highaltitude.log.20121103

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[04:17] <arko> man i hate ubuntu
[04:17] <arko> why did i choose this
[04:25] <natrium42> so install some other distro?
[04:26] <arko> i robably will
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[04:42] <arko> mmm
[04:43] <arko> looks like its looking for glib-2.0
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[04:43] <arko> i installed it though...
[04:50] <arko> ah i needed libglib2.0-dev
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[05:02] <arko> i wish i was over there in europe :<
[05:06] <arko> Upu: you around?
[05:20] <arko> anyone around>?
[05:20] <Darkside> nope
[05:21] <arko> haha
[05:21] <arko> excellent
[05:22] <arko> you wouldnt happen to know how to use the cusf-landing-prediction software would you?
[05:22] <Darkside> nope
[05:22] <Darkside> not offline anyway
[05:22] <arko> damn
[05:22] <arko> kk
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[05:50] <arko> i think i'll stay awake till europe wakes up
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[07:14] <arko> europe awake yet?
[07:15] <x-f> morning, arko
[07:15] <x-f> it's 7 am in UK :)
[07:16] <arko> hooray!
[07:16] <arko> also why are you awake!?
[07:16] <arko> its saturday morning!
[07:16] <arko> unless it's to watch saturday morning cartoons
[07:16] <x-f> i'm UTC+2
[07:17] <arko> oh
[07:18] <x-f> don't think i can help you much with the predictor software
[07:18] <arko> its cool
[07:18] <arko> i feel bad for the folks who can, i keep asking stupid questions :P
[07:18] <x-f> i kind of set it up on my mac, but it works only partially
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[07:21] <arko> i dont get how to run the cron job
[07:21] <arko> even the script keeps throwing errors at me
[07:21] <arko> im a linux n00b
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[07:23] <x-f> you need to fix those errors first
[07:24] <x-f> i think you can ignore the cron stuff for now, it's just for deleting old files
[07:24] <x-f> we're talking about standalone, not hourly version, right?
[07:26] <arko> hourly
[07:27] <x-f> ah that one
[07:27] <x-f> i failed with it
[07:28] <eroomde> morning all
[07:28] <eroomde> oh, you're trying to set up the predictgor locally
[07:29] <arko> yeah
[07:29] <arko> the hourly one
[07:29] <eroomde> eeeee
[07:29] <arko> also morning
[07:29] <arko> i want to run a cron job every 6 hours to get the latest hourly predictions
[07:29] <eroomde> snot easy. there is a big predictor effort about to begin to unify and simplify everything a bit
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[07:30] <eroomde> cos at the mo it is causing some upset
[07:30] <arko> oh
[07:30] <arko> hmm
[07:30] <eroomde> i mean, do have a go
[07:30] <eroomde> but
[07:30] <eroomde> have a whisky ready
[07:30] <arko> i have had 3 guniness' already
[07:31] <eroomde> the ballmer peak
[07:31] <x-f> hehe
[07:31] <arko> the wiki seems incomplete
[07:31] <arko> haha ballmers
[07:31] <x-f> well i'm afk, car needs winter tyres
[07:31] <eroomde> my car needs new rear tyres come to think ofd it
[07:33] <arko> eroomde: awake so early>
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[07:34] <eroomde> 7.30
[07:34] <eroomde> at parents come, got home last night
[07:34] <eroomde> mum's bday
[07:34] <arko> hah
[07:34] <arko> nice
[07:34] <eroomde> wine resupply mission
[07:35] <arko> damn, you resupply their stock?
[07:36] <eroomde> other way round
[07:36] <eroomde> i'm the iss in this scenario
[07:38] <arko> ah
[07:38] <arko> wine :D
[07:39] Action: eroomde is half french, french side are wine makers
[07:39] <arko> oh sweet
[07:40] <eroomde> sweet, dry, minerally, tannic
[07:40] <eroomde> u name it :)
[07:40] <arko> i enjoy wine now, i use to hate it for some reason
[07:41] <jcoxon> eroomde, i thoroughly appreciate your iss comparison
[07:41] <eroomde> i love it with food
[07:41] <arko> WARN: Do not have two data files around current time. Expect the results to be wrong!
[07:41] Last message repeated 3 time(s).
[07:41] <eroomde> jcoxon: thanks
[07:41] <eroomde> i try
[07:41] <arko> man they really want you to tknow
[07:41] <jcoxon> eroomde, you well?
[07:41] <eroomde> yep!
[07:42] <eroomde> fpga nerding and rocket testing this week
[07:42] <eroomde> can't be bads
[07:42] <eroomde> u?
[07:42] <jcoxon> yeah, work has been busy
[07:43] <jcoxon> thinking of getting a nice aerial for the flat today
[07:43] <jcoxon> might actually go to a ham shop
[07:43] Action: arko is jealous
[07:43] <eroomde> u got permission?
[07:44] <jcoxon> eroomde, ummmm, permission from me - yes!
[07:44] <eroomde> :)
[07:45] <jcoxon> i'm thinking i'll fit it onto the balconey perhaps
[07:45] <eroomde> yeah
[07:45] <eroomde> what are you thinking of betting?
[07:45] <jcoxon> in a tempoary way,
[07:45] <jcoxon> with some sort of clamp like anchor
[07:46] <arko> eroomde: you said the standalone is easier to install and run?
[07:47] <eroomde> possibly
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[07:48] <eroomde> and then there's the question of different results from each one
[07:48] <eroomde> jcoxon got hourly worrking didnt u?
[07:49] <jcoxon> a long time ago
[07:49] <jcoxon> but not with cron
[07:49] <jcoxon> just did it manually
[07:49] <jcoxon> as its a lot of data it pulls
[07:49] Action: DanielRichman recently installed both into VMs. Though I didn't look at cronning it
[07:50] <arko> hmm
[07:50] <arko> so i just downloaded both
[07:50] <arko> not sure what to do next
[07:50] <arko> i worked on the cmake one but it was funky
[07:50] <arko> i mean running cmake on the hourly
[07:51] <DanielRichman> literally just cd pred_src; cmake .; make
[07:51] <arko> oh
[07:51] <arko> ok
[07:51] <arko> that worked
[07:51] <arko> whats next?
[07:51] <DanielRichman> python dependencies all good?
[07:52] <arko> yep
[07:52] <arko> wait
[07:52] <arko> maybe not
[07:52] <arko> i have python-dev
[07:52] <arko> what am i missing?
[07:52] <DanielRichman> I think the next step is to cd into scripts and run some of the things and see what breaks
[07:53] <arko> oh you're talking about the hourly
[07:53] <DanielRichman> ah ok. Standalone?
[07:53] <arko> let me try the hourly real quick
[07:54] <DanielRichman> You need to set up a web server with php. apache2 is a one line install but I don't really like it
[07:54] <arko> oh
[07:54] <arko> just sudo apt-get it
[07:54] <arko> ?
[07:55] <DanielRichman> php necessary for standalone only
[07:55] <arko> oh
[07:55] <DanielRichman> yeah look for apache2 and apache2 php packages
[07:56] <arko> ah
[07:56] <arko> this makes sense
[07:56] <arko> sometimes i wish this was already a vm, only because im sometimes lazy :P
[07:57] <arko> ok
[07:57] <arko> all good
[07:57] <DanielRichman> we'll make deployment automatic or make deb packages for this stuff at some point...
[07:57] <arko> try a script?
[07:58] <arko> :P
[07:58] <arko> ./hourly-predictions-cronjob.sh: The directory /opt/cusf-landing-prediction/web/hourly-predictions/logs/ needs to exist and be writable.
[07:58] <DanielRichman> standalone. serve the predict/ directory (symlink into /var/www or whatever). edit predict/includes/config
[07:58] <DanielRichman> yeah I had it complaining about directoriea loads. Just make them
[07:59] <arko> ok
[08:00] <arko> hm
[08:01] <arko> the script ran
[08:01] <arko> had to add data and new
[08:01] <arko> but when i run it, it deletes new
[08:01] <arko> so it breaks the second time it's run
[08:03] <DanielRichman> I observed this too. As far as I can tell after a clean run eeverything/dirextories are ok
[08:03] <arko> hmm
[08:03] <eroomde> http://i.imgur.com/Ge4Pf.jpg
[08:04] <arko> so something isn't running right ay?
[08:04] <DanielRichman> if you error in the middle you have to keep making directories
[08:04] <arko> HOW COOL IS THAT PHOTO!?
[08:04] <DanielRichman> check the various logs directories for clues
[08:04] <DanielRichman> brb breakfadt
[08:04] <arko> you rock
[08:04] <arko> thanks for the help so far
[08:04] <arko> very much appricated :)
[08:05] <arko> Traceback (most recent call last):
[08:05] <arko> File "/opt/cusf-landing-prediction/scripts/run-hourly-predictions.py", line 11, in <module>
[08:05] <arko> import logging, glob, os, time, datetime, uuid, subprocess, demjson
[08:05] <arko> ImportError: No module named demjson
[08:05] <arko> i knew i needed that and demson
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[08:07] <arko> ok
[08:08] <arko> now that that's install im getting
[08:08] <arko> INFO:root:Scanning data directory /opt/landing-prediction-data/gfs/ Traceback (most recent call last): File "/opt/cusf-landing-prediction/scripts/run-hourly-predictions.py", line 226, in <module> main() File "/opt/cusf-landing-prediction/scripts/run-hourly-predictions.py", line 179, in main (end_stamp, model) = get_latest_timestamp() File "/opt/cusf-landing-prediction/scripts/run-hou
[08:08] <arko> im now spamming the channel :D
[08:10] <arko> rly-predictions.py", line 173, in get_latest_timestamp timestamp = max(timestamps) ValueError: max() arg is an empty sequence
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[08:13] <arko> eroomde: its my new wallpaper now :D
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[08:24] <eroomde> arko: quite right!
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[08:33] <DanielRichman> arko: if you're getting bizzare errors, check the version of Pydap you're using
[08:33] <DanielRichman> or wait a few minutes. Sometimges the weather servers do odd stuff
[08:33] <arko> im not sure i even have that installed correctly
[08:33] <DanielRichman> ok type pip freeze
[08:33] <DanielRichman> and tell me the line with Pydap in it
[08:33] <arko> pip not installed
[08:33] <arko> ?
[08:33] <DanielRichman> how did you install pydap?
[08:34] <arko> i dont think i did
[08:34] <arko> does it have an apt-get?
[08:34] <DanielRichman> Don't know
[08:34] <arko> hmm
[08:34] <arko> brb googling
[08:34] <DanielRichman> basically do this
[08:34] <DanielRichman> apt-get install python-pip
[08:34] <DanielRichman> sudo pip install Pydap==3.0.1
[08:35] <DanielRichman> this should also compile and insall numpy for you if you haven't already
[08:35] <arko> nice
[08:36] <arko> ok done
[08:36] <DanielRichman> are you sure. That was a bit quick
[08:36] <arko> yep
[08:36] <DanielRichman> type pip freeze and quote hte lines with pydap and numpy in them
[08:37] <arko> numpy==1.5.1
[08:38] <arko> Pydap==3.0.1
[08:38] <Upu> haha Hourly Predictors legendary 297 point install procedure ?
[08:38] <arko> yes
[08:38] <DanielRichman> okay cool
[08:38] <arko> im dying
[08:39] <DanielRichman> looks good
[08:39] <arko> kill me
[08:39] <DanielRichman> try running your prediction again
[08:39] <DanielRichman> ok
[08:39] <arko> haha
[08:39] <arko> at this point you probably want to
[08:39] <arko> same error
[08:39] <arko> with the max() function
[08:40] <DanielRichman> which script are you running
[08:40] <arko> sudo ./hourly-predictions-cronjob.sh
[08:41] <DanielRichman> use ./fetch-run-cronjob.sh
[08:42] <DanielRichman> it probably doesn't need to be run as root
[08:42] <DanielRichman> chmod and chown can sort that out
[08:42] <DanielRichman> but that's not important right this minute
[08:43] <arko> arko@ubuntu:/opt/cusf-landing-prediction/scripts$ ./fetch-run-cronjob.sh /opt/cusf-landing-prediction/scripts/grabdata-cronjob.sh: line 23: cd: /opt/landing-prediction-data/: No such file or directory /opt/cusf-landing-prediction/scripts/grabdata-cronjob.sh: The directory /opt/landing-prediction-data//gfs needs to exist and be writable.
[08:43] <arko> interesting
[08:43] <arko> arko@ubuntu:/opt/cusf-landing-prediction/scripts$ ./fetch-run-cronjob.sh
[08:43] <arko> /opt/cusf-landing-prediction/scripts/grabdata-cronjob.sh: line 23: cd: /opt/landing-prediction-data/: No such file or directory
[08:43] <arko> /opt/cusf-landing-prediction/scripts/grabdata-cronjob.sh: The directory /opt/landing-prediction-data//gfs needs to exist and be writable.
[08:43] <arko> thats better
[08:44] <DanielRichman> yeah you need to make those directories
[08:44] <DanielRichman> I think you also need to make the empty directory /opt/python-packages to keep some script happy
[08:48] <arko> omg
[08:48] <arko> it's giving me a blinking icon
[08:48] <arko> not sure if working or hanging
[08:48] <DanielRichman> probably working
[08:48] <Upu> open another terminal
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[08:48] <Upu> and tail the log file
[08:48] <DanielRichman> go do something else for 10 minutes ;P
[08:48] <DanielRichman> yeah or that
[08:48] <Upu> 15...
[08:49] <DanielRichman> you might find that it downloads all the data correctly and then fails on the predicting step but hey, this is progress
[08:49] <DanielRichman> you can also retry the latter without redownloading
[08:49] <DanielRichman> but only if you run the right script
[08:49] <arko> wonderful
[08:49] <arko> haha
[08:49] <arko> this is really powerful tool
[08:49] <arko> i would pay to get an installer
[08:50] <arko> honestly
[08:50] <DanielRichman> one day
[08:50] <DanielRichman> I promise
[08:50] <arko> :)
[08:50] <DanielRichman> maybe... by the time you need to upgrade to the next ubutu LTS
[08:50] <arko> i will donate money if it's free, you have my word
[08:50] <arko> haha
[08:51] <arko> i really need to learn how to do this stuff on linux
[08:51] <Upu> I have a feature request for the hourly as long as my arm
[08:51] <arko> hourly is a VERY valuable tool
[08:52] <arko> but im telling the guys who made it
[08:52] <arko> :P
[08:52] <arko> so obviously you know this
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[08:52] <DanielRichman> basically the predictor is gonna get a make over
[08:53] <arko> awesome
[08:53] <arko> I look forward to it
[08:53] <DanielRichman> the two tools will be probably - don't know for sure yet - but my best guess says that we'll merge the two tools
[08:53] <DanielRichman> keeping both features of course
[08:53] <arko> :)
[08:53] <DanielRichman> but they're similar enough that they really should be one thing IMO
[08:54] <arko> with a decent interface, you could always make it 1 thing
[08:54] <arko> an all in one program would be great
[08:54] <arko> decode aprs/etc, predict, trcak
[08:54] <arko> yada yada
[08:54] <DanielRichman> yeah we're thinking of that
[08:54] <Upu> one thing at one arko :)
[08:54] <Upu> small non paid team doing it
[08:54] <DanielRichman> they're all closely linked anyway since we have live predictions in the tracker, etc.
[08:55] <DanielRichman> so
[08:55] <DanielRichman> makes sense to unify all the things
[08:55] <arko> Upu: oh I totally get it
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[08:55] <arko> well, ill keep this running
[08:55] <arko> in the mean time, i got a meeting in 5 hours
[08:55] <arko> so i should get some sleep
[08:56] <arko> Upu: DanielRichman: thanks you so very much
[08:56] <DanielRichman> no problem
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[09:52] <OZ1SKY_Brian> hi, is lunar going to launch or is it just tests?
[09:52] <daveake> testing
[09:52] <Upu> just tests
[09:52] <Upu> but
[09:53] <Upu> Lunar is on Spacenear.us
[09:53] <daveake> epic
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[09:53] <Upu> up there with hell freezing over
[09:54] <daveake> Sandy won't get a look-in in the news shows today
[09:54] <OZ1SKY_Brian> ok yeah thats why i asked, i saw him on the tracker
[09:55] <OZ1SKY_Brian> wonder what oernen means
[09:56] <Upu> he did tell me once
[09:56] <Upu> I forgot
[09:56] <OZ1SKY_Brian> in danish it means Eagle
[09:56] <daveake> https://github.com/WinzenFlyer/Oernen-II-Stratosphere-Science-Platform/wiki/Introduction
[09:57] <OZ1SKY_Brian> ahh ok Eagle it is then
[09:57] <daveake> yup :)
[09:58] <Upu> imagine getting an eagle, covering it in glue the crashing it into the window of Sparkfuns sensor shop and you get Oernen-II
[09:58] <number10> thats the first time I have seen him track anything
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[09:59] Nick change: MrScienceMan -> RG-lz1dev
[09:59] <fsphil> he did get a few strings from apex
[09:59] <RG-lz1dev> morning
[09:59] <Upu> morning
[09:59] <fsphil> morning!
[09:59] <fsphil> it's cold here
[10:00] <RG-lz1dev> its 12C around here
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[10:33] <MiniMail> -.-
[10:33] <MiniMail> 6C here
[10:35] <Darkside> 23.5 here
[10:35] <Darkside> and its 9pm
[10:35] <MiniMail> 12:35
[10:39] <x-f> cool
[10:39] <x-f> Upu, received goodies from you, thanks!
[10:39] <Upu> welcome how long did they take ?
[10:41] <x-f> three weeks overall, and this week they spent laying in post office :/
[10:41] <Upu> well at least they are there
[10:42] <x-f> yup
[10:42] <x-f> will play with them tonight
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[11:21] <navrac> I hate locking wheel nuts - the key for mine looks trashed - so thats my day of fitting new pads and diskcs cancelled
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[11:37] <fsphil> cute idea: https://www.sparkfun.com/products/11515
[11:38] <m0psi> y, about time :-)
[11:38] <m0psi> hi fsphil
[11:38] <fsphil> morning m0psi
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[11:40] <m0psi> trying to figure out the serial settings to look at a port with a terminal
[11:40] <m0psi> http://ava.upuaut.net/store/wiki/doku.php?id=levelconvertor
[11:40] <m0psi> it is the second of the two programs on this page
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[11:41] <daveake> The converter doesn't affect the settings
[11:41] <m0psi> upu has set the serial rate at 9600, but i don't see the other settings
[11:41] <m0psi> 8N1 etc
[11:41] <daveake> It's 8 N 1
[11:41] <fsphil> if in doubt, 8n1
[11:41] <m0psi> ok
[11:42] <m0psi> bingo!
[11:43] <m0psi> silly ui
[11:43] <m0psi> i'm using a second arduino to act as a pretend um232r
[11:43] <m0psi> on advice from upu
[11:44] <m0psi> so, downloaded a serial terminal monitor
[11:44] <m0psi> and put in the correct settings, and away we go ? right?
[11:44] <m0psi> NO
[11:45] <m0psi> i had to click an icon which just looks like a connector
[11:45] <m0psi> and once clicked, it changes to one with a big red-cross
[11:45] <m0psi> so, totally non-intuitive
[11:45] <m0psi> anyway
[11:45] <m0psi> works a treat
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[12:00] <m0psi> :-( I was just able to upload to my shiny new uno, and now i can't
[12:00] <m0psi> i power cycled it, no joy
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[12:01] <m0psi> any suggestions?
[12:02] <m0psi> ! now working
[12:04] <daveake> Using the h/w serial to connect to the GPS?
[12:04] <daveake> Oh, what did you change to get it to work?
[12:05] <m0psi> recycled again, only this time i left it off for a while, and I touched the back of the pcb, to drain any residual charge
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[12:06] <m0psi> i hate it when i compare myself to superstitous pigions!
[12:07] <m0psi> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8uPmeWiFTIw
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[12:11] <m0psi> hmmm, seems to be upset when the gps module is plugged into it
[12:13] <m0psi> could be the gps drains the uno power enough to upset it
[12:13] <m0psi> gps module is being powered off theuno
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[12:26] <m0psi> daveake, is your launch still looking possible for tomorrow?
[12:27] <daveake> maybe
[12:28] <daveake> I was thinking about first thing, but looks like rain, and some strong ground winds if I don't get launched by 8
[12:29] <daveake> So probably 3pm is better - gentle winds, and prediction a bit better
[12:29] <m0psi> strong >= 5 knots?
[12:29] <m0psi> the snag for a later launch is darkness on landing. right?
[12:30] <daveake> 17
[12:30] <daveake> Well, a flashing light on the box, and some hi-viz tape, can make it easier to find than in the daylight
[12:30] <m0psi> what is the usual safe limit for ground winds?
[12:31] <daveake> No fixed number. Gusty can be ok so long as there are quiet bits - to measure lift and to launch
[12:32] <m0psi> y, measuring lift is important. forgot about that bit
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[12:32] <daveake> I like to see < 10mph on the weather chart
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[12:47] <cuddykid> makes it a nightmare filling in windy conditions
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[12:47] <cuddykid> made such a difference last time when there was no wind - went from being a multi-man job to a single man job (filling & launching)
[12:48] <daveake> indeed
[12:49] <daveake> Roughly, how much later is sunset @ 100,000 feet than it is at ground level?
[12:49] <SpeedEvil> lift on a restrained balloon in a wind is not zero
[12:49] <m0psi> gosh, good question
[12:50] <SpeedEvil> 30km
[12:50] <SpeedEvil> .5% of radius
[12:51] <Upu_M0UPU> http://groups.yahoo.com/group/GPSL/message/11877
[12:51] <daveake> cheers
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[12:53] <m0psi> anyone got some TinyGPS decoding code i can grab please. the one on the main page for it, is not clear to me.
[12:56] Nick change: Upu_M0UPU -> Upu
[12:56] <daveake> Not me. Don't use it.
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[12:56] <m0psi> how do you decode the gps string daveake? do you do it 'manually'?
[13:00] <daveake> Well, I'd written NMEA parsing code for work projects in the past, so I just wrote my own
[13:00] <daveake> It's not the nicest job but it's not actually difficult
[13:00] <m0psi> no, quite fiddly i should think
[13:00] <m0psi> are there any example code for parsing on the has wiki?
[13:02] <daveake> Don't think so
[13:03] <daveake> If you want to do it, start by writing code that will pick out a complete sentence ($ --> LF) into a buffer
[13:03] <daveake> Then step through the characters picking out the fields (separated by commas)
[13:03] <m0psi> y, i figured it would have to be picking my way bit by bit
[13:04] <daveake> And write some code that fills in a set of variables (altitude, speed, etc) from the NMEA
[13:04] <daveake> Oh, and you should check the checksum too
[13:05] <m0psi> i just wanted a shortcut for now, just to get started. I understood the point of tinyGPS is to make light of this task
[13:06] <daveake> Well it's like any task where there exists a library ... if that does the job then no need to write your own code.
[13:06] <daveake> Don't expect the entire tracker to be made up of pre-existing code though!
[13:08] <m0psi> no, the fun is putting all the blocks together for sure
[13:09] <m0psi> but it is a grey line to be drawn of where to stop 'rolling your own' vs 'getting the job done'.
[13:09] <daveake> Well, you need to understand how your tracker program is working, and if only a small percentage is your code then that won't be the case, and you won't have gained much experience in writing embedded code.
[13:10] <m0psi> no doubt. agreed.
[13:10] <daveake> It is, and everyone has a different line of course. I prefer to roll my own GPS code as to me that's an integral part of the tracker. Others will differ :)
[13:11] <daveake> But then, radio Tx is integral, and I used someone else's rfm22b code, so go figure :D
[13:11] <daveake> Sometimes expediency wins over :)
[13:11] <m0psi> exactly, it is whatever floats your boat/balloon
[13:11] <daveake> haha
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[13:12] <m0psi> my boat floats = kids in the club enjoy/learn something
[13:12] <daveake> It's also what parts you're interested in ... I have an Iridium module here and I'll have fun getting that going. So although there exists some code to talk to it, I'll write my own
[13:12] <m0psi> but that does not answer where my grey line is
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[14:28] Nick change: Cadair_away -> Cadair
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[14:34] <MickMondo> Upu you there...
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[14:35] <MickMondo> hello
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[14:38] <MickMondo> hello
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[14:40] Nick change: Cadair -> Cadair_away
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[14:52] <DrLuke> "nobody responded to me withing a minute, time to leave"
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[14:56] <MickMondo> Upu you there
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[15:00] <jcoxon> afternoon
[15:02] Action: jcoxon has a colinear nearly on his roof
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[15:03] <bertrik> jcoxon: nice, how many elements?
[15:04] Upu (~Upu@2a00:14f0:e028:0:cd9a:acfd:4361:975f) joined #highaltitude.
[15:04] <jcoxon> its a diamond X-50
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[15:07] <Lunar_Lander> hello
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[15:08] <fsphil> good choice jcoxon
[15:09] <jcoxon> its actually mounted above the roof level
[15:09] <jcoxon> as i've got an old sateliite dish mount point on my balconey
[15:09] <jcoxon> so have a bracked then some pipe to get it above the guttering then the colinear
[15:10] <fsphil> ah so not on the chimney
[15:11] <jcoxon> no, shared building
[15:16] <mclane> hi Lunar, got your payload ready?
[15:17] <Lunar_Lander> mclane, yea :)
[15:17] <Lunar_Lander> and hi fsphil jcoxon
[15:17] <jcoxon> fsphil, i'm thinking though that i'm not going to have it permenant for now
[15:17] <mclane> when will you launch?
[15:18] <Lunar_Lander> in december I think given that DFS wants two weeks of lead time
[15:20] <fsphil> it wouldn't be the simplest to put up and down again jcoxon
[15:20] Nick change: Laurenceb -> HansGruber
[15:20] <HansGruber> mclane: hi there
[15:20] <Randomskk> hehe
[15:20] <Randomskk> screaminspace.com got us an interview with CCTV
[15:20] <Randomskk> https://www.dropbox.com/s/8mqxel8s3dz4hax/2012-11-03%2012.23.26.jpg they loved the lab
[15:20] Nick change: HansGruber -> Laurenceb
[15:20] <mclane> hi HansGruber
[15:20] <fsphil> oooh must keep an eye out for that Randomskk
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[15:22] <jcoxon> fsphil, actually its quite easy
[15:22] <Lunar_Lander> XD nice Die Hard reference there Laurenceb
[15:25] <jcoxon> fsphil, so i want to an amateur radio shop
[15:25] <jcoxon> certainly an experiene
[15:25] <jcoxon> experience
[15:25] <Laurenceb> hehe
[15:26] <Laurenceb> was it the stereotypical crowd?
[15:27] <Randomskk> ugh I went to a comic book shop
[15:27] <Randomskk> and it was such a stereotypical crowd
[15:27] <Randomskk> and they'd sold out of the one thing I wanted :(
[15:28] <fsphil> ooh I've never been to one jcoxon
[15:29] <jcoxon> it was helpful in the way i could ask questions
[15:29] <jcoxon> so i managed to get all the parts i wanted
[15:32] <Upu> hey jcoxon
[15:32] <jcoxon> hey Upu
[15:33] <Upu> I got one of these picoAva's running purely from solar
[15:33] <jcoxon> nice!
[15:33] <Upu> going to make a payload round it this week
[15:33] <Upu> and test fly it under another payload when I get moment
[15:33] <jcoxon> with the boost? or 1.8v reg?
[15:33] <Upu> boost
[15:33] <jcoxon> cool
[15:33] <Upu> and a 4700µF cap
[15:33] <jcoxon> :-)
[15:33] <jcoxon> GPS happiy boots?
[15:33] <Upu> yep works fine
[15:33] <Upu> when the sun comes out you see the cap charge on the meter
[15:34] <Upu> and when it hits 3v payload fires up like normal
[15:34] <Upu> 4 x 30mA cells
[15:34] <jcoxon> so a 1.8v would cruise it
[15:34] <Upu> payload should be no more than 40g even in a poly ball
[15:34] <Upu> yeah I'll document it all and let you know how it goes
[15:35] <Upu> if we get it back you can float it to russia for me or something :)
[15:35] <jcoxon> haha
[15:35] <jcoxon> always keen for a floater
[15:35] <jcoxon> now that i have an antenna i can actually track
[15:35] <Upu> well I'll give it a good test under a normal payload first
[15:35] <Upu> oh what did you get in the end ?
[15:36] <jcoxon> diamond x-50
[15:36] <Upu> yeah that should be fine
[15:36] <Upu> so all up and working ?
[15:37] <jcoxon> yeah its mounted
[15:37] <jcoxon> need to do some cabling
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[15:38] <jcoxon> i can hear some aprs on 144.800
[15:38] <Upu> working then
[15:38] <jcoxon> i need a few more washers for the bracket before i'll leave it up
[15:39] <Upu> http://i.imgur.com/F5qNh.jpg panels in the window, payload in foreground, voltage is from the cells
[15:40] <jcoxon> awesome work
[15:41] <Upu> now need to work out how to mount them, will probably use the antenna radials as supports
[15:42] <fsphil> was gonna say I wonder if the PV panels could act as a radial
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[16:30] <navrac> ping jcoxon
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[16:37] <navrac> hi jcoxon
[16:38] daveake_ (~Dave@92.40.253.242.threembb.co.uk) joined #highaltitude.
[16:39] <jcoxon> hey navrac
[16:40] <navrac> I spent yesterday building aerials - Was hoping to borrow an antenna analyser tonight but the guys not in
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[16:41] <jcoxon> navrac, as in payload aerials?
[16:41] <navrac> yep
[16:42] <DrLuke> has anyone every tried eneloop batteries?
[16:42] <navrac> just sent you a link to the doc (I'm starting to document things)
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[16:49] <m0psi> hi all. having a nightmare of a day getting sensible strings out of my gps output. The gps is playing nice. However, I've not had any success getting TinyGPS working, as described in the TinyGPS tutorial.
[16:50] <m0psi> So, any kind soul out there wlling to hold my hand please?
[16:50] <navrac> makesure you have the right tinygps library
[16:50] <m0psi> i got it from their page
[16:50] <navrac> there are 3 versions I know about
[16:50] <m0psi> :-(
[16:51] <navrac> If you are using a ublox there is a modded library
[16:51] <m0psi> ok, got a url pls?
[16:51] <navrac> just looking
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[16:52] <navrac> try https://github.com/x-f/TinyGPS_UBX
[16:52] <m0psi> ya
[16:52] <m0psi> ta
[16:53] <m0psi> i'lll give that a go and see what happens
[16:54] <m0psi> oh, there is an include file: avr/pgmspace.h
[16:54] <m0psi> i don't see where to him from
[16:54] <Randomskk> avr-libc
[16:55] <m0psi> that does not compute either. can't find that in the arduino library
[16:55] <Randomskk> is it failing to include it?
[16:59] <Randomskk> it should just work
[16:59] <m0psi> there seems to be a fundamental knowledge step that im missing heree
[16:59] <m0psi> hmm, ok. i'll have a go
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[16:59] <navrac> my version doent have that include file
[16:59] Nick change: G0DJA_ -> G0DJA
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[17:01] <m0psi> i just tried compiling it, and it worked
[17:01] <m0psi> with that funny include
[17:02] <Randomskk> yea that's what I mean by just work
[17:02] <Randomskk> avr libc is standard, arduino should always link against it
[17:02] <m0psi> so, if standard, surely it would not have to be declared especially
[17:02] <m0psi> anyway, i'm not arguing. it works!
[17:03] <Randomskk> not necesserily. still need the include to make the functions available
[17:11] <Dan-K2VOL> hola
[17:12] <Dan-K2VOL> how have the RFM modules been doing in air?
[17:12] <navrac> pretty good if they are insulated
[17:13] <Dan-K2VOL> what do they do if not
[17:14] <navrac> drift like mad
[17:14] <Dan-K2VOL> cool
[17:14] <jcoxon> well, ntx2's drift as well
[17:14] <Dan-K2VOL> normal oscillator drift
[17:15] <Dan-K2VOL> I've been looking at TXCOs, has anyone tried replacing the normal crystals with the temperature compensated modules?
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[17:16] <navrac> yes I.ve done that on an rfm - also linked it to the timepulse off thr gps too
[17:16] <Dan-K2VOL> how's it working navrac
[17:17] <navrac> timepulse is a bit rubbish - when it looses lock the frequency drifts really badly.
[17:17] <Dan-K2VOL> but when it has lock-
[17:18] <navrac> tcvxo works - but its hard to get one at 30mhz and the rfm is fussy about its input frequency
[17:18] <navrac> its okish when locked - but you do get a bit of fm from the jitter
[17:18] <Dan-K2VOL> how did you feed it 30MHz from the gps timebase, a PLL?
[17:19] <navrac> the ublox max6 can be set to 6MHz ( although the datasheet says 1khz max)
[17:19] <navrac> then a pll running 5x
[17:20] <navrac> I'm currently playing with a crystal and an inverter with a varicap diode so you can create smaller shifts for domin
[17:20] <navrac> dominoex
[17:21] <navrac> which is quite drift tolerant
[17:26] <navrac> the rfm drift is not all the fault of the crystal - but of the si4432 substrate so using any external oscillator really helps
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[17:45] Nick change: Cadair_away -> Cadair
[17:48] <NigeyS> anyonek now a good source for the UK height map data?
[17:49] <Dan-K2VOL> the SRTM data might be available
[17:49] <Dan-K2VOL> don't know how it compares to other sources
[17:49] <NigeyS> ah thanks Dan i'll take a look
[17:50] <NigeyS> best ive found so far is an already generated map for the uk but its 1:100 and i need at least 1:50
[17:51] <Dan-K2VOL> http://vterrain.org/Elevation/SRTM/
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[17:51] <NigeyS> thanks, looks good!
[17:54] <m0psi> hmm, something is fundamentally wrong, and I can't see it :-(. Here is the program I ran (static test of TinyGPS), and then the output. Clearly not working:
[17:54] <m0psi> http://paste.ubuntu.com/1329793/
[17:54] <m0psi> http://paste.ubuntu.com/1329790/
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[17:55] <m0psi> I'm running the program on one arduino (Uno)
[17:55] <m0psi> and looking at the output of pins 4&5, with another Arduino
[17:56] <m0psi> basically a serial port monitor
[17:56] <craag> https://github.com/x-f/TinyGPS_UBX
[17:56] <craag> woops
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[17:56] <craag> sorry, ignore me.
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[17:58] <m0psi> btw, i'm running the dev interface 1.0.1
[17:58] <m0psi> on a mac
[17:58] <m0psi> not that this should make a difference, but just so you know
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[18:02] <m0psi> hi Randomskk, still having bother with tinygps
[18:03] <m0psi> program http://paste.ubuntu.com/1329793/
[18:03] <m0psi> output http://paste.ubuntu.com/1329790/
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[18:09] <navrac> are you sure the output is wrong?
[18:09] <m0psi> well, it does not look like lat long i expect
[18:09] <m0psi> from the test strings
[18:10] <navrac> well some areshownasx10^-5
[18:10] <m0psi> hmm
[18:10] <m0psi> you might be right navrac
[18:10] <navrac> and its changing them from pseudo decimal to real decimal
[18:11] <m0psi> hmm
[18:11] <m0psi> i think i need a break
[18:11] <m0psi> ok, this is useful stage to get to
[18:11] <m0psi> thanks for your help navrac
[18:12] <m0psi> i'll have a break, and then get to live test
[18:12] <m0psi> feeling confident now
[18:12] <m0psi> :-)
[18:12] Nick change: MI6VIM -> fsphil-m
[18:15] <m0psi> interesting navrac, when i replace the dummy string that came with the test program, with my string that i got live, it don't work
[18:15] <m0psi> i thought these strings were standards
[18:15] <m0psi> this one works "$GPGGA,201548.000,3014.5529,N,09749.5808,W,1,07,1.5,225.6,M,-22.5,M,18.8,0000*78"
[18:16] <m0psi> and this one, not "$GPGGA,151829.00,5111.05363,N,00049.19934,W,1,05,4.46,78.0,M,46.4,M,,78"
[18:17] pjm__ (~pjm@uhfsatcom.plus.com) got lost in the net-split.
[18:17] Randomskk (~adam@paladin.randomskk.net) got lost in the net-split.
[18:17] KF7FER (~kf7fer@c-71-193-131-187.hsd1.or.comcast.net) got lost in the net-split.
[18:17] <m0psi> in fact, this is why i was under the impression that it was not working, when i was doing the live test in the garden;, i got 10000.00000 for lat/long
[18:18] <m0psi> so, it seems the issue is that tinyGPS does not understand my ublox output, in the way it is expected to
[18:18] <m0psi> i wonder if there is a new firmware
[18:19] <m0psi> and tinyGPS is out of step with what the new ublox6 is chucking out
[18:24] <x-f> m0psi, the second one has a missing "*" right before checksum
[18:24] <m0psi> good spot
[18:25] <m0psi> may have died in copy/paste
[18:25] <m0psi> :-( still broken
[18:25] <m0psi> i re-ran it
[18:26] <x-f> it came from your GPS?
[18:26] <m0psi> y
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[18:29] <navrac> seems to me unlikely that the two strigs would both have the checksum *78
[18:31] <daveake> 0.4% chance :)
[18:31] <m0psi> yay!
[18:31] <m0psi> give navrac a prize
[18:31] <m0psi> this was compound errors
[18:31] <m0psi> too many copy pastes
[18:32] <m0psi> so, started from fresh
[18:32] <m0psi> so, this is a good place to be. my gps sentence works on a static test.
[18:34] <m0psi> here is the output from the new program http://paste.ubuntu.com/1329878/
[18:34] <m0psi> the date seems wrong at year 2000 though. hmm
[18:35] <m0psi> and here is the program http://paste.ubuntu.com/1329884/
[18:35] <m0psi> thanks navrac
[18:35] <x-f> because there is no date on GPGGA, only time
[18:35] <m0psi> ah
[18:36] <m0psi> thanks x-f for the spot, that was particularly helpful
[18:36] <m0psi> right. time to pause
[18:36] <x-f> you're welcome
[18:37] <m0psi> daveake, are you decided on tomorrow, or still watching weather etc?
[18:38] <daveake> I'm hopeful
[18:38] <m0psi> for the afternoon?
[18:38] <daveake> It'll be a 3pm launch if it happens
[18:38] <m0psi> ok
[18:38] <m0psi> would love to help out
[18:38] <m0psi> so, do give me a bell
[18:38] <daveake> Chat tomorrow morning - I'll decide then
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[19:15] <jcoxon> KT5TK, whats in the air from your side of the pond?
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[19:16] <Lunar_Lander> hello
[19:22] <Lunar_Lander> daveake, Upu told me that you two wanted to discuss something about my code
[19:23] <Dan-K2VOL> hi Jcoxon, how's your weekend going?
[19:23] <jcoxon> hi Dan-K2VOL not too bad thanks
[19:23] <jcoxon> you?
[19:23] <Dan-K2VOL> nice, I'm trying out UPU's latest radio
[19:24] <jcoxon> oh yeah
[19:24] <jcoxon> its really good
[19:24] <Dan-K2VOL> having trouble finding an SSB radio around here :-P
[19:24] <Lunar_Lander> hi Dan-K2VOL jcoxon
[19:24] <jcoxon> is yours a 1.8 or 3.3?
[19:24] <Dan-K2VOL> 3.3 I think
[19:24] <Lunar_Lander> Dan-K2VOL, how are you?
[19:24] <Dan-K2VOL> doing fine Lunar_Lander, u?
[19:24] <jcoxon> Dan-K2VOL, SDR?
[19:24] <Lunar_Lander> Dan-K2VOL, me too thanks
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[19:25] <Lunar_Lander> Dan-K2VOL, so how did you like europe?
[19:25] <Dan-K2VOL> hmm, don't have one of those at the moment here, but how easy is the config these days for dl-fldigi with SDRs like the funcube?
[19:25] <jcoxon> Dan-K2VOL, easy
[19:25] <EspacioCercano> hi everyone
[19:26] <jcoxon> you just pipe the output audio from the sdr software back into dl-fldigi
[19:26] <Dan-K2VOL> Lunar, I loved it, nice people, interesting balloon info, pleasant places
[19:26] <Dan-K2VOL> cool
[19:26] <EspacioCercano> I was wondering, what's the best way to create a radar reflector?
[19:27] <jcoxon> EspacioCercano, do you really need one?
[19:27] <jcoxon> they don't work too well
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[19:28] <Lunar_Lander> Dan-K2VOL, cool! I actually was anticipating your visit to Osnabruck
[19:28] <Lunar_Lander> :)
[19:29] <Lunar_Lander> EspacioCercano, hello and welcome
[19:29] <EspacioCercano> jcoxon, I don't know, just wanted to take all possible precautions :)
[19:29] <Lunar_Lander> EspacioCercano, where are you from if I may ask?
[19:29] <Dan-K2VOL> Sorry Lunar_Lander, I was too, I never got time to get past France, I ran out of time waiting to meet all the balloon scientists I was looking for
[19:29] <EspacioCercano> Lunar_Lander, sure, Argentina here& thanks for the welcome
[19:29] <Lunar_Lander> Dan-K2VOL, no problem, did you meet then all?
[19:30] <Lunar_Lander> EspacioCercano, cool! :)
[19:30] <Dan-K2VOL> no
[19:30] <Lunar_Lander> EspacioCercano, you surely know the StratoCat website? :)
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[19:30] <Lunar_Lander> Dan-K2VOL, :(
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[19:31] <EspacioCercano> Lunar_Lander: yes, of course :)
[19:31] <Lunar_Lander> yay :)
[19:31] <Lunar_Lander> Luis, who runs it is cool
[19:32] <EspacioCercano> It's a great resource& I don't know the webmaster, but I would love to!
[19:32] <Lunar_Lander> yea
[19:32] <Lunar_Lander> just write him via the contact form
[19:32] <Lunar_Lander> :)
[19:34] <EspacioCercano> Actually I did some time ago, but didn't get a reply. I was interested in knowing about Argentinean regulations for launch, if any.
[19:34] <Lunar_Lander> oh
[19:35] <Lunar_Lander> well when I wrote him he wrote back quite quickly
[19:35] <Lunar_Lander> just ask him again if he got your mail
[19:35] <EspacioCercano> Yes, I will& this wasn't urgent so I didn't re-try yet :)
[19:36] <Lunar_Lander> :)
[19:36] <Lunar_Lander> EspacioCercano, do you have a website too?
[19:37] <EspacioCercano> I'm in the process of setting one up :)
[19:38] <Lunar_Lander> :) cool
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[19:50] <EspacioCercano> So, going back to radar reflectors& is it not really a must?
[19:55] <navrac> not in the UK
[19:56] <navrac> you can make them by putting two flat circles of polystyrene at 90 degrees to each other covered in metal foil
[19:57] <navrac> or two squares
[19:57] <Laurenceb> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ut5DXxK1dvk
[19:58] <navrac> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Corner_reflector
[20:20] <EspacioCercano> thanks!
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[20:30] Nick change: Cadair_away -> Cadair
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[21:21] <griffonbot> Received email: chris hillcox "[UKHAS] Re: Which Canon Camera for CHDK?"
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[21:47] <EspacioCercano> I'm wondering how much can I trust the CUSF predictor for a launch in Argentina. Does anybody know where do they get their wind data from?
[21:47] <fsphil> it comes from NOAA
[21:48] <fsphil> I don't know what the accuracy is like globally
[21:49] <arko> woot
[21:49] <arko> vm is on the server
[21:49] <arko> built it all locally on a vm
[21:49] <EspacioCercano> fsphil: thanks
[21:49] <arko> then over to the server
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[21:50] <Lunar_Lander> EspacioCercano, I am using the predictor in germany and it usually works, but with that I mean it plots trajectories
[21:50] <Lunar_Lander> I never flew before so I can't say how accurate it is
[21:50] <fsphil> the prediction is less accurate the further into the future you run it
[21:50] <Lunar_Lander> yea
[21:50] <fsphil> *potentially less accurate
[21:50] <arko> right
[21:50] <arko> the downside is that it all runs
[21:50] <arko> but the prediction is just a dot :/
[21:51] <arko> doesn't look like the data is working right
[21:51] <arko> err
[21:51] <fsphil> I broke my version of the hourly predictor a while back
[21:51] <arko> the data might be bacd or something
[21:51] <fsphil> to scary to fix :)
[21:51] <arko> haha
[21:51] <fsphil> too
[21:51] <arko> i just pulled it down
[21:51] <ali_> yay!!! aqcuired real gps data, and parsed it.! bloody nora, that took too long
[21:51] <arko> and Upu and DanielRichman helped me get it going
[21:51] <ali_> well, at least it is a good step forward
[21:52] <fsphil> sweet ali_
[21:52] <ali_> indeed
[21:52] <ali_> right, time to get inside in the warmth. need to invent radio transparent roofs
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[21:54] Action: fsphil is trying hard not to make Upu's roof transparent
[21:54] <Lunar_Lander> XD
[21:55] <arko> http://thedoghousediaries.com/4685
[21:56] <fsphil> they finally hit that moving button
[21:57] <fsphil> brb, launching rockets into SPACE. (+/- 99.99km) (mostly -)
[21:57] <Lunar_Lander> XD
[21:57] <ali_> now fsphil?
[21:57] <Lunar_Lander> btw who of you knows the Orbiter space flight simulator?
[21:58] <zyp> I've got a friend that have spent too many hours with it
[21:58] <DrLuke> I do
[21:58] <DrLuke> it's fun
[21:59] <Lunar_Lander> yea
[21:59] <Lunar_Lander> it is awesome
[21:59] <Lunar_Lander> and also made in britain
[21:59] <Lunar_Lander> :)
[22:02] <arko> damn it
[22:02] <arko> i can't get wind data :(
[22:03] <DrLuke> landing on mars is so damn satisfying
[22:03] <arko> :0
[22:03] <arko> what are you using?
[22:03] <DrLuke> the deltaglider thingy
[22:03] <DrLuke> I love it
[22:03] <arko> link?
[22:04] <DrLuke> http://orbit.medphys.ucl.ac.uk/
[22:04] <arko> woooah
[22:04] <arko> this is awesome
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[22:14] <Lunar_Lander> :)
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[23:25] <griffonbot> Received email: David Akerman "[UKHAS] Launch Announcement - MRSTED / BUZZ on Sunday 4th November at 3:00pm"
[23:28] Nick change: Randomskk_ -> Randomskk
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[00:00] --- Sun Nov 4 2012