09:56] <jcoxon> okay so you need to connect your usb-ttl (=serial)
[09:56] <New2Balloon> Ok
[09:56] <jcoxon> to the gps and your computer
[09:57] <jcoxon> and then you could open up terminal (like the one in hte Arduino software)
[09:57] <jcoxon> and see the data
[09:58] <New2Balloon> terminal???? I downloaded the arduino 1.0.2 package is it in there? Sorry if this is dumb
[10:03] <jcoxon> yeah it is
[10:03] <jcoxon> unfortuantly i'll bbl
[10:03] <hibby> it'll be one of the round buttons near stop/play/etc
[10:04] <hibby> my badm I think it's the last of the square buttons on the right hand side, looks like a rectangle with a circle at the top?
[10:05] <New2Balloon> blimey, it was looking right at me, got it and see the data
[10:05] <New2Balloon> box
[10:05] <New2Balloon> sorry data box
[10:06] <hibby> or as it's known, terminal output ;)
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[10:06] <New2Balloon> no problem,,, catch you later, I'll have a play.......
[10:06] <New2Balloon> hibby thanks
[10:07] <hibby> sadly I haven't used the arduino software in many years as it offends my sensibilities
[10:07] <hibby> but that's a different discussion for a different time.
[10:07] <hibby> :)
[10:10] <fsphil> it certainly is, interesting
[10:11] <New2Balloon> off to have a play bbl - Thanks all, nice to have a helpful site rather than a patronising one... cheers
[10:13] <fsphil> we don't mine good questions here :)
[10:13] <fsphil> nid*
[10:13] <hibby> We're always here, up for a chat about anything from habbing to, uhm, the consistency of jelly.
[10:13] <fsphil> er, mind
[10:13] <hibby> one day, fsphil, we'll teach you Irish buggers how to speak the English Language.
[10:13] Action: fsphil is looking at oscilloscopes
[10:13] <hibby> but I say that of the English too.
[10:14] <fsphil> ack aye
[10:14] <hibby> also, that's coming from me, who represents Ireland in the international curling world.
[10:15] <hibby> going to have to get my belfast back in action
[10:16] <fsphil> your what?
[10:16] <hibby> Practise my how-now-brown-cows so I at least sound the part
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[10:20] <RocketBoy> hi all
[10:20] <RocketBoy> anyone know what happened to the cloud9 flights - I cant work out what went on from the tracker
[10:21] <fsphil> they all landed, not sure about recovery
[10:21] <Darkside> RocketBoy: they were using time multiplexing, i'm not sure how it went
[10:21] <fsphil> not all telemetry was uploaded, not sure what happened there
[10:21] <Darkside> also i don't think they were uploading to the tracker that much
[10:21] <hibby> fsphil: bad news, old chap:
[10:21] <hibby> 10:18 <+dd3> " <hibby> dd3: there's a total eclipse in 2015 that will be visible from the faroes... party at your mother's house?"
[10:21] <hibby> 10:18 <+dd3> neither me or my mother are there lol
[10:22] <fsphil> so.... it'll be empty? ;)
[10:22] <hibby> hehe
[10:22] <Darkside> it appears the launch site has patchy 3g coverage
[10:22] <RocketBoy> cheers
[10:24] <Darkside> ok justin smsed me asking to clear the tracker
[10:24] <Darkside> so... i'm going to clear the tracker
[10:24] <Darkside> standby..
[10:26] <Darkside> right
[10:26] <Darkside> "Althought there were a few newbie issues getting data up to the tracker, we recovered 100% of the 8 that we launched. Another 5 tomorrow morning."
[10:26] <Darkside> from justin
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[11:48] <daveake> brew your own transistors ... http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PdcKwOo7dmM&feature=fvwrel
[11:48] <jmcaliskey> Hello everyone, Need advice with a launch site in Northern Ireland
[11:49] <Darkside> talk to fsphil
[11:49] <Darkside> who is currently in australia
[11:49] <Darkside> :P
[11:49] <jmcaliskey> Thanks
[11:51] <hibby> haha
[11:51] <hibby> that's unfortunate.
[11:52] <hibby> jmcaliskey: failing that, there are a few launch sites that some of my students used near Stranraer a few years back, but that adds a ton of costs on for you.
[11:53] <jmcaliskey> We are working with a school so I doubt they couls stretch to that.
[11:54] <jmcaliskey> although, most simulations I run end up in Scotland anyway
[11:57] <fsphil> yea that tends to happen
[11:58] <fsphil> conditions at the moment, and for the last few months, have been poor
[11:58] <fsphil> I'm trying to organise a launch from Cookstown atm
[11:59] <jmcaliskey> it seems so, we could go into the republic if necessary. I would probably have to contact the IAA anyway
[11:59] <jmcaliskey> Really, I'm originally from Ardboe
[12:00] <fsphil> legally no, although they like to be told if it's gonna cross the border
[12:00] <jmcaliskey> I probably should... just in case
[12:01] <fsphil> certainly no harm
[12:02] <jmcaliskey> Ill try and go as far south and as far west as possible.
[12:02] <fsphil> really just need to get west. our normal launch site is An-Cregan
[12:02] <fsphil> far enouhg from the lough and plenty of open space around
[12:04] <fsphil> plus they have a cafe there :)
[12:04] <daveake> Not ... bacon butties?
[12:04] <fsphil> sadly no
[12:04] <jmcaliskey> Cafe is a definite plus
[12:04] <daveake> Cross that one off the list then
[12:04] <jmcaliskey> :(
[12:04] <fsphil> I should suggest that to them :)
[12:04] <daveake> indeed
[12:05] <jmcaliskey> Ill drive past me mums house so I could pick some up.....
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[12:05] <fsphil> what are you thinking of launching jmcaliskey?
[12:07] <jmcaliskey> Couple of GoPros and a Raspberry PI, plus assorted kit for measuring temp, airpressure etc, to make it educational for the kids. Don't know what GPS etc yet
[12:08] <jmcaliskey> Its all very much in the planning stage....
[12:08] <fsphil> I'd suggest not using the raspberry pi as the main method of tracking
[12:08] <Darkside> +1
[12:08] <daveake> +2
[12:09] <jmcaliskey> Its not for tracking just for logging data
[12:09] <jmcaliskey> ill have a separate GPS, plus a smartphone as backup
[12:09] <daveake> Top Tip: Tape down the SD card
[12:09] <fsphil> an arduino might be more appropriate
[12:10] <jmcaliskey> I had thought of that, but the school has a raspberry PI, but the arduino isn't too dear
[12:10] <jmcaliskey> Power for the RPi would be the probelm I think
[12:12] <daveake> It uses quite a bit. I use some switching modules one for 5V the other for 3.3V, both running from 6 AAs
[12:12] <hibby> +3 on no raspi
[12:14] <jmcaliskey> Thats a lot of batteries, Ill look into the Arduino. Cause the RPi has a linux install it was thought easier for the kids to muck about with.
[12:14] <hibby> the cost of losing the payload must be considered for the school - the raspi could make a valueable portable tracking station for the kids to work on, but losing the school's Raspi + gopros would be devastating
[12:15] <fsphil> you could fly it along with a traditional arduino radio tracker
[12:15] <daveake> The Arduino is a more reliable tracker. I've flown the Pi 3 times so far but I *always* run a separate Arduino radio tracker
[12:15] <jmcaliskey> the GoPros are mine, or rather the large public sector broadcaster I work for..... Ive budgeted for total loss
[12:16] <fsphil> I've been waiting on conditions for flying a gopro for ages
[12:16] <hibby> Budgeted for disappointment, however?
[12:16] <jmcaliskey> yep
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[12:17] <fsphil> it's always a risk, even with a good tracker
[12:17] <fsphil> no fun landing in a tree in a forest on a mountain
[12:18] <hibby> fair enough, all my suggestions are done, I'll return to my cage.
[12:18] <jmcaliskey> Ill be launching possibly in January..... so I am imagining conditions will be less than ideal
[12:18] <fsphil> well both my winter launches landed in england
[12:18] <fsphil> technically the second was the north sea
[12:19] <daveake> From NI it's probabyl possible to land in a treein a forest on a mountain on an island
[12:19] <jmcaliskey> land is better than sea and I can draw on lots of people to go and hunt it
[12:20] <fsphil> http://www.sanslogic.co.uk/hab/
[12:21] <fsphil> spring or summer is the best bet, but good conditions to still happen in winter from time to time
[12:21] <daveake> Nice launch technique :)
[12:22] <fsphil> that jump...
[12:22] <fsphil> in my head it was totally amazing leap into the air
[12:22] <daveake> I think #10 videod me doing something like that
[12:22] <daveake> lol
[12:22] <daveake> It is a bit alarming when the line from hand to balloon is basically horizontal
[12:22] <fsphil> yea
[12:22] <fsphil> I really thought it was gonna hit the ground or those sharp plants
[12:23] <daveake> My last one was really windy for ages
[12:23] <daveake> http://youtu.be/s-29qRJ7P58
[12:23] <daveake> FF to about 3:20
[12:24] <hibby> d'ya remember our students' catastrofuck about 2 years ago?
[12:24] <jonsowman> which one? ;)
[12:24] <hibby> where the students had the highschoolers threw the combined payload up....
[12:24] <jonsowman> and the bottom one fell off?
[12:25] <hibby> at the peak of which, the balloon deformed under the weight, the line stretched slightly under tension, it all came back to earth, dragged along the field, shed the actual science payload and floated off merrily after it had become airborne
[12:26] <Darkside> wow
[12:26] <jonsowman> oh yes
[12:26] <daveake> nice
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[12:27] <hibby> and because the students who'd built it were idiots and refused to learn how to program or do electronics (I gave them a low, low mark in their review...), they had stuffed the arduino in, not listened to/read my advice to solder things, wires popped out the board headers and that didn't work
[12:27] <jonsowman> what was the payload called?
[12:27] <jonsowman> i can't remember
[12:28] <hibby> ocht, dunno.
[12:28] <daveake> "students ... refused to learn" that's not a good attribute for a student
[12:28] <hibby> the good one was SUNSET, iirc.
[12:28] <hibby> daveake: yeah, I gave them 8 months and lots of support to learn arduino
[12:28] <hibby> they came back 2 weeks before launch saying "we're mechanical engineering students, we've never done this"
[12:28] <daveake> oh dear
[12:29] <daveake> Kinda the point isn't it? Doing stuff you've not done.
[12:29] <gonzo_> engineering is a way of life, not a subject
[12:29] <hibby> "I'm a mechanical engineer, guys, and learned how to do it" "Yeah, but you do radio things" "...Through self-learning..." "It was on your course" "I did the one you're doing" "oh"
[12:30] <hibby> i absolutely went through them in their paper review/defense section
[12:31] <hibby> "who wrote this code?" "Who integrated the project?"
[12:31] <hibby> "oh, it was so and so" "no, try again..."
[12:32] <hibby> they'd submitted my code as "so and so"'s work...
[12:32] <daveake> lol
[12:33] <jmcaliskey> eek, i think I might restrict my group to designing the logo on the payload!!!!!
[12:33] <hibby> jmcaliskey: nah, high schoolers are creative and good
[12:33] <hibby> these were engineering students too proud to ask for help, and got stung badly by it.
[12:34] <eroomde> i have not manually adjusted the headerbar width, it should just be textwidth
[12:34] <jmcaliskey> Failure is as important as success!
[12:34] <eroomde> er
[12:34] <hibby> the other group that did the same project were fantastic and came out with a great result.
[12:34] <eroomde> ignore
[12:35] <hibby> and the third team asked questions, saw what was going wrong and rectified it through applying engineering thought to new ideas (to them), which was a great result for all involved personally at least.
[12:39] <hibby> in summary; for those involved that managed to do the work, it was a worthwhile project. For those too lazy or feckless to do the work and/or realise their required learning and/or development areas, it was a farce!
[12:39] <hibby> More or less true for all academia :)
[12:39] <gonzo_> ah, managemet condidates then
[12:40] <daveake> pointy-haired bosses?
[12:40] <jmcaliskey> Thanks guysd, I'd better get back to work... Ill be back with more questions I'm afraid!
[12:40] <fsphil> haha
[12:40] <hibby> do come back with more, we're all here talking about nothing otherwise ;)
[12:40] <fsphil> probably a discussion on bacon
[12:41] <gonzo_> it takes up bandwidth that would otherwise be used for punning
[12:41] <jmcaliskey> Thanks
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[13:36] <navrac> ping jcoxon
[13:38] <jcoxon> hey navrac
[13:39] <jcoxon> back in 40mins
[13:42] <navrac> no problem
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[13:45] <Laurenceb> anyone here any good with shell scripts?
[13:45] <Laurenceb> i need to process a ton of tiles
[13:46] <DanielRichman> I hear `rm' is good at processing
[13:46] <Laurenceb> lol
[13:46] <SpeedEvil> what sort of processing?
[13:46] <fsphil> anyone bought anything from rigol-uk.co.uk?
[13:46] <Laurenceb> i need to move subdirectories to a new directory
[13:46] <Laurenceb> keeping the names
[13:47] <Laurenceb> but some files get processed by other scripts in the process
[13:47] <Laurenceb> based on file extension
[13:49] <DanielRichman> write it in python
[13:49] <Laurenceb> heh
[13:51] <Laurenceb> for entry in "ls $subdir"; do
[13:52] <Laurenceb> ^whats wrong with that?
[13:54] <Laurenceb> arg
[13:54] <Laurenceb> this would be faster written in c
[13:56] <Randomskk> ``
[13:57] <Randomskk> use ``
[13:57] <Randomskk> for entry in `ls $subdir`; do
[13:57] <SpeedEvil> what shell isa this in
[13:57] <SpeedEvil> also that
[13:58] <Laurenceb> bash
[13:59] <Laurenceb> arg
[13:59] <Laurenceb> also the subdirectory names contain spaces
[14:00] <Laurenceb> hmm guess ill try it in python
[14:00] <SpeedEvil> for...
[14:01] <SpeedEvil> mv "$x" temp/
[14:01] <Penfold> find subdir -print0 | xargs -n 1 -0 somescript
[14:03] <SpeedEvil> find is awesome
[14:04] <Laurenceb> can i just use "cd" in a shell script?
[14:04] <Penfold> yes. but you need to keep track of where you are :D
[14:04] <Laurenceb> ok
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[14:05] <zyp> you might want to use pushd/popd instead
[14:05] <SpeedEvil> in general, absolute paths are less confusing
[14:06] <zyp> pushd is like cd, but maintains a stack of previous directories, and return with popd
[14:06] <Laurenceb> ok
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[14:21] <jcoxon> ping navrac
[14:22] <NavracWork> hiya
[14:23] <NavracWork> was wondering if you had any launch plans coming up with an rfm
[14:23] <jcoxon> nothing definite
[14:23] <jcoxon> got a few ideas
[14:23] <NavracWork> wanted to test a repeater design - basically another rfm with a preamp and front end filter at ground level -
[14:24] <jcoxon> oh right
[14:24] <jcoxon> what do you need from me?
[14:24] <NavracWork> just a quick range test effectivly
[14:25] <NavracWork> I was just after someone launching with an rfm who could stick out a burst of gfsk
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[14:26] <NavracWork> or i guess i could stick a quick and dirty conference badge up to keep sending test messages to someone elses payload - wasnt going to bother with gps - just a plain tx then see if the ranges are workable and test perfromance at a few baud rates
[14:26] <jcoxon> nah its cool
[14:26] <jcoxon> my next flight will have gfsk
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[14:27] <jcoxon> but it won't be for a while
[14:27] <jcoxon> as in a few weeks i suspect
[14:27] <NavracWork> the penalty for a lna and filter is about 30mA which isnt great , but worth experimenting with
[14:29] <NavracWork> ah well i'll keep an eye out for any launches from Suffolk/cambridge in the mean time, or i might just quickly send off a pico - but i really wanted something with a bit of height that is already a good distance from me
[14:30] <NavracWork> just so los isnt limiting the distance
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[14:40] <jcoxon> i was hoping to do some solar
[14:40] <jcoxon> but winter is slightly a problem
[14:41] <SpeedEvil> not above the clouds
[14:41] <SpeedEvil> well, as long as you've panels round the sides
[14:42] <jcoxon> it makes testing a challange
[14:42] <SpeedEvil> true
[14:43] <Upu> I've given up jcoxon until we get some sun
[14:44] <Upu> I'm working on a power switcher that switches between solar and a primary cell automatically
[14:44] <jcoxon> Upu, mosfet?
[14:44] <Upu> yes
[14:44] <jcoxon> cool
[14:44] <Upu> however I can't get the MOSFET to play ball in ltspice at the moment
[14:45] <NavracWork> ive been playing with 868mhz rfm's , just out of interest
[14:46] <NavracWork> to match the range you need over double the power
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[14:49] <jcoxon> so i was thinking today
[14:49] <jcoxon> (and mind this is a wasteful design but worth ago)
[14:49] <jcoxon> 3v solar panel 100mA
[14:49] <jcoxon> through a diode
[14:50] <jcoxon> and then a voltage reg down to 1.8v
[14:51] <jcoxon> next a supercap
[14:51] <jcoxon> https://www.sparkfun.com/products/746
[14:51] <jcoxon> and then a 1.8v pico board
[14:51] <Upu> yeah should work, however you need a small circuit to ensure the regular doesn't lock out
[14:53] <Upu> http://uk.farnell.com/cooper-bussmann/hv1030-2r7106-r/capacitor-super-10f-2-7v-edlc/dp/2148486?in_merch=New%20Products
[14:54] <jcoxon> Upu, have you read the jeelabs blog
[14:54] <jcoxon> about supercaps etc
[14:54] <Upu> nope
[14:54] <jcoxon> http://jeelabs.org/tag/solar/
[14:55] <jcoxon> go back a couple of posts
[14:55] <jcoxon> i think you'll find it very interesting
[14:57] <Upu> thats charging the cell though
[14:57] Action: hibby gets off the phone from dubai
[14:58] Action: hibby wanders off to find something else to do.
[14:58] <Upu> oh the super cap
[14:58] <Upu> so 10F might be too much
[14:59] <jcoxon> well he looks at lots of different methods
[14:59] <Upu> I might drop him a line
[14:59] <Upu> what we are trying to do is slightly different
[14:59] <Upu> SOLAR ---|
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[15:00] <Upu> |---SWITCH---> REGULATOR
[15:00] <Upu> AACELL ---|
[15:00] <Upu> if solar <3v use AA
[15:00] <Upu> well what I'm trying to do anyway
[15:01] <Upu> right got to go
[15:01] <Upu> back later on
[15:03] <NavracWork> jcoxon - although its a little wasteful you method will work - need to rate the 1.8v reg so it can handle the inrush to the supercap - although i suspect the caps internal resistance will probably handle that
[15:08] Action: jcoxon will construct such a circuit
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[15:15] <NavracWork> you might be better off putting the solar into a small regulator set at 2.5v then into another regulator at 1.8V that way you get to use the full range of the capacitor - otherwise it will be down to 1.3 in the blink of an eye
[15:20] <daveake> ^ very good idea
[15:22] <jcoxon> would you need a diode
[15:22] <jcoxon> or would the reg be sufficient?
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[15:27] <NavracWork> depends on the reg
[15:27] <NavracWork> but most regs handle the out side going higher than the in on the grounds that after you switch off the power the caps on the far side of the reg still have charge
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[15:29] <NavracWork> only commect though is with the cap you are suggesting is that with an average of 10mA taken the cap will go to 1.3v in 20mins so not exactly suitable for overnight
[15:34] <NavracWork> I'd be tempted to go for a lithium rechargeable - painted black and only charge it when its sunny and probably above 0 degrees
[15:35] <jcoxon> tis a tough one
[15:37] <NavracWork> i found a source of lithiums that charge down so -20, not saft and were available - but im blowed if i can find the manufacturer again
[15:37] <NavracWork> I think i mentioned them to you back in March? - how good is your memory?
[15:38] <jcoxon> you could search zeusbot
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[15:42] <NavracWork> I think it was a pm
[15:44] <NavracWork> the only think i remember was they had a -5 and -4 model and one laptop manufacturer used them on one range of laptops and you could buy them. However I dont remeber the make of laptop and 'low temperature laptop' brought up too many matches
[15:44] <Laurenceb> http://www.element14.com/community/docs/DOC-51084/l/element14-discover-mo--an-expansion-board-for-stm32f4discovery
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[18:16] <jcoxon> ping Upu
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[18:32] <jcoxon> ping NavracWork
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[18:49] <costyn> evening
[18:49] <jcoxon> hey costyn
[18:50] <costyn> so I have this voltage divider. vcc = 5v, measured voltage at the divider is 3.944, measured input voltage is 8.22v and I have 2 resistors of 4645 ohm for my divider. something doesn't add up. the math says I 3.944v should equal 7.8v, not 8.2v
[18:51] <costyn> any ideas?
[18:52] <costyn> (sorry vcc isn't relevant to this issue actually)
[18:52] <daveake> I noticed :)
[18:52] <daveake> Was about to ask :)
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[18:52] <costyn> should I mistrust my multimeter?
[18:52] <daveake> Not yet
[18:53] <daveake> 2 Rs both of 4645?
[18:53] <costyn> yes
[18:53] <daveake> So it should halve the voltage going in
[18:54] <daveake> So 8.22V in should be 4.11V across one of the Rs
[18:54] <costyn> strange... maybe I have short?
[18:54] <daveake> It will drop a bit because of the meter, but not by much
[18:54] <daveake> (less than the resolution in this case)
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[18:55] <daveake> And it's *just* 2 Rs and the meter?
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[18:55] <costyn> hmm let me see I have a jmper for power to the reg
[18:56] <costyn> hmm the Vin is after the jumper, so it only measures voltage when the system is powered up
[18:56] <costyn> not sure if that answers your question
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[18:58] <daveake> Well ... I'm not sure I understand the situation.
[18:58] <daveake> You have a voltage that you measured, with a meter, to be 8.22V. Correct?
[18:58] <costyn> yes
[18:58] <daveake> And from there you have 2 Rs in series, both the same value, going to 0V?
[18:59] <daveake> i.e. 8.22V --> R ---> R --> 0V
[19:00] <costyn> yes
[19:00] <daveake> And nothing else connects to the R <--->R bit?
[19:00] <RG_LZ1DEV> 5v -> R10k -> Vout -> R10K -> 2.5v
[19:00] <RG_LZ1DEV> vout is also 2.5v
[19:01] <costyn> daveake: i disconnected the power circuit from the arduino
[19:01] <costyn> now i'm getting 4.1v at my divider
[19:02] <daveake> Which is what it should be
[19:02] <costyn> yes
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[19:04] <costyn> ok, well I guess problem solved then :)
[19:04] <costyn> thanks
[19:04] <daveake> :)
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[19:23] <WillDuckworth> hey cuddykid
[19:23] <cuddykid> hiya WillDuckworth :)
[19:23] <WillDuckworth> any launches planned soon?
[19:23] <cuddykid> unfortunately earliest would be a month away at least
[19:23] <costyn> daveake: should the 1pin NTX arduino circuit give a shift width of 425? I'm only getting 240 with using the resistors indicated on the wiki
[19:23] <WillDuckworth> yeah - im beavering away in the background
[19:24] <cuddykid> been super busy over the fast few weeks - was hoping to get one away in December, but looks unlikely
[19:24] <cuddykid> almost got v2 of the pcb completed, I think that will fly next
[19:24] <daveake> costyn what values?
[19:24] <costyn> daveake: 4.7k and 47k
[19:25] <costyn> 2x 4.7 and 1x 47k
[19:25] <WillDuckworth> cool - maybe piggyback next time again Adam? Also, did you get a mini server?
[19:26] <daveake> 47k is too high
[19:26] <costyn> so I'm getting too little voltage difference?
[19:26] <daveake> 20k will give 425Hz I think
[19:26] <costyn> ok, lemme try that
[19:27] <daveake> It'll depend on the voltage coming from your processor, but 20k is right for 3V3
[19:27] <cuddykid> WillDuckworth: yep, no probs - I did yeah, got the HP proliant mini (or something like that)
[19:28] <daveake> Those are nice little units
[19:28] <costyn> daveake: but this is on my 5v arduino
[19:28] <daveake> Good value too
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[19:28] <costyn> I'm revamping my 1st tracker
[19:28] <daveake> Well it should be higher then. But anyway, so long as you've wired it right, just find the value that works :)
[19:29] <costyn> hehe ok
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[19:54] <costyn> daveake: 25K is the sweetspot
[19:55] <griffonbot> Received email: "[UKHAS] Pico Board"
[19:57] <daveake> ok
[19:58] <Upu> I'm not sure if piggybacking the RFM22B is considered cheating or very clever
[19:58] <mattbrejza> i think pico comparisons should be based on area (mm^2) of pcb
[19:59] <mattbrejza> (excluding that taken up by the gps antenna)
[20:00] <costyn> Upu: piggy backing in what way?
[20:00] <Upu> http://www.flickr.com/photos/52455043@N03/8204050414/in/set-72157631811437083/
[20:00] <costyn> and "holy crap I'm impressed"
[20:01] <mattbrejza> also whats the max232 thing doing :/
[20:01] <mattbrejza> not sure routing it under the antenna is a good idea
[20:01] <Upu> not sure its a pic of some sorts
[20:01] <costyn> Upu: what function of the rfm is being exploited ?
[20:01] <costyn> other than radio
[20:02] <Upu> the fact its on a PCB so can be mounted on top of the ┬ÁC
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[20:02] <costyn> aaah
[20:02] <costyn> didn't catch that :)
[20:02] <costyn> clever
[20:02] <mattbrejza> i still claim victory on the pico size issue
[20:02] <Upu> yes you win alot :)
[20:02] <Upu> https://dl.dropbox.com/u/63720513/Images/PCB%20Pictures/Scan055.jpg
[20:03] <Upu> thats my latest attempt
[20:03] <mattbrejza> :P
[20:03] <costyn> mattbrejza: link to yours?
[20:03] <mattbrejza> its got to the point where the battery is the heavist thing so a 50% bigger board means not much
[20:03] <Upu> this is mattbrejza's e point where the battery is the heavist thing so a 50% bigger board means not much
[20:03] <Upu> grrr
[20:03] <mattbrejza> except if you ant to squeeze int o the ballon neck
[20:03] <Upu> http://www.biomedus.com/images/Pancy%20test%20500k.JPG
[20:03] <costyn> heh
[20:04] <costyn> Upu: wat
[20:04] <Upu> you'll see when you see it :)
[20:04] <mattbrejza> http://imgur.com/a/SWyR6
[20:05] <mattbrejza> http://imgur.com/hNkPq (regulator board)
[20:05] <costyn> Upu: not seeing it
[20:05] <Upu> the case looks like a pregnancy testing kit
[20:05] <costyn> mattbrejza: aah that one, yes :)
[20:05] <costyn> Upu: heh
[20:06] <mattbrejza> hmm not sure i have any of it next to a ruler
[20:07] <Upu> its small :)
[20:07] <Upu> I mean you win Matt :)
[20:08] <mattbrejza> the piggybacking one is still neat, i can see it inspiring some other picos
[20:08] <Upu> yeah
[20:09] <Upu> the RFM22B module is relatively large
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[20:10] <upix> good evening
[20:10] <natrium42> hi
[20:10] <Upu> evening natrium42
[20:10] <natrium42> awwwww yeeeeeah, 4 balloon launch again
[20:10] <Upu> and upix
[20:10] <natrium42> :D
[20:10] <natrium42> hi upu
[20:11] <natrium42> Upu: spacenear.us/test
[20:11] <natrium42> got a little bit further
[20:11] <upix> anyone know of any difference between eztv645 and eztv665 dongle?
[20:11] <Upu> looking good
[20:11] <Upu> not seen the insides og s 665
[20:11] <Upu> of a
[20:11] <Upu> the 645 has 2 versions
[20:12] <Upu> one has pads for a esd diode
[20:12] <Upu> the other one doesn't but you can make some with a scalpel
[20:13] <Upu> look good natrium42, wierd no street view in Germany
[20:15] <G7PMO_Kev> The pico's are looking good, my current effort is a dead bug style rfm22b, Arduinio pro mini and Max6 pico break out
[20:15] <Upu> those work well ask daveake
[20:15] <daveake> :)
[20:17] <G7PMO_Kev> Hi Upu - just checking you got the LiPowers?
[20:17] <Upu> yes I did sorry been on holiday
[20:17] <Upu> one is knackered
[20:17] <Upu> one you are right isn't working at 3.3V
[20:18] <G7PMO_Kev> no probs, the one I tried to solder the 3.3v fixed version to?
[20:18] <Upu> so I'm going to remove the UVLO
[20:18] <Upu> As everything else seems ok
[20:18] <Upu> I'll do it on Thursday
[20:18] <G7PMO_Kev> knackered = the one I tried to solder the 3.3v version to? :)
[20:19] <Upu> the one that had scortch marks on
[20:19] <Upu> the pads under the TPS chip were damaged
[20:19] <G7PMO_Kev> lol, yea, thats my many repeated attempts ant fixing things :)
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[20:20] <Upu> I hot aired the comps off and then binned the PCB as its dead
[20:20] <Upu> kept comps though
[20:20] <G7PMO_Kev> I wouldnt be supprised if I had fried the 3.3v converter too - I would bin that and use a fresh one if I was you :)
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[20:21] <upix> daveake: did you do any tests with tv dongles?
[20:22] <daveake> Not with the habamp, which it needs
[20:22] <daveake> I just use the FCD at home
[20:22] <Upu> they are fine for testing, not sure I'd want to rely on one for a launch though
[20:23] <upix> that's why I am asking if there are any tests
[20:24] <Upu> how do you mean tests ?
[20:25] projectaquila (41058015@gateway/web/freenode/ip.65.5.128.21) joined #highaltitude.
[20:25] <projectaquila> Hello
[20:25] <upix> well receiving range in general
[20:25] <upix> I know it depends
[20:25] <Upu> evening projectaquila
[20:25] <Upu> well depends on antenna
[20:26] <Upu> if I plug the Yagi in its pretty good :)
[20:26] <Upu> with a HABAmp
[20:27] <griffonbot> Received email: Anthony Stirk "Re: [UKHAS] Pico Board"
[20:27] <projectaquila> Quick question, we are using a Micro-Trak device to track our balloon. Does anyone have experience with this device?
[20:27] <Upu> Byonics one ?
[20:27] <projectaquila> Yes, the byonics one
[20:28] <Upu> No but they are ok, you're in the US I guess ?
[20:28] <projectaquila> Yes, we are.
[20:28] <Upu> yeah we can't use APRS in the air over here
[20:29] <Upu> so we tend to make our own boards
[20:29] <projectaquila> Do you know if it still gets signal at 30,000 meters?
[20:29] <Upu> well they claim the GPS4 works at up to 84km
[20:29] <SpeedEvil> is it an aprs tracker?
[20:29] <Upu> which is an odd number
[20:29] <Upu> yeah SpeedEvil
[20:29] <Upu> you have to plug in a GPS to it
[20:30] <projectaquila> Yes, it is an aprs tracker.
[20:30] <projectaquila> Ours is an "all-in-one" unit that includes a GPS, antenna, and transmitter
[20:30] <Upu> ah you best check the GPS thats on it works
[20:31] <projectaquila> Okay, thank you!
[20:31] <Upu> Do you know what its got on it ?
[20:32] <Upu> See I think all the modules they use are SiRF III based which don't work at altitude
[20:32] <Upu> http://www.cirocomm.com.tw/en/GPS_Module.html
[20:32] <Upu> I could be wrong I'd mail them and check
[20:32] <projectaquila> This is what we have: byonics.com/mt-aio
[20:33] <Upu> christ that looks heavy
[20:33] <projectaquila> Do you think that it will still work at that altitude?
[20:33] <Upu> http://www.flickr.com/photos/52455043@N03/8204050414/in/set-72157631811437083/ thats what we use over here , runs from a single AAA
[20:34] <Upu> Well
[20:34] <Upu> I think the module under there is a GMS-805 though I could be wrong
[20:35] <Upu> that is a SiRF III based module and generally they don't work > 18km
[20:35] <projectaquila> We purchased one that is said to be specifically for high altitude balloons
[20:35] <Upu> in that case I you'll just have to believe them
[20:36] <Upu> and if it stops working complain :)
[20:36] <projectaquila> Okay, thank you for your help! :)
[20:36] <Upu> let us know
[20:36] <projectaquila> Sure!
[20:36] <Upu> would be helpful to add to the Wiki
[20:36] <Upu> http://ukhas.org.uk/guides:gps_modules
[20:37] <Upu> sorry 24km
[20:37] <Upu> I would get clarity on what they consider high altitude balloons
[20:37] <Upu> as generally in the US it seems if it can do 60,000 feet its good
[20:37] <SpeedEvil> :-)
[20:37] <Upu> however 1600g Hwoyees balloons can easily double that
[20:38] <projectaquila> We have a 1500g balloon
[20:38] <Upu> Adafruit's Ultimate module is currently suitable for 25km+
[20:38] <SpeedEvil> brand is important
[20:38] <Upu> (it stops at 27km)
[20:38] <costyn> so I've got some of these RP-SMA connectors, but how to solder them to a coax cable is not intuitive to me; google isn't being my friend either. anybody got a good link?
[20:38] <Upu> I know the next batch from Adafruit are going to be ok to 40km
[20:39] <Upu> however this is still 5km short of what you could possibly get too
[20:39] <Upu> anyway in summary Ublox all the way
[20:40] <projectaquila> Thank you very much! We will look more into it, and let you know what happens! :)
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[20:40] <Upu> how heavy is that AIO transmitter btw ?
[20:40] <Upu> probably considered super light
[20:41] <Upu> haha
[20:41] <Upu> 400g without batteries
[20:42] <Upu> Operating temperature -20 to +70 Centigrade
[20:42] <Upu> Power supply 8 AA alkaline batteries of equivalent
[20:42] <Upu> Right thats it
[20:42] <Upu> I'm making an APRS unit for the US market
[20:42] <SpeedEvil> :-)
[20:43] <SpeedEvil> 1aaa, 20 grams, -40 to +90?
[20:43] <Upu> I know
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[20:46] <costyn> Upu: omg... 8 AAs? that's absurd
[20:46] <Upu> thats HABBing US style*
[20:46] <Upu> *They aren't all like that
[20:47] <costyn> Upu: you could make a killing if you made an APRS board for the US
[20:47] <costyn> :O
[20:47] <daveake> Even my Pi only uses 6 AAs :p
[20:47] <Upu> Well I'm making a version for pico Euro floater
[20:47] <Upu> with APRS
[20:47] <Upu> 10g with 70cms and APRS
[20:47] <Upu> your move America
[20:47] <daveake> lol
[20:48] <costyn> hehe
[20:48] <Upu> afk
[20:49] <Laurenceb_> aprs on 434?
[20:50] <x-f> ooh
[20:50] <x-f> how's the Project Swift doing? i checked its website earlier today, no updates since spring
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[20:53] <Laurenceb_> hmf my cron job isnt working :(
[20:54] <Laurenceb_> if i write a script that operates on files within its directory
[20:54] <Laurenceb_> and the script is called as a cron job, is the resent working directory different?
[20:57] <craag> Laurenceb_: I believe the working directory would be the home directory of the user that cron runs the script as.
[20:57] <Laurenceb_> ah ok
[20:57] <craag> You can put a 'cd ....' line at the top of the script.
[20:58] <Laurenceb_> yeah
[20:58] <Laurenceb_> cool
[20:58] <Laurenceb_> thanx
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[21:00] Action: SpeedEvil looks at the bonfire, and considers hot air balloons.
[21:01] Action: SpeedEvil is outside, finishing off a wooden rubbish burn.
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[21:07] <Laurenceb_> ok... i think this was silly
[21:08] <Laurenceb_> i set a cron job to run as root
[21:08] <Laurenceb_> and anyone can ssh in and rewrite the script
[21:11] <natrium42> Laurenceb_: so did you see http://goatse.cx
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[21:12] <Laurenceb_> yes
[21:12] <Laurenceb_> i also saw it back in the old days
[21:14] <Laurenceb_> arg
[21:14] <Laurenceb_> ok, so i have two user accounts on a machine
[21:14] <Laurenceb_> one user is me, I have a directory full of scripts
[21:15] <Laurenceb_> second account details are given to load of people
[21:15] <Laurenceb_> and its rather locked down
[21:15] <Laurenceb_> i want a cronjob to run my scripts on files used by the second account
[21:15] <Laurenceb_> atm i have a symlink in the second users account, to my scripts directory
[21:16] <Laurenceb_> but the permissions are all wrong
[21:16] <Laurenceb_> lrwxrwxrwx 1 root root 50 2012-11-20 17:35
[21:16] <Laurenceb_> this is not good
[21:16] <Laurenceb_> is there a solution?
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[21:18] <natrium42> Laurenceb_: but now it's a mail service
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[21:31] <navrac> If these pico boards get any lighter we wont need balloons
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[21:37] <Laurenceb_> can anyone give me any help?
[21:38] <Laurenceb_> at the moment i have "lrwxrwxrwx 1 user2 root 50 2012-11-20 17:35"
[21:38] <Laurenceb_> presumably i need "lrwxrwxrwx 1 user2 user1 50 2012-11-20 17:35"
[21:39] <G7PMO_Kev> hi Laurence
[21:39] <G7PMO_Kev> what are you trying to do?
[21:39] <Laurenceb_> i have two users
[21:40] <Laurenceb_> http://pastebin.com/3NC29y36
[21:41] <G7PMO_Kev> Mmm, permissions on a symlink work differently I seem to remember
[21:41] <Laurenceb_> yeah thats what i seem to be suffering from
[21:42] <Laurenceb_> is this even doable?
[21:42] <G7PMO_Kev> chmod never changes the permissions of symbolic links; the chmod system call cannot change their permissions. This is not a problem since the permissions of symbolic links are never used.
[21:42] <Laurenceb_> i see
[21:42] <Laurenceb_> yeah the link itself is owned by root
[21:42] <Laurenceb_> ok, so i need to change the permissions on my scripts
[21:42] <G7PMO_Kev> so dont worry at al about the link, just the file it is linking too
[21:43] <Laurenceb_> "-rwxr-xr-x 1 user1 user1"
[21:43] <Laurenceb_> where user1 is my account
[21:43] <jcoxon> hey navrac
[21:43] <Laurenceb_> so how do i give user2 read access?
[21:43] <jcoxon> been having fun with that concept i was discussing involving a supercap
[21:43] <natrium42> oooh
[21:43] <G7PMO_Kev> user 2 has read access to it
[21:44] <Laurenceb_> already?
[21:44] <G7PMO_Kev> the final r-x is 'all others'
[21:44] <natrium42> are you going to make a payload powered by a just a supercap?
[21:44] <Laurenceb_> wtf is wrong then
[21:44] <G7PMO_Kev> :)
[21:44] <Laurenceb_> ill try this again, just a sec
[21:44] <G7PMO_Kev> the 3 groups of rwx are 'user', 'group' and 'all others'
[21:44] <jcoxon> natrium42, well its there to help with the solar
[21:44] <Laurenceb_> ls Processing
[21:44] <Laurenceb_> ls: cannot access Processing: Permission denied
[21:45] <Laurenceb_> thats the symlink to the scripts
[21:45] <natrium42> jcoxon: meh, solar
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[21:45] <Laurenceb_> if im user2
[21:46] <natrium42> jcoxon: how about generating electricity from payload spin
[21:46] <G7PMO_Kev> so do a ls -la Processing
[21:46] <natrium42> put a magnet on the string surrounded by a coil
[21:46] <G7PMO_Kev> natrium42 - Lol, love the idea :)
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[21:47] <Laurenceb_> G7PMO_Kev: ok so i see the symlink
[21:47] <Laurenceb_> but how do i run the scripts?
[21:47] <Laurenceb_> bash: ./Processing/script.sh: Permission denied
[21:47] <G7PMO_Kev> ./Processing/script_name
[21:47] <G7PMO_Kev> ls -la ./Processing/script.sh ?
[21:48] <RG_LZ1DEV> chmod +x ./Processing/script.sh
[21:48] <Laurenceb_> ls: cannot access ./Processing/script.sh: Permission denied
[21:49] <Laurenceb_> oh
[21:49] <Laurenceb_> chmod: cannot access `./Processing/process.sh': Permission denied
[21:49] <Laurenceb_> or script.sh for that matter
[21:49] <G7PMO_Kev> yea you cant change the permissions if u dont own the file
[21:50] <Laurenceb_> but i cant even ls -la it
[21:50] <G7PMO_Kev> gosh this is hard over irc :)
[21:50] <Laurenceb_> i can if im user2
[21:50] <Laurenceb_> i mena 1
[21:50] <Laurenceb_> id give you access but im not sure that is wise :P
[21:51] <DanielRichman> Laurenceb_: check o+x bit on all directories leading to the actual location of Processing
[21:51] <DanielRichman> in order to access a file, you need +x on all directories leading to it in addition to access to the file itself
[21:51] <Laurenceb_> how do i do that?
[21:51] <DanielRichman> ls all teh things
[21:51] <DanielRichman> use readlink -f Processing
[21:51] <DanielRichman> first
[21:51] <DanielRichman> to find out where it actually is
[21:51] <DanielRichman> then in turn, ls /a /a/b/ /a/b/c/
[21:51] <DanielRichman> etc.
[21:52] <Laurenceb_> drwx------ etc
[21:52] <Laurenceb_> what do i need to see?
[21:52] <DanielRichman> k so there's your problem
[21:53] <G7PMO_Kev> so that means only the owner has access....
[21:53] <Laurenceb_> ah
[21:53] <G7PMO_Kev> not the group or any others
[21:53] <DanielRichman> that means: user has read write execute, group has nothing, others have nothing
[21:53] <DanielRichman> the pattern rwxrwxrwx represents the 9 bits. the first three are the user, second triplet is group, third triplet is other.
[21:53] <Laurenceb_> chmod +755 ?
[21:53] <RG_LZ1DEV> so he is not the owner?
[21:53] <DanielRichman> note that each triplet corresponds to an octal digit
[21:54] <Laurenceb_> ok
[21:54] <DanielRichman> etc. (sorry if stating obvious)
[21:54] <DanielRichman> chmod understands letters too; you may find (for example) chmod g+w (sets just one bit) chmod +w (sets three bits) chmod o-rwx,g+w,a+r (does a lot of rubbish. a means all.)
[21:54] <DanielRichman> *you may find easier:
[21:54] <DanielRichman> [or not; ignore if not easier]
[21:55] <Laurenceb_> chmod +755 works?
[21:55] <DanielRichman> yes
[21:55] <Laurenceb_> k
[21:56] <RG_LZ1DEV> add -R
[21:56] <DanielRichman> no
[21:56] <DanielRichman> don't do that
[21:56] <Laurenceb_> i can see the script
[21:56] <DanielRichman> you don't want to 755 all your files
[21:57] <Laurenceb_> yeah i just did 755
[21:57] <Laurenceb_> seems to work now, thanks
[21:57] <DanielRichman> 755 directories, 755 scripts, 644 other files
[21:57] <RG_LZ1DEV> fair enough :)
[21:59] <Laurenceb_> where does stout of cronjobs go to?
[21:59] <DanielRichman> usually gets emailed to the owning user
[21:59] <Laurenceb_> lol
[22:00] <Laurenceb_> dont think i setup an email address
[22:01] <DanielRichman> if there's an email daemon installed, check /var/lib/mail or spool/soemthing/blah/mail
[22:01] <DanielRichman> have a poke around
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[00:00] --- Wed Nov 21 2012