highaltitude.log.20121118

[00:00] <RG_LZ1DE1> fsphil: http://stackoverflow.com/questions/891643/twitter-image-encoding-challenge
[00:00] <RG_LZ1DE1> have you seen that?
[00:03] <Laurenceb_> impressive stuff
[00:05] <Lunar_Lander> is that similar to the legendary Arecibo message?
[00:06] <Lunar_Lander> where you had like all those 1 and 0 and they made up white and black pixels
[00:07] justinatomatic (~justin@124-169-26-107.dyn.iinet.net.au) joined #highaltitude.
[00:17] bertrik (~quassel@rockbox/developer/bertrik) left irc: Ping timeout: 260 seconds
[00:20] Nickolai (~Nickolai@cpe-98-14-240-138.nyc.res.rr.com) joined #highaltitude.
[00:24] <arko> man
[00:24] <arko> MixW is a pain
[00:26] Nickolai (~Nickolai@cpe-98-14-240-138.nyc.res.rr.com) left irc: Ping timeout: 255 seconds
[00:28] <arko> there is not a single website about APRS that looks like it's not from 1995
[00:29] <Randomskk> all ham websites look better ran through the geocities-izer
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[00:32] <RG_LZ1DE1> thats what happens when you make a website in microsoft word
[00:33] <arko> lol
[00:33] <arko> this is why im ashamed to tell folks im a ham
[00:34] <arko> last night while i was testing some dude came up to me and said kilo papa 6 blah blah
[00:34] <arko> out of no where
[00:34] <arko> im like ok?
[00:34] <arko> he's like whats yours
[00:34] <arko> im like, i dont know
[00:34] <Randomskk> haha I bet that went down well
[00:34] <arko> YOU"RE NOT LICENSED
[00:35] <arko> i was like whatever
[00:35] <arko> im totally licensed, i just dont want to talk to ham people :(
[00:35] <arko> 99.9% of them at least
[00:35] <arko> in the US, not sure about other countries
[00:37] <RG_LZ1DE1> never give your handle
[00:37] <arko> yeah
[00:37] <RG_LZ1DE1> i met a guy at uni, apperantly he was playing the same game i did and somehow on the same server
[00:38] <RG_LZ1DE1> get got pretty owned
[00:38] <arko> game?
[00:38] <RG_LZ1DE1> video game
[00:38] <RG_LZ1DE1> what are the chances right?
[00:38] <arko> hahaha
[00:38] <arko> nice
[00:39] <RG_LZ1DE1> there was a distint pause after i mentioned my handle
[00:42] ^ph (ph@87.57.58.38) left #highaltitude.
[00:45] <RG_LZ1DE1> and then he chanced me into servers, so it looked
[00:45] <RG_LZ1DE1> revenge ?
[00:46] <Lunar_Lander> xD
[00:46] <Lunar_Lander> yea
[00:46] <Lunar_Lander> RG_LZ1DE1, where are you from btw?
[00:46] <RG_LZ1DE1> bulgaria, but that happened in the uK
[00:47] <RG_LZ1DE1> oh, silly irssi
[00:47] Nick change: RG_LZ1DE1 -> RG-LZ1DEV
[00:53] <Lunar_Lander> ah
[00:57] <RG-LZ1DEV> eh?
[01:02] ^ph (~ph@0x57393a26.srnqu1.dynamic.dsl.tele.dk) joined #highaltitude.
[01:03] <Lunar_Lander> I am from germany
[01:04] <natrium42> Ich bin aus Kanada, aber ich lebe in Kalifornien
[01:04] <Lunar_Lander> :)
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[01:20] <KT5TK> OK, I'm out of ideas now. Here is the PecanPico board as far as I have the design ready. Essentially it's an updated version of the previous Pecan board. http://kt5tk.tkrahn.com/download/PecanPico/
[01:20] <KT5TK> Comments welcome
[01:21] <Laurenceb_> some of the routing is a little.. eek
[01:22] <KT5TK> Size is limited. I'm aware of some compromises but what exactly do you consider worst?
[01:23] <Laurenceb_> http://imagebin.org/index.php?mode=image&id=236315
[01:23] <Laurenceb_> thats about the limit of crazy routing id try
[01:23] <Laurenceb_> try to keep to 45degree angles imo
[01:24] Action: Laurenceb_ zzz
[01:24] <KT5TK> Nice, but does RF care about 45 angles?
[01:25] <KT5TK> I was using arbitary angles to compress further
[01:27] <Randomskk> RF is pretty much the only thing that cares about angles
[01:28] <Randomskk> low frequency stuff doesn't really matter
[01:28] <KT5TK> OK
[01:28] <Randomskk> that board looks kinda crazy too
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[01:28] <Randomskk> I mean it'l probably work, though I'm suspicious of how broken-up the ground plane is
[01:28] <Randomskk> but you could do the same job with neater routing I think
[01:29] <Darkside> yeeeeah
[01:29] <KT5TK> Yeah I had a hard time to get the groundplane half way connected. I tried at least the RF part to get as good as possible
[01:30] <Darkside> hmm
[01:30] <Darkside> are thoe 0402s?
[01:30] <Darkside> or just 0603s for the smaller components
[01:30] <KT5TK> yes
[01:30] <KT5TK> 402
[01:30] <Darkside> fun
[01:30] <Darkside> i haven't quite got there yet wiht my designs :P
[01:31] <Darkside> i still use 0603 as a minimum
[01:31] <KT5TK> The previous Pecan already used 402s
[01:31] <Darkside> do you do them by hand?
[01:31] <Randomskk> Darkside: 0402s by hand is fine, seriously
[01:32] <Darkside> yeah
[01:32] <KT5TK> Yes, with solder paste though
[01:32] <KT5TK> and a hot skillet
[01:32] <Darkside> Randomskk: i don't see why it would be much harder than 0603s
[01:32] <Darkside> even easier with a binocular microscope
[01:32] <Randomskk> I can do it by hand with normal solder and iron without a scope
[01:32] <Randomskk> with a microscope it's much more fun
[01:33] <Randomskk> reflow is totally fine
[01:33] <Darkside> mm, haven't got access to any reflow equipment atm
[01:33] <Darkside> apart from a hot air rework station
[01:34] <KT5TK> http://www.sparkfun.com/tutorials/59
[01:34] <KT5TK> The skillet is exactly how I do it
[01:35] <KT5TK> http://tkrahn.dyndns.org/gallery2/main.php?g2_itemId=7269
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[01:41] <KT5TK> It's a 2m/70cm dual band version btw.
[01:42] <natrium42> skillet method is nice, i only do it for batches though
[01:43] <KT5TK> You solder single boards plain hand?
[01:43] <natrium42> yeah, just use lots of flux
[01:44] <natrium42> surface tension takes care of everything
[01:45] <natrium42> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5uiroWBkdFY#t=2m01s
[01:45] <natrium42> you can just swipe the soldering iron
[01:45] <natrium42> like in that video
[01:46] <KT5TK> Yeah, I do this with small boards too. The skillet method works fine for me, but I get several standoffs when I heat up too fast.
[01:46] <BrainDamage> you can tape a thermocouple to a board to monitor temp
[01:47] <BrainDamage> then you can do the industrial profile rather easily by hand
[01:47] <natrium42> yeah, some parts just jump off from the pcb if not done properly with the skillet
[01:49] <KT5TK> Usually the grounded side of caps or resistors gets up because the other lead is heating up faster and its surface tension pulls the part over.
[01:50] <Lunar_Lander> Darkside, hello
[01:50] <KT5TK> Therefore slow heating is good
[01:50] <Lunar_Lander> do you have a moment?
[01:57] <Lunar_Lander> Darkside, this is about like you arrange the cutdown system on HORUS? http://s.gullipics.com/image/3/0/k/5yvpv2-jg498x-023l/IMG5318.jpeg
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[02:26] <fsphil> that twitter image challange is neat
[02:31] <KT5TK> What's the twitter image challenge about?
[02:31] <fsphil> http://stackoverflow.com/questions/891643/twitter-image-encoding-challenge
[02:31] <fsphil> basically come up with the best program to compress an image so that it fits wihtin a single twitter message
[02:31] <fsphil> the winning entry is amazing
[02:32] <KT5TK> nice
[02:35] <fsphil> I've created jpeg images that size, and they having nothing on that
[02:35] <fsphil> well, sort of jpeg
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[02:48] <bdale> http://ava.upuaut.net seems to be trying to charge VAT on shipments to the US .. that's not right, is it?
[02:48] <Darkside> getting rid of vat is a bit painful
[02:48] <Darkside> and ohi bdale
[02:48] <Lunar_Lander> hi Darkside
[02:49] <bdale> Darkside: I really need some MAX-6Q for prototypes, and the sub-reel price I'm being quoted is PAINFUL from ublox
[02:49] <Darkside> bdale: yeah
[02:49] <Darkside> it'll be cheaper to get them from Upu, even with VAT
[02:49] <bdale> yes, I just hate paying taxes I shouldn't have to pay
[02:49] <Darkside> and i can attest that MAX-6Q's are awesome
[02:49] <Darkside> and shoudl work well in your rockets :-)
[02:50] <KT5TK> Yes, Upu is charging tax for all international. However his uBlox modules were still cheaper than elsewhere.
[02:50] <Darkside> unfortunately the person who's used them in rockets isn't here, but apparently they maintain lock throughout some pretty high G launches
[02:50] <bdale> we're looking at using them on the next cut of MegaMetrum .. http://www.altusmetrum.org/MegaMetrum/
[02:50] <Lunar_Lander> hi Darkside
[02:50] <bdale> the issue isn't maintaining lock, really
[02:50] <Darkside> hi Lunar_Lander
[02:50] <Darkside> bdale: size?
[02:50] <Lunar_Lander> Darkside, did you read my question above?
[02:51] <Darkside> Lunar_Lander: yes, and yes, thats similar. i'll get you a picture of our cutdown device, hold on
[02:51] <Lunar_Lander> thanks
[02:51] <bdale> the issue is having Z not be laggy once lock is re-acquired so that we can get reliable apogee determination above baro sensor range
[02:51] <Darkside> Lunar_Lander: http://pipe2.darklomax.org/pics/2012-10-07_Horus_29/Pages/19.html
[02:51] <Darkside> bdale: ahhhh
[02:51] <Lunar_Lander> cool thanks
[02:51] <Darkside> you may not lose lock at all
[02:51] <bdale> the skytraq parts we're using are smaller, cheaper, and they're *finally* offering up some updated firmware for us, but we have no reason to believe they've given us a true high dynamic mode yet
[02:51] <Darkside> you remember those launches at LCA brisbane?
[02:52] <Lunar_Lander> the hooks on the cord are taped to the box?
[02:52] <Darkside> Lunar_Lander: yes
[02:52] <Lunar_Lander> ah
[02:52] <Darkside> bdale: the gps in joel stanleys rocket never lost lock
[02:52] <Lunar_Lander> that is OK for a .5 kg box?
[02:52] <Darkside> Lunar_Lander: the string on the hooks runs around the box, then down to the next payloads
[02:52] <Lunar_Lander> ah
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[02:52] <bdale> nice
[02:52] aj (aj@cerulean.erisian.com.au) joined #highaltitude.
[02:52] <Darkside> he only got 3 data points during ascent, btu it worked
[02:52] <Darkside> but*
[02:53] <Darkside> oh god its the whole altus metrum team
[02:53] <Darkside> HI!
[02:53] <bdale> keep in mind, though, that I fly much more aggressive flights than anything we flew in Brisbane
[02:53] <Darkside> bdale: hehe
[02:53] <Darkside> well, this shoudl work nicely still
[02:53] <bdale> btw, my personal bests now are Mach 2.15 on the way to 21660 feet AGL
[02:53] <Darkside> haha
[02:53] <Darkside> well we've seen descent rates of 300m/s
[02:53] <keithp> Darkside: found this channel via the ukhas web page
[02:53] <Darkside> but thats about it
[02:53] <Lunar_Lander> btw, yesterday I read "Thrust" by Richard Noble on his jet cars
[02:54] <Lunar_Lander> and I read that there has been a Australian with a jet car called "Aussie Invader II" who also tried for the speed record
[02:54] <fsphil> you rocket people and your speed ... slow down guys, enjoy life ;)
[02:54] <Lunar_Lander> :)
[02:54] <bdale> I've got a number of small issues on MegaMetrum v0.1 to fix in a v0.2 cut, and am thinking about trying out the MAX-6Q on v0.2 just to see how it works out
[02:54] <Lunar_Lander> fsphil, I got the best song for that
[02:54] <Lunar_Lander> if you want to hear it?
[02:54] <fsphil> I'm in an airport Lunar_Lander, I can't hear anything
[02:54] <Lunar_Lander> ah
[02:54] <Lunar_Lander> where are you going to?
[02:55] <Darkside> bdale: well, i've been quite happy with it
[02:55] <bdale> good to know, thanks!
[02:55] <fsphil> Lunar_Lander: sydney
[02:55] <Lunar_Lander> cool!
[02:55] <Darkside> i noticed you were using the chip antennas on some of your boards?
[02:55] <fsphil> I hope so
[02:55] <fsphil> it's too warm here
[02:55] <Lunar_Lander> maybe you even know the song if I say the name
[02:55] <Darkside> you mentioned impedance matching - is that really required?
[02:55] <bdale> I'm pretty sure it'll work well for us, I just can't stomach buying a reel without knowing first...
[02:55] <keithp> Darkside: no, we're using active patches
[02:55] <Lunar_Lander> "Bakerman" by Laid Back
[02:55] <Darkside> ok
[02:55] <keithp> Darkside: would love to use a passive patch, but haven't ever managed to make one work
[02:55] <bdale> I've used a chip antenna on a ground station board prototype and getting it tuned isn't fun
[02:55] <Darkside> the MAX-6Q won't provide active antenna power, but it's not hard to add it
[02:56] <Darkside> hmm
[02:56] <bdale> sure
[02:56] <Lunar_Lander> 6Q is the 3.3V model?
[02:56] <Darkside> we use the chip antennas on our boards fine
[02:56] <bdale> yes
[02:56] <Lunar_Lander> ah
[02:56] <fsphil> they're all 3.3v are they not?
[02:56] <Darkside> no impedance matching required
[02:56] <Lunar_Lander> I got one from Upu with a Sarantel
[02:56] <bdale> no
[02:56] <Darkside> fsphil: ye
[02:56] <bdale> they make a 1.8V version too
[02:56] <Lunar_Lander> yea
[02:56] <fsphil> of course
[02:56] <Lunar_Lander> that is a different letter
[02:56] <Lunar_Lander> 6N or so?
[02:56] <keithp> 6G is 1.8V
[02:56] <Lunar_Lander> yea
[02:56] <bdale> I have a couple eval boards, one with a sarantel and one with a chip antennna
[02:56] <Lunar_Lander> the sarantel is cool
[02:56] <keithp> but fragile
[02:57] <bdale> no way I'm putting a sarantel on a flight board, though
[02:57] <Darkside> haha
[02:57] <Darkside> heavy
[02:57] <Lunar_Lander> whz_
[02:57] <Darkside> it'll snap off!
[02:57] <bdale> heavy, fragile, and BIG
[02:57] <keithp> ever seen what happens with a motor that hits 100g?
[02:57] <Lunar_Lander> damn I just hit my knee on the desk
[02:57] <Lunar_Lander> and then I switched the keyboard from german to english cause of that
[02:57] <Lunar_Lander> ouch
[02:57] <bdale> I've pulled 82+g off the rail in one of my own airframes...
[02:57] <Darkside> dammit, we need edmoore in here
[02:57] <keithp> that's funny
[02:57] <SpeedEvil> keithp: little
[02:57] <Darkside> he's the rocket guy
[02:57] <Lunar_Lander> but sarantel is OK for balloon?
[02:57] <Darkside> Lunar_Lander: of course
[02:57] <fsphil> wake him up, phone him ;)
[02:58] <Lunar_Lander> XD
[02:58] <Lunar_Lander> he will not be amused
[02:58] <keithp> sure, unlikely to get that kind of accel in 'normal' operations
[02:58] <Lunar_Lander> yea
[02:58] <SpeedEvil> keithp: you get 100g from a drop from 10cm, that decelerates in 1mm
[02:58] <bdale> sure, they're nice antennas as long as you don't hit them with a big hammer / high thrust rocket motor
[02:58] <Darkside> bdale: keithp if you wait about 5 hours there will be someone here with experience using these gpses in rockets
[02:58] <Lunar_Lander> btw
[02:58] <keithp> SpeedEvil: sure, just not sustained, with vibration. turns out to matter a bit
[02:58] <Lunar_Lander> when I read the book yesterday there was an interesting thing
[02:58] <bdale> frankly, I'm just happy to have found a source for less than $99/ea
[02:59] <Lunar_Lander> the Thrust2 was short of lifting off the ground with its front
[02:59] <Lunar_Lander> and that would have been fatal
[02:59] <Darkside> bdale: haha yep. i saw that price on ublox's page
[02:59] <Lunar_Lander> as if had did that, it would have went up with 50G or so
[02:59] <bdale> I mostly hang out on oftc, but keeping a tab open here for a while can happen
[02:59] <Darkside> i was trying to get some NEO-6T's from them a while back
[02:59] <Darkside> bdale: cool
[02:59] <Lunar_Lander> does anyone of you actually remember Thrust2 or ThrustSSC?
[02:59] <Darkside> but yeah, there's a group here from cambridge who've been doing rocket launches in scotland
[02:59] <bdale> I was actually considering buying a reel and selling them, will likely do that in any case if they work well for us
[02:59] <Darkside> *big* rocket launches
[03:00] <Lunar_Lander> I was -6 at the time of Thrust2 and 8 when ThrustSSC drove, so I didn't get them
[03:00] <bdale> since I'll want the price I got quoted at reel quantity for any actual production runs
[03:00] <Darkside> bdale: http://www.cusf.co.uk/martlet-1/
[03:01] <bdale> yes, I've been pointed there before
[03:01] <bdale> fun project
[03:01] <Lunar_Lander> yea
[03:01] <Lunar_Lander> it's nice to see it
[03:01] <Lunar_Lander> :)
[03:01] <Lunar_Lander> in germany we aren't allowed multistage rockets or rockets with motors greater than D
[03:01] <Lunar_Lander> only if the owner has a T2 explosives license
[03:02] <keithp> Lunar_Lander: I'm building a small altimeter for that kind of environment -- http://www.altusmetrum.org/MicroPeak/
[03:02] <bdale> we test flew MicroPeak 4 times today .. totally rockin'
[03:03] <Darkside> hmm whats the cheapest barometer you've been able to find?
[03:03] <keithp> Darkside: the MS5607 is awesome and < $10
[03:03] <Lunar_Lander> keithp, cool, looking at it
[03:03] <Darkside> i'd like to make a cheap payload suitable for use in a throwaway radiosonde
[03:03] <Darkside> for temp traces
[03:03] <keithp> calibrated to 10km, linear to 30km
[03:03] <Darkside> that'd work
[03:03] <Darkside> that + temp sensor + humidity gets me enough info to work out convection height
[03:04] <keithp> does 24bit baro and 24 bit temp
[03:04] <Darkside> whats the temp range? (not that it shoudl matter up to 10000ft)
[03:04] <bdale> fwiw, to get that price on the MS5607 you need to dicker a bit with a distributor ..
[03:04] <keithp> 'sufficient'
[03:04] <Darkside> heh
[03:04] <Lunar_Lander> how do you get radiosondes to run with arduinos or so btw?
[03:04] <Darkside> bdale: yeah thats what i expect
[03:04] <Darkside> Lunar_Lander: i mean making my own
[03:04] <Lunar_Lander> ah
[03:04] <Darkside> i want something i can launch on a foil balloon
[03:05] <keithp> -40 - 85
[03:05] <Darkside> ideally the cost per unit should be <$25 or so
[03:05] <Darkside> but i think that'll be pushing it a bit
[03:05] <keithp> depends on how much the moisture sensor is
[03:05] <Darkside> the idea is i won't be recovering these - the fuel cost is too high. so they'r ethrowaway launches
[03:05] <Darkside> keithp: theres some pretty cheap ones out there
[03:05] <Darkside> it doesn't need to be too accurate
[03:05] <SpeedEvil> altimeters seem to be the latest mems device to be due to get the OMG volume treatment from phones.
[03:06] <keithp> Darkside: use a CC1111 for telem and microcontroller
[03:06] <Darkside> keithp: i was thinking that
[03:06] <Darkside> i've been avoiding the 8051 stuff
[03:06] <SpeedEvil> for really cheap, beacon, and multilateration,
[03:06] <keithp> Darkside: we're also building a simple CC1120-based ground station that has better receive sens than the CC1111
[03:06] <Darkside> they only do 10mw output power, right?
[03:06] <SpeedEvil> that does mean investing some in receivers
[03:07] <keithp> Darkside: right, need the CC1120 for 40mW
[03:07] <Darkside> i'd just have it output low baud rate RTTY
[03:07] <bdale> CC1125
[03:07] <Darkside> only one way comms, but meh
[03:07] <Darkside> ridiculous range
[03:07] <keithp> Darkside: can't do that; the cc1111 is packet only
[03:07] <bdale> the 1125 has the better RX specs
[03:07] <Darkside> keithp: no constant carrier mode?
[03:07] <keithp> Darkside: no
[03:07] <Darkside> oh boo
[03:07] <Darkside> wait
[03:07] <keithp> digital packets are better anyways
[03:07] <Darkside> im *sure* someone here has done RTTY using them
[03:07] <keithp> *way* longer range
[03:07] <Darkside> very very sure
[03:08] <bdale> we'll fly the CC1120 if it remains cheaper, use the CC1125 on the ground
[03:08] <keithp> it's got 1/2 rate convolution encoding built-in
[03:08] <Darkside> keithp: in general we use 50 baud RTTY for high altitude balloons, with a ~500hz shift
[03:08] <Darkside> we get ridiculous ranges on those
[03:08] <keithp> so, you get 256 bytes of data
[03:08] <Darkside> current record is 800km with 10mw
[03:08] <keithp> you can set the baud rate to whatever you like
[03:08] <Darkside> but again - only one way
[03:09] <keithp> you could do two-way with the CC1111
[03:09] <Darkside> well, we have uplink methods too
[03:09] <Darkside> the uplink link budget is far far better
[03:09] <keithp> so, you can get 2048 bits of RTTY per 'packet'
[03:10] <Darkside> yeah, at some point i need to get some of this kit and do some range tests
[03:10] <keithp> Darkside: we have CC1111 devices in boxes with USB cables
[03:10] <Darkside> what could i use on the balloon side?
[03:10] <Darkside> just something i can ping
[03:10] <keithp> you could use the 'telemini' flight computer that we sell
[03:10] <Darkside> ok
[03:11] <keithp> you'd want to be able to reprogram everything, of course
[03:11] <bdale> or fly a TeleDongle board only
[03:11] <Darkside> also - the other reasonw e all generally use RTTY is no special RX equipment is required
[03:11] <keithp> sure
[03:11] <Darkside> any amateur radio operator with a SSB receiver can receive and decode
[03:11] <Darkside> and upload to the web
[03:11] <bdale> sure, not compatible with our needs so we don't go there
[03:11] <Darkside> yep
[03:11] <keithp> SSB? Why not FM?
[03:11] <bdale> 'cause FM sucks rocks
[03:11] <keithp> heh
[03:11] <Darkside> keithp: more dB/Hz
[03:12] <bdale> right
[03:12] <keithp> good point
[03:12] <Darkside> 10mW into 500Hz vs 10mW into 5KHz
[03:12] <bdale> it's all about energy per bit per hz
[03:12] <Darkside> http://projecthorus.org/wp-content/uploads/2011/10/Horus_16_4_states.jpg
[03:12] <Darkside> theres the classic example of the distributed listening system
[03:12] <Darkside> balloon flight that went from adelaide to sydney
[03:13] <Darkside> we called up everyoen we knew in teh eastern states and got them to receive and decode
[03:13] <Darkside> and we were able to track it right until it hit the water off the coast south of sydney
[03:14] <keithp> yeah, lots of people around here use APRS
[03:14] <bdale> which is the worst of all possible combinations
[03:14] <keithp> which sucks for modulation, but there are lots of receivers around
[03:15] <bdale> double modulation so you lose 6dB
[03:15] <Darkside> yep - thats why APRS can be useful - just the density of receivers
[03:15] <bdale> as long as you don't mind running lots of watts on the tx end
[03:15] <Darkside> but it doesn't help much when you land 300km from an APRS receiver
[03:15] <bdale> amen
[03:15] <Darkside> we usually get away with 300mW
[03:15] <keithp> especially when your balloon heads out over the atlantic and europe
[03:15] <Darkside> but we don't get tracking below a few km
[03:16] <Darkside> hence why our 25mW RTTY trackers are our primary
[03:16] <keithp> and for a bitty ballon, 10mW RTTY should be plenty
[03:16] <Darkside> yep
[03:16] <Darkside> the UK guys use 10mW as thats what their ISM band regs allow
[03:17] <keithp> heh
[03:17] <Darkside> and they can't use amateur radio gear airborne, so they'r elimited to ISM
[03:17] <keithp> we don't even get that much
[03:17] <Darkside> that amateur radio limitation is a real bitch for them
[03:17] <keithp> really? That's harsh
[03:17] <Darkside> no fun stuff
[03:17] <Darkside> well think about how big the UK is
[03:17] <Darkside> a transmitter at 10km alt will have a footprint covering the entire UK
[03:17] <keithp> sounds good to me
[03:18] <Darkside> hehe
[03:18] <Darkside> anyway, we're all good in australia
[03:18] <Darkside> 25mW 434MHz ism band limit
[03:19] <keithp> Darkside: feel free to come bug us via email or oftc/#altusmetrum if you end up wanting to play with the CC1111
[03:19] <Darkside> and amateur radio in the air is fine
[03:19] <Darkside> keithp: sure :P
[03:19] <keithp> we've got tools and firmware
[03:19] <Darkside> mm
[03:19] <Darkside> iv'e been looking at the Si SoC's recently
[03:19] <keithp> and you should be able to hack up our boards to test stuff with
[03:19] <KT5TK> What do you need to get started with the C1111
[03:19] <Darkside> a lot of use use Si4432 radios on newer boards
[03:20] <keithp> KT5TK: SDCC builds code for them pretty easily
[03:20] <KT5TK> sounds good
[03:20] <KT5TK> How to upload on the chip?
[03:20] <keithp> KT5TK: we've packaged the necessary bits for debian in the cc1111 package even
[03:21] <keithp> KT5TK: our teledongle has a programming interface on it when used with the altos host software
[03:21] <KT5TK> So I just install a .deb?
[03:21] <keithp> yup
[03:21] <bdale> install the altos deb to get our tools, and the cc1111 deb to get the last version of SDCC that actually works
[03:21] <bdale> the sdcc 3.X series has "improvements" that make the 8051 code get suck rocks
[03:21] <Darkside> how do you program the C1111's without a bootloader?
[03:22] <keithp> There's nothing as standard as the AVR programming stuff, but we've settled on some pretty simple wiring
[03:22] <bdale> the debug interface doesn't require a bootloader to write code to flash
[03:22] <keithp> Darkside: no bootloader needed; we program through the debug interface
[03:22] <bdale> basically, keithp figure it out, so you don't have to
[03:22] <Darkside> which is serial?
[03:22] <bdale> no
[03:22] <keithp> Darkside: yeah, it's sync serial (kinda SPI-ish, but only two wires)
[03:22] <Darkside> ok
[03:23] <bdale> our TeleDongle is basically a cc1111 on a USB cable
[03:23] <keithp> turns out the STM32L uses something similar at a hardware level
[03:23] <bdale> it has the programming interface so it can be a programmer for all our cc1111 products
[03:24] <bdale> I sell the TeleDongle boards alone, and packaged with the USB cable
[03:24] <bdale> if you just want a cc1111 board to play with, the TeleDongle board could be useful
[03:24] <Darkside> mm, perhaps
[03:25] <keithp> the telemini has the advantage of having a battery power supply
[03:25] <keithp> otherwise very similar
[03:25] <Darkside> ok, i'm off - time for some wifi tests
[03:25] <keithp> thanks for your help this evening/morning
[03:25] <Darkside> 2pm here :-)
[03:25] <Darkside> no probs
[03:25] <bdale> the mini has essentially no way to hack stuff on, though, while the dongle does
[03:25] <keithp> true 'nuf
[03:25] <bdale> have fun!
[03:42] <Lunar_Lander> bdale, keithp are you from the USA or AUS?
[03:44] <keithp> USA
[03:44] <keithp> we'll be in AUS in Jan though :-
[03:44] <keithp> )
[03:46] <bdale> Colorado (me) and Oregon (keithp)
[03:54] <Lunar_Lander> ah
[03:54] <Lunar_Lander> :)
[03:54] <Lunar_Lander> I'm from Lower Saxony, North West Germany
[04:03] <fsphil> you're up late
[04:17] <natrium42> Lunar_Lander: do you know the city of Leer?
[04:20] <Lunar_Lander> yes
[04:28] <natrium42> Lunar_Lander: went to gymnasium there
[04:28] <natrium42> ubbo emmius gymnasium
[04:29] <Lunar_Lander> cool
[04:34] <Lunar_Lander> well
[04:34] <Lunar_Lander> good night :)
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[04:35] <natrium42> D:
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[05:15] <natrium42> wowaweewa, so many balloons on the tracker :P
[05:15] <Darkside> jeez
[05:16] <Darkside> its like a target on sydney
[05:16] <Darkside> with all the payloads they're testing
[05:18] <natrium42> time to retinafy the tracker
[05:23] <natrium42> Darkside: this would be cool http://code.google.com/apis/ajax/playground/#smooth_animation_with_frameend
[05:23] <natrium42> click "Start animation!"
[05:23] <natrium42> if you have google earth plugin installed
[05:23] <Darkside> There was a problem with the Google Earth Plugin. Please try reloading the page.
[05:23] <Darkside> lol
[05:24] <natrium42> d'oh
[05:24] <natrium42> i wish they had a webgl earth
[05:47] <justinatomatic> 10 trackers tested and flight ready for tuesday :)
[05:48] <Darkside> hehe
[05:48] <Darkside> good luck!
[05:48] <justinatomatic> although I think the block on Maverick Iceman and Goose is still in play as that didn't show up on the tracker
[05:48] <Darkside> ill be watching, if the footprint covers adelaide i'll have a go receiving
[05:48] <Darkside> but i don't lke my chances
[05:49] <justinatomatic> As is said the other day dam that curvature of the earth.
[05:50] <justinatomatic> And I guess everybody knows where i live now
[05:51] <Darkside> LoS at 17km alt from the launch site is 612km
[05:51] <Darkside> which falls short by about 80km
[05:51] <Darkside> if you go a bit higher then maybe :-)
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[09:26] <eroomde> bdale / keithp : Darkside tells me you're rocketeers!
[09:26] <eroomde> are you the ones responsible for altus metrum?
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[11:03] <justinatomatic> Any habitat admins around ??
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[11:07] <x-f> justinatomatic, worth asking on #habhub
[11:09] <griffonbot> Received email: Dave B "Re: [UKHAS] Watchdogs (Was ?? Subject not included in digest mail messages.)"
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[11:15] <justinatomatic> Ta thanks for that
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[11:53] <Willdude123> Parents have told me I can't do high altitude ballooning at all.
[11:53] <SpeedEvil> :-\
[11:53] <Willdude123> So I guess I'm not going to be in this channel much more.
[11:53] <jarod> you in Gaza?
[11:53] <SpeedEvil> any particular reason?
[11:54] <Willdude123> It's just they think it's going to land in some Londoner's garden.
[11:54] <Willdude123> Well, not exactly, but you get the picture.
[11:54] <jarod> AND? :P
[11:55] <SpeedEvil> sigh.
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[11:55] <Willdude123> Never mind. It's just irritating that I did all that research into it.
[11:55] <RG-LZ1DEV> those meddling high altitude ballooning kids
[11:55] <jarod> hehehe
[11:56] <Willdude123> As in what to buy, how to code the microcontroller.
[11:56] <fsphil> that's always a useful skill
[11:56] <Willdude123> Sorry, I am warbling.(just like RTTY). :(
[11:56] <SpeedEvil> microcontrollers are fun!
[11:57] <SpeedEvil> lots of stuff to do with r/c. or ...
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[12:01] <x-f> Willdude123, show them the predictor
[12:02] <x-f> tell them, how many times your neighbor (cuddykid) has landed in some Londoner's garden
[12:03] <cuddykid> fortunately not :P
[12:03] <x-f> that's the point
[12:03] <cuddykid> nearly had a road landing
[12:04] <cuddykid> but all have been in fields :)
[12:04] <cuddykid> Willdude123: you could always piggy back on someone else's flight after you've built a payload
[12:07] <Adam012> Build the tracker anyway and hitch a ride with someone else's project. There is also FPV which can be fun: http://www.fpvuk.org/
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[13:03] <Willdude123> Hmm...
[13:03] <Willdude123> How accurate is the predictor?
[13:06] <Darkside> with the right inputs, pretty good
[13:06] <Darkside> gets more and more accurate the closer to the launch date of course
[13:08] <Willdude123> Thanks for all your help.
[13:08] <Willdude123> I guess it just wasn't meant to be.
[13:09] <Willdude123> I especially want to thank Upu.
[13:09] <Willdude123> If I did do it, I couldn't have done it without Upu.
[13:10] <Willdude123> (no pun intended)
[13:11] <Upu> the predictions do change you know
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[13:14] <Willdude123> Bye! I might come back in a few months, just to say hi.
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[13:18] <Upu> wierd parents
[13:18] <Upu> but he is only 12
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[13:29] <griffonbot> Received email: MikeB "Re: [UKHAS] Watchdogs (Was ?? Subject not included in digest mail messages.)"
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[14:49] <bdale> eroomde: yep, keithp and I are Altus Metrum, LLC
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[14:51] <SpeedEvil> optimism:
[14:51] <SpeedEvil> the ice cream van I hear outside
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[15:48] <RG-LZ1DEV> hey fsphil managed to send my first image
[15:51] <RG-LZ1DEV> http://i.imgur.com/btkms.jpg
[16:03] <Lunar_Lander> hello
[16:10] <RG-LZ1DEV> hi lunar
[16:17] <Laurenceb_> http://i.imgur.com/dF2hy.jpg
[16:21] <Randomskk> hey Laurenceb_
[16:21] <Randomskk> I did that diffusion with a separated gaussian thing
[16:21] <Randomskk> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DEaAL-DQQ80
[16:21] <Randomskk> in parallel on my gpu
[16:21] <Randomskk> seems to work
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[16:23] <Laurenceb_> wow overkill?
[16:23] <Laurenceb_> or does it have to be really fast?
[16:23] <Laurenceb_> ^thats an ipad3 screen with adaptor dongle to displayport
[16:23] <Laurenceb_> from another channel
[16:23] <Laurenceb_> http://i.imgur.com/arEQZ.jpg
[16:24] <Randomskk> fast would be nice
[16:25] <Upu> yeah that looks nice
[16:25] <Lunar_Lander> hi Upu
[16:32] <Upu> Hi Lunar
[16:32] <Lunar_Lander> hope you have a good day
[16:33] <Randomskk> Laurenceb_: about 3ms per iteration of 512x512 grid with a 7x7 kernel
[16:34] <Randomskk> so that's what, 262144 cells each doing two 7-long convolutions
[16:34] <Laurenceb_> why does it need to be so fast?
[16:34] <Laurenceb_> is this some sort of speed challenge?
[16:34] <Randomskk> something like 3.6 million operations per 3ms
[16:34] <Randomskk> or about one million ops a millisecond
[16:35] <Randomskk> one billion operations a second
[16:35] <Randomskk> sweet
[16:35] <Randomskk> Laurenceb_: I plan to be doing a lot of iterations and doing other things at the same time
[16:35] <Laurenceb_> i see
[16:36] <Randomskk> probably including a biophysics simulator
[16:36] <Randomskk> and anyway it's a good way to get the hang of doing some opencl stuff
[16:36] <Randomskk> wish I had something to compare it to though, performance wise
[16:36] <Laurenceb_> the octave code i minked?
[16:36] <Laurenceb_> *linked
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[16:38] <jarod> http://d24w6bsrhbeh9d.cloudfront.net/photo/5872432_700b.jpg
[16:40] <RG-LZ1DEV> excellent shot
[16:49] <Randomskk> Laurenceb_: hmm. if I run the same code on the CPU rather than CPU it's six times slower
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[16:59] <Laurenceb_> wow
[16:59] <Laurenceb_> big difference
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[17:00] <Randomskk> Laurenceb_: was that sarcasm?
[17:00] <Randomskk> it seems like maybe the gpu should be more than 6x faster
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[17:02] <SpeedEvil> memory bandwidth limits?
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[17:03] <Randomskk> not sure if bandwidth constrained
[17:03] <Randomskk> I'm not transferring between host and gpu each iteration
[17:04] <Randomskk> but it is transferring between gpu global memory and the workgroup local memory
[17:04] <Randomskk> and my workgroups are fairly big
[17:04] <Randomskk> hard to say
[17:04] <Randomskk> a profiler would be nice
[17:04] <Randomskk> http://developer.amd.com/tools/heterogeneous-computing/amd-app-profiler/
[17:04] <Randomskk> hmmm
[17:05] <Laurenceb_> i have zero experience with this sort of thing
[17:05] <Laurenceb_> sorry
[17:05] <Laurenceb_> is thermal epoxy electrically conductive?
[17:06] <Randomskk> depends
[17:06] <Randomskk> some is
[17:08] <Laurenceb_> ok ill have to be careful
[17:08] <Laurenceb_> i needs isolation
[17:09] <Laurenceb_> sticking some allegro stepper motor driver boards to aluminium chassi frame
[17:10] <SpeedEvil> I used a mix of silicon carbide grades to do that once
[17:10] <SpeedEvil> fine plus coarse to set a minimum gap
[17:10] <SpeedEvil> and epoxy
[17:11] <SpeedEvil> seemed to work OK
[17:11] <Laurenceb_> interesting
[17:11] <Laurenceb_> i cant seem to find any thermal epxoy on farnell
[17:12] <Laurenceb_> its on RS tho :D
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[17:13] <Laurenceb_> this whole thing is pretty stupid really
[17:13] Nick change: Nabilbo -> Nabobalis
[17:13] <Laurenceb_> theres no need to stick 2A through the stepper at rest
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[17:14] <Laurenceb_> the allegro drivers suck
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[17:14] <SpeedEvil> it can improve holding toqrue
[17:14] <SpeedEvil> torque
[17:14] <Laurenceb_> yeah but i dont need that
[17:14] <Laurenceb_> i can turn it off using the enable pin
[17:15] <Laurenceb_> and use a dac to set the hold current
[17:15] <Laurenceb_> but itll still suck due to their bridge design
[17:15] <Laurenceb_> im almost tempted to build my own and get it down to ~0 heat dissipation
[17:15] <Laurenceb_> but im too lazy
[17:16] <Laurenceb_> use about 24V drive to counter the motor inductance, together with a freewheel"
[17:16] <Laurenceb_> type bridge design
[17:17] <Laurenceb_> and you could get some mental performance out of the motors
[17:17] <Laurenceb_> with no overheating
[17:18] <Laurenceb_> so drive of each phase would look like : 1) apply 24V to ramp up current
[17:18] <Laurenceb_> 2) short the phase
[17:19] <Laurenceb_> 3) apply -24V - i.e. dump back onto the 24v rail
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[17:47] <Randomskk> hah
[17:47] <Randomskk> I profiled it
[17:47] <Randomskk> "Limiting factors: None"
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[17:59] <SP9UOB> Hi all
[18:01] <Lunar_Lander> hello
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[19:31] <mclane> Does someone here has experience with cutdown devices?
[19:32] <eroomde> yup
[19:32] <mclane> what is the recommended principle?
[19:33] <Lunar_Lander> hello mclane
[19:33] <mclane> Hi lunar
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[19:35] <eroomde> mclane: well, there are a couple of often-flown types
[19:35] <eroomde> one is a hot-wire cutdown
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[19:35] <eroomde> one is a pyrotechnic
[19:35] <eroomde> initially, do you have a preference between those two?
[19:36] <mclane> I thought about a hot-wire design
[19:37] <mclane> purpose is to get rid of balloon remnants after burst
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[19:37] <mclane> we had some problems with our last 2 flights
[19:38] <eroomde> ok cool
[19:38] <eroomde> makes sense
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[19:38] <eroomde> well, the idea is generally that you use some resistive wire
[19:38] <eroomde> usually nichrome
[19:38] <eroomde> and do a couple of turns of it around the suspension wire
[19:38] <eroomde> and wire it up to a mosfet and a battery pack
[19:39] <eroomde> in reality you want to do a bit of engineering to, for example, stop the hot wire being being bent and flexed all of the place, which can break it
[19:41] <eroomde> now to calculate the wire and power combo, i'm not sure how other people do it, i guess experimentally
[19:41] <eroomde> but i think you want about 90kW/m^2 of heat on the length of hot wire
[19:41] <eroomde> to get through nylon string
[19:42] <eroomde> so for example you'll buy nichrome of some <0.5mm diameter and with some number of ohms/m resistence
[19:42] <eroomde> and so for a given length of that you can calculate the resistence of it, and its surface area
[19:43] <eroomde> and if you know the system battery voltage, you can calculate the power going through it ( (V^2)/R )
[19:43] <eroomde> and so see if you're >= 90kW/m^2
[19:43] <eroomde> it usually works out at being a couple of amps through like a 10cm long bit of maplin nichrome wire
[19:44] <eroomde> i'm monologuing a bit, sorry
[19:45] <x-f> a walking habencyclopedist
[19:46] <eroomde> so another kind of hot-wire we have flown, which i think is a bit more robust to flexing about, uses a low value standard plated-through-hole resistor
[19:47] <eroomde> and we arranged it in a way which will be tricky to describe over text
[19:47] <eroomde> but i shall try
[19:47] <eroomde> we took a small reel or bobbin
[19:48] <eroomde> like you might get a roll of thread on
[19:48] <eroomde> eg
[19:48] <eroomde> http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/c/cf/Sewing_Bobbin.jpg
[19:49] <eroomde> and then we cut it in half down the middle
[19:49] <eroomde> but in the axis so that you're left with 2 semicircles of bobbin
[19:49] <eroomde> do you see what i mean?
[19:50] <eroomde> i.e. in that photo, you would chop down from the top down onto that felt surface, leaving you with two halves
[19:50] <eroomde> then we put a standard small value resistor (like 2 ohms) on the inner surface of the reel
[19:50] <eroomde> the bit you would wind string around
[19:51] <eroomde> then we rejoined the two halves of the bobbin with a cable tie, so that it looked like a normal bobbin again
[19:51] <eroomde> but, if you dump current through the resistor now, which is on the surface and thus has the cable tie pressed against it, it melts through the cable tie
[19:51] <eroomde> and so the two halves of the bobbin separate
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[19:52] <eroomde> now, through the hole in the bobbin that the axle normally goes through on a sewing machine, you put one loop down to the payload and the other loop up to the balloon
[19:52] <OZ1SKY_Brian> hi
[19:52] <eroomde> do you see?
[19:52] <mclane> ok, need to think it through
[19:54] <mclane> thanks for the hints!
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[19:55] <mclane> what kind of power supply did you use? AA Energizer lithium ok?
[19:56] <eroomde> yep
[19:56] <eroomde> old faithful
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[20:02] <OZ1SKY_Brian> SP9UOB ping
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[20:13] <SP9UOB> PONG ;-)
[20:13] <SP9UOB> hi OZ1SKY
[20:14] <SP9UOB> mclane: CR123A are also nice
[20:15] <mclane> ah ok, didn't think about that
[20:15] <SP9UOB> 10 hours of flight with 1W output :-) - 4 in series
[20:18] <OZ1SKY_Brian> SP9UOB Hi, we should have tryed later, had polsat in
[20:25] <Laurenceb_> ive done hot resistor cutdowns too
[20:25] <Laurenceb_> simpler to eroomde
[20:26] <eroomde> yeah
[20:26] <SP9UOB> OZ1SKY_Brian: we can try on 14 MHz or so ;-)
[20:26] <OZ1SKY_Brian> SP9UOB thats too easy lol
[20:26] <SP9UOB> lol
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[20:27] <OZ1SKY_Brian> SP9UOB are you getting ready for another launch soon, or just tests?
[20:27] <Laurenceb_> http://ukhas.org.uk/_media/projects:mihab:p6290013.jpg?w=600
[20:27] <Laurenceb_> haha back in the day
[20:27] <Laurenceb_> from 2005 XD
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[20:28] <Laurenceb_> http://ukhas.org.uk/_media/projects:dscn1015.jpg?w=350
[20:28] <Laurenceb_> theres a cutdown
[20:28] <SP9UOB> OZ1SKY_Brian: that was solar-only powered tracker test lying on my roof. It stop transmitting when sun goes below 5 degrees in elevation
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[20:29] <OZ1SKY_Brian> Laurenceb nice
[20:29] <OZ1SKY_Brian> SP9UOB ahh ok i see
[20:29] <OZ1SKY_Brian> SP9UOB will next launch also be 10m?
[20:30] <SP9UOB> OZ1SKY_Brian: on 70 cm (100g kaysam ballon), 10m in early spring I think (long duration zero-pressure mylar balloon)
[20:31] <OZ1SKY_Brian> SP9UOB ok, better get a 10m GP up by then
[20:32] <OZ1SKY_Brian> i think i have some old cb ½w and 5/8w somewhere, they should work fine with a retune
[20:32] <SP9UOB> OZ1SKY_Brian: should by ok
[20:32] <SP9UOB> OZ1SKY_Brian: should be ok
[20:33] <OZ1SKY_Brian> SP9UOB or i should just find a polish car here, they all got CB´s on, LOL
[20:34] <SP9UOB> OZ1SKY_Brian: yep, youre right
[20:35] <SP9UOB> polish police is "hunting" for drivers (speeding) ie 40 meters before end of limit zone
[20:36] <SP9UOB> so many drivers using CB radio to avoid this - radar detectors in Poland are illegal
[20:37] <OZ1SKY_Brian> SP9UOB yes i did see a video on youtube about that
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[20:37] <SP9UOB> but.. hmm.. I think i can listen on 10 GHz - if someone call CQ ;-))
[20:37] <SP9UOB> its legal ;-)
[20:37] <OZ1SKY_Brian> i had to find out what all that CB buzz was about in poland :-)
[20:38] <SP9UOB> now You know
[20:38] <OZ1SKY_Brian> SP9UOB yes give the police some CQ on there radars lol
[20:39] <OZ1SKY_Brian> gives me "smokey and the bandit" flashbacks, if you know that movie :-)
[20:39] <SP9UOB> lol :-)
[20:39] <SP9UOB> or.. Olsen Gang ;-)
[20:40] <OZ1SKY_Brian> lol ahh you know that one, nice
[20:40] <SP9UOB> all of them :-)
[20:40] <OZ1SKY_Brian> lol
[20:41] <Lunar_Lander> OZ1SKY_Brian, hello
[20:41] <SP9UOB> 10 mtrs was also choosen - because we all had CB antennas in cars :-)
[20:41] <Lunar_Lander> I know the "next generation" one with the space base
[20:41] <SP9UOB> hi Lunar_Lander
[20:42] <Lunar_Lander> where the one guy almost gets shot into space and the other guy with the money steps on a landmine
[20:42] <OZ1SKY_Brian> Lunar_Lander Hi
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[20:42] <Lunar_Lander> and then the mine explodes but there was no money in the suitcase but only paper
[20:42] <Lunar_Lander> hi SP9UOB
[20:43] <OZ1SKY_Brian> SP9UOB 10meter was very good too, heard in canada, thats a very nice hab catch
[20:44] <SP9UOB> OZ1SKY_Brian: right - with little help of propagation
[20:44] <OZ1SKY_Brian> sure, i also had some help with PYSY
[20:44] <SP9UOB> was also heard in USA, but no decodable because of SSB QRM
[20:44] <Lunar_Lander> OZ1SKY_Brian,
[20:44] <Lunar_Lander> "Die neuen Eltern stellen sich in Wirklichkeit als Raketenfabrikanten heraus und wollen ihn als ersten Menschen in den Weltraum schicken. Noch vor den Russen oder Amerikanern soll Dänemark als Raumfahrtnation in die Geschichte eingehen."
[20:45] <SP9UOB> http://list-archives.org/2012/10/20/blt-stevens-com/sp9uob-in-float-at-110-000-ft/f/3151302588
[20:45] <Lunar_Lander> "his foster parents are in fact rocket manufacturers and want to send him into space as the first man ever to fly there. Even before the Russians or Americans, Danmark should go down in history as a space nation"
[20:45] <Lunar_Lander> now, look at Copenhagen Suborbitals...
[20:45] <Lunar_Lander> xD
[20:46] <Lunar_Lander> *Denmark of course
[20:46] <OZ1SKY_Brian> hehe yes i hope some day they mannage, its a pretty big task they are working on
[20:46] <Lunar_Lander> yea
[20:47] <Lunar_Lander> the german wikipedia page on the film is more detailed than the English or Danish
[20:47] <Lunar_Lander> https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Olsenbanden_Jr.
[20:47] <OZ1SKY_Brian> K5WH that somewhere down near Texas, if i can recall
[20:49] <SP9UOB> OZ1SKY_Brian: according to QRZ.com Grid Square: EL29fx
[20:50] <OZ1SKY_Brian> If they still use the same call area systen, 5 should be down south.
[20:50] <OZ1SKY_Brian> system
[20:51] <SP9UOB> US StateTexas
[20:51] <SP9UOB> US CountyHarris
[20:51] <SP9UOB> near Gulf of Mexico
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[20:51] <OZ1SKY_Brian> yes ok that sounds right
[20:52] <SP9UOB> 9000 km :-)
[20:52] <OZ1SKY_Brian> Just reinstalled my ads-b rx today, wonder if anyone every launched one on a hab
[20:52] <OZ1SKY_Brian> a tx a mean
[20:54] <SP9UOB> heavy...
[20:55] <OZ1SKY_Brian> yes thats right, didnt think about that
[20:55] <SP9UOB> OZ1SKY_Brian: is APRS in Danmark very popular?
[20:57] <OZ1SKY_Brian> SP9UOB not realy sure, i know there are some repeaters for it and lots of trafik on them, but when i last watched it, it didnt seem to be very active, just lots of automated beacons
[20:58] <OZ1SKY_Brian> It would be terriable to listen HAB on the APRS freq, they are allmost 100% dutycycle those repeaters
[20:58] <SP9UOB> OZ1SKY_Brian: maybe some of Hams in OZ will be interested in my dsDIGI http://sp9uob.verox.pl/dsdigi.html - use google Translator
[20:58] <SP9UOB> first pure DSP aprs modem :-)
[20:58] <SP9UOB> http://sp9uob.verox.pl/dstnc.html
[20:59] <Lunar_Lander> SP9UOB, I did a mistake there btw
[21:00] <Lunar_Lander> Denmark, not Danmark
[21:00] <Lunar_Lander> :)
[21:00] <OZ1SKY_Brian> SP9UOB ahh nice, would also be nice for mobile use, very small.
[21:01] <OZ1SKY_Brian> I think most of the aprs guys went to dstar though
[21:01] <SP9UOB> OZ1SKY_Brian: also have tracker code :-) and even bluetooth for APRSdroid :-)
[21:02] <OZ1SKY_Brian> ahh thats cool
[21:05] <OZ1SKY_Brian> how did you get so meny listernes at your launch, did you bring the news in a amateur paper or bb ?
[21:05] <SP9UOB> OZ1SKY_Brian: just ask them for help on HAM forum.
[21:06] <OZ1SKY_Brian> ok, i never seen such a big turnout at a launch before
[21:06] <SP9UOB> also frequency was available for almost everyone (no like 70cm/SSB)
[21:06] <OZ1SKY_Brian> yes thats right, more rigs will do that mode
[21:07] <SP9UOB> and antennas
[21:07] <OZ1SKY_Brian> well a 70cm is abit easyer to put up :-)
[21:07] <SP9UOB> 10m is perfect - but i tkink 1Watt was overkill
[21:07] <SP9UOB> think
[21:08] <SP9UOB> 100mW should be enough :-)
[21:08] <OZ1SKY_Brian> only problem on 10m is the noice floor
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[21:09] <OZ1SKY_Brian> 10m would be perfect for a night launch
[21:09] <Lunar_Lander> SP9UOB, what is Warzaw called in Polish?
[21:10] <Lunar_Lander> ah too late
[21:10] <Lunar_Lander> thanks anyway
[21:10] <Lunar_Lander> :)
[21:10] <SP9UOB> short before batterries die - only modulated crystal oscillator was received in 100 km radius :-)
[21:10] <SP9UOB> Lunar_Lander: Warszawa
[21:10] <Lunar_Lander> yea thanks
[21:11] <OZ1SKY_Brian> SP9UOB hehe very good inded
[21:12] <SP9UOB> batteries was drained down to 4.5V (from 12V)
[21:12] <OZ1SKY_Brian> 1W is also high for batt drive
[21:12] <OZ1SKY_Brian> pretty high dutycyle on rtty
[21:13] <SP9UOB> last 16 transmission was with 1 as the sequence ID - so brownout reset was happen
[21:14] <SP9UOB> TX was powered off between transmissions (30 seconds off - 12 seconds transmit)
[21:14] <OZ1SKY_Brian> ah ok, i only heard some sporadic bursts here
[21:15] <SP9UOB> possibly aeroplane scatter :-)
[21:15] <OZ1SKY_Brian> yeah or MS
[21:17] <OZ1SKY_Brian> i think i will retune the 5/8w, it should be better for the low angle
[21:18] <OZ1SKY_Brian> unless you plan to fligh to right over me
[21:19] <SP9UOB> i must order north jetstream ;-)
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[21:20] <OZ1SKY_Brian> i never had any HAB fligh over me, but last pico was fairly close
[21:20] <upix> good evening
[21:20] <OZ1SKY_Brian> hi upix
[21:21] <eroomde> evening upix
[21:22] <SP9UOB> OZ1SKY_Brian: just launch Your own :-)
[21:22] <OZ1SKY_Brian> SP9UOB yes i know, i just hate this location, water all around
[21:23] <OZ1SKY_Brian> not nice if you want the payload back
[21:23] <SP9UOB> OZ1SKY_Brian: just not plan to recover - easier :-)
[21:23] <OZ1SKY_Brian> lol thats right
[21:23] <SP9UOB> OZ1SKY_Brian: try to do something extremly cheap
[21:24] <SP9UOB> just 4 transistor TX, simple microcontroller and gps
[21:24] <OZ1SKY_Brian> i think a pico will be the first to try
[21:25] <SP9UOB> OZ1SKY_Brian: check Your local regulations - in Poland there is no pico exclusion
[21:26] <OZ1SKY_Brian> i read abit on the national regulation and got even more confused :-)
[21:26] <SP9UOB> for my first flight just use giant party ballooons - 1 Euro/ea
[21:27] <SP9UOB> http://sp9pdf.polsl.pl/wp/wp-content/gallery/balony_testowe/balon_5.jpg
[21:27] <OZ1SKY_Brian> thats what im thinking too, i have no experience with big ballons
[21:27] <SP9UOB> archeived 10km in altitude and go about 200 km
[21:28] <OZ1SKY_Brian> yes thats would be a good place to start
[21:28] <OZ1SKY_Brian> how long did the flight last, hours?
[21:29] <SP9UOB> http://aprs.fi/#!mt=roadmap&z=11&ts=1339200000&te=1339286400&call=a%2FSP9UOB-11
[21:30] <SP9UOB> about 4h30 min
[21:30] <OZ1SKY_Brian> ok thats a nice flight time
[21:30] <SP9UOB> altitude is wrong (bad tracker code)
[21:30] <OZ1SKY_Brian> yeah and 256C outside? :-)
[21:31] <SP9UOB> OZ1SKY_Brian: no this was overwritten by later tests
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[21:31] <SP9UOB> telemetry is dated 2012-10-27
[21:31] <OZ1SKY_Brian> ahh ok, because i dont see chernobyl below that ballon track :-)
[21:31] <SP9UOB> flight was on 9.06.2012
[21:32] <SP9UOB> lol
[21:32] <Lunar_Lander> XD
[21:32] <Lunar_Lander> OZ1SKY_Brian, btw we should really go for the first Danish HAB
[21:32] <Lunar_Lander> we'll make it
[21:32] <Lunar_Lander> somehow
[21:32] <SP9UOB> 29.490MMHz FM @300 mW and was received until fade over the horizon
[21:32] <Lunar_Lander> the boxes will float in the baltic sea
[21:32] <Lunar_Lander> :)
[21:33] <SP9UOB> if they drift to Poland i take them over :-)
[21:33] <Lunar_Lander> :)
[21:34] <SP9UOB> i can reserve boat too ;-)
[21:34] <OZ1SKY_Brian> Lunar_Lander yeah for a long time. I asked a frind if he had some interest in working on a pico launch and he had. But i dont have time before spring, because im in the process of total remodel my new home.
[21:34] <Lunar_Lander> yea
[21:36] <OZ1SKY_Brian> want to get it done, so i can move in, so hab has to wait abit still.
[21:37] <Lunar_Lander> yea
[21:37] <Lunar_Lander> awesome! http://habhub.org/predict/#!/uuid=8b3d18bd08a17e8f1ac708cbe03607659c1fc55c
[21:37] <SP9UOB> OZ1SKY_Brian: keep my fingers crossed :-)
[21:38] <OZ1SKY_Brian> Lunar_Lander only problem there is no bridge up there :-)
[21:38] <OZ1SKY_Brian> SP9UOB thanks :-)
[21:38] <Lunar_Lander> oh
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[21:39] <OZ1SKY_Brian> its a 400km detour and 2x bridge toll :-)
[21:39] <SP9UOB> http://habhub.org/predict/#!/uuid=5cda9c60110e6f87ab6319a61148bb10b0b73ebc
[21:39] <Lunar_Lander> oh
[21:39] <Lunar_Lander> yea you need go via Nyborg as I see it
[21:39] <Lunar_Lander> and then past Copenhagen to there
[21:40] <OZ1SKY_Brian> yep, its islands
[21:40] <Lunar_Lander> yea
[21:40] <Lunar_Lander> where is the Denmark-Sweden bridge again?
[21:41] <Lunar_Lander> Copenhagen-Malmö?
[21:41] <OZ1SKY_Brian> yes
[21:41] <Lunar_Lander> ah
[21:41] <SP9UOB> ok: its getting late - good night all
[21:41] <OZ1SKY_Brian> via sweden will not help me :-)
[21:41] <Lunar_Lander> :)
[21:41] <Lunar_Lander> good night Tomas
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[21:41] <OZ1SKY_Brian> SP9UOB goodnight
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[21:45] <OZ1SKY_Brian> if im going to launch, then i must expect to loose it, chances to recover are very slim
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[21:57] <x-f> OZ1SKY_Brian, use the backup recovery system recommended by WB8ELK - write the magic word "reward" on your payload
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[21:58] <OZ1SKY_Brian> lol yeah that should work
[21:58] <eroomde> it does
[21:59] <eroomde> 'modest reward' we put
[21:59] <eroomde> otherwise people's expectations seem to be like £1000
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[22:09] <SpeedEvil> 'a tesco value product of your choice'
[22:10] <Lunar_Lander> XD
[22:10] <Lunar_Lander> what would be one of such products?
[22:11] <SpeedEvil> it's a value range of groceries.
[22:11] <SpeedEvil> so, say a tin of chopped tomatoes.
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[22:12] <Lunar_Lander> ah
[22:12] <Lunar_Lander> XD
[22:14] <Lunar_Lander> daveake, just reading your blog post
[22:14] <Lunar_Lander> for some reason the photos in it disapperaed
[22:14] <Lunar_Lander> no, just the three with Anthony and you and the TV camera in the computer room
[22:15] <daveake> Site hasn't changed
[22:16] <fsphil> we've edited your memory though
[22:21] <daveake> Could you edit mine please? I could do with some free space
[22:23] Action: SpeedEvil deletes December from daveake.
[22:25] <DrLuke> Make me forget all the series I've watched
[22:25] <DrLuke> so I can rewatch all of them anew
[22:26] <fsphil> you might not like them the second time
[22:26] <eroomde> 1st time
[22:26] <eroomde> i would like to be able to have hard sotrage
[22:26] <eroomde> and ram
[22:26] <eroomde> storage*
[22:27] <Randomskk> you and everyone else
[22:27] <eroomde> where i can stash things like moods and emotions and handle them later
[22:27] <eroomde> for example
[22:27] <eroomde> i will be designing a circuit at work
[22:27] <eroomde> but suddenly i am thinking about cheese
[22:27] <eroomde> and i really want some cheese
[22:27] <eroomde> and it's distracting
[22:27] <eroomde> and this willbe the case for an hour or so
[22:27] <eroomde> if i could make that go away, that would help me in my life
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[22:28] <daveake> So you need fork() for cheese?
[22:29] <fsphil> where'd that cricket come from?
[22:31] <gonzo_> a little fermented curd will do the trick ?
[22:34] <Lunar_Lander> hello DrLuke
[22:34] <RG-LZ1DEV> cheese? sounds like somebody attempted memory management
[22:35] <DrLuke> hi lunar_lander
[22:35] <DrLuke> fsphil: how can you not like firefly
[22:35] <Lunar_Lander> daveake, I remember you sitting in your office with the BBC TV camera next to you
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[22:35] <Lunar_Lander> the image simply disappeared
[22:35] <daveake> It's simply there when I look
[22:35] <eroomde> DanielRichman: re earlier chat, http://klabs.org/history/apollo_11_alarms/eyles_2004/eyles_2004.htm
[22:36] <eroomde> specifically 'restart protecxtion'
[22:36] <eroomde> protection*
[22:36] <eroomde> picking up from where you left off if you get a random reset
[22:40] <fsphil> DrLuke: I do?
[22:40] <DrLuke> fsphil: yeah, so it's unlikely you won't like it again
[22:40] <DrLuke> afterall your personality doesn't change when a specific memory is deleted
[22:40] <DrLuke> atleast not much
[22:41] <fsphil> but you'd be comparing it against newer shows
[22:41] <DrLuke> yeah?
[22:41] <DrLuke> It's still win
[22:41] <DrLuke> it'd*
[22:42] <fsphil> true
[22:42] <fsphil> only flaw is I'd have to hate the theme tune all over again
[22:42] <DrLuke> oh god yeah
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[22:42] <DrLuke> also I'd have to cringe at the dropping-on-sword death all over again
[22:44] <fsphil> I'd forgot about that :p
[22:44] <fsphil> I was thinking of shows like Babylon 5. I love that show, but the effects haven't all aged well
[22:45] <fsphil> or has some of the acting
[22:48] <LazyLeopard> Hmmm... Effects worked OK on old TVs, but don't look so good on a modern HD tv, that's for sure.
[22:55] <SpeedEvil> 'you do not understand'
[22:58] <OZ1SKY_Brian> gn all
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[22:58] <staylo> All this talk of babylon 5 makes me want to watch spaced again.
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[23:07] <fsphil> SpeedEvil: Yes
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[00:00] --- Mon Nov 19 2012