highaltitude.log.20121111

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[07:33] <SamSilver> daveake: good morning, nice flight yesterday, when does the TV show air?
[07:33] <daveake> 2 days ago now :D Spring next year we think
[07:34] <daveake> The cameraman in the chase car was amazed that we just drove to a field and picked it up
[07:35] <daveake> I did tell him it didn't always work out that way :/
[07:35] <daveake> At the start the live predictor said it would land very near the coast, and looking at the slow initial ascent I said it was ocean-bound
[07:35] <daveake> Fortunately it sped up a bit vertically
[07:36] <SamSilver> seemed to all go swimingly except for the "retakes"
[07:37] <daveake> yep
[07:38] <daveake> 3 minor issues none of which caused much hassle. First my filler hose fell of the valve ... pliers and duct tape sorted that one :)
[07:39] <SamSilver> and
[07:39] <daveake> Second I had the balloon neck too low down on the filler tube, and there wasn't really space at the top to put the cable ties on
[07:39] <daveake> So I stretched the neck to make some more space for Upu to put the tie on
[07:40] <daveake> And the whole neck slipped off the filler
[07:40] <SamSilver> heart stopper that one
[07:40] <daveake> So I was then holding the unattached balloon, which had yet to be sealed, in my hand
[07:41] <daveake> Upu got it sealed and tied down while I concentrated on not letting go :)
[07:42] <daveake> Last one was that when I got the landed payload back to the car I opened it up and pulled the battery out to remove the battery clip
[07:43] <daveake> And found the -ve wire was loose. At the time I assumed it fell off on landing, because number10 (last listener, and lived very close) couldn't get receive the SSDV even though he could decode BUZZ
[07:43] <daveake> But later when I checked the images on the SD card it was clear it was running all the way till I opened the box and lifted the batteries
[07:43] <daveake> So it was me that broke the wire
[07:43] <Darkside> http://projecthorus.org/?p=2384
[07:44] <SamSilver> does the sd save the images?
[07:44] <daveake> So I do have a set of images of it on the ground, photographing the clouds and the darkening skies
[07:44] <daveake> Yes
[07:44] <SamSilver> linky
[07:44] <SamSilver> please
[07:45] <Darkside> so i screwed up the pico launch
[07:45] <Darkside> :P
[07:45] <daveake> See http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cHDiDdjI8zg&feature=g-crec-u
[07:45] <Darkside> and lost the payload (though that was the intention)
[07:46] <daveake> ah well
[07:46] <daveake> picos are very tricky to get right
[07:46] <daveake> need luck too
[07:46] <Darkside> yeah
[07:47] <Darkside> still, the remote RX site worked brilliantly
[07:47] <daveake> yes, nice
[07:49] <Darkside> worked down to 1.2 degrees elevation
[07:49] <Darkside> where the payload was obscured by a hill
[07:49] <Darkside> i had a guy in goolwa tracking the payload down to the ground, but he wasn't using dl-fldigi
[07:50] <Darkside> he just emailed me his log
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[09:40] <eroomde> arko: ping
[09:53] <arko> sup!
[09:53] <arko> dude you should be here
[09:53] <arko> we are having a hackathon at nullspace
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[09:53] <arko> building a kinect vision robot in 3 days
[09:53] <arko> WOOOOO CAFFINENEENENE
[09:54] <arko> eroomde: ^
[09:54] <eroomde> arko: yo
[09:54] <eroomde> awesome
[09:54] <arko> :)
[09:54] <arko> uploading photos to facebook in a bit
[09:54] <eroomde> i just got an email back from tom r. he'll show me around!
[09:54] <arko> it's like 2 am over here
[09:55] <arko> :O
[09:55] <arko> no way
[09:55] <arko> PLEASE
[09:55] <arko> lets meet for lunch
[09:55] <eroomde> so, i'm in your town either 1st or 2nd week of feb
[09:55] <eroomde> oh yeah for sure
[09:55] <arko> awesome
[09:55] <eroomde> i'll definitely come and say heyo
[09:56] <arko> great! I want to meet tom more than just the hello i've said to him
[09:56] <arko> give him one of my mars watches
[09:56] <arko> :>
[09:59] <eroomde> :D
[09:59] <eroomde> ok
[09:59] <eroomde> i'll suggest it to him :)
[09:59] <eroomde> so what are you hacking on?
[10:00] <arko> just to say hi, not much more, i dont want to intrude on your guys stuff
[10:00] <arko> we have a pandaboard
[10:00] <arko> kinect
[10:00] <arko> arduino
[10:00] <arko> motors
[10:00] <arko> and some power reg stuff
[10:00] <arko> running pcl stuff
[10:00] <arko> for doing calcuations etc
[10:03] <eroomde> SLAM!
[10:06] <arko> EXACTLY!
[10:06] <arko> lots of fun algorithms
[10:06] <arko> you need to come to our hackerspace
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[10:06] <arko> http://i.imgur.com/b9CKq.png
[10:06] <arko> here we go
[10:06] <arko> i just made this
[10:07] <arko> picture
[10:07] <arko> took 14 hours from no design to a functioning robot
[10:07] <arko> with cad
[10:07] <eroomde> ha awesome!
[10:07] <eroomde> you have a LAAZUUR?
[10:07] <arko> PEW PEW PEW
[10:08] <eroomde> 'murica
[10:08] <arko> haha
[10:08] <arko> brb, going to go wear some jeans, eat a burger and fire my guns
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[10:09] <eroomde> awesome
[10:09] <eroomde> the panda board looks cool
[10:09] <arko> yeah
[10:09] <arko> it's a pain to compile for
[10:09] <arko> almost everything we found was for x86
[10:11] <eroomde> :)
[10:11] <eroomde> does it have the NEON gpu?
[10:12] <arko> it's a PowerVR SGX540
[10:12] <arko> 304Mhz
[10:12] <arko> dual-core 1Ghz ARM A9
[10:12] <arko> 1gb of DDR2
[10:12] <arko> pretty sweet stuff
[10:14] <eroomde> nice
[10:15] <eroomde> was looking at a beaglebone for something recently
[10:15] <eroomde> that seems pretty nice too
[10:15] Nick change: Mission-Critical -> MissionCritical
[10:19] <eroomde> i want frasier crane's flat
[10:19] <arko> sweet
[10:19] <arko> yeah i have a beagleboard
[10:19] <arko> its cool
[10:19] <arko> but not powerful enough
[10:20] <arko> nither is the raspberry pi
[10:20] <arko> i want to like the raspberry pi
[10:20] <arko> but i just cant :(
[10:20] <arko> good price
[10:20] <eroomde> it's good for what it is
[10:21] <eroomde> but for me would be worth spending the extra $40 to bump up to a beaglebone
[10:21] <eroomde> for something flying, say, where $40 doesn;t make much difference
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[10:28] <arko> yeah
[10:28] <eroomde> arko: just saw you thing on fb
[10:28] <eroomde> i know that feeling
[10:28] <eroomde> i google how to do something
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[10:28] <eroomde> google takes me to some chap having the same problem 2 years ago, question unanswered
[10:29] <eroomde> then i see that chap was me
[10:29] <Darkside> there's an XKCD comic about this
[10:31] <eroomde> link me up
[10:33] <Darkside> uhm
[10:33] <Darkside> hm
[10:33] <Darkside> http://xkcd.com/979/
[10:34] <eroomde> amazing
[10:36] <bertrik> or having the OP saying "never mind, I figured it out" without an explanation of the solution
[10:39] <daveake> yup. Or an "answer" by someone who obviously didn't understand the question.
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[10:41] <eroomde> usually the case on the ubuntu forums
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[11:02] <arko> hahaha
[11:02] <arko> ermoode: that feel
[11:05] <mfa298> the other alternative I've come accross is several replies along the lines of "That's obvious, work it out yourself"
[11:09] <arko> Darkside: I laughed for like a minute
[11:09] <arko> that was amazing
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[11:24] <eroomde> arko: the most recent xkcd made me properly lol
[11:24] <eroomde> we now have it printed on our wall-of-awesome at work
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[11:24] <Darkside> eroomde: thats because you're a bayesian nut
[11:24] <arko> nice
[11:25] <eroomde> Darkside: no such thing
[11:25] <arko> bayesian rocks
[11:25] <arko> rock*
[11:25] <eroomde> it's just correct
[11:25] <eroomde> like saying someone is a truth nut
[11:25] <Darkside> heh
[11:26] <arko> hahaha
[11:26] <arko> i just read it
[11:27] <arko> awesome
[11:27] <eroomde> it's a good one. simultaneously funny but actually saying something quite profound about the nature of inference
[11:27] <arko> yarp
[11:28] <eroomde> my old lab tried to get some of those rubber bracelets made up
[11:28] <eroomde> back when they were a thing a couple of years ago
[11:28] <eroomde> saying
[11:28] <eroomde> Love Bayes Hate Frequentism
[11:29] <arko> HAHAHA
[11:29] <eroomde> which for the non english was a play on one of the big ones at that time, love football hate racism
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[11:30] <SpeedEvil> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vix6TMnj9vY&feature=youtube_gdata_player
[11:30] <arko> oh you guys actually use your feet in football :P
[11:30] <SpeedEvil> it'll never catch on.
[11:32] <eroomde> yes
[11:32] <eroomde> the sport is called football
[11:32] <eroomde> because that's what it is
[11:32] <eroomde> yours isn't football
[11:32] <eroomde> it should be called something like
[11:32] <eroomde> handegg
[11:32] Action: mfa298 wonders what else you'de use in 'foot' ball
[11:33] <eroomde> coffee is a splendid thing
[11:33] <mfa298> damned internet dropping out, I was a bit late with that one :(
[11:35] <eroomde> mine has been a bit flakey recently too
[11:36] <mfa298> I ought to look at the logs but it looks like my line just gets reset. Usually I notice because irssi starts showing an increasing lag
[11:36] <arko> alrighty
[11:37] <arko> hackathon is over, goodnight all!
[11:37] <mfa298> arko: what you're not doing a complete all nighter leading into the following day then?
[11:38] <cuddykid> arko: hackathon? work for Facebook or something?
[11:39] <eroomde> goodnight arko
[11:40] <eroomde> facebook?
[11:40] <eroomde> he works for tha jizzle-P-lizzle
[11:40] <cuddykid> what's that eroomde ?!
[11:40] <eroomde> ask arko
[11:41] <eroomde> JPL
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[11:51] <cuddykid> ah
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[12:05] <griffonbot> Received email: David Akerman "[UKHAS] Re: Launch Announcement - MRSTED / BUZZ on Sunday 4th
[12:06] <griffonbot> Received email: Tomasz Brol "[UKHAS] Solar powered HAB tracker"
[12:06] <mfa298> SpeedEvil: good video although I feel there's an important phrase missing in it.
[12:11] <SpeedEvil> MFA 'all calls limited to three minutes' should be law.
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[12:15] <griffonbot> Received email: Mike Willis "RE: [UKHAS] Re: Launch Announcement - MRSTED / BUZZ on Sunday 4th
[12:22] <griffonbot> Received email: David Akerman "Re: [UKHAS] Re: Launch Announcement - MRSTED / BUZZ on Sunday 4th
[12:23] <cuddykid> good write up daveake as always :)
[12:24] <daveake> cheers :)
[12:27] <eroomde> this is some good ISH-induced grizzle
[12:27] <eroomde> http://www.daveakerman.com/?attachment_id=764
[12:31] <Laurenceb__> http://modulatedlight.org/Modulated_Light_DX/DSCF0012ah.jpg
[12:31] <daveake> Yeah we had to pause for that shot
[12:43] <daveake> The squeamish may wish to avoid zooming in to my finger in this hires shot :-) http://www.daveakerman.com/wp-content/uploads/2012/11/IMG_6237.jpg
[12:51] <eroomde> scalpain
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[13:00] <fsphil> that's not too bad
[13:02] Action: Laurenceb__ is contemplating optical downlink
[13:02] <Laurenceb__> that photo is 173miles optical link
[13:03] <Laurenceb__> max line of sight in uk is 144miles, and max in world seems to be 244miles
[13:03] <Laurenceb__> so obviously we need to try with a balloon
[13:03] <Laurenceb__> to get the record
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[13:13] <cuddykid> how would you ensure the payload is stable Laurenceb__?
[13:14] <cuddykid> surely with a fine laser the slightest movement would point it way off
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[13:31] <bertrik> Laurenceb: the red dot in between the guys is the transmitter?
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[13:34] <eroomde> ealier i was talking to someone about how the staff on voyager had to wait like 5-8 years between planetary flybys back in the 70s and 80s
[13:34] <eroomde> and all got visibly older between the archival footage of each transit
[13:35] <eroomde> well, building gcc bootstrap in order to build octave brings this to mind
[13:40] <fsphil> hah
[13:40] <SpeedEvil> do not use 1802 to compile.
[13:41] <fsphil> I tried to bootstrap an arm system once, ended in tears
[13:42] <fsphil> I don't think gcc likes me
[13:45] <eroomde> it is now finished
[13:45] <eroomde> took about 1hr
[13:47] <eroomde> anyone able to find in a non-pathological place some lower frequency TCXOs, eg 4MHz?
[13:47] <fsphil> hope it works
[13:47] <fsphil> was got me in the end was waiting 2 hours for the build to end in some obsure error
[13:47] <eroomde> mmm
[13:48] <eroomde> octave did that last time with clang
[13:48] <SpeedEvil> eroomde: there are'tcxos with integral
[13:48] <eroomde> with integral?
[13:48] <SpeedEvil> frac n
[13:48] <eroomde> a) nice, where? b) don;t want to pay a penalty in mA for such a thing if poss
[13:49] <SpeedEvil> mm
[13:49] Action: SpeedEvil forgot where he found them.
[13:53] <SpeedEvil> actually, them part I was thinking of wasn't tcxo
[13:53] <SpeedEvil> I suppose storing a cal curve, and resetting on changes isn't an option?
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[14:57] Nick change: Upu_M0UPU -> UPu
[14:57] Nick change: UPu -> Upu
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[15:05] <CliveAllen> Hi all, I am going to start ordering componets from the HAB Supplies shop (GPS and NXT2 radio) but I also have seen that it is possible to use the EZCAP USB Dongle to track the ballon...does anyone have any experience with EZCAP and can it be used reliably for tracking or can I just use it to test with?
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[15:10] <Randomskk> they're great for testing with
[15:10] <Randomskk> if you got it with the HABamp you could probably use it for tracking
[15:10] <Randomskk> it's not as good as a radio, but much much much cheaper
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[15:12] <CliveAllen> Yep that was what i was thinking. We would need to get a radio license here as well to use the radio recommended.....any other radios than anyone can recommend which are just receivers?
[15:12] <Randomskk> they exist though I can't remember any atm
[15:12] <daveake> You need no license
[15:12] <Randomskk> in the UK
[15:13] <daveake> yes
[15:13] <CliveAllen> I am in Norway :)
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[15:17] <Upu> hey CliveAllen
[15:18] <Upu> when you order just bear in mind Airmail is very slow and isn't insured or tracked, I'd strongly recommend Airsure
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[15:20] <CliveAllen> Thanks for the info! I will be ordering the parts to my dad in England who will send them over to Norway due to import tax charges, VAT +++
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[15:23] <Upu> I can mark them up as a gift if you want
[15:23] <Upu> but however you want to do it
[15:25] <CliveAllen> Ok that could do the trick
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[15:45] Nick change: eroomde -> ALLCAPS
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[15:55] Nick change: ALLCAPS -> eroomde
[15:55] <Randomskk> eroomde: loads of frequentists are all riled up about that xkcd
[15:55] <Randomskk> http://normaldeviate.wordpress.com/2012/11/09/anti-xkcd/
[15:55] <Randomskk> http://andrewgelman.com/2012/11/16808/
[16:01] <eroomde> splendid!
[16:01] <eroomde> look at the muggles trying to use a wand!
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[16:03] <Randomskk> the comments are great
[16:03] <Randomskk> 'Had the cartoon been presented as bad statistician vs. good statistician or rote statistician vs. sensible statistician, I wouldve been fine with it.'
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[16:11] <eroomde> Randomskk: did you get anywhere with the n2o issues?
[16:13] <Randomskk> jaime emailed someone at BOC who's responsible for that asking about the procedures
[16:13] <Randomskk> that person said "In order to answer your question accurately I would need more information. The quickest & most effective way to so this is for you to contact the sales office to have an audit raised & scheduled in with the end user. Once the audit is completed I will have a clearer understanding of the processes etc."
[16:14] <Randomskk> said audit will be booked in next week
[16:14] <Randomskk> so. we'll see.
[16:15] <Randomskk> (jaime did say "the answer is yes, you can have nitrous" originally)
[16:15] <Randomskk> (so in theory fine but I think the main concern will be finding somewhere to store it...)
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[16:18] <Randomskk> but I mean, it's not flammable or particularly restricted
[16:18] <Randomskk> it's not like we're asking for hydrazine or something
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[16:24] <eroomde> well
[16:24] <eroomde> respect it still
[16:25] <eroomde> because it can detonate as a monopropellent
[16:25] <Randomskk> for sure
[16:25] <Randomskk> and also still a lot of pressurised gas
[16:25] <eroomde> and oxidisers can be as dangerous as flamable things
[16:25] <Randomskk> especially in combination
[16:25] <eroomde> i think you will soon see more about its danger
[16:26] <Randomskk> heh
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[16:26] <eroomde> as people are starting to thinking there were some holes in the report about the scaled composites accident
[16:26] <eroomde> and wondering if the investigation wasn't a bit of a coverup.
[16:27] <eroomde> also virgin bought 100% of the spaceship company a few weeks ago from scaled composites/northrop
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[16:28] <eroomde> which, so the whispers say, is because they don;t want to be associated with scaled if/when things start getting raked up again
[16:28] <Randomskk> covering up what kind of thing though?
[16:28] <eroomde> criminal negligence
[16:28] <Randomskk> right, but that doesn't alter the danger associated with nitrous so much as highlight a lack of controls at the time?
[16:29] <eroomde> well, the implication of the report was that it was human error and that nitrous is safe for manned aircraft
[16:30] <eroomde> and the implication of the people whove studied the report, who claim that few of the conditions the report describes make physical sense or add up, is that actually nitrous is not as stable as they are making out and that they are covering up to protect their space-ship 2 business
[16:30] <Randomskk> interesting
[16:31] <eroomde> they are also (sensibly) looking at building a biprop
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[16:37] <Lunar_Lander> hello
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[17:02] <Lunar_Lander> hello daveake
[17:03] <daveake> hello Lunar
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[17:18] <griffonbot> Received email: Vittorio Serra "[UKHAS] advices for a balloon flight"
[17:31] <eroomde> well at least the answer isn't directly on the wiki
[17:44] <Laurenceb__> eroomde: so im going to try and solve my linear actuator issue by running one of the 6v Firgelli thingys at 15v with a Rohm motor driver
[17:44] <Laurenceb__> hopefully it doesnt blow up
[17:48] <SpeedEvil> have you asked them?
[17:50] <Laurenceb__> nope
[17:50] <Laurenceb__> think ill just try it
[17:51] <Laurenceb__> doubt they could offer sane advice
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[18:06] <Lunar_Lander> evening jcoxon
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[19:25] <griffonbot> Received email: Anthony Stirk "Re: [UKHAS] advices for a balloon flight"
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[19:27] <OZ1SKY_Brian> hi
[19:28] <OZ1SKY_Brian> Found two vide clips about the SP9UOB ballon, not sure if they allready been posted:
[19:28] <OZ1SKY_Brian> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_zuvt6pZZYo&feature=plcp
[19:28] <OZ1SKY_Brian> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yJemBEbE3lc&feature=context-cha
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[19:36] <griffonbot> Received email: Nigel Vander Houwen "Re: [UKHAS] advices for a balloon flight"
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[19:39] <SP9UOB> hi All
[19:39] <Upu> evening
[19:40] <OZ1SKY_Brian> Hi. nice videos from TVN and TVP on youtube.
[19:40] <Lunar_Lander> hi SP9UOB OZ1SKY_Brian and Upu
[19:40] <Upu> pew pew multi hi
[19:40] <Lunar_Lander> Upu, did you get my earlier question?
[19:40] <Lunar_Lander> xD
[19:40] <SP9UOB> hi Upu, how is Yous SpAVA ?
[19:40] <Upu> err
[19:40] <Upu> sec
[19:40] <Upu> didn't fly it in the end
[19:40] <SP9UOB> OZ1SKY_Brian: thanks :-)
[19:40] <Upu> we had a TV crew there
[19:40] <Upu> and it was getting a bit hectic
[19:41] <Upu> https://picasaweb.google.com/118244444241111963790/201211CrackingTheCodeLaunch
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[19:42] <SP9UOB> Upu: iwas wondering about solar cells placement. I think facing they up is not a good idea
[19:42] <Upu> probably correct
[19:42] <Upu> not in winter anyway
[19:42] <Upu> thats why I didn't launch it , it was getting on for 2pm the sun was very low
[19:43] <Upu> http://ssdv.habhub.org/
[19:43] <SP9UOB> Upu: no atmosphere, so no light dispersion at all
[19:43] <SpeedEvil> you need four
[19:43] <Upu> see image 23
[19:43] <SpeedEvil> if you want to put them vertical
[19:43] <Upu> no it could under good conditions get away with 3
[19:43] <SpeedEvil> maybe
[19:43] <Upu> https://picasaweb.google.com/118244444241111963790/201211CrackingTheCodeLaunch#5809615821755992530
[19:43] <Upu> 50mA wach
[19:43] <Upu> each
[19:44] <SP9UOB> hmm look: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=x31idSQcdVE
[19:44] <SP9UOB> 2 pieces cut by dremel in serial - 300 mA @ 1.1V
[19:44] <Upu> yeah saw that
[19:46] <SpeedEvil> cell bits are cheap
[19:46] <Upu> impressive, mine needs a little more work
[19:46] <SP9UOB> i want to stick 4 pieces (2.2V) with blocking diodes on each side of capsule - there is enough power for day and charging nokia BL4C lipol for night
[19:47] <SP9UOB> even with iridium tracker :-)
[19:47] <Upu> lipol has to be > 0'C to charge
[19:47] <SpeedEvil> http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/72-NEW-broken-pcs-from-Solar-Cells-make-Solar-Panel-/170681889283?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item27bd6ef203
[19:48] <SP9UOB> Saw some charging at -20
[19:48] <SP9UOB> Lion - sorry
[19:48] <Upu> if you find some that *charge* below 0'C that you can get let me know
[19:49] <Upu> but generally its 0'C and at a reduced charing current
[19:49] <Upu> discharge they are usually ok to -20'C
[19:49] <Upu> but not charge
[19:51] <SP9UOB> SpeedEvil: I use these: http://allegro.pl/solar-ogniwo-bateria-sloneczna-sloneczne-cela-4-25-i2715531585.html about 1.5 Euro/ea - 4.5 Watts
[19:53] <SpeedEvil> nice price
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[19:54] <SP9UOB> Upu: it Was NICD by sanyo - user in amateur satelite but Youre right - discharge down to -20, charge at 0 and above
[19:54] <RocketBoy> how much does that weigh?
[19:54] <SP9UOB> RocketBoy: 12g
[19:54] <SP9UOB> 15x15 cm
[19:55] <SP9UOB> but i dont need 8 amps@0.5 V so need to cut them
[19:55] <SP9UOB> and connect in series
[19:55] <Upu> evening RocketBoy
[19:55] <Upu> https://picasaweb.google.com/118244444241111963790/201211CrackingTheCodeLaunch#5809615821755992530
[19:56] <Upu> thats 30g all in
[19:56] <Upu> adding secondary cells increased the complexity hugely it becomes a thermal control exercise then
[19:56] <Upu> as you have to keep the cells warm
[19:57] <SP9UOB> Upu: right, but for long distance, zero-pressure floater - weight is not so important
[19:57] <Upu> no but its still a balance, of warming them in the day and charging, then using them at night to keep themselves warm and power everything
[19:57] <Upu> it is something I'm working on
[19:58] <Upu> http://www.orbtronic.com/protected-3400mah-18650-li-ion-battery-panasonic-ncr18650B-orbtronic
[19:58] <SP9UOB> Upu: also 300F supercap is an option, with reduced transmit
[19:58] <Upu> really 300F ?
[19:59] <Upu> super caps are generally only rated to -25'C as well but yes that is an option
[19:59] <Upu> the Iridium board had a super cap on it btw
[20:01] <SP9UOB> upu: https://fbcdn-sphotos-h-a.akamaihd.net/hphotos-ak-snc6/277283_551470471545386_631110517_o.jpg This 100F supercap loadet with gps and small tracker
[20:01] <eroomde> stands to reason. They want to keep their peak draw less than 100mA right?
[20:01] <eroomde> but iridium probably needs a couple of amps
[20:01] <SP9UOB> 28 minutes working with no power saving at all
[20:01] <Upu> 2A
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[20:01] <Upu> but yes eroomde
[20:02] <eroomde> fun
[20:03] <SP9UOB> upu: yes 300F i brought one http://www.tme.eu/pl/details/db5u307w35050ha/superkondensatory/samwha/db5u107w22045ha/#
[20:04] <SP9UOB> about 11 euro/pcs
[20:04] <Upu> SP9UOB Dan Bowen and I are working on something so open to suggestions
[20:04] <Upu> cheap
[20:04] <SP9UOB> Upu: with UK sallary :-)
[20:04] <Upu> cheap compared to uk.farnell.com
[20:05] <SP9UOB> Upu: ah ok
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[20:06] <DrLuke> that's quite some capacity
[20:07] <SP9UOB> they also have 3000F one! http://www.tme.eu/pl/details/scsra1c300re00m/superkondensatory/wima/scsra1c300re00mv00/#
[20:08] <SP9UOB> but isnt cheap about 200 euro
[20:09] <SP9UOB> anyway - this was first time ever i seen capacitor charging at 5.5 amp about 20 seconds :-)
[20:09] <RocketBoy> mmmm Superkondensator - its a long time since I have seen a capacitor called a condenser - now when I were a lad...
[20:10] <SP9UOB> RocketBoy: kondensator = capacitor inpolish
[20:10] <daveake> when I were a laf a Farad was something you made from a box full of large electrolytics :)
[20:10] <daveake> lad*
[20:11] <DrLuke> it also is kondensator in german
[20:11] <DrLuke> When I was a lad a Farad was a bike
[20:11] <DrLuke> ba dum tsshhh
[20:11] <DrLuke> (fahrrad is bike in german, it's almost homophonic)
[20:12] <RocketBoy> ah yes condenser = capacitor in english (not american)
[20:12] <daveake> They were called condensers here, when transistors were valves
[20:12] <RocketBoy> still have condenser microphones
[20:12] <daveake> ah true
[20:14] <RocketBoy> I not like people calling varicaps varactors - totally not british
[20:14] <RocketBoy> variconds - humm
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[20:16] <daveake> hmm indeed :)
[20:19] <RocketBoy> and don't get me on to arials and antenna
[20:20] <SP9UOB> RocketBoy: in polish: Dioda Pojemnosciowa or warikap
[20:20] <Upu> one of those is a font
[20:21] <eroomde> number10: http://www.bbc.co.uk/programmes/b01nt07m
[20:21] <RocketBoy> or a mermaid
[20:21] <eroomde> go to 42.00
[20:21] <upix> hey everyone
[20:22] <DrLuke> hi
[20:22] <RocketBoy> so how is kondensator not Pojemnosciowa
[20:23] <RocketBoy> or similar
[20:23] <Upu> evening upix
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[20:27] <SP9UOB> RocketBoy: pojemnosc = capacitance
[20:27] <SP9UOB> capacity
[20:28] <upix> daveake: it's an old topic, but few months ago you said you were going to measure sdr dongles receiving capabilities. Have you done that?
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[20:28] <RocketBoy> yeah I guess i have a very english view on language structure
[20:29] <number10> a little jazzed up eroomde
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[20:37] <SP9UOB> Upu: when are You launching SPAVA ?
[20:37] <Upu> not sure now
[20:37] <Upu> probably stick it on a 1600g with the new PAVA
[20:38] <SP9UOB> btw: how high can fly 100g kaysam ?
[20:38] <Upu> kaysam ?
[20:38] <SP9UOB> with 50-60 grams
[20:38] <SP9UOB> kaysam balloon
[20:39] <Upu> not familiar with those, the 100g Hwoyee's seem to be able to get to 21km
[20:39] <SP9UOB> I have 7
[20:40] <Randomskk> more like 25km upu >_>
[20:40] <Upu> I stand corrected
[20:40] <SP9UOB> ok, i must buy some hydrogen and try
[20:40] <Randomskk> sadly
[20:40] <RocketBoy> kaysam - I though they dissapeard about 10 years ago
[20:41] <Randomskk> I did some calcs and predict maybe 3.6m burst diameter
[20:41] <Randomskk> which is a little more than the 1.8m spec
[20:41] <SP9UOB> RocketBoy: i get it from my friend - they look ok
[20:42] <RocketBoy> I think theye were the balloons that kaymont used to sell - I think theye wre produced in the states (might be wrong)
[20:43] <griffonbot> Received email: Ali al-Azzawi "Re: [UKHAS] advices for a balloon flight"
[20:46] <SP9UOB> RocketBoy: http://sp9uob.verox.pl/balon/kaysam.jpg
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[20:51] <RocketBoy> Just old balloons - give them a try
[20:53] <SP9UOB> ok will see :-)
[20:58] <RocketBoy> let me know how you get on - I'd be interested - they were supposed to be good balloons - but not sure how they will be after 10 years or so
[21:02] <OZ1SKY_Brian> gn
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[21:04] <SP9UOB> RocketBoy: ok, i want to test my 50 MHz tracker, so will launch on kaysam. Just must to do PCB and buy hydrogen
[21:10] <Lunar_Lander> SP9UOB, I got two old balloons too
[21:10] <Lunar_Lander> but they are like dark brown in colour
[21:11] <Lunar_Lander> from the 1980's I think
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[21:12] <SP9UOB> Lunar_Lander: wow - try to launch them :-)
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[21:13] <Lunar_Lander> I will
[21:13] <Lunar_Lander> and thanks to RocketBoy I also have a Kaymont-1500 :)
[21:13] <Lunar_Lander> that was the first balloon I bought
[21:13] Action: fsphil whistles the final countdown tune
[21:14] <Lunar_Lander> xD
[21:14] <Lunar_Lander> the guy from the gadget show on FIVE has strange glasses
[21:15] <SP9UOB> Lunar_Lander: link to youtube?
[21:15] <Lunar_Lander> for example here https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eg8Bh5iI2WY
[21:16] <SP9UOB> Lunar_Lander: this is the famous hab episode?
[21:17] <Lunar_Lander> no, I just checked
[21:17] <Lunar_Lander> searching for "the gadget show balloon" has no results
[21:23] <mattbrejza> http://www.youtube.com/show/thegadgetshow
[21:23] <Lunar_Lander> ah that is UK only I am afraid
[21:23] <SP9UOB> this channel is not available in your country
[21:23] <Lunar_Lander> yes
[21:23] <RG_LZ1DEV> :D
[21:23] <Lunar_Lander> here as well
[21:25] <mattbrejza> lol
[21:25] <mattbrejza> o well
[21:27] <SP9UOB> well 22 hours of driving and i'm in London ;-)
[21:27] <Lunar_Lander> XD!
[21:31] <fsphil> yay
[21:31] <fsphil> I was there a few days ago. Seen a load of fireworks while flying over
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[21:45] <SP9UOB> good night all
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[22:00] <natrium42> Lunar_Lander: so, any news? :)
[22:02] <Lunar_Lander> yea I'll rework the software once more
[22:02] <Lunar_Lander> but else
[22:02] <Lunar_Lander> please wait about 2 minutes
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[22:05] <natrium42> ok, cool
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[22:06] <Lunar_Lander> http://s.gullipics.com/image/k/3/c/5yvnld-jgtvqh-nx0v/IMG5318.jpeg
[22:13] <Lunar_Lander> natrium42, did you see it?
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[22:19] <Lunar_Lander> daveake, wb
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[22:19] <Lunar_Lander> hello Dan-K2VOL
[22:19] <Lunar_Lander> please consider this http://s.gullipics.com/image/k/3/c/5yvnld-jgtvqh-nx0v/IMG5318.jpeg
[22:19] <Lunar_Lander> :)
[22:20] <Dan-K2VOL> I have considered it
[22:20] <Lunar_Lander> yea
[22:20] <Lunar_Lander> orange
[22:20] <Lunar_Lander> xD
[22:20] <Dan-K2VOL> indeed! looks like you're getting close to flight kevin
[22:20] <Dan-K2VOL> nice
[22:20] <Dan-K2VOL> good box of parts too
[22:21] <Dan-K2VOL> the green one
[22:21] <Lunar_Lander> yea :)
[22:21] <Lunar_Lander> a teammate actually helped to sort all the stuff on the table into that
[22:23] <Lunar_Lander> the paper below the box is actually the homework in solid state physics
[22:23] <Lunar_Lander> xD
[22:23] <Dan-K2VOL> I should hope most of your physics homework is still in a solid state
[22:24] <Lunar_Lander> yea :)
[22:24] <Dan-K2VOL> :-P
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[22:30] <Dan-K2VOL> anyone ever do mechanical turk projects?
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[22:34] <upix> Lunar_Lander: what receiver are you going to use?
[22:34] <Lunar_Lander> Yaesu FT-790R
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[22:35] <upix> did you buy one? if so where from?
[22:36] <Lunar_Lander> I found one on ebay
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[22:47] <DrLuke> I'm just going to use a rtl sdr :P
[22:48] <sparkgap> hey, anyone in here decent with opamps willing to give a poor digital guy a hand? I'm kind of terrible at analog stuff...
[22:48] <Dan-K2VOL> hmm, what are you trying to do? (i'm terrible too)
[22:49] <DrLuke> well, I just learned a fair bit about opamps at uni
[22:50] <DrLuke> but it's all theoretical
[22:53] <sparkgap> http://i.imgur.com/QS7xL.png it works great in spice, I have the same circuit on a breadboard here with an AVR generating the PWM instead of U3, and its working pretty well, but there's a ton of PWM noise on the output going in to C7, and if I remove C2 it all goes away, and I'm not sure why that is...
[22:53] <Lunar_Lander> does anybody know a bit about Scotland?
[22:53] <sparkgap> strictly speaking, without C2 its perfectly fine for my needs, but I'd like to know why it's causing the noise
[22:54] <Randomskk> maybe you have a dodgy c2
[22:54] <Randomskk> it all runs fine in simulation?
[22:55] <sparkgap> yep
[22:55] <sparkgap> I swapped C2
[22:55] <sparkgap> and both of them check out fine on the DMM
[22:55] <Randomskk> what's this circuit doing?
[22:55] <sparkgap> plus I swapped C2 with the C5 counterpart and its the same
[22:56] <sparkgap> I'm trying to use PWM to make low frequency ~1000Hz arbitrary waveforms
[22:56] <sparkgap> without C2, its working perfectly
[22:56] <DrLuke> you might want to ask in ##electronics
[22:56] <Randomskk> not sure what c2 and c5 are providing
[22:56] <Randomskk> or why you're using two opamps like that anyway
[22:56] <DrLuke> they are integrating
[22:56] <DrLuke> I think
[22:57] <sparkgap> its supposed to be a 4 pole butterworth low pass filter
[22:57] <Randomskk> unusual configuration for it
[22:57] <Randomskk> sparkgap: aah.
[22:58] <Randomskk> okay that makes a lot more sense
[22:58] <Randomskk> though not the usual design I've used/seen used?
[22:59] <sparkgap> I pulled it from some datasheets, sallen-key configuration (I'm much better with digital things haha)
[22:59] <Randomskk> oh okay I suppose it works out to the same thing
[22:59] <Randomskk> yea
[23:00] <Darkside> TI FilterPro ftw
[23:00] <Randomskk> I have some notes on these... somewhere.
[23:01] <mattbrejza> you sure itll work off 5V->0V supply?
[23:01] <sparkgap> it seems fine without C2, plus I tried pushing it up to 10V->0V, no change
[23:02] <mattbrejza> as in, 5V->-5V?
[23:02] <sparkgap> nope, 10V to 0V
[23:02] <sparkgap> single supply design/opamp
[23:05] <Randomskk> it's really weird that your circuit a) works without C2 b) has such a high disparity with simulation
[23:05] <sparkgap> yeah, hence my confusion haha
[23:05] <Randomskk> could be breadboards being rubbish, or maybe it's worth double checking your circuit against the schematic
[23:05] <Randomskk> normally I use something like https://www.dropbox.com/s/o562g9vi8t7jw62/2012-11-11%2023.03.38.jpg
[23:05] <Randomskk> which is the same but has those two resistors on the feedback to provide non unity gain
[23:05] <sparkgap> I've triple checked it, I even had someone else review the schematic and check it for me
[23:05] <mattbrejza> also try a different opamp, some of the ones in ltspice are a bit funny
[23:06] <sparkgap> so you think the simulation is wrong in reporting this circuit as working?
[23:06] <Randomskk> no, the circuit should be fine
[23:06] <mattbrejza> it might be misleading
[23:06] <Randomskk> yes
[23:06] <Randomskk> but removing c2 should stop the first opamp being an effective filter, really
[23:06] <mattbrejza> ie the opamps having a BW of 20Hz
[23:07] <Randomskk> so it's weird that that should act to filter your signal further
[23:07] <sparkgap> yeah, I was going through the same thought process
[23:07] <sparkgap> the only thing I can figure is that at the node between R1 and R2 I can see a lot of PWM noise on the scope, it seems be getting coupled through to the output through C2
[23:08] <Randomskk> your schematic seems essentially fine though I can't speak for your component values
[23:08] <sparkgap> ah, I used an online calculator, went for about 2.2kHz corner, 125kHz PWM, trying to make a 1kHz sine wave
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[23:45] <arko> still having issues with the hourly predictor :<
[23:46] <jonsowman> what's up?
[23:47] <arko> http://pastebin.com/475uFhLU
[23:47] <arko> it runs for like 45 minutes
[23:47] <arko> then keep placing all the dots in the same place
[23:47] <arko> i monitor the network and cpu and it's doing things the whole time
[23:48] <jonsowman> interesting
[23:48] <arko> the other log looks good
[23:48] <jonsowman> 45 mins sounds about right
[23:48] <arko> not sure if the connection is timing out or what
[23:48] <jonsowman> not seen that one before
[23:48] <arko> still haven't run into DanielRichman who helped me a lot last time
[23:49] <arko> code wise it looks ok, but im not super familiar with it
[23:49] <jonsowman> i'm rather too familiar with it
[23:49] <arko> :P
[23:49] <arko> awesome
[23:49] <jonsowman> are you using the /cuspaceflight latest?
[23:49] <arko> let me double check
[23:50] <arko> i think so
[23:50] <arko> i downloaded it 2 weeks ago
[23:50] <jonsowman> you can try running the grab data script manually to see if it still times out
[23:50] <Randomskk> maybe upload the log file someplace
[23:50] <jonsowman> see above
[23:50] <Randomskk> oh yes
[23:51] <jonsowman> i've not seen that time out before
[23:51] <Randomskk> the timing out can't help
[23:52] <arko> hmm
[23:52] <arko> no more error
[23:52] <arko> odd...
[23:53] <arko> http://pastebin.com/K3zF9bRi
[23:53] <arko> this just finished
[23:54] <arko> thats in /opt/landing-prediction-data/logs
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[23:54] <Randomskk> same problem?
[23:54] <arko> well
[23:54] <arko> no
[23:54] <arko> it didn't error
[23:54] <arko> but
[23:54] <Randomskk> I mean
[23:54] <arko> the dots are still in the same place
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[23:54] <Randomskk> do you still have the problem where the predictions are all coincident
[23:54] <Randomskk> right
[23:54] <Randomskk> that's odd
[23:54] <Randomskk> can you run the predictor bit manually and get the log output from that?
[23:55] <arko> hmm
[23:55] <arko> not sure which script that is
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[23:55] <arko> btw, im running:
[23:55] <arko> ./fetch-run-cronjob.sh
[23:56] <jonsowman> yes
[23:56] <jonsowman> if you look at grabdata-cronjob, you'll see it just runs the python script with some params
[23:56] <jonsowman> which you can do manually for debugging purposes if you wish
[23:56] <upix> just out of curiosity: arko are you writing a landing predictor?
[23:56] <arko> not my own
[23:56] <arko> using the cusf one
[23:57] <upix> so what are you doing
[23:57] <jonsowman> trying to get it to work
[23:57] <upix> i mean what are you changing/adding
[23:57] <arko> jonsowman: do i need to update the "${GETDATA} --lat=52 ....etc etc"?
[23:58] <jonsowman> yes I imagine so
[23:58] <jonsowman> somewhere I wrote down deployment instructions
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[23:58] <jonsowman> but I can't find them
[23:58] <arko> hah
[23:58] <Randomskk> aah
[23:58] <Randomskk> is it..
[23:58] <arko> i only modified the scenario-template.json
[23:58] <Randomskk> is it getting wind data for the UK
[23:58] <Randomskk> and then running predictions for CA
[23:58] <Randomskk> that would be
[23:58] <Randomskk> that would explain the problem.
[23:58] <arko> oh
[23:58] <jonsowman> yes that sounds like it
[23:59] <arko> cool, let me try fixing this
[23:59] Action: Randomskk -> bed
[23:59] <Randomskk> good luck
[23:59] <arko> thanks!
[23:59] <Randomskk> the good news is that there's a big project working on the predictor at cusf now
[23:59] <Randomskk> so it'l probably change a lot :D
[23:59] <Randomskk> but be more accurate and much much easier to deploy
[23:59] <arko> :D
[23:59] <Randomskk> so that's good!
[23:59] <arko> can't wait
[23:59] <Randomskk> like, deployment instructions
[23:59] <arko> GFS HD data?
[23:59] <jonsowman> there's no point
[23:59] <arko> aweeessome
[23:59] <arko> oh really?
[23:59] <jonsowman> we tried it once
[00:00] --- Mon Nov 12 2012