highaltitude.log.20121114

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[00:19] <Laurenceb_> http://www.lasercomponents.com/fileadmin/user_upload/home/Datasheets/lcd/sae-series_nir-enhanced.pdf
[00:19] <Laurenceb_> nice stuff
[00:23] <KT5TK_QRL> Isn't 900nm where water has a high absorption region? bad for comms
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[01:46] <arko> there's no hab predictor that goes years back in time right?
[02:01] <SpeedEvil> well.
[02:01] <SpeedEvil> it's more am case no bodies archived them data
[02:01] <SpeedEvil> weather data
[02:02] <SpeedEvil> it'd be trivialish to reload
[02:02] <SpeedEvil> if it was avaiolabnle
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[03:11] <fsphil> noaa have archives but I can't remember where they are
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[03:57] <arko> woot!
[03:57] <arko> my Byonics microtrak RTG-FA just arrived :)
[03:57] <arko> this will be the primary radio for HABEX2
[03:58] <arko> the one that can't fail
[03:58] <arko> woo
[03:58] <Darkside> bah
[03:58] <Darkside> "micro" trak
[03:58] <Darkside> that'snot micro!
[03:58] <arko> not veryy micro
[03:58] <arko> i know
[03:59] <Darkside> we did micro aprs firs t:P
[03:59] <arko> oh?
[03:59] <Darkside> with the MicroNut
[03:59] <Darkside> well, maybe not first
[03:59] <Darkside> but our APRS tracker is tiny
[03:59] <Darkside> http://rfhead.net/wp-content/uploads/2012/05/aprs_payloads.jpg
[03:59] <arko> woah!
[03:59] <arko> thats aprs?
[04:00] <Darkside> yes
[04:00] <Darkside> 145.175MHz
[04:00] <arko> shut up and take my money
[04:00] <Darkside> using a 300mW Radiometrix HX1 module
[04:00] <Darkside> haha
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[04:00] <arko> how much?
[04:00] <Darkside> we don't sell them
[04:00] <arko> is it open source?
[04:00] <Darkside> nope
[04:00] <arko> i can mill and through hole plate
[04:00] <arko> damn it
[04:00] <Darkside> makes it a bit too easy
[04:01] <arko> i was thinking of designing my own
[04:01] <arko> just for lulz
[04:01] <arko> selling is too much work
[04:01] <Darkside> go for it :-)
[04:01] <Darkside> it's not that hard
[04:01] <arko> :D
[04:01] <Darkside> reasons why we don't sell #1
[04:01] <Darkside> too hard
[04:01] <Darkside> and B) support
[04:01] <arko> i would have publicized the shit out of that
[04:01] <arko> or as much as i could
[04:01] <Darkside> heh
[04:01] <arko> all good
[04:01] <Darkside> the micronut is from last year
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[04:02] <Darkside> we've been using them since about decembet 2011
[04:02] <arko> nice
[04:02] <arko> clean design
[04:02] <Darkside> the design is actually a bit outdated
[04:02] <Darkside> http://rfhead.net/?p=470
[04:02] <Darkside> thats the new version of the micronut
[04:03] <arko> ohhH!
[04:03] <arko> on the back!
[04:03] <arko> i was wondering where that way
[04:03] <Darkside> the micronut is meant to be a RTTY payload, but with the right module and power supply, it can do APRS
[04:03] <arko> was*
[04:03] <arko> nice
[04:03] <arko> i like this
[04:03] <Darkside> the trick with the HX1 modules is they require regulate 5V, which is why there was that second PCB with on the APRS transmitters
[04:03] <Darkside> the second PCB being a 5V boost converter
[04:03] <arko> noticed that
[04:04] <Darkside> these boards all have LDOs, to drop down to 5V
[04:04] <Darkside> again, an obsolete design
[04:04] <arko> whats taken over?
[04:04] <Darkside> i've moved on to using boost converters on my newer payloads
[04:04] <arko> cool
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[06:50] <RG_LZ1DEV> https://www.google.bg/search?q=askew
[06:50] <RG_LZ1DEV> hehe
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[07:10] <costyn> x-f: heh, that article http://www.engadget.com/2012/08/15/caption-contest-gopro-gone-wrong/ is not the guy from the other article, but I do know this guy too :)
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[08:07] <x-f> good morning
[08:07] <x-f> costyn, now that's a suprise! :) maybe you know the story behind that picture too?
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[08:10] <costyn> x-f: not sure, lemme find out
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[08:12] <costyn> x-f: I sent him a msg, but since he's in the US, won't find out til he wakes up
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[08:14] <costyn> x-f: think it might've been for this: http://vimeo.com/41338518 where they combine wingsuits with canopy flying
[08:14] <UpuWork> Who's uploading Iceman ?
[08:15] <eroomde> val kilmer
[08:15] <UpuWork> Well we have Maverick on there last night too
[08:15] <eroomde> shotgun $$GOOSE as a callsign
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[08:28] <x-f> costyn, that's an amazing video!
[08:29] <costyn> x-f: yea it's quite a feat to bring the 2 together. The parachutes are tiny nervous little ones, and the wingsuits are huge. FLying either takes a lot of practice and skill before you can do it safely.
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[08:35] <RG_LZ1DEV> Pluses: Perl / Dancer experience
[08:35] <RG_LZ1DEV> lol
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[09:20] <M0JCU> Setting up launch site. Probably closer to 10:30 launch
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[09:35] <griffonbot> Received email: Anthony Stirk "[UKHAS] ICEMAN/MAVERICK/GOOSE"
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[09:46] <LazyLeopard> Hmmm... chase-car in Sydney...
[09:47] <UpuWork> I keep deleting them...
[09:47] <fsphil> wasn't me :)
[09:47] <natrium42> could just use filtering
[09:48] <UpuWork> yeah but shouldn't have too really
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[09:49] <LazyLeopard> Quite.
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[09:52] <GMT> Are those Aussia ballons actually doing anything, or is it just 'noise'?
[09:53] <fsphil> likely them testing
[09:53] <fsphil> so, noise
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[09:54] <GMT> gonna be messy when the 3 UK balloons go up, and their chase car!
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[09:55] <GMT> any way to make them 'not appear' on my screen?
[09:56] <natrium42> filter in settings
[09:56] <natrium42> just list the callsigns you do want to appear
[09:57] <mattbrejza> do they disappear if you refresh?
[09:57] <mattbrejza> i think theyve been removed now as i cant see them
[09:57] <natrium42> that's because UpuWork is deleting them
[09:57] <mattbrejza> continously?
[09:57] <natrium42> sounds like it
[09:57] <mattbrejza> ive refreshed a few times and never seen
[09:57] <LazyLeopard> Yes, a forced reload will get rid of them for now.
[09:58] <Darkside> heh
[09:58] <Darkside> thats the USYD people
[09:58] <Darkside> whi of course aren't on IRC
[09:59] <LazyLeopard> Do they get the ukhas mailing list?
[09:59] <Darkside> probably not
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[10:02] <UpuWork> got a mail address for them Darkside
[10:03] <Darkside> nope
[10:04] <UpuWork> they seem to have stopped
[10:04] <Darkside> maybe they took the hint
[10:05] <LazyLeopard> Hopefully
[10:07] <number10> its a pitty you cant do a multiple filter on spacenear
[10:08] <fsphil> you can
[10:08] <fsphil> just put in multiple callsigns separated by a comma
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[10:09] <number10> aha cheers fsphil
[10:09] <kokey> is vortex going to be launched from that location?
[10:10] <Darkside> theres maverick again
[10:11] <GMT> kokey: the whole VORTEX combine is being launched from there
[10:11] <Darkside> oh well, it defaults to the UK one
[10:11] <daveake> Someone upload a payload called $$OhMaverickBuggerOffThere'sARealFlightOn
[10:11] <Darkside> not australia
[10:12] <daveake> s/Oh/Oy/
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[10:13] <kokey> GMT: seems like it would be one I could pick up on my scanner at work in London, or home in Watford
[10:13] <kokey> after launch that is
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[10:13] <kokey> if I was near my scanner
[10:13] <kokey> all hypothetical really
[10:14] <GMT> kokey: I'm in London too, near Heathrow, and I'm only using a scanner too. You should be able to pick it up soon after launch.
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[10:15] <gb73d> Hi M1ELK here S of Reading, ready to monitor VORTEX
[10:15] <jcoxon> those tabs really break spacenear.us for me
[10:15] <gb73d> approx how long until launch ?
[10:15] <natrium42> yeah, whoops
[10:16] <natrium42> maybe it was too long or it's the spaces
[10:17] <LazyLeopard> The flight banner might be a better place?
[10:17] <GMT> gb73d: they reckoned nearer to 10.30
[10:17] <natrium42> but they'd have to refresh page, LazyLeopard
[10:17] <natrium42> we need to add a way to force refresh for all clients
[10:18] <gb73d> ty i have windows updates to install back soon...
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[10:18] <LazyLeopard> Ah, yeah...
[10:19] Action: jcoxon does approve of their callsigns though...
[10:20] <LazyLeopard> "Top Gun" ;)
[10:20] <NavracWork> I'm not seeing the balloon data panels on spacenear - I can see one red balloon for vortex but no panel
[10:21] <NavracWork> and a chase car - is this normal?
[10:21] <natrium42> refresh please
[10:22] <natrium42> it couldn't handle spaces in the callsign o_O
[10:22] <natrium42> not sure why
[10:22] <NavracWork> done - had to clear the cache for it to refresh properly
[10:23] <daveake> oh ffs
[10:23] <natrium42> rofl
[10:23] <natrium42> i will block them
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[10:24] <UpuWork> zapped them again
[10:25] <daveake> Doesn't give up does he?
[10:25] <daveake> Bit of a maverick I say
[10:26] <jcoxon> booo spacenear.us doesn't work on IE8 on Xbox360
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[10:27] <jcoxon> just get stations and chase cars but no balloons
[10:27] <natrium42> ok, blocked
[10:28] <UpuWork> ta
[10:28] <UpuWork> how did you block it so we can unblock when done
[10:29] <natrium42> ~/www/tracker/track.php, lines 203-204
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[10:31] <natrium42> jcoxon: try legacy tracker
[10:31] <jcoxon> just tried
[10:31] <natrium42> no luck?
[10:31] <UpuWork> thanks natrium42
[10:31] <natrium42> np
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[10:32] <jcoxon> natrium42, so it just shows the map, ground stations, the chase car icon but no boxes or balloon
[10:32] <natrium42> strange
[10:32] <jcoxon> and it would be awesome as its on my TV
[10:33] <natrium42> try the experimental habhub tracker :)
[10:33] <natrium42> oh, is it down?
[10:34] <jcoxon> yeah looks like it
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[10:47] <daveake> up
[10:48] <UpuWork> be a while till I can RX them I suspect
[10:48] <UpuWork> any dials ?
[10:48] Nick change: UpuWork -> Upu_M0UPU
[10:48] <mattbrejza> something at 651
[10:49] <daveake> Vortex .077
[10:49] <LazyLeopard> And they're up
[10:49] <Upu_M0UPU> welcome to 2 mins ago LazyLeopard :)
[10:49] <LazyLeopard> .075.72 dial here
[10:49] <M0JCU> balloon in the air
[10:49] <mattbrejza> 653 even
[10:49] Nick change: LazyLeopard -> LazyL_M0LEP
[10:49] Action: LazyL_M0LEP was distracted ;)
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[10:50] <daveake> I was doing something else then noticed 2 very bright lines on the SDR waterfall
[10:50] <mattbrejza> someone get helioss? :P
[10:50] <mattbrejza> will be 655 or so i reckon
[10:51] <LazyL_M0LEP> Uh oh. Has Helio got left behind?
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[10:52] <GMT> I've got VORTEX, and uploading position via fldigi
[10:52] <mattbrejza> heiloss is at 646
[10:53] <NavracWork> cant decode helios
[10:54] <NavracWork> 300bd 7n1.5
[10:54] <GMT> HELIOS working fine for me; I'm u/l'ing with my old ham c/s G6SUQ
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[10:55] <mattbrejza> eww 1.5 stops
[10:55] <mattbrejza> luckly fldigi doesnt have a proper bit synchroniser
[10:56] <NavracWork> ah - thats because i want on helios!
[10:56] <Upu_M0UPU> so whats the dial on HELIOSS atm pls ?
[10:56] <NavracWork> want /wasnt
[10:56] <M0JCU> Actually, they're all 2 stop bits - sorry
[10:56] <M0JCU> HELIOSS is 434646.3
[10:56] <GMT> HELIOS showing on my mvt7100 as .074
[10:57] <NavracWork> i was on vortex2 with helios settingns
[10:57] <GMT> sorry, ignore that, that's VORTEX
[10:58] <Upu_M0UPU> ok can see both very weak though
[10:59] <NavracWork> vortex2 and helios are very evenly matched signal wise for me
[10:59] <gonzo_> no reason not to set the RX to 1 stop bit though. If the TX is 2 stops, it makes resync a bit more reliable
[10:59] <NavracWork> vortex probably 3db higher - bothe very strong though
[11:01] <Upu_M0UPU> yeah nice now
[11:02] <gb73d> Hi M1ELK up good copy
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[11:03] <gb73d> ive checked I will lose a frame ev 47 secs approx due to the pulse from my wx stn on 433.9 causing qrm.
[11:04] <gb73d> Will look into a solution, and am thinking of maybe a quadrifilar ant for later
[11:04] <mattbrejza> havnt seen a nice ntx2 turn on trace for a while :)
[11:05] <LazyL_M0LEP> ;)
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[11:05] <M0JCU> So far, so good
[11:06] <M0JCU> Both chase cars heading for Cambridge using different routes
[11:09] <gonzo_> ( you take the high road, etc....)
[11:09] <gb73d> Vortex is on 434.07830 mhz atm
[11:09] <GMT> aren't they going for different payloads?
[11:10] Nick change: number10 -> number10_M0MDB
[11:10] <gonzo_> supprised there is not more use made of the chase car app
[11:13] <GMT> don't these have a landing-prediction?
[11:13] <M0JCU> Current prediction is between Cambridge and Ely for Vortex(s) and North of Haverhill for HelioSS
[11:14] <GMT> on DaveAke's flight last Friday it showed the landing prediction on the map
[11:14] <Upu_M0UPU> oh yeah
[11:14] <Upu_M0UPU> fixing ...
[11:14] <Darkside> lol
[11:15] <GMT> it showed a predicted burst point, and also the landing
[11:15] <gonzo_> Ah, they are up? My map had frozen
[11:16] <Upu_M0UPU> they are up
[11:16] <gonzo_> OK, see the chase cars etc now. Ignore my earlier comments
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[11:17] <Ravinder> hi
[11:17] <GMT> signals from VORTEX now getting a bit noisy, and a bit weaker
[11:18] <Upu_M0UPU> ok live predictor is up
[11:18] <GMT> thanks uPu
[11:18] <Upu_M0UPU> shows the cut away point
[11:18] <Upu_M0UPU> not the actual burst
[11:19] <GMT> with a little bit of luck it could land *inside* the CUSF site!
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[11:20] <daveake> Red car obviously not running my chase car s/w :p
[11:21] <Upu_M0UPU> haha
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[11:24] <NavracWork> has anyone got fldigi working with hdsdr with rigcat?
[11:25] <Grumbleist> how many packets do you need to upload to appear on the spacenear map ?
[11:25] <Upu_M0UPU> 1
[11:25] <Grumbleist> i've had a couple accepted from habitat
[11:25] <Upu_M0UPU> well none
[11:25] <Grumbleist> trying to track from central london&.
[11:25] <Upu_M0UPU> what call sign are you uploading as ?
[11:25] <M0JCU> Three different landing sites. A little worrying :)
[11:26] <Grumbleist> h0hfj
[11:26] <Upu_M0UPU> it only updates every 60 secs based on the current data M0JCU
[11:27] <Upu_M0UPU> sure you running in HAB mode and are online Grumbleist ?
[11:27] <Grumbleist> yep
[11:27] <Grumbleist> [2012-11-14 11:20:35,171] INFO habitat.parser MainThread: Parsing [b64] 'JCRWT1JURVgsMDMxNCw6MnA6EhBXODY4NywtMC44NjE5LDExNzU2LDEyLDUuNjYsLTUuMCwyMTAyMCwwLFIqN2YzMwo=' (e355bfb14b4cc919363910ec7fdebe56591e2f6338b2c0b63fe290b957cf9645) from M0HFJ
[11:27] <Grumbleist> [2012-11-14 11:20:35,170] DEBUG habitat.parser_daemon MainThread: Saved doc a8c873f359ace1fa48fa81b69ba4b952e989aba936905b6e58a3869664492667 successfully
[11:27] <M0JCU> :)
[11:27] <M0JCU> 30 minutes to show time
[11:28] <Darkside> M0JCU: the drop?
[11:28] <M0JCU> yup
[11:28] <M0JCU> Upu what rate of descent did you assume?
[11:28] <Upu_M0UPU> 5
[11:28] <M0JCU> let me check
[11:28] <Upu_M0UPU> you know when it drops that payload
[11:28] <Upu_M0UPU> its going to go up like a rocket
[11:29] <Upu_M0UPU> so I would ignore the predictions atm
[11:29] <M0JCU> that was the plan. 5 m/s + a few Stirks
[11:29] <Upu_M0UPU> :)
[11:30] <M0JCU> chase car blue will have to get a move on
[11:30] <GMT> signal from VORTEX now very noisy for me, and drifting quite a bit, and shift reduced to abt 400
[11:31] <LazyL_M0LEP> Yeah, the cold is getting to it...
[11:32] <LazyL_M0LEP> Signal way down here...
[11:32] <M0JCU> I'm surprised. It's a 1" cellotex box
[11:32] <M0JCU> with a replayXD inside which gets very warm
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[11:35] <Laurenceb> http://i.imgur.com/NJqcD.jpg
[11:35] <LazyL_M0LEP> Signal strength is what's giving most trouble. One of those "I need a steerable yagi like UPU's" days...
[11:36] <Upu_M0UPU> steerable yagis like Upus are great :)
[11:36] <GMT> well, I'm only using a 2m/70cm colinear
[11:36] <Upu_M0UPU> Vortex is on the Colinear
[11:37] <LazyL_M0LEP> GMT: Likewise
[11:37] <Upu_M0UPU> which I'm struggling with atm
[11:38] <GMT> I'm struggling with the VORTEX signal, but FLDIGI is working like a dream - decoding whatever comes its way
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[11:40] <LazyL_M0LEP> Grumbleist: Checked your location under "Configure->DL Client->Location" ? And habitat settings under ->Habitat?
[11:40] <G7PMO_Kev> Im decoding Helioss, going quite well for me, I always seem to strugle a bit with 300 baud signals
[11:40] <GMT> oops, spoke too soon. FLDIGI now struggling
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[11:43] <Grumbleist> LazyL: Have entered QTH, whats the Locator box for ?
[11:44] <Grumbleist> fldigi is sending plenty of clean packets but nothing is arriving..
[11:44] <x-f> Grumbleist, mandatory fields are callsign, lat, lon and alt, to get you on the map
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[11:44] <LazyL_M0LEP> There are two places for location. Operator.QTH is a Maidenhead grid. DL Client Location is long and lat in decimal degrees.
[11:46] <LazyL_M0LEP> The latter is needed for the map.
[11:46] <GMT> signals from VORTEX now improving greatly, getting good decodes
[11:47] <Grumbleist> aha i entered in the other place...
[11:47] <daveake> What's the separation altitude?
[11:47] <GMT> wasn't it 25k?
[11:47] <daveake> Dunno. That's why I asked :)
[11:47] <Ravinder> it is 25k
[11:47] <daveake> ta
[11:48] <GMT> ooh, I win a prize!
[11:48] <daveake> 0.1 HAB points
[11:49] <G7PMO_Kev> gosh 50 baud seems slow after watching 300baud go past :)
[11:49] <LazyL_M0LEP> Indeed ;)
[11:49] <gonzo_> is it a fixed atl cutdown or commanded?
[11:49] <gonzo_> alt
[11:50] <LazyL_M0LEP> ...and to think my dial-up was 300 once upon a time. ;)
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[11:51] <Grumbleist> woohoo. on map. thanks M0LEP
[11:52] <G7PMO_Kev> I think 9600 was the slowest modem I ever owned...
[11:52] <LazyL_M0LEP> My first modem did 300 and 1200/75
[11:52] <M0JCU> fixed GPS altitude cut-down
[11:53] <NavracWork> 300 for me and a 1200/75
[11:53] <G7PMO_Kev> has any one done any analysis of 300 vs 50 for hab - ie more packets but more errors, vs less packets but less errors?
[11:54] <GMT> my first was also 1200/75, via a manual phone which you put into rubber cups!
[11:54] <daveake> How many HAB points was it for landing at Steve's site? :)
[11:54] <M0JCU> Generally, if you have line of sight, 300 works
[11:54] <LazyL_M0LEP> Mostly subjectively. ;)
[11:54] <M0JCU> if you don't 50 doesn't work
[11:54] <G7PMO_Kev> :)
[11:54] <G7PMO_Kev> I guess it is the edge conditions that matter...
[11:54] <G7PMO_Kev> when it is lieing in a field
[11:55] <LazyL_M0LEP> 300 is more sensitive to poor signal strength, and slow computers.
[11:55] <G7PMO_Kev> and you can only get a weak signal
[11:55] <LazyL_M0LEP> Vortex is demonstratinng weak signals atpresent.
[11:55] <NavracWork> yep - once its los I prefer 300 for local qrm, but when its landing/going up 50 wins quite easily for me
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[11:56] <G7PMO_Kev> 5 mins till seperation :)
[11:57] <GMT> have these packages got cameras inside?
[11:57] <NavracWork> traffic is obviously flowing freely on the M11
[11:58] <LazyL_M0LEP> ...and there's a jam in Aylesbury. ;)
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[11:59] <Upu_M0UPU> this should be interesting
[12:00] <Darkside> brace for impact
[12:00] <GMT> listen for the booom
[12:00] <Upu_M0UPU> 25km
[12:00] <Upu_M0UPU> 30 secs
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[12:01] <G7PMO_Kev> 25093
[12:01] <G7PMO_Kev> 25192
[12:01] <daveake> erm
[12:01] <M0JCU> that's rather disappointing
[12:01] <NavracWork> might need several consecutive reads
[12:01] <NavracWork> i would ...
[12:02] <Upu_M0UPU> hope you have a big parachute at the top...
[12:02] <daveake> Ditto but those come in at 1hz, so no need to wait so long. Anyway...
[12:02] <daveake> +1 Upu
[12:02] <Darkside> should have used a nichrome wire :P
[12:02] <daveake> :)
[12:02] <M0JCU> bugger
[12:02] <G7PMO_Kev> what was the release mechanism?
[12:02] <M0JCU> Metron actuator
[12:03] <M0JCU> very reliable. Must be something to do with the firing circuit
[12:03] <number10_M0MDB> strange that I rearly appear on the map for helioss
[12:03] <M0JCU> (or software)
[12:03] <Laurenceb> why the low cutdown?
[12:03] <x-f> "pyro status" would change before or after the cutdown?
[12:03] <Darkside> 25km isn't low :P
[12:03] Action: G7PMO_Kev googles Metron actuator
[12:03] <Darkside> we cut down at 10km
[12:03] <Upu_M0UPU> burst calc reckons 31km
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[12:04] <Upu_M0UPU> my gut feeling is thats wrong
[12:04] <Upu_M0UPU> I've put 34.5km in
[12:04] <daveake> Put in whatever has it landing at Elsworth
[12:05] <M0JCU> should be 33km based on the payload mass and rate of ascent
[12:05] <daveake> Cambridge-ish then
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[12:07] <GMT> can anyone contact the HELIOS chase-car and tell them to go up the A11 towards Newmarket
[12:08] <Darkside> im sure they know
[12:08] <Kelly> greetings from Estec
[12:08] <Heloiss_mobile> ok got it
[12:08] <M0JCU> on it already
[12:08] <M0JCU> Hi Kelly
[12:08] <M0JCU> Non-release of payload :(
[12:08] <Kelly> Is that John?
[12:08] <M0JCU> Yes
[12:08] <Kelly> oh no1
[12:09] <LazyL_M0LEP> Which payload was actually supposed to do the cutdown?
[12:09] <Kelly> what happens next?
[12:09] <Upu_M0UPU> pop wheeee smack
[12:09] <M0JCU> Upu, nice description. But hopefully not too much of a smack :)
[12:09] <M0JCU> It has a big parachute on it
[12:10] <Darkside> aha, now we have the frogs and the lobsters tracking
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[12:11] <Kelly> will you be able to retrieve the payloads?
[12:11] <eroomde> just reading the logs
[12:11] <birdstrike> hello there
[12:11] <M0JCU> I hope so. We have three transmitters on them!
[12:12] <M0JCU> Let's hope we don't find a tree.
[12:12] <birdstrike> if i understand, there is parachute - payload - parachute - payload
[12:12] <M0JCU> (The chase cars are equiped with saws)
[12:12] <Darkside> that'll be an interesting descent
[12:12] <M0JCU> yes
[12:12] <Darkside> we've done that before
[12:12] <Darkside> one parachute will 'steer' the other parachute
[12:12] <birdstrike> if there is no separation, might the second payload get tangled with the payload above it?
[12:12] <M0JCU> The bottom parachute is packed in a bag. It shoudn't (tm) deploy
[12:12] <Darkside> nah
[12:12] <birdstrike> or is the first parachute much bigger so the second parachute remains unfilled?
[12:12] <Darkside> if both deploy, one will likely move out to the side
[12:13] <Darkside> or they'll tangle, and one will still work anyway
[12:13] <birdstrike> ah i see, a bag
[12:13] <birdstrike> that makes things a bit simpler
[12:13] <gonzo_> what pulls it from the bag?
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[12:14] <M0JCU> static line to top payload
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[12:16] <x-f> clever
[12:16] <Kelly> stupid question: how do you know when the balloon will come down?
[12:16] <birdstrike> I understand they have a burst altitude which can be calculated from the quantity of helium inside them
[12:16] <birdstrike> so if you know your altitude and ascent rate, you can presumably calculate burst time
[12:17] <gonzo_> possible the deploy worked but the chute line still attached?
[12:17] <gonzo_> or was it just wrapped in the chute?
[12:17] <birdstrike> but i am just a new lurker who has been reading in the background, this is what I have read
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[12:18] <M0JCU> Prediction is currently close to junction of A11 and A1307
[12:18] <M0JCU> Will know much better once it has burst
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[12:20] <NavracWork> Clever - i'm uploading packets and appearing on helios, but apparently my last contact was 2 hours ago
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[12:21] <daveake> 33km
[12:21] <daveake> Balloons never read their specifications
[12:22] <gonzo_> Navrac, what's your uplink stystem
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[12:23] <NavracWork> fldigi
[12:23] <birdstrike> is this launch for some kind of commercial work? I seem to remember something about an ESA contract in the ukhas mailing list?
[12:23] <NavracWork> 3.21.50
[12:24] <gonzo_> NavracWork, what's the RX on the balloonn and what sort of data, speed mode?
[12:24] <M0JCU> It's testing a parachute for ESA
[12:24] <M0JCU> (or it would have been if it released on time)
[12:24] <birdstrike> interesting
[12:25] <GMT> it's testing an automatic cutdown mechanism
[12:25] <birdstrike> is it some specific design of parachute that has some properties that need to be testing at high altitudes?
[12:25] <M0JCU> Why do balloons never burst when you want them to?
[12:25] <birdstrike> are you part of this too, GMT?
[12:25] <gonzo_> ah poss a commrcial uplink then?
[12:25] <NavracWork> not sure i understand the question gonzo_
[12:25] <birdstrike> i have read about them occassionally floating
[12:25] <M0JCU> No. GPS altitude
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[12:25] <GMT> no, I'm just a Ham with an interest in this stuff (which mean's I'm 'dangerous')
[12:26] <M0JCU> burst
[12:26] <birdstrike> interesting
[12:26] <daveake> yup
[12:26] <NavracWork> ah gonzo_ no im not uploading to the balloon, Im uploading to the map
[12:26] <Helioss_chase> In position
[12:26] <gonzo_> Ah, ok, I misunderstood. Sri
[12:26] <gb73d> vortex burst
[12:27] <Luca___> 35 km altitude and still going.. impressive!
[12:27] <birdstrike> so if you now have increased mass hanging from the one chute, this means the predictor should be adjusted to account for the higher descent rate?
[12:27] <NavracWork> blimey - not even a flicker on helios tx when it burst
[12:27] <birdstrike> or does the predictor work it out automatically?
[12:27] <birdstrike> sorry for the 20 questions, this is all very interesting
[12:27] <mattbrejza> pop?
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[12:28] <daveake> yup
[12:28] <GMT> no prob birdstrike, we all have to start somewhere.
[12:28] <daveake> smidgen under 35km
[12:28] <gb73d> nice height
[12:28] <daveake> red car may get to see it come in
[12:28] <GMT> vortex-chase are gonna be a bit miffed!
[12:29] <costyn> so wait, vortex and vortex2 just separated from the balloon and helioss correct?
[12:29] <daveake> All part of HAB ... stuff doesn't always go the way you hoped/expected
[12:29] <LazyL_M0LEP> Another launch another day...
[12:29] <LazyL_M0LEP> costyn: don't think so....
[12:30] <LazyL_M0LEP> They all look very much together...
[12:30] <costyn> they do,but that's not what was in the email... ?
[12:31] <LazyL_M0LEP> Cut-down didn't happen.
[12:31] <M0JCU> Predicted landing is near Balsham @ 13:04
[12:31] <costyn> LazyL_M0LEP: seems so
[12:31] <Upu_M0UPU> well that wasn't a bad guess at the burst was it
[12:31] <NavracWork> hasnt happened on the way down either...
[12:31] <daveake> 1 HAB point to Upu
[12:32] <Upu_M0UPU> I can't get this FCD to decode properly Dave
[12:32] <daveake> User error
[12:32] <daveake> wossup?
[12:32] <Upu_M0UPU> probably
[12:32] <birdstrike> ah, so balsham implies that your predictor is taking account of the higher landing velocity
[12:32] <birdstrike> whereas the one on the tracking webpage isn't
[12:32] <Upu_M0UPU> no matter what I play with in the filters etc its just a messy siganl
[12:33] <daveake> Upload a screenshot
[12:33] <Luca___> kelly: I am aftraid but from the rate of descent it looks like there is no parachute..
[12:33] <birdstrike> what is the landing velocity in this configuration, out of interest?
[12:33] <M0JCU> My predictor has several alternative descent rates. One of them was "Balloon bursts with both attached"
[12:33] <M0JCU> 6 m/s in this configuration
[12:33] <daveake> 6m/s at a s guess
[12:33] <M0JCU> :)
[12:33] <daveake> :)
[12:33] <costyn> Luca___: they always go really fast when they're that high
[12:33] <daveake> Just judging from the rate @ 20km :)
[12:34] <costyn> Luca___: everything is expected so far
[12:34] <Upu_M0UPU> http://i.imgur.com/DnCAM.png
[12:35] <gb73d> ive noticed w my gp ant I start getting polarisation fading at extreme altitude like I would from a LEO sat
[12:35] <Darkside> Upu_M0UPU: you're not feeding it straight into dl-fldigi are you?
[12:35] <NavracWork> what have you got set under the expert settings Upu_M0UPU
[12:35] <Upu_M0UPU> no Darkside
[12:35] <Upu_M0UPU> sec
[12:36] <daveake> I have - http://imgur.com/GncDE
[12:36] <M0JCU> Landing prediction is holding well
[12:36] <M0JCU> 0.7 miles north of Balsham
[12:37] <M0JCU> Helioss_chase, if you head out of Balsham 0.4 miles towards West Wrattling you may see it come down
[12:37] <Upu_M0UPU> http://i.imgur.com/0eWz1.png
[12:39] <NavracWork> oops vortex2 is moving in to join helios frequency wise
[12:39] <Upu_M0UPU> uh oh
[12:39] <daveake> RF filter?
[12:40] <Upu_M0UPU> this isn't going to end well
[12:40] <GMT> VORTEX drifting in freq too
[12:40] <M0JCU> Vortex is still OK
[12:40] <Upu_M0UPU> only 2 options under there daveake
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[12:40] <birdstrike> why put them so close that they are at risk of colliding?
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[12:41] <birdstrike> you could presumably have them say 500kHz apart and still be within the ofcom exemption?
[12:41] <daveake> Strange - loads here inc 425MHz
[12:41] <daveake> 100k apart is plenty birdstrike
[12:42] <birdstrike> ok fine
[12:42] <daveake> Vortex drifting like buggery
[12:42] <birdstrike> but that still only reinforces the question?
[12:42] <daveake> Just had to widen the filter
[12:42] <M0JCU> Helioss_chase, update. 0.5 km out of West Wratting on the Six Mile Bottom road
[12:42] <daveake> Well yes thoe 2 you mention were very close together. I don't know why
[12:42] <M0JCU> Only had NTX2s - only 2 frequencies available
[12:43] <gb73d> the doppler shift is so fast the afc cant keep up!
[12:43] <daveake> gb73d Widen the filter
[12:43] <GMT> glad to see/hear that I'm not the only one with that prob!
[12:43] <LazyL_M0LEP> Vortex has its fading moments too....
[12:43] <birdstrike> M0JCU: but those frequencies, if i have read correctly, are 434.075 and 434.650. Surely they could not collide? that's a lot of separation
[12:44] <mattbrejza> ha
[12:44] <daveake> They have *3* payloads and *2* frequencies
[12:44] <mattbrejza> different levels of insulation
[12:44] <birdstrike> assuming they are crystal driven
[12:44] <birdstrike> ah I see
[12:44] <birdstrike> apollogies
[12:44] <daveake> So 2 of them are using the same type of NTX2
[12:44] <birdstrike> yes i see
[12:44] <daveake> There is an adjustment in the NTX2
[12:44] <gb73d> ty Dave i see
[12:44] <birdstrike> so they are bothin within the (20kHz?) and pass of an ntx2 on a certain frequency
[12:45] <birdstrike> sorry i should have read the email more closely
[12:45] <birdstrike> band pass*
[12:45] <daveake> Some people use other transmitters like the rfm22b where you can set the freq in s/w
[12:46] <Upu_M0UPU> I can make custom frequency NTX2's btw
[12:46] <Upu_M0UPU> but they aren't cheap
[12:47] <daveake> You may get an order for 20 next summer :D
[12:47] <Upu_M0UPU> yeah well my name isn't going near that
[12:47] <daveake> lol
[12:48] <costyn> whats the latest news on mitigating the drift on the rfm's?
[12:48] <costyn> (apart from adding lots of insulation)
[12:49] <mattbrejza> replace the crystal with one with less drift (or is part the issue the heating of the internal caps?)
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[12:50] <NavracWork> use an external tcxo - changing the crystal doesnt help
[12:50] <M0JCU> landing position holding at 1mile north of West Wratting
[12:50] <mattbrejza> ok
[12:50] <costyn> NavracWork: so that did the trick?
[12:50] <NavracWork> or just an external crystal with its own driver
[12:50] <NavracWork> yep
[12:50] <costyn> does the rfm have a txco pin?
[12:50] <mattbrejza> so it is the internal caps issue>
[12:51] <GMT> VORTEX now back on freq, but drifting wildly upwards!
[12:51] <Upu_M0UPU> I've never noticed an issue with drift as long as its insulated
[12:51] <NavracWork> https://docs.google.com/document/d/1Y1aenYiKOqeTF7ShiB3ZuWWs0pPSTlTQGekO4xaaXu8/edit
[12:52] <NavracWork> its mainly drift on powering up the tx - if its well insulated it doesnt drift
[12:52] <NavracWork> daveakes hardly drift at all - havent needed to retune on any of his recent flights
[12:53] Action: daveake has smug face
[12:53] <costyn> NavracWork: thanks. unfortunately this goes somewhat above my knowledge level at the moment :) I guess i'll stick to good insulation
[12:54] <Upu_M0UPU> Car is right under them
[12:54] <M0JCU> bad place to be :)
[12:55] <LazyL_M0LEP> Not the fastest drifting payload I've seen, but definitely up there in the race...
[12:55] <Upu_M0UPU> lol
[12:55] <daveake> hah
[12:55] <Upu_M0UPU> bonus points for catching it
[12:55] <GMT> if they had a very long stick they could open the sunroof and pull it in!
[12:56] <mattbrejza> NavracWork: its easy enough to do that without an opamp
[12:56] <mattbrejza> even from pwm
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[12:56] <NavracWork> you can do it without an op amp
[12:57] <NavracWork> but the op amp is an easy way to shift the zero point - but yes you can do it with just c's and r's
[12:57] <mattbrejza> lol probably should have read the whole thing?
[12:57] <M0JCU> Helioss_chase, take the B1052 out of West Wratting then turn left about 0.7 miles out
[12:58] <LazyL_M0LEP> *quote* Ah, I wonder if Vortex chase knows he can't turn right off the A14 onto the A11
[12:58] <Upu_M0UPU> I'm going to loose it soon
[12:58] <costyn> heh... gonna land near "Horny Bush Wood"... that's beyond inuendo
[12:58] <NavracWork> the op amp was there so i could quickly adjust things to find the most linear part of the varicaps ramp
[12:59] <mattbrejza> i just drive the entire range from the pwm
[12:59] <mattbrejza> then use a series cap to adjust the shift range
[12:59] <Upu_M0UPU> pesky horizon
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[12:59] Nick change: Upu_M0UPU -> UpuWork
[12:59] <mattbrejza> also i didnt really care about linearity
[13:00] <daveake> Silly non-single-plane Earth
[13:00] <NavracWork> I tried that - but it made it a bit drifty - and for domino you need to hit the 15.6hz steps consistently within a hz which it didnt do in the freezer very well till i got the various cap and resistors right for the crystal drive
[13:01] <M0JCU> Chase car has visual
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[13:02] <daveake> :)
[13:02] <Kelly> :)
[13:02] <GMT> I'm still hearing RTTY from VORTEX
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[13:04] <LazyL_M0LEP> Hope it misses those pylons
[13:04] <costyn> what kind of magic is F5APQ using to be the last one to receive VORTEX2
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[13:06] <gb73d> Nice 1 cheers cyall l8r ! 73s
[13:06] <NavracWork> a 200km antenna feeder....
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[13:06] <daveake> lol
[13:06] <daveake> French woowoo. OuiOui perhaps
[13:06] <GMT> next flight I may enter myself as a sprurious VK callsign!
[13:06] <M0JCU> Thanks to all the listeners. I'll let you know when we recover it. I don't expect it to be long (unless it hit the pylons :)
[13:08] <Penfold> not *seeing* any news of half of Cambs having a power cu?? NO CARRIER
[13:08] <NavracWork> loooks like it cleared the pylons then
[13:09] <LazyL_M0LEP> ;)
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[13:10] <daveake> Alt there is 106m
[13:10] <daveake> Last from the payloads was 119
[13:11] <LazyL_M0LEP> Hmmm...
[13:11] <Kelly> any good climbers?
[13:11] <LazyL_M0LEP> Lowest payload was which one? Vortex2?
[13:12] <M0JCU> last point from the chase car is north of the pylons
[13:12] <costyn> Kelly: that's above sea level, so might just be on the ground
[13:12] <M0JCU> They are recovering now
[13:12] <M0JCU> Kelly, don't let them wind you up :)
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[13:13] <Kelly> haha, I won't
[13:13] <M0JCU> Chase car is driving across the field!
[13:13] <daveake> hmmm!
[13:13] <Kelly> anyhow, I hope you get the two payloads back in good shape!
[13:14] <M0JCU> thanks
[13:14] <M0JCU> oops. Chase car disappeared. Maybe the farmer shot him?
[13:15] <costyn> gps snafu, it moved south
[13:15] <daveake> In another field??
[13:15] <GMT> fell down a mine shaft, lots of coal-mines in norfolk
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[13:16] <M0JCU> lost GPS. Using the mast for position?
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[13:17] <M0JCU> M0MDB, how on earth did you pick up that signal?
[13:18] <GMT> presumably a picl-up, traces moving around
[13:18] <daveake> Presumably the "car" in the field is someone with a phone?
[13:18] <M0JCU> indeed
[13:19] <M0JCU> I think we can assume they have it
[13:19] <daveake> hence the apparent transporter capability
[13:19] <daveake> if the phone lost GPS and guessed from the GSM mast data
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[13:36] <M0JCU> Payload recovered.
[13:36] <costyn> nice!
[13:37] <daveake> :D
[13:37] <daveake> Any obvious reason why the separation didn't happen?
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[13:39] <M0JCU> According to the chase crew, it was in the same configuration on landing as take off
[13:39] <M0JCU> (apart from a burst balloon)
[13:39] <M0JCU> Post mortem when they get back this afternoon
[13:39] <daveake> sure
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[13:43] <daveake> ^^ guilty party? :p
[13:44] <gonzo_> I assume the cutdown would have been GPS based?
[13:44] <daveake> It was; on altitude
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[13:47] <GMT> thanks guys, great mornings-worth of fun... time for some bacon butties. See you for the next one?
[13:48] <gonzo_> pft, isn't that the wrong way around? Should be butties before HAB?
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[13:51] <daveake> Must be a newbie :D
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[13:52] <gonzo_> well, the sentiment is there, just the order to work on
[13:52] <gonzo_> (or should that be, the condiment?)
[13:53] <gonzo_> Which is the sauce of the confusion
[13:54] <gonzo_> Nope? He just won't be provoked today!
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[14:04] <daveake> I'm feeling out of salts
[14:12] <number10> bug?
[14:13] <LazyL_M0LEP> Need spicing up?
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[14:20] <gonzo_> Ah that's butter. Make a pepper job of it.
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[14:26] <LazyL_M0LEP> Don't get chilli doing it....
[14:26] <daveake> This isn't the right thyme
[14:29] <SpeedEvil> can people just stop this crackling?
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[14:53] <gonzo_> This is mint!
[14:53] <gonzo_> Dave is a sage when it comes to punning
[14:54] <gonzo_> (or am I just trying to curry favour?)
[14:55] <gonzo_> trying to keep these at bay, leaf it out!
[14:55] <gonzo_> </PUN>
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[15:04] <SpeedEvil> cumin, this is just getting cillia.
[15:06] <costyn> oregano talk about something else yet?
[15:07] <eroomde> for confused americans, it's because you don;t pronounce it properly
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[15:10] <gonzo_> We need to fennel our efforts without dill-lay
[15:10] <costyn> :)
[15:11] <costyn> I don't know about you, but I clove these puns
[15:11] <daveake> Beats the daily grind
[15:12] <gonzo_> I didn't mean to chive in there
[15:14] <costyn> I think we need more people to cumin join the fun
[15:14] <staylo> shame on you all for peppering this channel with bad puns
[15:15] <costyn> staylo: ginger you hear? puns are all the (bo)rage in this channel
[15:15] <gonzo_> Yep these puns are starting to hurt, I'm really saffron here
[15:16] <staylo> I used to enjoy the punning. Guess they mustard got worse.
[15:16] <costyn> I think anise to get back to work
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[15:18] <costyn> SpeedEvil: sorry, just saw you already used cumin
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[15:23] <eroomde> it is nearly home time for me
[15:23] <eroomde> need to go home and get suited
[15:23] <gonzo_> I though it was a good day for puns. But it turns out that thi cinnamon of those days.
[15:23] <daveake> Ah, wearing musk tonight then Ed?
[15:24] <eroomde> yeah, it's been elon time since i last did
[15:24] <daveake> boom boom
[15:25] <jonsowman> oh dear
[15:25] <costyn> clever
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[15:28] Action: SpeedEvil may wander off for a while. do not worry about my absinthe.
[15:29] <staylo> gonzo says it's a bad day for puns, but it's the worst day ever sesame.
[15:29] <gonzo_> ah you are seeding anothe set of puns
[15:30] <gonzo_> that goes against the grain
[15:31] <costyn> peas, not another pun subject
[15:31] <gonzo_> Yep, bean there, done that
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[16:17] <UpuWork> I commented out the block so maverick, goose and iceman can now upload again
[16:17] <UpuWork> thanks natrium42
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[16:17] <costyn> someone he knew?
[16:18] <UpuWork> no
[16:18] <UpuWork> was some Aussies but they were uploading test data whilst a live flight was in progress
[16:23] <M0JCU> UpuWork, thanks for doing that. It made our life much easier
[16:25] <UpuWork> it was natrium42 who did it
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[16:41] <DrLuke> upu: 6.5 pounds = 8.10¬ according to google
[16:41] <UpuWork> I'll take that
[16:41] <UpuWork> Should I put these on the shop
[16:41] <UpuWork> ?
[16:42] <DrLuke> I actually gift you 0.02 cents on top of that
[16:42] <DrLuke> atmegas?
[16:42] <UpuWork> yeah
[16:42] <DrLuke> sure why not
[16:42] <DrLuke> somebody will always need some
[16:43] <DrLuke> pm'd you my adress
[16:43] <DrLuke> money is sent
[16:45] <Upu> cheers
[16:46] <DrLuke> thanks
[16:48] <DrLuke> now to install Matlab
[16:48] <DrLuke> and do some matrixish stuff
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[16:50] <UpuWork> right I'll post those tommorrow
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[17:42] <junderwood> natrium42, just catching up. Thanks for temporarily blacklisting the Auzzies this morning (UK)
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[18:36] <griffonbot> Received email: John Underwood "Re: [UKHAS] Launch announcement Wednesday 14th November - Vortex / HelioSS"
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[18:57] <nosebleedkt> well
[18:57] <griffonbot> Received email: Anthony Stirk "Re: [UKHAS] Launch announcement Wednesday 14th November - Vortex / HelioSS"
[18:57] <nosebleedkt> i got a ublox6 modules
[18:57] <nosebleedkt> it works
[18:57] <nosebleedkt> but i get some extra nmea data
[18:57] <nosebleedkt> 185443.004038.8853202256.66864155.295G30.316321.55-0.2020.991.500.958PUBX,00,185446.00,4038.88576,N,02256.66804,E,154.438,G3,8.5,11,0.457,321.55,-0.427,,0.99,1.50,0.95,10,0,0
[18:57] <nosebleedkt> its that data before PUBX starts
[18:57] <nosebleedkt> anyone got any idea what might be?
[19:00] <griffonbot> Received email: John Underwood "Re: [UKHAS] Launch announcement Wednesday 14th November - Vortex / HelioSS"
[19:01] <nosebleedkt> http://ukhas.org.uk/guides:ublox6 doesnt help that much !
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[19:11] <arko> totally giving myself a plug here
[19:11] <arko> http://www.reddit.com/r/movies/comments/136wcp/the_delorean_from_back_to_the_future_is_currently/
[19:11] <arko> if anyone is interested, this is a project i've been working on on the side
[19:11] <arko> im the electronics dude
[19:12] <arko> eroomde: ^
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[19:19] <nosebleedkt> d/c
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[19:47] <nigelvh> arko, don't mention it to Lunar_Lander. He would DIE of excitement.
[19:48] <nigelvh> Also, cool work you're doing there
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[19:52] <fsphil> wasn't there more than one delorian car?
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[20:07] <Laurenceb_> sup
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[20:19] Action: Laurenceb_ is playing with firgelli linear actuators
[20:20] <Laurenceb_> very well built control board - flexi pcb with pic16f
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[20:20] <Laurenceb_> esd protection and reverse polarity
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[20:35] <navrac> if its the same back to the future delorean i worked on it needed a complete rewire - the electronics were a mess
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[20:40] <Lunar_Lander> hello
[20:44] <nigelvh> Lunar, you've been missing some very interesting conversation
[20:47] <Lunar_Lander> what was it about?
[20:47] <nigelvh> BTTF
[20:47] <Lunar_Lander> xD
[20:47] <nigelvh> The one time it was discussed and you weren't here.
[20:47] <Lunar_Lander> WOW habhub has a new cool look
[20:48] <Lunar_Lander> arko, cool!
[20:54] <DrLuke> for some reason the font rendering on habitat.org is awful on my machine
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[20:54] <DrLuke> http://i.imgur.com/PFTTu.png
[20:54] <Lunar_Lander> hello DrLuke
[20:54] <DrLuke> hi
[20:54] <Lunar_Lander> yea that doesn't look good
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[20:58] <nigelvh> DrLuke, you on linux?
[20:58] <DrLuke> nope, windows and chrome
[20:59] <nigelvh> Hmm...
[20:59] <DrLuke> although chrome has been acting really weird in general
[20:59] <DrLuke> like it fails at displaying unicode on every second page
[21:00] <nigelvh> That does seem odd...
[21:04] <Lunar_Lander> ubuntu and firefox here
[21:04] <Lunar_Lander> works well
[21:08] <griffonbot> Received email: Matthew Brejza "Re: [UKHAS] Launch announcement tomorrow (Tuesday) 13th, 6am - PICO @ Southampton"
[21:09] <Randomskk> DrLuke: eww
[21:09] <Randomskk> check your cleartype settings
[21:11] <Dan-K2VOL> hello all
[21:12] <DrLuke> ;(
[21:12] <DrLuke> hey
[21:13] <DrLuke> I'll install windows 8 soon anyways
[21:13] <DrLuke> so I no point in taking an effort to fix this now :P
[21:13] <Laurenceb_> windows 8 ?! O_o
[21:13] <DrLuke> yeah
[21:13] <DrLuke> problem? :P
[21:14] <Dan-K2VOL> hey laurence
[21:14] <DrLuke> I've actually seen it in action today and maybe metro isn't even THAT awful
[21:14] <number10> Randomskk: Hi is there anywhere I can see raw tracking logs. robs page that is linked from fldigi does not show all data
[21:14] <Dan-K2VOL> do ukhas flights usually leave the radio carrier on solid between telemetry packets?
[21:15] <Dan-K2VOL> hey number10
[21:15] <griffonbot> Received email: Dan Bowen "Re: [UKHAS] Launch announcement tomorrow (Tuesday) 13th, 6am - PICO @ Southampton"
[21:15] <number10> hi Dan-K2VOL
[21:15] <mattbrejza> Dan-K2VOL: depends whether you want to annoy your trackers or not
[21:15] <danielsaul> number10: http://habitat.habhub.org/ept/
[21:15] <Randomskk> number10: that page should be considered totally deprecated. it's linked to from fldigi?
[21:16] <Randomskk> what version?
[21:16] <Dan-K2VOL> haha
[21:16] <Randomskk> anyway yea danielsaul has the link
[21:16] <number10> i will check Randomskk
[21:16] <number10> I would like to see raw telemetry by tracker
[21:16] <SpeedEvil> http://physics.princeton.edu/romalis/magnetometer/
[21:16] <SpeedEvil> funky
[21:16] <danielsaul> Randomskk: Under DL Client, there is "Raw Data" - should probably remove that :P
[21:17] <SpeedEvil> I even sorta understand how it works.
[21:17] <Randomskk> ew, yes, indeed
[21:18] <number10> danielsaul: the /ept shows the raw logs but I was interested in the strings sent by trackers, as today I was tracking and hardly any strings were shown on spacenear
[21:19] <Randomskk> you can check two things I guess
[21:19] <Randomskk> logtail shows all new uploads
[21:19] <Randomskk> but you can also just use the raw data export to see who received each sentence
[21:19] <Randomskk> depends if you want to see all uploaded strings, or see all the people who uploadeda good string
[21:19] <Randomskk> the former is a bit trickier to do post-hoc really
[21:20] <number10> Randomskk: where do I see logtail
[21:20] <Randomskk> http://habitat.habhub.org/logtail/
[21:20] <number10> thanks
[21:20] <Randomskk> all the tools are linked to from http://habitat.habhub.org
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[21:21] <griffonbot> Received email: Matthew Brejza "Re: [UKHAS] Launch announcement tomorrow (Tuesday) 13th, 6am - PICO @ Southampton"
[21:21] <mattbrejza> Dan-K2VOL: long answer ^
[21:21] <number10> cheers Randomskk
[21:24] <Dan-K2VOL> thx matt
[21:25] <mattbrejza> increasing the filter bw also increases your BER, but for some reason the AGC filter and rx filter are the same setting
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[21:27] <Dan-K2VOL> you know the GPS locks that are occasionally experienced might well be to oscillator swings, though it has a TCXO, I wonder if during descent it may still change temp too fast for compensation
[21:27] <griffonbot> Received email: Justin Maynard "Re: [UKHAS] ICEMAN/MAVERICK/GOOSE"
[21:27] <griffonbot> Received email: chris hillcox "[UKHAS] Re: Balloon Fiesta 2013"
[21:27] <griffonbot> Received email: "Re: [UKHAS] Balloon Fiesta 2013"
[21:27] <Randomskk> just like busses. comes in threes. how weird.
[21:27] <mattbrejza> someone been doing some moderating/
[21:27] <mattbrejza> oh
[21:27] <Randomskk> heh, correct answer :P
[21:27] <mattbrejza> i see
[21:28] <mattbrejza> i think doing DSSS might be a better idea than balloon mesh networking
[21:30] <number10> Randomskk: I dont think http://habitat.habhub.org/logtail/ seems to show what I am looking for - I was expecting to see strings for vortex and helioss on todays launch but... http://i.imgur.com/nMDqf.jpg
[21:31] <Randomskk> that's what I mean by "harder to do post-hoc"
[21:31] <Randomskk> logtail is for current data really
[21:31] <Randomskk> it does show uploaded sterings but you're "too late" to see vortex etc ones
[21:31] <Randomskk> but uhm
[21:31] <Randomskk> the data is still there - just those strings are essentially floating in the db as they were presumably not parsed
[21:31] <Randomskk> you can readily view all the parsed strings and see who uploaded each
[21:31] <Randomskk> but seeing what other strings were uploaded is a little trickier
[21:31] <Randomskk> uhm
[21:31] <Randomskk> there is also
[21:32] <Randomskk> http://habitat.habhub.org/logtail/log
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[21:32] <Randomskk> which is longer
[21:32] <Randomskk> and looks to cover today entirely
[21:33] <Randomskk> so that will have all the uploaded strings you're looking for
[21:33] <Randomskk> (thoughi n the cases where strings had unprintable characters, it'l only show the base64 encoding, not the ASCII attempt)
[21:33] <Randomskk> (you can still decode that manually if you like)
[21:35] <number10> thanks Randomskk I will take a look. the reason I ask is that I was tracking today and very little of what I recieved and uploaded appeared on spacener - so I was wondering if I had a problem
[21:35] <Dan-K2VOL> mattbrejza, do you know if fldigi AGC could auto lock onto the packets?
[21:36] <mattbrejza> well only if its within the red marks at the top of the waterfall
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[21:38] Nick change: LazyL_M0LEP -> LazyLeopard
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[21:45] <number10> Dan-K2VOL: just saw your question about carrier - usually is left on between payload frames - makes it easier to track when the frequency is drifting - and also some radio modules that are used here drift if you turn them off/on
[21:46] <Laurenceb_> http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_detailpage&list=UUl9OJE9OpXui-gRsnWjSrlA&v=oS165aBdNcI#t=175s
[21:46] <SpeedEvil> 'the competent owner has not made this content available on mobiles'
[21:47] <SpeedEvil> content
[21:48] <Dan-K2VOL> does anyone know if dl-fldigi actually DOES auto lock on new transmissions where people leave the radio off between telemetry pulses?
[21:48] <Dan-K2VOL> on past flight
[21:49] <daveake> It only auto-locks to rtty if both tones are present
[21:49] <Laurenceb_> you mean afc?
[21:52] <Laurenceb_> in my experience afc is quite poor
[21:52] <Laurenceb_> but that was an old version
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[22:11] <Dan-K2VOL> Laurenceb_ thank you, yes the AFC, not AGC :-)
[22:12] <Lunar_Lander> xD Apollo Guidance Computer?
[22:13] <Laurenceb_> yes, obviously
[22:13] <Laurenceb_> actually its Automatic Gain Control
[22:13] <Lunar_Lander> ah
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[22:16] <Dan-K2VOL> mattbrejza have you looked at temperature compensated crystals?
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[22:22] <Laurenceb_> Dan-K2VOL: navrac was investingating tcxo with si4432
[22:22] <Laurenceb_> i cant spell
[22:22] <Dan-K2VOL> yeah
[22:22] <Laurenceb_> seems to work well
[22:22] <Laurenceb_> i found another chip the other day
[22:23] <Laurenceb_> AC7021 or something... its in the logs
[22:23] <Laurenceb_> a bit obscure but in some of the noname chinese modules
[22:23] <Laurenceb_> gives ~11hz pll steps
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[22:27] Action: Laurenceb_ was randomly looking at optical downlink
[22:27] <Laurenceb_> http://modulatedlight.org/optical_comms/optical_apd_rx1.html
[22:27] <Laurenceb_> well not randomly - i was working on low noise front ends for work stuff
[22:29] <mattbrejza> Dan-K2VOL: i have tried to do my own frequency drift compensator where the ds18b20 reading is used to adjust the tuning voltages
[22:29] <mattbrejza> but that was a bit of a pain
[22:29] <mattbrejza> i know tcxos are avaiable, but probably not in a 2x2.5mm package which i had on this thing
[22:29] <Laurenceb_> for shift control?
[22:30] <Dan-K2VOL> yeah
[22:30] <mattbrejza> that size also would not have helped
[22:30] <Laurenceb_> with pll you dont need to worry about that
[22:30] <mattbrejza> it compensated shift and overall drift
[22:30] <mattbrejza> it was a crystal pulled thing
[22:30] <Laurenceb_> - shift is consistent
[22:30] <Laurenceb_> yeah
[22:30] <Dan-K2VOL> with pll you don't need to worry about what?
[22:30] <Laurenceb_> drifting shift
[22:30] <mattbrejza> that was a nice easy radio, but too cheap and cheerful to use next to a gps (max7057)
[22:31] <Laurenceb_> optical downlink is horribly impractical
[22:31] <Laurenceb_> but we could set the optical link record
[22:31] <Laurenceb_> - for amateur operators
[22:32] <mattbrejza> how about trying to hit the mirror on the moon? :P
[22:32] <Dan-K2VOL> the shift and the carrier freq will all change together with the oscillator frequency won't they?
[22:33] <Dan-K2VOL> they have nothing else to reference
[22:33] <mattbrejza> yea but the shift change will be very very small
[22:34] <Laurenceb_> the 173mile optical record is pretty insane
[22:34] <Laurenceb_> im doing the numbers and cant see how their kit made it
[22:34] <Laurenceb_> unless they were very lucky with very clear air
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[22:34] <mattbrejza> at night?
[22:35] <mattbrejza> am i right in thinking nasa (or similar) are developing single photon detectors with the aim to go interplanet?
[22:37] <Laurenceb_> yes at night over utah desert
[22:37] <Laurenceb_> you can do that with avalanche photodiodes
[22:37] <Laurenceb_> but it doesnt help massively
[22:37] <Laurenceb_> you can get close to single photon with pin photodiodes
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[22:47] <DrLuke> is there some way to have itoa output capitalized characters for hexadecimal stuff?
[22:49] <mattbrejza> most people use snprintf to generate the transmission string if thats what youre doing?
[22:49] <mattbrejza> no idea with itoa
[22:50] <DrLuke> eh
[22:50] <DrLuke> I used all string.h to do it so far :P
[22:51] <mattbrejza> snprintf/sprintf can do it all in one line
[22:53] <DrLuke> that might be so
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[22:57] <griffonbot> Received email: Alexei Karpenko "Re: [UKHAS] Balloon Fiesta 2013"
[23:06] Last message repeated 1 time(s).
[23:06] <eroomde> so
[23:06] <eroomde> as suspected
[23:06] <eroomde> amazing ceo
[23:06] <eroomde> not the worlds greatest rocket scientist
[23:07] <eroomde> the precooler a bit lost on him
[23:07] <eroomde> which is good for us as it means he wont start pushing it for himself
[23:07] <Dan-K2VOL> eh?
[23:07] <DrLuke> haha
[23:07] <eroomde> and more importantly i had a drink with talulah riley
[23:07] <SpeedEvil> eroomde: :-)
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[23:07] <DrLuke> hot
[23:07] <eroomde> and told richard dawkins that i thought his stuff was a bit heavy handed
[23:07] <Randomskk> haha
[23:07] <Dan-K2VOL> is she on the naked scientists?
[23:07] <eroomde> so, a good evening all in all
[23:07] <Randomskk> all in an evening's work huh
[23:07] <Dan-K2VOL> lol
[23:08] <SpeedEvil> is that the hot engineering spacex lady?
[23:08] <Dan-K2VOL> which rocket man did you meet?
[23:08] <eroomde> no, that's musk's ex wie
[23:08] <eroomde> who was there too
[23:08] <eroomde> wife*
[23:08] <SpeedEvil> ah
[23:08] <eroomde> and my age
[23:08] <eroomde> and quite hot
[23:09] <eroomde> http://i.dailymail.co.uk/i/pix/2012/08/22/article-2191824-14A4E331000005DC-374_306x423.jpg
[23:09] <SpeedEvil> indeed.
[23:09] <eroomde> Dan-K2VOL: elon
[23:10] <Dan-K2VOL> well howdy
[23:11] <Dan-K2VOL> haha wait, his crazy money-grubbing, space-future-threatening ex wife?
[23:12] <eroomde> no idea
[23:12] <eroomde> she was just quite flirty and quite pretty
[23:12] <Lunar_Lander> eroomde, you really met Dawkins?
[23:12] <eroomde> and she's been in a couple of films that are the sort of films i know i probably would never watch of my own volition
[23:12] <eroomde> that's all i know
[23:13] <eroomde> Lunar_Lander: yes i really met dawkins
[23:13] <eroomde> i really live in the same city as him
[23:13] <Lunar_Lander> cool
[23:13] <Lunar_Lander> how is he in real life?
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[23:13] <eroomde> he is really as i imagined
[23:14] <eroomde> good at writing books
[23:16] <eroomde> but i don't really get the whole mania
[23:17] <eroomde> he's doing popular science for a subject that is very popular/controversial to a large chucnk of english speakers
[23:18] <eroomde> anyway that's tangential
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[23:21] <SpeedEvil> he writes books?
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[23:22] <Lunar_Lander> yea
[23:24] <RG_LZ1DEV> http://edition.cnn.com/video/?/video/us/2012/11/13/co-ufo-sightings-in-denver.kdvr
[23:24] <Laurenceb_> eroomde: you're top man now
[23:24] <Laurenceb_> when are you running for president?
[23:25] <Laurenceb_> did you ask elon if he was serious about recovery?
[23:26] <Laurenceb_> having said that the answer would probably have been scripted
[23:28] <SpeedEvil> I guess grasshoppers progress will tell us that
[23:30] <Laurenceb_> indeed
[23:30] <Dan-K2VOL> that video of it hopping 5m really illustrated the scale of the rocket
[23:30] <Laurenceb_> watching now
[23:30] <Dan-K2VOL> it looks like it went about 0.5m
[23:30] <Dan-K2VOL> but the rocket is freaking huge
[23:31] <Dan-K2VOL> I can hardly wrap my mind around it after watching so many of the lunar lander challenge test flights
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[23:33] <Dan-K2VOL> wow look at how fresh that rocket pad is! http://www.spacex.com/updates.php
[23:33] <Dan-K2VOL> it looks like they poured the concrete last week
[23:36] <SpeedEvil> first falcon heavy allegedly next year
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[23:39] <Dan-K2VOL> nice
[23:43] <SpeedEvil> it would be awesome if they'd put the landing stages on at least the outer two stages
[23:45] <hibby> fsphil: i see you like osmgpsmap too.
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[00:00] --- Thu Nov 15 2012